September 9, 2025 • 59 mins
Relationships can make or break mental health. Why does it make a difference, and how can partners aid in mental health support? Join Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino and guests Ministers Nik Lewis and Charlie Reep and Brad Loggins, all of Sanctuary in Charlotte, North Carolina, for a discussion about Brad Loggins's book, Breaking the Silence: A Journey into Men's Mental Breakthrough, how he and Dr. Marino met, and why relationships matter in the mental health process. (Intro and Conclusion Track Fire ball" by Yvgeniy Sorokin, https://pixabay.com/users/eugenemyers-40510887/. Empire Transport Track "The Beauty of Green Legends" by DTXN1,https://pixabay.com/users/dtxn1-42017842/.)
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(00:00):
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(00:51):
Welcome to Kingdom Now, the podcast featuring Faith with an Edge, as we recognize the Kingdom
of God within you.
I am your host, Dr. Lee Ann Marino, apostle, Overseer, author, podcaster, blogger, professor
and theologian, and founder of Safe Ministries and all the works that go along with it.
(01:12):
I am excited to share this program with you.
As we explore the ins and outs encounter culture Christianity, present as you live out the kingdom
of God in your everyday life.
Want to learn more?
Visit KingdomPowerNow.org.
And now our program, which features a variety of formats, fear, just for you.
(01:33):
Interviews on a variety of relevant topics, teaching and preaching taught everywhere from our
ministry studios to sanctuary and beyond.
And powerful insights here for today as we turn the world upside down everywhere we go.
Well, good morning, good afternoon, good evening.
(02:00):
Happy whatever time of day it is wherever you are.
And to our listeners in Japan, we say, "Konichiwa."
Is that right?
Yes.
It's going to be right today.
Anyway, we hope to whatever time of day it is when you are listening that you are having
a good one.
And I welcome you to this edition of the Kingdom Now podcast such as it is.
And I am your host Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino here as the Spitfire serving as the voice
(02:24):
of counterculture Christianity, where we feature the theme of faith with an edge.
And if you would like to learn more about the world of counterculture Christianity, feel
free to visit my website at kingdompowernow.org.
So the role that relationships play in mental health is actually very relevant.
And we often undermine it or we don't pay attention to the way that we can help people
(02:48):
to improve their mental health.
Today I actually have three people here who are going to most likely two of which are
going to probably put us on the hot seat.
We have first and foremost, Ministers Nik Lewis and Charlie Reep back with us today.
And we also have the long anticipated special guest, Brad Loggins, who I am going to let him
(03:14):
tell you who he is, but he is author of the book "Breaking the Silence" a Journey Into
Men's Mental Breakthrough, which we are going to read the back for a summary of.
High rates of depression, suicide, and dissatisfaction with life.
Intense pressures on the job and lack of social support.
If one reads the current statistics on men's mental health, it is obvious men suffer
(03:37):
due to silence, failing to receive the proper support for mental and emotional issues.
A combination of factors, including societal expectations of a stoic unfailing masculinity,
lack of access to mental health information, and in proper mental health care leaves men
unable to cope in a world that often doesn't seem to care much about them.
(03:58):
In "Breaking the Silence" a Journey Into Men's Mental Breakthrough, Brad Loggins draws on
research, personal experience, and insights to offer men a personal compass for the
Journey Into World of Emotional Help, Support, and Guidance, just for them.
Written, "Clear and Concise" complete with infographics, quotations, story statistics, and
(04:19):
space to write.
This book can be used as a resource journal to live a life embracing better mental health.
Whether new to the Journey or experienced and desiring a refresher course, this is the
perfect place for mental to learn more about themselves, and the essence of emotional and
mental wellbeing.
So we welcome you to this edition, and who of all of the three of you would like to introduce
(04:40):
yourself first?
Sure, I'll go.
Okay, I'm Brad Loggins, author of "Breaking the Silence."
I'm also a truck driver and logistics expert.
You can reach out to me at empiretransport.co.
You left something out.
(05:01):
No, it didn't.
You left something out.
Hi, partner.
They don't know who you're talking to.
Brad Loggins is also my husband.
There.
Hi, I'm minister Charlie Reep, they/them pronoun user
(05:21):
I am a returning guest on the kingdom now podcast.
I have a website called Beloved Not Broken.
That is Beloved-Not-Broken.com.
It's a resource for queer questioning and deconstructing Christians.
I'm also the minister of education at Sanctuary International Fellowship Tabernacle in Charlotte,
(05:43):
North Carolina.
Hello, podcast listeners.
I am minister Nik Lewis.
You probably heard me before.
Also they/them pronounce user and minister of music/worship leader for Sanctuary International.
I also have a blog that's nikfits.com, N-I-K-F-I-T-S.com where nik fits and so do you.
(06:04):
I can't believe I've never used my slogan on here before, but anyway, I do a lot of faith
and pop culture related things on there.
I do some other non-nerdy stuff that's even one of the categories I have on my blog.
I have infographics on there from that recap, the Sunday school and sermons that I've done.
(06:29):
Look me up on there.
If you want to get in touch with me, my link tree is on the contact page.
I'm not super active on Twitter or Insta currently, but pretty much everywhere else you can
follow me.
Well, we welcome everyone and let's start with this because you did write the book.
(06:49):
Tell us a little bit why you wanted to write this book.
Oh, well, number one, I dealt with a lot of issues in my personal experience in life in
general and realized a lot of things that weren't really taught about men having the community
and some of the space and networking necessary.
(07:10):
So I set it up more like a journal because everyone's story is different.
So there is no one answer to solve all problems, right?
So that's kind of what I was going for, but the biggest thing is it's based on honesty.
And if you can't be honest with yourself, my book is not going to help you to begin with.
(07:32):
So I figured I would give someone a tool to help them.
You know, whether they decide, hey, I need professional help or hey, I need better communication
skills with my partner, you know, or somebody in the community.
I mean, there's a list of a few national resources, but again, it's not there for, it's not
(08:01):
going to, not everyone's going to apply for the same situation.
So let's just.
So would you say that this book is designed for people to help kind of figure out what's
going to be their answers for them?
In other words, it's not specifically saying, hey, this is the only answer or this is the
(08:22):
specific way, but this is basically a book that's made to give the necessary introspection
so that people can kind of figure out what the answer that they're seeking is for themselves.
Yes, that would be more accurate of a description, you know, and the reason I did it was, you
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know, for the fact it was coming up on men's mental health month, and I realized there
wasn't a lot of resources out there.
And the thing is, if you don't know how to look for them, you're not going to find them
as easily.
So I do list a few of those as well.
And let's also mention because it's been asked many different times, usually during international
(09:08):
women's day, there actually is an international men's day that is devoted to men's issues,
such as men's mental health, issues surrounding things such as suicide or overwork or basically
devoting to men's physical health as well, and those particular days are, okay, international
(09:30):
men's day is November 19th every year, and that there is also men's mental health month
in June and in November depending on the country that you're in.
So nobody can say anymore when is international men's day because we just told you.
So in talking about this in the book specifically, before we start talking more about some of the
(09:52):
relationship issues, what are some of the specific issues?
Obviously it's going to be different for everybody, but what are some of the specific issues
that men face is pertain to mental health?
Number one, clear and precise communication among themselves and loved ones because often
men are tall to essentially bottle things up and just, hey, don't cry, be a man.
(10:20):
And that starts young.
Yeah, I know for me personally, that's what I did.
I didn't know how to really be in touch with my emotions and I still struggle with that
sometimes.
So it can be drastic from person to person, just I mean, even people of the opposite gender
(10:42):
or females, it can tend to be, or they can be overly emotional.
Those can tend to be, what's the word I'm looking for?
Some of the major issues and then not knowing, even if you don't necessarily go to someone
finding the right hobbies and coping skills and not everyone has healthy methods of doing
(11:07):
that.
For some of us, it's going 100 miles an hour down the freeway.
For others, for others, for others, it might be going shopping for shoes or books.
That's very specific.
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What's the difference?
Okay, epic.
I didn't say both.
It's not fair.
She's first.
She, she's, okay.
Is there any questions about the book?
You just mentioned that you like to raise and that you like to bring out.
(11:51):
So you mentioned in chapter three, Brad, that society often teaches men to fear vulnerability.
Why do you think that's the case as opposed to healthy opening up when asking for help sometimes
is the bravest thing you can do?
Well, here's a key for myself.
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It personally can make you feel like a burden upon others at times.
And it goes for a kind of across the board with everyone.
So that's...
You can take that back on me.
Okay.
And before how there's like no, like one size fits all solution that you present in this
(12:31):
book.
And personally, I applaud your use of nuance because I feel that life is too complex
for simple solutions in any avenue.
So with that said, what are some of the nuances that will affect how somebody might be
(12:54):
able to use your book or like get something from it?
Well, again, that's where...
Because if you can't be honest with yourself in your situation, you're not going to get any
type of help from the book.
That's where the term, two things I hate in life are a liar and a thief.
(13:22):
You're not helping yourself by lying to yourself about these problems.
I mean, whether...
Even you may not realize...
You may not be able to put a label to it.
But hey, I know there's a problem I need to work through.
What can I do to be better for myself, for my family?
These are key things that went through my mind.
(13:46):
If I'd have known about a lot of these things without having to go through it, to be able
to ask the right questions, because most guys...
Oh, yeah, I'm fine.
No, we're not going to tell you, hey, man, I'm struggling.
You know, you often hear it is what it is.
(14:09):
So, you also mentioned that many mental health professionals adhere to traditional ideas
about masculinity and manliness, causing and proper diagnosis or lack of treatment.
What are some of the things that you would say fall along those traditional lines and
(14:35):
for men who do decide to reach out for help?
What are some red flags that they can learn to look out for when seeking out therapy and
need to know if they need to change their face?
Wow, that's a really good question.
I have a really great answer to it for you too.
If your therapist does like minded and fell asleep in the middle of your session, when they're
(14:59):
supposed to specialize in mental health or men's mental health, this is when I was going
down the suicide route, you know.
