August 23, 2025 • 32 mins
Back with renewed energy for season two! After a whirlwind summer filled with unexpected adventures—including camping mishaps involving ninja trees and discovering they're woefully unprepared for tent camping in Florida's scorching heat—they're diving back into the podcast with fresh perspectives from their new professional roles.
As the school year kicks into gear, behavior challenges emerge as students readjust to classroom structures after months of summer freedom. These transition periods reveal a universal truth in education: resistance is natural when expectations shift. For students with special needs, this adjustment can be particularly difficult as they navigate new routines, teachers, and demands. The hosts explore how seemingly minor issues—a fallen sock, tight shoelaces, or sensory discomfort—can trigger significant behavioral responses in children.
The heart of effective behavior management lies in collaborative parent-teacher relationships. Rather than approaching meetings determined to convince each other they're right, both parties benefit from asking questions and genuinely listening. "What do you see for your child?" becomes a transformative question that reveals differing yet equally important perspectives. When parents and educators align their goals and understand each other's viewpoints, they create a unified team that truly supports student success. Remember, every child deserves advocates who prioritize their well-being, whether they have formal diagnoses or not. As one wise t-shirt reminds us: "Be kind, because you never know what another person is going through."
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
I am so excited I was trying to figure out what kind
of yell that was.
I don't know if you like saw afrog or a lizard, or if you were
excited.
Right, no, I, no, I'm just likesuper excited.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
I feel like we haven't done this in forever and
we are embarking on what we'recalling our second season, so
I'm super excited.
Not only am I super excitedabout that, but we've had quite
the whirlwind of a summer.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Yeah, which started out with like zero or not zero,
but like two things on theagenda, and it ended up with
multiple fun things that we gotto do.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Yeah, I think like a week before school finished, the
entirety of our plan was likemaking our annual trip to
Virginia and having our annualget together with the Curtis
family somewhere, right, andthen next thing you know we're
like we were.
We were gone for a week andwe're back for a week.
(01:12):
And we're gone for a week andwe're back for a week and again
like gone.
I don't know, I lost count, butanyway we got to do some really
great things though.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
We did.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Like we and it's it's no secret.
The team that we worked with issuper cool and we love them so
much and they were always very,very, very good to us.
And yeah, I keep saying was, andwe'll explain that later but
they gifted us some campingtrips that were so much fun and
kind of weird, right, yeah, Imean, there was the backing into
(01:48):
a tree, okay, so listen, Idon't know if I'm getting old
and just can't hear, right, or Iwould like to blame the vehicle
, but okay, so here we are inthis campsite and it was a
really great campsite down in StAugustine and we had this idea
that, instead of having to backout into the road, why don't we
(02:10):
back in to the campsite so thatwe can just pull on out, right,
right, makes sense.
So I go to back up the behemothof the vehicle that we drive.
The thing is huge, it's a superlong expedition and and it has
the little bb thing when thingsare in the way.
(02:31):
But this tree had this likecrazy crook to it and yeah, I'm
I'm kind of making a gesturewith my hands that nobody can
see, but it has this crook to itthat while I'm backing up I
didn't hear the beepy thing.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
I'm looking at the, the camera and the screen and it
was didn't help that the treewas in the bushes yeah, stupid
tree.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
So the tree was being like a ninja tree.
It wasn't even like a normaltree that just hangs out and has
leaves.
It was hiding, almost like nowI'm not trying to start anything
, but it's almost like it wantedto hide and hit the truck.
So we back into it and all of asudden you hear and busted out
(03:19):
the window and that was weird.
But other than that everythingwas really great, like we had a
really good time yes, we did.
Would you like to elaborate onthat?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Hey, I think my brain needs to get back in like all
kinds of shape after the summer.
I need to get back in workshape.
I need to get back in schoolshape.
I need to, I guess, get back intalking shape, talking shape.
Talking shape for this, allright, so yeah, that trip was
down to St Augustine Beach and,like you said, the team that we
(03:54):
worked with last year gifted usa week there.
We'd never camped down therebefore, and it was one of those
bucket list sites that we wantedto check out.
Now, the other thing we'd neverdone we tent camped in Florida
in the summer, and as much funas we had, we sweat the entire
(04:19):
time to the point where we had aportable air conditioner and we
realized that our tent hadthese screens that didn't close,
and so we spent some of ourtime making making screens
closers that the air conditionerwould work better, and so then
we realized that Though we'resad, that's what we realized.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
We do not know how to camp, like if the end of the
world started.
I don't mean like the end ofthe world like it exploded, but
I mean, let's just for a minuteimagine us in, you know, like
the Walking Dead kind of setting.
We're done Kurti, we're goingto be laying out on the ground
(05:05):
sweating to death, hoping to geteaten by zombies.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Unless we got a beach to go to, because the beach was
great.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Oh, that did work out , didn't it?
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, the beach was great.
We could go and cool off andhave a good time.
However, one really cool thingwe did learn on that trip is
that okay, so we might want tolook into a camper if we plan on
doing this more in thesummertime, because it was great
and going to the beach wasgreat and if I'm near water, I'm
happy.
So we decided that for the nextfabulous trip that they gifted
(05:38):
us to Santee, south Carolina,that we probably wanted
something with some airconditioning.
Yeah, our creature comforts.
Yeah, that is pretty sad, butit was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
It was a lot of good times.
So, hey, listen, let us knowabout your summer stuff.
You can talk to us on Facebook,you can shoot us an email to
lifeintheeptribe at gmailcom and, yeah, tell us about some of
your fun times.
Now let's back up a little bitmore and talk about our change
(06:14):
of scenery.
