July 2, 2025 • 52 mins
Today, on Karl and Crew, we continued our weekly theme, "Rock Solid" and discussed the key bedrock truths of discipleship. Guests include R. York Moore, a gifted speaker, revivalist, and the President & CEO of the Coalition for Christian Outreach. He shared the power of the Gospel message in today's Gen Z; plus three bedrock truths for evangelizing the next generations. We also talked with Dr. David Nelms, Founder of TTI (The Timothy Initiative). Dr. Nelms is also a pastor and unpacked key solid truths of and the need for disciple-making. Finally, Arlene Pellicane shared three solid truths that help set up kids for faithful success. She is an author, speaker, and host of the Happy Home podcast. You can hear the highlights of today's program on the Karl and Crew Showcast.
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S1 (00:00):
Coming to you from the Morning Star Mission sponsored studio.
This is Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2 (00:09):
Carl and crew helping you take your next step with Jesus.
And we're so grateful that you're with us here today.
We've got a whole week committed to bedrock rock solid truths.
And the truth is, we could do this for a
month of Sundays. This could go on and on, but
we're trying to anchor some of these things with some
of our frequent flyer guests. That'll really put your teeth
(00:32):
into something. And there's guests that we bring in who
are in the mix in their specialty, the way really,
they're calling what God's called them into. And it's a
beautiful thing when it comes to salvation of young people.
I think there's a lot of presumption that maybe we
can never really know how to do that, and so
(00:54):
we need to outsource it. We get the young guys, right? Sure.
I mean, that can be I think I think that's
one of the greatest misses going. I think the gospel
is way more relevant than we give it credit for. Now,
that's a little bit tongue in cheek because we all
know that, right? Right. But I think there's a tendency
to think if we're going to reach young people, we
(01:15):
better outsource this to young people.
S3 (01:18):
Yeah, I get that.
S2 (01:19):
But isn't there more than that? I think back to
my buddy that was genuinely born again when I was
in youth group at Sand Lake Baptist Church in Anchorage, Alaska.
Mark Donner, who Mark was quite a guy. I mean,
looking back, I'm like, wow, Mark, you put up with
(01:39):
a lot with me. And he was my buddy. But
I saw him live so righteously and so differently. And
there were a few kids that lived that way. Most
of us had this great hallucination of salvation that were
in that youth group. And I know that because we
go back now, years later and we find out, wow,
a lot of these kids are walking with God, but
(01:59):
they didn't really get surrendered to Christ until they really
rubbed their nose in the world and they got the
full dose of what their life was like. Religiosity did
not save them. And that's one of the things that
we constantly wrestle with here. In fact, next week we're
going to tackle this one. Uh, there's a there's a
great myth flying around out there. It's a big one.
How does it go, Ali?
S4 (02:21):
I've been a Christian my whole life.
S2 (02:22):
I've been a Christian my whole life. That that's. We're
going to debunk that one day next week. Because that's.
It's impossible. You're born with your back to God. You're
born as an enemy of the cross of Christ. And
then the question is, how are we going to reach
kids and what are we bringing them into? Are we
bringing them into a culture or into a living, breathing
(02:43):
relationship with the Son of God? Those are two totally
different things.
S4 (02:47):
Very much so. And with you're looking at Gen Z,
you're going to hear a few very few Gen Zers say,
I've been a Christian my whole life. That is not
the norm for Gen Z when you just look at
their world, the prevailing worldview.
S2 (03:02):
Boom. And maybe that's the secret sauce. Maybe the beautiful
thing with Gen Z and even some late stage millennials,
is that a kind of post-Christian here? We don't have
to feign that we've always been saved because we haven't.
And so maybe that baseline is one of the kickers here.
(03:22):
Coming up in a moment. Man, I love this guy.
R-york more is being used so powerfully. The Lord. Some
of the stats of the reach that he has through
social media are going to blow your mind. And what
we want to pin down with York is get after
these three bedrock truths for evangelizing the next generation. I'm
flying blind here. I don't know what York's going to say,
(03:45):
but I can't wait. You guys ready?
S4 (03:47):
Ready.
S2 (03:47):
Coming up. Three minutes. Are York more? How are we
going to evangelize young people? And are any of these
principles transferable to lost boomers who think they know Jesus
but don't. Let's get after it. Hang on.
S1 (04:01):
Your spiritual pit stop to keep you going in the race.
You're listening to Carl and crew.
S2 (04:08):
We've got great data points that prove that this generation
Gen Z boy, God is doing something. And especially with
the young men. At least that's what we're hearing. Our
York more. Are we missing it, or is God doing
something out there, my man?
S5 (04:23):
Absolutely. God is on the move, and he is alive
and well on our college campuses. And with Gen Z.
S2 (04:28):
Our York Moore, speaker, revivalist and a president, CEO and
national evangelist of the coalition for Christian Outreach. That's a
lot of lot of stuff there, York. Boil it down.
What do you do? What's your passion?
S5 (04:42):
Well, the coalition for Christian Outreach, we partner with local
churches to reach college campuses with the gospel. We've been
around for 50 years, but the Lord has called us
to grow nationally. So I'm leading a national growth story
over here. We're now working in about 16 states with
a few hundred churches. And our model, you know, taking
college students to church is part of what we do.
(05:04):
So we don't just go to the campus, we take
the church to the campus. But we're seeing young people
come to faith in this generation, and we're bringing them
into the into the church, and they're getting baptized. We've
had a rash of baptisms this school year. That's just
mind blowing. We've never seen anything like it in 50 years.
You know, you mentioned earlier in the last segment that
this generation is open and man, are they open to
(05:27):
the gospel. But allies, right. Like they don't refer to
themselves as having been Christian. Uh, in fact, the largest
segment of our population would be considered nones. They have
no affiliation whatsoever. But we make the mistake of assuming
that that means that they're not interested in the gospel.
This isn't European secularism. This is the greatest opportunity for
the gospel in American history.
S4 (05:48):
Are York more with us right now? I'm looking at
an article from the Gospel Coalition on this. Uh, tell
me how this statement hits you. It says an increased
majority of Gen Zers are biblically illiterate, anxious, digitally native,
and uninterested in church. And then it goes on to say,
we must understand these obstacles, but also crucial that we
see them as opportunities for growth. How does that hit you?
(06:10):
Do you think that that's an accurate description of Gen Z?
S5 (06:15):
Yeah, absolutely. And the operative word there is, you know,
it's an opportunity. I don't know that I would say
that they're not interested in church. It's just nobody's really
inviting them. They don't really think of church like it's
just not on their top ten list. They you know,
they're binging Netflix. They're they're on TikTok. They're they're doing
these kinds of things. And church is almost like this
invisible world to them. So in the coalition for Christian Outreach,
(06:39):
when we invite them to church, almost always it's their
first opportunity to go to church. Now, what they find
at church is a very strange world, and so we
need to prepare them for that. There's a culture in
our churches, but yeah, that that actually describes Gen Z
pretty well. The idea that they're digital natives, that's a
phrase that we like to throw around and use a lot.
(06:59):
But you know, what I like to say is that,
you know, our life will forever be what I call
phygital the integration of physical and digital. There's no separation
between the digital self and our corporeal existence, our physical
existence and the relationships that we have online. Those lines
don't exist for Gen Z, and really, for most of us,
(07:20):
those lines are getting blurred every day. But Gen Z
is the first real, true generation of digital natives, if
we like to use that phrase.
S2 (07:28):
Love it R-york more is our guest. Before we get
into three bedrock truths for evangelizing this next generation, I
want you to give some stats. Our audience needs to
know what God's doing through your ministry. Uh, blow our
mind here. We haven't had you in here for a while.
What's God doing?
S5 (07:46):
Well, the God is always on the move, and it's
all the Lord. All glory to the Lord Jesus. But
you know the coalition for Christian Outreach is probably a
name that your listeners have never heard of. We've been
around for 50 years. I spent 27 years with a
very well-known ministry called InterVarsity Christian Fellowship, was their national evangelist.
That's a juggernaut. I mean, they are 50 states. Uh,
(08:07):
you know, 1400 employees. You know, part of 173 nation
movement of college students. We're tiny, tiny, tiny. And I
took this job because the invitation was nationalized. This movement,
I started the Every Campus coalition with a couple of
friends back in 2017. Now, that includes every single college
ministry in America. 130 college ministries are a part of
(08:30):
the every campus movement. You can go to every campus
comm and check that out. But I said yes to
being the CEO of the Co, which has taken me
three years now to to say, you know, with elegance,
I'm the CEO of the Co Karl and that's harder
to say.
S6 (08:45):
It is.
S5 (08:46):
And basically I said yes because our model is the
local church. Now, I love all of the campus ministries,
and so this isn't a competition. We're not in competition
with one another. But I think we are the only
college ministry at scale that's actually predicated upon working directly
with the local church. We put our missionaries on staff
(09:06):
with the local church, and then through the local church.
We're reaching students for Christ, and then we measure how
active are they in the life of the church. And
the exciting thing is, in the last three years, we've
seen 50% growth. We're now operating in 16 states. We
have a strategic plan to grow an additional 30%. So
God is on the move. But listen, it's not just
(09:27):
about the big numbers and these kinds of things. It's
about discipleship. We are a disciple making movement. And so
as we're seeing young people come to Christ, we're discipling
them into this passionate worldview that integrates the lordship of
Jesus into every square inch of their lives, not just
a Sunday faith. We call it our Beyond Sunday effect.
(09:48):
We're discipling students from Monday through Sunday. Faith.
S4 (09:52):
Are your guests right now. So let's get on these, uh,
these three bedrock truths for evangelizing this next generation. I
know you spend time with your TikTok ministry. You work
a lot with college students. Uh, sum up, give us
the first of those bedrock truths is going to help
us evangelize this generation.
S5 (10:11):
Yeah. The first one is, is really what we've already
touched upon. Listen, when you have an entire generation, let's
just say let's recognize the opportunity here. Gen Z is
literally the largest generation in American history. They are not
just the largest unchurched generation. They are the largest generation. Period.
So that means something. And so then when we dive
(10:31):
into the stats and, uh, you know, you know, Kinnaman
will tell us over there at Barna and these stats
are true. 84% of Gen Z, uh, are either extremely
open or moderately open to spiritual dialogue.
S6 (10:46):
That's amazing.
S5 (10:47):
And he also tells us that they're looking for mentors.
That's new. I'm an Xer. I wasn't looking for mentors.
I wasn't looking for somebody to feed into me spiritually
and walk in life. I had to be taught that
that was a good thing. This generation is actually open.
So the first bedrock truth is, listen, when you're sharing
the good news with people, the assumption that they're resistant.
(11:09):
The assumption that they have lots of kind of hostile questions,
that's that's gone. So when you now they do have questions,
they're different questions. They're not the classic apologetic questions. The
evidence for the resurrection. And you know, what's the historical
evidence for the validity of the Bible. And they're not
asking those kinds of questions. They are asking questions. And
their questions are challenging, but they're not hostile. This is
(11:32):
a generation that's incredibly open. So that first bedrock truth
is really this is the greatest evangelistic opportunity in American history.
And so if you're sitting on a board of a foundation,
if you're an elder in a church, if you're a
businessman or a woman who loves to invest in kingdom initiatives. Listen,
get your checkbook out. This is an opportunity to underwrite
(11:56):
a movement of God that we're seeing in this generation.
Don't miss this opportunity. This isn't this isn't just like
a a small little blip. This is a great opportunity. Listen,
I've been talking to people around the country. I was
just talking to somebody in the Fellowship of Christian Athletes,
which is a wonderful ministry. My organization does work with FCA.
They had 2000 students come to faith at a single
(12:18):
event in Jacksonville, Florida.
S6 (12:20):
Wow.
