January 15, 2023 • 39 mins
Meet Pierce Freelon, 2x Grammy Nominee, Former City Councilman, Emmy Award-winning Producer, Author, father of 3, and most recently inducted into the Kennedy 50.
Join Neal and Amer as they sit down with Pierce and hear about the importance of honoring our ancestors, vibrations, dealing with failures and challenges through acceptance, being obedient to your intuition, and that the way you do one thing, is the way you should do all things.
For the full & uncut episode, along with a number of other perks, please visit www.leavelookingup.com/fans and subscribe!
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Episode Transcript
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(00:02):
Hey listeners. This is Neil Ludovic and Amir,
John dalli, welcome to leave looking at.
Where we have uplifting conversations about the state of
the world with our heroes, with the intention to demystify
orient and leave you. Our listeners inspired for this
episode, we sat down with Piercefree Lon.
(00:23):
A man whose accomplishments are truly extraordinary.
Pierce is an Emmy Award winning producer for the PBS.
S-Series, the history of white people in America.
He is the former city. Councilman for the city of
Durham North Carolina, a two-time Grammy nominated artist
for best children's album, alongside his mom who was also
nominated in the same year for her Jazz album.
(00:46):
Making them the First mom and son Duo nominated in the same
year. He is also the founder of black
space, a space for afro futurists.
And if that's not enough, he's achildren's book author.
And perhaps most importantly to him, A proud dad.
In today's episode, we learn about the importance of
honoring. Our ancestors, vibrations,
(01:07):
dealing with failure and challenges through acceptance,
being obedient to your intuitionand not the way you do.
One thing is the way you do, allthings.
Thank you for joining us today. And now, without further Ado,
let's start this episode. We hope you enjoy it as much as
we did and leave afterwards looking up I met Pierce through
(01:27):
an incredible initiative which Ibelieve Eve is the Genesis of
one of your Grammy nominations, if that's correct.
We definitely have some overlapping networks but I also
think at a deeper level you put an energy out in the universe
and you attract like-minded energy and I found and you for
sure like so much Synergy, just all the projects you're working
(01:48):
on the people that you kick it, with our podcast, as a whole is
really about humanizing, our heroes, it's understanding their
worlds and who they are, and making them a little bit more.
Able to us. So I think I'm going to start
with this question of, how did you get here?
Wow, I got to start with my ancestors, they were
(02:08):
instrumental when I look back, first of all, my grandmother's
here to my left Queen Mother, Frances pierce, my mom made a
portrait of her. That I'm going to show you.
It says Bloom where you're planted is the name of this
piece. You can see here, there's Queen
Mother, it's kind of like a collage with these cut out
pictures and birds. She likes to be I mentioned.
(02:30):
This is one of those ancestors. That's like going to tell him
about your grandma right quick. This woman was a hairdresser, a
community organizer. She was just a church lady
bible-thumping hardcore, Jesus, Apostle woman, and really was
invested in rooted in her community and Cambridge
(02:53):
Massachusetts. She poured some really important
values and to my mom that she passed on to me, you She was
just one of these like many black women in the black Freedom
struggle, who often go unnamed. There's a lot of men but there
are scores of people like my grandmother who were doing work
on a daily basis to uplift, the black community that you may not
(03:17):
know the names of and we have these people in our family.
We have them in our community, we have them, you know, at our
schools, there are teachers there are Librarians.
There are Grandma's Auntie's I carry her.
Her spirit with me, just a look at me and my siblings say you
are the fruit of my womb in fullbloom.
(03:38):
And I think that such a such an apt metaphor because she did the
work during Jim Crow. You know what I mean?
Coming up for the Texarkana, Texas, grew up on a
sharecropping Farm, just in the Deep, South and found a way out
of no way. Found a way to build a business
doing hair and make them black. Men feel beautiful found a way
(04:02):
through her Church community to have an impact on the Civil.
Rights issues that mattered, to her found a way to saturate her
children in the Arts. She was close homies with Maya
Angelou and made sure that my mom and her siblings were at
every poetry reading art show exhibit.
(04:23):
Dance performance after school program that they were saturated
in that, and that was a part of her Legacy.
See, and what she left to her own children and I'm the fruit
of the fruit, you know, Fruity Fruity Fruity, Tooty number 2, T
second generation, right? My grandma passed that onto my
mom, then they form like Voltron.
(04:44):
No, I'm saying they and while I'm talking about granny
Freddie, I got a raise up. My dad's dad's dad's dad, his
name was Alan freelon, senior. He was a painter in the Harlem
Renaissance. He was a politician, he ran for
public office. Office in 1949 to represent
Pennsylvania and the in the state general assembly and was
(05:08):
just bout it. If you go look up his art, he
did. He was an impressionist painter.
But he also did kind of paintings that were critiques on
war and white supremacy. And he passed that on to my dad,
his grandparents and great-grandparents clearly
passed on their passion for Arts, their fighting spirit for
equality and their love for family and community.
(05:29):
Immunity on to his parents, my mom is a jazz vocalist, she's a
singer and have the courage and wherewithal, and audacity to
step into into that realm. And I'm a kid watching her and
seeing, oh, this could be a career trajectory.
This could be a path. My dad was a similar vibration
(05:50):
to my mom. He was an architect and designed
many buildings around this country, including the
Smithsonian Museum of African American history and culture
shortly before he died. And he was another one who was
just singularly aligned with hispurpose was undeterred by the,
you know, the fact that he was the only brother in the
(06:11):
all-white office and just overcoming adversity and tapping
into his excellence and resilience to pour himself
unapologetically into his purpose.
I don't have some kind of elevated perspective because I'm
taller than everybody. Buddy else.
Do I'm standing on the shouldersof giants.
(06:33):
Yeah, this is the whole family Force that's generation to
generation, but this is definitely family and role
models in. You're straddling that city
council. Being a producer, a music artist
and author as well. Talk to us all about those
different hats. How do they all integrate I do?
(06:54):
Wear a lot of hats, but there's a nucleus there that kind of
binds the other pieces of. There's a Are there in the
middle of my solar system of things that I'm doing and at the
core of my being in my purpose as a creative person versus
Black Liberation. That that's number one, it's
like a commitment to the black Freedom struggle and the
(07:15):
resiliency of black folks and families children Elders, that's
important. I think the Arts are there for
sure service, I say service because I think social justice
doesn't quite Eight, the fullness of what, you know,
service is really about. And also, when I say creativity,
(07:35):
or the Arts, which my dad said art is the most powerful force
in the universe. I'm not just talking about my
music, I'm not just talking about my books.
Like parenting is also an art form, you know, trying to get my
kids to do things disciplining or loving them.
They make you improvised, right?It's like parenting is creative.
(07:57):
Husbanding is creative work. I'm in a band with my wife and
she's dope. We got a shed to stay sharp
sometimes as date night sometimes that can look like
different things. Sometimes that's getting in an
argument or a fight and then coming back and apologizing,
like it requires chops that needto be honed and develop and
(08:19):
require the same things that need to show up for you, in a
creative environment. If you want to be successful.
I think service creativity BlackLiberation that It's in my
books. It's in my parenting, it's in
how I strive to be a spouse and how I strive to show up and
community and various ways. Something that I know is super
(08:41):
important to this idea of being a dad is so important and having
children, I was just thinking mydaughter like minutes before
this call comes into my office, just like Dad, come over here.
