Thriving in Real Estate Photography: Unveiling the Path to Success with Rick Garza

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Unlock the secrets to thriving in the competitive world of real estate photography with insights from Rick Garza, founder of Brighton Early Productions. Discover why creativity alone won't cut it, as we explore the vital technical skills and additional services like video and 3D tours that can elevate your business. With over 15 years of experience, Rick shares his journey from club photography to mastering real estate media, emphasizing the importance of treating photography as a business and the patience required to see growth.

Hear an inspiring story of resilience and adaptability from a former event photographer who transformed personal struggles into a passion-driven career. We discuss the challenges of transitioning from weddings to real estate, and the role supportive relationships play in motivating change. Learn how early experiences in unconventional sales can lay the groundwork for business success, even without formal training or resources.

Explore the multifaceted role of storytelling and market dynamics in real estate photography. We highlight the importance of professional imagery, statistics that demonstrate increased sales, and the power of a cohesive team approach. Discover strategies for navigating the economic waves of the industry and the significance of leaving a compelling first impression. With expert advice and relatable narratives, this episode is a treasure trove for anyone looking to turn their passion for photography into a thriving business.

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Host: Mark Jones | Sr. Loan Officer | NMLS# 513437
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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:21):
Thank you.

(01:08):
What's going on, guys?
Welcome back to my channel.
Today, we're going to becovering one of my favorite
topics why most real estatephotographers fail and the
reason this is one of myfavorite topics is because it's
a very realistic conversation tobe had.
Most football players are notgoing to end up in the NFL, just

(01:29):
like most realtors are notgoing to end up on the next
cover photo of Selling Sunset.
And same thing.
Most real estate photographersare not going to build a
successful photography business,and here's why Most real estate
photographers don't take thetime to learn their craft.
Now, real estate photography hasbeen an overhyped business for
the last three years, whereeveryone thinks they can just

(01:52):
get into it, make a whole bunchof money, create their own
schedule, go on vacationwhenever they want and ride off
into the sunset with asuccessful real estate
photography business, but that'snot the case.
The reality is there's a lotmore that goes into this.
Not only do you have to developan eye for real estate
photography, but you also haveto learn the ins and outs of
your camera, as well as all theother services that come with

(02:15):
real estate photography, such asshooting video, shooting
aerials, creating 3D tours,creating floor plans and editing
everything, everything.
These are all services that youneed to excel at to build a
successful, running real estatephotography business, and the
reality is most real estatephotographers aren't willing to
put the time in to really learnthe craft of all these services

(02:37):
and systems.
Another reason why most realestate photographers fail is
they don't think business.
Now, I've talked about thisbefore.
Most photographers that I seeget into real estate photography
, think of themselves as acreative individual or just as a
simple photographer, andbecause of that, their rates are
very low.
They hand out discounts leftand right and sooner or later,

(03:00):
life is gonna hit you with abill that you can't afford to
pay, and this venture of abusiness that you can't afford
to pay, and this venture of abusiness that you set out on,
has proven not to be assuccessful as you thought it
would be, and sooner than later,you will walk away from real
estate photography.
The final reason why most realestate photographers fail is
because they lack the patienceit takes to grow a successful

(03:21):
business.
We've heard the saying beforeRome wasn't built in a day, and
that's true for any successfulbusiness today, and it's true
for whatever situation you'recurrently at with your business.
It takes a lot of time to notonly learn about all this
photography stuff, but it takestime to network, for people to
learn about your business andfor clients to come knocking on

(03:42):
your door.
So you see, everything is awaiting game and most real
estate photographers aren'twilling to put the time in and
play the waiting game to seewhat the seeds that they've
planted grow into.
But I promise you, if you're areal estate photographer and you
put the time in to network, ifyou put the time in to post on
social media every single day,if you take the time to connect

(04:04):
with new social media everysingle day, if you take the time
to connect with new realtorsevery single week, I promise you
you'll do well.
But if you're a real estatephotographer who is just chasing
a paycheck, I promise you,sooner or later you will be
among those real estatephotographers who failed in this
business.

Speaker 2 (04:20):
Back with another episode of Key Factors Podcast,
Real Estate AF.
I'm your host, Mark Jones, andwe are powered by
ReviewMyMortgagecom, the largestindex of mortgage programs in
the nation, and on the lastcouple of episodes we got really
in depth on finance and what'sgoing on with the economy in the
United States, the debt crisis.

(04:41):
We looked at the debt clock andeducated you guys on some of
the nuances that are, and shouldbe, pretty important to us as
consumers, real estateprofessionals and all the above.
But today I wanted to dive intoa topic that most probably are
not even thinking about at themoment, which is this NAR

(05:03):
lawsuit and how it could affectothers in our industry and
attached to our industry.
That being said, photography.
There are plenty ofphotographers out there, but
there's only one that I wouldwant to have a conversation with
about this topic and, withoutfurther ado, let me introduce
Rick Garza.

(05:23):
Rick, what up dude, what's uphomie?
How you doing?
God is good to me.
Amen to that.
So Rick is the founder ofBrighton Early Productions and
you've had that company forquite some time now, and I
remember when you first started.
So if you could just take amoment real quick and tell our
audience who you are, what youdo currently and then after that

(05:47):
I want to kind of dig into yourjourney a little bit.

Speaker 3 (05:50):
Sweet.
Thank you for having me, man.
Of course, man, I like when yousaid you were with me, or you
remember when I first startedand I'm curious when was that to
your?

Speaker 2 (06:04):
knowledge?
To my knowledge, it had to havebeen.
Would it have been maybe 2016,2015-ish, right around the time
when you were doing a lot ofZars and Rogers stuff?

Speaker 3 (06:19):
So it was real estate , okay.
Yeah, I started off in theclubs doing club photography,
okay, and then I went from clubsto events like weddings and
stuff like that.
So I've been shooting for 15years, man.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
Holy cow, yeah, yeah, yeah, talk about expert.

Speaker 3 (06:40):
Trial and error.
I've practiced a lot.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
And you know what?
Let's relate that to uh uh uhlaw practice yeah a doctor's
practice definitely they don'tcall them experts.
They don't call them uh,perfect, yeah, it's always a
practice.
Uh, a student to the gameconcept absolutely but all these
folks who, who you are, and anduh, the company, and all that

(07:03):
good stuff.

Speaker 3 (07:04):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, like you said, we're amedia company that focuses on
real estate.
So the reason why that'simportant is because in the last
five, seven years, we've had toadopt things as standards,
right, so like 3D tours, videoand even social media videos

(07:25):
like snippets Uh, some of thoseare like, uh, unavoidable.
You have to do that.
So it's beyond just photography, but but, uh, it's.
We're hyper-focused on realestate because, like you said,
um, to master somethingspecifically, uh, it took 10,000
hours on just one thing.
I like to look at photography aslike.

(07:46):
If you look at it from a likeif you talked about athleticism,
you would say you would havethese little categories, big
categories like basketball,football, soccer, golf.
Everybody's physical shapeneeds to be different in order
for them to achieve a certainoutcome.
Very true.
And so with photography, it'skind of the same thing.

(08:06):
Like, wedding photographers arebuilt different than real
estate photographers.
We're built different thanproduct photographers, and every
one category has its own skillset, its own type of gear,
communication, the outcome theyseek, their customers, customers
are different, the, the resultsthat the customer needs are

(08:29):
different.
The time restraints, like thescheduling sure, just uh, with
with everything we do, we neededto like super focus because
they would like, when I firststarted, I would shoot a wedding
and then a house like a weddingover the weekend and the house
on monday, and then I'd be like,dude, I got to get out of this
house because I got to go packup for a wedding and then a
house like a wedding over theweekend and the house on Monday,
and then I'd be like dude, Igot to get out of this house
because I got to go pack up fora wedding, yeah, so I would
disserve one customer and then,you know, just to, you know, go,

(08:53):
please, another customer,versus knowing how to navigate
through all that.
So I started off as a eventphotographer and then I was
shooting everything to pay thebills.
So, like I bro, there was thisone time where I was shooting a
cadaver, okay, cadaver, yeah,Cadaver, dead body, yeah.
And I'm sitting there with awith another production company

(09:13):
and I'm like how the hell did Iget here?
But anything that came my waythat was camera related, I was
in it.
So any, like I said anything topay the bills.
So basically, I just practicedand practiced and practice and
practice.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
Um, now question where did that come from?
Where did that?
Because I can relate to this ona low level of when we started
the podcast, we were using uhcell phone cameras and, um, it
was a long process but I fell inlove with it as I was
researching more upgradingcameras, upgrading sound system,

(09:49):
knowing how to edit all thosetypes of things.
Yeah, and I'll be honest, if Ihad to do it over again, I would
have probably not gone themortgage side and gone more of a
creative uh photographyproduction.
I'm not even joking.

