October 4, 2024 • 28 mins
Discover how to conquer your fears and embrace change with our guest, life coach Dennis Bullock, in this enlightening episode of the Kinder Mind podcast. Learn why fear often arises from overthinking and how it both protects and limits us. Through Dennis's practical advice and personal stories you'll understand the importance of re-framing fear to uncover new opportunities for growth. Change your perspective on fear and see how it can be a stepping stone rather than a stumbling block in your life.
We also dive into the importance of acknowledging both the positive and negative possibilities that come with change. Dennis shares strategies to balance these possibilities while fostering a realistic outlook. Get inspired by his experiences with constant relocation and career transitions, which illustrate the power of stepping out of your comfort zone. Embrace failure as a learning opportunity, maintain a growth mindset, and take those leaps of faith toward self-improvement. Tune in to gain valuable guidance on navigating life's transitions and keep growing with us. For more personalized advice, connect with Dennis at https://kindermindcoaching.com/coaches/dennis-bullock
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (00:00):
Thanks so much to our listeners for
joining us on today's episode ofthe Kinder Mind podcast, where
we're exploring letting go offear and embracing change with
Dennis Bullock, life coach.
Dennis, thanks so much forjoining us today.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (00:14):
Dr Barlow is an honor and a
privilege.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (00:17):
Thank you, sir.
This topic fascinates mebecause I think we can all
recall times in our life wherewe have experienced fear and
dread, and that can definitelybe one of those negative
emotions that is a part of beinga human that we can get stuck
in.
What does letting go of fearmean to you?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (00:39):
Yes, as I was preparing, I had
multiple thoughts A lot of times.
You would probably think aboutthese particular things, the
unknown, but I really look at.
When you talk about letting goof fear is really letting go of
how you view it.
It's like this I know thismight be a horrible analogy, but
(01:00):
like trying sometimes trying tothrow them out every now and
then.
But it's like driving a carwith insurance versus not having
insurance.
Now, if you didn't haveinsurance on a nice vehicle, my
goodness, you're going toprobably be in fear all the time
, because fears a lot of timescomes in when you're
overthinking a lot of stuff andI'm really speaking about myself
(01:24):
most of the time that we'regoing to answer these questions,
because I have tendencies tooverthink a lot of times.
But when fear comes in, oh mygosh, it's like almost sweeping
water uphill.
And so when I get into thosemindsets that I have with fear,
it's more overthinking.
And when I get over tooverthinking what about this and
(01:46):
what about that, fear comes inand magnifies it.
And so letting go of fear isletting go of how you view it,
because sometimes fear actuallyis not necessarily a bad thing.
It could be a warning, it couldbe something that's letting you
know I'm feeling a particularway right now.
And then this is for me to askmyself this question why am I
(02:09):
feeling this way?
And a lot of times we don't dothat, we don't sit back and ask
ourselves those questionsbecause we're just overthinking.
So letting go of fear is reallyletting go of how you view it,
and that's what I wanted to sayfor that particular question.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (02:26):
Thank you so much for sharing that.
That makes so much sense.
And while you were speaking, Iwas thinking about fear and how
it really shapes our thoughtsand can get us stuck, but then
also how, like you mentioned, itcan help to protect us and
guide us.
And so why do you think fearoften prevents people from
(02:48):
embracing change?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (02:51):
I really feel like 95% of us live
in this particular area.
Let me explain these threewords comfort, convenience and
control.
A lot of times, man, when fearshows up or when change happens
or we're about to go through atransition, a lot of times we
(03:12):
find ourselves it's messing withour convenience in life.
How's this going to affect someof the, maybe even the leisures
, or just the things that I havegotten comfortable with?
Or this big one.
Control I want to control theoutcome, and when we can't
control the outcome which a lotof times we can't we freak out.
(03:33):
And I feel like those three C's.
When I start to even deal withsome of my clients, I start to
ask them some.
There's some things you justcan't control.
You can't control how you'regoing to feel in this transition
.
You can't control when a careerhappens, a career change
happens or a layoff happens andyou were so.
(03:54):
Your identity was attached tothat paycheck and now I'm not
getting no money coming in.
The fear arises.
But it's really attached to.
Am I going to lose control?
Or I'm going to lose thecomfort of what that paycheck
brought for me, or theconvenience?
I was getting a steady paycheckcoming in and now I've changed
(04:17):
to being an entrepreneur and Imight not get the paycheck this
week, I might not get a paycheckthis month or next couple
months, and so that really rilesyou up and I really feel like a
lot of times it's attached tothose particular three C's that
I talk about, but the verses ofthat is really the sacrifice,
(04:40):
the surrendering, and the reallywith the other one I can't
think of right now is reallysurrendering to the process of
change, embracing that change,because there's a growth that
comes with that change.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (04:58):
I could not agree more.
Back to a time, I think I wasthe most afraid when it came to
everything that you mentionedabout career.
I knew that I wanted to startmy own group therapy practice
and I was absolutely terrifiedto the point to where it stifled
me from taking any action atall.
(05:18):
And it was absolutely there'sthree C's that you mentioned and
I couldn't do it.
I couldn't take the next step.
I knew everything that I neededto do to take the next step,
but I was terrified of losingthat guaranteed paycheck.
I was terrified that I wasn'tgoing to make it.
I was terrified that I wasn'tgoing to be able to pay my bills
(05:38):
and provide for my family, andit took my partner telling me we
will be fine, go do this to getme motivated and to actually do
the scary thing.