Yep, that silence was on purple.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Well, because it happened much like the summer
filling up, it all happened veryfast.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
It's all your fault.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Well, it is my fault and I'll take the blame for that
.
I don't mind, that's okay.
So anybody that has hung aroundyou for the last I don't know
five years, that has hung aroundyou for the last I don't know
five years, knows that youreally, really, really enjoyed
(06:54):
your time hanging out at themiddle school when you were
doing your practicum hours forschool, right, and I think you
were.
How long were you there?
Speaker 2 (07:00):
I think I only did 40 hours Okay In one of the
semesters.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
But I think it was my second third year in school.
Did you say?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
your second, third year, second, or third year.
Oh, second or third year I waslike what is a second, third
year.
I think it was during my thirdyear and I had to go over there
to do more to do my hours forthe um, my degree, and luckily
that I got to you know, got tosee and work with, got to be in
(07:36):
the classroom with one ofXander's teachers but also got
to pick the brain of a Xander'sother teacher while that he was
there and I just really likedthe time there.
I like the things that they gotto work the brain of a Sanders
other teacher while that he wasthere and I just really liked
the time there.
I liked the things that theygot to work on Providing the
more of the life skills part ofspecial education going on the.
(07:58):
I got to go on one of thecommunity-based outings one time
and so I just felt like thatwas more.
I was more suited for that.
But, like I said, anybody likeyou said, anybody that knows me
knows.
I said that.
But I also said if you decideyou're pursuing other things,
(08:19):
then this is what I'm doing.
But that's not really how ithappened.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
No, no, it got kind of weird.
So it was literally the lastday of school and that opening
was sent out is that the rightway to say it?
Distributed amongst those whowork in the school system a
vacancy and yeah and so I saw itand I thought, oh my goodness,
(08:47):
you know, here's an opening tothe middle school and and I know
that laura had some interest inthat, and so I was like, hey,
check it out.
Um, and she did, and that'swhere she ended up yep I mean,
it happened like less than lessthan a week.
Yeah, it was a quick turnaroundand so, you know, with Laura
(09:07):
leaving, I got to, and so I gotto thinking about my situation
in life and, and with us goingback to school again, we're
finishing up some degrees herewithin the next couple of years,
and for me to have a change ofscenery as far as, like, my
(09:33):
responsibility, the things thathave some responsibility,
changes that would allow me moreflexibility and what's the word
I'm looking for, like I don'tknow put myself in a different
setting so I could focus onfinishing up this degree that's
coming along because, goodnessknows, I need all the help that
(09:55):
I can get.
So with that, I ended up movingto another school to do
collaborative teaching and, foranybody that does not know what
that means, I still work withkids that have IEPs.
I just push into the Gen Nclassroom and work with them
there, and I got to tell youwe've been back in school for
(10:15):
two and a half weeks and it'sbeen really great.
It's been neat getting to meetnew kids and new teachers and
make more connections, and soone of the things that we're
really excited about is the poolfrom which we can gain more
understanding and knowledgeabout the world of IEP, not just
(10:40):
the you know the paperwork sideof it and all of that, but
everything that comes along withstudents that have special
needs, and we know that it'sincredibly multifaceted, right.
So you know with kids that younever know what supports they
(11:01):
need in the beginning, and then,the more you work with them,
their supports needs change.
Sometimes you know what theywere needing support with.
On this day they no longer needthat support, and so now we
(11:25):
have to find other people whohave other specialties, and so
the plan for season two is tocontinue with a lot of those
interviews and bringing inspecialists.
And because, at the end of theday, our whole goal in
everything that we do is toprovide support, everybody wants
(11:47):
to know that they're supportedand everybody wants to feel
supported, and we know that,again, there's so many people
that are involved in the life ofa student that has special
needs that nobody is aspecialist in everything.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Right.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
And so yeah, so the more that we can gather, the
more that we can bring togetherand maybe kind of produce this
kind of a one-stop shop to atleast point people in a
direction that have differentconcerns or questions.
I think that would be a greatthing.
So how has the beginning ofyour year been?
(12:28):
I just talked a little bitabout mine and how exciting it's
been, but tell me some moreabout yours.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Mine's been good.
It's been really good and gotto meet some new kids, also have
some familiar faces where I am,some of the students that I've
known for a long time and got tosee some that I hadn't, that
had moved on and then came backto.
I came over to the middleschool after elementary and so
(12:56):
that's been great.
It's been great working withthe teachers I'm working,
working with and they have a lotof knowledge and um, but it
it's just been, it's been adifferent learning curve.
But, uh, as far as you know,realize that some of my
materials that I've brought overlike, okay, let's, yeah, so
(13:19):
these kids know all this.
So let me find I'm on the searchfor some, uh, more materials
for sure, um, I was fortunatethat um, two of the, the paras
that we worked with, had um alsoapplied and came over with me
and so I get to work with thembecause as a team, that is one
(13:45):
of the harder things, and I wasfortunate that I didn't have to
start the year learning a newschool, learning new students,
learning new routines andlearning new paras.
So that helped take a lot of theanxiety and stress away.
Now, as the beginning of theyear starts.
(14:07):
The students have to learn usand we all know children,
they're going to try to get awaywith what they can get away
with and see what we're going toput up with.
And so there's been somebehaviors that we've seen in the
(14:28):
school, not just in our classesbut in the school and we've
also talked to other co-workers,other friends, family members,
and I think that that'ssomething that is being seen and
we don't know about otherstates and county, but at least
(14:51):
in our county that's somethingthat we've been seeing and
hearing a lot of at thebeginning of the school years
having some struggles with thesekids coming back from school
and settling into a routine anddisplaying some of these
unwanted behaviors.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Yeah, and I think that what you said about
settling in on a routine iswhat's huge, because I know
we've talked a lot before aboutthe difference as far as
expectation goes in the houseand in the school building.
