February 11, 2025 • 64 mins
A bullsye often has a center square (sometimes black) that represents the ultimate "hit" in archery. From a spiritual perspective, what does it mean to "hit the black?" Especially, what does this mean in light of "hitting the red" of outer circles for some time? Join Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino and Julie Harvey for a conversation about what it means to hit the mark from a spiritual perspective, especially when that hasn't been the case for a long period of time. (Intro and Conclusion Track "Ready to Rock" by Yvgeniy Sorokin, https://pixabay.com/users/eugenemyers-40510887/. Righteous Pen Publications Track "Inspirational Background" by AudioCoffee, https://pixabay.com/music/corporate-inspirational-background-112290/.)
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Are you a writer who wants to become an author?
(00:06):
The righteous pen publications group is waiting for you with packages and options available
for every situation, including self and full publishing services and nine different
imprints, both religious and secular.
This company has the power to take your manuscript and turn it into the book you've always
(00:31):
wanted.
Visit their website at righteouspenpublications.com.
The righteous pen publications group, find your voice with us.
Welcome to Kingdom Now, the podcast featuring Faith with an Edge, as we celebrate the Kingdom
(00:53):
of God within you.
I am your host, Dr. Lee Ann Marino, apostle, author, podcaster, professor, and theologian,
and founder of Spitfire Apostolic Ministries and all the works that go along with it.
I am excited to share this program with you as we explore the ins and outs of Counterculture
(01:13):
Christianity Press as you live out the Kingdom of God in your everyday life.
And to learn more, visit my website at www.kingdonpowernow.org.
And now, our program, which features a variety of formats here, just for you.
Interviews on a variety of relative topics, teaching and preaching proclaimed everywhere
(01:35):
from my North Carolina studio to Sanctuary and Beyond.
And powerful insights here for now as we turn the world upside down everywhere we go.
[Applause]
Well, good morning, good afternoon, good evening.
(01:56):
Happy whatever time of day is wherever you are.
And to our listeners in name of country.
Switzerland?
In Switzerland, we say, "Bonjour."
We hope that whatever time of day is when you are listening that you are having a good
one.
And welcome you to this edition of the Kingdom Now podcast.
(02:16):
And I am your host, Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino here as the Spitfire serving as the voice of Counterculture
Christianity where we feature the theme of faith with an edge.
And if you'd like to learn more about the world of Counterculture Christianity, feel free
to visit my website at www.kingdonpowernow.org.
Hitting the black.
If anybody's ever tried archery, you know that when you've got a bullseye, there's a red
(02:40):
part and then there's a black center which is like the ultimate hit that you can get.
What happens when you finally reach that point, especially after many years of maybe hitting
other places on the target?
And does God have a purpose for us when we're not hitting the exact center mark?
So my guest today is Julie Harvey from Adelaide, Australia, who's going to introduce herself
(03:03):
and not say that she's ordinary.
Well, yeah, I don't know what to say.
I never do.
Every time you introduce me, I think, oh my God, I'm going to say no.
I drink out of an AC/DC glass.
Oh, you have to take a picture and send it to me.
(03:25):
I drink my iced coffee with AC/DC in the mornings.
I am okay with it.
Look, now that sounds really interesting.
Absolutely.
Yeah, it makes me sound cool at least.
Would you say edgy, you know?
Yeah, that's right.
(03:45):
Yeah, a lot of, we all know that a lot of religious people would look down, would frown upon
that.
Oh, goodness.
Yeah, they're just jealous because they're not having coffee with AC/DC anyway.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
I was going to say, I've got to, I'm sorry, I'm just me.
(04:07):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just muddling along.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Look, at least you get paid for that.
Yeah, but I'm cleaning in.
Yeah, I'm cleaning in.
I don't get paid to do my cleaning anyway.
(04:27):
I may neither, not this house.
I could go on a tangent.
And whine to you about not doing my own house.
Yeah, we're not getting it.
We're like it.
Anyway, you were the one who came up with the title, "Hitting the Black."
Yeah, yeah.
And I'm going to let you explain to everybody where we're going to go with that.
(04:51):
Okay, well, what I felt, like, because I've been through recently, I don't know, I reckon
the whole year, really.
And even last year was, last year was hard.
So let's put it this way.
2022 was hard.
2023 was harder.
And I sort of thought maybe 2024 would be an easier year.
(05:15):
Maybe it would, you know, be a little bit, a little bit.
Honestly, it got harder.
And I thought, oh my goodness, how can this be, you know?
Like, it was, and I just found that this year, and we're coming to the end of it now, I've
just found that everything felt like it was going wrong this year.
I mean, everything, you know, every single thing.
(05:38):
So, but what God recently, I came out of something recently, and it was like, oh, well, I was,
I was set free from something recently that had been really for the last five or, yeah,
probably four or five years had been, I'm not going to go into any detail, but it had just
(05:59):
been really like, it had just caused a lot of blockages, I guess you could say, like, yeah,
and I couldn't see clearly why.
I didn't understand why, probably because there was lots more to it.
It was pretty in depth.
And I had to go through a lot of hard things.
(06:20):
Sometimes you've got to get to the root of problems.
You've got to go through some stuff that you thought was dealt with.
We all go through, I guess, stages like that.
But recently, come out of it probably, I don't know, about six weeks ago now, maybe less,
a month to six weeks.
And since then, I've really only been in recovery mode spiritually, getting my, I don't know,
(06:46):
mojo back, is that a way of saying it?
Yes, I still feel when I think about it, I still feel a bit drained when I think about everything
that's been happening.
I'm not quite out of it yet, but getting there as far as other things are concerned.
But what God showed me is my whole Christian walk.
(07:07):
If I look back, it's been nearly 30 years of being a Christian.
And what God showed me is that he's always allowed to, even when I was hitting the bullseye,
and I was thinking that I was hitting my whole walk with God, I've really only been hitting
the red is what he showed me.
Now, the red is still the bullseye.
(07:28):
The red is still worth a lot of points.
But what he had been sort of doing with me was stripping that away.
And I couldn't, I always, I felt like the last 12 months, I haven't been hitting the
mark.
I have been, and no matter what I did, I couldn't get back to sort of where I was with God
(07:53):
as in the way he spoke to me, the way he showed me things, the way, it was like I was getting
revelations still the way I did, but it still did not feel right, if that makes sense.
It didn't, I don't know, I guess you could use the word 'satisfy' me, the way it once
(08:13):
did when God would show me certain things, and so I'd have the information there, like I
know, I knew why things were happening a certain way, but there was all that bit of doubt there,
but it wasn't because what God was showing me was wrong.
It was just that somehow it wasn't pulling everything together the way it used to.
(08:34):
And that was because he said to me, you're hitting the red and not the black.
And I thought, wow, so I've grown to the point in my Christian walk where it's imperative
now, I start to hit the black.
And I'm 30 years into this and I think, oh my goodness, I mean, I know I haven't been a
(08:57):
perfect Christian and I haven't, but who is?
No one?
And people say they are, have been working perfectly with the Lord for 30 odd years, are they
lying?
Yes, they are.
They're lying because we all fall short, you know, and if they think they are and they're
(09:18):
all that, then that's probably just some pride talking and maybe they need to pray.
I think it's probably not as close as what they think.
Pretty hard.
So I guess that's what God's been showing me, hitting the red is not satisfying you anymore,
it's not that it's not real and it's not correct and it's and it's not lining up at even
(09:46):
to say, because people might say there's a difference between God's submissive will and
God's perfect will.
And I could say, well, maybe hitting the red is God's permissive will.
I mean, I could go into a teaching on that, but no, no, no, that's not what God's saying.
He's saying, no, the red is still the part of the bullseye.
(10:08):
It's still God's perfect will.
But there's even deeper, there's a center and I guess it's more centered in Christ, I guess,
I don't know.
I mean, I know I'm not perfect and I do lots of things wrong, but maybe that's part of it.
I don't know, but recently my daughter's been through a lot of struggles with school
(10:33):
and I only just sort of got this the other day that I, I'll even last night, I was sitting
there thinking about, I'm thinking, well, you know, there's a shortfall between what they
can teach kids in a mainstream school and what kids with special needs.
I mean, I mean, there are special schools, don't get me wrong.
(10:55):
I never felt like my daughter should be going to an exclusively special school, if that
makes sense.
I always felt, no, she can handle mainstream, she's high functioning, autism, autistic, you
know.
So, so what I'm trying to say is, well, she was in primary school, there was, there were
(11:17):
issues, of course, I'm not saying there wasn't, but she could still cope.
But once high school, it's a whole different animal, you know, and they sort of jump
into this thing and it's like sink or swim almost and, you know, they can be treading water
for a while, but eventually.
And so that's happened twice now with two high schools and and and what I felt last night
(11:42):
was I'm thinking of this example in my head last night when I was thinking about it.
I feel like from year seven until year nine, because year nine, they've got set up now
as an alternative school, like alternative education for autistic children or kids that just
(12:07):
can't fit into the mainstream school, they've been, let's slip through the cracks or whatever
you want to call it.
And so they're starting to recognize that now and so schools are now, they're relatively
small, but they're being put in place for the kids that are turning 14, 15 years old and
(12:27):
they haven't made the cut, but it's not because of their lack of intelligence, it's just
because it's their lack of, well, not lack of social skills, they're just different, you
know, and like we were saying offline.
And the environment, the environment is overwhelming for them.
Yes, correct.
And so it's not really the curriculum, it's not really the material.
(12:49):
It's that being thrown to the wolves, which is basically what they've done is too much.
Yeah, yeah, you know, because they start off all right, but as soon as the other kids see
they're different, see, like we were saying offline, they're not teaching the quote unquote
(13:13):
normal, because nobody's normal, let's face it, but normal, unquote normal kids.
And the neurodivergent children, they're not teaching the quote, unquote normal kids about
them and how to, how to get along with them instead of the other way around.
(13:35):
They're trying to teach the special, I hate to use the word special, the kids with autism
and ADHD or whatever.
They're trying to teach them how to fit in with the big kids, right?
They're putting this little fish in this big ocean and expecting it not to get swallowed
up by a big fish sort of thing.
(13:58):
They're giving this little fish all these things that they need to try and do to help.
And they're trying to help as teachers, but they're not teaching the other kids, right?
And so the other kids are seeing this behavior and thinking, I don't want anything to do
with that, but they don't understand, right?
Because they haven't grown up in a household that even if they do, I don't know, kids will
(14:24):
be kids once they get to high school, they want to be popular, they want to do this, they
don't want to be associated with anybody that they feel is different in any way, they
all want to fit in, but, you know, yeah, so, I mean, there's a lot to it, but the example
that I got from, I feel like there's a gap from year 7 to year nine, there's a gap there
(14:50):
for these kids, because that's when my daughter started falling off the cliff if you want to
put it that way, I don't know how.
Do you know what I mean?
Because there's a gap there and I felt like what they're trying to do now is like a drum
and I met to look it up last night, but I did get the chance.
What are they called, you know, how in tribes they make drums and they use animal skin
(15:12):
to make them?
Yeah, they use hard or some sort of stretch, it's very flexible and what they've done to
my head.
Yeah, and so what they've done to make this instrument is they've stretched it over the
top of the drum and they're, you know, like attached it, but what they're trying to do is
(15:37):
stretch this skin too far and it's snapping.
It's not that it's not elastic enough.
It's that there's, it's the drum is sort of too, too big.
