January 13, 2025 • 31 mins
Ever wonder why so many fundraisers are burnt out and how to truly support their well-being? Join us as we engage with Raiya Sankari-Diaz, a global HR expert, to uncover the hidden causes of burnout in the fundraising sector. Forget superficial solutions like mindfulness apps; Raiya shares why authentic well-being programs, backed by genuine leadership buy-in, are essential. We explore the pitfalls of "care washing," where insincere initiatives lead only to dissatisfaction and disengagement, and we offer real-life insights and actionable strategies for fundraisers seeking more meaningful change.
Shift gears with us as we explore how smaller nonprofits can cultivate a healthy workplace culture that thrives on connection, creativity, and employee well-being. We dive into the importance of holistic approaches, emphasizing psychological safety, trust, and flexibility. Learn how to effectively engage stakeholders and gather meaningful data to tailor well-being initiatives to your organization’s specific needs. Even if you're not in HR, discover how you can influence positive change through cross-functional collaboration and data-driven approaches. Let’s break the culture of scarcity and work towards a thriving, inclusive workplace environment that stands the test of time.
HBR Article: Why Workplace Well-Being Programs Don't Achieve Better Outcomes
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Keith Greer, CFRE (00:05):
Hey, there, hi, and welcome back ambitious
fundraisers.
Today's episode is one youcannot afford to miss.
We're diving into aconversation that gets to the
heart of something we all feel,but don't talk about enough
burnout and well-being infundraising.
If you've read the recentHarvard Business Review article
why Workplace Well-BeingPrograms Don't Achieve Better
(00:27):
Outcomes and don't worry if youhaven't, the link is in the show
notes you know that so many ofthe programs designed to support
employee well-being missed themark.
Why?
Because they focus onsurface-level fixes without
addressing the deeper systemicchallenges that cause burnout in
the first place.
They call this care washing andfundraisers.
(00:49):
We see this play out all thetime.
Here's the reality.
As fundraisers, we're underimmense pressure high dollar
goals, emotional labor,leadership's expectations and
the looming weight of ourorganization's survival.
A mindfulness app or a one-offyoga class isn't going to cut it
when the job itself is burningus out.
(01:10):
So how can we, as fundraisingprofessionals, advocate for real
, meaningful change in ourworkplaces?
Today, I'm thrilled to bejoined by Raiya Sankari-Diaz, a
global HR expert who bringsyears of experience and insights
into what works and whatdoesn't when it comes to
employee well-being.
Together, we're unpacking thechallenges of burnout, the
(01:33):
importance of systemic changeand what nonprofit leaders and
fundraisers can do right now toinfluence healthier workplace
cultures.
Raiya and I cover a ton ofground, from leadership, buy-in
and emotional labor to practicalfirst steps and the future of
workplace well-being.
If you've ever felt stretchedtoo thin or wondered how to
(01:53):
spark meaningful change in yourorganization, this conversation
is for you.
All right, let's get into itand let's talk fundraising.
Raiya is a strategic andcompassionate HR leader with
extensive experience drivingtransformative people strategies
in Fortune 500 companies,nonprofits and government
(02:14):
organizations Known forfostering inclusion and
psychological safety.
Raiya has successfully expandedtalent pipelines and led
cultural transformations atKimberly Clark, mutual of Omaha
and the City of Green Bay.
Her expertise spans talentpipelines and led cultural
transformations atKimberly-Clark, mutual of Omaha
and the City of Green Bay.
Her expertise spans talentmanagement, employee engagement
and strategic planning,empowering organizations to
achieve sustainable growth.
(02:34):
A committed advocate forbelonging and equity, raya
brings a unique blend ofemotional intelligence and
strategic vision to createhigh-performing, inclusive
workplaces where employeesthrive.
So welcome to the podcast.
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (02:48):
Keith, thank you for having me.
I'm super excited to be herewith you.
Keith Greer, CFRE (02:52):
Oh, I'm thrilled to have you.
Let's just dive right into thisarticle that we found so.
You've worked globally in HRand you've seen all sides of the
equation when it comes toemployee well-being.
What do you see as the biggestchallenge, specifically for
fundraisers, when it comes toburnout and mental health?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (03:09):
Such a great topic, super essential,
extremely relevant and, honestly, Keith, across the board
employees are facing this, butspecifically for fundraisers, I
would say some of the key issuesthat people are facing include
just the challenges.
So seeking balance, meetinggoals, understanding how
challenging it can truly be tohave these things in front of
(03:32):
you and then looking to createthat kind of work-life
experience and formulating theconnection and how to relay
what's going on right.
And so, if there are challengestaking place, if there's a
sense of overwhelm taking place,really looking at how to convey
that and work through some ofthose barriers in order to
overcome that and be mostsuccessful for sure.
Keith Greer, CFRE (03:54):
Totally and in this article.
There's a lot of discussionaround this idea of care washing
and programs that don't addressthe root cause of burnout For
fundraisers, who are often underintense pressure both from the
leadership side as well as fromdonors.
Why is it critical thatwellbeing programs focus on
systemic change instead of justindividual solutions?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (04:17):
Yeah, that's a great question.
So I think the key factor in allof this is thinking through the
authenticity component, right,and so there's really an
opportunity to have thatauthenticity.
What truly is lacking oftentimeswhen we think about care
washing is the buy-in fromleaders, and so there has to be
that buy-in from senior leaders,and that has to be cascaded
(04:38):
down as well as I say outward,right, and so there has to be
momentum behind it, there has tobe an understanding, and the
authenticity factor is whatreally creates a success when we
think about kind of workingthrough some of these programs.
And so, when we think aboutbuilding out and we think about
the experience that employeesare having, how are they being
engaged?
(04:58):
Does it feel like somethingthat is true to them?
Are they being pulled to seewhat's important to them?
Are their employee engagementsurveys taking place?
How are leaders putting theirfinger on the pulse of what's
truly important to individualsthat they're working with, and
how does that show up in theworkplace, right?
How is that a part of workplaceculture?
And so that's a large piece ofthis is really understanding
(05:22):
from a care washing perspective,where's the authenticity coming
in from, and how are peopletuning in to understand what is
important to their employees andhow can they best serve their
employees first, so that theemployees can serve the
communities and meet the goalsthat are in front of them.
Keith Greer, CFRE (05:38):
Yeah, and so when we talk a little bit about
care washing, what is that?
What's the impact of carewashing on employees in an
organizational well-beingprogram?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (05:48):
Well, I'll give you an example.
If we think about recognitionas a component of well-being,
right?
So there was a study done onceupon a time within health care,
and nurses were provided with apiece of candy to thank them for
their efforts and their workbeing done.
85% of the nurses in that studyresigned due to that, and so,
(06:10):
again, it's where thatauthenticity factor comes in
right and it's where you knowunderstanding how to communicate
with your people what are theylooking for, what's important to
them, and diving into that.
