May 5, 2025 • 38 mins
Exploring the Creative Journey: Ellen Angelico and the Story of Shelly Bush
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In this episode of the Just Keep Talking podcast, host Brother Love sits down with Ellen Angelico, a Nashville-based musician and podcaster. They discuss the impact of mental health on creativity and the importance of belonging and being seen as a creative individual. Ellen shares her journey in the music industry, including playing with the late Shelly Bush, the 'Queen of Broadway,' and the making of her podcast 'Girl In A Hurry: The Shelly Bush Story.'
They delve into Ellen's experiences, her approach to music and gigs, her fascination with politics, and her commitment to preserving Shelly Bush's legacy. The conversation touches on themes of fame, authenticity, and self-acceptance, offering inspiration and insights for artists and listeners alike.
Click Here to Experience 'Girl In A Hurry: The Shelly Bush Story'
https://www.girlinahurry.com/
00:00 Introduction to Just Keep Talking Podcast
01:06 Meet Ellen Angelico: A Musical Force
03:05 Ellen's Journey and Musical Contributions
09:03 The Story of Shelly Bush
14:17 Reflections on Fame and Authenticity
20:03 Struggles and Self-Perception
20:39 Reflections on Career and Fame
21:50 Shelly's Journey and Legacy
23:44 Facing Illness and Decisions
25:04 Hope and Determination
26:42 Balancing Passion and Practicality
27:37 Ellen's Musical Journey
30:52 Creating and Sharing Stories
33:33 Final Thoughts and Farewell
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Brother Love (00:00):
Telling our stories is the connective tissue of the
collective human experience.
The Just Keep Talking podcast delvesinto the lives and stories of artists.
What is the impact ofmental health on creativity?
What does it mean to bea creative individual?
Someone who feels deeply, experiencesjoy and pain, intensely and
navigates the challenges of lifethrough the creative process.
(00:21):
With each story shared, we explore theauthentic experience of our basic need
to Be Seen, to Be Heard, and to Belong.
We're really not so different fromone another, nor are we alone.
Together we can inspire, encourage, andenlighten each other to find the true joy
and fulfillment that is within ourselves.
When we Just Keep Talking, we createthe space for gratitude, self-acceptance
(00:46):
and grace in everyday life in aworld filled with divisiveness.
Fostering inclusivity and connection isa powerful way to make a positive impact.
The Just Keep Talkingpodcast with me, Brother.
Love, because Your Story Matters.
Larry (01:02):
Welcome one.
Welcome all.
Welcome to the Just Keep Talking podcast.
My name is Brother Love and Iam here with Ellen Angelico.
Hello.
EllenAngelico (01:10):
Hello.
Larry (01:11):
Oh my goodness.
I have been starting this podcast andI can't even say that this is a start.
Maybe it's been paused.
Maybe I've been paused.
I've been starting this for so many yearsand the show should just be called Scared
To Start, or it's called Scared To Dream.
I'm not so sure, but there'sfear involved in here.
(01:31):
I appreciate your grace and I appreciateyou tuning in and I appreciate
to be in Ellen Angelico's home.
She is a musician.
I'm sorry, she?
EllenAngelico (01:40):
Yes, she's great.
Larry (01:41):
Is that great?
You know, I was questioning this,and I thought, I'm gonna ask on air.
My wife is like, youbetter find out beforehand.
Because we live in a worldnow, where people say, you
better find out before you go.
So, she.
Beautiful.
EllenAngelico (01:56):
Sarah didn't
Larry (01:57):
My wife
EllenAngelico (01:57):
Sarah's been calling me she forever, and
I've not had a problem with it.
Larry (02:01):
You are very accommodating you are an entertainer you are
a musician You're a songwriter.
You are a producer.
You are a Podcaster you arean absolute force of nature.
I am so grateful to be here I'm I've beenblown away by you for years And I was
scared to, I was scared to death of you.
(02:21):
I was, because you're that good.
EllenAngelico (02:23):
Do you not see yourself that way too?
Because I see you that way.
Not that I'm scared of you.
Cause I'm mostly not,
Larry (02:30):
Right.
Mostly not,
EllenAngelico (02:33):
But I see that.
In your art too, because of courseI've seen you perform with your
band, but I've also done a gigwith you that was like a cover gig.
And who you are in this podcastand who you are on Lightning
100, it's all Brother Love.
It's all an extension of who you areas an artist and your voice comes
(02:56):
through, whether you're playingThe congas or you're interviewing
somebody and that's how I see you too.
Larry (03:02):
Thank very much.
What a great way to start.
This is awesome.
Well, let me just read from, this isthe bio, this is from your website.
In case you didn't know, Ellenis an in demand session musician
based in Nashville, Tennessee.
The Nashville scene calls Ellen an angel.
ace of all things stringed, theyare not wrong and one of, and I'm
quoting here, and one of the "Greatestutility players in Nashville."
(03:23):
She plays guitar, bass,pedal steel, mandolin, banjo,
dobro, keys, and trombone.
Those are not stringed instruments,by the way, but who's bragging.
Every, she plays everywherefrom the Grand Ole Opry to Guam.
Oh my goodness.
I love this.
When she's not backing up a varietyof talented acts, such as Cam, Mickey
(03:44):
Guyton, Brandy Clark, Uncle Cracker,which I thought was hilarious, Delta
Ray, Ty Herndon, uh, Adeem the artistand many others, my gosh, Ellen pens
a quarterly column for Premier Guitar.
Are you still doing that?
EllenAngelico (03:57):
still doing that.
Larry (03:58):
See, she does everything.
Under the moniker, Uncle Ellen.
Which I think is amazing.
This is great.
Ellen regularly volunteers withorganizations like Please Vote
Nashville, Nashville Launchpad,and Association of Horizon.
And she proudly serves on thehearing board of the Nashville
Musicians Association, AFM Local 257.
(04:18):
You're a union cat, huh?
All right.
She's a union gal.
She hopes to leave the music industrybetter than, the way she received it.
You do it all right.
You really do, and you are greatat it all, and you are right.
We did play a show together, and Iwant to, um, express how grateful
I was that you were on board.
I printed out an email.
(04:39):
This is how hard Ellen works,and how much she cares.
So this was a cover gig that Ibelieve my wife put together.
Did you put it together?
It was the
EllenAngelico (04:47):
No, I didn't put it together.
I'm so nervous about what I've
Larry (04:50):
This is great.
So there was a cover gig.
So my wife, Sarah Tomek,world famous Sarah Tomek She
put together a corporate gig.
And she gathered us alltogether like a superstar band.
EllenAngelico (05:01):
It was an incr.
The, the amount of talent thatwas in that band was wild.
Yeah.
Larry (05:05):
And we were playing, it was at the City Winery.
And we did everything.
We did like seventies rock androll to country music of today
and everything in between.
And so you have all of these killers,these really great, I was, I was hired.
My wife hired me and I believeshe even paid me, so she, she
gathered these great musiciansand, there's such an undertaking.
(05:27):
There's like, I don't know, 20 songs, 40.
So there's so many songs.
So everybody needs to be on the same page.
For those of you listeningin, um, we chart things out.
It's a guide, right?
You are able to chart music.
I hit things as a drummer.
I can read the charts.
I understand them, butI'm not a chart writer.
You.
In detail.
This band was calledthe Down Underwood Band.
(05:49):
Okay, Ellen took everysong and gave us notes.
You listened to every song andsaid Play Something Country.
This is where I see me playing whatI play and somebody else playing.
We need this guidance.
This is something you are meticulous.
One of us, it says,"Play something country."
One of us should do rhythmand one should do lead.
I'm comfortable either way.
(06:10):
I thought this is great.
And it just goes, I thought, well, okay,because we had a lead guitar player.
We had you playing pedal steel, lap steel.
And lead guitar, I think,if not something like that.
Okay.
Take it easy.
The old Eagles favorite.
Okay...
I never learned the solo for this one.
So I'd be more comfortable doingrhythm unless you guys don't mind
(06:32):
the solo not being exactly right.
Now I know it's funny, but this isimportant stuff because I've been,
you've been on a million more gigsthan I have, where, you know, that
you've learned the solo, but maybenobody asked you and you did it anyway.
And because you know,you need to be prepared.
Cause you, I've been on theother side where it's like,
(06:52):
well, who, who learned this?
And I go, I don't know.
I didn't learn nobody.
And you know, the old,nobody asked me, right.
But you're giving notes, likesaying, this is what I'm good at.
I know my strengths.
I know my weaknesses.
That is a gift that you have.
I'll go down Orange Blossom Special.
Been a minute since I've played thisone, fine to solo as much as needed.
See, this is confidence.
(07:12):
You instill confidence in us.
I read that.
I go work.
Good, Sarah, we're golden.
We got you, we got Johnson Jay on guitar.
I mean, we are so good, but the factof the matter is this is the gig that
you were hired on and you cared enoughto write every song out and go through
it and say, here's my weakness, here'smy strength and here are my thoughts
(07:33):
because I care, look at this Brown Sugar.
To be honest, I'm not superfamiliar with this one.
How dare you, first of all.
The Rolling Stones.
I'm gonna listen to it a bunch,but if someone knows the parts
well, please feel free to cover theclassic rock shaped hole in my brain.
That's honesty.
See?
But look at this.
Redneck Woman?
I'm on steel.
(07:53):
Done,
EllenAngelico (07:54):
Right?
Larry (07:55):
We go, yep, yes ma'am, you got it.
EllenAngelico (07:57):
This is, this is over the top though.
This is, this is too
Larry (08:00):
It's exactly who you are because you care.
EllenAngelico (08:02):
This is so nuts.
Really the takeaway here isthat I should just learn the
solo for Take it easy already.
Larry (08:08):
No, no, no.
What the point of the matter is, isthat you're working well with others.
You're not just coming at it.
Like I, me, mine.
This is a community beingin a band is one thing.
Being a hired gun with a bunchof other cats is another animal.
And you're able to just say, allright, let me do my homework,
so I'm as prepared as possibleand I can give notes accordingly.
