July 27, 2025 • 65 mins
đź“„ Episode Description:
In this powerful and personal episode of the Key Factors Podcast – Real Estate AF (And Finance), host Mark Jones sits down with Rory Rogers—San Antonio realtor, former police officer, divorced father of twins, and real estate investor with over $3 million in acquisitions in the past year.
Rory shares his journey from buying his first home in 2005, weathering the 2008 crash, and using lessons learned to thrive in today’s market. From leveraging DSCR loans to rebuilding after a divorce that split his portfolio in half, Rory holds nothing back. This episode is packed with insights on mindset, market timing, resilience, and the power of surrounding yourself with people who push you forward.
Whether you're an agent looking to scale, an investor seeking your next move, or someone in need of a mindset shift—this episode will hit home.
🔑 Episode Summary:
- Rory’s first home in 2005 and how it opened the door to entrepreneurship
- Learning the hard way during the 2008 market crash
- Making bold investment moves in 2023 with DSCR financing
- Taking a major financial hit in his divorce—and still coming out ahead
- The difference between being in sales vs. service as a realtor
- Why being around growth-minded people is critical for success
- Rory’s framework for long-term real estate wins: cash flow, equity, tax benefits, and appreciation
- Insight into today’s shifting market and how to capitalize while others hesitate
Key Factors Podcast is Powered by ReviewMyMortgage.com
Host: Mark Jones | Sr. Loan Officer | NMLS# 513437
If you would like to work with Mark on your next home purchase or as a partner visit iThink Mortgage.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
And welcome back to another episode of Key Factors
Podcast.
I'm your host, mark Jones, andwe are powered by
ReviewMyMortgagecom, the largestindex of mortgage programs in
the nation, and I've got someexciting news to announce as we
go through this episode.
But it's been about two months,guys.
As I tell you all the time,this is cheaper than therapy, so
I've been spending a lot forthe therapist I'm kidding, Um.
(00:26):
But today's discussion, I'vegot a buddy of mine that I've
been looking forward to gettingto know even better.
Um, looking forward to himsharing his journey with you
guys.
Um, and you know, withoutfurther ado, let me just
introduce Rory Rogers.
Rory, how you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Doing good, Mark.
How are you doing today?
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Doing well.
Pull that mic closer to youjust a little bit.
And at the beginning of thesediscussions, this is the time
where you tell us just a littlebit about yourself.
Most people on this platformmaybe don't know who you are.
I know you're a badass.
You've been through quite a bitand are a top producing realtor
(01:08):
in San Antonio broker as well.
Correct, right, correct.
So tell us about yourself.
Start from the beginning, whereyou come from.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Sounds good.
So I'll take it back to theearly 2000s, when I bought my
first house in 2005.
Okay, and that was a bigexperience for me and that's
kind of where my origins in realestate really started.
My first transaction was$44,000, a house I bought for
$44,000.
And today's market wouldprobably be worth about $300,000
(01:38):
.
And I learned so many lessonsfrom that and that gave me the
ability to make decisions andbrought opportunities in my life
that no other decisions havebrought.
So I am like a true believer inreal estate, like real estate
(01:58):
has transformed my life and thatwas the origins, right there.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
That's awesome, yeah, and very similar in that regard
.
I don't have a college degree.
I went all the way four yearsand went.
This is just not for me.
I'm wasting time and effortwhen I could be making money and
at the time I was making money,so it was choose one or the
other.
But I didn't jump into realestate until another 10 years
(02:24):
later and, like you said, itopened my eyes to opportunity,
to all of the, I guess, thingsthat you see that successful
people are doing.
But you don't know it'sactually possible, you as the
layman, until you buy that$40,000 property and you go okay
, this is easy, correct Enough.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Easy enough, I should say so.
I bought the house.
I paid it off.
This is easy, correct Enough.
Easy enough, I should say so.
I bought the house.
I paid it off within two years.
I was working really hard atthe time, working overtime.
I had a roommate.
My roommate was paying themortgage and the bills at the
house with what I was charginghim.
And in 2009, I had somelife-changing events Okay, and I
(03:04):
decided to sell that house,which was paid off, and I used
that money to start my firstbusiness and since 2009, I've
been self-employed.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Boom.
I like that Self-employed.
That's a whole notherdiscussion in itself, and I'm
going to bring it back to that.
There's been a lot of chatteron the internet about
self-employed people and they'vegot lucky or this and that, and
chances are we did get lucky atsome point in time, but it was
(03:35):
putting ourselves in the rightposition to accept that luck, or
so they call it.
But going back to you and yourbeginnings, did you grow up in
San Antonio?
Where'd you grow up?
Born in a small town?
Speaker 2 (03:46):
called Alice Texas, alice Texas.
I have relatives in Alice.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Do you Absolutely.
They own a couple of well,several acres, a bunch of horses
.
Yeah, okay, the Delgados.
He owns a boxing gym down there.
Don't know them, okay.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Don't know them.
Yeah, yeah, so I left there in1985.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Okay that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I was born and I got out.
I was very young in 1985.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
That's awesome Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Yeah, so then I grew up here in San Antonio.
I go visit back.
I have a ranch in Freer.
Okay, we like to shoot guns andthings like that.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
And we'll get into that.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, I need to take you out there and do some
shooting.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Yeah, I need to take you out there and do some
shooting?
Yeah, absolutely so you.
I guess.
Your family brought you to SanAntonio, and before you got into
real estate, before you becameself-employed, what were you
doing?
What kind of jobs did you getinto?
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Okay, so I graduated from UT Austin in 2002.
And then I moved back to SanAntonio.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
So now JC's a big fan , okay, big, big fan, okay, big
big fan.
Texas UT Fine, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Nice, nice, yeah.
So I graduated from UT in 2002,and then I joined SAPD in that
same year 2002.
Really yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
And that is intriguing.
I've had a police officer onthe show before who essentially
was a police officer, got tiredof making what he was making,
giving all the effort, so hestarted a side business cutting
lawns that grew and grew andgrew, still was able to maintain
the police officer role, buteventually started making more
money over here.
What made you decide to do that?
Speaker 2 (05:23):
I was young, I didn't have a job.
It was a tough economy in 2002.
Yeah, and it was a good payingjob at the time and I wanted to
be back in San Antonio 2002.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
So that puts me at a junior in high school.
What areas did you survey?
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Worked West Patrol.
Okay, okay, for about fiveyears not like northwest patrol
holotis area no well.
Columbra 16.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Columbra 410 yeah, yeah, so kind of stomping
grounds yeah, columbra 410, Iavoided him.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
that's awesome, yeah, and and I was young though-
Same here, I was 21.
I was 21, right.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
That's okay.
So we would have hit it off andbeen super cool guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Yeah, and then I went to work downtown bike patrol
unit, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
So I worked bike patrol for a few years, so when
you were in law enforcement,there's not too many folks out
there that are like, well, I'mprotecting these streets, let me
go and open a business, let mego.
And it just doesn't happenquite often.
So what inspired you, whatinduced you to, number one, buy
real estate, being that young,and to shift into the industry,
(06:43):
this wild world of real estate?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Okay, so I bought that first house in 2005.
Okay, and this is pre-2008market.
Yeah, so real estate's goingvertical in pricing.
For sure, it didn't matter whatyou bought, where you bought it
, what price range.
The price was going vertical.
Mm-hmm, I had bought a 2005Corvette.
(07:09):
No, no, 2006 Corvette.
I bought a brand new 2006Corvette.
Hopefully it wasn't red.
No, no, it wasn't.
He's like no, I'm a policeofficer, I know.
And I sold it six months laterbecause I was looking at it and
I'm like this is going down invalue and real estate is going
up in value and I had it paidoff.
(07:31):
Okay, so I took it to adealership off of I-10 and they
wrote a check to Red McCombs.
Okay, so I took the check toRed McCombs and I got a Tacoma
from Redmond Combs and cash back.
So I got a truck and cash backand I took the cash back and I
(07:51):
bought more real estate.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Boom.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah, so that was how it went from one to multiple
homes.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
So you started law enforcement at 21.
A couple of years later, you'renow probably 24, 25,.
At 21, a couple of years later,you're now probably 24, 25,
making a decision that not onlymost people at that age but most
people in general could not dothe level of discipline.
Maybe you knew it, maybe youdidn't at the time, but making
(08:19):
that decision in the shift tonot have the shiny object and
work on something that peoplecan't really touch, feel have
yet, until you start realizingequity and all those things.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
So I'll touch on that right, Because these were all
like turning points in my life.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
These were all like big decisions and I remember,
when I was buying my second,then going into my third house,
my dad saying be careful, teestas metiendo muy hondo.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
Ah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
So translated into English, I mean.
So you're getting in too deep,Like you don't know what you're
doing.
You're over your head.
Be careful, use caution.
Blah, blah, blah, which I callthat a very Scarcity mindset,
scarcity mindset, scarcitymindset.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
My dad was the same way.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
A very disempowering belief system.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Very go to school, make good grades, get a good job
, live a good life, retire.
Mindset when instinctively.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
My decisions, my choices, my intuition was I
can't go wrong.
I see the vision, I see theplan, I see what's happening,
but yet the people I know, trust, love who should be giving me
good advice are telling me in avery subconsciously.
(09:42):
Empower it in a subconsciouslyimpactful way by giving you
metaphors.
Yeah, right, so so a metaphorhits differently than just
saying hey, use caution, thatthat you look at your numbers
and analyze what you're doing,versus speaking in metaphors,
which is you're getting in toodeep, implying that you can
(10:04):
drown, implying a very painful,impactful death.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Yeah, it brings emotion into the equation.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
So, with the metaphor , it's more emotional, it's more
impactful and it's moredisempowering.
So something as simple as canhave a very profound impact.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Oh, heavy yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
And, sure enough, you know, 2008's around the corner,
right and the real estatemarket starts to slip right.
And here I am, young, sittingon three houses and, uh-oh, what
everybody was trying to tocaution me about is is now
happening.
It's happening, it's happeningright.
(10:47):
Oh man, but I remember this onehouse.
I still have it to this day,and it was.
It's in the Northwest Grissomand Colubra area.
Okay, and I bought it off abuddy of mine, which which is
another great, another greatstory, but I'll get to that in a
(11:08):
second.
So I buy this house and it musthave been 2007-ish.
Yeah, it was.
It was May 2007.
And my intention was to do aflip on it.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
So I bought it, I rehabbed it and I put it back on
the market and in doing so, themarket starts to slip and we
didn't get what I wanted to sellit for and we kept doing price
adjustments on it.
And there was a point where Iremember telling myself will we
get any offer?
I'm taking it Like even at aloss, like I was overwhelmed.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
Time to unload.
Yeah, fire sale even at a loss.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Like I was.
I was overwhelmed.
Time to unload, yeah, fire saleand and my, my emotions were
high and scarcity mindset, right, right.
So, for lack of other options,I ended up renting the house.
Okay, and I'm so grateful tothis day that I didn't sell it,
that I didn't, Sir come.
(12:04):
Accept an offer.
Yeah exactly that.
Those lowball offers didn'tcome in and I didn't accept it,
because it has turned intoprobably one of my best
investments to this day.
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
That is awesome and, just like I was saying a bit ago
in regards to folks beingself-employed entrepreneurs, we
take risks.
They don't always pan out,they're not always something
tangible, but the one thing inthe equation is that little bit
of luck and is it luck or is itdestiny, who knows?
(12:35):
But something didn't allow youto take that lowball offer,
didn't allow you to just fire,sell it, and you went with I'm
just going to rent it out, seewhat happens.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
And luckily so, so so .
So the lesson that came fromright and what came like really
empowering from it was Iremember renting a house, and
I'll say it was a thousanddollar rent and I was cash
flowing maybe 10%, okay.
Well then, as a market startedto go down, my taxes started to
come down, so my mortgage gotreadjusted and I was paying less
(13:07):
on taxes.
So then, instead of having a$900 payment, I started to have
an $800 payment, which thenmeans instead of cash flowing
10%, now I'm cash flowing 20%,so I had a hundred percent
increase in my profit margin.
So to this day, I still carrythat with me, and that's why
last year, I had the mindsetwhere, even if the market
(13:31):
crashes, even if the market dips, I don't care, I'm not, I'm not
, I'm not going to sell in theshort term, and as long as I
hold onto it long enough, I'mgoing to win.
And even if it crashes, I go.
I win Right.
If the market goes up, I win.
If the market stays the way itis, I win.
It doesn't matter which way themarket goes, I'm going to win,
(13:54):
I'm all in.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
And I'm going to give you more credit than you're
giving yourself in that regard,because it wasn't that you
didn't care.
It was that you had alreadyrealized that if I buy real
estate and hold it, I'm good.
In time, it's going to earn itsvalue, it's going to recoup
(14:16):
from its ebbs and flows, etcetera.
Why is that the case?
Because history tells us thatwe can always take a snapshot
back.
Matter of fact, jc, if you wantto throw that reference up real
quick just to show this as avisual, not that, but thank you
guys for subscribing.
We're up to 23,600 and weprobably need to put another
(14:38):
video out there pretty quickly.
Let's see here We've gothistoric home values for texas.
Boom, there should be like amap ai mode.
No, come on everything is ai,okay.
(14:58):
So if we pull this guy up here,let's see if it'll let me Yep,
okay, so let's bring it backdown, see if it'll let me click
on it.
There we go, okay.
So what we're talking abouthere is this chart.
(15:20):
Oh, my goodness, can I get some?
