Knot Your Average Questions

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Episode Transcript

Kari (00:00):
Well, welcome to 2025 with our new name.
What is it?
Naughty by nature.
Naughty by nature.
Why are we naughty by nature?
We've been rolling with this fora while because we just, we
needed a name change.
It wasn't working well.
And one of the things we like todo best, remember things aren't
working well.
We change.
Yeah.
We adapt.
We overcome.
And the same way we preach aboutrelationships, we change, we

(00:20):
adapt, we overcome.
Yeah.
And here we are doing that.
Look at your cute little segue.
See, that was a good one.
That was a really good one.
We're sitting here like, Ididn't know where you're going
to go with that.
That was great.
We're redoing intros over andover again.
That one's stuck.
I feel like that one.
Isn't it funny that you'restuck, but mine didn't.
Yeah, that's typical.
So weird.
So weird.
So no, uh, we, we are welcominginto 2025.

(00:43):
February of 2025.
Hey, you know what?
We're here.
Damn it.
We're here.
Um, but yes.
So what our hope is within thename change that is actually,
there is no change where we'rethe same, um, quirky ass, weird
couple that is here to bring youinformation.
Uh, we, we remain to be ourraunchy, but informative podcast

(01:06):
and, and literally there is nodifference other than, yeah, we
adjusted the name.
That's been my favorite thing isbeing hailed as educationally
raunchy.
Who coined us as that?
I feel like I did, but maybenot.
It must've been a critic of somesort.
Oh, a critic.
Couldn't have been from theinside.
It had to have been from theoutside.
None, none of us was going tothink of that.

(01:26):
Right.
But we've been, we've enjoyedit.
So far, I mean, we're doing goodwith the change and, uh, we're
excited to bring you the samefun shit episodes that we've
been doing.
And when today we're actuallykind of taking it back to
basics, we're going to get iton, we're going to get into this
all in good time, but today'sall about going back to basics.

(01:47):
It's a new year.
We tend to do that anyway.
Yeah, we kind of do.
I mean, this is what our likethird year technically.
Yeah.
We've been going since 2022.
Yeah.
So third, third year with theshow.
Um, But again, like we're justreally here to continue to bring
the information to you.
Um, some of it's updated andsuper relevant and some of it is

(02:09):
just whatever we really feellike talking about in the time.
Um, we do get a lot of questionsfrom y'all, which is insanely
helpful.
Um, because sometimes I feellike we've like ran a topic into
the ground and then we're stillgetting questions around the
same topic.
It's one of my favorites,honestly, because that just,
that makes me feel like ateacher.
Yeah.
Reviewing the same thing overand over again to teach the

(02:31):
incoming class and then justtrust that the outgoing classes
knowing what they're doing fromthen on out.
So I like the fact that we kindof proved to be that conduit for
people to expand their knowledgein terms of kink and in terms of
relationships.
But I think it also gives us anopportunity to like alter how we
Give y'all the information rightbecause if we've said something
multiple times, but it's stillnot clicking then How can we

(02:55):
better ourselves or alter it oradjust it so it can kind of fit
every like?
Individual that's listening tous which isn't always easy and
coming from me.
That's an educator likeSometimes it takes the right way
of being said or the rightperson to say it before it
clicks.
Yeah, so that's kind of what wehope to do.
And, and we're also not tryingto like drown you in the same

(03:15):
material, but sometimes we dofeel it beneficial to bring up
old material.
So then we can maybe say it in anew light in hopes that it will
then click or connect with you.
Especially whenever people areasking similar questions.
And this, this falls also intonew listeners.
We've had a huge influx.
And the last six months or so ofa bunch of new listeners who now

(03:36):
we're starting to get emails.
It's like, Hey, listen to theshow.
I've heard y'all talk aboutthis, but dive in goes over
anal.
Do y'all have an episode thatgoes over how to talk about my
fantasies?
Do y'all have an episode thatgoes over?
What the fuck ever it might be.
I mean, at this point we kind ofprobably do, you know, it's just
a question of, do you want tocatalog them that detail?

(03:57):
Yeah, that's fair.
I would much rather sit down andbe like, great, you know what?
Let's have another conversationaround it and see what we can
come up with.
So that's what we want to dotoday is we've compiled probably
our 10, I would say most askedquestions about kink.
Yeah, very specific topic.
People are super interested inkink.
I know right now people aregoing, we don't care about

(04:19):
communicating clearly.
We care about the spicy shit.
Give us the kinky shit.
It's all the fucking smutty bookreaders out there.
That's what that is.
That has to be like, what dothey call it?
An up, uptake?
And uptick, there's been like amassive loads of individuals
that are now talking about likesexual kinks and wants through

(04:40):
this, like increase in fantasybooks or any fancy books, but
like sexual book re emergence,the popularity is smut.
Yeah.
And we are here for it.
Well, that's the thing too, islike, I get to talk to a lot of
ladies and a lot of fuckingwomen read who knew, but a lot
of it, but they don't talk aboutit because of what they're
reading.
I know.
And I do have like the veryfortunate.

(05:03):
Um, career choice that I get tosit down and just talk dirty
with these ladies, butespecially when you're with a
client for hours on it.
Yeah.
I'm with you for four hours.
What the hell else are wesupposed to talk about?
But like smut is one of thenumber one topics of discussion,
which has led to some of myclients that know that I have a
podcast that know what you and Iare doing as a couple, and it
has encouraged them to startasking questions.

(05:25):
And I have answered more kinkrelated questions in my career
in this last, building theclient.
It could also help that forking.
I know, right.
It could also help that peopleknow that I'm doing it so they
feel comfortable talking to meabout it.
Right.
But I do think that the increasein like smut books and the
popularity of it is gettingpeople to start asking

(05:46):
questions.
And it comes on the same ascircles that I run around in
socially.
Where once people learn what Ido, um, as, as this, as this
business, once people learnwhere we are, then they start to
open up real quick.
And it's really funny cause I'llhave some men that I talked to
who on the outside, you wouldnot.

