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September 13, 2025 42 mins

In another special race-week edition of IRONMAN Insider presented by Maurten, host Matt Lieto takes you inside the action at the IRONMAN World Championship in Nice. Fresh out of the pro press conference, hear from some of the biggest names in triathlon — including Rudy Von Berg, Patrick Lange, Jason West, Jonas Schomburg, Joe Skipper, and more — as they share their mindset, preparation, and predictions heading into race day.

From tales of breakthrough moments and evolving race strategies to candid reflections on pressure, fun, and resilience, this episode captures the excitement, nerves, and energy of the sport’s most competitive field yet. Plus, IRONMAN legend Craig Alexander joins the conversation with expert analysis on who could shape the race and why this year’s dynamics are unlike any we’ve seen before.

Whether you’re a fan, athlete, or part of the endurance community, this episode offers a front-row seat to the stories and personalities that will define race day in Nice.

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UNKNOWN (00:01):
Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 (00:14):
Welcome to a special episode of the Ironman Insider
presented by Morton.
We're here with another specialepisode here of race week at the
Ironman World Championships inNice.
The pro panel and the pro pressconference just happened.
So we're going to catch some ofthese athletes as they roll out
of the pro presser and some ofthe other athletes that weren't
at the pro presser as they comein for the pro meeting.

(00:36):
So we're going to get a littlebit of insight on those athletes
maybe that we didn't get to chatto in the podcast that you have
seen already this week and getsome insights maybe from some of
our elite media as far as whatthey think is going to happen
come race week.
Okay, our first guest after thePro Presser, Rudy Von Berg.

(00:57):
Dude, how do you like the ProPresser?
Do you get nervous for those orare you comfy?

SPEAKER_04 (01:03):
By now, I've done quite a few.
I remember when I was in myfirst few, maybe six years ago,
I was quite nervous.
Or my first Bob Babbitt, Iremember.
But now, fairly relaxed.
I mean, just obviously maybe alittle bit nervous sometimes
just talking in front of a room,but generally quite okay.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23):
Sweet.
And how are the vibes this week?
I know I talked to you a fewdays ago, but how's it gone
since

SPEAKER_04 (01:28):
then?
Quite relaxed.
I've had a good week at home,you know, 30, 40 minutes from
the race, so a bit out of thehustle and bustle of Nice.
Yeah, I've been training justmorning, so I've had every
afternoon quite easy to Relax.
Awesome.
So it's been nice.

SPEAKER_01 (01:46):
Awesome.
You know, people obviously knowthat you were podium in Kona
last year, fourth place here twoyears ago.
But sometimes people forget likeyour history on this course and
obviously living here just 30,40 minutes away.
But in 2019, third place at the70.3 World Championship.
How big of a breakthrough wasthat for you here?

(02:08):
And does that energy kind ofmove forward to you at the World
Championship level?

SPEAKER_04 (02:14):
Yeah, I mean, 2019 was my first global podium.
So that was definitely a bigmoment for me.
And kind of the way the raceunfolded was pretty special,
leading at the end of the bikeand onto the run, even though
Alistair and Gustav took overpretty quickly.
But yeah, and holding on for thepodium was quite amazing.

(02:36):
And as you said, it's been awhole build throughout the years
in Nice for me with my firstfull Ironman scheduled that I
here in 2022.
And then 2023 being fourth forthe World Championship.
And then third in Kona lastyear.
So yeah, it's a whole build.
And you could say, and I'vethought about this many times

(02:57):
this year, that it's just beingthe perfect up and up and up for
even better than third maybethis year.
So I'm hoping on that.
But as I said, I wouldn't sayI'm really one of the top
favorites, but I'm in theconversation.
So on a really great day, whynot something exceptional.

SPEAKER_01 (03:17):
Well, you've showed your consistency and I think why
I bring up the 70.3 Worlds islike you're so comfortable in
the technical aspects of thiscourse and obviously you know so
much of this course that youhave all the tools to be able to
get that second or that firstplace, right?

SPEAKER_04 (03:33):
I'd say generally yes, but I'll also have to
produce, you know, my best runever.
So obviously I haven't beeninjured.
I've been preparing year afteryear to improve my run, but but
I will have to have my best runever and after a crushing bike
as well.
So I think nothing's impossible.

(03:54):
I'm well prepared, and I wasthird last year.
So yeah, I'll say why not.

SPEAKER_01 (04:00):
Yeah, right on.
So we've seen last year and twoyears ago here, the podium or
top four is kind of the same,right?
It's like Magnus, Patrick, you,and then Sam.
Sam didn't produce at the endlast year.
Do you see those three, fournames still being in the fight
for those?
top three, four positions thisyear?

SPEAKER_04 (04:19):
I think definitely those three, four names are
going to be in the conversation,yeah, for a top five.
But then you have to add Gustavand Christian, potentially
Kasper as well.
They've proved this year and Ijust, well, Gustav a little
less, but I just know he's ingreat form now and getting
really confident.

(04:39):
And this is also kind of hiscourse, right?
World champion here in 2019 forthe 70.3.
And then a few newcomers wementioned that will shake up the
race a little bit.
I think obviously there's a lotof guys that can do quite well,
but again, yeah, the guys thathave been consistently
performing the last few yearswill still be up there.

SPEAKER_01 (05:01):
Yeah, and you use the word consistent, and, dude,
the last few years, that's theword that we have to use to
describe you, especially atWorld Championship Edition.
So best of luck on Sunday.
Look forward to seeing you.
Thank you very much.
Yeah, thanks.
Okay, next up.
Hey! Next up is me with PatrickLenga.
What's going on?
I mean, you're always...