I don't know, I just get this vision of this thing being stretched and it hasn't got the
(15:57):
capabilities that it's meant to have and so it's just breaking and, so they're trying
to stretch their resources, their teaching, their traditional methods of teaching, they're
trying to stretch them and they are not working.
(16:18):
Because my, Kayla's pediatrician said to us when we first went to her, she said, there
are in the future there will be more neurodivergent people than what there are quote, unquote,
normal people.
The numbers are growing and so they have to, they really need to try and move away more
(16:43):
away from traditional classrooms because one day that's all there's going to be sort
of, this is, well, that is her point of view.
That's not necessarily true.
I mean, I don't know, but you sort of got to think you're hearing more and more of more
cases or like someone I know said, it's only, it's becoming more acceptable like, you know,
(17:07):
years ago it was sharp, they were kids like that were shunned and society shunned them and
so it's still got a stigma obviously, you know.
I suppose it's similar to the gay community in that way where, you know, you know, being
shunned, it's not that they were, they always say they weren't as many, well, no, they were,
(17:29):
it's just that they kept quiet about it.
You know what I mean?
That's the only difference really and that's what we're seeing now, I guess.
We're seeing everything being exposed and we're seeing the flaws like I was just explaining
it.
I could see the flaws of mainstream teaching, mainstream schooling.
(17:50):
It's not that it's completely wrong because the school that Kayla goes to now have really
tried to help, they've done their best, you know, they really have tried.
I'm not saying that they're wrong at all.
It's just that I don't know the word insufficient, they don't know the word insufficient comes to
mind and I guess, yeah.
(18:11):
So, yeah, so that's why, what gave us the idea for this podcast?
Yeah, and I'm thinking, I'm having a whole thought as you're talking because one of the things
I get into when people start talking about permissive will of God versus perfect will is that I understand
(18:33):
what they're trying to explain, but if we look at the passage that that's from it's saying
that the will of God is good, acceptable and perfect, it's not really partitioning God's
will into three different areas.
And it's really not, I mean, you know, that that's us in our English and not really understanding
things.
But what is occurring to me is that maybe the perfect will of God for people is not always
(18:56):
perfection.
Yeah, yeah, that we have this idea that the will of God has to be perfect, that it can't
be anything secondary about it.
It's got to always be like this thing.
And maybe the red was where you were supposed to be for a while.
(19:19):
Well, a lot of, well, but maybe that was right for you and maybe there is nothing wrong
with that.
Yeah, that's right.
Yeah.
And I was just thinking what we said in a previous podcast about God making room for your
mistakes.
Well, this is sort of once that further than that because it's not really a mistake.
(19:40):
No, no, no, God saying no, it's, it was his will.
It's just that he wants you to go get it go a bit deeper and sort of see it a bit better
I suppose, you know, right to look at it in a different way because I'm even going to
say that with your daughter, the story that you're telling is the same thing that maybe
up until this point, that was the right place to be.
(20:04):
Well, it was because I keep thinking even my husband and I were discussing it yesterday
and he said, I wish we could have got her into because we're going to try and get her
into an alternative school, you know, she and he said, I wish we could have got her in
there earlier.
We should have done something earlier and I because that was my line of thinking too until
I thought, no, hang on, she's not in in in in nine until next year.
(20:28):
So we couldn't have done anything any earlier.
And that was when I saw, yeah, and that was when I saw there's a shortfall and that's the
word, sorry, that's the word that came to me last night and I just remember it, it was
like God was saying, it's a shortfall.
There's a little area there that just full short, it's not quite there and it's a two year
(20:51):
sort of point that Kayla and I and her father have all had to be stretched because there's
nothing else there sort of thing.
And so that's the new wine skins in the old wine.
It is.
And so that's the way you guys have been trying to put old wine in a new wine skin and it's
(21:14):
not you can learn from your own experience what happened.
Yeah, yeah, there's actually there's always a hole, you know, yeah, well it's actually even
it's it burst.
It burst.
It burst.
Yeah, it burst and it did burst because it hasn't been attending school for months because
it hasn't been able to cope with with the issues there and went went back for a few weeks
(21:40):
and worked in the wellbeing hub and caught up on her work.
You see, the work wasn't the issue, but she caught up on her work.
It's the atmosphere.
It's the environment.
It's because she was okay in the wellbeing hub and then they started saying you've got
to go to class and so they said you could they've got no one to supervise her in wellbeing
anymore and so I go had to bring her home because and then I had to keep her high because there
(22:07):
was nowhere for her to go if she wasn't going back to class.
I mean, they've organised classes.
They've done really well, but it's just the fact that she can't bring herself to go.
She just can't cope with it.
She just can't do it.
We've tried and we've tried and it's just just it's just not so it's not working right.
(22:28):
It's burst, you know, that's how I've seen it now.
It's like sort of like a little bit irreparable.
I mean, I'd like her to go back next year even if it's for a few weeks or whatever until
we can get her into the new school.
That's my goal now.
I think this year there's only a couple of weeks left.
(22:49):
It's, yeah, so there are other issues there that I'm going to be dealing with this morning
when I go to this meeting, but yeah, that's for...
That's not really for this podcast, but...
And we're also sticking that your years are different.
Yes, for people that don't know, do you want to explain that, Leankas?
(23:10):
People have a thing, you're, what?
You're in the middle of the year, no?
You guys, you guys go like, what, January to December?
Yeah, well, the end of January.
So in 2025, the first day of school is the 27th of January.
Okay.
Okay, so the school year...
(23:32):
Year off.
So the school year goes from the 27th of January to the 13th or the 14th of December.
So we've only really got, after this week, we've really only got two weeks left of the school
year.
Oh, okay.
And so then you guys actually have a much shorter duration than we do, because most schools
(23:54):
in the United States, they either go back in August or September, and then they run
from either to May or June.
And then you got, like, they have a winter break and they've got a spring break and, you
know, they're off periodically throughout the year.
So it sounds like you'll go to school more.
Yeah.
Yeah, well, we go from January to December, well, the end of January to mid-December
(24:21):
at the school year.
So it's sort of like easier if you think, if you want to think it, you know, because it's
the year and then when the year finishes, so does the schooling, you know what I mean?
So 2025 is much more sense.
Yeah.
So 2025 is a not one whole school year.
20/20.
It's a separate school year, whereas you guys sort of overlap, don't you?
(24:43):
Yeah, we do overlap.
It'll be like a financial year.
It's like financial year.
Our bullseyes just are all off in this country, but that's evident in more than one way.
Yes.
Yes.
So that's evident in more than one way.
But I think that, in listening to your story about the bullseye, the first thing that
(25:12):
I think it needs to make us all kind of aware of is that I think sometimes Christians are
holding other people to impossible standards.
You know, we are really doing our best.
Whether or not that's always obvious, whether or not that's really always evident.
(25:32):
Perfection, I think, is sometimes a goal that is lofty and it seems fun, but it's not
obtainable.
Yeah.
And if that's our goal, we are always going to come up short and we are going to always
think we are not acceptable before God, and that's not true.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was okay to be red.
(25:53):
Should I be saying that online?
It was okay to be red.
God is saying it's all right to be red.
Why not?
Oh, we know we don't know why we're laughing.
We think it's funny, but we...
Oh, we're trying not to be political, aren't we?
But yeah, anyway, I thought that was...
(26:16):
That was funny.
Don't everybody send me letters about that because we all know better than that.
That was quite funny, but yeah, yeah.
So hitting the black is not what we think it is then, is it?
No.
If we think hitting the black is some high and lofty status that we're going to be showing
(26:41):
everybody how perfect we are, because isn't that what it really is with a lot of Christians?
Like, you only see the outside.
You don't see what's going on behind closed doors, do you?
And isn't that the goals or is that they want everybody to think that they're so perfect?
And I'm thinking of, you know, there's a reason the Bible tells us this is not based
(27:04):
on our works.
Yeah.
Can you imagine if it was?
Oh.
Well, if it...
What I mean, that is Old Testament, isn't it?
And that is...
People...
They think the Old Testament is wonderful until they realise, well, if we were living in
(27:24):
the Old Testament really, can you imagine what going to church would be like and taking
the sacred...
What do they use to take?
Or do they use that to take offerings and things and burn all this meat and do all these...
People don't think of that, do they?
If you really want to be Old Testament...
And they don't think about the requirement.
If they really want to be Old Testament and observing Jew in Old Testament times gave
(27:47):
away a third of their income.
And you don't want to tithe, right?
You know.
And we don't want to be stoned to death if we do something wrong either.
Like imagine all the teenagers who'd be stoned.
Because it says if your son disobeys you, take him out and stoned him.
(28:10):
Oh.
Yeah, that's what I mean.
Oh my goodness.
Can't you just...
Everybody...
Come on kids, it's time to go be stoned.
That sounds funny for other reasons.
That's how it means but that's funny.
(28:33):
Okay, that was funny.
But, you know, yeah, I mean, it's like...
We think we want something because like I did this thing on for an episode that I was doing
some notes for where...
And you're gonna know why I'm talking about it.
That when they wanted a king.
Oh yes.
(28:55):
And everybody goes, oh, a Theocracy, oh God, directly ruling.
That sounds great.
Well, until you think about what that entails.
There is a reason they wanted a king.
I mean, first of all, look at the accountability and that in other words, all those rules would
have to be upheld.
Yeah.
(29:16):
And, you know, they wanted what their neighbors had because they're over there into debauchery
and sex rites and not having to worry about the Sabbath and, you know, they...
It looked a lot more appealing.
Yeah, well, it always does for me outside.
Doesn't it though?
Doesn't it though?
Until they had to confront the results that are right now these nations are gonna enslave
(29:41):
you.
But they wanted a king for a reason.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So he could do everything for them and make life easy for them, but...
But kings don't do that.
Kings don't do that.
No, but it's easy for them.
Yes.
I mean, all you've got to do is look at England and even not just kings, but queens.
(30:06):
I mean, they would sit up in their towers and, you know, all the old...
You know, all the peasants would come out and they'd throw them bits of bread and, I
don't know, whatever else they used to do.
They didn't give them much.
I mean, they still lived in squallor and I wish, you know, and oh, it comes to queen.
I mean, I think...
I mean, I know I'm thinking of Monty Python when I...
(30:28):
You know, the old Monty Python movies when I'm saying...
Yes.
But you know...
They come up all the time.
But it's true though.
I mean, yeah, I mean, the way they were treated...
They treated the peasants.
They, you know, they only made life better, like you say, for themselves.
(30:50):
They didn't make it better for the people.
Like Israel had a lot of wicked kings, didn't it?
And the Bible talks about how wicked they were.
I remember looking at that more than weren't.
Like, there was maybe one or two that were good.
There were maybe a couple that were okay, passing and then there was all these ones that were not.
(31:13):
There were more than more the right than what were...
Yeah, that's right.
Yeah.
What a world.
But, yeah.
You know, it's amazing because I think that...
I've often said that we have people have amnesia.
(31:35):
How?
People totally forget what things they're like, you know?
They live in an amnesia state.
How maybe four years ago we forgot what things were like.
And how easily we return to where we're not supposed to be.
(31:57):
And in that instance, we can really easily, you know, we talk about the red not being good
enough.
I mean, at least it's the bullseye.
You know?
I think people are, you know, hitting arrows off in the forest and totally missing the whole
thing.
And they're not finding their way back.
No.
(32:18):
No.
And that's the scary part because they're thinking that they're hitting the board and they're
not.
And they're not...
Because they're blind.
They're not even hitting the board.
Forget about the bullseye.
They're not even hitting the board.