(06:08):
Paint them as kinky at all.
They're very light, cut and dry.
And that's like my socialcircles and it comes to the bit
like my business and talkingwith them the second they find
out it immediately turns into aconversation.
Well, wait a minute.
I heard about, wait, I can talkabout this.
Exactly.
Now I'm trying to shift.
I'm always trying to ship theirperspectives because you know
me, I'm a, like I considermyself a feminist.

(06:30):
Um, I'm not a guys, guy.
Uh, I don't want to think I'mmore masculine than.
You are sure we can explore thatat a different thing.
However, my point, my pointbeing is that you have a lot of
these guys, their first responsethey have is like, Oh, you do
that.

(06:50):
How can I get my wife to dothis?
And I've heard you say thatactually.
Yeah.
My response is the same everytime as you don't, you don't get
them to do anything.
Don't approach the conversationis how do I convince someone to
Yeah.
I mean, there's not really muchequity in that.

(07:11):
That's more of, that's to me,that's like a selfish
introduction.
Very.
Ooh, you're kinky?
Cool.
How can I make this happen?
Yeah.
I respect the fact that you'reinterested in kink and fantasy
and all that, but I think thatyou should first have a
conversation with your partneraround like maybe your
fantasies.
Right.
Or even a talk with yourself.
Am I only doing this for me?
Yeah.
Am I doing this for us?

(07:32):
Yeah.
Right.
It's okay to enjoy things onyour own.
Like it's okay to be like, youknow what I've, I've thought
about, I've watched videos onthis.
Here's, here's maybe thefantasies I have.
Here's the acts that I wouldlike to engage in.
How can I bring that to mypartner?
How can you bring it into therelationship versus how can I
get them to do this to me?
Another thing that I find reallyinteresting is that men don't

(07:54):
really talk about this type ofstuff to other men.
It takes, it takes, it's reallyrare.
It's so, I, I did not knowgrowing, growing up in my head,
men were just like, The biggestgossip sharing stories and like
what I do with my partner thatit could not be further from the

(08:14):
truth.
It's women, women will talkabout anything.
Clients.
I know about your husband's, Iknow, I've heard all about it.
I've heard everything, you know,the size, shape, girth, all of
it.
I know your clients been around,but like.
And I just grew up thinking thatthat was men that talked like

(08:35):
that.
Right.
And it's not, it's women.
Right.
And I'm not, I fucking love it.
But it is women that share thesestories.
For the most part.
Yes, I would be fucking bored ifI was a dude.
It has, it had, to me, it has alot to do with so many men being
territorial.
And thinking of have thatmindset of like, this is mine.
And they're like very covetousabout it.
And they're very like, this ismine.

(08:56):
This is my treasure that theydon't want anyone else to know
about what's going on with them.
And also it leads into themtalking or not talking about
perhaps issues or problemsbecause they've been trained to
believe that talking about theirissues is a sign of weakness.
And if you discuss it withsomeone that it makes you less
of a man.
Do you think that's what it is?
I think that's in part.

(09:16):
Yeah.
I think there's a lot ofvariables that go into it, but
for the most part, like men arenot brought up in an okay way,
like they're not, it's, there'sa lot of, a lot of toxic
behaviors that go around and I'mnot going to toss out the
trigger word for that, butthere's a lot of toxic behaviors
that come along.
That's one of them with how menare raised, uh, there's a severe

(09:38):
lack of sexual education.
There's a severe lack of likeemotional vulnerability that's
needed within relationships andwith people.
And it's just a shit show for somany out there.
So I have a, I have a like aquick question and then we are
going to actually get into ourtopic.
But it's something I justthought about.
So like, you know, my historyof.
Um, watching sex shows at a veryyoung age, um, we do being very

(10:01):
passionate about it, but Ialways thought that I was
receiving this information aslike a girl that.
Not only needed to protectherself, right?
But be as educated as I couldto, in a sense, benefit my own
safety.
But like, from you, growing upand learning the same
perspective, or, I'm sorry, notthe same perspective, but

(10:22):
watching the same stuff througha different lens.
What do you feel was yourbenefit from watching that type
of stuff?
And do you feel like it alteredwho you are today?
Oh, absolutely.
I do.
So I think that the, the type ofmaterials consumed is probably
what did the trick, uh, becausea lot of the stuff that I
watched growing up, and we've,we've talked about this before.
Yeah.
We've talked about watching realsex.

(10:43):
We've talked about watching, um,like what Dr.
Ruth, yeah, Dr.
Ruth and a lot of these, a lotof these shows and part of what
it provides you.
I.
Think boils down to like, what,what is your, it's hard to do
this as a, as a kid, because as,as growing up, you don't have
the mindset of, I'm trying tolearn as much as I can about
relationships.

(11:03):
You're just like, mine was justsafety.
I just remember being like.
Okay.
What would men be attracted to?
What would men be drawn to?
And let me do the opposite.
And I, and it was literallycoming from a safe, a place of
safety.
Which came from learnedexperience from you.
Yeah.
Right?
So it comes from stuff in thepast of now you have the
mindset, like something createdthat lens of I need to be safe

(11:24):
for men.
Yes.
And so, you know, And so indoing that, it became, that was
your perspective of watching theshow.
That's the lens.
You were, you were viewing itthrough.
Yeah.
So I guess I'm curious about youthough.
What made you have that like, Iwanna watch originally it was
from a purely sexual standpoint,uh, it was, I know what sex is.
I know that I'm not learningabout it.

