January 23, 2024 • 26 mins
Ever dreamt of ditching your corporate gig to start your own creative agency? Emma, the brains behind Sparo Studios, did just that. Join us as we unravel Emma's journey from her childhood in prairies in Canada, to the bustling corporate world of Sydney, Australia to founding a thriving design agency. This isn't just a story of entrepreneurial courage—it's a playbook for leaders who want to steer their teams with authenticity and shared values.
The highlights of our conversation include Emma's honesty about three of her key leadership lessons:
1. What made her grow from a "terrible boss who churned through staff"
2. How leading with values helped her fire someone on her wedding day
3. When systems streamlined her ability to scale
We all know that values are the backbone of any successful organisation, but how do you embed them? Emma and I dig deep into how honesty, community, growth, and creativity aren't just lofty ideals at Sparo Studios; they're actionable standards that are used daily to create a culture of trust and psychological safety with the team and clients.
By the end of this chat, you'll walk away with strategies and insights to not just boost your leadership by 1%, but to create an environment where your team and business can thrive. Don't miss out on Emma's incredible journey and the valuable wisdom gained from steering a small studio to great successes.
Book your free strategy call with the Director of Sparo Studios Emma here
or get in contact with her on
Linkedin
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Guest Bio - Emma Sparrow, Sparo Studios
Emma (Em) is the founder and creative director of Sparo Studios - a strategic design agency with an all-women team of innovative, results-driven designers, developers, and strategists.
A Canadian prairie girl who tore up her acceptance letter to business school and moved across the world to find something more. After spending 3 years working in a creativity-killing corporate role, she knew there was no opportunity for her to truly push herself and live the life she wanted to live.
So in 2019, the business came to life. After years of epic growth, the agency evolved from 1 to a team with a combined 20+ years of experience in the industry.
Outspoken leaders in strategic branding and design for established businesses — Em and her team are well known for thinking (and creating) outside the box and doing things differently.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Emma Sparrow (00:00):
We've got our four values top of mind, and that's
honesty, community, growth andcreativity.
And so when we onboard our team, when we bring them on, they're
very much aware of this.
But also when hardconversations are had, these are
brought to light so theyunderstand where decisions are
being made.
Kate Peardon (00:17):
Welcome to the level up leadership podcast.
This is the go to podcast forchronically busy leaders and
small business owners who areready to get out of the weeds
and start leading.
The weekly episodes have microleadership lessons focused on
how to level up your leadershipand help you to be 1% better
every day.
It's all about growing yourleadership wisdom, building your
(00:38):
team and being the leaderpeople want to work for.
So let's get into it.
Em is the founder and creativedirector of Sparrow Studios, a
strategic design agency with anall woman team of innovative
results driven designers,developers and strategists.
Now M is a Canadian Prairie girlwho I happen to know
(01:01):
represented Saskatchewan inhorse trivia which maybe we'll
ask about later but she tore upher acceptance letter to
business school and moved acrossthe world to find something
more and who knew?
She'd find it here in Australia.
So she spent three yearsworking in a creativity killing
corporate role but knew therewas no opportunity for her to
truly push herself and live thelife she wanted to live.
So in 2019, a story we'll heara little bit more about her
(01:24):
business can be a little bitmore about her business came to
life.
So, after years of epic growth,the agency has involved, from
herself to a team of combined 20plus years of experience in the
industry.
Now Sparrow Studios is knownfor their outspoken leaders in
strategic branding and designfor established businesses a
business that I have used myselfand they're known for thinking
(01:46):
and creating outside the box anddoing things differently, which
is no surprise why I love Em,because that is one of my
favorite things to do.
So Em welcome to the podcast,thank you.
Emma Sparrow (01:54):
so much for having me.
I'm so excited to talk aboutall things leadership today.
Kate Peardon (01:59):
Well, we've got three particular leadership
lessons that we're going toshare with the listeners today,
and we had a good chat about thedifferent things that you've
learnt from your leadership and,I think, to get started to
understand these lessons, it'snice to hear a little bit of a
background of how you got towhere you are, because that
gives the context to what theseleadership lessons are.
So do you mind sharing a littlebit on how you got to where you
(02:21):
are in Sparrow Studios?
Emma Sparrow (02:23):
Definitely, I started out in a corporate role
in Sydney.
I was working in finance and Ialways joked that I worked in
finance but was terrible withnumbers.
So, I always knew I was goingto start my own business one day
, and that's where SparrowStudios came to light.
Really, I started because Ineeded to restart my visa and
(02:43):
get out of the country, and so Istarted it in Bali and got the
ball rolling, and then I reallydeep dived into UX design and
then started to grow my agency.
Kate Peardon (02:55):
And for those that are maybe not aware, so Em is
Canadian but is now living inAustralia, in the beautiful
Sunshine Coast in Queensland.
So Canada to Sydney, to Bali,to Sydney and then to Sunshine
Coast.
Emma Sparrow (03:08):
Yes, exactly, I moved here when I was 18.
I moved to Sydney for six yearsand then, of course, the sunny
Sunshine Coast was calling ourname and we moved up here about
three years ago.
Kate Peardon (03:19):
A lot of people have loved to move to Sunshine
Coast, and I moved probablysimilar time, and it's starting
to boom up here.
Your business has gone fromjust you and I know in the last
two years you've been thenbuilding your team, which is
where these wonderful leadershiplessons have started to blossom
.
Emma Sparrow (03:35):
Yes, exactly, it's been a roller coaster, and I
mean anyone who starts their ownbusiness and starts hiring a
team.
There's a lot of lessons thatyou have to learn that they
don't teach you in school.
Kate Peardon (03:46):
One of the things you'd said to me is you had to
unlearn a lot of the things youlearnt in corporate.
What does that mean?
Emma Sparrow (03:53):
Yeah, so I came from an office that was very
much male dominated, which isvery normal in the banking and
finance world.
When I began, I started in anadmin role, slowly started to
hire different employees, but Iwas still very much the
designated coffee getter,setting up a lot of systems and
taking care of that side ofthings.
But communication was verystructured to the point and I
(04:17):
knew that I wanted to grow anagency that came from a more
feminine type of role.
We run an all women team, butwe also wanted to lead from a
sense of empathy and lead a teamwhere everyone felt like they
were a part of it, that theywere a huge part of the
community.
Every company they say theyhave a set of values in their
business, but with our teamtalking about it and bringing it
(04:40):
into our company culture.
Kate Peardon (04:41):
Well, maybe that's a good spot to start A lot of
businesses that I work in.