Well, that's certainly not going to help in those moments.
Well, no, exactly.
It was like one of those situations.
It's like, oh, hey, dude, I'm supposed to be here to help you.
(15:20):
And this guy is just over here like calm down.
You know, doing that number right there.
How is that actually helping?
This is supposed to be something you take seriously.
You know, see?
Let's not forget that.
Oh, yeah, exactly.
It's not free.
Oh, no.
It wasn't court mandated or anything, but still, it was just one of those situations where,
(15:45):
hey, I realized, okay, let me try to go talk to somebody.
You know, it did no good.
You know, it's going to be different for everyone.
Really?
Because, you know, I may be able to come to you and say, hey, friend, look, I'm going through
this, but I may not be comfortable going into all the details.
(16:07):
The biggest thing is going to be an open line of communication, honesty with yourself
and those around you.
I mean, but the biggest caveat to that is just like anything, you know, say, you know,
I open up to this individual about this issue and it's used against me later at some
point just because, and I mean, you know, the toxic, super toxic, exes, we all hear about
(16:33):
them, right?
You know, I have personal experience with that one, but we're not going to get into that
whole situation.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's one of the biggest caveats with that is because if I, number one, if I feel like
I can't trust you enough for it not to be an issue.
And sometimes, you know, like I said, it'll be the part, the people closest to you that
(16:55):
you, you never know, right?
That do these things.
So in a lot of people's minds, you know, for me, that's one of my anxieties that I have
with opening up to people because of that.
So like, you'd bring up a point that I think is on a lot of people's minds about interpersonal
(17:19):
relationships and how trusting the wrong people can come back to bite you and it's just not
a, it's not a good feeling.
It's, it's not a good feeling to have someone who thought was a friend, basically betray
you like that.
And so what advice would you have for people who are wanting to open up to somebody and
(17:45):
need to be able to evaluate whether that person is going to do like, going to do right by
you and keep your secrets and like, help you process stuff or is going to be like the
toxic ex you were mentioning and basically use what you share with them against you.
Like how would you, what are some tips for evaluating those kind of relationships?
(18:09):
Starting out for now, everyone has skeleton, right?
So if I'm trusting you that much, I need to see some of yours.
So mutual vulnerability.
But the thing is, and I mean, if you can't be mutually vulnerable, like I am one of the
best people to try to give advice, but when it comes to taking advice, I'm absolutely
(18:33):
horrible for it.
You need help with your car.
You're not sure how to do it.
I can walk you through how to do it.
But when it comes to my own stuff or fixing my own stuff versus fixing someone else's,
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and I'm like this generally with people too.
So whether it's you, your car or like, you know, I don't know, like a lot of things.
Anyway, I'm, you know, you see, yeah, okay, one of those things.
(19:17):
I can walk you through and try to show you how to do things, but there's also the factor
if you don't pick up any of that knowledge I'm trying to put out for you, you know, versus,
you know, me going in and asking you how to do SEOs or something, right?
(19:37):
It's just one of those things.
I mean, it's something you've done that you're semi comfortable with, you know, it's,
I don't know how else to word that.
It's like, it's a give and take time.
Benefit.
Yeah.
So, but it can also be a mutual demise at the same time.
(19:59):
Mutual benefits can lead to, you know, I went to jail for something I had nothing to do
with because of a toxic ex getting me involved in something I had no business there because,
because I was trying to be, I was trying to be the good guy that I am because, you know,
hey, okay, let me go with you to make sure you don't get in trouble, right?
(20:24):
Yeah, see, sometimes we don't learn until after the fact and it's too late.
Fortunately, I made it out of that situation, but yeah, you know, sometimes, you know, and
the thing is you can go with good intentions sometimes and nothing good come of it and only
end up in a bad position.
(20:44):
So, I mean, the thing is you take risks with everything you do.
That's fair.
Yeah.
I want to say that I had thought about with your book and actually when you first posed
the book, which I, for the record, published, did the layout, did the editing, did the interior,
(21:06):
it is a righteous pen publications book, it is available wherever books are sold and
I also wrote the forward.
So, if you need to look up different things in order to find the book, you can find it.
And what I know about the history of psychotherapy, because I have done research in that particular
area, research and psychotherapy really does reveal that it was by men, for men.
(21:33):
I never really thought until you raised the point that it was raised and developed within
a certain narrative of masculinity that's not necessarily helpful.
So, like, for example, I'm saying they're going all right, it's very well known that psychotherapy
and the medical institution really is often not very favorable to women.
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But it never really occurred to me that it's really not made for a specific gender.
It's made based on certain ideals of certain things.
So, recognizing that, and recognizing that sometimes that stuff always really does not
work.
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What are some ways that a partner can help facilitate better mental health in somebody who
might be going through something?
And once again, we acknowledge that it can be different for people, but what are some
specific things that maybe can be universal, that can be appreciated by somebody?
A lot of time when it actually comes to that, just the fact of having the feeling that someone's
(22:44):
actually there for you, whether it be a romantic relationship, a best friend, even a parent,
there are roles everyone takes in those parts, and they're going to alter significantly.
But the biggest thing is being there, just knowing you have someone, I mean, in that aspect,
(23:10):
you know, if you don't have it, I do type of situation.
And it's a mutual support, a mutual benefit.
You take the good, bad, and ugly.
There's no real right way to do it, but I know you're honest with me.
I know where your loyalty lies.
I don't have to question that.
(23:32):
Those are the biggest things for me personally as far as, like, romantically or aromatically
in our case.
Maritally.
Yes.
So as you were talking, I ended up having a question as Leanne was talking about the history
(23:56):
of psychotherapy, and I was thinking when you were saying it was created by men for men, and
I'm here thinking, okay, but not all men, I'm assuming it was created by white men for
white men.
Yeah.
Oh, German, oh, okay, yeah, German white men.
(24:17):
So this actually is no longer a question, but it's kind of just a comment and a compliment
over because I've read the Breaking the Silence book.
It's very good.
I like how it's very concise, and it's to the point really keeps, like, as somebody who
(24:38):
I do enjoy reading books, but sometimes topics don't always necessarily grab my attention.
So the fact that it's like short and concise, it's very, very helpful.
I just wanted to comment or compliment you on the fact that you really don't necessarily
take sides of like the reason why men are having mental health crises.
(24:59):
So going back to what Leanne was saying about the history of psychotherapy, I know that there
have been explanations throughout history of like why people are the way they are, and some
people tend to focus on these like grand cosmic reasons of like, oh, maybe it's upbringing,
(25:20):
maybe it's...
Financial status.
Financial status, it could be like...
rejection of some girl 30 years ago, or even that it like they mistakenly pointing it
to like a racial category or something like that, but then I've also read like works
in this field where it's very individualized.
(25:42):
It's like, okay, basically go through your life and figure out like what choices you've
made led you to this situation, but I love how you don't really put a reason why people
are dealing with mental health in your book.
You're just saying, hey, this is a problem.
It doesn't matter if it's the result of individual choices you've made.
(26:03):
It doesn't matter if it's a result of, you know, the effect that society has had on you.
You basically are just like, we're not pointing fingers, we're just finding solutions.
And so I wanted to applaud you for that.
Thank you.
I definitely appreciate that.
That's one reason I set it up to be more of a workbook.
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That's exactly that reason.
Yeah, you know, a lot of environmental factors can go into play, but there's also the fact
sometimes it has nothing to do with it.
Just because I grew up poor and native, does it mean that my struggle with mental health
(26:44):
was only because of that?
And you know, you can try to blame it on everything you want to.
You know, abusive parents, whatever.
Yeah, all those factors can definitely play a part, but and the biggest thing is realizing
it.
You know, personally, I never realized, you know, my parents were huge narcissists and adulterers
(27:08):
to the matrix, right?
I didn't know about that part of it.
How many kids do we know of floating around?
Well, but I didn't know that they were committing adultery.
I just figured they were.
Oh no, just because, you know, chasing less.
It's a whole thing, you know, being a hoe.
(27:30):
Yeah, right.
But, you know, versus, you know, growing up middle class and still having bad parents, you
know, you're not going to learn a lot of the skills necessary, you know.
Me, if I wanted something nice, I had to go make it, you know, versus, you know, I mean,
I was in the hood.
(27:51):
I was in super nice places too.
It didn't make a difference where I was.
You know, I mean, yeah, sure, that can play a role, but it doesn't define you as an individual.
You make your own story out of that.
Okay.
So if you want to go do something stupid and go shoot up a school or something, I'm going
to blame battle my parents or my upbringing.
(28:13):
You can't blame it entirely on that because this is where some of those mental health problems
that could have been and should have been addressed from a much earlier stage.
You start running into issues like that and they try to blame it so we don't know.
No, you can't because at some point whether logical or not, it becomes a personal decision
(28:34):
to go do something.
It's your personal decision to go and pick this book up and get some of the help that you
may need.
You know, I mean, this, and the thing is anyone can use it.
It's aimed for men because I know what I went through and my situation.
(28:54):
So I felt like if I did something to make a difference, even if it's a small one, I'm going
to go do that.
You know, anyone here can pick this up and go through it.
Yeah, it's geared towards men, but you'll see a lot of things that will kind of resonate
with you and you'll be able to work through and kind of journal with it.
You know, whether you use the book, you know, most of us here at this table are aware of
(29:19):
our situations and what we struggle with.
Not everyone is.
So sometimes just having it down in front of you can be a bigger help than, you know,
try to explain it to someone else.
So this is sort of related to the thing I said before, but it's like your book really has
(29:42):
a no BS approach where, so I guess to give some background, I have been seeking professional
help myself for like several years now.
I have been studying it just on my own trying to address some personal issues and over
time I've like collected the language and I've, you know, heard different theories from
(30:06):
people, but going back to what you said about placing blame, it's, I feel like in my experience,
because my experience is going to be different from everybody else's, but in my experience,
it seems like the trend is to try and place blame on something.
We want to find a reason that something happened and almost like, sure, our accountability,
(30:31):
our responsibility for how we're feeling.