(11:45):
I wanna know about it.
I don't know anything about it.
What's, what is this?
What is this?
Okay, yeah.
What, what's pleasure about?
And I mean, at a young, as ayoung of an age enough to be
like.
What's masturbation and how doyou do it?
To be like, well, there was apleasure standpoint.
There was a sexualizedstandpoint purely in the
beginning.
Well, yeah, you're a kid.
And then as it started going, aswe started, started watching
more of it, it became more oflike, well, wait a minute,

(12:08):
there's people that do this andthey're able to achieve like,
like these really cool thingslike social circles and they're
able to like, learn how thesetoys are operated.
They're able to learn like allthese different acts.
And I went, that's not what Ihave understood sex to be.
I'd always been told that sexwas this one thing.
And then I've come to find outthat there's this whole area

(12:33):
that sex encompasses that isreally entertaining and that can
be used for good and that can beused to build connection and
communication.
And I think it was probablybecause I watched a lot of those
sex shows from way too young ofan age.
Um, but then going into liketeens.
And being exposed to things likepornography, because I was
exposed to those shows before Iwas ever exposed to pornography.

(12:53):
Same.
So then when I was like firstexposed to like pornography and
stuff, I did have the sense torealize like, cool, this is a,
this is an act.
Yeah, this is actors acting onstage just like they do in
dramas or anything else.
Mm hmm.
So to have that perspective thatshifted to being able to be
like, how can I like use this inmy own life?
How can I use this to createpleasure for other people in my

(13:13):
life?
You know, like, you know, me,that's one of my key concerns.
Anytime we like with sexual, uh,acts or anything like that.
It's always been like, how canwe get the most pleasure for
everybody?
Very like you tell utilitarianprinciples, how can we get the
most pleasure?
And so that's what it was on myperspective of looking through
the lens of pleasure and how doyou achieve it?
Yeah.
It's just like a fucking Lewisand Clark of sex manifest

(13:36):
destiny, explore it all.
So then like, where do you thinkthat growing up the way that you
did being sexually aware thatthe way that you were or brought
or not brought up, but you knowwhat I'm saying?
Um, when did you start takingwith your introduced into like
kink?
So in the getting into like moreof what we consider some of the,

(13:57):
yeah, like I, like we understandwhere we came from and all that
and what shaped us.
But again, like.
Because obviously today we werefocusing on kink, but I'm very
curious as to like, what was oneof the first things that you
understood as kink or what wassomething that you saw the first
time you're like, Oh, that'sdefined as kink.
I have pinpoint that that wouldhave been on an episode of real
sex when I was little and therewas people like dressed in

(14:19):
leather and engaging in impactplay.
Okay.
Oh, I didn't know what it was atthe time.
Sure.
To me, even at that time, likeit was a little scary because it
was like people in leather notshowing their faces and like
being whipped with shit.
Yeah.
And it was like, what the fuckis going on?
Like, I don't know what this is.
Yeah.
This is, this was like a littlebit scary.
Now it wasn't until later theunderstanding of consent, the

(14:41):
understanding of communication,like learning what they're
engaging in.
Uh, would be considered justkink, but it's not something
that was harming these people.
This is something that everybodythat was there and participating
in it wanted to do.
So would you say that you didn'tunderstand that level of kink
until you understood like Theother side of things, right?

(15:04):
Like what they're saying.
Oh yeah.
I don't think that anybody, Idon't think anybody watching
kink from the outside in with noknowledge about what's going on
is going to understand it.
Yeah.
I don't think there's any hopefor them to understand.
I think that it's not until theyactually gain the perspective in
the same way that you gainperspective from any culture,
any group of people, you lookfrom the outside in, you're
going to have.

(15:25):
Your biases that you, that youhave inherently grown up with
the ones that you've formulatedbecause you haven't engaged.
It's the same way that we engagein like cultural understanding.
If we go in and immerseourselves in it, or if we at
least talk to people who engagein it, you gain a better
understanding.
And so it was, yeah, it was forme, it was definitely like, saw
it, didn't know what it was,kind of scared of it, started to

(15:47):
learn more about what it was,started to learn about all the
different angles of it.
And then when.
Oh, this is a really great wayfor people to engage with each
other in a safe manner that theycan explore deeper sides of
themselves and engage in such away that creates not only
pleasure, but oftentimes atherapeutic feeling of release

(16:08):
and ways of feeling just puresatisfaction and happiness in
their lives.
kink could maybe listen to thisepisode?
And what we're about to bediscussing and maybe have a
different perspective.
Yeah.
I would hope so.
Right.
I would hope that if you'resomebody that's, that's like, I
feel like I know what kink is,but I don't engage in kink and

(16:31):
this episode is probably foryou.
Okay.
Um, I think that if you doengage in kink and you listen,
you, maybe you can gain some newknowledge, but if you're talking
about completely having like aparadigm shift that I think that
this would be good for peoplethat are like, I'm not really a
keen person, but I've hadinterest in it.
To really explore maybe some ofyour misconceptions that you
understand or have a lack ofunderstanding for.

(16:54):
Okay.
So Mr.
Like critical thinker, causeyou're really good at gotten
better over, over the time.
Isn't that weird?
So I basically have, I compileda list of questions that not
only viewers or listeners havesent us, but I did go through
and like ask, like, what arethe, some of the most common,
like miss whatever of.

(17:17):
Go ahead.
Misconceptions.
Thank you.
Of kink.
So because you are the doctor,I'm going to go through, and of
course I'm going to have my owntwo cents, but I would like to
ask these questions then to you,um, and then let's just kind of
let it go into discussion.
Okay.
You ready for your first?
So we're doing, we've got like acompilation of like 10

(17:39):
questions, right?
Yeah.
I went through and just made alist of 10.
Like I said, some of them wereones that people had asked us
and some are the ones that I'vejust kind of like searched
online, like most commonmisconceptions of, right?
Yeah.
Okay.
Let's do it.
Okay.
So, the first question, now thisactually came from a listener,
but it says, is kink just aboutsex?
Of this question.