Speaker 3 (10:02):
I love this stuff.
I can tell it yeah, yeah, yeah.
You got.
You got more of a, you got abetter setup than I would have
ever, and it's probably betterthat that that you didn't cause
we wouldn't be here if you didAmen to that.

Speaker 2 (10:14):
You know what I'm saying?
Amen to that.

Speaker 3 (10:16):
But well, I in short, I was broke and I was broken.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (10:22):
Okay, so the reason why I say that is because, uh,
like I, I I literally hadnothing going on for myself.
Uh, I was, I mean not to gettoo too deep.
I don't, I don't even mindCause I'm not ashamed of it, but
like I was a bouncer, I solddope on the side.

Speaker 2 (10:38):
I I minus the bouncer .
I wasn't big enough.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Yeah, it was all looks, you know.
And my wife at the timegirlfriend she gave me an
ultimatum.
She said if you don't get yourshit together, I gotta, I gotta
go.
My mom can't find out you're adope dealer, yeah, and, and I
don't know it was that.
And being on probation, I alwaysjoke and say I had two
probation officers.

(11:01):
I had John Esquivel and Claudio.
You know my, my correctionofficers, the real boss, yeah,
and it was funny because myactual probation officer didn't
correct nothing, wow, yeah.
But I was just like, given thatultimatum of either being with
a good woman for the rest ofyour life or by yourself for the

(11:22):
rest of your life, I don't know, something just made me want to
keep that going and so at thetime we were broke.
So I was like, man, I can make$50 a photo shoot, I can make
$75 a photo shoot, and at thetime, you know you're talking 15
years ago, so that would havebeen like 150 bucks, sure, you
know so in today's economy itwas like a decent amount of

(11:44):
change 50 bucks, sure, you know.
So, today's economy, today'seconomy, it was like a decent
amount of change.
Um, and so I just, I've alwayshad the hustle mindset where,
although today I don't thinkit's that attractive to have
that hustle mindset, um, justbecause I'm 40 now, sure, right
With the, with the kid and stuff, but anyway.
So I used to always have thatflip mindset where, if I buy
this and then I, how much moneycan I make off of this little

(12:06):
baggie or this little product orwhatever?

Speaker 2 (12:08):
Right, and it's funny that I've spoken to many expert
realtors, lenders, other trades, yeah, but a lot of us started
that way and it's the idea oflearning sales.
Even though it was illegal atthe time, it still gave us a
backbone or a foundation of.

(12:30):
This is how you make money fromnothing.

Speaker 3 (12:33):
That's right.
Yeah, so I was born and raisedin the projects, victoria courts
specifically.
So I was like 10 ish orsomething.
Things happen with our family,like we lost some family, a
relative, and basically we justkind of like from there just
either progressed or moved out,you know.
But that's, it's just alwaysbeen.

(12:56):
I was always as a kid, I wasalways around it, right, so it's
all I knew.
I didn't have a dad to be likea stupid.
Stop.
I had an uncle later in lifewho became a Christian and then
he started like telling mescriptures and stuff.
So I think that later in life,especially, you know, in your
20s, you start to realize likedude, I got to do something,
because all of my homies areliterally either dying or in

(13:19):
jail, right, right, so, yeah.
So, anyway, to how I got intothe photography, that was the
only other thing that I wasaddicted to.

(13:39):
Like you said, it's just likeit fascinated me that I suck,
like this, and people are like,oh, it's good.
And then it crushes your egobecause you're like, bro, I
think that's amazing.
And then you realize like no,it actually sucks.
So I had no technical skill, butwe didn't have YouTube back in
the day.
We didn't have a thousandtutorials available, so I had to

(14:06):
try and try and try and try,and then also the exposure right
.
So some people are afraid ofnegative feedback and so I just
didn't care.
I was too broke to care so Iwas just, like you know,
throwing myself out there everychance I got.
My first camera was a point andshoot and uh, and it has its
benefits, but it also has itslimitations, and I would come
home and be like man if I onlyhad the ability to switch out a

(14:27):
lens and all this stuff.
So my mother-in-law financed myfirst camera.
Yeah, I mean, and it soundslike not a big deal, but again,
$750, $1,000 kit back then wouldhave been equivalent to like
getting a loan for.

Speaker 2 (14:41):
Three grand.

Speaker 3 (14:41):
Three grand today, Right?
So it's like hey, Mark, let methree grand.
It's like well, I got to makesure you qualify, that's right,
you know.
So for me and my family it wasa big deal.
So I made this stupid promise.
Back in the day I said, hey, Ipromise you, I will take care of
our family with this camera.
And I had to do it, man.

Speaker 2 (15:02):
How freaking cool is that.
I mean, at time you're probablyvery scared, or not, because
there wasn't that restrictorjust yet, but it was something
that now you can look back onand go holy cow.

Speaker 3 (15:19):
You know, what's funny is when you say that, Mark
, I almost I had a sense of man.
I wish I had that again.
Like I need that same effortmentality, yeah Right.
Like that, who cares how badthis looks, who cares if this is
terrible?
And so just having thisconversation reminded me that

(15:41):
it's time for that dog to comeback.

Speaker 2 (15:42):
Hey, everything happens for a reason and my, my
fight began recently againbecause of the mortgage industry
and how bleak it was lookingfor a little while there Got
back into production, lost someof the loan officers that I had
here, so I had to kind ofreinvent myself and get my ass
back into the fire and beendoing well since then, you know.

Speaker 3 (16:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:06):
Go ahead.

Speaker 3 (16:06):
Go ahead?
No, I just try to.
What does bleak mean?

Speaker 2 (16:08):
Bleak, Very like it doesn't look too good.
Got it?
Yeah, Got it.
Like doomsday, Very like I wastelling you before.
My vocabulary has grown.

Speaker 3 (16:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:19):
Broadcast.

Speaker 3 (16:21):
I got a homie that says words and I'm like as soon
as I figure out what that means.
Bro, I got you.
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
I love it.
So you mentioned 10,000 hoursand I use that reference, but
I've never mentioned it on thispodcast.
Yeah, and to me, I believe thatit is very true in regards to
using that as a guideline whenyou want to master something, a
new craft, a new trait, andthere's a lot of realtors out

(16:50):
there, lenders out there andpeople, consumers, that are
trying to jump into somethingnew, tired of what they're doing
the same monotonous stuff thatover and over very repetitive.
What kept you?
I guess you answered it, but ifyou could elaborate what kept
you from going elsewhere withyour journey?

Speaker 3 (17:12):
Yeah, so, secretly, I've always wanted to be a
realtor.
It was very, you know, with theshiny suits and Mercedes and
everything that you see on TV, Iwas like man, that's dope.
But they got so muchresponsibility and so many text
messages and the fires that theygot to stop per customer, per
you know.

(17:32):
And then they got to build teamand I said I quickly realized,
like I ain't supposed to be arealtor.
I like to sell real estate.
I like the taking something andthat looks like nothing, cause I
can relate to that, right, likeI.
I, I walk into a property thatpeople are just like eh, it's
just a 2000 square foot, youknow $250,000 house, right, and

(17:56):
I'm like, bro, that's somebody'smansion, that's right, you know
like it's.
So I like the challenge andthere's so many.
And so I like the challenge andthere's so many.
And it's not just photography,it's like business in general,
right, because you can take mywords and literally apply it to
every type of business.
But like it's not just aboutthe thing that you do, it's the
stuff that makes the clock tick,right, so it's.