When we talk about leadership,what does leadership mean to you
, what's the special source ofyour leadership and what is
important to you?
And it's really easy to presumethat what's important to you is
important to everybody becauseit's so natural for you.
But sometimes writing downthose values helps you put on
paper and have a way you canhave these conversations with
(05:03):
your team and people withsmaller businesses might get
some values and put them on thewall or might not think about
the idea of values.
Same with big businesses youmight get the values and put
them on the wall, but it's verydifferent to have values, to
actually run and lead yourbusiness with your values.
And I know you have some greatexamples of this particular
leadership lessons, of leadingwith values.
(05:23):
Can you share a bit about that?
Emma Sparrow (05:25):
Yes, a bit of a backstory.
When I first started mybusiness, I was a terrible
leader.
I started with hiring peopleand bringing people on board.
There was no clarity, we had novalue set at that point, we
hadn't done any developmentaround company culture and I was
churning a lot of employees.
A lot of employees were comingthrough and I was not
(05:48):
communicating what I needed fromthem and in turn, they were
leaving or we were ending not inthe great terms.
I hired someone at one point andthey now still work with my
client a really good client ofmine, because I had actually
referred them on but we ended inbad terms and actually had a
conversation with her six monthsago and I apologize because I
know that we've done all thisdevelopment.
But we have very much developedthose values of our clients
(06:12):
when it comes to brand strategyand we find our clients love to
use that in marketing but wevery much make sure that it
comes into our company cultureand everything that we do with
our team, and so we've got ourfour values top of mind and
that's honesty, community,growth and creativity.
And so when we onboard our team, when we bring them on, they're
very much aware of this, butalso when hard conversations are
(06:33):
had, these are brought to lightso they understand where
decisions are being made.
Can you?
Kate Peardon (06:37):
share a bit about how that actually happens,
because I think we understandthe idea that we have values and
we lead to values, but actuallyhaving a conversation using the
values like a hard conversation.
People are always curious andask me how does that work?
Emma Sparrow (06:51):
We actually have a very recent example that's very
fresh for our team and I wentaway for a few months overseas
or getting married.
We had someone step into aleadership role and she very
much wasn't the right fit inthat role and we noticed
bullying and not that sense ofcommunity where we lead from
when she was working with thatother team member and we had to
(07:13):
make that hard decision to lether go.
But in those conversations,obviously, when you have someone
who is at the top of thecompany or moving towards a more
leadership role, when thatperson leaves the company, it
can be a very hard conversationwith the rest of the team and so
when we made that decision, itwas very much led from where we
come from in terms of our values.
(07:34):
Once it happened, we sat ourentire team down and reminded
them of the culture we're tryingto create within our team and
showed them this is what we needfrom you.
Your role is not in danger.
There's a space for you here,but there's a reason and there's
a way we run our company and ifyou want to be a part of this,
we really lean on these ways,not just for our clients but
(07:56):
also for our team to enjoy andlove the space that they're in
and we see it a lot in ourreviews that we have with our
team members every six monthsand they really bring back to
that and they really appreciatethat we always stick to those
particular values and bring itup in regular conversations.
Kate Peardon (08:12):
It reminds me of the other value that you
mentioned honesty and I thinkabout times when I've worked
with people and they've had tohave tough conversations with
their team or someone's had toleave the business and their
uncomfortable conversations foreverybody.
It's rare that someone feelscomfort in that, and then it's
not just the conversation youhave with that one person, but
how do you bring your team ontothe journey so they don't feel
(08:33):
concerned about their job.
And something that you justshared that I think could be a
good one percenter for ourlisteners is sit down with the
team and talk through.
We can't always share all theinformation.
It's important for somediscretion, but share what you
can in an honest way so theyunderstand how you make your
decisions and it's based onvalues and keep people across
why the business runs the waythat it does, and I think
(08:56):
honesty, being one of yourvalues, is something you've
naturally done and I think it issomething that our listeners
could also take it as their onepercent of.
Okay, I've got to have a toughconversation, but this impacts
everybody.
How do I have that conversationthen, with the whole team?
Emma Sparrow (09:10):
When you got something that happened.
We would love it if it was justalways an uphill climb, but
especially when you're running ateam, there's hurdles, there's
downward slopes, there's thingsthat just don't go perfectly,
and that's where our core valueis honesty, and we're very
upfront with our team in termsof what's happening, obviously
in a tasteful way, especiallywhen other people involved, but
(09:31):
it's important that they'reaware of everything that's
happening and really clear on itand knowing the reason why
they're being told thisinformation as well.
Kate Peardon (09:39):
It gives good psychological safety for your
team as well.
Exactly.
Emma Sparrow (09:43):
They see the future in the company and they
don't see it as just a role forthem.
They see it very much as a longterm part of their career.
Just us able to communicatethat set of things and be really
upfront and honest in terms ofwhere they are in the company
really helps.
Kate Peardon (09:57):
And I think this honesty is a good lead into your
second leadership lesson.
And it stems from that you sayyou're a pretty shit boss.
Emma Sparrow (10:05):
Yes, 100%.
I don't think I'm the only one.
Maybe I'm the only one to admitit.
I know that entrepreneurs, wehave very different skill sets
when it comes to running abusiness.
It's a very different skill set, I believe, to start a business
versus when you grow your team.
You have to step into adifferent type of role and
that's really the greatesthurdle for anyone that's small
(10:28):
business and wanting to grow andexpand is jumping into that
leadership role.
At least that's what I found inmy own business and I've had to
spend a lot of time developingthose skills, reading a lot of
resources, listening to Kate,going to her workshops, getting
to learn who I am as a leader.
Over time we've been throughthe ringer, we've dealt with
different situations and turnedthrough different staff members,
(10:49):
but if I had spent that timeearlier on in my journey
learning those key leadershipskills, it would have made a
world of difference.
Kate Peardon (10:57):
I think it's such a good point about leadership
being learned.
There's an earlier podcastepisode that I talk about the
leadership ladder, and whathappens is when you're
technically really good at whatyou do, you either lead other
people doing what you're doing.
So either you're an engineer,and then you lead all the
engineers, or you're a webdeveloper you lead the other two
web developers, or you startyour own business, and I think
anyone listening to thisthinking leadership is really
(11:18):
hard.
It's a great reminder that itis a skill that you can learn.
Leadership is learned.
Emma Sparrow (11:23):
It's very learnable, and if you are
someone who's a natural bornleader, it's almost harder to
teach leadership because atleast I've found, it's almost
like that.