So I'm curious if you couldshare a personal or even a
professional experience whereyou had to let go of fear to
embrace a significant change.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (06:01):
I've gone through many changes in my
life.
It first started out just beinga military brat.
Both my parents were in themilitary and so moving for us we
seem like we moved around thefall season.
October seems like the monththat we was always moving.
I didn't know if it was a trickor a treat, but at the end of
the day it was tough dealingwith those types of transitions.
(06:22):
But professionally I have to goall the way back, because this
is the first time I had toreally make a decision, because
I was unhappy.
When I came out of college I wasworking for a particular
automotive company.
I'm from Michigan and so theautomotive plants were big time
and if you got a job in thoseparticular companies, you were
(06:44):
doing fairly well.
And when I came out of collegeit was my first job that I got
and I was making very good moneyat 23 years old and I was
enjoying the check.
But I wasn't enjoying workingin a plant.
I had an easy job at first andthen I moved around and so
during that seven year period ofworking for that company it got
(07:07):
worse and worse.
I knew that I did not want tobe here.
I wanted something else.
I wanted to be more expressive.
I want to have moreopportunities to plan and
develop.
And I was working in a plant.
Again, the paycheck was awesome, but I just didn't want to be
there.
Again, the paycheck was awesome, but I just didn't want to be
(07:27):
there.
And so I found myself makingthe decision do I want to stay
here for the next seven years ordo I need to bail out and leave
and quit?
And so during that process, itwas the toughest thing, because
you're going from making thistype of money that you have
never made before.
Imagine going from a collegestudent making an hourly wage to
(07:48):
where you're making a salaryand you're getting paid tons of
money for what you're doing in aplant.
And I had to make a courageousstep, and it was tough.
It was so tough back then.
What do I do?
What do I transition into?
And so, for me, the easiestthing that I can think of was
leaving and going into teaching,and I didn't have a teaching
(08:11):
certificate, and so what I hadto do was go in, and I was
looking at these different typesof ads and they had substitute
teaching.
I was like, oh my gosh, I don'twant to be going from school to
school.
So all the overthinking, allthe fears, all the things that
were happening in my mind wasalmost keeping me stuck.
But I had to take a leap, andwhen I took that leap it was
(08:38):
tough because I did take severalthousands I said tens of
thousands of dollars paycheck.
I went from making this amountof money to going to being a
substitute teacher, where Iwasn't making that much money.
But let me tell you this Ienjoyed when I jumped.
The landing was pretty, prettysoft.
It wasn't as what I thought itwas going to be.
Now, yes, I lost money bymaking the transition, but I
(08:59):
found myself enjoying what I wasdoing, and so that was one of
the first experience I can thinkof coming out of college, and
that experience really helped metransition from when I got
married and me and my wife hadto move from Michigan to Arizona
, and so I was excited about it.
I was excited about it becauseI've done this before and I know
(09:21):
what it's like to leave a joband move into the next
opportunity, and so that was thefirst, really the first time I
can think of that.
I really it was a strugglebecause it was several months,
it wasn't something like acouple of weeks, a couple of
days.
It was several months before Iactually took that leap of faith
into leaving my job.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (09:43):
I love that personal story.
Thank you so much for sharingthat and it's really great in
how you illustrate that.
The motivator of financial gainwas a real one and it was a
great one.
And then you felt like you wereI'm paraphrasing here it sounds
like you felt like you werelosing yourself in just mundane
(10:03):
kind of job and you reallywanted to be able to, like you
mentioned, express yourself andreally feel your value and your
worth, and that was so importantto you that you didn't tie that
to a paycheck so that you madethat transition over to
happiness and joy andfulfillment and that was more of
(10:24):
a priority than the financialaspect.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (10:28):
Yes.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (10:30):
So, thinking about the clients that
you work with, what are some ofthe common fears that people
have that you've heard, whenfacing change?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (10:38):
Yes, the biggest one, and this is
also for me, and coaching reallyhelped me navigate this
particular fear, and it's thefear of failure, something that
actually, if you use it theright way or have the right
relationship with it, it canreally be something that really
(11:11):
helps you think through and takea self-inventory of where
you're at.
And that's the process thatI've used.
But fear of failure has beensomething that I hear a lot of
my clients.
They don't want to launch out,they going back to those three
C's, they're comfortable andsometimes, where they're at,
even their mice.
I'm like you need to launch out, you need to do something
(11:31):
different, you need to grow.
Have you explored theseparticular areas?
And it's but and now we'regoing back to those three C's Is
it, is this convenient this job?
Is it convenient in knowingthat you've got this steady
income coming in?
Or is it just convenientbecause maybe your spouse don't
want you to leave or you don'thave that support?
(11:53):
And so a fear of failure.
You come up with so manyexcuses and all these different
types of things, and so that'sprobably been the most common
one the areas of counseling.
Sometimes it's just I'm feelingI'm losing myself.
I think you had said that I'mlosing my identity, I'm losing
who I am.
I've been attached to this forso long and I don't know who I
(12:18):
am anymore, and so we have to goback a little bit and really
discover where did that comefrom?
What type of stuff did you dealwith as a child?
But then, when we get intocoaching, how can we move you
forward and not let this fear besomething where you're stuck
but you're coming out of it andseeing that, hey, this can be
(12:38):
something that will help me growthrough this change that I'm
experiencing?
I can't even say it for myselfeven now, or I don't.
When I left my teaching job overthe summer and launched my
coaching business, it was atfirst.
It was tough.
I can hear myself having anegative self-talk, a negative
(12:59):
mindset about certain things,but then I came out of it.
