March 28, 2024 • 54 mins
Get in touch with Matt by emailing him at m7gutermuth@gmail.com.
Owning a business is a challenge. Knowing how to keep innovating in your business is an even bigger one. Join restaurant owner, motivational speaker, and innovation expert Sara Frasca each week as she guides fellow business owners in taking the next step to level up their business. If you've ever pondered hiring a business coach but want a sample first, come along for the adventure!
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Sara Frasca is the founder and owner of Trasca & Co Eatery in Ponte Vedra Beach, Florida, an experienced and engaging motivational speaker, and the CEO of global business coaching firm Point NorthEast.
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Episode Transcript
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Unknown (00:00):
You're listening to level up your business, the
podcast where we talk tohardworking business owners and
leaders and help them solve realissues in real time. I'm your
host, Sarah Frasca restaurantowner, keynote speaker and
business coach. I've spent mycareer not only in corporate
(00:20):
America but also as anentrepreneur, carrying on my
family's legacy through myrestaurant, now a business coach
and consultant. I'm helpingother businesses to use creative
problem solving and innovativethinking to drive lasting
change. Stay tuned to hear someinspiring guidance that will
(00:40):
help you to level up yourbusiness. And today, I am joined
with my teammate Laura Rader andwe are going to chat with a very
special person to me, Matt Goodor Muth. Hello, Matt, welcome.
Thank you, Sara. Thanks forhaving me today. I'm excited to
be here. And nice to see you,Laura. Say, Matt, thanks for
(01:01):
being here. So funny enough,Matt and I, I'll start maybe
with my background with Matt, wegot to know each other in two
places in our community kind ofhere in Ponte Vedra Beach. And
the first was that we were botha part of the Jacksonville
University, Davis College ofBusiness board, kind of the
(01:22):
board of advisors and we got tosit on the board and help the
students help the faculty helpthe school. So that was an honor
and really got to know Mattthen. But it turned out he lives
in my neighborhood, basically,and goes to my restaurant. So
you're a Tresca.
Yeah, thank you for the supportback is the best. Oh, I know.
(01:46):
Everyone listening knows that isthe best.
So thank you, again, forsupporting the restaurant. I
mean, you and I get togetherevery so often, because I feel
like we have this mind meld whenwe come together. And we just
like it like froth with ideas.
And oh my gosh, we should dothis. And we should do that. And
anyway, I always enjoyedchatting with you. So thanks for
being on the show. As you know,Laura, and I come from General
(02:09):
Mills, and your background,which you'll share with folks in
just a minute is kind of atangent. And it's kind of funny,
but how they say like the sixdegrees. I mean, I bet we're
like two degrees of separation.
All three of us, you know, thesame people, we grew up in the
same world. So yes, why don't westart there, Matt, tell us about
(02:29):
your career and how you got towhere you are today.
Happy to.
So I grew up in the food andbeverage business. So when I say
grew up,I literally was born into it. My
father was with Nabisco for 42years. My dad was my hero, my
best friend.
(02:54):
So outside of becoming aprofessional baseball player,
there was nothing else I wasgoing to do except follow on my
dad's footsteps, which,unfortunately, I couldn't become
a professional baseball player.
So I went to work for PepsiCo.
As I graduated from college,again to follow in my dad's
(03:16):
footsteps. And I started out inthis industry, about as bottom
of the barrel as you can startout, I started out driving Pepsi
trucks, in a blue polyesterPepsi uniform, with patches all
over it. And I spent my firstnine, nine and a half years with
(03:36):
Pepsi, and worked my way upthrough a whole host of
different selling andoperational and marketing
positions. At the end of that910 year stretch, my father had
begun his retirement processwithin Nabisco. And he had hired
(03:56):
a bunch of my college buddies,to go to work for Nabisco, who
were all still there. And they,for all intents and purposes,
said, Maddie, you got to comeback home, come to Nabisco, your
dad's retiring it's time. And Ithought about it long and hard
because I loved Pepsi. But theone thing that Bisco was really
good at that Pepsi was a littlebehind was category management.
(04:21):
And they were widely regarded inthe industry as the best of the
best.
And I felt that was a missingpiece to my skill set. So I made
the decision to go back home,went to work for Nabisco and
spent in immediately moved toSan Antonio, Texas, to take on a
(04:41):
market unit for Nabisco. And Ispent about five and a half
years with the Nabisco company.
And during that period of time,it was in San Antonio, Texas,
and I was out in Pleasanton,California, calling on
Safeway stores at Kraft hadpurchased Nabisco kind of during
(05:05):
that, that stretch of time.
And I'll be very honest, I didnot love Kraft as much as I love
Nabisco and PepsiCo, verybureaucratic, very slow, very
non innovative.
So I was thinking about what doI want to do next? Here I am in
(05:26):
California and loved calling onSafeway. And I got a phone call
from Steve Byrd, who wasSafeways CEO at the time. And
Steve asked me to do. So Steve,and I go to dinner, and I had no
idea what the heck he wants totalk about. But he comes
straight through the front doorand says, Matt, we'd like you to
(05:48):
consider becoming a retailer.
Have you ever thought about it?
My first reaction was no, myfather would kill me if I ever
went to the other side of thetable.
And he asked me to think aboutit, which I did. And ultimately,
through a whole host of theseare the pros. These are the cons
of making this change. I decidedto go to work for Safeway, and
(06:12):
go to that other side of thedesk. I ran beverage snacks,
alcohol and tobacco, a bunch ofcategories that I was perfectly
familiar with, given my PepsiCoand, and my disco background,
and I became a merchant. And Idid that for about two and a
half years. And then a gentlemanwho's been incredibly successful
(06:35):
in this industry, came toSafeway, a gentleman by the name
of Brian Cornell, who happens tobe the CEO of target today.
Brian, I, Brian and I both hadPepsiCo backgrounds, we
developed a relationship. AndBrian plucked me out of
merchandising and asked if Iwould go run this little thing
(06:57):
that they had just bought out ofbankruptcy, called safeway.com.
It was a very early stagepioneer in the E commerce food
delivery space. And it was inrough shape. And Brian said,
you're not getting any newcapital. And you need to figure
this out in six months, becausewe're going to shut it down if
(07:20):
there's not a business there. Soin December of oh, five 2005, I
became CEO of safeway.com.
And had I told Brian, I said,Brian, you're asking me to run a
tech company. I can barely useemail. I am not a tech guy. And
he said, don't worry. He said,You'll figure it out. It's like
(07:43):
running a DSD company. It's allgood.
So I dropped into safeway.com.
Within two years, we had doubledthe size of our revenue
organically. And we have becomeoperating income profitable
about a year ahead of our ourpro formas. So the Safeway
organization was thrilled. Theybought out the other investors
(08:07):
which included Tesco, a bigretailer over and over in
Europe. And I led the companythrough that m&a
At the end of that, I bet inCalifornia for eight years, my
Safeway experience, I loved it,you know had the opportunity to
(08:29):
go back into a merchandisingrole there. But it was time for
me to get a little closer tohome. My parents are getting a
little older children aregetting a little older. And
that's when I moved toJacksonville for the first time
Sarah and I I was the leadmerchant for Winn Dixie stores,
right after Winn Dixie had comeout of bankruptcy. And there was
(08:52):
a handful of us that werebrought into to see if we can
help turn Winn Dixie around.
Which I'm glad to say that wedid. Winn Dixie in 2012 was
purchased by private equitygroup. It was a wonderful exit
for our shareholders. And quitefrankly, it allowed Winn Dixie
(09:15):
to turn into southeasterngrocers, which is today part of
the all B Corporation soprobably one of my most
enjoyable pieces of my career,because when we inherited Winn
Dixie, there were 50,000employees, and it was a zero sum
game we were either going tosucceed or those 50,000
(09:37):
employees were going to have tolook for a new job. When we
merged with bylo to formsoutheastern grocers, we had
over 65,000 employees. So wedidn't have to shut down a bunch
of stores which was absolutelyphenomenal.
(09:59):
On upon that exit,I then went to the other side of
food, which I knew nothingabout. But the food service side
of food. And I went to work forCisco. And I ran a chunk of
their corporate merchandisingactivity.
And loved working for Cisco wasin Houston, Texas for a little
(10:25):
over four years. Andunfortunately, that's when
we had a little bit of a familytragedy that struck, I lost my
dad, who I mentioned was by Eerorather suddenly, and my wife
lost her dad, rather suddenly,within about a 90 day stretch of
(10:46):
time. So it was a life eventthat made me rethink, you know,
hey, I got to be closer to home,I gotta get back to Florida.
But what do I what do I want todo?
And I had been collecting boardseats.
You know, kind of earlier in mywhen Dixie and my Cisco days.
(11:09):
And that's when I pivoted andsaid, How can I take all of this
experience, and really helpthese innovative companies in
the food and beverage place inthe food, food and beverage
space succeed. So I took a leapof faith, I went out on my own.
(11:31):
And I got, I got more activelyinvolved with these small,
emerging innovative companies inthe food and beverage space. And
over time, I got involved withmore and more companies that
enabled me to get involved withcapital companies. One in
(11:53):
particular,I'm sure you've heard of is
Goldman Sachs.