(18:01):
That's why I started with it.
I was like, oh, he loves thisone.
Cause I get to answer thatquestion with a question.
Yeah.
Uh, and you don't have to answerthis question.
It's just, uh, how do you definesex?
That, that's genuinely the firstquestion that I have because
what I've had in myconversations with people is
that whenever they're asked todefine sex, a lot of the time

(18:23):
they're like, Oh, that's, youknow, penis and vagina
penetration.
That's a very narrow scope ofthe word sex.
And even whenever I talk tomembers of the queer community.
Because we don't, you know,remove that penis into vagina
penetration.
Right.
Then they're like, well, it's,you know, some sort of, of act
of which we're playing aroundwith each other's genitals.

(18:43):
Okay, well, we need to broadenour horizons from even that.
Sex is really whatever youdefine it as.
Yeah.
Any engagement that you havewith at least one other person
in terms of this intimacy way.
You could potentially considerit as sex.
So I think that sex can bedefined in a broad, broad
stroke.
Having said that, whenever itcomes to kink, is all kink

(19:05):
sexual?
No, that's a resounding no fromme is not, not all kink is
sexual.
What is it you're deriving fromsome of the kink acts that
you're portraying?
Cause remember if it'sconsidered kinky, then it's just
considered kind of like.
Outside outside the norm.
Yeah, exactly.
So unconventional is whatthey'll call it a lot.
And in Western society, we havea very narrow scope of what sex

(19:29):
is.
So anything being introduced isconsidered outside of the norm,
which is considered kinky.
So like, just not having sex inthe bed, could it be centered?
Yeah, a lot of people would belike, Oh wow, sex on the couch
is super kinky.
And then in the Western culture,we had sex with the window open.
And I think in neighborhoods,there's a lot to consider, but

(19:51):
you can also engage in a numberof acts that would be considered
kink that are not necessarilysexualized, take one of our
favorites, Shibari, for example,I can sit down with you and I
can place a tie on you.
With no intention of engaging insexual activity whatsoever.
More of it being this feelingthat you get of being bound, of

(20:12):
being restrained, the feelingthat I get of restraining you,
the practice in it.
So we can remove thesexualization of it.
We can remove the sex from it.
And just engage in a simple actof what would be considered
kinky.
And that can be spread acrossthe entire board.
So no, a resounding no, not allkink acts.

(20:33):
Is it actually?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, so this is one that Iactually got from online, but I
thought it was a good point tobring up.
And it was saying is BDSM.
Abusive.
But first, can you go ahead andlike, what is BDSM?
Can you, do you remember likebondage?
It's bondage, dominance,submissive, um, masochism,

(20:55):
right?
Like masochism, it is.
No, it absolutely is.
Um, but then, yeah.
Is that then considered abuse?
Here's the fun thing.
Uh, whenever we look at the,see, this to me is going to all
go back to definitions.
How do you define certainthings?
Right.
And so whenever we're looking atthe definition of abuse and

(21:15):
we're looking at like creatingharm for someone, BDSM could
potentially create harm forsomeone.
Um, the key word that we want toput into any of that is, is
consent is the act that you'reengaging in consensual as a
person saying, I would like toexperience, let's go, let's go
with impact play.
Cause that's what a lot ofpeople think of.
But right.
It's like, Oh, you're going toget whipped when hit with a pad

(21:37):
and all that.
Yeah.
That's a form of it.
That's impact play.
Um, and you can create bruisingand you can create.
Like lashings and all that kindof stuff and go with it.
It can generate like pain, butnot everybody sees pain as a bad
thing.
And whenever it's a consensualact between two adults in which

(21:58):
you're not creating lifethreatening harm and what you're
engaging in an act that allowsyou to explore various
sensations, that is notinherently abusive because
remember, whenever we're talkingabout abuse, we're talking
about.
That generation of pain orwhether it be emotional or
physical, and that is unwantedand something that creates harm

(22:20):
within the person's life itselfcreates negative outcomes.
The outcomes typically of BDSMthat we look like when engaged
appropriately and consensuallyaren't going to create those
negative outcomes.
They're going to create positiveoutcomes.
Yeah.
And as someone, um, from my ownexperience that has gone into
the BDSM lifestyle and found it,Very therapeutic.

(22:43):
Um, I've never felt that I wasabused in any way.
Um, because as a personreceiving, we had this like a
beautiful thing called a safeword.
Um, we, we also have the red,the light light system where
we've talked about in the past,we're going to very quickly talk
about it now, right?
Where.
Um, green means go, right?

(23:05):
Whatever act you're doing, Ilove it.
Yellow means I don't mind it,but just don't take it to the
next level, right?
Maybe, maybe, maybe slow downwhere you're at.
It's okay, but don't go, don'tgo further.
And in red, obviously meaningstop, um, and then our added
blue and then our added blue andblue is I'm having an emotional
response for this, whichimmediately typically goes into

(23:25):
like after directly after care,whatever the case may be.
But from someone that has beenon the receiving end from it, I
have never felt that way.
Not not once and also becauseit's From our communication and
the things that we have set inplace.
Yeah.
We see, we see the depictions ofBDSM and we'll stick with
specifically impact play forthis example where people are

(23:46):
tied up and you're looking fromthe outside in, and if you don't
understand what's going on,you're like, Whoa, this person's
being.
like hit or hurt, or they'reeven making noises that I would
associate with somebody beinginjured.
They need to stop doing that.
They're clearly being hurt andreality.
No, what they're engaging in canbe very cleansing for them and
very calming for them.
So so no, uh, not all kink isabusive, but there is

(24:10):
definitely, we have to side notethis.
There is definitely people thatcan, Leverage kink to generate
abuse.
This is the importance of doingthings like vetting the people
that you're going to be engagingwith.
This is the importance of makingsure you're in a safe, a safe
environment.
There's so much to it, which isalso why we try to tell people
don't engage with people thatyou're not comfortable and safe

(24:33):
with and always be vigilant,making sure you're looking out
for others and you're lookingfor red flags.
Yep.
Um, so the next question that Igot, uh, came from one of our,
our listeners.
But I do feel like this is.
It's a big topic, but we have tobe careful with it at the same
time.
But, um, are people into kinkbecause of past trauma?

