Episode 58: The Science Behind Microschools. A Conversation with Kaity Broadbent.

How do we create learning environments that foster curiosity while helping kids develop real-world knowledge and skills? Since 2018, Prenda has helped open over 1,000 microschools across the US making small, effective learning environment accessible to thousands of families. Microschooling is a rapidly growing educational model, but how does it work? In this episode we'll peel back the layers of Prenda's mission to "empower learners," revealing how a community-focused approach can create learning environments where kids genuinely thrive.

Imagine transforming education from a fear-based model to one that champions intrinsic motivation and real-world readiness. Prenda makes that vision a reality by fostering environments that emphasize choice, while also equipping students with vital life skills and personal accountability.

More about our guest
Kaity Broadbent currently serves as Chief Empowerment Advocate and Head of Marketing at Prenda Microschools. As co-host of the Kindled Podcast she's focused on spreading the word about how microschooling can revolutionize education. In her previous role as Prenda's Head of Learning she helped articulate Prenda's unique microschool learning model ensuring that Prenda students and guides have access to high-quality, effective learning practices. Prior to Prenda, she was an ASHA certified Speech Language Pathologist. She plays "Adventure Kait" in Prenda's free literacy curriculum and she's the mother of 4 very curious Prenda kids.

Connect with Kaity
Follow Prenda on all social outlets @prendalearn
Follow Kaity personally on instagram @kaity_forthekids
Find more information about Prenda at Prenda.com 

Got a story to share or question you want us to answer? Send us a message!

About the podcast
The KindlED Podcast explores the science of nurturing children's potential and creating empowering learning environments.

Powered by Prenda Microschools, each episode offers actionable insights to help you ignite your child's love of learning. We'll dive into evidence-based tools and techniques that kindle young learners' curiosity, motivation, and well-being.

Got a burning question?
We're all ears! If you have a question or topic you'd love our hosts to tackle, please send it to [e-mail]. Let's dive into the conversation together!

Important links:
• Connect with us on social
• Get our free literacy curriculum

Interested in starting a microschool?
Prenda provides all the tools and support you need to start and run an amazing microschool. Create a free Prenda World account to start designing your future microschool today. More info at ➡️ Prenda.com or if you're ready to get going ➡️ Start My Microschool

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
every human child and every human adult is actually a
natural born learner.
Curiosity is innate and so wewere just trying to ignite that,
and we love the word empower.
When we say empower learners,like we want kids to know that
they own their learning and tosee their actions now it's
direct tied to their futuresuccess.

(00:20):
Hi and welcome to the Kindlepodcast, where we dig into the
art and science behind kindlingthe motivation, curiosity and
mental wellbeing of the younghumans in our lives.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Together, we'll discover practical tools and
strategies you can use to helpkids unlock their full potential
and become the strongestversion of their future selves
else.

(00:51):
Welcome to the Kindle podcast.
Today, it's Katie and me and wehave a deep dive for y'all.
And so, katie, what are wediving into today?
Today, we're going to talkabout Prenda's learning model.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
We're going to talk about the underlying principles,
the science behind it, themodel of micro-schooling that
might be kind of a new conceptto some people.
So we're going to talk aboutmicro-schools, why we are so
passionate about micro-schoolsand all of the principles that
kind of like underlie why we aredoing this, and we're going to
dig into some details about whata Prenda micro school looks

(01:25):
like.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
It's going to be great, okay, so what is Prenda's
main purpose?

Speaker 1 (01:32):
Oh, this is such a fun question because I just
remember the meeting where wedecided this.
So Prenda's mission is toempower learners and when we
were first deciding this, we hadthis meeting.
I think there were like 10 ofus and, um, we had all of these
like mission statement kind oflike brainstorms, like ideas up

(01:53):
on the board and we knew it wassomething about learners.
And kelly smith, our founder,was very passionate that he
didn't want a mission statementthat was like long like and kind
of like cliche, like platitudy.
He just wanted like two wordsthat said what we were doing
like super cut to the chase,which is so Kelly and I'm always
like trying to write these likelong, flowery paragraphs and

(02:14):
stuff.
He's like two words, I'm like,okay, two words.
So we originally started we hadlots of words.
What did we want to do forlearners was kind of the table,
the question on the table, andwe ended on empower, because I
think I think a close second waslike cultivate or nurture or or
I think originally we hadcreate learners.

(02:34):
That's what it was.
And, uh, we had this amazingdiscussion about how like we
weren't actually creatinglearners, how every human child
and every human adult isactually a natural born learner,
curiosity is innate and so wewere just trying to ignite that.
And we love the word empowerand Prenda actually the name

(02:58):
Prenda kind of embodies that,because Prenda means it means
literally means gift inPortuguese, and then it also
kind of sounds like aprender inSpanish, which means to learn,
and then you can.
It's also a verb that means tolight or like turn on or like to
spark a fire, like you say,like prendo un fuego, like

(03:19):
you're going to light a fire,and so that is really the main
mission of Prenda and how we seeourselves positioned in the
whole education landscape.
And yeah, so we're here toempower learners.
That's what we do.
So also early on we learned thatthe main way that we were going

(03:40):
to empower learners is not likedirectly to teach them or to
say things at them or to createa textbook or anything like that
.
We kind of drew this picture ofthe child at the center and
then Prenda as kind of like abigger circle around the child,
but there's this kind ofC-shaped I don't know if you can

(04:01):
like imagine this kind of aC-shaped buffer between Prenda
and the child and that is theguide.
And so what Prenda does is weempower adults parents, teachers
, homeschool moms, anyone whowants to help us on this journey
of empowering learners.
We empower them to start microschools, which then directly

(04:21):
impacts the child, and we havelittle touch points with the
child like through our softwareand through the curriculum and
things like that.
But mainly we're designing asystem that will help you or any
like any adult who loves andcares about kids.
If you're a crotchety oldperson that doesn't like kids,
I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 (04:44):
Crotchety old person, like kids I'm sorry, Really
really though.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
There are some people who like just love kids, yeah,
you have to like kids to do thisand like if you don't like kids
, please don't do this.
And that sounds like mean andrude, but yeah.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
So because it's hard to empower a child if you don't
like them oh, it's impossiblebecause all they want to do is
not be with you and so like ifthat is how they feel about
school, like your relationshipwith them is how they feel about
school, is how they feel abouteducation and learning to some
degree right, and so that's abig, a big part of the work we

(05:21):
do is helping adults becomepeople who kids like, because
our traditional kind of way weare with kids it's pretty hard
for a kid to like an adult whenwe're doing all of the things
that standard parenting orstandard educating teaches us to
do, teaches us how to treat achild, how to kind of frame your
relationship with a child.

