July 1, 2025 • 26 mins
https://justiceteamnetwork.com
In this week's Justice Team Podcast, Bob sits with Cynthia Santiago, immigration attorney, to talk Los Angeles ICE raids and knowing your rights. Stemming from the America's immigration process in the 20th century, Cynthia walks through immigration laws and advice for those who might be facing these issues head on. Stay tuned to the end to figure out how you and your community can help those who might need your help.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:02):
Hey, it's Bob Simon taking abreak to tell you about CallRail.
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Welcome to this episode of the JusticeTeam Podcast on the Justice Team Network.
I'm your host, Bob Simon, and todaywe're gonna be talking about some
very important issues in SouthernCalifornia, but now across the
(00:43):
nation, and that's about immigration.
The rights of those peopleaffected, and we have on.
The Cynthia Santiago.
How are you Ms. Santiago?
I'm good.
I'm good.
You know, chaotic times,but you know, good spirits.
Yeah.
And I know you do a lot ofmedia, a lot of interviews.
People reach out to you because ofyour knowledge in the space and being
boots on the ground and for helping.
(01:03):
Um, and I mean.
How do people reach you?
First of all, I'm sure you havea lot of people reaching out to
you, but how do they find you?
Yeah, so I, I always suggest like,uh, social media, AGA Santiago is the
handle, A-B-O-G-A-D-A, Abada, Santiago.
Um, but also people just call ouroffice or they reach out through,
(01:23):
um, texting us at our office as well.
We try to be very.
Present for different needsbecause if I can't handle it, I
know somebody that will be able
to.
Yeah.
And I think that's important'cause we do the same thing.
I know we, yeah.
We're big on finding the bestwarrior for that specific issue.
Um, I mean, I don't do any immigration,so I just literally will text.
(01:43):
Santiago here.
But you know, one thing, and I thinkpeople need to recognize is, you know,
you're a mom, you're balancing life.
I mean, two of your kids areoutside the studio right now.
It's summer break, but you, youstill have to fight every day.
Yeah.
You know, I think that, um, since I openedup the practice in 2012, I. My mission
has always been, um, fighting for mycommunity because of the impact that it's
(02:05):
had growing up, uh, with immigrant parentsand the community I, I RA was raised in.
But also, um, there was a big componentof why I opened up my own firm is to
do know your rights because even ifwe didn't have an immediate threat in
our face back then in 20 12, 20 13.
I wanted my community to leavewith information and knowledge
(02:26):
on how to protect themselves.
Yeah.
And let's, let's talkabout knowing your rights.
You know, right now, mid-June2025, a lot of chaotic times.
What are you telling people out there?
What are some suggestions you have for,for folks that either are employers or
people that are, that may be affected?
Yeah.
You know, it really is acomplicated issue because.
(02:49):
While I appreciate the know your rightsinformation that we're hearing so much
in social media and in the news, a lot ofthese things are not a one size fits all.
A lot of people have so many differentfactors in their case that it's
important that if they can reach outto an attorney and or a nonprofit
and get an individualized assessment.
(03:10):
Then they're gonna know what theycan do on the spot at that moment.
Or they can try to do affirmativelynow while like, you know, they're
not under any risk and they can filesomething to kind of get ahead of this,
which is what I've been telling folks,like, you need to know where you stand.
If you have previously been deported,then asking to see a judge isn't
(03:32):
gonna happen because you havean an order against you already.
So you're under a different process ofbeing expedited, removed, or reinstated.
So there's just like so many layers ofcomplications with these cases that,
um, that assessment is the first step.
Um, the know your rights advisors aregood general concepts, but there's
nothing, you know, that will, um, youknow, there's, there's nothing better
(03:56):
than to have an a person than an attorney.
That's what I do at the endof every consultation is we
do a Know your rights prep.
Mm-hmm.
If you're picked up,what are you gonna do?
What are you gonna say?
What are you gonna argue to see?
Because you're not gonnahave an attorney there.
You've gotta argue for yourself.
And I want each of my consultationsclients to leave knowing like,
(04:16):
okay, I'm gonna be able tohandle this if this happens.
And worst case scenario, this isgonna happen, and my attorney then
will be called and then she'llrespond and come and support me.
Yeah.
So let's go through, I mean, do youhave like those general blocks of
categories of folks from like theasylum seekers to perhaps kids, to folks
that may have had a deportation issue?
I. Or folks that have been justwaiting in line for a decade.
(04:39):
Yeah.
Or two.
What are Or two.
Two or two.
Decades?
Two.
But I mean, let's talk about that first.
Like Yeah.
Yeah.
I hear, we hear on socialmedia all the time.
Well, my parents came here legally,so these people have to do it too.
And
now you gotta go.
Yeah.
Um, then we would startwith the concept of.
Our immigration system from its inceptionin the 19, like even in the 19 hundreds,
you would see like the great wavewhere millions of people were allowed
(05:03):
in because of the conditions that theywere fleeing and and their country.
And, you know, uh, we're in a positionwhere our immigration laws were very
open borders, and then in the eightiesand nineties became more about reform
and control and, um, punishing folks.
And so that's.
(05:24):
I think the principle issue isthat understanding the history
of immigration law, it has notalways been about getting in line.
It's been about, you know, openingup the doors and people come and see.
And that's
been, and people don't realize in the lastdecade or two, it's been very difficult.
Yeah.
I mean, I know people that havebeen here paying taxes, members
of the community that have beenjust waiting in line for 20 years.
(05:44):
Yeah.
Um, I just did a presentation witha large organization, executives and
whatnot, uh, and employees and they.
And I went through the historyand the 1980s was the last time
Congress actually did an immigrationlike amnesty type project.
Yes.
Process.
And then we get into 1996 when Congressdid do the illegal Immigration Reform Act.
(06:08):
And so that is one to punishindividuals who enter the United
States without permission.
So it's 1996 all, andit's been, yes, it's been
more about control, punishingconsequences, and it's going to continue
to get that way unless we make immediatechanges to our immigration system.