S5 (12:20):
We heard about 2000 coming at Western Western WVU, Western
Virginia University. It's not just, you know, these little revivals
on these Christian college campuses that we're hearing about. There
is a move of God across America and Gen Z,
and I think we're just getting started.
S2 (12:36):
I love it. Anecdotally, this is so weird. I haven't
even told my team this. But at our new campus
that we opened up here for 180 Chicago, we had
three high schoolers come to the church and I started asking, hey,
does anyone know these kids? They were there for a
few weeks in a row. Campus directors started to get
to know them a little bit. Here's what we found out.
Ready for this, guys? No one invited him. York. They
(12:59):
showed up, they sought us out. And they sit in
the front row, leaning forward, hanging on every word. No
parents coming to church. No parents with any spiritual interest
at all. And they're there every week. York isn't that.
Does that shock anyone else here? I mean, yes, that's wild. Okay,
(13:22):
give us a second to bedrock here. Truth for reaching
these kids.
S5 (13:27):
Yeah, well. And this this will tie in exactly with
what you're saying. Listen, the Holy Spirit is on the move.
God is never inactive, and God is at work in
every population center, every people group, throughout time, throughout space.
God is always on the move. But some of us.
I'm not one of those people, but some of us
(13:47):
are old enough to remember the Jesus movement in the 1970s.
I had dinner last night with a very important Christian
leader here in Pittsburgh, where we're headquartered, and he and
his wife became Christians during the Jesus movement. And, you know,
they went on to a very storied career in corporate
and then became Christian leaders in Pittsburgh here. And they
(14:08):
recounted the story of being swept up by a move
of the Lord with a Holy Spirit was moving in power,
where people were getting saved by the hundreds everywhere you went. And,
you know, we think about that as kind of a
historic lure. That's what we're living in right now. You know,
we're seeing ministries like the circuit riders in Southern California
(14:29):
baptizing people by the thousands in the ocean like we
saw in the Jesus movement. Yes, the Holy Spirit is
moving in power. And I believe in many of my
colleagues in these other Christian ministries believe that revival is coming.
It is not yet here. What we're actually seeing are
the initial tremors of revival. So this second bedrock truth is,
(14:49):
listen to the Holy Spirit is.
S6 (14:51):
Alive and active and well, and.
S5 (14:53):
He's doing.
S6 (14:53):
Something unique.
S5 (14:54):
In power with this generation.
S2 (14:56):
All right, give us the third one, my man. You're
on a roll here.
S5 (15:00):
Well, the third one is a timeless truth. And I.
You know, I wouldn't be an evangelist worth my salt
if I didn't say this, but it is absolutely true. Listen, Carl,
the gospel cannot fail when we proclaim the gospel, God's
word goes.
S6 (15:13):
Out and.
S5 (15:13):
It comes back and it doesn't come back empty. It
doesn't come back void. The gospel doesn't fail. And it's
great to teach the great, you know, depths of the scriptures.
And but listen, you start with the good news of
Jesus death on the cross and the power of his
resurrection and the absolute authority of his lordship. And when
we proclaim that gospel, it's not coming back empty. It
(15:37):
always wins. And so I've been an evangelist now for
30 years. I've had the privilege of speaking to audiences
as small as five at a rehab center and as
large as 100,000. You know, I've been on TikTok, I've
been on TV, I've been on the street corners, and
I've been, you know, intimate coffee shops with people who
are giving their lives to Christ. And one thing that
is common in all of those experiences is that it
(16:00):
all comes down to Jesus. If we just make much
of Jesus, if we lift him up and focus on
the good news of the gospel, it cannot fail. It
will not fail. It will always produce fruit. Now, it
doesn't mean that always people become Christians, but it will
always produce fruit. How many of these stories do you hear?
Where somebody hears the gospel, they're offended, and it seems
(16:22):
as if there's rejection, but it's like a seed that
God puts in their heart, aggravates them and convicts them
of sin, of judgment or righteousness. And over the course
of time they end up repenting, giving their lives to Christ.
So my third bedrock truth is listen to gospel cannot fail.
Make much of Jesus. Lift him up. Make him known.
S2 (16:41):
Yeah. You know what, York? I was just sitting here
cogitating on this. So you got two stories in the Bible.
You got the Samaritan woman, and she responded. So much
so Jesus had to extend his stay in Samaria. And
then you got the rich young ruler. And he walked
away disappointed because he had a lot of wealth. Both
of those stories for 2000 years have been impacting people
(17:02):
for Christ, even though the rich young ruler apparently didn't respond.
That just that just hit me like a ton of bricks.
I guess the bottom line here is York. You put
these together. Don't assume they're resistant. The Holy Spirit is
on the move. Timeless truth is timeless truth. The gospel
changes everything. We got to keep our story out there,
no matter what age and stage we are. Right? York,
(17:24):
speak to our folks. That I mean, our average age
here is somewhere between 40 to 60, probably. However, lately
we've been finding a lot of teenagers and young people listening.
Just one final challenge. What do you say, my man?
S5 (17:37):
Well, next week, I'll have the privilege of joining my
friend Bob Lenz at Life Fest in Oshkosh, and I
think they'll probably be about 70,000 people there. And it's
a Christian festival with all the bands. And, you know,
at the end of each day the gospel will be proclaimed.
And I've been there a few times now, and I've
seen little kids with their mothers and dads, you know,
(17:59):
come forward to give their lives for Christ. And I've
seen teenagers and I've seen people smack dab in the
middle of your demographic, which I am. I'm 56. And
people who have lived their life coming to Jesus. And
then I've seen the elderly come to Christ. And so
the thing that I'm trying to say there, Carl, is, listen,
you know, God is no respecter of persons. God loves
us with an everlasting love. And he's not done working
(18:22):
until we're done breathing. And and listen, the gospel is
good news. The gospel is good news.
S2 (18:29):
Our York more. I love you, man. I do. God's
using you, and it's so inspiring. Yeah. Okay. You want
to get some goods? You want to get the goods
on this guy. We got it for you.
S4 (18:40):
Just text York to 800 555 78, 98. Text York
to 800 555 7898.
S2 (18:48):
Again. Text the word York to 800 555 7898.
S1 (18:55):
She's a choreographer extraordinaire, and everything is Greek to her.
Super die is in the crew. It's Carl and crew
on Moody Radio.
S2 (19:05):
Guess what? She slid back in here today. From parts
unknown around the world. Her name is Ali.
S7 (19:15):
Remember me?
S2 (19:16):
And if you've been suffering withdrawals. Boy, have we got
some hope for you.
S1 (19:23):
Making herself laugh no matter who joins her. It's time
for Ali. Thinks it's funny.
S2 (19:30):
Did you say remember me?
S4 (19:31):
Remember me? Boy, I've missed these jokes. I did try
out a couple on my on my trip.
S2 (19:39):
Oh, good for you.
S4 (19:40):
Yeah. They didn't go over great.
S2 (19:42):
But you gave it your. You put the mustard to it, right?
S4 (19:44):
It's never good when somebody's like. So tell us a joke.
Killing time on the bus between stops. You ready? Okay, then.
But I've got a I've got a loving, welcoming audience
in you. Listening. You. You enjoy these jokes? Uh, a
couple animal jokes for you today. How did the dog
get all A's on its report card? How did the
(20:07):
dog get all A's on? Say it's a boy dog
on his report card?
S8 (20:12):
Oh, I'm thinking hard. Nothing's coming.
S4 (20:15):
He was the teacher's pet. Of course. The teacher's pet.
That was rough. All A's. Wow.
S9 (20:24):
Thank you. Thank you.
S4 (20:27):
And now for a joke that. I've got to be honest,
when I first heard this one, my husband gave me
this one, and I said, I cannot wait to tell
this one on air. I laughed so hard.
S2 (20:38):
I can't wait. Wow. You've built.
S4 (20:39):
This.
S10 (20:40):
You've built it up. I've built.
S4 (20:41):
It up. And either you're gonna get it and you're
going to laugh, or you're going to go. That is horrible.
There's no in between. All right, I'm gearing up for it.
Favorite cat you have a you have a house cat?
S2 (20:53):
Yeah, we have two rescue cats.
S4 (20:55):
Rescue cats? Any anyone else a cat person? No. Cat. Okay,
then you might have a you might have an advantage.
How do cats like their steaks cooked? How do cats
like their steaks cooked?
S11 (21:08):
I can't wait.
S12 (21:10):
Rare. Okay. We need to flip that and save that. That's.
S3 (21:18):
That was great.
S12 (21:19):
I when I tell you.
S11 (21:23):
Oh, I applaud you on that one. That was too good.
S4 (21:27):
I've been.
S12 (21:27):
Waiting.
S11 (21:28):
That was so good.
S2 (21:30):
Oh, you did it.
S3 (21:31):
I love that.
S4 (21:32):
I have a I had one shot at it, I
knew I.
S2 (21:34):
Had one shot. You can't mess.
S4 (21:36):
That one up. Mess it up because there's no there's
no redos. And so when you get this joke, I
didn't quite indicate that you got to say it in
the voice.
S2 (21:43):
So you just have to.
S4 (21:45):
It's all voice. You've gotta. It's the voice inflection that
makes this.
S3 (21:48):
So when your husband told you your your big basketball
player husband told you.
S2 (21:54):
Did he do it.
S3 (21:55):
Well? Did he do that?
S4 (21:56):
Killed it.
S2 (21:57):
Killed it. That's coming out of Henry's mouth.
S3 (21:59):
That's what I want to.
S2 (22:00):
Crazier than Ali.
S4 (22:01):
He knows that I love these things. He hates these jokes.
But because of his love for me, he's a good husband.
And when he hears one or sees one online, he
saves it for me. And this one he delivered with
such gusto.
S12 (22:13):
You laughed.
S4 (22:13):
I was doubled over to hear.
S12 (22:15):
Him say ringer. I would pay.
S3 (22:23):
I pay.
S12 (22:24):
$5.
S2 (22:25):
To see Henry.
S12 (22:26):
Do it. Boy, it was. It was just a pure moment.
S4 (22:28):
Of gold in our household. If you want these jokes,
text Five, 78, 98. Just text jokes to 800 555 7898.
S2 (22:39):
I still can't picture Henry saying that. It was so.
S4 (22:42):
Good. I loved him more in that moment.
S2 (22:45):
Well, of course you did, man. That endeared you to
that hunk of burning love, man. Oh my goodness. Sex
jokes stayed under five. Five. Five. 78, 98. And I
can't see anyone texting in today.
S4 (22:58):
Oh, your.
S2 (22:59):
Machine is broken.
S4 (23:01):
Systems a little down.
S2 (23:02):
It's called simple texting. Well, that's simple enough for this Boomer.
All right, we'll work on that one. But we know
they're going out. Right, guys?
S4 (23:10):
Yes. I'm loving those of you who are giving me
a little puns. I'm feeling that joke. You're feeling it,
feeling it. Love it. Text jokes to 800 555 7898.
S2 (23:22):
Okay. Coming up, Ali is back. Man, I keep wanting
to say where you're back from, but I can't say
it and I hope it doesn't slip out of my mouth.
She went off on a missions trip to a to
a location in the planet Earth where.
S4 (23:37):
There are some restrictions. So I got to be restrictions.
S2 (23:40):
Yeah. Yeah. So we're going to break it down. We've
got lessons learned from this thing and we're going to
get them all day long. You ready to go, sister?
S4 (23:48):
Ready?
S2 (23:48):
She's got tears under her eyes. Guys, I'm not kidding you, right.
S4 (23:51):
And there may be more when I start talking about
this trip.
S2 (23:54):
Oh, but different ones.
S4 (23:55):
Different ones though.