(05:43):
It makes hard for that child tolike find safety and rest in
your relationship.
And if they can't find safetyand rest in your relationship,
they're going to be in fight orflight, your frontal cortex is
going to be off and the learningcenters of the brain will not
be engaged.
So it's kind of a selfdefeating cycle if you're not
going to be able to show up andlike, be like, just to be able

(06:03):
to infuse that learningenvironment with joy honestly,
yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
So I'm hearing you say that Prenda's mission seems
simple empower learners.
There's a lot that goes into it, because we have to empower
adults who, like children, whocan empower learners.
So what do you see?
So we're empowering learnersand these kids growing up in a

(06:30):
totally different environmentfor education and they're owning
their education and they'relearning what they're interested
in and passionate about.
How do you see that this isgoing to make a change in the
world, like in a broader sense,is going to make a change in the
world, like in a broader sense?

Speaker 1 (06:45):
Yeah, that's a good question.
So if you look at thestatistics on like adult
happiness, you know like we alllike all of us parents and
educators for generations havesaid like what do we want for
our kids?
We want them to be, you know,happy.
We want them to live likemeaningful, fulfilled lives, a
purpose.
And then you look at all of thestatistics about adult

(07:08):
happiness and you see likereally low mental health.
There's only only like 15% ofthe adult population who reports
being like really engaged andlike happy at work, like in what
they're doing.
The people that feel like verycalled to what they, what
they're working on.
Most of us are just in thiskind of pattern where we're
waking up, going to work, doingthings we kind of don't care

(07:32):
about, like doing the bareminimum, coming home watching
Netflix and just like coastingright.
Not, I wouldn't say there's ahigh percentage of people in the
world who are say, there's ahigh percentage of people in the
world who are waking up,motivated, excited to like live
their purposeful, meaningfullife right, and so we really
want to increase that percentage.

(07:52):
And if you look at what we'vebeen doing and you look at the
results, it's like hey, well,what we're doing isn't
engendering that result at all,but we keep doing what we're
doing generation aftergeneration, right?
So Prenda is meant as kind oflike a pattern interrupt to this
whole idea of like what thegoal of life is, and like what

(08:12):
meaning is and what purposes.
It's not just like a cutecurriculum for kids, it's like
it's an entirely differentperspective on how humans like
exist in the world.
And we see that like potential,that curiosity, that potential
passion that either gets printed, like kindled, or like ignited

(08:32):
in childhood or it getssuppressed.
Right, if you are sitting in aclassroom and you're just like
passively receiving andsomeone's like pouring knowledge
into you, you're there actually.
Like what do you do if you'retrying to start a fire?
You don't pour a bunch of wateron it, right, actually, like
what do you do if you're tryingto start a fire?
You don't pour a bunch of wateron it, right, like that's the
worst thing you can do is getall of the wood wet and then you
have to wait for it to drybefore you can start to kindle

(08:54):
it again.
And I think that's so, so trueof what we see of these kids.
They're just like sopping wet,with people trying to just like
pour knowledge on them andexpectations on them and nobody
has helped them find theirunique drive or their intrinsic
motivation and help like,preserve and nurture and protect
that.
The kids that come into Prenda,especially from public school, a

(09:16):
traditional classroom, but alsofrom homeschools and private
schools they're telling us loudand clear that they're not
jazzed about learning right.
We have the data to prove itand essentially they're like wet
wood, right, and they come intoPrenda and then they're they do
nothing for a while.
Some of them, some of them,some of them take off right away
and they're like oh, you'regiving me choices about this.

(09:38):
I can learn about what I wantto learn about.
I can set my own goal.
Some of them are like I'd saylike 70% of them, like are able
to get this pretty quickly.
There's another, another third,30% of them, I'd say that are
kind of like in that wet woodstage where it's just like I
just need to heal and I justneed to like do nothing for a
little bit.
And it's terrifying as an adultbecause you're like I put them

(10:00):
in this new learning environment.
I want to see them running, Iwant to see them like engaged
and there's kind of this likedrying out phase that they have
to go through before they beforeyou can really kindle a love of
learning and like an intrinsicmotivation in them.
But that's like a totallynormal process and we just help
parents and guides like leaninto that, yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:24):
That's such a great analogy.
I have been doing this podcastwith you for a year and a half
and I don't think I've heard yousay that before.
That is so great and gives yousuch a visual of what is
happening and why so many kidsjust have no drive.
I talk to a lot of parents, andespecially, for some reason, of

(10:45):
boys, and it's just they, justthey have no drive, they have no
interest, they have no passionsthey have, and I think this is
part of the problem.
And the circle back.
You talked about the frontallobe going offline.
You said it very quickly, andso the frontal lobe is offline
and the brain's not safe.
Then the brain cannot learn,and so I feel like this is what

(11:10):
we're able to do is providesafety first.
You know the brain can be safeso it can actually learn, and it
takes environment, it takes acaring adult, so all the things
that Pa is creating, which Ithink is really powerful yeah,
can I share a quote here?

Speaker 1 (11:28):
so this is by lr no nost, nost.
She wrote the gentle parent andthis quote.
I just found it the other dayand I really loved it.
She says it's not our job totoughen our children up to face
a cruel and heartless world.
It's our job to raise childrenwho will make the world a little
less cruel and heartless.
And I just love that, becausesometimes when we come in and

(11:50):
say safety first, it feels likewe're like protecting, like
overprotecting kids and likecoddling them and like making
them, making sure they don'thave to deal with hard things,
and it's like no, no, no, that'snot what we're talking about.
With safety, we simply meanthat the child feels safe enough
to take a risk to be wrong, topush themselves right.
Kids in a traditional classroomfeel like their value is on the

(12:13):
line, right If they could bringhome a B minus instead of an A
plus.
Or if they, you know, there'ssome sort of comparison or
competition at school andthey're second place, they feel
devalued and that triggers theirnervous system into thinking
like I need, I need it.
Sometimes it's good.
Like a little bit of stress canlike motivate you.
That's good.
But when that when that stressis chronic and when they can't

(12:35):
escape that stress, there's nosafe place for them to like rest
.
You know, like okay, they're inthe classroom, it's like very
competitive, but then they gohome to rest and it's like Nope,
it's like that here, like getyour homework out.
Like you know, I'm comparingyou to your siblings, and like
there is no rest for these kids.
And you see it in the mentalhealth statistics our kids are
suffering anxiety, depression.

(12:55):
Suicide rates are increasing,increasing in our youth
population, and they're there.
The brain has to have a placeof rest and research shows
really clearly that if the brainisn't at rest, it can't learn.
So we're putting kids into thiscycle where we want them to do
stuff.
And the way that we see kids dostuff is when we motivate them

(13:18):
by fear.
Right, you're going to loserecess, you're going to look
stupid in front of the class.
Like we're using all thesefear-based mechanisms to get
them to do stuff.
And we see like, oh, that's areally effective motivator,
right, like you make a kidafraid.
Like they, they sit in theirseat.
Like it's very effective in theshort term and so yeah, so then
it's like, oh, that's the mosteffective way, like let's bust

(13:39):
out the stickers, let's bust outthe grades, like let's use all
these mechanisms to controlthese kids and push them, and I
think it's done with good intent.
We want kids to excelacademically, we want them to be
excellent, we want them to beum, to be strong and to be able
to handle stressful situations.
Like those are all good things,and I think the message of
Prenda is you don't have to, youdon't have to choose one or the

(14:01):
other.
It's not like I'm going tochoose the mental health of my
kids and like protect them andcreate this safe environment for
them and never challenge them.
Or I'm going to like hand themover and they're going to
compete and they're going tolearn to, like you know, bring
home those A's and like win andall this stuff, but but their

(14:22):
mental health is going to sufferthis kind of like right now in
the world.
It's kind of a dichotomy, right, like you kind of have to pick
one of these things.
But Prenda is like a hypothesisthat there is a middle way
where you can have strong mentalhealth, intrinsic motivation,
love of learning and academicexcellence and like to be able
to help kids handle stress in ahealthy way that doesn't

(14:45):
actually negatively impact theirbrain development, which is
what's happening right now.