And because of the success thatthese handful of companies have
been able to deliver, I am now aGoldman Sachs turnaround CEO. So
(12:14):
I, I engage with various GoldmanSachs companies, either as an
independent director orsometimes as a CEO. And I help
get their portfolio of companieskind of on the right track
again. And I've also gotrelationships with a handful of
(12:36):
other capital partners now. ButI would say the second half of
my career has been all abouthelping really smart, emerging
innovative companies figure outhow to how to succeed in this
crazy industry of food and Bev,it's really great. So that's a
(12:58):
long story. But it's becauseI mean, I know Laura is probably
chomping at the bit because theamount of overlap with all three
of our careers is just so funand exciting. So Laura, I'm,
you've come a long way from Bluepolyester.
(13:19):
Right? I think I still have oneof them in my closet just for
for old times sake. Sure. Sure.
What a question that I have, orjust kind of shed some light on
it, as you look to, you know,going from big corporate down
to, hey, I'm a one person showto now it seems like you're kind
(13:39):
of going back. How have youmentally really prepared for
that? Because I think sometimeswe see in our business, that can
be a challenge one way or theother. So I just would love to
hear from you. And kind ofI don't think we've got mastered
either. So any tips and tricks?
Welcome, Matt. I tell you,Laura, that is that is a
(14:01):
phenomenal question, because Idon't I don't know that there's
an easy answer to it. Becauseyou're absolutely right. I was
used to being in this corporatebubble. You know, everything
from the check showed up everyother week. And you just picked
your benefits package once ayear. And you take so many
(14:21):
things for granted when you'rein this corporate world, that
all of a sudden are gone. Whenyou pivot out onto your own your
own and obviously there werewere some things I knew going
in. But quite frankly, there wasa whole bunch that I didn't. And
I think at the end of the day,what helped me
(14:45):
was just the self belief and thecourage to jump in. Not even
knowing how deep the pool is,but having faith in my
experiential background incorporate America.
Got that I was just going tofigure it out. And trust me,
there were days where Iquestioned myself, you know,
(15:08):
what have you done, especiallyat that stage in my life where I
was a little longer in mycareer. But as I sit back and
look back today, about four anda half years post making this
pivot, I am so very glad that Idid.
(15:29):
My career today, what I do todayis very different.
But it is so incrediblyrewarding. And I would just, if
I could give anybody one or twopieces of advice that are
thinking about doing it is one,believe in yourself, you are a
heck of a lot smarter, andyou're a heck of a lot better
(15:51):
than you give yourself creditfor. I think we're all our
biggest self critics, and tojust go into it with a spirit of
learning. It is a great time.
And I'm a big believer that youshould never ever, ever start
learning. You know, the oldsaying, of when you're the
smartest person in the room,you're in the wrong room. I am a
(16:13):
huge believer that in that. AndI think if you go into it with
that attitude to where you'regoing to be open, you're going
to be willing to put yourselfout there and network and listen
and meet people that you mighthave otherwise not met. It is
unbelievable. How much yourcommunity will give back to you.
(16:38):
If you invest a little bit init.
That's great. I mean, Matt, I,you know, I think there's
something to be said to for yourwillingness to kind of take that
leap to have the humility. Imean, you just are one of the
most, you know, loving,compassionate, humble people
(17:02):
that I've ever met. I mean, youryour background is so amazing
yet, you know, I just feel likeyou have this internal, like,
what the heck, I'm willing toroll up my sleeves and try
stuff. And just, I mean, so I dofeel like there's this beauty in
your character that allows youto step in and say like, Well, I
mean, why not? Let's give it ashot. And I think that's why
(17:25):
you've been so successful, youknow, and my
honest impression of what Ithink you've done. Well, I'm,
I'm humbled by you saying that,thank you.
And that is directlyattributable to my parents.
Thankfully, my mom's stillalive. In fact, I'm headed down
(17:46):
to go see her here later thisafternoon.
But I'll I will always remember,a car ride with my dad.
And I'll remember it like it wasyesterday, because it was one of
those seminal moments insomebody's life. And I was a
young kid, I don't know howyoung I was. But, you know, I
(18:07):
was old enough to remember it.
But I was young enough to notreally understand what my dad
did. And my dad had just takenon the role of head of sales for
Nabisco. And it was back in thebarbarians at the gate days when
KKR had come in ROSS Johnson whomy dad now worked for. And so it
(18:28):
was pretty crazy. And I was inthat car with my dad. And I
said, Dad, I said, I don'tunderstand how you do a job
that's this big. You have allthese customers and all these
products, and you have, youknow, 1000s of people that you
(18:49):
have to motivate and you haveshareholders and now you have
KKR and like, how do you manageall of this? And he kind of
smiled. And he just looked at meand he's and he said he said,
Matt, he said I actually havethe easiest job in the company.
(19:11):
And I was like, no, like, Whatare you talking about? I said,
he said, Yeah, he said, all Ihave to do is take care of and
inspire and bring in the rightcharacter people to our
organization. And if I do thatone simple thing. They all take
(19:33):
care of my customers who remainincredibly happy. And when happy
customers are when customers arehappy, they buy more. And when
they buy more, guess what all ofthose other people, the
shareholders in KKR andeverybody else, they're happy.
So I just never lose sight ofwhat is the
(20:00):
The single most important thingthat I do, and that is I put
people first. And as long asthat foundation is strong,
everything else takes care ofitself. And I will never forget
that conversation. Because youknow, you go to business school
or you go to college, andeverybody wants to tell you how
(20:22):
hard business is. And you got toknow the numbers and the finance
and the structures and themarketplace. And there's 1000
Things they tell you, you know,you need to be really good at
you need to be expertise that,and my dad just broke it down to
where it's no, what you need tobe really expertise at is
(20:42):
people. And if you can do thatexceptionally well, everything
else takes care of itself. AndI've tried to live by that
conversation in my career, Ihaven't always succeeded, but
I've tried. And, you know,having that belief that if you
can get the people, right,structure drives, behavior,
(21:04):
behavior drives results, thenyour business, whatever business
it is, is going to be incrediblysuccessful.
It's great. I mean, I was justthinking about how you greeted
me with, you know, your commentabout the restaurant and Zach's
the best. Like, it doesn'tmatter what type of a business
(21:24):
you have, if people have thecare have the compassion, they
have the willingness tocome in an authentic manner.
And, I mean, again, I said itearlier, roll up their sleeves,
like there's a lot of work thatneeds to be done. And if people
just lean in, we can do a lot offun things. So And Matt, what I
took away too, is like, Behuman, with people, like, you
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know, we spend so much of ourtime at work. And it's okay to
love your work family, too. Imean, you know, like, I'm Rich
and lovable, you know. But Ithink that that's an important
message that sometimes sometimesin the world of technology, and
not seeing people and all thatit kind of gets a little harder
(22:12):
to kind of have a connection,you have to be authentic. And
this is where I see a lot ofleaders and a lot of companies,
they get lost, right? You know,with all due respect to my HR
professional friends out there,HR can be a little bit cold, you
(22:33):
know, it can be a little bitabout rules and regulations and
compliance and governance. AndI'm not saying you know that
that is that you know that thatis bad. It's just how you come
across with doing all of theright things in a more authentic
(22:54):
human way, is really at the endof the day, what it's all about
HR can be really, really simple.
If just every single day, you'reguided by just do the right
thing. And we were faced earlyon.
When I was CEO of AI control, wewere faced with a serious
(23:17):
conundrum, where we had a teamof individuals that was working
for a third party that we had along relationship with. And they
were over in Ukraine. And therewas a handful of individuals in
Ukraine,working for us through a third
party, when the UK Ukraine,Russian conflict broke out. And
(23:41):
at the time I control was inwasn't in the best shape. And we
were still burning cash, weweren't profitable, we were a
long way away from being quoteunquote, turned around. And we
had to make a decision. Becausethese folks were fleeing with
(24:02):
their families for their lives.
And they weren't going to youknow, internet was down, they
were going to be offline for anunknown period of time. And
given that they went through athird party,
the business manual would havetold you, it's really simple.
Just go find another thirdparty, you know, so that you can
(24:25):
continue to get the work done,that these people were doing for
you. We threw the businessmanual out, because what we did
is we continue to pay thosepeople their full salary.
And basically said, when you andyour families are safe, and
(24:48):
you're ready to distractyourself with a little work, let
us know. And we went to thatthird party and we said look,
we're making this commitment toyour folks. RX
vacation now have you is thatyou take some of the fees that
we pay you, and you send them tothese people that are working
for us, which they actually did.
(25:11):
So, and guess what, thatresonated with the entire
company, not just the Ukrainianpeople. But it read, it
resonated with everybody in ourorganization that, you know,
wow, that is a pretty coolstance that our company decided
(25:31):
to make. And at the end of theday, in terms of dollars and
cents, it costs us very, verylittle, to do the right thing.
But sometimes, at the end of theday, the way you, if you will
create a culture ofauthenticity, is to throw the HR
(25:54):
manual out to throw the businessmanual out, and to just in your
gut, in your soul, just go dothe right thing. And it'll pay
itself back in spades. That'swhat I've found over the course
of my career. You mightsay, that's such an amazing
story. My question was going tobe so fast forward, and
(26:14):
unfortunately, they're still inthe conflict. You know, are
those individual settled? Arethey back working on your
business? Because I bet they'reworking twice as hard for you
Now, thankfully, every singleone of them survived. And as far
as we know, their familiessurvived their direct families.
