In our first Executive Spotlight of the year Loyalty360 CEO Mark Johnson dives into an energizing conversation with Amy Barnett, the Vice President of Digital Experience and Loyalty at Cracker Barrel, as part of the Leaders in Customer Loyalty Series. From spearheading a loyalty program that now drives 30% of Cracker Barrel’s sales to shaping an iconic brand’s transformation in today’s rapidly evolving dining landscape, Amy reveals her playbook for success.
This interview is packed with fresh insights on harnessing the "power couple" of first- and third-party data, leveraging generative AI for personalization, and shaking up outdated technology strategies. Plus, Amy shares her career secrets, her passion for mentorship, and the advice she’d give to the next generation of loyalty professionals. Don’t miss this dynamic conversation with one of the industry's most dynamic leaders, she’ll leave you inspired and ready to level up your customer loyalty strategy!
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Good morning.
This is Mark Johnson fromLoyalty360.
I want to welcome you to ournew interview series, the
Loyalty360 Executive Spotlight.
These conversations will bewith some of the customer
loyalty industry's leading mindsand personalities who are
driving success within the mostrevered and successful customer
loyalty programs in the markettoday all of them who are
(00:24):
members of Loyalty360.
In this series, you will learnmore about the individuals who
are working behind the scenes todevelop and maintain customer
loyalty efforts.
Yet we're going to take a morepersonal look into how they got
to where they are today.
Look at some of those successesand maybe some of the
challenges they have faced alongthe way.
Today, we have the pleasure ofspeaking with Amy Barnett.
(00:45):
She's the Vice President ofLoyalty and Digital at Cracker
Barrel.
Amy is one of the mostpassionate people I know within
the customer loyalty space.
We've known each other for over10 years, going back to her
days at Klairs and before thatat Briarley and Partners.
Welcome, amy.
Thank you very much for takingthe time to speak with us today.
It's a great honor to speakwith you, as always.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Thank you, Mark.
I'm honored to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Absolutely.
Can you please provide us alittle bit of background on your
role at Cracker Barrel?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
I would be delighted to.
I'm the Vice President ofDigital Experience and Loyalty
and in the Cracker Barrel worldthat means that I manage the
digital ecosystem, whichincludes the website.
So when you come tocrackerbarrelcom, we lead the
product development, the productprioritization, the UX, the UI
and the user experience oncrackerbarrelcom.
(01:36):
And when you download our app,it's also inclusive of our
digital guest experience in theapp, which, to us, is not just a
rewards app, it's actually alsoa menu and restaurant app as
well.
And then the other two pieces ofthe business are the rewards
program which launched about 18months ago, which I'm sure we'll
(01:57):
talk all about today, and thenthe fourth part of my job which
I'm delighted to share with youis guest relations.
Part of my job which I'mdelighted to share with you is
guest relations.
So, in addition to you know therewards program and the
channels that our guests engagewith us on, it's important to me
that I think about capital L,and capital L to me means that
(02:17):
it's so much more than therewards program and the data
that we collect and know aboutyou, but it's about how we
evolve the entire brandexperience based, rooted in data
and insights.
But how do we change and evolvethe whole customer experience
across store and our digitalproperties to extend customer
lifetime value and get ourguests coming back and wanting
(02:39):
more from us.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
That's excellent.
You talked about it a littlebit, but how does Cracker Barrel
work to meet these evolvingneeds and expectations of
today's customers, today'sguests?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Yeah, so it is January 14th 2025.
And this is a great time to behaving this interview, because
you've probably read in thepress, you've probably seen
Julie on the news or in otherchannels sort of talking about
our brand transformation.
But, as any amazing brand does,all brands sort of evolve over
(03:11):
time and Cracker Barrel is inthis really beautiful moment of
embracing all of our history andour heritage and everything
that we know and love about thisiconic brand and the shopping
experience we provide.
But bringing that forward basedon guest feedback, the changing
dynamic, particularly since2020, but just the changing
(03:39):
restaurant dynamic and howconsumers have changed in terms
of their you know, their dietarypreferences, their budgetary
preferences, even you know,right down to the flavor of the
food that they want and how theyengage with the brand.
So we are listening to quite abit of guest feedback currently
across so many different mediums.
That is driving a lot of thisbrand transformation and,
(03:59):
honestly, it's a part of thereason I'm at Cracker Barrel is
to help provide the datafoundational layer and the
insights to continue drivingthat evolution.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
You've done an amazing job launching a very
successful customer loyaltyprogram while also evolving kind
of the store a little bit thefood offerings.
You have some kind of testmarkets that you work on now.
How does the customer loyaltyplay into meeting some of these
evolving needs and expectationsof your customers?
The relationship that thecustomer loyalty program kind of
(04:31):
develops with their customers?
Speaker 2 (04:33):
Yeah, it plays a very significant part.
I think Julie has shared thisin other media, so I don't think
I'm sharing anything.
We track about 30% of our salesright now through the rewards
program, so we have thisenormously rich set of
first-party data that exists inour customer data platforms.
But we are no stranger tothird-party data and I actually
(04:57):
gave a speech this weekend and Italked about how third-party
data and first-party data arethe power couple and I think I
borrowed that from somebody elseand it's stuck with me and I
just can't shed it but it's theblend of third-party data and
the first-party data.
So we have several partners inthe space where we either
augment or append third-partydata to our first-party platform
(05:21):
.
So not just profilinginformation first party platform
.
So not just profilinginformation.
You know we all know sort ofthe historical, demographic and
profiling information but theability to go out onto the
larger data landscape and reallyunderstand in a very fragmented
industry like ours.
We have three day parts.
We have breakfast, lunch anddinner, so pretty much every
(05:41):
dining option in the market isour competitor but in all
fairness it's a share game,right.
So really relying onthird-party data to give us
overarching macro trends onconsumer spend.
You know where is our keyconsumer dining for breakfast,
where are they dining for lunchand dinner, and then marrying
that with the first-party datathat we obviously know what they
(06:01):
do with us through thefirst-party data to the data
that we obviously know what theydo with us through the first
party data to the extent thatwe're able to see it.
But the power couple exists whenyou have what they do in your
own four walls married to all ofthe other data for what they're
doing in the industry as awhole.
So it's a big part of thetransformation Everything from
(06:23):
retail merch selection to youknow how do we think about
delivering real value for lunchand dinner.
It's January, so everybody's inthe value moment.
You can't turn on your TVwithout seeing the three for me
and the.
You know all the Burger Kingand all the value plays.
We're no different, right.
So what's unique, though, sincewe launched the program 18
(06:46):
months ago, is we now have thisreally rich first-party data set
.
So we're not just relying onaggregate market data, but we
are doing the power couple blendof bringing the two together in
a data set.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Excellent.
For those of me that know youalso have a very unique and
storied history in customerloyalty, Did great work on the
agency side.
Now you've been at a number ofmarquee brands and been very
successful at kind of adaptingor enhancing or launching
customer loyalty programs.
What is it about customerloyalty that's kept you in the
industry for as long as you have.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
You know right.
I mean, how blessed are we,Mark, to be in this industry
that we never get bored in?
So I've always been sort ofdata and technology enabled.
You know, I sort of back in theday thought I was either going
to be a lawyer or an engineerand then I started to see this
like beautiful blend between thetechnology and the data and the
marketing.
(07:43):
And I thought, you know, almostinstantaneously I sort of found
my spot.
And what I feel very fortunatein is that the place that I'm in
and the place that we are allin and experiencing is that it
just never changes, it neverstops changing.
The data landscape has changed,the technology landscape has
(08:03):
evolved.
You probably were here too whenthe World Wide Web, you know,
launched and we were all givenpermission, you know, to go surf
the internet and then, just inthe last you know, 30 years,
everything has changed in ourjobs.
Some of the core principles arethere around consumer behavior
and, you know, staying true tothe consumer and what it takes
(08:26):
to measure and really understandthe consumer.
All of that is there, but howwe receive information, the
recency that we receive all thatdata and the space that we're
(08:49):
in for direct marketing andspecifically, the blend between
data and technology andcreativity is it's on.
It's still got so much moregrowth coming, so that's what's
kept me energized.
I mean, not to mention theamazing people I work with.
You know it's still a verypeople-based even with all the
(09:09):
data and technology we work in.
It is a very relationship,people-based business and I
couldn't do another job.
It's just I love it.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
That's excellent.