S1 (23:57):
You're listening to Curl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2 (24:00):
Allie's back in town, and she's been in a in
a country that we can't disclose for practical reasons. But. Allie,
break it down, sister. What's on your heart? What did
you learn?
S4 (24:12):
You know, I had an opportunity to go with a
small group of people to a country of. It's a
very country that lives under a lot of oppression. And
what this particular ministry does is they're able to take
resources and practical things to help meet the needs of
the pastors and the missionaries. So part of this was
just an encouragement trip. Were we able to go and
(24:34):
meet a lot of pastors, encourage some missionaries, bring lots
of things in that are difficult to get in this
particular country. Just really love them well, and it was
such a cool thing to be a part of. And
but it was challenging. I mean, if you've not done
a trip like this where you go to a country
that's very impoverished, where a lot of the first world
(24:57):
sort of comforts are stripped away, you know, that was
my first time taking a trip like this. And so
I remember sitting in this one particular gathering of people
and it it's so hot there. And so we're in
this kind of cramped sort of space. And it was
probably about, I would say 95 degrees. And there were
(25:19):
people I mean, a crowd doesn't even describe it. I mean,
it was to the point where there wasn't a space
where there wasn't a body. And so everybody sort of
pressed together in this 95 degree space. There was electricity
until there wasn't because there they have rolling blackouts, brownouts.
(25:41):
And so the power goes out. And so the little
bit of of air circulation that was coming from the fan.
S2 (25:47):
It's now done.
S4 (25:48):
It's now done. And I'm seeing the worship of these people.
And the joy in their faces as they've gathered come
from very, very humble homes that are kind of makeshift
where they're, they're they're just doing life in a very
under such hardship. And I thought, would I stay.
S2 (26:10):
Home.
S4 (26:11):
Would I? The power's out. There's no secular circulation. It's
95 degrees.
S2 (26:18):
It's a good question.
S4 (26:19):
Every part of my body honestly wanted to kind of, like,
get out of this space just to breathe. But there
was such a desperation for God in that place. I
was confronted with would I stay?
S2 (26:31):
You know that. I wonder if we might just shut
it down.
S4 (26:35):
If I showed up to my church on Sunday morning
and the air conditioner. Just. Let's just take that out alone.
And it was a one of those days like we
had in Chicago and in my church had no air conditioning.
Would I stay 95 degrees?
S2 (26:47):
I don't even know if they would. I wonder if
they would even have it.
S4 (26:51):
Would we even have a service? And it was such
a funny little thought, but I think.
S2 (26:55):
That's a great thought.
S4 (26:56):
I thought the hunger and the desire that, you know, when, when,
when I think it was Peter who asked the question,
where else would we turn? Yeah. And so not only
did these people come desperate to, for, for the support
of each other, the exhortation of seeing other believers as
we kind of go through this life, we're struggling together,
the encouragement of one another, hanging on to every word
(27:21):
that's being spoken. Because these really are the words of life.
And we know that there's nothing else. We've got nothing else.
And I thought, boy, you know, this heat, this many people,
this many bodies pressed together, this much sweat pouring off
of me might be a deterrent, but it's not. When
(27:42):
you're hungry for God.
S2 (27:46):
These are such great lessons, and I'm so glad you
brought them back. Because it's your story can help us.
Even though we weren't there with you. And I was
in Burundi recently, so it's same. Very similar. But but
it's it's good because. Not because it's the old. Well,
(28:10):
the kids in Africa don't have it guilt trip. It's
a sobering like hold on here. What are we intolerant
of that a hunger for God makes people tolerant of.
S4 (28:23):
I mean, the things that we allow to kind of
keep us from, keep us from church, keep us from
gathering together because it feels kind of optional. That's what
I realize is that it sort of it can feel optional.
Do I go, do I show up today?
S2 (28:39):
It's really good. Got a question for you. Boom crew.
You hear that? And I want a lightning round response
to our text message line. What is the thing that
has been an inconvenience for you around the gospel that
you're like? In light of that, I'm going to quit
letting that be a point of impediment. I'm not going
(29:03):
to let that get in the way of me anymore.
What is it for you think about it for a second.
You just get sobered up. These are. Here's what's beautiful
about this. This isn't just a story. God allowed Ali
to go to this country that we can't share to
and come back and go, all right, this rocked Ali.
You can feel it. You're shoulder to shoulder. You got
(29:23):
sweat pouring off your arm or her arm and it's like,
hold it. Whose arm is sweating, you know? And then
you realize it's both of us. And now and then
you're like, whoa! Now the fan's off. It's 95 degrees.
No one's leaving. What's that do for you? What's it
do for you? Just text us in a in a
word or a sentence? One sentence. What's it do for you? Anything. 805, five, 578, 98, 805, five, five, 78, 98.
(29:55):
Sometimes the best way to take a step forward with
God is to appreciate what we have, and to maybe
put up with a little bit of inconvenience if the
gospel is really the thing that changes everything. 805 55 7898.
What's God saying to your heart right now? 800 555 7898.
S1 (30:18):
Start your day moving closer to Jesus. You're listening to
Carl and crew.
S2 (30:24):
Yeah, we're getting some good responses here, I tell you.
You are the boom crew. That's why we love you.
This is a sobering thing. Some of you like, what
are we responding to? Because people tune in. This is
kind of the really unusual kind of church service here,
the gathering of saints that we have because we come
and go at totally different times. Thankfully, we don't see
(30:46):
people getting up or coming in to the front row,
but that's really what we are. We're a gathering of
people from every nation, tribe and tongue across North America
and beyond. And when you hear a story like Ali's,
it'll get you sobered up a little bit. And you go, yeah,
I'm not shoulder to shoulder dripping sweat. 95 degrees fan
just went out. And you look around you and you
(31:09):
saw this, didn't you? You saw the hunger in their eyes.
They didn't flinch.
S4 (31:12):
No. You know, and this was in such a remote place.
I mean, we had we were in this kind of
this bus. It was we were sort of off road,
drove at least 20 minutes into what felt like the
forest didn't I mean, everything. It was such poverty everywhere
you look around and it was almost overwhelming. But then
to walk in this little space where these people were
(31:35):
so hungry for God, and it was humbling because I thought,
would I, would I stay under if if this was
the circumstances on a Sunday morning, would I stay?
S2 (31:45):
Yeah. I mean, it's a great question to ask. You know,
a lot of responses here. Um, it's bringing conviction to some, um,
they've got people that are going through health problems, but
it gives perspective to that. Um, it shows that some
people said, don't let this do this conviction is good.
(32:06):
Shame is not good.
S4 (32:07):
Yeah. No, that's.
S2 (32:08):
That's from the evil one. Um, but conviction is good.
It humbles me. It brings fire to my soul. I mean,
the responses here are immense, and we can't cover them all.
But praise be to God. Praise be to God. You know,
sometimes you can look at the hunger of the gospel
(32:28):
for people around the globe that don't have it as
well as we do, and don't let that guilt you
or shame you. But what if it just drove us
to our knees in deeper appreciation for the little stuff
in life, right? Ellie?
S4 (32:42):
Absolutely.
S1 (32:44):
She's a choreographer extraordinaire, and everything is Greek to her.
Super dei is in the crew. It's Carl and crew
on Moody Radio.
S2 (32:54):
Sometimes you get your cage rattled, and it's one of
the most beautiful things on the planet. And I don't
know how this went down, except that we got this
common friend named George. George cook.
S4 (33:06):
Okay.
S2 (33:06):
And George invited me out. He said, hey, Carl, you
got to come listen to this guy. I'm bringing this
guy in. You got to come listen to him. I'm
going to be serving lunch. And so I'm like, ah,
it's one of those meetings. You're like, all right, George,
I'll show up. And when I got there, I'm like, God,
this is why I'm here. So the back story is
God had just broken me and brought me back to
(33:26):
the beginning of it all. And that is pastors first
and foremost. Calling is to make disciples. And then I
run into this character, David Nelms, and I'm like, who
is this guy? He talks funny. He's got an accent. Guys,
I'm not saying he talks funny. He thinks we talk funny. Okay.
(33:47):
But his heart is so sincere and it rocked my world.
You remember that lunch, David? By chance? I don't know
if you do or not.
S13 (33:57):
Yeah, I do. And? And I'm sure glad George introduced us.
It was a great day.
S2 (34:02):
Yeah, it was a great day. I sure love you, bud.
All right, we're going to start with something totally different here.
Ali and I were rocked by something you said in
this studio. Goodness sakes. A couple of years ago. Ali,
take it away. You remember the statement?
S4 (34:16):
Yeah. Doctor David Nelms with the Timothy Initiative, You said
that we are not called to plant churches. We are
called to make disciples. And it was like all of
a sudden something became clear that had maybe gotten a
little foggy with sometimes the model that is put forth.
(34:36):
First of all, what's the difference between planting a church
and making a disciple? Why are they not one and
the same?
S13 (34:42):
Yeah, well, and let me let me be clear. Uh,
planting churches is probably my hobby. Okay. Yeah. Uh, you'll
be hard to find anybody more excited about planting churches
than me, but I. I used to think I knew
the Great Commission was to make disciples. I thought the
(35:02):
best way to make disciples was by planting churches. But
I came to realize that I had it backwards. Uh,
more accurate would be the best way to plant churches
is by making disciples for Jesus. The Great Commission. Jesus
did not say, go therefore, and plant churches. He said,
go therefore and make disciples. And so that should be
(35:25):
our priority. Now if you make disciples who make disciples,
you can't stop it from happening. The fruit of that
will be churches will spring up. And so I'm not
saying don't plant churches. I'm saying the best way to
plant churches is by obeying the Great Commission, going and
making disciples.
S4 (35:42):
Doctor David Nelms with the Timothy Initiative. It's a global
movement that makes and multiplies disciples, churches and leaders. They're
committed to getting a church in every village, everywhere around
the globe.
S2 (35:54):
Uh, let's. David, I want to go back to something
before I brought you on air. I don't know if
you heard what I was sharing, but there is a gravitational,
I mean, force field that to get out of that
orbit is difficult. And it's. And a lot of pastors
and a lot of people listening right now struggle with. Yeah,
we're validated by how many people are coming and how
(36:16):
much money's given. How do you get out of that
gravitational pull into a genuine heart for disciple making?
S13 (36:25):
Well, for me, Carl. And let me let me say
this to your listeners, I about the only thing I'm
really good at is not being good. Okay. So you're
with Paul and me?
S2 (36:37):
Yeah.
S13 (36:37):
Yeah. I don't see myself as as an example by
any means, but, you know, uh, I would define a
disciple as someone who lives like Jesus and leads others
to do the same. And Jesus reached thousands. He preached
to thousands of people. But I don't think his motivation.
(37:01):
Excuse me, I don't think his motivation was was numbers.
I think his motivation was bringing glory to his father. Yeah.
And the the the Great Commission, to me, first and foremost,
it's about honoring God, bringing glory to God. And I
think I think, as you said before, there's nothing wrong
(37:23):
with counting our attendance. I certainly did for the many
years I was a pastor. There's nothing wrong with that.
But I don't think Heaven is impressed with the fact
that we're running a hundred more this year than we
were last year. I, I think what matters there is,
you know, when we get to heaven, the rewards are
going to be based on well done, good and faithful servant,
where we faithful to do what God's called us to do.
(37:46):
And his great commission is to make disciples who make disciples,
so that that needs to be the focus.
S4 (37:52):
Doctor David Nelms, talk a little bit about or explain
for our listener what this looks like, the work that
you're doing with the Timothy Initiative, this disciple making making
disciples who make disciples.
S13 (38:04):
Yeah. Well, much of the world is made up of
what's called unreached people, groups and ethnicities that are very few,
if any, believers. And we're talking about 40% of the
world's population. 40% plus. And forgive me, I got a
little cough here. I don't mean to be coughing into
your microphone there, but, uh. And so we focus there.