Wow?
Ok, me and technology thismorning.
Y'all, let's do this, let's,let's, let's cheat the system,
(15:42):
take that system, we got it,okay.
So what I'm discussing here isthis one only goes back to 1992,
but if you go all the way backto 1970, I think it's three,
something like that when theystarted tracking this
information, you'll see that,yes, we have had a um, let's
(16:03):
call it a downfall in realestate, being in Texas, but it
was a short period of time, from2008, which that's what you're
talking about which reallydidn't hit until 2009.
And then, lo and behold, westarted trucking right back up.
So my point that I'm makinghere and you can kill that JC is
who was it?
(16:23):
Warren Buffett said it Don'twait to buy real estate, buy
real estate and then wait.
Yeah, and that is literally thelesson that you lived and are
now able to tell people andencourage your clients and
everybody else.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
So, speaking of that, the only time I don't recommend
buying real estate is if you'regoing to be in a property short
term.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Agree.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
If you're going to be a property less than a year.
You know you're going to be inSan Antonio.
You know you're, you know,graduating from college and
you're going to get out of town.
You're going to.
You know, do something and bailout of town.
That's the only one of the veryfew situations that I recommend
renting.
Yeah, other than that, I'm abuyer.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
That's literally what I wrote a customer yesterday.
She said should I rent for onemore year?
And I said the only time I everrecommend somebody to rent is
if they are leaving the statewithin the next year.
And even in those cases, let'sdo the math, because at the end
of the day, hey, if you can hirea management company at 10, 20%
(17:19):
and you're still breaking evensomebody's filling your piggy
bank for you.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
So that leads to the next thing is what is that
individual's mindset?
What are their goals?
Right, if they don't mindhiring a management company to
manage it, if they're not goingto get overwhelmed with
maintenance calls, if they havethe persona, the personality,
the mindset that fits theentrepreneur mindset to be able
(17:45):
to be a landlord, then by allmeans that that fits them.
But if it's somebody who ishigh stress, somebody who
doesn't like responsibility,somebody who wants a very chill
lifestyle, may not be for you itmay not be for you, and you
know it's not for everyone.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
Even the concept of being an entrepreneur,
self-employed, it's not foreveryone, but that doesn't mean
if you have a dream, if you'vegot something that's just
burning inside you that you needto do it.
Do it Because you can and I saythis quite often, but it makes
sense in the instances where Iuse it because I give people
advice when they ask, theinstances where I use it because
(18:24):
I give people advice when theyask.
They'll say I've got this idea,I've got this business.
And I ask them first, what areyou currently doing?
Oh well, I'm working at USAA orI'm working here, I'm working
there.
Let me ask you this A year fromnow, two years from now, could
you go back to that job?
Like, would they take you back?
Oh, absolutely yeah.
Then what the hell are youwaiting for?
(18:44):
Yeah, because I can tell youtwo years from now, when that
opportunity passes you, you mayregret it for the rest of your
life, not just two years.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Something I'll always say is opportunities have a
lifetime and you got to takeadvantage of the opportunities
within the lifetime of theopportunity.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Ooh, can you say that one more time?
That's strong.
I've never heard that that'svery strong.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
No, no, never so opportunities have a lifetime,
yep, and you have to takeadvantage of the opportunity
within the lifetime of thatopportunity, wow.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Okay, guys, put that on a t-shirt.
Shirt, yeah, absolutely so.
At what point did you dive intoreal estate?
Because we're going to fast.
We're not going to fast track,but we're going to get all the
way to the point to where you'renow a broker.
And we know that you don't justflip a switch and now you're a
(19:34):
broker.
So what was that transitionlike from police officer?
And did you go from policeofficer to realtor directly?
Speaker 2 (19:40):
So, no, I sold my house, I ventured off in a
couple of different businessesand then I was at a point in my
life where I said I really needto figure out what's the long
game.
And I reflected and I said,okay, what's been the most
impactful thing in my life?
And it was real estate.
It was what gave me theopportunities to open businesses
(20:02):
.
It gave me the opportunities toleave careers, it gave me a
very strong foundation.
And that's when I said Ithought to myself well, I know
it.
I instinctively know realestate.
I know how to generate incomeand money off of buying and
selling real estate.
And money off of buying andselling real estate, right.
And I had dealt with a handfulof realtors and I'm like I can
(20:26):
service my clients better thanthey can.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
I can do that.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
I can do that.
I can do that, maybe a littlebit better, maybe a little bit
better.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
That's awesome, and we hear that quite often too.
The experiences that we'vepersonally had and going wait a
minute, you made how much.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Oh, okay, and initially, when we get into it.
Matter of fact, I'll stop there.
Initially, when you got into it, was it what you imagined it
would be, or was it a little bittougher than you had
anticipated?
Speaker 2 (21:00):
To this day, I still struggle with am I in sales or
am I in service?
Oh okay, yeah, because I've hada perception of salesmen being
grimy and being pushy and beingafter their interests versus
their clients.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
Absolutely Right, but at least the perception for
sure, yeah, correct.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Or the perception from the consumer Correct, right
, yep.
And instinctively, when we comeacross as being too salesy, the
consumer puts up their guardand throws you in that
telemarketer bracket.
That's right, right.
Puts up their guard and andthrows you in that telemarketer
bracket.
That's right, right, um, and inmy mind, as long as I am coming
(21:47):
from, a service perspective andI'm I'm watching out for my
client's best interest, then itmakes it a lot easier for me to
to have those, to have thosetalks and communications.
And advice, um, advise, notadvice.
Advise my clients.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
That makes sense, that makes perfect sense.
And when you first.
So what year did you jump intoreal estate?
Speaker 2 (22:09):
As a real estate agent.
Probably about 2012.
Speaker 1 (22:12):
Okay, same year as me , yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
January, february, march, so we're the same age.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
But you're better looking, brother.
You got it going on and we'regoing to talk about the health
stuff a little later in thisdiscussion.
So stay tuned, guys.
The idea of you getting in in2012, it was a great market in
2012.
We had rates that were prettylow.
Everybody was at leastoptimistic about buying homes
(22:42):
and, as a matter of fact, I wasusing social media one of the
first to use social media toadvertise and to post the
closing pictures and stuff likethat, when nobody was doing it.
But I'm not going to say I wasthe trendsetter in that, but.
But you are the trendsetter.
But the idea was it was startingto catch and become a cool
thing to own real estate.
(23:03):
Then you had million-dollarlistings coming out.
Then you had all these shows,reality TV that made real estate
sexy right around that time.
And for somebody getting intothe business, they're thinking
it's all peachy.
Into the business, they'rethinking it's all peachy For you
(23:26):
was the first couple of yearspretty tough, given that you had
already practiced real estateas a entrepreneur.
Now, shifting over to this ismy gig, this is my career.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Yeah.
So the first couple of yearswere very hard Getting the
clientele, getting the referrals, getting the clientele getting
the referrals and just buildingthe network right yeah, knowing
which photographers, which titlecompanies, which lenders, and
just having that solid network.
I was kind of grinning tomyself the other day because the
(23:55):
transaction is getting superdifficult.
I'm able to call photographersand they're like I can squeeze
you in, I can do this, but butindustry favors at this point
right, um, because I've I'vehelped out so many people, I'm a
big referral partner forcertain industry people, so so
if I ask favors that they Ithink they call it metida la
(24:16):
esquina in Spanish.
You watch my?
Speaker 1 (24:18):
back.
I got yours yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, yeah in Spanish .
Speaker 1 (24:22):
You watch my back, I got yours.
Yeah yeah, yeah, that makessense.
Um, now, what was it like yourI mean your first couple of
years?
Typically, we focus on oursphere of influence.
That's what they tell you inthe schools when you're going
through.
Make sure to get your uncle's,brother, sister's, aunt's
business.
Um, for me, I have a very,almost religious statement that
(24:45):
I live by, which is, if we onlydid business with our friends,
we'd all be broke in business.
That is normal in our industrythat the consumer, your friend,
the layman, not knowing all thatit takes on this side, can get
(25:08):
offended, upset, et cetera.
Now, there went your friendship.
Then you have the alternativesof well, I'm seeing him be
successful, I'm going to go overhere, or it doesn't matter
about his success, I don't wanthim seeing my financial stuff,
or I don't want him beinginvolved in that because we're
friends.
(25:29):
So my response to that is ifyou're still sending out
pre-approval letters and prayingyour realtor, send you the next
lead.
You're already behind.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Top producers are winning because they're giving
(26:02):
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Speaker 2 (26:34):
We are in an industry that's constantly pivoting,
yeah, and what may have workedat one point may not work today
or in the future or may comeback full circle.
Amen.
And I've been very blessed thatmy sphere and some limited
marketing has been veryeffective for my career.
And then I've built my pastclients into future clients and
(26:54):
into referral partners andthings like that.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Referrals.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Referrals is my business to this day.
Yeah, which organically is it's, it's, it's the.
It's a lot of squeeze for theit's a lot of juice for the
squeeze, sure, right?
one thousand percent, yeah, yeah, and and we know that the
conversion rate on referrals isis going to be substantially
higher than the conversion rateon online leads, that's right
(27:19):
you know, or, or cold calling,or all these other things that
people do to generate business,absolutely, um, so I've been
able to build my business arounda business style that that's
very comfortable for me.
Yeah, right, and that's what Ilike.
I don't like cold calling,right?
I don't like door knocking.
I like having genuinerelationships with people that
(27:42):
know that I watch their back.
If I say something, it'sbecause it's credible, and if I
don't know it, we find thelenders, we find the title
companies and we get to thebottom of it.
Speaker 1 (27:56):
And I love that.
You said, if I don't know it,I'll get the answers.
Basically, is what you'resaying, instead of just telling
you.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Because still to this day I consider myself a very
well-versed mortgageprofessional.
Guidelines to all the shit thathit the fan in the past, that
we've had to scrape off theceiling and fix and still get it
to the closing table or not fixand still get it to the closing
(28:27):
table or not.
But um, there is a ton to belearned and there's no way to
know it all all the time andit's constantly changing
constant.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
The one thing that's constant in our industry is
change and just because itworked yesterday doesn't mean
it's gonna work today, right.
And I've had people say I don'tknow how you bought x amount of
houses because after you knowthis or this that's illegal or
that's, I'm like no, it's not, Ijust you know, it's just change
different programs, or I dothis or I do that.
You know, like the more youknow.
Yeah, yeah, exactly Like.
(28:51):
So I'm at a different level.
I know certain things that youdon't know, because you've never
been down the road I've beennever been down the road.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
I've been.
Yeah, that's factual statementand and it's very difficult at
times with that statement toarticulate that to someone that
is trying to give you thisadvice or give you matter of
fact.
More times than not, it'ssomebody that's trying to figure
out how you did it, but themthemselves, like you said,
haven't been so they can't, theycan't fathom outside of what
they know currently.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
And that's why we're doing this.
That's right.
Right, Because you have ahunger to get to another level,
Absolutely.
And the same thing.
I caught myself talking to aclient the other day and I said
I told this client the samething three years ago.
I'm like, wow, I need to grow.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
At least you recognized it.
Yeah, they didn't.
Good thing.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
Maybe I guarantee they did it.
I think I called myself out.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
That's awesome.
Well see, and you're able to dothat with the experience that
you have, yeah, where many maynot have, they might have
fumbled it up and who knows, now, as you were going through your
real estate career, year one, Imean, shoot, you've been in
literally the same amount oftime as I have.
We really haven't gone throughcrashes, so to speak.
(30:12):
We've gone through ebbs andflows of interest rates going up
and down.
This past couple of years havebeen pretty difficult.
This past couple of years havebeen pretty difficult, not
impossible.
But going through your careerin real estate, what were some
of the challenges that you wentthrough?
Challenges, I mean pretty broadquestions, so you can bring it
(30:34):
any which way you want and I'llroll with it.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Okay, well, I'll just be transparent with you.
The biggest bomb dropped on mewas divorce.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Well, let's talk about that.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
And when you say divorce, I know that is that
word in itself brings a lot ofemotion, it brings a lot of
animosity sometimes, andsometimes it brings a lot of
relief.
Let's be honest.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Brings a lot of happiness.
Speaker 1 (31:04):
Happiness and joy.
As a matter of fact, that's oneof the things that I joke with
customers and they'll say no,I'm divorced because we have to
ask Marital status.
Oh, I'm divorced, happilydivorced, and they always
chuckle.
Why, I don't know, but it'sjust something that we can kind
of level with as human beings.
We know that it probably wasdifficult more times than not
(31:24):
and it's time to just laughabout it.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
So with the wars, right, yeah, we had to fight
over the business or we had tonegotiate Sure Over ownership of
businesses plural Sure RightProperties, plural Children,
yeah, twins, plural.
So there was many things thathad to get negotiated and
settled upon and it was a majordisruptor like it was costly and
(31:50):
emotionally draining,financially expensive and
fighting over, negotiating overthe real estate as well, was a
big part of it.
Yeah, and so many lessonslearned there, and that was why
as well.
Another lesson in real estateis if I can still come out ahead
(32:15):
after taking a 50% hit on myreal estate, I'm all of it
moving forward after this.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
That makes good sense .
I mean, that is a matter offact.
That's a good analogy, Like wewere talking about analogies and
the concept of utilizing thatfor impact.
That's a good analogy rightthere too, and I don't know if
it's something that thelisteners out there can take.