Yeah, and
that's what, you know, and it's, youknow, we see that, I've seen the video of
(06:29):
Ronald Reagan who granted amnesty to me.
It's just why would you not just say,Hey, if you've been a member of the
community, you, you've been payingtaxes, you've an upstanding person.
Why not try to find a path tocitizenship for those folks that are
contributing so positively to everybody?
Why would that be so hard?
Yeah.
Well, the, the wave that we have now underthis administration, um, doesn't have
(06:54):
that perspective of seeing individualsthat are others, uh, seeing individuals
of diverse backgrounds, uh, as, um,you know, as people that deserve, or
that people that are humans that have.
Uh, a family that have done alot to contribute this admission
doesn't see that in individuals.
(07:15):
They see them as, um, criminals and they,they have a whole nother perspective,
um, mostly having to do with the southernborder and who's coming and, and so
I think that's the, the reality of itthat we have to just also acknowledge
that this administration does not see.
The immigrant community the sameway they see them as less of lesser.
(07:36):
So are, are people, are peoplegetting ra racially profiled?
Yes.
Please describe.
Yes.
So, you know, simply driving, um,and out in public or being in a, you
know, location that's very open, likethe car wash workers, uh, um, day
laborers at the Home Depot centers.
The simple, like just the approachis, uh, the simple way to describe
(07:59):
it is that they're looking at folksthat look of a certain race ethnicity.
Latino, for example, has been themajority of individuals picked up,
but they, it's not like they'reseeking a specific person.
That's not like they're saying,oh, they have no idea this person's
background.
And that's why, you know, unfortunatelycitizens were getting picked up.
This just happened close tous here in the South Bay.
(08:21):
Oh, I just wonder, I mean, ifyou could explain to people
like, yeah.
I hear folks say, you know,back Midwest, east coast.
Yeah.
That doesn't happen.
They're not picking up peoplethat are here illegally.
They're only getting criminals.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean that was, um,
true or not true.
That was the slogan during the campaign.
And, um, once, you know, he came intooffice and we know there shouldn't
individuals in that office that are veryvocal about who they should be enforcing
(08:46):
immigration laws against and who.
No, they're not touching.
But the, the reality is that it's, it'sa very, the situation that's happened
in LA is a very, uh, detain themfirst and then ask questions later.
Whoa.
But that's that.
I mean, are they allowingdue process through this?
Um, there's so much going on withonce a person is detained, I don't
(09:10):
think they had a plan or strategy.
Like they don't even haveplaces to detained first.
Ask questions later.
Yeah.
Detained first, ask questions later.
What we've been seeing is, um.
People are getting detained and beingput into the immigration, like, uh, the
immigration offices where they're notequipped to house people overnight, so
(09:30):
they're sleeping on the floor, they'renot being fed properly, and then they're
trying to determine where to sendpeople that have bed space for them.
And so a lot of individuals fromLA were are in El Paso, Texas.
They're in, uh, Florida,they're in other states.
Um, really there's an yes there.
There was about two or three daysa lot of families couldn't find
(09:51):
their family member and we were ableto locate them in another state.
A completely, because it's creates,lemme guess, creates chaos so that then
they don't have access to attorneys.
Yeah.
Because they're also now in anotherstate, they don't have access to their
family as easily and it degrades theirmental state to wanna fight the case.
And, I mean, and let me guess,these are private prison centers
(10:14):
that are also benefiting bigley.
Yeah.
On retaining folks.
Yeah.
We trace back to billions of beingmade from the detention centers
and opening up new contracts.
But specifically there is, uh, uh,agreement called 2 87 G. It's a, it's
a contract that local law enforcementagencies can make with the federal
(10:37):
government so that they can be housing.
Uh, people that are detained.
So, uh, my good friends, a lot ofgood friends that cover investigative
work, they've covered these, um,stories of when a new contract is open,
it's public information and you'restarting to see, you know, when they
get approved and they, they get money.
They get money, local lawenforcement's agencies, and, um,
(10:59):
in states like, you know, statesway far away from Los Angeles and.
Um, that's what happened inGlendale recently as well.
They, Glendale had had a grandfatheredcontract with the federal government
to house folks, and then there waspublic outcry and it was canceled.
It was canceled.
I saw that.
Yeah.
So, but, but this is not gonna happenin, you know, the, you know, some
(11:21):
random city in Texas or Georgia, youknow, just locations where, um, some
of the individuals are ending up.
Yeah.
So they're trying to, they'retrying to financially benefit in.
With their strategic partnersof where they're sending people
wrongfully or not detained.
Yeah.
Just doesn't matter.
Yeah.
And I mean also, like we've seen itbefore in the, per one of the folks
(11:43):
you were mentioning, Stephen Miller,who used to be a professor of yours.
No,
no, no.
We used to be classmates.
Classmates.
You were classmates with Stephen Miller.
I was gonna say professor.
Ugh.
But
so, so, uh, I went toSanta Monica High School.
Mm-hmm.
Um, I didn't know him in middleschool, but I'm, you know, that's
where a lot of people believethat this started, this, uh.
(12:04):
You know, historical, mental, like,uh, campaign of wanting to promote
a society that was assimilated, thatdidn't celebrate diversity, that
everyone had to be a certain way.
Yeah.
And English only things to that
I've seen effect.
I mean, you've seen videos of himin high school saying that these,
they should be cleaning our food.
(12:24):
We should be, I was on
stage at the same, same time.
Yeah.
So I, I ran for student body president.
Uh, he was running for Speaker of theHouse, which, uh, was unfortunately,
uh, you know, that the articlesdidn't specify that, but I was
running for student Body President.
He was running for Speaker ofthe House, another position.
So we were all on stage gettingready to do our speeches,
(12:44):
and ours was the last one.
So I heard that speech.
The entire crowd of students were like.
Anywhere from ninth graders to11th graders booing him for that,
and he was taking off the stage.
Well just tell everybody what happened.