And so I really like that in your book.
You basically, you know, you completely bypass that and you're just like, no, you need to
be, you say it in not so many words, but you basically take the tone of, it doesn't
matter why you ended up this way.
We can't be blaming ourselves for what happened to us anymore.
(30:54):
We have to take responsibility for ourselves even if what happened to us was not our faults.
We still have to take the responsibility and move towards healing, move towards something
better.
And I really like that you take that approach because it can be very easy to point, to point
the blame at shortcomings with everybody else and to quote something that minister Nik
(31:18):
is always saying, you point one finger at somebody else, but there's three fingers pointing
back at you.
And yeah, so I just, I just think that that's a really great perspective to have because
it seems to be, at least in my experience again, the road least traveled and it is possibly
(31:40):
the most important way to start dealing with mental health.
Without assigning blame and just taking personal responsibility regardless of what happened
to you or the choices you've made is a very good approach that I feel like is a rarity
in these circles where mental health is being talked about.
(32:04):
So in talking about all this stuff and you mentioned you had a toxic ex which were not any
of us going to deny that as a fact in this room.
So I'm sure everybody kind of wonders, you know, how did we kind of meet?
Oh, well, yeah, no.
So we actually met on a trash shite.
(32:27):
Can I say the name of it on here?
Ok
No.
All right, either it was meetme or tinder one of the two.
I'm pretty sure it was meetme.
I haven't been on tender.
Yeah, I wasn't going to say no.
Tinder was not my scene
So we were being really awkward at first because we weren't really talking.
It was just kind of, hi, hey, what's up?
(32:50):
You know, I think we had, you know, it's sent a couple messages back and forth or whatever.
And I was like, you know, hey, yo, we should go like me for coffee or something.
And I just had a good feeling about you.
It wasn't a really physical attraction at that point.
It was, I was coming out of a really bad situation, is what I'm going to call it.
(33:13):
And you know, as we got to know each other a little better, we, we still never found that
coffee, by the way, until a few years later.
No, we've still been to Starbucks.
Well, I mean, we're not going to do the ice cream with coffee in it at chick-fil-a as
coffee anyway.
It's still coffee, either way, you say it.
(33:34):
I don't care what you say.
I'm going to happily disagree with you.
Call me here today.
No, just make it's fine.
Thank you for the offer, but hi.
We were supposed to initially.
I'm sorry.
It's okay.
I have other drugs.
And by that, I mean, my caffeine and nicotine.
(33:56):
Okay.
Thank you for clarifying that because that would have to get in that.
I don't.
Well, the thing is, and with, you know, exactly what I mean, nicotine and caffeine are my absolute
go-to's.
It prevents me from popping heads in a literal and figurative sense to a degree.
Okay.
(34:16):
Anyway.
I mean, you know how you just want to like hit somebody on the head sometimes.
It's like, you know, get loved.
So, um, kind of relate some of what you had said and tell where I was.
I had been at the time that we met.
(34:39):
I guess I was kind of in a situationship myself, but I didn't, yeah, pretty much, but I didn't
realize that that's what it was.
I had actually never heard that term until you heard the term situationship.
Now I'd never heard of it before you mentioned it.
And I would supposedly see the guy for over a year.
(35:02):
And my first hint, something was wrong was that previous July, I had a dream that he was
cheating on me and I even saw the person it was with.
And that made me notably paranoid and what happened was we just had a whole thing happen
at sanctuary.
So I went, oh, maybe I'm just having a bad time, you know, people think of spiritual gifts
(35:26):
are fun, not really.
And I didn't end things because there really wasn't a whole lot to end.
I just kind of kept dragging it out.
And right after my dog died, he was all over the internet lamenting his ex-girlfriend who
apparently he had still been involved with.
But to tell the whole story, I don't really know what happened.
(35:49):
Because he never came clean with me about it.
I did confront him about a couple times, but he never came clean with me about it.
And so I don't really know what happened or what was going on.
But I reached a point, I dyed my hair black right before you and I met.
I said, hey, I'm going to take this plunge.
(36:11):
Let's do this.
And then this guy is messaging me on there talking to me.
And, you know, hey, I'll talk to you again tomorrow and he didn't.
And tomorrow came about two to three weeks later and then it was, you know, hey, do you want
to go get coffee or something?
And my mind told me no, but my mouth said yes.
(36:36):
My brain was like, no, he's too young.
And out of my mouth, hey sure, okay.
And we never went as he pointed out.
We actually never made it out for coffee, but we didn't meet for a while.
We met what we met in like January because then you got COVID and I was in a car accident.
(36:59):
And so then we kind of kept talking though.
We still were talking in there.
We kind of kept procrastinating things.
I don't think either of us were really full comfortable actually meeting each other at
that.
Right.
I don't really think that we were ready.
But we were just, you know, kind of like it was kind of like an internet friendship about
more.
(37:19):
Yeah.
And then we finally met and we went out and we never stopped.
How pretty much this out of the story went.
And one day a few months later on TikTok of all places, our TikTok inbox, we started
talking about getting married.
Yeah.
But we had had a conversation with my lesbian friend Candace briefly like a little bit before
(37:47):
that and it just became like an ongoing joke.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, we were at a gas station and I should fill in here.
We spent a lot of time at gas stations.
I never have been to a gas station so much as I have been since we met and she was commenting
on how different you looked and on how much better you were, how much happier you were now
(38:10):
that you were out of that other relationship and she was like, hey, you know, we all going
to do anything.
And I think she was telling about getting married too.
That was the thing.
And we had just been saying, hey, you know, we're done out going to, you know, the courthouse
and kind of take care of this thing.
And that like became a thing after that.
And then we eventually did go to the courthouse and we did get the papers and then we held
(38:33):
on to them for a year.
Everybody kept getting sick or COVID or getting, you were sick.
But we all kind of had our issues and then one day this one across the table for me, minister
(38:55):
Nick, who loves to do weddings, anybody looking for an officiant?
I got you.
Did our ceremony and then we all went to cook out and played cards against humanity which
sounds just like us.
(39:16):
So in that and in what we're saying because we have both pointed out toxic relationships
or bad relationships in the past and in parallel in your book, how has this helped your mental
health, this particular relationship or this particular thing because you were in it
enough to one take the plunge?
(39:38):
The fact, I never thought I was going to get married was the first immediate thing that
crossed my mind.
I'm like, no, mentally, I'm screaming no, right?
You've all done it.
My body?
Yes.
I think it was kind of the opposite.
(40:04):
I knew we were destined for better.
I just didn't know exactly how I knew that.
I would have divine intervention if you will.
Yeah, you put a spell on me though.
I would have a spell on you.
(40:25):
I hate you for this.
So for our listeners, I did not put a spell on him.
Go on.
Totally.
I do not practice witchcraft in any form.
Go on.
Okay, but you get the gist of what I'm saying and how it could feel like it because sometimes
(40:45):
the best things come out of nowhere, but then again, how so do the worst ones.
I found out both of those spectrums.
And that's fair.
So now I'm here hanging out with you guys and watching my friends poke each other.
It started.
(41:06):
So I will also put in here that, I mean, even though I had been married before for our listeners,
and if you've been listening, I actually started the podcast the year that my first husband
died toward the end of the year.
And I've pretty much gone through a lot of that process on the air.
I've gone through a lot of that process.
(41:28):
My favorite episode to this day that I ever did for the podcast is say hello to heaven,
which was in the first season and I did it with Julie Harvey.
And we talked about a couple of experiences that we had with the spirit around death.
In other words, knowing that death was imminent with people and that remains my favorite episode
to this day.
(41:49):
But I really did not expect to get married again.
I was, you know, and a lot of people might find that I'd because when my first husband
died, I was only 37.
And I'm pretty much going on the premise first of all that I had had enough because it was
a very, very long marriage and it was kind of arduous.
But I think in a bigger sense, I didn't really think I'd find anybody.
(42:11):
And I think that we had talked about it and you probably don't even remember the conversation.
But we were talking about checking boxes and what we were looking for.
And I said, if we just keep checking box after box after box, you said, yeah, that is kind
of a limited scope.
And so then you get into the dating realm like I did and you're so markedly different
(42:33):
from everybody else because you don't fall into the heteronormative categories.
So you all think, you know, the first thing I wanted is a dick pic.
I did not.
And you did not get one of those for me for over a year.
That was on a dare.
That was on a dare.
(42:53):
I mean, we were going to say that that wasn't just because, just because that was on a dare
and you went bad.
And so you don't ever back down from a challenge.
But it was like, I started telling them that I had seen better.
And, you know, which is totally probably not the normal response.
(43:14):
And I mean, you know, I remember asking somebody, what am I supposed to say to this?
Okay, it's like, there it is.
Okay, today, you know, what am I supposed to do now?
It's offensive.
Oh, look at gherkin.
Okay, but you know, it's fine.
It's just, you know, I really did not expect a gherkin.
I was going to say a Berkins of it and society.
(43:37):
Oh, got it.
You know, I was just really pretty much assuming that I wasn't going to find anybody or that
really nothing was going to come out of anything.
And so you were definitely a surprise.
Oh, yeah.
You were too.
You were too.
You were not a survivor.
We were not each other.
Okay.
And I'm also going to throw that actually out there in terms of mental health.
(43:58):
And I think that this is an important thing to say is neither one of us was each other's
type.
And the fact when I went out with you the first time or two, I think it was after the second
time I went to Julie and Julie, I said to Julie, you know, he's not my type.
And she said, well, what are you going to do?
And I sat there and I thought about it and I said, you know, what I'm going to see where
(44:18):
it goes.
And the reason for that is because sometimes our type is just not good for us.
Our type is based on those earlier patterns, whether it was what we grew up with or those
first relationships that we had or often many times trying to get something from somebody
that they can't always get for us.
(44:39):
And maybe it's not always and maybe it's not everybody.
And maybe once again, that's not everybody's situation.
But I kept getting treated the same way by everybody who was my quote unquote type.
And it's because I had bad taste.
