S2E2: 49 Jobs in 36 Years: Overcoming Toxicity and Fear in the Workplace

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Nicola (00:00):
So I've actually so for today's chat I've actually got a
pregame.
I've done some research and Ihave prepared for us a pregame
chat.

Gina (00:12):
Okay.

Nicola (00:13):
Okay Are you ready?

Gina (00:14):
Did you chat CPG this?

Nicola (00:17):
No, I didn't.

Gina (00:18):
I'm actually shocked, because that's like your new
favorite thing.

Nicola (00:21):
Oh my God, it is my new favorite thing.
Honestly, it just does sucheasy things for me.

Gina (00:28):
Yeah, I mean I'm sure it does.

Nicola (00:30):
I was struggling.
Just you know, great advertshave said chat CPG wants to
sponsor us.
That would be nice, that wouldbe cool, that would be cool.
So I needed an Excelspreadsheet formula and I used
my smart thinking brain and itjust wasn't coming together.
And I asked oh, I'm terrible atExcel, like terrible at Excel.

(00:54):
And I was like I really likeI'm really struggling with this
formula.
So I asked chat CPG and it gaveme the formula exactly how I
wanted it, perfect.
And I was like I mean, it isuseful.
I was like, but it's so long,no wonder I didn't have it in my
brain anyway so today, today'spregame chat before we get on

(01:16):
our very last episode that wehave invented.
So we have no idea what we'regetting today.
Ooh.

Gina (01:22):
I know this is a little bit of like a dicey time for us.

Nicola (01:28):
We're on the edge, okay.
So toxic workplace behaviorsthat damage mental health.
There are a total of seven thatthis person has raised, and I'm
curious.
Yeah, I'm curious just to gothrough them and see how we feel
about them before we get Lindaon a little bit later.

(01:52):
So our seven toxic personalitytraits that damage mental health
.

Gina (01:59):
Yes, let's hear them.
I'm interested Also.
I side note based on the booksthat we I just got.
I think I'm going to read DrAmbers first because I like just
flipped through it and she itseems like really interesting
Love this already.

Nicola (02:16):
I'm so excited.

Gina (02:17):
I know.
Okay, all right.
What are the seven traits?

Nicola (02:20):
What are the seven traits of toxic workplace?
All right, I'm going to listall seven and then we can go
back and chat about any onesthat we think are critical to
talk about.
So we've got micro managementin in civility, blame, lack of
empathy, self entitlement, lackof support and unrealistic

(02:45):
expectations.

Gina (02:47):
Okay, so just off the top, what?
What are the ones that jump outat you?
Cause I wrote, I wrote down thethe three or four that
immediately spoke to me.

Nicola (02:58):
I feel like we're both on board with micro management.
And the description here wasmicro management reduces
autonomy and confidence and canlead to a culture of distrust In
civility.
Staff are ignored, underminedand belittled.
Blame there is a culture whereindividuals are blamed for
mistakes.
Lack of empathy.

(03:20):
Negative judgment is made whenpeople share or talk about
struggles.
Hmm, okay, self entitlement.
Staff are not treated equally.
Leaders find themselvessuperior to others.
Lack of support there is a lackof support and care for those
who need help and unrealisticexpectations.

(03:43):
Staff are expected to work longhours and available 24 seven,
okay.

Gina (03:47):
So which are your top three?

Nicola (03:51):
Micro management, I would say unrealistic
expectations and blame Okay.

Gina (04:00):
So my your micro management.
Lack of support?
Well, lack of support, slashself entitlement and unrealistic
expectations.

Nicola (04:11):
Ooh, Okay, I'm on board.
I'm on board.
I'm on board with your decision.
I'm on board with yours too.

Gina (04:17):
So talking about micro management I mean, we've talked
about that so much.
It really does remove allautonomy and it makes you feel
like like shit.
It makes you feel like shitbecause it's like why are you
checking on that every littlething I'm doing?

Nicola (04:31):
And then also, but it comes with that level of blame
or judgment If you're not doingwhat it is that you're supposed
to be doing.
Right, like you're, you'retrying to truck on and you've
prioritized things in a way thatmakes sense to you with the
experience that you have, andthen you have someone who has
less experience coming intomicro manage kind of Realistic

(04:54):
expectation.

Gina (04:54):
Right, and also like what a waste of time.
Oh, what a waste of time,because I would be like in the
middle of like, writing a, likea something to somebody that was
more important than thequestion this person's asking
and I have to stop and respondto them.
It's like it was a.
It was not my bag, baby, yourbag, baby, little Austin powers.

(05:16):
That ain't my bag, baby, okay.
So anyway, I, I, yeah, I will.
I feel like micro management islike Number one offender and
then everything kind of tricklesdown from there.

Nicola (05:31):
I agree, because I think once you have a micro manager,
you've got this like blameculture as well, and I think
blame is the worst, like I, youknow I said to, so you know what
the blame culture is so easy tofall into.
Just this week I had a reallygood example in the workplace

(05:51):
where I and it wasn't a toxic,but just to be clear, I was
bitching about a reportingstructure.
That was really I was bitchingabout a reporting structure that
wasn't giving me information.
Like I wasn't gettinginformation from the report I
was receiving, so I couldn'ttell a confidence story about
what I, what I was reading, andI was like I don't understand

(06:13):
why this reporting is not givingme the details I need.
I need to be able to say X, yand Z.
And then the person asked methey're like oh, is this because
so and so didn't do the reportscorrectly?
I said this has got nothing todo with a person.
Like, just take that straightoff the table right now.
This is to do with data andinformation that we're getting
in and if the data that's like.

Gina (06:34):
If it's like a science based report, it's there.
Where's the blame?
You're just running numbers.
Yeah, you just want numbers.

Nicola (06:41):
And I'm like it's got nothing to do with a person at
all, Like I don't, I'm not aperson, like we can't blame
people for this.
This is just us not collectingthe right information and we're
not running the right reportwhich you could.

Gina (06:54):
If that's the case, you just go back and rerun it with
the right queries.

Nicola (06:58):
Yeah, Exactly so.
I was like we just have topunch out what the right
information is to tell the rightstory.
But how, like I noticed rightin that moment, I was like isn't
it interesting how that blameculture, just instantaneously we
go to blame someone for aproblem.

Gina (07:15):
I think it's part of just like that fear that I think we
as humans have and it's like wehave to kind of do a little
extra work to kind of be like no, I'm not going to be scared to
tell the truth.
I know Like so many times atwhere you and I met I would be
like, nope, that was wrong, Iwas wrong, you were right.
Like I don't mind fessing up tomy mistakes, I have no problems

(07:37):
with that.
I've always been good at likepersonal self-assessment and
situational humility.
If I'm wrong, I don't mind.

Nicola (07:44):
Yeah, always, I will heavily take it yeah.

Gina (07:47):
But when I'm right and being told to do it the wrong
way or, you know, whatever itmay be, that bothers me.

Nicola (07:56):
What's the worst mistake you've ever made that you had
to own up for?
Like work wise, not personalize.
What's the worst work wiseyou've ever made?
Well, other than the one theother day.