I knew, okay, make me go backto my I am statements, and one
of the I am statements I used tosay, uh, I was myself over the
summer was I am attractive notby my looks, but I stand out.
And and as I kept on sayingthat, I got more opportunities,
I got people talking to me aboutcertain things, people ask me
(13:21):
questions, and then I started toreally embrace.
Wow, this is not a place that Ihave to stay in.
I reminded myself I'm here.
And then now it becomessomething that becomes another
encouragement for somebody else,especially for my clients.
I got one particular client andhe's making a transition into
the business arena and I gotsome words that I've been giving
(13:42):
to him.
He's been really encouraged byit and I got some words that
I've been given to him.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (13:45):
He's been really encouraged because by
behind it.
Thank you for sharing that.
I it's so interesting to hearhow fear can play a different
role in kind of everybody'sexperience, and how we all have
to try to use tools to growbeyond it.
Like you mentioned, and I thinkwhen I was working with clients
(14:08):
, oftentimes one of the I'd sayone of the primary concerns I
would frequently hear is I'mworried about this, or they
would use statements like I knowI shouldn't worry, and my
response was always what do youmean?
You shouldn't worry, you shouldabsolutely worry.
Worry is something that helpsyou to think about all of these
(14:32):
potential negative consequences.
So if you're putting on thispositive mindset and what's one
of those buzzwords If you're notallowing yourself to go into
the negative, you're going tocompletely fall apart should
that negative arise, and so Iwould always use the analogy for
my clients it's a lot shorterfall from a hill than it is from
(14:53):
a mountaintop.
So if you're churching yourselfup and you are just like
singing your song and you're thegreatest in the world, nothing
bad can happen because it'spositive vibes.
Only when those bad thingshappen, you're falling from a
mountaintop.
If you go ahead and develop themindset of yes, good is
possible, but negative is alsopossible, and you have those
(15:15):
thoughts and you allow yourselfto.
And another word I would hearfrom clients is I don't want to
go down this rabbit hole.
Go down the rabbit hole.
Let's fully map out this rabbithole.
Go down the rabbit hole.
Let's fully map out this rabbithole and understand what it
looks like and let's developsome pathways that we can take
should these negative thingscome true.
So I completely get, I want toput positivity out there and
(15:37):
will that into existence andabsolutely do that.
But don't put on thoserose-colored sunglasses and only
see the rosy side of things,because now you are limiting
your protection system andyou're limiting yourself from
planning, for these things isrational or irrational is where
(16:04):
we would get into theseconversations, because an
irrational fear is somethingthat has never happened to you
before and it just so happens topop in your head and now you're
worried about it and you'reallowing that to really take
over and limit yourpossibilities.
And those are the ones that wereally want to call out and try
to identify.
Okay, what's going on here,like why are you having this
(16:26):
fear?
Has this ever happened before?
What's making you think thatthis could happen.
And then those rational fearsare the boogers Like those are
the ones that have been provento you that, yeah, they can
happen and they can come trueLosing your job.
If you've been fired before, youcan lose your job, so now
that's not an irrational fear.
(16:47):
So then how do we work throughthat?
We go ahead and we allowourselves the worry and we map
out what are our options.
You get fired tomorrow.
What are you going to do?
Okay, that doesn't work out,what's that next thing?
You're going to try, and wedevelop this plan, and I think
that's another reason I lovethis conversation we're having
so much and the fact thatthere's coaching involved,
(17:08):
because it's very much aboutlooking to the future and
planning for the future, andthat doesn't always have to be a
positive thing.
That can be.
Let's plan for the worst.
Let's go and allow ourselves togo there and think about what
that could look like.
And can we always avoid theworst?
No, but can we go ahead andthink of some strategies to
(17:32):
maybe negate it from being quiteso intense?
Absolutely, we can do that.
Let's see.
Let me think about which is thenext question I would ask.
So how can embracing changereally lead to personal growth
in your opinion?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (17:46):
Yeah , I think you did a good job of
talking about that.
I think, again, going back tothose three C's comfort when you
really start to open yourselfto change and seeing the
opportunities what change canprovide, it does push you out of
your comfort.
(18:07):
I used to and this is probablya common phrase, but I know I
said, I used to say it back backin the day for myself and when
(18:28):
I was at this particularorganization and I used to say,
man, I can't even getcomfortable.
I'm like one one minute.
I'm here and we're changing andwe're comfortable in being
uncomfortable.
And so change pushes you outand it helps you explore again
how I'm feeling about myself,how am I feeling with my wife,
my kids Because they're part ofthat process too.
For those who are married andor just family members, it
(18:51):
pushes you out of your comfortzone.
But then the awesome part aboutthat is that now you're really
you're forced to do somethingdifferent, you're forced to
think differently, you're forcedto make a decision.
I got to make a decision onthis one.
I was dealing with some clientson Tuesday and I said I can't
(19:11):
really help you.
I'm here to give youperspective, but you ultimately
got to make a decision, that yougot to say yes to this or you
got to say no to this, andchallenge them directly.
I let them know how much I lovehim.
I want him to do his best, butI'm challenging you.
You got to make a decision andchange forces you to do that.
(19:33):
It's like renovation You'regoing into a house and you're
taking out certain things,whether it's a room or whether
it's the whole house, and youget to reimagine what the space
looks like.
But it looked like this before,and so you almost have to.
When change, you've got tovisualize something different.
(19:53):
What could this be?
What could this change looklike for me?
What could this change looklike for my marriage?
What can this change look likefor my relationship?
What can this change look likefor whatever that is?