(08:29):
And you know, you're nottelling everybody what to do.
I mean, how many gigs have you playedwhere somebody who's hired Just the
same pay grade as you are comes inand starts bossing everybody around.
Sometimes that's nice.
I don't mind that because I'mlike, great, tell me what to do.
if it's somebody else's music,I have less of an ego about it.
Your love of music isoutstanding, and it is moving.
(08:50):
The reason why we're sitting hereright now is because you just released
an incredible, podcast of your own.
And I just want to make sure that there'snobody podcasting in this town, but me.
EllenAngelico (08:59):
So I'm here to kill you.
Larry (09:01):
I'm here to get rid of everything, all the evidence.
I'm kidding.
Ellen Angelico presents (09:03):
Girl In A Hurry, the Shelly Bush story.
What an incredible journey.
I listened to all of it I.
Loved it.
EllenAngelico (09:13):
Thanks.
Larry (09:13):
Now, you're a musician.
You are a side person pretty much, right?
that's, your gig.
EllenAngelico (09:19):
Yeah.
Larry (09:20):
You played with Shelly Bush.
Explain to us who Shelly Bush was.
EllenAngelico (09:25):
They called her the queen of Broadway.
She's a honky tonk herothrough and through.
She had dreams of being a big star.
Those dreams did not come tofruition, but she worked her tail
off and she was well known amongthe people who played Broadway.
She was very well knownin her hometown, Revered,
Larry (09:43):
And where was she from?
EllenAngelico (09:44):
Stover, Missouri, Morgan County, Missouri, and she Whenever she
went back to Missouri to play, it was justthis big, like, oh my God, Shelly's back.
It was like, this is the person who'sgone off and made it big and done
the thing and lives in Nashville.
And she really was, uh,Special in a lot of ways.
And in a lot of ways, she wasexactly the same as you and me.
(10:04):
I think, obviously I think we're special,but we're just musicians doing our thing
and trying to make a living and tryingto get by Shelly was that way too.
I just felt that somebodyneeded to get her story.
There isn't a lot of information aboutShelly on the internet because most of
her career kind of predates the dailyinternet use that we all experience today.
(10:25):
And a lot of Shelly's careerwas like pre cell phones.
And so if you Google Shelly, youknow, before my podcast came out,
you basically just got her obituary.
And so I wanted to put something outthere so that Shelly's story could live
on even though it wasn't on the internet.
And I also wanted to do it to show herfriends and family that their stories
(10:48):
matter and that Shelly's story matteredand that I noticed her even if she
didn't get the recognition that shewas kind of seeking in her lifetime.
Larry (10:56):
You're a session player, you're a touring musician, you've been everywhere.
You really have.
Cutting your teeth on Broadway,Nashville, was with Shelly.
correct?
Like you, you sort of came in, youwere kind of green on that scene.
EllenAngelico (11:09):
Yes, very much so.
I mean, I had been in an indie rock band,and I had been in a, like, regionally
successful country cover band, so I hadexperience, I had touring experience.
Larry (11:19):
Regionally where?
Chicago area?
EllenAngelico (11:20):
No, here, and the Midwest, um, And for both of those projects, I
lived in Nashville and so I had touringexperience, but I didn't really have
a foothold in the scene of Nashville.
And so that was when I got off theroad with that country cover band.
That's when a friend of minetold me about Shelly told me
that she had an all female band.
And at Broadband.
(11:41):
and at the time I had boobs and aguitar and I was eminently qualified.
And I was immediately on as muchwork as I wanted to be on, as
much work as I could handle.
It's incredible to go back and say,give love to something we've done in
the past, especially in this business.
This business is about tomorrow.
(12:02):
This business is what's next.
What's next?
I've suffered greatlybecause of what's next.
I've suffered personally, relationshipsthat I thought were friends, relationships
that I thought, uh, were longer lasting.
Relationships with alcohol.
Relationships with my own self andself esteem all suffered because
I am so worried about what's next?
(12:23):
I'm upset about what I didn'tdo right in the past, right?
Could hey, can I get thatsong back please sir or ma'am?
You know, or can we do this differently?
Or wow, we shouldn't have lostthat record deal, that sucked.
This is great, while we're playingthis gig right here, this is great.
But oh my God, I got to get ittogether tomorrow, tomorrow, tomorrow,
tomorrow, next, next, next, next.
And of course, with scrolling andthe way everything is so quickly
right now, but looking back,you looked back with reverence.
(12:45):
You said, wow, this is somethingthat was helped me in my own growth.
And part of the thing that I thinkis amazing is that you are around
somebody that, am I wrong in sayingthat she really wanted to be famous?
Oh yeah.
She was, her whole, her solefocus was to get famous.
An old school style record deal.
That was what she wanted.
Larry (13:06):
And she worked forever for it.
She worked so hard.
This is a phenomenal podcast.
You guys play a show on lower Broadway.
For those of you who don't know, the lowerBroadway shifts are like 4 hour shifts,
and it starts like 10to 2, 2 to 6, 6 to 10.
And are there still the late night?
There has to be.
EllenAngelico (13:21):
Oh yes, absolutely.
Larry (13:22):
The insane and Lower Broadway is busier now than ever.
I mean, it is busier, busier, busier.
So for you to get off of a 4 hour shiftand you're not four hour taking breaks.
It used to be breaks back in the day.
There used to be, but now youare playing for four hours.
If you need to go to the bathroom,you just go to the bathroom and you
have somebody else on stage playing.
So you would play for fourhours straight with Shelly.
(13:44):
Um, and then you would get into the van.
Not a bus.
EllenAngelico (13:47):
Sometimes eight hours straight with Shelly
and then get in the van.
Larry (13:51):
And it wasn't a tour bus.
It wasn't, hey, we're goingto go, and I'm going to put my
head in a bunk and go to sleep.
And then I'm going to wake upin Florida and play tomorrow.
EllenAngelico (13:58):
I played with Shelly at the end of her life and I realized
pretty quickly because my gig prior tobeing with Shelly was on a tour bus.
And so I realized pretty quickly thatthe travel part of it was not for me.
And I stopped saying yes to gigswith Shelly that were like more
than six hours away because Ididn't want to deal with that grind.
But she was doing it up until her passing.
Larry (14:17):
What do you feel about fame?
What is fame?
EllenAngelico (14:20):
Oh, gosh.
Larry (14:20):
I mean, you work with somebody to try to help them achieve this goal.
What is fame to you?
EllenAngelico (14:25):
Well, I didn't work with Shelly to help her achieve her goal.
To be clear, my motivations for workingwith Shelly were pretty selfish.
Like, I wanted to, work andmake money as a guitar player.
That's my dream.
And so I was living my dreamwhile Shelly was pursuing hers.
I've worked with a lot of famous people.
I think that's great.
(14:46):
It's not something thatI value for myself.
I don't see it as a componentof what makes me happy, what
makes me feel fulfilled.
But I think that that's part of whyI wanted to tell this story about
Shelly because even though shewasn't famous, she was important.
The effects of Shelly being alivestill ripple around my life everyday,
(15:09):
and a lot of other people'slives in Nashville too.
Um, not just musicians who playedwith her on a regular basis.
Plenty of musicians just kindof came and went from her band.
The project was not about,awarding Shelly fame.
The project was about correcting thehistorical record and changing how, or
trying , to do my small part in changinghow history values certain people.
(15:33):
Why is shelly less valued than, I don'tknow, name a country singer, Pam Tillis.
I haven't played with Pam Tillis.
I wish I played with Pam Tillis.
Shelly is less valued in the eyesof history than Pam Tillis because
she has less of those conventionalcultural markers of achievement.
But Shelly was extremely important.
(15:53):
I would not be the musicianI am today without her.
And so I was trying to correct thehistorical record about her importance.
Larry (16:00):
I appreciate that very much because I was thinking about it and I'm
like, man, I've worked with artists.
they're wanting for fameoutweighed the music.
It outweighed the relationships.
And I love to quote, Brené Brownpart of what she talks about is,
is fitting in versus belonging.
You know, there's a whole thingabout we work so hard to fit in.
I'll put on these clothes.
I'll work this.
(16:20):
Because there are optics, right?
There's optics that I must, adhereto or, just be this thing, that's
not necessarily me belonging and mefeeling comfortable in my own skin.
Fitting in is, I'm doing everythingso I can be more like you.
Because what you're doing is whatI want, so I'm going to be that.
So, hence a hairdo, hence an outfit,hence, uh, even a vocal take.
(16:43):
Just carrying yourself, you know?
Telling everybody that, um, Hey, weopened up for Rascal Flatts, which is in
your documentary and your podcast whenit's like, yeah, well we played at one
o'clock Rascal Flatts played at nine.
So technically, I've opened upfor Cheap Trick, but guess what?
We were direct supportright before Cheap Trick.
I don't have a problem saying that, butif we played the same day, I'd be like,
(17:03):
yeah, we were on a bill with Cheap Trick.
But I understand because I've workedwith artists that are really in
denial like, no, no, no, no, no, no.
We opened up for Rascal Flatts!
Well I mean, okay.
If you feel better about yourself.
But it's not very authentic.
it sounds to me that Shellywas both as authentic as it
gets and yet still striving forsomething, and wanting to be loved.
(17:25):
To perform and to prove and toplease these are more, Brené
Brown isms, if you will.
Where you lose yourself, you workso hard to just be this thing that
I don't know, do you think Shellyeven knew what this thing was?
I mean, it's a record contract.
It's a record deal.
I get it.
And she had all of the highest, youknow, esteemed players on the record
(17:46):
and the records sound shiny andthey're produced, you know what?
They sound a lot likeeverybody else's records.
And when I listened to the records in allfairness, I'm not saying that she wasn't
good, but when I hear those records,I go, I know what you were going for.
You were going for theRascal Flatts sound.
At the time, 2000, like eight to 15.
That's when I moved to Nashville.
(18:07):
That's when I learned about country music.
And so her records sound likethe records of the times.