(26:36):
And the answer is, yes, we stillwork with that third party, and
we still work with, with most,if not all, of those, those
individuals. And You betcha. Imean, these folks, you know, I
heard stories of these folkswould literally be in shelters,
(26:59):
and they'd be working, you know,in in the middle of the night,
you know, to, you know, to tohelp us out and to do what they
did for us. So,yeah, I mean, no business
manual, no business school wouldbe would necessarily teach Hey,
(27:19):
that's the, that's the rightthing to do from a business
standpoint. But, you know,sometimes you come to those
crossroads, and you start to dothe right thing. You know, it's
interesting, you bring up thatstory, I haven't thought about
this in a long time. But asimilar situation happened to me
when I was at General Mills, andI was working,
(27:42):
you know, for for a certainmanager who recognized I mean, I
was in crisis, my mom had beendiagnosed with brain cancer. And
my dad and I were her main,I would say, nurses or care
providers, I mean, we weretaking her down to the Mayo
Clinic, and many in Rochesterfrom like, the Minneapolis St.
Paul area. Anyway, my point is,this was before remote based
(28:06):
work, and they allowed me totake her to her, you know, chemo
and radiation and work from downin Rochester and things like
that. And, you know, again, Imean, I'm sure General Mills,
corporate probably would havesaid, well, we got to have, you
know, good productivity. But, Imean, I came back with this kind
of loyalty and feeling of yousupported me when I needed the
(28:30):
most. And now I will give mywhole heart times three. Right.
And so I do think that there aresome really amazing ways of
supporting people that may notget, they might not make the
paper, but you know, it's it'sa, it's a it's the right thing
to do.
(28:52):
For the humans that are on yourteam are Yeah, that's really a
neat story. Yeah. Goosebumpshead to toe. And if you do it
with authenticity, it's like, itshouldn't make the paper, right.
Yeah. It, it shouldUnfortunately, most of the bad
stuff is the only stuff thatever makes the paper. Right. So
(29:13):
no, Sara, you're you'reabsolutely right. If if you can
come across, you know, employeeengagement is a huge topic,
right? And there's all sorts ofstatistics out there that, you
know, upwards of over 50% of theworkforce is completely
disengaged from the work thatthey do, right. And you My
(29:36):
goodness, if you can find a wayto cut that in half. And imagine
the amount of productivity ifyou can cut that in half. And
here's the deal, and what Ifound is it's never the big
things, you know, it's neverthrowing more money at people or
you know, those sorts ofthings or the, you know, the
(30:00):
forced fun that some companiesdo, right? It's always real
awkward. And it's awkwardbecause it's not authentic,
right is if you can just createhuman connections, authentic
human connections, you know,with the folks on your team,
(30:23):
then they're going to runthrough a wall for you. And in
my view, the role of the CEOis not to be the smartest person
in finance in the smartestperson in sales and the smartest
person in operations, becauseI'm far from all that.
(30:44):
But the CEOs role at the end ofthe day, is to keep the company
energized about the strategicpath, the journey that we're on,
and to encourage them along theway. And to make sure that the
individuals across the companyare all collaborating, and
they're positive, and theyunderstand what the expectations
(31:07):
are, and they're energized todeliver those expectations. At
the end of the day, that's theheart and soul of the role of
the CEO. I'll be the first toadmit,
you know, I was by far not thesmartest guy in the room in any
of my functions. But I hadreally, really good people, in
(31:27):
all of those functions that werethe smartest people in the room.
And alls I needed to do, again,going back to that car ride, is
I just needed to inspire andempower them and let them go do
what they're brilliant at doing.
And everything else was going totake care of itself. That's
awesome. I was with a clientyesterday that ironically, is
the CEO of his, I would saymedium to larger sized law firm.
(31:52):
And he's the CEO, but he saysthat it stands for Chief
encouragement officer. And Ireally, I thought that was cute,
you know, you could useexcitement or whatever. But it's
that empowerment. It's that, youknow, getting people fired up
towards the cause, telling themthey're doing a great job, you
(32:15):
know, and so I love that. Sospeaking of, you know, Laura is
one of my favorite bosses thatI've ever had at General Mills.
And so I sort of, you know, Ithink everything you said, you
know, in terms ofgetting a team rallied the
people that worked for for Lauraat General Mills would run
(32:36):
through a brick wall for herthen, and they would today.
Yeah, totally. I mean, there'speople around the country, and
hopefully, they're listening.
And they can chime in with theircomments, because deserves a lot
of love. But I mean, she didthat through authenticity, and
you know, andalso the customers, I think,
kind of new to Laura, to befair, I think, you know, calling
(32:59):
on all these customers fromWalmart to HEB to everybody in
between. And it was really fun.
But I think they all knew Laurameant business, but she sure had
your back.
But man, like you said, I had agreat team. I had the luxury of
(33:22):
we were always seem to be thesmartest. But we all were able
to work together. And we were byfar the smartest. So the power,
you know, the exponential powerthat we all had. So it was
great. Tim was a magic. Youknow, they say in your career
magical times. It's kind of itwas a magical. Yeah. So there
(33:44):
are, there are many engagementsthat have done seven turnarounds
or accelerations in my careerand knock on wood. I'm seven for
seven. So knock on wood.
But one of the things that I donotice often when I when I drop
(34:07):
into certain situations is isthe CEO and our glass leader or
a top path leader. And what Imean by that is we've all seen
an hourglass, and there's abunch of sand on the top and it
has to flow through this reallytight opening and then
(34:27):
eventually it gets to thebottom.
Is the CEO that tight spot inthe middle.
does everything have to runthrough that CEO? Does every
decision have to run throughthat CEO or does the CEO create
a culture where everybody isdisempowered and thinks it all
(34:50):
has to run through that CEO? Inmany cases, that is kind of the
situationAnd that I drop into, and
especially in founder ledorganizations, founders are
really, really great at startingsomething.
(35:14):
And then there comes a point intime in their journey, where
they have to stop acting like afounder, and start acting like a
leader. And there's a massivedifference. And I've seen so
many instances where thefounder, not intentionally, not
(35:34):
maliciously, but they becomethat, you know, the middle of
the hourglass. And what thatdoes, ultimately, at the end of
the day, is it stops innovation,it stifles growth, and they
their company that, you know,may have been on a rocket ship,
(35:55):
not so very long ago, all of asudden begins to stall. And it's
very difficult, in many cases,for founders to find their way
out of that conundrum. And a bigpart of what I hope to
accomplish in my second halfcareer is to help CEOs who are
(36:19):
in that stuck in that I'm in themiddle of the hourglass, I just
joined a health care board outof Denver, Colorado, was so
incredibly impressed with theCEO and founder, because he knew
he was stuck. And he didn't knowhow to get out.
So we got connected. And I nowpart of his organization, that
(36:46):
is actively helping him getunstuck in this company, I think
is going to be a rocket ship.
And I just I love working withCEOs, and founders who have that
self awareness, to know when togo ask for help. Just seen too
(37:07):
many, that kind of hang on tothat belief that they're the
smartest person in the room, Istarted this, this is my baby,
and you know, it's gonna liveand die with me. And
unfortunately, all too oftenThat attitude leads to, it's
more likely going to die withyou than live with you. So,
(37:29):
anyhow, how much of that becausewe see that all the time with
our clients. I mean, I wouldsay, we primarily work with
founders, or, you know, ownersthat maybe took over shortly
after the founder, but that areacting as those hourglass kind
of leaders. And so how much ofit do you find is actually I,
(37:52):
it's the psychologicalcomponent, they have trust
issues, or they have fear thatstifling them? I mean, this
seems like you're coming in as acounselor in a lot of senses to
the CEO and saying, like, it'sokay, I'm gonna strap your hands
down. Yeah, you anything,you're, you're along for the
ride, you brought the rightpeople, let them go. Yeah, let
(38:13):
them go. I honestly think thatcertainly there are instances,
you know, where their own selfdoubt, you know, or being, you
know, fearful of letting go,Hey, I've got in many cases,
man, this is my entire life,right? I've got my entire
livelihood in this thing. Ican't entrust it to somebody
(38:35):
else. But I also see a lot of,they just don't know what to do.
The beauty of our experiences,kind of coming up through
corporate America is guess whatwe were taught how to lead in
very specific and incrementalways. We were taught what it's
(39:02):
like, you know, to have teamsand to have to be accountable to
a number and to have to care forpeople. In many cases, these
founders did not have that sameexperience. They weren't taught
that. And now all of a sudden,they're thrown in, you know,
let's say they catch a tiger bythe tail, and their business,
(39:24):
all of a sudden hockey sticks.