(38:26):
It's basically it's your Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, animist parts of
the world. And we're not a sending agency. We simply
we have national teams who train pastors that we call
the Pauls. The Pauls recruit members of their church that
we call Timothy's. The Pauls trained the Timothy's to share
their story, share God's story out where they live, work, study, shop, play.
(38:48):
And as those Timothy's lead new believers to Christ, the
Timothy begins discipling the new believer. Don't bring them back
to the Paul. The Paul is equipping the Timothy to
do the work of the ministry, which, if it's anything,
it's the Great Commission making disciples. And so as the
Timothy begins discipling his or her Timothy, we call the
(39:09):
Timothy's Timothy, Titus, just the next generation. That's great. Then
pretty soon that Titus says, hey, I got a husband
or I got a wife, or I want my mom
to hear about this. And they begin bringing in their
their oikos, their friends and family. And the next thing
you know, wham! A little churches sprung up. And because, uh,
because multiplication is in the DNA, the we're not focused
(39:32):
on making disciples, but disciple makers. The goal is not
to plant a church. It's to plant a church that
plants a church. And so it just continues to move.
And we're just seeing God do some, I mean, book
of Acts type stuff. Incredible stuff.
S2 (39:46):
Yeah. And I don't want people to get derailed by
these numbers because they're so astronomical. But how many churches
do you anticipate, by the way? These are churches visited
twice to verify that there's leadership and that there's a
a gathering that can that constitutes called out ones that
meet together to grow up in a relationship with God.
(40:07):
How many churches do you hope to plant here in 2025?
S13 (40:12):
Five. Well, we're we're on. Uh, we're as it looks
right now. It looks like it's going to be somewhere
between 40 and 45,000 churches this year.
S2 (40:23):
Is that staggering, guys?
S4 (40:24):
It is staggering.
S2 (40:25):
And they're verified. This is not just some pipe dream
or numbers for numbers sake. It's just awesome. Okay, David Nelms,
I love you, dude. You are such an inspiration to me.
And I mean that. And you know, I love this
guy so much. I went to the brass here at
Moody and I said, I appeal to you, if we're
looking for a global partner, could we please have the
(40:47):
Timothy Initiative? So guess what? In 2026, I'm going to
be going to one of their sites. I don't even
think I've told you all this. Ali, you've been out
of the country. I'm going to be going to one
of their sites. We're going to see unreached people groups
that are being reached with the gospel and then discipled,
and then we're going to come back home and we're
going to have a big investment in what Ty is doing.
(41:10):
Isn't that cool?
S4 (41:11):
Oh That's.
S2 (41:11):
Awesome. Okay, so let's break it down here. David. Uh,
what I want from you today is three rock solid
truths of disciple making. And I just got a hunch
these things are going to jar us a little bit,
so let's go. What are they for? You, my man.
S13 (41:27):
Yeah. Number one, I would say for me personally. Now,
this is for me. I would say more important, the
most important thing about the Great Commission or about making
disciple makers, which is the Great Commission, is not what
you do, but why you do it. Uh, I believe
God is more concerned with why we do what we
do than he is with what we do. Making disciples
(41:51):
who make disciples, that's what we do. That's the Great Commission.
But why do we do it? I think the why
behind the what, the why behind the Great Commission is
the great commandment. Yes. When Jesus, when Jesus was asked,
what is the greatest of all the commandments. He did
(42:11):
not say, go make disciples. He did say, Love God
with all your heart. Love your neighbor as yourself. And
what I have found is this Carl. I grew up
being taught to keep the main thing. The main thing. Yup. And.
And what the pastor's always meant by that was the
main thing was the Great Commission. But they were right
(42:33):
that we should keep the main thing. The main thing.
S2 (42:35):
But that's the what?
S13 (42:36):
Yes. That's the what. The the main thing is, is
loving God, loving people and watch. If you love God,
you're going to want to please him, honor him, obey him. I,
I have a bunch of grandkids. I don't have any
problem talking to people about my grandkids because I love
my grandkids, and I want them to know about my grandkids.
(42:58):
If I love God, I'm going to want people to
know about my father. And if I love people, I'm
going to want them to have to experience God's grace
and his forgiveness and have joy and peace in their
hearts and and be able to walk on gold one
day for all eternity in heaven. So if you love
God and love people, the the Great Commission will just
(43:20):
naturally it's not a it. It's no longer a duty
or a command even see outflow.
S14 (43:26):
Yeah. Yeah.
S13 (43:27):
So so the main thing see, I think, I think
our problem is not the great. I think our problem, Karl.
My problem. It's a love thing.
S14 (43:38):
Yes.
S13 (43:38):
When I love God with all my heart and I
love people, the great, the great Commission is like taking
candy from a baby bro.
S2 (43:45):
This is so spot on. I mean, come on, we
could stop right there. Let's get two more, though. What
are these rock solid truths of disciple-making? Number one, love
God and the Great Commission will flow out of it.
Number two, what do you say?
S13 (44:01):
Yeah. Really? Really. Be filled with the Holy Spirit. Amen.
And in acts one and verse eight, when his last
statement before he went back to heaven. His last words,
and I'm going to paraphrase it, he said, I'm sending
the Holy Spirit and he is going to give you
the power you need to be my witnesses. I know
(44:22):
the Holy Spirit has many ministries, is given for many reasons.
But in our Lord's final statement, he directly connected the
dots of the coming of the Holy Spirit with power
to witness. And I believe, I believe, by the way,
a witness is just simply someone who tells what they've seen, heard,
know to be the truth. It's not techniques. It's not strategies.
(44:46):
It's being filled with the spirit.
S14 (44:48):
And.
S13 (44:49):
Filled with the spirit. The spirit produces the fruit of
the spirit in your life. And it is that love,
that joy, that peace, that patience. It's all that fruit.
That's what God uses to draw like a magnet people
to Jesus Christ. And so I would say, uh, make,
make much of the Holy Spirit, uh, every day. My
(45:12):
first prayer in my life, every single day is, father,
fill me with your Holy Spirit. And so, Carl, this
is important to me because I grew up, uh, to me,
the Holy Spirit was more of a doctrine. Uh.
S14 (45:27):
I'm with you.
S13 (45:28):
Yeah. And so, you know, see? Oh, God the father,
God the son, God the Holy Scriptures, as opposed to
God the Holy Spirit. So when the Holy Spirit is
alive in your heart and and and you are, you're
listening to him, and and your desire is to be
under his control. Again, the Great Commission just flows out
(45:50):
of that.
S4 (45:50):
Doctor David Nelms, our guest right now, founder of the
Timothy Initiative. Okay. In these last minute or two, give
us that third. What's that third rock solid truth of
disciple making.
S13 (46:00):
Yeah, I would say it's understanding, uh, what's often called
obedience based Base discipleship here in the States, most of
our discipling is knowledge base. It's just knowledge on top
of knowledge, fact on top of fact. So we know it.
But knowing it and doing it are two different things. Um,
the Great Commission passage, Matthew 2820 Jesus did not say,
(46:24):
teach those new believers everything I commanded you. He said,
teach them to observe or obey everything I commanded you.
And so, uh, I heard somebody say once, there's no
please in the Great Commission. It's it's not a request.
It's it's it's it's it is a command. It's more
than a command, but it is a command and understanding
(46:47):
that that it's it's not learning. It's not memorizing the
Romans Road or the three circles or the four spiritual laws,
or even how to share your, your story. It's it's
understanding that the King of kings, the one with all authority,
the one that snaps his fingers and heaven jumps. He
has told us to go out, share the gospel, make disciples.
(47:12):
When we obey him, that is what brings him glory.
So it's obedience based disciple making.
S2 (47:20):
This is so right on. You know, I actually called
David guys here. Just, uh, what was this a couple
of months ago? I said, what's the what's the game changer?
You get this love guy, you get all this stuff
cooking here, and he goes, at the end of the day,
we've got to we got to get rid of this
notion that calling for obedience is legalism. That's another thing
(47:40):
that's happened here, David, is that we've we've reduced obedience,
discipleship down to, oh, that must be legalism. That's not legalism.
Legalism is foisting something on people that God never intended.
Obedience is alignment of our life with God so that
our lives change. And this is beautiful. I got to
tell you, great Commission is the what? Here's the three
(48:05):
really whys. You might ask, why do you do this, guys?
That's what David just said. Love the Lord your God. Heart, soul, mind, strength.
Be filled with the Holy Spirit. Yes, an obedience based discipleship.
David Nelms I love you, hot dog. You are such
a blessing and we're grateful to have you in here.
S4 (48:23):
If you want more, text disciple to (800)Â 555-7898. Text disciple
to 800 555 7898. Thank you so much, Doctor David Nelms,
for being with us this morning.
S13 (48:35):
Thank you. My pleasure.
S2 (48:37):
What a guy, huh?
S14 (48:38):
Yeah.
S2 (48:40):
Is that rich?
S4 (48:42):
That's a lot to chew on.
S2 (48:44):
Three little points. That's a lot to chew on.
S4 (48:47):
Text disciple to 800 555, 78, 98.
S1 (48:53):
This is Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2 (48:56):
One of the challenging things living in the West is
that we look at experiences through our grid. Oftentimes, our
absence of experiences dictates how we make judgments on other people.
Just take what's going on in Afghanistan. I heard a
story just recently. Uh, I think this was it might
(49:19):
have been Pakistan, but here again, I heard an amazing story.
This is my bride that was telling me this when
she heard it on Moody Radio. Um. A woman has
a vision of Jesus. This is happening all the time.
And the. And the words were. She had never heard
(49:41):
anything about the Bible. Come to me. You're weary. You're
heavy laden. I'm going to give you rest. Take my
yoke upon you. She didn't know it was Jesus, but
she knew that this was God talking to her. So
she went on this hunt to find out who is.
Who is this God? And what came out of it
was she. She actually met someone who knew the Lord
(50:06):
and said, I can tell you where that quote comes from,
opens the scriptures and shows her. And she says, this is,
this is my God, bowed and knee surrendered to Jesus,
and the rest is history. And now it's having ripple
effects throughout her family. The tendency can be to get
fixated on the miracle rather than the miracle worker, which
(50:29):
is God. Yeah, that's the point of where you were.
They are.
S4 (50:32):
Totally.
S2 (50:33):
Totally enamored with the God of miracles, not miracles.
S4 (50:37):
Absolutely. And the I mean, the occupational hazard of living
in a wealthy nation is that your wealth and are
even the poorest people.
S2 (50:49):
In.
S4 (50:49):
America. The world is wealthy compared to the rest of
the world. So this is all of us in the
same boat of living in a place where physical needs,
for the most part, are are met. There's access, at least,
to things that modernize and make life a little bit easier. Yeah,
the occupational hazard is that the gospel can mean less
(51:12):
to you when you're not desperate for him.
S2 (51:17):
This is why we love to say here when you
feel like, oh man, I am so down. I'm so
kicked in the teeth I'm at the end of myself.
That's when you're most strategically positioned. It is to take
hold of the God of miracles. And if we can
uninsulated ourselves from the things of earth, and they grow
strangely dim in the light of his glory and grace. Katy,
(51:40):
bar the door. We don't know what's going to happen.
S4 (51:42):
Absolutely. Because this is not a oh, you know, I
feel like guilty for having. No it's not. It's stewarding
well what God's given you. But recognizing that man every
opportunity we need God, whether we have much or little
in the physical sense.
S2 (52:03):
Yeah. So here's here's an exercise, just a quick one
just on my heart here. Let's let's just imagine that
all the stuff that we're trusting in that just faded
to the background and all we have is Jesus. That's
all we have. And in truth, that is all we have.
