Ep. 182 - ‘Going Full-Time in Comedy’ with Kate Hammer - Just Get A Real Job

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hello, so happy to be back on the pod.
OK, Hammer, fourth time on the podcast.
Is it 4? You're probably now one of the,
I think you and Matt Exman, Brown Bear and both the joint,
the joint leaders. And we did one together.
Yeah, you did. Last time was what, 2023
Christmas special? Yeah.
How's it going? How's life?
It's good. And I think at that special we
were talking about because I wasjust applying to River City.

(00:24):
Yeah. And we worked.
We worked together. For and this isn't now it's been
like 2. Years and now you're writing an
episode. I'm stripped in it and.
You I'm, yes, doing a wonderful job.
Yeah, yeah, it's good. It's I'm glad I got to write an
episode because it was hard to work at EastEnders.
Then move to River City, do thatfor a year and a half and then

(00:45):
get when I decided to leave cuz knowing like okay if I go away I
can like visit my family in Canada and do all these other
things. I still have my visa as a
comedian that I need to be a. Government sponsored comedian.
I am a government approved comedian.
I'm on a global talent visa for comedy but it feels ridiculous
that it's like I need to make money off I.

(01:05):
Think the last time you on the part is you've just been
approved as well, right or you're you're waiting to be
approved. It was either waiting it depends
because I got notice of like it's been 2 years.
I think the official date is in December, but like November is
technically when I got. Yeah, notice.
Well, this isn't very different factor of sanity of it.
I interviewed the minister for this morning.

(01:26):
So I was like, obviously it was good, but like this I say it's a
bit more relaxed. Yeah, a comedian friend.
Now that's what you need after like.
Yeah, you know, I don't have anyadvisors behind me.
I know there's no advisor. We've not went.
You're not the government, but you are government approved.
Yeah. Yeah.
Well, do you want to reintroduceyourself for to the lesson?
Is this the first time we'd had video as well?
It's different to the Fringe or the Fringe show we did.

(01:48):
What's? Funny is that like you just get
it looks like I have two little fun pigtails.
I did. I'm Anyway, I'm going through a
hair journey as always. My name is Kate Hammer.
I am a comedian, writer, used tobe storyliner, performer,
director. All the all the things.

(02:09):
Molly. Hyphen, yes.
Molly Hyphen. Yeah, but you kind of went full
time basically being a stand up,right?
You're now making a career from writing and doing doing stand up
which. Feels great.
I mean it's amazing because I saved up a bit of money after
paying off all my visa debt working at EastEnders River City
saved up a bit. I went OK, I need to commit to

(02:31):
doing stand up as in as much as I want to, which means
unfortunately, that I need to have an online presence bigger
than what I do and I hate it. I want to just do the show.
I want to be in front of people and have fun and make.
Them. Yes, I know and it's like I have
all these videos and I know how to edit like I I edit all of I

(02:51):
started a kind of sketch. Now I'm forgetting the word not
cooperative group of people, yes, but it's like quite open,
like a Scottish cohort, like where we want to keep it open to
anyone who wants to put stuff in.
I have seen all over me and someother comics.
Yeah, so all of that is me and Chris Dudley editing, doing all

(03:13):
of the posts on that. And and Heather, Heather Kondak
Ross is the third. So she we all write, we all help
make it. And then Chris and I do post and
then we post it. But since I know how to edit, I
know how to like put stuff online, but I just, it's so

(03:33):
it's, yeah, I'm, I'm way busier than I thought I would anyway.
Luckily comedy is paying so wellthat I've not touched that kind
of savings that I put out for myself to go, OK, you're really
committing for like 6 months. You're just going to live off
this money and you're going to get yourself into debt because I
think it's hard. It's a hard thing accepting not

(03:55):
having money and I because I've already been there so many
times, like, you know, growing up, I was always so was very
good. I was with a credit union.
I was always taught how to like,handle money and be really good
with it. So I was never, you know,
anywhere close to broke because I don't go out that much.
I don't. Well, you work every.

(04:15):
Year I work every like this is the thing that versity I save
money because I was working during the day on not the best
salary, but then working every night pretty much as well.
So yeah, it's. So I've managed to not touch
that, but just kind of be, yeah,making a bit of money on comedy,
which is great. But then.
But then I'm like, I still haven't been clean.

(04:36):
I haven't done this stuff. You have that thing where you
like when you need to feel you need to constantly earn money
and work and you're still like kind of nervous to spend it
because you're a freelancer. You don't have like any real
security. But I think it's scary to invest
in yourself because I think there's always, especially with
the arts, because it's not objectively good or bad.
You're not creating code that works or doesn't work right.

(04:56):
You are putting yourself out there and you think, I think
that's funny. And then some people go, no,
it's not. And some people go, yes, it is.
And like finding your audience and all that.
Nish Kumar, I've probably said this on the podcast already
before, to be honest, is this great kind of bit about how
comedy is one of the only jobs you can have that people can
actually deny that you're doing it because yeah, that's not

(05:18):
funny. That's not comedy.
And you're like, well, it is. It is to some people tell.
Us a joke? Yeah.
Exactly. So anyway, it's it's it's
vulnerable to put yourself out there to invest, invest in
yourself. Because there's always the idea
of like, what if I don't make it?
Yeah. And what if I'm not?
But enough. It's making it as well.
That's the other thing. Because you've done things this
year like to be on the radio, Yeah, being paid to do some

(05:39):
like, TV stuff and things like that, which you probably five
years ago that wouldn't be making it.
And then you do it and you're like, have I made it?
Never. And you don't feel like you
have. I was actually talking with a
friend and I was like, I, we have to remind ourselves to look
back because this is it. I would say I am.
I'm doing it. I am.
I am a writer and comedian and that's how I'm making.
My money, that's how I'm living.My first broadcast credit, I've

(06:02):
been on breaking the news several times, which has been
amazing. It's so fun.
It's so well run. I've been on the Saturday show,
like, yeah, to be asked, like, reached out to as a comedian to
do gigs. Is is I'm doing it, You know,
I'm not having to hustle to get gigs.
I have a decently full schedule.This is amazing.
I'm not rich, but I am like I amdoing the thing and that's what

(06:26):
we need to yeah, be like. I feel so lucky that I can, that
I've reached this level that I can make it work.
But I know to go any to keep growing and not that a growth
mindset is what I'm about because I also want there to be
a live it. I don't want to take over the
world. I don't want to be a part.
Of everything. No, Yeah, I just want to be, you

(06:46):
know, I'm breaking even. I would love to be able to save
a bit, you know, a little bit more.
So to do that, you have to invest in yourself and then put
out clips and try and get, you know, I'm always a little
hesitant about people. You know, people are like, oh, I
don't have an agent. I'm like, well, I don't need one
right now like I'm doing. Yes, it would be great, but I

(07:06):
also want to make sure it's the right agent.
But make sure it's right. Yeah.
And then some people will go, well, you can always switch
agents. I'm like, it feels very
complicated and like you would burn some bridges doing that,
which is fine, but like why not make sure the person that I
actually end up working with is really.
And you also like the grind workand you know what your strengths
are and you've got like that. Yeah, I don't need.

