March 5, 2025 • 40 mins
Raised in a reserved American setting, Nolan offers his unique insights on navigating Croatia's expressive cultural landscape and the transitions the country has experienced since its independence in 1991. We'll explore the qualities that make a great leader in Croatia, where warmth, sociability, and community involvement are not just preferred but expected, providing a fresh perspective on leadership adaptation and resilience.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Welcome to the Leader Impact Podcast.
We are a community of leaderswith a network in over 350
cities around the world,dedicated to optimizing our
personal, professional andspiritual lives to have impact.
This show is where we have achance to listen and engage with
leaders who are living this out.
We love talking with leaders,so if you have any questions,
comments or suggestions to makethe show even better, please let
us know.
The best way to stay connectedin Canada is through our
(00:27):
newsletter at leaderimpactca oron social media at Leader Impact
.
If you're listening fromoutside of Canada anywhere in
the world, check out our websiteat leaderimpactcom.
I'm your host, lisa Peters, andour guest today is Nolan Sharp.
Nolan coordinates Leader Impactin Croatia.
He holds a master's degree inelectrical engineering from the
Stanford and worked as a chipdesigner for Hewlett Packard.
(00:49):
In 2001, he moved to his wife'shomeland to found what became
Leader Impact Croatia.
He coordinates the GlobalLeadership Summit in Croatia and
organizes small and large groupevents for business leaders.
For 18 years he trained therest of the staff of the
(01:11):
non-profit that Leader Impactbelongs to in fundraising.
He has a master's degree intheology and coordinates
theological development in AgapeEurope.
He is also an elder at theZagreb Malishnica.
Thank you, baptist Church.
Nolan and Sandra have two sons.
Welcome to the show, nolan, andthanks for the correction.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
No, it's great to be here.
That was a lie in mine.
Sorry about that.
You should have made sure youknew how to pronounce it.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Oh yeah, and it's funny because I usually go
through everything, I highlightall the words I don't know and I
don't know how I missed thatone.
It got to the end and I'm like,oh, I know it, I know it, I know
it leaders right, we don't askfor help no, just go for it,
just something I, uh, I want totell you that it is so exciting,
I mean, with our time change,with our difference from you
being around the world.
It it's so exciting to connectwith leaders like yourself,
(01:56):
nolan, so thank you for joiningus.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Oh, it's fantastic to be here.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Thank you for having me oh, I just I'm enjoying these
, just listening to othercultures, other ways to do
business, so I'm excited to divein.
Are you ready?
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
All right, okay.
Well, we're going to talk aboutyour leadership style and
approach, and our first questionis what makes a great leader in
Croatia, and do you feel thisis unique to Croatia?
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah, that's a.
That's a great country, youknow.
To Croatia, yeah, that's agreat country, you know.
Croatians are very warm,they're very sociable and it's
kind of a traditional cultureand the country has been through
enormous change sinceindependence in 1991.
So I think here it's importantfor leaders to be very warm, to
be involved in people's lives,sometimes, whether they want to
(02:44):
or not, to almost take on aparental role in ways towards
the people that they lead,because the culture has some of
the very warm and social andpersonal aspects to it.
But also because of whatCroatia has been going through
for the last three and a halfdecades, leaders here have to be
very, very flexible andresilient and adaptive to change
(03:07):
, Because Croatia has gone frombeing a social part of a larger
socialist country to beingindependent, to being kind of in
a nowhere land for a few yearsand then being on the road to
joining the European Union, nowEuropean Union member, and
change has just been a constant.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Mm-hmm.
Union member.
Uh, and, and change has justbeen a constant listening to you
.
Um, and you talked about warm,social, involved, parental.
My mind went to boundaries.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yeah, we have so many books on boundaries yeah, well,
my wife runs a course based onsome of henry cloud's, you know,
things on boundaries andchanges that heal and and and
there's we can into.
There's always the other sideof the coin, right.
So you have to accept thereality of how the culture works
.
But then of course, none of usare totally happy with the
cultures we are a part of, andso oftentimes we're thinking
(03:55):
like, oh gosh, I wish there wasa different way.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Yeah, I mean you were raised in the United States,
right, yeah, the differences andI know we'll probably get into,
but just when I think of howyou were raised to where you are
today, that's a big differencelistening.
Huge for me and I'm thinking wedidn't experience that sort of
independence and the change andall that Croatia has gone
(04:20):
through.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
I'm sure we'll get into it.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, do you want me to talk to that a
little bit?
Yeah, yeah, definitely.
I mean I grew up very kind ofmiddle class in the United
States and much more of atypical we used to say WASP-y,
you know kind of cultural momentin the United States.
White Anglo-Saxon Protestant,where there's my family, was
fairly quiet growing up.
We read a lot.
There wasn't much extravagantemotion and so not only you know
(04:50):
, I didn't grow up here, I'm notItalian or some other, you know
culture that maybe has a littlebit more similarities in some
ways and so, yeah, I've had alot, a lot to learn and, um, uh,
for me, cultural adaption,adaptation has a lot to to do
(05:12):
with the idea of reallyrealizing I, I need to
understand this place and livehere.
You know, if you really want tolive in a culture, that that's,
that's, that's non-negotiableUm.
But there's a process over timeto figuring out how, how, um can
I be flexible and adaptive andchange a lot of the ways I do
things?
And realize, if I want to winpeople's, if I want to win a
group's approval for some ideaI'm trying to push, I need to do
it in a way that works for thembut also not to lose myself in
(05:35):
the end either, because, again,every culture is kind of also
stuck in different ways.
I'm never going to be a bettercrowd than a crowd themselves,
but I can.
There are times I've, but thistakes decades.
There are times now when I'vebeen here so long enough that I
that I realized, okay, maybethis is one of those situations
where I can kind of kind ofexplain things like how I would
do this out of my own naturalways of doing stuff, and people
(05:56):
might say, oh, that's actuallyreally interesting, because we
tend to get stuck in that samearea.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Yeah, I think it's so important to have the
conversation because the worldhas opened up and we are dealing
, we can do business around theworld.
So to listen to you and tounderstand and just grant some
grace and talk about it and thisis the way I would have done
something.
So it's very interesting.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
You did mention WASP-y and then you said
Anglo-Saxon, what I don't know,maybe in Canada they use a term
that's an old term People talkabout white, Anglo-Saxon
Protestant culture.
That was sort of the sort ofnortheastern part of the United
States, the people whosebackground is in the English, or
(06:37):
people from the UK that came,the original colonial kind of
settlers of the United States,and so that has a lot to do with
patterns of, you know, wealthor of well standing or of being
very culturally at home in theUnited States.
Basically because that's that'skind of you know, waspy, that's
, I don't know, that's a termthat people used a lot more when
I was young, grown up.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
All right, we're gonna move on to challenges and
strategies and talk about whatare some of the unique
challenges you face as a leaderin Croatia, and could you share
an example and how you addressedit?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Yeah, well, I think I mentioned a little bit.
So you know, when you justbeing in any cross-cultural
situation, you have to learn toset yourself aside.
The kinds of advice I got werethings like for the first year
you're in a new environment kindof almost make no suggestions
or a term, a phrase someone gaveme and gave other people who
(07:30):
are in similar situations tomine was just keep reminding
yourself, it's not wrong, it'sjust different.
Because your intuitions aregoing to want to tell you all
the time in a cross-culturalsituation that's just wrong.
That's just wrong.
But because you don't haveenough experience in the culture
yet to realize why it's maybeactually not wrong, because a
(07:51):
lot of things are different thanthey are wherever you're coming
from, so you have to tellyourself a hundred or a thousand
times it's not wrong, it's justdifferent, before you kind of
maybe actually have enoughexperience where there are
things that are wrong as well inevery culture, but you kind of
don't.
You haven't won the experienceof the right for a long time to
kind of to say that necessarily,and so that process is a
(08:12):
process.
But I'd say, since I've beenliving here for 23 years, my
wife's creation and my kids grewup here.
My whole life is around, isaround creations.
There's comes a point too,which I alluded to, which is
that you do have to at the endsay you know what I am, who I am
, and I understand like Ioperate as an adaptive person in
(08:33):
this culture.
But I'm also not going tototally lose myself because that
kind of going native.
In a sense you lose what makesyou different and interesting
amongst the people you're aroundif you completely, almost kind
of like, just die to yourselfand become nothing.
So that kind of figuring outlike who am, I question.
(08:53):
I mean, we all struggle withthat throughout our lives, but
you think about it probably alot intensely in cross-cultural
living.
I think one area that for me inCroatia was very interesting
was the idea of learning.
So I read an article when I'dlived here for about seven years
and it was about and the authorwas a scholar who had lived in
Spain for a number of years atthat point and she wrote about
(09:15):
Spain as an honor-shame cultureand I'd never heard this term
before.
But in this article she kept ongiving examples where I thought
and.
But in this article she kept ongiving examples where I thought
I.
That feels really similar tosome things that I've
experienced, and so it startedme on this journey where I spent
more than 10 years learning andreading about.
You know what are honor shamecultures like and really quickly
(09:39):
it might be.
You know the difference betweenwhat the another group is
called like guilt innocenceculture so Canada, the United
States would be considered ingeneral guilt innocence cultures
and the difference between aguilt innocence culture and
honor shame culture.