You know, literally, in somecases overnight, they could now
have this 100 Plus personcompany with $10 million of
revenue, and they've got outsidecapital that they have to take
care of. I mean, these types ofthings can spin up and happen
(39:46):
really, really fast. And in inmany cases, they just don't have
the inherent skill sets. Becausethey've never been taught how to
actually beA leader in that type of
situation? Yeah, that's a goodpoint. Because what you made me
think of is, you know, back tocorporate America days that, you
(40:07):
know, we all three have been apart of, if there's a question
and it's like, gosh, I have noidea, I'm gonna go ask the HR
person or the finance person. Soyou get this kind of training of
like, I don't have to knoweverything, because there's a
department for that, and I'mgonna go talk to the expert. And
so when you have a founder, andthey have built it from the
(40:29):
ground up, they may have beenenough at the point in time when
they started, the business hasscaled, they now need an expert
to come in. And yeah, I thinkthat's a really interesting
kind of moment of reflection forme on just, you know, we learned
to ask for help, because we werenever expected exactly what
(40:51):
everything exactly like, there,I remember the story, you told
me about a law firm that youwere working with. And, you
know, one of the partners like aphenomenal lawyer, like
unbelievable lawyer,you know, was now trying to
venture into some of theadministrative functions of
(41:13):
their law firm, because they hadgotten to the size where they
needed to do that. And thisindividual was struggling
mightily,because, you know, didn't
necessarily know how to go buildout these other administrative
one. And I think this individualwas another one of those unique
(41:36):
individuals that recognize thisearly enough on that they were
able to ask for help. And hisfirm benefited greatly from him
asking for help. Yeah. And Ithink what kind of comes into
play to that we see is, again,if you're a founder, you've
clearly been somewhatsuccessful, you still have a
(41:56):
business, or you just kind of,you know, you've been able to
fake it maybe a little bit onthe HR and a few other areas.
And heaven forbid, you say, youdon't know what you're doing.
And you ask for help. And like,How can I possibly bring
typically someone in maybe thatmight be younger, that might
have the expertise in the area?
So we kind of end up coachingpeople on like, it's okay that
(42:20):
you don't know everything? No,we're all human. We can't
possibly know everything, andnor are you good at everything.
I mean, frankly, right. I'm nota good doctor. No.
That's not what I'm trained todo. So I think it's a good
insight from the standpoint of,you know, this growth, what it
(42:42):
means to grow your business andthe role that you play as a CEO.
And I think you're, you know, Ilove a founder versus leader. Am
I safe? Am I safe? And doctorthat? That's okay. Big
difference. Yeah. So what typesof businesses are you working
with right now, Matt? I mean,what if if someone's listening
in they're like, oh, my gosh, Icould really use a turnover
(43:04):
expert.
What kinds of businesses notturnover turnaround? Sorry.
I said the wrong way, definitelydon't want it to turn over.
Or I was thinking maybe we couldtalk about like Pop Tart
turnovers, you know, like, it'slike a, an actual bakery
turnover. Um, apologies. I meantturnaround, and what types of
(43:29):
businesses here is, what I'velearned over the years is, I
grew up as I mentioned in foodand beverage, and I certainly
know enough to be dangerous inin that vertical. But what I've
also learned having done anumber of turnarounds and
(43:50):
accelerations, all differentshapes and sizes, all different
types of turnarounds andaccelerations, supplier
technology distribution, youknow, retail, what I found is
that the fundamentals, there'seight areas, generally speaking,
(44:16):
that out are not operatingoptimally. That is creating the
business to sputter.
And those eight areas when I getinvolved with a business, that
is where I start to poke around,because generally speaking, you
(44:38):
can find the problem in thoseeight areas. As matter of fact,
I would almost guarantee it.
That somewhere in those eightbuckets, you're missing
something. And so therefore,Sara to get to the answer to
your question, I amWith today, I'm engaged with a
(45:00):
supply chain freight companythat ships products all over the
globe. And mentioned, I recentlyjoined a health care company.
I've been in SAS technology,I've been in the payments space,
(45:22):
I am currently engaged with a,a branded company that's
launching a new brand.
I'm involved with Sarah, you.
And I've talked a lot abouttended bar, which is a disruptor
in the arena, and hotel space.
(45:47):
And so at the end of the day,given my experience and my if
you will platform, I'm almostmore energized to go jump into
something that I know verylittle about.
And apply, you know, kind of myplaybook of these eight things.
(46:11):
And I can guarantee you that themarketplace may be different,
the vernacular may be a littledifferent, the widget may be
different, but the fundamentalsof those eight things are going
to be exactly the same. So I'minvolved, I have gone away
outside my comfort zone, andgotten outside of, of food and
(46:36):
beverage. So in short order, Iam not afraid to step in to
almost anything. The eighth,that's the title of your book.
Actually, you know what, it'sfunny, you mentioned that
because one of these days, I'mgonna get around to writing one.
The title of my book is it's allabout the athletes. Oh, it's all
(47:02):
about the athletes. Okay. Andthen we'll go into the eight
things that you know, allinvariably, you have to have the
right people to go pull off andexecute, but
it's all about the athletes.
What was your position inbaseball? I was a pitcher. Okay,
kind of thought that might bethe case. Laura's husband was
also a pitcher. There you go.
(47:27):
We love pitchers. Yes. My son isa pitcher as well, or was a
pitcher left in your writing? Inin the world of baseball?
The pitcher kind of is a veryunique position, right? Because
they're the only ones on theteam who have a win loss record.
(47:47):
Yep. Right. Everybody else onthe team is kind of strapped
with a win loss record of theteam. But a pitcher has their
own win loss record. So ifyou're going to be a pitcher,
you have to have thick skin.
Because you know, front andcenter is going to be you know,
your win loss record and howthat you know, positively or
(48:07):
negatively impacts the team.
You're in the middle of thefield. And you're elevated.
So, rise, yeah, all eyes are onthe pitcher. So again, if you're
going to be a pitcher, you haveto be okay with the good and the
(48:29):
bad that comes with being in themiddle of the field and being
elevated on a pedestal. Becauseit ain't always pretty, I've
given up more than my fair shareof home runs in my life. And
that's a miserable feeling whenyou're standing there alone,
watching the guy who just tookyard run around the bases. And
the third thing is everythingbegins with you. Nothing happens
(48:56):
nobody moves until you move.
So it you know, kind of thoseunique characteristics of being
a pitcheryou know, are quite frankly,
I've found you know, wonderfullife lessons that you can take
to being a leader.
(49:17):
You got to be okay with thescorecard is the scorecard the
scorecard never lies, you win oryou lose? It doesn't matter if
you felt you threw a good game.
The umpire was a little off.
What are your guys didn't scoreenough? Doesn't matter. The
scorecard is this or thescoreboard is the scoreboard you
(49:39):
either win or lose. And you haveto have the mindset to where
you're okay with both of those.
And to just keep working to justkeep grinding to just keep
learning.
You know, try to get a littlebit better every day. And so
it's interesting, Laura, thatyou're married to a pitcher but
(49:59):
it'sI'd be curious, you know if that
kind of describes his mindset alittle bit because it certainly
was something that I was taughtplaying that position. Well,
first of all, I'd say you leftyour writing. I'm a righty,
right. Okay. Right here. This iswhy I'm talking to you today. If
I was our son, our stats openingday, right, opening day right
(50:21):
there today, the only thing Iwould add about you pictures is
you spent a lot of time in yourhead console. Sometimes, as
you're leading, you sometimeshave to say, hey, wait, I'm the
extrovert. First baseman, youkind of got to tell me a couple
of things. So 1,000%, that'sgood. I was in percent. I am
(50:43):
incredibly superstitious.
I wore a t shirt.
Every time I pitched it was thesame T shirt, in high school and
all through college. By the timeI was a senior in college, it
(51:03):
had been washed so much youcould see through it.
And it was an all countybasketball camp. Grey t shirt
that I got when I was in highschool. And I think I just
thrown it on one day. And it wasa day where I threw a no hitter,
perfect game or something inhigh school. And from that day
(51:27):
forward, that T shirt wasunderneath my uniform no matter
what. Wow, where did you?
Where'd you pitch, Matt? I wentto the University of Richmond in
Virginia. Spider. So I'm amighty spider. Huh? Yeah.
Our son looked at it. So great.
Okay, so I have Pepsi polyester.
(51:51):
I have an hourglass, and I havea great t shirt. That's right.
These are some good visuals,visuals. And I do have an
hourglass, my, my home. That's agood reminder, I might be buying
a couple hour glasses to reminda couple of our client founders
to stop being pinned. Maybe wecan invent one. It's an
(52:11):
hourglass, and then it's kind oflike the Rubik's cube, and then
it becomes a top hat.
Absolutely. Like you think ifyou put sand in an hourglass and
sand in a bucket, you turn themboth over at the same time. You
know, which moves faster? Right.
I love that. Okay.
(52:32):
Well, how will people get intouch with you if they are
interested in either a pastryturnover? No, just getting more
turnaround or just picking yourbrain? How should they reach out
if they need you? Personal Emailis fantastic. All right. All
right. There it is. There it is.
Thank you.
(52:56):
Matt, truly, thank you forallowing us to chat with you
about your journey. I mean,you've done so many incredible
things in your life. And thanksfor just being a really good
human. Well, thank you both. forhaving me, Laura. It was a
pleasure to meet you. Hopefullyone of these days. We can do it
over Appennino Treska.
(53:17):
With a beer. Yes, yes. With abeer. Yes. Now that there's the
you know, the little tap roomright next to it. So
anyhow, y'all have a wonderfulEaster. Did you see Trevor
Lawrence came by this week. Isaw the picture on your social.
Yep. Yeah. Came right over tothat tap room and had I think
(53:38):
you had a pinion or two. Sothat's awesome.
All right. Great. Thank you bothhave.
Y'all have a wonderful Easter.