(07:28):
Yeah. So I do think that like, but
yeah, it's, it's one of the biggest, scariest things has
been like accepting being OK with going.
I'm going to not have money because I'm going to invest in
myself. And that's the only way to make
myself take myself to the next level, which I'm not, I've still
not been good at. I need to keep reminding myself
I'd be like, well, maybe I can apply to that job.

(07:49):
I'm like, no, you don't have time for that.
At the same time, I do think I finally kind of come around to
being like, maybe I want a job that is like one or two days a
week that I don't take home withme.
Like working in a cafe or a restaurant or a shop or
something. Because the one thing about well
OK, working so hard, doing long hours and ATV job and then

(08:13):
almost every night going to do acomedy show I think probably
burnt me to a deep. Level No, I mean used to come
into work. I'm like, but I got back at 1:15
last night and I'm like it's like 7 in the morning.
Like how how have you done this training?
But I'm going to leave K alone until we get to the stop.
You just used to it. It was so much but like I had to

(08:35):
do it all and I wanted to do it all but I think doing it for
that long probably burnt me out.But what happens is my ADHD
covers it a lot so I just keep going.
I just keep, keep going. And then I thought, you know.
But that's not also a good thingeither, is it?
No, but this is The thing is it's like I'll go to Canada,
I'll go to Canada and it'll be relaxing.
You're like trying to see everyone and going all these

(08:57):
places. And then so that was great, but
it was, it's still busy, right? And then coming back, I thought
July would be a down month, so busy with gigs.
Then August was the fringe, and then September ended up being
like, I keep, you know, you keepthinking you're not going to
have a down month in. It But are you able to say no to
things? Do you feel like you're if gigs
from and say got a gig tonight and do you find you just say yes

(09:20):
Evan because it's opportunity, it's money.
Is it hard to? It depends.
I'm getting better at it. It is a journey.
Really hard though, because today, today I was in the
interview this morning, I knew it wasn't even you.
Then there's another interview I've been trying to schedule for
ages and I felt bad. So I've had to rearrange it and
I was like, oh, maybe I could just squeeze it.
And then I was like, what are you doing?
Don't do that. So.

(09:41):
You're better than me already. I mean, it's taken me years.
I feel I can relate. Like, you know, I come home and
I do this podcast most nights orI do something for it.
Yeah. You always feel like you're
chasing the day. I feel like a cat chasing a
laser. It's like, how do you ever feel
rested? It's hard because like, I've
never thought about prioritisingrest time because I do really
well with like go go, go and then have periods of rest.

(10:04):
But for the last couple of years, because it's because I've
been on three visas and it's always been a stressful thing of
I need to do say yes to every gig in order to feel like I have
the best chance of getting this visa possible.
And then you get the visa and everyone goes, Oh my God,
congratulations. You can relax now.
And I'm like, it has just begun.Like this is now.

(10:26):
I don't know, I shouldn't need to e-mail my lawyer.
I I don't know what it looks like, but apparently they check
up on me and it'll be in about I.
Love that I love the idea that the company or comedy shows.
But this is. It and you'll be like that.
You make anyone laugh? It's not about making people
laugh. This is the best part is like, I
can be so shit at comedy. I just need to make money off

(10:50):
comedy. That's the the that's that is
fulfilling my visa is making money off comedy.
Yeah. So the hard thing about that is
you're like, how much? And they go, we're not going to
tell you. It's the same thing as like
actually, I totally forgot. I want to.
Pay more. I got to pay more.
I doing taxes here is at least so much better than in Canada

(11:13):
because so if you're on pay Y pay AYE you they do your taxes
for you. Yeah, that's quite good.
Incredible. I don't think you understand.
I never had to do a tax return. To be fair, I've been quite
lucky. I've always been for that.
That's insane. That's amazing.
Why don't they do that in Canada?
You always have to do your own taxes.
You always have to get your own software.

(11:35):
So it's always, it's ridiculous and complicated.
And then you do your own taxes and you go, here's the number I
think I owe. Is that right?
And the government goes, we'll see.
We're going to do our own calculations.
And it's like, so you know the number, They're like, yeah, but
we're not going to tell you. It's this whole weird thing
where they're like, OK, that's how much you think you owe,

(11:56):
right? And then they do.
And then and then they balance it out and they tell you how
much you should actually owe or not owe.
We're here. It's like, yeah, of course, this
is how much you've been paid. So here's how much you should
owe. Unless I think you can go into
it and be like here I should receive extra but as I need to
do my taxes as a self-employed. Person.

(12:19):
I'm doing it now, I did it the other day.
So I just need to I need to get access to these.
People like they're talking about taxes, but I think a lot
of freelancers, creatives listento this.
That is actually a reality. A lot of people will get that.
They have to do that. Oh my God, you know the hardest
thing? I'm better.
I think every year I'm getting better, which is that doing it
also a tax year? Why April 5th?

(12:40):
What the hell is that about? This is so confusing, I know.
But it's so weird doing it for like, you know, 2024 to 2025
while you're in and then, you know, if you're doing in
January, you're in 2026 and you're doing it for two years.
It's so wild. But.
Doing this I realised I would I had been kind of using 2 excel

(13:01):
pages to keep track so I was kind of messy and I wasn't doing
month by month expenditure. So I had to go through basically
a year of my expenses and piles of receipts and be like, what
did I spend money on and and what is available to be written
off. Luckily I take a million trains,
so it's always easy to be like that's to Edinburgh.

(13:21):
I've never once been to Edinburgh unless it's for a show
or to meet people about a show. But this year I'm a month behind
now. But otherwise I've been doing
month by month expenditure like OK here just so at the end of
the tax year, it should be easy enough for me to just add up all
the months, add up all the months out and that should be
done. But obviously there's this new

(13:43):
way coming in. But it's all apps and stuff,
right? It's going to be like online or
something. And I think if you make less
than a certain amount, you are exempt until 2027.
And I'm part of that, I think from what I've loosely read.
So it shouldn't like kick in, but it's just ridiculous.

(14:04):
I think it's like 4 * a year. Oh wow, yeah.
So it's it's just making it so much harder and you need to do a
SEC, a separate tax. We should talk about this.
I like to have asked the Craven she's.
Oh my gosh, it's ridiculous. Yeah.
And you have to do it at a separate tax return for each
thing. So if I'm a comedian, that's one
thing. But it's, it's very confusing.

(14:24):
It's like, but it's my being comedian on a radio show.
Is that is that a a separate thing or being filmed for TV on
a radio? Show a lot of like the creative
jobs are quite like people, you know, TikTok account to their
YouTube like this sort of what what do they call the small
creators like workforce? It's like really becoming a
thing. Exactly.
But also then so much of us willalso then like I teach, I teach

(14:46):
courses and classes or at UWS, I've been like a guest
selectoring is that a separate tax like how many tax refunds
and I've supposed to do as a self-employed person instead of
being able to. Be an easy thing where they you
have an app and. Because also the The thing is we
are not the people scamming the UK out of money.