I cooked something I want you totry.
She had taken some Her. We had a take out last night,
(09:02):
she mixed the leftover salmon with rice, all right.
Wrapped it up and rice paper through on some little sesame,
seed, some teriyaki in there, and then she threw it in there
in the airfryer and that in the airfryer.
So she comes in. She comes in here, Dad, you
(09:23):
gotta try this. I'm looking at the clock, I'm
like, I got an interview in 10 minutes.
Okay, ran in their shoes. She goes like this.
She puts her arms out. She says right this way.
Oh my goodness gracious. Excuse.
Right. I love it.
Oui oui. So, yes, that down.
It was so good. It was so good.
(09:44):
Not only was that creative of her to do to come up with the
recipe and to see what was in the fridge.
And then just remix. What was there?
How often do you experience thatas a DJ, where you like?
All right. Well, this is what I got today.
So let's You go down the rabbit hole and you surprise yourself
with what you find in the digital fridge of your hard
(10:06):
drive, right? And if we, you know, you escort
the audience to taste this delicious salmon and rice wrap
of a mix and it was a great parenting moment.
I honestly I haven't reflected about this because I literally
looked at the clock and said, oh, at now, I got to get on to
the calls. But you know, it's the same
thing that creative spark and the joy that you find.
(10:29):
And Being of service to others. Like it's one thing she could
have made those rice wraps and just smash them herself.
I got like that would have been dope for her to experience on
her own, but to share the experience, you know, and to
spread joy, to others. There is joy and abundance that
comes from service from looking at my expression.
(10:49):
And you see how expressive I am?I was like, Stella, you know, I
was helping her up. Like, she just won an award.
She didn't win an award, she wonthe air.
Prior award. The thing that is important back
to the purpose of your show. That kind of spark that Bliss of
(11:10):
a parenting moment or a doddering moment of her
presenting. Something to me, that is such a
visceral expression of love. That is available to us all.
I just think that is something that seems in accessible to
people, but is actually in everyone's fridge and everyone's
house home bless. And we just need to find ways to
(11:31):
tap into it as often as possibleand to share it, because when
you share it at the, you know, the vibration raises, for
everyone Creator included. There's this theme about
aligning to your purpose and sharing that, which is in all of
our fridges, no matter how we choose to slice and dice and
serve it, right? I'm also hearing from you this
beautifully integrated honor of your history in your past and so
(11:55):
I'm wondering what are the conditions that one can create
for themselves for That expression, I think the primary
condition is love. That's number one, that is more
accessible for some than it is for others, depending on your
childhood and how you grow up and what you've been through,
whatever. When my wife and I, we talked
about the kids especially reflect on decisions that we've
(12:17):
made. I tell her often, if you lead
with love. There's really no error possible
for you to have all you have is like opportunities to grow.
I think that is where you have your kids stepping into moments,
like, the ones we had this evening because the love is
present. And so, here's a great example
(12:39):
with my mom. My mom's Journey when she was a
teenager. She wanted to pursue a career in
music and was discouraged by herloved ones, including Queen
(13:04):
Mother who just wanted the best for her daughter and wanted her
to get a job that had some security attached to it.
We're all creative. We all got relatives for like,
really, what you doing, how's that 401k, doing with those
risky? Life Choices out there, you
know, making music or whatever. Make a out of love and a desire
(13:29):
to protect their child. Coming from a sharecropper
background. Not want your kid to live in
poverty and to build a foundation from which they can
have some Financial Security. She was discouraged at a young
age from pursuing a career in music I believe she was offered
a record deal of like 1415 whichwas also a young age to say like
(13:49):
well I'm not going to go to college, I'm going to do this
deal, you know, so So, for understandable, reasons, and
coming from a place of love, shewas discouraged from pursuing
her music. So there's nothing you can do
about that as a kid. You don't have the kind of
agency to chart your own path fast forward.
She went to college. She got her undergraduate from
Simmons and did exactly what herparents expected her to do.
(14:13):
Which was pursue a respectable career in healthcare.
She's going to be a nurse Matt my dad.
Boom boom three kids boom. Boom.
All right. Now, we're in 1984.
I'm born. I'm the youngest of three.
Mom has a crucial choice on her hands.
It's time to get back to work and be a contributing, you know,
member financially to the family.
(14:34):
Am I going to go back to UNC hospital and finish my Nursing
degree or am I going to step into the purpose denied at 16
into the space of abundance and resilience that I've been
dreaming about all the gigs she had done up to that point other
than singing in church is singing lullabies to her.
Babies. Right.
And she has a crucial choice on her hands about how she wants to
(14:58):
live moving forward. Now that she has the agency now
that she has the ability to makedecisions for herself and she
chose and that moment rather than bringing a guaranteed
income of whatever 3040 thousanddollars a year, a nursemaid back
in the 80s you know, certainly astable income relative to I mean
(15:20):
yeah. That s right.
Jazz it in the type of gig. For a person that don't have,
you know, a decade of experiencecareer, right?
I'm playing at the mall. I'm playing at the airport.
I'm playing at the lobby of the hotel during the holidays, you
know, barely making gas money. Like it's a humble place to
(15:41):
begin at 30 with three kids, youhave to love yourself enough to
Grant yourself permission to step into the space that, you
know, is going to be fulfilling for you.
You not necessarily the best formy family because it's not
bringing in the same amount of money, or whatever.
But guess what she was more happy and more able to pair it
(16:05):
with abundance coming home from a gig where she really thought
she crushed it. And building a career where
she's making forward progressionthat is helping on her
instrument and grow as a person.And as an artist you know that
To be a better wife than it better mother.
And of course, she got signed 10years later and was nominated
(16:30):
for a Grammy and you knows travel the world and has had the
career that she dreamed of. She only had that opportunity to
step into abundance because she was being basically selfish.
You know what I mean? There's a lot of people who
would look at her and say, oh, you're being selfish.
Nah, she's loving herself. So, I have plenty of examples.
(16:53):
As from Queen Mother Frances pierced, my own parents to other
elders. And so now my job is pretty
simple. Just don't mess it up, keep
doing the thing. Do the thing, keep stepping into
your abundance, keep being aligned with your purpose, keep
showing the children through your actions.
How you love yourself through the way that you show up in the
(17:15):
world and then your community and in your relationships and
your family and they will take note of that.
And Run with that baton. And I can't explain it to them
as they have questions, but the best explanation is my own
behavior and they can model and emulate that behavior as they
step into their own versions of self-love listening to that
(17:39):
especially like about your mother.
So much of that experience. I think was informed by that
original decision to respect herown mother right to do maybe
what's Needed, but not what's wanted.
And there's a little bit of a heartbreak there, a defining
moment that kind of makes cominginto herself at 30 that much
(18:02):
more meaningful, that much more of that mindset of abundance.
I think that somewhere in our origin stories and our Genesis,
we all have those kinds of heartbreak moments, that help
Define us and I'm curious what was yours?
What is your heartbreak? That was also a breakthrough
demystify that a bit. I've had many heartbreak moments
I've had To learn. So when I say something as Gully
(18:25):
as like I don't believe in mistakes and everything is a
learning experience, like that'snot just I wasn't born that way.