Speaker 2 (14:51):
Yes, absolutely.
You said so many things.
So I started talking about thebrain and I couldn't remember
what, where I was going withthat.
And then I was like, oh cause,adults are walking around in a
chronic state of stress.
And then you said the chronicstate of stress rate.
As I was writing that down, Iwas like, oh cause, adults are
walking around in a chronicstate of stress.
And then you said the chronicstate of stress rate.
As I was writing that down, Iwas like, oh my gosh, we're
totally on the same brain.
Um, like we're, we're jivinghere.

(15:13):
Uh, so, but that's the thing.
Like so many adults are walkingaround in this chronic state of
stress and they don't evenrealize it or know.
And so we, what we know aboutbrain science is, if there is
this super high levels of stress, it affects everything.
So what an opportunity we haveright now to impact kids before

(15:38):
they become adults that have,you know, a frontal lobe that
has been offline for so long.
They no longer have drive,motivation, Like you said,
they're just showing up to workso that they can feed themselves
and have a home, and butthey're not living a purposeful
life.
And so what an opportunity wehave to be able to really grab

(16:00):
hold of these kids when theirbrains are so young and fresh
and developing and the brainstill needs stress.
I mean, Ned Johnson talks aboutthis a lot and a certain level
amount of stress is great, butwhen it crosses over to chronic,
guess what?
There is no resilience.
I bet all of us want to havekids who are happy but also who

(16:22):
are resilient and who canovercome challenges.
I read one time in one of DrDan Siegel and Tina Payne
Bryson's books I can't rememberwhich one, maybe the yes Brain
and it was a really smallsection.
It was so transformative for meto go oh my gosh.
This is why we can't just keeppushing these kids harder and

(16:43):
harder and keep throwing moreand more at them is because if
there's chronic levels of stress, resilience doesn't happen.
Everything just shuts down andgoes into a survival state.
And so we want to, like you'resaying, cultivate an environment
that has just enough amount ofstress, but so that resilience

(17:03):
can still happen.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
And that we do stress together, right.
Like research shows that themost stressful thing about
stress is like having to dosomething traumatic or go
through something traumatic orsomething stressful by yourself,
right?
So like we're going to putthese kids in all sorts of
situations in a prenatal microschool where they're like very
stressed right, but we're goingto do that in a way that they
feel like they have a partnerand have a teammate and have a

(17:26):
culture community around themthat's supporting them in that
stress.
Like I was just talking to my11 year old who's been in Prenda
since I think this is his sixthyear or something.
Like he's a Prenda kid throughand through and I'm like what
are you stressed about?
Like what are you worried about?
He's like I don't know, I feellike my life is like good and
happy and like what's the moststressful things?
He's like just getting thoseconquer goals done.

(17:46):
You know, like I'm worried, I'mlike it's totally on his mind
all the time.
He like knows where he is, likehe feels like this
responsibility and there's nosticker, there's no grade,
there's nothing hanging over hishead in the short term to like
make him stress about that.
He just knows that he owns hislearning and that his long term
life results rely on him.

(18:08):
Right?
And so he feels.
When you feel thisresponsibility, it changes how
you think.
It changes how your brainprocesses your life, right?
It's not like oh yeah, I didn'tget my worksheet done, so my
teacher is going to be mad.
It's like I'll do it, so she'snot mad at me.
Like that's a very short termfear based cycle.
Like when he doesn't do aconquer goal, he's like dang it,
you know.
Like I've let myself down, likemy future self would not be

(18:29):
pleased with me, and like I needto like double down and get
this, get this done.
And it's not like I'm I mean,we definitely have conversations
that are like hey, it seemslike you have this thing.
Like how does me support?
Like do you want support?
What does my support look likefor you?
Like writing, for example, it'sreally tricky for them to like
stay on top of their writingassignments.

(18:51):
In their micro school they do apretty rigorous writing program
and my and my oldest hasdysgraphia, so writing's tricky
for him, right?
So like there's already thesenaturally embedded stressors.
Like we don't have to inventstress for kids.
Like the world is alreadystressful, we don't have to make
it more stressful.
Um, I feel like, uh, I just amremembering this moment where

(19:16):
it's like I don't know if thisis going to land or be relevant,
but I remember when I was, Iwas an aunt and I didn't have
any kids of my own and I washelping my little niece like
walk, like she was like learninghow to walk or something like
that, and I was trying to helpher and she fell down and she
started crying and I didn't havekids then.

(19:36):
Like I didn't have kids then,like I didn't know that was like
totally normal and like fine,she was actually totally fine.
But my brother looked at me andshe was.
He was like thanks a lot, katie, or like like said something
mean to me about likeendangering his child or
something like that.
And I just looked at him andsaid I already feel bad.
You don't have to help me feelbad.

(19:57):
And like it's like with kids.
It's like they already feelstressed.
They already want their livesto learn, to work out.
They already don't know what todo.
Like that's.
It is already incrediblystressful for them to like grow
up.
Growing up is just stressful.
Okay, we don't have to makethem, we don't have to invent
things to stress them out, likegrades and assignments and
homework, like all of this stuffis kind of invented to put that

(20:19):
pressure on them.
Like if we just let the naturalway of the world and maybe and
maybe in a past generation itwas a little easier to say that
because life, especially like inAmerica and like middle class
America, is like for a lot ofkids like kind of easy right.
It's like if, like, the food isgoing to be there.
I'm not saying for everyone,but for a lot of people in

(20:40):
America the norm is like kidsare not necessarily and I always
hesitate to say this because Iknow there are so many kids who
don't have this and so that islike one of the natural
stressors, like they do see,like kids, who's really?

Speaker 2 (20:53):
impoverished.
Yeah, yeah, you know what Imean.
There's not as much adversity,for sure these days.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
Then there was like I , I, my, my mom has done a lot
of like family history researchand she's like told me stories
about, like our answer, justlike 100 years ago, like our,
yeah, like my great grandmawanting, like her mom left and
she had to do the laundry.
She was 10 and like doing thelaundry was like boiling a

(21:22):
kettle of water, getting all ofthe family, like family's
clothes for like eight kids andlike putting it in boiling water
and like mixing it around, likedoing all of this super hard
stuff.
But when her mom came home, shehad done the laundry and her
mom looked at her and said, likelike I can trust you to do the
work of a woman like I, you, youare a contributing member of

(21:44):
this like family economy and oursurvival.
And she felt that as a 10 yearold and it's like we don't often
feel that like give our kidsthat much responsibility so they
never feel that accountable, sothat they don't much
responsibility, so they neverfeel that accountable, so that
they don't like their drive fortowards competency and like the
ability to do the work of a manor a woman, like to contribute,

(22:05):
isn't as acutely felt now as itwas in past generations, right
Like like two generations ago,we were sending six 16 year olds
were lying about their age togo to go fight in World War Two
because they, like they, were sobrave.
And I can't even imagine, likewe were just reading old yeller.
Have you read it?
Have you read old yeller?