Gina (08:08):
Which one?
Oh yeah, no, that was.
I made a Nikolas referring toan accounting thing.
I accidentally forgot to recordsomething, but in the end it's
going to be fine.
I have to say that it's theworst thing you've ever done.
And I think that's the worstthing I've ever done.
I think it's the worst thingthat everyone who had affected
and they understood, I mean, youknow anyway, I think the worst

(08:33):
thing I've ever done was I thinkyou know this story it's.
I said something to a colleague.
I was like this client isfucking annoying.
There was a lot of things goingon Like why would they go all
the way to the bottom of thethread, like I never go to the
bottom of the thread.

Nicola (08:51):
of any email, I go to the bottom of the thread.

Gina (08:54):
Oh, my God, okay.
So somehow they got to thebottom of the thread and they
noticed that somebody because itwas like from a Gmail account
said they're fucking annoying.
I think that was probably theworst thing I ever did.

Nicola (09:11):
I mean I tell you my worst, yes, please, no, okay, so
I'm going to give you like thehigh level summary version
because it has a bit of context.
I don't know if you've everdealt with mercury contamination
, like mercury issues.
So mercury evaporates at roomtemperature and in New Zealand
there was an accident wheresomeone dropped a thermometer on
the ground and it burst themercury, but it was one

(09:35):
milliliter of mercury and theyevacuated the school because it
is toxic.
And the minute it becomes, theminute it evaporates, it's toxic
.
So about a day later I getcalled in hi, nicola, we've just
found a container.
We're not sure what's in it.
Can you come check it out?
Can you come have a look?
And because I'm a hazardousgoods handler, I was like, okay,

(09:58):
yeah, cool, cool, cool.
I get there and it's twokilograms, so like four pounds
of mercury, just in a plasticcontainer, like in an ice cream
tub.

Gina (10:10):
Was this at a thermometer manufacturing plant?
Why?

Nicola (10:15):
did they have this?
It was a school like it was auniversity.

Gina (10:19):
So maybe for like experiments and stuff.

Nicola (10:22):
The mercury should not leave.
So what had happened?
We did a bit of deep diving andwhat had happened was the
previous incumbents in my rolehad they had been an incident
where they dropped likeindustrial grade thermometers
that have quite big bulbs.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And he just scooped it up withhis hands and put it in their

(10:47):
hands, bare hands, and put it inthis ice cream container.
But why so many questions Idon't have answers to, anyway.
So now I'm in the situation andI'm like, okay, well, we need
to call you know hazmat, and weneed to.
Yeah, cool, because weevacuated and tie a school with
one milliliter one little tinybit.

(11:08):
Yeah, like a drop, and now I'vegot four pounds of it and
there's like a evaporationwatermark as well and I was like
how much of this has evaporate,like how long has this been
here?
And I'd say that was my biggestmistake, is I?
I essentially did everything Icould to keep it out of the
press and kind of sweep it underthe rug.

Gina (11:31):
So what would you have done differently?

Nicola (11:33):
Oh, I for sure would have not.
I would have evacuated thatentire school if I could have.

Gina (11:39):
And would you have been honest about it in the press?
Yeah, yeah, I mean, what Ilearned is never put anything in
writing that you don't want tobe published, like like, if you
don't want another front page ofthe New York Times, don't write
it.
That's what I learned and thisis true.
Like I can, like on off timehours I can complain about a

(12:04):
client or something like thisclient was was probably being
like very nitpicky aboutsomething very simple, but I say
it in an email never write itdown in black and white.
You can say it, you know, but,and it's probably better to just
be grateful that you haveclients, you know one of those

(12:26):
is batteries.
Hello.

Lynda (12:27):
Hi, oh, my goodness.

Nicola (12:31):
Hello Linda, how are you ?

Lynda (12:34):
Hello, I'm doing great.
How are you ladies doing?

Nicola (12:38):
Yeah, we're going, we're getting going.

Lynda (12:42):
Let's go Gosh.
I started this zoom.
It just was not, it was notloading, and I was like that
happens sometimes.

Gina (12:48):
It's annoying.
Yeah, where are you calling usfrom?

Lynda (12:52):
San Diego California.

Gina (12:56):
So, Linda, how did you find us?
What do you plan to talk to usabout?
Give us a little bit of alowdown.

Lynda (13:06):
You know, I don't remember how I found you.
I have, you know, somebody onmy team that's out there finding
, you know, opportunities for me.
So it was probably through them, because I do reach out and
they do reach out and stuff.
Okay, one of my favorite topicsto talk about is breaking
through fear.
I broke through a fear everysingle day for a year in 2015

(13:26):
and I was 51 years old.
So that's a really great topic,because we all have fear.
We all have fear.
I had 49 jobs in 36 years, soI've got lots of stories.
I got stories for days abouttoxic.

Gina (13:41):
Oh my God, Linda, that just made me laugh so hard.

Lynda (13:46):
It's true, that's the worst part, is true.

Nicola (13:49):
Turning.
I'm curious to know right offthe bat, though, turning through
so many roles, were you thetoxic person?

Lynda (13:57):
I know and that was the question I started as, actually,
as I was filling out your form,because it reminded me
specifically one story of agentleman that was extremely
toxic.
And then, as I was writing thestory about him, I was asking
myself that same question like49 jobs Was I the toxic person?
It's possible I was.
I was a very negative personfor decades.

(14:19):
I grew up in abuse.
Like we'll get into all that.

Nicola (14:21):
Okay.

Gina (14:23):
So I mean, I love that you you're willing to own that,
because I know, like we talkabout it all the time on the
podcast, that we're someone'stoxic person somewhere.
You know in someone's storywe're the toxic person.

Lynda (14:39):
Oh for sure.
Yeah, I was probably toxic tothe gentleman that I will be
sharing about.

Gina (14:46):
Oh, okay.
So do you want to get into thatstory or do you want to play
with something else?

Lynda (14:54):
Oh yeah, let's prelude it with that, because it's a toxic
story, you know, it's a reallygreat place to start.

Gina (15:00):
What industry were you in?
What role did you have at thisposition?
You don't have to name theactual company if you don't want
to, or you can if you want to.
Whatever you want to do, yeah.

Lynda (15:10):
I don't remember the name of it.
You know, with 49 jobs is hardto remember what the names of
all the jobs are, but it was.
It was in the legal field.
I was a legal secretary forthat little over 20 years and I
had worked at several differentlaw jobs and this particular
firm.
There was just this one guy whowas very toxic to everybody,

(15:32):
and in particular his secretary.
And I remember one day and Ijust stayed away from him
because he actually terrified meas what it was.
I just didn't want to beanywhere near him.
Anytime he talked I just wentinto like hives, you know it was
.
I was a nervous wreck aroundhim.
But one day I was talking to asecretary because I was training

(15:53):
her on something I was like thetrainer of.
You know all the systems andeverything and I was training
her and he walked over and hedidn't see me because I was
leaned down and I was.
I was leaned down, I waslooking up at her computer and
so he didn't see me that I wasbehind the computer screen.
And he came and he said I don'tremember what he said to her,
but I remember that it was soextremely condescending.