Imagine what you went throughfor that and understand what you
(32:44):
just said the idea and conceptof I've invested in real estate
doing great, so I continued toinvest in real estate and then
got hit upside the head with adivorce, that we're in Texas,
50-50, baby Boom.
That's gone.
So at the end of the day, I'mstill going to buy some more
real estate.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Oh yeah no, because it's better to have something to
split than have nothing tosplit.
Oh, that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Right, that's a very good point.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
And I always try to change the narrative to
something positive Right, Idon't have to.
I get to positive Right, Idon't have to I get to Right.
Right, and it's a blessing thatthere was assets Right, that
there were things of value thathad to get negotiated Sure
(33:36):
Versus other people.
I know they get divorced andthey go.
Oh, it's simple, there'snothing.
There's nothing to fight about.
She kept the car.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
I still have to pay for it.
It's on my credit.
We've seen it so many times.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
So I always say my problems are other people's
dreams.
So I had this big problem wehad to negotiate this real
estate and the divorce but myproblems are other people's
dreams.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Wow, that's a great that's a great mindset on having
gone through something likethat Um and and, with that being
said, on the divorce, how didthat additionally impact your
career?
Cause you were you already inreal estate when this took place
, so not the buying side, butpracticing side.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
I was in the practicing side and I was at the
peak of my career.
Oh, wow, yeah, yeah, thepracticing side and I was at the
peak of my career.
Oh wow, yeah, yeah, I was.
I was at the peak of my career.
I was at 50 transactions a year.
I had a good team.
I had an office office, 1604.
I was, I was on a growing phaseof the business and then and
then here comes divorce.
Wow.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
Yeah Well, came out the other side looking all right
.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Yeah, yeah.
So so you know.
And then you asked so what wasthe biggest challenge?
Sure, and then and that wasthat was a big challenge and re
or maintaining the business, forsure, and and then getting
through it, and then now, in adifficult market with interest
rates, what they are gettingback in the feed and rebuilding,
(35:06):
that's right.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Rebuilding and we've had that as a topic on this show
many times is the idea ofrebuilding right?
What in you?
What is it innate?
Is it a passion?
Is it a advice?
What was it in you that saidyou know what?
(35:27):
It is time to rebuild, insteadof packing it up and shifting
gears or slowing down or justcontinuing to maintain after you
had already maintained it.
Going through that, if thatmakes sense.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
That's a great question, right, and it's like.
I know people that have kidsand they're like man.
I just wish she wanted to domore Like I wish that my kid
wanted to go to college.
You know, I wish my kid wantedto work out Right how to make
somebody want something.
I don't know the answer to that.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Man I was going to ask.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Right, so, so, so, so , so, so, so, so, so what is
that movie the breakup?
Speaker 1 (36:13):
Nobody wants to want to do the dishes.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Yeah, exactly, exactly.
So why do I want to continue togrow?
I don't know, I just so it issomething innate.
Yeah, or for me at least, orsomething I don't have an answer
for.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Right.
I mean you've got a collegedegree, so that's always in the
back of your mind.
I can fall back on.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
So yes and no.
Okay, yes and no.
I will say that more importantthan a college degree is the
mindset of continuing to learnevery day.
Amen to that, because I knowpeople that at one point were
very educated and they havestopped learning.
Yeah, and they're….
(36:54):
They signed up for an echochamber.
Yeah, and their education isobsolete.
That's right.
If you have a degree from 1995and you think you're still
relevant today, everything youlearned then, for the most part,
it's not going to keep you onthe cutting edge today.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
Well that I'm going to take it even a step further,
because I love this topic.
What you learn, stop, but also,as we evolve as humans, our
technology, the way of life, ourtrends, the way we learn,
changes as well, correct.
So if you're trying toimplement 1995's learning habits
(37:32):
in 2025's environment, you'regoing to have some difficult
times.
Correct.
And the idea of learning everyday?
It's totally possible, it is.
I'm an example, yeah.
So so.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
So like I never look back and say, well, I have a
college degree, Like I don'tcare, that was 20 plus years ago
.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
Touche, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
So so, unless I've been learning for the past 25
years, for the past 25 years.
That's what makes a difference,that's what makes me relevant
today.
And mortgage imagine if I'mtalking mortgage from 2002.
It's a complete different world.
Oh totally different.
Yeah, disclosures are different, interest rates, programs
everything is different.
So I can't say I have a degree,nobody cares, like that was so
(38:18):
long ago, that's right.
And unless you've continued tolearn and you're up to speed,
that's what the degree resemblesto me is I have a willingness
to learn.
That's what it means, andunless I have that willingness
to learn, I will be obsolete.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
You know, I've mentioned that topic of
education, college degree, onmany of these episodes, these
discussions and outside of this,and no one has put it in that
way in the idea of so what?
You got a college degree.
Are you still learning?
Yeah, yeah, because that is, inmy opinion, now thinking about
(38:56):
it, more important than thedegree itself.
But if you are, let's say,utilizing the fact that you can
get through college as a mindsetof I can get through this next
endeavor, yeah, I totally seethat.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
Yeah, and if, if anything, it's a confidence
challenge and I, I do this withmy children.
Right, we'll get on the bikesand we say, okay, last time we
did 10 miles, today we're doing14.
And I'm building theirconfidence right.
So heaven forbid they ever needto get on the bike and do 20
miles.
They have the confidence thatthey can do it right.
And that's what college isright.
(39:36):
It's a challenge.
You have your set of challengesto get through it.
You know finances and tests andexams and finals, whatever the
case is.
But once you push yourselfthrough that, then you got this
confidence that you either getthrough college or you get
through real life.
Right, you get through business.
Do you pay your mortgages?
You pay your taxes?
(39:59):
That's right.
That's right.
Do you have so, at the end ofthe day, do you have a nice car?
Is it paid for?
Are you?
Do you have money saved?
Are you healthy?
Or you got a healthy wife, ahappy wife?
Okay, you're winning Right.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
So you keep building your confidence and not in a
weird way it's like I did notthink about that concept right
there, the idea of winningbecause of these things.
In addition to parlaying thatwith what you've learned in the
past, I mean it just cancontinue down that road.
So I, yeah, I applaud you forhaving that mindset.
(40:38):
Ladies and gentlemen, that'srare breed right here.
Rare breed.
Thank you, man.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1 (40:44):
So let's see, jc, how long we've been going About 30
minutes, 40 minutes, 39, 25,almost hitting 40.
Okay, that being said, we'vegotten to learn quite a bit
about you thus far.
Is there anything that I'm notasking?
In regards to your real estatecareer, we've gone to what
you've learned.
Uh, biggest learning experienceis getting through that divorce
(41:08):
and being able to not justmaintain but coming out of it
with the mindset of all right,how do I rebuild?
Because staying here it's justnot in my DNA at the moment.
Is there anything?
Well, let me ask.
We talked about challenges.
What are some successes thatyou've had in real estate
(41:30):
through that journey and you caneven bring up the concept of
you becoming a broker.
At what point was it?
You know what I've done thereal estate thing.
I've been a good salesassociate.
I've had my fiduciaryresponsibilities fulfilled.
I've built my referral network.
(41:50):
I think I want to be a broker.
Speaker 2 (41:52):
How did that come across, okay?
So I don't know if I'm going toanswer your question, okay,
okay, but but I am going to goon some lessons I've learned
along the way that that, that,that that may be relative there.
Okay, um, one of my regrets inreal estate is is selling
properties.
Okay, I, I always I rememberthe house about for 44,000.
(42:16):
I sold it for 110.
Right, and back then I toldmyself, quitting while you're
ahead is not the same asquitting Right Age old saying
yes, sir.
But I regret saying thatbecause had I said, had I
refinanced it?
Yeah, right, had I refinancedit.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
Pulled some equity out, maybe leveraged.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Pulled out 80% equity Right Now.
Right Now, there's great loansout there, absolutely Right.
And then what are they called?
Speaker 1 (42:45):
You've got DSCRs, you've got all DSCR, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
DSCR is a loan that I've utilized recently.
Speaker 1 (42:52):
I'm telling you I've done more DSCRs in the past six
months than I ever have in mycareer.
Okay, so.
Speaker 2 (42:58):
I feel DSCRs are trending right now 1,000%.
Okay, and why?
Speaker 1 (43:04):
Because they're simple they go off DSCR stands
for In addition, go for it, keepgoing.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
Debt service and credit ratio.
Yes, sir, right, so as long asyou pull in 2,000 bucks a month
off this property, you can givea loan for $2,000 a month on
that property, as long as it's aone-to-one ratio for the most
part $19,999.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
If that makes sense, you've got to have at least a
dollar in profit over that DSCRratio.
But you're on the money, okay.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
But you are on the money.
But I'll say this the dollar isvery subjective.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
Yes, sir, yes, sir, to being able to accomplish that
goal.
Let's say you, and I'm going tobreak it down for our listeners
real quick.
This concept of DSCR comesabout when you have an investor
that has already they've gottheir primary.
Maybe they've bought investmentproperties to hold, maybe they
haven't, but this idea is buyinginvestment properties to hang
(43:58):
on to.
That allows that buyer, whetherthey have maxed out their total
properties that they canfinance on the secondary market.
Now they have to go alternativefinancing.
Or maybe they're self-employedand they write off too much.
Well, the DSCR has nothing todo with your income.
(44:19):
It is literally focused only onthe rent that could be brought
in, or the rent that's alreadybeing brought in, which should
be at least a dollar over whatthe mortgage payment is going to
be.
We pull credit, we look atassets, we look at the debt
service credit ratio and that'sit.
Speaker 2 (44:41):
Now go for it.
So so I'm glad you mentionedcredit, because credit's a
factor in there, absolutely yeah.
So so credit and income thatthe property produces, with
those two factors you can prettyeasily cash out refi and use
that money to to leverage andgrow.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Absolutely.
And and another thing to add tothat, another reason why I
believe that the SCRs arebecoming more and more popular
right now is you've got higherinterest rates as an investor
going into a conventional loanon the secondary market because
investors are wanting I'm sorry,investors of the loan purchases
(45:20):
correct are.
I'm not going to say they'retrying to steer investors away,
but they want to give primarybuyers an opportunity.
So those rates are much lowerwhen you're buying as a primary.
When you go DSCR, they'realmost the same kind of rates
you're looking at within about apoint, point and a half of your
primary residence rates.
(45:40):
You're looking at within abouta point, point and a half of
your primary residence.
That, additionally, you havethe whole world well, the whole
United States.
Right now, first timehomebuyers are scared to buy
real estate.
We're finding that people thathave owned real estate
understand the concept of equity, understand the concept of
somebody else paying off yourmortgage is going how do I buy
(46:03):
more right now?
Yeah, and that's what'shappening.
Yeah, I love it.
So you're utilizing thatprogram.
Speaker 2 (46:09):
So then that's how I bought, say it, eight houses
last year.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
Kaboom, I was waiting for that.
I'm like is he being modest?
So in eight houses over thelast 12 months, what did that
total made in the preparation?
Because obviously you have tobe prepared on the credit side,
(46:44):
on the asset side, to be able todo something like that, but
also the mindset to strike whilethe iron is hot.
Everybody else that you talk tothat is listening, watching
this is probably going.
I don't know about buying realestate right now.
I don't know what the market'sgoing to do.
Rory was like I'll take thatone, yeah.
Speaker 2 (47:02):
They're like I'll take them all.
I'll take all of them.
It's awesome, yeah.
So I got to go back to May of2007, when I bought the house
and the market crashed so that'swhat everybody's fearing right
now.
Everybody's seeing inventoryrise.
They're seeing days on marketrise.
They're seeing interest ratesrise.
They're seeing inventory rise.
They're seeing days on marketrise.
(47:22):
They're seeing interest ratesrise.
They're seeing affordabilityhit peaks.
So everybody's fear is throughthe roof and I'm like I know how
this ends.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
I've seen this.
This is a rerun.
Speaker 2 (47:34):
What everybody is telling themselves.
I had people telling me that'sright.
Was that 18 years ago.
Wow, yeah, I'm like I know howthis book ends.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
That's right.
Yeah, I'm in how cool and beingable to now.
I applaud you for that.
Um, my wife and I did also oneof our regrets.
We had investment properties,uh, back in 2019, we unloaded
them all.
We went okay, it's time to takethat money, buy a house that we
want and let's take the restand start flipping houses.
(48:06):
I kicked myself in the assbecause we should have held on
to it.
Absolutely.
You should have done a cashflow refi, and I'm the finance
guy.
Speaker 2 (48:14):
You should have done a DSCR refi.
You should have had somebodyelse pay those mortgages.
Still, even if it's at aone-to-one ratio where you're
not cash flowing on it, you'reon the money.
Yep, and I always say this it'snot always about the cash flow.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
Correct, Right God.
Great point.
Let's talk about that.
Speaker 2 (48:31):
So there's, I call it , the front end and the back end
and the middle.
Okay, right.
So the front end, I call itcash flow.
Yep, right On the middle, Icall it.
You're collecting $2,000 amonth.
You're rolling that $2,000 overa month into paying your
mortgage.
So that means in the middleyou're having at least some
(48:51):
principal reduction, dependingon where you're at on your
motorization table.
That's right.
So it's either a hundred bucksa month or a thousand bucks a
month, whatever it is, butsomehow or the other you're
using somebody else's money toput equity on your side of the
balance sheet.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
That's a great, great point.
Speaker 2 (49:04):
So front side is cash flow.
The middle of the transactionis just going to be what I was
talking about right there youhave principal reduction,
correct Right.