You know, he, he simply was like, he,he was being who he was on campus.
That's why I wasn't surprisedthat something like that, it
(13:05):
was not approved previously.
He went off and did his own statement asto, you know, why should we pick up after
ourselves if we have janitors to do this?
It's, yeah, I've heard somehorror stories, but, and
I know I had classes with him.
I don't remember every particular detail.
'cause obviously high school wasa long time ago, but I, I, I had,
(13:26):
um, interactions where, you know,as someone that was involved in my
student body, my campus, um, always,you know, doing, promoting diversity
events and cultural awareness eventsand promoting, um, you know, just.
People's mental, like socialjustice issues that, you know,
a lot of the students embraced.
(13:48):
Um, he was, you know, very.
Limited.
There wasn't a lot of peoplethat shared that belief.
It was very, it was a very small,like it was him and maybe like five
other friends that shared that belief.
Wow.
And they would try to promote, you know,that assimilation English only, um,
you know, highly criticized the welfareprograms, social social services programs.
(14:13):
Uh, cri criticize affirmative action.
He criticized a lot of the, the,the things that are good for our
community, our social wellbeing.
Um, and I ended up being the first Latinastudent body president of my campus.
Congratulations.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Thank you.
And like it just so
he's Yeah.
He probably has it out for you.
No, he doesn't.
He,
he was like this since middle schoolis what, what has been the picture.
(14:35):
And I've the speeches
where he is like, get the quotas up.
You know, where they're at.
Seven 11, they're at Home Depot.
Go get 'em.
I mean, this isn't like the campaignpromise of going to your criminals.
I mean, true or false, are they out there?
The folks that they're picking up, thepeople that you're helping, are these
these hardened criminals that were here?
Yeah.
I mean
the, the latest statistics I sawwas like 10% of the people that were
picked up had a criminal history.
Um, but in their agenda andtheir campaign, uh, coming to
(14:59):
the country without permission isthe criminal aspect that they're,
that's it.
And that's not even a criminal charge.
It's civil.
Yeah,
it's a civil issue.
But it, that's what the,the campaign and the.
You know, the, the motive out there thatwhat they're pushing for the community.
I mean, I, I've never seen anadministration do so much social
(15:19):
media and so much media, uh, well,it's called propaganda commercials.
Yeah.
And, and that really, um, is toincite, that is to incite this fear
and terror into communities andI, and we're not gonna take it.
And we've seen that thecommunity is out there, but now
we know why they've beendoing the DEI thing.
Mm-hmm.
Where they're saying, mm-hmm.
They're taking your jobs.
(15:40):
This is all a big lead, and itis a scare factor to tell people
things that just aren't true.
Like I don't see people lining upto go, uh, cook in the kitchens
where they took the cooks.
I don't see people liningup to go to the warehouses.
I don't see people out on the fields.
Yeah.
Where the migrant workers are.
Nope.
Yeah.
You know, and, and then that'sthe other thing too, like we.
(16:00):
We do, um, have a, a narrative of like,you know, these workers are, or these
people are taking your jobs and they,they're taking our system and they're
abusing of our system and whatnot.
But we also have to understandlike we have a huge majority of
folks that are foreign born thatlive in the country, entrepreneurs.
(16:23):
Mm-hmm.
Um, the DACA recipients were essentialin the, the pandemic situation.
A lot of, uh, the daca, sorry, theDACA students were workers in the
pandemic situation, so it just, it's.
Our, also, our role in society as, um,children of immigrants or immigrants
is threatening to them as well.
(16:44):
It's not just the farm workers andour, our, our day laborers that are,
are doing the, the grit work in oursociety, but it's like we are also a
threat if you have a a degree, if youhave some type of a Yeah, and that's
because they teach you.
It's like didn't earn it, quote unquote.
I say now they think anybody that.
(17:05):
Is of a certain color that theydidn't earn the job that they got to.
It's crazy.
Yeah.
That's what they, what they putin people and I don't think people
realize how many healthcare workers
mm-hmm.
Are undocumented or foreign born.
Yeah.
Or foreign born a lot.
From physicians to nurses, topeople that are taking care of
our elderly and our children.
Yeah,
it's a lifeblood and peoplejust do not realize it.
(17:26):
My mom was a home care worker.
My mom was a nanny.
My, you know, my, my mom did that, thatwork in, um, in taking care of others.
And I think that if we change ournarratives to show more visibility
of who, who are the immigrants inour country and what we do, then.
(17:47):
Then the, I think that would open upalso people's eyes because I think
that, um, all this spreading of, ofan image of someone, uh, in a certain
way is what really there's, there'speople in our United States, we have
to understand there's people in theUnited States who have never seen.
Somebody of, you know, certainbackground, uh, undocumented parents,
(18:07):
immigrant parents, like they've justnever seen somebody to understand
what their background and historyand how much they contribute in.
So what
can, what can lawyers do thatare watching or listening?
How can they get into help if they're not?
They don't do immigration, they'renot doing criminal defense.
Maybe they're in another state.
How can they help?
Yeah, so I mean, just educatingyourself on the immigration situation,
(18:29):
um, assessing your own client base.
I, I've been talking to a lot ofpersonal injury firms and just.
How to assess your clients, like wherethey stand in the immigration picture, and
not that you're gonna necessarily give 'ema consultation, but just know where they
and their family are so that you know ifthey are vulnerable to be picked up and
they have a court case or a deposition.
(18:51):
That you are also protecting themas a whole in a holistic way.
Right.
And their families.
I've spent the past week speakingto like at least 150 of my clients.
Mm-hmm.
And, and understanding who'smissing work, who's not able
to go to, to leave their home.
Yeah.
I saw
you at a post where you canactually donate so that people
can stay home if they feel likethey're gonna go get picked up at.
(19:14):
At work or even church, right?
So,
yeah, no, yeah.
Thankfully for Jose from who's like, um,reached out and we both are kind of just.
Took the lead to try to helpas many folks as possible.
He's, he's, um, helpinga lot with, with that.
