Boundaries with God with Michelle Wilding

Episode Transcript
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Unknown (00:03):
Have you ever thought that you should have boundaries
with God? Spirit source,whatever the title of God or
that higher connection that youhave, whatever that label is,
have you ever considered orthought that may be whatever
that is that voice that you'rehearing the knowing that you're
having is coming through afilter, and then maybe you
should have boundaries. Today Iget to dive into a beautiful

(00:26):
conversation about this with myfriend, Michelle wilding. And as
always I am thrilled that you'rehere and listening with us on my
podcast leaving religion aguide, I am your host, Amanda
joy, Loveland. And as Michelleand I dive in, you'll soon find
out why she was one of my deardear friends, we I love our
conversations. I love her mind.
I love how it works. And her andI think very similarly, but not

(00:49):
only that, she's brilliant. Shehas her degree in psychology,
but she is a certified trainerwhat she does in her day to day,
she's a certified trainer ofNLP, which is neuro linguistic
programming, and alsohypnotherapy. I believe she has
other so many other toolsunderneath her belts, but she's
amazing. And she is someone thatoutside of our friendship, if I

(01:09):
need a session, I reached out toMichelle. So I'm really excited
to share this episode with you.
And if you're interested inlearning, Michelle and her
business partner, Amanda Nelsonhave a really beautiful training
coming up here in a few weeks.
If you're wanting if you're inthat place of your law in your
life, that you're just wantingmore, maybe you're looking for a
new vocation, maybe you're justlearning wanting to learn more

(01:31):
about how you can become abetter human how you can get to
the limiting beliefs or the rootof what's going on with you.
This is a training I wouldhighly recommend. In fact, I
just did this last year withboth of them. They're beautiful
teachers, you end up walking outthe door with three different
certificates. One of them is amaster NLP practitioner. Another
I believe, is as a coach andanother one is as an energy. I

(01:53):
don't know if it's a healer, Ican't remember. But it's a
beautiful training, I'd highlyrecommend you go check it out.
If this is peeking yourcuriosity at all, head to their
website, thus soco.org That'sthe s o c o.org. And without
further ado, let's dive intothis fascinating conversation
with Michelle wilding. Hi.

(02:21):
Oh, sorry. It's your podcast.
You start.
This is our episode. We'revideoing Today we're testing
this out. Yeah.
So if you guys see me, I didn'tknow so I have like no makeup
on. I have no eyelashes and myhair is freshly washed, but it's
washed your. Your? Uh, yes, I'mvery clean. This is the this is
gonna be raw and unedited,unfiltered.

(02:44):
Yes. Which we like. Yeah, I wasjust talking to somebody about
that last night. It's like we'reso tired of the whole and you
and I were talking about thatthe other day too. Just to fake
and it's like I get we have allthese filters and and get we
have our insecurities. And Iwill be completely honest. I do
a little tiny filter when I domy stories. Just the one so it
just saw ohmy god, you guys, you look at
herInstagram. You know, it's it's
just a little tiny one.

(03:07):
So props to you for doing thestories. I'm still getting into
that.
I learned something yesterdayabout Instagram. But I'll tell
you that, because that's notwhat this podcast is about
talking about that. Well I hadin our I'm sitting here with
Michelle wilding. Hi, guys. AndMichelle is one of my dearest
dearest friends. And one of themany many reasons I love you is
because of her freakingconversations.

(03:29):
We Yeah, we definitely go someinteresting places.
Yes, we do. And recently, thingshave been coming up around.
There's a lot of when when westep out of religion, we look to
those places of trying to findthe gurus, those people that are
gonna teach us things that wedon't know. And there's so many
I hate to use the word pitfalls,but I'm just going to use the

(03:49):
word pitfalls because I thinkthat's what this is going to be
titled with spiritual pitfalls.
Totally.
Because we were putting it toYeah, and and in one sense it's
like you know, it's part of ourlearning that's great. But we
are this what this conversationis about is a spiritual pitfalls
of what do you normally comeinto what what to do about it?
And kind of what, what things tokind of look for when you're
stepping into this, you know,I'm out of religion. Now. I'm

(04:12):
stepping into this, who am I?
What's my connection to Godsource, we even believe in a god
source, and then starting tokind of go into a lot of times
we go into the woowoo world,which I love the movie world.
It's really fun. And there's avery, very vast degree of woowoo
enough. Yes, that is very true.
Let's go down snake it in theforest,

(04:34):
which I mean can be fun. Yeah.
Yeah. You know, when we startbranching out of our norms, it's
like we start learning moreabout who we are.
Yeah, and it's definitely it'sdefinitely interesting. Well, I
think one of the biggest reasonswhy like coming out like when
you step out of religion, it wasso structured you do this you
like, you follow the Prophet oryou follow whoever it is the
leader of you know, whateverreligion it is, you're leaving

(04:57):
and like that rejection piece ofwanting that you want to go
authentically, no rules, noboundaries, I get to choose what
I want. I get to create my ownworld, which I think there is a
truth in that. But then it alsokind of comes back into, like,
how does that actually play intoa life that's happy and
fulfilled? Yeah. Because I thinkeither way, it's like if you're
in religion, or if you're reallyinto the spiritual aspect of

(05:19):
things, it really comes backdown to the same as your wanting
to create a life that you love,to create freedom, treat
happiest create experiences. Andat some point, it's like, okay,
well, if being told what to dodidn't work. Now I'm going to
try doing whatever I want asauthentic as I want in the
moment. And I mean, I thinkyou've kind of noticed this,
too, but it's like, I did that.
I was like, oh, yeah, I get todo what I want. It gets to feel

(05:41):
how I want. And it didn't reallycreate. It was it was really
chaotic. My life started toexplode. Like, there were some
amazing things that happened. Igot to see different parts of
myself. But there were otherthings. I'm like, Oh, my gosh,
like my bank account sucks, man,I keep blowing up relationships.
My emotions were all over theplace all the time. I was
constantly seeking for that nexthigh of you know, if it was a

(06:03):
breakthrough, or,yeah, when I feel like this kind
of comes into the boundarypeace. You know, and I think
where you're speaking to wherethere's so much structure within
religion of what to do, and whatnot to do that when you step out
of it, I mean, I think I hatethe when people talk about, oh,
they're the pendulum swing, nowthey're gonna go off into left
field and do whatever. And Ihate that. But there is some

(06:23):
truth in varying ways as far aswhat that looks like. And this
is why I feel like you'respeaking to is a it is like, Oh,
great, I'm gonna go experienceall these parts of me. But then
there's a resistance toboundaries around it. And
actually boundary with I wouldlove to tap into and talk about
boundaries of spirit.

(06:43):
Okay, this is such a good onesuch a good one. That I feel
like I have dove deep into it.
Because it's you talk likeboundary with spirit or even
like boundaries with God, right?
Well, you're taught and religionno one, it's like you do what
God tells you to do. And then wehave stories that talk about you
know, depending on whatreligious texts it is, like, you

(07:05):
know, Abraham commanded to gokill his son are, you know, if
it's in the Book of Mormon,Nephi, killing labor, like you
hear these things is like, Ineed to do whatever God tells me
to do, or I'm not going to getinto heaven. Here's the deal. We
don't really know how thosestories played out. Again, those
stories were written bysomebody, and then they've been
translated. How many times dohow many years? We don't know

(07:25):
exactly. But if you listen tothe story piece, and this isn't
me talking from my own, maybeyou guys didn't think this kind
of thing. But I would read thiskind of stuff. I'm like, No,
whatever God tells me to do. Iam supposed to do Yeah. 100%.
Like, that's just what itis. All of it. Carry that. And
but then the question is, is doI know if I'm hearing God or
not? I mean, that's a wholeother.
Yeah, that's a whole otherthing, too. And I think you have
to get to the point where youunderstand what it feels like.