Kill the P On the backside ofthe transaction.
As long as you're anentrepreneur and you have some
taxable deductions, absolutelyRight.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Yes, and if you don't contact the CPA?
Speaker 2 (49:25):
Contact the CPA.
I'm not going to tell you howto do your taxes right.
That's right.
But you know there are manycreative ways to mitigate your
taxes, absolutely.
So on the front end, you do thedeal right.
You cash flow a little bit.
On the middle you're havingsome long-term equity principal
reduction.
On the back end, you have sometax write-offs and historically,
(49:46):
give it some time as long asyou hold on to it for more than
a year, ideally 20 years,ideally 30 years, ideally by
when you're in your 20s right,and then you're going to have
some great appreciation as well,and that's the cherry on top.
So that's four different ways ofbuilding value and equity and
everything else.
Speaker 1 (50:05):
And to add to what you're talking about here, I had
my CPA on here several episodesback and he went into pretty
good depth on how real estate isthe number one way to shield
yourself from paying taxes.
I'm not going to get into it.
If you want to listen to it, goback to that and by all means.
But there's some great tipsthat he provided to you
(50:27):
listeners out there and Rory,you're on- the money, and the
only thing I can add to that ismitigate your income tax.
Speaker 2 (50:35):
Yes, sir, not your property tax.
Speaker 1 (50:37):
That's correct.
That's correct.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
Because I got a pretty.
Speaker 1 (50:40):
Until we receive enough tariff money and, all of
a sudden, we don't have to paytaxes anymore.
But hey, I digress.
So we've gotten through justabout all of the about you.
I want to share this last,let's say, 10, 15 minutes or so
talking about today's market.
15 minutes or so talking abouttoday's market.
(51:01):
We always want to bringsomething of current value to
the equation for our listenersout there.
And right now I am still seeinggrumbling of the market, slow
still seeing realtors andlenders getting out of the
business silently.
In essence, they are portrayingthat they're a lender but
(51:22):
they're really working over here.
Right now we're seeing andhearing of all of the people
from California, new York, evenFlorida right now are coming to
Texas because of one reason oranother, and for me I remain
optimistic.
I shift with the market, kindof like how we were talking
(51:44):
about.
If first-time homebuyers are alittle reluctant to move forward
on purchasing, okay, then I'mgoing to focus on the ones that
want to be focused on, which,essentially, is going to be
those investors.
Is that a MacBook?
This is an iPad Air?
Drop it to me, I'll throw it upon the screen All right, boom,
boom, boom.
Speaker 2 (52:04):
I'm going to air drop this to you right now.
Let me make sure.
Speaker 1 (52:07):
I can do air drop everyone.
Speaker 2 (52:10):
Boom Mark's Mac.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
Boom, got it.
Save JC.
If you want to pull up thereferences, we've got this
coming on the screen Pulling thetrigger.
Get rid of that.
Okay, can you see it?
Speaker 2 (52:30):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (52:31):
Bang.
Okay, all right.
What am I looking at here, roryAll?
Speaker 2 (52:34):
right.
So we're looking at currentinventory of homes in the San
Antonio market.
Okay, okay, and this goes backjust to prior to covid, okay, um
, so, and we want to look at thechart.
Yeah, that was right, rightabout there.
Okay, very good.
So 2021, 2022, we see inventoryis under 6 000 right about 5
(52:55):
000 yep.
And prior to covid, um to that,2020, we're at about 10 000
homes on the market.
So prior to covid 2020, we'reat about 10,000 homes on the
market.
So prior to COVID, we had10,000 homes on the market.
During COVID, we had half theinventory, which led to prices
skyrocketing.
Right, supply-demand, amen.
And then, if we go to the farright of that 2025, go to today,
(53:16):
we're sitting at about 15,000,getting closer to 16,000.
So right now, we have 50% morehomes on the market than we did
prior to COVID, prior Yep.
Yeah, so why are buyers notcoming out of the woodworks and
and snagging up these deals?
It's because affordability,absolutely Right.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
I'm going to.
I'm going to do twofoldAffordability is the.
The is the MO.
Twofold Affordability is the MOis the initial shock of two
years ago I could buy this house, but now I can't.
Why?
Interest rates, this, thatinsurance, all of the factors.
The second piece to that is themindset, the idea of looking at
(53:57):
the right now versus the bigpicture of it.
So fear, essentially Correct.
Speaker 2 (54:02):
Correct.
So we're in an interestingmarket, right?
Because typically wheninventory rises, prices come
down Correct and buyers levelout the supply Affordability,
the higher interest rates.
We're seeing less buyers intothe market.
You know what mortgageapplications are down nationwide
(54:23):
, not just here in San Antonionationwide and inventories
rising Right.
So so at some point there hasto be a, a, a pressure point
where prices start to drop, butwhen.
Speaker 1 (54:35):
Yeah, yeah, cause we haven't seen it.
And when I say haven't seen it,I don't want people to get the
impression that homes are notbeing listed lower than what
they were because they are.
But were we too high, incorrectexpectations in 2020, 2021,
overinflated?
(54:56):
2020, 2021 screwed this marketup quite a bit because those
interest rates were down for toolong and it gave not only false
impression of what the idea ofowning a home is, but also the
idea of I can buy a house andsell it two years later and make
all this money.
Yeah, that wasn't the intent ofbuying real estate initially.
Speaker 2 (55:18):
I had people selling a house a year later with tons
of equity, yeah, and that's nota healthy market.
That's correct.
That's not a healthy market.
Speaker 1 (55:28):
I agree 100% with that.
So, that being said, given theclimate of our industry, being
so many listings and I don'tthink that they're going to stop
it's going to continue toincrease and I feel as though we
may still hit a recession herein the coming months, which to
(55:48):
me I hate to say it, but it'sprobably necessary to kind of
correct things from where we,inflated and overinflated,
injected all this capital andall.
I can keep going on and on, butgo for it.
Speaker 2 (56:02):
There's four things that make a house payment Okay
Principal interest, insuranceand taxes.
That's right, right.
So I, going back to 2008,.
If values go down, I win.
That's right, right, becauseI'm not going to sell.
I'm going to sell in 30 years.
You're going to pay less taxes.
I'm going to pay less taxes,right, so so I may pay more in
(56:25):
interest, right, but I'm goingto pay less in taxes, yeah, so
I'm fine with it, like I.
I see a winning situation.
They like, no matter, no matterwhich way that chart moves.
Situation they like, no matter,no matter which way that chart
moves, I win, that's right.
Speaker 1 (56:46):
And and I win because I'm not going to sell.
And that in itself is a prettypowerful statement for people
out there to digest, becausesome are going well, some
similar to stock market.
You saw it happen recentlywhere the stock market tanked.
Why?
Well, it only tanks becausepeople start selling out Correct
.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
So, and going back to when do you buy real estate?
You buy real estate as long asyou're not going to sell within
the next year.
That's right.
So if you're going to be inthis long enough, if you're
going to be in this longer thana year, I don't care what the
inventory is, I don't care whatthe rates are, I don't care what
the inventory is, I don't carewhat the rates are, I don't care
what the payment is.
There's going to be adjustments, right, rates may come down,
they may not come down, orinventory may come up or down,
(57:25):
or prices may be adjusted orwhatever the case is.
But no matter what happens, yourecognize the opportunity and
you capitalize on it.
Amen.
And whether that opportunity isyou're paying less taxes, or
whether that opportunity is youget a lower interest rate, or
whatever that opportunity is,you recognize it and you
(57:47):
capitalize on it.
Speaker 1 (57:48):
Amen to that.
Wow, man Rory, this has been agreat discussion.
I've gotten to learn quite abit that I did not know about
you before, and I'm impressed.
I was impressed even prior to usjumping on these mics, but now
it's like, ok, I understand thisguy, he's good shit.
Thank you Now to cap off thisdiscussion, is there anything
(58:10):
out there being that you haveplenty of experience not only
entrepreneurship putting yourmoney where your mouth is
essentially investing inyourself, taking that risk over
and over, even after goingthrough divorce and taking half
becoming a broker?
I'm sure there's plenty oftrials and tribulations that
(58:31):
you've gone through with that.
With all the experience thatyou have absorbed thus far, what
is some advice that you wouldgive to a realtor out there?
Because, let's face it, there'sonly 1%.
That is 1%, if that makes sense.
The rest are trying to figureit out and some get discouraged
(58:52):
and get out, and some jump onkey factors and they listen to
what Rory has to say and they go.
You know what?
Let's fucking go.
Speaker 2 (58:59):
So, for me, what's been extremely impactful for me
is being around people like you,right?
So before we started thispodcast, I asked you about your
businesses and things like that,and I call it a paradigm shift
right.
Where I once had somebody sayif you want to destroy
(59:19):
somebody's vision, give them two.
That's very disem.
Them two, Right.
That's very disempowering.
Speaker 1 (59:23):
Yes, sir.
Speaker 2 (59:24):
That's very disempowering.
So if you had that beliefsystem, you wouldn't have your
podcast, you wouldn't have yourmortgage business, you wouldn't
have the business setup that youhave in your life if you
genuinely, truly believe thatwas true, right, right is true,
right.
So, hanging around people likelike yourself, that that are
(59:44):
successful, that have multiplebusinesses, that are growing,
that are thriving, that despitethe economy, that despite the
mortgage applications, despitethe interest rates, despite this
, that and the other, you're,you're, you're progressing,
you're thriving, you're growingand you're adapting.
You're learning right, likelearning how to set up this,
this, this podcast and and getit out there what a pain in the
(01:00:06):
ass.
Speaker 3 (01:00:06):
That was right jc and a fun pain in the ass, that's
for sure amen to that.
Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
That's for the trip, making the phone calls, setting
up the appointments, getting itdone, and, and, just just just
being fearless, and, and, andembarking on it, right despite
the Right, despite the criticism, despite the negative, despite
it all, just making it fuckinghappen dude.
Yeah, and hanging around peoplethat are on that wavelength.
Speaker 3 (01:00:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
That is what is going to give you the right mindset.
That's what's going to give youthe right mindset.
That's what's going to give youthe right perspective.
Speaker 1 (01:00:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
And that's what's going to allow you to make the
right decisions.
I heard the other day everydecision is made twice.
Before a decision is made inreal life, it's made in your
mind, and that's so true.
Speaker 3 (01:00:56):
It is.
Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
Because everything that I've practiced in life,
I've told myself in my mind thatI'm going to do it before I do
it.
That's right, that's exactlyright.
Speaker 1 (01:01:06):
Uh, making a conscious uh decision that I'm
going to do this and, anddespite the noise, I'm going to
make it through to the otherside, however difficult it's
going to be.
And I think the message thereis find a way and you bring up
something that I can share thisidea of being around not
(01:01:30):
necessarily always like-mindedindividuals, because sometimes
it's good to be around peoplethat think totally different
than you, but at least have thesame mindset of continuing to
learn, being open to seeing newviews.
Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
So different mindset, but empowering mindset.
Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
Yes, sir Right, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
So I guess that's a better way of saying it, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
And recently and it's very cool that I get to share
things like this, becausethroughout my whole professional
career I've experienced thelevel up effect.
Whole professional career I'veexperienced the level up effect
and it was both from the mindset, the work ethic et cetera.
(01:02:09):
But it was also getting indifferent rooms that I never
thought I would be in beforethat, when in that instance, I
didn't have any fear to ask thequestion that others would maybe
shut up and sit in the room.
Recently, when launchingLoanBot, that was another
experience for me.
I had never been a CEO of atech company out in the
(01:02:29):
forefront launching to 200 loanofficers and having others that
have already done somethingsimilar come up to us and, hey,
let's talk, let's see what thislooks like if we put our brains
together, let's see.
And it was just like man, thisgetting into new rooms doesn't
stop unless you do.
Yeah, and that rings home to meAbsolutely yeah man, absolutely
(01:02:52):
.
Rory, this has been freakingawesome.
I appreciate this discussion.
I appreciate you being sotransparent with myself and our
listeners.
Is there anything else youwould like to tell our people
out there?
Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
No, I want to thank you guys for having me out here
and I feel bad we didn't talkmore about you and your business
man.
Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
Hey man, I'm an open book.
We'll do that over beers andshooting guns.
Speaker 2 (01:03:13):
Okay Deal.
A thousand yards.
Speaker 1 (01:03:15):
Amen, amen.
But you got to wait for it awhile.
That's awesome.
Ladies, gentlemen and those outthere, I do want to thank you
guys for continuing to listen,watch the show, make sure to
like, subscribe, because again,my promise to you, and more so
than ever, is to continue tobring guests that will be
(01:03:38):
transparent, that don't justtalk the talk but they walk the
walk.
They've been through it and areopen and willing to share those
ideals and their struggles andwins with you guys.
And why is that?
Because for us it isn't lonelyat the top, as they say.
So we'd like to see more risewith us.
(01:04:01):
As they say, when the tidecomes in, it lifts all the ships
.
So, essentially, be that risingtide in your community, in your
spheres, in your life, andhopefully you find some value in
this episode.
And if you do, make sure tolike, subscribe and we will
catch you guys on the next one.
(01:04:22):
If you're still sending outpre-approval letters and praying
your realtor, send you the nextlead you're already behind.
Speaker 3 (01:04:30):
Top producers are winning because they're giving
their agents more than just ratesheets and donuts they're
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(01:04:53):
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And the best part you seeeverything, every scenario,
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(01:05:14):
but it'd be in your bestinterest if they got it from you
.