Even with the tutelage that I got from the mentors, and loved
ones, who raised me, it really is something that I learned
through failure after failure after failure and getting up and
seeing wow, you know, that really seemed like an L in the
(18:49):
moment, but but now that's a whole W1.
Example of that would be runningfor mayor and losing that
election in 2017. Pierce ran for mayor of Durham
in North Carolina, his platform Community, growth Youth and love
the primary race was crowded with a total of seven
(19:11):
candidates. But Pierce gained 16 percent of
the vote as the first time runner, he ultimately lost the
race though. I put everything into that
campaign, it was in the uphill battle of uphill battles.
It was really tough to kind of claw back from what felt like a
devastating loss. Like all these people thousands
(19:33):
of people voted for me, supporting me got on my campaign
I'm like I let all of you down. You is Oprah, I let you down,
you down, you down. Hey you in the back you gave me
two thousand five hundred dollars.
I let you down like it was just like whoo.
This is tough. Now here's what those types of
experiences and wisdom over time.
(19:53):
Will teach you, I was not ready to do the work that came for our
mayor. So the guy who won his name is
Steve, Schewel had one of the hardest mayoral terms in the
history of our city, with covid and everything that was going
on. And he handled it with so much
Poise and made decisions that really reflected his experience.
(20:17):
He was on City Council. Council for a long time and that
experience, really helped informsome important life-saving
crucial decisions that he made for the city of Durham.
When an opening came up on the city council, my former
opponent, the guy I was locking horns with and debates a couple
of years prior was my biggest champion.
He was like, oh yeah, that's a. We got to get pierced in that
(20:38):
seat. He's that dude in 2020.
Pierce was appointed to serve onthe Durham city council.
Now, he was ready to make some real change.
During his term, he expanded theopportunity for those without
wealth to serve on the city council as well.
By passing a measure to increasecouncil members salaries, just
(20:58):
work. It made sense for what was going
on in my life at the time. If I was mayor, there would be
no children's music album and book and all these other things
that I've poured my life and energy into Yeah, daddy-daughter
day. Girl, what up, what up?
Right now we can go anywhere. You wanna roller skating rink to
the movies, chilling at the house.
(21:19):
Maybe later, my energy would have been channeled in a
different direction which I'm sure would have had its own
fruits. But there is no doubt in my mind
that everything happened exactlyas it was supposed to.
And I'm exactly where I need to be with, no regrets whatsoever.
And in fact, my previous angst and insecurity around failure
has been flipped to Gratitude, moving forward, when losses
(21:45):
occur, I'm much more resilient. It's not that I don't feel bad
when I don't get things that I really strive for think I
deserve, but the bounce back is much quicker, because I know
that it's not a loss, it's just a step.
It's just a step in the right direction.
I mean, hearing that story and especially that you were saying
(22:06):
that your opponent was your biggest champion.
I think that's a testament to your character to running
campaigns with integrity and styles and, and those
vibrations, right? The anyone can feel that
vibration. I'm curious.
Who are you looking to to Champion?
Who are you looking to, as your role model as a guide?
Who do you? Look up to all the people, I
(22:27):
mentioned the ancestors that I mentioned my kids.
My daughter Stella, there are certain historical figures that
I look to as people who really like you did that Harriet Tubman
and Nina Simone and You know, they're just too many to name
Paulie Marie, Andre Leon, Talleysindorim folks, Andre recent
(22:48):
ancestor. I think my daughter is important
to mention because it's not a people who are associated or
Tethered to institutions of power and the rod recognition,
there are grannies in my community, like my grandmother
who are just Rock-solid, highly intelligent Fierce, beautiful
(23:12):
power houses that I've known just from coming up in the
community but also that I've metthrough my service on Durham
city council women who would show up at meetings with Stage 2
cancer. Just like demanding things for
their community on other people's behalf and I'm just
like, whoa, you could be home right now.
(23:33):
Probably should be wrapped in a blanket like watching Golden
Girls on Hulu, but You hear it at the council meeting like
showing up for your people, respect strength and resilience.
Those role models are literally everywhere that you don't have
to squint hard to look speciallywhen you're looking at at black
women. As you're talking about all the
(23:53):
people that are around you and you have so much Direction, the
idea of what you want to do and how you want to do and where to
go, seems very clear. And I think there's a lot of
people that have maybe an intention like I want to be in
this space but I don't, I don't know where Start, I don't know
who to talk to first or how to talk to them.
What would you say is the first tool or resource you know for
(24:14):
the weary wavering person that'slike I want to do something I
just don't know how to start. What is that resource?
That could be used to them. There's clear tools that come to
mind to answer that question. One is butterflies that feeling
of butterflies in your stomach as soon as you leave the date or
whatever and you're just like I'm feeling you.
(24:35):
That's how I felt about the work.
Well, you never know listen before you find the one or the
several, you know, somebody thatyou really dig and really click
with, you got a date and you gotta say, you got to look at
the person, you thought was a diamond say, but your
personality is trash, it wasn't as good as I thought it was
gonna be. But I mean, you gotta try stuff
(24:57):
out and so over the course of you trying things, eventually
you're going to strike a chord with someone that puts a
butterfly in your stomach and makes you fall in love.
And when you feel that love in your and your, I don't know, all
the chakras, but whatever is in your stomach, or your solar
plexus, or whatever. But when you feel it, you have a
(25:18):
responsibility to say, like, what's going on here?
You can't have an experience like that and then go back to
like bussing tables or whatever.Is kind of like cool but not
like really the purpose and so that's what the, the advice to
The Listener. Who's looking for, what's my
path that my My mom had a similar experience, she enjoyed
(25:41):
nursing. It was healing and it's an in
one way, and then she enjoyed singing, which was healing in
another way she said, I want to be a Healer but she didn't know
necessarily at the time whether that healing was going to be
through nursing which she enjoyed or through music, which
she was deeply, deeply passionate about also, but it's
(26:01):
the difference between the person that you date but you
don't want to get engaged to andthe person that you're Head Over
Heels, Love with, let's elope tonight.
So the former is great. I think we all go through
experiences in jobs and work that occupy that former space.
If you're a musician, maybe it'sthe band that you go to that,
you play with to get checks, youknow.
(26:22):
But then there's this other one,that's that, that's it.
Like this band, is it when I'm playing with these players to
chemistry, the vibe is different.
And so we have to be aware because if you don't check in,
after your transformative experience, Then you can just
move on through life without recognizing, that you're walking
(26:43):
away from something that deserves further inquiry.
So, there's there's a responsibility to be aware of
how you feel. And then once you make an
observation and say, like, wow, I'm really, I'm smitten with
this. Then I have an obligation, an
obligation to seize the opportunity to see what this is
(27:04):
about. I'm not saying like, have a
midlife crisis because You enjoyplaying a gig one night, it
deserves further inquiry and as you sit with it and over time
you'll see if this is something you can dig your heels into or
if it's something that you want to step away from but the first
step is the awareness of the butterflies and the
(27:24):
responsibility to pursue them and to see what's on the other
end of that. Part of this is awareness.
And the next step is is trying. It's just seeing what may I'm
curious, how do? You get through those challenges
that maybe didn't work out. Like, what's the nurturing that
happens there? Listen.
(27:46):
If you mentioned some of them but that, you know, accepting,
yeah, it's really important. Another good dating metaphor as
well. This is actually a dating
podcast. This is this fantastic.