(07:49):
So for me, personally, I feltlike, I mean, I remember being
little, I'm like, I just want toserve God, like I'm here to
serve God. I was like, thislittle eight year old girl who
was like, whatever I'm supposedto do, I'm gonna do at the time,
like in the Mormon religion,you're not supposed to, like
you're supposed to keep theSabbath day holy. Well, I was
just like, super determinedlittle horseback rider, who was
like working her butt off to goto the Olympics. And I got to

(08:13):
the point, I was really good.
But I got to the point where thecompetitions were on Sunday, so
then my little self was like,Well, I have to stop competing
now. Literally gave up my dreamand thinking like, Okay, I'm
just supposed to do what I'vesaid. And so for so long, it was
like I did what I was supposedto do. This is how I'm going to
be worthy. This is how I thoughtI was going to be happy, because
that's what you were taught. Andthat whole thing of just like

(08:33):
doing whatever God told you, Ididn't realize before that me
doing whatever God told me waswhat the church told me to do.
It's like, okay, being totallyobedient. So then when I swung
when I was like, okay, nothappy. Had blight, having left
religion all of a suddenswinging to the other side?
Well, then I was like, a lot oflike, I mean, I talked about

(08:54):
I've talked about my leaving thechurch before I left, because I
wanted to find God. So I wasvery much like I had been
developing this relationship.
Hey, how do I ask questions? Howdoes God talk to me? What does
this look like? And I'd had someexperiences that whole thing. So
then when I left, I didn'trealize, because this is what
happens. A lot of times you havebeen caught programming or

(09:15):
beliefs or different ways you dothings in religion, that you
think when you leave religionthat you left that behind, and
you don'ta lot of unwind a long time
sometimes, yes.
And so what I realized is I hadtook this whole thing, because
before it was like, Oh, I justdo what I'm told. So it doesn't
really matter what I feelinspired to do. If it doesn't
fall in line with what theChurch tells me. It's wrong. And

(09:37):
I talked about my story before,like, you know, I'd gotten
married, and I felt like I wassupposed to stay. That was the
first time I was like, listeningto my own intuition. Well, all
of a sudden, then I swung overinto this world that wasn't a
part of religion. Then I waslike, well, whatever God tells
me I'm going to do becausethat's kind of how I was trained
and raised and programmed as achild. And now that I wasn't
falling to church, I had to findsomething new to follow. And it

(10:00):
was I, there was a point like,well, if I feel inspired to do
this, I'm just gonna do this.
And then I kind of almost feltlike I would, whatever the
consequences are, that's not onme because God told me to do
this. But I realized that I wassitting in groups, and a lot of
people had the same mentality.
Like, it wasn't just me. Andthere was kind of this idea.
Well, if you feel inspired,you're just supposed to do it.
And whatever happens that didthat that's not on you. But I

(10:23):
started to look at theseyears old, like you're a victim
to God telling you what to do.
And you're just a little vessel.
I literally, you actually don'thave free choice, even though in
religion, we told you, you did.
You don't.
So I'm taking that here. Well,now I really don't have like, I
have choice. But I really don'tI have to do it. I feel inspired
to do and I feel like God'stelling me to do this. I just

(10:45):
have to do it. I literallyremember having conversations
with some of my friends. I'mlike, I feel like I'm in this
abusive relationship with God.
He tells me to do these things.
And it's super hard and itsucks. And then I'm like, okay,
Please, God, give me some morelike, Please, Sir, give me some
more like, have some more. And Ijust always felt like I was
like, Well, God's gonna tell meto do something. And it's gonna

(11:06):
be hard. And that's just how itis. And then I just started
watching, like, what are theresults? Then I had to, like,
really get clear is like, okay,is God telling me this? Or is it
not? Because really, when youstart to feel getting into
having your own inspiration,that is a fine line that I'm
still figuring out. And I wealways are. Yeah. And so I got

(11:30):
to the point I was like,which kind of sucks, let's just
call this out for just a minute.
There's an I feel like I'vetalked about this lately. This
whole arrival, this destinationis home point, whatever of like,
Oh, yes, I figured this pieceout. Like some of these really
big things like the godconnection, source connection,
whatever you receive in yourhigher self, I feel like it is

(11:52):
constantly shifting andchanging, because we are
100%. And you also depending,and this is my belief, whatever
you believe, I think is totallyfine. What am I here to do? Are
we here? Do we believe that Godis here to test us to be
obedient? Or are we here to haveexperiences? Well, guess what,
if you're just here to haveexperiences, it can be like,

(12:14):
Hey, should I go take out thisloan to do this? Well, sure,
yeah. If that's what you want,that's what you want. Hey, well,
should I need to do this? Well,why? Like, really, I had to
realize what is it that I'mactually seeking? And is the
inspiration I'm getting takingme to there? I had to switch my.

(12:34):
Because before I was like, I'mjust being obedient. I had to
switch my thinking into what arethe results that I want? And is
it bringing me that? And havingboundary on spirit is where that
kind of started to happen?
Because really, you can getinspiration for a lot of
different things. But it dependson where you're going. And why.
Yeah. Why do you want that?
Like, because I really do thinkthat a lot of it when you switch

(12:57):
your mentality from not tryingto just be obedient so you can
make get to heaven, which thatwas kind of how I felt like with
my religion that I left, it'slike, Nope, I just have to be
obedient. I just have to do thethings I have to prove myself,
so I can eventually make it toheaven. Well, when you take that
away, well, then what is lifeabout? Where's it that you're
going? Yeah, because if it'sjust about experiences, you can

(13:17):
have a lot of them. And you gotto get really clear on what's
the experiences that you wantedto have. And then you do have to
put boundaries on spirit.
Because, again, whatever youbelieve, it's like, Who are you
listening to? And who's talkingto you. And that can come to a
lot of different things. Ifyou're super in the woowoo. You
can think that's other beings asentities, or even with yourself,
depending on how your program,you're going to feel different

(13:39):
things based on certainsituations.
Yeah, 100% when i. So you're,you're someone that has always
heard pretty clear. And there'sa lot of us, including myself
that haven't Yeah. And so thatwas one of those pieces that as
I kind of stepped out of, like,I would get answers, but I
wasn't really sure if they wereanswers when I was religious,

(14:01):
but then I would kind of Yep,that was an answer. Because I
would feel it my body say, kindof have those things, but I
didn't hear in the way that Ifelt like other people heard. So
it's like, oh, my gosh,something something's wrong with
me. So when I leave religion, Imoved more into like, you know,
learning about my gifts andspirituality and some different
pieces. And I would havedifferent beings that would come

(14:21):
in right through differentsessions. And then you'd have
different experiences. And thenI wanted to learn how to become
a psychic. Like I'm like, Idon't really want to learn how
to be a psychic. And it wasreally fascinating because one
of the first things that we didis she had me write a letter, in
a sense to like a letter ofacceptance into she's like, it's
almost like you're writinghere's your acceptance letter
into Hogwarts kind of thing. Oh,I kind of like that. But you put

(14:45):
in there I'm opening thesegifts. I'm wanting to be online
for this. But here are the hoursI'm available. Here are the
boundary pieces so huge becauseI actually have had moments as a
child I was always petrified ofgatos and of the dark because I
could actually fill darkerentities all the time and in
Christianity especially andreally in the world, we are so

(15:09):
programmed that the shadow isbad get that out we need to do
exorcisms. You know it all sortsof it's it's connected with the
devil was Satan.
And we're also taught to melet's talk about shut down our
gifts to how kids see things orhow like their imaginary best
friend or like, don't talk aboutthat right? No,
that's there's something Yes,that my kids great example the
nannies will get freaked outbecause it kept my kids would

(15:31):
see spirits and then scare theshit out of them. So they turned
off those gifts because it'slike it's not socially
acceptable. So it's reallyinteresting to go through that
experience. And I feel like itfeels pertinent here. Because we
like what we're talking aboutwhen you want to be available
for everything, because that's areally cool thing. It's like,
yes, and if you constantly areand it's really important, if

(15:53):
you're really open to so I havean agreement with spirit, I mean
sources a little bit different.
But spirits can only come inwhen I'm doing when I'm in
session, unless, unless there'sa really fine print here. Unless
it's a situation to where theyhaven't been able to get through
to a loved one any other way.
And that very, very rarelyhappens. And I feel like this