You guys. Thank you again. Youbet. Thanks so much for tuning
into this episode of level upyour business with me, Sarah
Frasca. If you have a problem inyour business that's keeping you
(53:58):
up at night. Please join us in afuture episode so we can help
get you unstuck. Just clickingthe link in the show notes and
send us a message. Pleaseremember, stay innovative
friends.
You're listening to level up your business, the
podcast where we talk tohardworking business owners and
leaders and help them solve realissues in real time. I'm your
host, Sarah Frasca restaurantowner, keynote speaker and
business coach. I've spent mycareer not only in corporate
(00:20):
America but also as anentrepreneur, carrying on my
family's legacy through myrestaurant, now a business coach
and consultant. I'm helpingother businesses to use creative
problem solving and innovativethinking to drive lasting
change. Stay tuned to hear someinspiring guidance that will
(00:40):
help you to level up yourbusiness. And today, I am joined
with my teammate Laura Rader andwe are going to chat with a very
special person to me, Matt Goodor Muth. Hello, Matt, welcome.
Thank you, Sara. Thanks forhaving me today. I'm excited to
be here. And nice to see you,Laura. Say, Matt, thanks for
(01:01):
being here. So funny enough,Matt and I, I'll start maybe
with my background with Matt, wegot to know each other in two
places in our community kind ofhere in Ponte Vedra Beach. And
the first was that we were botha part of the Jacksonville
University, Davis College ofBusiness board, kind of the
(01:22):
board of advisors and we got tosit on the board and help the
students help the faculty helpthe school. So that was an honor
and really got to know Mattthen. But it turned out he lives
in my neighborhood, basically,and goes to my restaurant. So
you're a Tresca.
Yeah, thank you for the supportback is the best. Oh, I know.
(01:46):
Everyone listening knows that isthe best.
So thank you, again, forsupporting the restaurant. I
mean, you and I get togetherevery so often, because I feel
like we have this mind meld whenwe come together. And we just
like it like froth with ideas.
And oh my gosh, we should dothis. And we should do that. And
anyway, I always enjoyedchatting with you. So thanks for
being on the show. As you know,Laura, and I come from General
(02:09):
Mills, and your background,which you'll share with folks in
just a minute is kind of atangent. And it's kind of funny,
but how they say like the sixdegrees. I mean, I bet we're
like two degrees of separation.
All three of us, you know, thesame people, we grew up in the
same world. So yes, why don't westart there, Matt, tell us about
(02:29):
your career and how you got towhere you are today.
Happy to.
So I grew up in the food andbeverage business. So when I say
grew up,I literally was born into it. My
father was with Nabisco for 42years. My dad was my hero, my
best friend.
(02:54):
So outside of becoming aprofessional baseball player,
there was nothing else I wasgoing to do except follow on my
dad's footsteps, which,unfortunately, I couldn't become
a professional baseball player.
So I went to work for PepsiCo.
As I graduated from college,again to follow in my dad's
(03:16):
footsteps. And I started out inthis industry, about as bottom
of the barrel as you can startout, I started out driving Pepsi
trucks, in a blue polyesterPepsi uniform, with patches all
over it. And I spent my firstnine, nine and a half years with
(03:36):
Pepsi, and worked my way upthrough a whole host of
different selling andoperational and marketing
positions. At the end of that910 year stretch, my father had
begun his retirement processwithin Nabisco. And he had hired
(03:56):
a bunch of my college buddies,to go to work for Nabisco, who
were all still there. And they,for all intents and purposes,
said, Maddie, you got to comeback home, come to Nabisco, your
dad's retiring it's time. And Ithought about it long and hard
because I loved Pepsi. But theone thing that Bisco was really
good at that Pepsi was a littlebehind was category management.
(04:21):
And they were widely regarded inthe industry as the best of the
best.
And I felt that was a missingpiece to my skill set. So I made
the decision to go back home,went to work for Nabisco and
spent in immediately moved toSan Antonio, Texas, to take on a
(04:41):
market unit for Nabisco. And Ispent about five and a half
years with the Nabisco company.
And during that period of time,it was in San Antonio, Texas,
and I was out in Pleasanton,California, calling on
Safeway stores at Kraft hadpurchased Nabisco kind of during
(05:05):
that, that stretch of time.
And I'll be very honest, I didnot love Kraft as much as I love
Nabisco and PepsiCo, verybureaucratic, very slow, very
non innovative.
So I was thinking about what doI want to do next? Here I am in
(05:26):
California and loved calling onSafeway. And I got a phone call
from Steve Byrd, who wasSafeways CEO at the time. And
Steve asked me to do. So Steve,and I go to dinner, and I had no
idea what the heck he wants totalk about. But he comes
straight through the front doorand says, Matt, we'd like you to
(05:48):
consider becoming a retailer.
Have you ever thought about it?
My first reaction was no, myfather would kill me if I ever
went to the other side of thetable.
And he asked me to think aboutit, which I did. And ultimately,
through a whole host of theseare the pros. These are the cons
of making this change. I decidedto go to work for Safeway, and
(06:12):
go to that other side of thedesk. I ran beverage snacks,
alcohol and tobacco, a bunch ofcategories that I was perfectly
familiar with, given my PepsiCoand, and my disco background,
and I became a merchant. And Idid that for about two and a
half years. And then a gentlemanwho's been incredibly successful
(06:35):
in this industry, came toSafeway, a gentleman by the name
of Brian Cornell, who happens tobe the CEO of target today.
Brian, I, Brian and I both hadPepsiCo backgrounds, we
developed a relationship. AndBrian plucked me out of
merchandising and asked if Iwould go run this little thing
(06:57):
that they had just bought out ofbankruptcy, called safeway.com.
It was a very early stagepioneer in the E commerce food
delivery space. And it was inrough shape. And Brian said,
you're not getting any newcapital. And you need to figure
this out in six months, becausewe're going to shut it down if
(07:20):
there's not a business there. Soin December of oh, five 2005, I
became CEO of safeway.com.
And had I told Brian, I said,Brian, you're asking me to run a
tech company. I can barely useemail. I am not a tech guy. And
he said, don't worry. He said,You'll figure it out. It's like
(07:43):
running a DSD company. It's allgood.
So I dropped into safeway.com.
Within two years, we had doubledthe size of our revenue
organically. And we have becomeoperating income profitable
about a year ahead of our ourpro formas. So the Safeway
organization was thrilled. Theybought out the other investors
(08:07):
which included Tesco, a bigretailer over and over in
Europe. And I led the companythrough that m&a
At the end of that, I bet inCalifornia for eight years, my
Safeway experience, I loved it,you know had the opportunity to
(08:29):
go back into a merchandisingrole there. But it was time for
me to get a little closer tohome. My parents are getting a
little older children aregetting a little older. And
that's when I moved toJacksonville for the first time
Sarah and I I was the leadmerchant for Winn Dixie stores,
right after Winn Dixie had comeout of bankruptcy. And there was
(08:52):
a handful of us that werebrought into to see if we can
help turn Winn Dixie around.
Which I'm glad to say that wedid. Winn Dixie in 2012 was
purchased by private equitygroup. It was a wonderful exit
for our shareholders. And quitefrankly, it allowed Winn Dixie
(09:15):
to turn into southeasterngrocers, which is today part of
the all B Corporation soprobably one of my most
enjoyable pieces of my career,because when we inherited Winn
Dixie, there were 50,000employees, and it was a zero sum
game we were either going tosucceed or those 50,000
(09:37):
employees were going to have tolook for a new job. When we
merged with bylo to formsoutheastern grocers, we had
over 65,000 employees. So wedidn't have to shut down a bunch
of stores which was absolutelyphenomenal.
(09:59):
On upon that exit,I then went to the other side of
food, which I knew nothingabout. But the food service side
of food. And I went to work forCisco. And I ran a chunk of
their corporate merchandisingactivity.
And loved working for Cisco wasin Houston, Texas for a little
(10:25):
over four years. Andunfortunately, that's when
we had a little bit of a familytragedy that struck, I lost my
dad, who I mentioned was by Eerorather suddenly, and my wife
lost her dad, rather suddenly,within about a 90 day stretch of
(10:46):
time. So it was a life eventthat made me rethink, you know,
hey, I got to be closer to home,I gotta get back to Florida.
But what do I what do I want todo?
And I had been collecting boardseats.
You know, kind of earlier in mywhen Dixie and my Cisco days.
(11:09):
And that's when I pivoted andsaid, How can I take all of this
experience, and really helpthese innovative companies in
the food and beverage place inthe food, food and beverage
space succeed. So I took a leapof faith, I went out on my own.
(11:31):
And I got, I got more activelyinvolved with these small,
emerging innovative companies inthe food and beverage space. And
over time, I got involved withmore and more companies that
enabled me to get involved withcapital companies. One in
(11:53):
particular,I'm sure you've heard of is
Goldman Sachs.
And because of the success thatthese handful of companies have
been able to deliver, I am now aGoldman Sachs turnaround CEO. So
(12:14):
I, I engage with various GoldmanSachs companies, either as an
independent director orsometimes as a CEO. And I help
get their portfolio of companieskind of on the right track
again. And I've also gotrelationships with a handful of
(12:36):
other capital partners now. ButI would say the second half of
my career has been all abouthelping really smart, emerging
innovative companies figure outhow to how to succeed in this
crazy industry of food and Bev,it's really great. So that's a
(12:58):
long story. But it's becauseI mean, I know Laura is probably
chomping at the bit because theamount of overlap with all three
of our careers is just so funand exciting. So Laura, I'm,
you've come a long way from Bluepolyester.