Sometimes I can remember playing darts with like when we were just messing around at a
(32:43):
friend's place and just, you know, you play it with your left hand.
Let's see where my left hand or throw...
You know, like, I'm dominant right hand and I should mention because there are some left
hand and people around and they, you know, but I'll just throw the dart with my left hand
and it wouldn't even hit anywhere near.
It would bounce off the wall, you know?
Because it wasn't even hitting the dart board.
(33:06):
Forget it.
So...
But it would be like me doing that and then saying, "Yay!
Look!"
At least so.
It went somewhere, right?
Yeah, but I'll be saying, "Look how good I am at this."
Everyone around me is going, "Hmm, yeah, okay.
Well, I mean, how blind can you be?"
(33:27):
But some people are.
Okay, but every time we get into that and I'm thinking about you, talk about the blind,
I'm thinking about Jesus' discourse on the Pharisees.
Yeah.
And one of the things that he said that they were blind guides and he said that, you know,
(33:48):
you'll travel over land and see to make a single convert and when you're done, you make
them twice as much as son of hell as you are.
But we can think where in that little black circle and we can look down on everybody that
we see as not being there and we can be severely, really misled and this is why I think it's
(34:12):
important that God is moving you into the circle for you.
Yeah.
And it's very much for what you need, it's individual to your future, it's individual
to where he's going to take you and do you have all the answers?
No.
Do you know every single detail?
(34:36):
No.
But you know that you're being moved into something that's even a step better and in order
to hit that and maybe this is some of where this goes like you're talking about just
taking your left hand with the dart and flinging it and hoping that you get it somewhere
and thinking you're good at it.
Like anything, archery is a skill and our faith is a skill and we grow in different ways
(35:03):
in our faith and maybe you're gaining the skill to be able better to handle that centered
art.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There's so many things that you could really think about isn't there when it comes to that.
Like you're like, you're sad people think that they're hitting the balls on and off.
(35:27):
Right.
And you've got to wonder where the other eye sites think you need your eyes checked.
You can see me sitting there looking at someone.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's why we've got to be willing to take advice some time.
(35:54):
I mean, not all the time because we can go the opposite direction with that and we could
just not live our lives unless someone else is telling us how to do it like being spoon
fed.
Right.
But at the same time, you know, the opposite is true, isn't it?
Yeah.
And the directions of God coming so many different ways, you know, you literally reached a point
(36:16):
where, you know, like you say the year before was hard the year after that was hard and you're
thinking, all right, finally, maybe this is it.
And then this is the year that the wineskin explodes.
And that's the year.
That's the year that God says, all right, I'm teaching you.
I'm training you.
I'm bringing you to a scribe for this better thing.
(36:39):
Yeah.
Because so many things have fallen apart this year.
One that I'm thinking of in particular that I won't go into something was taken away and
it was pretty devastating when it was, but when it was reinstated a few months later, well,
probably about, I don't know, three or four months later, it came with things that I never
(37:05):
expected and God showed me as well.
Maybe I'll just mention the lesson that I learned was the, where, coming back to wine again,
isn't that funny?
You've mentioned the wineskins and now, and what came to me was Jesus at the wedding where,
see, even he didn't know when his time, but Mary sort of got an inkling, didn't she, at
(37:29):
this wedding because she said about the, the, what did she got?
How did she put, I can't remember the wording from Mary, but he, he said to his mother,
my time has not yet come.
And, and then she said to the servants, just do whatever he asked you to do.
She, she knew something was coming.
(37:49):
She, it must have been a, I mean, I know they call women's into it.
She felt, she could feel something changing in that atmosphere.
Right.
I dare I say maybe even before he did.
Even forbidden that I should say it.
But, that's, but that's a message.
Isn't it just?
And she, that is a sermon.
(38:12):
She could feel it coming.
She, and he said, woman, my time has not yet come.
But then we then, not even five minutes.
All of a sudden, God must have spoken to him and said, now, see, so see how quickly, and
that was the lesson God taught me, how quickly things can change.
Wow.
He can, one minute you can be thinking, this isn't God's will, not yet.
(38:37):
Wait.
All right.
And then within five minutes, God will say, okay, I want you to do this.
And when God did that to me, I was in shock.
Really?
You want me to do?
Yes, I want you to do it.
And so I did it.
I took the step.
The faith was there.
I don't know.
It just came out of the blue.
It was very bold in, in my approach and what I did, I just did it without even really too
(39:04):
much thinking, which was good.
I didn't have time to think it was just like, now, do it.
And I, you just moved.
And I, after I did it, I was about half an hour later.
I got the shape because it was, I'd done it, you see.
And since then, things can take it back.
No.
And the funny thing was, once I'd done it, the warfare intensified, I mean, I didn't think
(39:28):
it could, but it did, like, intensify.
And that's where this message has come from, basically, about six weeks of wrestling.
And just really in the last couple of weeks, it's been, other things have been shown
me that have brought a bit more peace.
But if I hadn't stepped out when I did, I wouldn't be where I am.
(39:49):
And I wouldn't see the things that I've seen now.
But not that a lot has really changed.
It's just that I had to, it was something that I just had to do, you know.
I had to step out.
Right.
Right.
And it wasn't necessarily always for the end result either, which I think is important
to say in there.
It was for this bigger picture.
(40:10):
It was for, like, we're talking about this bullseye.
It was for the centering of God's will that you had a shift in where God's will was for
you.
That you had to take this step because we always do things.
And even in this particular situation, that was a factor where you're thinking you're doing
(40:30):
it and that it's going to be a certain result.
And then you do it.
And the result is not what you think it is.
And you've got to live with those results.
And now it's like God, what the hell?
You know, and so, look, I mean, I've had plenty of times where I've said worse than that.
It's a God, I mean, I'm not going to lie.
(40:51):
But you know, it's like God with the hell.
What do we do now?
And from that, you came to realization about you, about your situation and all of that came
just from taking those steps.
And it hurt too.
I mean, it hurt like hell, like there was no other way to describe what I went through after
(41:14):
was in the way in the, in the time following.
You know, I just, oh my goodness.
I just went through hell, but I came out of the other side a couple of weeks ago and I mean,
it's my life peaceful.
Well, no, because I'm still dealing with other stuff.
You know what I mean?
It's not perfect because I'm still dealing with lots of other stuff.
But it's a little bit better day by day, you know.
(41:38):
And like I said about the podcast, we try to do a, we were going to do a podcast.
Yeah.
And also I'm thinking back like even probably six months ago, when was the last podcast
that we did?
I can't even remember.
Is this the first one we've done this year?
Or did we do one this year?
Yeah, this is the first one for this season, yeah.
(42:00):
Yeah.
So that's what I mean.
I went through a real, quite a dark time, really, I guess.
Yeah, that's right.
Because I remember I was talking about it.
Yeah.
So my confidence was really, really shaken, I guess.
Yeah.
And even I slept through the other, because this pod was supposed to do this podcast a couple
(42:24):
of days ago.
But did you know how calm I was?
I didn't lose her, I'm like, all right.
Well, and I mean, actually that kind of worked out because it's like I said, we had friends
giving by the time this episode airs, it's going to be February.
But when we're recording this, it's actually the week of Thanksgiving in the United States.
(42:44):
Thanksgiving is tomorrow and sanctuary had friendsgiving on Sunday.
And we had to have it on Sunday because our monthly service is the first Sunday of the
month, which is next week.
So it's like Thanksgiving falls like this year.
And I had food.
I had food for Brad and I was just like, you know what, you're not up.
(43:06):
I'm going to go take this to him.
I'm glad you didn't waste a day.
I just was like, I'm going to take this to him and it worked out perfectly fine.
And in the meantime, I also finished a book.
So yesterday I was able to file the copyright for the releases for the next couple of years.
So in the world, I definitely, well, I wasn't hitting the sea.
(43:28):
So I wasn't hitting the black part.
You got a lot done so that helped me.
And so you know, maybe it wasn't, maybe somebody would say it wasn't the quote unquote black,
but maybe for me at that day it was.
Yeah.
Maybe that's exactly what I was supposed to be doing and where I was supposed to be at
that time.
(43:48):
And I did exactly what I was supposed to do.
And so like to me, I consider that to be a win, even if maybe we didn't record like
we said we were going to.
And I got to sleep.
I got to sleep.
So there you go there.
It was good for me.
It's impossible not to be in the will of God and be asleep.
But by that we can't just sleep in the boat.
(44:12):
He was sleeping the boat.
That was deliberate though, wasn't it?
Yes, it was.
And I mean, I'm still on that Mary thing, but you know, it's like, you know, we are so preoccupied
with our plans being God's will that we don't let up and let God show us where we should
be.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(44:33):
That's right because because we think we know God's will.
Sometimes we don't always know it.
Well, that's obvious sometimes we just don't know sometimes we just don't.
Yeah.
But the thing is what I've also started to realize because I guess I'm sort of being delivered
from having to know everything if that makes sense because I was having this.
(44:58):
I just, I just glared at you.
I was happy, but I was having this, this thought at work last night about me having to,
like having to know everything and some, I mean, I know it in theory.
They say it's best not to know everything, you know, but imagine if we did, I mean, you
(45:20):
wouldn't, I don't think we'd be able to function if we knew everything was that was going
to happen.
Like, for instance, in five years time, you know,
for us to know every, every little thing would be detrimental to our health.
I don't think I'd, I think it'd drive me crazy.
I don't, if I knew everything, see we wouldn't be able to handle the burden, wouldn't we?
(45:40):
Of everything.
No.
No, that's why we, and I mean, I hate that you're right, but you're right.
I hate it too.
Believe me.
But it's true.
We're not capable of carrying it at human, humanly possible, you know?
I mean, I'm thinking if you knew three years ago how these couple of years were going to
(46:02):
be, that's what I mean.
That's what I mean.
Yeah.
I don't think I could do it.
I'd go, I just want to run away.
Well, I kept saying that to myself, like, for, you know, this year's been like that.
I've just wanted to run away all year.
Right.
Can I leave home now and just run off with my suitcase and never come back?
(46:24):
Right.
No.
How many times do we actually really have situations like that?
I mean, it's like, we can barely handle things as they come one at a time.
That's right.
Let alone if we like, we're seeing all these years down the line, it's like you said, we
could handle it.
Well, I'm thinking of Daniel and his vision.
I don't know what's come into my mind just then about, about Daniel and his visions and
(46:49):
how he saw, God showed him things happening in the future, like showed him.
Right.
He was in line.
Down the line, what was happening.
And I mean, how long was he in bed for day?
He was just so, you know, it made him physically ill.
Right.
You know what I mean?
Even a man of God that ate everything, I mean, he did everything right.
(47:12):
See, God shows us that picture of Daniel that he was as perfect as any human was going
to get.
I suppose for those times.
He fasted when he was supposed to.
He prayed when he was supposed to.
He stood in the course.
He stood against, yeah.
He stood at everything.
He stood against the, he did it.
So he did everything right.
(47:33):
And then when he had this vision, it knocked him for a six, you know?
Uh-huh.
Yep.
So, yeah.
And he didn't have that vision.
This is kind of important to stick in here.
He didn't have that vision for himself.
No.
It wasn't for his benefit as you're pointing out.
(47:53):
He was sick.
He was not awful.
It, it, it, not dem out.
You know, and he had that for the benefit of things.
And it's like I've also said to people, you know, he's an example that sometimes the visions
and the prophetic words we get don't make a lot of sense at the time.