(16:14):
kind of dovetails a little bitinto when you start, like
learning you have these gifts.
You don't just start readingeverybody that you see and start
like oh my gosh, I see so and sowith you and your color is this
and I'm noticing this, it'slike, Holy hell.
Oh man, let's Okay, let's getinto that one. Because I got I
got things to say about that onelittle quick on the having the
having the boundary on spiritand your spiritual gifts. That's

(16:36):
true. When I first got into it,I could see I could feel. And I
could see and I could feeleveryone and it was so
overwhelming. I literally got tothe point, same as you I
literally told God Spirit,whatever we want to say, hey, if
I'm not if I can't actually helpthem, and it's not appropriate
to help them, I don't want tosee it. Because there's there's
no reason. Because all I did isI walked around and I saw

(16:57):
everyone's pain, everyone'strauma. And then it got to the
point where I'm living in thisworld. I'm like, This feels
terrible. But then to it's like,here's the deal, just because
you can see something like ifyou let's say you have the gift,
or you can feel it mine is moreof like a sense, I can feel
things. And like if I can feelsomeone else's pain? Well, I
realized it was like puttingboundaries on spirit. But I

(17:18):
always had to put boundaries onmyself. 100% Because boundaries
on myself is just because I cansee or feel something on someone
else. Some of my greatestlearnings and my greatest growth
came from my pain being therelong enough until I changed. And
so I had to start seeing itdifferently. But it was like to
say that again. Yes. So some ofthe biggest evolution and growth

(17:39):
I had is being with my pain andhaving it stick with me long
enough until I decided to changetill you
did nothing. Anybody could tellyou, Hey, I see this. But unless
you came to an agreement of likeseeing what it was, and what was
there to see for you in thegifts, it's not really
it's not gonna leave. And thething is, too is again, talking
about the shadow, we're sayingthat it's so terrible. But what

(17:59):
if it's the thing that literallyis helping you to become
everything that you want? Itcomes in and we're like, oh my
gosh, this is so terrible. And Ican't I can't have this happen.
When it's the thing thatactually gets you through it. My
name an example on this onereally quick, is a little
different. So I have twocousins. Both struggled with
drug addictions. Yeah, one ofthem literally didn't have help.

(18:23):
Her family was like, Nope,you're gonna have to figure this
out. She was on the street forlike three years lost her kids
TWICE, TWICE. She's now verysuccessful. She's gotten her
family together. She pulledherself out of it, by other
cousin had tons of help. Peoplekept trying to come in like,
hey, let's, here's a fancyrehab. Let's go to here. She
struggled over and over and overand Oregon still doesn't have

(18:44):
custody of her daughter.
Difference. One, that painliterally transformed her into
everything that she needed to doto be to the point where she
didn't need the drugs anymore.
Where the other own, everyonekind of kept trying to come in
to save to save to save. Yeah,still in it. So it's like, what
was the pain bad? No, it pulledher out to figure out what was

(19:04):
ever causing her to do that. SoI had to see that with the gifts
realizing like, No, I might seea bunch of pain or whatever. How
do I not know that that'sexactly what they need. Right? I
don't get to go play God and sayI can see this. So we're going
to change it.
And actually how interesting isit and ironic is it then that we
have the Savior archetype that'ssupposed to save us and take us
some and move us out of the painand loss of actually moving

(19:27):
through it and for me like avery personal I had bouts of
depression where I knew mylowest of lows like I just to
where you feel like nobody'sthere. It's dark. It's a shity
shity difficult place to be in.
Yeah. And it was one of thosethings that especially with
depression, when you get there'snobody that can help you in that
space and we do turn to drugs orwe try to turn to therapists,

(19:50):
but at the end of the day, youare alone with your emotions,
whatever they are at that timelater on in life because I knew
my lows I knew of where I couldgo on, I got to a point to where
I could pull myself out of thatfreaking Dark Pit. Later on in a
relationship, I saw that placethat we were going and that I
was going to continue going if Istay in that relationship. So it
ended up being a gift to melater, of knowing what I was

(20:12):
capable of, and knowing to wherethis relationship was going. And
if I didn't pull myself out, Iwould never come out. Yeah, and
I knew those places. So well,it's like, Oh, I'm not choosing
that. No, I'm gonna choosesomething different. But it
wasn't because I had medicatedit wasn't because I went to some
shaman, even though I'm ashaman, Shaman. They're good.
And told me these things thatthey saw it was because I had

(20:33):
those physical, deep sellsomatic experiences. That then
were some of my greatestteachers later on in life of
knowing who and what I'm capableof.
When I think that's, it's thisreally important, because I
think a lot of times, it's like,we're trying to we come having
structure, it's like littlekids, right? You want the rules,

(20:55):
you want the boundaries thatkeeps you safe? Well, once
you've had that foundation,you're realizing if it's a
religion, it's no longer workingfor you. When you leave, you're
trying to make these rules andtrying to figure it out. And a
lot of times are things like,well, this is how it is it has
to be this way for everyone, orthis is what it is, and you're
trying to do it, especiallygoing back to like having
boundaries with spirit. It'slike, you have to figure out

(21:17):
what are you available for whatare you not available for? What
are things that are like, open?
I wasn't going to share thisexperience. But I was like,
interesting to talk about it. SoI'm a coach, and I work with a
lot of women. And one of thethings like the personal
development world, it's like youcan get like these really like
culty mentalities where thesegroups can kind of turn into
this, like, interesting thing.

(21:39):
And I was always like, I don'tknow, no, I don't want to be one
of those people. I don't want tobe anyone's leader. I don't want
to be anyone's guru. But I wasalso feeling called to get, you
know, to this point of likehelping people. And I remember I
kept thinking about it, becausethat's one thing. If there's a
problem, I'm gonna think aboutit, I'm gonna look at it, and
we're gonna dissect it. And I'mlike, What do I have this thing

(21:59):
because I feel like I'm beingcalled to do it. And I was
watching I was on Hulu wascalled under the banner of
heaven. Okay, super interesting,but wants to Yeah, it's super
interesting. Lafferty brothersthat actually lived around here,
like creative minds and Utah.
And I was watching and I waslike, okay, where, because a lot
of things that they were talkingabout, were just following God.
We're just following God, thisis what God's telling us to do.

(22:22):
And I was like, um, they endedup killing people and like going
crazy. And you hear those thingsthat people just saying they're
following spirit. This is whatGod said. And I was looking at
it. I was like, Wait, what islike, what is this? Like? How
did they get to this point?
Well, one, you have to be veryclear about what spirit sounds

(22:43):
like what God sounds like toyou. And I feel like that's like
a fine line. I kept looking atit and looking at it. And this
was like, the first time I gotto the point where I was like,
you want to know it? No, I'm notwilling to do it, edit what God
said, up to this point, I wouldhave been the one. If God tells
me to do it. I'm gonna do it.
Yeah, absolutely. I alsorealized I was raised that way
to say, this is what it lookslike, this is what you have to
do in order to be an Ascendedbeing or to get to heaven, or to

(23:04):
be a good person. And I madethat thing. I was like, No, you
want No, I'm not. I will not doanything. I'm not willing to
kill somebody, not willing to gocheat on my partner, because
something inside of me feelslike I should go do that. It was
like, that's a no for me. Yeah.
And so. And it was, all of asudden, once I created those

(23:26):
boundaries for myself, it waslike, I felt like I could move
again. It was like, no, becauseI believe we're here to
experience ourselves at thegreatest highest version. This
is sovereignty, sovereignty,peace. And that's me, again, we
just started out of itselfalways starts with, it's all
about the self, like, let's behonest, anything that we're
doing, if it's helping whatever,really always comes back to you,

(23:48):
right. And that's the thing likemy belief, we talked about it
like I think in like the firstpodcast where
I think I think we'veinterviewed I don't can't
remember how many other podcastepisodes we've done. And I'll
make sure and link them downbelow.
But I talked about, like, mybelief about is that I feel like
Jesus came in to show us whatwas possible. Again, there's a