S4 (52:24):
It is. That's the only thing that we have that's certain.
S2 (52:27):
But what if we could really cling to the Lord today?
I mean, cling to him and say, God, you are
Jehovah Jireh. You're my provider. You're my healer. You're the
banner of love. You. You are everything. God. And if
(52:48):
we could just for a moment, right now. Just let
the things of earth grow strangely dim in the light
of God's glory and grace. Look out, look out!
Coming to you from the Morning Star Mission sponsored studio.
This is Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2 (00:09):
Carl and crew helping you take your next step with Jesus.
And we're so grateful that you're with us here today.
We've got a whole week committed to bedrock rock solid truths.
And the truth is, we could do this for a
month of Sundays. This could go on and on, but
we're trying to anchor some of these things with some
of our frequent flyer guests. That'll really put your teeth
(00:32):
into something. And there's guests that we bring in who
are in the mix in their specialty, the way really,
they're calling what God's called them into. And it's a
beautiful thing when it comes to salvation of young people.
I think there's a lot of presumption that maybe we
can never really know how to do that, and so
(00:54):
we need to outsource it. We get the young guys, right? Sure.
I mean, that can be I think I think that's
one of the greatest misses going. I think the gospel
is way more relevant than we give it credit for. Now,
that's a little bit tongue in cheek because we all
know that, right? Right. But I think there's a tendency
to think if we're going to reach young people, we
(01:15):
better outsource this to young people.
S3 (01:18):
Yeah, I get that.
S2 (01:19):
But isn't there more than that? I think back to
my buddy that was genuinely born again when I was
in youth group at Sand Lake Baptist Church in Anchorage, Alaska.
Mark Donner, who Mark was quite a guy. I mean,
looking back, I'm like, wow, Mark, you put up with
(01:39):
a lot with me. And he was my buddy. But
I saw him live so righteously and so differently. And
there were a few kids that lived that way. Most
of us had this great hallucination of salvation that were
in that youth group. And I know that because we
go back now, years later and we find out, wow,
a lot of these kids are walking with God, but
(01:59):
they didn't really get surrendered to Christ until they really
rubbed their nose in the world and they got the
full dose of what their life was like. Religiosity did
not save them. And that's one of the things that
we constantly wrestle with here. In fact, next week we're
going to tackle this one. Uh, there's a there's a
great myth flying around out there. It's a big one.
How does it go, Ali?
S4 (02:21):
I've been a Christian my whole life.
S2 (02:22):
I've been a Christian my whole life. That that's. We're
going to debunk that one day next week. Because that's.
It's impossible. You're born with your back to God. You're
born as an enemy of the cross of Christ. And
then the question is, how are we going to reach
kids and what are we bringing them into? Are we
bringing them into a culture or into a living, breathing
(02:43):
relationship with the Son of God? Those are two totally
different things.
S4 (02:47):
Very much so. And with you're looking at Gen Z,
you're going to hear a few very few Gen Zers say,
I've been a Christian my whole life. That is not
the norm for Gen Z when you just look at
their world, the prevailing worldview.
S2 (03:02):
Boom. And maybe that's the secret sauce. Maybe the beautiful
thing with Gen Z and even some late stage millennials,
is that a kind of post-Christian here? We don't have
to feign that we've always been saved because we haven't.
And so maybe that baseline is one of the kickers here.
(03:22):
Coming up in a moment. Man, I love this guy.
R-york more is being used so powerfully. The Lord. Some
of the stats of the reach that he has through
social media are going to blow your mind. And what
we want to pin down with York is get after
these three bedrock truths for evangelizing the next generation. I'm
flying blind here. I don't know what York's going to say,
(03:45):
but I can't wait. You guys ready?
S4 (03:47):
Ready.
S2 (03:47):
Coming up. Three minutes. Are York more? How are we
going to evangelize young people? And are any of these
principles transferable to lost boomers who think they know Jesus
but don't. Let's get after it. Hang on.
S1 (04:01):
Your spiritual pit stop to keep you going in the race.
You're listening to Carl and crew.
S2 (04:08):
We've got great data points that prove that this generation
Gen Z boy, God is doing something. And especially with
the young men. At least that's what we're hearing. Our
York more. Are we missing it, or is God doing
something out there, my man?
S5 (04:23):
Absolutely. God is on the move, and he is alive
and well on our college campuses. And with Gen Z.
S2 (04:28):
Our York Moore, speaker, revivalist and a president, CEO and
national evangelist of the coalition for Christian Outreach. That's a
lot of lot of stuff there, York. Boil it down.
What do you do? What's your passion?
S5 (04:42):
Well, the coalition for Christian Outreach, we partner with local
churches to reach college campuses with the gospel. We've been
around for 50 years, but the Lord has called us
to grow nationally. So I'm leading a national growth story
over here. We're now working in about 16 states with
a few hundred churches. And our model, you know, taking
college students to church is part of what we do.
(05:04):
So we don't just go to the campus, we take
the church to the campus. But we're seeing young people
come to faith in this generation, and we're bringing them
into the into the church, and they're getting baptized. We've
had a rash of baptisms this school year. That's just
mind blowing. We've never seen anything like it in 50 years.
You know, you mentioned earlier in the last segment that
this generation is open and man, are they open to
(05:27):
the gospel. But allies, right. Like they don't refer to
themselves as having been Christian. Uh, in fact, the largest
segment of our population would be considered nones. They have
no affiliation whatsoever. But we make the mistake of assuming
that that means that they're not interested in the gospel.
This isn't European secularism. This is the greatest opportunity for
the gospel in American history.
S4 (05:48):
Are York more with us right now? I'm looking at
an article from the Gospel Coalition on this. Uh, tell
me how this statement hits you. It says an increased
majority of Gen Zers are biblically illiterate, anxious, digitally native,
and uninterested in church. And then it goes on to say,
we must understand these obstacles, but also crucial that we
see them as opportunities for growth. How does that hit you?
(06:10):
Do you think that that's an accurate description of Gen Z?
S5 (06:15):
Yeah, absolutely. And the operative word there is, you know,
it's an opportunity. I don't know that I would say
that they're not interested in church. It's just nobody's really
inviting them. They don't really think of church like it's
just not on their top ten list. They you know,
they're binging Netflix. They're they're on TikTok. They're they're doing
these kinds of things. And church is almost like this
invisible world to them. So in the coalition for Christian Outreach,
(06:39):
when we invite them to church, almost always it's their
first opportunity to go to church. Now, what they find
at church is a very strange world, and so we
need to prepare them for that. There's a culture in
our churches, but yeah, that that actually describes Gen Z
pretty well. The idea that they're digital natives, that's a
phrase that we like to throw around and use a lot.
(06:59):
But you know, what I like to say is that,
you know, our life will forever be what I call
phygital the integration of physical and digital. There's no separation
between the digital self and our corporeal existence, our physical
existence and the relationships that we have online. Those lines
don't exist for Gen Z, and really, for most of us,
(07:20):
those lines are getting blurred every day. But Gen Z
is the first real, true generation of digital natives, if
we like to use that phrase.
S2 (07:28):
Love it R-york more is our guest. Before we get
into three bedrock truths for evangelizing this next generation, I
want you to give some stats. Our audience needs to
know what God's doing through your ministry. Uh, blow our
mind here. We haven't had you in here for a while.
What's God doing?
S5 (07:46):
Well, the God is always on the move, and it's
all the Lord. All glory to the Lord Jesus. But
you know the coalition for Christian Outreach is probably a
name that your listeners have never heard of. We've been
around for 50 years. I spent 27 years with a
very well-known ministry called InterVarsity Christian Fellowship, was their national evangelist.
That's a juggernaut. I mean, they are 50 states. Uh,
(08:07):
you know, 1400 employees. You know, part of 173 nation
movement of college students. We're tiny, tiny, tiny. And I
took this job because the invitation was nationalized. This movement,
I started the Every Campus coalition with a couple of
friends back in 2017. Now, that includes every single college
ministry in America. 130 college ministries are a part of
(08:30):
the every campus movement. You can go to every campus
comm and check that out. But I said yes to
being the CEO of the Co, which has taken me
three years now to to say, you know, with elegance,
I'm the CEO of the Co Karl and that's harder
to say.
S6 (08:45):
It is.
S5 (08:46):
And basically I said yes because our model is the
local church. Now, I love all of the campus ministries,
and so this isn't a competition. We're not in competition
with one another. But I think we are the only
college ministry at scale that's actually predicated upon working directly
with the local church. We put our missionaries on staff
(09:06):
with the local church, and then through the local church.
We're reaching students for Christ, and then we measure how
active are they in the life of the church. And
the exciting thing is, in the last three years, we've
seen 50% growth. We're now operating in 16 states. We
have a strategic plan to grow an additional 30%. So
God is on the move. But listen, it's not just
(09:27):
about the big numbers and these kinds of things. It's
about discipleship. We are a disciple making movement. And so
as we're seeing young people come to Christ, we're discipling
them into this passionate worldview that integrates the lordship of
Jesus into every square inch of their lives, not just
a Sunday faith. We call it our Beyond Sunday effect.
(09:48):
We're discipling students from Monday through Sunday. Faith.
S4 (09:52):
Are your guests right now. So let's get on these, uh,
these three bedrock truths for evangelizing this next generation. I
know you spend time with your TikTok ministry. You work
a lot with college students. Uh, sum up, give us
the first of those bedrock truths is going to help
us evangelize this generation.
S5 (10:11):
Yeah. The first one is, is really what we've already
touched upon. Listen, when you have an entire generation, let's
just say let's recognize the opportunity here. Gen Z is
literally the largest generation in American history. They are not
just the largest unchurched generation. They are the largest generation. Period.
So that means something. And so then when we dive
(10:31):
into the stats and, uh, you know, you know, Kinnaman
will tell us over there at Barna and these stats
are true. 84% of Gen Z, uh, are either extremely
open or moderately open to spiritual dialogue.
S6 (10:46):
That's amazing.
S5 (10:47):
And he also tells us that they're looking for mentors.
That's new. I'm an Xer. I wasn't looking for mentors.
I wasn't looking for somebody to feed into me spiritually
and walk in life. I had to be taught that
that was a good thing. This generation is actually open.
So the first bedrock truth is, listen, when you're sharing
the good news with people, the assumption that they're resistant.
(11:09):
The assumption that they have lots of kind of hostile questions,
that's that's gone. So when you now they do have questions,
they're different questions. They're not the classic apologetic questions. The
evidence for the resurrection. And you know, what's the historical
evidence for the validity of the Bible. And they're not
asking those kinds of questions. They are asking questions. And
their questions are challenging, but they're not hostile. This is
(11:32):
a generation that's incredibly open. So that first bedrock truth
is really this is the greatest evangelistic opportunity in American history.
And so if you're sitting on a board of a foundation,
if you're an elder in a church, if you're a
businessman or a woman who loves to invest in kingdom initiatives. Listen,
get your checkbook out. This is an opportunity to underwrite
(11:56):
a movement of God that we're seeing in this generation.
Don't miss this opportunity. This isn't this isn't just like
a a small little blip. This is a great opportunity. Listen,
I've been talking to people around the country. I was
just talking to somebody in the Fellowship of Christian Athletes,
which is a wonderful ministry. My organization does work with FCA.
They had 2000 students come to faith at a single
(12:18):
event in Jacksonville, Florida.
S6 (12:20):
Wow.
S5 (12:20):
We heard about 2000 coming at Western Western WVU, Western
Virginia University. It's not just, you know, these little revivals
on these Christian college campuses that we're hearing about. There
is a move of God across America and Gen Z,
and I think we're just getting started.