There's a lot of differences,but one quick way to get into it
is like do you, how do you feelwhen you've done something
(10:01):
wrong and no one else knows it?
And that's usually kind ofconscience, and that's what
people generally tend to feel inguilt-innocence cultures Like I
did something wrong, no oneelse knows it, but I feel
terrible.
Whereas in honor-shame culture,what's often really difficult
for people is when you mighthave not done anything wrong but
other people think you've donesomething wrong and just the
(10:22):
fact that they think you didsomething wrong creates a burden
.
That's called shame right.
So shame comes upon you sort of.
It can come upon you separatelyfrom whether you actually did
anything wrong yourself andwhich one of those two kind of
tends to dominate more in theway that you interact with other
people and live your life, andboth of these are everywhere,
(10:46):
and I think we've had this hugereawakening of understanding and
talking about the topic ofshame in the West in the past
couple of decades, I thinklargely because we ignored shame
for a long time, because guiltversus innocence was much more
the way we kind of adjudicatethings, like figure out, well,
how am I going to respond inthis situation?
Am I guilty or am I not?
(11:07):
And if I'm not guilty, I don'tcare.
Uh, whereas shame and honor is,um, uh, a much more traditional
way of people interacting withthe world.
It's still much, it's and it'svery present here, uh, and so
learning how to live with thatUm, and even, I think, in a lot
of ways, that's again one of theways, as a, as a foreigner,
someone living here, um, I'vehelped a lot of my Croatian
(11:27):
friends also understand theirown culture better by saying you
know, you guys are much moresensitive sometimes to the, the,
the, the reputation ofsomething, the, the, the voice
of the group, what other peopleare putting upon you, whether or
not you agree with it or not.
Then maybe I am, and you reallyneed to think about that.
So learning to navigate some ofthat stuff was a big part of my
(11:50):
journey.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
So you're speaking.
Well, maybe you're not speakingas a male.
So do you think the females, doyou think they have any unique
challenges, or where do they fitin this?
I mean looking at your wife asa leader.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Yeah, yeah, Well, I mean, I can talk forever on this
topic, but there there is,there is this thing, and I think
it's one of these things.
That's that, uh, where this hasbecome less visible.
Uh, and yet, you know, we, welive in this moment.
We don't.
We're I think we're close tosimilar generation, and when we
were growing up and you didn'thave the internet, you you could
(12:23):
live so much your life and befaced with all these kind of
factors, and yet if you didn'thave a specific class, you
didn't pick up the right book onit, you might never put your
finger on it.
And now we're all informationflying at us all the time and we
constantly have this experienceof maybe just scrolling through
you know, your Instagram feedor something, and some video
comes up and basically tells youlike something like that just
(12:44):
feels like it unlocks some crazypart of your life you never
thought about, Right?
So we're all kind of beingfaced with so many new ideas all
the time, some of which arereally important and interesting
.
So in traditional cultures, um,shame there's.
In traditional cultures, shamethere's a way in which there was
an expectation for women toguard their honor by avoiding
(13:04):
shameful experiences, andwhereas in honor-based cultures,
men would tend to go out intothe public and risk something
and succeed or fail in order togain honor, For women, in
traditional cultures, honor hasbeen something more to be kind
of guarded by avoiding pitfalls.
(13:26):
So you know, to the extent ofto the extremes of, say, sexual
shame for women being much morelike well, were you, were you,
did you go somewhere you werenot supposed to go?
Were you, did you put yourselfin a position you weren't
supposed to?
Did you wear clothes that youweren't supposed to?
And that could seem a thousandyears away from you?
Know many people who live today,and one of the things that's so
(13:47):
interesting about me for withmy wife and living here is that
my wife is basically, I mean,she's had an amazing life.
My wife, Sandra, is just justthe coolest people I know, but
she grew up in a village, grewup without.
She's the first person to go touniversity in her family, first
person to finish high school inher family, on starting out and
(14:07):
going all the way straightthrough high school, and so she
has these cultural memories thatevery once in a while we still
talk about.
Well, she'll be like oh yeah, Ihaven't thought about that in a
long time and she'll tell mesome story from, like, growing
up in a rural environment thatjust like blows my mind, Uh, and
it was also a helpful part ofour conversations with each
other to realize.
I mean, a simple example wouldbe like um, uh, uh, I grew up,
(14:28):
uh, we would go to church onSundays and do grocery shopping
afterwards and come home and Ilove Sunday lunch because we
would eat junk food, basicallyLike it was the.
We'd go to buy groceries and soI'd be like, oh, we can buy
potato chips, and then thepotato chips would get eaten
that afternoon and we would havesandwiches and I was super
happy.
I was like that's great.
My wife didn't grow up going tochurch and so for her, but the
(15:00):
kind of equivalent of church inthe village where my wife grew
up was that the mom made thishuge lunch on Sundays to take
care of her family and show thatshe was good at this.
And so my mother-in-law wouldask my wife a question that
seems innocent but never feltinnocent to my wife when we were
early on in our marriage, whereshe would say, oh, what are you
making for Nolan for lunchtoday?
And because we would go tochurch together, then like, well
, I'm just making a small lunchand we're going to get home
later, blah, blah, blah.
But for my wife, this questionjust all was so deep under her
skin because it's you know, it'sa, it's a very traditional
(15:20):
thing that, like this, is howyou demonstrate your, your
womanhood, to an extent, and andit took a lot of time and
conversation to realize like,okay, yeah, you know we don't
have to do this, Um and and uh,uh, but we can, I mean, we can
figure out ways around it.
Buying a crock pot actually wasone of the solutions for this
was just like, okay, I can wakeup and throw something in the
(15:41):
crock pot, we go to church, wecome home, we can still have a
nice Sunday lunch.
But you know, those messages goreally deep in people and
cultures and I think thatthey're very tricky and I think
it's good that we can just bringthem out and talk about them
and um, uh, and look at them forwhat they are and, you know,
say yes to the things that aregood or say goodbye to some
(16:02):
things and, um, yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
My mind just flooded things.
I grew up with that.
I have tried to let go of yeahwhen you yeah Woo, that's so I'm
just going to take a moment,Woo.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
That's so.
I'm just going to take a moment.
That's interesting, right,because you grew up in Canada,
right?
So do you think like, oh,that's you know, but that's one
of the things that's fun aboutliving here is realizing all
these things that I sort of hadto learn to survive here,
because this felt weird to me atfirst, and but then, as the
years go by, I realized like, ohyeah, we had our own version of
that when I was growing up.
It was just invisible to me.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Um, you know yeah, I grew up um the uh, a very large,
uh, not just Sunday, but verylarge dinners for the important
dates.
So if it was so very, verylarge, my mom would spend all
day in the kitchen and I marriedinto a family that, so that was
food, and food was important.
(16:56):
Where I married into, a familywith, people were important.
So, um, I now you know yougather all the people and it's
it's not about making sevendishes and how many vegetables
and two meats and how many, butyou know it's about the people
and that you don't spend thetime in the kitchen, you spend
the time at the table.
I love it because it's justless cooking.
(17:18):
Yeah, I'll just make a biglasagna, but yeah, I, um, and I
the guilt that I felt yeah ofyou know, when I have my mom
over and I don't cook a big, youknow, it's all about sitting
down for an hour at a table, ortwo hours and talking.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
So yeah, yeah that's another thing of someone.
Um, I, I think we learned alongthe way that having a
cross-cultural marriage for us,I mean, there's always
challenges.
It's kind of like morepractical challenges, like now,
as our kids, you know, we haveolder parents on two different
continents.
Now, like those, those are realthings.
But I think one of the positivethings about having a
cross-cultural marriage was wewent into it expecting to have a
(17:52):
lot of differences and thathelped us a lot to just have
conversations, whereas I thinkoftentimes, what people don't
you?
Maybe somebody marries someonefrom their hometown and so they
think, oh okay, you knowwhatever, but every family has
its own culture, so that, likewhat you just said, you can
marry your next door neighbor,but there can still be these
very big differences inexpectations.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, and just finding your space to make it
work?
Yeah, yeah, great conversation,thank.
To make it work yeah, yeah,great conversation, thank you.
So the next question does talkabout cultural sensitivity,
global leadership.
So I want to ask you, how doyou approach leading a team or
organization with members fromdiverse cultural backgrounds?
Speaker 1 (18:27):
That's a great question.
So I think a place to start isto say you don't get to live in
a culture-free zone.
So it's not about saying orthat a culture is just a team is
just going to invent a culturefor itself.
Cultures exist in large extentbecause we have to do so much of
our communication andunderstanding based on shared
(18:49):
assumptions and things we're noteven aware of.
So I think you have to kind ofpick a culture to be the
baseline for a team andoftentimes, depending on where
you are, you have to kind ofpick a culture to be the
baseline for a team andoftentimes, depending on where
you are, you have to pick alanguage.
Then, right, and maybe that'salso one of the things that's
getting really tricky in theworld today is that it's become
so common to just use English,as if English is neutral, but
(19:10):
that's not necessarily true.
You know, english also formsthe way we think about things or
the way people can expressthemselves, and the native
English speakers on a team ofEnglish speakers have a huge
advantage in how easily they'reable to express their deepest
emotions than people from othercultures.
Anyway, so I think you have topick.