Speaker 2 (22:24):
uh-huh yes okay.

Speaker 1 (22:26):
So it's like they're on the planes, whatever.
Uh, this boy, this 14 year oldboy, is left to take care of his
family as his dad goes on thiscattle drive.
And I'm like ever at my oldestwho's.
I'm like that's you in likethree years, do you think you
could do any of this stuff?
And it's just like he's justlike no, I couldn't do any of
this stuff.
But also, our life doesn't callfor those skills, right, and so

(22:49):
the the skills that our lifedoes call for, yeah, I do think
he's like three years away frombeing able to like, like to be
able to contribute meaningfullyto the family or to his own,
like savings, encounter, like tothe world, right.
And so I think that, with withPrenda, it's just really, really
important that we stay focusedon, like, the real, the real

(23:13):
education, not the diploma, notthe degree, not the paper that
says you sat in class for longenough, but the real education,
not the diploma, not the degree,not the paper that says you sat
in class for long enough, butthe real skills, the real
character, uh, the real who youare of a person.
I think that is what we, whenwe say empower learners like, we
want kids to know that they owntheir, their learning and to
see their actions.

(23:34):
Now.
It's directly tied tied totheir future success.
We want them to feel thatownership, which is incredibly
stressful.
It's actually way easier to sitin a desk and have someone tell
you what to do all day.
Um, it's different to feel like, oh shoot, I have to like craft
my own path and I have to findmentors and I have to like
really dig in here.
It's a much greater cognitiveload than that we're asking of

(23:55):
these kids and we start askingthem these things when they're
five.
Right, so like, yes, we'recreating safety this is all a
giant tangent around safety.
Like, yes, we're creatingsafety, but like we're creating
a deep competence and confidencein these kids that they can
handle anything that that showsup in their life.
They can handle it Liketactically, they can handle it
emotionally, they can handle itsocially, like all of these,

(24:16):
like all the different ways that, and like skills and like
categories of development, likethey're going to be there.
Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (24:25):
So I do want to walk us through a day in the life of
apprentice student Before we dothat.
You said something that I foundvery profound.
I wanted to pull out is yousaid your son would be go.
Oh, my future self would bedisappointed with me.
I don't think many kids arewalking around thinking about
their future self.
So is this something that inthe print, a micro school that

(24:48):
we talk about?
I mean, I guess I do know this,but can you walk us through
what that future self and justgiving kids that language and
why you start the year off withthat and that be a big focus in
a primary school?

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Yeah for sure.
So a few different reasons.
One, like, if you're listeningto this and you're hearing, like
, like you know my son sayingthat, whatever, you're probably
probably thinking something likeoh, my son would never say that
.
Or like, yeah, like we'rereally far away from that, I'd
say you're actually just rightaround the corner from that.
It's closer than it feels,cause this is, this is a spark

(25:27):
that is in every human heart,and um, so don't give up, is my
first uh sentence here.
And um, so the importance offinding of this concept.
So okay, so the prefrontalcortex, which is the part of
your brain right behind yourforehead here we talked about it
constantly on the Kindlepodcast.

(25:48):
But just to review problemsolving, emotional regulation,
inhibition and, I think, mostimportantly, the ability to
predict the future, to say, like, this thing I'm doing now is
tied to this result.
So I'm going to make thischoice instead of this choice.
Right, that is a veryprefrontal cortex skill.

(26:09):
And that the prefrontal cortex,again, doesn't start developing
until the age of seven, whichwe know, and so, and it doesn't
finish until until the twentiesUsually people say 25, but we
had that neuroscience onscientists on a while ago that
told us that was kind of a myth.
That was just the oldest personin the study, right?
So like they don't even know.
Like, yeah, 25, like you'redone cooking.
Like they don't even know thatit's just kind of the thing that

(26:30):
gets said Um, so it's a reallylong haul, is what I'm saying?
Um, and so a lot of people.
When I talk to them about likedoing purpose work with a
five-year-old, they're like well, they can't even understand
that.
Like their decisions now affecttomorrow, how can you even
expect them to like hold thisconcept of a future self and
work towards it?
Right, and to that I say like ababy doesn't have any concept

(26:56):
of like speech or walking orrunning or anything.
Right, like all they've knownis like you holding them.
Right, they don't know like, oh, someday I'm going to be a
walker.
Right, like they, they see ourmodel of that and they might,
you know they, they have the,the infrastructure in their
bodies and like the, the braininfrastructure, to like to
become that.
But they don't have a cognizantknowledge of that.

(27:17):
Right, they're not sittingthere thinking about walking
someday and like making surethat they're like playing with
all of their fine motor skills,just so, so that they can be
good writers someday, right, butwe know that all of those
things add up and build.
And what do we do?
We model really great walkingaround and we model talking,
even though they can't talk andthey can't walk.

(27:39):
And so when we spend a life,spend an education, a child's
education, modeling to themliving a life of purpose, and
when we spend that life talkingto them about their this idea of
a future self, that, while theprefrontal cortex, while they're
still kind of limited by theirprefrontal cortex, develop
development, it comes a wholeheck of a lot quicker than if

(28:01):
you suddenly start talking tothem about purpose and vision
for their lives when they turn18.
Right, then we get kids who aretotally like overwhelmed,
you're priming the brain, yeahyeah, you know these 18 year
olds that are graduating.
They're like I've never evenreally thought about what I want
to do, like I've just beenjumping through other people's
hoops so long, like anythingthat I want is kind of dead or

(28:24):
like was never even alive, maybewhen I was little little.
But I was quickly schooled intorealizing that all of my hopes
and dreams are like passions,were something to be tabled
instead of something to befocused on and nurtured and
cultivated.
So that is why purpose isreally important, also

(28:44):
accountability.
So we really want to change therelationship.
So, going back to the prefrontalcortex, kids look to adults in
their life, especially parentsand especially teachers.
These are primary caregivers,these are adults that kids spend
hours and hours with every dayand their brain looks to these
adults for safety right.

(29:04):
And so as long as they'regetting those safety cues, like
the prefrontal cortex stays on,like we can learn, everyone's
happy.
But a lot of times in school wecreate a very adversarial
relationship between adults andkids and we have this kind of
kid culture that is very antiadult culture and when two
cultures are at odds, thingsdon't go the right direction,

(29:26):
shall we say.
So any any sort of likelearning's fun or learning's
cool that like we as adults kindof like try to push on to the
kid culture, is immediatelyrepelled.
It's like what do you think iscool?
No, that's the opposite.
Like not learning is cool, likeit's just.
These cultures are justfighting and fighting and
fighting.