When you look at the agencyside and the brand side, what's
the biggest difference betweenthe agency side and the brand
side?
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Yeah.
So first of all, I got my starton the agency side.
I spent a lot of time on theagency side, but I never did the
same job for more than a fewyears, like I constantly was
doing something different orlearning a different industry.
So one thing that I think theagency side allows somebody is
(09:48):
to make those type oftransitions.
I can be working with creativedirectors.
I could be working with theprocess directors who are
implementing new technologies.
I can be working with theproduct teams, or I could be
working in travel andhospitality for a few years, and
then I can go and work in, youknow, the C store or the grocery
(10:09):
store or a restaurant or retail, and every industry sort of has
its underpinnings of sameness.
But the agency world allows you, I think, to sort of you know,
learn that expertise, and thenthere's so much opportunity to
learn different aspects of thebusiness and then change
verticals.
What I love about being on theclient side is I love being in
(10:36):
the details when you are on theagency side, and I was always a
great partner.
I hope I was a great partner.
I learned to be a great partner.
You could only take a strategyor an execution so far, right On
the brand side, on the clientside of the business, you own
(10:57):
everything from strategicconception to delivery and then
measuring and reporting andimproving.
So to me, you don't get quitethe breadth but you get the
depth and what I've been able todo is bring the breadth of that
experience into now a fewdifferent brands, and evolve
(11:19):
those brands with all of theexpertise across the different
functions.
So, yeah, I don't think there'sone answer.
I can't give anybody one answerDo you go agency side or do you
go client side?
My intuition is trust your gut,like you will know when it's
time to change, and you willknow, sort of like based on who
(11:40):
you are as a person, for whetheror not it's agency or client
side.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
You touched on a little bit, but what are some of
the learnings from the agencyside that help you on the brand
side?
You talked about maybe notnecessarily owning all the
details.
Specifically, what do you likemore or what learnings that you
take from the agency side thatkind of helped on the brand
client side?
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Well, I think I'm a better client partner.
I think I'm a better clientpartner having spent as much
time as I did on the technologyand the agency side.
When you are on the inside ofan agency, you understand the
product very detail.
You understand the strengthsand weaknesses and resource
(12:20):
constraints and all of thethings that are associated, sort
of, with supporting a businessrather than being in the
business, and so perhaps it'sjust maturity, but I like to
think that it's based on myagency background.
Is that I'm a better strategicpartner, I think, as a result to
my agency partners.
I think that I know theirstrengths and I sort of know
(12:44):
when my team probably needs tostep up a little bit to fill in
their gaps, and I'm just moreunderstanding.
I think that I've not onlygrown in my own career, but
people are generally good, andif an agency is not doing their
job, a lot of times it's becausethe client direction wasn't as
(13:07):
sound or as solid or as thoroughas it probably needed to be.
So I think it's a win-win.
Hopefully, I hope my agencypartners think that anyway, Okay
, and your opinion?
Speaker 1 (13:16):
you know what's the single biggest factor that
influences a great customerexperience?
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Single biggest influencing factor.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Oh, Mark, that is such an enormous question.
Single biggest influencingfactor.
Well, there's no one answer.
Okay, um, um, let's come backto that one.
It's too basic to give aquestion.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Okay, what is one passion outside of work that you
enjoy?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
I'm a big reader.
I, like you, do a lot ofreading.
I listen to a lot of podcasts.
I'm kind of nerdy in that Idon't turn on the TV very often,
although I love a good binge.
Like anybody else, I actuallydon't watch a lot of TV.
I'm sort of a news junkie.
I do a lot of reading.
I listen to a lot of podcasts.
I picked up tennis during 2020.
(14:11):
I guess that's a littlepersonal.
Who cares about it?
Anyway, play tennis.
It gets a little bit of mycompetitive spirit out of me and
onto the court.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Okay, what's the derivation of tennis Pickleball?
Have you picked up pickleballhave?
Speaker 2 (14:29):
you picked up pickleball.
You like pickleball?
I do not.
I'm I'm a hardcore tennis.
I'll do it socially, but I'm,I'm true, blue to the game of
tennis there you go.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
Um well, where did you go to college and what was
your major?
Speaker 2 (14:39):
by chance, yeah, so I grew up.
My undergraduate was from asmall private technology school
called Clarkson University.
It's in upstate New York.
It is a small engineeringschool.
I thought I was going to go toschool to become an engineer and
this school in particular hadan interesting program that they
(15:00):
blended engineering withmanagement.
I can't remember even whatindustrial management, I can't
remember the name of the program.
It was one of the first schoolsin the country to actually do
it and I was taking thosemanagement courses out of duress
because I didn't want to takeany management, you know sort of
marketing, business courses.
I just wanted to go straight up, you know, science, engineering
(15:21):
, and become an engineer.
And then I started to takethese management and business
courses and I just never lookedback.
So I got my undergraduate atClarkson University.
I did end up with a bachelor ofscience in marketing and
technical communications.
I got my graduate degree fromthe University of Texas at
Dallas and it was an MBA with aconcentration in marketing.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
So Okay, great, yeah.
How did that, the ClarksonUniversity, that dual degree,
prepare you for the success youhad in your career?
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Very much so.
Actually they this is a trivialpursuit question, should it
ever come up on your trivialpursuit game.
Clarkson University was thefirst university in the country
to make sure and and requirethat freshmen had laptops PCs we
actually had.
I don't even know if theyweren't laptops at the time.
They were those boxes, you know.
(16:13):
So every freshman had acomputer in our, in our dorm,
which was one of the first timesin the country to ever.
Now all these kids are going toschool.
But that foundation and actuallyI was a coder, I was coding,
but it prepared me foreverything to come, because
think about typing papers,thinking about submitting all of
(16:36):
your assignments electronically, think about coding and doing
all the things that PCs andcomputers were just starting to
really build and do.
And not starting.
I mean PCs.
They've been around for a longtime, but my point is to make it
available to a freshman incollege was pretty important and
(16:57):
to this day I still leantowards a writing degree.
I do a lot of writing in my jobin terms of, you know, copy and
looking at what a consumer isgoing to react to and receive in
terms of communication.
So I use it a lot.
I actually have used my degreequite a bit.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Okay, and what was your first job after college?
Speaker 2 (17:21):
My first job after college, I worked for a database
marketing company.
Well, my first job aftercollege I worked for a database
(17:41):
marketing company.
Well, my job in college wasMcDonald's.
So this is another ploy.
Mcdonald's is my first truelove and I worked there of.
College was actually with acompany, target Based Marketing.
They were out of Texas, out ofDallas, texas.
They were one of the very first.
I think next to Epsilon wereone of the first database
marketing companies and Istarted by leading some of the
RJ Reynolds tobacco clubs.
(18:02):
Right Back in the day there wasMarlboro Miles, if you remember
the Marlboro man, marlboroMiles.
So that got my start inconsumer packaged goods.
I spent a lot of time inconsumer packaged goods and then
, just in the course of mycareer, I got exposed to many
other verticals.
I spent about six years atTarget Base and then I went on
(18:24):
to other direct response ordirect marketing companies after
that.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Okay, what's the best work advice you've ever been
given?
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Here's the best work advice.
Number one there's no room inbusiness to take things
personally.
The sooner you can remove yourfeeling that somebody is
directing something at youpersonally, the more mature and
the higher emotionalintelligence you will have,
(18:56):
generally speaking.
So that's one thing.
The other piece of advice,which is directly in our space,
mark, is one of the hardestlessons I learned is that early
in my career I had held out acontrol cell and it was a huge
program and my analytics teamheld out too small of a control
cell and it basically did notgive us the read of the entire
(19:19):
two years of work that we haddone, because our control group
was too small to actually readthe results.
So there you go.
There's two pieces of advice.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Okay, good, make sure you have the right size control
group.
That's good.
What's the biggest challengeyou faced in your life and how
does that shape you as a person?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Yeah, you know what I first of all I'm.
I can't start this by saying Iknow I'm extremely fortunate.
Ok, I have been.
I was born into a place that Ifeel very fortunate to have been
born into and I've workedextremely hard and I'm very
proud of where I've come.
But I just want to start out bysaying I know that I am more
(19:59):
fortunate than than others.
But, that being said, some ofthe biggest challenges I've
moved.
Actually, I've takenopportunities to move several
times in my life um, fromupstate New York to Texas, to um
, new York city to LA.
I now live in St Louis.