(15:08):
Like I'm not allowed any anyway though.
But in terms of my visa is one thing, but in terms of like
freelancers, like if we're missing out any money, it's
probably like 100 lbs. Like we're not yes, Jimmy Carr,
get that guy, you know, the big comedians, but you're like
people doing a tax refund for freelance under like 20,000 lbs.

(15:30):
Like, come on, man. We're just, we're barely
scraping by as is, and you're just going to make it so much
harder for us to live as a freelancer.
No, it is an interesting one. I think one as well.
Something to go back to. We're talking about the
starters. Like I think when you're in the
early 20s as a creative, you canget by being like, oh, be broke
for a few years, yeah, and I'll just give this a bloody good
goat. But then we think the older you

(15:50):
get, like I think when you're like in your late 20s, early
faves and you're, you're like been doing it for a long time
and you start to get used to me having a bit of a salary.
It's like the idea of being like, Oh my God, I don't want to
be broke doing this. This is measurable.
And like you said, the problem is like we're caught in this
Arrested Development of emerging.
You're an emerging. There's people that we know who

(16:11):
are amazing and have made so much but are still emerging
because they keep getting an option or a pilot or this and
they have to make, they're putting everything into making
their own stuff, but they're notgetting a Commission, not even.
And not getting a Commission wouldn't guarantee you anything
anymore. You're still going to have to go
back to going. Well, what do I do now?
If there aren't enough jobs, there isn't enough money.

(16:33):
People are commissioning in a state of fear.
So they're not taking any risks.And there's some strange wild
thought that all people want is high end drama.
And you know, the money isn't going to making it necessarily
look good or the story being better.
It's just throwing a lot of money at a problem.
And it's so frustrating because especially being in the comedy

(16:53):
field, you go, I wish you would take one episode of those high
end dramas £1,000,000. You can make 6 episodes
something or something. No, to make 10 pilots, 10 comedy
pilots 100,000 the pilot that ismore than enough to make 10
comedy. Then you were commissioning 10
new comedic writers, 10 directors.

(17:14):
They can be working on a skeleton crew.
It doesn't matter really. And if then you go, OK, and
we're putting this out to pilot season, whether that's on
iPlayer on YouTube or TX thing go, whichever one gets the
highest numbers will Commission a full series on because it's
clearly landing with an audience.
Great. And then if I was one of the
people who didn't get the Commission, I'd go, at least I
have a credit that I can go to other commissioners with or

(17:37):
streaming services. And you're like, you are
actually investing in the community by giving people
credits and a way to move forward.
Because this is, it is like, like you said, being broke in
our in our 30s because we're stuck in this like emerging
cycle, because there is nowhere to move up, because they're not
giving. You even mid level.
It's like we're like for me as ascript editor when I'm obviously

(17:58):
getting into next year. Fun guys, please sponsor the
podcast on Patreon or whatever. Any all helps.
But you mean it's like, where, where do you go next?
Because it's, it's almost something that's easier if
you're, if you're a junior member of saying you do my job,
your script, that it's somethingthat's easier to start somewhere
as an assistant. And but then if you kind of to
qualify for like I'm probably over, I'm overqualified to do a

(18:18):
job like that, but then I'm not qualified enough to go and be
like work higher up. So do you mean that you're just
stuck? And then it's like, where'd you
go? And then also, as you say,
there's loads of people that just go back into like, getting
money from like, I don't know, afund for emerging talent, but
they'd be working in entry for seven years.
Yeah. So then it's blocking people who
have had no experience, but thenit's also they're not
progressing. So it's not just.

(18:39):
Because it's just like, oh, apply to this lab, apply to
this. And you're like the amount of
time it takes to apply to these things.
Yeah, on the chance that you could get, and I've been
accepted, like I got on the Jed Mercurial lab, I got on the
Torino Film lab. Like those are great.
But like at the end, I don't it's not, I'm not ending up with
like a clear path to something else.

(19:00):
As well, there's a necessary thing is all these talents
teams, but I feel like sometimesthey're just for sure, like I
did a talent scheme, but it's like there's no, I want a job, I
don't want a. Talent, I would love to see the
numbers of like even the BBC writers room, which I haven't
applied to for the like the lasthowever long, because again, it
feels like one of those things of don't know if it's worth like

(19:20):
even if you get on that scheme, what are the numbers of people
who BBC is then commissioning ordeveloping in a development like
an actual paid development scheme?
And there's all these things areunpaid and you're like, yes,
it's an amazing opportunity. Yes, like show us the numbers.
Yeah, and that's when it goes back to class again and and
again. And a lot of people that run
these, it comes from a good place, 100%.

(19:42):
They do lead to some good things.
But if, again, if you come from a privileged background, you can
afford to go and do an unpaid talent scheme for six months if
you need it, if you have a day job, it's really hard to like,
give up that and then go and do something.
Yeah, I. Think was it the a Channel Four
thing? And again, like I say names only
because it's like it's every it's every commissioner, it's
every production company and is would be amazing to get on them

(20:05):
and it comes from the right place.
But it was a thing that's like, we need full dedication to this
unpaid lab. And you're like, but how how is
this in any way accessible? And then you have to look at
what kind of writers you're going to get through that.
Because of the people who are more likely to be able to afford
doing that. And again, yeah, depending on

(20:28):
visas, like certain people can get on public funding and
certain people can. So it's like if you can't, if I
don't work, I don't eat kind of thing and it's and I don't have
a backup. So I, I love that the labs exist
and they're, that's great. But every e-mail back is we got

(20:49):
an incredible, we never expected1000 people to apply for this.
That's amazing. We will not be able to give a
specific feedback. You're like, I get that because
so many people applied, but you probably have internal feedback
that you've written the least you could do because you've
asked for, you know, ABCDEI spent a week putting it
together, and now, Oh, my gosh, due to overwhelming demand,

(21:11):
we're still only picking one person.
And you're like, yeah, I understand.
That's the game and it's enough.Because I've been on the other
side of that and work what I've done, worked in development
before, and you've so many people sending stuff in.
Yeah, can't physically get through it all.
But then that's there's an issuethere as well.
Because again, it shows you how many, how desperate people are,
how much talent exists out there.
Like put in certain and this is the, you know, both sides of the

(21:34):
the coin is like, you want to besay, OK, well, you need to have
at least this, this and this in order to apply for this thing.
But then there might be an amazing writer who doesn't have
those things, but then how do you?
You draw the line, Yeah, it's sotricky.
Yeah. And the other issue, I mean,
going back to that thing about £1,000,000 for example, you
could attend pilots, whoever it might be.
I think the issue is at the moment going back to high end

(21:54):
thing. And I was speaking about this to
Ian Murray this morning as a Crave industry man.
So I was raising that we're losing soaps obviously, yeah.
And again, I've been posting a lot of stuff about this on Tech
for Reason and people argue go Idon't watch soaps anymore, blah,
blah. My point with that is I'm not
really talking about the qualityof these shows.
That's that's irrelevant for me.I get things are changing like
there is a change in demographic, there is a change
in behaviour. You things like YouTube can

(22:15):
watch more than second most watched channel in in the UK.
That makes that all makes sense.But what I'm saying is if we are
losing things like that, insteadof just getting rid of them and
not and then replacing them withfree dramas, why can't we look
at like we're going to replace them with some like lower budget
stuff? Yeah, that then will be a
pipeline to feed the higher end stuff because in 10-15 years
Netflix and Apple are all these big streamers are going to

(22:36):
struggle when there's not enoughtalent to then make these big
shows. Well, yeah, they're going to
make AI swap and it's gonna be. But that's a whole.
I know, and I don't want to get into that because it's like it's
terrifying and disgusting and I don't understand what people
don't, you know, people that I care about will be like, I made
this thing on AI and I'm like, you have kids.
What do you mean? Like how do you not know that

(22:58):
you are destroying, you know, 1000 litres of water per then?
I don't understand, like the dissonance in place to like not
link these things of like, oh, but I just did this thing
because it's cute and you're like you, you put your face into
AI. You just gave it to you gave
your face AI. That's that's a eyes.
Now your face is gone. Your face is rich.