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Sign up for your demo with ourteam of innovators.
And welcome back to another episode of Key Factors
Podcast.
I'm your host, mark Jones, andwe are powered by
ReviewMyMortgagecom, the largestindex of mortgage programs in
the nation, and I've got someexciting news to announce as we
go through this episode.
But it's been about two months,guys.
As I tell you all the time,this is cheaper than therapy, so
I've been spending a lot forthe therapist I'm kidding, Um.
(00:26):
But today's discussion, I'vegot a buddy of mine that I've
been looking forward to gettingto know even better.
Um, looking forward to himsharing his journey with you
guys.
Um, and you know, withoutfurther ado, let me just
introduce Rory Rogers.
Rory, how you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Doing good, Mark.
How are you doing today?
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Doing well.
Pull that mic closer to youjust a little bit.
And at the beginning of thesediscussions, this is the time
where you tell us just a littlebit about yourself.
Most people on this platformmaybe don't know who you are.
I know you're a badass.
You've been through quite a bitand are a top producing realtor
(01:08):
in San Antonio broker as well.
Correct, right, correct.
So tell us about yourself.
Start from the beginning, whereyou come from.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Sounds good.
So I'll take it back to theearly 2000s, when I bought my
first house in 2005.
Okay, and that was a bigexperience for me and that's
kind of where my origins in realestate really started.
My first transaction was$44,000, a house I bought for
$44,000.
And today's market wouldprobably be worth about $300,000
(01:38):
.
And I learned so many lessonsfrom that and that gave me the
ability to make decisions andbrought opportunities in my life
that no other decisions havebrought.
So I am like a true believer inreal estate, like real estate
(01:58):
has transformed my life and thatwas the origins, right there.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
That's awesome, yeah, and very similar in that regard
.
I don't have a college degree.
I went all the way four yearsand went.
This is just not for me.
I'm wasting time and effortwhen I could be making money and
at the time I was making money,so it was choose one or the
other.
But I didn't jump into realestate until another 10 years
(02:24):
later and, like you said, itopened my eyes to opportunity,
to all of the, I guess, thingsthat you see that successful
people are doing.
But you don't know it'sactually possible, you as the
layman, until you buy that$40,000 property and you go okay
, this is easy, correct Enough.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Easy enough, I should say so.
I bought the house.
I paid it off.
This is easy, correct Enough.
Easy enough, I should say so.
I bought the house.
I paid it off within two years.
I was working really hard atthe time, working overtime.
I had a roommate.
My roommate was paying themortgage and the bills at the
house with what I was charginghim.
And in 2009, I had somelife-changing events Okay, and I
(03:04):
decided to sell that house,which was paid off, and I used
that money to start my firstbusiness and since 2009, I've
been self-employed.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Boom.
I like that Self-employed.
That's a whole notherdiscussion in itself, and I'm
going to bring it back to that.
There's been a lot of chatteron the internet about
self-employed people and they'vegot lucky or this and that, and
chances are we did get lucky atsome point in time, but it was
(03:35):
putting ourselves in the rightposition to accept that luck, or
so they call it.
But going back to you and yourbeginnings, did you grow up in
San Antonio?
Where'd you grow up?
Born in a small town?
Speaker 2 (03:46):
called Alice Texas, alice Texas.
I have relatives in Alice.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Do you Absolutely.
They own a couple of well,several acres, a bunch of horses
.
Yeah, okay, the Delgados.
He owns a boxing gym down there.
Don't know them, okay.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Don't know them.
Yeah, yeah, so I left there in1985.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Okay that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I was born and I got out.
I was very young in 1985.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
That's awesome Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Yeah, so then I grew up here in San Antonio.
I go visit back.
I have a ranch in Freer.
Okay, we like to shoot guns andthings like that.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
And we'll get into that.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, I need to take you out there and do some
shooting.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Yeah, I need to take you out there and do some
shooting?
Yeah, absolutely so you.
I guess.
Your family brought you to SanAntonio, and before you got into
real estate, before you becameself-employed, what were you
doing?
What kind of jobs did you getinto?
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Okay, so I graduated from UT Austin in 2002.
And then I moved back to SanAntonio.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
So now JC's a big fan , okay, big, big fan, okay, big
big fan.
Texas UT Fine, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Nice, nice, yeah.
So I graduated from UT in 2002,and then I joined SAPD in that
same year 2002.
Really yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
And that is intriguing.
I've had a police officer onthe show before who essentially
was a police officer, got tiredof making what he was making,
giving all the effort, so hestarted a side business cutting
lawns that grew and grew andgrew, still was able to maintain
the police officer role, buteventually started making more
money over here.
What made you decide to do that?
Speaker 2 (05:23):
I was young, I didn't have a job.
It was a tough economy in 2002.
Yeah, and it was a good payingjob at the time and I wanted to
be back in San Antonio 2002.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
So that puts me at a junior in high school.
What areas did you survey?
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Worked West Patrol.
Okay, okay, for about fiveyears not like northwest patrol
holotis area no well.
Columbra 16.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Columbra 410 yeah, yeah, so kind of stomping
grounds yeah, columbra 410, Iavoided him.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
that's awesome, yeah, and and I was young though-
Same here, I was 21.
I was 21, right.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
That's okay.
So we would have hit it off andbeen super cool guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Yeah, and then I went to work downtown bike patrol
unit, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
So I worked bike patrol for a few years, so when
you were in law enforcement,there's not too many folks out
there that are like, well, I'mprotecting these streets, let me
go and open a business, let mego.
And it just doesn't happenquite often.
So what inspired you, whatinduced you to, number one, buy
real estate, being that young,and to shift into the industry,
(06:43):
this wild world of real estate?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Okay, so I bought that first house in 2005.
Okay, and this is pre-2008market.
Yeah, so real estate's goingvertical in pricing.
For sure, it didn't matter whatyou bought, where you bought it
, what price range.
The price was going vertical.
Mm-hmm, I had bought a 2005Corvette.
(07:09):
No, no, 2006 Corvette.
I bought a brand new 2006Corvette.
Hopefully it wasn't red.
No, no, it wasn't.
He's like no, I'm a policeofficer, I know.
And I sold it six months laterbecause I was looking at it and
I'm like this is going down invalue and real estate is going
up in value and I had it paidoff.
(07:31):
Okay, so I took it to adealership off of I-10 and they
wrote a check to Red McCombs.
Okay, so I took the check toRed McCombs and I got a Tacoma
from Redmond Combs and cash back.
So I got a truck and cash backand I took the cash back and I
(07:51):
bought more real estate.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Boom.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah, so that was how it went from one to multiple
homes.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
So you started law enforcement at 21.
A couple of years later, you'renow probably 24, 25,.
At 21, a couple of years later,you're now probably 24, 25,
making a decision that not onlymost people at that age but most
people in general could not dothe level of discipline.
Maybe you knew it, maybe youdidn't at the time, but making
(08:19):
that decision in the shift tonot have the shiny object and
work on something that peoplecan't really touch, feel have
yet, until you start realizingequity and all those things.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
So I'll touch on that right, Because these were all
like turning points in my life.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
These were all like big decisions and I remember,
when I was buying my second,then going into my third house,
my dad saying be careful, teestas metiendo muy hondo.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
Ah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
So translated into English, I mean.
So you're getting in too deep,Like you don't know what you're
doing.
You're over your head.
Be careful, use caution.
Blah, blah, blah, which I callthat a very Scarcity mindset,
scarcity mindset, scarcitymindset.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
My dad was the same way.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
A very disempowering belief system.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Very go to school, make good grades, get a good job
, live a good life, retire.
Mindset when instinctively.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
My decisions, my choices, my intuition was I
can't go wrong.
I see the vision, I see theplan, I see what's happening,
but yet the people I know, trust, love who should be giving me
good advice are telling me in avery subconsciously.
(09:42):
Empower it in a subconsciouslyimpactful way by giving you
metaphors.
Yeah, right, so so a metaphorhits differently than just
saying hey, use caution, thatthat you look at your numbers
and analyze what you're doing,versus speaking in metaphors,
which is you're getting in toodeep, implying that you can
(10:04):
drown, implying a very painful,impactful death.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Yeah, it brings emotion into the equation.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
So, with the metaphor , it's more emotional, it's more
impactful and it's moredisempowering.
So something as simple as canhave a very profound impact.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Oh, heavy yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
And, sure enough, you know, 2008's around the corner,
right and the real estatemarket starts to slip right.
And here I am, young, sittingon three houses and, uh-oh, what
everybody was trying to tocaution me about is is now
happening.
It's happening, it's happeningright.
(10:47):
Oh man, but I remember this onehouse.
I still have it to this day,and it was.
It's in the Northwest Grissomand Colubra area.
Okay, and I bought it off abuddy of mine, which which is
another great, another greatstory, but I'll get to that in a
(11:08):
second.
So I buy this house and it musthave been 2007-ish.
Yeah, it was.
It was May 2007.
And my intention was to do aflip on it.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
So I bought it, I rehabbed it and I put it back on
the market and in doing so, themarket starts to slip and we
didn't get what I wanted to sellit for and we kept doing price
adjustments on it.
And there was a point where Iremember telling myself will we
get any offer?
I'm taking it Like even at aloss, like I was overwhelmed.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
Time to unload.
Yeah, fire sale even at a loss.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Like I was.
I was overwhelmed.
Time to unload, yeah, fire saleand and my, my emotions were
high and scarcity mindset, right, right.
So, for lack of other options,I ended up renting the house.
Okay, and I'm so grateful tothis day that I didn't sell it,
that I didn't, Sir come.
(12:04):
Accept an offer.
Yeah exactly that.
Those lowball offers didn'tcome in and I didn't accept it,
because it has turned intoprobably one of my best
investments to this day.
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
That is awesome and, just like I was saying a bit ago
in regards to folks beingself-employed entrepreneurs, we
take risks.
They don't always pan out,they're not always something
tangible, but the one thing inthe equation is that little bit
of luck and is it luck or is itdestiny, who knows?
(12:35):
But something didn't allow youto take that lowball offer,
didn't allow you to just fire,sell it, and you went with I'm
just going to rent it out, seewhat happens.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
And luckily so, so so .
So the lesson that came fromright and what came like really
empowering from it was Iremember renting a house, and
I'll say it was a thousanddollar rent and I was cash
flowing maybe 10%, okay.
Well then, as a market startedto go down, my taxes started to
come down, so my mortgage gotreadjusted and I was paying less
(13:07):
on taxes.
So then, instead of having a$900 payment, I started to have
an $800 payment, which thenmeans instead of cash flowing
10%, now I'm cash flowing 20%,so I had a hundred percent
increase in my profit margin.
So to this day, I still carrythat with me, and that's why
last year, I had the mindsetwhere, even if the market
(13:31):
crashes, even if the market dips, I don't care, I'm not, I'm not
, I'm not going to sell in theshort term, and as long as I
hold onto it long enough, I'mgoing to win.
And even if it crashes, I go.
I win Right.
If the market goes up, I win.
If the market stays the way itis, I win.
It doesn't matter which way themarket goes, I'm going to win,
(13:54):
I'm all in.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
And I'm going to give you more credit than you're
giving yourself in that regard,because it wasn't that you
didn't care.
It was that you had alreadyrealized that if I buy real
estate and hold it, I'm good.
In time, it's going to earn itsvalue, it's going to recoup
(14:16):
from its ebbs and flows, etcetera.
Why is that the case?
Because history tells us thatwe can always take a snapshot
back.
Matter of fact, jc, if you wantto throw that reference up real
quick just to show this as avisual, not that, but thank you
guys for subscribing.
We're up to 23,600 and weprobably need to put another
(14:38):
video out there pretty quickly.
Let's see here We've gothistoric home values for texas.
Boom, there should be like amap ai mode.
No, come on everything is ai,okay.
(14:58):
So if we pull this guy up here,let's see if it'll let me Yep,
okay, so let's bring it backdown, see if it'll let me click
on it.
There we go, okay.
So what we're talking abouthere is this chart.
(15:20):
Oh, my goodness, can I get some?
Wow?
Ok, me and technology thismorning.
Y'all, let's do this, let's,let's, let's cheat the system,
(15:42):
take that system, we got it,okay.
So what I'm discussing here isthis one only goes back to 1992,
but if you go all the way backto 1970, I think it's three,
something like that when theystarted tracking this
information, you'll see that,yes, we have had a um, let's
(16:03):
call it a downfall in realestate, being in Texas, but it
was a short period of time, from2008, which that's what you're
talking about which reallydidn't hit until 2009.
And then, lo and behold, westarted trucking right back up.
So my point that I'm makinghere and you can kill that JC is
who was it?
(16:23):
Warren Buffett said it Don'twait to buy real estate, buy
real estate and then wait.
Yeah, and that is literally thelesson that you lived and are
now able to tell people andencourage your clients and
everybody else.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
So, speaking of that, the only time I don't recommend
buying real estate is if you'regoing to be in a property short
term.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Agree.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
If you're going to be a property less than a year.
You know you're going to be inSan Antonio.
You know you're, you know,graduating from college and
you're going to get out of town.
You're going to.
You know, do something and bailout of town.
That's the only one of the veryfew situations that I recommend
renting.
Yeah, other than that, I'm abuyer.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
That's literally what I wrote a customer yesterday.
She said should I rent for onemore year?
And I said the only time I everrecommend somebody to rent is
if they are leaving the statewithin the next year.