Any progress. Listen, I believe that
everything is a marriage every band on man.
I'm like we're married now. Like if I'm in a business,
(28:07):
Worship with you, it's a marriage, it requires the same
thing from the individuals, and I can think of a few
collaborations that I was reluctant to let go of even
though I know the relationship was over.
And I'm talking about business, you know, relationships and
Partnerships and creativity and Entrepreneurship.
(28:28):
And here's the thing it's generous for you to let go.
Like there's this idea in our head that you know, letting go
is gonna end something and yeah,sometimes things need to end.
It's like an apple that doesn't want to fall off the tree.
Like it's remaining here, will only harm the vital nutrients
(28:52):
and prevent other new fruit fromforming.
If you have a blessing in your hand, that's meant for someone
else. Then you're digging a ditch for
yourself. You're canceling, your blessing
and there's by holding onto the things.
It's the same awareness with where you are in relation to
that person, or that project of that collaboration, or that
(29:14):
vibration, you'll know, if you're truly honest, you know,
when it's time to step away and you got to be, I still listen, I
still struggle with this but yougot to be obedient To your
intuition. And if you're not, you're only
causing harm to yourself and those that you're clinging to.
(29:35):
That's so beautiful. That's awesome, Pierce.
I'm also hearing the theme of surrender here.
That's the strong one. Now, you sound like my grandma.
That's what your grandma says tounder.
Yes. Surrender and obedience are kind
of like the right there. But, yeah, I think another thing
I'm hearing is allowing yourselfto experiment your way through
it, and try something. And if it's not Landing in a
(29:56):
certain way accepting that it's time, to Let It Go.
It move on, it might be a blessing for somebody else.
Just like your beautiful story about not winning the election.
It was a breakthrough in anothercapacity and you had that
symbolic site to see that. That's really, really beautiful
given. What we've heard given where
your internal Compass is pointing given where your
nutrients are flowing in the direction that you're heading.
(30:16):
What's on your radar right now? Like what's where is your
attention going? What, what, what seeds are?
You're nurturing? I look for this one.
My manager Monica cause connectivity, but I see it
visually as kind of Of concentric.
Bubbles in a Venn diagram. So so when you say father, for
example, that's a big-ass bubble, whelmingly overlapping
(30:38):
in that bubble is author. This is my book daddy-daughter
day and you know, it's inspired by a song I wrote with my
daughter. So like artist while parenting.
It's a book that's really rootedin the in the spiritual tenants
of afrofuturism which is one of the hats, you know?
And as I'm doing kind of book, tours and readings.
Whatever Stella will let me dragher with me.
(31:01):
I'm going to and whenever I havean opportunity to live the book
out in real life and cancel something, so I can help her do
handstands or test out that air fryer.
And, you know, I'm going to do that and it's not mutually
exclusive with any of the other kind of Bubbles and hats, that I
(31:24):
occupy and where, and as much aspossible, I want those Tools to
bleed into one another because of the more separate.
They are the more directions I need to run.
If I bring it home to the Hearthand I live in the, in the
center, then I'm constantly at maximum efficiency, you know, in
(31:46):
all the truth and all the spacesthat I want to be, I think for
me it's really about blurring those lines as much as possible.
While prioritizing husband and family first.
Then then you know everybody else get in line, this includes
what we talked about earlier with letting go.
You know, one of the things thatI've realized as far as what do
(32:10):
they call it in basketball and they sit players when they're
not injured load management. That's what they call it.
Okay, it is basically you're notgoing to play today because we
want to save you for the playoffs.
Anyway, if I'm ever in a situation where where I'm not
managing my life, Load appropriately.
It's important to be aware of that and to let go of things so
(32:34):
that I can hold the other thingswith a more steady hand rather
than just be wobbly, because I'mtrying to do everything at once.
And I think for me, like a good barometer to what I'm capable of
is three things, that's it. It's three things and parenting.
And husbanding is one of those three, those opportunities that
(32:55):
you give often come back to. And it Ways that people that you
wouldn't even have an expected are saying thanks to you.
You thanked a lot of people and recognize a lot of people today.
Who do you need to give? Thanks to that.
You haven't given thanks to yet whether here today or in
general, that is coming up that maybe was unexpected or, yeah,
(33:20):
that deserves it. I mean, there are too many
people to think, like I said, atthe beginning, I have a vaulted
perspective because I'm standingon the shoulders of giants.
Now, as if that wasn't dope enough, I also have like active
homies. First of all Spirits, ancestors
(33:40):
angels, helping me and then in it Angels, you know, helping me
out, lifted me up and then just our people here on this Earth.
And so, yeah, there's a ton of people that I consider mentors.
There's a ton of people that I consider mentees and then peers,
And then ancestors, even this this very conversation because
(34:03):
y'all got me like, awesome stuff.
I'm like, damn maybe I don't make this into a TED talk.
You know what I mean? Like, I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be
right, but, you know, but that is again, that's a testament to
the vibe that you're bringing and what you're pulling out of
me, which is not common, like you've heard my interviews,
they're not all like this but anyway.
(34:24):
Yeah. So I think there's a lot of
gratitude to go around. For sure Pierce.
You're amazing. Thank you for sharing so much
wisdom. We're going to tune out with the
track. You sent a few tracks over.
You can get contacts for one of them, which would it be?
And we'll take it off with that guy.
(34:46):
So, I found a tape VHS tape from1980 Something. 80-some 87.
I can't remember the year now ofmy mom as a teaching artist in
rural eastern, North Carolina. And, and this was a song, I'm
that was the The actual recording of that song, Justice.
(35:09):
Come here real quick. Just give me the tape.
There's a tape in that bag says 1988 in the green VHS, right
behind you. Thank you.
This is your grandmother. Check it out.
(35:57):
And she was, you know, singing no one exactly like you I heard
it and I called her. I said Mom, this is beautiful
like she's like. What's that again where did you
find that? She had no memory.
Memory of having recorded it at all, it's been 30 plus years but
it was really early in her career and is a Timeless
(36:18):
beautiful song. I added some vocals and
instruments and kind of try to breathe life into it for 20 21
(36:38):
which is when blacks in the future.
Came out and it was the opener. The album opener.
This kind of intergenerational sample from when I was really
little kid and my mom was reallyyoung and her career and it was
really special for me. You can follow Pierce on all
(37:37):
social channels at Pierce free lawn or on his website at
www.airsofthero.com leave looking up is hosted by myself,
me, Ludovic and my co-host, AmirJan Dolly, and produced by our
small. But Mighty team at Moon 31, a
company dedicated to creating platforms for Meaningful
conversations. That tackle the important issues
(38:00):
of today for folks that love with their hearing today and
want to hear and see. We have the complete uncut and
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On our fan page via patreon at www.levitt.com up.com fans
there. You can support, what we're
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(38:23):
Merch, be the first to access our content and more also we'd
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So, if you haven't already, please be sure to leave a rating
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(38:44):
for special content news. And first tips on the episodes
via our website at leave lookingup.com.
This episode was created throughthe combined efforts of myself
as executive producer, and our lead producer, Lou Chic Lotus Li
the moon 31 team. Also includes designer and
Draya. Kang glass slipper, media, and
engineer just inject, Carter. An extra special, thanks to
(39:06):
engineer, TJ, dumpster, who mixed and mastered this episode
original theme music by Brady W & background music provided for
Blue Dot sessions.