(18:17):
I was talking to somebodyrecently and they kind of blew
my mind because it just it hitme really hard when I heard this
.
It's like not just aboutknowing how to tell time, it's
about knowing what makes theclock tick.
So the photography is just whatwe do.
The reason why we do it is thebigger thing to focus on.
So death, divorce, you know,promotion, demotion, job

(18:41):
placement, job loss there wascountless times where I walk
into a situation in a home andthere's holes on the wall and I
already know what's going on andI know that these people are
either separating or haveseparated and this is the last
binding thing, and so it takesso long to get it sold, whether

(19:04):
they have to renovate it to getit up to market or they have to,
you know, just finalize thedivorce or the finances.
So it came.
So, again, like knowing whatmakes the clock tick was way
more of a driving force thanjust the actual thing that I do,
right.
And the minute I realized thatit was funny because I could

(19:27):
never walk into a house the same, right, you know, you, you
mentioned czars and there wasthis one.
There was this one house and II hate talking about it because
it always gets me emotional, butthere was this one house where
the child was ill and he wasattached to a machine and the

(19:48):
family had good success, theyhad good money, so they got a
bigger house, two-story house.
They got the bigger house andthen the child lived on the
second level, right, his roomwas upstairs.
Well, then he got sick.
When he got sick, he gotattached to the machine.
So now what do they have to do?
They have to sell the house thetwo story house right to get a

(20:09):
one story house, because he'sattached to the machine.
This was the third time thehouse had been listed.
We were the third team, thirdcrack.
Yeah, we were, like the other,the last or the next chance to
get this thing sold.
And so, before I start a project, typically if I know it's like
high urgency or really tough, Igo well, let's see the photos.

(20:31):
And dude, the photos wereterrible.
So the photos being terrible,along with the price being too
high, price being too high meantthat the realtor didn't have
that confidence to say, hey,this is where we need to be
priced to begin with, because ifwe're priced right, then we're
in the game, if we're pricedwrong, we're out of the option.
Pool Right, right.
So no matter how fantastic myphotos are, if the home isn't

(20:51):
priced right, we're not anoption, we're not in the game,
you are correct.
So, not having that confidence,well then, where do you get the
confidence from practice?
Where do you get the practice?
10,000 hours, that's right, youknow.
So there's all these littlefacets behind the what you do.
And in every business, likeeven this, celsius can Right.
So it's not just about like thechemicals inside of it, it's

(21:16):
like the mission, the drive, thepurpose.
You know there's probablysomebody fired up about some
reason.
They did so bad that they hadto make an energy drink, right,
you, you know that's, that'sonly two bucks with 200
milligrams of caffeine.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Man, that's awesome.
So, that being the case, I meanwe're looking at all of the
changes.
Yeah, so now that we've we'vetalked about your, your, your
journey thus far, um.

Speaker 3 (21:44):
Well, you know, the other part to it is like the
photography, like what we reallydo is sell.
So there's two things we sell.
We sell vision, okay, and thenwe sell time, right.
So what I mean by that is, like, as far as vision specifically,
it's like this is what youcould own, right, this is the
life that you could live.
Yeah, this could be your livingroom, this could be your

(22:10):
theater this could be.

Speaker 2 (22:10):
Do you remember I shot your house absolutely, yeah
, yeah.
Do you remember how sexy you're?
I mean, I still go back andshow people those pictures.

Speaker 3 (22:13):
Bro, I shot that house three times really yeah,
one for the builder, one for thefirst time it was listed okay
and then the second time, whichis when you bought it yeah.
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (22:23):
Man.
Well, I tell you what, when youwere like celebrating in the
pool.

Speaker 3 (22:28):
I was like I know that pool really well and it
happens all the time.
I believe that.
So where was I going?
Well, the idea of oh, what wesell, sorry, go for it.
Yeah, because I'm going to loseit.
And then I missed the wholepoint.
So we sell the vision right,this could be yours.
But then we sell the time back.
So, in order to create thatvision that you're experiencing,

(22:49):
that sold you, that moved you,that compelled you, it takes six
to 12 hours.
Why do I say that?
Well, you got an hour of drivetime, then you got the shoot
time, and then you got theediting time, and then you got
the deliverables editing timeand then you got the
deliverables, then you got thefeedback and then you go okay,
are we good now?
So that's 12 hours, all forsmall price of you know whatever

(23:10):
it is right.

Speaker 2 (23:12):
You know, for the time everybody's different,
every home's different.
All that good stuff, and we canget into that well later as
well.

Speaker 3 (23:17):
So that's what I'm saying.
So we sell vision and then wesell time, right, some people
have more time than money, sothey shoot it themselves.
Fantastic.
Some people have more time,more money than time and shoot
it themselves Fantastic.
Some people have more time,more money than time and they go
bro, I only I ain't got fourhours, I ain't got two hours.
Correct, charge me whatever itis.
And you know, if you have thatpractice and you have that
diligence and you stick to it,then people trust you and they
say yo, I know you're worthevery penny, go ahead, just bill

(23:40):
it to me.

Speaker 2 (23:40):
Makes perfect sense.
Yeah, so, that being being thecase, as we've seen and you
you've been doing this for quitesome time I want to hear from
you, the expert, how photographyand real estate has evolved in
the last let's call it ten tofive years yeah, so anybody can

(24:04):
be a photographer.

Speaker 3 (24:06):
You take a picture with your iPhone.
You go buy a camera at Best BuyI think you can buy cameras at
HEB, anyway.
So becoming a photographer hasbecome easier, right, accessible
to the masses, which alsointroduces problems, because now
everybody's a photographer, sothe photographer.

(24:26):
Technically, if you take apicture, you're a photographer,
so you are a photographer here.
You know, if you're taking acell phone picture, you're a
photographer.
However, the service, thepeople business, is what we're
in, because there's always.
Although AI and technologyadvances, it's almost naive to
think that everything that we'reusing right now is not going to

(24:47):
evolve tomorrow, like it's sostupid to think that they're not
.
People are literally interestedin making it faster, better,
cheaper.
Faster, better, always.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
And mortgage and real estatephotography in in the actual
mechanics and the gear itself.
They're faster, cheaper, better, right.

Speaker 2 (25:06):
I use an analogy all the time, which is no one ever
goes to the Apple store and says, hey, give me that iPhone 12
and the 15's already out.
Nobody goes backwards, they'realways going forward.
That's right.
Faster, stronger, better, likeyou said.

Speaker 3 (25:21):
And unfortunately cheaper.
Sounds good, sounds good, yeah,so then, but the the cheaper.
It is in Spanish to say locadothe Cuesta double the.

Speaker 2 (25:37):
In hindsight, it cost you double.

Speaker 3 (25:39):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, it's the cheap shit costyou more, excuse me, but but
yeah.
So basically, in the way theway it's evolved, is that, like
you have in any industry, in anybusiness that you know things
are as, as, at the same timethat things are getting easier
and faster and cheaper, there'salso a parallel that with, like,

(26:02):
they're creating more problems,and so there's always going to
be a need for people to dopeople right.
That's right.
Yeah, there's, there's alwaysgoing to be a need for a human
to service another human.
So I think all of our jobs areokay, but it is going to weed
out the weak.
I agree with that right.
So it's just like whoever can'thandle or keep up with, you
know, zillow 3d tours orwhatever yep, whatever's up, the

(26:24):
monster that's eating all of us, right?
So like, if you can't figure outa way to bring value, then
obviously you probably need tolook for something different.
That's very true.
Every 10 years, yeah, and nowit's probably even faster.
I'm scared for the nextgeneration because it's like
dude, it's like, you know,forest fires.

(26:45):
Things change so fast.
I think one of the things thatI always have to remind myself
is that you can never go wrongby doing what's right, and so if
you're just looking for whatwould make this situation right
and you just go there, and ifthat's all you know, just stay
there, and people know you asthat guy that makes sense, that
makes perfect sense.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
Stay there and people know you as that guy.
That makes sense, that makesperfect sense.
So, with the evolution of this,this industry itself, you guys,
um like, when did we startseeing?
Uh, a heli, not heli, what dothey call?
It Drone footage, that kind ofstuff.

Speaker 3 (27:16):
Yeah, so about?
Uh, so when, 12 years ago, uh,my wife and I was like 12, 11,
12 years ago, uh, my wife and Iwas like 12, 11, 12 years ago we
were buying our first house,okay, and my wife was dismissing
like all of the listings thatour realtor was sending us,
right, she was like I don't likethat one, I don't like that one
, I don't like that one.
And I said, baby, you, you're,you're criticizing the house

(27:37):
based off of these photos andnot me being a um student of
photography.
I was like, well, it's thewhite balance, it's the vertical
.
Like, well, it's the whitebalance, it's the verticals,
it's the, it's the lack ofediting, you know, and, and and
then the storytelling, right, Isaid so you're going to dismiss
this home because of that.
And I go, oh, void, there's aproblem.