And even in those cases, let'sdo the math, because at the end
of the day, hey, if you can hirea management company at 10, 20%
(17:19):
and you're still breaking evensomebody's filling your piggy
bank for you.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
So that leads to the next thing is what is that
individual's mindset?
What are their goals?
Right, if they don't mindhiring a management company to
manage it, if they're not goingto get overwhelmed with
maintenance calls, if they havethe persona, the personality,
the mindset that fits theentrepreneur mindset to be able
(17:45):
to be a landlord, then by allmeans that that fits them.
But if it's somebody who ishigh stress, somebody who
doesn't like responsibility,somebody who wants a very chill
lifestyle, may not be for you itmay not be for you, and you
know it's not for everyone.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
Even the concept of being an entrepreneur,
self-employed, it's not foreveryone, but that doesn't mean
if you have a dream, if you'vegot something that's just
burning inside you that you needto do it.
Do it Because you can and I saythis quite often, but it makes
sense in the instances where Iuse it because I give people
advice when they ask, theinstances where I use it because
(18:24):
I give people advice when theyask.
They'll say I've got this idea,I've got this business.
And I ask them first, what areyou currently doing?
Oh well, I'm working at USAA orI'm working here, I'm working
there.
Let me ask you this A year fromnow, two years from now, could
you go back to that job?
Like, would they take you back?
Oh, absolutely yeah.
Then what the hell are youwaiting for?
(18:44):
Yeah, because I can tell youtwo years from now, when that
opportunity passes you, you mayregret it for the rest of your
life, not just two years.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Something I'll always say is opportunities have a
lifetime and you got to takeadvantage of the opportunities
within the lifetime of theopportunity.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Ooh, can you say that one more time?
That's strong.
I've never heard that that'svery strong.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
No, no, never so opportunities have a lifetime,
yep, and you have to takeadvantage of the opportunity
within the lifetime of thatopportunity, wow.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Okay, guys, put that on a t-shirt.
Shirt, yeah, absolutely so.
At what point did you dive intoreal estate?
Because we're going to fast.
We're not going to fast track,but we're going to get all the
way to the point to where you'renow a broker.
And we know that you don't justflip a switch and now you're a
(19:34):
broker.
So what was that transitionlike from police officer?
And did you go from policeofficer to realtor directly?
Speaker 2 (19:40):
So, no, I sold my house, I ventured off in a
couple of different businessesand then I was at a point in my
life where I said I really needto figure out what's the long
game.
And I reflected and I said,okay, what's been the most
impactful thing in my life?
And it was real estate.
It was what gave me theopportunities to open businesses
(20:02):
.
It gave me the opportunities toleave careers, it gave me a
very strong foundation.
And that's when I said Ithought to myself well, I know
it.
I instinctively know realestate.
I know how to generate incomeand money off of buying and
selling real estate.
And money off of buying andselling real estate, right.
And I had dealt with a handfulof realtors and I'm like I can
(20:26):
service my clients better thanthey can.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
I can do that.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
I can do that.
I can do that, maybe a littlebit better, maybe a little bit
better.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
That's awesome, and we hear that quite often too.
The experiences that we'vepersonally had and going wait a
minute, you made how much.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Oh, okay, and initially, when we get into it.
Matter of fact, I'll stop there.
Initially, when you got into it, was it what you imagined it
would be, or was it a little bittougher than you had
anticipated?
Speaker 2 (21:00):
To this day, I still struggle with am I in sales or
am I in service?
Oh okay, yeah, because I've hada perception of salesmen being
grimy and being pushy and beingafter their interests versus
their clients.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
Absolutely Right, but at least the perception for
sure, yeah, correct.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Or the perception from the consumer Correct, right
, yep.
And instinctively, when we comeacross as being too salesy, the
consumer puts up their guardand throws you in that
telemarketer bracket.
That's right, right.
Puts up their guard and andthrows you in that telemarketer
bracket.
That's right, right, um, and inmy mind, as long as I am coming
(21:47):
from, a service perspective andI'm I'm watching out for my
client's best interest, then itmakes it a lot easier for me to
to have those, to have thosetalks and communications.
And advice, um, advise, notadvice.
Advise my clients.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
That makes sense, that makes perfect sense.
And when you first.
So what year did you jump intoreal estate?
Speaker 2 (22:09):
As a real estate agent.
Probably about 2012.
Speaker 1 (22:12):
Okay, same year as me , yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
January, february, march, so we're the same age.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
But you're better looking, brother.
You got it going on and we'regoing to talk about the health
stuff a little later in thisdiscussion.
So stay tuned, guys.
The idea of you getting in in2012, it was a great market in
2012.
We had rates that were prettylow.
Everybody was at leastoptimistic about buying homes
(22:42):
and, as a matter of fact, I wasusing social media one of the
first to use social media toadvertise and to post the
closing pictures and stuff likethat, when nobody was doing it.
But I'm not going to say I wasthe trendsetter in that, but.
But you are the trendsetter.
But the idea was it was startingto catch and become a cool
thing to own real estate.
(23:03):
Then you had million-dollarlistings coming out.
Then you had all these shows,reality TV that made real estate
sexy right around that time.
And for somebody getting intothe business, they're thinking
it's all peachy.
Into the business, they'rethinking it's all peachy For you
(23:26):
was the first couple of yearspretty tough, given that you had
already practiced real estateas a entrepreneur.
Now, shifting over to this ismy gig, this is my career.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Yeah.
So the first couple of yearswere very hard Getting the
clientele, getting the referrals, getting the clientele getting
the referrals and just buildingthe network right yeah, knowing
which photographers, which titlecompanies, which lenders, and
just having that solid network.
I was kind of grinning tomyself the other day because the
(23:55):
transaction is getting superdifficult.
I'm able to call photographersand they're like I can squeeze
you in, I can do this, but butindustry favors at this point
right, um, because I've I'vehelped out so many people, I'm a
big referral partner forcertain industry people, so so
if I ask favors that they Ithink they call it metida la
(24:16):
esquina in Spanish.
You watch my?
Speaker 1 (24:18):
back.
I got yours yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, yeah in Spanish .
Speaker 1 (24:22):
You watch my back, I got yours.
Yeah yeah, yeah, that makessense.
Um, now, what was it like yourI mean your first couple of
years?
Typically, we focus on oursphere of influence.
That's what they tell you inthe schools when you're going
through.
Make sure to get your uncle's,brother, sister's, aunt's
business.
Um, for me, I have a very,almost religious statement that
(24:45):
I live by, which is, if we onlydid business with our friends,
we'd all be broke in business.
That is normal in our industrythat the consumer, your friend,
the layman, not knowing all thatit takes on this side, can get
(25:08):
offended, upset, et cetera.
Now, there went your friendship.
Then you have the alternativesof well, I'm seeing him be
successful, I'm going to go overhere, or it doesn't matter
about his success, I don't wanthim seeing my financial stuff,
or I don't want him beinginvolved in that because we're
friends.
(25:29):
So my response to that is ifyou're still sending out
pre-approval letters and prayingyour realtor, send you the next
lead.
You're already behind.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Top producers are winning because they're giving
(26:02):
their agents more than just ratesheets and donuts.
They're giving them loan botwith loan.
We'll be right back.
And the best part you seeeverything, every scenario,
every lead, every milestone.
You're looped in the whole way.
Loanbot isn't a widget.
It's the referral machineyou've been waiting for.
Here's the deal.
Your realtors can get it fromus directly for $9.99 a month,
but it'd be in your bestinterest if they got it from you
Either way.
They'reors can get it from usdirectly for $9.99 a month, but
(26:22):
it'd be in your best interest ifthey got it from you Either way
.
They're going to get it Whitelabeled, co-branded, transparent
and more.
Sign up for your demo with ourteam of innovators.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
We are in an industry that's constantly pivoting,
yeah, and what may have workedat one point may not work today
or in the future or may comeback full circle.
Amen.
And I've been very blessed thatmy sphere and some limited
marketing has been veryeffective for my career.
And then I've built my pastclients into future clients and
(26:54):
into referral partners andthings like that.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Referrals.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Referrals is my business to this day.
Yeah, which organically is it's, it's, it's the.
It's a lot of squeeze for theit's a lot of juice for the
squeeze, sure, right?
one thousand percent, yeah, yeah, and and we know that the
conversion rate on referrals isis going to be substantially
higher than the conversion rateon online leads, that's right
(27:19):
you know, or, or cold calling,or all these other things that
people do to generate business,absolutely, um, so I've been
able to build my business arounda business style that that's
very comfortable for me.
Yeah, right, and that's what Ilike.
I don't like cold calling,right?
I don't like door knocking.
I like having genuinerelationships with people that
(27:42):
know that I watch their back.
If I say something, it'sbecause it's credible, and if I
don't know it, we find thelenders, we find the title
companies and we get to thebottom of it.
Speaker 1 (27:56):
And I love that.
You said, if I don't know it,I'll get the answers.
Basically, is what you'resaying, instead of just telling
you.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Because still to this day I consider myself a very
well-versed mortgageprofessional.
Guidelines to all the shit thathit the fan in the past, that
we've had to scrape off theceiling and fix and still get it
to the closing table or not fixand still get it to the closing
(28:27):
table or not.
But um, there is a ton to belearned and there's no way to
know it all all the time andit's constantly changing
constant.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
The one thing that's constant in our industry is
change and just because itworked yesterday doesn't mean
it's gonna work today, right.
And I've had people say I don'tknow how you bought x amount of
houses because after you knowthis or this that's illegal or
that's, I'm like no, it's not, Ijust you know, it's just change
different programs, or I dothis or I do that.
You know, like the more youknow.
Yeah, yeah, exactly Like.
(28:51):
So I'm at a different level.
I know certain things that youdon't know, because you've never
been down the road I've beennever been down the road.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
I've been.
Yeah, that's factual statementand and it's very difficult at
times with that statement toarticulate that to someone that
is trying to give you thisadvice or give you matter of
fact.
More times than not, it'ssomebody that's trying to figure
out how you did it, but themthemselves, like you said,
haven't been so they can't, theycan't fathom outside of what
they know currently.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
And that's why we're doing this.
That's right.
Right, Because you have ahunger to get to another level,
Absolutely.
And the same thing.
I caught myself talking to aclient the other day and I said
I told this client the samething three years ago.
I'm like, wow, I need to grow.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
At least you recognized it.
Yeah, they didn't.
Good thing.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
Maybe I guarantee they did it.
I think I called myself out.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
That's awesome.
Well see, and you're able to dothat with the experience that
you have, yeah, where many maynot have, they might have
fumbled it up and who knows, now, as you were going through your
real estate career, year one, Imean, shoot, you've been in
literally the same amount oftime as I have.
We really haven't gone throughcrashes, so to speak.
(30:12):
We've gone through ebbs andflows of interest rates going up
and down.
This past couple of years havebeen pretty difficult.
This past couple of years havebeen pretty difficult, not
impossible.
But going through your careerin real estate, what were some
of the challenges that you wentthrough?
Challenges, I mean pretty broadquestions, so you can bring it
(30:34):
any which way you want and I'llroll with it.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Okay, well, I'll just be transparent with you.
The biggest bomb dropped on mewas divorce.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Well, let's talk about that.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
And when you say divorce, I know that is that
word in itself brings a lot ofemotion, it brings a lot of
animosity sometimes, andsometimes it brings a lot of
relief.
Let's be honest.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Brings a lot of happiness.
Speaker 1 (31:04):
Happiness and joy.
As a matter of fact, that's oneof the things that I joke with
customers and they'll say no,I'm divorced because we have to
ask Marital status.
Oh, I'm divorced, happilydivorced, and they always
chuckle.
Why, I don't know, but it'sjust something that we can kind
of level with as human beings.
We know that it probably wasdifficult more times than not
(31:24):
and it's time to just laughabout it.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
So with the wars, right, yeah, we had to fight
over the business or we had tonegotiate Sure Over ownership of
businesses plural Sure RightProperties, plural Children,
yeah, twins, plural.
So there was many things thathad to get negotiated and
settled upon and it was a majordisruptor like it was costly and
(31:50):
emotionally draining,financially expensive and
fighting over, negotiating overthe real estate as well, was a
big part of it.
Yeah, and so many lessonslearned there, and that was why
as well.
Another lesson in real estateis if I can still come out ahead
(32:15):
after taking a 50% hit on myreal estate, I'm all of it
moving forward after this.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
That makes good sense .
I mean, that is a matter offact.
That's a good analogy, Like wewere talking about analogies and
the concept of utilizing thatfor impact.
That's a good analogy rightthere too, and I don't know if
it's something that thelisteners out there can take.
Imagine what you went throughfor that and understand what you
(32:44):
just said the idea and conceptof I've invested in real estate
doing great, so I continued toinvest in real estate and then
got hit upside the head with adivorce, that we're in Texas,
50-50, baby Boom.
That's gone.
So at the end of the day, I'mstill going to buy some more
real estate.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Oh yeah no, because it's better to have something to
split than have nothing tosplit.
Oh, that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Right, that's a very good point.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
And I always try to change the narrative to
something positive Right, Idon't have to.
I get to positive Right, Idon't have to I get to Right.
Right, and it's a blessing thatthere was assets Right, that
there were things of value thathad to get negotiated Sure
(33:36):
Versus other people.
I know they get divorced andthey go.
Oh, it's simple, there'snothing.
There's nothing to fight about.
She kept the car.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
I still have to pay for it.