Hey listeners. This is Neil Ludovic and Amir,
John dalli, welcome to leave looking at.
Where we have uplifting conversations about the state of
the world with our heroes, with the intention to demystify
orient and leave you. Our listeners inspired for this
episode, we sat down with Piercefree Lon.
(00:23):
A man whose accomplishments are truly extraordinary.
Pierce is an Emmy Award winning producer for the PBS.
S-Series, the history of white people in America.
He is the former city. Councilman for the city of
Durham North Carolina, a two-time Grammy nominated artist
for best children's album, alongside his mom who was also
nominated in the same year for her Jazz album.
(00:46):
Making them the First mom and son Duo nominated in the same
year. He is also the founder of black
space, a space for afro futurists.
And if that's not enough, he's achildren's book author.
And perhaps most importantly to him, A proud dad.
In today's episode, we learn about the importance of
honoring. Our ancestors, vibrations,
(01:07):
dealing with failure and challenges through acceptance,
being obedient to your intuitionand not the way you do.
One thing is the way you do, allthings.
Thank you for joining us today. And now, without further Ado,
let's start this episode. We hope you enjoy it as much as
we did and leave afterwards looking up I met Pierce through
(01:27):
an incredible initiative which Ibelieve Eve is the Genesis of
one of your Grammy nominations, if that's correct.
We definitely have some overlapping networks but I also
think at a deeper level you put an energy out in the universe
and you attract like-minded energy and I found and you for
sure like so much Synergy, just all the projects you're working
(01:48):
on the people that you kick it, with our podcast, as a whole is
really about humanizing, our heroes, it's understanding their
worlds and who they are, and making them a little bit more.
Able to us. So I think I'm going to start
with this question of, how did you get here?
Wow, I got to start with my ancestors, they were
(02:08):
instrumental when I look back, first of all, my grandmother's
here to my left Queen Mother, Frances pierce, my mom made a
portrait of her. That I'm going to show you.
It says Bloom where you're planted is the name of this
piece. You can see here, there's Queen
Mother, it's kind of like a collage with these cut out
pictures and birds. She likes to be I mentioned.
(02:30):
This is one of those ancestors. That's like going to tell him
about your grandma right quick. This woman was a hairdresser, a
community organizer. She was just a church lady
bible-thumping hardcore, Jesus, Apostle woman, and really was
invested in rooted in her community and Cambridge
(02:53):
Massachusetts. She poured some really important
values and to my mom that she passed on to me, you She was
just one of these like many black women in the black Freedom
struggle, who often go unnamed. There's a lot of men but there
are scores of people like my grandmother who were doing work
on a daily basis to uplift, the black community that you may not
(03:17):
know the names of and we have these people in our family.
We have them in our community, we have them, you know, at our
schools, there are teachers there are Librarians.
There are Grandma's Auntie's I carry her.
Her spirit with me, just a look at me and my siblings say you
are the fruit of my womb in fullbloom.
(03:38):
And I think that such a such an apt metaphor because she did the
work during Jim Crow. You know what I mean?
Coming up for the Texarkana, Texas, grew up on a
sharecropping Farm, just in the Deep, South and found a way out
of no way. Found a way to build a business
doing hair and make them black. Men feel beautiful found a way
(04:02):
through her Church community to have an impact on the Civil.
Rights issues that mattered, to her found a way to saturate her
children in the Arts. She was close homies with Maya
Angelou and made sure that my mom and her siblings were at
every poetry reading art show exhibit.
(04:23):
Dance performance after school program that they were saturated
in that, and that was a part of her Legacy.
See, and what she left to her own children and I'm the fruit
of the fruit, you know, Fruity Fruity Fruity, Tooty number 2, T
second generation, right? My grandma passed that onto my
mom, then they form like Voltron.
(04:44):
No, I'm saying they and while I'm talking about granny
Freddie, I got a raise up. My dad's dad's dad's dad, his
name was Alan freelon, senior. He was a painter in the Harlem
Renaissance. He was a politician, he ran for
public office. Office in 1949 to represent
Pennsylvania and the in the state general assembly and was
(05:08):
just bout it. If you go look up his art, he
did. He was an impressionist painter.
But he also did kind of paintings that were critiques on
war and white supremacy. And he passed that on to my dad,
his grandparents and great-grandparents clearly
passed on their passion for Arts, their fighting spirit for
equality and their love for family and community.
(05:29):
Immunity on to his parents, my mom is a jazz vocalist, she's a
singer and have the courage and wherewithal, and audacity to
step into into that realm. And I'm a kid watching her and
seeing, oh, this could be a career trajectory.
This could be a path. My dad was a similar vibration
(05:50):
to my mom. He was an architect and designed
many buildings around this country, including the
Smithsonian Museum of African American history and culture
shortly before he died. And he was another one who was
just singularly aligned with hispurpose was undeterred by the,
you know, the fact that he was the only brother in the
(06:11):
all-white office and just overcoming adversity and tapping
into his excellence and resilience to pour himself
unapologetically into his purpose.
I don't have some kind of elevated perspective because I'm
taller than everybody. Buddy else.
Do I'm standing on the shouldersof giants.
(06:33):
Yeah, this is the whole family Force that's generation to
generation, but this is definitely family and role
models in. You're straddling that city
council. Being a producer, a music artist
and author as well. Talk to us all about those
different hats. How do they all integrate I do?
(06:54):
Wear a lot of hats, but there's a nucleus there that kind of
binds the other pieces of. There's a Are there in the
middle of my solar system of things that I'm doing and at the
core of my being in my purpose as a creative person versus
Black Liberation. That that's number one, it's
like a commitment to the black Freedom struggle and the
(07:15):
resiliency of black folks and families children Elders, that's
important. I think the Arts are there for
sure service, I say service because I think social justice
doesn't quite Eight, the fullness of what, you know,
service is really about. And also, when I say creativity,
(07:35):
or the Arts, which my dad said art is the most powerful force
in the universe. I'm not just talking about my
music, I'm not just talking about my books.
Like parenting is also an art form, you know, trying to get my
kids to do things disciplining or loving them.
They make you improvised, right?It's like parenting is creative.
(07:57):
Husbanding is creative work. I'm in a band with my wife and
she's dope. We got a shed to stay sharp
sometimes as date night sometimes that can look like
different things. Sometimes that's getting in an
argument or a fight and then coming back and apologizing,
like it requires chops that needto be honed and develop and
(08:19):
require the same things that need to show up for you, in a
creative environment. If you want to be successful.
I think service creativity BlackLiberation that It's in my
books. It's in my parenting, it's in
how I strive to be a spouse and how I strive to show up and
community and various ways. Something that I know is super
(08:41):
important to this idea of being a dad is so important and having
children, I was just thinking mydaughter like minutes before
this call comes into my office, just like Dad, come over here.
I cooked something I want you totry.
She had taken some Her. We had a take out last night,
(09:02):
she mixed the leftover salmon with rice, all right.
Wrapped it up and rice paper through on some little sesame,
seed, some teriyaki in there, and then she threw it in there
in the airfryer and that in the airfryer.