(05:22):
You're so much looser, I feellike, than you used to be, like
10 years ago.

SPEAKER_06 (05:27):
Oh yeah, thank you.
Take this as a compliment.
Yeah, definitely.
I think maturing can be a goodthing.
No, it's, yeah.
I think it can.
It's been a process, right?
Just talked about it in theinterview.
Especially the situation with mymom, it just puts everything

(05:51):
into another perspective rightso yeah I'm grateful to be here
and I think it's it's yeah it'sa it's just second most
important thing in the world to

SPEAKER_01 (06:06):
say right right like it's you've been able to have a
little more perspective onwhat's important this feels more
fun to you than maybe it did inthe past 100% yeah

SPEAKER_06 (06:15):
yeah definitely I had a racist where I was like in
the hotel room and really reallynot looking forward to race.
I just did not want to be outthere.
I just put so much pressure onmyself that It felt like
everything was blocked.

(06:37):
You're making your own prison,kind of, right?
Exactly.
And at one point, I reallydecided this is not the way I
want to live, right?
It should be fun.
Of course, racing is not alwaysfun.
Don't get me wrong.
It's still hard, and I want tobe at my limit.
But still, I don't want to feelthe pressure.

(06:58):
And especially the race and thevictory last year in Kona.
I definitely took off somepressure and some weight.

SPEAKER_01 (07:06):
Right, and it shows that, like, scientifically it is
proven that the looser you areand the happier you are, you
actually better results, andyou've shown that, right?

SPEAKER_06 (07:17):
Yeah, I think...

SPEAKER_01 (07:18):
Best race of your life last year.

SPEAKER_06 (07:19):
Yeah, it was a perfect race.
Yeah.
And I always said, like, I feelthat there is a...
This perfect race is out there,and I'm super grateful to have
found it at the most importantplace.

SPEAKER_01 (07:32):
It is.
But could it also be yourperspective during the race that
you see things more perfectly,right?
Like, are you more likely tohave a perfect race tomorrow or,
I'm sorry, two days out onSunday because you have that
perspective?

SPEAKER_06 (07:50):
Yes, because I know it's not the end of the world if
I finished 8th or 15th here, youknow?
Life goes on and I just try mybest, go out as hard as possible
and make the best instead of it.

SPEAKER_01 (08:03):
Yeah, like if you drop a gel and you're stressed
out the days leading up to therace, you're like, oh, I dropped
a gel, what's going to happen?
But if you're loose, you'relike, oh, that's weird.
Cool, that's a bummer, but we'llget past it, right?

SPEAKER_06 (08:14):
Yeah, and of course you make plan A, B, C, and you
just, it's an Ironman, and thereare always things going wrong in
an Ironman, and you have toaccept it and embrace the
journey.

SPEAKER_01 (08:30):
I love, so we just came out of the Pro Presser, and
People are asking you a coupledifferent questions.
But to me, what stands out isyou were asked a question on if
you think a sub 230 is needed towin.
And after that question wasasked, you never referred to
runtime, basically.
Maybe you did a little bit, butyou're like, no, eight hours is

(08:51):
what it's going to take to win.
And it's funny because I thinkpeople look at you somehow still
as the fast runner.
But you are.
It makes sense, yes.
You are,

SPEAKER_06 (09:01):
but.
It's how I win my

SPEAKER_01 (09:03):
races.
Totally, but you're across thethree and I think that's part of
the reason why maybe you'reunderestimated.
Like Kona, you biked insane.
Here you biked well enough toput yourself in that position.
So you think maybe sometimespeople still in this era think
of the single disciplines whenin the end it's the bar is so
high you have to be good at

SPEAKER_06 (09:24):
all three.
Yes, yes.
You know, I always race tofinish in the best position
possible, right?
Yeah.
So you won't see me backing downjust to have a sub 230 marathon
and become fifth.
So this is not my approach.
So I'm not holding back in theswim.

(09:44):
I'm not holding back on thebike.
You always see me pushing thehardest I can in this situation.
And I think it also makes meproud that I'm going to go out
and I really don't race fornumbers and race for times and
always want to win the race.

SPEAKER_01 (10:02):
Right.
Winning the race on Sunday, youknow this, every world
championship is the best fieldwe've ever had.
Yeah.
Right?
Yeah.
And obviously people are sayingthis is the best field we've
ever had.
I will say, whether or notthat's true or not, is it seems
like the field with the mostdifferent types of athletes here

(10:23):
that are of a high level, right?
Like you've got yourself won afew Ironman world championships.
You've got Olympic goldmedalists, a bunch of Olympians.
The dynamics...
I'm expecting dynamics to bedifferent than we've seen
before.
Do you see that at all?
Or do you think it's in the end,it's always an Ironman, it
always kind of pans out how itis?