It's on my credit.
We've seen it so many times.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
So I always say my problems are other people's
dreams.
So I had this big problem wehad to negotiate this real
estate and the divorce but myproblems are other people's
dreams.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Wow, that's a great that's a great mindset on having
gone through something likethat Um and and, with that being
said, on the divorce, how didthat additionally impact your
career?
Cause you were you already inreal estate when this took place
, so not the buying side, butpracticing side.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
I was in the practicing side and I was at the
peak of my career.
Oh, wow, yeah, yeah, thepracticing side and I was at the
peak of my career.
Oh wow, yeah, yeah, I was.
I was at the peak of my career.
I was at 50 transactions a year.
I had a good team.
I had an office office, 1604.
I was, I was on a growing phaseof the business and then and
then here comes divorce.
Wow.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
Yeah Well, came out the other side looking all right
.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Yeah, yeah.
So so you know.
And then you asked so what wasthe biggest challenge?
Sure, and then and that wasthat was a big challenge and re
or maintaining the business, forsure, and and then getting
through it, and then now, in adifficult market with interest
rates, what they are gettingback in the feed and rebuilding,
(35:06):
that's right.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Rebuilding and we've had that as a topic on this show
many times is the idea ofrebuilding right?
What in you?
What is it innate?
Is it a passion?
Is it a advice?
What was it in you that saidyou know what?
(35:27):
It is time to rebuild, insteadof packing it up and shifting
gears or slowing down or justcontinuing to maintain after you
had already maintained it.
Going through that, if thatmakes sense.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
That's a great question, right, and it's like.
I know people that have kidsand they're like man.
I just wish she wanted to domore Like I wish that my kid
wanted to go to college.
You know, I wish my kid wantedto work out Right how to make
somebody want something.
I don't know the answer to that.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Man I was going to ask.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Right, so, so, so, so , so, so, so, so, so what is
that movie the breakup?
Speaker 1 (36:13):
Nobody wants to want to do the dishes.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Yeah, exactly, exactly.
So why do I want to continue togrow?
I don't know, I just so it issomething innate.
Yeah, or for me at least, orsomething I don't have an answer
for.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Right.
I mean you've got a collegedegree, so that's always in the
back of your mind.
I can fall back on.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
So yes and no.
Okay, yes and no.
I will say that more importantthan a college degree is the
mindset of continuing to learnevery day.
Amen to that, because I knowpeople that at one point were
very educated and they havestopped learning.
Yeah, and they're….
(36:54):
They signed up for an echochamber.
Yeah, and their education isobsolete.
That's right.
If you have a degree from 1995and you think you're still
relevant today, everything youlearned then, for the most part,
it's not going to keep you onthe cutting edge today.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
Well that I'm going to take it even a step further,
because I love this topic.
What you learn, stop, but also,as we evolve as humans, our
technology, the way of life, ourtrends, the way we learn,
changes as well, correct.
So if you're trying toimplement 1995's learning habits
(37:32):
in 2025's environment, you'regoing to have some difficult
times.
Correct.
And the idea of learning everyday?
It's totally possible, it is.
I'm an example, yeah.
So so.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
So like I never look back and say, well, I have a
college degree, Like I don'tcare, that was 20 plus years ago
.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
Touche, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
So so, unless I've been learning for the past 25
years, for the past 25 years.
That's what makes a difference,that's what makes me relevant
today.
And mortgage imagine if I'mtalking mortgage from 2002.
It's a complete different world.
Oh totally different.
Yeah, disclosures are different, interest rates, programs
everything is different.
So I can't say I have a degree,nobody cares, like that was so
(38:18):
long ago, that's right.
And unless you've continued tolearn and you're up to speed,
that's what the degree resemblesto me is I have a willingness
to learn.
That's what it means, andunless I have that willingness
to learn, I will be obsolete.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
You know, I've mentioned that topic of
education, college degree, onmany of these episodes, these
discussions and outside of this,and no one has put it in that
way in the idea of so what?
You got a college degree.
Are you still learning?
Yeah, yeah, because that is, inmy opinion, now thinking about
(38:56):
it, more important than thedegree itself.
But if you are, let's say,utilizing the fact that you can
get through college as a mindsetof I can get through this next
endeavor, yeah, I totally seethat.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
Yeah, and if, if anything, it's a confidence
challenge and I, I do this withmy children.
Right, we'll get on the bikesand we say, okay, last time we
did 10 miles, today we're doing14.
And I'm building theirconfidence right.
So heaven forbid they ever needto get on the bike and do 20
miles.
They have the confidence thatthey can do it right.
And that's what college isright.
(39:36):
It's a challenge.
You have your set of challengesto get through it.
You know finances and tests andexams and finals, whatever the
case is.
But once you push yourselfthrough that, then you got this
confidence that you either getthrough college or you get
through real life.
Right, you get through business.
Do you pay your mortgages?
You pay your taxes?
(39:59):
That's right.
That's right.
Do you have so, at the end ofthe day, do you have a nice car?
Is it paid for?
Are you?
Do you have money saved?
Are you healthy?
Or you got a healthy wife, ahappy wife?
Okay, you're winning Right.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
So you keep building your confidence and not in a
weird way it's like I did notthink about that concept right
there, the idea of winningbecause of these things.
In addition to parlaying thatwith what you've learned in the
past, I mean it just cancontinue down that road.
So I, yeah, I applaud you forhaving that mindset.
(40:38):
Ladies and gentlemen, that'srare breed right here.
Rare breed.
Thank you, man.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1 (40:44):
So let's see, jc, how long we've been going About 30
minutes, 40 minutes, 39, 25,almost hitting 40.
Okay, that being said, we'vegotten to learn quite a bit
about you thus far.
Is there anything that I'm notasking?
In regards to your real estatecareer, we've gone to what
you've learned.
Uh, biggest learning experienceis getting through that divorce
(41:08):
and being able to not justmaintain but coming out of it
with the mindset of all right,how do I rebuild?
Because staying here it's justnot in my DNA at the moment.
Is there anything?
Well, let me ask.
We talked about challenges.
What are some successes thatyou've had in real estate
(41:30):
through that journey and you caneven bring up the concept of
you becoming a broker.
At what point was it?
You know what I've done thereal estate thing.
I've been a good salesassociate.
I've had my fiduciaryresponsibilities fulfilled.
I've built my referral network.
(41:50):
I think I want to be a broker.
Speaker 2 (41:52):
How did that come across, okay?
So I don't know if I'm going toanswer your question, okay,
okay, but but I am going to goon some lessons I've learned
along the way that that, that,that that may be relative there.
Okay, um, one of my regrets inreal estate is is selling
properties.
Okay, I, I always I rememberthe house about for 44,000.
(42:16):
I sold it for 110.
Right, and back then I toldmyself, quitting while you're
ahead is not the same asquitting Right Age old saying
yes, sir.
But I regret saying thatbecause had I said, had I
refinanced it?
Yeah, right, had I refinancedit.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
Pulled some equity out, maybe leveraged.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Pulled out 80% equity Right Now.
Right Now, there's great loansout there, absolutely Right.
And then what are they called?
Speaker 1 (42:45):
You've got DSCRs, you've got all DSCR, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
DSCR is a loan that I've utilized recently.
Speaker 1 (42:52):
I'm telling you I've done more DSCRs in the past six
months than I ever have in mycareer.
Okay, so.
Speaker 2 (42:58):
I feel DSCRs are trending right now 1,000%.
Okay, and why?
Speaker 1 (43:04):
Because they're simple they go off DSCR stands
for In addition, go for it, keepgoing.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
Debt service and credit ratio.
Yes, sir, right, so as long asyou pull in 2,000 bucks a month
off this property, you can givea loan for $2,000 a month on
that property, as long as it's aone-to-one ratio for the most
part $19,999.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
If that makes sense, you've got to have at least a
dollar in profit over that DSCRratio.
But you're on the money, okay.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
But you are on the money.
But I'll say this the dollar isvery subjective.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
Yes, sir, yes, sir, to being able to accomplish that
goal.
Let's say you, and I'm going tobreak it down for our listeners
real quick.
This concept of DSCR comesabout when you have an investor
that has already they've gottheir primary.
Maybe they've bought investmentproperties to hold, maybe they
haven't, but this idea is buyinginvestment properties to hang
(43:58):
on to.
That allows that buyer, whetherthey have maxed out their total
properties that they canfinance on the secondary market.
Now they have to go alternativefinancing.
Or maybe they're self-employedand they write off too much.
Well, the DSCR has nothing todo with your income.
(44:19):
It is literally focused only onthe rent that could be brought
in, or the rent that's alreadybeing brought in, which should
be at least a dollar over whatthe mortgage payment is going to
be.
We pull credit, we look atassets, we look at the debt
service credit ratio and that'sit.
Speaker 2 (44:41):
Now go for it.
So so I'm glad you mentionedcredit, because credit's a
factor in there, absolutely yeah.
So so credit and income thatthe property produces, with
those two factors you can prettyeasily cash out refi and use
that money to to leverage andgrow.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Absolutely.
And and another thing to add tothat, another reason why I
believe that the SCRs arebecoming more and more popular
right now is you've got higherinterest rates as an investor
going into a conventional loanon the secondary market because
investors are wanting I'm sorry,investors of the loan purchases
(45:20):
correct are.
I'm not going to say they'retrying to steer investors away,
but they want to give primarybuyers an opportunity.
So those rates are much lowerwhen you're buying as a primary.
When you go DSCR, they'realmost the same kind of rates
you're looking at within about apoint, point and a half of your
primary residence rates.
(45:40):
You're looking at within abouta point, point and a half of
your primary residence.
That, additionally, you havethe whole world well, the whole
United States.
Right now, first timehomebuyers are scared to buy
real estate.
We're finding that people thathave owned real estate
understand the concept of equity, understand the concept of
somebody else paying off yourmortgage is going how do I buy
(46:03):
more right now?
Yeah, and that's what'shappening.
Yeah, I love it.
So you're utilizing thatprogram.
Speaker 2 (46:09):
So then that's how I bought, say it, eight houses
last year.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
Kaboom, I was waiting for that.
I'm like is he being modest?
So in eight houses over thelast 12 months, what did that
total made in the preparation?
Because obviously you have tobe prepared on the credit side,
(46:44):
on the asset side, to be able todo something like that, but
also the mindset to strike whilethe iron is hot.
Everybody else that you talk tothat is listening, watching
this is probably going.
I don't know about buying realestate right now.
I don't know what the market'sgoing to do.
Rory was like I'll take thatone, yeah.
Speaker 2 (47:02):
They're like I'll take them all.
I'll take all of them.
It's awesome, yeah.
So I got to go back to May of2007, when I bought the house
and the market crashed so that'swhat everybody's fearing right
now.
Everybody's seeing inventoryrise.
They're seeing days on marketrise.
They're seeing interest ratesrise.
They're seeing inventory rise.
They're seeing days on marketrise.
(47:22):
They're seeing interest ratesrise.
They're seeing affordabilityhit peaks.
So everybody's fear is throughthe roof and I'm like I know how
this ends.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
I've seen this.
This is a rerun.
Speaker 2 (47:34):
What everybody is telling themselves.
I had people telling me that'sright.
Was that 18 years ago.
Wow, yeah, I'm like I know howthis book ends.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
That's right.
Yeah, I'm in how cool and beingable to now.
I applaud you for that.
Um, my wife and I did also oneof our regrets.
We had investment properties,uh, back in 2019, we unloaded
them all.
We went okay, it's time to takethat money, buy a house that we
want and let's take the restand start flipping houses.
(48:06):
I kicked myself in the assbecause we should have held on
to it.
Absolutely.
You should have done a cashflow refi, and I'm the finance
guy.
Speaker 2 (48:14):
You should have done a DSCR refi.
You should have had somebodyelse pay those mortgages.
Still, even if it's at aone-to-one ratio where you're
not cash flowing on it, you'reon the money.
Yep, and I always say this it'snot always about the cash flow.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
Correct, Right God.
Great point.
Let's talk about that.
Speaker 2 (48:31):
So there's, I call it , the front end and the back end
and the middle.
Okay, right.
So the front end, I call itcash flow.
Yep, right On the middle, Icall it.
You're collecting $2,000 amonth.
You're rolling that $2,000 overa month into paying your
mortgage.
So that means in the middleyou're having at least some
(48:51):
principal reduction, dependingon where you're at on your
motorization table.
That's right.
So it's either a hundred bucksa month or a thousand bucks a
month, whatever it is, butsomehow or the other you're
using somebody else's money toput equity on your side of the
balance sheet.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
That's a great, great point.
Speaker 2 (49:04):
So front side is cash flow.
The middle of the transactionis just going to be what I was
talking about right there youhave principal reduction,
correct Right.
Kill the P On the backside ofthe transaction.
As long as you're anentrepreneur and you have some
taxable deductions, absolutelyRight.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Yes, and if you don't contact the CPA?
Speaker 2 (49:25):
Contact the CPA.
I'm not going to tell you howto do your taxes right.
That's right.
But you know there are manycreative ways to mitigate your
taxes, absolutely.
So on the front end, you do thedeal right.
You cash flow a little bit.
On the middle you're havingsome long-term equity principal
reduction.
On the back end, you have sometax write-offs and historically,
(49:46):
give it some time as long asyou hold on to it for more than
a year, ideally 20 years,ideally 30 years, ideally by
when you're in your 20s right,and then you're going to have
some great appreciation as well,and that's the cherry on top.