And I don't even know if I'm going to say I had bad taste or I had taste that wasn't for
(45:02):
me.
Maybe they were perfectly fine for somebody else.
Maybe they went on to another relationship.
Okay, I'm going to say probably not, but you know, maybe they went on and they found somebody
else and they were perfectly fine and it worked okay.
But for me, it didn't.
And they weren't right for me.
(45:23):
And they weren't helping me in my own mental health.
They were kind of magnifying it.
So you were being gaslighted.
I was being gaslighted.
And I'm also going to say though that I think that it really is a testament that when we
are in relationships that maybe aren't always what we expect or what we anticipate, we
can really find something that helps us to grow mentally rather than repeating patterns.
(45:51):
And so kind of piggyback off of that.
I will say there's probably a difference between type and compatibility because I have only
dated twice and my type is essentially dorky artistic.
That's kind of like the broad umbrella.
The first one was not talk about it.
I think I talked about it on like an earlier episode.
(46:12):
Yeah, so go listen to that when I won't rehash it.
I think it is the asexual one.
Probably.
Welcome to the spectrum.
I'm the spectrum of it.
Yeah.
Probably the asexual one.
And I'm running through trauma one of those.
Or both.
Anyway, just listen to the product podcast.
But the relationship I'm in now is significantly healthier and it was because I got into this
(46:35):
relationship that I was able to confront some of the issues I still had from past relationships
like thinking that my current partner was going to be upset at me for being too busy
because I wasn't making enough time for them.
Which I mean, we both have busy lives.
That's not a thing, but it hasn't been an issue.
We understand we're both adults.
(46:56):
We have schedules things to do.
So that's fine.
But kind of circling back to what you were saying about vulnerable or mutual vulnerability
Brad, that's definitely an important thing because not to get into their business, but
they've also been through stuff where they've had to we've basically had to confront it
(47:16):
together.
And one of happen had we one not inter into this relationship, but two not been upfront
about like, hey, so you didn't do anything.
But my brain's being mean to me thinking I'm in this bad situation still, even though it's
a good situation.
So I just wanted to give you a heads up that my brain is being mean.
It is not you.
So.
(47:37):
Especially when relationships, they base everything off of their past relationships, which is
unhealthy in itself.
Yeah, that's what we've all got trauma from some sort of relationship.
If you don't, kudos to you, you will eventually.
Good luck, right?
(47:58):
Yeah, shut.
Oh, nothing.
I'd like to call you out on that one.
Because you don't have any relations.
No, relationships.
Not like of a romantic, but no, but I am going to say that doesn't mean that you haven't
had relationship trauma.
Yeah, everyone.
And so just to say you didn't date somebody longer than a month doesn't mean that you haven't
(48:22):
had any relationship.
Oh, it is.
It is.
It is.
You're dead because you tried it.
You didn't like it.
You know, it's it was that, you know, I'm going to say I'm not going to say you didn't
do it.
That's not fair.
You did, but I mean, to be fair though, but you have had really bad.
It's somebody like that I've been traumatized from that experience, so.
(48:47):
But, you know, to be fair, you know, you do have experience with different traumas because
you still have had relationships and we're not going to segue into this, but the whole
idea that if you haven't had a quote unquote romantic relationship means you know nothing
about relationships is not fair.
And it's not true.
But anyway, everyone has had some type of issues.
(49:11):
And they tend to bring some type of previous trauma.
Whether it, I mean, and it can influence friendships, romantic interests, you know, work,
yeah, even then, you know, you can feel like super close and cool with somebody and then
they just stab you in the back versus, you know, the person you may not talk to, you
(49:33):
know, because you'll have a mutual interest or benefit from a situation that's necessarily
mean it's healthy.
I think there's a long line distinguish, but that's a whole other conversation and it's
going to be different for everyone.
There's a lot of things that we do, even though we have great, amazing relationships with
(49:56):
people.
You know, sometimes we don't do things all the right way, sometimes, you know, so sometimes
you have those bad traits, but they're also redeeming qualities that you, that you go
and play a role in there too.
You know, it's like, you know, we had a lot of hurtfuls and a lot of boys had, you know, you
(50:17):
know, still do.
I think we have a lot of differences.
We do, but we also find a common ground and move past some of those things.
It's like, okay, well, what can I do to be better for you?
You know, and I mean, you know, we both make compromises.
And that's one thing a healthy partner should do, you know, because if you care about your
(50:43):
person, you're, okay, if I feel like I'm not doing something right, I'm going to come to
you and ask, hey, what, you know, what can I do to be better for you?
You, I mean, how do we do that?
I don't know.
We do.
I already know what we're going to call that one that we're going to do on relationship
hurt, so called everybody hurts.
(51:04):
Everybody hurts after the song by REM, but anyway, anyway, usually or all the time, I typically
turn over the final thoughts to my guests.
And so we're going to do that now, giving everything we've talked about.
(51:26):
And this has actually turned into a really interesting episode.
What are some final thoughts that you would all like to leave with our listeners?
Enjoy life, first and foremost.
Seek wellness and help if you need it, whether it being your partner, you know, or you know,
(51:47):
prayer or whatever the case is, that we can all use a sense of some type of peace.
And you know, if you don't feel appreciated, make it known, but do it in an appropriate
way.
And make yourself be seen, because sometimes that's all it takes.
(52:09):
It's a kind of piggyback off of that.
I will say, don't be afraid to enter into new relationships.
I know sometimes we can have apprehension about getting into new romantic ones or even
platonic ones or I mean, Charlie and I are going through an employment situation where, you
(52:31):
know, we're kind of worried about getting into a worse job than we left.
But you know, we kind of need to work to live.
So we have to take a chance on different people, different types of relationships, different
environments even.
So yeah, don't be afraid to explore life happens.
(52:52):
There's a good chance you will probably get hurt again, but the hurt is not the end.
I mean, I have a lot of thoughts running through my head.
It's trying to land on one.
Okay.
Well, we're going to use my favorite word nuance and yes, my other favorite, my favorite
(53:14):
word is context, my second favorite word is nuance.
We're favorite, right?
They are related, yes.
So I guess in that vein, understand that life is so much more complicated than we realize
and we want to admit to and that even if you can't see all of the nuances that are before
(53:35):
you, just acknowledging some of them, the fact that it's like, hey, you know, not all men
want to bottle it up or are comfortable bottling it up, you know, or, you know, not all therapists
are going to fall asleep on you as you talk to them about stuff that's on your mind or
(53:57):
which I still think is ridiculous.
Yeah, but just acknowledging that stuff isn't all black and white.
I mean, I think that's a big thing that we cover here on the Kingdom Now podcast is
that there's just so many complexities and as much as we want simple answers, there isn't
going to be a simple answer and that's probably for the best.
(54:21):
So how can everybody get in contact with all of you?
Well, you can reach me at empiretransport.co, I'm also on TikTok.
I've got links to those on my website, feel free to reach out to me there and if you have
any, you know, logistics or freight needs, I'm your go to.
(54:48):
Hello, minister Charlie.
Minister Charlie here, I'm tired.
You can get in contact me.
The best way to do that is through my website.
It's beloved-not-broken.com.
My contact page is actually called questions, but you can literally just submit anything
you want to ask me there.
(55:08):
I am, I guess most active on Instagram at this point other than that, I really don't have
like a social media presence.
Hey, minister Nik here again, again, I have a blog called Nikfits.com.
That's N-I-K-F-I-T-S.com.
(55:30):
You can reach me through my contact page, through my linktree on there.
I am most active on TikTok and BlueSky currently.
I may get more back into Insta at some point.
Whatever I do not see myself going back to you, but you never know.
But if you want to reach me just about anywhere else on there, that's also fine.
(55:53):
Well, I thank you all for sitting through this and for talking today.
I'm very grateful to our audience as well.
And if you would like the book that we spoke of earlier, I recommend the book.
It is breaking the silence, a journey into men's mental breakthrough that's breaking the
silence, a journey into men's mental breakthrough by Brad Loggins.
(56:15):
It is available on Amazon.com and both paperback and ebook wherever books are sold.
So go and search for that today.
Also if you would like to follow me on patheos, my column leadership on fire, feel free to
visit the site at patheos.com/blogs/leadershiponfire.
(56:37):
And there is also our church blog, Write the Vision, which you can access
youarewelcomeinthisplace.wordpress.com
youarewelcomeinthisplace.wordpress.com
where you can read what Minister Nik Charlie and I have to say about a whole
bunch of topics.
So go and check that out today.
(56:58):
If you are interested in connecting with me, connect with me across social media @kingdompowernow
that's @kingdompowernow
I'm on Facebook, TikTok, Twitter, Blue Sky, Instagram, Wordpress, wherever else.
Go and check me out today @kingdompowernow and let's have a conversation on what's
on your mind.
Also, if you'd like to learn more about the world of counterculture Christianity, feel free
(57:20):
to visit my website at www.kingdompowernow.org
That's www.kingdompowernow.org
If you're interested in seminary, that is entirely affordable, can be done from anywhere in the
world and is completely accessible.
Check out Apostolic Covenant Theological Seminary at acts176.org.
That's acts176.org.
(57:41):
And if you are looking for a place where you can find your found family because we are here
waiting, check out the work of Sanctuary across North Carolina and soon to be in South Carolina.
Welcomeinthisplace.org.
If you have any questions that are not answered on site, feel free to reach out and we will
get back to you.
And this is Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you in closing that mental
(58:04):
health matters for all.
So make sure that you are doing the work that you need to do to find the answers that you
seek.
Until next time, be blessed.
Thank you for joining us on Kingdom Power Now.
I pray that it is proven to be a blessing in your life, offering an on time word for you.
(58:26):
To learn more about this work, ask a question, submit feedback, advertise with us, order
suggested items, be a guest, or donate to support this work.
As our podcast is supported by people like you, visit my website which contains essential
information, projects, and other points of contact around the way.
(58:48):
at kingdompowernow.org
Also, if you would like to visit sanctuary international fellowship tabernacle, sit in one
of our North Carolina or South Carolina locations.