(13:19):
Right? I think I still have oneof them in my closet just for
for old times sake. Sure. Sure.
What a question that I have, orjust kind of shed some light on
it, as you look to, you know,going from big corporate down
to, hey, I'm a one person showto now it seems like you're kind
(13:39):
of going back. How have youmentally really prepared for
that? Because I think sometimeswe see in our business, that can
be a challenge one way or theother. So I just would love to
hear from you. And kind ofI don't think we've got mastered
either. So any tips and tricks?
Welcome, Matt. I tell you,Laura, that is that is a
(14:01):
phenomenal question, because Idon't I don't know that there's
an easy answer to it. Becauseyou're absolutely right. I was
used to being in this corporatebubble. You know, everything
from the check showed up everyother week. And you just picked
your benefits package once ayear. And you take so many
(14:21):
things for granted when you'rein this corporate world, that
all of a sudden are gone. Whenyou pivot out onto your own your
own and obviously there werewere some things I knew going
in. But quite frankly, there wasa whole bunch that I didn't. And
I think at the end of the day,what helped me
(14:45):
was just the self belief and thecourage to jump in. Not even
knowing how deep the pool is,but having faith in my
experiential background incorporate America.
Got that I was just going tofigure it out. And trust me,
there were days where Iquestioned myself, you know,
(15:08):
what have you done, especiallyat that stage in my life where I
was a little longer in mycareer. But as I sit back and
look back today, about four anda half years post making this
pivot, I am so very glad that Idid.
(15:29):
My career today, what I do todayis very different.
But it is so incrediblyrewarding. And I would just, if
I could give anybody one or twopieces of advice that are
thinking about doing it is one,believe in yourself, you are a
heck of a lot smarter, andyou're a heck of a lot better
(15:51):
than you give yourself creditfor. I think we're all our
biggest self critics, and tojust go into it with a spirit of
learning. It is a great time.
And I'm a big believer that youshould never ever, ever start
learning. You know, the oldsaying, of when you're the
smartest person in the room,you're in the wrong room. I am a
(16:13):
huge believer that in that. AndI think if you go into it with
that attitude to where you'regoing to be open, you're going
to be willing to put yourselfout there and network and listen
and meet people that you mighthave otherwise not met. It is
unbelievable. How much yourcommunity will give back to you.
(16:38):
If you invest a little bit init.
That's great. I mean, Matt, I,you know, I think there's
something to be said to for yourwillingness to kind of take that
leap to have the humility. Imean, you just are one of the
most, you know, loving,compassionate, humble people
(17:02):
that I've ever met. I mean, youryour background is so amazing
yet, you know, I just feel likeyou have this internal, like,
what the heck, I'm willing toroll up my sleeves and try
stuff. And just, I mean, so I dofeel like there's this beauty in
your character that allows youto step in and say like, Well, I
mean, why not? Let's give it ashot. And I think that's why
(17:25):
you've been so successful, youknow, and my
honest impression of what Ithink you've done. Well, I'm,
I'm humbled by you saying that,thank you.
And that is directlyattributable to my parents.
Thankfully, my mom's stillalive. In fact, I'm headed down
(17:46):
to go see her here later thisafternoon.
But I'll I will always remember,a car ride with my dad.
And I'll remember it like it wasyesterday, because it was one of
those seminal moments insomebody's life. And I was a
young kid, I don't know howyoung I was. But, you know, I
(18:07):
was old enough to remember it.
But I was young enough to notreally understand what my dad
did. And my dad had just takenon the role of head of sales for
Nabisco. And it was back in thebarbarians at the gate days when
KKR had come in ROSS Johnson whomy dad now worked for. And so it
(18:28):
was pretty crazy. And I was inthat car with my dad. And I
said, Dad, I said, I don'tunderstand how you do a job
that's this big. You have allthese customers and all these
products, and you have, youknow, 1000s of people that you
(18:49):
have to motivate and you haveshareholders and now you have
KKR and like, how do you manageall of this? And he kind of
smiled. And he just looked at meand he's and he said he said,
Matt, he said I actually havethe easiest job in the company.
(19:11):
And I was like, no, like, Whatare you talking about? I said,
he said, Yeah, he said, all Ihave to do is take care of and
inspire and bring in the rightcharacter people to our
organization. And if I do thatone simple thing. They all take
(19:33):
care of my customers who remainincredibly happy. And when happy
customers are when customers arehappy, they buy more. And when
they buy more, guess what all ofthose other people, the
shareholders in KKR andeverybody else, they're happy.
So I just never lose sight ofwhat is the
(20:00):
The single most important thingthat I do, and that is I put
people first. And as long asthat foundation is strong,
everything else takes care ofitself. And I will never forget
that conversation. Because youknow, you go to business school
or you go to college, andeverybody wants to tell you how
(20:22):
hard business is. And you got toknow the numbers and the finance
and the structures and themarketplace. And there's 1000
Things they tell you, you know,you need to be really good at
you need to be expertise that,and my dad just broke it down to
where it's no, what you need tobe really expertise at is
(20:42):
people. And if you can do thatexceptionally well, everything
else takes care of itself. AndI've tried to live by that
conversation in my career, Ihaven't always succeeded, but
I've tried. And, you know,having that belief that if you
can get the people, right,structure drives, behavior,
(21:04):
behavior drives results, thenyour business, whatever business
it is, is going to be incrediblysuccessful.
It's great. I mean, I was justthinking about how you greeted
me with, you know, your commentabout the restaurant and Zach's
the best. Like, it doesn'tmatter what type of a business
(21:24):
you have, if people have thecare have the compassion, they
have the willingness tocome in an authentic manner.
And, I mean, again, I said itearlier, roll up their sleeves,
like there's a lot of work thatneeds to be done. And if people
just lean in, we can do a lot offun things. So And Matt, what I
took away too, is like, Behuman, with people, like, you
(21:48):
know, we spend so much of ourtime at work. And it's okay to
love your work family, too. Imean, you know, like, I'm Rich
and lovable, you know. But Ithink that that's an important
message that sometimes sometimesin the world of technology, and
not seeing people and all thatit kind of gets a little harder
(22:12):
to kind of have a connection,you have to be authentic. And
this is where I see a lot ofleaders and a lot of companies,
they get lost, right? You know,with all due respect to my HR
professional friends out there,HR can be a little bit cold, you
(22:33):
know, it can be a little bitabout rules and regulations and
compliance and governance. AndI'm not saying you know that
that is that you know that thatis bad. It's just how you come
across with doing all of theright things in a more authentic
(22:54):
human way, is really at the endof the day, what it's all about
HR can be really, really simple.
If just every single day, you'reguided by just do the right
thing. And we were faced earlyon.
When I was CEO of AI control, wewere faced with a serious
(23:17):
conundrum, where we had a teamof individuals that was working
for a third party that we had along relationship with. And they
were over in Ukraine. And therewas a handful of individuals in
Ukraine,working for us through a third
party, when the UK Ukraine,Russian conflict broke out. And
(23:41):
at the time I control was inwasn't in the best shape. And we
were still burning cash, weweren't profitable, we were a
long way away from being quoteunquote, turned around. And we
had to make a decision. Becausethese folks were fleeing with
(24:02):
their families for their lives.
And they weren't going to youknow, internet was down, they
were going to be offline for anunknown period of time. And
given that they went through athird party,
the business manual would havetold you, it's really simple.
Just go find another thirdparty, you know, so that you can
(24:25):
continue to get the work done,that these people were doing for
you. We threw the businessmanual out, because what we did
is we continue to pay thosepeople their full salary.
And basically said, when you andyour families are safe, and
(24:48):
you're ready to distractyourself with a little work, let
us know. And we went to thatthird party and we said look,
we're making this commitment toyour folks. RX
vacation now have you is thatyou take some of the fees that
we pay you, and you send them tothese people that are working
for us, which they actually did.
(25:11):
So, and guess what, thatresonated with the entire
company, not just the Ukrainianpeople. But it read, it
resonated with everybody in ourorganization that, you know,
wow, that is a pretty coolstance that our company decided
(25:31):
to make. And at the end of theday, in terms of dollars and
cents, it costs us very, verylittle, to do the right thing.
But sometimes, at the end of theday, the way you, if you will
create a culture ofauthenticity, is to throw the HR
(25:54):
manual out to throw the businessmanual out, and to just in your
gut, in your soul, just go dothe right thing. And it'll pay
itself back in spades. That'swhat I've found over the course
of my career. You mightsay, that's such an amazing
story. My question was going tobe so fast forward, and
(26:14):
unfortunately, they're still inthe conflict. You know, are
those individual settled? Arethey back working on your
business? Because I bet they'reworking twice as hard for you
Now, thankfully, every singleone of them survived. And as far
as we know, their familiessurvived their direct families.