So that's four different ways ofbuilding value and equity and
everything else.
Speaker 1 (50:05):
And to add to what you're talking about here, I had
my CPA on here several episodesback and he went into pretty
good depth on how real estate isthe number one way to shield
yourself from paying taxes.
I'm not going to get into it.
If you want to listen to it, goback to that and by all means.
But there's some great tipsthat he provided to you
(50:27):
listeners out there and Rory,you're on- the money, and the
only thing I can add to that ismitigate your income tax.
Speaker 2 (50:35):
Yes, sir, not your property tax.
Speaker 1 (50:37):
That's correct.
That's correct.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
Because I got a pretty.
Speaker 1 (50:40):
Until we receive enough tariff money and, all of
a sudden, we don't have to paytaxes anymore.
But hey, I digress.
So we've gotten through justabout all of the about you.
I want to share this last,let's say, 10, 15 minutes or so
talking about today's market.
15 minutes or so talking abouttoday's market.
(51:01):
We always want to bringsomething of current value to
the equation for our listenersout there.
And right now I am still seeinggrumbling of the market, slow
still seeing realtors andlenders getting out of the
business silently.
In essence, they are portrayingthat they're a lender but
(51:22):
they're really working over here.
Right now we're seeing andhearing of all of the people
from California, new York, evenFlorida right now are coming to
Texas because of one reason oranother, and for me I remain
optimistic.
I shift with the market, kindof like how we were talking
(51:44):
about.
If first-time homebuyers are alittle reluctant to move forward
on purchasing, okay, then I'mgoing to focus on the ones that
want to be focused on, which,essentially, is going to be
those investors.
Is that a MacBook?
This is an iPad Air?
Drop it to me, I'll throw it upon the screen All right, boom,
boom, boom.
Speaker 2 (52:04):
I'm going to air drop this to you right now.
Let me make sure.
Speaker 1 (52:07):
I can do air drop everyone.
Speaker 2 (52:10):
Boom Mark's Mac.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
Boom, got it.
Save JC.
If you want to pull up thereferences, we've got this
coming on the screen Pulling thetrigger.
Get rid of that.
Okay, can you see it?
Speaker 2 (52:30):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (52:31):
Bang.
Okay, all right.
What am I looking at here, roryAll?
Speaker 2 (52:34):
right.
So we're looking at currentinventory of homes in the San
Antonio market.
Okay, okay, and this goes backjust to prior to covid, okay, um
, so, and we want to look at thechart.
Yeah, that was right, rightabout there.
Okay, very good.
So 2021, 2022, we see inventoryis under 6 000 right about 5
(52:55):
000 yep.
And prior to covid, um to that,2020, we're at about 10 000
homes on the market.
So prior to covid 2020, we'reat about 10,000 homes on the
market.
So prior to COVID, we had10,000 homes on the market.
During COVID, we had half theinventory, which led to prices
skyrocketing.
Right, supply-demand, amen.
And then, if we go to the farright of that 2025, go to today,
(53:16):
we're sitting at about 15,000,getting closer to 16,000.
So right now, we have 50% morehomes on the market than we did
prior to COVID, prior Yep.
Yeah, so why are buyers notcoming out of the woodworks and
and snagging up these deals?
It's because affordability,absolutely Right.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
I'm going to.
I'm going to do twofoldAffordability is the.
The is the MO.
Twofold Affordability is the MOis the initial shock of two
years ago I could buy this house, but now I can't.
Why?
Interest rates, this, thatinsurance, all of the factors.
The second piece to that is themindset, the idea of looking at
(53:57):
the right now versus the bigpicture of it.
So fear, essentially Correct.
Speaker 2 (54:02):
Correct.
So we're in an interestingmarket, right?
Because typically wheninventory rises, prices come
down Correct and buyers levelout the supply Affordability,
the higher interest rates.
We're seeing less buyers intothe market.
You know what mortgageapplications are down nationwide
(54:23):
, not just here in San Antonionationwide and inventories
rising Right.
So so at some point there hasto be a, a, a pressure point
where prices start to drop, butwhen.
Speaker 1 (54:35):
Yeah, yeah, cause we haven't seen it.
And when I say haven't seen it,I don't want people to get the
impression that homes are notbeing listed lower than what
they were because they are.
But were we too high, incorrectexpectations in 2020, 2021,
overinflated?
(54:56):
2020, 2021 screwed this marketup quite a bit because those
interest rates were down for toolong and it gave not only false
impression of what the idea ofowning a home is, but also the
idea of I can buy a house andsell it two years later and make
all this money.
Yeah, that wasn't the intent ofbuying real estate initially.
Speaker 2 (55:18):
I had people selling a house a year later with tons
of equity, yeah, and that's nota healthy market.
That's correct.
That's not a healthy market.
Speaker 1 (55:28):
I agree 100% with that.
So, that being said, given theclimate of our industry, being
so many listings and I don'tthink that they're going to stop
it's going to continue toincrease and I feel as though we
may still hit a recession herein the coming months, which to
(55:48):
me I hate to say it, but it'sprobably necessary to kind of
correct things from where we,inflated and overinflated,
injected all this capital andall.
I can keep going on and on, butgo for it.
Speaker 2 (56:02):
There's four things that make a house payment Okay
Principal interest, insuranceand taxes.
That's right, right.
So I, going back to 2008,.
If values go down, I win.
That's right, right, becauseI'm not going to sell.
I'm going to sell in 30 years.
You're going to pay less taxes.
I'm going to pay less taxes,right, so so I may pay more in
(56:25):
interest, right, but I'm goingto pay less in taxes, yeah, so
I'm fine with it, like I.
I see a winning situation.
They like, no matter, no matterwhich way that chart moves.
Situation they like, no matter,no matter which way that chart
moves, I win, that's right.
Speaker 1 (56:46):
And and I win because I'm not going to sell.
And that in itself is a prettypowerful statement for people
out there to digest, becausesome are going well, some
similar to stock market.
You saw it happen recentlywhere the stock market tanked.
Why?
Well, it only tanks becausepeople start selling out Correct
.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
So, and going back to when do you buy real estate?
You buy real estate as long asyou're not going to sell within
the next year.
That's right.
So if you're going to be inthis long enough, if you're
going to be in this longer thana year, I don't care what the
inventory is, I don't care whatthe rates are, I don't care what
the inventory is, I don't carewhat the rates are, I don't care
what the payment is.
There's going to be adjustments, right, rates may come down,
they may not come down, orinventory may come up or down,
(57:25):
or prices may be adjusted orwhatever the case is.
But no matter what happens, yourecognize the opportunity and
you capitalize on it.
Amen.
And whether that opportunity isyou're paying less taxes, or
whether that opportunity is youget a lower interest rate, or
whatever that opportunity is,you recognize it and you
(57:47):
capitalize on it.
Speaker 1 (57:48):
Amen to that.
Wow, man Rory, this has been agreat discussion.
I've gotten to learn quite abit that I did not know about
you before, and I'm impressed.
I was impressed even prior to usjumping on these mics, but now
it's like, ok, I understand thisguy, he's good shit.
Thank you Now to cap off thisdiscussion, is there anything
(58:10):
out there being that you haveplenty of experience not only
entrepreneurship putting yourmoney where your mouth is
essentially investing inyourself, taking that risk over
and over, even after goingthrough divorce and taking half
becoming a broker?
I'm sure there's plenty oftrials and tribulations that
(58:31):
you've gone through with that.
With all the experience thatyou have absorbed thus far, what
is some advice that you wouldgive to a realtor out there?
Because, let's face it, there'sonly 1%.
That is 1%, if that makes sense.
The rest are trying to figureit out and some get discouraged
(58:52):
and get out, and some jump onkey factors and they listen to
what Rory has to say and they go.
You know what?
Let's fucking go.
Speaker 2 (58:59):
So, for me, what's been extremely impactful for me
is being around people like you,right?
So before we started thispodcast, I asked you about your
businesses and things like that,and I call it a paradigm shift
right.
Where I once had somebody sayif you want to destroy
(59:19):
somebody's vision, give them two.
That's very disem.
Them two, Right.
That's very disempowering.
Speaker 1 (59:23):
Yes, sir.
Speaker 2 (59:24):
That's very disempowering.
So if you had that beliefsystem, you wouldn't have your
podcast, you wouldn't have yourmortgage business, you wouldn't
have the business setup that youhave in your life if you
genuinely, truly believe thatwas true, right, right is true,
right.
So, hanging around people likelike yourself, that that are
(59:44):
successful, that have multiplebusinesses, that are growing,
that are thriving, that despitethe economy, that despite the
mortgage applications, despitethe interest rates, despite this
, that and the other, you're,you're, you're progressing,
you're thriving, you're growingand you're adapting.
You're learning right, likelearning how to set up this,
this, this podcast and and getit out there what a pain in the
(01:00:06):
ass.
Speaker 3 (01:00:06):
That was right jc and a fun pain in the ass, that's
for sure amen to that.
Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
That's for the trip, making the phone calls, setting
up the appointments, getting itdone, and, and, just just just
being fearless, and, and, andembarking on it, right despite
the Right, despite the criticism, despite the negative, despite
it all, just making it fuckinghappen dude.
Yeah, and hanging around peoplethat are on that wavelength.
Speaker 3 (01:00:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
That is what is going to give you the right mindset.
That's what's going to give youthe right mindset.
That's what's going to give youthe right perspective.
Speaker 1 (01:00:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
And that's what's going to allow you to make the
right decisions.
I heard the other day everydecision is made twice.
Before a decision is made inreal life, it's made in your
mind, and that's so true.
Speaker 3 (01:00:56):
It is.
Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
Because everything that I've practiced in life,
I've told myself in my mind thatI'm going to do it before I do
it.
That's right, that's exactlyright.
Speaker 1 (01:01:06):
Uh, making a conscious uh decision that I'm
going to do this and, anddespite the noise, I'm going to
make it through to the otherside, however difficult it's
going to be.
And I think the message thereis find a way and you bring up
something that I can share thisidea of being around not
(01:01:30):
necessarily always like-mindedindividuals, because sometimes
it's good to be around peoplethat think totally different
than you, but at least have thesame mindset of continuing to
learn, being open to seeing newviews.
Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
So different mindset, but empowering mindset.
Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
Yes, sir Right, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
So I guess that's a better way of saying it, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
And recently and it's very cool that I get to share
things like this, becausethroughout my whole professional
career I've experienced thelevel up effect.
Whole professional career I'veexperienced the level up effect
and it was both from the mindset, the work ethic et cetera.
(01:02:09):
But it was also getting indifferent rooms that I never
thought I would be in beforethat, when in that instance, I
didn't have any fear to ask thequestion that others would maybe
shut up and sit in the room.
Recently, when launchingLoanBot, that was another
experience for me.
I had never been a CEO of atech company out in the
(01:02:29):
forefront launching to 200 loanofficers and having others that
have already done somethingsimilar come up to us and, hey,
let's talk, let's see what thislooks like if we put our brains
together, let's see.
And it was just like man, thisgetting into new rooms doesn't
stop unless you do.
Yeah, and that rings home to meAbsolutely yeah man, absolutely
(01:02:52):
.
Rory, this has been freakingawesome.
I appreciate this discussion.
I appreciate you being sotransparent with myself and our
listeners.
Is there anything else youwould like to tell our people
out there?
Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
No, I want to thank you guys for having me out here
and I feel bad we didn't talkmore about you and your business
man.
Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
Hey man, I'm an open book.
We'll do that over beers andshooting guns.
Speaker 2 (01:03:13):
Okay Deal.
A thousand yards.
Speaker 1 (01:03:15):
Amen, amen.
But you got to wait for it awhile.
That's awesome.
Ladies, gentlemen and those outthere, I do want to thank you
guys for continuing to listen,watch the show, make sure to
like, subscribe, because again,my promise to you, and more so
than ever, is to continue tobring guests that will be
(01:03:38):
transparent, that don't justtalk the talk but they walk the
walk.
They've been through it and areopen and willing to share those
ideals and their struggles andwins with you guys.
And why is that?
Because for us it isn't lonelyat the top, as they say.
So we'd like to see more risewith us.
(01:04:01):
As they say, when the tidecomes in, it lifts all the ships
.
So, essentially, be that risingtide in your community, in your
spheres, in your life, andhopefully you find some value in
this episode.
And if you do, make sure tolike, subscribe and we will
catch you guys on the next one.
(01:04:22):
If you're still sending outpre-approval letters and praying
your realtor, send you the nextlead you're already behind.
Speaker 3 (01:04:30):
Top producers are winning because they're giving
their agents more than just ratesheets and donuts they're
giving them LoanBot.
With LoanBot, you can offerrealtors a white labeled,
coabeled, co-branded digitalmortgage tool that they send
straight to their buyers.
It's like giving them a miniloan officer in their pocket,
available 24-7, fully loaded andbranded with your name and
their trust.
Buyers can self-diagnose,compare loan programs, check
(01:04:53):
real numbers, search propertiesand explore down payment
assistance without blowing youup at 10 pm.
And the best part you seeeverything, every scenario,
every lead, every milestone.
You're looped in the whole way.
Loanbot isn't a widget.
It's the referral machineyou've been waiting for.
Here's the deal.
Your realtors can get it fromus directly for $9.99 a month,
(01:05:14):
but it'd be in your bestinterest if they got it from you
.
Either way.
They're going to get it Whitelabeled, co-branded, transparent
and more.
Sign up for your demo with ourteam of innovators.
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