I lived in Dallas for 15 years,um, the hardest part for me at
(20:21):
the time.
Now social media makes all ofthis different right, but at the
time I started over.
Every time, every time, it'sreally hard to start over and
build your network and yoursocial networks and your
professional contacts.
Now the world has changed andone of the biggest pieces of
advice I actually have for folksis hang on to your contacts,
(20:43):
build that network.
Hang on to your contacts, usethose social outlets to network.
Hang on to your contacts, usethose social outlets to stay in
touch.
At the end of the day, a lot ofthis does come down to
interactions and connectionswith people and you know I don't
regret a single moment of themoves that I made.
They were all for the rightreasons.
But it is certainly challengingat least at the time I was
(21:05):
developing my career to stay intouch with a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
That's awesome.
What life lessons have shapedyour perspective?
Speaker 2 (21:13):
I work really hard.
So you're going to ask me later, I think, what my resolutions
are, so I won't share that.
I will just say work ethic andgrit goes a long, long way.
Education is important.
I was fortunate to have areally incredible opportunity to
get a great education and it'svery important, but grit goes a
(21:36):
long way.
And collaboration andnetworking just you know I can't
say enough about those twothings.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
That's awesome.
When you look at your careersuccess, what are a couple of
things you're most proud of?
Speaker 2 (21:51):
My career success.
Well, the work I'm doing atCracker Barrel I'm incredibly
proud of.
It is probably one of my careerhighlights, actually.
First of all, I just I am inlove with this brand.
We are a brand born and bred toplease people.
I sort of feel like that'sabout me as a person as well,
and so like this perfect blendof like my personal nature as
(22:14):
well as the corporate culture,just is like this amazing blend.
The leadership team here isphenomenal in terms of the way
that they strategically thinkabout the brand and the customer
and how they're thinking aboutour transformation.
So I'm very, very proud of thequick I've been here for two and
a half years, so the work thatwe've done in two and a half
years I could not be more proudof.
(22:37):
There's been other brandmoments that I've been
incredibly proud of.
I think it's mostly the peoplethat I have hired in my career
and I feel like I've developed alittle bit.
Most of them were alreadyamazing, but when you hire
really good talent and youinvest the time and the energy
and you see them grow and yousee them move on.
(22:57):
You know I've hired andpromoted people and some of the
people I've hired and promotedare now in, you know, amazing
big jobs at these companies.
So that's pretty fulfilling, Igot to say.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
That's awesome.
As mentioned, you've launchedand enhanced many customer
loyalty programs in your career,several customer loyalty
programs in your career.
What is the key attribute orkey thing that you've done so
well that has allowed you toachieve the success in these
programs that you've launched orrelaunched?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
You're asking me for my secret weapons, Mark.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Yes, why not?
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Okay, I do have a couple of secret weapons.
So there's a lot of research,there's a lot of data to inform
it and I know everybodylistening to this knows the data
pieces and what you bring froma consumer listening perspective
into almost everything that youdo.
It's got to be the foundation,have a good gut reaction and
(23:53):
good gut feel.
But you know everything needsto be grounded in data and
insights.
Number one but that's not mysecret weapon is there is this
beautiful blend of that datawith a really really good,
strong, creative communicationsplan.
And so if you look back, Ithink, at the programs that I've
(24:15):
developed or the programs thatI've launched, or the emails
you've got to sign up If youhaven't signed up for the
Cracker Barrel email, it isreally strong.
But the the blend of a reallystrong, creative strategy and
communications plan, blendedwith the data and the insights
to continually evolve and learn,that's one of my secret weapons
(24:36):
the.
The other secret weapons arethat technology tools.
You know really taking a lookat your technology stack and
being able to, in a veryunbiased way, say this
technology is not working.
And we get married totechnology because it's easy,
(25:00):
you know these, you bringtechnology in and you go to the,
you know you go through all ofthe work of integrating it and
configuring it and training yourstaff and hiring your staff,
and then you get them on thetechnology and then you know
it's here for 10 years and thelife cycle of technology.
Just I really encourageeverybody to think differently
about it.
It needs to be on a much moreagile you know, composable, plug
(25:26):
out, you test, you learn.
Not everything, of course.
Nobody wants to move a customerdatabase or a CDP every two
years, but I think everythingelse, though sort of on the
periphery, should be continuallyevaluated and don't be afraid
of it.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
Excellent.
I think it's very salient.
You know approach.
Some people get married totechnology and it could be the
worst piece of the platformright the technology stack and
they continue to build around it, versus yanking that piece out
and putting something else thatcan actually do what it was
meant to do.
Those are great.
You know keys to success.
So thank you If you go back intime and change one thing about
(26:09):
your life.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
What would that be?
And why, oh my gosh, thesequestions, mark?
Um, I really don't lookbackward.
That's awesome.
I really really buy into thebelief that you know, the future
is forward.
And you know, we are all humanbeings.
We are all human at our core.
We learn, we make mistakes.
(26:29):
We love, you know, we don'tlove.
You know I think that I reallyencourage this with my kids to
you know, shame and regret holdhuman beings back.
And so, you know, as you thinkabout the future and as you look
forward, you know, take thoselessons into play and think.
You know, maybe I could havechanged that interaction, or I
(26:50):
could have changed the way Ileft that company, or I could
have stayed in touch with thatperson, and I didn't.
You know, most importantly,don't hold on to it.
We're all human beings.
We all, you know, are imperfect.
We're imperfectly perfect,which is an overused phrase, but
we're all imperfectly perfectand I fully embrace that within
myself and within all of my teammembers and my coworkers as
(27:14):
well.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
That's awesome If you could make one great change to
the workplace.
You know what would that be andwhy.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Yeah, you know.
Okay.
So one thing about theworkplace, and this is debatable
.
So I would love, if you'rewatching this and want to debate
with me.
I'd love to have this debateversus hybrid, versus hiring
(27:48):
great talent, regardless wherethey are the pressures that we
all have as leaders to, you know, deliver, but then also to
create an amazing culture.
I think that it's verydifficult.
I think it's incrediblydifficult to find the right
blend.
I tend to lean toward a morehybrid solution.
I personally love to be in theoffice.
I'm in my office today inLebanon, tennessee, outside of
Nashville.
I love to be in the office.
I'm in my office today inLebanon, tennessee, outside of
(28:08):
Nashville.
I love to be able to walk downthe corridor and see my
colleague who runs theadvertising paid media campaigns
.
I love to see my person who'srunning the website two doors
down.
But half of my team is hybridand I really learned how to
manage a hybrid team so that wehave a culture of accountability
(28:31):
and fun and you know theobjective of we're all here to
get something done together.
And how do we best collaboratebetween a hybrid environment and
an offsite environment.
So if you're asking me aboutthe one thing that I would
change.
I would say that I'm sort of inthe moment of how do we think
about these companies that areall now going back five days a
(28:53):
week with hiring the very besttalent wherever they are?
So I'm in that moment of changeLike how do we migrate out of
COVID into this sort of new lifegoing forward and how to create
that culture.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
That's awesome.
It's definitely a very kind ofpoignant and timely discussion,
right?
Some people take the beliefthat you need to have more, you
know, in-person meetings tocreate that, engage, create that
kind of opportunity.
But it's definitely definitelyeveryone and the numbers kind of
go both ways.
You can read, as you know, youcan shape the numbers to tell
(29:28):
any story you want if you go inwith a belief, right.
So you have to go in, look atthe numbers objectively, but not
many people are doing that, sothat's a great perspective.
Next question Is there a bookthat you enjoy, you find
relevant, maybe from a businessperspective, that you recommend
to your colleagues or the teamat Cracker?
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Barrel.
Well, actually I do a lot ofpodcasts.
I do have some books.
They're probably pretty boring,like our company just embraced
OKRs, so I just finished OKRsfor all.
Don't read it.
You can do the Clip Notesversion.
The couple of podcasts that Iactually really enjoy there is
an omni-channel I think it'scalled OmniTalk or I think the
(30:08):
prior Target executives runsomething called OmniChannel
OmniTalk.
I do a lot of the New York Times, sort of unfiltered.
I try and be as neutral aspossible.
I do a lot of news throughApple.
Actually I find the Apple Newssource to be one of the most
neutral sources that I actuallyread for information.
I'm drawing a blank on.
(30:31):
I mean I read all of theLoyalty360 stuff that comes out
and I do a lot of industry.
