October 8, 2024 • 74 mins
What happens when a promising athlete faces a life-changing injury that threatens to silence his dreams? Kenneth Jennings, a remarkable football coach and quadriplegic, opens up about his powerful journey from the southside of Chicago to becoming an inspiring mentor for others with spinal cord injuries. With a vibrant narrative, Kenneth shares the soulful moments that shaped his path, from the support of a coach during his darkest times to an unexpected out-of-body experience that offered peace amidst chaos.
Kenneth's story is a testament to the resilience and hope found in the face of adversity. His candid discussion about the emotional and physical challenges of adapting to life after his spinal cord injury reveals profound insights into the human spirit. Through creative therapies like singing to strengthen his diaphragm, and the sheer determination to breathe independently, Kenneth found new purpose. His experiences at the Rehabilitation Institute of Chicago, alongside mentors who had walked similar paths, provided the strength needed to redefine his new normal.
Join us as we explore Kenneth's journey to independence, the transformative impact of the Americans with Disabilities Act, and the innovative adaptive technologies that have become vital tools in his life. From the determination required to overcome transportation hurdles to the indispensable role of the mouse stick, Kenneth's narrative not only celebrates personal triumphs but also highlights the enduring power of community and support. His insights remind us that, with passion and perseverance, one can truly live life to the max.
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Speaker 1 (00:20):
We're just trying to get by, Just a couple of quants
all trying to get by, Just acouple of teens all trying to
survive.
Live to the max, cause youdon't live it twice.
Couple green thumbs, all highs,okay.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And welcome back to another episode of Life to the
Max.
I am your host, MaximilianGross, aka the Quadfather, and
today I have someone that Iadmire so much, someone that has
faced so much adversity andsomeone that has, like, just
(01:02):
bounced over obstacles.
He's a quadriplegic just likeme.
His name is Kenneth Jennings,but I call him Coach because
he's a football coach and I'mjust going to let him talk,
Coach, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
What's up?
Max Love being here Lookingforward to this.
I've been looking forward to itfor a while.
Yeah, Thank you for walking meinto your beautiful home and I
say let's get started.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Let's get started.
So full disclosure, the way meand Coach Matt is.
When I got injured at RIC,which is Rehabilitation
Institute of Chicago.
You're a mentor, right?
You come in to help otherpatients, is that true?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Yeah, I do mentoring, where I go in and talk to some
of the newly spinal cord injurypatients.
Just let them know you're notalone and you got someone that
you can talk to.
That's been through what you'reabout to go through.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Honestly, that helped me so much.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Yeah, I did it because I know when I got hurt
we didn't have mentors back then, but somebody came into my life
that was a mentor for me andhis name was Gerald Stingley and
he got hurt playingprofessional football 10 years
before I got hurt and it justchanged my life and I was like
to have opportunity to do thatfor somebody else is amazing and
(02:36):
you know what it really helpedme?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
because I was going through a rough patch.
I mean, I was 20 years old.
It happened right old.
It happened right in the primeof my life.
I felt like I was doingeverything right and all of a
sudden, bam paradox flips upsidedown.
The world changes.
(02:58):
I don't know what's going on,but I meet the kindest people
like you.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Yeah, and when something likethat happens, it changes your
life.
You know if you go from, likeyou say, living the prime of
your life, because for me too, Iwas the captain of the football
team, playing middle linebacker, playing fullback, getting
scholarship offers and then bam,all of it in a matter of a few
(03:25):
seconds it was all taken awayfrom me and so I, for me, um, I
dealt with it a little differentthan what a lot of other people
deal deal with it.
Um, I had there's what theywould call a day going viral.
It went viral, so it's like Igot so much attention from it.
I never had opportunity toreally get down about it because
(03:50):
it's just constantly peoplethere, people around me on the
news, all those different things, so I never had a chance to
really get down about it.
But I mean, I did have mydifficult times but I just
wanted to share with otherpeople the, the positiveness
that you can have from it, howimportant that is to survive in
something like this.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Yes, having a support system is so huge and people
who don't even know you andyou're making an impact on their
lives it just speaks volumes.
That's why I started thepodcast.
I always say it every episode,but I started the podcast so
people could share their stories.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
And it's very important and I thank you for
doing that because you're givingpeople an outlet to be able to
share their stories and sharetheir truth, and share their
testimony.
And that's something that needsto be done to be able to hear
what we go, what we deal with,what we go through.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Yes, Okay, so let's dive in.
Coach.
How was your upbringing?
Did you grow up in Chicago?
Speaker 3 (04:54):
Yeah, I grew up in the projects of Chicago and on
39th and Wentworth, southsideyeah, southside, two blocks from
old comiskey park, at leastthat's what I still call it to
me, from two blocks from thewhite socks stadium, and so of
course, I'm a white socks fan.
Oh, but, yeah so, and for me, Inever felt like me being in
(05:19):
projects was gonna be where mylife was gonna be.
I always wanted to strive toget out the projects and I knew
football was my way of gettingout.
I just didn't know footballwould take me this way to get
out of it.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Now, when you were growing up, was it difficult.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
Oh yeah, in my neighborhood sometimes there was
only two ways you was gettingout and neither one of them was
a positive way.
You was either going to go outby going to jail or go out dead.
So very few people left myneighborhood on a positive level
and I didn't want that to be myfate.
So I knew football wassomething I knew how to do, I
(06:02):
loved to do and I knew that wasgoing to be my ticket out.
I used to pray and ask God tolet me get out to projects
through football.
So I got what I asked for.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
So how did you avoid encounters in the hood, Like how
did you avoid encounters thatcould possibly be dangerous?
Speaker 3 (06:24):
Well, back then they knew I was an athlete, they knew
this was going to take it out,so they wouldn't let me get
involved in the gangs andeverything.
And there have been times thatI tried to and I wanted to
because that was just part ofthe nature growing up and seeing
some of my friends do it andbeing involved in gangs so I
(06:44):
wanted to do it too, but theywouldn't let me do it.
Whenever things started gettingto the point where things were
starting to go down or somethingwrong was about to happen,
they'd make me go home.
So my neighborhood actuallysaved my life too.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
That's amazing man.
Thank God for your neighbors,thank God for the people around
you.
Amazing man, thank God for yourneighbors, thank God for the
people around you.
So let's talk about how you gotinjured, man.
It was 1986, correct?
Speaker 3 (07:20):
88.
88?
Yeah, so 1988, can you explain?
Yeah, I can remember that, likeit was yesterday, yesterday it
was the opening kickoff of thegame.
I think it was our third gameof the season, um, and this was
my first game starting on bothas the linebacker and middle
linebacker I mean middlelinebacker and fullback and so I
(07:40):
was extremely excited.
I'm like I'm going both ways, Iain't going to be coming off
the field, it's going to be allday, every day.
So I'm excited going into thegame it's the opening kickoff
Went down, made my last tackleand broke my neck and trapped my
34th vertebra and as I made thehit, I hit him on the side and
(08:04):
as my head was sliding down, histhigh came up and hit me on the
chin and snapped my neck backand I fell down to the turf on
my back.
Luckily, and as I usually do athousand times before, I jumped
up and ran to the sidelines.
Only difference this time itwas mentally and not physically.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
I can totally attest to that.
That's how I felt when my momwas like you're paralyzed in the
hospital and I, like, triedmoving my leg.
I was like, see, mom, I'm notparalyzed, but my leg wasn't
moving.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
And so, after one of my teammates came over and
that's what a teammate'ssupposed to do he reached out
and he grabbed my arm and he wastrying to snatch me up, and all
I remember is looking at himwith my eyes bucked, telling him
no, because I knew somethingwas wrong.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Were you able to speak?
Speaker 3 (09:02):
Barely, barely yeah, barely, but just enough to be
able to get his attention forhim not to move me.
So he dropped my arm and atthat point he started going to
the sidelines until the coachand something was wrong and they
the coaches ran out there.
The paramedics came running outthere and they did what I call
the pen test.
When he took a pen, took myshoes off and ran the pen across
(09:26):
my feet and asked me did I feelit?
I'm like no, I don't feelanything.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
So explain to the people this.
So you're doing a kickoff, it'slike seven seconds in and you
get paralyzed like right on it,the first eight seconds of the
game.
What were you feeling?
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Well, running down or after it happened.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
After it happened.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Like I said, when they was doing that pen test I
didn't feel anything.