(24:08):
whole idea he came to save us,maybe I don't understand. But
for me, it's like he came toshow us what was possible. Well,
I'm here to experience myself atthe greatest level possible, I
get to create that. What are theboundaries for me? What are the
rules for me? What am I willingto do and what I'm not willing
to do?
Well, then having that awarenessthat anything that does come
through as far as inspiration oryou're hearing something is

(24:31):
coming through our filters. Yes.
And that's the kicker. And it'slike, I know a lot of the things
that we're talking about, canmake your head kind of spin a
little MB like, oh my gosh, Idon't even know where to go
right now, what does even meanright how to do it. I'm just
gonna invite everybody that'slistening, just to take a breath
that these are things toconsider. But that's the kicker
is that they are like when Istep in, you and I both we step

(24:53):
into client sessions, it'salways coming through our filter
every single time and so I'd saythat gets to be spoken into the
space. And you know,100%, too, because it's like
it's coming through your filter.
And if it's coming through yourfilter, I think one of the
biggest things you have to do isif you're going to step into the
point where you're starting tofigure out, I do want to listen

(25:14):
to God, what God is for me, I dowant to listen to spirit, I do
want to be inspired and listenedto, you also get to take 100%
accountability for the choicesthat you make.
Yeah, you're not a victim tothis, you are the song you are
the person that's making thatchoice to listen to whatever it
is that you're hearing,and whatever happens for that
you get to take responsibilityfor that. If it's like, because
like, let's be honest, in thespiritual woowoo world, you see

(25:35):
people, I'm supposed to go bewith this person, even though
I'm married, and I have afamily. I'm going to leave my
family behind. Okay, well, if itall blows up, and everything's
terrible, and you've heard abunch of people, you don't get
to stand on the corner. Well,God told me to so I'm fine. No,
I didn't do that. That doesn'tmatter. Because I listened to
spirit. It's like, No, I do. Imean, if you know me, you know

(25:58):
me. I know. I very much I love.
I'm like, Hey, cool. I feel likeGod's telling me to do this. I
feel like I get to go here. Ieven felt at one time, like, I
got married. And I'm 10 months.
And I'm like, I don't think thisis gonna be good for both of us.
Cool. You want to know, I wasthat person at first, like,
Well, God told me to God told meto. And finally, man, you should
say. So I was like, Oh, my Godtold me to leave. And so it's

(26:20):
like, whatever it was, I wantedto blame. I was like, Well, this
is fine. I can do it. Finally, Isaid, you want to know what? I
wanted to have a different lifethan that way that was going my
soul knew that. And what I feltlike God was saying, did that,
and I'm okay, if you're mad atme. I'm okay. If you think that
I did wrong for most of thetime, and probably even still,
my mom's like, I don't think youheard God. They're cool. That

(26:41):
was super hurtful for me. Yeah.
But I get to take responsibilityfor whatever it is you're doing.
And then I think you need tostart looking at Cool. Is it
working? Or is it not working?
And if it's not working, youdon't just get to blame God he's
or spirit saying they're takingin the wrong direction? It's
like, no, what are you actuallylistening to?

(27:03):
Well, there's two pieces to thisone, when you say, you know, is
it working or not working? Thisis where so you are a master NLP
practitioner, and coach andteacher and all sorts of things.
So the way that you see theworld is always looking at what
are the results that I'mgetting. Because if they're not
the results that I want, thenthere's something internally
that I get to shift. So that'swhat you're speaking to, if
you're listening to God,whatever it is the voice that

(27:23):
you're hearing, and you're notgetting the results you want in
life, then maybe you shouldstart asking questions or wonder
what filter this is comingthrough. And maybe that's not
God you're actually hearing. Andto think that, you know, so it's
kind of like that. Well, how doI know if I'm hearing God? Yep.
How do I know if it's not myuncle that passed away? That's
just wanting to play or you knowwhat I mean?
Like, they're How do I not know,this? Is my inner child or my

(27:45):
subconscious mind? That has thisprogram that's afraid to do
this? And it's telling me notto? Yeah,
yeah. And you know, and thisbrings up, I think one of the
easiest ways to do that is toask yourself every day show me
what the voice of God soundslike, like, let me see the
difference? Am I hearing God? Oram I hearing something
different? And getting reallyclear with that question, and I
think that would be reallyunique for each person. Oh, for

(28:07):
sure. One of the practices Istill do every day is I do
inspired action, like cool.
What's the one inspired action Iget to do today? And I would
start just listening to see I'dlike, Okay, let's see what it
is. And with that one most thetime, it's not very big. And
it's not really like you're notgonna do a lot of damage with
that, right? Like most of myinspired actions, like, hey,
tech, so and so, hey, do this. Istarted doing that, because I

(28:28):
was trying to fine tune what thevoice felt like. Yeah, but I
would also watch to see whathappened that came from the
things that I did.
So you just said felt like andthis is where I think there's a
interesting, distinct, distinctuation distinct distinguishing
factor. Fishing factor. I feellike in my experience, and maybe

(28:48):
it's because I'm a feeler butmost of us are, when I hear
something that is more sourceenergy, or my higher self,
whatever you want to call it,usually I will feel it
throughout my entire body astruth. And that I feel like it's
a slight difference betweensomething that's just Spirit
coming in, because I'll feelthat but it'll be different.
Yeah, because I know for meusually, like, and I think I

(29:09):
should be really clear when Ihear God talk to me, you guys.
It's my own voice is my ownthought. I'm not hearing this
outside source. It'scoming like your show. Go do
this today. You hear that? Iwant to talk to you because
that's so interesting. That'snot comes from me. Like those
people. That would be so cool.
But when it comes to it'susually like, a thought that
comes in. Sounds like my ownnormal thought, except it says

(29:34):
it's saying something that'slike, that doesn't it kind of
sounds like me, but it's butit's a little different. It's
like no that I wouldn't normallythink of this and it's coming in
in a way that doesn't feel likeme. And for me, you guys, most
of the time I don't get thisfull body experience. Mine is
it's in my chest and it's littleand a lot of times I can have

(29:55):
inspiration come in and my wholebody say nope, nope, nope, I
don't like this. I don't likethis And there's just a little
tiny feeling. It's the whisperof something I've had to really
feel like, Nope, it's just asolid feeling mine just solid.
It's just as grounded. You getto do it. Okay, you guys.
There's also times though, whensomething comes in, and I'm
like, I'm so excited. I lovethis. And that same feeling

(30:19):
inside is like, it's not right.
Yeah. So most of the time, Idon't listen to what I feel. If
it's heightened either way, andthat's super happy or not, I
don't listen to the heightenedfeeling. I get really still. And
it's this feeling inside of me.
But it's little.
That's something that you Imean, I can't even remember how

(30:40):
long ago this was a few yearsago. How long have we known each
other now? Anyway, minute youand I was going through
something and you just knew oneof the things you said to me
that stuck to me to this day. Inever make decisions from a
place of when I'm really in it.
What it's chaos when it feelsfrantic when it's Phil's like,
just scattered and never makedecisions from that place. Like
it's orif it's super exciting, because

(31:00):
you got I've made a lot ofdecisions when I was so pumped
up about it thatyou're like shit.
Not literally, I'm like Goddammit, like, and I realized the
heightened feeling anytime itfeels even slightly chaotic. I
won't do it. But But I, I alsoknow where it's not like, well,

(31:21):
I have to feel just peacefulabout it. No, I can feel feel
feel fearful, and have it stillfeel solid and also move.
While a lot of times it feelsfearful. Like I'm sitting right
now with a piece of possiblygoing and doing some plant
medicine. And I you know me, I'mone that it's like, I have to be
reallydeeply called to do it. Yeah.
And I just don't want to do it.
And yeah, and the whole time.