Check out welcomeinthisplace.org
Until next time, this is Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you that the Kingdom of God is within you
(59:08):
and that means the Kingdom is now.
(dramatic music)
Are you ready to enlarge your territory?
(00:06):
Empire Transport is ready willing and able to cover all your transportation needs both
long haul and local.
We serve South Carolina throughout the southeastern United States and across the
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Come in and large your territory with us.
(00:51):
Welcome to Kingdom Now, the podcast featuring Faith with an Edge, as we recognize the Kingdom
of God within you.
I am your host, Dr. Lee Ann Marino, apostle, Overseer, author, podcaster, blogger, professor
and theologian, and founder of Safe Ministries and all the works that go along with it.
(01:12):
I am excited to share this program with you.
As we explore the ins and outs encounter culture Christianity, present as you live out the kingdom
of God in your everyday life.
Want to learn more?
Visit KingdomPowerNow.org.
And now our program, which features a variety of formats, fear, just for you.
(01:33):
Interviews on a variety of relevant topics, teaching and preaching taught everywhere from our
ministry studios to sanctuary and beyond.
And powerful insights here for today as we turn the world upside down everywhere we go.
Well, good morning, good afternoon, good evening.
(02:00):
Happy whatever time of day it is wherever you are.
And to our listeners in Japan, we say, "Konichiwa."
Is that right?
Yes.
It's going to be right today.
Anyway, we hope to whatever time of day it is when you are listening that you are having
a good one.
And I welcome you to this edition of the Kingdom Now podcast such as it is.
And I am your host Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino here as the Spitfire serving as the voice
(02:24):
of counterculture Christianity, where we feature the theme of faith with an edge.
And if you would like to learn more about the world of counterculture Christianity, feel
free to visit my website at kingdompowernow.org.
So the role that relationships play in mental health is actually very relevant.
And we often undermine it or we don't pay attention to the way that we can help people
(02:48):
to improve their mental health.
Today I actually have three people here who are going to most likely two of which are
going to probably put us on the hot seat.
We have first and foremost, Ministers Nik Lewis and Charlie Reep back with us today.
And we also have the long anticipated special guest, Brad Loggins, who I am going to let him
(03:14):
tell you who he is, but he is author of the book "Breaking the Silence" a Journey Into
Men's Mental Breakthrough, which we are going to read the back for a summary of.
High rates of depression, suicide, and dissatisfaction with life.
Intense pressures on the job and lack of social support.
If one reads the current statistics on men's mental health, it is obvious men suffer
(03:37):
due to silence, failing to receive the proper support for mental and emotional issues.
A combination of factors, including societal expectations of a stoic unfailing masculinity,
lack of access to mental health information, and in proper mental health care leaves men
unable to cope in a world that often doesn't seem to care much about them.
(03:58):
In "Breaking the Silence" a Journey Into Men's Mental Breakthrough, Brad Loggins draws on
research, personal experience, and insights to offer men a personal compass for the
Journey Into World of Emotional Help, Support, and Guidance, just for them.
Written, "Clear and Concise" complete with infographics, quotations, story statistics, and
(04:19):
space to write.
This book can be used as a resource journal to live a life embracing better mental health.
Whether new to the Journey or experienced and desiring a refresher course, this is the
perfect place for mental to learn more about themselves, and the essence of emotional and
mental wellbeing.
So we welcome you to this edition, and who of all of the three of you would like to introduce
(04:40):
yourself first?
Sure, I'll go.
Okay, I'm Brad Loggins, author of "Breaking the Silence."
I'm also a truck driver and logistics expert.
You can reach out to me at empiretransport.co.
You left something out.
(05:01):
No, it didn't.
You left something out.
Hi, partner.
They don't know who you're talking to.
Brad Loggins is also my husband.
There.
Hi, I'm minister Charlie Reep, they/them pronoun user
(05:21):
I am a returning guest on the kingdom now podcast.
I have a website called Beloved Not Broken.
That is Beloved-Not-Broken.com.
It's a resource for queer questioning and deconstructing Christians.
I'm also the minister of education at Sanctuary International Fellowship Tabernacle in Charlotte,
(05:43):
North Carolina.
Hello, podcast listeners.
I am minister Nik Lewis.
You probably heard me before.
Also they/them pronounce user and minister of music/worship leader for Sanctuary International.
I also have a blog that's nikfits.com, N-I-K-F-I-T-S.com where nik fits and so do you.
(06:04):
I can't believe I've never used my slogan on here before, but anyway, I do a lot of faith
and pop culture related things on there.
I do some other non-nerdy stuff that's even one of the categories I have on my blog.
I have infographics on there from that recap, the Sunday school and sermons that I've done.
(06:29):
Look me up on there.
If you want to get in touch with me, my link tree is on the contact page.
I'm not super active on Twitter or Insta currently, but pretty much everywhere else you can
follow me.
Well, we welcome everyone and let's start with this because you did write the book.
(06:49):
Tell us a little bit why you wanted to write this book.
Oh, well, number one, I dealt with a lot of issues in my personal experience in life in
general and realized a lot of things that weren't really taught about men having the community
and some of the space and networking necessary.
(07:10):
So I set it up more like a journal because everyone's story is different.
So there is no one answer to solve all problems, right?
So that's kind of what I was going for, but the biggest thing is it's based on honesty.
And if you can't be honest with yourself, my book is not going to help you to begin with.
(07:32):
So I figured I would give someone a tool to help them.
You know, whether they decide, hey, I need professional help or hey, I need better communication
skills with my partner, you know, or somebody in the community.
I mean, there's a list of a few national resources, but again, it's not there for, it's not
(08:01):
going to, not everyone's going to apply for the same situation.
So let's just.
So would you say that this book is designed for people to help kind of figure out what's
going to be their answers for them?
In other words, it's not specifically saying, hey, this is the only answer or this is the
(08:22):
specific way, but this is basically a book that's made to give the necessary introspection
so that people can kind of figure out what the answer that they're seeking is for themselves.
Yes, that would be more accurate of a description, you know, and the reason I did it was, you
(08:44):
know, for the fact it was coming up on men's mental health month, and I realized there
wasn't a lot of resources out there.
And the thing is, if you don't know how to look for them, you're not going to find them
as easily.
So I do list a few of those as well.
And let's also mention because it's been asked many different times, usually during international
(09:08):
women's day, there actually is an international men's day that is devoted to men's issues,
such as men's mental health, issues surrounding things such as suicide or overwork or basically
devoting to men's physical health as well, and those particular days are, okay, international
(09:30):
men's day is November 19th every year, and that there is also men's mental health month
in June and in November depending on the country that you're in.
So nobody can say anymore when is international men's day because we just told you.
So in talking about this in the book specifically, before we start talking more about some of the
(09:52):
relationship issues, what are some of the specific issues?
Obviously it's going to be different for everybody, but what are some of the specific issues
that men face is pertain to mental health?
Number one, clear and precise communication among themselves and loved ones because often
men are tall to essentially bottle things up and just, hey, don't cry, be a man.
(10:20):
And that starts young.
Yeah, I know for me personally, that's what I did.
I didn't know how to really be in touch with my emotions and I still struggle with that
sometimes.
So it can be drastic from person to person, just I mean, even people of the opposite gender
(10:42):
or females, it can tend to be, or they can be overly emotional.
Those can tend to be, what's the word I'm looking for?
Some of the major issues and then not knowing, even if you don't necessarily go to someone
finding the right hobbies and coping skills and not everyone has healthy methods of doing
(11:07):
that.
For some of us, it's going 100 miles an hour down the freeway.
For others, for others, for others, it might be going shopping for shoes or books.
That's very specific.
(11:28):
What's the difference?
Okay, epic.
I didn't say both.
It's not fair.
She's first.
She, she's, okay.
Is there any questions about the book?
You just mentioned that you like to raise and that you like to bring out.
(11:51):
So you mentioned in chapter three, Brad, that society often teaches men to fear vulnerability.
Why do you think that's the case as opposed to healthy opening up when asking for help sometimes
is the bravest thing you can do?
Well, here's a key for myself.
(12:11):
It personally can make you feel like a burden upon others at times.
And it goes for a kind of across the board with everyone.
So that's...
You can take that back on me.
Okay.
And before how there's like no, like one size fits all solution that you present in this
(12:31):
book.
And personally, I applaud your use of nuance because I feel that life is too complex
for simple solutions in any avenue.
So with that said, what are some of the nuances that will affect how somebody might be
(12:54):
able to use your book or like get something from it?
Well, again, that's where...
Because if you can't be honest with yourself in your situation, you're not going to get any
type of help from the book.
That's where the term, two things I hate in life are a liar and a thief.
(13:22):
You're not helping yourself by lying to yourself about these problems.
I mean, whether...
Even you may not realize...
You may not be able to put a label to it.
But hey, I know there's a problem I need to work through.
What can I do to be better for myself, for my family?
These are key things that went through my mind.
(13:46):
If I'd have known about a lot of these things without having to go through it, to be able
to ask the right questions, because most guys...
Oh, yeah, I'm fine.
No, we're not going to tell you, hey, man, I'm struggling.
You know, you often hear it is what it is.
(14:09):
So, you also mentioned that many mental health professionals adhere to traditional ideas
about masculinity and manliness, causing and proper diagnosis or lack of treatment.
What are some of the things that you would say fall along those traditional lines and
(14:35):
for men who do decide to reach out for help?
What are some red flags that they can learn to look out for when seeking out therapy and
need to know if they need to change their face?
Wow, that's a really good question.
I have a really great answer to it for you too.
If your therapist does like minded and fell asleep in the middle of your session, when they're
(14:59):
supposed to specialize in mental health or men's mental health, this is when I was going
down the suicide route, you know.
Well, that's certainly not going to help in those moments.
Well, no, exactly.
It was like one of those situations.
It's like, oh, hey, dude, I'm supposed to be here to help you.
(15:20):
And this guy is just over here like calm down.
You know, doing that number right there.
How is that actually helping?