(16:14):
I stood up for me Because shetold me he was coming.
So I even duck, you duck evendeeper down because I didn't
want him to see me, you know.
And so I stood up and I saiddon't you ever talk to her that
I was so mad, just live it thathe had the guts to talk to her
that way.
And he looked at me and he saiddon't you tell me how to treat

(16:36):
my secretary like that.
She was a secretary, yeah.

Gina (16:41):
And so.

Lynda (16:42):
I was condescending.
Ew, he was awful, awful.
So I I turn around and I walkedaway and he goes where are you
going?
Yelling at me in the office andyou know, usually you don't
have this kind of behavior in alaw firm.
So he's yelling at me where areyou going?
I said I'm going to go tell themanager what just happened.
She's not even here, she's onvacation.

(17:03):
He said, and I go no, thereplacement is here and I'm
going to go talk to her.
So it was.
It was scary for me to do that,but I'm so glad I did.
I stood up for her night.
Here was the thing that wasreally fascinating to me.
Later, as I started talking tothe secretary about it, she goes
I didn't even know he wascondescending and I think that

(17:23):
sometimes in life we're treatedso poorly on a regular basis
that we don't even know it'shappening.
And that was what I kind of gotout of that.
That whole story I'll sharewith you.
What happened is my HR personended up calling our corporate
office, which was in a differentstate.
They flew out to San Diego inorder to meet with him and every

(17:46):
single employee got all of ourstories and they literally got
him squared away.
They told him get squared awayin a month or you're out.

Nicola (17:53):
And he had worked there for 16 years If you got squared
away If this wasn't anemployment facility.
I feel like the irony twisthere would be ridiculous.

Lynda (18:02):
It wasn't.

Gina (18:03):
Okay, it wasn't Okay.

Nicola (18:04):
I was like I'm on board because the irony I would love
that.

Gina (18:08):
I would live for that irony.
Yeah, okay, but yeah, so did heshape up or ship out what
happened to him?

Lynda (18:14):
He's shaped up.
He's shaped up, and so it wasjust from calling him out.
I didn't think he would.
I really didn't think he would,but he did.
He shaped up and we ended uphaving conversations with each
other and he played saxophone, Iplayed flute, and so during the
Christmas, like our Christmasparty, we all did some music and
he and I actually stood next toeach other.
So the whole environment, forme at least, shifted just

(18:38):
because I stood up for somebody.
I was scared, but I did it.
You know, mm, hmm.

Gina (18:43):
So did he treat you like?
Do you think he had aresentment towards you or did?
Or, if he did, he hit it well.

Lynda (18:52):
If he did, he hit it really well.

Gina (18:53):
Yeah.

Lynda (18:53):
Yeah, he actually thanked me for calling him out.

Gina (18:56):
So why do you think he was like that?
Like do you think there wassomething going on personally
with him, or he was frustratedwith something at the job, like
usually it's a reason that youdon't know, because it's not
really personal, right?
It's like usually they'rereacting to something.
These toxic people are reactingto something within themselves
or that's happening to them.

(19:17):
So what do you think it was?

Lynda (19:21):
Well, I can only state that what I know is hearsay,
because it didn't come from himand I don't know the facts about
it.
I was told, though, that he wason some kind of medication for
personality.
What do you call?

Gina (19:37):
it.

Lynda (19:38):
Personality and he hadn't been taking his medication.
That's what I was told.
I don't know if it's a truth ornot, or somebody was just
spreading rumors, but I was like, oh, that makes a lot of sense.
I mean, I feel like whereverthere's smoke, there's fire.

Gina (19:50):
So maybe you didn't get the correct story, but you got
like the gist of it, like maybehe was on medication for
whatever depression anxiety.
Stop taking it, I mean.
I'm much more irritable whenI'm feeling anxious and
depressed, so I mean yeah.
I mean, well, I'm glad that, ifthat was true, I'm glad he got
back on the medication, becausesometimes people need medication

(20:13):
to function properly in society.
So yeah, and I'm one of thosepeople.

Lynda (20:18):
Yeah you know, what people are like.
Please get back on yourmedication.

Gina (20:22):
Yeah, I just become like non-functioning.
I don't eat, I just like wasteaway in bed.
Um super fun time.

Nicola (20:34):
Yeah, okay.
What is the next?
What is the next toxicworkplace?
You have up your sleeve, linda.
What is it?

Lynda (20:42):
It was job number 18.
I just Do you remember thisLike they probably blend
together.
I do remember I'm able toCompartmentalize them.
You know each of them, but Idon't know in in the exact order
that they.
One year I had eight W2s, youknow.

(21:02):
So I had eight jobs in one yearand so that was like an easier
to kind of like take me over thedouble digits.

Gina (21:08):
You know, but um yeah, I just like a shitty year for
employment, or what year was it?
Was it a recession?
Was there any?

Lynda (21:16):
No, no, I just Um, I easily got bored.
You know, I just had these verysimple, mundane jobs when I was
, you know, kind of like at thebeginning of my, my work life, a
lot of, you know, just simple,mundane jobs, and I got easily
bored, not realizing that I, Iwas actually a creative person.
I didn't know this about myselfbecause, you know, I grew up in
a very volatile, abusive,alcoholic household.

(21:39):
My dad was a narcissist, agaslighter, and I learned those
behaviors from him, you know.
So I became a little bit likehim.
He was like a little bit ofthat kind of stuff.
So we're talking about toxicityearlier.
We're talking about were youthe toxicity?
in the environment to have 49jobs, and I probably was in some
way.
You know I did.
I did do a lot of things thatnow I look back and like, wow, I

(22:01):
can't believe I was like that,because I'm nothing like that
today, you know, like abackstabber talking behind
people's backs and the gossip Iwas, you know, one of those that
was gossiping and doing allthat stuff.
So that is possible that all ofthat stuff just made me Not
want to be around where I wasbecause I left every job.
I was only laid off one time.

(22:22):
Other than that, every job wasmy choice to leave.
I was never fired.

Gina (22:26):
So, yeah.

Lynda (22:29):
So I don't know, Maybe I was, maybe I wasn't.

Gina (22:31):
But I would say I would say, just by maybe taking a job
that you knew you weren'ttotally into, that could lead to
its own brand of toxicity,because it's like you'll get
bored, you'll start yeah, you'llstart gossiping, you know.
So it's like that.
You know everyone has a part toplay in every situation that
they're in.
So I Ask everyone who comes onour podcast like what do you

(22:56):
think your part was in thatdynamic?
You know, so I think for you itsounds like you were just
knowingly taking jobs, probablybecause you needed to support
yourself, that you weren't like,you knew in the back of your
mind You're only gonna be therefor like two months or something
.
You know you were like I'lltake it now and see, see if I
can get something better orsomewhere else, or something

(23:17):
like it's Right now.
Yeah, it's okay for right now.

Lynda (23:22):
We I always was back in those days we had something
called a newspaper.
You know when you actually likehave this paper and it got all.

Nicola (23:29):
Do you think we are?

Lynda (23:31):
now all.
Do you think we are Speakingfor the audience?
You know, I don't know, maybethere's a 10 year old this thing
right now, who knows?