S2 (12:36):
I love it. Anecdotally, this is so weird. I haven't
even told my team this. But at our new campus
that we opened up here for 180 Chicago, we had
three high schoolers come to the church and I started asking, hey,
does anyone know these kids? They were there for a
few weeks in a row. Campus directors started to get
to know them a little bit. Here's what we found out.
Ready for this, guys? No one invited him. York. They
(12:59):
showed up, they sought us out. And they sit in
the front row, leaning forward, hanging on every word. No
parents coming to church. No parents with any spiritual interest
at all. And they're there every week. York isn't that.
Does that shock anyone else here? I mean, yes, that's wild. Okay,
(13:22):
give us a second to bedrock here. Truth for reaching
these kids.
S5 (13:27):
Yeah, well. And this this will tie in exactly with
what you're saying. Listen, the Holy Spirit is on the move.
God is never inactive, and God is at work in
every population center, every people group, throughout time, throughout space.
God is always on the move. But some of us.
I'm not one of those people, but some of us
(13:47):
are old enough to remember the Jesus movement in the 1970s.
I had dinner last night with a very important Christian
leader here in Pittsburgh, where we're headquartered, and he and
his wife became Christians during the Jesus movement. And, you know,
they went on to a very storied career in corporate
and then became Christian leaders in Pittsburgh here. And they
(14:08):
recounted the story of being swept up by a move
of the Lord with a Holy Spirit was moving in power,
where people were getting saved by the hundreds everywhere you went. And,
you know, we think about that as kind of a
historic lure. That's what we're living in right now. You know,
we're seeing ministries like the circuit riders in Southern California
(14:29):
baptizing people by the thousands in the ocean like we
saw in the Jesus movement. Yes, the Holy Spirit is
moving in power. And I believe in many of my
colleagues in these other Christian ministries believe that revival is coming.
It is not yet here. What we're actually seeing are
the initial tremors of revival. So this second bedrock truth is,
(14:49):
listen to the Holy Spirit is.
S6 (14:51):
Alive and active and well, and.
S5 (14:53):
He's doing.
S6 (14:53):
Something unique.
S5 (14:54):
In power with this generation.
S2 (14:56):
All right, give us the third one, my man. You're
on a roll here.
S5 (15:00):
Well, the third one is a timeless truth. And I.
You know, I wouldn't be an evangelist worth my salt
if I didn't say this, but it is absolutely true. Listen, Carl,
the gospel cannot fail when we proclaim the gospel, God's
word goes.
S6 (15:13):
Out and.
S5 (15:13):
It comes back and it doesn't come back empty. It
doesn't come back void. The gospel doesn't fail. And it's
great to teach the great, you know, depths of the scriptures.
And but listen, you start with the good news of
Jesus death on the cross and the power of his
resurrection and the absolute authority of his lordship. And when
we proclaim that gospel, it's not coming back empty. It
(15:37):
always wins. And so I've been an evangelist now for
30 years. I've had the privilege of speaking to audiences
as small as five at a rehab center and as
large as 100,000. You know, I've been on TikTok, I've
been on TV, I've been on the street corners, and
I've been, you know, intimate coffee shops with people who
are giving their lives to Christ. And one thing that
is common in all of those experiences is that it
(16:00):
all comes down to Jesus. If we just make much
of Jesus, if we lift him up and focus on
the good news of the gospel, it cannot fail. It
will not fail. It will always produce fruit. Now, it
doesn't mean that always people become Christians, but it will
always produce fruit. How many of these stories do you hear?
Where somebody hears the gospel, they're offended, and it seems
(16:22):
as if there's rejection, but it's like a seed that
God puts in their heart, aggravates them and convicts them
of sin, of judgment or righteousness. And over the course
of time they end up repenting, giving their lives to Christ.
So my third bedrock truth is listen to gospel cannot fail.
Make much of Jesus. Lift him up. Make him known.
S2 (16:41):
Yeah. You know what, York? I was just sitting here
cogitating on this. So you got two stories in the Bible.
You got the Samaritan woman, and she responded. So much
so Jesus had to extend his stay in Samaria. And
then you got the rich young ruler. And he walked
away disappointed because he had a lot of wealth. Both
of those stories for 2000 years have been impacting people
(17:02):
for Christ, even though the rich young ruler apparently didn't respond.
That just that just hit me like a ton of bricks.
I guess the bottom line here is York. You put
these together. Don't assume they're resistant. The Holy Spirit is
on the move. Timeless truth is timeless truth. The gospel
changes everything. We got to keep our story out there,
no matter what age and stage we are. Right? York,
(17:24):
speak to our folks. That I mean, our average age
here is somewhere between 40 to 60, probably. However, lately
we've been finding a lot of teenagers and young people listening.
Just one final challenge. What do you say, my man?
S5 (17:37):
Well, next week, I'll have the privilege of joining my
friend Bob Lenz at Life Fest in Oshkosh, and I
think they'll probably be about 70,000 people there. And it's
a Christian festival with all the bands. And, you know,
at the end of each day the gospel will be proclaimed.
And I've been there a few times now, and I've
seen little kids with their mothers and dads, you know,
(17:59):
come forward to give their lives for Christ. And I've
seen teenagers and I've seen people smack dab in the
middle of your demographic, which I am. I'm 56. And
people who have lived their life coming to Jesus. And
then I've seen the elderly come to Christ. And so
the thing that I'm trying to say there, Carl, is, listen,
you know, God is no respecter of persons. God loves
us with an everlasting love. And he's not done working
(18:22):
until we're done breathing. And and listen, the gospel is
good news. The gospel is good news.
S2 (18:29):
Our York more. I love you, man. I do. God's
using you, and it's so inspiring. Yeah. Okay. You want
to get some goods? You want to get the goods
on this guy. We got it for you.
S4 (18:40):
Just text York to 800 555 78, 98. Text York
to 800 555 7898.
S2 (18:48):
Again. Text the word York to 800 555 7898.
S1 (18:55):
She's a choreographer extraordinaire, and everything is Greek to her.
Super die is in the crew. It's Carl and crew
on Moody Radio.
S2 (19:05):
Guess what? She slid back in here today. From parts
unknown around the world. Her name is Ali.
S7 (19:15):
Remember me?
S2 (19:16):
And if you've been suffering withdrawals. Boy, have we got
some hope for you.
S1 (19:23):
Making herself laugh no matter who joins her. It's time
for Ali. Thinks it's funny.
S2 (19:30):
Did you say remember me?
S4 (19:31):
Remember me? Boy, I've missed these jokes. I did try
out a couple on my on my trip.
S2 (19:39):
Oh, good for you.
S4 (19:40):
Yeah. They didn't go over great.
S2 (19:42):
But you gave it your. You put the mustard to it, right?
S4 (19:44):
It's never good when somebody's like. So tell us a joke.
Killing time on the bus between stops. You ready? Okay, then.
But I've got a I've got a loving, welcoming audience
in you. Listening. You. You enjoy these jokes? Uh, a
couple animal jokes for you today. How did the dog
get all A's on its report card? How did the
(20:07):
dog get all A's on? Say it's a boy dog
on his report card?
S8 (20:12):
Oh, I'm thinking hard. Nothing's coming.
S4 (20:15):
He was the teacher's pet. Of course. The teacher's pet.
That was rough. All A's. Wow.
S9 (20:24):
Thank you. Thank you.
S4 (20:27):
And now for a joke that. I've got to be honest,
when I first heard this one, my husband gave me
this one, and I said, I cannot wait to tell
this one on air. I laughed so hard.
S2 (20:38):
I can't wait. Wow. You've built.
S4 (20:39):
This.
S10 (20:40):
You've built it up. I've built.
S4 (20:41):
It up. And either you're gonna get it and you're
going to laugh, or you're going to go. That is horrible.
There's no in between. All right, I'm gearing up for it.
Favorite cat you have a you have a house cat?
S2 (20:53):
Yeah, we have two rescue cats.
S4 (20:55):
Rescue cats? Any anyone else a cat person? No. Cat. Okay,
then you might have a you might have an advantage.
How do cats like their steaks cooked? How do cats
like their steaks cooked?
S11 (21:08):
I can't wait.
S12 (21:10):
Rare. Okay. We need to flip that and save that. That's.
S3 (21:18):
That was great.
S12 (21:19):
I when I tell you.
S11 (21:23):
Oh, I applaud you on that one. That was too good.
S4 (21:27):
I've been.
S12 (21:27):
Waiting.
S11 (21:28):
That was so good.
S2 (21:30):
Oh, you did it.
S3 (21:31):
I love that.
S4 (21:32):
I have a I had one shot at it, I
knew I.
S2 (21:34):
Had one shot. You can't mess.
S4 (21:36):
That one up. Mess it up because there's no there's
no redos. And so when you get this joke, I
didn't quite indicate that you got to say it in
the voice.
S2 (21:43):
So you just have to.
S4 (21:45):
It's all voice. You've gotta. It's the voice inflection that
makes this.
S3 (21:48):
So when your husband told you your your big basketball
player husband told you.
S2 (21:54):
Did he do it.
S3 (21:55):
Well? Did he do that?
S4 (21:56):
Killed it.
S2 (21:57):
Killed it. That's coming out of Henry's mouth.
S3 (21:59):
That's what I want to.
S2 (22:00):
Crazier than Ali.
S4 (22:01):
He knows that I love these things. He hates these jokes.
But because of his love for me, he's a good husband.
And when he hears one or sees one online, he
saves it for me. And this one he delivered with
such gusto.
S12 (22:13):
You laughed.
S4 (22:13):
I was doubled over to hear.
S12 (22:15):
Him say ringer. I would pay.
S3 (22:23):
I pay.
S12 (22:24):
$5.
S2 (22:25):
To see Henry.
S12 (22:26):
Do it. Boy, it was. It was just a pure moment.
S4 (22:28):
Of gold in our household. If you want these jokes,
text Five, 78, 98. Just text jokes to 800 555 7898.
S2 (22:39):
I still can't picture Henry saying that. It was so.
S4 (22:42):
Good. I loved him more in that moment.
S2 (22:45):
Well, of course you did, man. That endeared you to
that hunk of burning love, man. Oh my goodness. Sex
jokes stayed under five. Five. Five. 78, 98. And I
can't see anyone texting in today.
S4 (22:58):
Oh, your.
S2 (22:59):
Machine is broken.
S4 (23:01):
Systems a little down.
S2 (23:02):
It's called simple texting. Well, that's simple enough for this Boomer.
All right, we'll work on that one. But we know
they're going out. Right, guys?
S4 (23:10):
Yes. I'm loving those of you who are giving me
a little puns. I'm feeling that joke. You're feeling it,
feeling it. Love it. Text jokes to 800 555 7898.
S2 (23:22):
Okay. Coming up, Ali is back. Man, I keep wanting
to say where you're back from, but I can't say
it and I hope it doesn't slip out of my mouth.
She went off on a missions trip to a to
a location in the planet Earth where.
S4 (23:37):
There are some restrictions. So I got to be restrictions.
S2 (23:40):
Yeah. Yeah. So we're going to break it down. We've
got lessons learned from this thing and we're going to
get them all day long. You ready to go, sister?
S4 (23:48):
Ready?
S2 (23:48):
She's got tears under her eyes. Guys, I'm not kidding you, right.
S4 (23:51):
And there may be more when I start talking about
this trip.
S2 (23:54):
Oh, but different ones.
S4 (23:55):
Different ones though.
S1 (23:57):
You're listening to Curl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2 (24:00):
Allie's back in town, and she's been in a in
a country that we can't disclose for practical reasons. But. Allie,
break it down, sister. What's on your heart? What did
you learn?