(19:30):
You kind of have to pick aculture, and it really, in my
kind of world, you should pickthe culture you're trying to
serve, because if you pick theculture of the majority of the
team or the whole organizationyou're representing, then you
are going to, I think, make tonsof mistakes, trying to go, you
(19:54):
know, talking about some topicin a leadership meeting as if
this is okay, this is how we'regoing to define this, this is
what's going to work for us, andthen going out into a world
that basically doesn't match it,and that can be a big challenge
, especially if you're, say,sent as a leader somewhere, but
then the language and theculture is different than yours.
So I know that's a huge order,but I really do think you have
(20:15):
to be realistic and say somekind of culture is going to be
like a baseline and it probablyshould be as close as possible
to your target or your audienceor your customers, and you need
to figure out, then, how to showrespect for that culture and to
work with inside of it.
And then you're, of course.
Then you can do things likesaying, well, there's things we
(20:36):
don't actually like here, course.
Then you can do things likesaying, well, there's things we
don't actually like here orthere are certain things we want
to modify or we want to bringin as much as we can from these
different values.
But you have to be explicitabout it and you have to
recognize that some cultures aregoing to be the default.
And again, because there's just, you can't have a two-day
offsite and say like we're goingto define our values as a team
(20:58):
and think you're going to getanywhere close to having enough
to actually define a new culture.
There's so much that goes unsaidin culture that it seems kind
of hopeless to me that you'regoing to just define it based on
the global value.
I don't know something andyou'll never get it all right.
There'll be a lot of ummistakes and, uh, you have to
(21:20):
encourage people to to apologize, see clarity, ask people to
explain themselves.
But even that's tricky becausethat's a set.
Those are Western valuesusually actually to to say,
speak up and assert yourself andto do these little things.
That that that can be a trap aswell.
Um, because some cultures arebig on power, distance and
indirect communication and it'svery, very tricky.
(21:45):
But if you use tools like theCulture Map, the World Values
Survey, and you get things asmuch out on paper as possible,
like objectively, sort of evenexplaining to people what power
distance means or what, um, uh,indirect communication means.
Uh, uh can be really, reallyhelpful for them to go okay,
yeah, that's, you know, that'swho I am, but yeah, it's, I mean
(22:06):
, it's fun, it's can drive youcrazy, it's, it's beautiful,
it's complicated.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Challenge.
I go back to something you saidearlier about just set yourself
aside, make no suggestions.
Yeah, you know, when you'reworking with someone of a new
culture, it's like just you knowyou said pick the culture you
are trying to serve.
Yeah, and maybe just sometimesjust step back a bit and just
listen, you know.
Yeah.
I mean it's tricky because Iknow it's not a women thing.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
Did I just put it in, just no, but I know, but it's
very tricky.
No, I think women there's some,I mean we live, I guess we've
again maybe our generation.
There was a long, we were toldfor a long time men and women
are pretty much interchangeableand it feels like we're now
entering a little bit more of amoment of, because we just can't
avoid it, and there's been somuch more scientific research
(22:55):
done.
But women and men,statistically speaking, people
can be anything they are, but onthe average, women and men have
some very different ways oftending to look at things or
whatever, and women are, just onthe average, so much more aware
of what's going on around themthan men are.
That it's pretty hilarious.
So women, but maybe sometimes,but everything can be a little
(23:17):
bit paradoxical.
So I think women in newsituations, it's kind of like
they're more sensitive, butthey're getting blasted, their
filters are getting blasted allthe time by, you know, nonverbal
communication or body languageor whatever, and guys are
clueless.
But maybe then guys might belike okay, wait, they told me to
focus on one thing, so I'mgoing to focus on that one thing
and I'm going to observe kindof this one thing.
(23:39):
So I think that you know it'sjust, it's just amazing how, how
complex it can be.
But I, like, I wanted to saythat, like I am, I know and
understand to say you know,mcdonald's is amazing and they
can go into any, almost anyplace in the world and open
mcdonald's and they have a, theyhave a thing they're trying to
deliver and then they have, youknow, standards and they train
everybody everywhere to anextent to do things the same way
(24:01):
or to have the same, you know,operating system.
And so multinationalcorporations often do have a
kind of standardized culturethat they employ, which often
then is a sort of a smooshedversion of the culture of the
countries that they came from.
And I get that.
But I think that that works forcertain kinds of enterprises
that are basically delivering avery standardized product into a
(24:24):
new environment.
And you have to ask yourself alot am I installing a franchise
of something else here, or am Itrying to really solve a local
problem that may demand localsolutions?
And if it does, you've justsigned up for Alice in
Wonderland and figuring out howfar down the rabbit hole goes,
cause it's like you know, if youreally start open.
Yeah, you know.
(24:45):
So you know I, I understand ifyou're, if you're thinking about
an international corporation orsomething that's going to move
its business into a new place,but you still run into it all
the time, no matter what.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Wow, oh, nolan, such a great conversation.
You make my cheeks hurt.
I'm smiling for life.
So when I I want to talk alittle bit about personal
development and learning and, um, because there are many
aspiring leaders, so what advicewould you give to inspire
aspiring leaders, particularlythose from different cultural
backgrounds?
I feel like you've touched onthis a little bit, but yeah,
yeah, I mean.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
So your, your life, is a a gift from God and your,
your unique person, who has aunique background that really
like, is a gift to the world.
So, however, you grew up andand good and bad and ugly and a
mix of everything and stuffyou're so proud about and stuff
you're not so proud about itmade you who you are and it's
(25:38):
made you this very complicatedperson that is adaptable and yet
really has some very, verydeeply held values and patterns
for doing things.
And I think my life has beenpartially about figuring out how
far can you go, how much canyou really change by working in
another language all the timeand working completely with
people from another country allthe time and working, you know,
complete with people fromanother country all the time,
(26:01):
and you can go really far, butyou can't.
You can't like complete.
Only in childhood Are you youknow this like a plastic,
malleable thing that cancompletely recreate itself and
the more you can do tounderstand and reflect on how
you were raised?
What was my extended familylife?
What was my community like?
What was the societal moment inwhich I was raised in my own
(26:21):
culture?
What kind of things did I seevalued and held up as good
examples of leadership or badways.
How did people come toconsensus in my family, in my
neighborhood, in my village?
How did all these things reallyfunction?
Neighborhood in my village?
You know how did all thesethings really function and then
use.
You know tools, like, I think,what I mentioned.
(26:42):
You know the Culture Map, aWorld Values Survey, to try and
start giving some language tothose differences.
And so you know, really figureout where you come from and
there are parts of where youcome from you're going to dig
deep in and rely upon in manyhard situations.
Like I am the fifth generationof hardworking.
You know rural farmers and likeno one ever.
(27:05):
You know, like I'm raised bypeople who always got up at five
in the morning and you know I'mnot going to be lazy today.
Like you know, dig deep andembrace the good parts of where
you came from, but also learn attimes that you can say goodbye
to parts of where you came from.
But also learn at times thatyou can say goodbye to parts of
what you grew up with or modifyit.
You know and say, like it'sgreat that my background helps
(27:27):
me to be really flexible andaccommodating to other people.
But there are times I need tolearn how to speak up for myself
, and so you know how do I dothat.
So you have to be a student ofyour own life.
There's an activity you probablyfamiliar with that maybe you
could recommend to people,called a genogram, where you
really kind of look at yourfamily's history, you know, and
(27:48):
kind of go back severalgenerations and say what were
the really, what's the reallycrucial part of my family story?
It's kind of where you do someanalysis of like, where their
broken relationships ortragedies or major events in my
sort of parents, grandparents,aunts and uncles, even great
grandparents if you know muchabout them kind of what happened
in the background there.
Because all of us are much more, I think maybe those of us who
(28:11):
are Westerners need tounderstand that we're much more
a product of the way we wereraised than we are just this
completely individual person whogets to think about things
however we want to.
So I think understandingyourself is a really crucial
thing and that again gives yousome understanding for, okay, so
(28:32):
other people are different thanme.
I can adapt myself, I can dothings a certain way, but I'm
probably also going to findsooner or later that in teams
and in certain environments Ilike stability versus dynamic
environment or I function best.
You know I should.
It's kind of a I think it'slike an 80-20 thing.
It's like we can spend 20% ofour time doing something that's
like completely unnatural for usand hard and awkward If it fits
(28:55):
in this bigger picture of likeI love and I want that, but I
have to do.
I have to do sales to get tothis other goal.
Even on, I don't love going andknocking on doors but, I, got to
do it, but it can be a 20%thing, but if it's an 80% thing
and you know in your bones thisit's not for me, you know, then
you've got to figure out, likeprobably thinking about how to
make some changes.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
Yeah, I think, when just listen to, and if the
opportunity ever came up for meto work with someone from
Croatia, because we're justtalking, just being vulnerable
and being open, you know, justsometimes yeah, because you said
we're a product of how we wereraised and sometimes just you've
(29:35):
got to put that down my mindgoes to just you know I might
need a coach.
Yeah, just to help you throughthe conversations that I would
need to have in the backgroundbefore coming to you and going.
I just want to push this agenda, you know, because this is
what's you know, and sometimesyou've got to go whoa.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
As you said earlier.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Set yourself aside, you know.
Just listen, just be vulnerable, say how you're feeling.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
And as a leader I mean, one of the things I've
been really fascinated by iswatching the stories of Croatia,
like many countries in a lot ofplaces, but in Eastern Europe
has a huge problem with youngpeople leaving.