(24:55):
Yes.
And no.
Yeah.
As I said, let me be carefulbecause it's both.
But I do think that peopleassume that, Oh, I had this
traumatic experience as a child,which then, or any point, it
doesn't have to be childhood atany point, which had then turned
into a kink, but that's notnecessarily the case.
So let me return that with say,say that you did experience
something traumatic as a child.

(25:16):
Okay.
And now because of that trauma,you have developed, uh, this
attraction towards a certaintype of kink.
Why is that bad?
I find it like I'm a reclaimthat shit.
Right?
Like I don't think it's bad, butI, yeah, no, keep going.
Keep going.
I'll stop.
That was, that was, that was a,I think that was a good answer.

(25:37):
A lot of times people canreclaim their power.
They can find a, uh, this niceempowering experience by
engaging and taking back thevery thing that broke through
their defenses in the firstplace, especially whenever it's
something maybe that happened toyou as a child and It created
this like rewiring of your brainthat just destroyed you

(25:58):
emotionally to re explore thatwe have other types of, you
know, therapies that people seewhere there is a version of, of
exposure therapy, where someonesay afraid of heights.
And so they take them up on ahigh building or they do like VR
where you're at the top of thebuilding.
Exposure therapy can be, can behelpful to people.
And the same way.
If you had a traumaticexperience and now you find

(26:21):
yourself attracted to certainkinks as long as they're
consensual and as long as youare not creating a negative
outcome for yourself by engagingin it, no, it's, it's, it's
entirely okay to engage in it.
But yeah, of course that you candevelop kinks off of past
traumas.
I like using the example, uh,because I'm a bourbon drinker.

(26:42):
I always like using the examplethat all bourbon is whiskey, but
not all whiskey is bourbon.
It takes certain things.
There's a broad topic that iswhiskey, but then there's a
subset that is bourbon in thesame way.
Not all traumas become kinks.
And not all kinks are traumas,right?
You can develop kinks that havenothing to do with your past

(27:04):
with your past.
That can be something that youjust saw and said, that looks
fun.
Now, if we did a deep dive, youmight find something that linked
it to an event that occurred toyou.
Could have been negative, couldhave been positive.
Could have been a number ofthings.
Yeah.
I mean, really, we're allsubject to our past anyways,
right?
We can be.
Yeah.
So at the end of that all, likeyou can make that claim.

(27:27):
Like they're not all.
Not all kinks are, are, arederivative of the trauma.
Uh, but I would also ask you torevisit that by saying, even if
some of them are, um, is that abad thing?
Right.
Cause I love what you're sayingis like, we're reclaiming that.
Right.
And then also I, I knowindividuals that have gone
through a traumatic experienceand use that to, like we've said

(27:50):
to reclaim it, but it also needsto come with what we were
talking about just a second agois.
Finding a partner that you feelcomfortable with to try to
reclaim that through while usingthe red light system while
communicating.
I mean, that's one of thereasons why I do feel like this
kink lifestyle can be verytherapeutic.
I mean, even the traumatherapist I'm seeing now, she

(28:14):
has brought up.
Hey, what is a lot?
Have you ever thought aboutgetting into a, you know, impact
play engagement with someonewhere you could.
You know, reclaim some of thetrauma that happened to you in
the past.
And this is my therapist tellingme this.
Like, and I, and I love to hearthat though.
One, it's validating for you andI.
And two, like, It's just, it'sreally helpful and empowering.

(28:38):
I mean, there's actually afriend of ours that obviously we
don't mention names here, butthere's a friend of ours that
went through a breakup where,um, they had this like massive
praise kink, like massive praisekink.
And then, um, after they brokeup with her partner, they were
like, Oh, I'm not doing thatanymore.
I don't, I'm not going to have apraise kink because.

(28:59):
It just reminds me of this otherperson, which to me, I'm like,
fuck that.
Like have a praise kink becauseyou have a praise kink.
Don't like associate that.
You don't necessarily need totie it to one partner.
And so going through some stepsto break that.
Tie that association would benecessary.
Yeah.
Anyways.
Okay.
We're going to go on to the nextone so we can keep in timeline.

(29:20):
Um, does being dominant meanbeing aggressive?
I love this question so much.
There are a million differenttypes of, of doms or dominance
out there.
There really are.
Uh, The thing that we have tokeep in mind whenever it comes
to our dominance, aggressive,they can be, they can also be

(29:43):
soft.
And they're kind of aggressiveor soft to what your needs as
the sub could be, which is oneof the biggest thing are as the
person is that Dom doing thisfor their own selfish reasons,
which it could, or are theydoing it for like, with, for the
relationship, for the dynamic.
For you, are they taking allthat into account?

(30:03):
We've had people we've talked tothat have been like, well, you
know, I wanted to be submissive.
So I got onto something like fatlife and I was looking for a Dom
and I met this guy.
And one of the first things hemessaged me was that was his
expectations of my behaviorsbefore ever entering into any
sort of contractual agreementbefore.
Ever vet any vetting process.

(30:23):
It immediately was like, youwill address me as sir.
All the time you will do, youknow, X, Y, and Z.
And that's what we call redflags.
Yeah, that is aggressively whatwe call red flags.
But that level of aggression isnot OK.
No, but you have to understandthat the, um, the bind or I'm

(30:44):
trying to think of a better wordfor it.
But the connection that a Domand a sub have is not to make
one higher or better than theother.
Most times a Dom's goal is tohelp the sub achieve what they
want to achieve in life.
It's to help them.
It's to better them.

(31:05):
It's not to take over.
It's not to control.
It is, is there to say, I'mgoing to help you with the
things that you are alreadywanting to achieve.
Yeah.
Which is one of the, one of thetopics we discussed.
Remember it like comes to thepower of the sub versus the
power of the Dom.
Yeah.
Power exchanges is willinglygiven.
Let's be correct.