And a lot of people are, arejumping in, which is inspiring.
A lot of people want to helpout somebody that they know is
So how, like, so how do people watchingor listening, should they just reach
(19:37):
out to you to be put in touch with justhelping folks so they don't have to feel
scared of getting detained illegally?
Yeah, I mean, people can reach out to meand then Jose from Easylinks and, and I
are talking and, and trying to match up.
A family to someone who iswilling to support them.
Um, you know, we're not reallyposting about all this too much either
because they are put in a vulnerableposition and we're trying to make
(19:59):
sure that we take care of them.
And, you know, they're,they're open to it.
But, you know, he, he has received thecalls and I, I've sent him the calls
and, and he's, you know, people are,are so scared to leave their home and
to go and, and they don't know howthey're gonna get through the month.
Another organization I workwith a lot is called Ello.
(20:21):
They work with a lot ofindigenous immigrants, indigenous
undocumented community.
And um, the effort there has been todeliver grocery boxes and to also help
folks with, um, you know, any needsthat they have for the month to get
through the month for their family.
Wow.
So,
and uh, I know you have, I mean, whenwe talked on Sunday, you had pulled
(20:42):
together, I mean, you have, do you havea group of community of lawyers that are
like-minded that you guys are trying to.
Talk to each other, make sure that,that everything's moving forward.
Yeah, I mean, in, in this time we,we as immigration attorneys are
receiving a lot of the secondarytrauma, but also personal trauma.
Like we, we've been through experiencesof deportation, maybe in our own
(21:04):
immediate families or, or loved ones.
And so, um, the weight is a lot and so we.
On Sunday morning, I, I just, Ipreviously had spoken to a group of us
and I said, well, let's just do a, azoom check-in and all of us just tap
in with each other and check how we'refeeling, what we can do to support
each other, and how we can link up.
(21:24):
And if I can't take a case upnorth, you can step in and, and
support each other with that.
And so I think that's, um, essentialfor our communities is that we also.
Take care of, um, ourselves so that wecan keep fighting back and, and be rested.
So I, I also, you know, did go tothe boxing this weekend with my
(21:46):
husband because I needed, my familywas like, you need to go and sleep.
Yeah.
Because it was like a week of not reallysleeping and not having a sit down
meal just because it was back to back.
Yeah.
And I encourage all lawyers out there to.
Anybody that calls your officeif they have an issue, get them
quickly to an immigration lawyer.
Yes.
So they can raise their hand.
I know an attorney share,we waived all fees for that.
(22:07):
So people can easily just automate goingdirectly to somebody that can help.
Um, one question I had, you know, we'rehearing a lot about the kids and what's
happening to the kids and foster kids,and again, people just want to know.
Can I donate money somewhere?
What can I do to help?
Like, can you give anyadvice to folks like that?
Yeah, I just, I would also just makesure you, you kind of, uh, look at the,
(22:31):
the organization and their history andthat they're, um, an organization that's
been around for many years and the workthat they, they do in the community.
One of the organizations that I'veworked with a lot over the past
years is MD Immigrant Defenders.
They're based here in la.
Hmm.
Um, but they just, we gotta becareful as well that we we're
(22:54):
working with organizations thatare doing the on the ground work.
A lot of my friends areat MD. They're either at,
is it M-D-E-F-M-M?
Sorry.
I am MM Defenders.
M Defenders.
Oh, okay.
I am M Defenders.
Yeah, I am just for thecaptions later on the show.
Make sure we nail that one.
And so, um, they, uh, you know, they'reat the detention centers right now.
(23:15):
They're talking to families, they're.
Um, stepping up for the kids.
Um, you know, a lot of the organizationsalso were representing kids that
were unaccompanied and they've takena big hit right now with, um, that
those services, because the kids arealso being put back into proceedings.
Um, they're other trauma for these kids.
(23:36):
Yeah.
Mean, come
on.
They finally found probably a safeplace with a foster family or somewhere.
Now it's ripped out again.
Yeah.
Um.
And then we're also seeingthis in, uh, immigration court.
Among the last number I looked at wasat 3.7 million cases are backlogged
in immigration court across the USAnd, um, they recently started to
do this wave, the DHS attorneys, uh.
(23:57):
Started, uh, copying, pasting, massproducing, uh, motions to re calendar
cases that have been sleeping underadministrative closure for 10 to 15 years.
And they're doing this in an attempt tothen not be able to locate the attorneys
either not be able to locate theirclients or the clients having moved.
And so now there's gonna be a hearingset and the person is going to miss it
(24:21):
because they didn't get their notice.
So they, they're doing thisother effort that just started
about a week and a half ago.
That's so disgusting.
So that I flew back from ne um,sorry, from Nevada to be able to
file emergency opposition motionsbecause, you know, they just,
that's just sad.
Yeah.
They're just trying to do any,anything possible to meet the quota.
(24:42):
Yeah, just to meet the quotas is about quotas all, it's
about that quota.
So then that way they can continuetheir, uh, campaign trail and say, look
what we did while we were in office.
Yeah.
And then look at all the money we funneledto our friends of the private detention
centers that are also donating to ourcampaign, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
It's just, yeah,
it's a circle.
It's like, it's, it's a whole mixup and, and unfortunately like our
(25:04):
community's at the forefront ofthis, our undocumented community.
Um, but I also.
I'm also inspired to see how many peopleare stepping up and finally talking
about immigration because for manyyears we continue to leave immigration
on the, you know, back end of the list.
We have other issues to talk about.
We have other things.
No, we need like a real, real, uh.
(25:28):
Good conversation and actuallike legislation and, and changes
to our immigration system thatwill include these families.
We, we sure.
Hope so.
Well, Cynthia, thanks for coming on.
Um, big fan of yours and you're reallylike up there changing things and well,
thank you for watching and listeningto this episode, the Justin podcast.
Um, you can reach outto, at Ms. Santiago on.
(25:49):
Aga Santiago.
Yeah.
Aga
Santiago.