(23:18):
Anyway, I got a row from Kate there.
We can't buy for admitting that you I'll use chat with GD for
stuff and you're like. It's one of those things where
I'm like, I also don't want, I want to keep it accessible.
But I think it comes from this like deep, like, yeah, fear of
going, my God, we're we're it's a bubble and it's going to

(23:39):
explode and it's going to affecteverything.
And also, yeah, it's art is likethe one thing that brings joy to
life. Why can't we use AI to solve
medical problems and leave the acting?
Middle of the other thing as well for me is right.
I think what I worry about it isyou're losing critical thinking,
yes. So sometimes I've been like if I

(24:00):
come up by the ears and how you like, because they're even in
parts of you've seen how they use AI to come up with generate
ideas and stuff. So sometimes I'm famous of using
it for that and I'm like, what are you doing like?
I think the legality around thatis also quite.
I know just stealing those ideaslike you know.
But it's also like if you're using Chacha BT then legally and

(24:20):
then you actually show gets commissioned.
Whose idea is that? I know, but then they'd also
scraped all these other do you know, I mean, it's it's not as
well. So you're like, so you trained
this? Yes, it's all about the
training. Yeah, but if we remove a out
because like, yeah, in how many years a the town won't be there.
But also like, I do think basically talking with a friend,

(24:44):
he's like kind of feeling disheartened about the industry
and going, I don't know why I thought do whatever, you know, I
could make it when of course, everything I love to watch had
like a niche audience and was cancelled after two seasons
because it wasn't mainstream successful.
But it was the best show. It was the best writing.
It was, you know, all these things.

(25:06):
And you're like, yeah, I think we there's a certain amount of
acceptance that I go, OK, I'm not going to be the type of
success I thought I was, you know, in terms of like, oh, I
can just make my own shows and this would be amazing.
And and but like what does this?I gotta like readdress.
Like what does my total success look like?

(25:29):
Yeah, I think that's quite a hard one because again, like
going back to the film, we said at the start, like what does
making actually? I mean, yeah, does make is
making a living as a comedian and doing that full time that is
that making it or is making it when you had a hit show and
you're like, you got, can I justsay one of my most annoying
things at the moment is can comedians stop having fun?
That's all the time. I mean, I know it's a bit rich,

(25:50):
but like Andrew, I'm kind of doing a niche thing and it's for
me, this is more educational. I'm trying to be a resource, but
I feel like there's so I've got every comedian I love has a
podcast. There's some of them are really
funny, but I'm like, come on. I just want podcasts to have
formats I don't mind but like when it's just like we just lose
chat for. Exactly.
I think formats are great, right?
But they might know that's just like everyone has that and this

(26:11):
book, like everyone's copied therest, this format as well.
So there's so many like politicians now.
So it's like, oh, we're also a Tourian lamer politician.
So we're gonna have another podcast kind of done that
format. How about something original?
Yeah, we're. Yeah, I know.
It's a bit rich, guys, I know I'm.
Not no, but like even like a specific theme or something that
people can know because that's it.
It's like, I mean, I'm a super visual learner, so podcasts in

(26:33):
general, if I lose focus becauseI'm thinking about something
else and then I come back and I've no idea what you're talking
about. If it's a format, I go, oh,
well, I know this will be comingup, so at least I'll be caught
on. It's like being able to turn on
a game show and knowing that it's going to get to a point
where you can jump back in again.
But yeah, when it's just generalchat, you know, there's a bit of
ego in terms of we're just so fantastic, people will just want

(26:56):
to listen to me shoot the shit. Yeah, sure, maybe.
Maybe that's true. Yeah, I think I'm just a bit of
jealousy creeping over saturated.
It's not like God does everyone eat 1.
I just love it when it's like, and now we've come to the part
of the show where I love that kind of crap.
I love when there's a bit of fake formatting in play of like

(27:19):
to guide the conversation at least.
Yeah, I've got even prepared anyquestions for our chat today.
This is just all unscripted. Normally I'm quite.
Off the Dome maybe? Prepared.
But I've had you on three times.I've asked you most things like
so where you from Kate? How did that influence you?
Yeah, those answers haven't changed.
No, I mean there is stuff other things I want to ask you.
So like obviously done a bit of radio, but TV, TV work and

(27:40):
stuff. But did you want, is there
anything you want to plug or anything that you've got coming
up because you've been doing like your own shows of standing
things? Yes.
Well I I Co produce and host allmales with the wonderful Ray
Brogan every month. It's at the Rome shack.
It's. Around the corner from where we
are. Just around the corner and it's
it's just such a great vibe show.
I love it. And it's the only queer,

(28:02):
consistent professional comedy show, possibly in the UK, but
definitely. It was very welcoming.
I went along a few months ago. It's a really fun little night.
Yeah, yeah, we try and keep it really, you know, it's a nice
place where I can feel like I can also like dress up a bit
differently and, and play aroundwith stuff.

(28:22):
And then I have the very important panel show, or VIPs as
I call it, and that's a new show.
Yeah, that's at the stand and Ohmy is it a lot of work, But it's
fun. I had a ticket bought last time
and then someone tried to steal my dad's car the same day so I
ended up not going. That's wild.
Well, December 7th is the next one from 4:00 to 6:00 PM.

(28:43):
Yeah. And it's fine.
I think it'll be nicer on a Sunday, 4:00 to 6:00 because in
an evening you're like, it it, you know, it's an 8 to 10:00 PM
show that's it's late enough to then get home afterwards and
then going to be fun a little Sunday, get your, you know,
round off the weekend or get your Sunday night started.
And it's the key is I wanted a chaotic show.