It's really getting into a newspace, and that's what change
does.
Change changes the way you think, the way things, even yourself.
(20:16):
I think self-awareness isprobably a big piece of that is
that you become so self-aware ofwho I am and how I've grown
from, how I used to be.
Fear, failure used to grip me,and I can remember all the way
back from high school.
I felt like I was a pretty goodstudent in high school.
(20:37):
I had aspiration, I hadambition.
But when I moved over tocollege and I little more
different than what I did inhigh school and when I made my
(20:59):
first F or I flunked my firstclass in my freshman year, the
fear of failure gripped me and Ididn't know what to do.
But when you get around acommunity of people that helps
you change, or you get aroundpeople who are forcing you and
pushing you out of your comfortzone, you begin to see, okay, I
can do this, I can.
There's opportunities.
That's going to come out ofthis if I just look at it a
different way and I come out ofmy comfort zone.
(21:22):
So that's.
I think that's probably one ofthe biggest things when you're
embracing change.
It's really pushing you outsome zones that you need to get
out of.
You need to get out of thatspace.
You need to get out of comfortand move to something that's
going to challenge you and Ithink that's the biggest thing I
can really can answer in thatquestion.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (21:41):
And I love how you mention community,
because community is soimportant.
Our environment is so importantfor shaping how we behave and
our outlook and how we'refeeling.
So how can support systems likebrands or professionals help
individuals through change andlike on their journey?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (22:01):
Let me speak for coaching,
especially under the kinder mindplatform Coaches.
When I had my first coach, Ireally felt like I had somebody
that was on my team.
Now, thank God for an awesomewife, thank God for a wonderful
family support.
Sometimes they can talk and saythings to you.
(22:22):
They love you and they're justreally trying to encourage you
to move out to whatever areayou're in.
But a coach man, they're ableto say some things to you and
it's coming from a place of thisperson don't even know me, but
this coach is for you and as yougo through the process of
(22:43):
asking questions, trying to getto know each other and where you
want to go and all those typesof things, a coach really helps
you see further than what youwould see for yourself.
Or a coach will help you seethings that you possibly I
didn't see, that I didn't seehow fear is actually working
with me.
I haven't changed myrelationship.
(23:05):
A coach helps you notnecessarily practice until
you're perfect, but you'regetting to a place where I do
this on a regular basis till Ijust can't get it wrong, because
I'm in the space of living this, living it out, and that's what
I like about the platform thatyou're providing is that not
(23:28):
only do we need people who needcounseling yes, we need people
to.
Definitely we need to go backand deal with some past traumas
that are hindering you frommoving forward.
But what I like about coachingnow that you are getting healed
in this area how can we move youforward?
What are some of the thingsthat you need to set for
yourself?
And I love that with a coach,that's what I love doing for
(23:52):
people is really helping themsee the potential that they had,
because a lot of times, it'sjust the potential.
You have an idea, you havesomething that you want to do.
That's great potential.
That's great.
That's great that you're there.
But how are we going to get youthere?
What is the next steps that youneed to make?
And a lot of times, peopledon't think through those
particular things.
(24:12):
They see the finish line, theysee themselves winning in life,
and that's a great visualizationof having that.
But what's the process inbetween?
And a lot of us don't like theprocess.
The process is I got to get upearly in the morning, I have
these particular rituals, or Igot to exercise, or I got to go
(24:34):
out there and market and learnthis different type of tool in
order to increase man, thatprocess.
That is challenging, but it'sworth it.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (24:49):
What advice would you give to someone
standing at the edge of asignificant change in their life
?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (24:56):
Man, I would say jump Now, depending
on the situation.
Again, all situations areunique but it's repelling.
I was in ROTC back in the dayand I had to repel off a wall
and of course they give you allthe equipment, give you ropes
and stuff like that.
They put you on the edge andliterally you have somebody
(25:19):
that's looking at you.
The first attempt that I hadwas off of a 50-foot wall and
then, if you did successfully,did that, then you can start
repelling off the mountain.
A lot of people don't make it tothe mountain because they're so
afraid of that 50-foot wall andthey just don't want to jump.
Their legs are shaking, theirbody's telling them no, don't do
(25:40):
it.
Fear is gripping them and theydon't know what to do.
They just stay stuck, they stayup there and a lot of the time
the coach is saying just jump,just jump.
We got you, we got you theropes, the training that you've
done.
It's not going to help, it'snot going to make you, you're
not going to fall, you're goingto be okay.
(26:00):
But sometimes we don't see it,but what we're hearing.
I'm trying to say to people whoare in that place go ahead and
jump, just experience it,because fear and failure, if it
depends on how you look, it canactually work for you instead of
against you.
If you try something, you falldown, pick yourself back up If
(26:22):
it's not life threatening.
Of course, we're not talkingabout nothing life threatening
here, but we're talking aboutgoing to your next level.
You might fall, you might fail,but that's OK.
There's nothing wrong with that, and I think sometimes our
comforts, our conveniences, thethings that we think that we're
(26:45):
trying to control, sometimes wejust can't control it.
So just jump.
You're not going to be able tocontrol if you don't get no
business the first few months orthe first year, but keep going,
jump, experience, see what it'slike and then, if it don't work
well, transition to somethingelse and learn something new.
(27:06):
But you learned about yourself.
I think John Maxwell says thisit's not failure, it's learning.
Well, you're learning somethingnew.
You're growing still, though,and that's what's so awesome
about that.
So I tell people just go aheadand jump.
Go ahead and experience whatit's like.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (27:24):
I love that so much.