Aga Santiago, uh, Facebook,Instagram, TikTok.
I almost gave your email away.
We were close.
It's fine.
Um, yeah.
Well, thank for watchinglistening, Cynthia.
Always a pleasure.
Hey, it's Bob Simon taking abreak to tell you about CallRail.
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Welcome to this episode of the JusticeTeam Podcast on the Justice Team Network.
I'm your host, Bob Simon, and todaywe're gonna be talking about some
very important issues in SouthernCalifornia, but now across the
(00:43):
nation, and that's about immigration.
The rights of those peopleaffected, and we have on.
The Cynthia Santiago.
How are you Ms. Santiago?
I'm good.
I'm good.
You know, chaotic times,but you know, good spirits.
Yeah.
And I know you do a lot ofmedia, a lot of interviews.
People reach out to you because ofyour knowledge in the space and being
boots on the ground and for helping.
(01:03):
Um, and I mean.
How do people reach you?
First of all, I'm sure you havea lot of people reaching out to
you, but how do they find you?
Yeah, so I, I always suggest like,uh, social media, AGA Santiago is the
handle, A-B-O-G-A-D-A, Abada, Santiago.
Um, but also people just call ouroffice or they reach out through,
(01:23):
um, texting us at our office as well.
We try to be very.
Present for different needsbecause if I can't handle it, I
know somebody that will be able
to.
Yeah.
And I think that's important'cause we do the same thing.
I know we, yeah.
We're big on finding the bestwarrior for that specific issue.
Um, I mean, I don't do any immigration,so I just literally will text.
(01:43):
Santiago here.
But you know, one thing, and I thinkpeople need to recognize is, you know,
you're a mom, you're balancing life.
I mean, two of your kids areoutside the studio right now.
It's summer break, but you, youstill have to fight every day.
Yeah.
You know, I think that, um, since I openedup the practice in 2012, I. My mission
has always been, um, fighting for mycommunity because of the impact that it's
(02:05):
had growing up, uh, with immigrant parentsand the community I, I RA was raised in.
But also, um, there was a big componentof why I opened up my own firm is to
do know your rights because even ifwe didn't have an immediate threat in
our face back then in 20 12, 20 13.
I wanted my community to leavewith information and knowledge
(02:26):
on how to protect themselves.
Yeah.
And let's, let's talkabout knowing your rights.
You know, right now, mid-June2025, a lot of chaotic times.
What are you telling people out there?
What are some suggestions you have for,for folks that either are employers or
people that are, that may be affected?
Yeah.
You know, it really is acomplicated issue because.
(02:49):
While I appreciate the know your rightsinformation that we're hearing so much
in social media and in the news, a lot ofthese things are not a one size fits all.
A lot of people have so many differentfactors in their case that it's
important that if they can reach outto an attorney and or a nonprofit
and get an individualized assessment.
(03:10):
Then they're gonna know what theycan do on the spot at that moment.
Or they can try to do affirmativelynow while like, you know, they're
not under any risk and they can filesomething to kind of get ahead of this,
which is what I've been telling folks,like, you need to know where you stand.
If you have previously been deported,then asking to see a judge isn't
(03:32):
gonna happen because you havean an order against you already.
So you're under a different process ofbeing expedited, removed, or reinstated.
So there's just like so many layers ofcomplications with these cases that,
um, that assessment is the first step.
Um, the know your rights advisors aregood general concepts, but there's
nothing, you know, that will, um, youknow, there's, there's nothing better
(03:56):
than to have an a person than an attorney.
That's what I do at the endof every consultation is we
do a Know your rights prep.
Mm-hmm.
If you're picked up,what are you gonna do?
What are you gonna say?
What are you gonna argue to see?
Because you're not gonnahave an attorney there.
You've gotta argue for yourself.
And I want each of my consultationsclients to leave knowing like,
(04:16):
okay, I'm gonna be able tohandle this if this happens.
And worst case scenario, this isgonna happen, and my attorney then
will be called and then she'llrespond and come and support me.
Yeah.
So let's go through, I mean, do youhave like those general blocks of
categories of folks from like theasylum seekers to perhaps kids, to folks
that may have had a deportation issue?
I. Or folks that have been justwaiting in line for a decade.
(04:39):
Yeah.
Or two.
What are Or two.
Two or two.
Decades?
Two.
But I mean, let's talk about that first.
Like Yeah.
Yeah.
I hear, we hear on socialmedia all the time.
Well, my parents came here legally,so these people have to do it too.
And
now you gotta go.
Yeah.
Um, then we would startwith the concept of.
Our immigration system from its inceptionin the 19, like even in the 19 hundreds,
you would see like the great wavewhere millions of people were allowed
(05:03):
in because of the conditions that theywere fleeing and and their country.
And, you know, uh, we're in a positionwhere our immigration laws were very
open borders, and then in the eightiesand nineties became more about reform
and control and, um, punishing folks.
And so that's.
(05:24):
I think the principle issue isthat understanding the history
of immigration law, it has notalways been about getting in line.
It's been about, you know, openingup the doors and people come and see.
And that's
been, and people don't realize in the lastdecade or two, it's been very difficult.
Yeah.
I mean, I know people that havebeen here paying taxes, members
of the community that have beenjust waiting in line for 20 years.
(05:44):
Yeah.
Um, I just did a presentation witha large organization, executives and
whatnot, uh, and employees and they.
And I went through the historyand the 1980s was the last time
Congress actually did an immigrationlike amnesty type project.
Yes.
Process.
And then we get into 1996 when Congressdid do the illegal Immigration Reform Act.
(06:08):
And so that is one to punishindividuals who enter the United
States without permission.
So it's 1996 all, andit's been, yes, it's been
more about control, punishingconsequences, and it's going to continue
to get that way unless we make immediatechanges to our immigration system.
Yeah, and
that's what, you know, and it's, youknow, we see that, I've seen the video of
(06:29):
Ronald Reagan who granted amnesty to me.