EllenAngelico (18:11):
Yes.
Larry (18:12):
I don't even know if I had a question in all of this.
EllenAngelico (18:13):
I think there's, there's like a distinction there too.
It's an interesting thing.
Like you talking about the peoplethat you've played for who want
so desperately to be famous.
And then so many otherareas of their art suffer.
The reality is if what they reallywanted was to be famous, they would
be doing something entirely differentbecause you can achieve fame
without going through all this botherof the music business, you know?
(18:36):
So ultimately that is not whatShelly's overriding goal was.
Her goal was to be famous butshe wanted to be famous for doing
what she loved which was singing.
And so I think that is wherethat's the authenticity part.
She loved to sing it was always inher from when she was a kid with
her three karaoke machines That waswho she was, you know, the same way
(18:59):
that playing guitar, is who I am.
I think Shelly's goal, yes,Shelly wanted a record deal.
mythology of that wasvery important to her.
The mythology of country music.
I guess to kind of answer yourquestion, I don't think she
realized how much she had achieved.
I think a lot of peoplewho played with her do.
I think people who played with hernow look back at that time and see
(19:22):
the way that Shelly elevated them outof a quote unquote, ordinary life.
Yeah.
If you're a good bass player, but youdon't have the organizational skills to
start a band and, buy a van and routeshows to Las Vegas and back, you may
not ever actually see the Grand Canyon.
You know?
There are people in Shelly's band who wereafforded that opportunity to break out
(19:47):
of the doldrums of an everyday existence.
Larry (19:51):
Do you think she was coming from a point of view of that, I don't feel
like I'm good enough in a shame wayor did she feel like I am good enough!
EllenAngelico (19:57):
No, she definitely felt she was good enough.
Larry (19:59):
Right on.
I mean, a big distinction, becausewe struggle for worthiness, right?
We struggle to believe thatwe're valuable, you know?
Part of the exterior is I don'tfeel good about myself, and I'm
going to put up this really reallysterling strong, wall, or defense.
And in my defense, I'm wonderful!
You know what I mean?
And you're like, well, okay, I guessyou say you are, so I believe you.
(20:20):
And thank you for hiring me toplay percussion in your gig.
Cause I couldn't tell.
Part of me felt sorry for her alittle bit and then I don't know
why I know why, because I'm seeingmyself through that I'm seeing myself.
When I started the show saying I'mscared to dream, scared to start.
She was not scared to start,she was not scared to dream.
And so when it didn't happen forher, that's when I start to sort of
(20:43):
tear up a little bit because I'm a 53year old male who moved to Nashville
in a band, a country rock band.
Signed and dropped.
I've dedicated my career to ThemVibes and some other artists
that I've worked with and thingsjust where they're at right now?
It's sad I've had tomourn part of my career.
I'm not a touring musician.
I'm not out there, hustling my own band.
(21:05):
I have a band and we can playwhatever we want, whenever we want.
So I'm free from having to pushmyself in a direction that I
know is just not going to happen.
This fame fortune rockstar thing.
And yet, guess what?
I'm more famous than I've ever been.
And I mean that in a funny way!
Cause Everywhere I go.
It's like, Hey Larry, Oh my
G-d Or it's like, Oh my G-dthat's the guy from the radio.
(21:25):
I love this.
It's another Brené Brown.
"Let go of who you think you'resupposed to be and embrace who you are."
I have been doing that for yearsnow, since I started the idea of
this show, because I'm letting go ofwho I thought I was supposed to be.
You, Ellen Angelico, seem to me toknow who you are, and you were witness
to somebody like Shelly who reallydid know, she knew who she was.
EllenAngelico (21:48):
I don't get it right all the time.
And I don't talk about this in thepodcast because I didn't have a lot
of great information about it, buttowards the end of Shelly's life, she
was looking into going back to school.
She knew that she wasn't goingto be able to keep up the pace
that she was keeping up forever.
And I think part of that isbecause she was getting sick.
She felt her body slowing down.
It's not just this self focused thingof like, I need to know who I am and I
(22:12):
need to get back in touch with the coreand like hue to myself and be authentic.
It's also like circumstances changearound you and you just have to
kind of go with the flow sometimes.
Shelly's story could not havehappened at any other time.
In Nashville history, Broadwayhistory, human history.
It happened when it happened, becausethat was when we had Garmin GPS
(22:36):
units instead of maps on our phones.
It happened when it happened, becauseit was before all the bars on Broadway
went three stories and had more, Rockmusic, party music, wedding music.
And Shelly would not havesurvived in that scene.
It would have been totally different.
It happened at a different timein American political history.
Now members of Shelly's band havevery opposing political views.
(23:01):
And at the time that Shelly was doingher thing, that wasn't as much of
the public national conversation.
I don't look back at it andI'm like, man, I wish those
good old days were back again.
I look at it and I'm like, thatwas an amazing experience that
could have only happened then.
And I'm like, now that it's adifferent thing, there's different
scenes happening downtown.
There's different sceneshappening in my life.
(23:24):
And that's okay.
That's cool.
Like I'm down to just gowith the flow of that.
It's easy for me to say becauseI don't see myself as the artist.
I don't see myself as the product.
It's not like if I don't playMadison Square Garden that
I'm going to die unhappy.
I don't have those kinds of goals.
Larry (23:40):
Do you think Shelly died unhappy?
EllenAngelico (23:42):
God, I hope not.
Um, yeah,
Larry (23:44):
She died in 2015 of cancer, bladder cancer, and it spread.
So, she was in a lot of pain.
EllenAngelico (23:49):
Yes, she was.
Larry (23:50):
She was a trooper to the end.
I'm saying, guys, I listenedto this, alright folks?
You, giving away some stuff.
But she fought to the end.
We're dealing with family member right aswe speak who is dealing with some issues.
She has to decide, is shegoing to fight or not?
She's got to make a decision.
And it's really hard.
My mother had brain cancer and sheended up passing away, but they took the
(24:12):
tumor out and then they sit her down andthey go, okay, here are your choices.
What do you want to do?
And you go, I don't know.
Back in the day, people believe doctors.
I still believe doctors.
I really do.
Cause you know what?
I'm not a doctor.
You know, you come to me about anythingelse, I can have an opinion, but I
didn't go to school for that, so Idon't have an opinion nor should I.
My mother, they sat her down, and theysaid, okay, here are your options.
(24:35):
What would you like to do?
And she said, I don't, what should I do?
And it's scary, Shelly chose, shedecided against her doctor's wishes.
Her doctor said, listen,chemo, radiation too much.
You're too far gone.
Why don't you just be comfortable?
And she said, no, take me to Texas wherethere's a treatment that I don't know
if it's going to work, but it's hope andher parents did it and they went to Texas
(24:56):
and just the fact that they were able todo it together, honorably and with love.
It's so beautiful.
I'm blown away by itbecause she chose to fight.
EllenAngelico (25:04):
Yeah.
It is beautiful and it's also like, Shellywas just going with her gut on that.
That's who she was in lifeand it's who she was in death.
And so it, it makes perfect sensethat when Shelly was admitted to MD
Anderson in Texas, and I texted herthat everyone downtown misses her tons.
She said, "I miss you too.
(25:25):
Coming back soon!"
Larry (25:26):
You didn't expect anything less?
EllenAngelico (25:27):
No!
She was texting people.
I got a text.
Actually, I've been trying to keepthe people who played with Shelly
abreast of kind of like all the eventsthat I'm doing around this, podcast.
And I texted one of her drummersthat I used to play downtown with,
and he texted me and he said, I willnever forget Shelly tried to get me
on some shows while she was in Texas.
Like was asking me if I was availablefor dates at Cadillac Ranch in March.
(25:48):
And this is February that she passed away.
She believed that she was gonna come backand do those shows at Cadillac Ranch.
Larry (25:55):
That's a huge thing.
I'm friends with a guy named Larry.
He's 84 years old.
He's a vet.
He's like me at 84.
So I, I get very afraid.
It's like, I'm, I'm dealing with a man.
I'm like, this guy seems so familiar.
You know, there's something charmingabout him, but he's got plans.
My first inclination, the firstthing I did was, Was like,
That's not going to happen.
Larry, what are you even talking about?
And I shut him down and I thought,what the heck is wrong with me?
(26:18):
You know what?
Maybe it will happen.
Maybe you will.
84 year old man that shoulddefinitely not drive.
Cause you're like Mr.
Magoo, who can't see much.
Look up Mr.
Magoo.
It's hilarious, and it'sdangerous, but he's like,
I'm going to go drive back to WestTennessee and pick up my stuff.
Now I'm like, you know what?
Maybe you will.
Maybe you will.
Why should I squash somebody's hope?
(26:38):
Who the heck am I?
Lord knows I squashed my own hope.
Okay.
I'm good at that.
You are very in demand,your bio is correct.
To call Ellen Angelico means that you area very serious person about your craft.
You have a,
Should I take this gig flow chart?
You take this very seriously.
I know people and I've been this waywhere it's just, Hey, Larry, you want it?
(26:58):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
I'm going to perform.
I'm going to please.
And I'm going to prove my value, my worth.
I'll say yes, I'll do everything great.
And we're going to be best friendsand everything's gonna be wonderful.
And I have all these ideas and Ibring everything to the table and.
What am I doing?
Zero boundaries.
Larry is gone.
And I'm not happy because I'mnot taking care of myself.
It's not just being a kidthat just wants to play.
(27:19):
There's a little more, we gotto take care of ourselves.
We have to eat, pay the rent and ourmental health and our physical health.
Going, driving 8 to 14 hours in a vanwith Shelly, it was very unhealthy.
You've done that and you've beenin tour buses all around the world.
So where are you at now?
And how do you feel aboutwhere you came from?
EllenAngelico (27:37):
There's something small that you said in there, which is like,
it's not just kids playing, but that iswhy we started doing this and I started
playing music because it brought mesomething as a kid and I don't ever want
to lose my connection to that feeling.
And like you, it sounds likethere were times that I started
to lose my connection to that.