People come from the bottom.
They have to learn how todevelop those skills, and so
that's been another hurdle, aswell as remembering back that I
also had to learn these skills,so I have to teach my other
leaders how to learn theseskills too.
Kate Peardon (11:45):
Reminds me of learning a second language.
If it's something that you havelearned growing up, it comes so
naturally you don't think muchof it.
But if you learn as an adult,you have to learn the whole
structure of how things to gotogether.
How do you put this sentence?
All the different terms andthere's so much to understand.
It can really hurt your brain.
But if someone that knowsleadership so naturally won't
think about all the bits that gointo it like you would if you
(12:07):
knew a language as a kid, so Ithink people that are learning
leadership just to remember thatthere are so many parts of it
and we can help people comingsort of behind us with
leadership by giving a few tipsand not just presuming, which I
think is your point remembering.
Ah, this is something I knownow, but I didn't always.
Emma Sparrow (12:25):
Exactly what you said before, like it's a whole
different ladder.
So you have to remember whenyou're asking in the past to
grow, you need obviously leadersto oversee different teams and
as they jump onto the otherladder, they've got so much to
learn too.
Kate Peardon (12:38):
So the growth process can hurt, but it does
get better.
And one thing that really helpsis your third leadership lesson
that you've picked up, and thisis something that you are
phenomenal at.
It's a way that your brainworks, and I think it's great to
hear a little bit about thisleadership lesson, because
hearing how you've done it willhelp a lot of other people.
Emma Sparrow (12:58):
So I actually learned this from going to one
of your first workshops.
It's actually where I firstheard of you.
This was probably just astepping stone to it all and
it's really evolved over as wego, but I learned what type of
leader I was at the very firstworkshop that I went to yours
and really started to developthose skills.
(13:18):
But a huge way that I work is Iknow what kind of leader I am
and then I've developed systemsto incorporate different pieces
of leadership that may not be mystrong suit, so I am very much
a systemized learner and I meananyone who has built a business
has to build operations.
So either they're gonna be asystemized learner or they're
(13:39):
gonna have someone on their teamthat can do something like this
.
But setting up systems anywherein your business where you or
your leadership team may belacking to be able to make sure
you're hitting all differentpoints of leadership and just
having a well-rounded culture.
Kate Peardon (13:56):
Can you share a couple of the systems that you
have set up?
As you said, they're not yourarea of expertise.
Emma Sparrow (14:02):
Yeah, the very first thing when we bring on
employees is we're veryparticular in terms of the
information that they get asthey onboard our onboarding
process with us.
So we're making sure that we'resetting really clear
expectations, because I know asa leader that I talk very
quickly, I'm very much an ideasleader and I can get a lot of
(14:25):
ideas out and my team don't getto absorb them completely.
So we have very set onboardingand information that gets our
team members onboarded and sothat starts with they get their
full employee handbook, they gettheir onboarding call and then
we set their three months, sixmonths, 12 month goals and work
towards those, and so very muchgetting that onboarding process
(14:48):
sets the transparency for them.
They're able to see everythingreal clear.
And then we have regularcheck-ins with our team members.
So we're constantly, everysingle week my leaders are
trying to do this, but I do thisas well we try to keep it
personal, but not too personalwhere they have to open up,
where it might not beappropriate for them.
So we have check-ins where we'llask the question from one to
(15:09):
five how is your workflow today?
And then they'll either say oneor five.
If it's below five, then we sayhow can we make it a five?
And then they can open up andfigure out is it a problem with
the actual systems or if it'ssomething where they need to sit
down and figure out where theycan improve.
And then the final question weask is how is your personal
happiness from one to five?
And being a remote team, it'svery difficult to see how
(15:33):
everyone's feeling throughoutthe day, and so this is a way
for us to check in and see howthey're going, without them
feeling like they have to fullyopen up and completely share
their soul when they might notbe completely comfortable with
it.
So if it's anything below, thenwe'll say is there anything we
can do to make it a five?
And then they can either feelcomfortable enough to share or
we can move on and know that weneed to check in with them in
(15:55):
the future.
So we have those very sets onboarding process, but also
check-ins as well, and make surethat, again coming back to our
values, very transparent in ourway of working with our team
members, which make them feelreally comfortable in sharing
and collaborating with everyone.
Kate Peardon (16:12):
The thing I love about that is, when you set up a
system, it doesn't rely on youremembering every time, but also
people know what to expect.
So, again, psychological safetyof the team, there's clarity
and just your recruitmentprocess.
So you have a set process thatpeople go through when they come
on board.
They have their inductionprocess and, like you said,
there's initial conversation,three, six, 12 month check-ins,
(16:34):
which is always what I recommendpeople do.
Even if you're really clear onwhat they should do and they're
doing a great job, if you justwait until things aren't going
well to have a conversation,they're always gonna be panicked
that you're gonna pick up thephone and call them when things
aren't going well.
Having that structure in placeis both ways.
So these systems can help you,especially if you're not a
(16:56):
systems person, which, as Emsaid, it's not her leadership
style.
So, knowing your leadershipstyle and working at well, how
can I set up my business tosupport me in the things that
I'm not so great in?
Emma Sparrow (17:07):
Exactly and like that, three to six month is just
a great way for you to setexpectations, especially someone
who may struggle to have thosehard conversations.
We actually sit down in writingand go through it together on
an actual presentation and talkabout what they're gonna expect
from the whole position in thefirst three to six to 12 months.
(17:29):
And again, it just helps you inthose hard conversations where
you might struggle to,especially when you're starting
out.
That's probably one of thehardest things is having those
types of conversations so you'reable to show them and really
clear in terms of what they needto do.
So if that conversation iscoming, they're almost aware
because they know that this isfully outlined from the initial
get go.
Kate Peardon (17:49):
Yeah, expectation management looks like the number
one thing for leadership.
Emma Sparrow (17:53):
Exactly, and it can all be so simply systemized
and just through your generaloperations.
And lots of times when we'resetting up a business, we set up
the operations for the business, but when you hire a team, it's
really important that you setup the operations for your team
to make sure that that issystemized and everyone again is
getting the equal treatment,they're getting full
(18:16):
transparency.
And then we even systemize thetypes of fun that we have within
the office because we're aremote team.
So there's so many ways thatyou can set this up, especially
if you know that you struggle incertain areas.
Kate Peardon (18:29):
Yeah, and I also highly recommend it to my
clients.
We'll talk about how do youwant to set up your systems, to
run your team.
And then what about the cultureof your business?