(29:06):
I wanted a show that was like controlled cast, you know, but
you know, there can be some liketopical quizzing questions, but
it's more, more chaotic than taskmaster.
It's not, you know, as getting the question right as other
topical shows, but it's that mixof like a bit of tasks, a bit of
silliness, but like, how can thecomedians find creative ways of

(29:31):
overcoming whatever tasks they're doing?
Or also just try and bribe me? I'm really open to that and very
clear about being open to that. Nice.
Yeah. And, and what other thing
you've, I mean, you've mentionedthis stuff that's on line, like
the sketch stuff and you've donestuff with BBC.
Yes, yeah, or BBC short stuff. That's the one.
Yes, too much, too many of them.Did so my one of my sketches was

(29:54):
actually just re released onlineby BBC short stuff slash.
I think it's just under BBC Scotland or comedy.
So yeah, I did seven of those and get your goat releases
weekly. So that's also.
Oh, links as always. And it's fun.
Again, it's just like we're trying to make it so that like I

(30:14):
need to make it more accessible.If some a comedian has an idea
for sketch, but they're like, I don't really know how to do that
and come to us, we'll help you make it.
Or what's the point of trying toget everyone, every comedian
trying to become an individual viral sensation influencer
online. Like what if we have one place
where everyone can kind of put their sketches or put their

(30:35):
stuff under that. It can be an umbrella for new
talent and help people discover other people through, you know,
if they come for their friend, but they see someone else.
Like trying to make it feel likemore of a community thing.
Because I think that's the otherthing about modern day industry
and also being online as it feels so competitive and
individual. What I really enjoy about the

(30:57):
small creator podcast, the nichetime and for the where people do
shows a bit and then the TV industry in Scotland or like the
UK is how nice and sportive is online.
Yeah. Oh really?
I've recently, I never thought I'd do this.
I would just say I'd never do that.
But I've started doing more liketech talk videos where it's me
speaking to camera go like just interview Kate Hammer or
whatever. And naturally not something I've

(31:19):
thought I'd ever do, but I kind of you get more comfortable with
it. And what's lovely is you get
people that are doing some of the things that comment and we
meet people online and it's kindof supportive space, which is
quite nice because as you say, it does feel quite competitive.
We're in the tension deficit agewhere everyone's like fighting
for the attention. Listen to my real watch that.
Also it's literally being given as advice and all.

(31:40):
It was somebody I know in a talent lab made someone come in
and. Really going for talent labs.
No, but it was not even, it wasn't the lab, it was this
person coming in and saying they're trying to give advice on
how to make it as a writer. And some of their advice was
trying to have a moment, trying to have a viral moment.
And it's like, what? Yeah, try and do something else.

(32:03):
Like maybe you could be, you know, a pop star.
And that would be, you know, that could help you then get
noticed and then we'll have a show.
What does that mean? It's so frustrating because it's
like, you could have this thing,it's a Twitter account, you have
a viral tweet, and then they want to make a show.
But haven't we learned that those don't work?
Well, it's like the it's the oldthing of like you go on a
reality show and you get famous,but you've got needing for

(32:25):
nothing just went on. But also it's it philtres out.
It's like one of the, you know, what was it shit my dad says or
my dad is a porno. Yeah, wrote a porno.
Quite highly successfully. They're not quite big.
No, no, but they have massive but then when they start, it's
when people they try to make a show out of it and then that
usually kind of goes away. But the podcast is not super
great. And you're like, why do we

(32:45):
always we always need things to be other things?
And they're like, yes, yes, because people will come to
watch the show and you're like, not necessarily.
And sometimes it's also that people have built, built like
talent and outside of their followers.
So for me, like I tried to be quite offended.
Got it. And not I'm just posting stuff
as in my head, it's not, I'm notgoing to pretend to do something
to get like 25,000 views or 1,000,000 views or whatever.

(33:06):
And then people are going to come for that.
But then that's not who I am. So they'll then not come back.
Yeah, unless, you know, you're doing all the time.
So it's like, what's the point in that?
Exactly. Well, this is it.
So it's like why can't why is the advice of being a good
writer to do something else? And I like in terms of making
yourself around well-rounded person, yes, have multiple
things. It is like I also agree there's

(33:29):
a frustration around, you know, even applying for TV jobs, so
much of them were. Do you have a background in
journalism? I was like, no, I have a
master's in TV writing because this is what I want to do and I
put all my time and money into doing that.
Thing, yeah, but I mean this even going back to the markings,
I see you post a viral video that gets a million views and

(33:50):
people come and see your stand up show and there's nothing like
that video. They're going to be pretty
disappointed that, yeah, what's the point in doing that?
Yes, I mean. There's benefits to get an
online exposure. From no, but it's also like,
again, we've seen it time and time again.
It's like, and I'm not saying every single person, because
there's lots of influencers, there are lots of people who are
successful online who would makean amazing show, who I know

(34:11):
would be a good writer and. Probably.
Totally exactly. So you're like it's not as if
everyone who is online isn't going to make there's going to
be amazing shows, but it's the problem that it's they associate
because you have had a viral moment.
People will watch you in this show and it's like not unless
there's show is unless they are a good writer.

(34:32):
You pair them with a good writerand then the show really is like
good to watch. They just try and recreate.
I don't know. It's it's, it's this weird
illness with like commissioners of being like, if they have this
one thing that'll make a successful show and it's like,
why not just make a really greatshow?
I feel like this, the thing we're always trying to go, we
want it to be like Fleabag. That was the thing back in the

(34:54):
day, right? But then.
Or dairy. Girls, but it takes 2 years to
make a show, so the time you'd made the show and put it out
like that thing's moved on. So it's like, why don't we just
make a great show? That'll be a great show
completely. Yeah.
I mean, being a commissioner is also hard as well.
So again, don't envy it. For me when I talk about these
things, it's a systemic issue. It's not like a personal.
Totally not, because what are their bosses telling them that

(35:16):
they want? Like it's all.
They're under pressure to deliver and.
Yeah, but I do think there's going to be like the shows that
I really respect came from a self driven place and like some
of my my favourite creators are Nirvana, the band, the show on
my. Hand.
It's a Toronto based. It started off as a web series

(35:39):
that I don't think you can find.And then it was a show on Vice
and you can find most of the exes on YouTube now.
And then they what did they do after they they did a bunch of
stuff. But then Matt was the creator of
BlackBerry the movie with JB Rochelle, and it was also a
series on CBC. So he did both of those and he

(36:01):
was in it and, and now they're touring around Nirvana, the
band, the show, the movie, whichis.
They've gone back to their rootsafter the commercial.
And it's a film so that they filmed.
But again, the way they did it, the way they made it so cheaply,
what they were allowed to do wasjust like, really I respect and
and and envious of and just I'm like, this is what we need to be
doing is just people. Just how many times in the

(36:23):
industry are you told like for oh, let's do this.
We can't do that because of thisand this and this and you're
like, I understand, but what if we found a way to make it happen
or it's not going to look perfect?
You're like, but what if it's just like, I really want to find
the people who are like, let's working, try to do it.
Let's put, there's got to be a way to make this work.
You know, instead of going, well, it would be too much work.