(29:46):
And when we can come in andreframe that and say, actually
I'm not here to push anything,I'm here to stand shoulder to
shoulder with you and we'relooking at, what are we looking
at?
We're looking at your futureself and we're looking at the
landscape for your life.
And what do you see?
And what do I see that's sointeresting to us, isn't it?
Where?
What would you like this tolook like and how can I help you

(30:09):
get there?
And now I'm not pushing, nowthey're not pushing against me,
I'm, I've partnered with them.
And that is scary because inorder to do that, you have to
let go of some control.
You know your quiet classroomwith kids sitting in rows.
That's adult culture pushedonto kid culture.
And they're being compliantbecause they know that they are
reliant on us for survival.
And part of that is staying inour good graces.

(30:32):
Right, because if, like, yourancestral brain knows that, like
, if, at any moment a lion showsup, who is the teacher going to
protect?
Probably the well-liked kidwho's obedient and can sit still
and not talk and gets goodgrades.
Right, because that's who theteacher likes.
So your brain knows thatthere's safety, there's internal
safety in being liked andappreciated and valued by adults

(30:55):
.
And we created a world for kidswhere the currency of that
liking is academic performanceand good behavior.
So if you can't show up as akid who can sit still all day,
or a kid who can get an A on themath test.
Our culture has set up that,like, you are at odds with the
adults and the thing that theywant you to do before they will
love and accept you is performand behave.

(31:16):
And if that's a hard thing foryou, because it's
developmentally inappropriatefor you to be able to sit for
seven hours like, you're goingto have this adversarial
relationship which is going tokeep you in that constant state
of fear and seeking, seekingapproval, seeking acceptance
which might drive compliance.
So so, adults that likecompliance and like want those
classrooms, they're like this isgreat, this is gold, how can I

(31:37):
use this Right?
And we're actually likewithholding our relationship to
um to push behavior or umacademic excellence on kids,
instead of like partnering andsaying like what do you see?
What do I see and how can we dothis together?

Speaker 2 (31:54):
Okay when someone thinks of school, because,
especially if you're in the U S,school looks a certain way, and
so micro school you might belike, okay, small school, but
there's still this vision orthis thought process of what
school looks like.
Like you mentioned desks andchairs and the teachers in
charge and but then, as I'mlistening, you are.

(32:16):
It's very counter to all ofthat.
So can you take us through like, what does Apprenda Microschool
look like and what does the daylook like for a student versus
a traditional environment?

Speaker 1 (32:31):
Yeah, so when we say microschool, what we mean and
this word is thrown around microschools are hip and trendy now,
um, when we started this in2018, they were not.
I was the weird mom at the parktalking about this weird new
thing and I had to spend like anhour just explaining what it
was.
And now everyone's like oh,cool Micro school's.
Like where can I find a microschool?
Um, which I love.
That's great.

(32:52):
It's a big success for themovie.
Everyone knows what this is now,but it is defined differently.
I think that you can find microschools or like schools or
entities that are broadcastingthemselves as micro schools,
that are really like smallschools.
Like a hundred kids, 70 kids,right, what we're talking about
is a group of five to 10 kids.
This is like in business, inthe military, like this is the

(33:14):
smallest unit that can be led byone person.
Like in a business, you neverwant to have more than like
eight to 10 direct reports.
Like, once you get past 10direct reports, you're like all
you're doing is managing it.
Just, it just gets reallystressful and there's not enough
relationship to go around.
Essentially, so we get.
So 10 is like our ideal number.

(33:35):
We have micro schools that have12, that have 13 with the older
kids they do well.
Um, I've also talked to theseguys and they're like that is
the limit, like uh, and and soit's like yeah, you know, it
differs.
There's also micro schools thathave.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
yeah, there's micro schools that have multiple
teachers or multiple microschools like within a micro
school.
So I think it's really justlooking at how many adults per
kid Totally.

Speaker 1 (33:59):
It's like a ratio thing, for sure, but there's
also kind of like like I couldput 60 kids in a room and I
could put six adults in thereand keep a one to 10 ratio.
But the most important thing isthat every child knows who their
one person is right, they'rebuilding a relationship.
It's not like adults are justmingling, and I think other

(34:19):
micro schools really take thatapproach, and so I think it's
really important that, likethere's a mama duck and she's
got 10 ducks and those ducksknow that she, that she or he,
is there for them, she is theircoach, she is their guide, she
is, she is there for them, sheis the one investing a lot of
time and energy into theirrelationship, she's the one that
has the emotional energy as amicro school guide maybe not as
a teacher, because the like hatsthat we ask teachers to wear

(34:41):
just like astronomicallyoutrageous.
So how can we, how can we helpkids?
Like like people will come inand they'll be like I can handle
more than 10 kids.
I'm like, yeah, you can handlethem using these techniques that
are really bad for learning andfor their brain.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
You can manage them, you can manage them right.

Speaker 1 (34:58):
And I'm like it's not you I'm worried about.
Actually, I'm worried about thekids, which is not.
I mean, you'd think that asystem of education would be
really concerned with kids, butit's really really not at the
core, kids do not have a voicein the education system and they
they don't get listened to,they don't get a vote Right, and
so adults end up making a lotof decisions that are good for

(35:21):
adults, and that's just the waythe world is.
I don't think that's like illintention, it just is.
But I think every kid in amicro school needs to have a
direct connection to an adultthat has enough energy and
mental resource to like be therefor them and to actually
communicate that safety, thosesafety cues to the brain that
the brain is looking for, to beable to satiate that need so

(35:41):
that that child can learn Um.
So when we say micro school, wemean five to 10 kids.
Um, 12,?
Sure, three, okay.

Speaker 2 (35:49):
So like, take us through, yeah, take us.
Take us for a day in a life,then, of what a student.
So we have five to 10 kids, wehave a really loving, caring
adult who likes kids, and sowhat else?
What?
What happens in a day whenevera student goes to a Prenda micro
school?

Speaker 1 (36:07):
Yeah, so I, prenda.
Prenda is an organization thathelps people start and run
amazing micro schools.
That's like our internal, likevision.
Um, we all say we like, we canall repeat that that's what
we're doing.
Um, which means that not everymicro school is the same, right,
so every micro, every prendamicro school it's not like a
little cookie cutter school,like you have to get to know

(36:28):
that guide specifically.
That guide's going to bring alot of different energy,
different focus.
But if they're using theprendaa model, I can tell you
what that looks like.
But you're gonna have to talkto every, every unique
individual guide, which isperfect, because in a school you
don't really like, if you maybehave a good relationship with a
teacher or with a principal,you can kind of like get your

(36:49):
kids that teachers you want,here and there depending, but
this, like as a parent, you cancompletely vote with your feet.
It's like, oh yeah, like, as aparent, you can completely vote
with your feet.
It's like, oh yeah, like thatguide didn't like the vibe,
didn't like something else, likeI'm going to go find a
different guide.
Uh, so that creates aneducational marketplace where
the incentives are lined up for,um, like guides to take care of

(37:10):
parents and kids, which isperfect because that's like kids
we want at the center.
Who is the greatest advocate fortheir child?
The parent.
So if we create a system thatincentivizes like kids
respecting and um, cultivatingrelation, respecting parents and
their choices about their kidsand cultivating those
relationships, so that guideunderstands that family, and

(37:33):
then only asking that guide todo that for 10 families, if, if
nobody's siblings a lot of timewe'll get like little siblings,
so you'll really have like likesix parents you know you're
building relationships with andstuff.
So that is a really importantpiece.
I'm on a tangent.
Sorry I only speak in tangents.
I'm learning.
Everything I say is a tangent.