I like I listen to a lot ofnerdy like industry podcasts, to
be honest, anything on digital,anything on loyalty, you know,
sort of definitely anything inthe restaurant digital space,
which there are podcasts forrestaurant digital which I
(30:51):
listened to.
So I do a lot of those type ofreadings.
I do a lot of personal readingsas well, but that's awesome,
yeah, great.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
I haven't checked a couple of those podcasts and
this is a kind of a fun question.
You can ask one question tosomeone else running a customer
loyalty about their program andthey had to answer it.
What would that question be?
Speaker 2 (31:13):
At this moment.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (31:15):
How are you using Gen AI?
It is the hot topic of themoment.
I, as a digital leader here atCocker Barrel, believes that
every single part of our companyshould be exploring Gen AI, not
just in marketing.
I think that there's so manyuses.
I've already started using itin my customer service contact
center.
I've seen really good resultsthere.
(31:36):
I'm encouraging my team to youknow, really understand it and
explore it in terms of content,personalization, offer
development.
You know everything, reallyeverything, like how do we
embrace and use Gen AI in a safe, like you know, that's the
other thing.
How do we create theseenvironments through Microsoft
(31:57):
or these other companies, tocreate the walls that gives us,
give us a safety, but how do weuse Gen AI in various parts of
marketing?
And then fraud, you know, Ithink just fraud is just
everywhere.
It's just popping up all overthe place.
And how do we stay on top ofthat?
Speaker 1 (32:14):
Yeah, definitely, gen AI is a hot topic.
Fraud is a hot topic.
Gen AI seems to be one wherecustomer loyalty professionals
are using it, but they're notnecessarily kind of achieving
the benefits necessarily,because they seem to have a
higher threshold for approval.
So they bring some gen AIAI andthey have now 25 people
(32:35):
checking the copy, right.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
It's very similar to, you know, the Tesla, the
automated cars right, They'vekilled three or four people
where there's 13,000 accidents aday in the US.
So, yes, they killed a fewpeople, yes, it has some
mistakes, but there's hundredsof deaths every day from
automobile accidents versus four.
So the confidence levels wetalk about from a statistic
(33:03):
perspective is a little bitskewed right now.
Hopefully that changed a littlebit.
From a statistic perspective,is is a little bit skewed right
now.
Hopefully that changed a littlebit.
You know you're very active inmulti 360, which definitely
appreciate.
You know what do you like, whatdo you find value about the
community?
And then, what would you liketo see more of?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yes.
Well, first of all, I I want toparticipate more like this.
Mark, what you've created inthis community is really
incredible, and I said this atthe conference.
Every single person in ourspace on any day has like 25
jobs.
We're financial analysts, youknow.
We are operations specialists.
(33:36):
We're analysts you know, youname it.
We are a little bit of all ofthose things.
So the fact that you havebrought so many like-minded
professionals together in acommunity for us to have a safe
place to learn from each otherand brainstorm You've heard me
say this before Nobody canreally mimic what happens within
a company, right?
So if we are sharing KPIs, if weare sharing best practices with
(34:01):
technology or how we're usingGen AI, we're not stealing this
from each other.
What we're doing is we'remaking and evolving the guest
experience to be better at theend of the day.
So I'm a big believer inknowledge sharing to the extent
that we're all comfortable, youknow, within our boxes.
I've gotten a lot of value outof the mentor program.
I really enjoy being a mentor.
(34:22):
I think my mentoree and I aregetting ready to kick things off
here in January, so I love thatpiece of it.
I think you've done a great jobin having some of the
professionals align on thebenchmarks in loyalty and really
starting to align and sharethoughts around.
How do we continue to evolveour benchmarks and hold each
other accountable, to sort of astandard set of metrics that we
(34:46):
can start to train ourcolleagues and counterparts on?
Speaker 1 (34:51):
Excellent.
Well, thank you very much forthat great feedback it's always
great to hear.
And the last question we try toend these up with some words of
wisdom for marketers orcustomer multi-professionals
newer ones, who may not be astenured as you and I are.
What are some things theyshould be considering with
regard to their growth, helpingthem develop effective customer
(35:14):
loyalty strategies and elevatingthe customer experience?
What's?
A couple pieces of advice youcan give to them.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Yeah.
So there's two things.
One is curiosity.
There's two things.
One is curiosity and ask thequestion.
If you need to know, don't beafraid to ask.
You know, be curious, explore,excuse me, probe, because
(35:44):
guaranteed if somebody juststarting has a question, chances
are it's probably bringing newinsight or new thought to
something that somebody elseisn't thinking of.
So be curious and maintain yourcuriosity honestly throughout
your whole career.
Never stop being curious,always be a learner, always be
observant.
So curiosity is the one thing.
(36:05):
The second one is courage.
You know, have the courage touse your voice.
One of the pieces of advice youknow I got very early on was it
can be overwhelming to sit in aroom of executives who know
each other or have workedtogether for years and as
(36:25):
somebody you know newly in thatroom, you know newly sitting
around that table, have thecourage to use your voice.
People, you're there, you'veearned your way there.
You know we want to hear fromyou, especially those of you who
are just starting your careeror learning or coming off.
We're hiring you, we put you ina position.
(36:46):
So be curious, continue to askthe questions and have the
courage to use your voice, speakout.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Excellent.
Thank you very much for that.
Now we have our quick fireround of questions.
I'd like to keep these to a oneword or a short phrase, and
this is the second time thatyou've done these, so you have
our second batch that we come upwith, so we're going to try
them out on you.
Okay, how would you describeyour work life?
Speaker 2 (37:15):
Balanced.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Excellent.
If you have a day off, a weekoff from work, what are you
doing?
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Spending time with my kids.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
That's awesome.
What are your New Year'sresolutions?
Speaker 2 (37:28):
with my kids.
That's awesome.
What are your New Year'sresolutions?
Speaker 1 (37:29):
I have, I do one word resolutions, and my word this
year is love.
There we go.
That's awesome.
If you could live in any city,any country, where would you
live?
Speaker 2 (37:36):
I love the United States.
I can't think about livinganywhere else.
I'm in love with our country.
But if you were to tell me Ihad unlimited tell me I had
unlimited.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
This isn't one word.
The United.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
States.
There you go.
Okay, if you could go back toschool.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
What would you study?
Maybe law, but yeah, yes,that's on my bucket list too.
I was accepted to a program butI haven't went back, so maybe
someday probably have to applyagain and probably won't get in
then either.
So who knows?
Speaker 2 (38:16):
What facet of the job would you like to know more
about?
Speaker 1 (38:24):
Um, oh gosh, Gen AI and just generally speaking,
technology is constantlysomething I'm learning about.
How do you plan for projects?
Are you a just-in-time kind ofa person or are you kind of a
very strategic planner?
Speaker 2 (38:31):
Okay, well, I would love to be a strategic planner,
Mark.
However, you know I spent 10years in retail and you know,
guess what?
Newsflash Restaurant isn't anydifferent.
So, yes, of course you have tohave a strategic plan, but I'm
very agile and pivot quite a bitoff of the plan to take care of
, like, where we are in thebusiness.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
What motivates you when tackling challenges at
Cracker Barrel?
Speaker 2 (38:55):
What motivates me?
Yeah, oh, for somebody tounderestimate me.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Awesome when you what do you draw inspiration from?
You know what lights your firewhat do you draw inspiration
from?
Speaker 2 (39:08):
You know what lights your fire.
I think I think youth, you know, I think really, listening to
the younger generations inspireme a lot.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Okay, what's your favorite sports or hobby?
Speaker 2 (39:26):
Okay.
College football I can't getenough of Okay.
Speaker 1 (39:29):
And tennis.
Oh, so then, what is yourfavorite sports team then?
Speaker 2 (39:32):
Well, I have two kids , one at Tulane and one at
Arizona state, and if you playedattention to the football
playoffs this year, Arizonastate was the underdog new to
the big 12 and ended up in areally great spot.
They didn't they're not goingon, but right now it's Arizona
State and Tulane Anybody butOhio.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
I live in Ohio.
I'm not an Ohio State fan, sodon't hold that against me, but
that's good.
And, amy, I want to thank youagain for taking the time to
speak with us today.
It was great having you on thesecond edition of our Executive
Spotlight.
It was interesting and verythought-provoking.
Your passion for the program,passion for your employees, what
you've done in the mentorshipprogram is just a pleasure to
(40:15):
have been part of.