Keep growing, keeptransitioning, keep jumping.
Thank you so much for joiningus today, dennis, and providing
your valuable insight andexperience around this topic.
If anyone would like to book atime to meet with dennis, they
can go check out dennis'sprofile at kindermindcoachingcom
(27:47):
and get started on growing andtransitioning and making that
jump today.
Thank you again for your time,dennis.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coac (27:55):
Thank you so much, Dr Barlow.
Thanks so much to our listeners for
joining us on today's episode ofthe Kinder Mind podcast, where
we're exploring letting go offear and embracing change with
Dennis Bullock, life coach.
Dennis, thanks so much forjoining us today.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (00:14):
Dr Barlow is an honor and a
privilege.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (00:17):
Thank you, sir.
This topic fascinates mebecause I think we can all
recall times in our life wherewe have experienced fear and
dread, and that can definitelybe one of those negative
emotions that is a part of beinga human that we can get stuck
in.
What does letting go of fearmean to you?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (00:39):
Yes, as I was preparing, I had
multiple thoughts A lot of times.
You would probably think aboutthese particular things, the
unknown, but I really look at.
When you talk about letting goof fear is really letting go of
how you view it.
It's like this I know thismight be a horrible analogy, but
(01:00):
like trying sometimes trying tothrow them out every now and
then.
But it's like driving a carwith insurance versus not having
insurance.
Now, if you didn't haveinsurance on a nice vehicle, my
goodness, you're going toprobably be in fear all the time
, because fears a lot of timescomes in when you're
overthinking a lot of stuff andI'm really speaking about myself
(01:24):
most of the time that we'regoing to answer these questions,
because I have tendencies tooverthink a lot of times.
But when fear comes in, oh mygosh, it's like almost sweeping
water uphill.
And so when I get into thosemindsets that I have with fear,
it's more overthinking.
And when I get over tooverthinking what about this and
(01:46):
what about that, fear comes inand magnifies it.
And so letting go of fear isletting go of how you view it,
because sometimes fear actuallyis not necessarily a bad thing.
It could be a warning, it couldbe something that's letting you
know I'm feeling a particularway right now.
And then this is for me to askmyself this question why am I
(02:09):
feeling this way?
And a lot of times we don't dothat, we don't sit back and ask
ourselves those questionsbecause we're just overthinking.
So letting go of fear is reallyletting go of how you view it,
and that's what I wanted to sayfor that particular question.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (02:26):
Thank you so much for sharing that.
That makes so much sense.
And while you were speaking, Iwas thinking about fear and how
it really shapes our thoughtsand can get us stuck, but then
also how, like you mentioned, itcan help to protect us and
guide us.
And so why do you think fearoften prevents people from
(02:48):
embracing change?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (02:51):
I really feel like 95% of us live
in this particular area.
Let me explain these threewords comfort, convenience and
control.
A lot of times, man, when fearshows up or when change happens
or we're about to go through atransition, a lot of times we
(03:12):
find ourselves it's messing withour convenience in life.
How's this going to affect someof the, maybe even the leisures
, or just the things that I havegotten comfortable with?
Or this big one.
Control I want to control theoutcome, and when we can't
control the outcome which a lotof times we can't we freak out.
(03:33):
And I feel like those three C's.
When I start to even deal withsome of my clients, I start to
ask them some.
There's some things you justcan't control.
You can't control how you'regoing to feel in this transition
.
You can't control when a careerhappens, a career change
happens or a layoff happens andyou were so.
(03:54):
Your identity was attached tothat paycheck and now I'm not
getting no money coming in.
The fear arises.
But it's really attached to.
Am I going to lose control?
Or I'm going to lose thecomfort of what that paycheck
brought for me, or theconvenience?
I was getting a steady paycheckcoming in and now I've changed
(04:17):
to being an entrepreneur and Imight not get the paycheck this
week, I might not get a paycheckthis month or next couple
months, and so that really rilesyou up and I really feel like a
lot of times it's attached tothose particular three C's that
I talk about, but the verses ofthat is really the sacrifice,
(04:40):
the surrendering, and the reallywith the other one I can't
think of right now is reallysurrendering to the process of
change, embracing that change,because there's a growth that
comes with that change.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (04:58):
I could not agree more.
Back to a time, I think I wasthe most afraid when it came to
everything that you mentionedabout career.
I knew that I wanted to startmy own group therapy practice
and I was absolutely terrifiedto the point to where it stifled
me from taking any action atall.
(05:18):
And it was absolutely there'sthree C's that you mentioned and
I couldn't do it.
I couldn't take the next step.
I knew everything that I neededto do to take the next step,
but I was terrified of losingthat guaranteed paycheck.
I was terrified that I wasn'tgoing to make it.
I was terrified that I wasn'tgoing to be able to pay my bills
(05:38):
and provide for my family, andit took my partner telling me we
will be fine, go do this to getme motivated and to actually do
the scary thing.
So I'm curious if you couldshare a personal or even a
professional experience whereyou had to let go of fear to
embrace a significant change.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (06:01):
I've gone through many changes in my
life.
It first started out just beinga military brat.
Both my parents were in themilitary and so moving for us we
seem like we moved around thefall season.
October seems like the monththat we was always moving.
I didn't know if it was a trickor a treat, but at the end of
the day it was tough dealingwith those types of transitions.
(06:22):
But professionally I have to goall the way back, because this
is the first time I had toreally make a decision, because
I was unhappy.
When I came out of college I wasworking for a particular
automotive company.