This is supposed to be something you take seriously.
You know, see?
Let's not forget that.
Oh, yeah, exactly.
It's not free.
Oh, no.
It wasn't court mandated or anything, but still, it was just one of those situations where,
(15:45):
hey, I realized, okay, let me try to go talk to somebody.
You know, it did no good.
You know, it's going to be different for everyone.
Really?
Because, you know, I may be able to come to you and say, hey, friend, look, I'm going through
this, but I may not be comfortable going into all the details.
(16:07):
The biggest thing is going to be an open line of communication, honesty with yourself
and those around you.
I mean, but the biggest caveat to that is just like anything, you know, say, you know,
I open up to this individual about this issue and it's used against me later at some
point just because, and I mean, you know, the toxic, super toxic, exes, we all hear about
(16:33):
them, right?
You know, I have personal experience with that one, but we're not going to get into that
whole situation.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's one of the biggest caveats with that is because if I, number one, if I feel like
I can't trust you enough for it not to be an issue.
And sometimes, you know, like I said, it'll be the part, the people closest to you that
(16:55):
you, you never know, right?
That do these things.
So in a lot of people's minds, you know, for me, that's one of my anxieties that I have
with opening up to people because of that.
So like, you'd bring up a point that I think is on a lot of people's minds about interpersonal
(17:19):
relationships and how trusting the wrong people can come back to bite you and it's just not
a, it's not a good feeling.
It's, it's not a good feeling to have someone who thought was a friend, basically betray
you like that.
And so what advice would you have for people who are wanting to open up to somebody and
(17:45):
need to be able to evaluate whether that person is going to do like, going to do right by
you and keep your secrets and like, help you process stuff or is going to be like the
toxic ex you were mentioning and basically use what you share with them against you.
Like how would you, what are some tips for evaluating those kind of relationships?
(18:09):
Starting out for now, everyone has skeleton, right?
So if I'm trusting you that much, I need to see some of yours.
So mutual vulnerability.
But the thing is, and I mean, if you can't be mutually vulnerable, like I am one of the
best people to try to give advice, but when it comes to taking advice, I'm absolutely
(18:33):
horrible for it.
You need help with your car.
You're not sure how to do it.
I can walk you through how to do it.
But when it comes to my own stuff or fixing my own stuff versus fixing someone else's,
(18:56):
and I'm like this generally with people too.
So whether it's you, your car or like, you know, I don't know, like a lot of things.
Anyway, I'm, you know, you see, yeah, okay, one of those things.
(19:17):
I can walk you through and try to show you how to do things, but there's also the factor
if you don't pick up any of that knowledge I'm trying to put out for you, you know, versus,
you know, me going in and asking you how to do SEOs or something, right?
(19:37):
It's just one of those things.
I mean, it's something you've done that you're semi comfortable with, you know, it's,
I don't know how else to word that.
It's like, it's a give and take time.
Benefit.
Yeah.
So, but it can also be a mutual demise at the same time.
(19:59):
Mutual benefits can lead to, you know, I went to jail for something I had nothing to do
with because of a toxic ex getting me involved in something I had no business there because,
because I was trying to be, I was trying to be the good guy that I am because, you know,
hey, okay, let me go with you to make sure you don't get in trouble, right?
(20:24):
Yeah, see, sometimes we don't learn until after the fact and it's too late.
Fortunately, I made it out of that situation, but yeah, you know, sometimes, you know, and
the thing is you can go with good intentions sometimes and nothing good come of it and only
end up in a bad position.
(20:44):
So, I mean, the thing is you take risks with everything you do.
That's fair.
Yeah.
I want to say that I had thought about with your book and actually when you first posed
the book, which I, for the record, published, did the layout, did the editing, did the interior,
(21:06):
it is a righteous pen publications book, it is available wherever books are sold and
I also wrote the forward.
So, if you need to look up different things in order to find the book, you can find it.
And what I know about the history of psychotherapy, because I have done research in that particular
area, research and psychotherapy really does reveal that it was by men, for men.
(21:33):
I never really thought until you raised the point that it was raised and developed within
a certain narrative of masculinity that's not necessarily helpful.
So, like, for example, I'm saying they're going all right, it's very well known that psychotherapy
and the medical institution really is often not very favorable to women.
(21:55):
But it never really occurred to me that it's really not made for a specific gender.
It's made based on certain ideals of certain things.
So, recognizing that, and recognizing that sometimes that stuff always really does not
work.
(22:17):
What are some ways that a partner can help facilitate better mental health in somebody who
might be going through something?
And once again, we acknowledge that it can be different for people, but what are some
specific things that maybe can be universal, that can be appreciated by somebody?
A lot of time when it actually comes to that, just the fact of having the feeling that someone's
(22:44):
actually there for you, whether it be a romantic relationship, a best friend, even a parent,
there are roles everyone takes in those parts, and they're going to alter significantly.
But the biggest thing is being there, just knowing you have someone, I mean, in that aspect,
(23:10):
you know, if you don't have it, I do type of situation.
And it's a mutual support, a mutual benefit.
You take the good, bad, and ugly.
There's no real right way to do it, but I know you're honest with me.
I know where your loyalty lies.
I don't have to question that.
(23:32):
Those are the biggest things for me personally as far as, like, romantically or aromatically
in our case.
Maritally.
Yes.
So as you were talking, I ended up having a question as Leanne was talking about the history
(23:56):
of psychotherapy, and I was thinking when you were saying it was created by men for men, and
I'm here thinking, okay, but not all men, I'm assuming it was created by white men for
white men.
Yeah.
Oh, German, oh, okay, yeah, German white men.
(24:17):
So this actually is no longer a question, but it's kind of just a comment and a compliment
over because I've read the Breaking the Silence book.
It's very good.
I like how it's very concise, and it's to the point really keeps, like, as somebody who
(24:38):
I do enjoy reading books, but sometimes topics don't always necessarily grab my attention.
So the fact that it's like short and concise, it's very, very helpful.
I just wanted to comment or compliment you on the fact that you really don't necessarily
take sides of like the reason why men are having mental health crises.
(24:59):
So going back to what Leanne was saying about the history of psychotherapy, I know that there
have been explanations throughout history of like why people are the way they are, and some
people tend to focus on these like grand cosmic reasons of like, oh, maybe it's upbringing,
(25:20):
maybe it's...
Financial status.
Financial status, it could be like...
rejection of some girl 30 years ago, or even that it like they mistakenly pointing it
to like a racial category or something like that, but then I've also read like works
in this field where it's very individualized.
(25:42):
It's like, okay, basically go through your life and figure out like what choices you've
made led you to this situation, but I love how you don't really put a reason why people
are dealing with mental health in your book.
You're just saying, hey, this is a problem.
It doesn't matter if it's the result of individual choices you've made.
(26:03):
It doesn't matter if it's a result of, you know, the effect that society has had on you.
You basically are just like, we're not pointing fingers, we're just finding solutions.
And so I wanted to applaud you for that.
Thank you.
I definitely appreciate that.
That's one reason I set it up to be more of a workbook.
(26:23):
That's exactly that reason.
Yeah, you know, a lot of environmental factors can go into play, but there's also the fact
sometimes it has nothing to do with it.
Just because I grew up poor and native, does it mean that my struggle with mental health
(26:44):
was only because of that?
And you know, you can try to blame it on everything you want to.
You know, abusive parents, whatever.
Yeah, all those factors can definitely play a part, but and the biggest thing is realizing
it.
You know, personally, I never realized, you know, my parents were huge narcissists and adulterers
(27:08):
to the matrix, right?
I didn't know about that part of it.
How many kids do we know of floating around?
Well, but I didn't know that they were committing adultery.
I just figured they were.
Oh no, just because, you know, chasing less.
It's a whole thing, you know, being a hoe.
(27:30):
Yeah, right.
But, you know, versus, you know, growing up middle class and still having bad parents, you
know, you're not going to learn a lot of the skills necessary, you know.
Me, if I wanted something nice, I had to go make it, you know, versus, you know, I mean,
I was in the hood.
(27:51):
I was in super nice places too.
It didn't make a difference where I was.
You know, I mean, yeah, sure, that can play a role, but it doesn't define you as an individual.
You make your own story out of that.
Okay.
So if you want to go do something stupid and go shoot up a school or something, I'm going
to blame battle my parents or my upbringing.
(28:13):
You can't blame it entirely on that because this is where some of those mental health problems
that could have been and should have been addressed from a much earlier stage.
You start running into issues like that and they try to blame it so we don't know.
No, you can't because at some point whether logical or not, it becomes a personal decision
(28:34):
to go do something.
It's your personal decision to go and pick this book up and get some of the help that you
may need.
You know, I mean, this, and the thing is anyone can use it.
It's aimed for men because I know what I went through and my situation.
(28:54):
So I felt like if I did something to make a difference, even if it's a small one, I'm going
to go do that.
You know, anyone here can pick this up and go through it.
Yeah, it's geared towards men, but you'll see a lot of things that will kind of resonate
with you and you'll be able to work through and kind of journal with it.
You know, whether you use the book, you know, most of us here at this table are aware of
(29:19):
our situations and what we struggle with.
Not everyone is.
So sometimes just having it down in front of you can be a bigger help than, you know,
try to explain it to someone else.
So this is sort of related to the thing I said before, but it's like your book really has
(29:42):
a no BS approach where, so I guess to give some background, I have been seeking professional
help myself for like several years now.
I have been studying it just on my own trying to address some personal issues and over
time I've like collected the language and I've, you know, heard different theories from
(30:06):
people, but going back to what you said about placing blame, it's, I feel like in my experience,
because my experience is going to be different from everybody else's, but in my experience,
it seems like the trend is to try and place blame on something.
We want to find a reason that something happened and almost like, sure, our accountability,
(30:31):
our responsibility for how we're feeling.
And so I really like that in your book.
You basically, you know, you completely bypass that and you're just like, no, you need to
be, you say it in not so many words, but you basically take the tone of, it doesn't
matter why you ended up this way.