Speaker 2 (37:55):
So the model?
Tell us the model.
So when a guide goes throughtraining or goes through and
says, okay, I want to run amicro school and I want to use
the Predna model, what are theygetting what?
How are they encouraged to setup the environment?
And I mean, we've talked aboutlittle things like future, self

(38:17):
and connection and safety and,you know, flexible environment.
But what else can we talk about, Like the actual learning modes
and what does a day look like?

Speaker 1 (38:29):
Sure.
So it's all based around kindof three main principles
Empowerment, maybe fourprinciples, the idea of
empowerment.
So we have Prenda camp.
Camp stands for communityautonomy, mindset and purpose,
and this is something that theydo during a time of the day we
call connect mode.
It's like 15 to 20 minutes inthe morning where we all come
together and Prenda provideslike journal prompts,

(38:51):
discussions, videos, activities,games that help you build
culture and help help.
It helps kids build the skillsof an empowered learner.
It helps them understand whatautonomy means, what
accountability is, how we canmanage our thoughts and our
emotions and how we'recompletely responsible for those
things and we're not looking toothers to like make us happy or

(39:13):
to like not do things that bugus.
It's like everything, like I'mfully responsible for myself
internally and we teach kids theskills to manage all of that.
We this is where we do a lot ofthat future self-work, but
that's that's the culture thatwe're trying to build.
And then the rest of the day isreally focused around either
mastery or inquiry, and so forour mastery and inquiry it's not

(39:36):
like it's mastery time, it'sinquiry time, but the learning
modes, which I'll talk about ina minute that, like mastery and
inquiry is like driventhroughout everything that we do
.
There's also another, if youwant to like understand like the
pedagogy better, like Prenda isclosely aligned with something
called constructivism, uh, whichis like a Jean Piaget thing.
Um, I can like post some.

(39:56):
I don't want to go all intothat right now, Then you'll know
how nerdy I am Like trying tolike create this facade of like.
Not that nerdy, um, but I'mprofoundly nerdy embrace it
educational pedagogy, um, soyeah, so mastery, okay.
So we have.
We talked about connect mode.
The next part of the day isconquer mode.

(40:17):
So every kid comes in they takean adaptive diagnostic test in
math and reading.
This is not a stressfulstandardized test like kids are
accustomed to.
It is actually optional.
So if you don't want your kidsto take it, just say like I
don't want my kids to take thetest and we'll be like okay,
we'll try to do our best to.
The goal of this time is to findevery child's learning frontier

(40:37):
in um, in standards educationspeak.
That's called their zone ofproximal development.
This is a concept developed bylove by Gatsby Um, and it's the
idea, it's like the Goldilockszone of where you're learning it
Things.
Something isn't too easy, butit's not also like I'm on the
floor crying too hard, but it'sat that challenge level where I

(41:00):
have to be engaged.
My brain is a little stressedso I'm focused, but I can do it
if I have a little support.
Right.
So we want to find that levelfor everyone and that is so
wildly different.
Like in the traditionalclassroom we have 2530 kids all
learning in the same group,listening to the same same

(41:21):
lesson out of the teacher'smouth, who can only deliver one
lesson at a time, right, andthen she's asked to
differentiate her education, todifferentiate her education or
differentiate her teaching tokids who maybe are a little more
advanced or a little bit lower,and so you kind of get these
like mid middle, teach themiddle and then differentiate
for your like high kids and yourlow kids, and so now we have

(41:42):
three levels of differentiation,which is really hard to
accomplish as a teacher, very,very, very tricky, very
stressful.
You have to plan all sorts ofdifferent lessons.
You have to create groups thatrotate.
You have to put kids in abilitygroups where kids now know like
oh, like I'm really smart atmath and this other kid is not.
Like gives them social fodderfor like judgment and comparison

(42:02):
.
It teaches kids to havelimiting beliefs about who they
are and what they can accomplishbecause they're like a slow
reader.
They have a label now that sayslike I'm not good at this, and
that's stressful for the brainand inhibits learning and all
sorts of kinds of ways thatactually stick with you your
whole life or you have.

Speaker 2 (42:19):
or you have students like I was, I remember, because
I was put in the middle groupfor reading.
I, you know, didn't have anysupport at home, or no one was
like reading to me at home, andnot that they did it on purpose
or anything, I just didn't havethat, and so where I was
learning, everything was atschool.
So I was probably right ontrack with what I was exposed to
.
But I was put in the middlegroup and I I stole.

(42:42):
I stole my book, um, fromschool and I took it home.
I probably still have it in mydad's attic because I was
determined to get to that topgroup.
So then you have students thatare like, ok, my worth is if I'm
in that top reading group, andthen others that just don't care
, and then they could care, youknow.

(43:02):
So it really defines who theyare.
It's such a young age I was six.

Speaker 1 (43:08):
Oh, that's heartbreaking.
But, like from the teacher'sperspective, it's like great,
our system is working perfectly.
Adrienne is so driven, right,yeah, but she's driven by fear.
And then, to those kids whoaren't driven, it's like well, I
tried once and I didn't get thesticker.
This is a game that I can't win, that I'm forced to play every
day, and so I'm like out, right.
And so you have all sorts ofdifferent reactions to this, to

(43:29):
this setup.
But at Prenda our goal is forevery child to spend all of
their learning minutes at theirlearning frontier.
So in that differentiatedclassroom, even if teacher's
doing that well, you're onlygetting a limited number of
minutes at your learningfrontier, right, you still have
to sit through the lesson youdon't understand or that you
already know, and then you haveto wait for the teacher to dose
you with whatever your learningis for the day.

(43:50):
And we think that's a big wasteof time.
And when I say waste of time inthe classroom, what I actually
hear myself say in my brain iswe're wasting their childhood.
They could be out playing, theycould be out, they could be
doing something else.
We're just making them sit inthis desk and, if they don't
show up to that, to that desk,like there are repercussions,
parents, like there are truancylaws, like all sorts of things.

(44:12):
There's a very strong hand offorce here that says you have to
sit in the seat and if we'renot making good use of those
minutes, like that's on us as asystem, we need to answer for
that.
Um, so at prenda, the goal is.

Speaker 2 (44:23):
what does it look like?

Speaker 1 (44:25):
So you come in, you take the adaptive diagnostic
test, we get a level for you inmath and in reading, and these
are like mastery subjects, um.
And then we match you with acurriculum.
There's like a suite ofcurriculums that you can choose
from.
If you, if a parent has acurriculum that they like, that
the guide is willing to workwith, um, that can also be
incorporated.
We're not like the Prendapolice saying you can only learn

(44:46):
from these tools.
We do not believe that there'sa one right tool, like one right
, like there's no one size fitsall right.
So we want to maintain aflexible system and I guess we
want to build a system thatassumes the need for flexibility
instead of like, like in.
I used to be a speech languagepathologist, so I worked in the
special education world.