We appreciate your sharingadvice with our listeners and
looking forward to hearing morefrom you and your team in the
future.
So thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
Awesome.
Well, thank you for includingme.
I appreciate you guys, asalways.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
Thank you everyone for taking the time to listen
today to our second edition ofour Executive Spotlight.
Please be sure to join us backsoon for another edition and
make sure you sign up for ourpodcast and subscribe to our
YouTube channel to stay updatedon all things.
Customer loyalty.
Good morning.
This is Mark Johnson fromLoyalty360.
I want to welcome you to ournew interview series, the
Loyalty360 Executive Spotlight.
These conversations will bewith some of the customer
loyalty industry's leading mindsand personalities who are
driving success within the mostrevered and successful customer
loyalty programs in the markettoday all of them who are
(00:24):
members of Loyalty360.
In this series, you will learnmore about the individuals who
are working behind the scenes todevelop and maintain customer
loyalty efforts.
Yet we're going to take a morepersonal look into how they got
to where they are today.
Look at some of those successesand maybe some of the
challenges they have faced alongthe way.
Today, we have the pleasure ofspeaking with Amy Barnett.
(00:45):
She's the Vice President ofLoyalty and Digital at Cracker
Barrel.
Amy is one of the mostpassionate people I know within
the customer loyalty space.
We've known each other for over10 years, going back to her
days at Klairs and before thatat Briarley and Partners.
Welcome, amy.
Thank you very much for takingthe time to speak with us today.
It's a great honor to speakwith you, as always.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Thank you, Mark.
I'm honored to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Absolutely.
Can you please provide us alittle bit of background on your
role at Cracker Barrel?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
I would be delighted to.
I'm the Vice President ofDigital Experience and Loyalty
and in the Cracker Barrel worldthat means that I manage the
digital ecosystem, whichincludes the website.
So when you come tocrackerbarrelcom, we lead the
product development, the productprioritization, the UX, the UI
and the user experience oncrackerbarrelcom.
(01:36):
And when you download our app,it's also inclusive of our
digital guest experience in theapp, which, to us, is not just a
rewards app, it's actually alsoa menu and restaurant app as
well.
And then the other two pieces ofthe business are the rewards
program which launched about 18months ago, which I'm sure we'll
(01:57):
talk all about today, and thenthe fourth part of my job which
I'm delighted to share with youis guest relations.
Part of my job which I'mdelighted to share with you is
guest relations.
So, in addition to you know therewards program and the
channels that our guests engagewith us on, it's important to me
that I think about capital L,and capital L to me means that
(02:17):
it's so much more than therewards program and the data
that we collect and know aboutyou, but it's about how we
evolve the entire brandexperience based, rooted in data
and insights.
But how do we change and evolvethe whole customer experience
across store and our digitalproperties to extend customer
lifetime value and get ourguests coming back and wanting
(02:39):
more from us.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
That's excellent.
You talked about it a littlebit, but how does Cracker Barrel
work to meet these evolvingneeds and expectations of
today's customers, today'sguests?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Yeah, so it is January 14th 2025.
And this is a great time to behaving this interview, because
you've probably read in thepress, you've probably seen
Julie on the news or in otherchannels sort of talking about
our brand transformation.
But, as any amazing brand does,all brands sort of evolve over
(03:11):
time and Cracker Barrel is inthis really beautiful moment of
embracing all of our history andour heritage and everything
that we know and love about thisiconic brand and the shopping
experience we provide.
But bringing that forward basedon guest feedback, the changing
dynamic, particularly since2020, but just the changing
(03:39):
restaurant dynamic and howconsumers have changed in terms
of their you know, their dietarypreferences, their budgetary
preferences, even you know,right down to the flavor of the
food that they want and how theyengage with the brand.
So we are listening to quite abit of guest feedback currently
across so many different mediums.
That is driving a lot of thisbrand transformation and,
(03:59):
honestly, it's a part of thereason I'm at Cracker Barrel is
to help provide the datafoundational layer and the
insights to continue drivingthat evolution.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
You've done an amazing job launching a very
successful customer loyaltyprogram while also evolving kind
of the store a little bit thefood offerings.
You have some kind of testmarkets that you work on now.
How does the customer loyaltyplay into meeting some of these
evolving needs and expectationsof your customers?
The relationship that thecustomer loyalty program kind of
(04:31):
develops with their customers?
Speaker 2 (04:33):
Yeah, it plays a very significant part.
I think Julie has shared thisin other media, so I don't think
I'm sharing anything.
We track about 30% of our salesright now through the rewards
program, so we have thisenormously rich set of
first-party data that exists inour customer data platforms.
But we are no stranger tothird-party data and I actually
(04:57):
gave a speech this weekend and Italked about how third-party
data and first-party data arethe power couple and I think I
borrowed that from somebody elseand it's stuck with me and I
just can't shed it but it's theblend of third-party data and
the first-party data.
So we have several partners inthe space where we either
augment or append third-partydata to our first-party platform
(05:21):
.
So not just profilinginformation first party platform
.
So not just profilinginformation.
You know we all know sort ofthe historical, demographic and
profiling information but theability to go out onto the
larger data landscape and reallyunderstand in a very fragmented
industry like ours.
We have three day parts.
We have breakfast, lunch anddinner, so pretty much every
(05:41):
dining option in the market isour competitor but in all
fairness it's a share game,right.
So really relying onthird-party data to give us
overarching macro trends onconsumer spend.
You know where is our keyconsumer dining for breakfast,
where are they dining for lunchand dinner, and then marrying
that with the first-party datathat we obviously know what they
(06:01):
do with us through thefirst-party data to the data
that we obviously know what theydo with us through the first
party data to the extent thatwe're able to see it.
But the power couple exists whenyou have what they do in your
own four walls married to all ofthe other data for what they're
doing in the industry as awhole.
So it's a big part of thetransformation Everything from
(06:23):
retail merch selection to youknow how do we think about
delivering real value for lunchand dinner.
It's January, so everybody's inthe value moment.
You can't turn on your TVwithout seeing the three for me
and the.
You know all the Burger Kingand all the value plays.
We're no different, right.
So what's unique, though, sincewe launched the program 18
(06:46):
months ago, is we now have thisreally rich first-party data set
.
So we're not just relying onaggregate market data, but we
are doing the power couple blendof bringing the two together in
a data set.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Excellent.
For those of me that know youalso have a very unique and
storied history in customerloyalty, Did great work on the
agency side.
Now you've been at a number ofmarquee brands and been very
successful at kind of adaptingor enhancing or launching
customer loyalty programs.
What is it about customerloyalty that's kept you in the
industry for as long as you have.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
You know right.
I mean, how blessed are we,Mark, to be in this industry
that we never get bored in?
So I've always been sort ofdata and technology enabled.
You know, I sort of back in theday thought I was either going
to be a lawyer or an engineerand then I started to see this
like beautiful blend between thetechnology and the data and the
marketing.
(07:43):
And I thought, you know, almostinstantaneously I sort of found
my spot.
And what I feel very fortunatein is that the place that I'm in
and the place that we are allin and experiencing is that it
just never changes, it neverstops changing.
The data landscape has changed,the technology landscape has
(08:03):
evolved.
You probably were here too whenthe World Wide Web, you know,
launched and we were all givenpermission, you know, to go surf
the internet and then, just inthe last you know, 30 years,
everything has changed in ourjobs.
Some of the core principles arethere around consumer behavior
and, you know, staying true tothe consumer and what it takes
(08:26):
to measure and really understandthe consumer.
All of that is there, but howwe receive information, the
recency that we receive all thatdata and the space that we're
(08:49):
in for direct marketing andspecifically, the blend between
data and technology andcreativity is it's on.
It's still got so much moregrowth coming, so that's what's
kept me energized.
I mean, not to mention theamazing people I work with.
You know it's still a verypeople-based even with all the
(09:09):
data and technology we work in.
It is a very relationship,people-based business and I
couldn't do another job.
It's just I love it.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
That's excellent.
When you look at the agencyside and the brand side, what's
the biggest difference betweenthe agency side and the brand
side?
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Yeah.
So first of all, I got my starton the agency side.
I spent a lot of time on theagency side, but I never did the
same job for more than a fewyears, like I constantly was
doing something different orlearning a different industry.
So one thing that I think theagency side allows somebody is
(09:48):
to make those type oftransitions.
I can be working with creativedirectors.
I could be working with theprocess directors who are
implementing new technologies.