And if I can give you a recent example,I have always been interested in
(27:59):
local politics and I've always beeninvolved in local races and I tend to
know my council person pretty well.
My previous council woman noticedthat in me and put me up to
serve on a Metro Commission andI did that for a couple years.
Larry (28:15):
Here in Nashville?
EllenAngelico (28:16):
Mhmm and I became the chair of the Metro Arts Commission.
Larry (28:19):
Do we still have that anymore?
Metro Arts Commission?
EllenAngelico (28:22):
It's a long sordid story and I would recommend, any of
the 85 million articles that came outduring my scandal embroiled tenure.
But I was Investing a lot ofenergy into it and not feeling any
of that kid like desire anymore.
And when I left, I startedto regain touch with that.
And so when you say, where are you now?
(28:44):
I am trying to listen to Kid Ellen
with the gigs that I say yes to.
Does it make me excited to get upthere and play that show, you know?
And if it doesn't, just don't do it.
It doesn't even have to be,like, for a good reason.
It can be just because I haven't playedat Lipstick Lounge in a while and, I
would like to do that again and theyhave good french fries, you know?
(29:05):
That can be as simple as As itis, but if there's something
that's drawing you to it, DO THAT.
Don't just do it because youthink it's the right thing to do
because the person is so famousand you think it's gonna elevate
you to this next thing or whatever.
Do it because you want to.
Larry (29:19):
Isn't that easier said than done?
I got to eat Ellen.
EllenAngelico (29:21):
Well, it is and so I have never not had a day job.
I've always had a day job in this townand that provides me not with enough
money to get by, but with enough ofa financial floor to turn stuff down.
And Sarah and I talkabout this all the time.
Sarah is looking out much farther inthe future than I generally am for gigs
because she's trying to lock down asmuch time as possible so that she knows
(29:44):
that she has that financial securityand I don't have to make that choice
because I work at a guitar company.
Larry (29:50):
That's great.
Wow.
You're very smart
EllenAngelico (29:52):
I'm just fortunate.
I mean, think everybody should work at aguitar store, but also I've been fortunate
to work for people that have been largelyflexible with me touring and stuff.
Larry (30:01):
So What's your favorite instrument?
You play so many instruments.
The Shelly Bush story,we'll wrap that in a minute.
Let's go just a little more you, please.
What are your favorite instruments?
You play them all.
It seems all the stringed instruments.
What's your first?
EllenAngelico (30:12):
My first instrument is guitar.
And I do feel the most fluent on guitar.
When I have a guitar in my hands,I don't have to work hard to
communicate what I want to say.
So that is very freeing.
I also play pedal steel and in termsof connecting with Kid Ellen, that
sense of discovery, that hearingsomething on the radio and being like,
I bet I can figure out how to do that!
(30:33):
That feeling of wanting tolock myself in my room and not
come down in time for dinner.
That is what I'm getting on pedal steel.
I'm still nowhere near as goodat pedal steel as I am guitar.
And I probably will never be asgood at pedal steel as I am a
guitar, but I'm enjoying exploringand that feels like a gift.
Just more shows and, get this podcaststuff behind me and just see what's next.
(30:57):
I invented a card gameabout Bro Country Music.
It's called the Bro Country Card Game.
And, it's running up against alicensing problem, the size of which
you could not possibly imagine.
And so I'm curious to see what formit can take next and to explore
fleshing out that little thing, butlike I was saying about you, how
your artistry is not just your music.
(31:19):
That's sort of how Ifeel about myself too.
And I'm realizing that I don't justhave to make albums in order to be the
best version of myself that I can be.
There's as much of me in The Podcast.
There's as much of me in theBro Country Card Game as there
is in any album I've ever made.
And I'm as proud of the podcast as I am...
I'm even prouder of it than I am of someof the recordings that I've worked on.
(31:39):
What's next gosh, I don't know, butthe possibilities are limitless.
It could be anything.
maybe I go back into politics!?
I probably won't.
Larry (31:47):
I would vote Ellen for sure.
So, Girl In A Hurry,the Shelly Bush story.
What did you learn about yourselfnow that you've completed?
So you started this and what,when did you start this?
EllenAngelico (31:57):
I started doing interviews in 2020.
Larry (31:59):
2020.
So it's a five year endeavor.
What have you learned?
What have you taken awayfrom it for your own self?
What do you think?
Wow, I didn't know this about myself.
I'm glad I learned this aboutmyself I would prefer not
to know this about myself.
EllenAngelico (32:11):
Well, I learned that I don't ever wanna do it again unless
I'm paid an exorbitant amount of money.
I mean, you know, as somebody thatis processing a lot of interview
tape and is editing and making apodcast that it is just a lot of work.
Larry (32:22):
Yeah this will never come out...
EllenAngelico (32:23):
It better!
Um, So much of history is in the telling.
Shelly's story is notout there besides this.
I felt a lot of anxiety in the weeksbefore the podcast came out, because
I realized that I was holding.
Shelly's legacy.
Larry (32:42):
Yeah.
EllenAngelico (32:42):
Shelly's memory existed in the minds of her friends
and family, and it didn't existanywhere else until someone, me, came
along and translated it to a storythat other people could understand.
And I was, I'm still scaredbecause what if somebody
doesn't like how I framed them?
What if somebody doesn'tlike how they are portrayed?
(33:02):
This is Shelly's story, but it'stold through an Ellen colored lens.
And, it hit me like a ton ofbricks because I realized that
must be every story is that way.
Every story that you ever read in ahistory book, every biography that
you ever read of a musician that youloved, every liner notes that you read.
There is no truth to anything.
It's all through the lensof our own experience and
(33:25):
that's heavy and frightening.
Larry (33:28):
Well, I commend you for it.
It's a fantastic story.
It absolutely is.
Absolutely.
Girl in a hurry.
The Shelly Bush story.
You inspired me so much to get thisgoing, by the way, you inspired me
to revisit this project because Ithink we need to Just Keep Talking.
I think if we keeptalking, we're not alone.
And I think that YourStory Absolutely Matters.
And I encourage people to Just KeepTalking, to share their stories.
(33:52):
As Brené Brown would say,
"Don't ask what the world needs.
Ask what makes you comealive and go do it.
Because what the world needsis people who have come alive."
You, Ellen Angelico, have come alive.
I have a few questions just toend this This is my questionnaire.
What fascinates you right now?
What is something you'rereally into right now?
EllenAngelico (34:10):
Well, I really got into, um, Spectral Denoise
when I was making this podcast...
Larry (34:15):
Making the world a less noisy place.
I'm all about it.
Good!
Denoise!
We need less noise.
Perfect.
Great.
uh, What pisses you off?
What angers you?
EllenAngelico (34:25):
I read a really interesting book about anger recently,
and I can't remember the name of theauthor, I should look it up, but it
was basically about not vilifying angerand allowing yourself to feel angry.
And recognizing that anger cansometimes be pointing you towards
a broader truth about yourself.
It's productive to feel angry.
It's an emotion like any other.
It doesn't have to be squashed.
(34:45):
It should be experienced.
And it kind of flipped my brain aroundon it because I don't personally
experience like big emotional swings.
I don't have like way highhighs and way low lows.
Larry (34:56):
Good for you!
EllenAngelico (34:58):
I think that's because I feel some pressure to moderate.
I feel some pressure to, make myselfand my experience of the world
palatable to people around me.
And one of the ways that I do that isby not experiencing anger too strongly.
After reading that book, I'vetried to get more connected
with that, the feeling of anger.
Larry (35:15):
The question was, What makes you angry?
So in other words, understandinganger makes you feel angry?
EllenAngelico (35:19):
Exactly.
No, I would say what I've learned Isthat there is a little flicker of anger
that happens to me sometimes that I'vemostly ignored throughout my life.
And it does seem to mostlyhappen, around injustice.
It's not a just world.
And, it sucks.
Larry (35:34):
Well, I want to do a whole series on injustice.
I really do.
And I think that everybody I speak withand this community that we have here
in Nashville and my friends and lovedones, we all have feelings of injustice.
The scariest part is that there is nojustice but everybody has an idea
of what maybe it could look like.
And I just think it'ssomething to talk about more.
So we'll delve into that another time.
EllenAngelico (35:52):
Just Keep Talking.
Larry (35:53):
What, brings you joy?
EllenAngelico (35:56):
Man.
When you have that feeling of makingmusic with other people, where you
feel connected to the people you'replaying with, you feel connected to
the people who are listening, you feelconnected to a force of spirituality
that is bigger than yourself, biggerthan you could just make by yourself.
That feeling of communion, that is thebest feeling in the entire world, and
(36:19):
I'm always in pursuit of that feeling.
Larry (36:21):
I wish I didn't have one more question because you could end it
there, is the hardest one of all.
Ellen, toilet paper over or under?
EllenAngelico (36:30):
Oh, like that.
Over?
Larry (36:32):
Ellen just indicated over and I almost changed her toilet paper
before because it's under, my friend.
Your toilet paper in yourguest bathroom is under.
So you're either a liar I'm kidding.
EllenAngelico (36:43):
It is under now?
Larry (36:44):
It's under right now.
Do you have a cat?
EllenAngelico (36:46):
No, my brother was the most recent denizen.
Larry (36:50):
We'll blame on the brother,
EllenAngelico (36:50):
that bathroom.
Larry (36:51):
But your answer is correct.
Toilet paper over.
Ladies and gentlemen, Ellen Angelico.
You are a magician of a musician.
You play every stringed instrument.
You're a producer.
You're a gun for hire.
You are a gem of a human being.
How do we get in touch with you if youwant people to get in touch with you?
You've got social media
EllenAngelico (37:10):
Think you could just, um, SHOUT!
Really Loud, wherever you are.
Larry (37:13):
Yeah
EllenAngelico (37:14):
Yeah, I do.
I currently, my socialmedia is all sort of.
Bereft of everything that doesn'thave to do with Shelly, but I
have my website ellenangelico.
com and you can always getin touch with me there.