As they were running the pen,they went to my legs, my thigh,
my stomach, my chest, my neck.
I didn't feel anything untilthey touched my face.
So by the time he got to myface I got tears streaming down
the side of my face and I lookup and I see all the coaches and
(10:20):
everybody with tears comingdown their face.
So I knew something was wrong.
At this point.
I couldn't move.
Nothing would move.
My breathing was getting realshallow.
I'm having a hard timebreathing and at that point I
didn't know whether I was goingto live or die.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
I know what you're talking about.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
And it was terrifying .
I know what you're talkingabout and it was terrifying.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
I know what you're talking about, but I was
sleeping, luckily, so I didn'thave to see it.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
You actually had the visuals of what happened and you
said you can remember it tothis day yeah, and my coach
probably saved my life becausethey was getting ready to take
me in Amilam and take me to thelocal hospital and the hospital
(11:14):
that was near the stadium wasone of the worst hospitals in
the city and chances are Iprobably wouldn't be here today
if they took me there.
So he stood over me and somehowconvinced them, demanded or
whatever he did, to get ahelicopter out there and fly me
down to Northwestern Hospitaldowntown and that probably saved
(11:36):
my life.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Well, I mean shout out to your coach, yeah.
Coach.
Yeah, that is amazing.
I mean, it's's terrifying, it'sscary, but it's amazing.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
you're still here and I'm happy you're still here and
funny thing with that um withthem putting me in a helicopter.
I was afraid of heights, so ontop of getting hurt that y'all,
finna, put me in a helicopterand fly me somewhere were you
conscious?
Yeah, I was still conscious,doing all this what yeah, and so
(12:13):
I.
I give a lot of thanks to theparamedic that was in the
helicopter because he reallykept me calm as we was flying
down to the umern Hospital.
And craziest thing happenedOnce we get to Northwestern, I
stopped breathing as they wasrushing me to the emergency room
.
I stopped breathing and I endedup having an out-of-body
(12:36):
experience.
I was literally looking down onthem working on my body,
cutting my shoulder pads off,cutting my jersey off, getting
the helmet off me, and theytrying to resuscitate me and
bring life back into my lifelessbody so you were watching them
do this I was like in the upperright hand corner in the purest
(13:01):
of white room and watchingeverything they're doing, but
not panicking, I'm in totalpeace.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
That's how I felt.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Yeah and just watching everything Like wow, it
was so peaceful yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Until they pulled you back into this fucking world.
But it was so peaceful.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
And like I tell people for me, me, I think that
was god making the decisionbetween me either still being
here or me going to heaven, andseeing I'm here talking to you
today.
I guess we know what that is,unless we all have it right now
yeah, free will yeah, and so hebrought me back down and he gave
(13:44):
me work to do at that point,and I've been trying to live
that purpose ever since so youget to northwestern hospital.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
What time is it?
Speaker 3 (13:52):
this would we.
That was a 10 o'clock game so Iprobably got northwestern,
probably about 11.
Yeah, by 11, 11, 30.
I'm gonna do a 10 o'clock gamein the morning.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
And were you conscious for that experience?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
All the way until we got to going toward the
emergency room when I stoppedbreathing.
But all before then I was stillconscious and seeing and
everything going on, everybodybeing frantic and everybody
running around trying to get meto where I need to get to, to
try to save my life.
And I remember, um, they askedme who did I want them to call?
(14:36):
I had them to call my brotherinstead of my mom's.
My mom's didn't want me to playfootball.
So I'm like the lad, don't callmy mama.
I said call my brother, this ishis number, call him, but please
don't call my mama.
So he was there when you woke up.
Oh, I didn't wake up for likethree days later.
(15:00):
Me too.
Yeah, three days.
And the funniest well, I ain'tgoing to say funny, but
something kind of crazy when Iwoke up, they kept the TV on for
me.
So it was like maybe in themiddle of the night when I woke
up and I'm watching this TV showand I've never been on a cruise
(15:21):
, and this is, and I've neverbeen on the cruise, and this is
why I've never been on a cruiseand I never will go on a cruise.
This TV show they had on it wasbased on a true story.
It was a cruise ship that gothijacked by some pirates or
whatever.
And they tell everybody to goto the upper deck of this cruise
(15:42):
on the cruise ship.
So there's one man in thewheelchair.
He rolls over to the stairs, soof course he can't get up the
stairs.
They um wouldn't let nobody tohelp him up the stairs either.
So they grabbed this man, takehim to the side of the ship,
shoot him in the head and throwhim overboard.
(16:03):
Just the first thing I ever seeafter coming to.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
That's terrifying.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
I'm like I would never get on a cruise.
I've had people offer to pay methat I would pay for the cruise
.
All that I'm never getting onnobody's cruise, never going to
happen.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
So when you got injured and they brought you,
when you got injured and theylike kind of like stabilized you
and they told you you wereparalyzed, how did you feel,
like what were your thoughts?
Speaker 3 (16:36):
Well, they didn't just tell me I was paralyzed.
They told me the only thing Iwas going to do the rest of my
life was blink.
They told me I would neverbreathe on my own, I would never
talk on my own, never be ableto have solid foods, never be
able to have kids.
And then, to top it off, theytold me that my life expectancy
(16:57):
was 10 years.
So all this was dumped on me atthe age of 17 years old.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
I can't imagine that, man.
This is why I have so muchrespect for you, Coach.
Let's keep going with yourstory.
So how long were youNorthwestern?
Speaker 3 (17:20):
I was at northwestern probably about two months or
maybe a month and a half, maybea month, month and a half and
then they sent me over to um rscthe iconic rehabilitation
institute of chicago.
Yes.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
What was this like in 1988?
Speaker 3 (17:46):
For me and this is what I tell people being in
Northwestern was about what Icouldn't do.
You can't do this, you can't dothat, you'll never do this,
you'll never do that.
Going to RSC, it was aboutpossibilities of what I can do,
that we go try to teach you howto do this, teach you how to do
(18:06):
that.
And in my mind, going there, Ifigured out okay, after I get to
the rehab, I'm going to walkagain.
I'm going to walk up out ofhere.
That was my thought.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
That was the same thought, man.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
And it took me a while to come to reality, to
realize that I wouldn't go walkup out of here.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
How long did it take you?
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Probably took me about a month to get to that.
And don't get me wrong even tothis day, I still believe that
I'm going to walk again, Me too.
But I know that I still believethat I'm going to walk again,
me too.
But I know that I still have alife to live.
Until that happens, I stillhave a purpose until that
(18:50):
happens.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
So I live with that purpose.
But when that day comes and Godsees fit to let me walk again,
I can't wait for that day tohappen, but until then I'm going
to live life to the fullest,life to the max.
Walk again.
I can't wait for that day tohappen, but until then I'm going
to live life to the fullest.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Life to the max, yes, so when you get to RIC RIC is
world known for their therapyand for their research, for
spinal cord injury research Didyou have a lot of hope when you
got to RIC, and how were thetherapists?
Speaker 3 (19:24):
when I first got there, I had all the hope in the
world.
Um, I'm like I couldn't wait toget to therapy.
I couldn't wait to do whateverthey was asking me to do.
I was trying to learneverything I possibly could as
what I call my new normal.
And after, after a couple ofweeks, you know, as a patient,
(19:46):
we want to see these hugechanges, we want to see these
major changes, and I didn't seethem.
So once I didn't see them, Istarted believing what the
doctor told me.
When the doctor told me thatI'd never be able to breathe on
my own and I'd never be able totalk, the only thing I'm able to
do is blink, and I startedbelieving it.
(20:07):
So at some point I felt like Iwanted to give up.
And that's when the gentlemancame in my life, darryl Stingley
, and he started telling meeverything that he was doing and
how he was going out, stillenjoying life, talking to um,
going to giving speeches to um,young kids and like what?
(20:28):
and for the first time, whensomebody left out the room and
said they understand what I'mgoing through.
I believed him because herolled out the room in this
power wheelchair, like I had toand everybody else usually.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Just like you did for me.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Right, exactly, and that's where it came from.
You got to be able to give back, you know, pay it forward.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
So, coach, walk me through the progression of your
rehab, Like, how did it start?
You got there, you were on aventilator, dependent correct,
just like me.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
So what walked me through it?