(31:42):
I am not that girl. I know thepeople that deal is like really?
You think that's fun? Oh, a lotof people do. You know, they
like they like the feeling ofit, and they get it and that's
fine. But for me, I have to bereally, really deeply called.
And so it's bringing up theanxiety in me, right? Because if
there, I see you, I feel you.
And it's like the slightdistinct, distinct uation
between? Am I fearing feelingfearful? Or like that anxiety?
Because this is a no for meright now. And that's my

(32:04):
indicator of like, yeah, notright now? Or is it like, yep,
you get to do this and holyshit, you're gonna go face some
shadows? Yeah, you know, andthat is a question that I get to
sit with. And then I'll make adecision. And we'll move
forward. But that happens a lot.
Oh, absolutely. And I think alot of this too, is, I would say
the biggest thing for me comingout of religion into this new

(32:28):
space is you kind of get tocreate the rules, you don't get
to create the results. You don'tget to say, Hey, I'm going to do
whatever I want. People have toshow up and do it like, are like
that expectation yet, you don'tget to have an expectation
piece. But you kind of get to belike, This is your time to
really become the creatorthat's ever been that you want.
Because you are creating yourresults is just always fine.
It's not likeHey, I get to you know, I feel

(32:49):
really called to open thisprogram. No one signs up for
Well, that's on them, they haveto come do this for me, or, Hey,
I get to just like, leave myhusband and sleep with five
different men. And if you dothat, there's no judgment on
that. I'm just saying that. Butyou can't be mad that your
family broke up. Yeah, you can'tsay well, no, I get to do this.
And you get to stay. And youknow, you get to decide what you
want to create. But you get tobe 100% accountable for all of

(33:12):
it. Yeah. So you get to beaccountable. So having
boundaries on spirit, that'swhen things really started to
shift, because things would comein, hey, you should go do this.
Hey, well, what I'm wanting tocreate is, like, if it's in
business, I did that withrelationships, too. It was like,
oh, let's talk aboutrelationships. Okay, so in
relationships, like, I guesswhen following different things,

(33:34):
I had like inspiration come in.
I was like, I got really clear,I want my relationship to I want
a relationship with someonewho's like this, this, this and
this. Well, part of what thatwas, I got to clean myself up,
and I got to get ready for that.
So when I felt inspired to docertain things, it was I always
had a metric of cool was itgonna take me here? And when the

(33:55):
inspiration said, yeah, it'sgoing to take you to that and I
call that I'll do it. Hey, youknow,
so you wait your questions whenyou got inspiration? So
weird. Oh, you guys questionalways, I usually ask questions.
You should 100% ask questionswhen it comes in, ask questions.
But in order to ask questions,you have to know where you're
going. Cool. What are youwanting to create in your

(34:15):
spiritual life? What are youwanting to create in your
business life, your relationshiplife and if you're wanting to
use spirit to help create itwith God, which I 100% And like
a million times on board withbecause you'll get inspiration
and things you could never thinkof on your own? But don't be
that person that's takinganything that comes in you guys.
There's so many influences somany voices, your own

(34:37):
programming in your mind thatcan tell you things when it
comes in ask questions. Cool.
Sweet. Well, what does thismean? When should I do it?
Because let's be honest, too.
Inspiration comes in. You shouldopen this. Well I had before I
feel like I should do somethingand I take the first step. And I
stop asking any questions cuz Ithought I saw the end result and

(34:58):
I start running a mile down Theroad it was like, No, I just
wanted to take you this step,because then we were going to
turn right to go here.
And this, this brings up areally, really interesting piece
that I noticed is popping in myworld, just in conversations
that I'm having is, let's talkcareer seems to be popping up
for a lot of people right now.
Okay, I would, you know, okayfigured out that this is my
vision, but I don't know how toget there. It's like the how

(35:19):
right and instantly stops. Infact, I just had another
conversation about this lastnight. And it's always
interesting that we, our brains,our humaneness always goes into
that. But how am I going to getthere instead of using inspired
action? And doing the one stepat a time? Because usually, and
this is something that I willapply for any of us in your
family life and yourrelationships and your career in

(35:40):
all facets of your life? Has itturned out exactly the way you
thought it? Would? Every singleperson would say, No, oh,
absolutely. No, no, absolutelynot. In fact, some of the
greatest things that have everhappened to us were things we
never predicted or never saw,you know, could see coming. So
if we do try to take the miledown the road instead of just
the one step, and then going,Okay, now, what's the next step?
What's the next step and doingone step at a time, we go to

(36:01):
places that we didn't think wecould, would have gone, because
here's thedeal. For me personally. And
again, if you are still inreligion, or if you're listening
this and you have people thatare leaving, like, there's
members of my family that arestill in the Mormon church, it
is so good for them, like sogood for them. And for me, the
greatest experiences I've everhad was because I left. Yeah.

(36:22):
But it's also scarier. I feellike it's way harder, is way
harder,because I just released this
last year anyway, it was talkingabout this.
Yeah. But I feel like therewards of what you can get here
are profound, what you canexperience inside yourself, what

(36:42):
you can experience on thespiritual realm, what you can go
and create and who you become ifyou're willing to keep walking
the steps is for me, it's Icould never go back. Yeah, I
could absolutely never go back.
Absolutely. But also realize, Imean, I've been out of religion
for 10 years now. So weird. Iwas like, where's the time
though? It's been 10 years. Soat the same time, that's crazy.

(37:05):
No way. 2012? Yeah.
How did we not put that? Oh,yeah. No, maybe we did. And I
just don't remember. I did.
Yeah. So it's been 10 years. Sowe're talking about things that
if you're just leaving religion,this is stuff that we took years
to figure out. I had the timewhere I do whatever God told me,
I'm like, what this didn't turnout well, and then I'd be mad at

(37:25):
God tried to be atheist forwhole 30 minutes. And then I
gotta pray about this. Because Idon't know how to do this one.
We got to figure something outto say this atheism craps not
where Yeah, and so the fact thatyou're even listening to a
podcast that's giving you tips,I hope we cut like, good eight
years off of the site.
Absolutely. You know, and that'swhat you listen to stuff like
this. So we're telling you aboutthe little things that we've

(37:45):
done to get to the point wherethis spiritual life is so
fulfilling, but if you're rightnow being like, I don't know,
I'm trying to find here, God,and they're telling me this
weird thing, I blew up myrelationship, and my family
won't talk to me. And I have nomoney, like, been there, like
been there. And it's okay. Makesure you have the grace with

(38:06):
yourself. It's like, part ofyour learning. Don't Yes,
because this is the whole thing.
You're setting boundaries.
Everywhere. You're setting,you're learning how to set
boundaries with spirit. Youlearn to set boundaries with
that inner critic in your head.
The one that's so mean tellingyou you need to have this
figured out well, they're doingit. Well. Yeah, we had 10 years
of this. It's a pretty painfulexperiences. And we're hoping

(38:28):
that this is going to make iteasier for you moving forward.
Yeah. But here's here's justreal talk real truth. In
religion, you had a lot ofpeople you could blame if things
didn't work out. You had no Ididn't. And that didn't work
out. That's your fault. Nope. Ichecked this off. So I'm good
because I did the list. Thatblessing, but also the scariest
part is on you know, it's allyou have no one to blame. This

(38:50):
is why it's harder. This is whyit's harder because most people
it's easier. We'll know if Ididn't get this all I did was
supposed to do it's fine. Well,no, I'm doing this this this. I
went to church, I paid mytithing. I did you know, my
calling. I'm going to heaven. Itdoesn't matter. This. You can
blame a lot of other things.
Nope. I don't have to thinkabout this. Because this is what
you know, my church leader toldme to do, guess what the
scariest part was actuallyhappening. I have to now listen

(39:13):
to God. And now, whateverhappens, this is on me. Yeah.
What does it mean? So takingthese things and start looking
at it? If there's one thing Icould tell you, that helped me
the most that switched over isreally what life really start
thinking, what kind of life doyou want to create here? And
even if it's little, you want toknow what I want to start