So she comes in. She comes in here, Dad, you
(09:23):
gotta try this. I'm looking at the clock, I'm
like, I got an interview in 10 minutes.
Okay, ran in their shoes. She goes like this.
She puts her arms out. She says right this way.
Oh my goodness gracious. Excuse.
Right. I love it.
Oui oui. So, yes, that down.
It was so good. It was so good.
(09:44):
Not only was that creative of her to do to come up with the
recipe and to see what was in the fridge.
And then just remix. What was there?
How often do you experience thatas a DJ, where you like?
All right. Well, this is what I got today.
So let's You go down the rabbit hole and you surprise yourself
with what you find in the digital fridge of your hard
(10:06):
drive, right? And if we, you know, you escort
the audience to taste this delicious salmon and rice wrap
of a mix and it was a great parenting moment.
I honestly I haven't reflected about this because I literally
looked at the clock and said, oh, at now, I got to get on to
the calls. But you know, it's the same
thing that creative spark and the joy that you find.
(10:29):
And Being of service to others. Like it's one thing she could
have made those rice wraps and just smash them herself.
I got like that would have been dope for her to experience on
her own, but to share the experience, you know, and to
spread joy, to others. There is joy and abundance that
comes from service from looking at my expression.
(10:49):
And you see how expressive I am?I was like, Stella, you know, I
was helping her up. Like, she just won an award.
She didn't win an award, she wonthe air.
Prior award. The thing that is important back
to the purpose of your show. That kind of spark that Bliss of
(11:10):
a parenting moment or a doddering moment of her
presenting. Something to me, that is such a
visceral expression of love. That is available to us all.
I just think that is something that seems in accessible to
people, but is actually in everyone's fridge and everyone's
house home bless. And we just need to find ways to
(11:31):
tap into it as often as possibleand to share it, because when
you share it at the, you know, the vibration raises, for
everyone Creator included. There's this theme about
aligning to your purpose and sharing that, which is in all of
our fridges, no matter how we choose to slice and dice and
serve it, right? I'm also hearing from you this
beautifully integrated honor of your history in your past and so
(11:55):
I'm wondering what are the conditions that one can create
for themselves for That expression, I think the primary
condition is love. That's number one, that is more
accessible for some than it is for others, depending on your
childhood and how you grow up and what you've been through,
whatever. When my wife and I, we talked
about the kids especially reflect on decisions that we've
(12:17):
made. I tell her often, if you lead
with love. There's really no error possible
for you to have all you have is like opportunities to grow.
I think that is where you have your kids stepping into moments,
like, the ones we had this evening because the love is
present. And so, here's a great example
(12:39):
with my mom. My mom's Journey when she was a
teenager. She wanted to pursue a career in
music and was discouraged by herloved ones, including Queen
(13:04):
Mother who just wanted the best for her daughter and wanted her
to get a job that had some security attached to it.
We're all creative. We all got relatives for like,
really, what you doing, how's that 401k, doing with those
risky? Life Choices out there, you
know, making music or whatever. Make a out of love and a desire
(13:29):
to protect their child. Coming from a sharecropper
background. Not want your kid to live in
poverty and to build a foundation from which they can
have some Financial Security. She was discouraged at a young
age from pursuing a career in music I believe she was offered
a record deal of like 1415 whichwas also a young age to say like
(13:49):
well I'm not going to go to college, I'm going to do this
deal, you know, so So, for understandable, reasons, and
coming from a place of love, shewas discouraged from pursuing
her music. So there's nothing you can do
about that as a kid. You don't have the kind of
agency to chart your own path fast forward.
She went to college. She got her undergraduate from
Simmons and did exactly what herparents expected her to do.
(14:13):
Which was pursue a respectable career in healthcare.
She's going to be a nurse Matt my dad.
Boom boom three kids boom. Boom.
All right. Now, we're in 1984.
I'm born. I'm the youngest of three.
Mom has a crucial choice on her hands.
It's time to get back to work and be a contributing, you know,
member financially to the family.
(14:34):
Am I going to go back to UNC hospital and finish my Nursing
degree or am I going to step into the purpose denied at 16
into the space of abundance and resilience that I've been
dreaming about all the gigs she had done up to that point other
than singing in church is singing lullabies to her.
Babies. Right.
And she has a crucial choice on her hands about how she wants to
(14:58):
live moving forward. Now that she has the agency now
that she has the ability to makedecisions for herself and she
chose and that moment rather than bringing a guaranteed
income of whatever 3040 thousanddollars a year, a nursemaid back
in the 80s you know, certainly astable income relative to I mean
(15:20):
yeah. That s right.
Jazz it in the type of gig. For a person that don't have,
you know, a decade of experiencecareer, right?
I'm playing at the mall. I'm playing at the airport.
I'm playing at the lobby of the hotel during the holidays, you
know, barely making gas money. Like it's a humble place to
(15:41):
begin at 30 with three kids, youhave to love yourself enough to
Grant yourself permission to step into the space that, you
know, is going to be fulfilling for you.
You not necessarily the best formy family because it's not
bringing in the same amount of money, or whatever.
But guess what she was more happy and more able to pair it
(16:05):
with abundance coming home from a gig where she really thought
she crushed it. And building a career where
she's making forward progressionthat is helping on her
instrument and grow as a person.And as an artist you know that
To be a better wife than it better mother.
And of course, she got signed 10years later and was nominated
(16:30):
for a Grammy and you knows travel the world and has had the
career that she dreamed of. She only had that opportunity to
step into abundance because she was being basically selfish.
You know what I mean? There's a lot of people who
would look at her and say, oh, you're being selfish.
Nah, she's loving herself. So, I have plenty of examples.
(16:53):
As from Queen Mother Frances pierced, my own parents to other
elders. And so now my job is pretty
simple. Just don't mess it up, keep
doing the thing. Do the thing, keep stepping into
your abundance, keep being aligned with your purpose, keep
showing the children through your actions.
How you love yourself through the way that you show up in the
(17:15):
world and then your community and in your relationships and
your family and they will take note of that.
And Run with that baton. And I can't explain it to them
as they have questions, but the best explanation is my own
behavior and they can model and emulate that behavior as they
step into their own versions of self-love listening to that
(17:39):
especially like about your mother.
So much of that experience. I think was informed by that
original decision to respect herown mother right to do maybe
what's Needed, but not what's wanted.
And there's a little bit of a heartbreak there, a defining
moment that kind of makes cominginto herself at 30 that much
(18:02):
more meaningful, that much more of that mindset of abundance.
I think that somewhere in our origin stories and our Genesis,
we all have those kinds of heartbreak moments, that help
Define us and I'm curious what was yours?
What is your heartbreak? That was also a breakthrough
demystify that a bit. I've had many heartbreak moments
I've had To learn. So when I say something as Gully
(18:25):
as like I don't believe in mistakes and everything is a
learning experience, like that'snot just I wasn't born that way.
Even with the tutelage that I got from the mentors, and loved
ones, who raised me, it really is something that I learned
through failure after failure after failure and getting up and
seeing wow, you know, that really seemed like an L in the
(18:49):
moment, but but now that's a whole W1.
Example of that would be runningfor mayor and losing that
election in 2017. Pierce ran for mayor of Durham
in North Carolina, his platform Community, growth Youth and love
the primary race was crowded with a total of seven
(19:11):
candidates. But Pierce gained 16 percent of
the vote as the first time runner, he ultimately lost the
race though. I put everything into that
campaign, it was in the uphill battle of uphill battles.