I can be working with theproduct teams, or I could be
working in travel andhospitality for a few years, and
then I can go and work in, youknow, the C store or the grocery
(10:09):
store or a restaurant or retail, and every industry sort of has
its underpinnings of sameness.
But the agency world allows you, I think, to sort of you know,
learn that expertise, and thenthere's so much opportunity to
learn different aspects of thebusiness and then change
verticals.
What I love about being on theclient side is I love being in
(10:36):
the details when you are on theagency side, and I was always a
great partner.
I hope I was a great partner.
I learned to be a great partner.
You could only take a strategyor an execution so far, right On
the brand side, on the clientside of the business, you own
(10:57):
everything from strategicconception to delivery and then
measuring and reporting andimproving.
So to me, you don't get quitethe breadth but you get the
depth and what I've been able todo is bring the breadth of that
experience into now a fewdifferent brands, and evolve
(11:19):
those brands with all of theexpertise across the different
functions.
So, yeah, I don't think there'sone answer.
I can't give anybody one answerDo you go agency side or do you
go client side?
My intuition is trust your gut,like you will know when it's
time to change, and you willknow, sort of like based on who
(11:40):
you are as a person, for whetheror not it's agency or client
side.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
You touched on a little bit, but what are some of
the learnings from the agencyside that help you on the brand
side?
You talked about maybe notnecessarily owning all the
details.
Specifically, what do you likemore or what learnings that you
take from the agency side thatkind of helped on the brand
client side?
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Well, I think I'm a better client partner.
I think I'm a better clientpartner having spent as much
time as I did on the technologyand the agency side.
When you are on the inside ofan agency, you understand the
product very detail.
You understand the strengthsand weaknesses and resource
(12:20):
constraints and all of thethings that are associated, sort
of, with supporting a businessrather than being in the
business, and so perhaps it'sjust maturity, but I like to
think that it's based on myagency background.
Is that I'm a better strategicpartner, I think, as a result to
my agency partners.
I think that I know theirstrengths and I sort of know
(12:44):
when my team probably needs tostep up a little bit to fill in
their gaps, and I'm just moreunderstanding.
I think that I've not onlygrown in my own career, but
people are generally good, andif an agency is not doing their
job, a lot of times it's becausethe client direction wasn't as
(13:07):
sound or as solid or as thoroughas it probably needed to be.
So I think it's a win-win.
Hopefully, I hope my agencypartners think that anyway, Okay
, and your opinion?
Speaker 1 (13:16):
you know what's the single biggest factor that
influences a great customerexperience?
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Single biggest influencing factor.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Oh, Mark, that is such an enormous question.
Single biggest influencingfactor.
Well, there's no one answer.
Okay, um, um, let's come backto that one.
It's too basic to give aquestion.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Okay, what is one passion outside of work that you
enjoy?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
I'm a big reader.
I, like you, do a lot ofreading.
I listen to a lot of podcasts.
I'm kind of nerdy in that Idon't turn on the TV very often,
although I love a good binge.
Like anybody else, I actuallydon't watch a lot of TV.
I'm sort of a news junkie.
I do a lot of reading.
I listen to a lot of podcasts.
I picked up tennis during 2020.
(14:11):
I guess that's a littlepersonal.
Who cares about it?
Anyway, play tennis.
It gets a little bit of mycompetitive spirit out of me and
onto the court.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Okay, what's the derivation of tennis Pickleball?
Have you picked up pickleballhave?
Speaker 2 (14:29):
you picked up pickleball.
You like pickleball?
I do not.
I'm I'm a hardcore tennis.
I'll do it socially, but I'm,I'm true, blue to the game of
tennis there you go.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
Um well, where did you go to college and what was
your major?
Speaker 2 (14:39):
by chance, yeah, so I grew up.
My undergraduate was from asmall private technology school
called Clarkson University.
It's in upstate New York.
It is a small engineeringschool.
I thought I was going to go toschool to become an engineer and
this school in particular hadan interesting program that they
(15:00):
blended engineering withmanagement.
I can't remember even whatindustrial management, I can't
remember the name of the program.
It was one of the first schoolsin the country to actually do
it and I was taking thosemanagement courses out of duress
because I didn't want to takeany management, you know sort of
marketing, business courses.
I just wanted to go straight up, you know, science, engineering
(15:21):
, and become an engineer.
And then I started to takethese management and business
courses and I just never lookedback.
So I got my undergraduate atClarkson University.
I did end up with a bachelor ofscience in marketing and
technical communications.
I got my graduate degree fromthe University of Texas at
Dallas and it was an MBA with aconcentration in marketing.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
So Okay, great, yeah.
How did that, the ClarksonUniversity, that dual degree,
prepare you for the success youhad in your career?
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Very much so.
Actually they this is a trivialpursuit question, should it
ever come up on your trivialpursuit game.
Clarkson University was thefirst university in the country
to make sure and and requirethat freshmen had laptops PCs we
actually had.
I don't even know if theyweren't laptops at the time.
They were those boxes, you know.
(16:13):
So every freshman had acomputer in our, in our dorm,
which was one of the first timesin the country to ever.
Now all these kids are going toschool.
But that foundation and actuallyI was a coder, I was coding,
but it prepared me foreverything to come, because
think about typing papers,thinking about submitting all of
(16:36):
your assignments electronically, think about coding and doing
all the things that PCs andcomputers were just starting to
really build and do.
And not starting.
I mean PCs.
They've been around for a longtime, but my point is to make it
available to a freshman incollege was pretty important and
(16:57):
to this day I still leantowards a writing degree.
I do a lot of writing in my jobin terms of, you know, copy and
looking at what a consumer isgoing to react to and receive in
terms of communication.
So I use it a lot.
I actually have used my degreequite a bit.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Okay, and what was your first job after college?
Speaker 2 (17:21):
My first job after college, I worked for a database
marketing company.
Well, my first job aftercollege I worked for a database
(17:41):
marketing company.
Well, my job in college wasMcDonald's.
So this is another ploy.
Mcdonald's is my first truelove and I worked there of.
College was actually with acompany, target Based Marketing.
They were out of Texas, out ofDallas, texas.
They were one of the very first.
I think next to Epsilon wereone of the first database
marketing companies and Istarted by leading some of the
RJ Reynolds tobacco clubs.
(18:02):
Right Back in the day there wasMarlboro Miles, if you remember
the Marlboro man, marlboroMiles.
So that got my start inconsumer packaged goods.
I spent a lot of time inconsumer packaged goods and then
, just in the course of mycareer, I got exposed to many
other verticals.
I spent about six years atTarget Base and then I went on
(18:24):
to other direct response ordirect marketing companies after
that.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Okay, what's the best work advice you've ever been
given?
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Here's the best work advice.
Number one there's no room inbusiness to take things
personally.
The sooner you can remove yourfeeling that somebody is
directing something at youpersonally, the more mature and
the higher emotionalintelligence you will have,
(18:56):
generally speaking.
So that's one thing.
The other piece of advice,which is directly in our space,
mark, is one of the hardestlessons I learned is that early
in my career I had held out acontrol cell and it was a huge
program and my analytics teamheld out too small of a control
cell and it basically did notgive us the read of the entire
(19:19):
two years of work that we haddone, because our control group
was too small to actually readthe results.
So there you go.
There's two pieces of advice.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Okay, good, make sure you have the right size control
group.
That's good.
What's the biggest challengeyou faced in your life and how
does that shape you as a person?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Yeah, you know what I first of all I'm.
I can't start this by saying Iknow I'm extremely fortunate.
Ok, I have been.
I was born into a place that Ifeel very fortunate to have been
born into and I've workedextremely hard and I'm very
proud of where I've come.
But I just want to start out bysaying I know that I am more
(19:59):
fortunate than than others.
But, that being said, some ofthe biggest challenges I've
moved.
Actually, I've takenopportunities to move several
times in my life um, fromupstate New York to Texas, to um
, new York city to LA.
I now live in St Louis.
I lived in Dallas for 15 years,um, the hardest part for me at
(20:21):
the time.
Now social media makes all ofthis different right, but at the
time I started over.
Every time, every time, it'sreally hard to start over and
build your network and yoursocial networks and your
professional contacts.
Now the world has changed andone of the biggest pieces of
advice I actually have for folksis hang on to your contacts,
(20:43):
build that network.
Hang on to your contacts, usethose social outlets to network.