We can't be blaming ourselves for what happened to us anymore.
(30:54):
We have to take responsibility for ourselves even if what happened to us was not our faults.
We still have to take the responsibility and move towards healing, move towards something
better.
And I really like that you take that approach because it can be very easy to point, to point
the blame at shortcomings with everybody else and to quote something that minister Nik
(31:18):
is always saying, you point one finger at somebody else, but there's three fingers pointing
back at you.
And yeah, so I just, I just think that that's a really great perspective to have because
it seems to be, at least in my experience again, the road least traveled and it is possibly
(31:40):
the most important way to start dealing with mental health.
Without assigning blame and just taking personal responsibility regardless of what happened
to you or the choices you've made is a very good approach that I feel like is a rarity
in these circles where mental health is being talked about.
(32:04):
So in talking about all this stuff and you mentioned you had a toxic ex which were not any
of us going to deny that as a fact in this room.
So I'm sure everybody kind of wonders, you know, how did we kind of meet?
Oh, well, yeah, no.
So we actually met on a trash shite.
(32:27):
Can I say the name of it on here?
Ok
No.
All right, either it was meetme or tinder one of the two.
I'm pretty sure it was meetme.
I haven't been on tender.
Yeah, I wasn't going to say no.
Tinder was not my scene
So we were being really awkward at first because we weren't really talking.
It was just kind of, hi, hey, what's up?
(32:50):
You know, I think we had, you know, it's sent a couple messages back and forth or whatever.
And I was like, you know, hey, yo, we should go like me for coffee or something.
And I just had a good feeling about you.
It wasn't a really physical attraction at that point.
It was, I was coming out of a really bad situation, is what I'm going to call it.
(33:13):
And you know, as we got to know each other a little better, we, we still never found that
coffee, by the way, until a few years later.
No, we've still been to Starbucks.
Well, I mean, we're not going to do the ice cream with coffee in it at chick-fil-a as
coffee anyway.
It's still coffee, either way, you say it.
(33:34):
I don't care what you say.
I'm going to happily disagree with you.
Call me here today.
No, just make it's fine.
Thank you for the offer, but hi.
We were supposed to initially.
I'm sorry.
It's okay.
I have other drugs.
And by that, I mean, my caffeine and nicotine.
(33:56):
Okay.
Thank you for clarifying that because that would have to get in that.
I don't.
Well, the thing is, and with, you know, exactly what I mean, nicotine and caffeine are my absolute
go-to's.
It prevents me from popping heads in a literal and figurative sense to a degree.
Okay.
(34:16):
Anyway.
I mean, you know how you just want to like hit somebody on the head sometimes.
It's like, you know, get loved.
So, um, kind of relate some of what you had said and tell where I was.
I had been at the time that we met.
(34:39):
I guess I was kind of in a situationship myself, but I didn't, yeah, pretty much, but I didn't
realize that that's what it was.
I had actually never heard that term until you heard the term situationship.
Now I'd never heard of it before you mentioned it.
And I would supposedly see the guy for over a year.
(35:02):
And my first hint, something was wrong was that previous July, I had a dream that he was
cheating on me and I even saw the person it was with.
And that made me notably paranoid and what happened was we just had a whole thing happen
at sanctuary.
So I went, oh, maybe I'm just having a bad time, you know, people think of spiritual gifts
(35:26):
are fun, not really.
And I didn't end things because there really wasn't a whole lot to end.
I just kind of kept dragging it out.
And right after my dog died, he was all over the internet lamenting his ex-girlfriend who
apparently he had still been involved with.
But to tell the whole story, I don't really know what happened.
(35:49):
Because he never came clean with me about it.
I did confront him about a couple times, but he never came clean with me about it.
And so I don't really know what happened or what was going on.
But I reached a point, I dyed my hair black right before you and I met.
I said, hey, I'm going to take this plunge.
(36:11):
Let's do this.
And then this guy is messaging me on there talking to me.
And, you know, hey, I'll talk to you again tomorrow and he didn't.
And tomorrow came about two to three weeks later and then it was, you know, hey, do you want
to go get coffee or something?
And my mind told me no, but my mouth said yes.
(36:36):
My brain was like, no, he's too young.
And out of my mouth, hey sure, okay.
And we never went as he pointed out.
We actually never made it out for coffee, but we didn't meet for a while.
We met what we met in like January because then you got COVID and I was in a car accident.
(36:59):
And so then we kind of kept talking though.
We still were talking in there.
We kind of kept procrastinating things.
I don't think either of us were really full comfortable actually meeting each other at
that.
Right.
I don't really think that we were ready.
But we were just, you know, kind of like it was kind of like an internet friendship about
more.
(37:19):
Yeah.
And then we finally met and we went out and we never stopped.
How pretty much this out of the story went.
And one day a few months later on TikTok of all places, our TikTok inbox, we started
talking about getting married.
Yeah.
But we had had a conversation with my lesbian friend Candace briefly like a little bit before
(37:47):
that and it just became like an ongoing joke.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, we were at a gas station and I should fill in here.
We spent a lot of time at gas stations.
I never have been to a gas station so much as I have been since we met and she was commenting
on how different you looked and on how much better you were, how much happier you were now
(38:10):
that you were out of that other relationship and she was like, hey, you know, we all going
to do anything.
And I think she was telling about getting married too.
That was the thing.
And we had just been saying, hey, you know, we're done out going to, you know, the courthouse
and kind of take care of this thing.
And that like became a thing after that.
And then we eventually did go to the courthouse and we did get the papers and then we held
(38:33):
on to them for a year.
Everybody kept getting sick or COVID or getting, you were sick.
But we all kind of had our issues and then one day this one across the table for me, minister
(38:55):
Nick, who loves to do weddings, anybody looking for an officiant?
I got you.
Did our ceremony and then we all went to cook out and played cards against humanity which
sounds just like us.
(39:16):
So in that and in what we're saying because we have both pointed out toxic relationships
or bad relationships in the past and in parallel in your book, how has this helped your mental
health, this particular relationship or this particular thing because you were in it
enough to one take the plunge?
(39:38):
The fact, I never thought I was going to get married was the first immediate thing that
crossed my mind.
I'm like, no, mentally, I'm screaming no, right?
You've all done it.
My body?
Yes.
I think it was kind of the opposite.
(40:04):
I knew we were destined for better.
I just didn't know exactly how I knew that.
I would have divine intervention if you will.
Yeah, you put a spell on me though.
I would have a spell on you.
(40:25):
I hate you for this.
So for our listeners, I did not put a spell on him.
Go on.
Totally.
I do not practice witchcraft in any form.
Go on.
Okay, but you get the gist of what I'm saying and how it could feel like it because sometimes
(40:45):
the best things come out of nowhere, but then again, how so do the worst ones.
I found out both of those spectrums.
And that's fair.
So now I'm here hanging out with you guys and watching my friends poke each other.
It started.
(41:06):
So I will also put in here that, I mean, even though I had been married before for our listeners,
and if you've been listening, I actually started the podcast the year that my first husband
died toward the end of the year.
And I've pretty much gone through a lot of that process on the air.
I've gone through a lot of that process.
(41:28):
My favorite episode to this day that I ever did for the podcast is say hello to heaven,
which was in the first season and I did it with Julie Harvey.
And we talked about a couple of experiences that we had with the spirit around death.
In other words, knowing that death was imminent with people and that remains my favorite episode
to this day.
(41:49):
But I really did not expect to get married again.
I was, you know, and a lot of people might find that I'd because when my first husband
died, I was only 37.
And I'm pretty much going on the premise first of all that I had had enough because it was
a very, very long marriage and it was kind of arduous.
But I think in a bigger sense, I didn't really think I'd find anybody.
(42:11):
And I think that we had talked about it and you probably don't even remember the conversation.
But we were talking about checking boxes and what we were looking for.
And I said, if we just keep checking box after box after box, you said, yeah, that is kind
of a limited scope.
And so then you get into the dating realm like I did and you're so markedly different
(42:33):
from everybody else because you don't fall into the heteronormative categories.
So you all think, you know, the first thing I wanted is a dick pic.
I did not.
And you did not get one of those for me for over a year.
That was on a dare.
That was on a dare.
(42:53):
I mean, we were going to say that that wasn't just because, just because that was on a dare
and you went bad.
And so you don't ever back down from a challenge.
But it was like, I started telling them that I had seen better.
And, you know, which is totally probably not the normal response.
(43:14):
And I mean, you know, I remember asking somebody, what am I supposed to say to this?
Okay, it's like, there it is.
Okay, today, you know, what am I supposed to do now?
It's offensive.
Oh, look at gherkin.
Okay, but you know, it's fine.
It's just, you know, I really did not expect a gherkin.
I was going to say a Berkins of it and society.
(43:37):
Oh, got it.
You know, I was just really pretty much assuming that I wasn't going to find anybody or that
really nothing was going to come out of anything.
And so you were definitely a surprise.
Oh, yeah.
You were too.
You were too.
You were not a survivor.
We were not each other.
Okay.
And I'm also going to throw that actually out there in terms of mental health.
(43:58):
And I think that this is an important thing to say is neither one of us was each other's
type.
And the fact when I went out with you the first time or two, I think it was after the second
time I went to Julie and Julie, I said to Julie, you know, he's not my type.
And she said, well, what are you going to do?
And I sat there and I thought about it and I said, you know, what I'm going to see where
(44:18):
it goes.
And the reason for that is because sometimes our type is just not good for us.
Our type is based on those earlier patterns, whether it was what we grew up with or those
first relationships that we had or often many times trying to get something from somebody
that they can't always get for us.
(44:39):
And maybe it's not always and maybe it's not everybody.
And maybe once again, that's not everybody's situation.
But I kept getting treated the same way by everybody who was my quote unquote type.
And it's because I had bad taste.
And I don't even know if I'm going to say I had bad taste or I had taste that wasn't for
(45:02):
me.
Maybe they were perfectly fine for somebody else.
Maybe they went on to another relationship.
Okay, I'm going to say probably not, but you know, maybe they went on and they found somebody
else and they were perfectly fine and it worked okay.