(39:35):
feeling. I just didn't want toknow what it feels like to feel
Scott's love. Cool. Well, that'sa destination. You're gonna
start listening to inspirationand start listening and figuring
out how to get to that point.
Okay, well, at that point, it'slike, for me, like I'm creating,
I'm expanding my business. AndI'm like, Cool. How does it look
like to have God help me dothis? Yeah. But I don't get to

(39:57):
come in and make a decision ofmy business and Then when it
doesn't work out, Well, God toldme to do it. So it's fine. No
one should be mad at me. No, I'mlike, guess what cool, I get to
go fine tune this, I get to seewhat it looks like
here no psycho creation piece.
And when we co create with ahuman, a physical being, like,
there's all the times, it'slike, Oh, you just pop my stuff.
Let's have this, you know, whatis this? What gets to be seen?
How can we navigate throughthis? How can we have better

(40:19):
communication? Like, I feel likethose are similar things that
you apply to listening to God,oh, God, you're at your higher
self, whatever it is that youthink that voice is.
And I will say it's worth it.
It's worth it to figure thisout. Do whatever it takes, make
all the mistakes, figure it out,go through the painful things,
go have a fight with God, goyell at him. Like, my

(40:40):
relationship with God literallyis one of probably one of like,
the most important things to me,like they were I think about
like, I could almost cry, likewhere it's taken me to put the
effort into build myrelationship with God. And
realizing it's still arelationship, this is not you,
victim to whatever God says, andto really building that. Because

(41:01):
when you get to that point, allof a sudden, it's like, the
wealth of the world's magic justopens up, you experience
yourself at a deeper level, youactually get to start creating
at this deeper level. And you'relearning. I mean, this is a
journey, I feel like I'm gonnabe on for the rest of my life.
And it's going to evolve, it'sgoing to change. Because guess
what, you can go yell at God.

(41:24):
Like, I used to think that Nope,can't be mad at God. It
literally wasn't the day we'reall in. I was so mad. I just
like laid it out there. Again,the boundaries and the
relationship you get to createthat this is on you to figure
out what you want to do. Yeah,how you want it to be.
I keep thinking about differentarchetypes that we've had in our
history, you know, Joan of Arc,totally listen to God, she was

(41:45):
totally inspired by God and thenyou know, was later killed and
her whole story and it's quiteinspiring. And you listen to
different, you know, gurus thathave been on the planet and
especially Jesus, right. Solooking at Jesus do we don't
have Ark? You know, we don'tknow a ton about her. We do.
So interesting. You've seen Joerock. I just had a conversation
on this subject with my mom onher.
But how interesting. Yeah,because it's like, Okay, here's

(42:07):
to let's just take Joan of Arcand Jesus for some reason, they
always come in together to me,and I forgot I had written about
it in my book, my friends, like,Hey, look at this, and she sends
me a chapter the thing and I'mlike, Oh, that's really cool.
Where's where's that from? She'slike your book, you wrote it.
I'm like, Oh, I don't rememberthat. But what the reason why
this is coming up for me ishere's to people that we have

(42:28):
been taught, totally heard thevoice of God totally listened,
and then had this prettyremarkable life. They were both
killed for it. But I especiallywith Jesus, for me, when I'm
tapping into his energy, Ibelieve very strongly, he had
it. He had a choice there. Andhe knew that he was accountable
for everything that he waschoosing. I don't know, Joan of
Arc has not tapped into herenergy too much.
Okay. So this is an interestingthing. I love that you bring it

(42:50):
up, and it totally had thisawareness. So my mom read her
biography. I can't remember whoI was not CS Lewis, I can't
remember. Whatever it is, it wassomething that they went in, and
they studied her life. So Joanof Arc, totally heard the voice
of God, right? Did all thesethings. Well, her big thing is
she was like the king is thesethis? From what? Again? You

(43:10):
guys, I didn't read this. Thisis my mom's take on it. But I
thought it was a reallyinteresting point. Her life
was very similar, prophesied,just like Jesus. So they have a
lot of really similar.
So when she was sitting in theprison before she was killed,
she was like, No, the king is anhonorable man. I'm fighting for
him. It's supposed to be this.
But when you actually look athistory, he actually wasn't, he
was kind of a little bit of ascoundrel, like, wasn't all

(43:31):
these things. And when hecouldn't go on, come in to save
her. He didn't he left her. Andso people I was looking at that
I was like, interesting. That'san interesting piece is that I
thought this was the mostinteresting piece. And I love
that you brought it up. I waslike, her up because it was
like, I was sitting with that. Iwas thinking, I was like, Wait,
and my biggest thing is like,Hmm, do I think she heard God?

(43:53):
Absolutely. But did it comethrough a filter that she
thought I'm doing this? BecauseGod thinks he's the most amazing
man? Or is like, I get to dothis? Because this is, what is
the best thing to happen inhistory. But for her motivation,
and again, you guys, we talkedabout programming. And if you
really want to understand howyou do behaviors, definitely go

(44:14):
look into like, subconsciousprogramming and that type of
thing. But what if themotivation to do everything that
was so hard, she had to believethat he was a man of God,
because that was what she wouldfight for? Yeah. And what if God
was willing to let her thinkthat so she would do the thing
that was going to changehistory? Because I know for me,
um, about a year and a half ago,I had relationships used to be
this thing for me super hard.

(44:38):
Like, couldn't figure it out. Ihad this one guy that I was
dating, I blew it up. And then Ifelt like I was trying to fix it
again. And I kept getting thisintegration like No, you need to
wait for your ex. I keptthinking like, Nope, we're gonna
get back together. Anytime Itapped into it. Like I had this
conversation with you, right? Iwas like, No, I, I keep trying
to let it go and keep sayinglike, Nope, you need to wait.

(45:00):
You need to wait, you need towait. Now. And I remember my
biggest thing is like, what if Iwas lying to me? What if God's
lying to me? Like that was thebiggest thing because I was
like, everything I do is oftenthe inspiration like this is
huge. What if I now the thingthat I teach the I live my life?
Or what if I don't care thisright? And that was my biggest
fear. Well, you guys, I spent 13months holding to this

(45:23):
inspiration, even after the guywas like, No, we're not getting
back together. I'm with someoneelse. And I'm like, I feel like
a crazy person. Am I stillhearing this inspiration? Right?
Well, when it came down to it, Iended up with the man that I'm
with now, I absolutely love him.
But it took me 13 months toprepare for that. And the only
thing that would have kept megoing that long is if I thought
I was so attached to my ex, thatI felt like when the inspiration

(45:45):
came into weight, my brain madeit mean it was going to be this
guy. And in the end it didn't.
But it still got me there. Ithink that's another thing with
inspiration is like if you lookat Joan of Arc, well, what if
her brain had to think the kingwas the most honorable man? God
was like he's not. But this iswhat's gonna happen to take us
where we need to go. But I'mokay with her thinking that

(46:06):
mean, could God lie to us?
I think this is why it's thatone step. Like we were talking
about going back to that thingthat we said a little earlier,
that we don't know what we don'tknow. And with our narrow and
this is why we want to createwith something that's outside of
us, it's higher than us can seethings from a different level
and see, into the vastness ofcreation instead of just our
limited our limited sight,because there's so many other

(46:28):
things going on. Like for mypersonal thing, I literally am
so grateful, my biggest fear toGod lie to me, like no, he told
me exactly what I needed tohear, to get me to where I
needed to go. Because not onlydid it make it so I could have
this beautiful relationship. Itchanged my mentality with my
body. It changed my mentalitywith my business, God was trying
to give me everything. But ifyou would have, if I literally

(46:49):
look back, I'm like, I don'tknow if I would have pushed
through the pain of what I hadto do to get to where I wanted
to go. If I wasn't so stuck on,he used almost like this flaw
that I had that I was soattached to this, which makes me
laugh. I literally think aboutit now I'm like, Oh my gosh,
like super grateful. But it'slike, again to inspiration
following God, it's like youhave to be able to not have to

(47:09):
hold on to it so tight. Yeah, wewant to know, no, you have to
tell me exactly what it is.
Well, if God would have told me,Hey, no, you're gonna go through
two months of excruciating pain,but you're gonna be with someone
else. I would have been like,nope, screw this. Screw it. I'm
not gonna go through the pain.
Why? And so it's like, followingthe different things again, Joan
of Arc, literally. She's, westill talk about her. But if you