You know, he's running around telling everybody about this statue and that it represents these
(48:15):
different things and people are looking at him like he's crazy.
Now after it happened, everybody went, oh, yeah.
And for that time and that period, he had to really battle some things.
Yeah.
Same like, same as with Noah when he was building the ark.
Right.
What the heck are you on?
Yeah, right.
You know, so, yeah, but what happened to all of them in the end?
(48:42):
Right.
Because they didn't believe him and they mocked him.
Right.
And he had to deal with that for all those years until he got to that point.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Which is a whole other thing he had to do.
Yeah.
But what's scary about that is all those people, I mean, I'm sure if they had have been, if
(49:04):
they had have even wondered what he was doing and actually took him seriously, they didn't
take him seriously because if they did and they started thinking about it and maybe seeking
God about it, they would have been saved too.
Right.
People always say, oh, those people, they were so wicked, they all got washed away and look
(49:25):
at was only his family.
But I'm sure that if, you know, if there was any, any else of repentance in them, it's not
that God wasn't willing to let them on me.
Right.
No, I agree.
It's not a story that God was exclusive.
It's not a story that only people who hit the center block can do this.
It's the story that they had.
(49:47):
I mean, I remember when I calculated it, you know, he built that arc for over 100 years.
Yeah.
So for that entire period of time, right up until they shut the door on the arc, those
people had a chance to repent.
They had a chance to do whatever it was that they were going to do.
I mean, you know, when I agree, if there had been one, if there had been a hundred, there
(50:08):
would have been room for them.
They would have all got on the building team.
I mean, I agree with you about that.
And I'm wondering in this, if part of this is a bigger thing like you talk about neurodivergency,
we talked about, you mentioned the gay community or we'll do extension, the queer community.
(50:29):
We'll talk about Christians that are human rather than the Susie super Christian, that
an awful lot of people don't take us seriously.
Yep.
That's wrong.
Yeah.
And that, you know, just like you're saying, they didn't necessarily take Daniel seriously,
they didn't necessarily take no seriously.
(50:51):
They didn't take the message seriously.
But at some point in time, it all comes home to roost that the message lines up with the
timing and that bulls eye gets hit and then everybody has to repent or face consequences.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There was another instance of it too and I'm just trying to think that I've lost it, track
(51:16):
of it now in my mind.
I can't remember what it was.
There was another instance of that happening where they were all given a chance and didn't
take it.
It was too late, you know, once.
I saw, he, well, we've spoken about him before.
You know, it was his inheritance, but he didn't think anything of it.
(51:38):
He thought it was not worth anything until he realized, you know, that it is, it is, you
know, but it was too late by then, you know, it's too late.
Right.
And it's not like he didn't have opportunities because God would have given him plenty of them,
plenty of opportunities.
(51:58):
Right.
And that's the thing this guy does give us plenty of opportunities.
We have them through our whole lives.
God is always giving us that chance to turn and it's like I've said, the word repent literally
means to change your mind.
And so I'm of the opinion that we don't just do it once and we're done.
(52:19):
I think that throughout our lives, God is changing our minds.
God is that we're turning and changing our ways.
And that that's part of that bull's eye experience too.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Because just see what I suppose I've been taken back to, you know, how you say you've come
(52:40):
full circle when you're in your sort of back there, they're again, but everything feels
different.
And so now you're being taught to, I guess it's greater accuracy really, isn't it, that realm
of that little black bull's eye is like, I mean, red is okay.
There's accuracy there, but it's not quite, it's not quite centre.
(53:03):
You know, so it's just greater accuracy all the time within our relationship with God
and being able to hear God clearly, that's because that's where I found I was falling
down.
I wasn't hearing God as sharply as what I was, but then again, you've also got to remember
that when you're going through warfare, you're done.
(53:23):
I was reading a book once and it mentioned the fog of war.
They call it the fog of war.
When you're in war, especially the ships, the battleships when I used to blow their cannons
and they'd be all this fog everywhere from the cannons and then the weather conditions,
you know, when they were, when they were riding on the waves and everything and going through
(53:44):
the fog, they couldn't see clearly.
So you've just got a whole course until you come out of that fog.
And I think God's been teaching me that a lot too, just to hold steady when you can't
see.
You've got to try and hold onto what God's already showing you, but then the battle gets
so fierce that you start losing sight of it.
(54:07):
And I guess for me, it was just battle on top of battle, on top of battle and it was
like not just in one area, it was every area and everything was starting to collapse, but
now I can see that it was the wine skin bursting.
But you can't do things the old way anymore.
(54:28):
There comes a point, God's changing everything and there's not a lot you can do.
You've just got to sort of hold steady really.
You've just got to hold on it, but we always think we have to do something.
That's another thing, isn't it?
You know, like, what am I going to do?
What am I going to do?
Is that's what I was thinking all the time?
What am I going to do?
(54:49):
What am I going to do?
You know?
And sometimes you're not meant to do anything.
Right.
You've done all you can.
You can, you're doing the best you can.
You're not, you're not, you know, you're trying.
But we expect results and we don't always get the results we want.
(55:11):
And sometimes we don't get results at all.
It's just like, well, what was that then?
Nothing.
Because that's sort of what happened to me, you know?
It was like this decision, this thing that I had to make this decision and I made this move
and then it was just, okay, and now I'm back to sort of where I was before, but just a
(55:33):
little bit more understanding, I guess, really, about different things.
Do you see the ass do you sub you?
Yes, that's right.
Because I was feeling, that's how I was feeling, meaningless, meaningless.
Everything is meaningless.
Because this year has just been a year that has felt that way.
(55:53):
Right.
But the stretching of that drum, that drum, you know, I'm thinking I'm going to make a drum
out of this.
So I'm going to make an awesome instrument out of this and just it wasn't, it wouldn't
pull far enough.
It just, you know, when something elastic pulls back, it's just like ping and then you're
back to square one.
(56:15):
And so I guess that's what was happening.
Well, and in that, God brought you back to a whole different place.
Like you say, back to the beginning, but not the beginning.
Yeah, yeah, because it's different.
But I still sort of feel like I'm sort of still recovering from, because it just went on
(56:39):
for so long.
Well, you're probably going to be feeling like you're recovering for a while, but that being
said, we are about to be.
We're about out of time.
And what would you like to leave our listeners with as a final thought?
Well, I guess it's just, I've probably said it before, but don't give up.
(57:00):
And even when you think, what on earth is going on?
What is this teaching me?
Because that's sort of what I've been thinking.
Because usually it wouldn't take too long before I got the answers, but this year has been
like, you think you've got the answer.
But then all of a sudden, what was that?
No, that's not right.
(57:21):
And like I said, I wasn't hitting where I wanted to be hitting.
Oh, I thought I will.
Like I said, I think that's what I was thinking, but I think it was more along the lines
of you being moved into a sort of like a deeper area of more accuracy and being willing
(57:41):
to move quicker.
Like even yeet.
Like I said, even Jesus didn't really see it until bang, Mary sort of saw it like five minutes
beforehand, or maybe even half an hour beforehand.
She sort of got the word a little bit earlier than him, didn't she, really?
And so just be willing sometimes to move quickly because I realized I've been in a whole season
(58:07):
of things moving slowly.
Or for years, really, years of.
So that's what I was used to.
I was used to slow.
And all of a sudden, everything's been speeding up.
And it's all been hitting all at once.
And so I guess you've got to have the same attitude that you had when things were slow.
(58:28):
And if they're fast, you've sort of got to just keep going and not giving up, I think,
is really the thing.
When you can't see, you can't give up.
You know.
Because everyone's watching you, you know, people are watching.
You sort of can't give up, you know.
(58:51):
Right.
That's it.
Wow.
Well, I'm really grateful we finally got to do this.
And I'm looking forward to whatever we're going to do next because we'll do something next.
I don't know what it's going to be, but we all know God will drop something at some
point in time.
And how can everybody get in contact with you if they would like to?
(59:11):
I think I'm on your website.
Oh, on the discord.
On the discord one or on Facebook is easy because I'm usually on there, but although I
must say I've got, I've sort of got, no, you can send, still send message requests, but
like I haven't got an ad friend button on any on there anymore, but because I locked my
(59:32):
profile and I've got, because I've just had a few issues with a few people.
And so, you know, like you said to me yesterday, you don't want people peering into your
life, you sort of got to, in this season in my life, I've got to be more discerning on who
I let in, but there's also always a message request function on Facebook.
(59:52):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
That is still available and messenger.
You're in current care for today page is also a really good.
Yes.
Get in contact with you.
Yes.
Yes.
That just operates like a normal Facebook page.
Right.
And so that's a great way to follow.
Well, I mean, and I'm actually kind of throwing that in there that rather always then open up
(01:00:13):
our lives so personally to everybody, there's a reason we have these pages.
Yes.
So that's a great way to follow you.
That's a great way to keep in contact.
It's a great way to keep updated and so definitely I would recommend that too.
And the discord because we definitely love the discord.
If you're interested in joining Sanctuary's discord, you can go to our website and there
(01:00:35):
is a link there and you send us a request.
And so that's another great way.
Yeah.
Well, as I said, I thank you for being on and I thank all of you for listening.
And if you would like a resource that I think would be very, very helpful kind of along
the lines of what we're talking about here, a lot of different things that relate to faith.
(01:00:57):
So you have questions about your faith.
Do you have stuff you'd like to know more about?
I recommend my book just between us Christians real answers to real questions submitted by real
Christians.
Say that five times fast.
That's just between us Christians real answers to real questions submitted by real Christians.
You can look me up, Dr. Lee Ann B. Marino on Amazon.com, all wherever books are sold and all
(01:01:20):
of my titles will come up with some new ones that we will actually be talking about this season
to be released very soon.
So go ahead and check that out.
Look me up, Dr. Lee Ann B. Marino today.
You'll check out my pathos column leadership on fire, which is all about things related
to leadership.
So whether you're in leadership interested in leadership or want to learn more about it,
(01:01:40):
feel free to check that out today at patheos.com/blogs/leadershiponfire.
That's patheos.com/blogs/leadershiponfire.
Also if you'd like to learn more about the world of counterculture Christianity, feel free
to visit my website at kingdompowernow.org.
And speaking of kingdompowernow, add me across social media.
(01:02:03):
You can find me at kingdompowernow.
I am on Facebook.
I am on blue sky, Twitter, TikTok, Instagram, WordPress and beyond at kingdompowernow.
Let's have a discussion.
Let's learn more about where we're at.
Let's have that exchange and whatever it is that you'd like to hear about for this program.
I am here to hear it.
(01:02:23):
So that's at kingdompowernow.
So if you are looking for affordable seminary that can be done from home that is entirely accessible
and you will use in real life, check out apostolic covenant theological seminary that's
ACTS for short at acts176.org.
That's acts176.org.
And if you are in the Charlotte, North Carolina area and you are looking for your found family,
(01:02:46):
we are there waiting for you and welcomeinthisplace.org.
That's welcomeinthisplace.org.
And if you've got a question that is not answered on the website, feel free to reach out and
we will be more than happy to get back to you.
And this is Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you in closing.
Don't quit and don't give up as much as we say it.
And as cliche as it sounds, there's truth because eventually the light comes at the end
(01:03:11):
of the tunnel.
Until next time, be blessed.
Thank you for joining us on the kingdom now podcast today.
I pray it is proven to be a blessing in your life to learn more about this work.
Ask a question, submit feedback, advertise with us, be a guest or donate to support this
(01:03:34):
work as our podcast is sponsored by listeners like you visit my website, which contains
essential information, projects and looks for other points of contact around the web at
kingdompowernow.org.