(27:58):
And I said, well, obviously, ifthere's a big enough void, then
maybe somebody can do somethingabout this.
Yeah, and so I started askingfor feedback.
I was like yo, why do y'all doI?
I talked to a realtor and I waslike, why do y'all let this
crap on the internet represent?
And it was a hundred thousanddollar house that we were
shopping like we were lookingfor, right, a hundred thousand

(28:18):
dollar house.
It wasn't like a mansion, itwasn't a baller house, it was a
hundred k, but to us at the timethat was the max that we can
afford and it would come fromthe hood.
So it was like, oh, we made it,we made it Right, but they were
not not anybody specifically,but they were treating it as a,
you know, just a hundredthousand dollar list.
And I said, dude, that's aproblem, cause there's a seller

(28:40):
on the other side of thisstruggling to get this thing
sold, right.
And then there's a seller onthe other side of this
struggling to get this thingsold, oh, true, right.
And then there's a buyer thatcan't connect.
And I was like, bro, y'alldon't see the big enough problem
.
This is a problem, yeah.
So I said I'll do somethingabout it.
And it was like good, 50 bucks.
And I was like what?
Wow, how am I going to competewith 50 bucks?
Right time?

(29:05):
I was just like that, like uh,just defeated instantly.
But then I go well, if I shot10 of these a day, 50 times 10,
would be $500 a day.
And I didn't know what made theclock tick.
I didn't know all the mechanicsbehind it and at the time I
didn't have that many customers,so it was just like yeah, it
took me.
It took me seven hours to getthis job done, of course.
Of course, 50 bucks is worth it, right?

Speaker 2 (29:22):
But so there was no efficiency.

Speaker 3 (29:26):
There was no need for efficiency.
Right, it was a hobby.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying.
Yeah, it was like when you gotthese cameras, you spend 12
hours.
And your wife was like why areyou still messing with this
camera?
And you're like I've just gotto figure this out.
And she's like, but you spent38 hours this week on this, this

(29:46):
week on this.
And you were like, yeah, butone day we're gonna have a
podcast.
and she was like you ain'tmaking no money and you just
said you know it's fact right,it's a hobby at the start, yeah
and um, and you know, it's just,I would imagine, not that I'm a
basketball player, but when youstart playing basketball, it's
just, it's a, it's a sport, it'sfun, it's it's a hobby.
But then there's a businessside of it and if you don't know
how to start thinking aboutthat early, like the

(30:10):
efficiencies and the economicsand the ups and the downs of
just business in general, you'llget wiped out.
Bro, you'll get wiped out.
I've been there several times.
I'm there, like every otherquarter, where I'm just like Am
I on the right path?
You know, uh, but it's just oneof those things where, if you

(30:32):
listen to your heart and youremember the one thing that
actually matters, you know, andthe reason why you're doing it,
you know and and uh, what I'veknown to be true on my business
maybe it's the same for yours,maybe it's not, but in my
business it's it's like waves.
Um, you have this gorgeous,beautiful, massive wave of
business come in and you're like, oh man, I am in the right spot

(30:56):
, like I, I've, I got my, I gotmy groove, I got my customers,
my clientele, and then, uh, youdon't realize it, but that wave
also goes out, and then thatthat amount of business kind of
thins out and you're like whathappened?
Yeah, you know and I didn't.
I didn't save money and I didn't, you know, you know I didn't
market or I didn't, you know,pay for ads or I just, you know,

(31:23):
did the organic thing.
So every season there's like arush of business, and then it's,
you know, crickets, and so it'svery tugging on your heart and
your emotions.
Your family's going through it.
And then you know, at the sametime you have to motivate your
team, sure, and but then youhave to have enough business to
build a team.
That's exactly right.
And then they go, you know, andthen the wave goes out and
you're like, hey, stick around,bro, I promise it's going to be
awesome.
So you have peak seasons, youhave off seasons.

(31:44):
You can't really ignore the offseason.
You don't want to like scareyour team and talk about the off
season, but you have to.
So there's all these likenuances that unless you do the
10,000 hours or or more, you'llnever prepare for those quiet
times.
And then you'll freak out andsay, you know what?
Let me go do something else.
Time to fold up, yeah, time togo do time.

(32:05):
Time for me to go start being arealtor.

Speaker 2 (32:07):
And you know that's very relatable.
What you're talking about isvery relatable to today and
what's happening in the mortgageand real estate professionals
that a lot are jumping out andthey're going to do something

(32:34):
else instead of digging in orbeing prepared.
Maybe they didn't put the10,000 hours in to be able to
know that, hey, this is how Ineed to shift in a market like
this.
Um, that being the case in yourindustry and your side of the
tracks and I was going to talkabout this at the end, but
definitely it sounds like a goodtime to do it how has the

(32:57):
market affected you guys'business?
Because I can imagine that,with fewer listings, people out
there, with their lower ratesthat are not willing to sell
their home right now andprobably could have or should
have, um, are not.
So therefore, there's lesslistings going out, less photos
that are being taken, uh, lessjobs to be had.

Speaker 3 (33:20):
Yeah, so very good point and totally true.
Um, what's also true for, um, Iwould imagine, every industry
and every type of uh of partnerinvolved in the real estate
right, there is a time to sell,there's a time to buy, right?
And so, as a professional inthe game, you know how do I

(33:44):
serve and be prepared for bothseasons, because it's all
seasonal there's a summer,there's a winter, there's a fall
, there's a spring.
Yeah, there's no way around it,right?
And so Jim Rohn says that somepeople give up in the winter and
some people go skiing, and I'mparaphrasing, I'm chopping that

(34:05):
up.
But he's like the guy that isprepared for the ski trip, he
has gear and he has equipmentand he goes skiing, right, right
.
And then other people say, oh,this is terrible, it's so cold,
we can't go outside, and theyfreak out, right so.
But one guy's having a blast.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
That's right.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
So it's like that for us in our business,
specifically going back to howour business is affected, if
it's not a time to sell's a timeto rent, and what I mean by
rent I mean, like, be thelandlord, sure, right, because
the rental rates are high,that's right, right.
So knowing how to positionyourself as a professional to
there's, they're always, luckilyfor us, they're always going to

(34:44):
need to see that's very truetheir rental, um, and and,
honestly, if you want to get apremium rate or like a premium
rental rate, right, is it's youwant to get a premium rate or
like a premium rental rate?
It's more likely to get thatwith professional photos than
iPhone or unprofessional,because iPhone takes great
photos.
But the storytelling, theediting, the drone, the

(35:05):
perspective matters, right, andso it's like it's a metaphor for
life, a metaphor for life, likeperspective really matters.
So when you mentioned the drone,like the reason why that became
so popular or so in demand wasbecause there's only a certain
way that you can communicate howbig the lot is, sure, or how
much privacy you have behindyour house, and you could try to

(35:25):
do that from a ground level.
But there's a better way.
And if you get at 100 feet or200 feet.
You can really emphasize onthat privacy, and it puts it in
perspective.
I like that, yeah, and also thedesign of the pools.
Sometimes that matters, right,so like if your home is $200,000
above your comps, right, why,right and so well, let me tell

(35:47):
you why, and you can grab adrone and hyper-focus on that
intricate design that thelandscaper or I don't know what
they're called- Whoever they are, but, yes, the people that
designed the concrete and thedesign of the whole thing.
There was this one house thathad a guitar-shaped entrance and

(36:08):
it literally looked like aguitar.
So the design was crazy.
Well, I can imagine that costsa lot of money.
They overpaid, put it that way.
Yeah, they overpaid at the timeand they need a recoup.
That's right.
So what do I recoup in mylisting price?
Yep, Well, why is your listingprice 100K above the neighbor's?
Well, let me show you.
And so that's why ourstorytelling matters.
Yes, storytelling matters, yes.

(36:35):
So how do you become an expertreal estate storyteller?
Well, practice and listen toyour customers.
So part of those 10,000 hoursis not just shooting, it's like
getting feedback.
And so you have to ask yourcustomer hey, how did I do?
Is there anything I could havedone better?
What would have made it better?
And that's that's hard dude,it's.
It's a conversation that Irather not have.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
Well, most would rather not have it.
But those that are seekinggrowth and those are, they're
seeking the, the higher level ofsuccess, greater than the
average, which it doesn't takemuch to be extraordinary, it's
just a little extra, as they say, um are.
I'm not saying that it getseasier to take that constructive
criticism, but they aredefinitely inclined to continue

(37:16):
to getting constructivecriticism.
Myself, I'm open to it always.
I don't take offense to that,especially if it's coming from a
good place, you know.
And with you asking for directfeedback, I mean it's not only
do you get to see your own workas you're completing it, but you
also have a direct feedbacksource, which is how long is it
going to take?