How often will you be havingand it doesn't necessarily have
to be a social, face to faceevent, particularly if you're
not in the same location, buthow can you still connect?
Because, in the end of the day,we're all people that are
working together.
So even if people aren't havingthose face to face social
(18:51):
interactions, we still need somesort of interaction, and if you
systematize it, you don't haveto remember it 100%.
Emma Sparrow (18:57):
And lots of times when you're starting a business,
a lot of us are introverts.
Building that connection isvery much easy to put on the
back burner and forget about.
So there's certain ways thatwill run our connection calls.
You know, have once a monthconnection call and I've got the
team love it.
I've got my set silly questionsper se about them, especially
(19:20):
when you have a team that isvery diverse or even remote as
well.
Getting to know them and askingthem those kinds of questions
that you usually don't askunless you're taking your team
out for a coffee or a drinkafter work or something like
that, or dinner, like what didyou want to be when you grew up?
For just anything that wouldstart the conversation and out
of the box answer, and it'ssomething that is so ridiculous.
(19:43):
But they look forward to everysingle monthly call.
It's just a way for us toconnect and something for them
to laugh about when usuallyconnection wouldn't be me being
an introvert.
That wouldn't be the firstthing that I would be reaching
for as a leader.
Kate Peardon (19:58):
Well, we were actually having a mastermind
dinner and this question came upwhat is your secret skill?
Again, a silly question.
And what was your answer?
Horse trivia.
Yes, and please, please explainmore, because this was such a
fantastic conversation that camefrom one of these so-called
silly questions.
Emma Sparrow (20:16):
Yeah, so I grew up from a farming background, so
we were very much in Pony Club Ibelieve it's in Australia here
too and I was a part of the quizteam.
So I traveled around Canadadoing horse trivia.
So how many inches in a hand,or what was this famous
racehorse's name?
That was something I competedfor.
(20:38):
So these are the kinds ofquestions that we throw a team
all the time and it definitelygets a giggle.
Kate Peardon (20:42):
Well, it did, and I feel like I know you so much
better now that I know that yourepresented Saskatchewan in
horse trivia.
You weren't just good at, youwere really good.
Emma Sparrow (20:51):
Yeah, I ran the Saskatchewan team.
We were a small population, butit's still really good.
Kate Peardon (20:57):
So with your business Sparrow Studios.
My last question is what?
Is the thing that you love todo the most for clients.
Emma Sparrow (21:05):
Yeah, so we are a result driven web design and
development agency and what wedo really well is we've
developed this process that's acombination of user experience,
design and brand strategy and webring our team together that's
a mix of designers, developersand strategists to create our
(21:25):
clients results and reallyfocusing on our clients overall
goals and then bringing thattogether with design and
websites.
Kate Peardon (21:32):
So if someone works with you, they can expect
a great user based website andwhat else.
Emma Sparrow (21:38):
Yeah, exactly so.
We do websites that are verymuch focused on the user and the
experience that they have, butwe bring all the pieces together
.
So we're very much aboutsitting down with our clients,
getting understanding of whatthey need from their business in
the next three to five yearsand then seeing how a website
would fit into that or a brandas well, and then help them,
(21:59):
bring all those pieces togetherand talk about what the plan is
post launch and support them notjust with the website, but also
ongoing.
We're able to support them allthe way through, have constant
strategies with our clients andcheck in with them and make sure
that their website isperforming and helping them grow
, and so our team is a core partof that and something that we
all absolutely love to do.
Kate Peardon (22:20):
Recently I got to experience having a strategy
call for you and it was a greatexperience to sit down and
really think about my websiteand where I want to be, and does
this website support it, and Iknow this is a service that you
offer people.
How do they get their hands onthat?
Emma Sparrow (22:38):
So on our website.
You can jump on there andthere's just a short form to
download our packages guide andyou'll see a link.
We can also drop a link in theshow notes as well.
But yeah, we offer freestrategy calls for anyone who's
looking to they feel that theirwebsite might just not be doing
or working for them.
And especially in this same age, your website is your
(23:00):
storefront.
Everyone is going to beGoogling and trying to find you
first online.
It's so important that whatevergoals you have for your
business, your website fits intothat.
So we love sitting out downwith people and figuring out you
know, what are they, what aretheir pain points, what are they
working towards, and then wecan talk about and backtrack and
see how a website or a brandfits into that.
Kate Peardon (23:19):
And I always say we're always growing.
You don't want to stay in thesame space.
We, as humans, we continue toevolve, so it makes sense that
our businesses continue toevolve, particularly if you are
a small business or a founderbusiness.
Your business is a reflectionof who you are.
So if you've changed, it'slikely that your business has
changed, which is likely thatyour website needs to change,
(23:40):
which is a conversation that youand I have been having recently
, like how have I changed andhow have my services changed,
and is my website stillreflecting that?
And it definitely needs someupdating.
Emma Sparrow (23:51):
That's the thing, though, with businesses.
We are evolving, like we'reinvolving our team or our
business or marketing.
That's what we're supposed tobe doing.
We're having a lot of theseconversations recently because
of the way that the wholeindustry has evolved so quickly
in the past not even 24 months,but 12 months, I mean.
The whole industry and thewhole economy has changed so
(24:14):
quickly that everyone is kind ofdoing a little bit of a 180.
And so we're having this a lot,and that's not a wrong thing.
Businesses, it's supposed toevolve, it's supposed to grow,
and it's so crucial that yourwebsite and your brand is
growing with you, and also youhave a team to support you that
you trust, that is there foryour best interests and it's
going to help you grow and be apart of that Well.
Kate Peardon (24:36):
Em nand her business growth have three
leadership lessons.
So if you're wanting to takeyour 1% from today, we talked
about these three things whichwas leading with your values,
that leadership is learned, thatEm used to be a really good
boss and now is a good boss, andI can tell you, because I've
spoken to her team, she doesactually do the things that she
says that she's doing.
(24:56):
And the third big leadershiplessons were about systems and
how to set up your system tosupport your style as a natural
leader.
You don't have to change whoyou are to be a leader, and I
think that's probably a reallygood little side note.
We think we need to change whowe are to lead a team.
I believe if you know who youare, you can then set up your
business and your systems andyour team to support everyone to
(25:18):
be the best in who they are,because we all perform better
that way.
Is there anything you'd like toadd to close up today?
Emma Sparrow (25:25):
A huge part of the development that we've done in
our leadership and ourleadership styles is a big part
of working alongside you andlearning from you.