Hang on to your contacts, usethose social outlets to stay in
touch.
At the end of the day, a lot ofthis does come down to
interactions and connectionswith people and you know I don't
regret a single moment of themoves that I made.
They were all for the rightreasons.
But it is certainly challengingat least at the time I was
(21:05):
developing my career to stay intouch with a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
That's awesome.
What life lessons have shapedyour perspective?
Speaker 2 (21:13):
I work really hard.
So you're going to ask me later, I think, what my resolutions
are, so I won't share that.
I will just say work ethic andgrit goes a long, long way.
Education is important.
I was fortunate to have areally incredible opportunity to
get a great education and it'svery important, but grit goes a
(21:36):
long way.
And collaboration andnetworking just you know I can't
say enough about those twothings.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
That's awesome.
When you look at your careersuccess, what are a couple of
things you're most proud of?
Speaker 2 (21:51):
My career success.
Well, the work I'm doing atCracker Barrel I'm incredibly
proud of.
It is probably one of my careerhighlights, actually.
First of all, I just I am inlove with this brand.
We are a brand born and bred toplease people.
I sort of feel like that'sabout me as a person as well,
and so like this perfect blendof like my personal nature as
(22:14):
well as the corporate culture,just is like this amazing blend.
The leadership team here isphenomenal in terms of the way
that they strategically thinkabout the brand and the customer
and how they're thinking aboutour transformation.
So I'm very, very proud of thequick I've been here for two and
a half years, so the work thatwe've done in two and a half
years I could not be more proudof.
(22:37):
There's been other brandmoments that I've been
incredibly proud of.
I think it's mostly the peoplethat I have hired in my career
and I feel like I've developed alittle bit.
Most of them were alreadyamazing, but when you hire
really good talent and youinvest the time and the energy
and you see them grow and yousee them move on.
(22:57):
You know I've hired andpromoted people and some of the
people I've hired and promotedare now in, you know, amazing
big jobs at these companies.
So that's pretty fulfilling, Igot to say.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
That's awesome.
As mentioned, you've launchedand enhanced many customer
loyalty programs in your career,several customer loyalty
programs in your career.
What is the key attribute orkey thing that you've done so
well that has allowed you toachieve the success in these
programs that you've launched orrelaunched?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
You're asking me for my secret weapons, Mark.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Yes, why not?
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Okay, I do have a couple of secret weapons.
So there's a lot of research,there's a lot of data to inform
it and I know everybodylistening to this knows the data
pieces and what you bring froma consumer listening perspective
into almost everything that youdo.
It's got to be the foundation,have a good gut reaction and
(23:53):
good gut feel.
But you know everything needsto be grounded in data and
insights.
Number one but that's not mysecret weapon is there is this
beautiful blend of that datawith a really really good,
strong, creative communicationsplan.
And so if you look back, Ithink, at the programs that I've
(24:15):
developed or the programs thatI've launched, or the emails
you've got to sign up If youhaven't signed up for the
Cracker Barrel email, it isreally strong.
But the the blend of a reallystrong, creative strategy and
communications plan, blendedwith the data and the insights
to continually evolve and learn,that's one of my secret weapons
(24:36):
the.
The other secret weapons arethat technology tools.
You know really taking a lookat your technology stack and
being able to, in a veryunbiased way, say this
technology is not working.
And we get married totechnology because it's easy,
(25:00):
you know these, you bringtechnology in and you go to the,
you know you go through all ofthe work of integrating it and
configuring it and training yourstaff and hiring your staff,
and then you get them on thetechnology and then you know
it's here for 10 years and thelife cycle of technology.
Just I really encourageeverybody to think differently
about it.
It needs to be on a much moreagile you know, composable, plug
(25:26):
out, you test, you learn.
Not everything, of course.
Nobody wants to move a customerdatabase or a CDP every two
years, but I think everythingelse, though sort of on the
periphery, should be continuallyevaluated and don't be afraid
of it.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
Excellent.
I think it's very salient.
You know approach.
Some people get married totechnology and it could be the
worst piece of the platformright the technology stack and
they continue to build around it, versus yanking that piece out
and putting something else thatcan actually do what it was
meant to do.
Those are great.
You know keys to success.
So thank you If you go back intime and change one thing about
(26:09):
your life.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
What would that be?
And why, oh my gosh, thesequestions, mark?
Um, I really don't lookbackward.
That's awesome.
I really really buy into thebelief that you know, the future
is forward.
And you know, we are all humanbeings.
We are all human at our core.
We learn, we make mistakes.
(26:29):
We love, you know, we don'tlove.
You know I think that I reallyencourage this with my kids to
you know, shame and regret holdhuman beings back.
And so, you know, as you thinkabout the future and as you look
forward, you know, take thoselessons into play and think.
You know, maybe I could havechanged that interaction, or I
(26:50):
could have changed the way Ileft that company, or I could
have stayed in touch with thatperson, and I didn't.
You know, most importantly,don't hold on to it.
We're all human beings.
We all, you know, are imperfect.
We're imperfectly perfect,which is an overused phrase, but
we're all imperfectly perfectand I fully embrace that within
myself and within all of my teammembers and my coworkers as
(27:14):
well.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
That's awesome If you could make one great change to
the workplace.
You know what would that be andwhy.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Yeah, you know.
Okay.
So one thing about theworkplace, and this is debatable
.
So I would love, if you'rewatching this and want to debate
with me.
I'd love to have this debateversus hybrid, versus hiring
(27:48):
great talent, regardless wherethey are the pressures that we
all have as leaders to, you know, deliver, but then also to
create an amazing culture.
I think that it's verydifficult.
I think it's incrediblydifficult to find the right
blend.
I tend to lean toward a morehybrid solution.
I personally love to be in theoffice.
I'm in my office today inLebanon, tennessee, outside of
Nashville.
I love to be in the office.
I'm in my office today inLebanon, tennessee, outside of
(28:08):
Nashville.
I love to be able to walk downthe corridor and see my
colleague who runs theadvertising paid media campaigns
.
I love to see my person who'srunning the website two doors
down.
But half of my team is hybridand I really learned how to
manage a hybrid team so that wehave a culture of accountability
(28:31):
and fun and you know theobjective of we're all here to
get something done together.
And how do we best collaboratebetween a hybrid environment and
an offsite environment.
So if you're asking me aboutthe one thing that I would
change.
I would say that I'm sort of inthe moment of how do we think
about these companies that areall now going back five days a
(28:53):
week with hiring the very besttalent wherever they are?
So I'm in that moment of changeLike how do we migrate out of
COVID into this sort of new lifegoing forward and how to create
that culture.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
That's awesome.
It's definitely a very kind ofpoignant and timely discussion,
right?
Some people take the beliefthat you need to have more, you
know, in-person meetings tocreate that, engage, create that
kind of opportunity.
But it's definitely definitelyeveryone and the numbers kind of
go both ways.
You can read, as you know, youcan shape the numbers to tell
(29:28):
any story you want if you go inwith a belief, right.
So you have to go in, look atthe numbers objectively, but not
many people are doing that, sothat's a great perspective.
Next question Is there a bookthat you enjoy, you find
relevant, maybe from a businessperspective, that you recommend
to your colleagues or the teamat Cracker?
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Barrel.
Well, actually I do a lot ofpodcasts.
I do have some books.
They're probably pretty boring,like our company just embraced
OKRs, so I just finished OKRsfor all.
Don't read it.
You can do the Clip Notesversion.
The couple of podcasts that Iactually really enjoy there is
an omni-channel I think it'scalled OmniTalk or I think the
(30:08):
prior Target executives runsomething called OmniChannel
OmniTalk.
I do a lot of the New York Times, sort of unfiltered.
I try and be as neutral aspossible.
I do a lot of news throughApple.
Actually I find the Apple Newssource to be one of the most
neutral sources that I actuallyread for information.
I'm drawing a blank on.
(30:31):
I mean I read all of theLoyalty360 stuff that comes out
and I do a lot of industry.
I like I listen to a lot ofnerdy like industry podcasts, to
be honest, anything on digital,anything on loyalty, you know,
sort of definitely anything inthe restaurant digital space,
which there are podcasts forrestaurant digital which I
(30:51):
listened to.
So I do a lot of those type ofreadings.
I do a lot of personal readingsas well, but that's awesome,
yeah, great.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
I haven't checked a couple of those podcasts and
this is a kind of a fun question.