Speaker 3 (37:35):
How long did it sell?
Yeah, right.
And so when you get that thatpost where it's like um offer
accepted or offer me, you know,uh, closed in 30 days, clear to
close.
And you see that you just shotthat house like 30 days ago or
20 days ago or you know a monthago, it's like, okay, I did good

(37:56):
, yeah, uh.
But then when you get thefeedback, like man, I can't
figure it out, I have noshowings You're like wait,
that's the house that we shotfour months ago.
Uh, what was that house again?
And I started looking it up andI go, hmm, well, it's in
Redbird ranch.
Hmm, as far as yes as far I'mlike, ain't no Stone Oak agent

(38:23):
trying to drive to Redbird ranchright now, that's right.
So I I usually will say did youdo a 3d tour?
No, okay.
So where are you at with thislisting right now?
Are you about to lose it or arey'all good?
They said well, why do you askthat question?
Well, cause, if you about tolose it, we need to do something
now.

Speaker 2 (38:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:43):
Right and they said, nah, I'm good for another year.
I'm like, okay, well, what doyou want to do?
You want to ride this out andsee what happens, or drop the
price?
Or you're going to drop theprice and see.
That's what I'm saying, bro.
I get so fired up when I'm like, okay, so you'd rather drop the
price 40K than to invest or getsome feedback.
That's right.
Yo, bro, what could I do?
What didn't I do Right thefirst time?

(39:05):
I listed it.

Speaker 2 (39:05):
Well, this brings up a good topic.
Briefly, I briefly I'm going toget so much heat.
That's okay.
That's what the show is for.
A lot of folks have come onhere being very transparent and
I think it has increased theirvalue in the market because
people know that they can standbehind what they're saying and
it's not coming from anemotional only place.

(39:26):
It's very logical behind it.

Speaker 3 (39:28):
Right, like I tell you this, mark the other, like,
I guess, cause I'm getting youknow how like when you, when you
turn I think I don't know ifthey say it's like 60 or
something, but when you turn 60,you just don't give up- you
don't give a fuck.
Yeah, I think I'm 60 and I'mcreeping up there in my head,
right there with you.
So sooner, yep, and so oftenyou're going to get there faster

(39:50):
, right?
So I'm an old man, yeah, andanyway, I say that because it's
like the other day, somebody waslike, well, how much does it
cost?
And I was like, dude, you'reasking the wrong question, bro,
because you get that questionall the time, rightfully so.
Like, how much does it cost toget all whatever you recommend?
Right, but there's a price andthere's a cost.

(40:13):
And in what we do, I'm like theprice of the service is this,
but the cost is so far greaterthan the price, like you're
about to lose your relationshipwith this client.
Your commission issignificantly more than what I
priced this service out for.
That's right, like you know,doing a price drop is so
significant, dude, it's likeit's easier just for me to be

(40:36):
awkward up front and be like howmuch you want to list this for?
Oh, yeah, no, it's true, right,like it's true, I.
I think I would rather be likehey, oh, you want to do 100k
more than what it should.
Uh, yeah, I don't want to messup our friendship bro right, uh,
but there's like a hundredother agents that'll go.

Speaker 2 (40:54):
Yep, oh, no problem, I'll list it and have no
justification on the price, nocomps, nothing like that.
It's just I want the businessnot knowing that you taking that
listing is setting up wrongexpectations for the seller, for
the next agent for the economy,the seller, for the next agent
for the economy?

Speaker 3 (41:11):
Absolutely the economy.
Yeah, the neighborhood, it'strue.
Like bro, you're affectingeverybody.
Yeah, it's not just the little,it's not the listing, bro, it's
lives, right I?

Speaker 2 (41:22):
believe, since COVID and we were already moving
towards this virtual world, morevirtual than actual in person,
physically.
And that's why I love thispodcast, because we get to spend
at least an hour with no phonesand just rapping about stuff.
And since COVID we realizedthat people number one are

(41:48):
starting to work remotely morethan not Number two when you're
remote, that means you can liveanywhere, but if you're in
another state, another country,you can't just fly over here to
see these properties.
So the next best thing is thequality and the magic in the

(42:09):
photography or in thepresentation of what it is the
story.
That's exactly right and givingperspective to that.
And we've seen so many people,myself included, that have
bought homes without actuallygoing to them physically to be
in the home.

Speaker 3 (42:24):
Yeah, this is how relevant the story is.
I think it's Lidl, I don't know.
It's like oil there's a big oil.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
Lytle, Texas.

Speaker 3 (42:34):
I think it's Lytle.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
Lytle or Odessa.

Speaker 3 (42:37):
Odessa, it's Lytle, but here's the point the only
reason to live in it might notbe Lytle.
I'm sorry people that live inLytle, they're like bro, that
ain't us.
Bro, La, Um, they're like bro,that ain't us.
It's like, uh, it's like one ofthose towns where the only
reason to live there is becauseyou're going to work in the oil,

(42:58):
like Odessa, yeah Well, let'scall it something like that.
It's far so.
This is my point is that, likethe only reason to live there is
that, right, and if you driveby it, it's nothing sexy at all,
right?
However, it's the only reasonto live there, right?
And you would think, well, youdon't need photos to sell that
lifestyle.
Actually, you do so if it's arental, right.

(43:20):
If you're a homeowner again,and it's not the time to sell
because of nobody's buying oryou know interest rates or
whatever, whatever, okay, well,then rent it and then get
professional photos, so that wayyou can sell that lifestyle to
that guy that's got to livethere for nine months and he's
okay with payment, payingpremium because his company pays
for it or he gets a lot ofmoney for nine months.

(43:41):
So the story is the what mattersthe most super impactful.
Yeah, it's just like, if youdon't, if you just show up and
you'd be like, well, they paidfor 15 angles, bro.
Then you're like, well, theypaid for 15 angles, bro.
Then you're like, okay, you'remissing the point.

Speaker 2 (43:53):
Yeah, and even more so to add to your point here, we
as consumers not all, but mostdon't have the vision to place
yourself in that propertywithout the vision being
presented in a certain way andmany different aspects, it's
like okay, I don't like thatphoto at first sight, so I'm not

(44:16):
even going to dig into the nextphoto.

Speaker 3 (44:18):
Like you, you, you sell the sexy, you sell the
lifestyle.
Nothing else matters at thisvery moment, cause if you can't
get them past the, the, thephotos like.
So I always say like, the priceis the most important because
of the data being so pertinent,or is that?

Speaker 1 (44:36):
the right word.

Speaker 3 (44:36):
Yeah, the data matters the most.
On Zillow and these realtorcom,all these websites that are
consumer-driven, they're doing abig bulk of lead generation.
So they're doing a hell of a lotmore than you and I can
physically do, right, so if Iknow that, that's where the
majority of my potentialeyeballs are going to be right,

(44:59):
your pool, my pool, right I needto make sure I know how to
maximize my time there, or myspace there.
It's like real estate on theirwebsite.
You're so knowing how to playthe game, like what makes them
click on my listing, you know,and uh, and that's why getting
feedback is so important,because I I recently had an

(45:20):
experience and I don't thinkshe'll listen to this podcast,
but she shitted on my photos andshe was like it's just not
clickable.
And it was frustrating me, markCause.
I was like what the hell doesthat mean?
It's not clickable?
it was frustrating me markbecause I was like what the hell
does that mean?
It's not clickable.
But I realized what she wastalking about.
What was she talking about?
What she was talking about islike, when you're looking at the
thumbnails, you know I wasn'tdelivering anything that was

(45:42):
like click.
You know, there was nothingthat I was creating because it
was just like a standardinvestment property.
Okay, I was, I, I was, you know, just looking at it.
Like you know, it's standard,right Standards to flip for her,
it's a flip for him, it's aflip for everybody.
Nobody cares, but in herperspective, right Like it

(46:02):
matters, she spent 150 K on theflip.
Yeah, and here comes thishotshot photographer being like,
oh, it's a standard listing.
And so I wasn't trying to createa thumbnail that was clickable.
So it was funny because I thinkGod talks to me through other
people and I don't know.
Anyway, it just it.
Just it kind of re-ignitedsomething where I was like, hmm,

(46:26):
before I leave, did I makeanything clickable or click
worthy?
You know, it's the same reasonpeople show cleavage.
It's the same reason why dudesare showing their thighs on leg
days.
It's just fact a lot.
You're like what's going onthere, bro?
Oscar De La Hoya's littleweenie video.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
I haven't seen it yet , but I'm sure I hate it bro, I
hated that.