It's just why would you not just say,Hey, if you've been a member of the
community, you, you've been payingtaxes, you've an upstanding person.
Why not try to find a path tocitizenship for those folks that are
contributing so positively to everybody?
Why would that be so hard?
Yeah.
Well, the, the wave that we have now underthis administration, um, doesn't have
(06:54):
that perspective of seeing individualsthat are others, uh, seeing individuals
of diverse backgrounds, uh, as, um,you know, as people that deserve, or
that people that are humans that have.
Uh, a family that have done alot to contribute this admission
doesn't see that in individuals.
(07:15):
They see them as, um, criminals and they,they have a whole nother perspective,
um, mostly having to do with the southernborder and who's coming and, and so
I think that's the, the reality of itthat we have to just also acknowledge
that this administration does not see.
The immigrant community the sameway they see them as less of lesser.
(07:36):
So are, are people, are peoplegetting ra racially profiled?
Yes.
Please describe.
Yes.
So, you know, simply driving, um,and out in public or being in a, you
know, location that's very open, likethe car wash workers, uh, um, day
laborers at the Home Depot centers.
The simple, like just the approachis, uh, the simple way to describe
(07:59):
it is that they're looking at folksthat look of a certain race ethnicity.
Latino, for example, has been themajority of individuals picked up,
but they, it's not like they'reseeking a specific person.
That's not like they're saying,oh, they have no idea this person's
background.
And that's why, you know, unfortunatelycitizens were getting picked up.
This just happened close tous here in the South Bay.
(08:21):
Oh, I just wonder, I mean, ifyou could explain to people
like, yeah.
I hear folks say, you know,back Midwest, east coast.
Yeah.
That doesn't happen.
They're not picking up peoplethat are here illegally.
They're only getting criminals.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean that was, um,
true or not true.
That was the slogan during the campaign.
And, um, once, you know, he came intooffice and we know there shouldn't
individuals in that office that are veryvocal about who they should be enforcing
(08:46):
immigration laws against and who.
No, they're not touching.
But the, the reality is that it's, it'sa very, the situation that's happened
in LA is a very, uh, detain themfirst and then ask questions later.
Whoa.
But that's that.
I mean, are they allowingdue process through this?
Um, there's so much going on withonce a person is detained, I don't
(09:10):
think they had a plan or strategy.
Like they don't even haveplaces to detained first.
Ask questions later.
Yeah.
Detained first, ask questions later.
What we've been seeing is, um.
People are getting detained and beingput into the immigration, like, uh, the
immigration offices where they're notequipped to house people overnight, so
(09:30):
they're sleeping on the floor, they'renot being fed properly, and then they're
trying to determine where to sendpeople that have bed space for them.
And so a lot of individuals fromLA were are in El Paso, Texas.
They're in, uh, Florida,they're in other states.
Um, really there's an yes there.
There was about two or three daysa lot of families couldn't find
(09:51):
their family member and we were ableto locate them in another state.
A completely, because it's creates,lemme guess, creates chaos so that then
they don't have access to attorneys.
Yeah.
Because they're also now in anotherstate, they don't have access to their
family as easily and it degrades theirmental state to wanna fight the case.
And, I mean, and let me guess,these are private prison centers
(10:14):
that are also benefiting bigley.
Yeah.
On retaining folks.
Yeah.
We trace back to billions of beingmade from the detention centers
and opening up new contracts.
But specifically there is, uh, uh,agreement called 2 87 G. It's a, it's
a contract that local law enforcementagencies can make with the federal
(10:37):
government so that they can be housing.
Uh, people that are detained.
So, uh, my good friends, a lot ofgood friends that cover investigative
work, they've covered these, um,stories of when a new contract is open,
it's public information and you'restarting to see, you know, when they
get approved and they, they get money.
They get money, local lawenforcement's agencies, and, um,
(10:59):
in states like, you know, statesway far away from Los Angeles and.
Um, that's what happened inGlendale recently as well.
They, Glendale had had a grandfatheredcontract with the federal government
to house folks, and then there waspublic outcry and it was canceled.
It was canceled.
I saw that.
Yeah.
So, but, but this is not gonna happenin, you know, the, you know, some
(11:21):
random city in Texas or Georgia, youknow, just locations where, um, some
of the individuals are ending up.
Yeah.
So they're trying to, they'retrying to financially benefit in.
With their strategic partnersof where they're sending people
wrongfully or not detained.
Yeah.
Just doesn't matter.
Yeah.
And I mean also, like we've seen itbefore in the, per one of the folks
(11:43):
you were mentioning, Stephen Miller,who used to be a professor of yours.
No,
no, no.
We used to be classmates.
Classmates.
You were classmates with Stephen Miller.
I was gonna say professor.
Ugh.
But
so, so, uh, I went toSanta Monica High School.
Mm-hmm.
Um, I didn't know him in middleschool, but I'm, you know, that's
where a lot of people believethat this started, this, uh.
(12:04):
You know, historical, mental, like,uh, campaign of wanting to promote
a society that was assimilated, thatdidn't celebrate diversity, that
everyone had to be a certain way.
Yeah.
And English only things to that
I've seen effect.
I mean, you've seen videos of himin high school saying that these,
they should be cleaning our food.
(12:24):
We should be, I was on
stage at the same, same time.
Yeah.
So I, I ran for student body president.
Uh, he was running for Speaker of theHouse, which, uh, was unfortunately,
uh, you know, that the articlesdidn't specify that, but I was
running for student Body President.
He was running for Speaker ofthe House, another position.
So we were all on stage gettingready to do our speeches,
(12:44):
and ours was the last one.
So I heard that speech.
The entire crowd of students were like.
Anywhere from ninth graders to11th graders booing him for that,
and he was taking off the stage.
Well just tell everybody what happened.
You know, he, he simply was like, he,he was being who he was on campus.
That's why I wasn't surprisedthat something like that, it
(13:05):
was not approved previously.
He went off and did his own statement asto, you know, why should we pick up after
ourselves if we have janitors to do this?