(36:45):
So I don't really want to do that.
And you're like, I don't know ifI want to collaborate.
Like I want to collaborate with people who are passionate about
making the thing. So tricky in the morning isn't
it? We do need more, like more risk
taking. Yeah, and I feel like because
it's anti, I know it's it feels antithetical to being like,
well, we have less money, so should we should be more careful
with it? You see the same thing like in

(37:05):
the theatre world or I'm sure a bunch of other industries, which
is like we have less, so let's do less.
Let's close the doors and you goand you actually need to be
doing the opposite of like we have less money, so let's open
up the space to have people. Hey, you want to rent out the
space? You want to rehearse in the
space? Like the more community you
build and the more loyal, like if if, you know, I felt like a

(37:28):
theatre was really investing in me, I'm going to give back.
I'm going to spread the word. I'm going to be an evangelist.
But the more theatres go, well, we don't rent to people because
we don't want to. And you're like, but I just want
to use a black box theatre for anight.
Doesn't have to reflect your theatre.
No. And you're just like, OK, so
that's I'm like, well, I don't really want.

(37:49):
To need more innovation that that's what we need across the
board is like, how can people ina time of lack of resources,
money and stuff, what can biggerorganisations do to help in a
way that's not that expensive? Like actually, is it just simple
as like use this space for a fewhours this afternoon?
Yeah. Or, you know, people thought a
lot of people unemployed. TV.
There's loads of desks at the Pacific Key BBC office.

(38:10):
Well, they're hot, destined for people who are unemployed, who
just feel the need about community.
Little things like that could goso far.
That would be amazing. Like you don't even have to go
through this security. You could be in the front of the
BBC. You just, you send an e-mail and
say I've got and they just clearyou and get you in you as long
as you're cleared. It's surely not.
It would be amazing. So it's loads of stuff we could
do that would be more. Or having more Open Access to

(38:32):
meetings, like it feels it's also gate kept and and
inconspicuous because I also they're like, Oh well, we'll
meet with your producer and you're like, what about me?
What about me, the creator? Can I like just get in there
and. And yeah.
And this thing goes back, we were speaking before we started
recording a bit like the way people are employed in a lot of
these jobs. It's like it's three people, you
know, isn't it? So it's like, I think there was
a study, I have completely forgotten this that I'll edit

(38:53):
and if I can find it. But it's like, I think it was in
the majority of jobs in TV and film work basically came from
people they're hiring someone they know as a contact or hiring
a friend. So yeah, again, watch if you
come from a dispatch back and don't have the contest, what
like you're just being pushed out of the the opportunity to to
get in. And it's also frustrating of
being like, you know, I'm I knowI'm a lot and you know that not

(39:16):
everyone's going to think that I'm that they want to be friends
with me, which is terrible, but fine, you know, can't force
someone. But it's that thing of going
well, networking is, you know, I'm not sure do they think I can
do the job? But if I I showed them my work
and my resume and what I can do,like I'd be perfect for that
job. But the people tend to go.

(39:36):
And This is why things become a boys club, because you have
these people not questioning allthe time.
Like, I really liked that guy. Yeah.
Why? Because it's comfortable to be
around a guy you know. Human instinct is you want to
employ people that are light minded to you.
So it's not even it could happento anyone.
It can happen to a middle class white female producer.
It could happen to like, you know, a worker class male, but

(39:58):
it can happen to anyone like in those positions because
naturally like, oh, they, they're kind of we've got on
because we had a similar upbringing.
I'll bring them in or, you know,we both like this thing where
sometimes it's good to give it somebody you have nothing in
Commonwealth. So you're bringing and like
range of voices as well. Yeah.
And it's hard because I think again, a lot of people don't
maliciously mean a lot of peoplehave got like a day to hire.
They just need something they want to bring something they can

(40:18):
trust. But it's hard.
You have to sort of really look at yourself and go should have
asked this person that. Or take a chance, I don't know.
Questioning your subconscious and going, yeah, why do I like
this person? And and like, that's it.
Is it good to bring in somebody who has a different experience
than me? And it will challenge me.
And it's hard because a lot of people can see that as being
like a negative attitude or, youknow, there's tension in the

(40:41):
room and you're like, no, if, especially if we're creating
story, we need people with different points of view who
will question a story, not necessarily the legitimacy, but
offering different points of view and going like, well, are
we making this person look like a hero for doing something that,
you know, and it, you know, having it's more the training of
going. How can you not see that as a

(41:02):
personal attack, but see it as the positive, challenging
interaction which the industry needs versus like, being like,
don't stand up. Not that this has never happened
to me, but some of me like, don't stand up to me or like,
don't say that. Yeah.
No, 100% we I think we we spoke briefly about advice something
up and start asking all my guests is like what the worst

(41:24):
advice I've ever received As youhave you ever had a really bit
of bad advice or heard about badadvice in the industry?
Yeah, this is one that I said I sat at a fringe panel and
somebody actually came up to me was like, I went to this panel
and I loved this piece of adviceyou give.
So I'll say it here. Also, before I forget, I wanted
to acknowledge that I'm wearing the stand comedy socks.

(41:46):
There you go. So thank you so much.
You. Want to sponsor this episode
stand? Feel free to reach out and
they're. Fantastic, you will I'll they'll
give you 5 lbs at least. Yeah, I'll take.
It so the yeah, the worst adviceI think is when somebody goes,
make sure you are handing in thebest version of this script,
whether it's for an application or for a Commission or for to a

(42:11):
producer, make sure it's perfect.
Make sure it is perfect before you send it in.
And it's not that I don't agree with that.
It's that a, I'm not sure there is a perfect script because then
you also get conflicting advice of going, well, if it's done,
done, then a producer or commissioner, they want to put
their thumbprint on, they want to help develop it.

(42:33):
So they don't want it to be donedone.
But then also, yeah, well, if it's not perfect, it's not your
best writing, then they're not going to Commission it.
And you, I think it disproportionately would
probably get in the head of women, non binary people or non
gender conforming people and neurodiverse people who go who
feel the anxiety of perfection more than maybe let's say, just

(42:56):
being in the comedy field. Like straight white guy who
bombs a show, walks off stage goes nailed that.
Like I've seen that so many times where I go, Oh my God, to
have the confidence of that guy,that would be amazing because he
is so untouched by what just happened.
And he'll keep going and he'll probably get better until he
does make it. The people who?

(43:16):
Who? Have that left self esteem?
Some people are. Just perfection.
More more affected by rejection as well because then they're
going to go like, Oh my God, they hated me out there and so
I'm never going to do comedy again.
And those are the voices we need.
So I feel like something got into my but for scripts it's
it's that it's that like, well, no, it needs to be perfect.