And there are differentresources that can truly equip
leaders to help that take place.
But the impact of that isdisengagement.
(06:31):
When we think about carewashing right, so we know people
become disengaged from theirworkforce and they tend to have
one foot out the door and theimpact of that right are dollars
and cents.
So there's the retraining thathas to take place, there's the
rehiring.
It's a time resource, it's afinancial resource, so it really
(06:51):
has strong implications whencare washing is done.
Keith Greer, CFRE (06:55):
And so let's talk a little bit about
leadership, because you hadmentioned that earlier and that
leadership buy-in is a major keyto successful well-being
initiatives for employees.
How can fundraisers advocatefor better support from their
own leaders, whether they'releading a team themselves or
maybe if they're trying toinfluence the C-suite within
their organization?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (07:14):
Absolutely so.
My response to that, keith,would be to truly see the
benefit of speaking up, so usingyour voice right, so saying
what's important to you, havingplatforms for that.
So it's twofold.
I believe that it's part of theemployer responsibility to
share that, but it's also partof the leader responsibility to
(07:34):
set up the environment that'sconducive to sharing that
feedback or that experienceright.
And so you can go as deep as tosay, for example, oftentimes
leaders will say, oh, we'rehaving one-on-ones that's not
being brought up in theone-on-one right.
And part of that is my responseto that is that's great that
there's a one-on-one situationhappening.
What about a touch base?
(07:55):
Because a one-on-one and thisoften gets lost in the HR world
when translated to managementand things like that so a
one-on-one is meant to really goover the work that's taking
place, the goals, etc.
A touch base is hey, how areyou doing, how are things going?
And that can includesurrounding life experiences,
(08:15):
learnings that you're interestedin.
It's aside from the workcomponent.
So that's where that work-lifebalance piece comes into play
and it's setting the stage tohave that connection, that
vulnerability, that trust, thatpsychological safety that will
help drive the understanding ofwhat's truly taking place with
an employee from a burnoutstandpoint.
Keith Greer, CFRE (08:37):
And I think fundraisers specifically deal
with a lot of burnout because wedo a lot of emotional labor in
our roles right?
So we're constantly yes,especially if we're in a small
nonprofit like we're fundraisingto keep the lights on sometimes
(08:59):
, and so the entire weight ofthe organization's survival
feels like it's resting on ourshoulders.
So, from your experience, howcan organizations adjust their
expectations of what fundraiserscan do to help reduce this
pressure, and what shouldleaders be doing differently to
support their teams?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (09:17):
Sure.
So, again, understanding, firstof all, there's opportunity
here to be creative, becausewhen we think about resources
internally, we're all feeling afiscal pinch at this time, right
, and so looking at that pieceof it is really, really
important.
And it's important to betransparent about budget and
what we do have and what wedon't have to drive certain
programming and things like that.
(09:38):
But there's space to becreative.
And so, understanding your teamand taking the time to invest
in the team and understand whatare their passions, what are
they excelling in, where wouldthey like to stretch right All
of that can really help to growthe experience on a holistic
scale.
And so when we think about youknow, smaller nonprofits that
may not have a ton of resourcesto dive into some of this, and
(10:01):
things like that, my advice isconnection and creativity.
Also, identifying who are yourstakeholders.
Are you communicating with acommunications person perhaps
that may have a capability inplace where they can step in and
help be a stakeholder on a veryimportant project taking place
right?
They can step in and help be astakeholder on a very important
project taking place right.
When we think about who we'reinteracting with, we're not
(10:23):
necessarily always tapping in.
In addition to that, I would goas far as to say is there a
community liaison put into place, somebody who really is
connected well in the communitythat can bring that information
back?
So there's knowledge sharing,there's connecting going on,
extremely important when wethink about the burnout factor,
(10:43):
because oftentimes people we seethis across the board, right
People are internalizing thatrejection and they get isolated.
And there's also this siloeffect that takes place, a deep,
heavy silo effect whereindividuals are feeling super
isolated, not connected withthose around them, not connected
with their community, and thenthat hits hard when it comes
(11:04):
time to meet those goals, right.
And so, in order to kind ofbypass some of that, I say think
about those in your communitywho you're not tapping into yet.
Have those essentialconversation, link up, meet up,
have the conversations in orderto help delegate some of that,
so it's not just being owned inone central space, and that's a
(11:26):
key to some of the avoidancepiece of burnout is delegation
individual who is working as thefundraiser as well as the
leadership, to understand wheretheir people are at.
How are they delegating?
Are they head down?
Do they have opportunities toconnect to elsewhere and are
they tapping into that for thedeepest, most positive outcome
(11:51):
possible, I would say.
Keith Greer, CFRE (11:53):
Yeah, and so when we were looking at the
article, one of the things thatyou highlighted was the
importance of holisticapproaches.
Can you walk us through what asuccessful holistic well-being
program actually looks like inpractice, because I don't think
many of us have actuallyexperienced a really good one,
especially in a nonprofit whereour resources might be limited.
So what does that look like?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (12:14):
Sure.
So that's going to be superspecific to the organization,
and so the best way to put yourfinger on the feel secure, safe,
that their voice matters andthat their experience matters
(12:42):
and that their contributionsmatter.
And so thinking about this iswe want a program that fosters
trust, psychological safety,balance, flexibility All of
these can be key components intowhat's going to really help
drive some of that well-beingtaking place within an
organization.
But I think the key thing isthe primary thing to understand
(13:06):
is how do people want to becommunicated with?
Because you have to gather dataon this matter.
That's simply the first step tounderstanding what's going to
work well for your specificorganization.
So gathering data looks likeyou know you can create a high
level survey.
Hr can do this.
Learning and development ifthat's a thing where you're at,
(13:26):
learning and development canhelp with this.
It's finding those kind of keypeople in those key roles to
help foster this.
So this can be created, andasking questions like are you
satisfied in your workforce?
Are you seeking moreflexibility?
What does that look like to you?
And having space for people tocommunicate what's going to be
really important to them.
(13:46):
Do they want to be communicatedwith via email.
Would they like to receive atext?
When is that most important tothem?
Research tells us that if we'regoing to take the email approach
and extend a survey, that wouldbest be done on a Tuesday
morning at 10 am versus Thursdayat 4 pm, for example.
Monday people are heavy withemails and different work going
(14:08):
on prepping for the work week.
Friday, people are gettingready to close out or maybe off
for a long weekend, right.
So we know that Tuesday is asweet spot for really gauging
employee well-being.
We know that Tuesday is a sweetspot for really gauging
employee well-being.
Also, a great time to do thatis spring, right, because this
is kind of a new time and soputting your finger on the pulse
in spring is great.
Also, checking back in inOctober is a great time just to
(14:31):
see where your employees are atand what's important to them at
that time.
So that's a strong way ofcreating a foundation to say, ok
, I have this data, now I'mgoing to begin building.