(31:25):
Willingly.
Yes.
It's you're not entering into apower dynamic in which power is.
Taken or demanded.
Ultimately, the initial start isgoing to be willingly given.
And then from there it becomes,here's how you'll talk to me.
Here's going to be your tasks,your punishments, all of that
kind of stuff that comes afterthose initial engagements of

(31:48):
here's what I'm looking for.
Let's vet you out.
Let's figure out if this isgoing to be a good fit.
Now, green light go.
Now we can enter into thataggressive behavior or that more
aggression if it's negotiatedout.
Correct.
Okay.
So then, um, really back intothe same thing, but on the
opposite side of it issubmission a sign of weakness.

(32:11):
Then I think that you would be agood person to answer this.
Yeah.
Um, so as someone as myself,that is a very loud outspoken
dominating like personalitytype.
Um, I love to be submissive atcertain times because for me it

(32:35):
is that sense of like, I'm goingto let myself go.
Someone that is very.
Um, in charge or dominating,never allows themselves the
permission to just let go.
Um, it can be a very cleansingexperience.
And the very first time that Iwas ever submissive was with

(32:56):
you.
And then it, it sparked this,like, Inner child in me that
wanted to be taken care of,didn't need it, but desperately
desired to be taken care of.
And I understand that I am moreof like the dominant role all

(33:16):
the time.
So I will find times to besubmissive.
Yeah.
That's where you fit in as a, asa business owner, as somebody
that like is taking care ofpeople all the time.
You're a mother, like you, youdo all these things where you're
in like this head roll.
All the time around you.
So to be able to let go and justsink and have someone else do it

(33:37):
all.
And that's, to me, I'm like,that's, that's empowering in
itself.
It is.
And, and, and that's the thingis because I'm going to let you
do that.
And so there is no weakness andletting someone, right.
But at the same time, like.
I will admit before we got intothis lifestyle, before we
understood and research and likereally dove in, I would in the

(34:01):
past have considered that as aweakness.
But now as someone that my eyesare more open and I am just more
generally aware of things, I nowview it as one of my strengths.
But I also view it as.
I'm, I'm glad that you as mypartner give me the space to be

(34:22):
submissive because if I didn'ttrust you, there's no fucking
way I would be submissive toyou.
I like, so it's not a weakness.
I like that a lot becausewhenever you do you discuss like
the trust aspect of it, you'llsee people that want to enter
in, they want to be submissive,but they have a very, very hard
time.
Letting their guard down.
Yeah.

(34:43):
This is, again, goes back tothat importance of safety and
communication and trust, becauseonce you find a group of people
or a person that you cangenuinely become vulnerable
around and allow your defensesto sink, and you sink into that
submissive space, and you allowsomeone to come in and just let
them take over and then they doit in such a artful, unique

(35:08):
domineering way.
That's a great, great dynamicfor you to find.
Yeah.
And it can do a ton of thingsfor you, especially like
whenever we're talking aboutlike day to day emotional stuff.
That's one of the, one of thethings I love.
saying to people that maybe thatare, uh, that struggle with like
their emotions, that they likethey don't feel fulfilled or
they have all this kind ofthings.
What are you exploring right nowto try and change that?

(35:31):
And what are you exploring onthe side of like intimacy and on
the side of potentiallyleveraging kink?
To your benefit to increase youroverall happiness and
satisfaction in life.
Honestly.
All right.
We're getting serious today.
I really like this.
Um, so the next one kind ofjumped, uh, and this is one I

(35:54):
actually found online, um, whichI'm kind of surprised our
viewers haven't asked thisbefore, but, but it's about.
And living a polyamorouslifestyle.
Do those, do those go hand inhand?
Is it one without the other?
Or those are not like mutuallyinclusive.

(36:15):
What's it called?
So not synonymous or whatever,saying it wrong.
Not, not all people that areinto kink are polyamorous and
not all people that arepolyamorous or kinky, which is
interesting because I mean,generally speaking, if you're
like polyamory, that's kind of.
Sexual interaction outside thenorm, which would be considered
kinky.
So we can go off on a whole,right?

(36:35):
That's fair.
However, no, not everybody thatengages in kink and Paul is
polyamorous.
What we do see is that peoplethat are engaged in poly,
something like polyamory andpeople that engage in something
like kink have some personalitytraits in common, like great
fucking communication skills,right?
Serious.
You cannot be poly and not bethe best communicator.

(36:59):
It's an, it is an impossibilityfor people to engage in these
things in a consensual andproductive way without building
a ton of communication skillswithout being able to, to set
boundaries and follow them andhave great self worth to where
you can create, generate trustand engage in these things.

(37:21):
So I think it's more along thelines of just a lot of.
polyamorous people are drawn tokink just like a lot of kinky
people are drawn to polyamory.
Yeah.
I don't think they're, they'renot interchangeable.
We know plenty of people thatare strictly monogamous.
Oh yeah.
And kinky as fuck.
And kinky as.
Book.
Once you get to know them.
Yeah.
And then once they actually openup and start talking about it,

(37:43):
you're like, you really?
Okay.
But I also know plenty of polypeople that aren't kinky at all.
We know poly people that arelike vanilla.
Yes.
Right.
Like, um, we have sex with thelights off and close on.
But like, yeah, it's, it's not.
Yes.
Yes.
There you can have one withoutthe other easily.

(38:05):
Yeah.
Um, now this one, I kind ofcreated myself, uh, just because
I thought it was a really goodquestion.
And it's also because.
Like, duh.
Okay.
I'm gonna go anyways.
So Dub and Psalm.
Duh.
Really?
I hate when I do that.
Um, that was me in the storeyesterday.

(38:25):
I do that all the time and itannoys me so bad and I hate that
I finally did a recording.
I did that with Skittle Gummiesyesterday.
You, you said it like twice too.
Anyways, um, a, a dom and a sub.
Walk into a bar.
I knew how the fuck did I knowyou were going to say that
anyways, uh, gender rolesbetween dubs and dub.