Okay, it's been incredible, andI know we've also sent one of
my team leaders to yourworkshops and that's been a huge
reason for the way we'vedeveloped our team and we've
developed our company culture,and I know that my team leader
(25:46):
has taken a step back based onwhat she's learned from you as
well, and anyone who's curiousabout your services too.
It's just done tremendous forus and our company.
Kate Peardon (25:57):
Thank you very much, amy.
Make me embarrassed.
If you're watching this, you'llsee there.
Thank you for joining on thepodcast today.
I will put in the show notesthe transcript with your
leadership lessons, but also thelinks for people to book in for
their strategy call if theyneed an update on their website
and for people that arelistening to this.
I'm all about your 1% of whatcan you take from this podcast
(26:18):
that can help your leadership be1% better.
So having a think through theselessons from Em about values,
about learning leadership andabout systems and pick one thing
that you want to implement tomake your life is a little bit
easier.
Thanks for listening in.
It's amazing.
Emma Sparrow (26:31):
Thanks for having me, kate, you're very welcome.
We've got our four values top of mind, and that's
honesty, community, growth andcreativity.
And so when we onboard our team, when we bring them on, they're
very much aware of this.
But also when hardconversations are had, these are
brought to light so theyunderstand where decisions are
being made.
Kate Peardon (00:17):
Welcome to the level up leadership podcast.
This is the go to podcast forchronically busy leaders and
small business owners who areready to get out of the weeds
and start leading.
The weekly episodes have microleadership lessons focused on
how to level up your leadershipand help you to be 1% better
every day.
It's all about growing yourleadership wisdom, building your
(00:38):
team and being the leaderpeople want to work for.
So let's get into it.
Em is the founder and creativedirector of Sparrow Studios, a
strategic design agency with anall woman team of innovative
results driven designers,developers and strategists.
Now M is a Canadian Prairie girlwho I happen to know
(01:01):
represented Saskatchewan inhorse trivia which maybe we'll
ask about later but she tore upher acceptance letter to
business school and moved acrossthe world to find something
more and who knew?
She'd find it here in Australia.
So she spent three yearsworking in a creativity killing
corporate role but knew therewas no opportunity for her to
truly push herself and live thelife she wanted to live.
So in 2019, a story we'll heara little bit more about her
(01:24):
business can be a little bitmore about her business came to
life.
So, after years of epic growth,the agency has involved, from
herself to a team of combined 20plus years of experience in the
industry.
Now Sparrow Studios is knownfor their outspoken leaders in
strategic branding and designfor established businesses a
business that I have used myselfand they're known for thinking
(01:46):
and creating outside the box anddoing things differently, which
is no surprise why I love Em,because that is one of my
favorite things to do.
So Em welcome to the podcast,thank you.
Emma Sparrow (01:54):
so much for having me.
I'm so excited to talk aboutall things leadership today.
Kate Peardon (01:59):
Well, we've got three particular leadership
lessons that we're going toshare with the listeners today,
and we had a good chat about thedifferent things that you've
learnt from your leadership and,I think, to get started to
understand these lessons, it'snice to hear a little bit of a
background of how you got towhere you are, because that
gives the context to what theseleadership lessons are.
So do you mind sharing a littlebit on how you got to where you
(02:21):
are in Sparrow Studios?
Emma Sparrow (02:23):
Definitely, I started out in a corporate role
in Sydney.
I was working in finance and Ialways joked that I worked in
finance but was terrible withnumbers.
So, I always knew I was goingto start my own business one day
, and that's where SparrowStudios came to light.
Really, I started because Ineeded to restart my visa and
(02:43):
get out of the country, and so Istarted it in Bali and got the
ball rolling, and then I reallydeep dived into UX design and
then started to grow my agency.
Kate Peardon (02:55):
And for those that are maybe not aware, so Em is
Canadian but is now living inAustralia, in the beautiful
Sunshine Coast in Queensland.
So Canada to Sydney, to Bali,to Sydney and then to Sunshine
Coast.
Emma Sparrow (03:08):
Yes, exactly, I moved here when I was 18.
I moved to Sydney for six yearsand then, of course, the sunny
Sunshine Coast was calling ourname and we moved up here about
three years ago.
Kate Peardon (03:19):
A lot of people have loved to move to Sunshine
Coast, and I moved probablysimilar time, and it's starting
to boom up here.
Your business has gone fromjust you and I know in the last
two years you've been thenbuilding your team, which is
where these wonderful leadershiplessons have started to blossom
.
Emma Sparrow (03:35):
Yes, exactly, it's been a roller coaster, and I
mean anyone who starts their ownbusiness and starts hiring a
team.
There's a lot of lessons thatyou have to learn that they
don't teach you in school.
Kate Peardon (03:46):
One of the things you'd said to me is you had to
unlearn a lot of the things youlearnt in corporate.
What does that mean?
Emma Sparrow (03:53):
Yeah, so I came from an office that was very
much male dominated, which isvery normal in the banking and
finance world.
When I began, I started in anadmin role, slowly started to
hire different employees, but Iwas still very much the
designated coffee getter,setting up a lot of systems and
taking care of that side ofthings.
But communication was verystructured to the point and I
(04:17):
knew that I wanted to grow anagency that came from a more
feminine type of role.
We run an all women team, butwe also wanted to lead from a
sense of empathy and lead a teamwhere everyone felt like they
were a part of it, that theywere a huge part of the
community.
Every company they say theyhave a set of values in their
business, but with our teamtalking about it and bringing it
(04:40):
into our company culture.
Kate Peardon (04:41):
Well, maybe that's a good spot to start A lot of
businesses that I work in.
When we talk about leadership,what does leadership mean to you
, what's the special source ofyour leadership and what is
important to you?
And it's really easy to presumethat what's important to you is
important to everybody becauseit's so natural for you.
But sometimes writing downthose values helps you put on
paper and have a way you canhave these conversations with
(05:03):
your team and people withsmaller businesses might get
some values and put them on thewall or might not think about
the idea of values.
Same with big businesses youmight get the values and put
them on the wall, but it's verydifferent to have values, to
actually run and lead yourbusiness with your values.
And I know you have some greatexamples of this particular
leadership lessons, of leadingwith values.
(05:23):
Can you share a bit about that?
Emma Sparrow (05:25):
Yes, a bit of a backstory.
When I first started mybusiness, I was a terrible
leader.
I started with hiring peopleand bringing people on board.
There was no clarity, we had novalue set at that point, we
hadn't done any developmentaround company culture and I was
churning a lot of employees.