(45:06):
Like man, the hoops thesepeople have to jump through to
get a special accommodation isjust crazy.
Um, so Apprenda, it's like yes,you need that accommodation.
Great, like, we can do that andwe can do that for everyone.
Right, because we have these,these small groups that are
really focused on individualneeds.
So that's Conquer Um, and thenthey set a goal and they set a

(45:29):
purpose for that goal.
So every student has a littledashboard that they see.
We call it progress mountain.
Here's where you're at.
Maybe you're two years ahead,maybe you're three years behind,
we do not care.
We are learning where the datasays you need to learn.
If you try that level and it'slike too easy or too hard, we
will adjust the level.
If you try a tool, a curriculum, and it's like, oh, this is
really hard for me to learn thisway, this is being explained in

(45:52):
a way that makes sense to me.
Let's switch your tool Likethere's just, it's just packed
with flexibility and options sothat we can accommodate easily
for every, every child's needs.
Um, so then they set along-term goal and then our
software breaks down that longterm goal into daily commitments
.
And so you come into theclassroom or the micro school
and you set a daily commitmenttowards that goal that you have

(46:15):
chosen with your parent and withyour guide, and that you've
gonna have to stay in the recess.
It's like, oh, what would yourfuture self think?
Like, what is your, what's yourpurpose?
Like, have you come todisconnected from your purpose?
Like, is that not veryimportant for you today?
Like, is there some otherpurpose that is more important
today.
Like we're having that kind ofa conversation instead of like,

(46:41):
hey, you're not going to getyour sticker or I'm going to
want to stay in this adult'sgood graces, I need to perform
and behave right.
So we use different mechanismsin Conquer to help kids really
unearth their purpose and tofind their intrinsic motivation.
That being said, like noteveryone comes to the Prenda
environment ready to learn, likethat right.
Like you need to have that kindof like wet wood dry out period

(47:04):
where it's like I don't know,I've never thought about what I
want to do or what I want mylife to be about and that's
going to take me six months tokind of figure, like start to be
able to think about that, right.
And so there might be a periodof time where you're just like
doing math for math's sake andlike there are different ways we
meet kids where they're at umto help them feel excited and
motivated to learn, whilethey're discovering their
purpose and their intrinsicmotivation.

(47:25):
It's not a light switch, it'smore like the sun rising happens
slowly, it happens differentlyfor every kid.
So that's Conquer After Conquer,we move into our inquiry parts
part of the day.
We call it collaborate mode,where this is like a whole group
experience, where we're mostlyfocused on science and social
studies and we have all sorts ofdifferent activities and things

(47:46):
, challenges that kids dotogether that sharpen their
problem solving skills, theircommunication skills, their
leadership skills, their teambuilding skills, while they're
discovering all of fascinating,truly fascinating, amazing
things about history and science.
Instead of like, open your page, open your book to page 30.
Today we're learning about theRenaissance Itissance.
It's like, no, like, all ofthis has to start with kid

(48:08):
questions.
Like we teach the guides thatthe question is the curriculum,
and we have a lot of like I callthem on ramps into learning
where it's like oh, this thinglooks cool.
This, this like picture inprint world is interesting to me
and I'm going to choose toexplore that and we're curating
all these resources so they'regetting really high quality
content, but they're not beingsat down and read to like

(48:30):
through a textbook.
Right, it's like this discoveryprocess.
We follow the inquiry cycle.
You can Google that.
We actually have a really greatepisode on that with Trevor
McKenzie, but that's a really,really good deep dive into
inquiry.
In fact, his book is calleddive into inquiry and I love it.
I love all of his work.
Um, so that's collaborate modeand then create mode is the last

(48:52):
part of our day, where it's allhands-on, project-based
learning.
And this is where thatconstructivism piece really
comes into play, where we'redoing real things with our
learning.
Um, sometimes I will see, I'llgo in and I'll read the kids
purposes, um, when they settheir goals, and I'll see like I
want to be able to do math sothat I can solve math problems.
It's like, oh, whoops, that'snot a purpose, right.

(49:14):
Like that's, that's like a loop, like we're not just like I as
a functioning member of ofsociety, I'm not just sitting at
home doing math problems that Icreated for myself to do, like
that's not part of being human.
Solving a problem, a real worldproblem with math, is what we do
, why we do math right.
And so I even see thisevolution in kids as they set

(49:34):
their purpose to be like, oh, Iactually want to be able to
solve this.
I see this problem in the worldand I want to be able to help
contribute to that problem, andI see that my third grade math
will lead me to eventuallylearning the math that I need to
understand, like engineering,to like be able to go solve that
problem in the real world.
So we really want to want todraw them out in that way and
that we start doing that increate mode with hands on

(49:56):
projects, and we help them finda real problem to do a real
thing in their community topresent to an authentic audience
and to make their learning real, relevant and meaningful to
them.
So that's the whole shebang getconnect mode, conquer mode,
collaborate mode, create mode.
That's.
That's a Prenda day.
I did it.

(50:16):
I answered your question.

Speaker 2 (50:19):
You did it.
So what are some of Prenda'sweak spots Like?
What are some things thatPrenda is improving upon?

Speaker 1 (50:29):
I love this question because I'm like a total
perfectionist and while there'slike this analogy of like well,
we're building the airplanewhile we're flying, it's just
like that's a stupid idea, likeno one should ever get on an
airplane that's not built.
But that's how this thing, howthese things work, and it's not
like we have this kind ofperception it things work and
it's not like we have this kindof perception.

(50:49):
It's like here, take my child,no, don't.
So I have this like impulsive,like we just need to make
everything perfect all the time,but like that's not how things
are created in the world.
And your public school, likedown the street, is also not
like that.
It's not fully baked, likethey're still figuring things
out, they're doing experience,they're they're trying to to see
what works, and things likethat, and I think that's good.
I think that I want the peoplethat are in charge of education

(51:11):
to be leaning into new ideas, toto be trying things and to be
finding what works instead ofbeing like, well, this is what
we've done, this is what we'vealways done, right.
Like the world is changing andwe need to change along with it
and help prepare kids for aworld that, like, doesn't even
exist yet.
So, like, if we're not leadingout by saying, like what if we
tried this?
And let's, let's take this newapproach?