It's, yeah, I've heard somehorror stories, but, and
I know I had classes with him.
I don't remember every particular detail.
'cause obviously high school wasa long time ago, but I, I, I had,
(13:26):
um, interactions where, you know,as someone that was involved in my
student body, my campus, um, always,you know, doing, promoting diversity
events and cultural awareness eventsand promoting, um, you know, just.
People's mental, like socialjustice issues that, you know,
a lot of the students embraced.
(13:48):
Um, he was, you know, very.
Limited.
There wasn't a lot of peoplethat shared that belief.
It was very, it was a very small,like it was him and maybe like five
other friends that shared that belief.
Wow.
And they would try to promote, you know,that assimilation English only, um,
you know, highly criticized the welfareprograms, social social services programs.
(14:13):
Uh, cri criticize affirmative action.
He criticized a lot of the, the,the things that are good for our
community, our social wellbeing.
Um, and I ended up being the first Latinastudent body president of my campus.
Congratulations.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Thank you.
And like it just so
he's Yeah.
He probably has it out for you.
No, he doesn't.
He,
he was like this since middle schoolis what, what has been the picture.
(14:35):
And I've the speeches
where he is like, get the quotas up.
You know, where they're at.
Seven 11, they're at Home Depot.
Go get 'em.
I mean, this isn't like the campaignpromise of going to your criminals.
I mean, true or false, are they out there?
The folks that they're picking up, thepeople that you're helping, are these
these hardened criminals that were here?
Yeah.
I mean
the, the latest statistics I sawwas like 10% of the people that were
picked up had a criminal history.
Um, but in their agenda andtheir campaign, uh, coming to
(14:59):
the country without permission isthe criminal aspect that they're,
that's it.
And that's not even a criminal charge.
It's civil.
Yeah,
it's a civil issue.
But it, that's what the,the campaign and the.
You know, the, the motive out there thatwhat they're pushing for the community.
I mean, I, I've never seen anadministration do so much social
(15:19):
media and so much media, uh, well,it's called propaganda commercials.
Yeah.
And, and that really, um, is toincite, that is to incite this fear
and terror into communities andI, and we're not gonna take it.
And we've seen that thecommunity is out there, but now
we know why they've beendoing the DEI thing.
Mm-hmm.
Where they're saying, mm-hmm.
They're taking your jobs.
(15:40):
This is all a big lead, and itis a scare factor to tell people
things that just aren't true.
Like I don't see people lining upto go, uh, cook in the kitchens
where they took the cooks.
I don't see people liningup to go to the warehouses.
I don't see people out on the fields.
Yeah.
Where the migrant workers are.
Nope.
Yeah.
You know, and, and then that'sthe other thing too, like we.
(16:00):
We do, um, have a, a narrative of like,you know, these workers are, or these
people are taking your jobs and they,they're taking our system and they're
abusing of our system and whatnot.
But we also have to understandlike we have a huge majority of
folks that are foreign born thatlive in the country, entrepreneurs.
(16:23):
Mm-hmm.
Um, the DACA recipients were essentialin the, the pandemic situation.
A lot of, uh, the daca, sorry, theDACA students were workers in the
pandemic situation, so it just, it's.
Our, also, our role in society as, um,children of immigrants or immigrants
is threatening to them as well.
(16:44):
It's not just the farm workers andour, our, our day laborers that are,
are doing the, the grit work in oursociety, but it's like we are also a
threat if you have a a degree, if youhave some type of a Yeah, and that's
because they teach you.
It's like didn't earn it, quote unquote.
I say now they think anybody that.
(17:05):
Is of a certain color that theydidn't earn the job that they got to.
It's crazy.
Yeah.
That's what they, what they putin people and I don't think people
realize how many healthcare workers
mm-hmm.
Are undocumented or foreign born.
Yeah.
Or foreign born a lot.
From physicians to nurses, topeople that are taking care of
our elderly and our children.
Yeah,
it's a lifeblood and peoplejust do not realize it.
(17:26):
My mom was a home care worker.
My mom was a nanny.
My, you know, my, my mom did that, thatwork in, um, in taking care of others.
And I think that if we change ournarratives to show more visibility
of who, who are the immigrants inour country and what we do, then.
(17:47):
Then the, I think that would open upalso people's eyes because I think
that, um, all this spreading of, ofan image of someone, uh, in a certain
way is what really there's, there'speople in our United States, we have
to understand there's people in theUnited States who have never seen.
Somebody of, you know, certainbackground, uh, undocumented parents,
(18:07):
immigrant parents, like they've justnever seen somebody to understand
what their background and historyand how much they contribute in.
So what
can, what can lawyers do thatare watching or listening?
How can they get into help if they're not?
They don't do immigration, they'renot doing criminal defense.
Maybe they're in another state.
How can they help?
Yeah, so I mean, just educatingyourself on the immigration situation,
(18:29):
um, assessing your own client base.
I, I've been talking to a lot ofpersonal injury firms and just.
How to assess your clients, like wherethey stand in the immigration picture, and
not that you're gonna necessarily give 'ema consultation, but just know where they
and their family are so that you know ifthey are vulnerable to be picked up and
they have a court case or a deposition.
(18:51):
That you are also protecting themas a whole in a holistic way.
Right.
And their families.
I've spent the past week speakingto like at least 150 of my clients.
Mm-hmm.
And, and understanding who'smissing work, who's not able
to go to, to leave their home.
Yeah.
I saw
you at a post where you canactually donate so that people
can stay home if they feel likethey're gonna go get picked up at.
(19:14):
At work or even church, right?
So,
yeah, no, yeah.
Thankfully for Jose from who's like, um,reached out and we both are kind of just.
Took the lead to try to helpas many folks as possible.
He's, he's, um, helpinga lot with, with that.
And a lot of people are, arejumping in, which is inspiring.
A lot of people want to helpout somebody that they know is
So how, like, so how do people watchingor listening, should they just reach
(19:37):
out to you to be put in touch with justhelping folks so they don't have to feel
scared of getting detained illegally?