They go and they live somewhereelse and so the population is
decreasing.
And when you listen to people Ilove, I'm very, because it's
their own cross-culturalexperience.
So when they go and they movesomewhere else, a lot of times
(30:19):
people said as they said, likein the end, I'm not, I didn't
leave Croatia.
I mean I'm being paid more andwhatever than I was in Croatia.
But the reason I don't thinkabout coming back is because I
have experienced leadership, orleadership on the part of people
I work for in these othercountries, in Ireland or
something, where they value meas a person, they are open to my
(30:41):
input, they see potential in meand they want to see me grow,
and I think that's something.
And we have both many culturesaround the world, but also this
global emerging culture that'shappening because of the
internet or whatever, and Ireally feel like I mean, I don't
know every place, but I feellike there's so much to be
(31:03):
gained from being a leader whosays I see things in you maybe
you're not ready to see inyourself yet.
I believe for more in you.
I think that there's more thatcan happen in your life than
maybe what you're seeing rightnow.
That seems to be something that,for whatever reason, I think is
often a hole or wound for somany people, no matter where
they're from.
(31:23):
And even it's kind of crazybecause, like America is full of
this, has been full of this,maybe Canada, the United States
has been full of this likeyou're perfect, you're your own
individual snowflake and you'regoing to do great things in your
life.
And then the generation kind oflike you have young people then
grows up and says I've beenhearing that my whole life.
I don't believe it.
It's just like whether or notyou've heard the positive,
(31:44):
whether or not anybody went outof their way to tell you I you
know.
But there's something I thinkabout being someone's actual
leader, someone's actual boss ina job, or or someone's actual
boss in a job or whatever, whosays like I see you, I know you,
I watch you.
I'm not just telling you thisas a whatever we need to talk
about.
Some of you know some of thethings you need to improve as
well, but um I I see a path foryou to grow.
I think that's huge for people.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
So you mentioned the young people are leaving,
getting these experiences.
Are they coming back after afew years?
And my goes to you know,there's, there's the family
business and someone is raisedin the family business.
The dad says you know what, goget a job somewhere else.
Uh, take your degree, get a joband then come back and run my
company because you learn,you've, you've expanded.
(32:26):
Is that happening or are theystaying away?
Speaker 1 (32:28):
uh, what happened?
The person whose family has.
So the stereotype in this partof the world would be if the
person who has the familybusiness is like no, I have
taken care of you, I have a slotfor you, you never need to
leave.
The people that leave are theones who are probably more
ambitious and maybe don't comefrom backgrounds where there's
the social capital that theirfamily or their group got them
(32:52):
an opportunity right away andthey start running up against at
least the perception thateverything here depends on
connections.
And I don't have those kinds ofconnections.
So I'm going to go.
You know, I'm going to go livesomewhere else and, of course,
tons of people would love tocome home.
They would love to come back.
You know, they see like, oh man, this it's a tough.
It's tough to live somewhereelse, even if you can make a
good wage and all this kind ofstuff, and you're far away from
(33:13):
your family and the years go byand then you start wondering if
your kids are going to have anycultural identity from your home
country at all.
So, like I, I I completelyunderstand the desire to come
back, but as of yet,specifically in Croatia, people
are very slow to come back.
Wow, if they've been gone for aAll right.
(33:39):
My last question for you, nolan, is what do you hope will be
your legacy as a leader when youleave this world?
Yeah, that's a great question,and I think I just really wanted
to know that I had a part asmall or large part in the
growth of other people whobecame transformational leaders
themselves.
You know, it's leading leaderimpact in Croatia, or something
like that for the last 23 years.
(33:59):
I feel like I've made everypossible mistake you can make
and I think it's the grace ofGod that we're still here and
doing what we're doing.
So you have to learn to lookfor and celebrate what might, at
the moment, seem like smallsuccesses, things where you know
(34:19):
you.
You just get a glimpse.
My son came home from seeingplaying soccer and being around
a bunch of uh guys, uh the othernight and turned out one of
them is someone that thatvolunteers at our global
leadership summit the othernight and turned out one of them
is someone that volunteers atour Global Leadership Summit and
he said something nice to myson about how my leadership and
taking over this in Croatia andkeeping it going and seeing it
(34:41):
grow and you know you got tolive for the little wins.
I think most of us in our livesare not going to experience fame
and fortune and all this kindof stuff, but when you can learn
to appreciate theinterconnectedness with other
people and going out of your wayto help, and without ever, you
(35:02):
know, you don't look for thereward, you don't look for
calculation and sort of.
You know, making space forother people or giving them an
opportunity or whatever.
But you got to allow yourself,you know, to really celebrate
when you get the glimpses thatit was worth it, because you can
start to see change in otherpeople and and and oftentimes
you're not, you're not like thecrucial person, but you, you got
(35:22):
to play a part, um, in, youknow, adding a brick in the wall
or whatever of someone else'sgrowth.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
So oh, I love that Cause I don't think we think of
the little wins as enough.
And there are.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
There can be so many in a day, the little wins, and
yeah, we're not all fame um yeah, we live in a generation, we
live in an age obsessed with,like, the one person who did the
one thing, sort of Steve Jobsor whatever.
But, like you know, that'sthat's a very specific thing
about time and history orwhatever that made for Steve
(35:55):
jobs and that's great that hedid what he did and stuff.
But you know the impact, Ithink.
I think maybe one of the thingsthat's happening in culture
today is like we're losing thevalue of I don't know, like what
a career high school teacherdoes over the course of working
for 40 years and having hundredsand hundreds of young people go
through their, their school,and the the incredible impact
(36:15):
that that can have.
I think we're sort of losingthe because and, of course, in a
more traditional culture, likeif you were the school teacher
in a town, you were a prettyimportant person.
And now we live in an age when,unfortunately, I think, people
who who serve other peoplethrough their work, um are just
constantly feeling the pressureand the criticism of like it's
not good enough.
You're not.
You know we, we live in an ageof complaints about those who
(36:37):
serve others.
Right, so it's um, yeah, it'stricky.
I just hope that you know, andI often talk about what I do,
about like when we do globalleadership, some in the way we
put a program together.
I often say, like I want totarget a program for the leader
who's just about ready to quit,because they're like I've been
doing this thing and I got intothis because I wanted to make a
difference and I wanted to makea change and I wanted to be
(36:57):
helpful.
But like I'm done, you know,like I I just gotten so much
blowback and criticism and Idon't feel it's fair.
But I don't get to complain andsay it's not fair because I'm
the leader, um, this is, this isan I'm in agony, I'm almost
ready to give up.
You know, and and we often tryand think about you know how to
(37:18):
how to put a program together insuch a way that for that person
they're going to have thatmoment that kind of just gives
them clarity and insight andmaybe a reset of their kind of
frame of saying, like you knowwhat, the reasons I got into
this thing were actually really,really great and I'd be stupid
to give it up now.
And I just need to.
You know, I need to recenter,refocus or rethink about.
You know how I'm evaluating allthis stuff because everybody
like has enough reason to justsay, like, that's it, I'm out,
(37:39):
I'm done, I've had enough.
Speaker 2 (37:42):
So I feel the reason I keep coming back here and the
reason I keep involved withleader impact is for many of
that, because I have to bereminded, and you do.
You can't just think you know.
Just, leadership isn't aone-time day thing, it's every
day and and you have to surroundyourself with people that will
pump you know, and just be partof your team.
(38:04):
Um, there's a uh from the bibleI.
I interviewed my father-in-law,who's one of the greatest men
and one of the quotes I or oneof the bible um, from the bible
I put in first p.10, god callsyou to use all your gifts,
talents and influence to serveothers and I just you know, I
read that and yeah, and theother part I added was fight the
(38:25):
lie that their talents arebetter than your talents,
because we are all different andwe all have talents and we are
to find them and and use themand serve.
So, yeah, Anyway, Nolan, I wantto thank you for joining us.
This is just so good.
I just feel blessed to be ableto share this with everyone and
(38:47):
just be able to talk to you,because it's like when I come to
Croatia, you are on my list.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
Yeah definitely, yeah , come visit and and and your
blessing too, thank you, for youknow your thoughtfulness and
approaching this and thinkingthat work and put all this
together and it's it's.
It's been great.
We talked, you know, oncebefore to set this up and it's
been fun to getting to know yourstory a little bit and it's a
blessing, thank you.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
It's awesome, Thank you.
Now, if listeners want toengage with you, they want to
find more about leader impact inCroatia, or just you.
What's the best way to find you?
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Well, my mom made a great decision 50 years ago to
give me a relatively unusualname, and so it's pretty easy to
find me on the internet.
So my name is Nolan N-O-L-A-N,my last name is Sharp S-H-A-R-P,
and so it's usually comes upreally quickly on LinkedIn or
whatever who I am.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
All right.
Well, if you've listened tothis and you want to reach out
to Nolan and tell him you'reawesome, we all love it.
So, nolan Sharp, you'll findhim on LinkedIn.
Thank you again, nolan, forjoining us.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
All right.
Well, if you're part of LeaderImpact and would like to find
out more and grow yourleadership, find our podcast
page on our website atleaderimpactca and check out our
free leadership assessment.
You can also check out groupsavailable in Canada at
leaderimpactca.
Or, if you're listening fromanywhere else in the world,
(40:07):
check out leaderimpactcom or getin touch with us by email.