S4 (24:12):
You know, I had an opportunity to go with a
small group of people to a country of. It's a
very country that lives under a lot of oppression. And
what this particular ministry does is they're able to take
resources and practical things to help meet the needs of
the pastors and the missionaries. So part of this was
just an encouragement trip. Were we able to go and
(24:34):
meet a lot of pastors, encourage some missionaries, bring lots
of things in that are difficult to get in this
particular country. Just really love them well, and it was
such a cool thing to be a part of. And
but it was challenging. I mean, if you've not done
a trip like this where you go to a country
that's very impoverished, where a lot of the first world
(24:57):
sort of comforts are stripped away, you know, that was
my first time taking a trip like this. And so
I remember sitting in this one particular gathering of people
and it it's so hot there. And so we're in
this kind of cramped sort of space. And it was
probably about, I would say 95 degrees. And there were
(25:19):
people I mean, a crowd doesn't even describe it. I mean,
it was to the point where there wasn't a space
where there wasn't a body. And so everybody sort of
pressed together in this 95 degree space. There was electricity
until there wasn't because there they have rolling blackouts, brownouts.
(25:41):
And so the power goes out. And so the little
bit of of air circulation that was coming from the fan.
S2 (25:47):
It's now done.
S4 (25:48):
It's now done. And I'm seeing the worship of these people.
And the joy in their faces as they've gathered come
from very, very humble homes that are kind of makeshift
where they're, they're they're just doing life in a very
under such hardship. And I thought, would I stay.
S2 (26:10):
Home.
S4 (26:11):
Would I? The power's out. There's no secular circulation. It's
95 degrees.
S2 (26:18):
It's a good question.
S4 (26:19):
Every part of my body honestly wanted to kind of, like,
get out of this space just to breathe. But there
was such a desperation for God in that place. I
was confronted with would I stay?
S2 (26:31):
You know that. I wonder if we might just shut
it down.
S4 (26:35):
If I showed up to my church on Sunday morning
and the air conditioner. Just. Let's just take that out alone.
And it was a one of those days like we
had in Chicago and in my church had no air conditioning.
Would I stay 95 degrees?
S2 (26:47):
I don't even know if they would. I wonder if
they would even have it.
S4 (26:51):
Would we even have a service? And it was such
a funny little thought, but I think.
S2 (26:55):
That's a great thought.
S4 (26:56):
I thought the hunger and the desire that, you know, when, when,
when I think it was Peter who asked the question,
where else would we turn? Yeah. And so not only
did these people come desperate to, for, for the support
of each other, the exhortation of seeing other believers as
we kind of go through this life, we're struggling together,
the encouragement of one another, hanging on to every word
(27:21):
that's being spoken. Because these really are the words of life.
And we know that there's nothing else. We've got nothing else.
And I thought, boy, you know, this heat, this many people,
this many bodies pressed together, this much sweat pouring off
of me might be a deterrent, but it's not. When
(27:42):
you're hungry for God.
S2 (27:46):
These are such great lessons, and I'm so glad you
brought them back. Because it's your story can help us.
Even though we weren't there with you. And I was
in Burundi recently, so it's same. Very similar. But but
it's it's good because. Not because it's the old. Well,
(28:10):
the kids in Africa don't have it guilt trip. It's
a sobering like hold on here. What are we intolerant
of that a hunger for God makes people tolerant of.
S4 (28:23):
I mean, the things that we allow to kind of
keep us from, keep us from church, keep us from
gathering together because it feels kind of optional. That's what
I realize is that it sort of it can feel optional.
Do I go, do I show up today?
S2 (28:39):
It's really good. Got a question for you. Boom crew.
You hear that? And I want a lightning round response
to our text message line. What is the thing that
has been an inconvenience for you around the gospel that
you're like? In light of that, I'm going to quit
letting that be a point of impediment. I'm not going
(29:03):
to let that get in the way of me anymore.
What is it for you think about it for a second.
You just get sobered up. These are. Here's what's beautiful
about this. This isn't just a story. God allowed Ali
to go to this country that we can't share to
and come back and go, all right, this rocked Ali.
You can feel it. You're shoulder to shoulder. You got
(29:23):
sweat pouring off your arm or her arm and it's like,
hold it. Whose arm is sweating, you know? And then
you realize it's both of us. And now and then
you're like, whoa! Now the fan's off. It's 95 degrees.
No one's leaving. What's that do for you? What's it
do for you? Just text us in a in a
word or a sentence? One sentence. What's it do for you? Anything. 805, five, 578, 98, 805, five, five, 78, 98.
(29:55):
Sometimes the best way to take a step forward with
God is to appreciate what we have, and to maybe
put up with a little bit of inconvenience if the
gospel is really the thing that changes everything. 805 55 7898.
What's God saying to your heart right now? 800 555 7898.
S1 (30:18):
Start your day moving closer to Jesus. You're listening to
Carl and crew.
S2 (30:24):
Yeah, we're getting some good responses here, I tell you.
You are the boom crew. That's why we love you.
This is a sobering thing. Some of you like, what
are we responding to? Because people tune in. This is
kind of the really unusual kind of church service here,
the gathering of saints that we have because we come
and go at totally different times. Thankfully, we don't see
(30:46):
people getting up or coming in to the front row,
but that's really what we are. We're a gathering of
people from every nation, tribe and tongue across North America
and beyond. And when you hear a story like Ali's,
it'll get you sobered up a little bit. And you go, yeah,
I'm not shoulder to shoulder dripping sweat. 95 degrees fan
just went out. And you look around you and you
(31:09):
saw this, didn't you? You saw the hunger in their eyes.
They didn't flinch.
S4 (31:12):
No. You know, and this was in such a remote place.
I mean, we had we were in this kind of
this bus. It was we were sort of off road,
drove at least 20 minutes into what felt like the
forest didn't I mean, everything. It was such poverty everywhere
you look around and it was almost overwhelming. But then
to walk in this little space where these people were
(31:35):
so hungry for God, and it was humbling because I thought,
would I, would I stay under if if this was
the circumstances on a Sunday morning, would I stay?
S2 (31:45):
Yeah. I mean, it's a great question to ask. You know,
a lot of responses here. Um, it's bringing conviction to some, um,
they've got people that are going through health problems, but
it gives perspective to that. Um, it shows that some
people said, don't let this do this conviction is good.
(32:06):
Shame is not good.
S4 (32:07):
Yeah. No, that's.
S2 (32:08):
That's from the evil one. Um, but conviction is good.
It humbles me. It brings fire to my soul. I mean,
the responses here are immense, and we can't cover them all.
But praise be to God. Praise be to God. You know,
sometimes you can look at the hunger of the gospel
(32:28):
for people around the globe that don't have it as
well as we do, and don't let that guilt you
or shame you. But what if it just drove us
to our knees in deeper appreciation for the little stuff
in life, right? Ellie?
S4 (32:42):
Absolutely.
S1 (32:44):
She's a choreographer extraordinaire, and everything is Greek to her.
Super dei is in the crew. It's Carl and crew
on Moody Radio.
S2 (32:54):
Sometimes you get your cage rattled, and it's one of
the most beautiful things on the planet. And I don't
know how this went down, except that we got this
common friend named George. George cook.
S4 (33:06):
Okay.
S2 (33:06):
And George invited me out. He said, hey, Carl, you
got to come listen to this guy. I'm bringing this
guy in. You got to come listen to him. I'm
going to be serving lunch. And so I'm like, ah,
it's one of those meetings. You're like, all right, George,
I'll show up. And when I got there, I'm like, God,
this is why I'm here. So the back story is
God had just broken me and brought me back to
(33:26):
the beginning of it all. And that is pastors first
and foremost. Calling is to make disciples. And then I
run into this character, David Nelms, and I'm like, who
is this guy? He talks funny. He's got an accent. Guys,
I'm not saying he talks funny. He thinks we talk funny. Okay.
(33:47):
But his heart is so sincere and it rocked my world.
You remember that lunch, David? By chance? I don't know
if you do or not.
S13 (33:57):
Yeah, I do. And? And I'm sure glad George introduced us.
It was a great day.
S2 (34:02):
Yeah, it was a great day. I sure love you, bud.
All right, we're going to start with something totally different here.
Ali and I were rocked by something you said in
this studio. Goodness sakes. A couple of years ago. Ali,
take it away. You remember the statement?
S4 (34:16):
Yeah. Doctor David Nelms with the Timothy Initiative, You said
that we are not called to plant churches. We are
called to make disciples. And it was like all of
a sudden something became clear that had maybe gotten a
little foggy with sometimes the model that is put forth.
(34:36):
First of all, what's the difference between planting a church
and making a disciple? Why are they not one and
the same?
S13 (34:42):
Yeah, well, and let me let me be clear. Uh,
planting churches is probably my hobby. Okay. Yeah. Uh, you'll
be hard to find anybody more excited about planting churches
than me, but I. I used to think I knew
the Great Commission was to make disciples. I thought the
(35:02):
best way to make disciples was by planting churches. But
I came to realize that I had it backwards. Uh,
more accurate would be the best way to plant churches
is by making disciples for Jesus. The Great Commission. Jesus
did not say, go therefore, and plant churches. He said,
go therefore and make disciples. And so that should be
(35:25):
our priority. Now if you make disciples who make disciples,
you can't stop it from happening. The fruit of that
will be churches will spring up. And so I'm not
saying don't plant churches. I'm saying the best way to
plant churches is by obeying the Great Commission, going and
making disciples.
S4 (35:42):
Doctor David Nelms with the Timothy Initiative. It's a global
movement that makes and multiplies disciples, churches and leaders. They're
committed to getting a church in every village, everywhere around
the globe.
S2 (35:54):
Uh, let's. David, I want to go back to something
before I brought you on air. I don't know if
you heard what I was sharing, but there is a gravitational,
I mean, force field that to get out of that
orbit is difficult. And it's. And a lot of pastors
and a lot of people listening right now struggle with. Yeah,
we're validated by how many people are coming and how
(36:16):
much money's given. How do you get out of that
gravitational pull into a genuine heart for disciple making?
S13 (36:25):
Well, for me, Carl. And let me let me say
this to your listeners, I about the only thing I'm
really good at is not being good. Okay. So you're
with Paul and me?
S2 (36:37):
Yeah.
S13 (36:37):
Yeah. I don't see myself as as an example by
any means, but, you know, uh, I would define a
disciple as someone who lives like Jesus and leads others
to do the same. And Jesus reached thousands. He preached
to thousands of people. But I don't think his motivation.
(37:01):
Excuse me, I don't think his motivation was was numbers.
I think his motivation was bringing glory to his father. Yeah.
And the the the Great Commission, to me, first and foremost,
it's about honoring God, bringing glory to God. And I
think I think, as you said before, there's nothing wrong
(37:23):
with counting our attendance. I certainly did for the many
years I was a pastor. There's nothing wrong with that.
But I don't think Heaven is impressed with the fact
that we're running a hundred more this year than we
were last year. I, I think what matters there is,
you know, when we get to heaven, the rewards are
going to be based on well done, good and faithful servant,
where we faithful to do what God's called us to do.
(37:46):
And his great commission is to make disciples who make disciples,
so that that needs to be the focus.
S4 (37:52):
Doctor David Nelms, talk a little bit about or explain
for our listener what this looks like, the work that
you're doing with the Timothy Initiative, this disciple making making
disciples who make disciples.
S13 (38:04):
Yeah. Well, much of the world is made up of
what's called unreached people, groups and ethnicities that are very few,
if any, believers. And we're talking about 40% of the
world's population. 40% plus. And forgive me, I got a
little cough here. I don't mean to be coughing into
your microphone there, but, uh. And so we focus there.
(38:26):
It's basically it's your Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, animist parts of
the world. And we're not a sending agency. We simply
we have national teams who train pastors that we call
the Pauls. The Pauls recruit members of their church that
we call Timothy's. The Pauls trained the Timothy's to share
their story, share God's story out where they live, work, study, shop, play.