Whether that's sourcing anexternal vendor to help with
some programming, whether it'scompiling YouTube videos and
then some questions to go withthat for a team building day, it
(14:53):
really just depends kind of onwhat's relevant to the people
within your personal org andwhat they're experiencing at
that time.
Keith Greer, CFRE (15:03):
Yeah, and so when our fundraisers are,
they're obviously a lot of timesnot involved in the HR
decisions as part of our dailyjobs.
How can they help push theirorganizations to collect that
meaningful data on the employeewell-being, and how can that
data be used to create long-termchange?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (15:22):
Sure.
So, again, connecting I alwayssay don't be afraid to set up a
meeting and reach out.
It's really important to dosome of that cross-functional
work.
Oftentimes we get super headdown in our spaces and we're
very focused on our goals andthat doesn't leave a whole lot
of opportunity to connect inkind of those cross-function
spaces.
(15:42):
And so thinking about, hey, doI know who my HR person is?
Am I familiar with HR?
Am I familiar?
Do we have learning anddevelopment here?
Am I connecting withcommunications, things like that
?
And so putting a meeting on acalendar and saying, hey, I'd
just like to do a quick connectfor 25 minutes and touch base on
some things that are importantto me, that's going to be a
(16:02):
really strong way to get theball rolling.
The more communication, the morearticulation that's happening
surrounding this, the easier itis for HR to gauge what really
needs to take place and set upthose streams for gathering data
and then putting that together,and so oftentimes people seek
(16:24):
out consultants to do that.
But it really doesn't need tobe that route.
It can be as simple as, again,a high-level survey,
understanding what's importantto your people and ensuring that
there are a few initiatives setup to support that.
People are looking for results.
I think the worst thing thatcan happen is when data is
collected and nothing is donewith it.
(16:45):
That leaves a hole in people'shearts, right.
And it makes people feel unseen,unheard.
So the goal of the reaching outand the conversation and the
collecting of the data is toensure that people feel seen,
heard, and that, in turn, willhelp retain people, especially
from a funding standpoint,fundraisers right that retention
(17:08):
factor should take place andthe data should also reflect
that.
If these programs are done welland I know that kind of sounds
like a whole stream of things,but I've seen this carried out
very well in different spacesand so I believe that there is a
lot of work behind the scenesthat takes place in order to
(17:28):
help this be done well and beimpactful and effective, and
it's not just lip service whenit's done well.
Keith Greer, CFRE (17:35):
So when you're talking about people that
are being seen and heard,that's kind of talking directly
to the culture of the workplace.
And so how does that workplaceculture play in either
alleviating or exacerbating thestress within the organization,
and how can fundraisers take thelead in shaping a healthier
workplace culture?
You know, even if they're notin a senior leadership position.
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (17:58):
Sure.
So I believe that there areleaders in every single seat.
Your title doesn't depend on it.
It's truly your attitude, yourinitiative and what's put before
you, right, and what you createfor yourself.
You know what do you want to bea part of and what do you want
to create, and so I think aboutit from a sense of what is your
passion, right?
You know, where do you want toinvest your energy, what do you
(18:21):
want to show up to every daywhen you come to work?
Everybody's heard of the Sundayscaries, right, where people are
like, oh, I don't, you know,monday's right around the corner
, oh my goodness.
And so I think the purpose isto create that culture, and the
way you do that is, again, toput your finger on the pulse of
people.
So what somebody could do isperhaps propose a committee,
(18:41):
right, a culture committee,workplace culture committee and
assemble some individuals whoare interested in contributing
to that, create a playbook forthat.
You can create a book clubsurrounding what does positive
workplace culture look like.
So there are some differentthings that can take place in
order to help stimulate thisenvironment, and we've also
(19:02):
heard culture eats strategy forbreakfast, right?
That's a very famous quote, andso, strategically speaking,
leaders can put a whole bunch ofstuff into place, but if the
culture of inclusion, of a speakyour voice culture, a speak
your mind culture, if that's notbeing perpetuated, that creates
(19:25):
those silos again, right, andthere's a deterioration, and the
worst thing that can happen isthe meeting after the meeting,
right, and so everybody wentthere and it wasn't kind of the
vibe, and all of a sudden youhave, you know, people
sectioning off to haveconversations about man.
This is tough, right, and sothat's what we want to avoid
(19:47):
with a healthy workplace cultureto really build together, to
come together to understand whatis going to make us not just
survive but thrive, and thatmeans something different to
everybody.
That's why it's super importantif a committee is formed, or if
there is a connection formedthere and something whether it's
formal or informal, to havedifferent voices at the table.
(20:08):
The key is to bring a differentlens forward through everybody
and their contribution in orderto get this holistic approach to
well-being, because if somebodyis experiencing something here,
somebody else may beexperiencing something else, and
so that relevancy factor isextremely important.
But in order to drive all ofthat, there has to be trust, and
(20:31):
so trust is a key inclusivecapability that leaders need to
work on in order to foster therest of this, to really make the
workplace culture anenvironment where individuals
feel soothed, present, welcomeand as though they belong in
order to bring forward theirsuccesses and their challenges
(20:51):
overall.
Keith Greer, CFRE (20:53):
Yeah, and talking about putting together a
committee about this.
This is something that's justkept repeating itself over and
over in my life recently, forwhatever reason, so I kind of
feel the need to bring it up.
But it was this idea of talkingabout how, whenever a new idea
is being presented, you shouldnever present it in a group
meeting.
You should always do the prelegwork to meet with people
(21:15):
one-on-one, pitch them your idea, get that feedback beforehand,
start negotiating at thatone-on-one level so that by the
time you're presenting it to thegroup and you're trying to
implement change, you alreadyhave people that are bought into
this idea of where you'rewanting to go and where you're
wanting to get to.
Because in every meeting italways feels like there's at
(21:35):
least one, debbie Downer, who isgonna find every excuse in the
book to delay, halt or stop theprogress altogether.
But if you're able to have thatkind of coalition around what
you're working towards, you aremuch more effective with
bringing those groups togetheras opposed to launching ideas
(21:56):
straight out of the gates.
What are kind of your thoughtson that?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (22:04):
So I would say transparency is extremely
important, and so beingtransparent about what people
are experiencing and, again,that's why surveys are so
important, that's why outlets toexpress what people are going
through is so important, and sothere should be that
transparency factor in my mindwhen we think about formulating
committees.
And so when there is data thatspeaks to the issue, the data
(22:26):
speaks for itself.
So that takes part of thepressure off the individual to
have to push, push, push,persuade, persuade, persuade for
something to take place.
It's as simple as saying thenumbers and the metrics here.
They're letting us know that weneed to do this, that this
culture isn't as holistic as itcould be, and we know that when
a culture isn't super holisticand when people don't feel
(22:48):
engaged, when people feel likethey have to hide their feelings
or hide aspects of themselvesin the workplace, engagement can
go down by as much as 85%.