(26:36):
And the answer is, yes, we stillwork with that third party, and
we still work with, with most,if not all, of those, those
individuals. And You betcha. Imean, these folks, you know, I
heard stories of these folkswould literally be in shelters,
(26:59):
and they'd be working, you know,in in the middle of the night,
you know, to, you know, to tohelp us out and to do what they
did for us. So,yeah, I mean, no business
manual, no business school wouldbe would necessarily teach Hey,
(27:19):
that's the, that's the rightthing to do from a business
standpoint. But, you know,sometimes you come to those
crossroads, and you start to dothe right thing. You know, it's
interesting, you bring up thatstory, I haven't thought about
this in a long time. But asimilar situation happened to me
when I was at General Mills, andI was working,
(27:42):
you know, for for a certainmanager who recognized I mean, I
was in crisis, my mom had beendiagnosed with brain cancer. And
my dad and I were her main,I would say, nurses or care
providers, I mean, we weretaking her down to the Mayo
Clinic, and many in Rochesterfrom like, the Minneapolis St.
Paul area. Anyway, my point is,this was before remote based
(28:06):
work, and they allowed me totake her to her, you know, chemo
and radiation and work from downin Rochester and things like
that. And, you know, again, Imean, I'm sure General Mills,
corporate probably would havesaid, well, we got to have, you
know, good productivity. But, Imean, I came back with this kind
of loyalty and feeling of yousupported me when I needed the
(28:30):
most. And now I will give mywhole heart times three. Right.
And so I do think that there aresome really amazing ways of
supporting people that may notget, they might not make the
paper, but you know, it's it'sa, it's a it's the right thing
to do.
(28:52):
For the humans that are on yourteam are Yeah, that's really a
neat story. Yeah. Goosebumpshead to toe. And if you do it
with authenticity, it's like, itshouldn't make the paper, right.
Yeah. It, it shouldUnfortunately, most of the bad
stuff is the only stuff thatever makes the paper. Right. So
(29:13):
no, Sara, you're you'reabsolutely right. If if you can
come across, you know, employeeengagement is a huge topic,
right? And there's all sorts ofstatistics out there that, you
know, upwards of over 50% of theworkforce is completely
disengaged from the work thatthey do, right. And you My
(29:36):
goodness, if you can find a wayto cut that in half. And imagine
the amount of productivity ifyou can cut that in half. And
here's the deal, and what Ifound is it's never the big
things, you know, it's neverthrowing more money at people or
you know, those sorts ofthings or the, you know, the
(30:00):
forced fun that some companiesdo, right? It's always real
awkward. And it's awkwardbecause it's not authentic,
right is if you can just createhuman connections, authentic
human connections, you know,with the folks on your team,
(30:23):
then they're going to runthrough a wall for you. And in
my view, the role of the CEOis not to be the smartest person
in finance in the smartestperson in sales and the smartest
person in operations, becauseI'm far from all that.
(30:44):
But the CEOs role at the end ofthe day, is to keep the company
energized about the strategicpath, the journey that we're on,
and to encourage them along theway. And to make sure that the
individuals across the companyare all collaborating, and
they're positive, and theyunderstand what the expectations
(31:07):
are, and they're energized todeliver those expectations. At
the end of the day, that's theheart and soul of the role of
the CEO. I'll be the first toadmit,
you know, I was by far not thesmartest guy in the room in any
of my functions. But I hadreally, really good people, in
(31:27):
all of those functions that werethe smartest people in the room.
And alls I needed to do, again,going back to that car ride, is
I just needed to inspire andempower them and let them go do
what they're brilliant at doing.
And everything else was going totake care of itself. That's
awesome. I was with a clientyesterday that ironically, is
the CEO of his, I would saymedium to larger sized law firm.
(31:52):
And he's the CEO, but he saysthat it stands for Chief
encouragement officer. And Ireally, I thought that was cute,
you know, you could useexcitement or whatever. But it's
that empowerment. It's that, youknow, getting people fired up
towards the cause, telling themthey're doing a great job, you
(32:15):
know, and so I love that. Sospeaking of, you know, Laura is
one of my favorite bosses thatI've ever had at General Mills.
And so I sort of, you know, Ithink everything you said, you
know, in terms ofgetting a team rallied the
people that worked for for Lauraat General Mills would run
(32:36):
through a brick wall for herthen, and they would today.
Yeah, totally. I mean, there'speople around the country, and
hopefully, they're listening.
And they can chime in with theircomments, because deserves a lot
of love. But I mean, she didthat through authenticity, and
you know, andalso the customers, I think,
kind of new to Laura, to befair, I think, you know, calling
(32:59):
on all these customers fromWalmart to HEB to everybody in
between. And it was really fun.
But I think they all knew Laurameant business, but she sure had
your back.
But man, like you said, I had agreat team. I had the luxury of
(33:22):
we were always seem to be thesmartest. But we all were able
to work together. And we were byfar the smartest. So the power,
you know, the exponential powerthat we all had. So it was
great. Tim was a magic. Youknow, they say in your career
magical times. It's kind of itwas a magical. Yeah. So there
(33:44):
are, there are many engagementsthat have done seven turnarounds
or accelerations in my careerand knock on wood. I'm seven for
seven. So knock on wood.
But one of the things that I donotice often when I when I drop
(34:07):
into certain situations is isthe CEO and our glass leader or
a top path leader. And what Imean by that is we've all seen
an hourglass, and there's abunch of sand on the top and it
has to flow through this reallytight opening and then
(34:27):
eventually it gets to thebottom.
Is the CEO that tight spot inthe middle.
does everything have to runthrough that CEO? Does every
decision have to run throughthat CEO or does the CEO create
a culture where everybody isdisempowered and thinks it all
(34:50):
has to run through that CEO? Inmany cases, that is kind of the
situationAnd that I drop into, and
especially in founder ledorganizations, founders are
really, really great at startingsomething.
(35:14):
And then there comes a point intime in their journey, where
they have to stop acting like afounder, and start acting like a
leader. And there's a massivedifference. And I've seen so
many instances where thefounder, not intentionally, not
(35:34):
maliciously, but they becomethat, you know, the middle of
the hourglass. And what thatdoes, ultimately, at the end of
the day, is it stops innovation,it stifles growth, and they
their company that, you know,may have been on a rocket ship,
(35:55):
not so very long ago, all of asudden begins to stall. And it's
very difficult, in many cases,for founders to find their way
out of that conundrum. And a bigpart of what I hope to
accomplish in my second halfcareer is to help CEOs who are
(36:19):
in that stuck in that I'm in themiddle of the hourglass, I just
joined a health care board outof Denver, Colorado, was so
incredibly impressed with theCEO and founder, because he knew
he was stuck. And he didn't knowhow to get out.
So we got connected. And I nowpart of his organization, that
(36:46):
is actively helping him getunstuck in this company, I think
is going to be a rocket ship.
And I just I love working withCEOs, and founders who have that
self awareness, to know when togo ask for help. Just seen too
(37:07):
many, that kind of hang on tothat belief that they're the
smartest person in the room, Istarted this, this is my baby,
and you know, it's gonna liveand die with me. And
unfortunately, all too oftenThat attitude leads to, it's
more likely going to die withyou than live with you. So,
(37:29):
anyhow, how much of that becausewe see that all the time with
our clients. I mean, I wouldsay, we primarily work with
founders, or, you know, ownersthat maybe took over shortly
after the founder, but that areacting as those hourglass kind
of leaders. And so how much ofit do you find is actually I,
(37:52):
it's the psychologicalcomponent, they have trust
issues, or they have fear thatstifling them? I mean, this
seems like you're coming in as acounselor in a lot of senses to
the CEO and saying, like, it'sokay, I'm gonna strap your hands
down. Yeah, you anything,you're, you're along for the
ride, you brought the rightpeople, let them go. Yeah, let
(38:13):
them go. I honestly think thatcertainly there are instances,
you know, where their own selfdoubt, you know, or being, you
know, fearful of letting go,Hey, I've got in many cases,
man, this is my entire life,right? I've got my entire
livelihood in this thing. Ican't entrust it to somebody
(38:35):
else. But I also see a lot of,they just don't know what to do.
The beauty of our experiences,kind of coming up through
corporate America is guess whatwe were taught how to lead in
very specific and incrementalways. We were taught what it's
(39:02):
like, you know, to have teamsand to have to be accountable to
a number and to have to care forpeople. In many cases, these
founders did not have that sameexperience. They weren't taught
that. And now all of a sudden,they're thrown in, you know,
let's say they catch a tiger bythe tail, and their business,
(39:24):
all of a sudden hockey sticks.
You know, literally, in somecases overnight, they could now
have this 100 Plus personcompany with $10 million of
revenue, and they've got outsidecapital that they have to take
care of. I mean, these types ofthings can spin up and happen
(39:46):
really, really fast. And in inmany cases, they just don't have
the inherent skill sets. Becausethey've never been taught how to
actually beA leader in that type of
situation? Yeah, that's a goodpoint. Because what you made me
think of is, you know, back tocorporate America days that, you
(40:07):
know, we all three have been apart of, if there's a question
and it's like, gosh, I have noidea, I'm gonna go ask the HR
person or the finance person. Soyou get this kind of training of
like, I don't have to knoweverything, because there's a
department for that, and I'mgonna go talk to the expert. And
so when you have a founder, andthey have built it from the
(40:29):
ground up, they may have beenenough at the point in time when
they started, the business hasscaled, they now need an expert
to come in. And yeah, I thinkthat's a really interesting
kind of moment of reflection forme on just, you know, we learned
to ask for help, because we werenever expected exactly what
(40:51):
everything exactly like, there,I remember the story, you told
me about a law firm that youwere working with. And, you
know, one of the partners like aphenomenal lawyer, like
unbelievable lawyer,you know, was now trying to
venture into some of theadministrative functions of
(41:13):
their law firm, because they hadgotten to the size where they
needed to do that. And thisindividual was struggling
mightily,because, you know, didn't
necessarily know how to go buildout these other administrative
one. And I think this individualwas another one of those unique
(41:36):
individuals that recognize thisearly enough on that they were
able to ask for help. And hisfirm benefited greatly from him
asking for help. Yeah. And Ithink what kind of comes into
play to that we see is, again,if you're a founder, you've
clearly been somewhatsuccessful, you still have a
(41:56):
business, or you just kind of,you know, you've been able to
fake it maybe a little bit onthe HR and a few other areas.