Larry (37:23):
Oh my goodness Girl In A Hurry The Shelly Bush Story out now.
It is a beautiful podcast.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you for your energy.
Thank you for your friendship.
You look after me, which I know andyou look after Sarah Tomek, my wife.
I'm so grateful to know you.
EllenAngelico (37:39):
You too larry.
Larry (37:39):
This has been wonderful.
Thanks again.
Thanks for listening.
Just Keep Talking folks.
Just
Keep Talking.
Bye.
Bye.
Brother Love (37:47):
Please like, share, and subscribe.
Our YouTube page is atJust Keep Talking Podcast.
Instagram is at the JustKeep Talking podcast.
We have such a wonderfulcommunity here in Nashville.
Thank you so much for listening.
And remember, we arenot alone out there...
So, don't forget touse your turn signal!!!
Telling our stories is the connective tissue of the
collective human experience.
The Just Keep Talking podcast delvesinto the lives and stories of artists.
What is the impact ofmental health on creativity?
What does it mean to bea creative individual?
Someone who feels deeply, experiencesjoy and pain, intensely and
navigates the challenges of lifethrough the creative process.
(00:21):
With each story shared, we explore theauthentic experience of our basic need
to Be Seen, to Be Heard, and to Belong.
We're really not so different fromone another, nor are we alone.
Together we can inspire, encourage, andenlighten each other to find the true joy
and fulfillment that is within ourselves.
When we Just Keep Talking, we createthe space for gratitude, self-acceptance
(00:46):
and grace in everyday life in aworld filled with divisiveness.
Fostering inclusivity and connection isa powerful way to make a positive impact.
The Just Keep Talkingpodcast with me, Brother.
Love, because Your Story Matters.
Larry (01:02):
Welcome one.
Welcome all.
Welcome to the Just Keep Talking podcast.
My name is Brother Love and Iam here with Ellen Angelico.
Hello.
EllenAngelico (01:10):
Hello.
Larry (01:11):
Oh my goodness.
I have been starting this podcast andI can't even say that this is a start.
Maybe it's been paused.
Maybe I've been paused.
I've been starting this for so many yearsand the show should just be called Scared
To Start, or it's called Scared To Dream.
I'm not so sure, but there'sfear involved in here.
(01:31):
I appreciate your grace and I appreciateyou tuning in and I appreciate
to be in Ellen Angelico's home.
She is a musician.
I'm sorry, she?
EllenAngelico (01:40):
Yes, she's great.
Larry (01:41):
Is that great?
You know, I was questioning this,and I thought, I'm gonna ask on air.
My wife is like, youbetter find out beforehand.
Because we live in a worldnow, where people say, you
better find out before you go.
So, she.
Beautiful.
EllenAngelico (01:56):
Sarah didn't
Larry (01:57):
My wife
EllenAngelico (01:57):
Sarah's been calling me she forever, and
I've not had a problem with it.
Larry (02:01):
You are very accommodating you are an entertainer you are
a musician You're a songwriter.
You are a producer.
You are a Podcaster you arean absolute force of nature.
I am so grateful to be here I'm I've beenblown away by you for years And I was
scared to, I was scared to death of you.
(02:21):
I was, because you're that good.
EllenAngelico (02:23):
Do you not see yourself that way too?
Because I see you that way.
Not that I'm scared of you.
Cause I'm mostly not,
Larry (02:30):
Right.
Mostly not,
EllenAngelico (02:33):
But I see that.
In your art too, because of courseI've seen you perform with your
band, but I've also done a gigwith you that was like a cover gig.
And who you are in this podcastand who you are on Lightning
100, it's all Brother Love.
It's all an extension of who you areas an artist and your voice comes
(02:56):
through, whether you're playingThe congas or you're interviewing
somebody and that's how I see you too.
Larry (03:02):
Thank very much.
What a great way to start.
This is awesome.
Well, let me just read from, this isthe bio, this is from your website.
In case you didn't know, Ellenis an in demand session musician
based in Nashville, Tennessee.
The Nashville scene calls Ellen an angel.
ace of all things stringed, theyare not wrong and one of, and I'm
quoting here, and one of the "Greatestutility players in Nashville."
(03:23):
She plays guitar, bass,pedal steel, mandolin, banjo,
dobro, keys, and trombone.
Those are not stringed instruments,by the way, but who's bragging.
Every, she plays everywherefrom the Grand Ole Opry to Guam.
Oh my goodness.
I love this.
When she's not backing up a varietyof talented acts, such as Cam, Mickey
(03:44):
Guyton, Brandy Clark, Uncle Cracker,which I thought was hilarious, Delta
Ray, Ty Herndon, uh, Adeem the artistand many others, my gosh, Ellen pens
a quarterly column for Premier Guitar.
Are you still doing that?
EllenAngelico (03:57):
still doing that.
Larry (03:58):
See, she does everything.
Under the moniker, Uncle Ellen.
Which I think is amazing.
This is great.
Ellen regularly volunteers withorganizations like Please Vote
Nashville, Nashville Launchpad,and Association of Horizon.
And she proudly serves on thehearing board of the Nashville
Musicians Association, AFM Local 257.
(04:18):
You're a union cat, huh?
All right.
She's a union gal.
She hopes to leave the music industrybetter than, the way she received it.
You do it all right.
You really do, and you are greatat it all, and you are right.
We did play a show together, and Iwant to, um, express how grateful
I was that you were on board.
I printed out an email.
(04:39):
This is how hard Ellen works,and how much she cares.
So this was a cover gig that Ibelieve my wife put together.
Did you put it together?
It was the
EllenAngelico (04:47):
No, I didn't put it together.
I'm so nervous about what I've
Larry (04:50):
This is great.
So there was a cover gig.
So my wife, Sarah Tomek,world famous Sarah Tomek She
put together a corporate gig.
And she gathered us alltogether like a superstar band.
EllenAngelico (05:01):
It was an incr.
The, the amount of talent thatwas in that band was wild.
Yeah.
Larry (05:05):
And we were playing, it was at the City Winery.
And we did everything.
We did like seventies rock androll to country music of today
and everything in between.
And so you have all of these killers,these really great, I was, I was hired.
My wife hired me and I believeshe even paid me, so she, she
gathered these great musiciansand, there's such an undertaking.
(05:27):
There's like, I don't know, 20 songs, 40.
So there's so many songs.
So everybody needs to be on the same page.
For those of you listeningin, um, we chart things out.
It's a guide, right?
You are able to chart music.
I hit things as a drummer.
I can read the charts.
I understand them, butI'm not a chart writer.
You.
In detail.
This band was calledthe Down Underwood Band.
(05:49):
Okay, Ellen took everysong and gave us notes.
You listened to every song andsaid Play Something Country.
This is where I see me playing whatI play and somebody else playing.
We need this guidance.
This is something you are meticulous.
One of us, it says,"Play something country."
One of us should do rhythmand one should do lead.
I'm comfortable either way.
(06:10):
I thought this is great.
And it just goes, I thought, well, okay,because we had a lead guitar player.
We had you playing pedal steel, lap steel.
And lead guitar, I think,if not something like that.
Okay.
Take it easy.
The old Eagles favorite.
Okay...
I never learned the solo for this one.
So I'd be more comfortable doingrhythm unless you guys don't mind
(06:32):
the solo not being exactly right.
Now I know it's funny, but this isimportant stuff because I've been,
you've been on a million more gigsthan I have, where, you know, that
you've learned the solo, but maybenobody asked you and you did it anyway.
And because you know,you need to be prepared.
Cause you, I've been on theother side where it's like,
(06:52):
well, who, who learned this?
And I go, I don't know.
I didn't learn nobody.
And you know, the old,nobody asked me, right.
But you're giving notes, likesaying, this is what I'm good at.
I know my strengths.
I know my weaknesses.
That is a gift that you have.
I'll go down Orange Blossom Special.
Been a minute since I've played thisone, fine to solo as much as needed.
See, this is confidence.
(07:12):
You instill confidence in us.
I read that.
I go work.
Good, Sarah, we're golden.
We got you, we got Johnson Jay on guitar.
I mean, we are so good, but the factof the matter is this is the gig that
you were hired on and you cared enoughto write every song out and go through
it and say, here's my weakness, here'smy strength and here are my thoughts
(07:33):
because I care, look at this Brown Sugar.
To be honest, I'm not superfamiliar with this one.
How dare you, first of all.
The Rolling Stones.
I'm gonna listen to it a bunch,but if someone knows the parts
well, please feel free to cover theclassic rock shaped hole in my brain.
That's honesty.
See?
But look at this.
Redneck Woman?
I'm on steel.
(07:53):
Done,
EllenAngelico (07:54):
Right?
Larry (07:55):
We go, yep, yes ma'am, you got it.
EllenAngelico (07:57):
This is, this is over the top though.
This is, this is too
Larry (08:00):
It's exactly who you are because you care.
EllenAngelico (08:02):
This is so nuts.
Really the takeaway here isthat I should just learn the
solo for Take it easy already.
Larry (08:08):
No, no, no.
What the point of the matter is, isthat you're working well with others.
You're not just coming at it.
Like I, me, mine.
This is a community beingin a band is one thing.
Being a hired gun with a bunchof other cats is another animal.
And you're able to just say, allright, let me do my homework,
so I'm as prepared as possibleand I can give notes accordingly.
(08:29):
And you know, you're nottelling everybody what to do.
I mean, how many gigs have you playedwhere somebody who's hired Just the
same pay grade as you are comes inand starts bossing everybody around.
Sometimes that's nice.
I don't mind that because I'mlike, great, tell me what to do.
if it's somebody else's music,I have less of an ego about it.
Your love of music isoutstanding, and it is moving.
(08:50):
The reason why we're sitting hereright now is because you just released
an incredible, podcast of your own.
And I just want to make sure that there'snobody podcasting in this town, but me.
EllenAngelico (08:59):
So I'm here to kill you.
Larry (09:01):
I'm here to get rid of everything, all the evidence.
I'm kidding.
Ellen Angelico presents (09:03):
Girl In A Hurry, the Shelly Bush story.