SPEAKER_06 (10:43):
I really think the first two, three, four hours
will be super fast.
And I think this definitelychanged.
And I'm racing professionally inIronman almost 10 years now.
And definitely I felt thedynamics of the race changes

(11:03):
changed in those 10 years.
In 2016, of course, we also, weswam past the first 400 meters,
but the settling in Ironman racepace was just much quicker.
And you tried to be more of thediesel engine and, you know, we

(11:29):
didn't take that 150, 160 grandof carbohydrates an hour so we
really go with 40 50 grams anhour and just kept it steady yes
and this definitely changed likenow you have to be a turbo
engine you have to go with allthe peaks and the normalized

(11:49):
powers is so much higher yeahand the surges that we didn't
train for surges 10 years agoright no so now you have to have
to be prepared for that andespecially on this course here
in Nice, the first really sharphill.
It's going to be, I think, wewill go up with 450 watts, you

(12:12):
know, for five minutes orsomething.
So, yeah, and you have to adapta little bit, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (12:17):
Yeah, no, it's crazy to see.
And in the end, though, do youthink, all that being said,
strongest athlete still wins atthe end of the

SPEAKER_06 (12:25):
day?
100%.
I'm 100% sure the strongestathlete will win, yeah.
But also, not only the strongestathlete athlete from a body
perspective, but the strongestathlete mentally.
Because especially in this racehere, it's longer.
It's just half an hour longerthan a normal Ironman.

(12:45):
So you've got to hang in therefor as long as possible and keep
believing until the finish line.
Well,

SPEAKER_01 (12:53):
we know that, I mean, right now you say that,
and I picture what you look likeon the run.
And we know you hang in there.
And hanging in there is anunderstatement when we to get to
the back half of the realm withyou, and looking forward to
watching it on Sunday.
Thanks, man.
I'm looking

SPEAKER_06 (13:06):
forward for having a great day again.
Awesome.
Sweet.
Thanks, man.
Thanks.

SPEAKER_01 (13:11):
Okay, we're here with Jason West, first Ironman
World Championship.

SPEAKER_00 (13:15):
Yeah, first one.

SPEAKER_01 (13:16):
How's it feeling?

SPEAKER_00 (13:16):
Yeah, it feels good.
Wasn't necessarily planning onbeing here, so it's all a bonus.

SPEAKER_01 (13:23):
Sweet.
We were kind of just hoping todo Placid and get your feet wet
in the distance?

SPEAKER_00 (13:27):
Yeah, honestly, I didn't even know if I was going
to do that.
Really?
I had a few months in the middleof the year to kind to just
explore some things, and I waslike, ah, I'll try it out.
Yeah, I didn't feel like I had agood day, but I was good enough
to get here, so I figured whynot.
And you were rolling on thatrun.
Yeah, until I wasn't.

(13:49):
So, yeah, it was a reallydifficult course.
I mean, for the first one,choosing that course was tough,
but I knew, like, if I qualifiedhere, I should go race a tough
course, because this one's goingto be hard, so...

SPEAKER_01 (14:02):
And dude, to be running the paces you were
running on that course is crazy.
Because I was commentating andI'm like, oh, he's on pace for
like

SPEAKER_00 (14:09):
224.
Yeah, I think I was on like, Iwas like 114 through the half.
And it was feeling really easy.
But once it, yeah, once I lostit, I really lost it.
And what'd you end up?
237.
Yeah, it was like 114, 123.

SPEAKER_01 (14:24):
You never run a harder 123 in your life.

SPEAKER_00 (14:29):
Yeah, I know, right?
I was like, I don't know if I'mgoing to get to the finish line,
but Right on.

SPEAKER_01 (14:34):
So this weekend on Sunday, is it kind of a similar
deal?
Are you just experienced outdoing it, or are you trying to
get top five, top ten?

SPEAKER_00 (14:42):
Yeah, I think if I have a good day, I can probably
get into the top ten.
Maybe I can squeak in there, butprobably not in shape to race
with the front at this distanceyet.
But I just want to learn.
The best way to figure out thedynamic of a world championship
is to go on the start line andrace it.
So really, I just want to have agood day, learn a much as I can

(15:03):
for the future.

SPEAKER_01 (15:03):
Sweet.
And I've seen you have somecrazy fast runs over the 70.3
distance on flat courses.
Does this course suit you wellin that?
Like being able to see everybodyin front of you and just keep
taking it over?

SPEAKER_00 (15:14):
Yeah, I really like flat running.
Like I think that's kind of myjam.
It's like I just get the get theturnover going and just hold it.
So I really do like it and I'lljust see what I can do.
Sweet.
Well, best of

SPEAKER_01 (15:25):
luck out

SPEAKER_00 (15:25):
there, man.
Cool.
Appreciate it.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (15:28):
Thanks, dude.
Appreciate you.
Okay, we're here with JonasSchoenberg.
Man, your name's been coming upa lot when I've been talking to
the other athletes.
Is it?
You don't believe me,

SPEAKER_04 (15:40):
do

SPEAKER_01 (15:40):
you?
No, for sure.
Yeah, new guy on the scene forthose that haven't been watching
this year, but I was luckyenough to commentate your first
Ironman in South Africa thisyear.
Yeah.
And I heard, you know, they toldus that you were just doing it
for fun.

SPEAKER_04 (15:55):
Just a training day.
And

SPEAKER_01 (15:56):
you

SPEAKER_04 (15:56):
just

SPEAKER_01 (15:57):
went out there for it, man.

SPEAKER_04 (15:58):
Yeah, I just, my sister's living there, so I was
there for training camp in thejoint.
I was putting my name on thestart list and then had some fun
on the day.