I'm from Michigan and so theautomotive plants were big time
and if you got a job in thoseparticular companies, you were
(06:44):
doing fairly well.
And when I came out of collegeit was my first job that I got
and I was making very good moneyat 23 years old and I was
enjoying the check.
But I wasn't enjoying workingin a plant.
I had an easy job at first andthen I moved around and so
during that seven year period ofworking for that company it got
(07:07):
worse and worse.
I knew that I did not want tobe here.
I wanted something else.
I wanted to be more expressive.
I want to have moreopportunities to plan and
develop.
And I was working in a plant.
Again, the paycheck was awesome, but I just didn't want to be
there.
Again, the paycheck was awesome, but I just didn't want to be
(07:27):
there.
And so I found myself makingthe decision do I want to stay
here for the next seven years ordo I need to bail out and leave
and quit?
And so during that process, itwas the toughest thing, because
you're going from making thistype of money that you have
never made before.
Imagine going from a collegestudent making an hourly wage to
(07:48):
where you're making a salaryand you're getting paid tons of
money for what you're doing in aplant.
And I had to make a courageousstep, and it was tough.
It was so tough back then.
What do I do?
What do I transition into?
And so, for me, the easiestthing that I can think of was
leaving and going into teaching,and I didn't have a teaching
(08:11):
certificate, and so what I hadto do was go in, and I was
looking at these different typesof ads and they had substitute
teaching.
I was like, oh my gosh, I don'twant to be going from school to
school.
So all the overthinking, allthe fears, all the things that
were happening in my mind wasalmost keeping me stuck.
But I had to take a leap, andwhen I took that leap it was
(08:38):
tough because I did take severalthousands I said tens of
thousands of dollars paycheck.
I went from making this amountof money to going to being a
substitute teacher, where Iwasn't making that much money.
But let me tell you this Ienjoyed when I jumped.
The landing was pretty, prettysoft.
It wasn't as what I thought itwas going to be.
Now, yes, I lost money bymaking the transition, but I
(08:59):
found myself enjoying what I wasdoing, and so that was one of
the first experience I can thinkof coming out of college, and
that experience really helped metransition from when I got
married and me and my wife hadto move from Michigan to Arizona
, and so I was excited about it.
I was excited about it becauseI've done this before and I know
(09:21):
what it's like to leave a joband move into the next
opportunity, and so that was thefirst, really the first time I
can think of that.
I really it was a strugglebecause it was several months,
it wasn't something like acouple of weeks, a couple of
days.
It was several months before Iactually took that leap of faith
into leaving my job.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (09:43):
I love that personal story.
Thank you so much for sharingthat and it's really great in
how you illustrate that.
The motivator of financial gainwas a real one and it was a
great one.
And then you felt like you wereI'm paraphrasing here it sounds
like you felt like you werelosing yourself in just mundane
(10:03):
kind of job and you reallywanted to be able to, like you
mentioned, express yourself andreally feel your value and your
worth, and that was so importantto you that you didn't tie that
to a paycheck so that you madethat transition over to
happiness and joy andfulfillment and that was more of
(10:24):
a priority than the financialaspect.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (10:28):
Yes.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (10:30):
So, thinking about the clients that
you work with, what are some ofthe common fears that people
have that you've heard, whenfacing change?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (10:38):
Yes, the biggest one, and this is
also for me, and coaching reallyhelped me navigate this
particular fear, and it's thefear of failure, something that
actually, if you use it theright way or have the right
relationship with it, it canreally be something that really
(11:11):
helps you think through and takea self-inventory of where
you're at.
And that's the process thatI've used.
But fear of failure has beensomething that I hear a lot of
my clients.
They don't want to launch out,they going back to those three
C's, they're comfortable andsometimes, where they're at,
even their mice.
I'm like you need to launch out, you need to do something
(11:31):
different, you need to grow.
Have you explored theseparticular areas?
And it's but and now we'regoing back to those three C's Is
it, is this convenient this job?
Is it convenient in knowingthat you've got this steady
income coming in?
Or is it just convenientbecause maybe your spouse don't
want you to leave or you don'thave that support?
(11:53):
And so a fear of failure.
You come up with so manyexcuses and all these different
types of things, and so that'sprobably been the most common
one the areas of counseling.
Sometimes it's just I'm feelingI'm losing myself.
I think you had said that I'mlosing my identity, I'm losing
who I am.
I've been attached to this forso long and I don't know who I
(12:18):
am anymore, and so we have to goback a little bit and really
discover where did that comefrom?
What type of stuff did you dealwith as a child?
But then, when we get intocoaching, how can we move you
forward and not let this fear besomething where you're stuck
but you're coming out of it andseeing that, hey, this can be
(12:38):
something that will help me growthrough this change that I'm
experiencing?
I can't even say it for myselfeven now, or I don't.
When I left my teaching job overthe summer and launched my
coaching business, it was atfirst.
It was tough.
I can hear myself having anegative self-talk, a negative
(12:59):
mindset about certain things,but then I came out of it.
I knew, okay, make me go backto my I am statements, and one
of the I am statements I used tosay, uh, I was myself over the
summer was I am attractive notby my looks, but I stand out.
And and as I kept on sayingthat, I got more opportunities,
I got people talking to me aboutcertain things, people ask me
(13:21):
questions, and then I started toreally embrace.
Wow, this is not a place that Ihave to stay in.
I reminded myself I'm here.
And then now it becomessomething that becomes another
encouragement for somebody else,especially for my clients.
I got one particular client andhe's making a transition into
the business arena and I gotsome words that I've been giving
(13:42):
to him.