(43:37):
And it's held me back from applying so much like, oh,
that's not good enough. Because then I hand it in and
then they don't like it and they're going to put my game on
this list and never want to work.
The difference between time being perfect and someone being
like good enough to make a good impression.
And again, I used to get for sure because I was I'm dyslexic
and we'll wrap up some quite a few questions.
But because we always talk aboutnew diversion when you come on,
but you see stuff. But because I'm dyslexic, I used

(43:58):
to hate when I hear producers say spell mistakes.
If there's spell mistakes in thescript like it's just not worth
the clear, not taking the time and it's like does it really
matter? Obviously if you can get someone
else to read your script, yes proofread it obviously.
But some people you are going tomiss a if a script agree.
Who cares if it's got a final? Draft misses steps, too.
It's very frustrating. You're writing a 90 page thing,

(44:19):
right? There's a It's OK to have a few
typos. For me, it doesn't really matter
that much. Obviously, even if you're
filming something long, we can understand it.
I thought my way. Around that.
I thought I didn't like makes mistakes because I was like,
yeah. And then I reread that script
and I was like, Oh my gosh. Like there's just a word missing
but your brain fills in so. Even as a reader, it does.
So you know what people mean if somebody's missed the word

(44:41):
there. For me as a reader, I'm like,
oh, we can't work then They're so lazy.
There's a weird late. We attach like, bad grammar, bad
spelling to people being lazy. And it really frustrates me.
And someone dislikes it because I'm like, we're really hard
work. It's actually harder sometimes
have to work harder. So yeah.
And we really need to watch thatfor sure.
No. And that's fascinating to be
like, oh, my script might be thrown up because of this one
thing, because you're like, yeah, if you're make one little

(45:03):
change. And again, final draft.
It really isn't great. It's kind of sucks.
I don't know why we have to use it for everything.
That's so nice. It really sometimes it'll be
like, anyway, we'll get into that.
But yeah, it's like, so just do the thing.
I hate this pressure that like companies kind of make us feel
like they're putting us onto of like, if you don't hand in the

(45:24):
perfect thing, then we're not going to do it.
You could hand in the perfect thing and it still won't get
chosen because they've just decided to go for.
Some there's always there's a note you'll never be done, film
a show and then there's notes inthe Ed.
Yes, of. Course, nothing's ever perfect
because it's subjective as well.Exactly so nothing's ever
perfect, but also like don't feel like you are ruining your
career like that's what I think the intensity of it is If you

(45:48):
submit a script not done yet, then you will you're done.
This was your chance and we've so much pressure on it being
like this is my time. This is my one thing that then
yeah, it just it gets into your head and and you put so much
pressure on it then when you don't get it because they just
were going to go with something else anyway.
It's crushing to you and but if and I'm not saying hand in shit,

(46:11):
hand in good things make. Sure.
Make it more than good enough. Make it make you want to feel
great about what you're handing it.
But if you are holding back because it's not perfect, like
get yourself out there, have themeetings.
You know how many people? Again, you're going to have
audiences that don't love you. You don't have readers that
don't love you've. Got to fail.

(46:32):
You've got to fail, put yourselfout there.
And I guess like this and again this is advice I give everywhere
is like I have a rejections quota that I want to make.
It I love one too. It's a great thing to do.
I'm going to try 100 rejections,whatever, because then you're
going to get yes, it's all. The way well in good you get to
give you a cheque mark. When I I receive a rejection and
go, well, I put myself out there, I did a thing still feels

(46:54):
like you're getting better or you're at least doing stuff and
you're marking that you're. Putting.
Trying. Yeah, yeah, 100%.
I love that. Now I need to get better to that
myself. Just turn it into a positive.
It's a great reference. Just before we sort of wrap up
cakes. I know we've been for like 45
minutes and 50 minutes, whateverit is, but sort of ADHD and
stuff. Now you're a full time comic.
How are you finding that the late nights having big high

(47:15):
energy and then having to go sleep after and get up and.
I mean, this is the nice thing is like my schedule has totally
shifted. So I now go to bed at like 2 and
I wake up at 10 and it's very strange.
Yeah. But this is it's 8 hours and I'm
trying to kind of try to go to bed a bit earlier.
Last night was a bit earlier. But like, sometimes it's, it's

(47:36):
that. Yeah.
It's just I've always been more of a night owl so it feels like
more natural and it feels nice to go.
It's OK, I can. I love working at night.
I love doing stuff at night. And it just means that when I am
doing shows, I'm not feeling like, oh, I got to get home and
I got to get to sleep. This is a stress of me.
And take doesn't feel that late that like late to get up really.

(47:58):
No, because I get up, you know, try and go for a run and then
then I can like start my. Day.
Yeah, I think that's this is thetough thing is going well.
How do I make sure like I still am doing other work during the
day, the amount of emails or theamount of work that these shows
and keeping on top of everythingand even just like little life

(48:20):
stuff. Like yesterday I walked into
town to drop off clothes at a charity shop and then I got a
skirt that needs to be hemmed and then I went to get a
necklace fixed. Turns out the price of gold has
like quadrupled in the last 10 years.
So I can't afford to get. I was like 90 lbs for a class
but I was like, oh wait till gold drops back down.
But you're just like all these little life happened that I've

(48:40):
been putting out for months thatI hate to see on my do this
finding time to do them. I do still think that like I'm
not properly relaxing. So I'm still feeling like I'm in
this state of like, well, I'll try and just like watch some TV
and I get stuck in the cycle of like, well, that's like
dissonance. That's not.
Yeah, I know what? You mean relaxing so I it is

(49:02):
tricky. I mean, for me, I always find
when I'm trying to relax, Mom was thinking, but you shouldn't
be more productive to do this because if you don't do this,
then you're not gonna, you know,this thing could might not
happen and then you're a failure.
And it's like I'd like to have an even off.
I know it's hard. It's that I want to get
everything done. That's why I'm doing my taxes
now. So I'm like then it's done and
off my list and I can then do the other things.

(49:23):
But it's like the other things are just work.
It's not real relaxation. But I think it's one of the
toughest parts for being a creative.
But before we wrap up, can you tell this story at stand up?
And you didn't tell us when you're working that time, but
can you tell the listeners your airport story?
Because I've been this brilliant.
That's a great piss. And this is your viral moment.
I'll do, I'll do like because I actually haven't thought about
it. And actually I wonder if so I

(49:46):
here I paid £200 to show up to the airport 2 hours early and
wish my plane a good flight. And it was.
So yeah, I basically was visiting friends in Paris on on
a super quick, I just like, you know, was working so much, went
down and then needed to get backon Sunday night.
Was so exhausted working on an application that was due like at

(50:07):
midnight and around the gate with all these like Disneyfied
kids screaming to go home. And I was like, oh, so I went
like a gate over basically to towork.
I just keeping an eye on time and like trying to listen to the
announcements, which all soundedlike like it was impossible.
But there was a flight that leftbefore mine, right, But like I

(50:30):
could see it like to Manchester and it was it left like 20
minutes before my flight. So they just started like lining
up and going into the plane and went great.
So I'll now go over to my gate because it's leaving before
mine. So mine should now, you know,
start boarding in 20 minutes andI show up and the gate's empty
and I was like, Oh my God, did they move the gate?

(50:51):
Like where is it now? And she and the woman just went,
we left and I was like, what? She's like, yeah, the plane
left. We called you and I was like,
are you kidding me? And I didn't think they were
allowed to leave once you were like, I had checked through
security and had my password. The plane left fucking early.
Easy. Jeff left early.
This never happens. Like what?

(51:12):
This shouldn't be allowed to happen.
He's they're always so late. And then they, they get mad at
you when they leave 20 minutes early and they're even trying to
get you. And I was just like, this can't
be happening. There was they wouldn't let me
on the Manchester flight. There was no other flights
leaving to the UK. I was freaking out.
I had to like go outside. I didn't know what to do.