They should be different.
There should be morerestrictions in the school
(15:30):
building right, because you'retrying to help students learn
how to operate in differentsettings, and home should be a
place that they can go to andkind of, you know, take a breath
and unwind, and not saying thatkids shouldn't have direction
or order.
However, you know that it isimportant to have that place
(15:51):
where you can just kind of letloose a little.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
I think there's less expectations.
I know one of the common thingsthat when teachers talk to
parents, one of the commonthings they hear is well, I
don't see that at home, and weoften hear teachers that get
frustrated or they don't believethe parent.
I think we've even been foundthinking, huh, and until we
(16:21):
realize that well yeah, well,that does make sense, because
they're not asking them to sitdown and do these work tasks and
, like you said, it shouldn't belike that.
Of course they should haveexpectations at home.
We're not saying that, butthey're different expectations
and a lot of times what'shappening at school is they're
(16:44):
being asked to do things thatare not highly preferred
activities.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Right, right.
I mean, I don't know how manytimes over the course of my
adult life I've woke up and saidI don't want to go to work
today, just because I didn'tfeel like doing work.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I don't want to write this paper this weekend, yep.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
See, and so that all makes sense.
And so what happens is we'restarting back into the school
year.
So where we're at, like I saidearlier, we're two and a half
weeks into the school year.
And so now you have all of thesekids from, you know, from
kindergarten all the way upthrough 12th grade, who are now
stepping back into a buildingwhere the expectations are going
(17:23):
to be a lot higher after havingmonths of not the same types of
expectations, and with thatcomes pushback.
And so we've seen that, we'veseen the pushback in the
self-contained classrooms, we'veseen the pushback in the
general setting.
And so I think what thequestion is, just moving into,
(17:45):
sliding into this first episodeof the first season, let's just
kind of talk a little bit about,let's talk about those
behaviors, kind of at a surfacelevel, and discuss, I mean, what
are some of the things that weneed to understand, some of the
things that we need to do inresponse to those you know
(18:10):
there's, of course there's thatimpact on on learning, for the
student presenting the behaviorsand the students in the in the
classroom, for the studentpresenting the behaviors and the
students in the classroom, andso, and then it impacts the
teachers being able to get whatthey need to get done.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
And we know that each seems like each year, that
there is, you know, more of thatpush on teachers of academics.
I'm not saying academics isn'timportant, don't?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
take that, Listen who really gives a rip.
If you can read.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
No, we're not saying that.
But it seems that thecurriculum and instruction is
starting they're expected to dofrom the get-go and so it's hard
for those teachers to get thatroutine.
Because most of the time we'rea little more fortunate in our
(19:10):
setting that we already have.
A lot of times we already haverelationships with our students
and they know our expectationswhen they come back.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
Yeah, because you'll spend multiple years with the
same students and they know ourexpectations when they come back
.
They have to remind them.
Yeah, because you'll spendmultiple years with the same
students.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
But in the majority of the classrooms, these
students are working with newteachers and, like I said, most
children are going to see whatthey can get away with and if
they can get away with something, so they're going to test that
new teacher that they have thisyear.
And so we've talked beforeabout the importance of having
(19:43):
relationships, but with therigor that is expected, it's
hard to develop thoserelationships right from the
get-go, and so they're seeingthe behaviors and the
disruptions and reaching out toparents, and parents are I don't
know what to do, or I haven't,I haven't seen this, or this
(20:04):
didn't happen last year, and soit's yeah, it.
I think that it's a lot, a lotof that going on.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Well, and then when we start to look at our specific
population, our tribe, thestudents with special needs, it
always one of the things thatrings in my head very often is
the conversation that we hadwith Heather McMillan last year,
one of the greatest specialeducation teachers I've ever met
(20:32):
in my life.
She's fantastic.
She was Zander's teacher.
She gets results, she pushesthe kids like she's figured them
out, and something that sheshared with us is that that
people don't learn till they'reready to learn.
Right, and we can agree withthat.
We can look and we can see that.
We see that in our adult lives,People who you know shirk off
(20:56):
certain responsibilities untilthey get to a point where
they're like oh wait, a minute,no, this things have to change.
I'm now ready to takeaccountability and action, or
take accountability for myactions and what I'm doing with
my life and kids.
Learning is the same thing.
So we can have a kid in ourclassroom that you know they may
be incredibly intelligent, butif they're not ready to learn,
(21:20):
it's not going to happen.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Right.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
You're going to have that clash, you're going to have
that Pushback.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, resistance.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Right, and so we look at that and we think to
ourselves, okay, well, why, why,why?
Why is this happening, right?
And so we've already talked alittle bit about that.
How do we approach that, though?
What do we do as parents?
What do we do as specialeducation educators?
Should I just say specialeducators?
(21:50):
I think that makes more sense,special educators when looking
at these behaviors, because I doknow this.
I know that any time we want tosee a change, it starts with an
understanding.
Right, we have to have anunderstanding of what's going on
.
One of the things that I hadthis conversation with somebody
just the other day.
I'm not a big like systemsperson from the standpoint of I
(22:16):
believe that if I do X, y and Z,I'm always going to get this
result.
I just don't.
I think there's too manyvariables in life to live that
way, and oftentimes we have toget to know people and we have
to work those.
We have to work through that toget to the desired end, and in
(22:37):
this case, we're talking aboutmodifying behavior.