Speaker 3 (21:10):
So I was still on the ventilator and everything, and
after I, after encounteringEnduro and everything they want,
I was going full out Everyexercise they had me to do,
every therapy they wanted me todo.
I even changed some of mytherapy when I was going through
speech therapy, instead ofgoing through all the exercises
(21:34):
they wanted me to do, I startedfeeling a little different
Because, like I said, I likedsinging before I got injured.
I was actually in a groupcalled.
New.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
Fortune.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
And so, instead of doing the regular voice
exercises, I would sing, and itcaught on with some of the other
patients too, and I would be,because it was the same exercise
.
It was about strengthening mydiaphragm.
So what do you do when you sing?
You take deep breaths in andyou let it out and you sing, and
(22:09):
that's what I was doing.
So my voice started gettingstronger and it just made me a
little bit of a way of enjoyingthe therapy sessions right along
with just wanting to do as muchas I could.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
So a day came, oh, oh , I can't wait for this story
yes, tell me, I had um, how longis this?
Is this like a month in?
Speaker 3 (22:33):
this.
Yeah, I was probably in um, atI mean at rsc probably for about
a month, okay, and, like I said, my story went viral, so I used
to always have all these randompeople come to see me.
So on this day, two beautifulyoung girls came in and see me.
There's a high school also, andI'm, I'm, I'm so intrigued, I'm
(22:56):
talking to everything.
I'm, I'm 17, 18 years old, I'mfrantic that they're in there
and oh, yes, and they look realnice too, yeah, and so I'm
talking to them.
So the respiratory therapistcomes in and he said he needed
(23:18):
to work on the machine, heneeded to test everything out,
and I said is it okay if theystay in here?
Why are you doing that?
He said, yeah, no problem.
He seen the smile on my facetoo.
So he said, yeah, no problem.
So when he's working on themachine, checking the machine,
he has to turn all the alarmsoff.
So, all the alarms off.
(23:40):
And while I'm talking to themand so intrigued and all into
them, I don't notice that thetubing popped off.
So for the first time since myaccident, for about three to
five minutes I'm literallybreathing and talking on my own.
And then I didn't know, hedidn't know, of course the girls
(24:03):
don't know.
And then, um, once he finishedworking on the machine, he turns
the alarms back on.
So, of course, all the bellsand whistles going off, yeah,
yeah, you know, you know, and Ipanic and I'm like I can't
breathe.
I can't breathe, and so he putit back on.
He rushed the girls out of theroom.
(24:24):
And so, about 30 minutes later,my whole team come in the room
my doctor, my nurse, therapist,physical therapist, everybody
come in the room and I'm lookinglike what did I do?
And they was like we need totalk to you Like what they said.
Like we need to talk to youLike what they say, if you could
(24:45):
do that for three to fiveminutes, you should be able to
do that forever.
And they say we want to sendyou back to Northwestern to get
weaned off.
I'm like no, y'all not.
Uh-uh, uh-uh.
Because to me in my mind, beingon the ventilator was like being
on a drug, because I wasdependent on it and I thought
(25:07):
that's the only way that I couldbreathe is by having it.
So I wasn't going to get wingedoff, nothing.
And I told him let me thinkabout it.
And then, on top of that, thiswas right around the holiday.
It was right around Christmasand this was my first time
getting a visit back home.
(25:27):
So now I just have to thinkabout the fact of getting weaned
off, to go in there to getweaned off.
But also, if I got went thereenough ways to get weaned off, I
wasn't ready to go back home,so I told him let me think about
it.
So the next morning, when Iwoke up, it's about 7 o'clock in
(25:48):
the morning this is beforeeverybody else gets started it's
an older lady at the door, andthis is something that's
different for what y'all here todeal with.
It was four people in my room.
It was four of us in one room.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Oh, my God, yes.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
Can you imagine Four people?
That was crazy, and my thatsucks Right, wasn't no privacy,
wasn't nothing, and wasn't nofamily being there with you all
the time or anything?
And so when I woke up, my bedwas just so.
I happened to be right next tothe door and it's an older lady
(26:28):
at the door and she asked couldshe come in and pray for me?
So I don't hear people do that.
A lot of times, like I say, Ialways hear random people coming
in.
So I told her she'd come in andpray for me.
So she came in and prayed overme.
When she got done she saiddon't worry about anything.
God already said you're gonnabe able to breathe.
(26:50):
I'm like huh, like hold on howshe know that I'm go.
What's going on with me If Iain't never met her before?
So after she leaves, I hit thebutton for the receptionist to
come, push my head on the buttonfor the receptionist to be able
(27:10):
to come, and when she rings Iasked.
I said who was the lady thatjust came in?
And she prayed over me.
She's like what lady?
I quit playing.
I said the lady that just leftup out of here.
She was an older lady.
She prayed over me.
She said ain't nobody been inhere?
I said the lady just left.
(27:37):
So by then the receptionistcame to the room and she was
like ain't nobody, doctors ain'teven here.
Yet I said somebody just leftout of here.
So she grabbed the phone andshe called down to security,
security, like ain't nobody beenhere.
And so for me I was like HolySpirit.
Yeah, that was God sending me,an angel to let me know
everything's going to be okay,and at that point I made a
decision to go get weaned off.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
And I bet you're very happy about that.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Yeah, probably the best decision I've made.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
Isn't it great when doctors are wrong?
Yeah, honestly.
I love it Because doctorsalways think they're right.
But listen, dude, you practicemedicine.
You don't know medicine.
Right, you know what I mean.
The big guy upstairs, he's theone.
He's't know medicine.
Right, the big guy upstairs,he's the one.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
He's the ultimate doctor.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
And what I?
This is something because overthe last couple of months I've
been in and out the hospitalprobably about six times.
What's?
Speaker 2 (28:35):
going on.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
I had a UTI a recurring UTI that just kept
coming, and with some of thedoctors and nurses and
everything, I felt like theywasn't listening to.
What I was trying to tell themand what I explained to one of
the doctors was I understand,you studied this, you went to
school for it, you learned andyou got a PhD, but I said I got
(29:00):
a PhD too.
I got a PhD, but I say I got aPhD too.
I got a PhD in me.
Yes, what I know and learnedabout my body and my system and
how things work is somethingthat you would never know.
So let's work together insteadof against each other and some
of them understand that andthey're willing to open up and
let us work together as a teaminstead of against each other.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
All right, work together as a team instead of
against each other, all right.
So how was therapy back then in88 compared to when I did
therapy in 2016?
Speaker 3 (29:30):
It was a whole lot different.
I mean, technology is so muchdifferent.
You know they had theelectroshock system that they do
.
We didn't have that back then.
Everything was manually that wedid as far as range of motion
and things of that nature,hooking me up to different
(29:51):
machines, where my arms was inthe air, connected, where I was
able to swing back and forth andtry to get strength within my
shoulders.
So technology is a whole lotdifferent, even from when you,
in 2016, up until now.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
When I go into Shirley Ryan and see some of the
different things that they'redoing and just to see that
they're getting closer tofinding a cure for paralysis.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
And that's going to be a great day.
I don't know if it's gonna workfor me because I'm 36 years in
um, but if it do I'll be gladthat it will.
But I'm hoping and praying thatit will come true to help
others if it don't help me well,I have a uh guy on uh, john
(30:42):
o'connor.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
He owns uh a rehab place called next steps.
I don't know if you heard ofnext steps.
It's a.
It's kind of like shirley ryan,it's like on steroids, but
anyways they, they know a doctorin san diego that's very close
to uh, you know, reversingparalysis, and luckily I'm able
(31:07):
to speak to this doctor.
Shout out to uh, dr marktrusinski, and you know, in san
diego university, and we'll see.
We'll see what happens withthat, okay, I, okay, I'm excited
for the future because thefuture only gets brighter.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
Always, always.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Yeah, and honestly, man, like your composure, it's
so inspiring.
When I was at RAC, I wasterrified.
I was terrified of the beeping.
I was terrified of the beeping.
I was terrified of being alone.
My family stayed with me forlike a month, like sleeping on
(31:47):
cots.
Like were you alone.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
Yeah, well, other than my four roommates, yeah.
And back then when 9 o'clockcame, they didn't care if you
was the president of the UnitedStates, you had to leave.
They didn't care if you was thepresident of the United States,
you had to leave.