SPEAKER_01 (16:09):
Did you think a week out from South Africa that this
would be where you'd be and yourseason would go how it's gone
and now you're an Ironmandistance athlete?
No, I was just going with theflow.
Yeah,

SPEAKER_04 (16:21):
cool.
So then I was like, okay, goingfor the pro series, put my name
on Frankfurt and then happenedwith my handlebars came off and
then I raced the Roth and nowI'm here on the start list,
first words, and keen to give ita go.
Yeah, and I imagine you're goingto race the same way here,

SPEAKER_01 (16:40):
yeah?
I would be stupid to change mytactics on this course.
I believe so, I believe so.
And I'm not kidding.
Like, I did a bunch of pre-raceinterviews with everybody, and
they're like, you know,Schoenberg, he's the guy.
He's the dark horse.
Even Sam just said it at the ProPress Conference.
But it's that aggressive racingstyle that people are talking

(17:01):
about you, and I agree of beingsomeone that's going to kind of
change the dynamic, and ifanybody wants to settle in,
you're going to...

SPEAKER_04 (17:09):
No hiding on this course, eh?
Yeah, my text is going from thegun, and I think with the
strength of my swim, and thereare some other guys like Jamie
and Martin, we would try to pushthem, and Sam, we would try to
push it, and then we see how itgoes.

SPEAKER_01 (17:26):
Yeah, I mean, that's kind of the talk, right, is you
think you can get four or five,maybe add Martin in there, away
from the man group, on the swim?

SPEAKER_04 (17:33):
Yeah, definitely.
There are some good swimmers.
I hope I don't have to do allthe work on the swim so I can
stay sitting there and waitingfor the transition and then

SPEAKER_01 (17:43):
going from there.
You got to talk to Jamie.
Jamie's going to take us to thepole, right?
100%.
He's got to, right?
But really, man, we're all superexcited to see what you can do
and don't change that energy.
The reason why you're doing whatyou're doing is because you're
like, let's see what happens.

SPEAKER_04 (17:57):
Yeah, just having some fun and

SPEAKER_01 (17:59):
going for it.
Love it, man.
Awesome.
Good luck on some Thank you.
We're here with Joe Skipper.
Joe, I commentated with you thisyear, so I don't know whether or
not I should be asking you yourpreview on the race or your
race.

SPEAKER_05 (18:12):
Yeah, no, good point.
Yeah, it's been, training's beengoing really well.
The thing I've struggled withover the last 18 months is kind
of like, getting a bit illbefore races, you know, a bit of
sickness, stuff like that.
And it's been very inconsistent.
But I did do a 70.3 last week.
Felt really good.
Didn't kind of go that hard.
Like, took the run easy.

(18:33):
But it was a great confidenceboost.
Had probably my best ever swimin my career.
Really?
Yeah, yeah.
I was only 90 seconds down forthe first out of the water and
was in between the front packand the chase pack.
So I had to do it all myself aswell.
So it wasn't like I got luckywith the pack.
It was like, you know, it wasjust a TT swim for me.
So if I can do that and ridelike I did on Sunday, then I I
hope to be up there after thebike.

(18:55):
And then I think in an Ironman,it's kind of like a bit of a
lottery as to whether or not youhave your run legs.
You know, in the first K or two,whether or not it's going to be
your day or whether or not it'sgoing to be a slog.

SPEAKER_01 (19:02):
Right.
And if you're on one of yourdays, it seems like this course
where you get to look ateverybody that many times as
you're chasing is a good coursefor you.

SPEAKER_05 (19:11):
I think so.
And the thing that's good for methis year is there's a lot of us
who are strong cyclists thataren't the best swimmers.
So we could fall.
Normally, when you do, say, likea race like Kona or something in
the park, when I've been there alot of the strong cyclists have
been half decent in the water sothe strong cyclists can get
isolated whereas I feel like inthis race there will be a few of

(19:31):
us that will be able to worktogether as well so hopefully we
can form a little group and wecan start picking people off
that would be great and then alot of the time when it's a hard
bike some of the guys thataren't the best cyclists really
struggle on the run and in thiscourse there's not really any
free rides on the hills you haveto push the power you can't get
pulled along so it's a veryhonest Well,

SPEAKER_01 (19:53):
sweet.
Honest course for an honestracer.
Good luck out there on Sunday,man.

SPEAKER_05 (19:56):
Cheers, Matt.
Thanks very much.

SPEAKER_01 (19:58):
Okay, the pro meeting's about to start, and we
only have two minutes, and Idon't think Cam has ever had a
two-minute conversation in hislife.
Yeah, it might be better if Iask the questions and you do the
talking.
Otherwise, we could be here fora while.
Possibly.
We'll keep it quick.
Man, I know you had a race heretwo years ago you wanted to
improve upon, and last year wesaw some really impressive

(20:19):
improvement on the run.
I was calling you Kipchoge outon the run course.
Yeah.
Are you going to put it alltogether out here on Sunday?
That's the plan.
I've had a good year.
I mean, I think the start of theyear, when you're working on
your weaknesses, which, youknow, I felt like the swim and
the bike had become that for me.
You kind of compromise a bitsomewhere else.
And that was the first part ofthe year.
But now I've had the summer totry to piece it all together.

(20:40):
And, yeah, I feel really goodwhere I'm at with everything.
So I'm excited for Sunday.
And to me, looking at thetraining you've done on the
bike, to me, that shows, oh,man, his run's going to be
dangerous because thatresiliency that you're building
up, right?
That's the key.
I mean, we're not trying to bethe best runners in the world.
We're trying to run fast afterriding really hard.
And not to mention, you know,ideally around high 48, 40

(21:02):
minutes of threshold in thewater before that.
So, you know, I'm really excitedfor Sunday.
You know, this is a course thatpeople feel should suit me.
It's never really suited me.
I've had my better resultselsewhere.
But, yeah, it's obviously thelast chance we've got here as a
world championship.
And, yeah, I'm really lookingforward to it.
I'm looking forward to seeingwhere I'm at.