Yeah, I mean, people can reach out to meand then Jose from Easylinks and, and I
are talking and, and trying to match up.
A family to someone who iswilling to support them.
Um, you know, we're not reallyposting about all this too much either
because they are put in a vulnerableposition and we're trying to make
(19:59):
sure that we take care of them.
And, you know, they're,they're open to it.
But, you know, he, he has received thecalls and I, I've sent him the calls
and, and he's, you know, people are,are so scared to leave their home and
to go and, and they don't know howthey're gonna get through the month.
Another organization I workwith a lot is called Ello.
(20:21):
They work with a lot ofindigenous immigrants, indigenous
undocumented community.
And um, the effort there has been todeliver grocery boxes and to also help
folks with, um, you know, any needsthat they have for the month to get
through the month for their family.
Wow.
So,
and uh, I know you have, I mean, whenwe talked on Sunday, you had pulled
(20:42):
together, I mean, you have, do you havea group of community of lawyers that are
like-minded that you guys are trying to.
Talk to each other, make sure that,that everything's moving forward.
Yeah, I mean, in, in this time we,we as immigration attorneys are
receiving a lot of the secondarytrauma, but also personal trauma.
Like we, we've been through experiencesof deportation, maybe in our own
(21:04):
immediate families or, or loved ones.
And so, um, the weight is a lot and so we.
On Sunday morning, I, I just, Ipreviously had spoken to a group of us
and I said, well, let's just do a, azoom check-in and all of us just tap
in with each other and check how we'refeeling, what we can do to support
each other, and how we can link up.
(21:24):
And if I can't take a case upnorth, you can step in and, and
support each other with that.
And so I think that's, um, essentialfor our communities is that we also.
Take care of, um, ourselves so that wecan keep fighting back and, and be rested.
So I, I also, you know, did go tothe boxing this weekend with my
(21:46):
husband because I needed, my familywas like, you need to go and sleep.
Yeah.
Because it was like a week of not reallysleeping and not having a sit down
meal just because it was back to back.
Yeah.
And I encourage all lawyers out there to.
Anybody that calls your officeif they have an issue, get them
quickly to an immigration lawyer.
Yes.
So they can raise their hand.
I know an attorney share,we waived all fees for that.
(22:07):
So people can easily just automate goingdirectly to somebody that can help.
Um, one question I had, you know, we'rehearing a lot about the kids and what's
happening to the kids and foster kids,and again, people just want to know.
Can I donate money somewhere?
What can I do to help?
Like, can you give anyadvice to folks like that?
Yeah, I just, I would also just makesure you, you kind of, uh, look at the,
(22:31):
the organization and their history andthat they're, um, an organization that's
been around for many years and the workthat they, they do in the community.
One of the organizations that I'veworked with a lot over the past
years is MD Immigrant Defenders.
They're based here in la.
Hmm.
Um, but they just, we gotta becareful as well that we we're
(22:54):
working with organizations thatare doing the on the ground work.
A lot of my friends areat MD. They're either at,
is it M-D-E-F-M-M?
Sorry.
I am MM Defenders.
M Defenders.
Oh, okay.
I am M Defenders.
Yeah, I am just for thecaptions later on the show.
Make sure we nail that one.
And so, um, they, uh, you know, they'reat the detention centers right now.
(23:15):
They're talking to families, they're.
Um, stepping up for the kids.
Um, you know, a lot of the organizationsalso were representing kids that
were unaccompanied and they've takena big hit right now with, um, that
those services, because the kids arealso being put back into proceedings.
Um, they're other trauma for these kids.
(23:36):
Yeah.
Mean, come
on.
They finally found probably a safeplace with a foster family or somewhere.
Now it's ripped out again.
Yeah.
Um.
And then we're also seeingthis in, uh, immigration court.
Among the last number I looked at wasat 3.7 million cases are backlogged
in immigration court across the USAnd, um, they recently started to
do this wave, the DHS attorneys, uh.
(23:57):
Started, uh, copying, pasting, massproducing, uh, motions to re calendar
cases that have been sleeping underadministrative closure for 10 to 15 years.
And they're doing this in an attempt tothen not be able to locate the attorneys
either not be able to locate theirclients or the clients having moved.
And so now there's gonna be a hearingset and the person is going to miss it
(24:21):
because they didn't get their notice.
So they, they're doing thisother effort that just started
about a week and a half ago.
That's so disgusting.
So that I flew back from ne um,sorry, from Nevada to be able to
file emergency opposition motionsbecause, you know, they just,
that's just sad.
Yeah.
They're just trying to do any,anything possible to meet the quota.
(24:42):
Yeah, just to meet the quotas is about quotas all, it's
about that quota.
So then that way they can continuetheir, uh, campaign trail and say, look
what we did while we were in office.
Yeah.
And then look at all the money we funneledto our friends of the private detention
centers that are also donating to ourcampaign, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
It's just, yeah,
it's a circle.
It's like, it's, it's a whole mixup and, and unfortunately like our
(25:04):
community's at the forefront ofthis, our undocumented community.
Um, but I also.
I'm also inspired to see how many peopleare stepping up and finally talking
about immigration because for manyyears we continue to leave immigration
on the, you know, back end of the list.
We have other issues to talk about.
We have other things.
No, we need like a real, real, uh.
(25:28):
Good conversation and actuallike legislation and, and changes
to our immigration system thatwill include these families.
We, we sure.
Hope so.
Well, Cynthia, thanks for coming on.
Um, big fan of yours and you're reallylike up there changing things and well,
thank you for watching and listeningto this episode, the Justin podcast.
Um, you can reach outto, at Ms. Santiago on.
(25:49):
Aga Santiago.
Yeah.
Aga
Santiago.
Aga Santiago, uh, Facebook,Instagram, TikTok.
I almost gave your email away.
We were close.
It's fine.
Um, yeah.
Well, thank for watchinglistening, Cynthia.
Always a pleasure.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.