You can ask one question tosomeone else running a customer
loyalty about their program andthey had to answer it.
What would that question be?
Speaker 2 (31:13):
At this moment.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (31:15):
How are you using Gen AI?
It is the hot topic of themoment.
I, as a digital leader here atCocker Barrel, believes that
every single part of our companyshould be exploring Gen AI, not
just in marketing.
I think that there's so manyuses.
I've already started using itin my customer service contact
center.
I've seen really good resultsthere.
(31:36):
I'm encouraging my team to youknow, really understand it and
explore it in terms of content,personalization, offer
development.
You know everything, reallyeverything, like how do we
embrace and use Gen AI in a safe, like you know, that's the
other thing.
How do we create theseenvironments through Microsoft
(31:57):
or these other companies, tocreate the walls that gives us,
give us a safety, but how do weuse Gen AI in various parts of
marketing?
And then fraud, you know, Ithink just fraud is just
everywhere.
It's just popping up all overthe place.
And how do we stay on top ofthat?
Speaker 1 (32:14):
Yeah, definitely, gen AI is a hot topic.
Fraud is a hot topic.
Gen AI seems to be one wherecustomer loyalty professionals
are using it, but they're notnecessarily kind of achieving
the benefits necessarily,because they seem to have a
higher threshold for approval.
So they bring some gen AIAI andthey have now 25 people
(32:35):
checking the copy, right.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
It's very similar to, you know, the Tesla, the
automated cars right, They'vekilled three or four people
where there's 13,000 accidents aday in the US.
So, yes, they killed a fewpeople, yes, it has some
mistakes, but there's hundredsof deaths every day from
automobile accidents versus four.
So the confidence levels wetalk about from a statistic
(33:03):
perspective is a little bitskewed right now.
Hopefully that changed a littlebit.
From a statistic perspective,is is a little bit skewed right
now.
Hopefully that changed a littlebit.
You know you're very active inmulti 360, which definitely
appreciate.
You know what do you like, whatdo you find value about the
community?
And then, what would you liketo see more of?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yes.
Well, first of all, I I want toparticipate more like this.
Mark, what you've created inthis community is really
incredible, and I said this atthe conference.
Every single person in ourspace on any day has like 25
jobs.
We're financial analysts, youknow.
We are operations specialists.
(33:36):
We're analysts you know, youname it.
We are a little bit of all ofthose things.
So the fact that you havebrought so many like-minded
professionals together in acommunity for us to have a safe
place to learn from each otherand brainstorm You've heard me
say this before Nobody canreally mimic what happens within
a company, right?
So if we are sharing KPIs, if weare sharing best practices with
(34:01):
technology or how we're usingGen AI, we're not stealing this
from each other.
What we're doing is we'remaking and evolving the guest
experience to be better at theend of the day.
So I'm a big believer inknowledge sharing to the extent
that we're all comfortable, youknow, within our boxes.
I've gotten a lot of value outof the mentor program.
I really enjoy being a mentor.
(34:22):
I think my mentoree and I aregetting ready to kick things off
here in January, so I love thatpiece of it.
I think you've done a great jobin having some of the
professionals align on thebenchmarks in loyalty and really
starting to align and sharethoughts around.
How do we continue to evolveour benchmarks and hold each
other accountable, to sort of astandard set of metrics that we
(34:46):
can start to train ourcolleagues and counterparts on?
Speaker 1 (34:51):
Excellent.
Well, thank you very much forthat great feedback it's always
great to hear.
And the last question we try toend these up with some words of
wisdom for marketers orcustomer multi-professionals
newer ones, who may not be astenured as you and I are.
What are some things theyshould be considering with
regard to their growth, helpingthem develop effective customer
(35:14):
loyalty strategies and elevatingthe customer experience?
What's?
A couple pieces of advice youcan give to them.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Yeah.
So there's two things.
One is curiosity.
There's two things.
One is curiosity and ask thequestion.
If you need to know, don't beafraid to ask.
You know, be curious, explore,excuse me, probe, because
(35:44):
guaranteed if somebody juststarting has a question, chances
are it's probably bringing newinsight or new thought to
something that somebody elseisn't thinking of.
So be curious and maintain yourcuriosity honestly throughout
your whole career.
Never stop being curious,always be a learner, always be
observant.
So curiosity is the one thing.
(36:05):
The second one is courage.
You know, have the courage touse your voice.
One of the pieces of advice youknow I got very early on was it
can be overwhelming to sit in aroom of executives who know
each other or have workedtogether for years and as
(36:25):
somebody you know newly in thatroom, you know newly sitting
around that table, have thecourage to use your voice.
People, you're there, you'veearned your way there.
You know we want to hear fromyou, especially those of you who
are just starting your careeror learning or coming off.
We're hiring you, we put you ina position.
(36:46):
So be curious, continue to askthe questions and have the
courage to use your voice, speakout.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Excellent.
Thank you very much for that.
Now we have our quick fireround of questions.
I'd like to keep these to a oneword or a short phrase, and
this is the second time thatyou've done these, so you have
our second batch that we come upwith, so we're going to try
them out on you.
Okay, how would you describeyour work life?
Speaker 2 (37:15):
Balanced.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Excellent.
If you have a day off, a weekoff from work, what are you
doing?
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Spending time with my kids.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
That's awesome.
What are your New Year'sresolutions?
Speaker 2 (37:28):
with my kids.
That's awesome.
What are your New Year'sresolutions?
Speaker 1 (37:29):
I have, I do one word resolutions, and my word this
year is love.
There we go.
That's awesome.
If you could live in any city,any country, where would you
live?
Speaker 2 (37:36):
I love the United States.
I can't think about livinganywhere else.
I'm in love with our country.
But if you were to tell me Ihad unlimited tell me I had
unlimited.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
This isn't one word.
The United.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
States.
There you go.
Okay, if you could go back toschool.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
What would you study?
Maybe law, but yeah, yes,that's on my bucket list too.
I was accepted to a program butI haven't went back, so maybe
someday probably have to applyagain and probably won't get in
then either.
So who knows?
Speaker 2 (38:16):
What facet of the job would you like to know more
about?
Speaker 1 (38:24):
Um, oh gosh, Gen AI and just generally speaking,
technology is constantlysomething I'm learning about.
How do you plan for projects?
Are you a just-in-time kind ofa person or are you kind of a
very strategic planner?
Speaker 2 (38:31):
Okay, well, I would love to be a strategic planner,
Mark.
However, you know I spent 10years in retail and you know,
guess what?
Newsflash Restaurant isn't anydifferent.
So, yes, of course you have tohave a strategic plan, but I'm
very agile and pivot quite a bitoff of the plan to take care of
, like, where we are in thebusiness.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
What motivates you when tackling challenges at
Cracker Barrel?
Speaker 2 (38:55):
What motivates me?
Yeah, oh, for somebody tounderestimate me.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Awesome when you what do you draw inspiration from?
You know what lights your firewhat do you draw inspiration
from?
Speaker 2 (39:08):
You know what lights your fire.
I think I think youth, you know, I think really, listening to
the younger generations inspireme a lot.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Okay, what's your favorite sports or hobby?
Speaker 2 (39:26):
Okay.
College football I can't getenough of Okay.
Speaker 1 (39:29):
And tennis.
Oh, so then, what is yourfavorite sports team then?
Speaker 2 (39:32):
Well, I have two kids , one at Tulane and one at
Arizona state, and if you playedattention to the football
playoffs this year, Arizonastate was the underdog new to
the big 12 and ended up in areally great spot.
They didn't they're not goingon, but right now it's Arizona
State and Tulane Anybody butOhio.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
I live in Ohio.
I'm not an Ohio State fan, sodon't hold that against me, but
that's good.
And, amy, I want to thank youagain for taking the time to
speak with us today.
It was great having you on thesecond edition of our Executive
Spotlight.
It was interesting and verythought-provoking.
Your passion for the program,passion for your employees, what
you've done in the mentorshipprogram is just a pleasure to
(40:15):
have been part of.
We appreciate your sharingadvice with our listeners and
looking forward to hearing morefrom you and your team in the
future.
So thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
Awesome.
Well, thank you for includingme.
I appreciate you guys, asalways.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
Thank you everyone for taking the time to listen
today to our second edition ofour Executive Spotlight.
Please be sure to join us backsoon for another edition and
make sure you sign up for ourpodcast and subscribe to our
YouTube channel to stay updatedon all things.
Customer loyalty.
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