Info at leaderimpactca and wewill connect you.
And if you like this podcast,please leave us a comment, give
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This will help other globalleaders find our podcast.
Thank you for engaging with usand remember impact starts with
you.
Welcome to the Leader Impact Podcast.
We are a community of leaderswith a network in over 350
cities around the world,dedicated to optimizing our
personal, professional andspiritual lives to have impact.
This show is where we have achance to listen and engage with
leaders who are living this out.
We love talking with leaders,so if you have any questions,
comments or suggestions to makethe show even better, please let
us know.
The best way to stay connectedin Canada is through our
(00:27):
newsletter at leaderimpactca oron social media at Leader Impact
.
If you're listening fromoutside of Canada anywhere in
the world, check out our websiteat leaderimpactcom.
I'm your host, lisa Peters, andour guest today is Nolan Sharp.
Nolan coordinates Leader Impactin Croatia.
He holds a master's degree inelectrical engineering from the
Stanford and worked as a chipdesigner for Hewlett Packard.
(00:49):
In 2001, he moved to his wife'shomeland to found what became
Leader Impact Croatia.
He coordinates the GlobalLeadership Summit in Croatia and
organizes small and large groupevents for business leaders.
For 18 years he trained therest of the staff of the
(01:11):
non-profit that Leader Impactbelongs to in fundraising.
He has a master's degree intheology and coordinates
theological development in AgapeEurope.
He is also an elder at theZagreb Malishnica.
Thank you, baptist Church.
Nolan and Sandra have two sons.
Welcome to the show, nolan, andthanks for the correction.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
No, it's great to be here.
That was a lie in mine.
Sorry about that.
You should have made sure youknew how to pronounce it.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Oh yeah, and it's funny because I usually go
through everything, I highlightall the words I don't know and I
don't know how I missed thatone.
It got to the end and I'm like,oh, I know it, I know it, I know
it leaders right, we don't askfor help no, just go for it,
just something I, uh, I want totell you that it is so exciting,
I mean, with our time change,with our difference from you
being around the world.
It it's so exciting to connectwith leaders like yourself,
(01:56):
nolan, so thank you for joiningus.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Oh, it's fantastic to be here.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Thank you for having me oh, I just I'm enjoying these
, just listening to othercultures, other ways to do
business, so I'm excited to divein.
Are you ready?
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
All right, okay.
Well, we're going to talk aboutyour leadership style and
approach, and our first questionis what makes a great leader in
Croatia, and do you feel thisis unique to Croatia?
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah, that's a.
That's a great country, youknow.
To Croatia, yeah, that's agreat country, you know.
Croatians are very warm,they're very sociable and it's
kind of a traditional cultureand the country has been through
enormous change sinceindependence in 1991.
So I think here it's importantfor leaders to be very warm, to
be involved in people's lives,sometimes, whether they want to
(02:44):
or not, to almost take on aparental role in ways towards
the people that they lead,because the culture has some of
the very warm and social andpersonal aspects to it.
But also because of whatCroatia has been going through
for the last three and a halfdecades, leaders here have to be
very, very flexible andresilient and adaptive to change
(03:07):
, Because Croatia has gone frombeing a social part of a larger
socialist country to beingindependent, to being kind of in
a nowhere land for a few yearsand then being on the road to
joining the European Union, nowEuropean Union member, and
change has just been a constant.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Mm-hmm.
Union member.
Uh, and, and change has justbeen a constant listening to you
.
Um, and you talked about warm,social, involved, parental.
My mind went to boundaries.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yeah, we have so many books on boundaries yeah, well,
my wife runs a course based onsome of henry cloud's, you know,
things on boundaries andchanges that heal and and and
there's we can into.
There's always the other sideof the coin, right.
So you have to accept thereality of how the culture works
.
But then of course, none of usare totally happy with the
cultures we are a part of, andso oftentimes we're thinking
(03:55):
like, oh gosh, I wish there wasa different way.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Yeah, I mean you were raised in the United States,
right, yeah, the differences andI know we'll probably get into,
but just when I think of howyou were raised to where you are
today, that's a big differencelistening.
Huge for me and I'm thinking wedidn't experience that sort of
independence and the change andall that Croatia has gone
(04:20):
through.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
I'm sure we'll get into it.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, do you want me to talk to that a
little bit?
Yeah, yeah, definitely.
I mean I grew up very kind ofmiddle class in the United
States and much more of atypical we used to say WASP-y,
you know kind of cultural momentin the United States.
White Anglo-Saxon Protestant,where there's my family, was
fairly quiet growing up.
We read a lot.
There wasn't much extravagantemotion and so not only you know
(04:50):
, I didn't grow up here, I'm notItalian or some other, you know
culture that maybe has a littlebit more similarities in some
ways and so, yeah, I've had alot, a lot to learn and, um, uh,
for me, cultural adaption,adaptation has a lot to to do
(05:12):
with the idea of reallyrealizing I, I need to
understand this place and livehere.
You know, if you really want tolive in a culture, that that's,
that's, that's non-negotiableUm.
But there's a process over timeto figuring out how, how, um can
I be flexible and adaptive andchange a lot of the ways I do
things?
And realize, if I want to winpeople's, if I want to win a
group's approval for some ideaI'm trying to push, I need to do
it in a way that works for thembut also not to lose myself in
(05:35):
the end either, because, again,every culture is kind of also
stuck in different ways.
I'm never going to be a bettercrowd than a crowd themselves,
but I can.
There are times I've, but thistakes decades.
There are times now when I'vebeen here so long enough that I
that I realized, okay, maybethis is one of those situations
where I can kind of kind ofexplain things like how I would
do this out of my own naturalways of doing stuff, and people
(05:56):
might say, oh, that's actuallyreally interesting, because we
tend to get stuck in that samearea.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Yeah, I think it's so important to have the
conversation because the worldhas opened up and we are dealing
, we can do business around theworld.
So to listen to you and tounderstand and just grant some
grace and talk about it and thisis the way I would have done
something.
So it's very interesting.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
You did mention WASP-y and then you said
Anglo-Saxon, what I don't know,maybe in Canada they use a term
that's an old term People talkabout white, Anglo-Saxon
Protestant culture.
That was sort of the sort ofnortheastern part of the United
States, the people whosebackground is in the English, or
(06:37):
people from the UK that came,the original colonial kind of
settlers of the United States,and so that has a lot to do with
patterns of, you know, wealthor of well standing or of being
very culturally at home in theUnited States.
Basically because that's that'skind of you know, waspy, that's
, I don't know, that's a termthat people used a lot more when
I was young, grown up.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
All right, we're gonna move on to challenges and
strategies and talk about whatare some of the unique
challenges you face as a leaderin Croatia, and could you share
an example and how you addressedit?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Yeah, well, I think I mentioned a little bit.
So you know, when you justbeing in any cross-cultural
situation, you have to learn toset yourself aside.
The kinds of advice I got werethings like for the first year
you're in a new environment kindof almost make no suggestions
or a term, a phrase someone gaveme and gave other people who
(07:30):
are in similar situations tomine was just keep reminding
yourself, it's not wrong, it'sjust different.
Because your intuitions aregoing to want to tell you all
the time in a cross-culturalsituation that's just wrong.
That's just wrong.
But because you don't haveenough experience in the culture
yet to realize why it's maybeactually not wrong, because a
(07:51):
lot of things are different thanthey are wherever you're coming
from, so you have to tellyourself a hundred or a thousand
times it's not wrong, it's justdifferent, before you kind of
maybe actually have enoughexperience where there are
things that are wrong as well inevery culture, but you kind of
don't.
You haven't won the experienceof the right for a long time to
kind of to say that necessarily,and so that process is a
(08:12):
process.
But I'd say, since I've beenliving here for 23 years, my
wife's creation and my kids grewup here.
My whole life is around, isaround creations.
There's comes a point too,which I alluded to, which is
that you do have to at the endsay you know what I am, who I am
, and I understand like Ioperate as an adaptive person in
(08:33):
this culture.
But I'm also not going tototally lose myself because that
kind of going native.
In a sense you lose what makesyou different and interesting
amongst the people you're aroundif you completely, almost kind
of like, just die to yourselfand become nothing.
So that kind of figuring outlike who am, I question.
(08:53):
I mean, we all struggle withthat throughout our lives, but
you think about it probably alot intensely in cross-cultural
living.
I think one area that for me inCroatia was very interesting
was the idea of learning.
So I read an article when I'dlived here for about seven years
and it was about and the authorwas a scholar who had lived in
Spain for a number of years atthat point and she wrote about
(09:15):
Spain as an honor-shame cultureand I'd never heard this term
before.
But in this article she kept ongiving examples where I thought
and.
But in this article she kept ongiving examples where I thought
I.
That feels really similar tosome things that I've
experienced, and so it startedme on this journey where I spent
more than 10 years learning andreading about.
You know what are honor shamecultures like and really quickly
(09:39):
it might be.
You know the difference betweenwhat the another group is
called like guilt innocenceculture so Canada, the United
States would be considered ingeneral guilt innocence cultures
and the difference between aguilt innocence culture and
honor shame culture.
There's a lot of differences,but one quick way to get into it
is like do you, how do you feelwhen you've done something
(10:01):
wrong and no one else knows it?
And that's usually kind ofconscience, and that's what
people generally tend to feel inguilt-innocence cultures Like I
did something wrong, no oneelse knows it, but I feel
terrible.