(21:24):
Well, I'm looking forward toseeing it too, man.
See you out there Sunday.
I appreciate it.
Okay, I'd be remiss not to takeadvantage of having Craig
Alexander here to chat a littlebit about what exactly is going
to happen on race day.
I was

SPEAKER_07 (21:38):
going to say, let me break out my crystal ball.
I don't know, after, like you, Ijust sat through the press
conference and I think whatstruck me is all eight gentlemen
there look relaxed.
They seem ready, fit.
There's no chit-chat aboutpeople being injured or under

(21:58):
the weather.
I don't know.
I think we say it each year thatI heard Leon Chevalier say
there's 15 guys who could win.
I don't think there's that many.
I think there legitimately isfour, maybe five.
And I definitely think there'ssome guys who have been hovering

(22:20):
around that top or just insidethat top five who can step it
right up as well.

SPEAKER_01 (22:24):
Right.
I think probably there's like 15that could be in the hunt for a
podium, right, on the day,right?
But I think you're right.
So who are the five you thinkcould win?

SPEAKER_07 (22:33):
Well, it's Christian, Blumenfeld, it's Sam
Laidlow, Patrick Langer, I thinkMagnus Ditlef.
I don't think we've seen thebest of him this year.
I think he's dangerous.
And I've just got a...
I said it in Frankfurt, but I'vejust got a feeling Gustav's
inching back to towards his 2022form.

(22:53):
And, you know, I feel he's, it'snot like he's flying under the
radar, but he's not the bigfavorite he was three years ago.
So I think he may escape some ofthe race dynamics and hit that
marathon run.
And I think he can run well onthe 240 here.

SPEAKER_01 (23:09):
Yeah, I think what to me stood out the most for all
the interviews that I did wasGustav.
And in the last two years, whenI interviewed him before race, I
felt like I wanted to give him ahug.
You could tell he did not thinkhe was a good athlete.
He verbalized that.

(23:30):
A few days ago, he said, I canwin this race and I'm going to
win this race.
That's a very different Gustavthan we've seen.
And I think even his competitorsare stoked to see that.

SPEAKER_07 (23:40):
Yeah, I mean, he's good for the sport.
He's great entertainment.
He gives a hot take.
But just on the race course,when he's at his best, he's
consistent.
I mean, we saw him win his firstworld title on this course in
2019, 70.3 worlds.
On a road bike.
On a road bike.
And I actually had breakfastwith him yesterday morning and
he still says that's hisfavorite triathlon memory.

(24:03):
So of all the things he'saccomplished, I think.
So he's got great feelingscoming back to this course and
this place.
He told me, you know, that allthe three Norwegian boys have
had a pretty awesome lead up.
And Kasper Stornis, he's a guythat we don't really...
talk about, but surely he's apodium contender.

SPEAKER_01 (24:24):
Well, that's the thing.
I mean, there's so many peoplethat we don't talk about.
Martin Van Riel.

SPEAKER_07 (24:28):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (24:28):
You know, we can look at the list behind us,
right?
But Kieran Linders, obviously,Christian Hogan.
Jonas

SPEAKER_07 (24:33):
Schomburg.

SPEAKER_01 (24:34):
Yeah, I was just talking to Jonas and he's one
that like 90% of the athletesthat I've interviewed are like,
are saying his name and beinglike, oh, he's the guy that
could completely disrupt anexpectation of how the race
might go.

SPEAKER_07 (24:48):
Yeah, well, Christian talked about him,
called him out by name in thepress conferences but he's a guy
who's going to shape the raceand the race dynamics.
So yeah, it's exciting.
I mean, I'm excited to seeMartin van Riel race.
I mean, incredibly versatileathlete across all distances,
finished second in South Africa.
I know he's had a bit of aninjury cloud coming in with his

(25:08):
ankle, but I think this coursesuits him.
And I feel like he's flying alittle under the radar, but he's
just, he's got so much qualityand pedigree.

SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
I

SPEAKER_07 (25:19):
mean,

SPEAKER_01 (25:20):
it's every year somebody falls on it.
Like it's so many people, likePatrick Lange, still falling
under the radar.
You didn't mention him.
No, you did mention him.
I did mention him, yeah.
But, I mean, he's one, and Ithink Martin Van Riel is one,
and I think, you know, we'retalking about those top five,
and for me, you know, we talkabout Jonas Schoenberg, we talk
about Martin Van Riel, I thinkJamie Riddle is another athlete

(25:40):
that

SPEAKER_07 (25:41):
will shape the race,

SPEAKER_01 (25:42):
but when we talk about those five, the one that's
going to benefit, in my opinion,from all those

SPEAKER_07 (25:49):
people, is Wadlow.

SPEAKER_01 (25:51):
So he might be It might be like a free ride.

SPEAKER_07 (25:54):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, these athletes areall smart and they pay
attention.
They do their homework.
And I think what we saw in Rotmight be a blueprint.
I mean, Schomburg off the front,laid low chasing.
I would have been surprised ifthose two didn't have a chat
after that race.
Yeah.

(26:14):
You know, as athletes do, it'sin their mutual interest.
I mean, those partnerships ofconvenience form all the time
and they these races.
So, no, I agree.
I mean, the thing that we knowabout Sam Laidlaw is he's an
aggressive racer, even though hetalked about toning that down a
little bit.
But he's such a good swimmer,biker, and runner.
He has a few different options.