Also, if you are in our area and would like to visit sanctuary international fellowship
(01:03:55):
tabernacle, visit welcomeinthisplace.org.
Until next time, this is Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you that the kingdom of God
is within you.
And that means the kingdom is now.
(gentle music)
Are you a writer who wants to become an author?
(00:06):
The righteous pen publications group is waiting for you with packages and options available
for every situation, including self and full publishing services and nine different
imprints, both religious and secular.
This company has the power to take your manuscript and turn it into the book you've always
(00:31):
wanted.
Visit their website at righteouspenpublications.com.
The righteous pen publications group, find your voice with us.
Welcome to Kingdom Now, the podcast featuring Faith with an Edge, as we celebrate the Kingdom
(00:53):
of God within you.
I am your host, Dr. Lee Ann Marino, apostle, author, podcaster, professor, and theologian,
and founder of Spitfire Apostolic Ministries and all the works that go along with it.
I am excited to share this program with you as we explore the ins and outs of Counterculture
(01:13):
Christianity Press as you live out the Kingdom of God in your everyday life.
And to learn more, visit my website at www.kingdonpowernow.org.
And now, our program, which features a variety of formats here, just for you.
Interviews on a variety of relative topics, teaching and preaching proclaimed everywhere
(01:35):
from my North Carolina studio to Sanctuary and Beyond.
And powerful insights here for now as we turn the world upside down everywhere we go.
[Applause]
Well, good morning, good afternoon, good evening.
(01:56):
Happy whatever time of day is wherever you are.
And to our listeners in name of country.
Switzerland?
In Switzerland, we say, "Bonjour."
We hope that whatever time of day is when you are listening that you are having a good
one.
And welcome you to this edition of the Kingdom Now podcast.
(02:16):
And I am your host, Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino here as the Spitfire serving as the voice of Counterculture
Christianity where we feature the theme of faith with an edge.
And if you'd like to learn more about the world of Counterculture Christianity, feel free
to visit my website at www.kingdonpowernow.org.
Hitting the black.
If anybody's ever tried archery, you know that when you've got a bullseye, there's a red
(02:40):
part and then there's a black center which is like the ultimate hit that you can get.
What happens when you finally reach that point, especially after many years of maybe hitting
other places on the target?
And does God have a purpose for us when we're not hitting the exact center mark?
So my guest today is Julie Harvey from Adelaide, Australia, who's going to introduce herself
(03:03):
and not say that she's ordinary.
Well, yeah, I don't know what to say.
I never do.
Every time you introduce me, I think, oh my God, I'm going to say no.
I drink out of an AC/DC glass.
Oh, you have to take a picture and send it to me.
(03:25):
I drink my iced coffee with AC/DC in the mornings.
I am okay with it.
Look, now that sounds really interesting.
Absolutely.
Yeah, it makes me sound cool at least.
Would you say edgy, you know?
Yeah, that's right.
(03:45):
Yeah, a lot of, we all know that a lot of religious people would look down, would frown upon
that.
Oh, goodness.
Yeah, they're just jealous because they're not having coffee with AC/DC anyway.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
I was going to say, I've got to, I'm sorry, I'm just me.
(04:07):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just muddling along.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Cleaning.
Look, at least you get paid for that.
Yeah, but I'm cleaning in.
Yeah, I'm cleaning in.
I don't get paid to do my cleaning anyway.
(04:27):
I may neither, not this house.
I could go on a tangent.
And whine to you about not doing my own house.
Yeah, we're not getting it.
We're like it.
Anyway, you were the one who came up with the title, "Hitting the Black."
Yeah, yeah.
And I'm going to let you explain to everybody where we're going to go with that.
(04:51):
Okay, well, what I felt, like, because I've been through recently, I don't know, I reckon
the whole year, really.
And even last year was, last year was hard.
So let's put it this way.
2022 was hard.
2023 was harder.
And I sort of thought maybe 2024 would be an easier year.
(05:15):
Maybe it would, you know, be a little bit, a little bit.
Honestly, it got harder.
And I thought, oh my goodness, how can this be, you know?
Like, it was, and I just found that this year, and we're coming to the end of it now, I've
just found that everything felt like it was going wrong this year.
I mean, everything, you know, every single thing.
(05:38):
So, but what God recently, I came out of something recently, and it was like, oh, well, I was,
I was set free from something recently that had been really for the last five or, yeah,
probably four or five years had been, I'm not going to go into any detail, but it had just
(05:59):
been really like, it had just caused a lot of blockages, I guess you could say, like, yeah,
and I couldn't see clearly why.
I didn't understand why, probably because there was lots more to it.
It was pretty in depth.
And I had to go through a lot of hard things.
(06:20):
Sometimes you've got to get to the root of problems.
You've got to go through some stuff that you thought was dealt with.
We all go through, I guess, stages like that.
But recently, come out of it probably, I don't know, about six weeks ago now, maybe less,
a month to six weeks.
And since then, I've really only been in recovery mode spiritually, getting my, I don't know,
(06:46):
mojo back, is that a way of saying it?
Yes, I still feel when I think about it, I still feel a bit drained when I think about everything
that's been happening.
I'm not quite out of it yet, but getting there as far as other things are concerned.
But what God showed me is my whole Christian walk.
(07:07):
If I look back, it's been nearly 30 years of being a Christian.
And what God showed me is that he's always allowed to, even when I was hitting the bullseye,
and I was thinking that I was hitting my whole walk with God, I've really only been hitting
the red is what he showed me.
Now, the red is still the bullseye.
(07:28):
The red is still worth a lot of points.
But what he had been sort of doing with me was stripping that away.
And I couldn't, I always, I felt like the last 12 months, I haven't been hitting the
mark.
I have been, and no matter what I did, I couldn't get back to sort of where I was with God
(07:53):
as in the way he spoke to me, the way he showed me things, the way, it was like I was getting
revelations still the way I did, but it still did not feel right, if that makes sense.
It didn't, I don't know, I guess you could use the word 'satisfy' me, the way it once
(08:13):
did when God would show me certain things, and so I'd have the information there, like I
know, I knew why things were happening a certain way, but there was all that bit of doubt there,
but it wasn't because what God was showing me was wrong.
It was just that somehow it wasn't pulling everything together the way it used to.
(08:34):
And that was because he said to me, you're hitting the red and not the black.
And I thought, wow, so I've grown to the point in my Christian walk where it's imperative
now, I start to hit the black.
And I'm 30 years into this and I think, oh my goodness, I mean, I know I haven't been a
(08:57):
perfect Christian and I haven't, but who is?
No one?
And people say they are, have been working perfectly with the Lord for 30 odd years, are they
lying?
Yes, they are.
They're lying because we all fall short, you know, and if they think they are and they're
(09:18):
all that, then that's probably just some pride talking and maybe they need to pray.
I think it's probably not as close as what they think.
Pretty hard.
So I guess that's what God's been showing me, hitting the red is not satisfying you anymore,
it's not that it's not real and it's not correct and it's and it's not lining up at even
(09:46):
to say, because people might say there's a difference between God's submissive will and
God's perfect will.
And I could say, well, maybe hitting the red is God's permissive will.
I mean, I could go into a teaching on that, but no, no, no, that's not what God's saying.
He's saying, no, the red is still the part of the bullseye.
(10:08):
It's still God's perfect will.
But there's even deeper, there's a center and I guess it's more centered in Christ, I guess,
I don't know.
I mean, I know I'm not perfect and I do lots of things wrong, but maybe that's part of it.
I don't know, but recently my daughter's been through a lot of struggles with school
(10:33):
and I only just sort of got this the other day that I, I'll even last night, I was sitting
there thinking about, I'm thinking, well, you know, there's a shortfall between what they
can teach kids in a mainstream school and what kids with special needs.
I mean, I mean, there are special schools, don't get me wrong.
(10:55):
I never felt like my daughter should be going to an exclusively special school, if that
makes sense.
I always felt, no, she can handle mainstream, she's high functioning, autism, autistic, you
know.
So, so what I'm trying to say is, well, she was in primary school, there was, there were
(11:17):
issues, of course, I'm not saying there wasn't, but she could still cope.
But once high school, it's a whole different animal, you know, and they sort of jump
into this thing and it's like sink or swim almost and, you know, they can be treading water
for a while, but eventually.
And so that's happened twice now with two high schools and and and what I felt last night
(11:42):
was I'm thinking of this example in my head last night when I was thinking about it.
I feel like from year seven until year nine, because year nine, they've got set up now
as an alternative school, like alternative education for autistic children or kids that just
(12:07):
can't fit into the mainstream school, they've been, let's slip through the cracks or whatever
you want to call it.
And so they're starting to recognize that now and so schools are now, they're relatively
small, but they're being put in place for the kids that are turning 14, 15 years old and
(12:27):
they haven't made the cut, but it's not because of their lack of intelligence, it's just
because it's their lack of, well, not lack of social skills, they're just different, you
know, and like we were saying offline.
And the environment, the environment is overwhelming for them.
Yes, correct.
And so it's not really the curriculum, it's not really the material.
(12:49):
It's that being thrown to the wolves, which is basically what they've done is too much.
Yeah, yeah, you know, because they start off all right, but as soon as the other kids see
they're different, see, like we were saying offline, they're not teaching the quote unquote
(13:13):
normal, because nobody's normal, let's face it, but normal, unquote normal kids.
And the neurodivergent children, they're not teaching the quote, unquote normal kids about
them and how to, how to get along with them instead of the other way around.
(13:35):
They're trying to teach the special, I hate to use the word special, the kids with autism
and ADHD or whatever.
They're trying to teach them how to fit in with the big kids, right?
They're putting this little fish in this big ocean and expecting it not to get swallowed
up by a big fish sort of thing.
(13:58):
They're giving this little fish all these things that they need to try and do to help.
And they're trying to help as teachers, but they're not teaching the other kids, right?
And so the other kids are seeing this behavior and thinking, I don't want anything to do
with that, but they don't understand, right?
Because they haven't grown up in a household that even if they do, I don't know, kids will
(14:24):
be kids once they get to high school, they want to be popular, they want to do this, they
don't want to be associated with anybody that they feel is different in any way, they
all want to fit in, but, you know, yeah, so, I mean, there's a lot to it, but the example
that I got from, I feel like there's a gap from year 7 to year nine, there's a gap there
(14:50):
for these kids, because that's when my daughter started falling off the cliff if you want to
put it that way, I don't know how.
Do you know what I mean?
Because there's a gap there and I felt like what they're trying to do now is like a drum
and I met to look it up last night, but I did get the chance.
What are they called, you know, how in tribes they make drums and they use animal skin
(15:12):
to make them?
Yeah, they use hard or some sort of stretch, it's very flexible and what they've done to
my head.
Yeah, and so what they've done to make this instrument is they've stretched it over the
top of the drum and they're, you know, like attached it, but what they're trying to do is
(15:37):
stretch this skin too far and it's snapping.
It's not that it's not elastic enough.
It's that there's, it's the drum is sort of too, too big.
I don't know, I just get this vision of this thing being stretched and it hasn't got the
(15:57):
capabilities that it's meant to have and so it's just breaking and, so they're trying
to stretch their resources, their teaching, their traditional methods of teaching, they're
trying to stretch them and they are not working.
(16:18):
Because my, Kayla's pediatrician said to us when we first went to her, she said, there
are in the future there will be more neurodivergent people than what there are quote, unquote,
normal people.