(38:48):
And as those Timothy's lead new believers to Christ, the
Timothy begins discipling the new believer. Don't bring them back
to the Paul. The Paul is equipping the Timothy to
do the work of the ministry, which, if it's anything,
it's the Great Commission making disciples. And so as the
Timothy begins discipling his or her Timothy, we call the
(39:09):
Timothy's Timothy, Titus, just the next generation. That's great. Then
pretty soon that Titus says, hey, I got a husband
or I got a wife, or I want my mom
to hear about this. And they begin bringing in their
their oikos, their friends and family. And the next thing
you know, wham! A little churches sprung up. And because, uh,
because multiplication is in the DNA, the we're not focused
(39:32):
on making disciples, but disciple makers. The goal is not
to plant a church. It's to plant a church that
plants a church. And so it just continues to move.
And we're just seeing God do some, I mean, book
of Acts type stuff. Incredible stuff.
S2 (39:46):
Yeah. And I don't want people to get derailed by
these numbers because they're so astronomical. But how many churches
do you anticipate, by the way? These are churches visited
twice to verify that there's leadership and that there's a
a gathering that can that constitutes called out ones that
meet together to grow up in a relationship with God.
(40:07):
How many churches do you hope to plant here in 2025?
S13 (40:12):
Five. Well, we're we're on. Uh, we're as it looks
right now. It looks like it's going to be somewhere
between 40 and 45,000 churches this year.
S2 (40:23):
Is that staggering, guys?
S4 (40:24):
It is staggering.
S2 (40:25):
And they're verified. This is not just some pipe dream
or numbers for numbers sake. It's just awesome. Okay, David Nelms,
I love you, dude. You are such an inspiration to me.
And I mean that. And you know, I love this
guy so much. I went to the brass here at
Moody and I said, I appeal to you, if we're
looking for a global partner, could we please have the
(40:47):
Timothy Initiative? So guess what? In 2026, I'm going to
be going to one of their sites. I don't even
think I've told you all this. Ali, you've been out
of the country. I'm going to be going to one
of their sites. We're going to see unreached people groups
that are being reached with the gospel and then discipled,
and then we're going to come back home and we're
going to have a big investment in what Ty is doing.
(41:10):
Isn't that cool?
S4 (41:11):
Oh That's.
S2 (41:11):
Awesome. Okay, so let's break it down here. David. Uh,
what I want from you today is three rock solid
truths of disciple making. And I just got a hunch
these things are going to jar us a little bit,
so let's go. What are they for? You, my man.
S13 (41:27):
Yeah. Number one, I would say for me personally. Now,
this is for me. I would say more important, the
most important thing about the Great Commission or about making
disciple makers, which is the Great Commission, is not what
you do, but why you do it. Uh, I believe
God is more concerned with why we do what we
do than he is with what we do. Making disciples
(41:51):
who make disciples, that's what we do. That's the Great Commission.
But why do we do it? I think the why
behind the what, the why behind the Great Commission is
the great commandment. Yes. When Jesus, when Jesus was asked,
what is the greatest of all the commandments. He did
(42:11):
not say, go make disciples. He did say, Love God
with all your heart. Love your neighbor as yourself. And
what I have found is this Carl. I grew up
being taught to keep the main thing. The main thing. Yup. And.
And what the pastor's always meant by that was the
main thing was the Great Commission. But they were right
(42:33):
that we should keep the main thing. The main thing.
S2 (42:35):
But that's the what?
S13 (42:36):
Yes. That's the what. The the main thing is, is
loving God, loving people and watch. If you love God,
you're going to want to please him, honor him, obey him. I,
I have a bunch of grandkids. I don't have any
problem talking to people about my grandkids because I love
my grandkids, and I want them to know about my grandkids.
(42:58):
If I love God, I'm going to want people to
know about my father. And if I love people, I'm
going to want them to have to experience God's grace
and his forgiveness and have joy and peace in their
hearts and and be able to walk on gold one
day for all eternity in heaven. So if you love
God and love people, the the Great Commission will just
(43:20):
naturally it's not a it. It's no longer a duty
or a command even see outflow.
S14 (43:26):
Yeah. Yeah.
S13 (43:27):
So so the main thing see, I think, I think
our problem is not the great. I think our problem, Karl.
My problem. It's a love thing.
S14 (43:38):
Yes.
S13 (43:38):
When I love God with all my heart and I
love people, the great, the great Commission is like taking
candy from a baby bro.
S2 (43:45):
This is so spot on. I mean, come on, we
could stop right there. Let's get two more, though. What
are these rock solid truths of disciple-making? Number one, love
God and the Great Commission will flow out of it.
Number two, what do you say?
S13 (44:01):
Yeah. Really? Really. Be filled with the Holy Spirit. Amen.
And in acts one and verse eight, when his last
statement before he went back to heaven. His last words,
and I'm going to paraphrase it, he said, I'm sending
the Holy Spirit and he is going to give you
the power you need to be my witnesses. I know
(44:22):
the Holy Spirit has many ministries, is given for many reasons.
But in our Lord's final statement, he directly connected the
dots of the coming of the Holy Spirit with power
to witness. And I believe, I believe, by the way,
a witness is just simply someone who tells what they've seen, heard,
know to be the truth. It's not techniques. It's not strategies.
(44:46):
It's being filled with the spirit.
S14 (44:48):
And.
S13 (44:49):
Filled with the spirit. The spirit produces the fruit of
the spirit in your life. And it is that love,
that joy, that peace, that patience. It's all that fruit.
That's what God uses to draw like a magnet people
to Jesus Christ. And so I would say, uh, make,
make much of the Holy Spirit, uh, every day. My
(45:12):
first prayer in my life, every single day is, father,
fill me with your Holy Spirit. And so, Carl, this
is important to me because I grew up, uh, to me,
the Holy Spirit was more of a doctrine. Uh.
S14 (45:27):
I'm with you.
S13 (45:28):
Yeah. And so, you know, see? Oh, God the father,
God the son, God the Holy Scriptures, as opposed to
God the Holy Spirit. So when the Holy Spirit is
alive in your heart and and and you are, you're
listening to him, and and your desire is to be
under his control. Again, the Great Commission just flows out
(45:50):
of that.
S4 (45:50):
Doctor David Nelms, our guest right now, founder of the
Timothy Initiative. Okay. In these last minute or two, give
us that third. What's that third rock solid truth of
disciple making.
S13 (46:00):
Yeah, I would say it's understanding, uh, what's often called
obedience based Base discipleship here in the States, most of
our discipling is knowledge base. It's just knowledge on top
of knowledge, fact on top of fact. So we know it.
But knowing it and doing it are two different things. Um,
the Great Commission passage, Matthew 2820 Jesus did not say,
(46:24):
teach those new believers everything I commanded you. He said,
teach them to observe or obey everything I commanded you.
And so, uh, I heard somebody say once, there's no
please in the Great Commission. It's it's not a request.
It's it's it's it's it is a command. It's more
than a command, but it is a command and understanding
(46:47):
that that it's it's not learning. It's not memorizing the
Romans Road or the three circles or the four spiritual laws,
or even how to share your, your story. It's it's
understanding that the King of kings, the one with all authority,
the one that snaps his fingers and heaven jumps. He
has told us to go out, share the gospel, make disciples.
(47:12):
When we obey him, that is what brings him glory.
So it's obedience based disciple making.
S2 (47:20):
This is so right on. You know, I actually called
David guys here. Just, uh, what was this a couple
of months ago? I said, what's the what's the game changer?
You get this love guy, you get all this stuff
cooking here, and he goes, at the end of the day,
we've got to we got to get rid of this
notion that calling for obedience is legalism. That's another thing
(47:40):
that's happened here, David, is that we've we've reduced obedience,
discipleship down to, oh, that must be legalism. That's not legalism.
Legalism is foisting something on people that God never intended.
Obedience is alignment of our life with God so that
our lives change. And this is beautiful. I got to
tell you, great Commission is the what? Here's the three
(48:05):
really whys. You might ask, why do you do this, guys?
That's what David just said. Love the Lord your God. Heart, soul, mind, strength.
Be filled with the Holy Spirit. Yes, an obedience based discipleship.
David Nelms I love you, hot dog. You are such
a blessing and we're grateful to have you in here.
S4 (48:23):
If you want more, text disciple to (800)Â 555-7898. Text disciple
to 800 555 7898. Thank you so much, Doctor David Nelms,
for being with us this morning.
S13 (48:35):
Thank you. My pleasure.
S2 (48:37):
What a guy, huh?
S14 (48:38):
Yeah.
S2 (48:40):
Is that rich?
S4 (48:42):
That's a lot to chew on.
S2 (48:44):
Three little points. That's a lot to chew on.
S4 (48:47):
Text disciple to 800 555, 78, 98.
S1 (48:53):
This is Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2 (48:56):
One of the challenging things living in the West is
that we look at experiences through our grid. Oftentimes, our
absence of experiences dictates how we make judgments on other people.
Just take what's going on in Afghanistan. I heard a
story just recently. Uh, I think this was it might
(49:19):
have been Pakistan, but here again, I heard an amazing story.
This is my bride that was telling me this when
she heard it on Moody Radio. Um. A woman has
a vision of Jesus. This is happening all the time.
And the. And the words were. She had never heard
(49:41):
anything about the Bible. Come to me. You're weary. You're
heavy laden. I'm going to give you rest. Take my
yoke upon you. She didn't know it was Jesus, but
she knew that this was God talking to her. So
she went on this hunt to find out who is.
Who is this God? And what came out of it
was she. She actually met someone who knew the Lord
(50:06):
and said, I can tell you where that quote comes from,
opens the scriptures and shows her. And she says, this is,
this is my God, bowed and knee surrendered to Jesus,
and the rest is history. And now it's having ripple
effects throughout her family. The tendency can be to get
fixated on the miracle rather than the miracle worker, which
(50:29):
is God. Yeah, that's the point of where you were.
They are.
S4 (50:32):
Totally.
S2 (50:33):
Totally enamored with the God of miracles, not miracles.
S4 (50:37):
Absolutely. And the I mean, the occupational hazard of living
in a wealthy nation is that your wealth and are
even the poorest people.
S2 (50:49):
In.
S4 (50:49):
America. The world is wealthy compared to the rest of
the world. So this is all of us in the
same boat of living in a place where physical needs,
for the most part, are are met. There's access, at least,
to things that modernize and make life a little bit easier. Yeah,
the occupational hazard is that the gospel can mean less
(51:12):
to you when you're not desperate for him.
S2 (51:17):
This is why we love to say here when you
feel like, oh man, I am so down. I'm so
kicked in the teeth I'm at the end of myself.
That's when you're most strategically positioned. It is to take
hold of the God of miracles. And if we can
uninsulated ourselves from the things of earth, and they grow
strangely dim in the light of his glory and grace. Katy,
(51:40):
bar the door. We don't know what's going to happen.
S4 (51:42):
Absolutely. Because this is not a oh, you know, I
feel like guilty for having. No it's not. It's stewarding
well what God's given you. But recognizing that man every
opportunity we need God, whether we have much or little
in the physical sense.
S2 (52:03):
Yeah. So here's here's an exercise, just a quick one
just on my heart here. Let's let's just imagine that
all the stuff that we're trusting in that just faded
to the background and all we have is Jesus. That's
all we have. And in truth, that is all we have.
S4 (52:24):
It is. That's the only thing that we have that's certain.
S2 (52:27):
But what if we could really cling to the Lord today?
I mean, cling to him and say, God, you are
Jehovah Jireh. You're my provider. You're my healer. You're the
banner of love. You. You are everything. God. And if
(52:48):
we could just for a moment, right now. Just let
the things of earth grow strangely dim in the light
of God's glory and grace. Look out, look out!
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.