(51:34):
I was like, I need to stay closeto the airport so that I can
like get the first flight in themorning.
I was hoping I can still make itinto work because Glasgow
Airport was right by where it sounds like, OK, this is fine.
And it was so insane. No taxi wanted to take me to a
nearby hotel. I had to like bribe someone and
pay an extortionate amount to get to this hotel.

(51:56):
I finished my application crying, send it in, didn't get
it, by the way, not even worth it.
And then like rebook for the earliest flight I could, but
even that wasn't going to get mein.
It was like, you know, leaving at 10 AM or something.
So I was like, shoot, I'm out ofholiday days and I can't like I
felt so embarrassed by like I messed up.

(52:16):
It's not the plane didn't cancel.
I just missed it. And I'm so frustrated being
like, I wish there was a lesson like what do I get out of this?
Is there like a? But you know, I kind of, I
didn't want anyone to get hurt, but I kind of wanted that plane
to crash a little bit. Do you know what I mean?
Like just a tiny but just for them to like touchdown somewhere
they shouldn't just. Like what do you call it?

(52:37):
The bird thing? What's that called again?
Yeah, something, in other words,just like I Then I go, Oh my
God, there's a reason I didn't get on that flight.
I was saved. That's what I wanted.
But no, nothing flight was fine.I have to tell my boss that I
like had a celiac reaction, which to be honest, my body was
not doing well with the stress. And, you know, fine, except that

(53:00):
I've spent just like money on a hotel and all of this extra
money just to get home. My own fault.
OK, fine. Go into the airport.
I'm like looking at the right you passing the same steps.
You're like, wow, back again so soon.
And I buy, you know, I pass through security.
I go to, you know, the shop. I'm like, OK, I'm in.

(53:23):
I'm going home. I buy some mustard or some
really nice mustard and then yougo through a second set of gates
towards my, my flight. And only then I didn't realise
they hadn't checked my passport until then.
Only then did they like, I need your passport.
And I was like, what the hell? I always kept it in my little
pouch. I was like in my pocket.
I packed in my bag. I now at this gate, I'm like

(53:46):
having to tear my entire bag apart to look for this passport
to take me everything and patting everything down.
My diva cup is just rolling on the ground.
OK, that just it's just. And there was this moment where
I'm like, what is happening to my life right now?
It's a mess. My D be free diva cup like I
don't know, you know I'm trappedhere, but you can go home and it

(54:06):
was nowhere and I'm like callingthe hotels like is it in the
room? Like I don't understand.
It was. I just had it this morning to
check in for my flight in the hotel.
I don't understand. I always keep it here.
And again, it's just like one thing out of process.
And because I'm so visual, I, you know, anyway, I'll reveal
what happened later. So I call the hotel again.

(54:28):
They're like, no, stop calling me.
Don't have your passport. We checked your room and I was
like, OK, at this point, I like have to tell the police that I
think my passport has been stolen.
They do a whole scan. They look at my bag.
They're like your passports not in there.
You're going to have to get a temporary emergency passport.
You have to go back into Paris and do this.
It's going to take at least a week to do that.

(54:49):
By the way, it's not like a you pay.
And you've called. For one day, Jamie, and I'm
like, how am I now going to explain to my mom that I fucked
this up so bad that like, I actually can't turn him?
Like what, how do I now I have to admit that I've lied because
I thought it was only a day delay because I messed up and I
was just like, Oh my gosh, so panicking.

(55:10):
And so I go out to try and rebook my flight.
Turns out rebooking like saying,Hey, I've missed or I'm not
going to make this flight. So I need to rebook it more
expensive than just buying a newflight.
So I've now paid for two flightsand I need to book a third, but
I don't know when I'm going to get my passport back right.
So I'm in line to rebook this flight like just at the bottom

(55:31):
of my life being like, oh, great.
I really wanted to spend £400 onnothing on nothing.
And then I get a call from the hotel being like, we found a
passport and I was like, becausethe first time I got to the
airport so early that if I when I called, they found it, I would
have been able to go out, get it, come back and make the same
flight. I really would have.
So like I went up to the security desk like that.

(55:54):
The trial. I was like, is there any
passport? Here like I thought I lost it in
the airport. So finally anyway, so they say
that and I'm like, well, I'm notgoing to make it.
I'm so angry at you guys. But at least you found it right?
At least I can still get home today.
So rebook my flight for later inthe day at 5:00 PM at this point
hour like 4 or 5:00 PM, take thebus to my hotel, pick it up.

(56:15):
And I'm just I was asking I was like, sorry what like happened
because you said you went up andchecked the room twice and you
didn't find it. Now you found it and she was
just like it's found now just behappy.
And I was like OK thank you so much.
Easy hotel, fuck you and you left me early on a flight then
you screw me over in the hotel. I feel like it's part of their
thing to like if we then use Jake, it's more money if we just

(56:36):
keep doing her. Like I had the passport.
Yeah, I think what happened is probably like put everything on
my bed to pack so I can visualise it probably happen is
if the sheet, if I pulled the sheet and it covered the
passport, then when I did the scan of the room like I wouldn't
have seen it. One thing out of line.
And you're so focused on that I just need to make this flight.
Yeah, So anyway, I need to make the bus to make the flight.

(56:58):
I'd like walk across a highway to get to the bus stop.
It was so crazy. So anyway, finally get my
passport bus back and I with my mustard.
They're like, you can't take this through security.
It was one of those things whereI was just like the third time
passing all these restaurants. I feel like you're my family.
And I just looked through and I was like, I was just here an

(57:19):
hour ago, Please, please let me take my mustard.
This is all I have left at this point is this mustard.
And I know it's above 100 millilitres, but you can see
that I've just bought it in. I was there and then had to
leave and he let me keep the mustard and I made it home.
I had to cancel an improv show because I wasn't going to make

(57:41):
it back that night. And.
I think the moral. So is it the difficulty of
having to apply for all these talent schemes and opportunities
as a free landscape and having ADHD?
Yeah. This event is like, all I wanted
to do was get a bit of funding to make a documentary and you're
staying up on a Sunday night to do that and then they say no and

(58:02):
you go that's okay, but this cost me at least £500.
At least you could slow. I know I need to work on it
because it was I was like oh I think.
That well at the time I just thought you had to see like
reaction at work. So when I went to see the stand
up and you told the story, I wasdying.
Can you hammer anything else youwant to really plug before?
No, you can't. I think you can't use that

(58:23):
against me, BBC. You can't take that against me.
No, I think that's it. Follow me online and like and
put on my videos and and you're giving me money.
As well, it's always a pleasure.None of this was planned and we
have. It's been a great chat.
It's been amazing, yeah. Thank you.
Pleasure. As always, come follow Kate
Stuff. Please subscribe to the podcast

(58:43):
wherever you're listening on YouTube, Spotify or Apple.
Thank you.

All Episodes

Ep. 182 - ‘Going Full-Time in Comedy’ with Kate Hammer

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Dateline NBC

Are You A Charlotte?

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ep. 182 - ‘Going Full-Time in Comedy’ with Kate Hammer