A lot of employees were comingthrough and I was not
(05:48):
communicating what I needed fromthem and in turn, they were
leaving or we were ending not inthe great terms.
I hired someone at one point andthey now still work with my
client a really good client ofmine, because I had actually
referred them on but we ended inbad terms and actually had a
conversation with her six monthsago and I apologize because I
know that we've done all thisdevelopment.
But we have very much developedthose values of our clients
(06:12):
when it comes to brand strategyand we find our clients love to
use that in marketing but wevery much make sure that it
comes into our company cultureand everything that we do with
our team, and so we've got ourfour values top of mind and
that's honesty, community,growth and creativity.
And so when we onboard our team, when we bring them on, they're
very much aware of this, butalso when hard conversations are
(06:33):
had, these are brought to lightso they understand where
decisions are being made.
Can you?
Kate Peardon (06:37):
share a bit about how that actually happens,
because I think we understandthe idea that we have values and
we lead to values, but actuallyhaving a conversation using the
values like a hard conversation.
People are always curious andask me how does that work?
Emma Sparrow (06:51):
We actually have a very recent example that's very
fresh for our team and I wentaway for a few months overseas
or getting married.
We had someone step into aleadership role and she very
much wasn't the right fit inthat role and we noticed
bullying and not that sense ofcommunity where we lead from
when she was working with thatother team member and we had to
(07:13):
make that hard decision to lether go.
But in those conversations,obviously, when you have someone
who is at the top of thecompany or moving towards a more
leadership role, when thatperson leaves the company, it
can be a very hard conversationwith the rest of the team and so
when we made that decision, itwas very much led from where we
come from in terms of our values.
(07:34):
Once it happened, we sat ourentire team down and reminded
them of the culture we're tryingto create within our team and
showed them this is what we needfrom you.
Your role is not in danger.
There's a space for you here,but there's a reason and there's
a way we run our company and ifyou want to be a part of this,
we really lean on these ways,not just for our clients but
(07:56):
also for our team to enjoy andlove the space that they're in
and we see it a lot in ourreviews that we have with our
team members every six monthsand they really bring back to
that and they really appreciatethat we always stick to those
particular values and bring itup in regular conversations.
Kate Peardon (08:12):
It reminds me of the other value that you
mentioned honesty and I thinkabout times when I've worked
with people and they've had tohave tough conversations with
their team or someone's had toleave the business and their
uncomfortable conversations foreverybody.
It's rare that someone feelscomfort in that, and then it's
not just the conversation youhave with that one person, but
how do you bring your team ontothe journey so they don't feel
(08:33):
concerned about their job.
And something that you justshared that I think could be a
good one percenter for ourlisteners is sit down with the
team and talk through.
We can't always share all theinformation.
It's important for somediscretion, but share what you
can in an honest way so theyunderstand how you make your
decisions and it's based onvalues and keep people across
why the business runs the waythat it does, and I think
(08:56):
honesty, being one of yourvalues, is something you've
naturally done and I think it issomething that our listeners
could also take it as their onepercent of.
Okay, I've got to have a toughconversation, but this impacts
everybody.
How do I have that conversationthen, with the whole team?
Emma Sparrow (09:10):
When you got something that happened.
We would love it if it was justalways an uphill climb, but
especially when you're running ateam, there's hurdles, there's
downward slopes, there's thingsthat just don't go perfectly,
and that's where our core valueis honesty, and we're very
upfront with our team in termsof what's happening, obviously
in a tasteful way, especiallywhen other people involved, but
(09:31):
it's important that they'reaware of everything that's
happening and really clear on itand knowing the reason why
they're being told thisinformation as well.
Kate Peardon (09:39):
It gives good psychological safety for your
team as well.
Exactly.
Emma Sparrow (09:43):
They see the future in the company and they
don't see it as just a role forthem.
They see it very much as a longterm part of their career.
Just us able to communicatethat set of things and be really
upfront and honest in terms ofwhere they are in the company
really helps.
Kate Peardon (09:57):
And I think this honesty is a good lead into your
second leadership lesson.
And it stems from that you sayyou're a pretty shit boss.
Emma Sparrow (10:05):
Yes, 100%.
I don't think I'm the only one.
Maybe I'm the only one to admitit.
I know that entrepreneurs, wehave very different skill sets
when it comes to running abusiness.
It's a very different skill set, I believe, to start a business
versus when you grow your team.
You have to step into adifferent type of role and
that's really the greatesthurdle for anyone that's small
(10:28):
business and wanting to grow andexpand is jumping into that
leadership role.
At least that's what I found inmy own business and I've had to
spend a lot of time developingthose skills, reading a lot of
resources, listening to Kate,going to her workshops, getting
to learn who I am as a leader.
Over time we've been throughthe ringer, we've dealt with
different situations and turnedthrough different staff members,
(10:49):
but if I had spent that timeearlier on in my journey
learning those key leadershipskills, it would have made a
world of difference.
Kate Peardon (10:57):
I think it's such a good point about leadership
being learned.
There's an earlier podcastepisode that I talk about the
leadership ladder, and whathappens is when you're
technically really good at whatyou do, you either lead other
people doing what you're doing.
So either you're an engineer,and then you lead all the
engineers, or you're a webdeveloper you lead the other two
web developers, or you startyour own business, and I think
anyone listening to thisthinking leadership is really
(11:18):
hard.
It's a great reminder that itis a skill that you can learn.
Leadership is learned.
Emma Sparrow (11:23):
It's very learnable, and if you are
someone who's a natural bornleader, it's almost harder to
teach leadership because atleast I've found, it's almost
like that.
People come from the bottom.
They have to learn how todevelop those skills, and so
that's been another hurdle, aswell as remembering back that I
also had to learn these skills,so I have to teach my other
leaders how to learn theseskills too.
Kate Peardon (11:45):
Reminds me of learning a second language.
If it's something that you havelearned growing up, it comes so
naturally you don't think muchof it.
But if you learn as an adult,you have to learn the whole
structure of how things to gotogether.
How do you put this sentence?
All the different terms andthere's so much to understand.
It can really hurt your brain.
But if someone that knowsleadership so naturally won't
think about all the bits that gointo it like you would if you
(12:07):
knew a language as a kid, so Ithink people that are learning
leadership just to remember thatthere are so many parts of it
and we can help people comingsort of behind us with
leadership by giving a few tipsand not just presuming, which I
think is your point remembering.
Ah, this is something I knownow, but I didn't always.
Emma Sparrow (12:25):
Exactly what you said before, like it's a whole
different ladder.