And so let that number sink infor leaders and sink in from a
financial component.
What happens if fundraisers areexperiencing an 85% decline in
(23:11):
their engagement in theworkplace?
That impacts the wholecommunity.
So, again, the numbers speakfor themselves, and if the data
says that somebody isn't feelingengaged, that's enough to if
one individual isn't feelingengaged to create a ripple
effect, right, and so you wantto nip that in the bud by
helping to propose strong,systematic approaches to some of
(23:36):
this change.
So when I think about this,keith, I think about how, again,
when we rely on data and datatells us what needs to be done,
some of these things can beembedded in the systems and
processes, right, like theone-on-one situation I was
talking about.
Okay, so now we know, as partof our procedure, we may need to
have touch bases, especially aspart of our onboarding
(23:57):
experience, right, and we needto have those check-ins, not
only with our new employees butour seasoned employees.
Are we having stayconversations, right?
Are we having theseconversations?
When we think about exitinterviews, are we having stay
interviews to see how are peoplefeeling, what's going on here,
what can we do more of, and soreally thinking about ways that
(24:22):
people can really buildthemselves up, build up their
community, their internalcommunity at work it all comes
back to.
Are we building trust?
Are we embedding those valuesinto the systems and processes
that we have?
And when we look at policy, isthat reflective of the
well-being that we're saying?
That needs to be transformativein this environment.
Keith Greer, CFRE (24:45):
And when you talk about that, employees who
are disengaged have an 85% dropin productivity.
I think one of the biggestfrustrations for so many
fundraisers is that nonprofitshave this culture of scarcity
scarcity of resources, scarcityof time and scarcity of an
(25:06):
emotional bandwidth because ofthe work we're doing.
How can nonprofits shift awayfrom this scarcity mindset to
create a more sustainable workenvironment for their employees?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (25:17):
Such a great question that feels like a
million dollar question, Keith.
It really is, if I had thecomplete answer to that, I think
that would be just amazing.
But I think I refer back toconnectivity, staying away from
those silos, really focusing onconversation and checking in.
(25:37):
There are things that managerscan do with their direct reports
.
Who are fundraisers?
Just using different language,right, and so when we think
about the impact that languagehas on our day, part of that is
the recognition factor, right.
But also thinking about usinglanguage and thinking about
leadership styles that trulymatter, and so using words of
(25:59):
encouragement as silly as thatsounds or as cliche as that
sounds, it's true, but havingthere be that authenticity
factor behind it utilize whatthe person is doing and
compliment them on that.
Their efforts are tremendous,and so let's make sure we're
doing that.
But we do know, and researchtells us this, keith, it says
that individuals are more likelyto be uplifted by their peers
(26:24):
than their manager, and sothat's because the peers are the
ones who are interacting on aregular basis, right.
The manager may have lessinteraction taking place on that
daily basis, and so peerrecognition is a huge piece of
this.
So teaching peers how torecognize each other and
understanding the individualnuances of how people want to be
(26:46):
recognized plays a large partin this, of course, as well, and
so some people want to berecognized with a note, some
people want that publicrecognition, some people want to
be recognized privately indiscussion.
So there's a lot of differentways that people want to be
recognized and that I think thatconnectivity piece will help
(27:07):
break down some of that, sopeople don't feel so alone in
their experience, so overwhelmed, so burned out.
Keith Greer, CFRE (27:13):
And so let's get practical for just a minute.
What are some of the firststeps that a fundraiser or a
nonprofit leader can take todayto start influencing their
organization toward betterwell-being practices?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (27:24):
Connect, talk to your people, communicate
, communicate, communicate whatis lacking, what is going well,
what needs to stop, what needsto pause and what needs to
continue.
Taking inventory is going to bereally important in doing that,
through communication and sotaking the step to connect,
being transparent and sayingthat, hey, I understand that
(27:45):
this is super overwhelming rightnow, or I understand we're
having a great year.
What are we going to do tocontinue that momentum right?
Or what are we going to do inthe areas where this burnout is
so severe?
And how can I delegatedifferently from an individual
standpoint, when we think aboutindividual contributors and
fundraisers, I would say the keyis to speak up, use your voice
(28:06):
and explain what is not workingfor you right now, simply what
is not going well.
One way to do that is to have acrucial conversation, and so
that's kind of just focusing inon you know, this is what's
happening for me, this is myresults at this time.
You're sticking to the facts,you're explaining.
These are my numbers right now,or this was my experience, and
(28:27):
I may need a new strategy or anew approach, but again, the
culture is what's going to helpshape the opportunity to build
that new strategy or tore-strategize, to re-energize
some of those capabilities.
Keith Greer, CFRE (28:41):
And so looking forward.
How do you see the future ofworkplace well-being programs,
evolving especially aroundhigh-pressure roles like in
fundraising, and whatinnovations or trends should
nonprofit leaders be payingattention to in order to create
that lasting change?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (28:56):
Sure.
So I would say generationaldiversity is going to play a
huge part in understanding whattakes place next and how things
shape out.
And so we know, in 2025, we'regoing to have a new set of Gen Z
managers coming in, and that'sgoing to really, really shape
(29:16):
part of what the well-beingprocess looks like within the
workplace.
That is for sure.
Gen Z is one of the mosttherapized generations that we
have known to us at this point,and so we know that Gen Z plays
a large part in shaping some ofthat well-being, and they have
an open approach to well-being,right, and so that's very
(29:38):
different from some of the othergenerations.
That research would speak to usand say maybe there are some
differences there, and sothere's going to be, I think,
opportunity for growth and, atthe same time, we think about
tech, right, and how we use techwhen it comes to well-being,
and so there's going to be, Ithink, a drive towards learning
(29:58):
how technology really holdsclose and safe for evolvement of
well-being in the workplace.
It may be as quick as opening anapp up on a phone.
It may be, you know, again,thinking that generational
diversity, thinking about peoplewho like to have one-on-one
experiences or group experiencesin person.
(30:19):
And so, again, keeping yourfinger on the pulse of your own
community is super important,and when you see those
differences be strategic in yourofferings, that's my word of
advice.
And so if we do haveindividuals who like a
one-on-one experience on an appor who like to utilize tech for
their well-being, that's great.
If you have individuals who sayI'd like a book club, I'd like
(30:43):
to formulate a committee, haveindividuals who say I'd like a
book club, I'd like to formulatea committee, I'd like to do
more in the workplace for teambuilding excellent from a
culture component.
And so think about how tointegrate tech into some of
those experiences.
There's lots of ways to do thatand there are different
platforms that can help do that,and so it's really about kind
of that flexibility factor.
(31:04):
When we think about how we'regoing to evolve, I think my
answer would be how are we goingto be most flexible to meet the
needs of the people?
Keith Greer, CFRE (31:12):
I think that's a great place for us to
wrap up today.