So I had to learn how to, inthe middle of the night, where I
(32:10):
still had to call, like where Icould hit the button with my
head to get the nurse to come.
But I had to learn how to fendfor myself a lot to try to
figure things out on what was Igoing to do If I dropped my
stick, or my stick was a littletoo far trying to figure out how
could I reach it and things ofthat nature.
So I think in some ways that wasgood for me, but it was
(32:33):
difficult, it was scary, it washard Just not knowing there was
somebody there and somethingwent wrong immediately.
You know, nurses wereeventually going to come but
they had other patients they hadto work with too.
So sometimes they couldn't comeright away but they would get
there.
And sometimes I did wish that Idid have family that could have
(32:56):
been right there with me.
But there's other times I thinkit was good for me that I
didn't have family, because itgave me the opportunity to gain
some independence that I don'tknow if I would have had.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
I'm happy you brought up independence, because I am
so dependent on people my nurses, my team.
I need a support team becauseof I'm a C1 quadriplegic.
What?
Speaker 3 (33:24):
are you?
I'm C3, C4 complete.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
C3, c4 complete.
So I'm C1 and I'm ventilatordependent and I always need
someone with me.
When did you gain independence?
When did you gain independencelike, and how like?
When did you gain theindependence to like, live on
(33:49):
your own?
In what age?
Speaker 3 (33:50):
well, first let me say this max, I think what
you're doing is incredible forthe independence that you I know
you say you have to have peoplearound you every day, but the
independence that you havegained and shown for you from
the time when I first met you upuntil now is amazing.
I'm so proud of you, of the manthat you have become, the man
(34:15):
that I can't wait to see thatyou're still to grow into.
I tip my hat off to you and II'm thankful that you become a
part of my life because youinspire me to continue to do
things to be stronger.
So I wanted to say that first Iappreciate that no problem.
(34:36):
I mean, that's the truth.
Um, for me, when did myindependence start?
Um, start, actually, I wouldsay started in rehab, because
some of the things that theytaught us back then they
probably can't do today becauseof liability reasons.
Okay, um, they had me to go outto a restaurant, gave me money
(35:07):
and I had to stop PerfectStructures on the street to
convince them to take me intothe restaurant.
Yeah, and then, once I got inthe restaurant, I had to talk to
the manager of the restaurantand ask him if he could take
somebody off the floor to feedme when my food got there and,
after they fed me, to explain tothem where to take my money out
(35:30):
, to pay for the meal and to getback out the restaurant.
I had to stop people that washaving meals to ask them to help
me get back down the stairs soI could leave the restaurant.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Oh my God, you're crazy.
You are crazy, and speaking ofyou, saying that you got injured
in 1988.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
That was before the American Disability Act correct
Yep.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
What was that?
Like man.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
It was like trying to invent a wheel that never been
made.
It wasn't trying to reinventthe wheel, it was making the
wheel because, um, I was one.
After I left rehab, I was oneof the first kids in a
wheelchair to go to a regularhigh school.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
I remember going back to school.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
Yeah, I remember going up curve cuts on one end
of the street and getting to theother end of the block and it's
not a curve cut there, so I hadto come all the way back down,
go down a curve cut right up thestreet and to the next curve
cut K to get to where I wantedto go to.
But when I got hurt and leftrehab they had one high school
(36:51):
in the city that if you weredisabled you had to go to this
high school and for a couple ofweeks I went there and for me it
wasn't right for me and theperson that I was before before
I got hurt, I was a shy kid,didn't say much, was in the
background, only time I wasvocal was on the football field
(37:15):
and that person would haveaccepted standing at that high
school.
But, as I tell people, when Igot hurt Kenneth Jennings the
football player died and KennethJennings the man was born and
Kenneth Jennings the man was notgoing to accept them telling me
I had to go to this high school.
So at that point I battled withthe Board of Education to go
(37:40):
back to Simeon and the excusethat they gave me, why they told
me I shouldn't be able to goback to the semi-high, was they
told me.
I wouldn't be able to keep upacademically with the rest of
the students.
Speaker 2 (37:51):
But you're cognitively fine.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Huh.
You're cognitively fine, yeah,and that's why I explained to
them.
I say, do y'all not understand?
My body was injured, not mymind.
So I still got my mind.
So I threatened to sue them.
So they that way, they startedgiving me different tests and
everything that I could take anddo to show that I would be able
(38:17):
to compete with the rest of thestudents academically.
So I ended up graduating ontime and I increased my GPA from
a 2.55, 2.6.
I graduated with a 3.75.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Nice man.
Speaker 3 (38:35):
And what I had to do to get to that point.
I was taking classes while Iwas at rehab when I left there.
I left in April, so I was inbetween the hospital and rehab.
I was there six months in a day.
I got hurt October 8th and Ileft rehab April 9th and
(38:57):
immediately went after.
I fought to get back intoschool.
I went back to Symbiont it wasprobably late April and so I
finished the rest of the yearthere, and during the summertime
I had a summer school class inthe morning, I had a tutor in
the middle of the day and I hada class at night at one of the
(39:17):
local colleges, just so I couldcatch up, so I'd be able to
graduate on time with myclassmates.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Dude hats off to you, man.
That's amazing.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
That's how bad I wanted it.
I didn't want this to go awayin.
No how for people to say, oh hehad to graduate late because of
what happened to him.
No, I wouldn't take that as noexcuse.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
So walk me through the progression of your life.
So you went to high school, Didyou go to college?
Speaker 3 (39:51):
Yeah, People thought I was crazy for this too.
After I graduated I decidedthat I wanted to go away to
college like everybody elsewould, Like.
I didn't get hurt, andinitially I got accepted to
Florida A&M.
And yeah, and my family was likehow you going to do this?
(40:12):
My thing was I don't know.
I'll find out when I get there.
So I was planning on going toFlorida A&M and at that time I
was on government assistance andthey sent me a letter stating
that if I go away to leave thestate to go to school, I was
going to have to pay for itmyself.
So at that time I couldn'tafford to pay for it myself and
(40:35):
so I ended up going to SouthernIllinois in Carbondale, and at
that time that was the numberone party school in the nation.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Oh, yeah, that's how you.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
Yeah, it is.
So we got our party all downthere, and this was back in 1990
.
So you partied.
Oh yeah, I got my party.
You were partying, that's whenI finally realized I wasn't an
athlete, no more.
Because, before then I stillfelt like I was an athlete, so I
(41:04):
wasn't drinking.
I was an athlete, so I wasn'tdrinking, I wasn't smoking, I
wasn't doing nothing.
I'm like I'm an athlete, Ican't do none of that.
So I got down there, um, and Iwas literally sleeping in the
regular dorm bed and I wouldhave pillows on the floor in
front of me because I would layon my side at night to go to
sleep.
And just in case I fell forwardand fell out the bed, I had
(41:30):
pillows on the floor, just incase.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Who was helping you?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
They assigned me a caregiver while I was there, and
it made the biggest difference.
So my teammates I didn't knowthey went there and I found out
they went there.
So I used to sleep a lot oftimes in their room, but they
were the same people that taughtme how to drink too.
I remember we had a time wherewe was going out and so they
(41:59):
said we should go to the liquorstore.
And man, we ain't grown either.
We go to the liquor store andthey we ain't grown either.
We go to the liquor store andthey say we finna get a case of
beer.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
You rolling there.
Speaker 3 (42:09):
Yeah, so when you say a case of beer, what you
thinking?
You think they finna get a caseof beer, yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
They got a case of 40s.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
Whoa, yes, I'm like what we supposed to do with this
.
I said, oh, this is for theweek.
They said, no, that's fortonight.
For tonight, like no, ain't noway Right.
So I started gettingcomfortable drinking and I used
to have this real long straw,and so it would fit down in the
(42:44):
40 bottle and still long enoughfor me to drink out of it.
So we used to have thisdrinking game to see who could
drink the most the fastest, youknow you're strong, so yes, you
could drink fast.
I was wearing them out and soonce I got so drunk, I'm trying
to roll down the sidewalk and Icouldn't go straight.
(43:04):
So I would roll all the wayover to the grass and turn just
before I rolled off into thegrass and then come all the way
back down and go right near thecurb before I roll off the curb
and turn back and forth.
So I'm zigzagging going downthe street because I was too
drunk to ride straight.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
You could have gone DUI.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Most definitely Driving under the influence.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
So let me ask you a question, coach.