What an incredible journey.
I listened to all of it I.
Loved it.
EllenAngelico (09:13):
Thanks.
Larry (09:13):
Now, you're a musician.
You are a side person pretty much, right?
that's, your gig.
EllenAngelico (09:19):
Yeah.
Larry (09:20):
You played with Shelly Bush.
Explain to us who Shelly Bush was.
EllenAngelico (09:25):
They called her the queen of Broadway.
She's a honky tonk herothrough and through.
She had dreams of being a big star.
Those dreams did not come tofruition, but she worked her tail
off and she was well known amongthe people who played Broadway.
She was very well knownin her hometown, Revered,
Larry (09:43):
And where was she from?
EllenAngelico (09:44):
Stover, Missouri, Morgan County, Missouri, and she Whenever she
went back to Missouri to play, it was justthis big, like, oh my God, Shelly's back.
It was like, this is the person who'sgone off and made it big and done
the thing and lives in Nashville.
And she really was, uh,Special in a lot of ways.
And in a lot of ways, she wasexactly the same as you and me.
(10:04):
I think, obviously I think we're special,but we're just musicians doing our thing
and trying to make a living and tryingto get by Shelly was that way too.
I just felt that somebodyneeded to get her story.
There isn't a lot of information aboutShelly on the internet because most of
her career kind of predates the dailyinternet use that we all experience today.
(10:25):
And a lot of Shelly's careerwas like pre cell phones.
And so if you Google Shelly, youknow, before my podcast came out,
you basically just got her obituary.
And so I wanted to put something outthere so that Shelly's story could live
on even though it wasn't on the internet.
And I also wanted to do it to show herfriends and family that their stories
(10:48):
matter and that Shelly's story matteredand that I noticed her even if she
didn't get the recognition that shewas kind of seeking in her lifetime.
Larry (10:56):
You're a session player, you're a touring musician, you've been everywhere.
You really have.
Cutting your teeth on Broadway,Nashville, was with Shelly.
correct?
Like you, you sort of came in, youwere kind of green on that scene.
EllenAngelico (11:09):
Yes, very much so.
I mean, I had been in an indie rock band,and I had been in a, like, regionally
successful country cover band, so I hadexperience, I had touring experience.
Larry (11:19):
Regionally where?
Chicago area?
EllenAngelico (11:20):
No, here, and the Midwest, um, And for both of those projects, I
lived in Nashville and so I had touringexperience, but I didn't really have
a foothold in the scene of Nashville.
And so that was when I got off theroad with that country cover band.
That's when a friend of minetold me about Shelly told me
that she had an all female band.
And at Broadband.
(11:41):
and at the time I had boobs and aguitar and I was eminently qualified.
And I was immediately on as muchwork as I wanted to be on, as
much work as I could handle.
It's incredible to go back and say,give love to something we've done in
the past, especially in this business.
This business is about tomorrow.
(12:02):
This business is what's next.
What's next?
I've suffered greatlybecause of what's next.
I've suffered personally, relationshipsthat I thought were friends, relationships
that I thought, uh, were longer lasting.
Relationships with alcohol.
Relationships with my own self andself esteem all suffered because
I am so worried about what's next?
(12:23):
I'm upset about what I didn'tdo right in the past, right?
Could hey, can I get thatsong back please sir or ma'am?
You know, or can we do this differently?
Or wow, we shouldn't have lostthat record deal, that sucked.
This is great, while we're playingthis gig right here, this is great.
But oh my God, I got to get ittogether tomorrow, tomorrow, tomorrow,
tomorrow, next, next, next, next.
And of course, with scrolling andthe way everything is so quickly
right now, but looking back,you looked back with reverence.
(12:45):
You said, wow, this is somethingthat was helped me in my own growth.
And part of the thing that I thinkis amazing is that you are around
somebody that, am I wrong in sayingthat she really wanted to be famous?
Oh yeah.
She was, her whole, her solefocus was to get famous.
An old school style record deal.
That was what she wanted.
Larry (13:06):
And she worked forever for it.
She worked so hard.
This is a phenomenal podcast.
You guys play a show on lower Broadway.
For those of you who don't know, the lowerBroadway shifts are like 4 hour shifts,
and it starts like 10to 2, 2 to 6, 6 to 10.
And are there still the late night?
There has to be.
EllenAngelico (13:21):
Oh yes, absolutely.
Larry (13:22):
The insane and Lower Broadway is busier now than ever.
I mean, it is busier, busier, busier.
So for you to get off of a 4 hour shiftand you're not four hour taking breaks.
It used to be breaks back in the day.
There used to be, but now youare playing for four hours.
If you need to go to the bathroom,you just go to the bathroom and you
have somebody else on stage playing.
So you would play for fourhours straight with Shelly.
(13:44):
Um, and then you would get into the van.
Not a bus.
EllenAngelico (13:47):
Sometimes eight hours straight with Shelly
and then get in the van.
Larry (13:51):
And it wasn't a tour bus.
It wasn't, hey, we're goingto go, and I'm going to put my
head in a bunk and go to sleep.
And then I'm going to wake upin Florida and play tomorrow.
EllenAngelico (13:58):
I played with Shelly at the end of her life and I realized
pretty quickly because my gig prior tobeing with Shelly was on a tour bus.
And so I realized pretty quickly thatthe travel part of it was not for me.
And I stopped saying yes to gigswith Shelly that were like more
than six hours away because Ididn't want to deal with that grind.
But she was doing it up until her passing.
Larry (14:17):
What do you feel about fame?
What is fame?
EllenAngelico (14:20):
Oh, gosh.
Larry (14:20):
I mean, you work with somebody to try to help them achieve this goal.
What is fame to you?
EllenAngelico (14:25):
Well, I didn't work with Shelly to help her achieve her goal.
To be clear, my motivations for workingwith Shelly were pretty selfish.
Like, I wanted to, work andmake money as a guitar player.
That's my dream.
And so I was living my dreamwhile Shelly was pursuing hers.
I've worked with a lot of famous people.
I think that's great.
(14:46):
It's not something thatI value for myself.
I don't see it as a componentof what makes me happy, what
makes me feel fulfilled.
But I think that that's part of whyI wanted to tell this story about
Shelly because even though shewasn't famous, she was important.
The effects of Shelly being alivestill ripple around my life everyday,
(15:09):
and a lot of other people'slives in Nashville too.
Um, not just musicians who playedwith her on a regular basis.
Plenty of musicians just kindof came and went from her band.
The project was not about,awarding Shelly fame.
The project was about correcting thehistorical record and changing how, or
trying , to do my small part in changinghow history values certain people.
(15:33):
Why is shelly less valued than, I don'tknow, name a country singer, Pam Tillis.
I haven't played with Pam Tillis.
I wish I played with Pam Tillis.
Shelly is less valued in the eyesof history than Pam Tillis because
she has less of those conventionalcultural markers of achievement.
But Shelly was extremely important.
(15:53):
I would not be the musicianI am today without her.
And so I was trying to correct thehistorical record about her importance.
Larry (16:00):
I appreciate that very much because I was thinking about it and I'm
like, man, I've worked with artists.
they're wanting for fameoutweighed the music.
It outweighed the relationships.
And I love to quote, Brené Brownpart of what she talks about is,
is fitting in versus belonging.
You know, there's a whole thingabout we work so hard to fit in.
I'll put on these clothes.
I'll work this.
(16:20):
Because there are optics, right?
There's optics that I must, adhereto or, just be this thing, that's
not necessarily me belonging and mefeeling comfortable in my own skin.
Fitting in is, I'm doing everythingso I can be more like you.
Because what you're doing is whatI want, so I'm going to be that.
So, hence a hairdo, hence an outfit,hence, uh, even a vocal take.
(16:43):
Just carrying yourself, you know?
Telling everybody that, um, Hey, weopened up for Rascal Flatts, which is in
your documentary and your podcast whenit's like, yeah, well we played at one
o'clock Rascal Flatts played at nine.
So technically, I've opened upfor Cheap Trick, but guess what?
We were direct supportright before Cheap Trick.
I don't have a problem saying that, butif we played the same day, I'd be like,
(17:03):
yeah, we were on a bill with Cheap Trick.
But I understand because I've workedwith artists that are really in
denial like, no, no, no, no, no, no.
We opened up for Rascal Flatts!
Well I mean, okay.
If you feel better about yourself.
But it's not very authentic.
it sounds to me that Shellywas both as authentic as it
gets and yet still striving forsomething, and wanting to be loved.
(17:25):
To perform and to prove and toplease these are more, Brené
Brown isms, if you will.
Where you lose yourself, you workso hard to just be this thing that
I don't know, do you think Shellyeven knew what this thing was?
I mean, it's a record contract.
It's a record deal.
I get it.
And she had all of the highest, youknow, esteemed players on the record
(17:46):
and the records sound shiny andthey're produced, you know what?
They sound a lot likeeverybody else's records.
And when I listened to the records in allfairness, I'm not saying that she wasn't
good, but when I hear those records,I go, I know what you were going for.
You were going for theRascal Flatts sound.
At the time, 2000, like eight to 15.
That's when I moved to Nashville.
(18:07):
That's when I learned about country music.
And so her records sound likethe records of the times.
EllenAngelico (18:11):
Yes.
Larry (18:12):
I don't even know if I had a question in all of this.
EllenAngelico (18:13):
I think there's, there's like a distinction there too.
It's an interesting thing.
Like you talking about the peoplethat you've played for who want
so desperately to be famous.
And then so many otherareas of their art suffer.
The reality is if what they reallywanted was to be famous, they would
be doing something entirely differentbecause you can achieve fame
without going through all this botherof the music business, you know?
(18:36):
So ultimately that is not whatShelly's overriding goal was.
Her goal was to be famous butshe wanted to be famous for doing
what she loved which was singing.
And so I think that is wherethat's the authenticity part.
She loved to sing it was always inher from when she was a kid with
her three karaoke machines That waswho she was, you know, the same way
(18:59):
that playing guitar, is who I am.