(38:49):
I hate this.
We have a dub stepper in aSomalia.
Uh, whatever.
I'm running my own goddangquestion.
I'm so annoyed.
Try again.
I am.
Okay.
For a dom and a sub, are theregender roles around that?

(39:13):
Correct answer.
No, absolutely not.
That is so silly.
Go further.
Are you, what are you saying?
That like, do we usually see?
Yeah.
Like I'm a dog.
I'm a, I'm a man.
I'm a man.
Cause I'm a dom.
That a dom needs to be this likehard cut, aggressive biker
looking guy.

(39:33):
Almost biker.
Yeah.
Submissive needs to be likethis, like dainty, like quiet,
very Calm.
All right, Jerry.
Yep.
No, because it's so funny.
I like, yes, I talk about sex alot.
And, and that is one of the mostcommon things is they'd be like,

(39:53):
Oh, so are you, well, clearlyyou're submissive because you're
the woman.
And I'm like, have you everheard of Thank you.
And I'm like, if you've everheard of a dominatrix, it is a
woman.
It is a badass fucking leatheredup woman with a whip that I
would love to be friends with.
If you're a dominatrix, please.
Oh, Carrie's got a Catwomankink.

(40:14):
I really have a Catwoman kinkand I will sub so hard for you.
Uh, Oh, satisfaction.
I yours?
Yeah.
That was a wishful sigh, but no,there's, whatever it comes to
things like gender roles, nokink is whatever you make it.

(40:36):
Yeah.
Like we have to repeat ourselvesover and over again, because
I've watched a number of, ofmales that are submissive and
they want to be submissive andthat's okay.
It's the same thing.
And this is something that willcome up because what you just
discussed earlier, we're likethinking about like the powerful
woman CEO going into service andto her submissive side.

(40:57):
But we didn't discuss thepowerful male CEO that wants to
explore his because he has a lotof stress on him all the time
and he's running things andbeing a leader and doing all
that.
It can benefit them as well tosink into their submission and
allow someone else to take overand control them entirely.
You'd probably get a prettygood, like.
emotional release doing that.

(41:18):
Yeah.
So no, gender roles don't havea.
No, that's but that's also thewhole thing that I feel like
we're trying to get past in thefirst fucking place or gender
roles as a whole.
I still have guys out there thatI'll talk to.
That's like, oh, if a woman putsa finger in your butt, you're
gay.
You're totally gay.
Oh, my God.
I had to process it at the timebecause, you know.

(41:40):
I don't think that youunderstand what that means.
I love that you're pointing yourfinger in the air as if you're
trying to put it in a butt.
I don't think you understandwhat that, what that means.
Whenever you say what you'resaying, like take a step back.
Like you're literally talkingabout engaging with someone of
the opposite sex of you, uh, butyou're calling it gay.

(42:03):
I know.
Okay.
Anyway.
That's a whole other podcastepisode about those types of
people.
All right.
So the next one, um, is kinksomething that has been modern,
modern, modern, modernized, orhas this something that we have
seen like In our history.
Oh, are you asking if kink islike, if this is like, did we

(42:26):
just come up with this in thelast, you know, 20th century or
have we been kinky since thedawn of time?
I will say this one time and onetime only kink has existed as
long as humans have.
Yeah.
Right.
And again, the definition ofkink can be altered based upon
what culture you're speakingwith.
Um, however, we have welldocumented.

(42:47):
Events throughout history wherepeople engage in all sorts of
kink and sexual kink.
I mean, what do you think theywere doing back in those
Victorian eras at those secretparties that they were having?
That was some kinky shit thatwas happening.
All right.
We can take this back to, Imean, ancient Greece.

(43:07):
We can go further back thanthat.
Like there's, there's hundredsand thousands of years of
history.
Uh, which I mean, I kind of, Idon't have the book title on me
right now.
I think it's just like sex, ahistory.
I'd have to look up who the, uh,who the author was, but they
talk about, uh, kinky activitiesthroughout history.
I mean, what do you think washappening at orgies?
Orgies is considered a kink.

(43:27):
Where did we have orgies?
Oh yeah.
Greek.
It was actually, no, there was avideo I saw not too long ago,
uh, a reel that somebody hadmade where it was like, it was
discussing the differencebetween, I think it was like
Greek orgies.
And, um, Oh, I don't rememberwhat other culture it was, but
it was like, whenever the,whenever this culture finds out

(43:48):
that the other culture bringswomen to the orgies.
Okay.
So, um, to end our 10questionnaire of kink, do people
in kink relationships haveunhealthy dynamics?

(44:09):
They can, they can, theyabsolutely can.
Yeah.
Do they all know?
Um, if you're engaging a key, sothis is just like any other.
Any other thing that you engagein, there are multiple ways to
go about it.
There are multiple ways that youcan study it.
As long as you're doing your duediligence and learning as much

(44:32):
as you can about it andpreparing and doing it in a
consensual way.
That's not going to create anunhealthy dynamic.
What creates unhealthy dynamicsare the people that do it in an
ignorant way.
So those people that begin toengage in these things without
looking into it first, they'rejust like, we're going to jump
in head first.
We're going to go, I'm going togo to the store today and I'm

(44:53):
going to go get a paddle and aspanking bench and we're going
to put it in the house and thenyou just bend over and I'm gonna
start beating the shit out ofyou.
That's going to create anunhealthy dynamic real well.
Yes, I would try not to beturned on right now because
we're trying to stay on task.
But for the most part, these arethe dynamics are typically made
by the people.

(45:13):
It's not, it's not, it's not theking.
It's not the king's fault.
It always goes back to the backto the people.
Yeah.
Well, and I mean, and honestly,any relationship can have an
unhealthy dynamic.
You take kink or kink out of itentirely.
Every relationship can havesomething unhealthy with it.
And I don't what are the mostunhealthy relationships
statistically?