And heaven forbid, you say, youdon't know what you're doing.
And you ask for help. And like,How can I possibly bring
typically someone in maybe thatmight be younger, that might
have the expertise in the area?
So we kind of end up coachingpeople on like, it's okay that
(42:20):
you don't know everything? No,we're all human. We can't
possibly know everything, andnor are you good at everything.
I mean, frankly, right. I'm nota good doctor. No.
That's not what I'm trained todo. So I think it's a good
insight from the standpoint of,you know, this growth, what it
(42:42):
means to grow your business andthe role that you play as a CEO.
And I think you're, you know, Ilove a founder versus leader. Am
I safe? Am I safe? And doctorthat? That's okay. Big
difference. Yeah. So what typesof businesses are you working
with right now, Matt? I mean,what if if someone's listening
in they're like, oh, my gosh, Icould really use a turnover
(43:04):
expert.
What kinds of businesses notturnover turnaround? Sorry.
I said the wrong way, definitelydon't want it to turn over.
Or I was thinking maybe we couldtalk about like Pop Tart
turnovers, you know, like, it'slike a, an actual bakery
turnover. Um, apologies. I meantturnaround, and what types of
(43:29):
businesses here is, what I'velearned over the years is, I
grew up as I mentioned in foodand beverage, and I certainly
know enough to be dangerous inin that vertical. But what I've
also learned having done anumber of turnarounds and
(43:50):
accelerations, all differentshapes and sizes, all different
types of turnarounds andaccelerations, supplier
technology distribution, youknow, retail, what I found is
that the fundamentals, there'seight areas, generally speaking,
(44:16):
that out are not operatingoptimally. That is creating the
business to sputter.
And those eight areas when I getinvolved with a business, that
is where I start to poke around,because generally speaking, you
(44:38):
can find the problem in thoseeight areas. As matter of fact,
I would almost guarantee it.
That somewhere in those eightbuckets, you're missing
something. And so therefore,Sara to get to the answer to
your question, I amWith today, I'm engaged with a
(45:00):
supply chain freight companythat ships products all over the
globe. And mentioned, I recentlyjoined a health care company.
I've been in SAS technology,I've been in the payments space,
(45:22):
I am currently engaged with a,a branded company that's
launching a new brand.
I'm involved with Sarah, you.
And I've talked a lot abouttended bar, which is a disruptor
in the arena, and hotel space.
(45:47):
And so at the end of the day,given my experience and my if
you will platform, I'm almostmore energized to go jump into
something that I know verylittle about.
And apply, you know, kind of myplaybook of these eight things.
(46:11):
And I can guarantee you that themarketplace may be different,
the vernacular may be a littledifferent, the widget may be
different, but the fundamentalsof those eight things are going
to be exactly the same. So I'minvolved, I have gone away
outside my comfort zone, andgotten outside of, of food and
(46:36):
beverage. So in short order, Iam not afraid to step in to
almost anything. The eighth,that's the title of your book.
Actually, you know what, it'sfunny, you mentioned that
because one of these days, I'mgonna get around to writing one.
The title of my book is it's allabout the athletes. Oh, it's all
(47:02):
about the athletes. Okay. Andthen we'll go into the eight
things that you know, allinvariably, you have to have the
right people to go pull off andexecute, but
it's all about the athletes.
What was your position inbaseball? I was a pitcher. Okay,
kind of thought that might bethe case. Laura's husband was
also a pitcher. There you go.
(47:27):
We love pitchers. Yes. My son isa pitcher as well, or was a
pitcher left in your writing? Inin the world of baseball?
The pitcher kind of is a veryunique position, right? Because
they're the only ones on theteam who have a win loss record.
(47:47):
Yep. Right. Everybody else onthe team is kind of strapped
with a win loss record of theteam. But a pitcher has their
own win loss record. So ifyou're going to be a pitcher,
you have to have thick skin.
Because you know, front andcenter is going to be you know,
your win loss record and howthat you know, positively or
(48:07):
negatively impacts the team.
You're in the middle of thefield. And you're elevated.
So, rise, yeah, all eyes are onthe pitcher. So again, if you're
going to be a pitcher, you haveto be okay with the good and the
(48:29):
bad that comes with being in themiddle of the field and being
elevated on a pedestal. Becauseit ain't always pretty, I've
given up more than my fair shareof home runs in my life. And
that's a miserable feeling whenyou're standing there alone,
watching the guy who just tookyard run around the bases. And
the third thing is everythingbegins with you. Nothing happens
(48:56):
nobody moves until you move.
So it you know, kind of thoseunique characteristics of being
a pitcheryou know, are quite frankly,
I've found you know, wonderfullife lessons that you can take
to being a leader.
(49:17):
You got to be okay with thescorecard is the scorecard the
scorecard never lies, you win oryou lose? It doesn't matter if
you felt you threw a good game.
The umpire was a little off.
What are your guys didn't scoreenough? Doesn't matter. The
scorecard is this or thescoreboard is the scoreboard you
(49:39):
either win or lose. And you haveto have the mindset to where
you're okay with both of those.
And to just keep working to justkeep grinding to just keep
learning.
You know, try to get a littlebit better every day. And so
it's interesting, Laura, thatyou're married to a pitcher but
(49:59):
it'sI'd be curious, you know if that
kind of describes his mindset alittle bit because it certainly
was something that I was taughtplaying that position. Well,
first of all, I'd say you leftyour writing. I'm a righty,
right. Okay. Right here. This iswhy I'm talking to you today. If
I was our son, our stats openingday, right, opening day right
(50:21):
there today, the only thing Iwould add about you pictures is
you spent a lot of time in yourhead console. Sometimes, as
you're leading, you sometimeshave to say, hey, wait, I'm the
extrovert. First baseman, youkind of got to tell me a couple
of things. So 1,000%, that'sgood. I was in percent. I am
(50:43):
incredibly superstitious.
I wore a t shirt.
Every time I pitched it was thesame T shirt, in high school and
all through college. By the timeI was a senior in college, it
(51:03):
had been washed so much youcould see through it.
And it was an all countybasketball camp. Grey t shirt
that I got when I was in highschool. And I think I just
thrown it on one day. And it wasa day where I threw a no hitter,
perfect game or something inhigh school. And from that day
(51:27):
forward, that T shirt wasunderneath my uniform no matter
what. Wow, where did you?
Where'd you pitch, Matt? I wentto the University of Richmond in
Virginia. Spider. So I'm amighty spider. Huh? Yeah.
Our son looked at it. So great.
Okay, so I have Pepsi polyester.
(51:51):
I have an hourglass, and I havea great t shirt. That's right.
These are some good visuals,visuals. And I do have an
hourglass, my, my home. That's agood reminder, I might be buying
a couple hour glasses to reminda couple of our client founders
to stop being pinned. Maybe wecan invent one. It's an
(52:11):
hourglass, and then it's kind oflike the Rubik's cube, and then
it becomes a top hat.
Absolutely. Like you think ifyou put sand in an hourglass and
sand in a bucket, you turn themboth over at the same time. You
know, which moves faster? Right.
I love that. Okay.
(52:32):
Well, how will people get intouch with you if they are
interested in either a pastryturnover? No, just getting more
turnaround or just picking yourbrain? How should they reach out
if they need you? Personal Emailis fantastic. All right. All
right. There it is. There it is.
Thank you.
(52:56):
Matt, truly, thank you forallowing us to chat with you
about your journey. I mean,you've done so many incredible
things in your life. And thanksfor just being a really good
human. Well, thank you both. forhaving me, Laura. It was a
pleasure to meet you. Hopefullyone of these days. We can do it
over Appennino Treska.
(53:17):
With a beer. Yes, yes. With abeer. Yes. Now that there's the
you know, the little tap roomright next to it. So
anyhow, y'all have a wonderfulEaster. Did you see Trevor
Lawrence came by this week. Isaw the picture on your social.
Yep. Yeah. Came right over tothat tap room and had I think
(53:38):
you had a pinion or two. Sothat's awesome.
All right. Great. Thank you bothhave.
Y'all have a wonderful Easter.
You guys. Thank you again. Youbet. Thanks so much for tuning
into this episode of level upyour business with me, Sarah
Frasca. If you have a problem inyour business that's keeping you
(53:58):
up at night. Please join us in afuture episode so we can help
get you unstuck. Just clickingthe link in the show notes and
send us a message. Pleaseremember, stay innovative
friends.
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