(26:35):
And he has been the guy that wesaw here two years ago agitating
the swim.
Matthew Marquardt led out, butSam in the middle picked the
pace up.
And we saw it in Kona last year.
You know, at the turn, Sam goton the front And I think, you
know, he's always intent on justcreating a bit of separation to

(26:56):
some of the other contenderslike a Patrick and a Magnus.
And he's been able to do it.
And I think he's going to havesome willing allies here in the
water and, you know, the firsthalf of the bike.

SPEAKER_01 (27:06):
I think so.
And so if we're trying to likedo a prediction, right, which is
impossible to do.
But for me, if I ever do, Ithink about how the race, not
like who I think is going to dowhat, but how the race tactics
might pan out and kind of pickone of and go with it, right?
And let's say we get four guysout of the water, five guys out
of the water together.

(27:27):
Sam's one of them.
And you've got Schoenbergpushing the pace, Sam pushing
the pace.
If that happens and they get afew minutes, like how does,
because I think one of thebiggest pre-race favorites is
Christian Blumenthal.

SPEAKER_03 (27:41):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (27:42):
How does he win if that tactic is happening, right?
Like if they get three or fourminutes by the top of that
climb, does the race start to...
to fall away from a Christian ora Patrick or those fast runners?

SPEAKER_07 (27:55):
Well, yes and no.
I think, again, Christian talkedabout that in the press
conference.
He's got two options for hisrace, and he likes to race
aggressively.
But maybe that took him out ofthe mix a little bit last year
in Kona when he tried to bridgeup to Sam.
And the other card he has toplay, and it's a great card, is
the one he played in Frankfurt,which is be in that group.

(28:16):
Don't dawdle.
You don't want to leak time.
But He showed he can run a 230or a low.
Well, it was a 230, 231 inFrankfurt, and probably equates
to a similar time on thiscourse, give or take, a few
minutes.
So I think KB's quite confidentin his ability to give up 10
minutes and still run to the winhere.

SPEAKER_01 (28:38):
Yeah, and we were kind of talking about that
before.
That's the hard part with thelevel being raised so

SPEAKER_02 (28:43):
much.

SPEAKER_01 (28:44):
We talk about, oh, you give up 10 minutes, but you
run a 230.
He's like, yeah, but you've gotto count on some of those guys
in those 10 minutes not runninga 230.
235, 236, right?
Like, you're hoping they allwent way too hard, and you can
just run through the field,

SPEAKER_07 (28:58):
right?
Yeah, I mean, we've only got asample size of one two years
ago, and Patrick ran a 232.
I think Matt Hanson was a 235,but he was a little ways back
off the bike.
There are only a handful ofsub-240 runs.
I feel there's going to be a lotmore this weekend, potentially
because the level's lifted alittle bit, and I just think
guys will race a bit smarter.

(29:19):
There's a lot of depth in thisfield, you know, So much.
Yeah, so I'm torn.
I keep flip-flopping between.
I think there will be a group offive or seven out of the water,
of which Laidlaw will be in thatgroup.
Yeah.
Andreas Solversberg, WillieHirsch, Riddle, and Schomburg.
And they're going to agitate atthe start of the bike as well.

(29:43):
But then I also think there'sjust incredible depth here.
Like, is it going to split up?
And if it does, it might only be30 seconds.
I mean, Daniel Back, There's somany great swimmers here.
The guys that don't

SPEAKER_01 (29:54):
make that front split are still guys that are
normally in the front of themain

SPEAKER_07 (29:57):
group.
Or close to it.
And they're talented,world-class athletes.
You have to imagine thatChristian and Patrick and Magnus
are going to be in that mixsomewhere.
I know two years ago here, itwas about 60 or 70 seconds
difference.
That was enough for Sam to getsort of out of sight and out of
mind with Clement Mignon earlyin the bike course.

(30:19):
The thing I find fascinatingabout this course He's like, of
course, most of the elevationcomes early.
But I think that 60 kilometersin the middle is crucial, like
keeping the power up.
That's, I think, where Samreally just consolidated and
extended his lead two years ago.

SPEAKER_01 (30:34):
Right, and I think that was what was impressive.
Like, obviously, he was ridinghis butt off up that climb, but
then he was like, click, click,click, click, when he got to the
top.
And I think what'sunderestimated about this course
is that section.
And then, you know, people say,okay, you go to the Grealier on
the descent, and you're like,dude, there's a...
pretty hard climb in thedescent.
And so you have to be, you know,you're playing these cards,

(30:57):
you're lighting matches, but youhave to have enough left in the
tank for the back, you know, 60,80K this bike course.

SPEAKER_07 (31:04):
Yeah, for sure.
And I mean, a lot of the samerules apply.
This is a unique course.
Most of the elevation gain comesearly, but there's some pinches
that come late.
And, you know, the marathoncourse here, this is not a
biker's course.
This is a triathlete's course.
I often feel that a flat orflat-ish marathon course is fast

(31:25):
but not easy.
There's no sections where youcan get free time, maybe coast
it downhill, let the heart ratedrop, let the core body
temperature come down.
On a flat course, you're justgenerating momentum and rhythm
the whole time.
There's no let up.
The heart rate goes up and theonly let up you get is at the
turn at each end of the course.
Yeah, then you

SPEAKER_01 (31:45):
gotta accelerate out of it.
Yeah,

SPEAKER_07 (31:46):
so I feel it's a real runner's course.
It's a rhythm and momentumcourse.
which suits Christian andPatrick.
So...
but may suit a Martin Van Rielas well.
I

SPEAKER_01 (31:59):
mean, there's so many, there's so many.
And I appreciate that you saidthis is a triathletes course and
you're someone that obviouslybroke the Ironman world record
at the championship one or twotimes.
I can't remember.
One time.
One time.
Hamstring got a little tight atthe end.
Yeah, cramped up.
I remember that.
You made it look dramatic.
Should

SPEAKER_07 (32:18):
have taken more salt.