So what do we need to know,like, what are some things that
we need to understand to helpkind of shape our scope, shape
our perspective on these kidsand what they're going through
right now.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
I think one of the things you talked about was
parents and teachers, and sothat parent-teacher relationship
and communication is important.
I was having a conversationwith a friend who is also a
parent of a young child andtheir child is displaying some
(23:18):
behaviors and there's someconcern and I was really, really
excited that she had said that.
Well, I have a meeting with theteacher and I understand that
the school has a lot to offer.
So before I take further steps,I want to hear what the teacher
(23:40):
says and what the you know theperspective of the teacher and
you know she also has somethings that they have changed at
home with the child and theyalso have some strategies that
they use.
So it was exciting to me thatshe's going in there with this
(24:02):
open mind, with this teacher,that and with this thought that
she's this teacher's here tohelp me and my child.
She's not just like complainingabout my child and the
behaviors, complaining about mychild and the behaviors.
(24:25):
So I think that's one of theimportant things to keep in mind
is having that conversation andhopefully that is the case,
that the teacher isn't justthere trying to complain about
your child.
That they're like okay, let'sfigure out the why, like you're
saying, you have to understandwhy this behavior is happening,
because it can be a long list ofthings and especially when
(24:50):
you're talking about youngchildren, some of the things
that get in their heads, thatbother them, that they're like.
We may finally, when we figureit out, be like, oh my gosh,
that's like completelyunreasonable, but to them it's
not, it's a big deal.
To them it, you know, couldn'tbe the fact that their sock has
(25:10):
fallen into their shoe.
I know that drives me crazy.
However, as a small child, thatcan be a big deal, especially
if there's a sensory issues ortheir shoelaces are too tight.
I know as a baby our oldestTroy.
Every time I put shoes on himhe cried and I couldn't figure
(25:34):
out why.
Well, it was because his feetneeded a little bit more work
before they could go into thoseshoes, but like he would scream
bloody murder, as soon as I tookhis shoes off he was fine.
So finding the, the reason whythey're they're um he wasn't
just being a turd right, no no,because he was a pretty easy
(25:55):
baby, so like something is wrongif he's crying like this.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
But yeah, it can just , it can be the simplest things.
Something that we learned nottoo terribly long ago and
something that I continue tocarry with me and I know you do
as well is is that theimportance of listening and the
importance of asking questions.
You know it's very easy from aparent side to have a mindset of
(26:24):
this is what I want for my kid,this is what I want them to
accomplish, and if the teacherdoesn't agree with that, then
there's some serious friction.
And there's some seriousfriction and then on the other
side, when you're the teacher,you have in mind, working with
this kid, everything they canaccomplish and the goals that
you believe they can achieve,but it may not match what the
(26:52):
parent's thinking conversationsalmost like.
We are dead set on convincingthe other that we're right and
we don't take the time to listenand to ask the questions.
You know it took us years to getto a point where we were
sitting in a meeting withparents and it just for whatever
(27:14):
reason.
At that time it clicked and wequestion what do you, what do
you see for your child?
Well, and what they saw andwhat we saw, not that one was
better or worse or they werevery different.
Right, and there is no way thatwe as a team are going to
achieve a goal when the goalsare different, right we're.
(27:36):
We're kind of pointing guns indifferent directions and pulling
the trigger.
We're never going to hit thebullseye, right, it's never
going to happen.
And so I think that what I wantto really push at the end of
this conversation is thatteachers and parents, if we
can't be and I've failed at this, right so this isn't me
(27:57):
standing on a pedestal saying,hey, I've got it figured out,
I've done it right, like I havefailed this numerous times and
I'm trying to get better at it.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
And we have, on both sides of that fence, right as
parents and as teachers.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Absolutely.
Us right now is is if we canget our teachers and our parents
to walk into the meetings readyto listen, ready to hear each
other, ready to ask thequestions of what do you see and
why?
Because you know what here's.
(28:32):
The truth is that you know wecan sit all day and we can say a
kid's going to be able to dothis and a kid's not going to be
able to do that, and there'sgoing to be teachers that are
going to have too lowexpectations, too high
expectations.
There's going to be parents inthat same vein, but we never
know where to meet if we don'task the questions and we don't
(28:52):
listen, right?
So I think.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but ifwe can give one little piece of
advice rolling into this schoolyear, it's that if the kid's
going to be first and theirwell-being is first, we've got
to be a team.
We've got to be a team.
(29:14):
So let's walk in there, b team.
And oh, by the way, if you area teacher and that student is
not like, their best interest isnot number one on your, on your
to do list Quit, go, dosomething else.
Don't do that to these youngins, Right?
(29:36):
If you're just in there becauseyou've been a teacher and this
is what I do, and I'm just kindof waiting out and I'm going to
make these kids listen.
Go do something else, becausethey don't need that from you.
What they need is a team, anIEP team, parents, teachers,
other support staff that say ourgoal is to help this kid be the
(29:59):
very best that they can be.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Even before an IEP team, some of these young kids
are not diagnosed or not theyhave not been screened, and so
some of these students that arehaving these issues, especially
the young ones, you don't haveto have an IEP to have a team at
(30:21):
school.
True story you know parents askthe questions.
Okay, so because, and if theteacher doesn't know and won't
find out, go to the next person,talk to the guidance counselor,
talk to the principal and findout what is available for your
(30:42):
child to help your child andwhat's the best way to support
as a team, because you have ateam whether your kid has an IEP
or not.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
So you were telling me the other day about this
T-shirt.
I think you said that one ofyour parents got all of you a
t-shirt, or but it had thisreally great saying on it.
What was it?
I?
Speaker 2 (31:02):
think it said be kind , because you never know what
another person is going through.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Yeah, and I think that's key to keep in mind.