Speaker 3 (46:47):
I clicked on it.
But his you know what I'msaying?
His thing was like I, I waslike what's wrong with this dude
?
But you know, you clicked on it, they got you, yeah.
And then because I'm like, okay, I'm not gonna click on it,
okay, but I gotta see what.
I gotta see more right, likeright, yeah, right, is he on

(47:07):
drugs?
And then you go, he's justtrying to create awareness for a
good cause.
Okay, got it, but he got me toclick on it.
Anyway, back to Zillow.

Speaker 2 (47:20):
That was a smooth transition.
Is what we call that yeah?

Speaker 3 (47:26):
I say the stupidest things.

Speaker 2 (47:27):
They're relevant.
Okay, so in this interim, let'sthrow this up on the screen.

Speaker 3 (47:31):
JC, if you can go to reference one homes listed with
professional real estate photossell quicker and for more money.

(47:51):
This is why and I want to justrun through this real quick and
I would um, angles matter,perspective matters, uh like, if
you see that first photo on thetop right, it's too dark.
The verticals look.
It looks like I'm looking at ahaunted house.
Oh yeah, so for 375,.
It doesn't make sense.
I don't want to click on it,but the one right underneath it
for a million dollars.
Better highlights, bettershadows, better shadows.

(48:11):
I mean, it's just a differentcomposition.
It kind of makes me go hmm, Iwonder what that is.
I want to see more.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (48:17):
Yeah, I think they actually do some before and
afters right here, or someprofessional versus not.

Speaker 3 (48:24):
Like notice that $2 million listing starts on the
view and that makes sense.
Oh yeah, you know.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Matter of fact my home.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
That's why I bought it.
I literally didn't even see thedownstairs.
I walked in I was so busy atthe time that 2020, 2019, end of
2019, right when it was kind ofbeefing up before COVID
happened it was time for us tomove.
It was our three-year mark.
We were doing it every threeyears and uh saw the, the, the
uh pamphlet, that that youobviously took the picture of,
and it was the view and it waslike, okay, we got to go see

(48:57):
that house and Kristen's likewell, that's not in our price
range.
I'm like but I can stretch alittle bit for that, If that is
what it is and literally walkedin the front door, walk straight
through the living room andstraight out to the back and it
was like this is the one.
wait a minute.
You like?
This is the one.
Wait a minute.
You don't want to see any moreof the house?
I don't need to.
This is why I mean we'll do ourinspections and all that stuff,

(49:19):
but let's roll.

Speaker 3 (49:21):
See that for me is like mission achieved.

Speaker 2 (49:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (49:24):
Mission accomplished, Because now, I mean, I see your
family enjoying that lifestyleand it just has impact.
It's like the alternative,right.
It's like I didn't sell thatlifestyle.
You didn't see that view.
That's right.
You live now in the ghetto.

Speaker 2 (49:44):
No, you live from the ghetto.

Speaker 3 (49:45):
No, no, you no.
You know what I'm saying.
You live in a different houseand it wasn't the mission that
that seller was set out toachieve, right, you know.
But it also wasn't thisdivision that you set out to
achieve, you know.
But it also wasn't the visionthat you set out to achieve.
Because you've come this far tojust not get what you want,
right, like, I know I can get it, I'll figure everything out,

(50:05):
but that's what I want.
And you know, it's just funnythat there's people in the way
of that vision.
That's true, and sometimes it'sego that's in the way of it, bro
, because it's like no, I don't,I don't need to get, I don't
need to upgrade to that or sell,I don't need, I don't need to
get that photographer or thatlandscaper or that painter or
that.
And it's like, bro, just If youknew the cost, if you knew the

(50:28):
cost, yes, bro, cause on bothsides selling and buying I mean
the cost of it would have beendifferent.
You know, if, if, anyway, soyeah, but like what?
What thumbnail you pick on onany of those website matters?
Then they click on it, and thenyour description if it's like

(50:49):
57 paragraphs, like you lost me,yeah, me too, me too.

Speaker 2 (50:55):
But if it it's like a picture is worth a thousand
words, right and it's true in myopinion.

Speaker 3 (51:00):
I mean, now you got see, that's what I'm saying with
technology.
Oh yeah, you got people doing,hey, chat, gpt, spit me up a
essay.
And it's like no, bro, what'sthe meat and potatoes?
Why are you buying this houseCause of this, this, this and

(51:22):
this and this?
And then the other thing islike this, the, the, the, uh,
demographic bro, like some ofthese, I I've, I've looked at my
listings.
I say my listings, but like no,it's stuff that I shot for
people on nolan and hayes andnew brownfels and the words that
they use.
I'm like, bro, we don't readlike that right that's very true
, we don't use elegant labrishwords like that.
I'm like you.
You lost all these half of thedemographic.

Speaker 2 (51:41):
That's exactly right.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
We're in Antonio, bro , but like straight to the meat
and potatoes.
I mean you could choose to.
You know, use chat GPT, butthen also learn how to use chat
GPT.
Don't just use chat GPT like,then learn it and say bro, okay,
okay, dumb this down for a dude.
Dumb this down for a 32 yearold dude.
Dumb this down for a 25 yearold dude.
All right, sound like a dude.

(52:03):
Use emojis.
Don't use emojis Like learn howto use it.

Speaker 2 (52:07):
Don't just use it and just be like well, I've done my
question for you and this isside note because I just thought
about it, but you've got plentyof business now, but was there
any point in time where you setout or establish some type of
presentation or class valueproposition to present to
realtors?

Speaker 3 (52:26):
Yeah, I got this slide.
It's called strategy matters andit's super dope, because it's
like what we're talking about,the story, is what matters more
than the photos.
Sure, like, if you say, hey,how much is this?
I'm like, wait, wait, wait,let's take it back bro, what
neighborhood is it?
What price are you gonna be at?
Does it have a pool?
Does it have external lighting?
Why is that important?

(52:46):
Well, because it matters how Iposition this thing.
If it's overpriced by choice,like you guys said, hey, we are
going to be a hundred K over ourcomps.
Right, I have to know what toemphasize on, sure.
And if I don't know what toemphasize on, then it's going to
be possible that I overlook itor it's not in my story, you

(53:09):
know.
So I have this process in mybrain and in my company where I
go CAs and EAs.
Cas is a critical angle, ea isan emphasis angle.
So a lot of times you need toemphasize on something and a lot
of times you don't have shit toemphasize on.
So let's just connect theangles or make sure I at least
cover the critical angles.
If you cover the criticalangles, you can go live with

(53:30):
critical angles, but you can'tgo live all the time with
emphasized angles, like whocares if it has a fireplace,
right.
You know what's the flow like.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Yeah, how do I get through this?
How do I get?
I need to envision myselfwalking through it in these
photos.

Speaker 3 (53:42):
That's right and, like I said, it's all a metaphor
for life, because what'simportant in life in general,
and you bring it into thephotography where, where did I
come from?
Right, like, how did I like?
Where's the entrance?
Where's the like, how did I gethere?
Where am I at?
Okay, you are clearly in theliving room, so what angle best
says that story?
Right, so, like, where did Icome from?
Where am I at?

(54:03):
Yes, right.
And then where am I going?
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 3 (54:07):
Absolutely, that's what matters the most in my
process.
Yes, you know what I'm saying.
It's like like, where, how didI get from the kitchen to the
living room, to living, to thekitchen?
So all those things applybecause you're answering
questions.
Yeah, basically, the betterstoryteller you are, the better
question, the better answer tothose people's questions, you
are Right.
So it's like you know how manypeople can.

(54:30):
So, for example, like when oneof the questions you asked was
like how has technology involved?
Well, 10 years ago we didn'tcare about staging or virtual
staging.
Okay, 10 years later, if theygot the time and the budget, I'm
going to recommend actualstaging, always first and
foremost, sure.
But if they don't got the timeor the budget, I'm going to say,
bro, at least do virtualstaging.
Yeah, why does that matter?
Well, because if you're in adining and explain to us what

(54:51):
virtual staging is.
It's staging it digitallybecause you don't have the time
or financial means to make ithappen in real life.

Speaker 2 (55:01):
Meaning you are literally placing a couch here,
you're putting a table here?