Whereas in honor-shame culture,what's often really difficult
for people is when you mighthave not done anything wrong but
other people think you've donesomething wrong and just the
(10:22):
fact that they think you didsomething wrong creates a burden
.
That's called shame right.
So shame comes upon you sort of.
It can come upon you separatelyfrom whether you actually did
anything wrong yourself andwhich one of those two kind of
tends to dominate more in theway that you interact with other
people and live your life, andboth of these are everywhere,
(10:46):
and I think we've had this hugereawakening of understanding and
talking about the topic ofshame in the West in the past
couple of decades, I thinklargely because we ignored shame
for a long time, because guiltversus innocence was much more
the way we kind of adjudicatethings, like figure out, well,
how am I going to respond inthis situation?
Am I guilty or am I not?
(11:07):
And if I'm not guilty, I don'tcare.
Uh, whereas shame and honor is,um, uh, a much more traditional
way of people interacting withthe world.
It's still much, it's and it'svery present here, uh, and so
learning how to live with thatUm, and even, I think, in a lot
of ways, that's again one of theways, as a, as a foreigner,
someone living here, um, I'vehelped a lot of my Croatian
(11:27):
friends also understand theirown culture better by saying you
know, you guys are much moresensitive sometimes to the, the,
the, the reputation ofsomething, the, the, the voice
of the group, what other peopleare putting upon you, whether or
not you agree with it or not.
Then maybe I am, and you reallyneed to think about that.
So learning to navigate some ofthat stuff was a big part of my
(11:50):
journey.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
So you're speaking.
Well, maybe you're not speakingas a male.
So do you think the females, doyou think they have any unique
challenges, or where do they fitin this?
I mean looking at your wife asa leader.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Yeah, yeah, Well, I mean, I can talk forever on this
topic, but there there is,there is this thing, and I think
it's one of these things.
That's that, uh, where this hasbecome less visible.
Uh, and yet, you know, we, welive in this moment.
We don't.
We're I think we're close tosimilar generation, and when we
were growing up and you didn'thave the internet, you you could
(12:23):
live so much your life and befaced with all these kind of
factors, and yet if you didn'thave a specific class, you
didn't pick up the right book onit, you might never put your
finger on it.
And now we're all informationflying at us all the time and we
constantly have this experienceof maybe just scrolling through
you know, your Instagram feedor something, and some video
comes up and basically tells youlike something like that just
(12:44):
feels like it unlocks some crazypart of your life you never
thought about, Right?
So we're all kind of beingfaced with so many new ideas all
the time, some of which arereally important and interesting
.
So in traditional cultures, um,shame there's.
In traditional cultures, shamethere's a way in which there was
an expectation for women toguard their honor by avoiding
(13:04):
shameful experiences, andwhereas in honor-based cultures,
men would tend to go out intothe public and risk something
and succeed or fail in order togain honor, For women, in
traditional cultures, honor hasbeen something more to be kind
of guarded by avoiding pitfalls.
(13:26):
So you know, to the extent ofto the extremes of, say, sexual
shame for women being much morelike well, were you, were you,
did you go somewhere you werenot supposed to go?
Were you, did you put yourselfin a position you weren't
supposed to?
Did you wear clothes that youweren't supposed to?
And that could seem a thousandyears away from you?
Know many people who live today,and one of the things that's so
(13:47):
interesting about me for withmy wife and living here is that
my wife is basically, I mean,she's had an amazing life.
My wife, Sandra, is just justthe coolest people I know, but
she grew up in a village, grewup without.
She's the first person to go touniversity in her family, first
person to finish high school inher family, on starting out and
(14:07):
going all the way straightthrough high school, and so she
has these cultural memories thatevery once in a while we still
talk about.
Well, she'll be like oh yeah, Ihaven't thought about that in a
long time and she'll tell mesome story from, like, growing
up in a rural environment thatjust like blows my mind, Uh, and
it was also a helpful part ofour conversations with each
other to realize.
I mean, a simple example wouldbe like um, uh, uh, I grew up,
(14:28):
uh, we would go to church onSundays and do grocery shopping
afterwards and come home and Ilove Sunday lunch because we
would eat junk food, basicallyLike it was the.
We'd go to buy groceries and soI'd be like, oh, we can buy
potato chips, and then thepotato chips would get eaten
that afternoon and we would havesandwiches and I was super
happy.
I was like that's great.
My wife didn't grow up going tochurch and so for her, but the
(15:00):
kind of equivalent of church inthe village where my wife grew
up was that the mom made thishuge lunch on Sundays to take
care of her family and show thatshe was good at this.
And so my mother-in-law wouldask my wife a question that
seems innocent but never feltinnocent to my wife when we were
early on in our marriage, whereshe would say, oh, what are you
making for Nolan for lunchtoday?
And because we would go tochurch together, then like, well
, I'm just making a small lunchand we're going to get home
later, blah, blah, blah.
But for my wife, this questionjust all was so deep under her
skin because it's you know, it'sa, it's a very traditional
(15:20):
thing that, like this, is howyou demonstrate your, your
womanhood, to an extent, and andit took a lot of time and
conversation to realize like,okay, yeah, you know we don't
have to do this, Um and and uh,uh, but we can, I mean, we can
figure out ways around it.
Buying a crock pot actually wasone of the solutions for this
was just like, okay, I can wakeup and throw something in the
(15:41):
crock pot, we go to church, wecome home, we can still have a
nice Sunday lunch.
But you know, those messages goreally deep in people and
cultures and I think thatthey're very tricky and I think
it's good that we can just bringthem out and talk about them
and um, uh, and look at them forwhat they are and, you know,
say yes to the things that aregood or say goodbye to some
(16:02):
things and, um, yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
My mind just flooded things.
I grew up with that.
I have tried to let go of yeahwhen you yeah Woo, that's so I'm
just going to take a moment,Woo.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
That's so.
I'm just going to take a moment.
That's interesting, right,because you grew up in Canada,
right?
So do you think like, oh,that's you know, but that's one
of the things that's fun aboutliving here is realizing all
these things that I sort of hadto learn to survive here,
because this felt weird to me atfirst, and but then, as the
years go by, I realized like, ohyeah, we had our own version of
that when I was growing up.
It was just invisible to me.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Um, you know yeah, I grew up um the uh, a very large,
uh, not just Sunday, but verylarge dinners for the important
dates.
So if it was so very, verylarge, my mom would spend all
day in the kitchen and I marriedinto a family that, so that was
food, and food was important.
(16:56):
Where I married into, a familywith, people were important.
So, um, I now you know yougather all the people and it's
it's not about making sevendishes and how many vegetables
and two meats and how many, butyou know it's about the people
and that you don't spend thetime in the kitchen, you spend
the time at the table.
I love it because it's justless cooking.
(17:18):
Yeah, I'll just make a biglasagna, but yeah, I, um, and I
the guilt that I felt yeah ofyou know, when I have my mom
over and I don't cook a big, youknow, it's all about sitting
down for an hour at a table, ortwo hours and talking.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
So yeah, yeah that's another thing of someone.
Um, I, I think we learned alongthe way that having a
cross-cultural marriage for us,I mean, there's always
challenges.
It's kind of like morepractical challenges, like now,
as our kids, you know, we haveolder parents on two different
continents.
Now, like those, those are realthings.
But I think one of the positivethings about having a
cross-cultural marriage was wewent into it expecting to have a
(17:52):
lot of differences and thathelped us a lot to just have
conversations, whereas I thinkoftentimes, what people don't
you?
Maybe somebody marries someonefrom their hometown and so they
think, oh okay, you knowwhatever, but every family has
its own culture, so that, likewhat you just said, you can
marry your next door neighbor,but there can still be these
very big differences inexpectations.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, and just finding your space to make it
work?
Yeah, yeah, great conversation,thank.
To make it work yeah, yeah,great conversation, thank you.
So the next question does talkabout cultural sensitivity,
global leadership.
So I want to ask you, how doyou approach leading a team or
organization with members fromdiverse cultural backgrounds?
Speaker 1 (18:27):
That's a great question.
So I think a place to start isto say you don't get to live in
a culture-free zone.
So it's not about saying orthat a culture is just a team is
just going to invent a culturefor itself.
Cultures exist in large extentbecause we have to do so much of
our communication andunderstanding based on shared
(18:49):
assumptions and things we're noteven aware of.
So I think you have to kind ofpick a culture to be the
baseline for a team andoftentimes, depending on where
you are, you have to kind ofpick a culture to be the
baseline for a team andoftentimes, depending on where
you are, you have to pick alanguage.
Then, right, and maybe that'salso one of the things that's
getting really tricky in theworld today is that it's become
so common to just use English,as if English is neutral, but
(19:10):
that's not necessarily true.
You know, english also formsthe way we think about things or
the way people can expressthemselves, and the native
English speakers on a team ofEnglish speakers have a huge
advantage in how easily they'reable to express their deepest
emotions than people from othercultures.
Anyway, so I think you have topick.
(19:30):
You kind of have to pick aculture, and it really, in my
kind of world, you should pickthe culture you're trying to
serve, because if you pick theculture of the majority of the
team or the whole organizationyou're representing, then you
are going to, I think, make tonsof mistakes, trying to go, you
(19:54):
know, talking about some topicin a leadership meeting as if
this is okay, this is how we'regoing to define this, this is
what's going to work for us, andthen going out into a world
that basically doesn't match it,and that can be a big challenge
, especially if you're, say,sent as a leader somewhere, but
then the language and theculture is different than yours.