Nicola (23:40):
10 year old is listening .
I'm fucking concerned.
Toxic workplace that they'vebeen in, oh my god, yeah, child
labor and he's like I need toget out of my toxic workplace.

Gina (23:54):
No, nicholas, that's, that's highly illegal.
It's like anything.
Yeah, how do it would be likeyour son or my daughter being
like mom creates a toxicworkplace in the house.

Nicola (24:09):
I'm confident my child would say that, considering I
make him do so many chores.

Gina (24:15):
I mean single moms.
We have a different plate,right, okay, so.

Lynda (24:20):
Yeah, I don't remember um .

Gina (24:25):
But it was.
You know the papers, newspapersand newspapers classifies,
right, that's where you're going.
I got some of my first jobs viathe newspaper classified ads,
please.

Lynda (24:36):
A lot of my jobs, a lot of my jobs to that.
Well, you know, what I did is,every single week we got those
classifies, you know, in thepaper, and every single week I
would go through them and lookthrough, go help wanted.
So I was always searching foranother job.
It was even when I got a job Iwas still searching, and it
wasn't that like this was myplan to keep getting new jobs,

(24:57):
right, just, I would see a joband I like who that sounds
interesting, go apply, and Iwould get, I would get hired and
I would go, you know, and Ijust and was interesting about
it.
For me, though, is all thedifferent jobs I've had is, you
know, each job has led to thenext, to the next, really, and
then the things I've learned,because I have had so many jobs,
I've worked with so manydifferent personalities,

(25:19):
thousands and thousands ofdifferent personalities, and I
was always the trainer, like I,was always the one training all
the employees, like I, you know,doing the computer training,
because I was really good atthat and I probably learned a
good.
You know, 80 to 100 differentprograms, you know just that,
were specific to differentcompanies, just by having all
those jobs, and so I trained onall those, those programs, and

(25:42):
so the amount of knowledge thatI gained and the things that I
learned, you know, by having allthose jobs, was actually a
blessing, because all of thatstuff led me to what I'm doing
today, which is book publishing,and I use all of those skills
that I've learned how tocommunicate with people, how to
train people, you know how toorganize people.
Being a secretary, I had someof the companies our law firm

(26:06):
was with working for was likeMicrosoft, you know, qualcomm,
like these huge, hugecorporations, and I was
organizing, you know, teams of30 lawyers.
So so all of that stuff that Ilearned, I've pulled it all into
my business, which is reallycool because it makes me a much,
much better business owner.

Nicola (26:26):
That makes sense.
It makes sense because I thinkyou know those are soft skills,
those are transfer, transferable, transfer, it's transferable,
transferable soft skills.
Right, you've got those skillsthat you have that you can do
and everybody can do, like wecan all do, computers pretty
much.
But then there's those softskills around training and
developing people and you know,using those to be able to, you

(26:49):
know, transfer them over to thework that you're doing now I
think is a skill in itself.

Lynda (26:56):
Yeah, it's been.
It's been amazing, you know,okay, so.

Gina (27:02):
What, yeah?
So what was your, your nextmost toxic Workplace experience?
I?

Lynda (27:10):
was.
I remember this job like I wasonly there for about three days
because, well, see that when Iwas interviewed I was promised
it was right around Thanksgivingtime here in the US and I was
promised that even though I wasstarting the week of
Thanksgiving and things news.
So I started on Monday.
Thanksgiving was Thursday andFriday.
I was promised that I would getthose days off with pay, but

(27:33):
when I got my paycheck, whichwas the following Monday, they
paid us.
Those days weren't in that pay.
So I went to the manager.
I said, hey, when we, when youinterviewed me, you said I would
be getting paid for these Days.
And he goes.
I never said that and it was inwriting, like I had it in
writing and he so he, just ballof place lied to me and I, like

(27:53):
I do not work with liars, sowhat I did that day is I I work
the morning and then atlunchtime, and my friend got me
the job, by the way, and I wasworking with her and I just said
, just so you know, I'm notcoming back from lunch, okay.
And then I said to the managerI said, hey, I'll see you after
lunch and like I just like, Ijust lied to him like I knew I

(28:14):
wasn't coming back, but I justwalked out of there and I I went
straight to an employmentagency and got a job the next
day.

Gina (28:23):
Like where jobs were aplenty and like yeah.
I was just recently, likeTrying to get consulting work
like almost a year ago now, justto kind of during like the
after COVID slump, like it hitmy company really hard.
So my I wasn't making as muchmoney as I once had, and it took
me like six months to find aconsulting gig, like it was

(28:45):
awful and I interviewed so manygreat companies and I don't know
, I don't know what.
What happened?

Nicola (28:52):
I guess I know, and then you ended up in our toxic
company.
Please, babe, it was terrible,it was terrible.

Gina (28:59):
I was like I'd rather have less pay and not like I'd
rather be just scraping alongright now than deal with
Whatever this is.
But okay, you said you don'twork with liars, but then you
lied to the boss what?
What are your feelings on thatnow?

Lynda (29:15):
Yeah, at the time I didn't even realize what I was
saying.
So you know, it's a again, youknow I, having grown up in that
environment, I grew up in like Iwas.
I was a liar, I was toxic,myself, very toxic.
I was very judgmental, callpeople names all the time, call
them out, and and I would gotattle-tattle on people you know

(29:36):
.
And so I did all that stuff andand so sometimes, you know, we
don't see who we are.
You know, because we're toobusy looking at others.
And that's what I was doing.
I was looking at the otherpeople, not looking at myself.
I didn't really start to lookat myself until I was age 51.

Gina (29:52):
So I spent a lot of years, that was a 2015.
Okay, so it's pretty safe tosay, linda, and you can hate me
for this it sounds like you werethe toxic one.

Lynda (30:04):
Possibly I was a toxic person.
For sure I Would say that.

Gina (30:10):
And you know it's like everywhere you go.
There you are.
So if you're toxic, if you knowyou're toxic and you're going
to work, I would say there's a99.9% chance that you're being
toxic without even meaning to.
It's not like you werea.
Malicious.
That's just the headspace youwere in.
I mean, I get it, you know.

Nicola (30:29):
Yeah, I get that too.
Like you know you're notfeeling your best self and
you're not feeling your you know, you know that there's these
traits that you've brought fromlike a generational trauma, and
now you're bringing those withyou into the workplaces that
you're going into.

Lynda (30:45):
Yeah, yeah, I didn't even know I was doing it right,
because I didn't, because Inever looked inward, I Always.
So what made you look inward?
Well, when I was driving to my49th job Working for a judge,
working for a judge in the courtof appeals, I had worked my way
up the ladder in the legalfield, you know, to work for the
, the number two judge in theentire, the entire circuit here.