Being flexible for the needs ofour employees is really, really
important, but if somebodywants to reach out and follow up
with you for more information,or if they maybe want to do any
kind of consulting services,where can people find you?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (31:29):
I can be reached on LinkedIn, so please
reach out, connect with me inLinkedIn space and I'm happy to
talk further.
Keith Greer, CFRE (31:36):
Perfect, and we'll put a link to your
LinkedIn right in the bio and inthe show notes of this, so head
right there to be able toconnect with Raiya Sankari Diaz.
Thank you so much for beinghere and for sharing your wisdom
and your expertise.
We really appreciate it.
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (31:49):
Thank you, Keith.
Thanks for having me.
Hey, there, hi, and welcome back ambitious
fundraisers.
Today's episode is one youcannot afford to miss.
We're diving into aconversation that gets to the
heart of something we all feel,but don't talk about enough
burnout and well-being infundraising.
If you've read the recentHarvard Business Review article
why Workplace Well-BeingPrograms Don't Achieve Better
(00:27):
Outcomes and don't worry if youhaven't, the link is in the show
notes you know that so many ofthe programs designed to support
employee well-being missed themark.
Why?
Because they focus onsurface-level fixes without
addressing the deeper systemicchallenges that cause burnout in
the first place.
They call this care washing andfundraisers.
(00:49):
We see this play out all thetime.
Here's the reality.
As fundraisers, we're underimmense pressure high dollar
goals, emotional labor,leadership's expectations and
the looming weight of ourorganization's survival.
A mindfulness app or a one-offyoga class isn't going to cut it
when the job itself is burningus out.
(01:10):
So how can we, as fundraisingprofessionals, advocate for real
, meaningful change in ourworkplaces?
Today, I'm thrilled to bejoined by Raiya Sankari-Diaz, a
global HR expert who bringsyears of experience and insights
into what works and whatdoesn't when it comes to
employee well-being.
Together, we're unpacking thechallenges of burnout, the
(01:33):
importance of systemic changeand what nonprofit leaders and
fundraisers can do right now toinfluence healthier workplace
cultures.
Raiya and I cover a ton ofground, from leadership, buy-in
and emotional labor to practicalfirst steps and the future of
workplace well-being.
If you've ever felt stretchedtoo thin or wondered how to
(01:53):
spark meaningful change in yourorganization, this conversation
is for you.
All right, let's get into itand let's talk fundraising.
Raiya is a strategic andcompassionate HR leader with
extensive experience drivingtransformative people strategies
in Fortune 500 companies,nonprofits and government
(02:14):
organizations Known forfostering inclusion and
psychological safety.
Raiya has successfully expandedtalent pipelines and led
cultural transformations atKimberly Clark, mutual of Omaha
and the City of Green Bay.
Her expertise spans talentpipelines and led cultural
transformations atKimberly-Clark, mutual of Omaha
and the City of Green Bay.
Her expertise spans talentmanagement, employee engagement
and strategic planning,empowering organizations to
achieve sustainable growth.
(02:34):
A committed advocate forbelonging and equity, raya
brings a unique blend ofemotional intelligence and
strategic vision to createhigh-performing, inclusive
workplaces where employeesthrive.
So welcome to the podcast.
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (02:48):
Keith, thank you for having me.
I'm super excited to be herewith you.
Keith Greer, CFRE (02:52):
Oh, I'm thrilled to have you.
Let's just dive right into thisarticle that we found so.
You've worked globally in HRand you've seen all sides of the
equation when it comes toemployee well-being.
What do you see as the biggestchallenge, specifically for
fundraisers, when it comes toburnout and mental health?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (03:09):
Such a great topic, super essential,
extremely relevant and, honestly, Keith, across the board
employees are facing this, butspecifically for fundraisers, I
would say some of the key issuesthat people are facing include
just the challenges.
So seeking balance, meetinggoals, understanding how
challenging it can truly be tohave these things in front of
(03:32):
you and then looking to createthat kind of work-life
experience and formulating theconnection and how to relay
what's going on right.
And so, if there are challengestaking place, if there's a
sense of overwhelm taking place,really looking at how to convey
that and work through some ofthose barriers in order to
overcome that and be mostsuccessful for sure.
Keith Greer, CFRE (03:54):
Totally and in this article.
There's a lot of discussionaround this idea of care washing
and programs that don't addressthe root cause of burnout For
fundraisers, who are often underintense pressure both from the
leadership side as well as fromdonors.
Why is it critical thatwellbeing programs focus on
systemic change instead of justindividual solutions?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (04:17):
Yeah, that's a great question.
So I think the key factor in allof this is thinking through the
authenticity component, right,and so there's really an
opportunity to have thatauthenticity.
What truly is lacking oftentimeswhen we think about care
washing is the buy-in fromleaders, and so there has to be
that buy-in from senior leaders,and that has to be cascaded
(04:38):
down as well as I say outward,right, and so there has to be
momentum behind it, there has tobe an understanding, and the
authenticity factor is whatreally creates a success when we
think about kind of workingthrough some of these programs.
And so, when we think aboutbuilding out and we think about
the experience that employeesare having, how are they being
engaged?
(04:58):
Does it feel like somethingthat is true to them?
Are they being pulled to seewhat's important to them?
Are their employee engagementsurveys taking place?
How are leaders putting theirfinger on the pulse of what's
truly important to individualsthat they're working with, and
how does that show up in theworkplace, right?
How is that a part of workplaceculture?
And so that's a large piece ofthis is really understanding
(05:22):
from a care washing perspective,where's the authenticity coming
in from, and how are peopletuning in to understand what is
important to their employees andhow can they best serve their
employees first, so that theemployees can serve the
communities and meet the goalsthat are in front of them.
Keith Greer, CFRE (05:38):
Yeah, and so when we talk a little bit about
care washing, what is that?
What's the impact of carewashing on employees in an
organizational well-beingprogram?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (05:48):
Well, I'll give you an example.
If we think about recognitionas a component of well-being,
right?
So there was a study done onceupon a time within health care,
and nurses were provided with apiece of candy to thank them for
their efforts and their workbeing done.
85% of the nurses in that studyresigned due to that, and so,
(06:10):
again, it's where thatauthenticity factor comes in
right and it's where you knowunderstanding how to communicate
with your people what are theylooking for, what's important to
them, and diving into that.
And there are differentresources that can truly equip
leaders to help that take place.
But the impact of that isdisengagement.
(06:31):
When we think about carewashing right, so we know people
become disengaged from theirworkforce and they tend to have
one foot out the door and theimpact of that right are dollars
and cents.
So there's the retraining thathas to take place, there's the
rehiring.
It's a time resource, it's afinancial resource, so it really
(06:51):
has strong implications whencare washing is done.
Keith Greer, CFRE (06:55):
And so let's talk a little bit about
leadership, because you hadmentioned that earlier and that
leadership buy-in is a major keyto successful well-being
initiatives for employees.