SPEAKER_01 (32:20):
That was the day, back in the days where you
weren't just eating 200 gramsevery hour.
No, well, nutrition wasn't whatit is but anyways uh patrick
long i don't know if this stoodout to you or not but was asked
about you know running sub 230and he like almost didn't even
answer the question right and hesaid yeah no it's we're gonna go
eight hours and you look at himlike that you you'd assume that

(32:43):
would be the guy who wouldanswer that question all the the
younger guys are talking aboutsub 230 and how many guys can do
this and he's like i gotta goeight hours right like how
different is that mentality ofkind of that old dog that's like
okay whatever Whatever you guysare doing, that's fine, but I'm
going to be at the finish linein eight hours.

SPEAKER_07 (32:59):
Yeah, I think that's experience talking.
We saw him execute a veryexperienced and composed race
last year.
Yeah, yeah.
Had a great swim.
There were different times onthe bike where he got distanced
but was able to get back ontothe group.
I know it wasn't the windyconditions and it probably suits
a smaller athlete, but he justshowed patience and composure
and understood that to win, hestill had to maximize his run

(33:24):
potential and to that you haveto ride a certain way.
So yeah, he did.
It was interesting.
That was a telling answer thathe gave because he didn't just
want to buy into what marathontime.
It was like, it's going to beeight hours and you're going to
have to swim, bike and run well.

SPEAKER_01 (33:38):
And I think for me, seeing him from the motorcycle
in Kona last year and theamount, as you said, like he got
dropped and pulled himself back.

SPEAKER_03 (33:47):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (33:47):
His performance on the bike in Kona made me more
confident that he could win onthis course because he has the
ability to go over that I think

SPEAKER_07 (33:57):
this course, I don't want to say it suits him more
than Kona, but it suits him.
I mean, he's a lighter guy goingup those climbs, and technically
he's great on the descents aswell.
I mean, there is 60 or 70kilometers of, you know, aero
riding where, you know, you'vegot to put out good power.
But he's shown he can stillmatch it with the bigger boys on

(34:17):
courses like that as well.
And, yeah, I mean, I think itjust speaks to his greatness and
his legacy.
I mean, to finish second in Niceand then win Kona shows he's
versatile.
But again, mate, we talk aboutthis all the time.
The best athletes are versatileand they do adapt.
And the top four from Kona hadbeen top five from least the
year before.

(34:37):
And the one who missed out wasSam, who just blew up for
whatever reason, maybe overbites, maybe it was a
nutritional sort of malfunction.
But it was the same fivegentlemen shaping the race both
years on two different courses.

SPEAKER_01 (34:53):
And what's telling to me about that is you're
right.
But the one person that wehaven't mentioned yet that was
in that top five, Rudy Von Berg.
He's always overlooked.
And it's funny because I stillthink of him as the young guy
because when he was third herein 2019, it was a breakthrough
and a great performance.

(35:14):
But he's become kind of that olddog to a certain extent in
spirit.
The way he raced and got thirdin Kona last year, you could
tell he was the guy that waslike, I've got blinders on.
I'm going to do my thing.
And at the end of the day, I'mgoing to get across that finish
line as fast as I can, not liketrying to worry about what
everybody else is doing.
And I think he's certainly, Imean, he kind of hinted too when

(35:39):
I interviewed him that hedoesn't think he can win.
And he might be right because hedoesn't have maybe the run of
like a low 230 to be able to doit.
But he's that guy, like theharder the race is, the more
guys are going to crack in frontof him and the more he's going
to move through.

SPEAKER_07 (35:53):
Well, I mean, he said it himself.
in the press conference that hewasn't offended because he
wasn't considered one of themain favourites.
Because he's not one of the mainfavourites.
He said, my run's not quitewhere it needs to be.
But yeah, I mean, he couldpossibly, a three or five minute
PB in that marathon could do it.
He's certainly, since 2019, beenone of the most consistent

(36:15):
athletes on the circuit,particularly at the major
championships.
You know, Ironman North America,Ironman France.
I mean, you actually lookthrough his Palmares, his
resume, he's Won a lot ofIronman races.
He's finished on the podium in alot of championship races.
I think he's not daunted by thebig occasion.
But yeah, all of these guys, Iwas going to say he's
self-aware.
They're all self-aware.

(36:36):
He knows what it would take forhim to take that next step up.
And it's three or five minutespotentially in the marathon.
That's really, for Rudy, that'swhat he needs.
He needs to step that marathonPB up.
He's the one who said it in thepress conference.
But the other guy in the topfive we didn't really mention
was Leon Chevalier as well.
I mean, and he's interestingbecause you don't really see him

(36:59):
in the race.
He normally comes out a fair...
He's always...
It's a time trial for him.
It is.
So I think that's got its prosand its cons.
I mean, you want to be in therace.
He must be incredibly mentallystrong to...
to really just drill down on hisown strategy.
But again, it just shows thatthat's ultimately the best

(37:21):
course of action, isn't it?
Wherever you are in the race,knowing your strengths and
making a few, I guess I don'twant to say risky decisions, but
sometimes you need to go outsidethe plan a little bit if you
want to win the race.
But generally speaking, youstick within the way and the
dynamic that suits yourstrengths the best.
And Leon does that.
He faces a large deficit out ofthe swim.