Speaker 3 (55:05):
Yeah, if you have a theater and some builders don't
put features that clearlyidentify or distinguish this
theater.
Okay, like those little lightsthat are on the side, sure, and
the little arches, that kind oflike make it look like this
theater.
Okay, like those little lightsthat are on the side, sure, and
the little arches, that kind oflike, make it look like a
theater, correct.
Sometimes they don't spend themoney on making it look like a
theater, right?
So if the photographer is justlike here's your photo, it's
just a room.
It's just a room.

(55:26):
In fact, it looks like a caveor a cave, a dungeon, or like a
storage unit.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:32):
But it's a six seater theater room that can actually
have a hundred inch screen.
So the digitally, uh the optionto do it digitally, comes in
clutch.
Yeah, it's like, and if you dothe comparison and again I am an
advocate for stagers First ofall, the consultation takes time

(55:53):
and I want people to stage, butI get it.
Sometimes they're like, bro, Ican't, there's nothing I can do,
my hands are tied.
Well, at that point I think, asa professional, it's your
responsibility to be like thereis another option.
Right, and I prefer you go thisway.
But if you can't do that, gothis way.
So we now have companies thatwe use, but we also do it

(56:15):
ourselves in-house, just becausewe have a little bit more
control.
But when there's so much volume, sometimes we sub it out.
But anyway, we have options forthese people that they need to
get on the market tomorrow andthey don't have the time or
capacity or the bandwidth to getit physically staged.
So that's one way thattechnology has evolved and so we
introduced those services.

(56:35):
Sure, the 3D tours wasn't a bigthing 10 years ago.
Today it's like dude I meanespecially with like people
moving getting a job at thesetech companies that come into
San Antonio.
Bro, they have to buy today fora house that they got to live
in in like seven months from now.
Yeah, so like, how do I do that?
How do I make that decision?
Well, based on just photos,right, I got to do.

(56:59):
I have a homie that will drivefrom Stone Oak all the way to
Somerset to show me a house,probably not Probably right.
They're like yeah, I'll go nextThursday.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
So essentially what we're trying to and what that
ends up doing is reducing theeyeballs, reducing the attempts,
reducing the offers, loweringyour sales price value
technically, because it's notgetting the same looks, the same
feedback, the same paintedpicture that we, as layman
consumers, need to see becausewe can't do it ourselves.

Speaker 3 (57:32):
That's right.
And if you have the ability,bro, to position your listing
right and a home run consists offour bases right, it's like
where you start and then thereare three others and then.
So if you cover all your bases,you're in the best position
that you could possibly be yeah.
That's a great way to put that.
But if you say, well, I'll justcover the first base, okay,

(57:55):
yeah, that's a great way to putthat.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
But if you say, well, I'll just cover the first base,
okay, well, it's going to.

Speaker 3 (57:58):
I mean it's half-assed.
It's half-assed, but also Imean you're decreasing your
chances or your odds are againstyou now, because other people
are actually covering all fourbases.

Speaker 2 (58:05):
That's true, that's true.

Speaker 3 (58:19):
Putting them and it may not sell faster than others,
but it is going to sell fasterthan the others.
That don't, that don't, yeah.
So your position, like as a, asan expert, like how do you want
to be positioning yourself?
Same reason why you buy aMercedes, it's the same reason
why you buy whatever, whateverit is that, that, uh, that
associates you with the statusthat you're trying to claim,
correct, right.
So if you say, like, I needthis to do what I do best, right
.
Or I need this house or thiscar or this process or this

(58:39):
machine or this tool, that'sright.
Right, you don't always need ajackhammer, but there's a guy
who always needs a jackhammer,that's right.
Right, there's a like, I neverneed a jackhammer, but there's
dudes that can't operate withoutjackhammers, operate without
jackhammers.
So my point is is that, like,you need to know what tool do
you need to sell and, uh, or toachieve the goal that we're

(59:00):
trying to achieve?
So if your goal is to listsomething, then it doesn't
matter what you do, but if yourgoal is to sell something, then
it does matter.
You know how much effort youput into it.
And there's, there's agents.
Man, you talk about Gilly.
Uh, you know, gilly's a greatexample, and damn, I'm going to
single this dude out.

Speaker 2 (59:18):
Do it, do it.
Matter of fact, I'll play itback for him for tomorrow.

Speaker 3 (59:21):
Martin, he'll be here in tomorrow.
All your guests are like myclients or just homies, you know
, so they can be like.
Well, why don't you LikeWhitney?
Whitney, yeah, no-transcriptthat that's the dream, right but

(01:00:02):
you know, if you don't do whatyou got to do, I mean, sometimes
you know you don't necessarilyneed money to make money, but
you just need to make decisionsand you need to like, like,
decide.

Speaker 2 (01:00:12):
So true, right and so jc how we doing on time need to
like, like, decide, so true,right.
And so jc how we doing on time.
It's one hour 45 seconds, holycow.
Okay, see, I told you, dude, Idon't have a timer, it's just
always right on the money.
It does feel like 20 minutes.
Like I said, it'll go by sofast, yeah thank you for being
before.
Before we wrap this up, I've gotsome stats that I want to go
over and I want the listeners tohear this stuff.

(01:00:33):
Let me see here Okay, soutilizing chat GPT the correct
way I asked it using aprofessional photographer versus
doing them yourself what arethe benefits?
And this is based on actualdata and it says here first
impressions matter.
According to study by theNational Association of Realtors

(01:00:56):
, 87% of home buyers rely onphotos as a key factor in their
home search.
High quality photos are oftenthe first thing buyers notice,
creating a strong firstimpression that can either make
or break their interest in theproperty Basically what you were
talking about there.
Let me go to number two Fastersales.

(01:01:16):
Homes with professional photossell faster.
Redfin, a real estate brokerage, found that homes listed with
higher quality DSLR photos andthat is DSLR versus iPhone, so
to speak sold 32% faster thanthose with lower quality images
with iPhone or said uh other uhcameras.

(01:01:38):
This is a particularlyimportant in competitive market,
where making a strong initialimpression can result in a
faster offer.
Number three higher sellingprice.
Professional photos can alsohelp sellers achieve a higher
sales price.
A study from VHT Studiorevealed that the homes with

(01:01:59):
professional photography tend tosell for higher prices.
In fact, listings withhigh-quality photos have been
shown to sell for between $3,000and $11,000 more than the homes
with amateur photos.
Number four perceived value,and we spoke about this.

(01:02:19):
High quality photos help conveythe value of the home.
The buyers perceiveprofessionally photographed
homes as being better maintainedand more desirable.
This emotional response cantranslate into increased
interest and potentially, ahigher offer.
And then broader reach is thelast one In the digital age

(01:02:43):
being the time that we're in nowand, as we mentioned, not going
backwards, so we're only goingforward and faster In the
digital age.
Buyers often view homes onlinefirst, bright and saved by
potential.
No, no, no.
Bright and clear, professionalshots are most likely to be

(01:03:04):
clicked on, shared and saved bypotential buyers.
This increases the visibilityof the listing and lead to more
showings.
Basically what you said thereand this is all data statistics
this is not emotion.

Speaker 3 (01:03:16):
It's all been removed from there yeah, because uh,
the important thing is to uhcompare it to the alternative.
Yeah, right, so bright and airy, dark and or bright and clear,
dark and unclear, correct.
You know, uh, professional,unprofessional, the the, the
thing is what makes itprofessional right.
So it's like you know, uh,training, it's right versus

(01:03:38):
knowing what aperture is,knowing what your white balance
is.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
I know all these things now going up, not
smelling like weed.

Speaker 3 (01:03:44):
It's over and up, not you know showing up on and you
know on a timely fashion.
You know um the thedeliverables being consistent,
meeting the customer'sexpectation.
On the 37th house, that lookstotally different from all 36
houses before.

Speaker 2 (01:04:01):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:04:02):
Being consistent, you know.
So it's like.
The reason why it sells fasteris when you compare it to those
who don't have a professional,those who don't have a
professional.
The reason why it's, you knowthe reason why it's, the reason
why it sells for more istypically because you have a
multiple offer situation, whichis, if you ask any seller, hey,

(01:04:28):
would you rather have one offeror would you rather have 10?
They're always going to say I'drather have 10.
Always Right, but the agentthat doesn't know.
What they don't know and that'sthe problem is that they might
not have been in the game longenough to know that one offer
isn't really nothing to getexcited about.
Right, that's very true.
It's very true.
It's almost scary if you onlyhave one.
If you have one offer, I'd benervous.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
I'm right there with you, especially in this market.
What website Bright and Early?