(31:08):
And as I was driving to workthat job I was probably about
there for about eight months orso I realized how bored I was.
Again, like it happened, I gotmyself into this job where I was
just like I can do it with myhands, you know, behind my back.
I mean, it was so easy and thatjob was that job.
I wouldn't say it was liketoxic, toxic, but it was toxic

(31:29):
for me.
You know the the environment ofYou're not allowed to talk to
any.
I was not allowed to talk toanybody unless it was
specifically only related to acase.
That was the judge's rules,like, and so you had to follow
the judge's rules and and so forme that was like putting me in
a cage, because I'm a verysocial person, I love to talk to
people.
So I was driving to work oneday and I was just like I don't.

(31:52):
I don't, like I hate this job.
I don't understand.
Like why am I doing this?
Why am I doing this to myselfand just asking what's my
purpose?
Why am I here?
I'm so worthless.
I have no value.
There is no reason for me to behere.
All I do is push papers aroundfor a judge.
That's all I do.
And I'm like, as a matter offact, why is this whole planet
here?
I don't understand.

(32:13):
I was just really angry aboutlife.
Like why is this whole stuffhere?
Why are we even doing this?
You know, and when I got to workthat day, there was a Facebook
post from a woman who said I'm alife coach.
I took some time off.
I'm getting it back into it.
I'm looking for five women whowant to change their lives.
And I saw that and I was like Iwant to change my life.

(32:35):
I didn't know what a life coachwas, but I want to change my
life.
And so I ended up reaching outto her and I ended up hiring her
and that was the start.
That was the first time in mylife that I ever really looked
at myself by having help.
You know, having somebody helpme.
I never asked for help prior tothat, so that was really the
door opener to everything.

(32:55):
Everything that I'm doing rightnow is as a result of me
working with her.

Gina (33:01):
Wow, okay.
So what did she offer you Like?
What kind of tools did sheoffer you to look inwards and
then, like you know, coursechange or come correct in terms
of your toxic thoughts andpotential behaviors?

Lynda (33:19):
So many, but the ones that really stand out the most
were.
You know, I didn't really knowwho I was.
I was a people pleaser, youknow.
I ran away when I was fiveyears old.
Yeah, I ran away when I wasfive years old and I was gone
for a week Because I was runningout of that, running away from
that toxic home, right, and then, when I came back, I became

(33:42):
riddled with fears and I becamea people pleaser and I lived my
life that way, as a peoplepleaser.
And so when I started workingwith my life coach, one of the
tools that she gave me was tolook at myself and discover what
is it that I absolutely lovedoing, what is it that I
absolutely hate doing and whatis it that I like doing because

(34:02):
I spent my life.
If you loved it, I loved it.
If you hated it, I hated it.
I just followed the crowd Veryindependent.

Nicola (34:08):
Yeah, oh extremely.
So once you've had like anarcissistic parent, as you said
you have, one of those traumasis a hyper independence.
You don't ask help from anyone,which you've already stated.
The other one is that you knowyou're so cautious about what
they like and what they need.

(34:29):
You then transfer that into allyour relationships going
forward as well.
Those narcissistic parents man,they fucked you up.

Gina (34:36):
Going back to Linda, you get these tools from your life
coach.
You start to figure out whatyou like, what you don't like,
or and what you love, and wheredoes that lead you?

Lynda (34:48):
Yeah, what that led me to was to actually really to dive
deep down inside and and askmyself am I doing this because
they want me to, or am I doingthis because I want to?
Am I saying yes because I wantthem to like me, or am I saying
yes because I actually want todo it?
Do I really want to say no here?
But I'm saying yes, you know.
So it really started me.

Gina (35:08):
Yeah, that's big just asking questions.

Lynda (35:11):
That's all.
That's really what it did is,as started me asking different
questions, which I never didabout yourself like to yourself.

Gina (35:18):
Yeah, when I learned that no is a complete sentence, it
changed my life.
Like I don't have to explainwhy I'm not coming, I can't make
it.
The answers no, like that's it.
You know, you don't owe anyonean explanation and I was
codependent for a period of mylife because I had this sister
who, whatever her mood was, Ihad to balance it out.

(35:40):
She was acting up, I had to belike the peacekeeper or whatever
.
So I get that, but I don'tthink I people please that all.
Now.
I think I've swung completelyto the opposite direction.
Yeah, which is probably atrauma response, but I'd much
rather be the opposite directionthan be codependent, because
the amount of emotional, likeupheaval on like a five minute

(36:05):
circle, like you know, think itjust happens.
It's just you exhausted andyou're just like you don't know
what's going on.
So you're just saying yes toeverything or whatever, like I
deeply identify with that.
So did you start saying no to alot of things?

Lynda (36:23):
I started saying no to a lot of things but also saying
you know what I'm going to thinkabout that?
First, instead of beingreactionary and because I used
to be very reactionary and justsay yes, and then what would
happen is the meantime I'm backhere like overloading myself and
I'm just so stressed out andand I'm just like I can't
fulfill, you know, for anybody,and then I'm stressed because I
can't please it.

(36:44):
So I was like like this is thespiral.

Gina (36:55):
It's never ending circle, it just it's very cyclical
you're just like in it and it'shard to get off.
It's like a merry go round.
So what else?

Lynda (36:59):
theory at all, it's just a go around.
Let me show you one of thetechniques that I learned, which
I thought was awesome.
It wasn't for my life coachsomeone else, though, because I
have a lot of mentors andcoaches in my life now, because
I do ask for help a lot now andone of the techniques I learned
was that, when somebody askedyou to do something, instead is
say you know what, that doesn'treally fit for me right now, but
let me, I will let you know ifI run across somebody that can

(37:21):
help you or I will.
I will look for you to see if,like, maybe I have somebody in
my toolkit that can help you,but I don't always have to be
the one that does it.
Maybe sometimes I'm just goingto do it to direct them right.
The collaborator.

Gina (37:35):
I mean, I think that's valid because it's like, just
like you're trying to createboundaries, those people you
know they'll mirror you, like,on a certain level, if you're
creating a boundary, hopefullythey will mirror that back.
I mean, I think you get intothe whole toxic boss thing when
they don't understand boundariesor they don't have them, you

(38:01):
know.
But once you start having hardlines and boundaries Usually a
course correct others around youwho are not, you know,
suffering from some kind ofdiluted mentality or whatever,
thinking that they're the bestat whatever they do, you know.

Lynda (38:19):
So do you?

Gina (38:19):
find that that happened.

Lynda (38:22):
Yeah, definitely setting my own boundaries.
It's been interesting becausemy daughter she's almost 40.
I'm going to be 60 in a coupleof weeks.
She's almost 40.
We had this headbuttingrelationship for almost all of
our years, until about fouryears ago three or four years
ago it's after I started mypersonal development she was

(38:46):
seeing me do this, make theseshifts and stuff.
At the beginning, she didn'tlike it, because I was becoming
new, yeah, and I wasn't, as Ididn't say yes all the time.
That's people who you say yesto all the time don't like it
when you say no.
Of course, they have to becomekind of accustomed to it.
Recently, though, I saw herdoing a Facebook Live, and it

(39:09):
was really cool because she wasusing some of the language that
I've learned on this journey ofgoing inward and all these kinds
of things, and I'm like, oh, mylittle girl, she's growing up,
it's so awesome.
I'm not helping her, because ifI do, she'll run the other way.
So I'm emulating something andshe's catching some of it, which
is just really awesome.