I think Shelly's goal, yes,Shelly wanted a record deal.
mythology of that wasvery important to her.
The mythology of country music.
I guess to kind of answer yourquestion, I don't think she
realized how much she had achieved.
I think a lot of peoplewho played with her do.
I think people who played with hernow look back at that time and see
(19:22):
the way that Shelly elevated them outof a quote unquote, ordinary life.
Yeah.
If you're a good bass player, but youdon't have the organizational skills to
start a band and, buy a van and routeshows to Las Vegas and back, you may
not ever actually see the Grand Canyon.
You know?
There are people in Shelly's band who wereafforded that opportunity to break out
(19:47):
of the doldrums of an everyday existence.
Larry (19:51):
Do you think she was coming from a point of view of that, I don't feel
like I'm good enough in a shame wayor did she feel like I am good enough!
EllenAngelico (19:57):
No, she definitely felt she was good enough.
Larry (19:59):
Right on.
I mean, a big distinction, becausewe struggle for worthiness, right?
We struggle to believe thatwe're valuable, you know?
Part of the exterior is I don'tfeel good about myself, and I'm
going to put up this really reallysterling strong, wall, or defense.
And in my defense, I'm wonderful!
You know what I mean?
And you're like, well, okay, I guessyou say you are, so I believe you.
(20:20):
And thank you for hiring me toplay percussion in your gig.
Cause I couldn't tell.
Part of me felt sorry for her alittle bit and then I don't know
why I know why, because I'm seeingmyself through that I'm seeing myself.
When I started the show saying I'mscared to dream, scared to start.
She was not scared to start,she was not scared to dream.
And so when it didn't happen forher, that's when I start to sort of
(20:43):
tear up a little bit because I'm a 53year old male who moved to Nashville
in a band, a country rock band.
Signed and dropped.
I've dedicated my career to ThemVibes and some other artists
that I've worked with and thingsjust where they're at right now?
It's sad I've had tomourn part of my career.
I'm not a touring musician.
I'm not out there, hustling my own band.
(21:05):
I have a band and we can playwhatever we want, whenever we want.
So I'm free from having to pushmyself in a direction that I
know is just not going to happen.
This fame fortune rockstar thing.
And yet, guess what?
I'm more famous than I've ever been.
And I mean that in a funny way!
Cause Everywhere I go.
It's like, Hey Larry, Oh my
G-d Or it's like, Oh my G-dthat's the guy from the radio.
(21:25):
I love this.
It's another Brené Brown.
"Let go of who you think you'resupposed to be and embrace who you are."
I have been doing that for yearsnow, since I started the idea of
this show, because I'm letting go ofwho I thought I was supposed to be.
You, Ellen Angelico, seem to me toknow who you are, and you were witness
to somebody like Shelly who reallydid know, she knew who she was.
EllenAngelico (21:48):
I don't get it right all the time.
And I don't talk about this in thepodcast because I didn't have a lot
of great information about it, buttowards the end of Shelly's life, she
was looking into going back to school.
She knew that she wasn't goingto be able to keep up the pace
that she was keeping up forever.
And I think part of that isbecause she was getting sick.
She felt her body slowing down.
It's not just this self focused thingof like, I need to know who I am and I
(22:12):
need to get back in touch with the coreand like hue to myself and be authentic.
It's also like circumstances changearound you and you just have to
kind of go with the flow sometimes.
Shelly's story could not havehappened at any other time.
In Nashville history, Broadwayhistory, human history.
It happened when it happened, becausethat was when we had Garmin GPS
(22:36):
units instead of maps on our phones.
It happened when it happened, becauseit was before all the bars on Broadway
went three stories and had more, Rockmusic, party music, wedding music.
And Shelly would not havesurvived in that scene.
It would have been totally different.
It happened at a different timein American political history.
Now members of Shelly's band havevery opposing political views.
(23:01):
And at the time that Shelly was doingher thing, that wasn't as much of
the public national conversation.
I don't look back at it andI'm like, man, I wish those
good old days were back again.
I look at it and I'm like, thatwas an amazing experience that
could have only happened then.
And I'm like, now that it's adifferent thing, there's different
scenes happening downtown.
There's different sceneshappening in my life.
(23:24):
And that's okay.
That's cool.
Like I'm down to just gowith the flow of that.
It's easy for me to say becauseI don't see myself as the artist.
I don't see myself as the product.
It's not like if I don't playMadison Square Garden that
I'm going to die unhappy.
I don't have those kinds of goals.
Larry (23:40):
Do you think Shelly died unhappy?
EllenAngelico (23:42):
God, I hope not.
Um, yeah,
Larry (23:44):
She died in 2015 of cancer, bladder cancer, and it spread.
So, she was in a lot of pain.
EllenAngelico (23:49):
Yes, she was.
Larry (23:50):
She was a trooper to the end.
I'm saying, guys, I listenedto this, alright folks?
You, giving away some stuff.
But she fought to the end.
We're dealing with family member right aswe speak who is dealing with some issues.
She has to decide, is shegoing to fight or not?
She's got to make a decision.
And it's really hard.
My mother had brain cancer and sheended up passing away, but they took the
(24:12):
tumor out and then they sit her down andthey go, okay, here are your choices.
What do you want to do?
And you go, I don't know.
Back in the day, people believe doctors.
I still believe doctors.
I really do.
Cause you know what?
I'm not a doctor.
You know, you come to me about anythingelse, I can have an opinion, but I
didn't go to school for that, so Idon't have an opinion nor should I.
My mother, they sat her down, and theysaid, okay, here are your options.
(24:35):
What would you like to do?
And she said, I don't, what should I do?
And it's scary, Shelly chose, shedecided against her doctor's wishes.
Her doctor said, listen,chemo, radiation too much.
You're too far gone.
Why don't you just be comfortable?
And she said, no, take me to Texas wherethere's a treatment that I don't know
if it's going to work, but it's hope andher parents did it and they went to Texas
(24:56):
and just the fact that they were able todo it together, honorably and with love.
It's so beautiful.
I'm blown away by itbecause she chose to fight.
EllenAngelico (25:04):
Yeah.
It is beautiful and it's also like, Shellywas just going with her gut on that.
That's who she was in lifeand it's who she was in death.
And so it, it makes perfect sensethat when Shelly was admitted to MD
Anderson in Texas, and I texted herthat everyone downtown misses her tons.
She said, "I miss you too.
(25:25):
Coming back soon!"
Larry (25:26):
You didn't expect anything less?
EllenAngelico (25:27):
No!
She was texting people.
I got a text.
Actually, I've been trying to keepthe people who played with Shelly
abreast of kind of like all the eventsthat I'm doing around this, podcast.
And I texted one of her drummersthat I used to play downtown with,
and he texted me and he said, I willnever forget Shelly tried to get me
on some shows while she was in Texas.
Like was asking me if I was availablefor dates at Cadillac Ranch in March.
(25:48):
And this is February that she passed away.
She believed that she was gonna come backand do those shows at Cadillac Ranch.
Larry (25:55):
That's a huge thing.
I'm friends with a guy named Larry.
He's 84 years old.
He's a vet.
He's like me at 84.
So I, I get very afraid.
It's like, I'm, I'm dealing with a man.
I'm like, this guy seems so familiar.
You know, there's something charmingabout him, but he's got plans.
My first inclination, the firstthing I did was, Was like,
That's not going to happen.
Larry, what are you even talking about?
And I shut him down and I thought,what the heck is wrong with me?
(26:18):
You know what?
Maybe it will happen.
Maybe you will.
84 year old man that shoulddefinitely not drive.
Cause you're like Mr.
Magoo, who can't see much.
Look up Mr.
Magoo.
It's hilarious, and it'sdangerous, but he's like,
I'm going to go drive back to WestTennessee and pick up my stuff.
Now I'm like, you know what?
Maybe you will.
Maybe you will.
Why should I squash somebody's hope?
(26:38):
Who the heck am I?
Lord knows I squashed my own hope.
Okay.
I'm good at that.
You are very in demand,your bio is correct.
To call Ellen Angelico means that you area very serious person about your craft.
You have a,
Should I take this gig flow chart?
You take this very seriously.
I know people and I've been this waywhere it's just, Hey, Larry, you want it?
(26:58):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
I'm going to perform.
I'm going to please.
And I'm going to prove my value, my worth.
I'll say yes, I'll do everything great.
And we're going to be best friendsand everything's gonna be wonderful.
And I have all these ideas and Ibring everything to the table and.
What am I doing?
Zero boundaries.
Larry is gone.
And I'm not happy because I'mnot taking care of myself.
It's not just being a kidthat just wants to play.
(27:19):
There's a little more, we gotto take care of ourselves.
We have to eat, pay the rent and ourmental health and our physical health.
Going, driving 8 to 14 hours in a vanwith Shelly, it was very unhealthy.
You've done that and you've beenin tour buses all around the world.
So where are you at now?
And how do you feel aboutwhere you came from?
EllenAngelico (27:37):
There's something small that you said in there, which is like,
it's not just kids playing, but that iswhy we started doing this and I started
playing music because it brought mesomething as a kid and I don't ever want
to lose my connection to that feeling.
And like you, it sounds likethere were times that I started
to lose my connection to that.
And if I can give you a recent example,I have always been interested in
(27:59):
local politics and I've always beeninvolved in local races and I tend to
know my council person pretty well.
My previous council woman noticedthat in me and put me up to
serve on a Metro Commission andI did that for a couple years.
Larry (28:15):
Here in Nashville?
EllenAngelico (28:16):
Mhmm and I became the chair of the Metro Arts Commission.
Larry (28:19):
Do we still have that anymore?
Metro Arts Commission?
EllenAngelico (28:22):
It's a long sordid story and I would recommend, any of
the 85 million articles that came outduring my scandal embroiled tenure.
But I was Investing a lot ofenergy into it and not feeling any
of that kid like desire anymore.
And when I left, I startedto regain touch with that.
And so when you say, where are you now?