The numbers are growing and so they have to, they really need to try and move away more
(16:43):
away from traditional classrooms because one day that's all there's going to be sort
of, this is, well, that is her point of view.
That's not necessarily true.
I mean, I don't know, but you sort of got to think you're hearing more and more of more
cases or like someone I know said, it's only, it's becoming more acceptable like, you know,
(17:07):
years ago it was sharp, they were kids like that were shunned and society shunned them and
so it's still got a stigma obviously, you know.
I suppose it's similar to the gay community in that way where, you know, you know, being
shunned, it's not that they were, they always say they weren't as many, well, no, they were,
(17:29):
it's just that they kept quiet about it.
You know what I mean?
That's the only difference really and that's what we're seeing now, I guess.
We're seeing everything being exposed and we're seeing the flaws like I was just explaining
it.
I could see the flaws of mainstream teaching, mainstream schooling.
(17:50):
It's not that it's completely wrong because the school that Kayla goes to now have really
tried to help, they've done their best, you know, they really have tried.
I'm not saying that they're wrong at all.
It's just that I don't know the word insufficient, they don't know the word insufficient comes to
mind and I guess, yeah.
(18:11):
So, yeah, so that's why, what gave us the idea for this podcast?
Yeah, and I'm thinking, I'm having a whole thought as you're talking because one of the things
I get into when people start talking about permissive will of God versus perfect will is that I understand
(18:33):
what they're trying to explain, but if we look at the passage that that's from it's saying
that the will of God is good, acceptable and perfect, it's not really partitioning God's
will into three different areas.
And it's really not, I mean, you know, that that's us in our English and not really understanding
things.
But what is occurring to me is that maybe the perfect will of God for people is not always
(18:56):
perfection.
Yeah, yeah, that we have this idea that the will of God has to be perfect, that it can't
be anything secondary about it.
It's got to always be like this thing.
And maybe the red was where you were supposed to be for a while.
(19:19):
Well, a lot of, well, but maybe that was right for you and maybe there is nothing wrong
with that.
Yeah, that's right.
Yeah.
And I was just thinking what we said in a previous podcast about God making room for your
mistakes.
Well, this is sort of once that further than that because it's not really a mistake.
(19:40):
No, no, no, God saying no, it's, it was his will.
It's just that he wants you to go get it go a bit deeper and sort of see it a bit better
I suppose, you know, right to look at it in a different way because I'm even going to
say that with your daughter, the story that you're telling is the same thing that maybe
up until this point, that was the right place to be.
(20:04):
Well, it was because I keep thinking even my husband and I were discussing it yesterday
and he said, I wish we could have got her into because we're going to try and get her
into an alternative school, you know, she and he said, I wish we could have got her in
there earlier.
We should have done something earlier and I because that was my line of thinking too until
I thought, no, hang on, she's not in in in in nine until next year.
(20:28):
So we couldn't have done anything any earlier.
And that was when I saw, yeah, and that was when I saw there's a shortfall and that's the
word, sorry, that's the word that came to me last night and I just remember it, it was
like God was saying, it's a shortfall.
There's a little area there that just full short, it's not quite there and it's a two year
(20:51):
sort of point that Kayla and I and her father have all had to be stretched because there's
nothing else there sort of thing.
And so that's the new wine skins in the old wine.
It is.
And so that's the way you guys have been trying to put old wine in a new wine skin and it's
(21:14):
not you can learn from your own experience what happened.
Yeah, yeah, there's actually there's always a hole, you know, yeah, well it's actually even
it's it burst.
It burst.
It burst.
Yeah, it burst and it did burst because it hasn't been attending school for months because
it hasn't been able to cope with with the issues there and went went back for a few weeks
(21:40):
and worked in the wellbeing hub and caught up on her work.
You see, the work wasn't the issue, but she caught up on her work.
It's the atmosphere.
It's the environment.
It's because she was okay in the wellbeing hub and then they started saying you've got
to go to class and so they said you could they've got no one to supervise her in wellbeing
anymore and so I go had to bring her home because and then I had to keep her high because there
(22:07):
was nowhere for her to go if she wasn't going back to class.
I mean, they've organised classes.
They've done really well, but it's just the fact that she can't bring herself to go.
She just can't cope with it.
She just can't do it.
We've tried and we've tried and it's just just it's just not so it's not working right.
(22:28):
It's burst, you know, that's how I've seen it now.
It's like sort of like a little bit irreparable.
I mean, I'd like her to go back next year even if it's for a few weeks or whatever until
we can get her into the new school.
That's my goal now.
I think this year there's only a couple of weeks left.
(22:49):
It's, yeah, so there are other issues there that I'm going to be dealing with this morning
when I go to this meeting, but yeah, that's for...
That's not really for this podcast, but...
And we're also sticking that your years are different.
Yes, for people that don't know, do you want to explain that, Leankas?
(23:10):
People have a thing, you're, what?
You're in the middle of the year, no?
You guys, you guys go like, what, January to December?
Yeah, well, the end of January.
So in 2025, the first day of school is the 27th of January.
Okay.
Okay, so the school year...
(23:32):
Year off.
So the school year goes from the 27th of January to the 13th or the 14th of December.
So we've only really got, after this week, we've really only got two weeks left of the school
year.
Oh, okay.
And so then you guys actually have a much shorter duration than we do, because most schools
(23:54):
in the United States, they either go back in August or September, and then they run
from either to May or June.
And then you got, like, they have a winter break and they've got a spring break and, you
know, they're off periodically throughout the year.
So it sounds like you'll go to school more.
Yeah.
Yeah, well, we go from January to December, well, the end of January to mid-December
(24:21):
at the school year.
So it's sort of like easier if you think, if you want to think it, you know, because it's
the year and then when the year finishes, so does the schooling, you know what I mean?
So 2025 is much more sense.
Yeah.
So 2025 is a not one whole school year.
20/20.
It's a separate school year, whereas you guys sort of overlap, don't you?
(24:43):
Yeah, we do overlap.
It'll be like a financial year.
It's like financial year.
Our bullseyes just are all off in this country, but that's evident in more than one way.
Yes.
Yes.
So that's evident in more than one way.
But I think that, in listening to your story about the bullseye, the first thing that
(25:12):
I think it needs to make us all kind of aware of is that I think sometimes Christians are
holding other people to impossible standards.
You know, we are really doing our best.
Whether or not that's always obvious, whether or not that's really always evident.
(25:32):
Perfection, I think, is sometimes a goal that is lofty and it seems fun, but it's not
obtainable.
Yeah.
And if that's our goal, we are always going to come up short and we are going to always
think we are not acceptable before God, and that's not true.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was okay to be red.
(25:53):
Should I be saying that online?
It was okay to be red.
God is saying it's all right to be red.
Why not?
Oh, we know we don't know why we're laughing.
We think it's funny, but we...
Oh, we're trying not to be political, aren't we?
But yeah, anyway, I thought that was...
(26:16):
That was funny.
Don't everybody send me letters about that because we all know better than that.
That was quite funny, but yeah, yeah.
So hitting the black is not what we think it is then, is it?
No.
If we think hitting the black is some high and lofty status that we're going to be showing
(26:41):
everybody how perfect we are, because isn't that what it really is with a lot of Christians?
Like, you only see the outside.
You don't see what's going on behind closed doors, do you?
And isn't that the goals or is that they want everybody to think that they're so perfect?
And I'm thinking of, you know, there's a reason the Bible tells us this is not based
(27:04):
on our works.
Yeah.
Can you imagine if it was?
Oh.
Well, if it...
What I mean, that is Old Testament, isn't it?
And that is...
People...
They think the Old Testament is wonderful until they realise, well, if we were living in
(27:24):
the Old Testament really, can you imagine what going to church would be like and taking
the sacred...
What do they use to take?
Or do they use that to take offerings and things and burn all this meat and do all these...
People don't think of that, do they?
If you really want to be Old Testament...
And they don't think about the requirement.
If they really want to be Old Testament and observing Jew in Old Testament times gave
(27:47):
away a third of their income.
And you don't want to tithe, right?
You know.
And we don't want to be stoned to death if we do something wrong either.
Like imagine all the teenagers who'd be stoned.
Because it says if your son disobeys you, take him out and stoned him.
(28:10):
Oh.
Yeah, that's what I mean.
Oh my goodness.
Can't you just...
Everybody...
Come on kids, it's time to go be stoned.
That sounds funny for other reasons.
That's how it means but that's funny.
(28:33):
Okay, that was funny.
But, you know, yeah, I mean, it's like...
We think we want something because like I did this thing on for an episode that I was doing
some notes for where...
And you're gonna know why I'm talking about it.
That when they wanted a king.
Oh yes.
(28:55):
And everybody goes, oh, a Theocracy, oh God, directly ruling.
That sounds great.
Well, until you think about what that entails.
There is a reason they wanted a king.
I mean, first of all, look at the accountability and that in other words, all those rules would
have to be upheld.
Yeah.
(29:16):
And, you know, they wanted what their neighbors had because they're over there into debauchery
and sex rites and not having to worry about the Sabbath and, you know, they...
It looked a lot more appealing.
Yeah, well, it always does for me outside.
Doesn't it though?
Doesn't it though?
Until they had to confront the results that are right now these nations are gonna enslave
(29:41):
you.
But they wanted a king for a reason.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So he could do everything for them and make life easy for them, but...
But kings don't do that.
Kings don't do that.
No, but it's easy for them.
Yes.
I mean, all you've got to do is look at England and even not just kings, but queens.
(30:06):
I mean, they would sit up in their towers and, you know, all the old...
You know, all the peasants would come out and they'd throw them bits of bread and, I
don't know, whatever else they used to do.
They didn't give them much.
I mean, they still lived in squallor and I wish, you know, and oh, it comes to queen.
I mean, I think...
I mean, I know I'm thinking of Monty Python when I...
(30:28):
You know, the old Monty Python movies when I'm saying...
Yes.
But you know...
They come up all the time.
But it's true though.
I mean, yeah, I mean, the way they were treated...
They treated the peasants.
They, you know, they only made life better, like you say, for themselves.
(30:50):
They didn't make it better for the people.
Like Israel had a lot of wicked kings, didn't it?
And the Bible talks about how wicked they were.
I remember looking at that more than weren't.
Like, there was maybe one or two that were good.
There were maybe a couple that were okay, passing and then there was all these ones that were not.
(31:13):
There were more than more the right than what were...
Yeah, that's right.
Yeah.
What a world.
But, yeah.
You know, it's amazing because I think that...
I've often said that we have people have amnesia.
(31:35):
How?
People totally forget what things they're like, you know?
They live in an amnesia state.
How maybe four years ago we forgot what things were like.
And how easily we return to where we're not supposed to be.
(31:57):
And in that instance, we can really easily, you know, we talk about the red not being good
enough.
I mean, at least it's the bullseye.
You know?
I think people are, you know, hitting arrows off in the forest and totally missing the whole
thing.
And they're not finding their way back.
No.
(32:18):
No.
And that's the scary part because they're thinking that they're hitting the board and they're
not.
And they're not...
Because they're blind.
They're not even hitting the board.
Forget about the bullseye.
They're not even hitting the board.
Sometimes I can remember playing darts with like when we were just messing around at a
(32:43):
friend's place and just, you know, you play it with your left hand.
Let's see where my left hand or throw...
You know, like, I'm dominant right hand and I should mention because there are some left
hand and people around and they, you know, but I'll just throw the dart with my left hand
and it wouldn't even hit anywhere near.