Gina (39:31):
It's like promotion by attraction, like she sees the
change in you so then she'sgoing, probably not even
realizing it.
It's rubbing off on her.
My relationship changedsignificantly with my own mom
after my dad passed away,because it was a very
traditional marriage and his saywas final and now that she has

(39:57):
more autonomy she's willing tolike I'm a single mom.
She helps me with certainthings, like monetarily,
especially during COVID when mycompany was hit really hard.
She's helped me and ourrelationship has changed because
my mom never had the chance tohelp me in the past.

(40:18):
They one time told me to go toCatholic charity.
My dad told me go to thecharities if you need financial
help and I was like thanks, dad.
Meanwhile, yeah, it was likeyou bring us into this world.
We didn't ask to be broughthere and then you're just
hanging us out to dry Likethanks, but yeah, so I think the

(40:38):
change within us attractspeople.
Yeah, you know, it's like I seethe change in my mom.
I'm much more willing to haveopen and honest conversations
with her and it sounds likesimilar to your daughter.

Lynda (40:53):
Yeah, yeah, you just reminded me of something.
When I know we're allowed tocuss here because you did Nicola
earlier, you're like I did.

Gina (41:06):
I told Nicola on the podcast not that long ago to go
fuck herself.
So, yeah, you can curse.
I was like Nicola, you're wrong, go fuck yourself.
And I was like okay.
She was like okay, got you,fine, fine.

Lynda (41:20):
I'm out, I'm out.

Gina (41:22):
Well, she was like you're right, she went along with it
Anyway so yes, please curse.

Lynda (41:31):
When my dad was on his deathbed he had had 86 heart
attacks from his pacemaker.
His pacemaker kicked in everysingle time, 86 times.
So my dad and my mom walkedinto the hospital on Thursday
and then Friday morning my dadpassed away after 86 heart
attacks.
Well, when the family showed upas kids you know, the siblings

(41:52):
all showed up I was like 86heart attacks, like mom, you got
to tell them to, just like,disconnect his pacemaker.
Tell them to.
She was so controlled by my dadthat she couldn't make that
decision Because every decisionshe made in their 55 years was
the wrong decision.
And so she couldn't make thatdecision.
And so I was the one I went andI told the doctor.

(42:15):
I said go ahead and turn offhis pacemaker.
He took that last breath andI'm standing right next to my
mom and she says, thank God, thebastard is dead.
Oh wrong, that's when my dadtook his last breath.
55 years of living in the hell.
Yeah, like such incrediblefreedoms yeah.
So he was on a pacemaker likethat.

(42:36):
Yeah, for about a year and ahalf the last year and a half of
his life he was on a pacemaker.
Yeah, Okay, 86 heart attacks.
Can you imagine, like, oh mygosh, how much longer were we
going to let him go?
I mean, even though you know, Ididn't like my dad and he was a
bastard, I just I didn't wantthat.

Nicola (42:54):
You know, I don't want that for anything, fun fact
about pacemakers and heartattacks is they actually
decrease your short-term memory.
So you have zero short-termmemory when you have a pacemaker
and a heart attack.
Oh really, was he like losingit, or was he?

Gina (43:05):
just was it just the heart ?
He was not losing it mentally,just the heart.

Lynda (43:10):
Well, he didn't really have a heart to begin with, but
Like, anatomically it was justhis heart.

Gina (43:15):
Yeah, it was just his heart, yeah.

Lynda (43:17):
It was a lump of coal with a pacemaker.

Nicola (43:20):
Oh my gosh.

Gina (43:23):
So did your relationship with your mom change after your
dad passed away?

Lynda (43:29):
It did a little bit, but not a whole lot, because I
started and that was before Iwent through this personal
development stuff, and that wasI was like, wow, how could you
put up with that for so long?
I didn't know, I knew shedidn't like him but I didn't
know she felt that strongly tohim because she my mom never
said anything bad about people.
She just held it all in, youknow, and, and so I just started

(43:50):
looking at it.
It's like why did you stay withhim that long?
You were so weak, you know, andI really blamed him for that.
And I really blamed my mom somuch for staying with him,
because many times she wouldpack up us kids to run away, but
then we would go right backhome.
I remember when I was I waslike eight years old and we had
all of us packed in the panelstation wagon.

Gina (44:12):
Oh yeah, we had one of those too.

Nicola (44:15):
Go to the.
Go to the bank, Pull out allthe money.
No seat belts.

Lynda (44:19):
Yeah, we call the back of the way back the way back seat
right.
And we went to the bank to takeout all the money and when my
mom came out of the bank, my dadwas there and she hopped in the
car and we drove back home, youknow.
So there were so many of thosetypes of things that happened
that I just I had so muchresentment for her while she was
still alive.
She only lived another threeyears after he passed away.

(44:41):
Okay, she got cancer.
She got cancer.
Like right as he was hearingthe end of his life, she got
cancer.

Gina (44:47):
Yeah, I mean living with all of that toxicity.
I think it can?

Lynda (44:51):
He was cancer.

Gina (44:54):
It can become physical.
I mean, we're not psychologistsor doctors, but I had, like
what we've been talking to otherpeople who have had burnout
from toxic workplaces and itdoes become physical.
It's like you can't concentrate, you're, you can't do anything
in a normal period of timebecause you're like your mind is
just going.
So I mean, I get it, yeah.

(45:14):
So so what other things did youdo in your, your that year that
you kind of looked in words andfigured out who you were and
what you wanted?

Lynda (45:26):
Yeah, that after working with my life coach.
I worked with her for fivemonths and then after that I had
gotten addicted to somethingdifferent, and that was called
positivity.
You know, I had never beenaround positive, motivational,
inspirational people before, butI got addicted to it because
she really helped me to to seewho I am and see that there was

(45:47):
so much more for me out therethat I do have a purpose, there
is a reason for me to be hereand there's something more for
me to go and find out what thatis.
So in 2015, on January 1st, Iwoke up that morning and I was
like, wow, I just love what I'vedone with her, but I want to
keep going.
I want to keep going andgrowing.
And so I decided to breakthrough one fear every single

(46:08):
day that year, and that was.
That was like I can't evenexplain the transformation that
happened for me and with you forme that year, because it's so
astronomical you can't evenimagine how your life would
change when you walk us throughmaybe one or two fears that you
walked through that changed youfor the better?

Gina (46:30):
Yeah, Because once you like fear, you feel the fear,
but do it anyway it is.
It is a very like watershedmomentum Moment, almost, you
know or like have thoserealizations as a result of
walking through the fear.
Yeah, so can you tell us that?

Nicola (46:47):
Feel the fear and go for .
It was my mantra from probably16 to 25, before it was even
popularized.

Gina (46:56):
Right.

Lynda (46:56):
Wow, yeah, that's awesome , I mean.