So I know that's a huge order,but I really do think you have
(20:15):
to be realistic and say somekind of culture is going to be
like a baseline and it probablyshould be as close as possible
to your target or your audienceor your customers, and you need
to figure out, then, how to showrespect for that culture and to
work with inside of it.
And then you're, of course.
Then you can do things likesaying, well, there's things we
(20:36):
don't actually like here, course.
Then you can do things likesaying, well, there's things we
don't actually like here orthere are certain things we want
to modify or we want to bringin as much as we can from these
different values.
But you have to be explicitabout it and you have to
recognize that some cultures aregoing to be the default.
And again, because there's just, you can't have a two-day
offsite and say like we're goingto define our values as a team
(20:58):
and think you're going to getanywhere close to having enough
to actually define a new culture.
There's so much that goes unsaidin culture that it seems kind
of hopeless to me that you'regoing to just define it based on
the global value.
I don't know something andyou'll never get it all right.
There'll be a lot of ummistakes and, uh, you have to
(21:20):
encourage people to to apologize, see clarity, ask people to
explain themselves.
But even that's tricky becausethat's a set.
Those are Western valuesusually actually to to say,
speak up and assert yourself andto do these little things.
That that that can be a trap aswell.
Um, because some cultures arebig on power, distance and
indirect communication and it'svery, very tricky.
(21:45):
But if you use tools like theCulture Map, the World Values
Survey, and you get things asmuch out on paper as possible,
like objectively, sort of evenexplaining to people what power
distance means or what, um, uh,indirect communication means.
Uh, uh can be really, reallyhelpful for them to go okay,
yeah, that's, you know, that'swho I am, but yeah, it's, I mean
(22:06):
, it's fun, it's can drive youcrazy, it's, it's beautiful,
it's complicated.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Challenge.
I go back to something you saidearlier about just set yourself
aside, make no suggestions.
Yeah, you know, when you'reworking with someone of a new
culture, it's like just you knowyou said pick the culture you
are trying to serve.
Yeah, and maybe just sometimesjust step back a bit and just
listen, you know.
Yeah.
I mean it's tricky because Iknow it's not a women thing.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
Did I just put it in, just no, but I know, but it's
very tricky.
No, I think women there's some,I mean we live, I guess we've
again maybe our generation.
There was a long, we were toldfor a long time men and women
are pretty much interchangeableand it feels like we're now
entering a little bit more of amoment of, because we just can't
avoid it, and there's been somuch more scientific research
(22:55):
done.
But women and men,statistically speaking, people
can be anything they are, but onthe average, women and men have
some very different ways oftending to look at things or
whatever, and women are, just onthe average, so much more aware
of what's going on around themthan men are.
That it's pretty hilarious.
So women, but maybe sometimes,but everything can be a little
(23:17):
bit paradoxical.
So I think women in newsituations, it's kind of like
they're more sensitive, butthey're getting blasted, their
filters are getting blasted allthe time by, you know, nonverbal
communication or body languageor whatever, and guys are
clueless.
But maybe then guys might belike okay, wait, they told me to
focus on one thing, so I'mgoing to focus on that one thing
and I'm going to observe kindof this one thing.
(23:39):
So I think that you know it'sjust, it's just amazing how, how
complex it can be.
But I, like, I wanted to saythat, like I am, I know and
understand to say you know,mcdonald's is amazing and they
can go into any, almost anyplace in the world and open
mcdonald's and they have a, theyhave a thing they're trying to
deliver and then they have, youknow, standards and they train
everybody everywhere to anextent to do things the same way
(24:01):
or to have the same, you know,operating system.
And so multinationalcorporations often do have a
kind of standardized culturethat they employ, which often
then is a sort of a smooshedversion of the culture of the
countries that they came from.
And I get that.
But I think that that works forcertain kinds of enterprises
that are basically delivering avery standardized product into a
(24:24):
new environment.
And you have to ask yourself alot am I installing a franchise
of something else here, or am Itrying to really solve a local
problem that may demand localsolutions?
And if it does, you've justsigned up for Alice in
Wonderland and figuring out howfar down the rabbit hole goes,
cause it's like you know, if youreally start open.
Yeah, you know.
(24:45):
So you know I, I understand ifyou're, if you're thinking about
an international corporation orsomething that's going to move
its business into a new place,but you still run into it all
the time, no matter what.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Wow, oh, nolan, such a great conversation.
You make my cheeks hurt.
I'm smiling for life.
So when I I want to talk alittle bit about personal
development and learning and, um, because there are many
aspiring leaders, so what advicewould you give to inspire
aspiring leaders, particularlythose from different cultural
backgrounds?
I feel like you've touched onthis a little bit, but yeah,
yeah, I mean.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
So your, your life, is a a gift from God and your,
your unique person, who has aunique background that really
like, is a gift to the world.
So, however, you grew up andand good and bad and ugly and a
mix of everything and stuffyou're so proud about and stuff
you're not so proud about itmade you who you are and it's
(25:38):
made you this very complicatedperson that is adaptable and yet
really has some very, verydeeply held values and patterns
for doing things.
And I think my life has beenpartially about figuring out how
far can you go, how much canyou really change by working in
another language all the timeand working completely with
people from another country allthe time and working, you know,
complete with people fromanother country all the time,
(26:01):
and you can go really far, butyou can't.
You can't like complete.
Only in childhood Are you youknow this like a plastic,
malleable thing that cancompletely recreate itself and
the more you can do tounderstand and reflect on how
you were raised?
What was my extended familylife?
What was my community like?
What was the societal moment inwhich I was raised in my own
(26:21):
culture?
What kind of things did I seevalued and held up as good
examples of leadership or badways.
How did people come toconsensus in my family, in my
neighborhood, in my village?
How did all these things reallyfunction?
Neighborhood in my village?
You know how did all thesethings really function and then
use.
You know tools, like, I think,what I mentioned.
(26:42):
You know the Culture Map, aWorld Values Survey, to try and
start giving some language tothose differences.
And so you know, really figureout where you come from and
there are parts of where youcome from you're going to dig
deep in and rely upon in manyhard situations.
Like I am the fifth generationof hardworking.
You know rural farmers and likeno one ever.
(27:05):
You know, like I'm raised bypeople who always got up at five
in the morning and you know I'mnot going to be lazy today.
Like you know, dig deep andembrace the good parts of where
you came from, but also learn attimes that you can say goodbye
to parts of where you came from.
But also learn at times thatyou can say goodbye to parts of
what you grew up with or modifyit.
You know and say, like it'sgreat that my background helps
(27:27):
me to be really flexible andaccommodating to other people.
But there are times I need tolearn how to speak up for myself
, and so you know how do I dothat.
So you have to be a student ofyour own life.
There's an activity you probablyfamiliar with that maybe you
could recommend to people,called a genogram, where you
really kind of look at yourfamily's history, you know, and
(27:48):
kind of go back severalgenerations and say what were
the really, what's the reallycrucial part of my family story?
It's kind of where you do someanalysis of like, where their
broken relationships ortragedies or major events in my
sort of parents, grandparents,aunts and uncles, even great
grandparents if you know muchabout them kind of what happened
in the background there.
Because all of us are much more, I think maybe those of us who
(28:11):
are Westerners need tounderstand that we're much more
a product of the way we wereraised than we are just this
completely individual person whogets to think about things
however we want to.
So I think understandingyourself is a really crucial
thing and that again gives yousome understanding for, okay, so
(28:32):
other people are different thanme.
I can adapt myself, I can dothings a certain way, but I'm
probably also going to findsooner or later that in teams
and in certain environments Ilike stability versus dynamic
environment or I function best.
You know I should.
It's kind of a I think it'slike an 80-20 thing.
It's like we can spend 20% ofour time doing something that's
like completely unnatural for usand hard and awkward If it fits
(28:55):
in this bigger picture of likeI love and I want that, but I
have to do.
I have to do sales to get tothis other goal.
Even on, I don't love going andknocking on doors but, I, got to
do it, but it can be a 20%thing, but if it's an 80% thing
and you know in your bones thisit's not for me, you know, then
you've got to figure out, likeprobably thinking about how to
make some changes.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
Yeah, I think, when just listen to, and if the
opportunity ever came up for meto work with someone from
Croatia, because we're justtalking, just being vulnerable
and being open, you know, justsometimes yeah, because you said
we're a product of how we wereraised and sometimes just you've
(29:35):
got to put that down my mindgoes to just you know I might
need a coach.
Yeah, just to help you throughthe conversations that I would
need to have in the backgroundbefore coming to you and going.
I just want to push this agenda, you know, because this is
what's you know, and sometimesyou've got to go whoa.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
As you said earlier.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Set yourself aside, you know.
Just listen, just be vulnerable, say how you're feeling.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
And as a leader I mean, one of the things I've
been really fascinated by iswatching the stories of Croatia,
like many countries in a lot ofplaces, but in Eastern Europe
has a huge problem with youngpeople leaving.
They go and they live somewhereelse and so the population is
decreasing.
And when you listen to people Ilove, I'm very, because it's
their own cross-culturalexperience.
So when they go and they movesomewhere else, a lot of times
(30:19):
people said as they said, likein the end, I'm not, I didn't
leave Croatia.