But for me, it didn't.
And they weren't right for me.
(45:23):
And they weren't helping me in my own mental health.
They were kind of magnifying it.
So you were being gaslighted.
I was being gaslighted.
And I'm also going to say though that I think that it really is a testament that when we
are in relationships that maybe aren't always what we expect or what we anticipate, we
can really find something that helps us to grow mentally rather than repeating patterns.
(45:51):
And so kind of piggyback off of that.
I will say there's probably a difference between type and compatibility because I have only
dated twice and my type is essentially dorky artistic.
That's kind of like the broad umbrella.
The first one was not talk about it.
I think I talked about it on like an earlier episode.
(46:12):
Yeah, so go listen to that when I won't rehash it.
I think it is the asexual one.
Probably.
Welcome to the spectrum.
I'm the spectrum of it.
Yeah.
Probably the asexual one.
And I'm running through trauma one of those.
Or both.
Anyway, just listen to the product podcast.
But the relationship I'm in now is significantly healthier and it was because I got into this
(46:35):
relationship that I was able to confront some of the issues I still had from past relationships
like thinking that my current partner was going to be upset at me for being too busy
because I wasn't making enough time for them.
Which I mean, we both have busy lives.
That's not a thing, but it hasn't been an issue.
We understand we're both adults.
(46:56):
We have schedules things to do.
So that's fine.
But kind of circling back to what you were saying about vulnerable or mutual vulnerability
Brad, that's definitely an important thing because not to get into their business, but
they've also been through stuff where they've had to we've basically had to confront it
(47:16):
together.
And one of happen had we one not inter into this relationship, but two not been upfront
about like, hey, so you didn't do anything.
But my brain's being mean to me thinking I'm in this bad situation still, even though it's
a good situation.
So I just wanted to give you a heads up that my brain is being mean.
It is not you.
So.
(47:37):
Especially when relationships, they base everything off of their past relationships, which is
unhealthy in itself.
Yeah, that's what we've all got trauma from some sort of relationship.
If you don't, kudos to you, you will eventually.
Good luck, right?
(47:58):
Yeah, shut.
Oh, nothing.
I'd like to call you out on that one.
Because you don't have any relations.
No, relationships.
Not like of a romantic, but no, but I am going to say that doesn't mean that you haven't
had relationship trauma.
Yeah, everyone.
And so just to say you didn't date somebody longer than a month doesn't mean that you haven't
(48:22):
had any relationship.
Oh, it is.
It is.
It is.
You're dead because you tried it.
You didn't like it.
You know, it's it was that, you know, I'm going to say I'm not going to say you didn't
do it.
That's not fair.
You did, but I mean, to be fair though, but you have had really bad.
It's somebody like that I've been traumatized from that experience, so.
(48:47):
But, you know, to be fair, you know, you do have experience with different traumas because
you still have had relationships and we're not going to segue into this, but the whole
idea that if you haven't had a quote unquote romantic relationship means you know nothing
about relationships is not fair.
And it's not true.
But anyway, everyone has had some type of issues.
(49:11):
And they tend to bring some type of previous trauma.
Whether it, I mean, and it can influence friendships, romantic interests, you know, work,
yeah, even then, you know, you can feel like super close and cool with somebody and then
they just stab you in the back versus, you know, the person you may not talk to, you
(49:33):
know, because you'll have a mutual interest or benefit from a situation that's necessarily
mean it's healthy.
I think there's a long line distinguish, but that's a whole other conversation and it's
going to be different for everyone.
There's a lot of things that we do, even though we have great, amazing relationships with
(49:56):
people.
You know, sometimes we don't do things all the right way, sometimes, you know, so sometimes
you have those bad traits, but they're also redeeming qualities that you, that you go
and play a role in there too.
You know, it's like, you know, we had a lot of hurtfuls and a lot of boys had, you know, you
(50:17):
know, still do.
I think we have a lot of differences.
We do, but we also find a common ground and move past some of those things.
It's like, okay, well, what can I do to be better for you?
You know, and I mean, you know, we both make compromises.
And that's one thing a healthy partner should do, you know, because if you care about your
(50:43):
person, you're, okay, if I feel like I'm not doing something right, I'm going to come to
you and ask, hey, what, you know, what can I do to be better for you?
You, I mean, how do we do that?
I don't know.
We do.
I already know what we're going to call that one that we're going to do on relationship
hurt, so called everybody hurts.
(51:04):
Everybody hurts after the song by REM, but anyway, anyway, usually or all the time, I typically
turn over the final thoughts to my guests.
And so we're going to do that now, giving everything we've talked about.
(51:26):
And this has actually turned into a really interesting episode.
What are some final thoughts that you would all like to leave with our listeners?
Enjoy life, first and foremost.
Seek wellness and help if you need it, whether it being your partner, you know, or you know,
(51:47):
prayer or whatever the case is, that we can all use a sense of some type of peace.
And you know, if you don't feel appreciated, make it known, but do it in an appropriate
way.
And make yourself be seen, because sometimes that's all it takes.
(52:09):
It's a kind of piggyback off of that.
I will say, don't be afraid to enter into new relationships.
I know sometimes we can have apprehension about getting into new romantic ones or even
platonic ones or I mean, Charlie and I are going through an employment situation where, you
(52:31):
know, we're kind of worried about getting into a worse job than we left.
But you know, we kind of need to work to live.
So we have to take a chance on different people, different types of relationships, different
environments even.
So yeah, don't be afraid to explore life happens.
(52:52):
There's a good chance you will probably get hurt again, but the hurt is not the end.
I mean, I have a lot of thoughts running through my head.
It's trying to land on one.
Okay.
Well, we're going to use my favorite word nuance and yes, my other favorite, my favorite
(53:14):
word is context, my second favorite word is nuance.
We're favorite, right?
They are related, yes.
So I guess in that vein, understand that life is so much more complicated than we realize
and we want to admit to and that even if you can't see all of the nuances that are before
(53:35):
you, just acknowledging some of them, the fact that it's like, hey, you know, not all men
want to bottle it up or are comfortable bottling it up, you know, or, you know, not all therapists
are going to fall asleep on you as you talk to them about stuff that's on your mind or
(53:57):
which I still think is ridiculous.
Yeah, but just acknowledging that stuff isn't all black and white.
I mean, I think that's a big thing that we cover here on the Kingdom Now podcast is
that there's just so many complexities and as much as we want simple answers, there isn't
going to be a simple answer and that's probably for the best.
(54:21):
So how can everybody get in contact with all of you?
Well, you can reach me at empiretransport.co, I'm also on TikTok.
I've got links to those on my website, feel free to reach out to me there and if you have
any, you know, logistics or freight needs, I'm your go to.
(54:48):
Hello, minister Charlie.
Minister Charlie here, I'm tired.
You can get in contact me.
The best way to do that is through my website.
It's beloved-not-broken.com.
My contact page is actually called questions, but you can literally just submit anything
you want to ask me there.
(55:08):
I am, I guess most active on Instagram at this point other than that, I really don't have
like a social media presence.
Hey, minister Nik here again, again, I have a blog called Nikfits.com.
That's N-I-K-F-I-T-S.com.
(55:30):
You can reach me through my contact page, through my linktree on there.
I am most active on TikTok and BlueSky currently.
I may get more back into Insta at some point.
Whatever I do not see myself going back to you, but you never know.
But if you want to reach me just about anywhere else on there, that's also fine.
(55:53):
Well, I thank you all for sitting through this and for talking today.
I'm very grateful to our audience as well.
And if you would like the book that we spoke of earlier, I recommend the book.
It is breaking the silence, a journey into men's mental breakthrough that's breaking the
silence, a journey into men's mental breakthrough by Brad Loggins.
(56:15):
It is available on Amazon.com and both paperback and ebook wherever books are sold.
So go and search for that today.
Also if you would like to follow me on patheos, my column leadership on fire, feel free to
visit the site at patheos.com/blogs/leadershiponfire.
(56:37):
And there is also our church blog, Write the Vision, which you can access
youarewelcomeinthisplace.wordpress.com
youarewelcomeinthisplace.wordpress.com
where you can read what Minister Nik Charlie and I have to say about a whole
bunch of topics.
So go and check that out today.
(56:58):
If you are interested in connecting with me, connect with me across social media @kingdompowernow
that's @kingdompowernow
I'm on Facebook, TikTok, Twitter, Blue Sky, Instagram, Wordpress, wherever else.
Go and check me out today @kingdompowernow and let's have a conversation on what's
on your mind.
Also, if you'd like to learn more about the world of counterculture Christianity, feel free
(57:20):
to visit my website at www.kingdompowernow.org
That's www.kingdompowernow.org
If you're interested in seminary, that is entirely affordable, can be done from anywhere in the
world and is completely accessible.
Check out Apostolic Covenant Theological Seminary at acts176.org.
That's acts176.org.
(57:41):
And if you are looking for a place where you can find your found family because we are here
waiting, check out the work of Sanctuary across North Carolina and soon to be in South Carolina.
Welcomeinthisplace.org.
If you have any questions that are not answered on site, feel free to reach out and we will
get back to you.
And this is Apostle Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you in closing that mental
(58:04):
health matters for all.
So make sure that you are doing the work that you need to do to find the answers that you
seek.
Until next time, be blessed.
Thank you for joining us on Kingdom Power Now.
I pray that it is proven to be a blessing in your life, offering an on time word for you.
(58:26):
To learn more about this work, ask a question, submit feedback, advertise with us, order
suggested items, be a guest, or donate to support this work.
As our podcast is supported by people like you, visit my website which contains essential
information, projects, and other points of contact around the way.
(58:48):
at kingdompowernow.org
Also, if you would like to visit sanctuary international fellowship tabernacle, sit in one
of our North Carolina or South Carolina locations.
Check out welcomeinthisplace.org
Until next time, this is Dr. Lee Ann Marino reminding you that the Kingdom of God is within you
(59:08):
and that means the Kingdom is now.
(dramatic music)
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