How can fundraisers advocatefor better support from their
own leaders, whether they'releading a team themselves or
maybe if they're trying toinfluence the C-suite within
their organization?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (07:14):
Absolutely so.
My response to that, keith,would be to truly see the
benefit of speaking up, so usingyour voice right, so saying
what's important to you, havingplatforms for that.
So it's twofold.
I believe that it's part of theemployer responsibility to
share that, but it's also partof the leader responsibility to
(07:34):
set up the environment that'sconducive to sharing that
feedback or that experienceright.
And so you can go as deep as tosay, for example, oftentimes
leaders will say, oh, we'rehaving one-on-ones that's not
being brought up in theone-on-one right.
And part of that is my responseto that is that's great that
there's a one-on-one situationhappening.
What about a touch base?
(07:55):
Because a one-on-one and thisoften gets lost in the HR world
when translated to managementand things like that so a
one-on-one is meant to really goover the work that's taking
place, the goals, etc.
A touch base is hey, how areyou doing, how are things going?
And that can includesurrounding life experiences,
(08:15):
learnings that you're interestedin.
It's aside from the workcomponent.
So that's where that work-lifebalance piece comes into play
and it's setting the stage tohave that connection, that
vulnerability, that trust, thatpsychological safety that will
help drive the understanding ofwhat's truly taking place with
an employee from a burnoutstandpoint.
Keith Greer, CFRE (08:37):
And I think fundraisers specifically deal
with a lot of burnout because wedo a lot of emotional labor in
our roles right?
So we're constantly yes,especially if we're in a small
nonprofit like we're fundraisingto keep the lights on sometimes
(08:59):
, and so the entire weight ofthe organization's survival
feels like it's resting on ourshoulders.
So, from your experience, howcan organizations adjust their
expectations of what fundraiserscan do to help reduce this
pressure, and what shouldleaders be doing differently to
support their teams?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (09:17):
Sure.
So, again, understanding, firstof all, there's opportunity
here to be creative, becausewhen we think about resources
internally, we're all feeling afiscal pinch at this time, right
, and so looking at that pieceof it is really, really
important.
And it's important to betransparent about budget and
what we do have and what wedon't have to drive certain
programming and things like that.
(09:38):
But there's space to becreative.
And so, understanding your teamand taking the time to invest
in the team and understand whatare their passions, what are
they excelling in, where wouldthey like to stretch right All
of that can really help to growthe experience on a holistic
scale.
And so when we think about youknow, smaller nonprofits that
may not have a ton of resourcesto dive into some of this, and
(10:01):
things like that, my advice isconnection and creativity.
Also, identifying who are yourstakeholders.
Are you communicating with acommunications person perhaps
that may have a capability inplace where they can step in and
help be a stakeholder on a veryimportant project taking place
right?
They can step in and help be astakeholder on a very important
project taking place right.
When we think about who we'reinteracting with, we're not
(10:23):
necessarily always tapping in.
In addition to that, I would goas far as to say is there a
community liaison put into place, somebody who really is
connected well in the communitythat can bring that information
back?
So there's knowledge sharing,there's connecting going on,
extremely important when wethink about the burnout factor,
(10:43):
because oftentimes people we seethis across the board, right
People are internalizing thatrejection and they get isolated.
And there's also this siloeffect that takes place, a deep,
heavy silo effect whereindividuals are feeling super
isolated, not connected withthose around them, not connected
with their community, and thenthat hits hard when it comes
(11:04):
time to meet those goals, right.
And so, in order to kind ofbypass some of that, I say think
about those in your communitywho you're not tapping into yet.
Have those essentialconversation, link up, meet up,
have the conversations in orderto help delegate some of that,
so it's not just being owned inone central space, and that's a
(11:26):
key to some of the avoidancepiece of burnout is delegation
individual who is working as thefundraiser as well as the
leadership, to understand wheretheir people are at.
How are they delegating?
Are they head down?
Do they have opportunities toconnect to elsewhere and are
they tapping into that for thedeepest, most positive outcome
(11:51):
possible, I would say.
Keith Greer, CFRE (11:53):
Yeah, and so when we were looking at the
article, one of the things thatyou highlighted was the
importance of holisticapproaches.
Can you walk us through what asuccessful holistic well-being
program actually looks like inpractice, because I don't think
many of us have actuallyexperienced a really good one,
especially in a nonprofit whereour resources might be limited.
So what does that look like?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (12:14):
Sure.
So that's going to be superspecific to the organization,
and so the best way to put yourfinger on the feel secure, safe,
that their voice matters andthat their experience matters
(12:42):
and that their contributionsmatter.
And so thinking about this iswe want a program that fosters
trust, psychological safety,balance, flexibility All of
these can be key components intowhat's going to really help
drive some of that well-beingtaking place within an
organization.
But I think the key thing isthe primary thing to understand
(13:06):
is how do people want to becommunicated with?
Because you have to gather dataon this matter.
That's simply the first step tounderstanding what's going to
work well for your specificorganization.
So gathering data looks likeyou know you can create a high
level survey.
Hr can do this.
Learning and development ifthat's a thing where you're at,
(13:26):
learning and development canhelp with this.
It's finding those kind of keypeople in those key roles to
help foster this.
So this can be created, andasking questions like are you
satisfied in your workforce?
Are you seeking moreflexibility?
What does that look like to you?
And having space for people tocommunicate what's going to be
really important to them.
(13:46):
Do they want to be communicatedwith via email.
Would they like to receive atext?
When is that most important tothem?
Research tells us that if we'regoing to take the email approach
and extend a survey, that wouldbest be done on a Tuesday
morning at 10 am versus Thursdayat 4 pm, for example.
Monday people are heavy withemails and different work going
(14:08):
on prepping for the work week.
Friday, people are gettingready to close out or maybe off
for a long weekend, right.
So we know that Tuesday is asweet spot for really gauging
employee well-being.
We know that Tuesday is a sweetspot for really gauging
employee well-being.
Also, a great time to do thatis spring, right, because this
is kind of a new time and soputting your finger on the pulse
in spring is great.
Also, checking back in inOctober is a great time just to
(14:31):
see where your employees are atand what's important to them at
that time.
So that's a strong way ofcreating a foundation to say, ok
, I have this data, now I'mgoing to begin building.
Whether that's sourcing anexternal vendor to help with
some programming, whether it'scompiling YouTube videos and
then some questions to go withthat for a team building day, it
(14:53):
really just depends kind of onwhat's relevant to the people
within your personal org andwhat they're experiencing at
that time.
Keith Greer, CFRE (15:03):
Yeah, and so when our fundraisers are,
they're obviously a lot of timesnot involved in the HR
decisions as part of our dailyjobs.
How can they help push theirorganizations to collect that
meaningful data on the employeewell-being, and how can that
data be used to create long-termchange?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (15:22):
Sure.
So, again, connecting I alwayssay don't be afraid to set up a
meeting and reach out.