I mean I'm being paid more andwhatever than I was in Croatia.
But the reason I don't thinkabout coming back is because I
have experienced leadership, orleadership on the part of people
I work for in these othercountries, in Ireland or
something, where they value meas a person, they are open to my
(30:41):
input, they see potential in meand they want to see me grow,
and I think that's something.
And we have both many culturesaround the world, but also this
global emerging culture that'shappening because of the
internet or whatever, and Ireally feel like I mean, I don't
know every place, but I feellike there's so much to be
(31:03):
gained from being a leader whosays I see things in you maybe
you're not ready to see inyourself yet.
I believe for more in you.
I think that there's more thatcan happen in your life than
maybe what you're seeing rightnow.
That seems to be something that,for whatever reason, I think is
often a hole or wound for somany people, no matter where
they're from.
(31:23):
And even it's kind of crazybecause, like America is full of
this, has been full of this,maybe Canada, the United States
has been full of this likeyou're perfect, you're your own
individual snowflake and you'regoing to do great things in your
life.
And then the generation kind oflike you have young people then
grows up and says I've beenhearing that my whole life.
I don't believe it.
It's just like whether or notyou've heard the positive,
(31:44):
whether or not anybody went outof their way to tell you I you
know.
But there's something I thinkabout being someone's actual
leader, someone's actual boss ina job, or or someone's actual
boss in a job or whatever, whosays like I see you, I know you,
I watch you.
I'm not just telling you thisas a whatever we need to talk
about.
Some of you know some of thethings you need to improve as
well, but um I I see a path foryou to grow.
I think that's huge for people.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
So you mentioned the young people are leaving,
getting these experiences.
Are they coming back after afew years?
And my goes to you know,there's, there's the family
business and someone is raisedin the family business.
The dad says you know what, goget a job somewhere else.
Uh, take your degree, get a joband then come back and run my
company because you learn,you've, you've expanded.
(32:26):
Is that happening or are theystaying away?
Speaker 1 (32:28):
uh, what happened?
The person whose family has.
So the stereotype in this partof the world would be if the
person who has the familybusiness is like no, I have
taken care of you, I have a slotfor you, you never need to
leave.
The people that leave are theones who are probably more
ambitious and maybe don't comefrom backgrounds where there's
the social capital that theirfamily or their group got them
(32:52):
an opportunity right away andthey start running up against at
least the perception thateverything here depends on
connections.
And I don't have those kinds ofconnections.
So I'm going to go.
You know, I'm going to go livesomewhere else and, of course,
tons of people would love tocome home.
They would love to come back.
You know, they see like, oh man, this it's a tough.
It's tough to live somewhereelse, even if you can make a
good wage and all this kind ofstuff, and you're far away from
(33:13):
your family and the years go byand then you start wondering if
your kids are going to have anycultural identity from your home
country at all.
So, like I, I I completelyunderstand the desire to come
back, but as of yet,specifically in Croatia, people
are very slow to come back.
Wow, if they've been gone for aAll right.
(33:39):
My last question for you, nolan, is what do you hope will be
your legacy as a leader when youleave this world?
Yeah, that's a great question,and I think I just really wanted
to know that I had a part asmall or large part in the
growth of other people whobecame transformational leaders
themselves.
You know, it's leading leaderimpact in Croatia, or something
like that for the last 23 years.
(33:59):
I feel like I've made everypossible mistake you can make
and I think it's the grace ofGod that we're still here and
doing what we're doing.
So you have to learn to lookfor and celebrate what might, at
the moment, seem like smallsuccesses, things where you know
(34:19):
you.
You just get a glimpse.
My son came home from seeingplaying soccer and being around
a bunch of uh guys, uh the othernight and turned out one of
them is someone that thatvolunteers at our global
leadership summit the othernight and turned out one of them
is someone that volunteers atour Global Leadership Summit and
he said something nice to myson about how my leadership and
taking over this in Croatia andkeeping it going and seeing it
(34:41):
grow and you know you got tolive for the little wins.
I think most of us in our livesare not going to experience fame
and fortune and all this kindof stuff, but when you can learn
to appreciate theinterconnectedness with other
people and going out of your wayto help, and without ever, you
(35:02):
know, you don't look for thereward, you don't look for
calculation and sort of.
You know, making space forother people or giving them an
opportunity or whatever.
But you got to allow yourself,you know, to really celebrate
when you get the glimpses thatit was worth it, because you can
start to see change in otherpeople and and and oftentimes
you're not, you're not like thecrucial person, but you, you got
(35:22):
to play a part, um, in, youknow, adding a brick in the wall
or whatever of someone else'sgrowth.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
So oh, I love that Cause I don't think we think of
the little wins as enough.
And there are.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
There can be so many in a day, the little wins, and
yeah, we're not all fame um yeah, we live in a generation, we
live in an age obsessed with,like, the one person who did the
one thing, sort of Steve Jobsor whatever.
But, like you know, that'sthat's a very specific thing
about time and history orwhatever that made for Steve
(35:55):
jobs and that's great that hedid what he did and stuff.
But you know the impact, Ithink.
I think maybe one of the thingsthat's happening in culture
today is like we're losing thevalue of I don't know, like what
a career high school teacherdoes over the course of working
for 40 years and having hundredsand hundreds of young people go
through their, their school,and the the incredible impact
(36:15):
that that can have.
I think we're sort of losingthe because and, of course, in a
more traditional culture, likeif you were the school teacher
in a town, you were a prettyimportant person.
And now we live in an age when,unfortunately, I think, people
who who serve other peoplethrough their work, um are just
constantly feeling the pressureand the criticism of like it's
not good enough.
You're not.
You know we, we live in an ageof complaints about those who
(36:37):
serve others.
Right, so it's um, yeah, it'stricky.
I just hope that you know, andI often talk about what I do,
about like when we do globalleadership, some in the way we
put a program together.
I often say, like I want totarget a program for the leader
who's just about ready to quit,because they're like I've been
doing this thing and I got intothis because I wanted to make a
difference and I wanted to makea change and I wanted to be
(36:57):
helpful.
But like I'm done, you know,like I I just gotten so much
blowback and criticism and Idon't feel it's fair.
But I don't get to complain andsay it's not fair because I'm
the leader, um, this is, this isan I'm in agony, I'm almost
ready to give up.
You know, and and we often tryand think about you know how to
(37:18):
how to put a program together insuch a way that for that person
they're going to have thatmoment that kind of just gives
them clarity and insight andmaybe a reset of their kind of
frame of saying, like you knowwhat, the reasons I got into
this thing were actually really,really great and I'd be stupid
to give it up now.
And I just need to.
You know, I need to recenter,refocus or rethink about.
You know how I'm evaluating allthis stuff because everybody
like has enough reason to justsay, like, that's it, I'm out,
(37:39):
I'm done, I've had enough.
Speaker 2 (37:42):
So I feel the reason I keep coming back here and the
reason I keep involved withleader impact is for many of
that, because I have to bereminded, and you do.
You can't just think you know.
Just, leadership isn't aone-time day thing, it's every
day and and you have to surroundyourself with people that will
pump you know, and just be partof your team.
(38:04):
Um, there's a uh from the bibleI.
I interviewed my father-in-law,who's one of the greatest men
and one of the quotes I or oneof the bible um, from the bible
I put in first p.10, god callsyou to use all your gifts,
talents and influence to serveothers and I just you know, I
read that and yeah, and theother part I added was fight the
(38:25):
lie that their talents arebetter than your talents,
because we are all different andwe all have talents and we are
to find them and and use themand serve.
So, yeah, Anyway, Nolan, I wantto thank you for joining us.
This is just so good.
I just feel blessed to be ableto share this with everyone and
(38:47):
just be able to talk to you,because it's like when I come to
Croatia, you are on my list.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
Yeah definitely, yeah , come visit and and and your
blessing too, thank you, for youknow your thoughtfulness and
approaching this and thinkingthat work and put all this
together and it's it's.
It's been great.
We talked, you know, oncebefore to set this up and it's
been fun to getting to know yourstory a little bit and it's a
blessing, thank you.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
It's awesome, Thank you.
Now, if listeners want toengage with you, they want to
find more about leader impact inCroatia, or just you.
What's the best way to find you?
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Well, my mom made a great decision 50 years ago to
give me a relatively unusualname, and so it's pretty easy to
find me on the internet.
So my name is Nolan N-O-L-A-N,my last name is Sharp S-H-A-R-P,
and so it's usually comes upreally quickly on LinkedIn or
whatever who I am.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
All right.
Well, if you've listened tothis and you want to reach out
to Nolan and tell him you'reawesome, we all love it.
So, nolan Sharp, you'll findhim on LinkedIn.
Thank you again, nolan, forjoining us.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
All right.
Well, if you're part of LeaderImpact and would like to find
out more and grow yourleadership, find our podcast
page on our website atleaderimpactca and check out our
free leadership assessment.
You can also check out groupsavailable in Canada at
leaderimpactca.
Or, if you're listening fromanywhere else in the world,
(40:07):
check out leaderimpactcom or getin touch with us by email.
Info at leaderimpactca and wewill connect you.
And if you like this podcast,please leave us a comment, give
us a rating or review.
This will help other globalleaders find our podcast.
Thank you for engaging with usand remember impact starts with
you.
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