It was really tough to kind of claw back from what felt like a
devastating loss. Like all these people thousands
(19:33):
of people voted for me, supporting me got on my campaign
I'm like I let all of you down. You is Oprah, I let you down,
you down, you down. Hey you in the back you gave me
two thousand five hundred dollars.
I let you down like it was just like whoo.
This is tough. Now here's what those types of
experiences and wisdom over time.
(19:53):
Will teach you, I was not ready to do the work that came for our
mayor. So the guy who won his name is
Steve, Schewel had one of the hardest mayoral terms in the
history of our city, with covid and everything that was going
on. And he handled it with so much
Poise and made decisions that really reflected his experience.
(20:17):
He was on City Council. Council for a long time and that
experience, really helped informsome important life-saving
crucial decisions that he made for the city of Durham.
When an opening came up on the city council, my former
opponent, the guy I was locking horns with and debates a couple
of years prior was my biggest champion.
He was like, oh yeah, that's a. We got to get pierced in that
(20:38):
seat. He's that dude in 2020.
Pierce was appointed to serve onthe Durham city council.
Now, he was ready to make some real change.
During his term, he expanded theopportunity for those without
wealth to serve on the city council as well.
By passing a measure to increasecouncil members salaries, just
(20:58):
work. It made sense for what was going
on in my life at the time. If I was mayor, there would be
no children's music album and book and all these other things
that I've poured my life and energy into Yeah, daddy-daughter
day. Girl, what up, what up?
Right now we can go anywhere. You wanna roller skating rink to
the movies, chilling at the house.
(21:19):
Maybe later, my energy would have been channeled in a
different direction which I'm sure would have had its own
fruits. But there is no doubt in my mind
that everything happened exactlyas it was supposed to.
And I'm exactly where I need to be with, no regrets whatsoever.
And in fact, my previous angst and insecurity around failure
has been flipped to Gratitude, moving forward, when losses
(21:45):
occur, I'm much more resilient. It's not that I don't feel bad
when I don't get things that I really strive for think I
deserve, but the bounce back is much quicker, because I know
that it's not a loss, it's just a step.
It's just a step in the right direction.
I mean, hearing that story and especially that you were saying
(22:06):
that your opponent was your biggest champion.
I think that's a testament to your character to running
campaigns with integrity and styles and, and those
vibrations, right? The anyone can feel that
vibration. I'm curious.
Who are you looking to to Champion?
Who are you looking to, as your role model as a guide?
Who do you? Look up to all the people, I
(22:27):
mentioned the ancestors that I mentioned my kids.
My daughter Stella, there are certain historical figures that
I look to as people who really like you did that Harriet Tubman
and Nina Simone and You know, they're just too many to name
Paulie Marie, Andre Leon, Talleysindorim folks, Andre recent
(22:48):
ancestor. I think my daughter is important
to mention because it's not a people who are associated or
Tethered to institutions of power and the rod recognition,
there are grannies in my community, like my grandmother
who are just Rock-solid, highly intelligent Fierce, beautiful
(23:12):
power houses that I've known just from coming up in the
community but also that I've metthrough my service on Durham
city council women who would show up at meetings with Stage 2
cancer. Just like demanding things for
their community on other people's behalf and I'm just
like, whoa, you could be home right now.
(23:33):
Probably should be wrapped in a blanket like watching Golden
Girls on Hulu, but You hear it at the council meeting like
showing up for your people, respect strength and resilience.
Those role models are literally everywhere that you don't have
to squint hard to look speciallywhen you're looking at at black
women. As you're talking about all the
(23:53):
people that are around you and you have so much Direction, the
idea of what you want to do and how you want to do and where to
go, seems very clear. And I think there's a lot of
people that have maybe an intention like I want to be in
this space but I don't, I don't know where Start, I don't know
who to talk to first or how to talk to them.
What would you say is the first tool or resource you know for
(24:14):
the weary wavering person that'slike I want to do something I
just don't know how to start. What is that resource?
That could be used to them. There's clear tools that come to
mind to answer that question. One is butterflies that feeling
of butterflies in your stomach as soon as you leave the date or
whatever and you're just like I'm feeling you.
(24:35):
That's how I felt about the work.
Well, you never know listen before you find the one or the
several, you know, somebody thatyou really dig and really click
with, you got a date and you gotta say, you got to look at
the person, you thought was a diamond say, but your
personality is trash, it wasn't as good as I thought it was
gonna be. But I mean, you gotta try stuff
(24:57):
out and so over the course of you trying things, eventually
you're going to strike a chord with someone that puts a
butterfly in your stomach and makes you fall in love.
And when you feel that love in your and your, I don't know, all
the chakras, but whatever is in your stomach, or your solar
plexus, or whatever. But when you feel it, you have a
(25:18):
responsibility to say, like, what's going on here?
You can't have an experience like that and then go back to
like bussing tables or whatever.Is kind of like cool but not
like really the purpose and so that's what the, the advice to
The Listener. Who's looking for, what's my
path that my My mom had a similar experience, she enjoyed
(25:41):
nursing. It was healing and it's an in
one way, and then she enjoyed singing, which was healing in
another way she said, I want to be a Healer but she didn't know
necessarily at the time whether that healing was going to be
through nursing which she enjoyed or through music, which
she was deeply, deeply passionate about also, but it's
(26:01):
the difference between the person that you date but you
don't want to get engaged to andthe person that you're Head Over
Heels, Love with, let's elope tonight.
So the former is great. I think we all go through
experiences in jobs and work that occupy that former space.
If you're a musician, maybe it'sthe band that you go to that,
you play with to get checks, youknow.
(26:22):
But then there's this other one,that's that, that's it.
Like this band, is it when I'm playing with these players to
chemistry, the vibe is different.
And so we have to be aware because if you don't check in,
after your transformative experience, Then you can just
move on through life without recognizing, that you're walking
(26:43):
away from something that deserves further inquiry.
So, there's there's a responsibility to be aware of
how you feel. And then once you make an
observation and say, like, wow, I'm really, I'm smitten with
this. Then I have an obligation, an
obligation to seize the opportunity to see what this is
(27:04):
about. I'm not saying like, have a
midlife crisis because You enjoyplaying a gig one night, it
deserves further inquiry and as you sit with it and over time
you'll see if this is something you can dig your heels into or
if it's something that you want to step away from but the first
step is the awareness of the butterflies and the
(27:24):
responsibility to pursue them and to see what's on the other
end of that. Part of this is awareness.
And the next step is is trying. It's just seeing what may I'm
curious, how do? You get through those challenges
that maybe didn't work out. Like, what's the nurturing that
happens there? Listen.
(27:46):
If you mentioned some of them but that, you know, accepting,
yeah, it's really important. Another good dating metaphor as
well. This is actually a dating
podcast. This is this fantastic.
Any progress. Listen, I believe that
everything is a marriage every band on man.
I'm like we're married now. Like if I'm in a business,
(28:07):
Worship with you, it's a marriage, it requires the same
thing from the individuals, and I can think of a few
collaborations that I was reluctant to let go of even
though I know the relationship was over.
And I'm talking about business, you know, relationships and
Partnerships and creativity and Entrepreneurship.