He's been really encouraged byit and I got some words that
I've been given to him.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (13:45):
He's been really encouraged because by
behind it.
Thank you for sharing that.
I it's so interesting to hearhow fear can play a different
role in kind of everybody'sexperience, and how we all have
to try to use tools to growbeyond it.
Like you mentioned, and I thinkwhen I was working with clients
(14:08):
, oftentimes one of the I'd sayone of the primary concerns I
would frequently hear is I'mworried about this, or they
would use statements like I knowI shouldn't worry, and my
response was always what do youmean?
You shouldn't worry, you shouldabsolutely worry.
Worry is something that helpsyou to think about all of these
(14:32):
potential negative consequences.
So if you're putting on thispositive mindset and what's one
of those buzzwords If you're notallowing yourself to go into
the negative, you're going tocompletely fall apart should
that negative arise, and so Iwould always use the analogy for
my clients it's a lot shorterfall from a hill than it is from
(14:53):
a mountaintop.
So if you're churching yourselfup and you are just like
singing your song and you're thegreatest in the world, nothing
bad can happen because it'spositive vibes.
Only when those bad thingshappen, you're falling from a
mountaintop.
If you go ahead and develop themindset of yes, good is
possible, but negative is alsopossible, and you have those
(15:15):
thoughts and you allow yourselfto.
And another word I would hearfrom clients is I don't want to
go down this rabbit hole.
Go down the rabbit hole.
Let's fully map out this rabbithole.
Go down the rabbit hole.
Let's fully map out this rabbithole and understand what it
looks like and let's developsome pathways that we can take
should these negative thingscome true.
So I completely get, I want toput positivity out there and
(15:37):
will that into existence andabsolutely do that.
But don't put on thoserose-colored sunglasses and only
see the rosy side of things,because now you are limiting
your protection system andyou're limiting yourself from
planning, for these things isrational or irrational is where
(16:04):
we would get into theseconversations, because an
irrational fear is somethingthat has never happened to you
before and it just so happens topop in your head and now you're
worried about it and you'reallowing that to really take
over and limit yourpossibilities.
And those are the ones that wereally want to call out and try
to identify.
Okay, what's going on here,like why are you having this
(16:26):
fear?
Has this ever happened before?
What's making you think thatthis could happen.
And then those rational fearsare the boogers Like those are
the ones that have been provento you that, yeah, they can
happen and they can come trueLosing your job.
If you've been fired before, youcan lose your job, so now
that's not an irrational fear.
(16:47):
So then how do we work throughthat?
We go ahead and we allowourselves the worry and we map
out what are our options.
You get fired tomorrow.
What are you going to do?
Okay, that doesn't work out,what's that next thing?
You're going to try, and wedevelop this plan, and I think
that's another reason I lovethis conversation we're having
so much and the fact thatthere's coaching involved,
(17:08):
because it's very much aboutlooking to the future and
planning for the future, andthat doesn't always have to be a
positive thing.
That can be.
Let's plan for the worst.
Let's go and allow ourselves togo there and think about what
that could look like.
And can we always avoid theworst?
No, but can we go ahead andthink of some strategies to
(17:32):
maybe negate it from being quiteso intense?
Absolutely, we can do that.
Let's see.
Let me think about which is thenext question I would ask.
So how can embracing changereally lead to personal growth
in your opinion?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (17:46):
Yeah , I think you did a good job of
talking about that.
I think, again, going back tothose three C's comfort when you
really start to open yourselfto change and seeing the
opportunities what change canprovide, it does push you out of
your comfort.
(18:07):
I used to and this is probablya common phrase, but I know I
said, I used to say it back backin the day for myself and when
(18:28):
I was at this particularorganization and I used to say,
man, I can't even getcomfortable.
I'm like one one minute.
I'm here and we're changing andwe're comfortable in being
uncomfortable.
And so change pushes you outand it helps you explore again
how I'm feeling about myself,how am I feeling with my wife,
my kids Because they're part ofthat process too.
For those who are married andor just family members, it
(18:51):
pushes you out of your comfortzone.
But then the awesome part aboutthat is that now you're really
you're forced to do somethingdifferent, you're forced to
think differently, you're forcedto make a decision.
I got to make a decision onthis one.
I was dealing with some clientson Tuesday and I said I can't
(19:11):
really help you.
I'm here to give youperspective, but you ultimately
got to make a decision, that yougot to say yes to this or you
got to say no to this, andchallenge them directly.
I let them know how much I lovehim.
I want him to do his best, butI'm challenging you.
You got to make a decision andchange forces you to do that.
(19:33):
It's like renovation You'regoing into a house and you're
taking out certain things,whether it's a room or whether
it's the whole house, and youget to reimagine what the space
looks like.
But it looked like this before,and so you almost have to.
When change, you've got tovisualize something different.
(19:53):
What could this be?
What could this change looklike for me?
What could this change looklike for my marriage?
What can this change look likefor my relationship?
What can this change look likefor whatever that is?
It's really getting into a newspace, and that's what change
does.
Change changes the way you think, the way things, even yourself.
(20:16):
I think self-awareness isprobably a big piece of that is
that you become so self-aware ofwho I am and how I've grown
from, how I used to be.
Fear, failure used to grip me,and I can remember all the way
back from high school.
I felt like I was a pretty goodstudent in high school.
(20:37):
I had aspiration, I hadambition.
But when I moved over tocollege and I little more
different than what I did inhigh school and when I made my
(20:59):
first F or I flunked my firstclass in my freshman year, the
fear of failure gripped me and Ididn't know what to do.