So you have to remember whenyou're asking in the past to
grow, you need obviously leadersto oversee different teams and
as they jump onto the otherladder, they've got so much to
learn too.
Kate Peardon (12:38):
So the growth process can hurt, but it does
get better.
And one thing that really helpsis your third leadership lesson
that you've picked up, and thisis something that you are
phenomenal at.
It's a way that your brainworks, and I think it's great to
hear a little bit about thisleadership lesson, because
hearing how you've done it willhelp a lot of other people.
Emma Sparrow (12:58):
So I actually learned this from going to one
of your first workshops.
It's actually where I firstheard of you.
This was probably just astepping stone to it all and
it's really evolved over as wego, but I learned what type of
leader I was at the very firstworkshop that I went to yours
and really started to developthose skills.
(13:18):
But a huge way that I work is Iknow what kind of leader I am
and then I've developed systemsto incorporate different pieces
of leadership that may not be mystrong suit, so I am very much
a systemized learner and I meananyone who has built a business
has to build operations.
So either they're gonna be asystemized learner or they're
(13:39):
gonna have someone on their teamthat can do something like this
.
But setting up systems anywherein your business where you or
your leadership team may belacking to be able to make sure
you're hitting all differentpoints of leadership and just
having a well-rounded culture.
Kate Peardon (13:56):
Can you share a couple of the systems that you
have set up?
As you said, they're not yourarea of expertise.
Emma Sparrow (14:02):
Yeah, the very first thing when we bring on
employees is we're veryparticular in terms of the
information that they get asthey onboard our onboarding
process with us.
So we're making sure that we'resetting really clear
expectations, because I know asa leader that I talk very
quickly, I'm very much an ideasleader and I can get a lot of
(14:25):
ideas out and my team don't getto absorb them completely.
So we have very set onboardingand information that gets our
team members onboarded and sothat starts with they get their
full employee handbook, they gettheir onboarding call and then
we set their three months, sixmonths, 12 month goals and work
towards those, and so very muchgetting that onboarding process
(14:48):
sets the transparency for them.
They're able to see everythingreal clear.
And then we have regularcheck-ins with our team members.
So we're constantly, everysingle week my leaders are
trying to do this, but I do thisas well we try to keep it
personal, but not too personalwhere they have to open up,
where it might not beappropriate for them.
So we have check-ins where we'llask the question from one to
(15:09):
five how is your workflow today?
And then they'll either say oneor five.
If it's below five, then we sayhow can we make it a five?
And then they can open up andfigure out is it a problem with
the actual systems or if it'ssomething where they need to sit
down and figure out where theycan improve.
And then the final question weask is how is your personal
happiness from one to five?
And being a remote team, it'svery difficult to see how
(15:33):
everyone's feeling throughoutthe day, and so this is a way
for us to check in and see howthey're going, without them
feeling like they have to fullyopen up and completely share
their soul when they might notbe completely comfortable with
it.
So if it's anything below, thenwe'll say is there anything we
can do to make it a five?
And then they can either feelcomfortable enough to share or
we can move on and know that weneed to check in with them in
(15:55):
the future.
So we have those very sets onboarding process, but also
check-ins as well, and make surethat, again coming back to our
values, very transparent in ourway of working with our team
members, which make them feelreally comfortable in sharing
and collaborating with everyone.
Kate Peardon (16:12):
The thing I love about that is, when you set up a
system, it doesn't rely on youremembering every time, but also
people know what to expect.
So, again, psychological safetyof the team, there's clarity
and just your recruitmentprocess.
So you have a set process thatpeople go through when they come
on board.
They have their inductionprocess and, like you said,
there's initial conversation,three, six, 12 month check-ins,
(16:34):
which is always what I recommendpeople do.
Even if you're really clear onwhat they should do and they're
doing a great job, if you justwait until things aren't going
well to have a conversation,they're always gonna be panicked
that you're gonna pick up thephone and call them when things
aren't going well.
Having that structure in placeis both ways.
So these systems can help you,especially if you're not a
(16:56):
systems person, which, as Emsaid, it's not her leadership
style.
So, knowing your leadershipstyle and working at well, how
can I set up my business tosupport me in the things that
I'm not so great in?
Emma Sparrow (17:07):
Exactly and like that, three to six month is just
a great way for you to setexpectations, especially someone
who may struggle to have thosehard conversations.
We actually sit down in writingand go through it together on
an actual presentation and talkabout what they're gonna expect
from the whole position in thefirst three to six to 12 months.
(17:29):
And again, it just helps you inthose hard conversations where
you might struggle to,especially when you're starting
out.
That's probably one of thehardest things is having those
types of conversations so you'reable to show them and really
clear in terms of what they needto do.
So if that conversation iscoming, they're almost aware
because they know that this isfully outlined from the initial
get go.
Kate Peardon (17:49):
Yeah, expectation management looks like the number
one thing for leadership.
Emma Sparrow (17:53):
Exactly, and it can all be so simply systemized
and just through your generaloperations.
And lots of times when we'resetting up a business, we set up
the operations for the business, but when you hire a team, it's
really important that you setup the operations for your team
to make sure that that issystemized and everyone again is
getting the equal treatment,they're getting full
(18:16):
transparency.
And then we even systemize thetypes of fun that we have within
the office because we're aremote team.
So there's so many ways thatyou can set this up, especially
if you know that you struggle incertain areas.
Kate Peardon (18:29):
Yeah, and I also highly recommend it to my
clients.
We'll talk about how do youwant to set up your systems, to
run your team.
And then what about the cultureof your business?
How often will you be havingand it doesn't necessarily have
to be a social, face to faceevent, particularly if you're
not in the same location, buthow can you still connect?
Because, in the end of the day,we're all people that are
working together.
So even if people aren't havingthose face to face social
(18:51):
interactions, we still need somesort of interaction, and if you
systematize it, you don't haveto remember it 100%.
Emma Sparrow (18:57):
And lots of times when you're starting a business,
a lot of us are introverts.
Building that connection isvery much easy to put on the
back burner and forget about.
So there's certain ways thatwill run our connection calls.
You know, have once a monthconnection call and I've got the
team love it.
I've got my set silly questionsper se about them, especially
(19:20):
when you have a team that isvery diverse or even remote as
well.
Getting to know them and askingthem those kinds of questions
that you usually don't askunless you're taking your team
out for a coffee or a drinkafter work or something like
that, or dinner, like what didyou want to be when you grew up?
For just anything that wouldstart the conversation and out
of the box answer, and it'ssomething that is so ridiculous.