It would bounce off the wall, you know?
Because it wasn't even hitting the dart board.
(33:06):
Forget it.
So...
But it would be like me doing that and then saying, "Yay!
Look!"
At least so.
It went somewhere, right?
Yeah, but I'll be saying, "Look how good I am at this."
Everyone around me is going, "Hmm, yeah, okay.
Well, I mean, how blind can you be?"
(33:27):
But some people are.
Okay, but every time we get into that and I'm thinking about you, talk about the blind,
I'm thinking about Jesus' discourse on the Pharisees.
Yeah.
And one of the things that he said that they were blind guides and he said that, you know,
(33:48):
you'll travel over land and see to make a single convert and when you're done, you make
them twice as much as son of hell as you are.
But we can think where in that little black circle and we can look down on everybody that
we see as not being there and we can be severely, really misled and this is why I think it's
(34:12):
important that God is moving you into the circle for you.
Yeah.
And it's very much for what you need, it's individual to your future, it's individual
to where he's going to take you and do you have all the answers?
No.
Do you know every single detail?
(34:36):
No.
But you know that you're being moved into something that's even a step better and in order
to hit that and maybe this is some of where this goes like you're talking about just
taking your left hand with the dart and flinging it and hoping that you get it somewhere
and thinking you're good at it.
Like anything, archery is a skill and our faith is a skill and we grow in different ways
(35:03):
in our faith and maybe you're gaining the skill to be able better to handle that centered
art.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There's so many things that you could really think about isn't there when it comes to that.
Like you're like, you're sad people think that they're hitting the balls on and off.
(35:27):
Right.
And you've got to wonder where the other eye sites think you need your eyes checked.
You can see me sitting there looking at someone.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's why we've got to be willing to take advice some time.
(35:54):
I mean, not all the time because we can go the opposite direction with that and we could
just not live our lives unless someone else is telling us how to do it like being spoon
fed.
Right.
But at the same time, you know, the opposite is true, isn't it?
Yeah.
And the directions of God coming so many different ways, you know, you literally reached a point
(36:16):
where, you know, like you say the year before was hard the year after that was hard and you're
thinking, all right, finally, maybe this is it.
And then this is the year that the wineskin explodes.
And that's the year.
That's the year that God says, all right, I'm teaching you.
I'm training you.
I'm bringing you to a scribe for this better thing.
(36:39):
Yeah.
Because so many things have fallen apart this year.
One that I'm thinking of in particular that I won't go into something was taken away and
it was pretty devastating when it was, but when it was reinstated a few months later, well,
probably about, I don't know, three or four months later, it came with things that I never
(37:05):
expected and God showed me as well.
Maybe I'll just mention the lesson that I learned was the, where, coming back to wine again,
isn't that funny?
You've mentioned the wineskins and now, and what came to me was Jesus at the wedding where,
see, even he didn't know when his time, but Mary sort of got an inkling, didn't she, at
(37:29):
this wedding because she said about the, the, what did she got?
How did she put, I can't remember the wording from Mary, but he, he said to his mother,
my time has not yet come.
And, and then she said to the servants, just do whatever he asked you to do.
She, she knew something was coming.
(37:49):
She, it must have been a, I mean, I know they call women's into it.
She felt, she could feel something changing in that atmosphere.
Right.
I dare I say maybe even before he did.
Even forbidden that I should say it.
But, that's, but that's a message.
Isn't it just?
And she, that is a sermon.
(38:12):
She could feel it coming.
She, and he said, woman, my time has not yet come.
But then we then, not even five minutes.
All of a sudden, God must have spoken to him and said, now, see, so see how quickly, and
that was the lesson God taught me, how quickly things can change.
Wow.
He can, one minute you can be thinking, this isn't God's will, not yet.
(38:37):
Wait.
All right.
And then within five minutes, God will say, okay, I want you to do this.
And when God did that to me, I was in shock.
Really?
You want me to do?
Yes, I want you to do it.
And so I did it.
I took the step.
The faith was there.
I don't know.
It just came out of the blue.
It was very bold in, in my approach and what I did, I just did it without even really too
(39:04):
much thinking, which was good.
I didn't have time to think it was just like, now, do it.
And I, you just moved.
And I, after I did it, I was about half an hour later.
I got the shape because it was, I'd done it, you see.
And since then, things can take it back.
No.
And the funny thing was, once I'd done it, the warfare intensified, I mean, I didn't think
(39:28):
it could, but it did, like, intensify.
And that's where this message has come from, basically, about six weeks of wrestling.
And just really in the last couple of weeks, it's been, other things have been shown
me that have brought a bit more peace.
But if I hadn't stepped out when I did, I wouldn't be where I am.
(39:49):
And I wouldn't see the things that I've seen now.
But not that a lot has really changed.
It's just that I had to, it was something that I just had to do, you know.
I had to step out.
Right.
Right.
And it wasn't necessarily always for the end result either, which I think is important
to say in there.
It was for this bigger picture.
(40:10):
It was for, like, we're talking about this bullseye.
It was for the centering of God's will that you had a shift in where God's will was for
you.
That you had to take this step because we always do things.
And even in this particular situation, that was a factor where you're thinking you're doing
(40:30):
it and that it's going to be a certain result.
And then you do it.
And the result is not what you think it is.
And you've got to live with those results.
And now it's like God, what the hell?
You know, and so, look, I mean, I've had plenty of times where I've said worse than that.
It's a God, I mean, I'm not going to lie.
(40:51):
But you know, it's like God with the hell.
What do we do now?
And from that, you came to realization about you, about your situation and all of that came
just from taking those steps.
And it hurt too.
I mean, it hurt like hell, like there was no other way to describe what I went through after
(41:14):
was in the way in the, in the time following.
You know, I just, oh my goodness.
I just went through hell, but I came out of the other side a couple of weeks ago and I mean,
it's my life peaceful.
Well, no, because I'm still dealing with other stuff.
You know what I mean?
It's not perfect because I'm still dealing with lots of other stuff.
But it's a little bit better day by day, you know.
(41:38):
And like I said about the podcast, we try to do a, we were going to do a podcast.
Yeah.
And also I'm thinking back like even probably six months ago, when was the last podcast
that we did?
I can't even remember.
Is this the first one we've done this year?
Or did we do one this year?
Yeah, this is the first one for this season, yeah.
(42:00):
Yeah.
So that's what I mean.
I went through a real, quite a dark time, really, I guess.
Yeah, that's right.
Because I remember I was talking about it.
Yeah.
So my confidence was really, really shaken, I guess.
Yeah.
And even I slept through the other, because this pod was supposed to do this podcast a couple
(42:24):
of days ago.
But did you know how calm I was?
I didn't lose her, I'm like, all right.
Well, and I mean, actually that kind of worked out because it's like I said, we had friends
giving by the time this episode airs, it's going to be February.
But when we're recording this, it's actually the week of Thanksgiving in the United States.
(42:44):
Thanksgiving is tomorrow and sanctuary had friendsgiving on Sunday.
And we had to have it on Sunday because our monthly service is the first Sunday of the
month, which is next week.
So it's like Thanksgiving falls like this year.
And I had food.
I had food for Brad and I was just like, you know what, you're not up.
(43:06):
I'm going to go take this to him.
I'm glad you didn't waste a day.
I just was like, I'm going to take this to him and it worked out perfectly fine.
And in the meantime, I also finished a book.
So yesterday I was able to file the copyright for the releases for the next couple of years.
So in the world, I definitely, well, I wasn't hitting the sea.
(43:28):
So I wasn't hitting the black part.
You got a lot done so that helped me.
And so you know, maybe it wasn't, maybe somebody would say it wasn't the quote unquote black,
but maybe for me at that day it was.
Yeah.
Maybe that's exactly what I was supposed to be doing and where I was supposed to be at
that time.
(43:48):
And I did exactly what I was supposed to do.
And so like to me, I consider that to be a win, even if maybe we didn't record like
we said we were going to.
And I got to sleep.
I got to sleep.
So there you go there.
It was good for me.
It's impossible not to be in the will of God and be asleep.
But by that we can't just sleep in the boat.
(44:12):
He was sleeping the boat.
That was deliberate though, wasn't it?
Yes, it was.
And I mean, I'm still on that Mary thing, but you know, it's like, you know, we are so preoccupied
with our plans being God's will that we don't let up and let God show us where we should
be.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(44:33):
That's right because because we think we know God's will.
Sometimes we don't always know it.
Well, that's obvious sometimes we just don't know sometimes we just don't.
Yeah.
But the thing is what I've also started to realize because I guess I'm sort of being delivered
from having to know everything if that makes sense because I was having this.
(44:58):
I just, I just glared at you.
I was happy, but I was having this, this thought at work last night about me having to,
like having to know everything and some, I mean, I know it in theory.
They say it's best not to know everything, you know, but imagine if we did, I mean, you
(45:20):
wouldn't, I don't think we'd be able to function if we knew everything was that was going
to happen.
Like, for instance, in five years time, you know,
for us to know every, every little thing would be detrimental to our health.
I don't think I'd, I think it'd drive me crazy.
I don't, if I knew everything, see we wouldn't be able to handle the burden, wouldn't we?
(45:40):
Of everything.
No.
No, that's why we, and I mean, I hate that you're right, but you're right.
I hate it too.
Believe me.
But it's true.
We're not capable of carrying it at human, humanly possible, you know?
I mean, I'm thinking if you knew three years ago how these couple of years were going to
(46:02):
be, that's what I mean.
That's what I mean.
Yeah.
I don't think I could do it.
I'd go, I just want to run away.
Well, I kept saying that to myself, like, for, you know, this year's been like that.
I've just wanted to run away all year.
Right.
Can I leave home now and just run off with my suitcase and never come back?
(46:24):
Right.
No.
How many times do we actually really have situations like that?
I mean, it's like, we can barely handle things as they come one at a time.
That's right.
Let alone if we like, we're seeing all these years down the line, it's like you said, we
could handle it.
Well, I'm thinking of Daniel and his vision.
I don't know what's come into my mind just then about, about Daniel and his visions and
(46:49):
how he saw, God showed him things happening in the future, like showed him.
Right.
He was in line.
Down the line, what was happening.
And I mean, how long was he in bed for day?
He was just so, you know, it made him physically ill.
Right.
You know what I mean?
Even a man of God that ate everything, I mean, he did everything right.
(47:12):
See, God shows us that picture of Daniel that he was as perfect as any human was going
to get.
I suppose for those times.
He fasted when he was supposed to.
He prayed when he was supposed to.
He stood in the course.
He stood against, yeah.
He stood at everything.
He stood against the, he did it.
So he did everything right.
(47:33):
And then when he had this vision, it knocked him for a six, you know?
Uh-huh.
Yep.
So, yeah.
And he didn't have that vision.
This is kind of important to stick in here.
He didn't have that vision for himself.
No.
It wasn't for his benefit as you're pointing out.
(47:53):
He was sick.
He was not awful.
It, it, it, not dem out.
You know, and he had that for the benefit of things.
And it's like I've also said to people, you know, he's an example that sometimes the visions
and the prophetic words we get don't make a lot of sense at the time.
You know, he's running around telling everybody about this statue and that it represents these
(48:15):
different things and people are looking at him like he's crazy.
Now after it happened, everybody went, oh, yeah.
And for that time and that period, he had to really battle some things.
Yeah.
Same like, same as with Noah when he was building the ark.
Right.
What the heck are you on?
Yeah, right.
You know, so, yeah, but what happened to all of them in the end?