It's really important to dosome of that cross-functional
work.
Oftentimes we get super headdown in our spaces and we're
very focused on our goals andthat doesn't leave a whole lot
of opportunity to connect inkind of those cross-function
spaces.
(15:42):
And so thinking about, hey, doI know who my HR person is?
Am I familiar with HR?
Am I familiar?
Do we have learning anddevelopment here?
Am I connecting withcommunications, things like that
?
And so putting a meeting on acalendar and saying, hey, I'd
just like to do a quick connectfor 25 minutes and touch base on
some things that are importantto me, that's going to be a
(16:02):
really strong way to get theball rolling.
The more communication, the morearticulation that's happening
surrounding this, the easier itis for HR to gauge what really
needs to take place and set upthose streams for gathering data
and then putting that together,and so oftentimes people seek
(16:24):
out consultants to do that.
But it really doesn't need tobe that route.
It can be as simple as, again,a high-level survey,
understanding what's importantto your people and ensuring that
there are a few initiatives setup to support that.
People are looking for results.
I think the worst thing thatcan happen is when data is
collected and nothing is donewith it.
(16:45):
That leaves a hole in people'shearts, right.
And it makes people feel unseen,unheard.
So the goal of the reaching outand the conversation and the
collecting of the data is toensure that people feel seen,
heard, and that, in turn, willhelp retain people, especially
from a funding standpoint,fundraisers right that retention
(17:08):
factor should take place andthe data should also reflect
that.
If these programs are done welland I know that kind of sounds
like a whole stream of things,but I've seen this carried out
very well in different spacesand so I believe that there is a
lot of work behind the scenesthat takes place in order to
(17:28):
help this be done well and beimpactful and effective, and
it's not just lip service whenit's done well.
Keith Greer, CFRE (17:35):
So when you're talking about people that
are being seen and heard,that's kind of talking directly
to the culture of the workplace.
And so how does that workplaceculture play in either
alleviating or exacerbating thestress within the organization,
and how can fundraisers take thelead in shaping a healthier
workplace culture?
You know, even if they're notin a senior leadership position.
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (17:58):
Sure.
So I believe that there areleaders in every single seat.
Your title doesn't depend on it.
It's truly your attitude, yourinitiative and what's put before
you, right, and what you createfor yourself.
You know what do you want to bea part of and what do you want
to create, and so I think aboutit from a sense of what is your
passion, right?
You know, where do you want toinvest your energy, what do you
(18:21):
want to show up to every daywhen you come to work?
Everybody's heard of the Sundayscaries, right, where people are
like, oh, I don't, you know,monday's right around the corner
, oh my goodness.
And so I think the purpose isto create that culture, and the
way you do that is, again, toput your finger on the pulse of
people.
So what somebody could do isperhaps propose a committee,
(18:41):
right, a culture committee,workplace culture committee and
assemble some individuals whoare interested in contributing
to that, create a playbook forthat.
You can create a book clubsurrounding what does positive
workplace culture look like.
So there are some differentthings that can take place in
order to help stimulate thisenvironment, and we've also
(19:02):
heard culture eats strategy forbreakfast, right?
That's a very famous quote, andso, strategically speaking,
leaders can put a whole bunch ofstuff into place, but if the
culture of inclusion, of a speakyour voice culture, a speak
your mind culture, if that's notbeing perpetuated, that creates
(19:25):
those silos again, right, andthere's a deterioration, and the
worst thing that can happen isthe meeting after the meeting,
right, and so everybody wentthere and it wasn't kind of the
vibe, and all of a sudden youhave, you know, people
sectioning off to haveconversations about man.
This is tough, right, and sothat's what we want to avoid
(19:47):
with a healthy workplace cultureto really build together, to
come together to understand whatis going to make us not just
survive but thrive, and thatmeans something different to
everybody.
That's why it's super importantif a committee is formed, or if
there is a connection formedthere and something whether it's
formal or informal, to havedifferent voices at the table.
(20:08):
The key is to bring a differentlens forward through everybody
and their contribution in orderto get this holistic approach to
well-being, because if somebodyis experiencing something here,
somebody else may beexperiencing something else, and
so that relevancy factor isextremely important.
But in order to drive all ofthat, there has to be trust, and
(20:31):
so trust is a key inclusivecapability that leaders need to
work on in order to foster therest of this, to really make the
workplace culture anenvironment where individuals
feel soothed, present, welcomeand as though they belong in
order to bring forward theirsuccesses and their challenges
(20:51):
overall.
Keith Greer, CFRE (20:53):
Yeah, and talking about putting together a
committee about this.
This is something that's justkept repeating itself over and
over in my life recently, forwhatever reason, so I kind of
feel the need to bring it up.
But it was this idea of talkingabout how, whenever a new idea
is being presented, you shouldnever present it in a group
meeting.
You should always do the prelegwork to meet with people
(21:15):
one-on-one, pitch them your idea, get that feedback beforehand,
start negotiating at thatone-on-one level so that by the
time you're presenting it to thegroup and you're trying to
implement change, you alreadyhave people that are bought into
this idea of where you'rewanting to go and where you're
wanting to get to.
Because in every meeting italways feels like there's at
(21:35):
least one, debbie Downer, who isgonna find every excuse in the
book to delay, halt or stop theprogress altogether.
But if you're able to have thatkind of coalition around what
you're working towards, you aremuch more effective with
bringing those groups togetheras opposed to launching ideas
(21:56):
straight out of the gates.
What are kind of your thoughtson that?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (22:04):
So I would say transparency is extremely
important, and so beingtransparent about what people
are experiencing and, again,that's why surveys are so
important, that's why outlets toexpress what people are going
through is so important, and sothere should be that
transparency factor in my mindwhen we think about formulating
committees.
And so when there is data thatspeaks to the issue, the data
(22:26):
speaks for itself.
So that takes part of thepressure off the individual to
have to push, push, push,persuade, persuade, persuade for
something to take place.
It's as simple as saying thenumbers and the metrics here.
They're letting us know that weneed to do this, that this
culture isn't as holistic as itcould be, and we know that when
a culture isn't super holisticand when people don't feel
(22:48):
engaged, when people feel likethey have to hide their feelings
or hide aspects of themselvesin the workplace, engagement can
go down by as much as 85%.
And so let that number sink infor leaders and sink in from a
financial component.
What happens if fundraisers areexperiencing an 85% decline in
(23:11):
their engagement in theworkplace?
That impacts the wholecommunity.
So, again, the numbers speakfor themselves, and if the data
says that somebody isn't feelingengaged, that's enough to if
one individual isn't feelingengaged to create a ripple
effect, right, and so you wantto nip that in the bud by
helping to propose strong,systematic approaches to some of
(23:36):
this change.
So when I think about this,keith, I think about how, again,
when we rely on data and datatells us what needs to be done,
some of these things can beembedded in the systems and
processes, right, like theone-on-one situation I was
talking about.