So we have this little whitestraw next to you.
When did you so that basicallyallows you to move and control
your chair, correct?
Speaker 3 (43:45):
Yep, I have a S and puff wheelchair.
Okay, this is one of the thingsthat they taught me how to use
when I was in the rehab center,and it helped change my life
because it gave me theopportunity to be mobile.
Mobile yes, so I didn't have towait for someone to push or move
(44:05):
me around, which was extremelyimportant, and the way that it
works, like I said, sipping puff.
So I blow hard to go forward, Isip in hard to go reverse, I
blow in lightly to go right andsip in lightly to turn left and
literally I go everywhere inthis chair.
(44:27):
And when I go everywhere, Itell people about a story.
A few years ago, when I wascoaching at Simeon, we Coaching,
you were coaching.
Yeah, I coach high schoolfootball.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
I'm quite sure you're going to get into it.
You're right on everything, man.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
Yeah, I know we're going to get into that a little
bit.
And so we made it to thechampionship game and somehow my
ride to the game got mixed upso I didn't have no ride to the
championship game.
So the game was about two and ahalf miles away.
Speaker 2 (45:02):
You did not, yeah, you drove.
Speaker 3 (45:05):
Got in my chair, left out and went to the game.
But that was the easy part.
Yeah, the hard part was it wasin the middle of a blizzard.
Speaker 2 (45:15):
Get the fuck out of here.
Are you serious?
Speaker 3 (45:18):
Yes.
So I'm literally in the streetriding through the game in the
middle of a blizzard and I couldbarely see in front of me.
So I know people in cars werebarely seeing me either.
And thank God, I prayed.
I was praying all the way thereand all the way back and by the
time I got to the game I hadabout two inches of snow on my
(45:39):
table.
That's how bad it was snowing.
So I had somebody go outside,got to the game and scoop all
this snow off my table and wentto coaching.
Speaker 2 (45:51):
That takes grit.
I'll tell you that.
Speaker 3 (45:55):
I was a believer that , and I think it got a lot to do
with football just like withyou being in the service that
you don't believe in lettingnothing stop you.
Speaker 2 (46:05):
Yeah, service, yeah, that you don't really even let
nothing stop you.
Speaker 3 (46:07):
Yeah, that's so you, you, you live into the max and
you push it to the max yeah andthat's the same thing I do.
Speaker 2 (46:12):
I push it to the max so, so, coach, you get
introduced on how to be mobilewith this wheelchair.
Then they obviously give you awheelchair.
What were more wheelchairs likeback then compared to now?
Speaker 3 (46:28):
um, oh they, they was a lot harder to drive.
They're a lot easier to drivenow.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
Um what about, like the tires?
Speaker 3 (46:40):
oh you had.
You had air in the tires backthen and so any given time you
could be out.
Thank God I never had anopportunity where I caught a
flat, but I know people that hadthat was out in their
wheelchairs and they got a flatand basically you're trying to
get back home any way that youcan.
You have to have someone tohelp you and it's like having a
(47:05):
car.
When your car goes on the flat,you basically driving on the
rim trying to get back to adestination, but unlike a car
where you could basically takeit to a lot of different places
to get to that tire fix, youcouldn't do that with your
wheelchairs.
You had to make arrangementsfor someone to either come
(47:26):
change the tire or you had tocome pick up your chair and
change the tire, and that's thelast thing you wanted to do is
have someone to come pick upyour chair, because you were
going to be out without yourchair for about a week.
Speaker 2 (47:40):
so something as simple as just having your tire
I was going to ask what was thedifference with accommodations
for people who had disabilitiesbefore and after the American
Disability Act.
Speaker 3 (47:54):
Things got a whole lot better after the American
Disability Act Because we hadsomeone finally fighting for us,
because we had someone finallyfighting for us, someone that we
could depend on with thegovernment and everybody else
that understood that they justcouldn't look at us as second
class citizens.
They had to look at us and giveus respect, like they had to
(48:18):
give everyone else.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (48:20):
And that was huge, and that was huge.
And for the people that went inand sat in at the Senate and
Congress to make this law, toput this law, I give them all
the respect in the world,Because without them I would
(48:46):
hate to see what position wewould still be in if they didn't
do what they had to do.
They sacrificed a lot, a lot,in order for all of us that's
disabled to be able to have therespect that we deserve.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
Well, thank God for those congressmen.
Speaker 3 (48:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:56):
Thank God for that, because the ADA has helped me a
lot too.
Speaker 3 (49:00):
And.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
I can also be like, hey, this is an ADA compliant
and you could complain, and theyactually, like you know,
figured out.
You know the restaurant or theplace you go to.
So you live in the city ofChicago, correct?
Yes.
And have you bounced around orhave you just had one house?
Speaker 3 (49:23):
I've bounced around quite a bit.
After I came back from collegeI was still trying to find
myself, and so I remember wellbefore I go there.
Another piece of adaptiveequipment that I use is my mouse
.
Stick right here.
Speaker 2 (49:43):
Yes, please show me this.
I use this to use stick righthere.
Yes, please show me this.
Speaker 3 (49:46):
I use this to use my phone with.
Speaker 2 (49:49):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (49:52):
To use the phone with computers, turn light switches
on and off Pretty mucheverything.
I consider this my third hand.
Speaker 2 (50:00):
Yeah, me too Okay.
So you have to tell me when wasthe mouth stick introduced?
Speaker 3 (50:06):
It was introduced to me while I was still in rehab,
okay, and for me it wasn't ashard to have.
A lot of people like they'renot used to having something in
their mouth, but with playingfootball I was always used to
having a mouthpiece in my mouth,so that wasn't a huge
adjustment for me, learning howbecause my head was my neck and
(50:28):
my neck was still weak.
Just the fact of trying to holdit up was difficult.
Um, because not only did I havea neck brace on before, um, I
initially, when I first got hurt, I had a halo on too, and for
people that don't know what ahalo brace is, it's a metal
brace that's from your headgoing to your shoulders with
(50:51):
poles and they literally screwit into your head and I'm not
joking, I'm talking literallyscrew it into your head to keep
you perfectly stable.
So when that came off, it feltlike my head wore 100 pounds,
(51:11):
and so and well, some of myfriends think, or my family
think, my head probably do wear100 pounds for real.
But that's beside the point.
But I had to when they let me,taught me to wheel with the
wheelchair and my mouse stick,the two most pieces of adaptive
(51:32):
equipment that I ever had,because the chair gave me
mobility.
The mouse stick gave me anotherform of having a voice, to be
able to communicate witheverybody else by using my phone
to be able to turn channels tobe able to hit buttons.
Like I said, it was a thirdhand for me well, what is, uh?
Speaker 2 (51:55):
the mouse stick, like before and now, since, like ai,
is like taking over and liketechnology, because a mouse
stick usually was used forpainting and writing, and like
flipping the page of a book.
How did it progress?
Like even with smartphones,like when you got your first
smartphone.
(52:16):
Was it amazing?
Speaker 3 (52:18):
oh yeah, it was amazing, but I, even today, I
still don't use all the AItechnology or the voice commands
to use my phone.
I still like using my stick,like I'm writing a book right
now and I'm using my stick to doit.
I don't like all the voicecommands because with the voice
(52:40):
commands it still make mistakes.
We're just trying to get by, Just a couple of quants
all trying to get by, Just acouple of teens all trying to
survive.
Live to the max, cause youdon't live it twice.
Couple green thumbs, all highs,okay.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And welcome back to another episode of Life to the
Max.
I am your host, MaximilianGross, aka the Quadfather, and
today I have someone that Iadmire so much, someone that has
faced so much adversity andsomeone that has, like, just
(01:02):
bounced over obstacles.
He's a quadriplegic just likeme.
His name is Kenneth Jennings,but I call him Coach because
he's a football coach and I'mjust going to let him talk,
Coach, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
What's up?
Max Love being here Lookingforward to this.
I've been looking forward to itfor a while.
Yeah, Thank you for walking meinto your beautiful home and I
say let's get started.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Let's get started.
So full disclosure, the way meand Coach Matt is.
When I got injured at RIC,which is Rehabilitation
Institute of Chicago.
You're a mentor, right?
You come in to help otherpatients, is that true?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Yeah, I do mentoring, where I go in and talk to some
of the newly spinal cord injurypatients.