(48:42):
Right.
Because they didn't believe him and they mocked him.
Right.
And he had to deal with that for all those years until he got to that point.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Which is a whole other thing he had to do.
Yeah.
But what's scary about that is all those people, I mean, I'm sure if they had have been, if
(49:04):
they had have even wondered what he was doing and actually took him seriously, they didn't
take him seriously because if they did and they started thinking about it and maybe seeking
God about it, they would have been saved too.
Right.
People always say, oh, those people, they were so wicked, they all got washed away and look
(49:25):
at was only his family.
But I'm sure that if, you know, if there was any, any else of repentance in them, it's not
that God wasn't willing to let them on me.
Right.
No, I agree.
It's not a story that God was exclusive.
It's not a story that only people who hit the center block can do this.
It's the story that they had.
(49:47):
I mean, I remember when I calculated it, you know, he built that arc for over 100 years.
Yeah.
So for that entire period of time, right up until they shut the door on the arc, those
people had a chance to repent.
They had a chance to do whatever it was that they were going to do.
I mean, you know, when I agree, if there had been one, if there had been a hundred, there
(50:08):
would have been room for them.
They would have all got on the building team.
I mean, I agree with you about that.
And I'm wondering in this, if part of this is a bigger thing like you talk about neurodivergency,
we talked about, you mentioned the gay community or we'll do extension, the queer community.
(50:29):
We'll talk about Christians that are human rather than the Susie super Christian, that
an awful lot of people don't take us seriously.
Yep.
That's wrong.
Yeah.
And that, you know, just like you're saying, they didn't necessarily take Daniel seriously,
they didn't necessarily take no seriously.
(50:51):
They didn't take the message seriously.
But at some point in time, it all comes home to roost that the message lines up with the
timing and that bulls eye gets hit and then everybody has to repent or face consequences.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There was another instance of it too and I'm just trying to think that I've lost it, track
(51:16):
of it now in my mind.
I can't remember what it was.
There was another instance of that happening where they were all given a chance and didn't
take it.
It was too late, you know, once.
I saw, he, well, we've spoken about him before.
You know, it was his inheritance, but he didn't think anything of it.
(51:38):
He thought it was not worth anything until he realized, you know, that it is, it is, you
know, but it was too late by then, you know, it's too late.
Right.
And it's not like he didn't have opportunities because God would have given him plenty of them,
plenty of opportunities.
(51:58):
Right.
And that's the thing this guy does give us plenty of opportunities.
We have them through our whole lives.
God is always giving us that chance to turn and it's like I've said, the word repent literally
means to change your mind.
And so I'm of the opinion that we don't just do it once and we're done.
(52:19):
I think that throughout our lives, God is changing our minds.
God is that we're turning and changing our ways.
And that that's part of that bull's eye experience too.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Because just see what I suppose I've been taken back to, you know, how you say you've come
(52:40):
full circle when you're in your sort of back there, they're again, but everything feels
different.
And so now you're being taught to, I guess it's greater accuracy really, isn't it, that realm
of that little black bull's eye is like, I mean, red is okay.
There's accuracy there, but it's not quite, it's not quite centre.
(53:03):
You know, so it's just greater accuracy all the time within our relationship with God
and being able to hear God clearly, that's because that's where I found I was falling
down.
I wasn't hearing God as sharply as what I was, but then again, you've also got to remember
that when you're going through warfare, you're done.
(53:23):
I was reading a book once and it mentioned the fog of war.
They call it the fog of war.
When you're in war, especially the ships, the battleships when I used to blow their cannons
and they'd be all this fog everywhere from the cannons and then the weather conditions,
you know, when they were, when they were riding on the waves and everything and going through
(53:44):
the fog, they couldn't see clearly.
So you've just got a whole course until you come out of that fog.
And I think God's been teaching me that a lot too, just to hold steady when you can't
see.
You've got to try and hold onto what God's already showing you, but then the battle gets
so fierce that you start losing sight of it.
(54:07):
And I guess for me, it was just battle on top of battle, on top of battle and it was
like not just in one area, it was every area and everything was starting to collapse, but
now I can see that it was the wine skin bursting.
But you can't do things the old way anymore.
(54:28):
There comes a point, God's changing everything and there's not a lot you can do.
You've just got to sort of hold steady really.
You've just got to hold on it, but we always think we have to do something.
That's another thing, isn't it?
You know, like, what am I going to do?
What am I going to do?
Is that's what I was thinking all the time?
What am I going to do?
(54:49):
What am I going to do?
You know?
And sometimes you're not meant to do anything.
Right.
You've done all you can.
You can, you're doing the best you can.
You're not, you're not, you know, you're trying.
But we expect results and we don't always get the results we want.
(55:11):
And sometimes we don't get results at all.
It's just like, well, what was that then?
Nothing.
Because that's sort of what happened to me, you know?
It was like this decision, this thing that I had to make this decision and I made this move
and then it was just, okay, and now I'm back to sort of where I was before, but just a
(55:33):
little bit more understanding, I guess, really, about different things.
Do you see the ass do you sub you?
Yes, that's right.
Because I was feeling, that's how I was feeling, meaningless, meaningless.
Everything is meaningless.
Because this year has just been a year that has felt that way.
(55:53):
Right.
But the stretching of that drum, that drum, you know, I'm thinking I'm going to make a drum
out of this.
So I'm going to make an awesome instrument out of this and just it wasn't, it wouldn't
pull far enough.
It just, you know, when something elastic pulls back, it's just like ping and then you're
back to square one.
(56:15):
And so I guess that's what was happening.
Well, and in that, God brought you back to a whole different place.
Like you say, back to the beginning, but not the beginning.
Yeah, yeah, because it's different.
But I still sort of feel like I'm sort of still recovering from, because it just went on
(56:39):
for so long.
Well, you're probably going to be feeling like you're recovering for a while, but that being
said, we are about to be.
We're about out of time.
And what would you like to leave our listeners with as a final thought?
Well, I guess it's just, I've probably said it before, but don't give up.
(57:00):
And even when you think, what on earth is going on?
What is this teaching me?
Because that's sort of what I've been thinking.
Because usually it wouldn't take too long before I got the answers, but this year has been
like, you think you've got the answer.
But then all of a sudden, what was that?
No, that's not right.
(57:21):
And like I said, I wasn't hitting where I wanted to be hitting.
Oh, I thought I will.
Like I said, I think that's what I was thinking, but I think it was more along the lines
of you being moved into a sort of like a deeper area of more accuracy and being willing
(57:41):
to move quicker.
Like even yeet.
Like I said, even Jesus didn't really see it until bang, Mary sort of saw it like five minutes
beforehand, or maybe even half an hour beforehand.
She sort of got the word a little bit earlier than him, didn't she, really?
And so just be willing sometimes to move quickly because I realized I've been in a whole season
(58:07):
of things moving slowly.
Or for years, really, years of.
So that's what I was used to.
I was used to slow.
And all of a sudden, everything's been speeding up.
And it's all been hitting all at once.
And so I guess you've got to have the same attitude that you had when things were slow.
(58:28):
And if they're fast, you've sort of got to just keep going and not giving up, I think,
is really the thing.
When you can't see, you can't give up.
You know.
Because everyone's watching you, you know, people are watching.
You sort of can't give up, you know.
(58:51):
Right.
That's it.
Wow.
Well, I'm really grateful we finally got to do this.
And I'm looking forward to whatever we're going to do next because we'll do something next.
I don't know what it's going to be, but we all know God will drop something at some
point in time.
And how can everybody get in contact with you if they would like to?
(59:11):
I think I'm on your website.
Oh, on the discord.
On the discord one or on Facebook is easy because I'm usually on there, but although I
must say I've got, I've sort of got, no, you can send, still send message requests, but
like I haven't got an ad friend button on any on there anymore, but because I locked my
(59:32):
profile and I've got, because I've just had a few issues with a few people.
And so, you know, like you said to me yesterday, you don't want people peering into your
life, you sort of got to, in this season in my life, I've got to be more discerning on who
I let in, but there's also always a message request function on Facebook.
(59:52):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
That is still available and messenger.
You're in current care for today page is also a really good.
Yes.
Get in contact with you.
Yes.
Yes.
That just operates like a normal Facebook page.
Right.
And so that's a great way to follow.
Well, I mean, and I'm actually kind of throwing that in there that rather always then open up
(01:00:13):
our lives so personally to everybody, there's a reason we have these pages.
Yes.
So that's a great way to follow you.
That's a great way to keep in contact.
It's a great way to keep updated and so definitely I would recommend that too.
And the discord because we definitely love the discord.
If you're interested in joining Sanctuary's discord, you can go to our website and there
(01:00:35):
is a link there and you send us a request.
And so that's another great way.
Yeah.
Well, as I said, I thank you for being on and I thank all of you for listening.
And if you would like a resource that I think would be very, very helpful kind of along
the lines of what we're talking about here, a lot of different things that relate to faith.
(01:00:57):
So you have questions about your faith.
Do you have stuff you'd like to know more about?
I recommend my book just between us Christians real answers to real questions submitted by real
Christians.
Say that five times fast.
That's just between us Christians real answers to real questions submitted by real Christians.
You can look me up, Dr. Lee Ann B. Marino on Amazon.com, all wherever books are sold and all
(01:01:20):
of my titles will come up with some new ones that we will actually be talking about this season
to be released very soon.
So go ahead and check that out.
Look me up, Dr. Lee Ann B. Marino today.
You'll check out my pathos column leadership on fire, which is all about things related
to leadership.
So whether you're in leadership interested in leadership or want to learn more about it,
(01:01:40):
feel free to check that out today at patheos.com/blogs/leadershiponfire.
That's patheos.com/blogs/leadershiponfire.
Also if you'd like to learn more about the world of counterculture Christianity, feel free
to visit my website at kingdompowernow.org.
And speaking of kingdompowernow, add me across social media.
(01:02:03):
You can find me at kingdompowernow.
I am on Facebook.
I am on blue sky, Twitter, TikTok, Instagram, WordPress and beyond at kingdompowernow.
Let's have a discussion.
Let's learn more about where we're at.
Let's have that exchange and whatever it is that you'd like to hear about for this program.
I am here to hear it.
(01:02:23):
So that's at kingdompowernow.
So if you are looking for affordable seminary that can be done from home that is entirely accessible
and you will use in real life, check out apostolic covenant theological seminary that's
ACTS for short at acts176.org.
That's acts176.org.
And if you are in the Charlotte, North Carolina area and you are looking for your found family,
(01:02:46):
we are there waiting for you and welcomeinthisplace.org.
That's welcomeinthisplace.org.
And if you've got a question that is not answered on the website, feel free to reach out and
we will be more than happy to get back to you.
And this is Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you in closing.
Don't quit and don't give up as much as we say it.
And as cliche as it sounds, there's truth because eventually the light comes at the end
(01:03:11):
of the tunnel.
Until next time, be blessed.
Thank you for joining us on the kingdom now podcast today.
I pray it is proven to be a blessing in your life to learn more about this work.
Ask a question, submit feedback, advertise with us, be a guest or donate to support this
(01:03:34):
work as our podcast is sponsored by listeners like you visit my website, which contains
essential information, projects and looks for other points of contact around the web at
kingdompowernow.org.
Also, if you are in our area and would like to visit sanctuary international fellowship
(01:03:55):
tabernacle, visit welcomeinthisplace.org.
Until next time, this is Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you that the kingdom of God
is within you.
And that means the kingdom is now.
(gentle music)
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.