(45:34):
I was about to say am I allowedto answer this?
Cisgendered heteronormativerelationships?
What are the worst?
That tends to be where we seethe most issues.
Now, could that be correlatedwith the sheer number of these
types of couples there areversus other relationships?
Yeah.

(45:54):
Dynamics.
Yeah.
Sure.
Um, however, that's where we seeit most.
So no, it's, it's not, it's notthe kink.
It's the people.
Yes.
Thank you.
So until the people learn how tobetter themselves and their
communication abilities andtheir ability.
Because odds are, they'reprobably already having.
Lack of communication, right?
Laugh, lack of consent in theirrelationship.

(46:16):
Don't use it.
It's kind of same thing of like,don't use kink to fix your
relationship.
Oh God, no, that'd be so badthat you use kink in order to
really break down the wallsbetween you and your partner to
better your relationship and togrow and understand each other
more.
But God, no, it's not going tobe an automatic fix into a
relationship.
If you have a healthyrelationship.

(46:38):
Kink is going to put a likewrench in it for a little bit
because it just alters andchanges everything that you
think, you know, about theperson that you're with and
yourself and yourself.
It's similar to whenever we seepeople that are like, I want to
have a threesome.
Me and my partner, when I have athreesome and they're doing it
because they're just trying tolike.
Check it off their bucket list.

(46:59):
I've had a threesome.
Yeah.
And so we'll go through andthey'll do all these like
terrible practices where theylike just go and look for a
third and they objectify theperson.
Don't hold them in equity totheir own relationship and do
all this kind of stuff.
That's just damaging.
Yeah.
I think at this point now I talkpeople out of having threesomes
more than I talk them into it.

(47:20):
Because I'm like, okay, you wantto have a threesome, let's talk
about everything you need toknow.
And by the end of it, they'relike, I don't want to have a
threesome anymore.
I'm like, I bet not.
I don't know if I want to haveput in the work.
Yeah.
I bet you don't.
And if you don't want to put inthe work, then you don't deserve
it.
Look, if you're a person thatfalls into like your.

(47:41):
Absolutely secure andeverything.
And you don't really experiencejealousy.
You're like, it's a hugely lowlevel and you're curious and
you're in your partner on thesame level and y'all want to
experience that, you know what?
Go for it.
You can find out that it's anamazing thing.
And like, this is a really coolbonding experience and you're
getting to engage with somebodyelse that you guys get to like

(48:01):
have equity with and making surethat everybody's taken care of.
It's going to be a really coolthing.
But you're sitting down, you'relike, I think that we're going
to have a threesome.
I don't really build ourrelationship more.
We're going to be so muchstronger after this.
Read more about it.
You won't learn about it.
First, you won't see that firsttime.
They're seeing some of theirpartner, like receive pleasure

(48:23):
from someone.
They're like, what the fuck?
That's the face I make her make.
We've said that on the podcast.
Whenever we started engaging ourfirst times, it was like, wait a
minute.
I know that face.
That's what Anymore it could bea kink within itself actually
You know a healthy kink nexttime.

(48:44):
We're gonna have a wholediscussion on healthy kinks
versus unhealthy kinks No,anyways Those are all the
questions I had.
I mean, yeah, there are a fewmore, but, um, I was just trying
to like compile it into like 10to keep her episode.
No, you did good as, as aparting thought in this.
Yeah.
Um, we have a lot of people thatwe talked to about kink.

(49:06):
We have a lot of people that wetalked to.
We talked to them through theirrelationship issues.
We talked to them through allsorts of stuff.
Uh, and in fact, I mean, realquick, I would love for you to,
you can mention this.
Carrie's got something comingup, an opportunity to engage in
that very discussion.
Yeah.
So if you are hearing thismessage on Friday, the 14th,

(49:29):
when this is posted, um, at thesalon that I work at on Sunday,
the 16th, uh, I am hosting akink.
Expo, essentially.
Um, I'm very excited about it,but we've had a group of girls
that are coming together and itis business owned women of South
Fort Worth and we are creating alittle Galentine's event and I'm
going to be going in and justtalking about my experiences

(49:52):
within kink and everything else.
I'm very excited for it.
Um, it's something that I'vealways been wanting us to do to,
you know, branch out more thanjust our podcasts and what it is
that we're doing.
So, yeah.
Um, the group that I'll betalking with are called she
dares collective.
And again, it is, you know, it'sall business women, all South
Fort Worth.
And we are just really lookingto expand, uh, and grow, but

(50:16):
yeah, it's going to be atcollective salon from one to
five.
If you have any questions aboutit, just shoot me a message and
I would be very happy to answerany questions and also really
love to have y'all there.
Yeah.
That was what?
Sunday the 16th.
Yep.
From one to five.
Yeah, you can find out moreabout it on if you actually go
to our page on naughty bynature.
You can learn a little bit moreabout it.

(50:36):
Or, or my, yeah, um, I alsocreated another Instagram
account.
It's called before the knot.
Um, and you can find a lot ofinformation on there as well.
Um, did you mention this is afree event?
Oh, of course.
Okay.
I didn't mention it.
I didn't know if you had saidthat or not.
I didn't, but it is free.
So come see me talk about somekinky shit for free this Sunday
at collective.

(50:57):
I'm proud of you because this isone that we, this is an event
that it's not us doing it.
This is you doing it.
No, this, this is, this is myfirst event without you, which
I'm kind of nervous.
Like you should be.
I'm so nervous.
You're with me with everything.
We already know this.
You're going to do amazingly.
Yeah.
You know the stuff, you know,you know the topics, you're very
well versed in all these things.
I mean, it's easy when I enjoytalking about it, right?

(51:18):
Exactly, right?
Makes it much easier.
Well, for our first episode of2025, this is Naughty by Nature.
I am your co host, Keri Sanders,and I'm Casey Sanders.