Right, you're walking intothese meetings, you're seeing
these children, you're seeingthe behaviors, you're seeing a
lot of chaos going on and it'svery important to consider them.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Right, and my dad always used to say you know
everyone's carrying their ownsack of rocks.
You never know what's in.
You don't know what's in thatsack of rocks, and everybody's
sack of rocks is different, sodon't assume that you know
what's going on.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Well, my dad just used to say what's wrong with
you?
And you know I still can'tanswer that question, so we are
wrapping up episode one ofseason two.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
I'm so excited still.
And his football season likecheers.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
Right Weird, but anyway we'll see you next time.
I am so excited I was trying to figure out what kind
of yell that was.
I don't know if you like saw afrog or a lizard, or if you were
excited.
Right, no, I, no, I'm just likesuper excited.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
I feel like we haven't done this in forever and
we are embarking on what we'recalling our second season, so
I'm super excited.
Not only am I super excitedabout that, but we've had quite
the whirlwind of a summer.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Yeah, which started out with like zero or not zero,
but like two things on theagenda, and it ended up with
multiple fun things that we gotto do.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Yeah, I think like a week before school finished, the
entirety of our plan was likemaking our annual trip to
Virginia and having our annualget together with the Curtis
family somewhere, right, andthen next thing you know we're
like we were.
We were gone for a week andwe're back for a week.
(01:12):
And we're gone for a week andwe're back for a week and again
like gone.
I don't know, I lost count, butanyway we got to do some really
great things though.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
We did.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Like we and it's it's no secret.
The team that we worked with issuper cool and we love them so
much and they were always very,very, very good to us.
And yeah, I keep saying was, andwe'll explain that later but
they gifted us some campingtrips that were so much fun and
kind of weird, right, yeah, Imean, there was the backing into
(01:48):
a tree, okay, so listen, Idon't know if I'm getting old
and just can't hear, right, or Iwould like to blame the vehicle
, but okay, so here we are inthis campsite and it was a
really great campsite down in StAugustine and we had this idea
that, instead of having to backout into the road, why don't we
(02:10):
back in to the campsite so thatwe can just pull on out, right,
right, makes sense.
So I go to back up the behemothof the vehicle that we drive.
The thing is huge, it's a superlong expedition and and it has
the little bb thing when thingsare in the way.
(02:31):
But this tree had this likecrazy crook to it and yeah, I'm
I'm kind of making a gesturewith my hands that nobody can
see, but it has this crook to itthat while I'm backing up I
didn't hear the beepy thing.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
I'm looking at the, the camera and the screen and it
was didn't help that the treewas in the bushes yeah, stupid
tree.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
So the tree was being like a ninja tree.
It wasn't even like a normaltree that just hangs out and has
leaves.
It was hiding, almost like nowI'm not trying to start anything
, but it's almost like it wantedto hide and hit the truck.
So we back into it and all of asudden you hear and busted out
(03:19):
the window and that was weird.
But other than that everythingwas really great, like we had a
really good time yes, we did.
Would you like to elaborate onthat?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Hey, I think my brain needs to get back in like all
kinds of shape after the summer.
I need to get back in workshape.
I need to get back in schoolshape.
I need to, I guess, get back intalking shape, talking shape.
Talking shape for this, allright, so yeah, that trip was
down to St Augustine Beach and,like you said, the team that we
(03:54):
worked with last year gifted usa week there.
We'd never camped down therebefore, and it was one of those
bucket list sites that we wantedto check out.
Now, the other thing we'd neverdone we tent camped in Florida
in the summer, and as much funas we had, we sweat the entire
(04:19):
time to the point where we had aportable air conditioner and we
realized that our tent hadthese screens that didn't close,
and so we spent some of ourtime making making screens
closers that the air conditionerwould work better, and so then
we realized that Though we'resad, that's what we realized.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
We do not know how to camp, like if the end of the
world started.
I don't mean like the end ofthe world like it exploded, but
I mean, let's just for a minuteimagine us in, you know, like
the Walking Dead kind of setting.
We're done Kurti, we're goingto be laying out on the ground
(05:05):
sweating to death, hoping to geteaten by zombies.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Unless we got a beach to go to, because the beach was
great.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Oh, that did work out , didn't it?
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, the beach was great.
We could go and cool off andhave a good time.
However, one really cool thingwe did learn on that trip is
that okay, so we might want tolook into a camper if we plan on
doing this more in thesummertime, because it was great
and going to the beach wasgreat and if I'm near water, I'm
happy.
So we decided that for the nextfabulous trip that they gifted
(05:38):
us to Santee, south Carolina,that we probably wanted
something with some airconditioning.
Yeah, our creature comforts.
Yeah, that is pretty sad, butit was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
It was a lot of good times.
So, hey, listen, let us knowabout your summer stuff.
You can talk to us on Facebook,you can shoot us an email to
lifeintheeptribe at gmailcom and, yeah, tell us about some of
your fun times.
Now let's back up a little bitmore and talk about our change
(06:14):
of scenery.
Yep, that silence was on purple.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Well, because it happened much like the summer
filling up, it all happened veryfast.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
It's all your fault.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Well, it is my fault and I'll take the blame for that
.
I don't mind, that's okay.
So anybody that has hung aroundyou for the last I don't know
five years, that has hung aroundyou for the last I don't know
five years, knows that youreally, really, really enjoyed
(06:54):
your time hanging out at themiddle school when you were
doing your practicum hours forschool, right, and I think you
were.
How long were you there?
Speaker 2 (07:00):
I think I only did 40 hours Okay In one of the
semesters.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
But I think it was my second third year in school.
Did you say?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
your second, third year, second, or third year.