(28:44):
I am trying to listen to Kid Ellen
with the gigs that I say yes to.
Does it make me excited to get upthere and play that show, you know?
And if it doesn't, just don't do it.
It doesn't even have to be,like, for a good reason.
It can be just because I haven't playedat Lipstick Lounge in a while and, I
would like to do that again and theyhave good french fries, you know?
(29:05):
That can be as simple as As itis, but if there's something
that's drawing you to it, DO THAT.
Don't just do it because youthink it's the right thing to do
because the person is so famousand you think it's gonna elevate
you to this next thing or whatever.
Do it because you want to.
Larry (29:19):
Isn't that easier said than done?
I got to eat Ellen.
EllenAngelico (29:21):
Well, it is and so I have never not had a day job.
I've always had a day job in this townand that provides me not with enough
money to get by, but with enough ofa financial floor to turn stuff down.
And Sarah and I talkabout this all the time.
Sarah is looking out much farther inthe future than I generally am for gigs
because she's trying to lock down asmuch time as possible so that she knows
(29:44):
that she has that financial securityand I don't have to make that choice
because I work at a guitar company.
Larry (29:50):
That's great.
Wow.
You're very smart
EllenAngelico (29:52):
I'm just fortunate.
I mean, think everybody should work at aguitar store, but also I've been fortunate
to work for people that have been largelyflexible with me touring and stuff.
Larry (30:01):
So What's your favorite instrument?
You play so many instruments.
The Shelly Bush story,we'll wrap that in a minute.
Let's go just a little more you, please.
What are your favorite instruments?
You play them all.
It seems all the stringed instruments.
What's your first?
EllenAngelico (30:12):
My first instrument is guitar.
And I do feel the most fluent on guitar.
When I have a guitar in my hands,I don't have to work hard to
communicate what I want to say.
So that is very freeing.
I also play pedal steel and in termsof connecting with Kid Ellen, that
sense of discovery, that hearingsomething on the radio and being like,
I bet I can figure out how to do that!
(30:33):
That feeling of wanting tolock myself in my room and not
come down in time for dinner.
That is what I'm getting on pedal steel.
I'm still nowhere near as goodat pedal steel as I am guitar.
And I probably will never be asgood at pedal steel as I am a
guitar, but I'm enjoying exploringand that feels like a gift.
Just more shows and, get this podcaststuff behind me and just see what's next.
(30:57):
I invented a card gameabout Bro Country Music.
It's called the Bro Country Card Game.
And, it's running up against alicensing problem, the size of which
you could not possibly imagine.
And so I'm curious to see what formit can take next and to explore
fleshing out that little thing, butlike I was saying about you, how
your artistry is not just your music.
(31:19):
That's sort of how Ifeel about myself too.
And I'm realizing that I don't justhave to make albums in order to be the
best version of myself that I can be.
There's as much of me in The Podcast.
There's as much of me in theBro Country Card Game as there
is in any album I've ever made.
And I'm as proud of the podcast as I am...
I'm even prouder of it than I am of someof the recordings that I've worked on.
(31:39):
What's next gosh, I don't know, butthe possibilities are limitless.
It could be anything.
maybe I go back into politics!?
I probably won't.
Larry (31:47):
I would vote Ellen for sure.
So, Girl In A Hurry,the Shelly Bush story.
What did you learn about yourselfnow that you've completed?
So you started this and what,when did you start this?
EllenAngelico (31:57):
I started doing interviews in 2020.
Larry (31:59):
2020.
So it's a five year endeavor.
What have you learned?
What have you taken awayfrom it for your own self?
What do you think?
Wow, I didn't know this about myself.
I'm glad I learned this aboutmyself I would prefer not
to know this about myself.
EllenAngelico (32:11):
Well, I learned that I don't ever wanna do it again unless
I'm paid an exorbitant amount of money.
I mean, you know, as somebody thatis processing a lot of interview
tape and is editing and making apodcast that it is just a lot of work.
Larry (32:22):
Yeah this will never come out...
EllenAngelico (32:23):
It better!
Um, So much of history is in the telling.
Shelly's story is notout there besides this.
I felt a lot of anxiety in the weeksbefore the podcast came out, because
I realized that I was holding.
Shelly's legacy.
Larry (32:42):
Yeah.
EllenAngelico (32:42):
Shelly's memory existed in the minds of her friends
and family, and it didn't existanywhere else until someone, me, came
along and translated it to a storythat other people could understand.
And I was, I'm still scaredbecause what if somebody
doesn't like how I framed them?
What if somebody doesn'tlike how they are portrayed?
(33:02):
This is Shelly's story, but it'stold through an Ellen colored lens.
And, it hit me like a ton ofbricks because I realized that
must be every story is that way.
Every story that you ever read in ahistory book, every biography that
you ever read of a musician that youloved, every liner notes that you read.
There is no truth to anything.
It's all through the lensof our own experience and
(33:25):
that's heavy and frightening.
Larry (33:28):
Well, I commend you for it.
It's a fantastic story.
It absolutely is.
Absolutely.
Girl in a hurry.
The Shelly Bush story.
You inspired me so much to get thisgoing, by the way, you inspired me
to revisit this project because Ithink we need to Just Keep Talking.
I think if we keeptalking, we're not alone.
And I think that YourStory Absolutely Matters.
And I encourage people to Just KeepTalking, to share their stories.
(33:52):
As Brené Brown would say,
"Don't ask what the world needs.
Ask what makes you comealive and go do it.
Because what the world needsis people who have come alive."
You, Ellen Angelico, have come alive.
I have a few questions just toend this This is my questionnaire.
What fascinates you right now?
What is something you'rereally into right now?
EllenAngelico (34:10):
Well, I really got into, um, Spectral Denoise
when I was making this podcast...
Larry (34:15):
Making the world a less noisy place.
I'm all about it.
Good!
Denoise!
We need less noise.
Perfect.
Great.
uh, What pisses you off?
What angers you?
EllenAngelico (34:25):
I read a really interesting book about anger recently,
and I can't remember the name of theauthor, I should look it up, but it
was basically about not vilifying angerand allowing yourself to feel angry.
And recognizing that anger cansometimes be pointing you towards
a broader truth about yourself.
It's productive to feel angry.
It's an emotion like any other.
It doesn't have to be squashed.
(34:45):
It should be experienced.
And it kind of flipped my brain aroundon it because I don't personally
experience like big emotional swings.
I don't have like way highhighs and way low lows.
Larry (34:56):
Good for you!
EllenAngelico (34:58):
I think that's because I feel some pressure to moderate.
I feel some pressure to, make myselfand my experience of the world
palatable to people around me.
And one of the ways that I do that isby not experiencing anger too strongly.
After reading that book, I'vetried to get more connected
with that, the feeling of anger.
Larry (35:15):
The question was, What makes you angry?
So in other words, understandinganger makes you feel angry?
EllenAngelico (35:19):
Exactly.
No, I would say what I've learned Isthat there is a little flicker of anger
that happens to me sometimes that I'vemostly ignored throughout my life.
And it does seem to mostlyhappen, around injustice.
It's not a just world.
And, it sucks.
Larry (35:34):
Well, I want to do a whole series on injustice.
I really do.
And I think that everybody I speak withand this community that we have here
in Nashville and my friends and lovedones, we all have feelings of injustice.
The scariest part is that there is nojustice but everybody has an idea
of what maybe it could look like.
And I just think it'ssomething to talk about more.
So we'll delve into that another time.
EllenAngelico (35:52):
Just Keep Talking.
Larry (35:53):
What, brings you joy?
EllenAngelico (35:56):
Man.
When you have that feeling of makingmusic with other people, where you
feel connected to the people you'replaying with, you feel connected to
the people who are listening, you feelconnected to a force of spirituality
that is bigger than yourself, biggerthan you could just make by yourself.
That feeling of communion, that is thebest feeling in the entire world, and
(36:19):
I'm always in pursuit of that feeling.
Larry (36:21):
I wish I didn't have one more question because you could end it
there, is the hardest one of all.
Ellen, toilet paper over or under?
EllenAngelico (36:30):
Oh, like that.
Over?
Larry (36:32):
Ellen just indicated over and I almost changed her toilet paper
before because it's under, my friend.
Your toilet paper in yourguest bathroom is under.
So you're either a liar I'm kidding.
EllenAngelico (36:43):
It is under now?
Larry (36:44):
It's under right now.
Do you have a cat?
EllenAngelico (36:46):
No, my brother was the most recent denizen.
Larry (36:50):
We'll blame on the brother,
EllenAngelico (36:50):
that bathroom.
Larry (36:51):
But your answer is correct.
Toilet paper over.
Ladies and gentlemen, Ellen Angelico.
You are a magician of a musician.
You play every stringed instrument.
You're a producer.
You're a gun for hire.
You are a gem of a human being.
How do we get in touch with you if youwant people to get in touch with you?
You've got social media
EllenAngelico (37:10):
Think you could just, um, SHOUT!
Really Loud, wherever you are.
Larry (37:13):
Yeah
EllenAngelico (37:14):
Yeah, I do.
I currently, my socialmedia is all sort of.
Bereft of everything that doesn'thave to do with Shelly, but I
have my website ellenangelico.
com and you can always getin touch with me there.
Larry (37:23):
Oh my goodness Girl In A Hurry The Shelly Bush Story out now.
It is a beautiful podcast.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you for your energy.
Thank you for your friendship.
You look after me, which I know andyou look after Sarah Tomek, my wife.
I'm so grateful to know you.
EllenAngelico (37:39):
You too larry.
Larry (37:39):
This has been wonderful.
Thanks again.
Thanks for listening.
Just Keep Talking folks.
Just
Keep Talking.
Bye.
Bye.
Brother Love (37:47):
Please like, share, and subscribe.
Our YouTube page is atJust Keep Talking Podcast.
Instagram is at the JustKeep Talking podcast.
We have such a wonderfulcommunity here in Nashville.
Thank you so much for listening.
And remember, we arenot alone out there...
So, don't forget touse your turn signal!!!
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