(37:44):
The way he picks...
He picks his way through on thebike and run.
It's just incredible.
And I mean, was it Utah IronmanWorld Champs?
He finished eighth.
And then he was seventh in Kona.
And then fifth here in Nice.
And then fourth in Kona.
I mean, that is impressive.

SPEAKER_01 (38:00):
Yeah, and it's going to be a little harder to move
down another.
Well, it's

SPEAKER_07 (38:03):
always harder to move down, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (38:05):
Yeah, and it's interesting because I think
those athletes, like you weresaying, kind of doing your own
thing, put the blinders on, likea Leon or maybe a Rudy, that's
the way in a course like this,it's almost the fact that we're
talking about Jonas Schoenbergand Martin Vermeer, the fact
that that dynamic early is goingto occur actually plays into the

(38:26):
favor of that athlete.
I think we both probably agreethat tactic with maybe those
athletes won't get you the win.
Maybe a Patrick Longa could pullthat off.
But if they stick to that anddon't pay attention to everybody
else when the carnage startshappening, because the The thing
that's hard about this course,man, is that once you get to the

(38:47):
run, it's so many outbacks andyou see everybody.
And I think what mentallydamages people more than any
other course is you feel so farbehind that when I'm telling
athletes, I'm like, man, ifyou're like 5K back, keep going.
Because the guy in front of youis like, I'm 4K back, I'm out.

(39:08):
And they stop, right?
So I think this course,obviously it's because so much
difficulty has come before therun, but also just the mentality
of seeing the leader come by youand then you don't get to the
turn for like 12 minutes.
You're like,

SPEAKER_07 (39:22):
I'm out.
Yeah.
And again, it was, I reallyenjoyed the press conference.
A lot of them can be a waste oftime.
I can tell you have a littlespark.
Yeah.
There was some, some greatlittle nuggets and insights and
Magnus talked about that.
Just staying in the fight onefoot after the other one pedal
stroke.
And it's, it's, it's simpleadvice, but sometimes we
overcomplicate things and youfeel like mentally you might be

(39:44):
be out of the race, but whoknows?
Who knows?
And strange things happen inthese events.
Magnus, who's the Uber biker,came off the bike seventh in
Kona and then ran his way upinto second last year.
So you've just got to stay inthe fight.
But I definitely think there's afew storylines here.
The clear favourites, the bigfavourites, they deserve.

(40:06):
I mean, they've shown they cando it.
There's a lot of contenders thatnext echelon.
I feel Rudy's in that and...
You know, I'm excited to see ifsomeone out of that group does
take the step up.
And, you know, history tells usthat usually it's someone from
the top four or top five of theyear before.
I think this year's a littledifferent because we're getting
a couple of defending championswho didn't finish top five last

(40:30):
year for different reasons.
So that might skew that stat alittle bit, but it's very top
heavy and we do have some clearfavourites and I think they
deserve to be.
They've shown they can perform.
But yeah, I'm excited.
The Van Riel the Schomburgs tosee how they impact the race.
Someone like Rudy Von Berg, he'sgot a feel at home on this
course.

(40:50):
He grew up not far from here.
He knows the roads inside andout.
But it would take him to breaknew ground in that marathon to
do it.

SPEAKER_01 (41:02):
Yeah, no, totally.
And yeah, I appreciate what yousay.
It's like probably those fiveguys have that chance to win.
But to me, what makes this raceexciting is, and we've seen it a
lot, you get of random or anathlete you never expected that
gets second every couple years.
My brother did that one yearwith you.
We saw Ben Hoffman kind of dothat.

(41:23):
Luke McKenzie did that.

SPEAKER_07 (41:25):
Yeah,

SPEAKER_01 (41:25):
exactly, right?
And he's racing here too.
And it's that, I think that thatathlete, not sure which one it's
going to be yet, but I thinkthat athlete that gets second
that we don't expect is going toinfluence the race from the
front.
And there's no doubt we're goingto get an exciting race.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 (41:45):
I can't, like I say it every year, I'm excited for
it, but there's just so manystorylines and dynamics and I
just feel the depth,particularly that upper tier,
that top tier depth is the bestit's been for a long time.

SPEAKER_01 (41:56):
Yep.
So when we say every year, thisis the best world championship
field, this actually is.
Yeah.
We mean it this year.
Craig says it.
Awesome.
Well, appreciate you coming onand chatting and we're going to
get some good work together onSunday.
Looking forward to

SPEAKER_07 (42:09):
it.
Yeah.
Always fun to work together.

SPEAKER_01 (42:10):
Yeah, for sure.
Well, thanks so much for tuningin to race week.
special with the Ironman Insiderpresented by Morton for Craig
Lieto.
I'm Matt Lieto.
Craig Lieto.
It's been a long week.
We're brothers now.
We could be brothers.
Look at us.
I know.
Look at us.
It's Craig Alexander.
I'm Matt Lieto.
Keep your eye on this space formore good information and be

(42:34):
sure to watch the race onSunday.
It's going to be crazy.

SPEAKER_07 (42:35):
Yeah.
Tune in.
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