Just let them know you're notalone and you got someone that
you can talk to.
That's been through what you'reabout to go through.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Honestly, that helped me so much.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Yeah, I did it because I know when I got hurt
we didn't have mentors back then, but somebody came into my life
that was a mentor for me andhis name was Gerald Stingley and
he got hurt playingprofessional football 10 years
before I got hurt and it justchanged my life and I was like
to have opportunity to do thatfor somebody else is amazing and
(02:36):
you know what it really helpedme?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
because I was going through a rough patch.
I mean, I was 20 years old.
It happened right old.
It happened right in the primeof my life.
I felt like I was doingeverything right and all of a
sudden, bam paradox flips upsidedown.
The world changes.
(02:58):
I don't know what's going on,but I meet the kindest people
like you.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Yeah, and when something likethat happens, it changes your
life.
You know if you go from, likeyou say, living the prime of
your life, because for me too, Iwas the captain of the football
team, playing middle linebacker, playing fullback, getting
scholarship offers and then bam,all of it in a matter of a few
(03:25):
seconds it was all taken awayfrom me and so I, for me, um, I
dealt with it a little differentthan what a lot of other people
deal deal with it.
Um, I had there's what theywould call a day going viral.
It went viral, so it's like Igot so much attention from it.
I never had opportunity toreally get down about it because
(03:50):
it's just constantly peoplethere, people around me on the
news, all those different things, so I never had a chance to
really get down about it.
But I mean, I did have mydifficult times but I just
wanted to share with otherpeople the, the positiveness
that you can have from it, howimportant that is to survive in
something like this.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Yes, having a support system is so huge and people
who don't even know you andyou're making an impact on their
lives it just speaks volumes.
That's why I started thepodcast.
I always say it every episode,but I started the podcast so
people could share their stories.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
And it's very important and I thank you for
doing that because you're givingpeople an outlet to be able to
share their stories and sharetheir truth, and share their
testimony.
And that's something that needsto be done to be able to hear
what we go, what we deal with,what we go through.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Yes, Okay, so let's dive in.
Coach.
How was your upbringing?
Did you grow up in Chicago?
Speaker 3 (04:54):
Yeah, I grew up in the projects of Chicago and on
39th and Wentworth, southsideyeah, southside, two blocks from
old comiskey park, at leastthat's what I still call it to
me, from two blocks from thewhite socks stadium, and so of
course, I'm a white socks fan.
Oh, but, yeah so, and for me, Inever felt like me being in
(05:19):
projects was gonna be where mylife was gonna be.
I always wanted to strive toget out the projects and I knew
football was my way of gettingout.
I just didn't know footballwould take me this way to get
out of it.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Now, when you were growing up, was it difficult.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
Oh yeah, in my neighborhood sometimes there was
only two ways you was gettingout and neither one of them was
a positive way.
You was either going to go outby going to jail or go out dead.
So very few people left myneighborhood on a positive level
and I didn't want that to be myfate.
So I knew football wassomething I knew how to do, I
(06:02):
loved to do and I knew that wasgoing to be my ticket out.
I used to pray and ask God tolet me get out to projects
through football.
So I got what I asked for.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
So how did you avoid encounters in the hood, Like how
did you avoid encounters thatcould possibly be dangerous?
Speaker 3 (06:24):
Well, back then they knew I was an athlete, they knew
this was going to take it out,so they wouldn't let me get
involved in the gangs andeverything.
And there have been times thatI tried to and I wanted to
because that was just part ofthe nature growing up and seeing
some of my friends do it andbeing involved in gangs so I
(06:44):
wanted to do it too, but theywouldn't let me do it.
Whenever things started gettingto the point where things were
starting to go down or somethingwrong was about to happen,
they'd make me go home.
So my neighborhood actuallysaved my life too.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
That's amazing man.
Thank God for your neighbors,thank God for the people around
you.
Amazing man, thank God for yourneighbors, thank God for the
people around you.
So let's talk about how you gotinjured, man.
It was 1986, correct?
Speaker 3 (07:20):
88.
88?
Yeah, so 1988, can you explain?
Yeah, I can remember that, likeit was yesterday, yesterday it
was the opening kickoff of thegame.
I think it was our third gameof the season, um, and this was
my first game starting on bothas the linebacker and middle
linebacker I mean middlelinebacker and fullback and so I
(07:40):
was extremely excited.
I'm like I'm going both ways, Iain't going to be coming off
the field, it's going to be allday, every day.
So I'm excited going into thegame it's the opening kickoff
Went down, made my last tackleand broke my neck and trapped my
34th vertebra and as I made thehit, I hit him on the side and
(08:04):
as my head was sliding down, histhigh came up and hit me on the
chin and snapped my neck backand I fell down to the turf on
my back.
Luckily, and as I usually do athousand times before, I jumped
up and ran to the sidelines.
Only difference this time itwas mentally and not physically.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
I can totally attest to that.
That's how I felt when my momwas like you're paralyzed in the
hospital and I, like, triedmoving my leg.
I was like, see, mom, I'm notparalyzed, but my leg wasn't
moving.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
And so, after one of my teammates came over and
that's what a teammate'ssupposed to do he reached out
and he grabbed my arm and he wastrying to snatch me up, and all
I remember is looking at himwith my eyes bucked, telling him
no, because I knew somethingwas wrong.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Were you able to speak?
Speaker 3 (09:02):
Barely, barely yeah, barely, but just enough to be
able to get his attention forhim not to move me.
So he dropped my arm and atthat point he started going to
the sidelines until the coachand something was wrong and they
the coaches ran out there.
The paramedics came running outthere and they did what I call
the pen test.
When he took a pen, took myshoes off and ran the pen across
(09:26):
my feet and asked me did I feelit?
I'm like no, I don't feelanything.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
So explain to the people this.
So you're doing a kickoff, it'slike seven seconds in and you
get paralyzed like right on it,the first eight seconds of the
game.
What were you feeling?
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Well, running down or after it happened.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
After it happened.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Like I said, when they was doing that pen test I
didn't feel anything.
As they were running the pen,they went to my legs, my thigh,
my stomach, my chest, my neck.
I didn't feel anything untilthey touched my face.
So by the time he got to myface I got tears streaming down
the side of my face and I lookup and I see all the coaches and
(10:20):
everybody with tears comingdown their face.
So I knew something was wrong.
At this point.
I couldn't move.
Nothing would move.
My breathing was getting realshallow.
I'm having a hard timebreathing and at that point I
didn't know whether I was goingto live or die.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
I know what you're talking about.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
And it was terrifying .
I know what you're talkingabout and it was terrifying.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
I know what you're talking about, but I was
sleeping, luckily, so I didn'thave to see it.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
You actually had the visuals of what happened and you
said you can remember it tothis day yeah, and my coach
probably saved my life becausethey was getting ready to take
me in Amilam and take me to thelocal hospital and the hospital
(11:14):
that was near the stadium wasone of the worst hospitals in
the city and chances are Iprobably wouldn't be here today
if they took me there.
So he stood over me and somehowconvinced them, demanded or
whatever he did, to get ahelicopter out there and fly me
down to Northwestern Hospitaldowntown and that probably saved
(11:36):
my life.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Well, I mean shout out to your coach, yeah.
Coach.
Yeah, that is amazing.
I mean, it's's terrifying, it'sscary, but it's amazing.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
you're still here and I'm happy you're still here and
funny thing with that um withthem putting me in a helicopter.
I was afraid of heights, so ontop of getting hurt that y'all,
finna, put me in a helicopterand fly me somewhere were you
conscious?
Yeah, I was still conscious,doing all this what yeah, and so
(12:13):
I.
I give a lot of thanks to theparamedic that was in the
helicopter because he reallykept me calm as we was flying
down to the umern Hospital.
And craziest thing happenedOnce we get to Northwestern, I
stopped breathing as they wasrushing me to the emergency room
.
I stopped breathing and I endedup having an out-of-body
(12:36):
experience.
I was literally looking down onthem working on my body,
cutting my shoulder pads off,cutting my jersey off, getting
the helmet off me, and theytrying to resuscitate me and
bring life back into my lifelessbody so you were watching them
do this I was like in the upperright hand corner in the purest
(13:01):
of white room and watchingeverything they're doing, but
not panicking, I'm in totalpeace.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
That's how I felt.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Yeah and just watching everything Like wow, it
was so peaceful yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Until they pulled you back into this fucking world.