(28:28):
And here's the thing it's generous for you to let go.
Like there's this idea in our head that you know, letting go
is gonna end something and yeah,sometimes things need to end.
It's like an apple that doesn't want to fall off the tree.
Like it's remaining here, will only harm the vital nutrients
(28:52):
and prevent other new fruit fromforming.
If you have a blessing in your hand, that's meant for someone
else. Then you're digging a ditch for
yourself. You're canceling, your blessing
and there's by holding onto the things.
It's the same awareness with where you are in relation to
that person, or that project of that collaboration, or that
(29:14):
vibration, you'll know, if you're truly honest, you know,
when it's time to step away and you got to be, I still listen, I
still struggle with this but yougot to be obedient To your
intuition. And if you're not, you're only
causing harm to yourself and those that you're clinging to.
(29:35):
That's so beautiful. That's awesome, Pierce.
I'm also hearing the theme of surrender here.
That's the strong one. Now, you sound like my grandma.
That's what your grandma says tounder.
Yes. Surrender and obedience are kind
of like the right there. But, yeah, I think another thing
I'm hearing is allowing yourselfto experiment your way through
it, and try something. And if it's not Landing in a
(29:56):
certain way accepting that it's time, to Let It Go.
It move on, it might be a blessing for somebody else.
Just like your beautiful story about not winning the election.
It was a breakthrough in anothercapacity and you had that
symbolic site to see that. That's really, really beautiful
given. What we've heard given where
your internal Compass is pointing given where your
nutrients are flowing in the direction that you're heading.
(30:16):
What's on your radar right now? Like what's where is your
attention going? What, what, what seeds are?
You're nurturing? I look for this one.
My manager Monica cause connectivity, but I see it
visually as kind of Of concentric.
Bubbles in a Venn diagram. So so when you say father, for
example, that's a big-ass bubble, whelmingly overlapping
(30:38):
in that bubble is author. This is my book daddy-daughter
day and you know, it's inspired by a song I wrote with my
daughter. So like artist while parenting.
It's a book that's really rootedin the in the spiritual tenants
of afrofuturism which is one of the hats, you know?
And as I'm doing kind of book, tours and readings.
Whatever Stella will let me dragher with me.
(31:01):
I'm going to and whenever I havean opportunity to live the book
out in real life and cancel something, so I can help her do
handstands or test out that air fryer.
And, you know, I'm going to do that and it's not mutually
exclusive with any of the other kind of Bubbles and hats, that I
(31:24):
occupy and where, and as much aspossible, I want those Tools to
bleed into one another because of the more separate.
They are the more directions I need to run.
If I bring it home to the Hearthand I live in the, in the
center, then I'm constantly at maximum efficiency, you know, in
(31:46):
all the truth and all the spacesthat I want to be, I think for
me it's really about blurring those lines as much as possible.
While prioritizing husband and family first.
Then then you know everybody else get in line, this includes
what we talked about earlier with letting go.
You know, one of the things thatI've realized as far as what do
(32:10):
they call it in basketball and they sit players when they're
not injured load management. That's what they call it.
Okay, it is basically you're notgoing to play today because we
want to save you for the playoffs.
Anyway, if I'm ever in a situation where where I'm not
managing my life, Load appropriately.
It's important to be aware of that and to let go of things so
(32:34):
that I can hold the other thingswith a more steady hand rather
than just be wobbly, because I'mtrying to do everything at once.
And I think for me, like a good barometer to what I'm capable of
is three things, that's it. It's three things and parenting.
And husbanding is one of those three, those opportunities that
(32:55):
you give often come back to. And it Ways that people that you
wouldn't even have an expected are saying thanks to you.
You thanked a lot of people and recognize a lot of people today.
Who do you need to give? Thanks to that.
You haven't given thanks to yet whether here today or in
general, that is coming up that maybe was unexpected or, yeah,
(33:20):
that deserves it. I mean, there are too many
people to think, like I said, atthe beginning, I have a vaulted
perspective because I'm standingon the shoulders of giants.
Now, as if that wasn't dope enough, I also have like active
homies. First of all Spirits, ancestors
(33:40):
angels, helping me and then in it Angels, you know, helping me
out, lifted me up and then just our people here on this Earth.
And so, yeah, there's a ton of people that I consider mentors.
There's a ton of people that I consider mentees and then peers,
And then ancestors, even this this very conversation because
(34:03):
y'all got me like, awesome stuff.
I'm like, damn maybe I don't make this into a TED talk.
You know what I mean? Like, I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be
right, but, you know, but that is again, that's a testament to
the vibe that you're bringing and what you're pulling out of
me, which is not common, like you've heard my interviews,
they're not all like this but anyway.
(34:24):
Yeah. So I think there's a lot of
gratitude to go around. For sure Pierce.
You're amazing. Thank you for sharing so much
wisdom. We're going to tune out with the
track. You sent a few tracks over.
You can get contacts for one of them, which would it be?
And we'll take it off with that guy.
(34:46):
So, I found a tape VHS tape from1980 Something. 80-some 87.
I can't remember the year now ofmy mom as a teaching artist in
rural eastern, North Carolina. And, and this was a song, I'm
that was the The actual recording of that song, Justice.
(35:09):
Come here real quick. Just give me the tape.
There's a tape in that bag says 1988 in the green VHS, right
behind you. Thank you.
This is your grandmother. Check it out.
(35:57):
And she was, you know, singing no one exactly like you I heard
it and I called her. I said Mom, this is beautiful
like she's like. What's that again where did you
find that? She had no memory.
Memory of having recorded it at all, it's been 30 plus years but
it was really early in her career and is a Timeless
(36:18):
beautiful song. I added some vocals and
instruments and kind of try to breathe life into it for 20 21
(36:38):
which is when blacks in the future.
Came out and it was the opener. The album opener.
This kind of intergenerational sample from when I was really
little kid and my mom was reallyyoung and her career and it was
really special for me. You can follow Pierce on all
(37:37):
social channels at Pierce free lawn or on his website at
www.airsofthero.com leave looking up is hosted by myself,
me, Ludovic and my co-host, AmirJan Dolly, and produced by our
small. But Mighty team at Moon 31, a
company dedicated to creating platforms for Meaningful
conversations. That tackle the important issues
(38:00):
of today for folks that love with their hearing today and
want to hear and see. We have the complete uncut and
raw episodes in video form available online.
On our fan page via patreon at www.levitt.com up.com fans
there. You can support, what we're
creating here. Sound bites, that didn't make it
to the Final Cut gain wisdom from our guests score.
(38:23):
Merch, be the first to access our content and more also we'd
like to take a second to thank you for joining us today.
So, if you haven't already, please be sure to leave a rating
and view of the podcast and yourapp of choice.
We also recommend following us on social media at leave looking
up on all social channels or subscribing to our mailing list
(38:44):
for special content news. And first tips on the episodes
via our website at leave lookingup.com.
This episode was created throughthe combined efforts of myself
as executive producer, and our lead producer, Lou Chic Lotus Li
the moon 31 team. Also includes designer and
Draya. Kang glass slipper, media, and
engineer just inject, Carter. An extra special, thanks to
(39:06):
engineer, TJ, dumpster, who mixed and mastered this episode
original theme music by Brady W & background music provided for
Blue Dot sessions.
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