Gina (46:59):
So I heard this thing recently that fear is courage
walking, and that stuck with mebecause it was like that's, that
is what it is Like.
You feel the fear, but you doit anyway, and you know, all
growth comes on the other sideof pain or discomfort.
Right, like most of my personalgrowth has been a result of

(47:20):
emotional pain.
Like I'm in so much emotionalpain I don't know what to do and
the only thing I can change ismyself.
I can't change the carpet ofthe world that I can put on
different slippers.
So that is that needs to be at-shirt.
Yeah, so it's like, if thecarpet's like that scratchy,
like retan carpet that somepeople have, and like I'm

(47:42):
wearing like bare feet, let mejust put on some nice, like you
know, sheepskin slippers.
I'm going to feel so muchbetter about everything.
So tell us what some of thosefears that you walked through
were.

Lynda (47:55):
Yeah, definitely.
Well, first of all, I created adifferent saying, and that's to
do it because you're scared,not in spite of the fear,
because to me that's an more ofan empowerment move, because,
you know, 99% of the fears thatI broke through, the results
that I got were either waybetter than I ever imagined.
A door was open that I didn'teven know was closed.
I ended up meeting someabsolutely incredible people

(48:17):
because I walked through thatdoor of fear, and so I now I say
, oh, that's just fear, I've gotto.
I have to do this because I'mscared, because I don't know
what's going to be on the otherside.
And then also, like thatproverbial comfort zone thing,
you know doesn't mean it'scomfortable, it's just a place
of comfort like we're used to it, like my mom was with my dad 55
years of that was a comfortzone for her, and then I just

(48:39):
stretch out of it.
And so one thing I realized is,by breaking through so many
fears, that my comfort zone justkept enlarging, enlarging,
enlarging.
So those things that I used tobe scared to do I'm no longer
scared to do.
They've actually become part ofmy comfort zone.
So what I did is, every morningwhen I woke up for 365 days in a
row.
The first thing I would dobefore I got out of bed is just

(49:00):
ask myself a question whatscares me?
And I would lay in bed and Iwould wait until the very first
fear popped into my head and mycommitment to myself it was a
commitment was to break throughthat fear that day.
And I didn't know what thefears were going to be.
There was no plan, no plan ofaction, except to ask a question
and see what came up.
And so some days it wassomething like go talk to a

(49:22):
stranger in a Starbucks, go tothe movie theater by yourself.
You go grocery shopping byyourself, go go to a restaurant
and say, like how many in yourparty One you know that was?
Those are all big deals for me.

Gina (49:37):
Those are so many good things that I love to do because
I'm such an introvert like.

Lynda (49:44):
I love it.

Gina (49:46):
And going out to eat alone we've talked about we talked
about this with Joanna, theexpert on introverts and
extroverts is like my dream.
It's like I feel like I've madeit like take myself to a nice
restaurant and just like sitthere and people watch.
Watch a treat, just kiss.

Lynda (50:02):
Basically now.
Okay, see, part of what youjust said was the reason I had
the fear of it.
You said and people watch.
See, my fear was that if I gothere by myself, that people are
going to look at me and say, ohpoor thing, she's all by
herself, she has nobody.

Gina (50:18):
That's what nobody cares that much about us.

Lynda (50:22):
Well, but not only that.
This is what I started lookingat is that I was thinking that
of people who were by themselves.
So I was thinking people werethinking that about me, right?
So really like pointing thefinger back at myself, and so
what I came to the conclusion,you know, about six months into
breaking through these differentfears that you guys love, but

(50:42):
they were terrifying for me.

Gina (50:44):
Yeah, I mean I had to work up to that place.
It wasn't like I was born.
So, yeah, like, because I usedto have that thing too, like
where I'd be like people thinkI'm a loser.
But the older I got I was likenobody.
First of all I realized I'm notthat important.
I'm the most important personin my narrative, but I'm not in
anyone else's.

(51:04):
You know, maybe my daughter is,but that's it.
So I had to realize that.
You know, I had this thingwhere I was like an egotistical,
like piece of shit.
So I was the biggest piece ofshit in the room.
I'm bigger than everybody else,but I hated myself.
So once I kind of like turnedthat narrative and I was just

(51:24):
like no, nobody cares about me.
Like it was really freeing,because it's not that nobody
cares, it's just that I'm notthe center of everyone's
narrative or everyone's universe, and that's okay.
Why would I want to be for sure, like I don't want to be so?

Lynda (51:40):
I had to work up there to that point.

Gina (51:43):
Yeah yeah, once I got there I was like this is like
once.
I started traveling on my ownfor work, before I had my own
company and I was forced to.
It was that I was.
I had no choice, I had to do itanyway.
So I had to walk through thefear and then I realized I
fucking love traveling alone, Ilove being alone, like this is
my jam.
But like you, I had to beforced to do it, left to my own

(52:06):
devices.
I don't know if I'd ever knowthat about myself, you know.

Lynda (52:11):
Yeah, well, I love it now .
Now I actually am, I actuallyenjoy more going by myself,
because I'm not because thatpeople please are person, right,
I needed to please them.
If I went somewhere withsomebody else, I always had to
do what they wanted to do and Inever got to do what I wanted to
do.
So it's completely shifted forme.
It just it took later in lifefor me to get to that point.

(52:31):
You know, 51 years old, but oneof the greatest, greatest,
greatest discoveries that I madeduring that time is that the
fear of judgment was my greatestfear and because that was my
greatest fear, I could work outon that, like that one thing.
And if that was my greatestfear and I could kind of like
extinguish that or at leastminimize it to a great degree,

(52:52):
then my life would shift.
And that's exactly what hashappened.
I mean, it's been.
It's been absolutely amazingSome of the things that have
happened to me.
You, because I I no longer havethat fear of judgment.
It's been just absolutelyincredible.

Gina (53:07):
So do you think that was?
If, once you realize that wasyour biggest fear, you realize
why you had been so judgmental,you were probably striking first
right.
Yeah, let me judge them beforethey judge me, but most people
have so many other things goingon in their personal life.
Again, you're not thatimportant, right?

(53:28):
But because you're doing that,you think everybody else is.
So it's like such a mind fuckin so many ways, like I was I
identify with, like being superjudgmental because I was scared.
I was scared that people werelooking at me and saying she's
ugly, she's this, whatever.
Because I grew up with thatnarrative from the narcissist
sister telling me how ugly andfat and stupid I was and I

(53:51):
couldn't be further from all ofthose things.
But I had internalized it, so Iget it.

Lynda (53:57):
Yeah, you know yeah, that's exactly what it was.
You know, I especially my exhusband ever, on a daily basis,
just pounded into my head howstupid and ignorant I am, you
know.
And so I really thought I wasstupid and ignorant and so I
wouldn't even talk in front ofmost people, because what if I
said something stupid?
And then they caught on to methat I really was ignorant.
I didn't know anything aboutanything, right?

(54:18):
So I I walked around again withthat belief of myself and I
remember what.
There was this one event Iattended and and I walked in the
door and I saw this womanstanding on the other side of
the room and she was justimmaculate.
She looked, she was perfectlydressed, her hair was perfect,
everything was just so perfectabout her.
And I saw her over there and Ilooked at her and I had an

(54:40):
immediate sense of judgment.
But then I caught myself and Isaid let's look for for all the
amazing things about her.
So when I first saw her, I waslike you know, who does she
think she is like that?
That was my initial reactreaction.
But then I've moved out of Ishouldn't say I've moved out of
but I'm working on, continuallyworking on moving out of
reaction and into response.