Oh, second or third year I waslike what is a second, third
year.
I think it was during my thirdyear and I had to go over there
to do more to do my hours forthe um, my degree, and luckily
that I got to you know, got tosee and work with, got to be in
(07:36):
the classroom with one ofXander's teachers but also got
to pick the brain of a Xander'sother teacher while that he was
there and I just really likedthe time there.
I like the things that they gotto work the brain of a Sanders
other teacher while that he wasthere and I just really liked
the time there.
I liked the things that theygot to work on Providing the
more of the life skills part ofspecial education going on the.
(07:58):
I got to go on one of thecommunity-based outings one time
and so I just felt like thatwas more.
I was more suited for that.
But, like I said, anybody likeyou said, anybody that knows me
knows.
I said that.
But I also said if you decideyou're pursuing other things,
(08:19):
then this is what I'm doing.
But that's not really how ithappened.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
No, no, it got kind of weird.
So it was literally the lastday of school and that opening
was sent out is that the rightway to say it?
Distributed amongst those whowork in the school system a
vacancy and yeah and so I saw itand I thought, oh my goodness,
(08:47):
you know, here's an opening tothe middle school and and I know
that laura had some interest inthat, and so I was like, hey,
check it out.
Um, and she did, and that'swhere she ended up yep I mean,
it happened like less than lessthan a week.
Yeah, it was a quick turnaroundand so, you know, with Laura
(09:07):
leaving, I got to, and so I gotto thinking about my situation
in life and, and with us goingback to school again, we're
finishing up some degrees herewithin the next couple of years,
and for me to have a change ofscenery as far as, like, my
(09:33):
responsibility, the things thathave some responsibility,
changes that would allow me moreflexibility and what's the word
I'm looking for, like I don'tknow put myself in a different
setting so I could focus onfinishing up this degree that's
coming along because, goodnessknows, I need all the help that
(09:55):
I can get.
So with that, I ended up movingto another school to do
collaborative teaching and, foranybody that does not know what
that means, I still work withkids that have IEPs.
I just push into the Gen Nclassroom and work with them
there, and I got to tell youwe've been back in school for
(10:15):
two and a half weeks and it'sbeen really great.
It's been neat getting to meetnew kids and new teachers and
make more connections, and soone of the things that we're
really excited about is the poolfrom which we can gain more
understanding and knowledgeabout the world of IEP, not just
(10:40):
the you know the paperwork sideof it and all of that, but
everything that comes along withstudents that have special
needs, and we know that it'sincredibly multifaceted, right.
So you know with kids that younever know what supports they
(11:01):
need in the beginning, and then,the more you work with them,
their supports needs change.
Sometimes you know what theywere needing support with.
On this day they no longer needthat support, and so now we
(11:25):
have to find other people whohave other specialties, and so
the plan for season two is tocontinue with a lot of those
interviews and bringing inspecialists.
And because, at the end of theday, our whole goal in
everything that we do is toprovide support, everybody wants
(11:47):
to know that they're supportedand everybody wants to feel
supported, and we know that,again, there's so many people
that are involved in the life ofa student that has special
needs that nobody is aspecialist in everything.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Right.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
And so yeah, so the more that we can gather, the
more that we can bring togetherand maybe kind of produce this
kind of a one-stop shop to atleast point people in a
direction that have differentconcerns or questions.
I think that would be a greatthing.
So how has the beginning ofyour year been?
(12:28):
I just talked a little bitabout mine and how exciting it's
been, but tell me some moreabout yours.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Mine's been good.
It's been really good and gotto meet some new kids, also have
some familiar faces where I am,some of the students that I've
known for a long time and got tosee some that I hadn't, that
had moved on and then came backto.
I came over to the middleschool after elementary and so
(12:56):
that's been great.
It's been great working withthe teachers I'm working,
working with and they have a lotof knowledge and um, but it
it's just been, it's been adifferent learning curve.
But, uh, as far as you know,realize that some of my
materials that I've brought overlike, okay, let's, yeah, so
(13:19):
these kids know all this.
So let me find I'm on the searchfor some, uh, more materials
for sure, um, I was fortunatethat um, two of the, the paras
that we worked with, had um alsoapplied and came over with me
and so I get to work with thembecause as a team, that is one
(13:45):
of the harder things, and I wasfortunate that I didn't have to
start the year learning a newschool, learning new students,
learning new routines andlearning new paras.
So that helped take a lot of theanxiety and stress away.
Now, as the beginning of theyear starts.
(14:07):
The students have to learn usand we all know children,
they're going to try to get awaywith what they can get away
with and see what we're going toput up with.
And so there's been somebehaviors that we've seen in the
(14:28):
school, not just in our classesbut in the school and we've
also talked to other co-workers,other friends, family members,
and I think that that'ssomething that is being seen and
we don't know about otherstates and county, but at least
(14:51):
in our county that's somethingthat we've been seeing and
hearing a lot of at thebeginning of the school years
having some struggles with thesekids coming back from school
and settling into a routine anddisplaying some of these
unwanted behaviors.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Yeah, and I think that what you said about
settling in on a routine iswhat's huge, because I know
we've talked a lot before aboutthe difference as far as
expectation goes in the houseand in the school building.
They should be different.
There should be morerestrictions in the school
(15:30):
building right, because you'retrying to help students learn
how to operate in differentsettings, and home should be a
place that they can go to andkind of, you know, take a breath
and unwind, and not saying thatkids shouldn't have direction
or order.
However, you know that it isimportant to have that place
(15:51):
where you can just kind of letloose a little.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
I think there's less expectations.