But it was so peaceful.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
And like I tell people for me, me, I think that
was god making the decisionbetween me either still being
here or me going to heaven, andseeing I'm here talking to you
today.
I guess we know what that is,unless we all have it right now
yeah, free will yeah, and so hebrought me back down and he gave
(13:44):
me work to do at that point,and I've been trying to live
that purpose ever since so youget to northwestern hospital.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
What time is it?
Speaker 3 (13:52):
this would we.
That was a 10 o'clock game so Iprobably got northwestern,
probably about 11.
Yeah, by 11, 11, 30.
I'm gonna do a 10 o'clock gamein the morning.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
And were you conscious for that experience?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
All the way until we got to going toward the
emergency room when I stoppedbreathing.
But all before then I was stillconscious and seeing and
everything going on, everybodybeing frantic and everybody
running around trying to get meto where I need to get to, to
try to save my life.
And I remember, um, they askedme who did I want them to call?
(14:36):
I had them to call my brotherinstead of my mom's.
My mom's didn't want me to playfootball.
So I'm like the lad, don't callmy mama.
I said call my brother, this ishis number, call him, but please
don't call my mama.
So he was there when you woke up.
Oh, I didn't wake up for likethree days later.
(15:00):
Me too.
Yeah, three days.
And the funniest well, I ain'tgoing to say funny, but
something kind of crazy when Iwoke up, they kept the TV on for
me.
So it was like maybe in themiddle of the night when I woke
up and I'm watching this TV showand I've never been on a cruise
(15:21):
, and this is, and I've neverbeen on the cruise, and this is
why I've never been on a cruiseand I never will go on a cruise.
This TV show they had on it wasbased on a true story.
It was a cruise ship that gothijacked by some pirates or
whatever.
And they tell everybody to goto the upper deck of this cruise
(15:42):
on the cruise ship.
So there's one man in thewheelchair.
He rolls over to the stairs, soof course he can't get up the
stairs.
They um wouldn't let nobody tohelp him up the stairs either.
So they grabbed this man, takehim to the side of the ship,
shoot him in the head and throwhim overboard.
(16:03):
Just the first thing I ever seeafter coming to.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
That's terrifying.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
I'm like I would never get on a cruise.
I've had people offer to pay methat I would pay for the cruise
.
All that I'm never getting onnobody's cruise, never going to
happen.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
So when you got injured and they brought you,
when you got injured and theylike kind of like stabilized you
and they told you you wereparalyzed, how did you feel,
like what were your thoughts?
Speaker 3 (16:36):
Well, they didn't just tell me I was paralyzed.
They told me the only thing Iwas going to do the rest of my
life was blink.
They told me I would neverbreathe on my own, I would never
talk on my own, never be ableto have solid foods, never be
able to have kids.
And then, to top it off, theytold me that my life expectancy
(16:57):
was 10 years.
So all this was dumped on me atthe age of 17 years old.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
I can't imagine that, man.
This is why I have so muchrespect for you, Coach.
Let's keep going with yourstory.
So how long were youNorthwestern?
Speaker 3 (17:20):
I was at northwestern probably about two months or
maybe a month and a half, maybea month, month and a half and
then they sent me over to um rscthe iconic rehabilitation
institute of chicago.
Yes.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
What was this like in 1988?
Speaker 3 (17:46):
For me and this is what I tell people being in
Northwestern was about what Icouldn't do.
You can't do this, you can't dothat, you'll never do this,
you'll never do that.
Going to RSC, it was aboutpossibilities of what I can do,
that we go try to teach you howto do this, teach you how to do
(18:06):
that.
And in my mind, going there, Ifigured out okay, after I get to
the rehab, I'm going to walkagain.
I'm going to walk up out ofhere.
That was my thought.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
That was the same thought, man.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
And it took me a while to come to reality, to
realize that I wouldn't go walkup out of here.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
How long did it take you?
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Probably took me about a month to get to that.
And don't get me wrong even tothis day, I still believe that
I'm going to walk again, Me too.
But I know that I still believethat I'm going to walk again,
me too.
But I know that I still have alife to live.
Until that happens, I stillhave a purpose until that
(18:50):
happens.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
So I live with that purpose.
But when that day comes and Godsees fit to let me walk again,
I can't wait for that day tohappen, but until then I'm going
to live life to the fullest,life to the max.
Walk again.
I can't wait for that day tohappen, but until then I'm going
to live life to the fullest.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Life to the max, yes, so when you get to RIC RIC is
world known for their therapyand for their research, for
spinal cord injury research Didyou have a lot of hope when you
got to RIC, and how were thetherapists?
Speaker 3 (19:24):
when I first got there, I had all the hope in the
world.
Um, I'm like I couldn't wait toget to therapy.
I couldn't wait to do whateverthey was asking me to do.
I was trying to learneverything I possibly could as
what I call my new normal.
And after, after a couple ofweeks, you know, as a patient,
(19:46):
we want to see these hugechanges, we want to see these
major changes, and I didn't seethem.
So once I didn't see them, Istarted believing what the
doctor told me.
When the doctor told me thatI'd never be able to breathe on
my own and I'd never be able totalk, the only thing I'm able to
do is blink, and I startedbelieving it.
(20:07):
So at some point I felt like Iwanted to give up.
And that's when the gentlemancame in my life, darryl Stingley
, and he started telling meeverything that he was doing and
how he was going out, stillenjoying life, talking to um,
going to giving speeches to um,young kids and like what?
(20:28):
and for the first time, whensomebody left out the room and
said they understand what I'mgoing through.
I believed him because herolled out the room in this
power wheelchair, like I had toand everybody else usually.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Just like you did for me.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Right, exactly, and that's where it came from.
You got to be able to give back, you know, pay it forward.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
So, coach, walk me through the progression of your
rehab, Like, how did it start?
You got there, you were on aventilator, dependent correct,
just like me.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
So what walked me through it?
Speaker 3 (21:10):
So I was still on the ventilator and everything, and
after I, after encounteringEnduro and everything they want,
I was going full out Everyexercise they had me to do,
every therapy they wanted me todo.
I even changed some of mytherapy when I was going through
speech therapy, instead ofgoing through all the exercises
(21:34):
they wanted me to do, I startedfeeling a little different
Because, like I said, I likedsinging before I got injured.
I was actually in a groupcalled.
New.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
Fortune.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
And so, instead of doing the regular voice
exercises, I would sing, and itcaught on with some of the other
patients too, and I would be,because it was the same exercise
.
It was about strengthening mydiaphragm.
So what do you do when you sing?
You take deep breaths in andyou let it out and you sing, and
(22:09):
that's what I was doing.
So my voice started gettingstronger and it just made me a
little bit of a way of enjoyingthe therapy sessions right along
with just wanting to do as muchas I could.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
So a day came, oh, oh , I can't wait for this story
yes, tell me, I had um, how longis this?
Is this like a month in?
Speaker 3 (22:33):
this.
Yeah, I was probably in um, atI mean at rsc probably for about
a month, okay, and, like I said, my story went viral, so I used
to always have all these randompeople come to see me.
So on this day, two beautifulyoung girls came in and see me.
There's a high school also, andI'm, I'm, I'm so intrigued, I'm
(22:56):
talking to everything.
I'm, I'm 17, 18 years old, I'mfrantic that they're in there
and oh, yes, and they look realnice too, yeah, and so I'm
talking to them.
So the respiratory therapistcomes in and he said he needed
(23:18):
to work on the machine, heneeded to test everything out,
and I said is it okay if theystay in here?
Why are you doing that?
He said, yeah, no problem.
He seen the smile on my facetoo.
So he said, yeah, no problem.
So when he's working on themachine, checking the machine,
he has to turn all the alarmsoff.
So, all the alarms off.
(23:40):
And while I'm talking to themand so intrigued and all into
them, I don't notice that thetubing popped off.
So for the first time since myaccident, for about three to
five minutes I'm literallybreathing and talking on my own.
And then I didn't know, hedidn't know, of course the girls
(24:03):
don't know.
And then, um, once he finishedworking on the machine, he turns
the alarms back on.
So, of course, all the bellsand whistles going off, yeah,
yeah, you know, you know, and Ipanic and I'm like I can't
breathe.