(51:32):
Like what are we even doing?
How?
How are we supposed to raisekids that will do that in 30
years if we're not modeling thatto them now?
So, um, I will be the first totell you that Prenda is not
perfect, but, um, I think theintent and like the principles
are pretty darn close to perfect.
Not that we're not open to morelearning, but we've had, we've,
we've helped open over athousand schools and we've had

(51:56):
thousands of kids come throughthe program.
Which is not to say we'veempowered and won the hearts and
minds of thousands of kids.
It's that we have lots oflearning data points like oh,
that didn't work and this didwork, and so we have a lot of um
data and experience to stand on.
And so places where Prenda Ithink can improve um, just in

(52:16):
our like process, what we'reasking guides to do is is
complicated and I think there'sa lot we can do in that.
Like guide development processto really like we we do a lot of
work with our guides.
Like guide development processto really like we do a lot of
work with our guides, but it'snot like as open and go as I'd
like it to be right.
There's kind of like somefriction in that process that I

(52:37):
think that Brenda could work onerasing for for potential guides
to help them better learn whatto do and how to do it.
I think there are a lot ofimprovements in our software um,
and just the depth of ourcontent can improve and I'm
super excited, um, for like theplans we have with Prenda and
like all of the different thingsI see coming together, uh, in

(53:02):
the next like two to five yearsto be like really, really
impactful in the education space, doing things very differently
than most, most people do them,and I'm sure there's lots of
learnings and and excitingtwists and turns that we'll go
through Is the biggestdifference is, for example, when

(53:22):
my son was at a traditionalschool and right from the
beginning, first day, or when wejust met the teacher, she
showed me the red, yellow, greenbehavior chart that she uses in
her classroom.

Speaker 2 (53:36):
I said please do not use that with my child.
He's a green kid.
He's going to be stressed outabout it.
My middle child's a yellow kidand my oldest is a red kid.
I already know like what colorthey are.
Please don't use this.
And she told me well, I have to.
And so I think the biggestdifference with Prenda, what I
noticed when my kids were in amicro school, is, as a parent
and, honestly, as a guide, youhave more of a voice.

(53:57):
I have seen so many guides havereally great ideas and they
come to Prenda and guess what?
Prenda goes?
You know what.
We're going to listen to youbecause this is a really good
idea and it's going to impactmore people.
In a school environment wherethere's all the bureaucracy of
school, it's way harder to makechange and way harder to take

(54:20):
those weak spots and go okay,this isn't working well, let's
change it.
Whereas at Prenda, I feel likethere's a lot, more, honestly,
room for empowerment from theguide standpoint as well as the
parent standpoint, and becauseeach guide runs their own micro
school and has the autonomy torun it how they want, then they

(54:43):
can really listen to the parentsand cultivate an environment
that works well for each andevery one of their students.
Way easier to do becausethere's only five to 10 students
than thousands of studentsunder one building.

Speaker 1 (54:57):
Yeah, I love that.
That's so perfect.
Yeah, so, just along with yourquestion, weaknesses, like I
think that helping peopleunderstand the underlying
principles of what we're doingis really important.
That's a big focus of theKindle podcast, right, because,
like, we can create curriculum,we create systems and stuff, but
until, like I see it in theeyes of guides, they're like,

(55:18):
okay, I'm doing this stuff.
But when they get it like whatthey're doing, they become very
passionate and very effectiveadvocates for student autonomy,
student mastery, very passionateand very effective advocates
for student autonomy, studentmastery, student inquiry, all of
these things.
And that is like really what,what turns a micro school into
like a nice environment for kidsto an impactful, empowering
environment for kids, and so Ithink that that's something that

(55:39):
I'm really going to be focusingon the next like two to five
years is like helping helpingadults understand the underlying
principles even more than we donow.
I think we are doing a prettygood job now.
I want to do like an amazing,excellent job there, so that
would be my other like thing toimprove.

Speaker 2 (55:53):
Yeah, it makes me think of our very first episode
of season two with Julia,because she came from teaching,
was a teacher in a really youknow rough school district and
she said, even though she knewhow to teach and she could
manage all these kids and hadall these tools and things, she
said it took some time to get tothis place.
I can tell you, though, youwalk into her micro school and

(56:16):
it is pure Prenda magic.
She is following the model to aT, but then she has autonomy
within that to make it her own,cause she is just embodies this
very like ethereal presenceabout her that she's able to
infuse into her environment.
But she is following the modeland, you guys, it works.

(56:37):
It is just so incredible whenyou walk into her micro school
and see these kids truly beingempowered.
Love it, okay.
So, katie, who is Prenda forand how can they find Prenda?
How can they sign up?

Speaker 1 (56:53):
Prenda is for everyone, honestly, but for kids
it's for K through eight kids.
Sorry, we don't do high schoolyet, but as far as, as far as
becoming a guide, anyone canbecome a guide.
You do not need to have aformal education background.
If you love kids, are mildlytech savvy and willing to learn,
like we can help you run amicro school.

(57:14):
Um, family wise.
This is for parents who wanttheir kids to think for
themselves, uh, want their kidsto be able to, like, develop
their own personhood and andwant to put their kids in an
environment that is aligned totheir family values, because
that parent is going to have areally strong voice into the

(57:36):
culture of that micro school andworking as a partner with that
guide.
Um, guide wise.
It's for people who want tohave an impact with kids and
maybe you're a teacher, maybeyou're a homeschool parent,
Maybe you've never thought aboutdoing anything in the education
space, Maybe your students arein public school and they're
just not thriving and you wantto be a part of that solution,
Like any of those.
If you're in those categories,like we are built for you, Um,

(58:00):
and I.
That being said, like I don'tthink Prenda is the only kind of
micro school you can run right.
Like Prenda is one approach tolearning.
I think there are many reallyreally valid and beautiful
approaches to learning.
So if you are, if you agreewith the idea that kids, kids

(58:22):
deserve to love school and thatkids enjoy school and thrive
more when we give them morechoices, like choices within
guardrails, Um, if you love theidea of mastery, if you think
mastery makes sense instead oflike, let's just make sure all
the nine-year-olds know aboutwhales by week three.
Like, uh, let's get off the kindof like curriculum schedule
that's been given to us bypeople far away.
Like, our kids can still haveall of the right skills.

(58:44):
We can do that in a mastery andinquiry focused way.
If those ideas make sense toyou, like, go check out the
website.
Go like read our blog, listento more kindled episodes.
Like find more, find out moreabout this idea Prendacom, you
can find all of those things.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
Awesome.
This was a great deep dive intothe Prenda model and we just
learned even more than what it'slike in the day in the life.
I just love listening to you.
I'm like, oh my gosh, I again.
We have been doing this podcastfor some time and I've been
working with you for four yearsand still like, oh my gosh,
that's so good.
I'm writing this down, I'mgoing to put it on my wall.

(59:21):
Uh, so anyways, thank you fordiving into what Prenda is and
the change that we are seekingin the world.
So that is it for today.
We hope you enjoyed thisepisode of the Kindle podcast.
If it was helpful to you,please like, subscribe and
follow us on social at Prendalearn.
If you have a question youwould like Katie to address, you

(59:44):
just need the email podcast atprendacom.
You can also go to our websiteand sign up for our weekly
newsletter, the Sunday spark.

Speaker 1 (59:53):
The Kindle podcast is brought to you by Prenda.
Prenda makes it easy for you tostart and run an amazing micro
school built on all of the ideasthat we talk about here on the
Kindle podcast.
If you want more informationabout becoming a Prenda guide,
just go to prendacom.
Thanks for listening andremember to keep kindling.