(47:29):
go read her story, her you wouldthink Did she really hurt God?
Absolutely. But the way that shetook it was different. Yeah. And
it was okay. I think it's okayto let yourself again, because
it's figuring it out. Yeah, it'splaying and there's a taking you
This is where I have abelief that you can't do it
wrong. No, you know, and it'slike, that is one of those

(47:50):
things, the programming thatcomes over from Christianity and
my religion. It's like, there'sright, there's wrong, you know,
choose the right choose theright choose the right. It's
like, well, actually, what if wecan't do it wrong, whatever it
is just experience and it'slike, okay, well, that was fun
to go and listen to everythingthat God said. And now my whole
life has imploded.
Be okay with that. I was like,okay, cool. You learned

(48:11):
something, like letting it go,again, that programming that
comes from religion, it's like,no, this is the way you do this,
you do this, you do this, thenyou go to heaven. And it's when
you find it's all laid out foryou. And this is the thing
people will say, Well, what doyou know? Like, I don't know
what you're talking about? Well,I was like, I don't go, Who do
you think God is? I was still tothis day. I don't really know.

(48:32):
Right? To me, thinking he's likea daddy in the sky is still the
most comforting to me. Like, andI joke about that? Do I actually
think that's what it is? No, butI also know that my brain can't
comprehend exactly what it is.
But I have enough of arelationship that I don't have
to know. Yeah. Because mybiggest thing is like, I thought
that I knew in the Mormonreligion, I knew. Nope, this is
how it is. Right? But because Ithought that I knew I was so

(48:53):
pigeon holed. I couldn't seeanything outside of that. Until
you did until I did. Yeah. Butlike, give yourself grace, go
figure it out. Go go make abunch of messes when you're
listening to God. But I willsay, out the gate, I mean, you
don't have to do this, but bewilling to take 100%
accountability. Because ifyou're going to take 100%
accountability, and you can'tblame anybody else for your
decision, you're gonna thinkabout it. Yeah. You're more

(49:14):
prone to being like, do I reallywant to go blow this up? Am I
really okay, that I don't get toblame spirit for this? You know,
like, I mean, I've seen a lot ofthings where people like I can't
work God tells me not to workcool. Then also take
accountability. You might nothave no you might have no money.
No money. No, but like, Be okaywith that and say, I'm choosing
into this experience, cuz I wantto see where it's going to take

(49:36):
me.
Yeah, this feels where I'm gonnago and it's like, Okay, then
let's do it anddo and be okay. It's like, hey,
that God can tell you one thingtoday. And tomorrow, it might be
different. Maybe today. No.
Tomorrow is like, yeah, get upand go to work.
I want to circle back on thatpiece where it's like when we
were talking about the filtersthat God comes through,
especially if you know, it'slike, what if that's my five

(49:58):
year old self that tells me I'mnot worthy. You have anything?
So then God, the voice of Godthat comes through is continuing
saying, Yeah, well, you need tostop working. And now you're not
worthy of that you need to gofind another partner, like a lot
of self sabotage can happen. Soit's like, to your point of what
are the results you're gettingwhen you are listening? And are
they getting you what you'rewanting and close to where
you're wanting to go are furtheraway. Because if they're getting

(50:19):
you further away, and they'reblowing up your life, then maybe
there's a program, some sort ofa limiting belief that's
underneath there, that'screating a filter so that when
you're hearing the voice of Godsource, whatever, is actually
through a program or a filterthat you have running, and it's
easy to clear it.
That's the biggest thing cankind of talk me about like a
quick background on like, whatit means you got you got what

(50:39):
these filters are programmedmeans your brain is a computer.
It's literally programmed justlike a computer. Most of your
programming happens between theages of zero and eight. So
literally what it means is thislittle cages or sponge, you
watch to see what happens.
Right? Okay, this is how theworld works. That's why a lot of
times people who grew up superpoor are like, Oh, everyone's
poor, or people who are rich,like no money comes from
everywhere. It's not becauseit's true. Either way. It's just

(51:01):
what you decide to take. So whenyou have a program that's coming
in, if you believe you have todo everything that God says, or
you're not worthy, which isfunny, everyone has that. Oh,
yeah, everyone has that one.
What happens is I'm lovable.
I'm unworthy. Yep. What are someof the other big core ones that
most people those are the twothat I see the most?
Yeah, it's like not worthy, notgood enough unlovable.

(51:24):
Basically, all the same thing asnot being enough. Yeah. And so
what happens is, your brain isneutral. It's not like your
brain is not mortal. Your brainis not trying to figure out
what's good, what's wrong. Itliterally takes whenever it's
programmed. It's literallysaying like, your phone has
feelings. And it's deciding No,you're pro your phone will
literally do whatever it'sprogrammed to do. And to see
someone just say like, Well, myphone sabotaging me, it's like,

(51:46):
no, your phone, changed theprogram, your brain is more
powerful than a computer. And sowhen these programs happen, one
of the things that does is likeif you feel like you're
unworthy, your mind willliterally go show you the
situations or go create thesituations to do that. To prove
that you're right to prove thatyou're right. So let's say you
believe that I'm gonna savemoney because this is an easy

(52:07):
one. Let's say you grew up yourdad invested his money, he lost
it. So you have this belief thatif you go invest money, you're
going to lose it. Well, yourbrain literally is looking for
those experiences to show it soyou're gonna feel massive pull
to something, your consciousmind, which is what you're aware
with subconscious means it'sbelow consciousness. You're not
aware of it, you'll fill thesepolls to go do something. And

(52:29):
then when it blows up, you'relike, What? What happened? But
your brain is like, look, wemade your true you're not crazy.
We did our job. We did our job.
And it's just because there's aprogramming that's why when you
understand how your brain works,this is the same thing in
relationships, right? Why do youfeel pulled to the you know?
Yeah, and you'll watch someonewho literally dates the same
person right different faceevery single time. Yeah, it's

(52:52):
because their unconscious mindoh my gosh, I love them so much.
It's like no, your brain sayinghey, that person is going to
show you're unlovable becausethat's what you believe. You're
welcome. I proved you right justproves you right. You
didn't know that you're carryingthis but your results are
showing your outer world isactually showing this and this
leads into you and your businesspartner Amanda have an upcoming

(53:14):
training because youguys T Yes, we do. You speak to
that? Because youand I have learned a shit ton
from both of you and youramazing teachers.
Well, thank you. Um, yeah, soI'm a master NLP practitioner.
NLP is neuro linguisticprogramming. The best way they
can describe it, it's brainreprogramming, going in and

(53:35):
programming your brain, the waythat a computer
and bring to light those thoseprograms. And that right there
is like, oh, my gosh, it yourworld shifts when you start
seeing all the things you'relike, I didn't even know that
wasthis. Yeah. So basically, this
is a, if this is something thatyou want to do for yourself, or
specifically, if you want to goin and help other people is
literally going in and figuringout how does your brain work?

(53:56):
How do the programs in yourbrain work? And how do you
reprogram them, so you canactually start having different
results. Most of the time 95% ofwhat's going on is subconscious,
which means you're not aware ofit. And most of your behaviors
are running off of thesubconscious programs that are
happening between the ages ofzero and eight. That's why when
people leave religion, andthey're like, I don't want to do

(54:18):
this anymore. Well, they wereprogrammed from a young age,
this is how the world works. Sothey take those same programs,
right? You just have to listento God. Okay, cool. Well, you
just have to listen to God hereand you're not in religion
anymore. And so now it's like,how what do I do now? And so
basically, we go in we teach youhow your brain works, how your
emotions work, why you feel theway that you feel, why you're
pulled to things, and moreimportantly, how to break it.