I know one of the common thingsthat when teachers talk to
parents, one of the commonthings they hear is well, I
don't see that at home, and weoften hear teachers that get
frustrated or they don't believethe parent.
I think we've even been foundthinking, huh, and until we
(16:21):
realize that well yeah, well,that does make sense, because
they're not asking them to sitdown and do these work tasks and
, like you said, it shouldn't belike that.
Of course they should haveexpectations at home.
We're not saying that, butthey're different expectations
and a lot of times what'shappening at school is they're
(16:44):
being asked to do things thatare not highly preferred
activities.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Right, right.
I mean, I don't know how manytimes over the course of my
adult life I've woke up and saidI don't want to go to work
today, just because I didn'tfeel like doing work.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I don't want to write this paper this weekend, yep.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
See, and so that all makes sense.
And so what happens is we'restarting back into the school
year.
So where we're at, like I saidearlier, we're two and a half
weeks into the school year.
And so now you have all of thesekids from, you know, from
kindergarten all the way upthrough 12th grade, who are now
stepping back into a buildingwhere the expectations are going
(17:23):
to be a lot higher after havingmonths of not the same types of
expectations, and with thatcomes pushback.
And so we've seen that, we'veseen the pushback in the
self-contained classrooms, we'veseen the pushback in the
general setting.
And so I think what thequestion is, just moving into,
(17:45):
sliding into this first episodeof the first season, let's just
kind of talk a little bit about,let's talk about those
behaviors, kind of at a surfacelevel, and discuss, I mean, what
are some of the things that weneed to understand, some of the
things that we need to do inresponse to those you know
(18:10):
there's, of course there's thatimpact on on learning, for the
student presenting the behaviorsand the students in the in the
classroom, for the studentpresenting the behaviors and the
students in the classroom, andso, and then it impacts the
teachers being able to get whatthey need to get done.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
And we know that each seems like each year, that
there is, you know, more of thatpush on teachers of academics.
I'm not saying academics isn'timportant, don't?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
take that, Listen who really gives a rip.
If you can read.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
No, we're not saying that.
But it seems that thecurriculum and instruction is
starting they're expected to dofrom the get-go and so it's hard
for those teachers to get thatroutine.
Because most of the time we'rea little more fortunate in our
(19:10):
setting that we already have.
A lot of times we already haverelationships with our students
and they know our expectationswhen they come back.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
Yeah, because you'll spend multiple years with the
same students and they know ourexpectations when they come back
.
They have to remind them.
Yeah, because you'll spendmultiple years with the same
students.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
But in the majority of the classrooms, these
students are working with newteachers and, like I said, most
children are going to see whatthey can get away with and if
they can get away with something, so they're going to test that
new teacher that they have thisyear.
And so we've talked beforeabout the importance of having
(19:43):
relationships, but with therigor that is expected, it's
hard to develop thoserelationships right from the
get-go, and so they're seeingthe behaviors and the
disruptions and reaching out toparents, and parents are I don't
know what to do, or I haven't,I haven't seen this, or this
(20:04):
didn't happen last year, and soit's yeah, it.
I think that it's a lot, a lotof that going on.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Well, and then when we start to look at our specific
population, our tribe, thestudents with special needs, it
always one of the things thatrings in my head very often is
the conversation that we hadwith Heather McMillan last year,
one of the greatest specialeducation teachers I've ever met
(20:32):
in my life.
She's fantastic.
She was Zander's teacher.
She gets results, she pushesthe kids like she's figured them
out, and something that sheshared with us is that that
people don't learn till they'reready to learn.
Right, and we can agree withthat.
We can look and we can see that.
We see that in our adult lives,People who you know shirk off
(20:56):
certain responsibilities untilthey get to a point where
they're like oh wait, a minute,no, this things have to change.
I'm now ready to takeaccountability and action, or
take accountability for myactions and what I'm doing with
my life and kids.
Learning is the same thing.
So we can have a kid in ourclassroom that you know they may
be incredibly intelligent, butif they're not ready to learn,
(21:20):
it's not going to happen.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Right.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
You're going to have that clash, you're going to have
that Pushback.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, resistance.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Right, and so we look at that and we think to
ourselves, okay, well, why, why,why?
Why is this happening, right?
And so we've already talked alittle bit about that.
How do we approach that, though?
What do we do as parents?
What do we do as specialeducation educators?
Should I just say specialeducators?
(21:50):
I think that makes more sense,special educators when looking
at these behaviors, because I doknow this.
I know that any time we want tosee a change, it starts with an
understanding.
Right, we have to have anunderstanding of what's going on
.
One of the things that I hadthis conversation with somebody
just the other day.
I'm not a big like systemsperson from the standpoint of I
(22:16):
believe that if I do X, y and Z,I'm always going to get this
result.
I just don't.
I think there's too manyvariables in life to live that
way, and oftentimes we have toget to know people and we have
to work those.
We have to work through that toget to the desired end, and in
(22:37):
this case, we're talking aboutmodifying behavior.
So what do we need to know,like, what are some things that
we need to understand to helpkind of shape our scope, shape
our perspective on these kidsand what they're going through
right now.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
I think one of the things you talked about was
parents and teachers, and sothat parent-teacher relationship
and communication is important.
I was having a conversationwith a friend who is also a
parent of a young child andtheir child is displaying some
(23:18):
behaviors and there's someconcern and I was really, really
excited that she had said that.
Well, I have a meeting with theteacher and I understand that
the school has a lot to offer.
So before I take further steps,I want to hear what the teacher
(23:40):
says and what the you know theperspective of the teacher and
you know she also has somethings that they have changed at
home with the child and theyalso have some strategies that
they use.