Okay, so now we know, as partof our procedure, we may need to
have touch bases, especially aspart of our onboarding
(23:57):
experience, right, and we needto have those check-ins, not
only with our new employees butour seasoned employees.
Are we having stayconversations, right?
Are we having theseconversations?
When we think about exitinterviews, are we having stay
interviews to see how are peoplefeeling, what's going on here,
what can we do more of, and soreally thinking about ways that
(24:22):
people can really buildthemselves up, build up their
community, their internalcommunity at work it all comes
back to.
Are we building trust?
Are we embedding those valuesinto the systems and processes
that we have?
And when we look at policy, isthat reflective of the
well-being that we're saying?
That needs to be transformativein this environment.
Keith Greer, CFRE (24:45):
And when you talk about that, employees who
are disengaged have an 85% dropin productivity.
I think one of the biggestfrustrations for so many
fundraisers is that nonprofitshave this culture of scarcity
scarcity of resources, scarcityof time and scarcity of an
(25:06):
emotional bandwidth because ofthe work we're doing.
How can nonprofits shift awayfrom this scarcity mindset to
create a more sustainable workenvironment for their employees?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (25:17):
Such a great question that feels like a
million dollar question, Keith.
It really is, if I had thecomplete answer to that, I think
that would be just amazing.
But I think I refer back toconnectivity, staying away from
those silos, really focusing onconversation and checking in.
(25:37):
There are things that managerscan do with their direct reports
.
Who are fundraisers?
Just using different language,right, and so when we think
about the impact that languagehas on our day, part of that is
the recognition factor, right.
But also thinking about usinglanguage and thinking about
leadership styles that trulymatter, and so using words of
(25:59):
encouragement as silly as thatsounds or as cliche as that
sounds, it's true, but havingthere be that authenticity
factor behind it utilize whatthe person is doing and
compliment them on that.
Their efforts are tremendous,and so let's make sure we're
doing that.
But we do know, and researchtells us this, keith, it says
that individuals are more likelyto be uplifted by their peers
(26:24):
than their manager, and sothat's because the peers are the
ones who are interacting on aregular basis, right.
The manager may have lessinteraction taking place on that
daily basis, and so peerrecognition is a huge piece of
this.
So teaching peers how torecognize each other and
understanding the individualnuances of how people want to be
(26:46):
recognized plays a large partin this, of course, as well, and
so some people want to berecognized with a note, some
people want that publicrecognition, some people want to
be recognized privately indiscussion.
So there's a lot of differentways that people want to be
recognized and that I think thatconnectivity piece will help
(27:07):
break down some of that, sopeople don't feel so alone in
their experience, so overwhelmed, so burned out.
Keith Greer, CFRE (27:13):
And so let's get practical for just a minute.
What are some of the firststeps that a fundraiser or a
nonprofit leader can take todayto start influencing their
organization toward betterwell-being practices?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (27:24):
Connect, talk to your people, communicate
, communicate, communicate whatis lacking, what is going well,
what needs to stop, what needsto pause and what needs to
continue.
Taking inventory is going to bereally important in doing that,
through communication and sotaking the step to connect,
being transparent and sayingthat, hey, I understand that
(27:45):
this is super overwhelming rightnow, or I understand we're
having a great year.
What are we going to do tocontinue that momentum right?
Or what are we going to do inthe areas where this burnout is
so severe?
And how can I delegatedifferently from an individual
standpoint, when we think aboutindividual contributors and
fundraisers, I would say the keyis to speak up, use your voice
(28:06):
and explain what is not workingfor you right now, simply what
is not going well.
One way to do that is to have acrucial conversation, and so
that's kind of just focusing inon you know, this is what's
happening for me, this is myresults at this time.
You're sticking to the facts,you're explaining.
These are my numbers right now,or this was my experience, and
(28:27):
I may need a new strategy or anew approach, but again, the
culture is what's going to helpshape the opportunity to build
that new strategy or tore-strategize, to re-energize
some of those capabilities.
Keith Greer, CFRE (28:41):
And so looking forward.
How do you see the future ofworkplace well-being programs,
evolving especially aroundhigh-pressure roles like in
fundraising, and whatinnovations or trends should
nonprofit leaders be payingattention to in order to create
that lasting change?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (28:56):
Sure.
So I would say generationaldiversity is going to play a
huge part in understanding whattakes place next and how things
shape out.
And so we know, in 2025, we'regoing to have a new set of Gen Z
managers coming in, and that'sgoing to really, really shape
(29:16):
part of what the well-beingprocess looks like within the
workplace.
That is for sure.
Gen Z is one of the mosttherapized generations that we
have known to us at this point,and so we know that Gen Z plays
a large part in shaping some ofthat well-being, and they have
an open approach to well-being,right, and so that's very
(29:38):
different from some of the othergenerations.
That research would speak to usand say maybe there are some
differences there, and sothere's going to be, I think,
opportunity for growth and, atthe same time, we think about
tech, right, and how we use techwhen it comes to well-being,
and so there's going to be, Ithink, a drive towards learning
(29:58):
how technology really holdsclose and safe for evolvement of
well-being in the workplace.
It may be as quick as opening anapp up on a phone.
It may be, you know, again,thinking that generational
diversity, thinking about peoplewho like to have one-on-one
experiences or group experiencesin person.
(30:19):
And so, again, keeping yourfinger on the pulse of your own
community is super important,and when you see those
differences be strategic in yourofferings, that's my word of
advice.
And so if we do haveindividuals who like a
one-on-one experience on an appor who like to utilize tech for
their well-being, that's great.
If you have individuals who sayI'd like a book club, I'd like
(30:43):
to formulate a committee, haveindividuals who say I'd like a
book club, I'd like to formulatea committee, I'd like to do
more in the workplace for teambuilding excellent from a
culture component.
And so think about how tointegrate tech into some of
those experiences.
There's lots of ways to do thatand there are different
platforms that can help do that,and so it's really about kind
of that flexibility factor.
(31:04):
When we think about how we'regoing to evolve, I think my
answer would be how are we goingto be most flexible to meet the
needs of the people?
Keith Greer, CFRE (31:12):
I think that's a great place for us to
wrap up today.
Being flexible for the needs ofour employees is really, really
important, but if somebodywants to reach out and follow up
with you for more information,or if they maybe want to do any
kind of consulting services,where can people find you?
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (31:29):
I can be reached on LinkedIn, so please
reach out, connect with me inLinkedIn space and I'm happy to
talk further.
Keith Greer, CFRE (31:36):
Perfect, and we'll put a link to your
LinkedIn right in the bio and inthe show notes of this, so head
right there to be able toconnect with Raiya Sankari Diaz.
Thank you so much for beinghere and for sharing your wisdom
and your expertise.
We really appreciate it.
Raiya Sankari-Diaz (31:49):
Thank you, Keith.
Thanks for having me.
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