(55:03):
I'm not having responses ratherthan reaction, because response
requires thought.
And so I looked at it and Iended up just walking right over
and turn and say I just got totell you that you are absolutely
beautiful, like you arestunning.
I saw you the second.
I walked in the room and I justwanted to tell you and she was
like, oh, thank you so much.
She was very shy and so, whoknows?

Gina (55:22):
what's going on in her world, like the ugliest fattest,
this most shabbily dressedperson there, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I'm feeling like should herself.
Yeah yeah.
But like, how great is that to?
So another little trick Ilearned because I'm not really
as outgoing as I might seem onthis podcast.
Yeah, so I want to be leftalone all the time and not

(55:51):
bothered by anyone.
But, um, so I learned peoplelove to talk about themselves.
So if you're ever in like aweird social situation and you
don't know what to say.
Just ask them like how is yourday, what do you do for work?
And you don't even have tolisten to what they say, it's
just you know are going today.

Nicola (56:10):
What do you like about your life?
Like all of these things thatmake people feel like they're
being listened.
To hold on, I just have to pee.

Gina (56:17):
Okay, and also like complimenting people is a great
way.

Lynda (56:22):
You know definitely.

Gina (56:24):
Yeah.
So what happened?
Did you end up talking to thisimmaculately dressed woman?

Lynda (56:28):
That was it.
I just walked over her to saythat you know, it's kind of like
a fear of mine.
And so I just, you know, break.
Now I break through fears on aregular basis because, like I
said, you know, do them becauseyou're scared.
I don't remember her name oranything, I just remember that
situation because it was so, itwas so prominent to me that I
had that shift in that moment.
That's what the the big dealwas for me is that I judged and

(56:49):
then I said wait a minute, let'slook for the good things.
And that was exactly whathappened in that moment for me.

Gina (56:54):
And that was funny, that all of the judgmental things
were really just a reflection ofthe good things that you were
most like like because you were,you grew up the way you did.
It was probably just like youfeeling a deficit in yourself or
just jealousy, right.
So it's like once you turnedthe narrative, you were able to

(57:15):
make it a positive experiencefor not only yourself, but for
this woman who is probablyfeeling shitty standing in the
corner by herself becausenobody's approaching her.
Yeah, she's impeccably dressed.
I would love someone exactlyideas like that.
Do you think anyone would everdescribe me like that?
Nicola Standing in the cornerimmaculately dressed.

Nicola (57:34):
Oh, please.
I saw you in Las Vegas, babe,trying on your stupid gumboots.
I, or whatever the fuck thoseshoes were, I was there for that
and you were immaculatelydressed.
I was in sweats and a jumper.
Please, I.
Was not immaculately dressed,but the night before you were
more immaculately dressed than Iwas, in my sweats and jumper.

Gina (57:56):
Probably that's true, but you don't always dress like that
.
Where does this leave you now,linda?
So you've had this like radicaltransformation by feeling the
fear or walking through the fear.
So where are you now?

Lynda (58:10):
Oh, Well, I'm, first of all, I am doing a lot of things
that were never ever in my mind,anything that I would ever be
doing.
For example, I I had an amazingopportunity to interview the
president of Mexico, the countryMexico.
We're good, yeah, andinterviewing in every stars on
the red carpet, you know, andit's yeah, those things like

(58:31):
those are the kind of the funthings that I've been doing.
But I spent my whole lifesaying I'm not a reader, I'm not
a writer, I'm not a reader, I'mnot a writer because I had that
fear of judgment right.
And so I am now in a 22-timenumber one international
best-selling author and I have apublishing company.
These are things that I nevereven Do you write.

Nicola (58:53):
Yeah, like wait what.

Gina (58:56):
Hold on.
Why are we just finding thisout at the end?
What kind of You're writing?

Lynda (59:00):
well, we do.
You have a nom.
You're talking about toxicworkplaces and mine is not toxic
because no, but now we'recurious.

Nicola (59:09):
Curious inquiring minds must know.

Lynda (59:12):
Well, I mostly do Collaboration books, you, where
we bring people together toshare their stories.
Each person writes one storyand my whole mission like my
mission in life, since I'vebecome a reformed person is, you
know, to empower people toshare their stories with the
world, to make a greater impacton the planet.
And so I have this mission ofempowering five million women

(59:34):
and men to write their storiesWorld hit number 248,.
But you know what?
You got to start with one step,and so that's where we are, and
it's been just absolutelyIncredible being able to you
read their stories and sharethem, reading their
transformation, because ourbooks are all about Inspiration,
motivation, you, and movingfrom here to there, like, how

(59:56):
did, how did you get from hereto there?
We want those stories becausethis planet, man, we've got so
much mess, that stuff going onthat I want to do what I can to
get that positivity out thereinto the world.
Remember, I said I was addictedto positivity.
I'm still addicted to beingaround positive people.
I don't want, I don't, I don'twant to spend any time around

(01:00:16):
that negative stuff that I spentdecades around, you know.

Gina (01:00:20):
I really appreciate you coming on and sharing.
Do you have any additionalinformation you want to give us,
like how can people find you?
What platforms are you on?
Any last minute?

Lynda (01:00:33):
Thank, you want to share.
Well, thanks so much for havingme and it's been great.
Reminiscing about Toxicenvironments, you know and it
started in the household, rightthat toxicity like you mentioned
, and you know I carried thataround myself and not realizing
at the time that I was part ofthe problem, of course.
But, yeah, you can find me ataction takers publishing comm.

(01:00:55):
Action takers publishing command my name, linda sunshine West
.
L Y NDA, sunshine West that'show I am on all the socials you
know Facebook, linkedin,instagram, clubhouse and All
those places and I just loveconnecting with people.
So if anybody wants to, ifyou're looking at writing a book
or you just want to talk aboutsome of the fears that you're

(01:01:16):
Experiencing and want me to helpyou through those two, you can
reach out to me.
It's awesome, I'd love to help.

Nicola (01:01:22):
Yeah, I love that we really appreciate the time that
you've taken to have a chat withus.
I think it's been reallyawesome and you know we wish you
the best going forward withyour fear domination yeah.

Gina (01:01:38):
Yeah.

Lynda (01:01:41):
That's a good one, you got trademark that.

Gina (01:01:44):
We just did fear domination.
Okay, well, thank you so much.
I identified so much with yourstory, Linda.

Lynda (01:01:52):
Yeah sounds good.
I can't wait to get it outthere.
And thank you so much.
It really has.
It's been interesting because Idon't usually talk about those
toxic things, so it has beeninteresting for me and just like
bringing up that stuff, youknow.

Gina (01:02:06):
Thank you have a cup of tea, and just remember that you
have a meal, tea, right yourfeet, yeah, yeah, and that
you're a fear dominator, youdominate here, Dominate 50.
Yeah, yeah okay, thanks so much, linda.
We'll talk to you.
Thank you, have a great one.
Thank you, bye.

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