But when you get around acommunity of people that helps
you change, or you get aroundpeople who are forcing you and
pushing you out of your comfortzone, you begin to see, okay, I
can do this, I can.
There's opportunities.
That's going to come out ofthis if I just look at it a
different way and I come out ofmy comfort zone.
(21:22):
So that's.
I think that's probably one ofthe biggest things when you're
embracing change.
It's really pushing you outsome zones that you need to get
out of.
You need to get out of thatspace.
You need to get out of comfortand move to something that's
going to challenge you and Ithink that's the biggest thing I
can really can answer in thatquestion.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (21:41):
And I love how you mention community,
because community is soimportant.
Our environment is so importantfor shaping how we behave and
our outlook and how we'refeeling.
So how can support systems likebrands or professionals help
individuals through change andlike on their journey?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (22:01):
Let me speak for coaching,
especially under the kinder mindplatform Coaches.
When I had my first coach, Ireally felt like I had somebody
that was on my team.
Now, thank God for an awesomewife, thank God for a wonderful
family support.
Sometimes they can talk and saythings to you.
(22:22):
They love you and they're justreally trying to encourage you
to move out to whatever areayou're in.
But a coach man, they're ableto say some things to you and
it's coming from a place of thisperson don't even know me, but
this coach is for you and as yougo through the process of
(22:43):
asking questions, trying to getto know each other and where you
want to go and all those typesof things, a coach really helps
you see further than what youwould see for yourself.
Or a coach will help you seethings that you possibly I
didn't see, that I didn't seehow fear is actually working
with me.
I haven't changed myrelationship.
(23:05):
A coach helps you notnecessarily practice until
you're perfect, but you'regetting to a place where I do
this on a regular basis till Ijust can't get it wrong, because
I'm in the space of living this, living it out, and that's what
I like about the platform thatyou're providing is that not
(23:28):
only do we need people who needcounseling yes, we need people
to.
Definitely we need to go backand deal with some past traumas
that are hindering you frommoving forward.
But what I like about coachingnow that you are getting healed
in this area how can we move youforward?
What are some of the thingsthat you need to set for
yourself?
And I love that with a coach,that's what I love doing for
(23:52):
people is really helping themsee the potential that they had,
because a lot of times, it'sjust the potential.
You have an idea, you havesomething that you want to do.
That's great potential.
That's great.
That's great that you're there.
But how are we going to get youthere?
What is the next steps that youneed to make?
And a lot of times, peopledon't think through those
particular things.
(24:12):
They see the finish line, theysee themselves winning in life,
and that's a great visualizationof having that.
But what's the process inbetween?
And a lot of us don't like theprocess.
The process is I got to get upearly in the morning, I have
these particular rituals, or Igot to exercise, or I got to go
(24:34):
out there and market and learnthis different type of tool in
order to increase man, thatprocess.
That is challenging, but it'sworth it.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (24:49):
What advice would you give to someone
standing at the edge of asignificant change in their life
?
Dennis Bullock, Life Coach (24:56):
Man, I would say jump Now, depending
on the situation.
Again, all situations areunique but it's repelling.
I was in ROTC back in the dayand I had to repel off a wall
and of course they give you allthe equipment, give you ropes
and stuff like that.
They put you on the edge andliterally you have somebody
(25:19):
that's looking at you.
The first attempt that I hadwas off of a 50-foot wall and
then, if you did successfully,did that, then you can start
repelling off the mountain.
A lot of people don't make it tothe mountain because they're so
afraid of that 50-foot wall andthey just don't want to jump.
Their legs are shaking, theirbody's telling them no, don't do
(25:40):
it.
Fear is gripping them and theydon't know what to do.
They just stay stuck, they stayup there and a lot of the time
the coach is saying just jump,just jump.
We got you, we got you theropes, the training that you've
done.
It's not going to help, it'snot going to make you, you're
not going to fall, you're goingto be okay.
(26:00):
But sometimes we don't see it,but what we're hearing.
I'm trying to say to people whoare in that place go ahead and
jump, just experience it,because fear and failure, if it
depends on how you look, it canactually work for you instead of
against you.
If you try something, you falldown, pick yourself back up If
(26:22):
it's not life threatening.
Of course, we're not talkingabout nothing life threatening
here, but we're talking aboutgoing to your next level.
You might fall, you might fail,but that's OK.
There's nothing wrong with that, and I think sometimes our
comforts, our conveniences, thethings that we think that we're
(26:45):
trying to control, sometimes wejust can't control it.
So just jump.
You're not going to be able tocontrol if you don't get no
business the first few months orthe first year, but keep going,
jump, experience, see what it'slike and then, if it don't work
well, transition to somethingelse and learn something new.
(27:06):
But you learned about yourself.
I think John Maxwell says thisit's not failure, it's learning.
Well, you're learning somethingnew.
You're growing still, though,and that's what's so awesome
about that.
So I tell people just go aheadand jump.
Go ahead and experience whatit's like.
Dr. Elizabeth Barlow (27:24):
I love that so much.
Keep growing, keeptransitioning, keep jumping.
Thank you so much for joiningus today, dennis, and providing
your valuable insight andexperience around this topic.
If anyone would like to book atime to meet with dennis, they
can go check out dennis'sprofile at kindermindcoachingcom
(27:47):
and get started on growing andtransitioning and making that
jump today.
Thank you again for your time,dennis.
Dennis Bullock, Life Coac (27:55):
Thank you so much, Dr Barlow.
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