(19:43):
But they look forward to everysingle monthly call.
It's just a way for us toconnect and something for them
to laugh about when usuallyconnection wouldn't be me being
an introvert.
That wouldn't be the firstthing that I would be reaching
for as a leader.
Kate Peardon (19:58):
Well, we were actually having a mastermind
dinner and this question came upwhat is your secret skill?
Again, a silly question.
And what was your answer?
Horse trivia.
Yes, and please, please explainmore, because this was such a
fantastic conversation that camefrom one of these so-called
silly questions.
Emma Sparrow (20:16):
Yeah, so I grew up from a farming background, so
we were very much in Pony Club Ibelieve it's in Australia here
too and I was a part of the quizteam.
So I traveled around Canadadoing horse trivia.
So how many inches in a hand,or what was this famous
racehorse's name?
That was something I competedfor.
(20:38):
So these are the kinds ofquestions that we throw a team
all the time and it definitelygets a giggle.
Kate Peardon (20:42):
Well, it did, and I feel like I know you so much
better now that I know that yourepresented Saskatchewan in
horse trivia.
You weren't just good at, youwere really good.
Emma Sparrow (20:51):
Yeah, I ran the Saskatchewan team.
We were a small population, butit's still really good.
Kate Peardon (20:57):
So with your business Sparrow Studios.
My last question is what?
Is the thing that you love todo the most for clients.
Emma Sparrow (21:05):
Yeah, so we are a result driven web design and
development agency and what wedo really well is we've
developed this process that's acombination of user experience,
design and brand strategy and webring our team together that's
a mix of designers, developersand strategists to create our
(21:25):
clients results and reallyfocusing on our clients overall
goals and then bringing thattogether with design and
websites.
Kate Peardon (21:32):
So if someone works with you, they can expect
a great user based website andwhat else.
Emma Sparrow (21:38):
Yeah, exactly so.
We do websites that are verymuch focused on the user and the
experience that they have, butwe bring all the pieces together
.
So we're very much aboutsitting down with our clients,
getting understanding of whatthey need from their business in
the next three to five yearsand then seeing how a website
would fit into that or a brandas well, and then help them,
(21:59):
bring all those pieces togetherand talk about what the plan is
post launch and support them notjust with the website, but also
ongoing.
We're able to support them allthe way through, have constant
strategies with our clients andcheck in with them and make sure
that their website isperforming and helping them grow
, and so our team is a core partof that and something that we
all absolutely love to do.
Kate Peardon (22:20):
Recently I got to experience having a strategy
call for you and it was a greatexperience to sit down and
really think about my websiteand where I want to be, and does
this website support it, and Iknow this is a service that you
offer people.
How do they get their hands onthat?
Emma Sparrow (22:38):
So on our website.
You can jump on there andthere's just a short form to
download our packages guide andyou'll see a link.
We can also drop a link in theshow notes as well.
But yeah, we offer freestrategy calls for anyone who's
looking to they feel that theirwebsite might just not be doing
or working for them.
And especially in this same age, your website is your
(23:00):
storefront.
Everyone is going to beGoogling and trying to find you
first online.
It's so important that whatevergoals you have for your
business, your website fits intothat.
So we love sitting out downwith people and figuring out you
know, what are they, what aretheir pain points, what are they
working towards, and then wecan talk about and backtrack and
see how a website or a brandfits into that.
Kate Peardon (23:19):
And I always say we're always growing.
You don't want to stay in thesame space.
We, as humans, we continue toevolve, so it makes sense that
our businesses continue toevolve, particularly if you are
a small business or a founderbusiness.
Your business is a reflectionof who you are.
So if you've changed, it'slikely that your business has
changed, which is likely thatyour website needs to change,
(23:40):
which is a conversation that youand I have been having recently
, like how have I changed andhow have my services changed,
and is my website stillreflecting that?
And it definitely needs someupdating.
Emma Sparrow (23:51):
That's the thing, though, with businesses.
We are evolving, like we'reinvolving our team or our
business or marketing.
That's what we're supposed tobe doing.
We're having a lot of theseconversations recently because
of the way that the wholeindustry has evolved so quickly
in the past not even 24 months,but 12 months, I mean.
The whole industry and thewhole economy has changed so
(24:14):
quickly that everyone is kind ofdoing a little bit of a 180.
And so we're having this a lot,and that's not a wrong thing.
Businesses, it's supposed toevolve, it's supposed to grow,
and it's so crucial that yourwebsite and your brand is
growing with you, and also youhave a team to support you that
you trust, that is there foryour best interests and it's
going to help you grow and be apart of that Well.
Kate Peardon (24:36):
Em nand her business growth have three
leadership lessons.
So if you're wanting to takeyour 1% from today, we talked
about these three things whichwas leading with your values,
that leadership is learned, thatEm used to be a really good
boss and now is a good boss, andI can tell you, because I've
spoken to her team, she doesactually do the things that she
says that she's doing.
(24:56):
And the third big leadershiplessons were about systems and
how to set up your system tosupport your style as a natural
leader.
You don't have to change whoyou are to be a leader, and I
think that's probably a reallygood little side note.
We think we need to change whowe are to lead a team.
I believe if you know who youare, you can then set up your
business and your systems andyour team to support everyone to
(25:18):
be the best in who they are,because we all perform better
that way.
Is there anything you'd like toadd to close up today?
Emma Sparrow (25:25):
A huge part of the development that we've done in
our leadership and ourleadership styles is a big part
of working alongside you andlearning from you.
Okay, it's been incredible, andI know we've also sent one of
my team leaders to yourworkshops and that's been a huge
reason for the way we'vedeveloped our team and we've
developed our company culture,and I know that my team leader
(25:46):
has taken a step back based onwhat she's learned from you as
well, and anyone who's curiousabout your services too.
It's just done tremendous forus and our company.
Kate Peardon (25:57):
Thank you very much, amy.
Make me embarrassed.
If you're watching this, you'llsee there.
Thank you for joining on thepodcast today.
I will put in the show notesthe transcript with your
leadership lessons, but also thelinks for people to book in for
their strategy call if theyneed an update on their website
and for people that arelistening to this.
I'm all about your 1% of whatcan you take from this podcast
(26:18):
that can help your leadership be1% better.
So having a think through theselessons from Em about values,
about learning leadership andabout systems and pick one thing
that you want to implement tomake your life is a little bit
easier.
Thanks for listening in.
It's amazing.
Emma Sparrow (26:31):
Thanks for having me, kate, you're very welcome.
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