So it was exciting to me thatshe's going in there with this
(24:02):
open mind, with this teacher,that and with this thought that
she's this teacher's here tohelp me and my child.
She's not just like complainingabout my child and the
behaviors, complaining about mychild and the behaviors.
(24:25):
So I think that's one of theimportant things to keep in mind
is having that conversation andhopefully that is the case,
that the teacher isn't justthere trying to complain about
your child.
That they're like okay, let'sfigure out the why, like you're
saying, you have to understandwhy this behavior is happening,
because it can be a long list ofthings and especially when
(24:50):
you're talking about youngchildren, some of the things
that get in their heads, thatbother them, that they're like.
We may finally, when we figureit out, be like, oh my gosh,
that's like completelyunreasonable, but to them it's
not, it's a big deal.
To them it, you know, couldn'tbe the fact that their sock has
(25:10):
fallen into their shoe.
I know that drives me crazy.
However, as a small child, thatcan be a big deal, especially
if there's a sensory issues ortheir shoelaces are too tight.
I know as a baby our oldestTroy.
Every time I put shoes on himhe cried and I couldn't figure
(25:34):
out why.
Well, it was because his feetneeded a little bit more work
before they could go into thoseshoes, but like he would scream
bloody murder, as soon as I tookhis shoes off he was fine.
So finding the, the reason whythey're they're um he wasn't
just being a turd right, no no,because he was a pretty easy
(25:55):
baby, so like something is wrongif he's crying like this.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
But yeah, it can just , it can be the simplest things.
Something that we learned nottoo terribly long ago and
something that I continue tocarry with me and I know you do
as well is is that theimportance of listening and the
importance of asking questions.
You know it's very easy from aparent side to have a mindset of
(26:24):
this is what I want for my kid,this is what I want them to
accomplish, and if the teacherdoesn't agree with that, then
there's some serious friction.
And there's some seriousfriction and then on the other
side, when you're the teacher,you have in mind, working with
this kid, everything they canaccomplish and the goals that
you believe they can achieve,but it may not match what the
(26:52):
parent's thinking conversationsalmost like.
We are dead set on convincingthe other that we're right and
we don't take the time to listenand to ask the questions.
You know it took us years to getto a point where we were
sitting in a meeting withparents and it just for whatever
(27:14):
reason.
At that time it clicked and wequestion what do you, what do
you see for your child?
Well, and what they saw andwhat we saw, not that one was
better or worse or they werevery different.
Right, and there is no way thatwe as a team are going to
achieve a goal when the goalsare different, right we're.
(27:36):
We're kind of pointing guns indifferent directions and pulling
the trigger.
We're never going to hit thebullseye, right, it's never
going to happen.
And so I think that what I wantto really push at the end of
this conversation is thatteachers and parents, if we
can't be and I've failed at this, right so this isn't me
(27:57):
standing on a pedestal saying,hey, I've got it figured out,
I've done it right, like I havefailed this numerous times and
I'm trying to get better at it.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
And we have, on both sides of that fence, right as
parents and as teachers.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Absolutely.
Us right now is is if we canget our teachers and our parents
to walk into the meetings readyto listen, ready to hear each
other, ready to ask thequestions of what do you see and
why?
Because you know what here's.
(28:32):
The truth is that you know wecan sit all day and we can say a
kid's going to be able to dothis and a kid's not going to be
able to do that, and there'sgoing to be teachers that are
going to have too lowexpectations, too high
expectations.
There's going to be parents inthat same vein, but we never
know where to meet if we don'task the questions and we don't
(28:52):
listen, right?
So I think.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but ifwe can give one little piece of
advice rolling into this schoolyear, it's that if the kid's
going to be first and theirwell-being is first, we've got
to be a team.
We've got to be a team.
(29:14):
So let's walk in there, b team.
And oh, by the way, if you area teacher and that student is
not like, their best interest isnot number one on your, on your
to do list Quit, go, dosomething else.
Don't do that to these youngins, Right?
(29:36):
If you're just in there becauseyou've been a teacher and this
is what I do, and I'm just kindof waiting out and I'm going to
make these kids listen.
Go do something else, becausethey don't need that from you.
What they need is a team, anIEP team, parents, teachers,
other support staff that say ourgoal is to help this kid be the
(29:59):
very best that they can be.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Even before an IEP team, some of these young kids
are not diagnosed or not theyhave not been screened, and so
some of these students that arehaving these issues, especially
the young ones, you don't haveto have an IEP to have a team at
(30:21):
school.
True story you know parents askthe questions.
Okay, so because, and if theteacher doesn't know and won't
find out, go to the next person,talk to the guidance counselor,
talk to the principal and findout what is available for your
(30:42):
child to help your child andwhat's the best way to support
as a team, because you have ateam whether your kid has an IEP
or not.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
So you were telling me the other day about this
T-shirt.
I think you said that one ofyour parents got all of you a
t-shirt, or but it had thisreally great saying on it.
What was it?
I?
Speaker 2 (31:02):
think it said be kind , because you never know what
another person is going through.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Yeah, and I think that's key to keep in mind.
Right, you're walking intothese meetings, you're seeing
these children, you're seeingthe behaviors, you're seeing a
lot of chaos going on and it'svery important to consider them.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Right, and my dad always used to say you know
everyone's carrying their ownsack of rocks.
You never know what's in.
You don't know what's in thatsack of rocks, and everybody's
sack of rocks is different, sodon't assume that you know
what's going on.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Well, my dad just used to say what's wrong with
you?
And you know I still can'tanswer that question, so we are
wrapping up episode one ofseason two.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
I'm so excited still.
And his football season likecheers.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
Right Weird, but anyway we'll see you next time.
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