(54:41):
Yeah, because I think thebiggest thing fast that's what's
so cool. That's the thing that Ilove
and I wish I can like shout itfrom the rooftops as you guys in
this might make some of youangry at me to be angry when I
finally figured this out. Andactually one thing that my
clients tell me all the sametime healing is not hard, and
it's fast. And that does doesn'tmean that what you've gone

(55:01):
through isn't valid. And itdoesn't mean you're not going to
still feel things. But whenyou're ready to change, your
brain can changeinstantaneously. Because if your
brain is more powerful than acomputer, which there's go look
up the studies, it says that itis. How fast can you uninstall
an app on your phone? Superfast? And how easy is it? And
how easy is it? To know how todo it? Literally, it's dark.

(55:22):
Yeah, you just have to know howto do it when you're changing
beliefs, like not being worthynot being enough. I've seen that
time and time again, is withinfive minutes. Yeah, maybe eight
to 10. Yeah, you get it. And youcan change it because you're re
changing the way that your brainworks. Yeah. And so these
programs when you're coming in,it's like really being aware of
how are you wanting this newworld to go and are your natural

(55:44):
behaviors, and the way thatyou're showing up supporting it,
and if it's not, that's aprogram in your brain. So
programming your brain, and youhave to just switch it and
change it.
And I wouldn't say any, like anytraining that I've ever done
first and foremost has been forme, like that's the thing.
That's what I love aboutanything, any modality that I've
learned, any training that I'vethat I've done, yes, I use it in
my practice. But I first andforemost, it was for me, we

(56:06):
practice what we preach. So ifyou are listening, and you are
someone that's like, I don'tknow, I want to learn more. But
in order to go, man andMichelle's class is probably
like, that's a great step.
Because you you guys actuallygive it three different
certificates by the time they'redone. Yep. And energy healing in
NLP practitioner. And what's thethird?
Um, you get that energy, Haleyand coaching. Yeah. So it's

(56:27):
freaking brilliant. It'samazing. And you two are
phenomenal teachers. So thisfirst because it's a three part.
It's like not is it nine monthslong?
Um, is it bitmap? Six? Aboutsix?
Yeah. And the firstclass just because you get to
integrate and get to practice.
Most trainings are like that.
Yeah, they should be. But youthis this next upcoming I mean,
it's coming up here prettyquick.
Yeah, end of October. It's the25th to the 28th. Perfect.

(56:50):
So I will link your website downbelow because it's what is it?
So phrenic collected? What's theforward slash?
Easy? When did you get this? Socode.org? No, code.com? Yeah,
that was too long.
I will make sure to link it downbelow. But yeah, that just I
gotta like, plug that a littlebit. Because it's

(57:11):
great to talk about that. Imean, I get on talking about
spirit stuff, because it's likemy favorite.
No, and you're my good friends.
We need to talk about this.
Thank you. Thanks. Yeah. Thanksfor coming on.
No, this is really fun. Andhopefully, I mean, I really hope
that if you're in the middle ofit, you have no clue. If God
talks to you, if God is talkingto you any Filipina abusive
relationship,boundaries, surrounding more

(57:32):
questions, and then inspiredaction.
Yeah, yeah, you could haveboundaries with like, like us,
you are creating your life. Now.
This is you are now steppinginto the driver's seat. You are
co creating with spirit, but youget to have boundaries. Yeah,
you get to decide what this getsto look like. And it's okay.
You're not a bad person. Ifyou're saying no, I'm not going
to do that. Right. Why? BecauseI'm not willing to cheat on my

(57:52):
husband. I'm not willing to dothe shady thing, even though I
feel inspired to do this. Like,no, these are, these are my
values. This is my integrity.
And this is the boundary andit's okay to do that. Yeah.
I wholeheartedly agree. And Ithink that's something that the
reason why I want to talk aboutthis is because I don't it's not
talked aboutnow most people think you can't
have boundaries have gone likeAbsolutely. Oh, sure. It
actually makes your life reallyamazing. Yeah. And you actually

(58:14):
start to have like, you actuallyfeel like you're actually
driving your car. Instead oflike being this whirlwind of
like, spiritual craziness.
Follow? What's the sign like Godtake the wheel. And there's
truth in some of that sometimes,but for the most part, it's
like, no, you're driving still.
You're still driving.
And usually God take the wheel,it's stuff you should have your
hands on anyways. Usually, whenit's Jesus take the wheel, it's

(58:39):
like, you're like, Hey, I'mgonna let my mom go. I'm not
going to try to control myhusband. I'm not going to try to
control my kid. Right? Youshould never had your hand on
that. Well, anyway,right. So it's like good
awareness that you were doingthat now. Let's go let go. Yeah.
And I usually when I hear thosethings, which I love that it's
like, I just let Jesus handleI'm like, Oh, your child that
you can't control manipulate.
Yeah, you should have never beentrained.

(59:00):
That's a good place to let themgo. Yeah, well, thank you. Thank
you. Yes. I love you dearlylove. Yeah. Wasn't that a
fantastic conversation, Ireally, really enjoyed it. And
as Michelle was mentioning, theyhave a beautiful training coming
up, head over to their websitethus, so Co s o c.
o.org not.com. It's the CIOcode.org. To get more

(59:23):
information about what Michelledoes what Amanda and her both do
together and their upcomingtraining that really truly is
beautiful. They have both beenreally beautiful friends to me,
but also amazing teachers andthere have been things that I
have learned that have impactedmy life greatly, like life
changing things. So if you're inthat place and you're debating

(59:43):
about this head over theirwebsite, go check out the recent
their upcoming training that'scoming up I think it's like less
than two weeks now and get somemore information there. And if
you are looking for more toolsto assist you and winding out of
religion, you guys it is aprocess so be Be patient with
yourself, give yourself grace,understand that it's, you're
unwinding years and years ofprogramming years and years of

(01:00:05):
beliefs that you've had. Andit's natural and normal for it
to take some time some people goquicker than others and it
doesn't, your processes yourprocess. So if you're looking
for more ways to assist you headto Amazon, go pick up my latest
book leaving religion and thosewe leave behind. If you've
searched that in Amazon, I thinktoo if you just searched my name

(01:00:27):
Amanda Loveland, it also comesup, I will link it down below as
well. But the guide book that Iwrote really is a guidebook,
there are exercises that you doin the book that you actually
get to write in, you go throughdifferent somatic experiences,
that just with what I'm cueingyou into in the book, and it's
really powerful, it's, it'sactually quite a simple book,

(01:00:47):
but it's really impactful. Also,I have my guided meditations
that are kind of turned into acourse there's four different
modules that take you throughsomatic experiences to really
unwind the energetics of thebinding the covenants, the
things that you've made withinthat religion that may be
impeding your views, it may befiltering, how you are seeing

(01:01:11):
the world, how you'recommunicating with God, your
intuition, your higher self, allof those pieces. Oftentimes,
what I find with my clients isthere's a little bit of
resonance and a little bit ofenergetic blocking that needs to
be cleared. So I recorded thesemeditations so you could do them
on your own, they're powerful,they really are life changing, I

(01:01:31):
highly recommend them head to mywebsite, Amanda loveland.com
forward slash leaving religiontools. And last but not least,
if you are feeling called toshare tools that you have
learned that have been reallyimpactful in your life or even
just sharing your story out ofreligion from a place of non
judgment and non attackingplease reach out to me you can

(01:01:52):
go to my Instagram Amanda JoyLoveland. It's Amanda dot Joy
dot Loveland and message methere, or go to my website, hit
the podcast tab, and you'll seethat there's a form about
halfway down the page to applyto be on my podcast as I as you
already listened, I'm ramping itback up. I'm really excited to
have some amazing guests andwith love, if you feel are

(01:02:14):
feeling the call to be on thisepisode or on an episode, then
reach out. And as always knowthat you're not alone. This is
why I'm doing this podcast isjust to remind us all that we
are in this together. We aremore when we're united when
we're more heart centered andheart LED. Man Can we make a
difference and an impact in theworld? So know that you're not

(01:02:35):
alone. We're here I'm here. AndI hope today you are having a
beautiful day and you can seethe beauty and all things in
life. Sending you all so muchlove

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