Speaker 3 (01:04:51):
Bright and Early Productions is the website, yeah
, website, bright and Early.
Bright and Early.

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
Productions is the website.
Yeah, productionscom JC, if youcan throw that up there,
showing this beautiful home.
Nothing but beautiful picturesof homes.
Rick shoots luxury homes tosmall investment properties.
He does it all.

Speaker 3 (01:05:20):
And one of the things to kind of make sure that
people know is that it's notjust Rick, the, the photographer
.
Like I am the, the seniorphotographer, I'm the leader,
I'm the team leader, I'm alsothe um.
Like I will take challengingprojects.
Sure, I'll take higher endprojects, for sure, because
that's where the energy needs tobe concentrated, versus
anything 300 000 and below.
We have uh tiers that certainlyhave tier one, tier two to
three.
I'm like a tier three so I canexecute a two hundred thousand
dollar house, but so sure, socan my junior associate, so can

(01:05:41):
my partners that been with us ayear or two years.
Any of us can do that.
But when it comes to a projectthat is going to be challenging
or going to be higher priced,you don't want to get a tier one
associate to take on thatproject.
So it's good to know thatthere's, first of all, it's not
just me.
So that way you know you don'thave to wait for Rick's

(01:06:01):
availability because I'mprobably not available tomorrow,
right, right, but we have sevenother.
Well, we have six other guysthat can, that can shoot it.
That's awesome.
So we do have a team ofphotographers, a team of editors
, we have customer service reps.
So a lot of my challenge in myearlier years was that I
wouldn't respond as fast aspeople need to know.
Hey, are you available?
There's so many things toconsider around it.

(01:06:21):
Like I would say yes, but thenmy previous appointment would be
in Bernie and then theirappointment is in Austin and I'm
like well, how the hell do I bein two places at once?
Yeah, like in 30 minutes, right.
So we have customer servicereps.
That kind of helps me help, youknow, keep the machine going.
But yeah, if you follow us onour Facebook or Instagram pages,
the beautiful thing is most ofthat is our team.

(01:06:43):
It's not my work, because Ilearned earlier in the years
that people were expecting whatthey saw and so we stopped
posting my stuff because itlooked a certain way.
If you want that, you got to paythem.
Yeah, well that.
But also they're like wait aminute?
Well, because everybody hastheir certain level of skill,
their practice, their expertise,their experience.
So you know, to get a certainlook, you have to do a certain

(01:07:06):
thing, and that comes with time,that comes with experience.
So it's like a barber.
You know, the barber knows youredge up and the barber who
doesn't.
This is his first time cuttingyour hair.
He doesn't know your hairline.
So he's like what do you want?
Ball fade or taper fade?
Okay, cool.
And then you get in.
You're like oh, you're not likethat other guy, why would it be
any different?
On photography, that's exactlyright.

Speaker 2 (01:07:26):
Experience matters.

Speaker 3 (01:07:27):
Mortgage right, like I mean, even in your process,
I've been with lenders that knowand then I've been with lenders
that care and I've been withlenders that don't know, don't
care, and I'm like man.
The experience is totallydifferent.
They either flood you with allthe information you need,
sometimes they overwhelm you,sometimes they stress you out,
sometimes they care, sometimesthey don't.

Speaker 2 (01:07:57):
But the person who's refined themselves, they know
how far to go in and go out andguide you.
They're more like that EQ of ofknowing people and knowing the,
the mannerisms and picking upon those things along with
parlaying your craft or yourexpertise with that.

Speaker 3 (01:08:05):
Yeah, it's the same in our business.
So expecting a photographerthat's been doing this for one
year to execute like aphotographer that's been doing
this for 15 years is outlandish,outlandish, yep.
But you know, that's what we'rehere for to call and to you
know, to educate.
And if you have something thatyou're like, man, I hasn't.
So I wish more people would dothat.
I wish the ego would get out ofthe way and they would say, hey

(01:08:26):
, can you help me with this?
Can you take a look at this andjust tell me what you recommend
?
Maybe I'm not looking atsomething or maybe I didn't do
something.
If more of us did what we'redoing right now, which is
conversation and actuallynetworking and saying, hey, like
um, collaborate Right.
So I wish we would collaboratemore because we would probably

(01:08:46):
get some crazy stuff done.

Speaker 2 (01:08:47):
Absolutely, you know.
But everybody, like you said,does have the ego and and and.
Uh, if I'm doing somethinggreat, I want nobody to know
about it.
Why?
Because it's a secret.
I'm not that way man.
That's why this show is doingwell is because we, we lay it
all out there and, hey, theinfo's there.
Yeah, matter of fact, weweren't the first ones to put it

(01:09:08):
out there.
It's out there all over theplace.
If you go and find it, you willfind it.
That's right, that's awesome.
Okay, so we got some good stuffin this discussion?
I hope so.
Um, one of the the the biggestuh things that I have heard
within this and folks may nothave picked up on it, but the
market being what it is, a bitslower for all of us real estate
professionals um, rick and histeam decided to leverage.

(01:09:32):
They can now do rentals andprobably always have, but now
they've got multiple thingsgoing and I believe that's
something that I want tochallenge or inspire you guys
out there to do If you're in thereal estate profession, if you
can, don't get out of the realestate profession, shift your

(01:09:52):
focus to something that willstill earn you money and still
help the consumer umaccomplishing their goals.
I mean that's something thatyou can continue to better
sharpening your tools, yourcraft, all of that good stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:10:06):
Um, yeah, cause you could still rent.
You can still make money onthem renting the house for six
months.
Of course, I have one, um, Ihave one agent who will hire me
to sell the house and if itdoesn't sell, I get hired again
and I'm like what are we doingnow?
Well, we're going to Airbnbthis for a year.
And I said why Airbnb and notlong-term, why STR and not

(01:10:28):
long-term rental?
And they said, well, because weneed a premium mortgage, we
need a premium rent.
Ah Right, so that's why I wastalking about Positioning
yourself Right.
It's pivoting.

Speaker 2 (01:10:38):
Right, in addition to if they are ready to sell it,
they don't have to wait for atenant to get out of there and
turn around.
Pull your pictures from thatone.
And because it goes to that,feedback stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:10:46):
So if we have a short-term rental, they give you
feedback out on the hour that Ibrought your, your, your
toilets making too much noise,your, you know your paint is,
too, is a lot darker than thesephotos, you know, and they're
like, and so what happens is thelandlord has to like, eat it
and just say, okay, I got to dosomething about it.
So your, your, your, yoursolution as a professional

(01:11:08):
adapts to the market, right.
And you say, yo, like, you know, don't worry, you know you're,
you're afraid of not meetingyour mortgage.
I get that.
You wanted to sell this rightnow.
I got you.
I'm on the same page.
I want to sell this, but wecan't get what you want, for
whatever reason, or it's goingto take you some time to
renovate it, whatever.
Let's look into this option andthere's agents that will

(01:11:29):
initially go for trying to sellit and they do everything they
can because they're looking forthat max dollar right now for
the seller, right, right Seller.
And if they can't do it, they gohey, don't trip, I got you, I
see you, I know what you'regoing through.
You don't need market rate,rental price, you need whatever
we can get right.
The only way to do that is toto do an Airbnb.

(01:11:49):
That's smart move, man.

Speaker 2 (01:11:50):
That's another tidbit right here towards the end.
Well, rick, man, that's anothertidbit right here towards the
end.
Well, rick, is there anythingelse you want to add to this
thing?

Speaker 3 (01:11:56):
I just want you to know that I'm proud of you, man.
I'm grateful that we finallydid this.
It's been a long time comingand I just I'm grateful that you
didn't quit and that you didyour 10,000 hours and that you
stuck it out, because, if youlike, I said, if you would have
became a photographer, wewouldn't be here.

Speaker 2 (01:12:15):
That is a damn good point.
Well, rick, thank you forjoining me.
Incredible person and anamazing expert at your craft.
Truly, those of you out theretuning in realtors, if you've
never hired a professionalphotographer, test that out.
It's definitely going to beworth it.
Uh, as we mentioned, the manydifferent um factors that will

(01:12:38):
play into your success ingetting that property sold.
Um, typically first impressionsway on those uh photos.
Um, guys, I really appreciateyou tuning in.
We are now at 11,000subscribers and climbing Um, so
we're going to continue to bringyou guys um more experts in our

(01:12:58):
field.
Um, and hopefully it continuesto bring you guys value.
Uh.
That being the case, we willcatch you on the next one.
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