I can't breathe, and so he putit back on.
He rushed the girls out of theroom.
(24:24):
And so, about 30 minutes later,my whole team come in the room
my doctor, my nurse, therapist,physical therapist, everybody
come in the room and I'm lookinglike what did I do?
And they was like we need totalk to you Like what they said.
Like we need to talk to youLike what they say, if you could
(24:45):
do that for three to fiveminutes, you should be able to
do that forever.
And they say we want to sendyou back to Northwestern to get
weaned off.
I'm like no, y'all not.
Uh-uh, uh-uh.
Because to me in my mind, beingon the ventilator was like being
on a drug, because I wasdependent on it and I thought
(25:07):
that's the only way that I couldbreathe is by having it.
So I wasn't going to get wingedoff, nothing.
And I told him let me thinkabout it.
And then, on top of that, thiswas right around the holiday.
It was right around Christmasand this was my first time
getting a visit back home.
(25:27):
So now I just have to thinkabout the fact of getting weaned
off, to go in there to getweaned off.
But also, if I got went thereenough ways to get weaned off, I
wasn't ready to go back home,so I told him let me think about
it.
So the next morning, when Iwoke up, it's about 7 o'clock in
(25:48):
the morning this is beforeeverybody else gets started it's
an older lady at the door, andthis is something that's
different for what y'all here todeal with.
It was four people in my room.
It was four of us in one room.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Oh, my God, yes.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
Can you imagine Four people?
That was crazy, and my thatsucks Right, wasn't no privacy,
wasn't nothing, and wasn't nofamily being there with you all
the time or anything?
And so when I woke up, my bedwas just so.
I happened to be right next tothe door and it's an older lady
(26:28):
at the door and she asked couldshe come in and pray for me?
So I don't hear people do that.
A lot of times, like I say, Ialways hear random people coming
in.
So I told her she'd come in andpray for me.
So she came in and prayed overme.
When she got done she saiddon't worry about anything.
God already said you're gonnabe able to breathe.
(26:50):
I'm like huh, like hold on howshe know that I'm go.
What's going on with me If Iain't never met her before?
So after she leaves, I hit thebutton for the receptionist to
come, push my head on the buttonfor the receptionist to be able
(27:10):
to come, and when she rings Iasked.
I said who was the lady thatjust came in?
And she prayed over me.
She's like what lady?
I quit playing.
I said the lady that just leftup out of here.
She was an older lady.
She prayed over me.
She said ain't nobody been inhere?
I said the lady just left.
(27:37):
So by then the receptionistcame to the room and she was
like ain't nobody, doctors ain'teven here.
Yet I said somebody just leftout of here.
So she grabbed the phone andshe called down to security,
security, like ain't nobody beenhere.
And so for me I was like HolySpirit.
Yeah, that was God sending me,an angel to let me know
everything's going to be okay,and at that point I made a
decision to go get weaned off.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
And I bet you're very happy about that.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Yeah, probably the best decision I've made.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
Isn't it great when doctors are wrong?
Yeah, honestly.
I love it Because doctorsalways think they're right.
But listen, dude, you practicemedicine.
You don't know medicine.
Right, you know what I mean.
The big guy upstairs, he's theone.
He's't know medicine.
Right, the big guy upstairs,he's the one.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
He's the ultimate doctor.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
And what I?
This is something because overthe last couple of months I've
been in and out the hospitalprobably about six times.
What's?
Speaker 2 (28:35):
going on.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
I had a UTI a recurring UTI that just kept
coming, and with some of thedoctors and nurses and
everything, I felt like theywasn't listening to.
What I was trying to tell themand what I explained to one of
the doctors was I understand,you studied this, you went to
school for it, you learned andyou got a PhD, but I said I got
(29:00):
a PhD too.
I got a PhD, but I say I got aPhD too.
I got a PhD in me.
Yes, what I know and learnedabout my body and my system and
how things work is somethingthat you would never know.
So let's work together insteadof against each other and some
of them understand that andthey're willing to open up and
let us work together as a teaminstead of against each other.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
All right, work together as a team instead of
against each other, all right.
So how was therapy back then in88 compared to when I did
therapy in 2016?
Speaker 3 (29:30):
It was a whole lot different.
I mean, technology is so muchdifferent.
You know they had theelectroshock system that they do
.
We didn't have that back then.
Everything was manually that wedid as far as range of motion
and things of that nature,hooking me up to different
(29:51):
machines, where my arms was inthe air, connected, where I was
able to swing back and forth andtry to get strength within my
shoulders.
So technology is a whole lotdifferent, even from when you,
in 2016, up until now.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
When I go into Shirley Ryan and see some of the
different things that they'redoing and just to see that
they're getting closer tofinding a cure for paralysis.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
And that's going to be a great day.
I don't know if it's gonna workfor me because I'm 36 years in
um, but if it do I'll be gladthat it will.
But I'm hoping and praying thatit will come true to help
others if it don't help me well,I have a uh guy on uh, john
(30:42):
o'connor.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
He owns uh a rehab place called next steps.
I don't know if you heard ofnext steps.
It's a.
It's kind of like shirley ryan,it's like on steroids, but
anyways they, they know a doctorin san diego that's very close
to uh, you know, reversingparalysis, and luckily I'm able
(31:07):
to speak to this doctor.
Shout out to uh, dr marktrusinski, and you know, in san
diego university, and we'll see.
We'll see what happens withthat, okay, I, okay, I'm excited
for the future because thefuture only gets brighter.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
Always, always.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Yeah, and honestly, man, like your composure, it's
so inspiring.
When I was at RAC, I wasterrified.
I was terrified of the beeping.
I was terrified of the beeping.
I was terrified of being alone.
My family stayed with me forlike a month, like sleeping on
(31:47):
cots.
Like were you alone.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
Yeah, well, other than my four roommates, yeah.
And back then when 9 o'clockcame, they didn't care if you
was the president of the UnitedStates, you had to leave.
They didn't care if you was thepresident of the United States,
you had to leave.
So I had to learn how to, inthe middle of the night, where I
(32:10):
still had to call, like where Icould hit the button with my
head to get the nurse to come.
But I had to learn how to fendfor myself a lot to try to
figure things out on what was Igoing to do If I dropped my
stick, or my stick was a littletoo far trying to figure out how
could I reach it and things ofthat nature.
So I think in some ways that wasgood for me, but it was
(32:33):
difficult, it was scary, it washard Just not knowing there was
somebody there and somethingwent wrong immediately.
You know, nurses wereeventually going to come but
they had other patients they hadto work with too.
So sometimes they couldn't comeright away but they would get
there.
And sometimes I did wish that Idid have family that could have
(32:56):
been right there with me.
But there's other times I thinkit was good for me that I
didn't have family, because itgave me the opportunity to gain
some independence that I don'tknow if I would have had.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
I'm happy you brought up independence, because I am
so dependent on people my nurses, my team.
I need a support team becauseof I'm a C1 quadriplegic.
What?
Speaker 3 (33:24):
are you?
I'm C3, C4 complete.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
C3, c4 complete.
So I'm C1 and I'm ventilatordependent and I always need
someone with me.
When did you gain independence?
When did you gain independencelike, and how like?
When did you gain theindependence to like, live on
(33:49):
your own?
In what age?
Speaker 3 (33:50):
well, first let me say this max, I think what
you're doing is incredible forthe independence that you I know
you say you have to have peoplearound you every day, but the
independence that you havegained and shown for you from
the time when I first met you upuntil now is amazing.
I'm so proud of you, of the manthat you have become, the man
(34:15):
that I can't wait to see thatyou're still to grow into.
I tip my hat off to you and II'm thankful that you become a
part of my life because youinspire me to continue to do
things to be stronger.
So I wanted to say that first Iappreciate that no problem.
(34:36):
I mean, that's the truth.
Um, for me, when did myindependence start?
Um, start, actually, I wouldsay started in rehab, because
some of the things that theytaught us back then they
probably can't do today becauseof liability reasons.
Okay, um, they had me to go outto a restaurant, gave me money
(35:07):
and I had to stop PerfectStructures on the street to
convince them to take me intothe restaurant.
Yeah, and then, once I got inthe restaurant, I had to talk to
the manager of the restaurantand ask him if he could take
somebody off the floor to feedme when my food got there and,
after they fed me, to explain tothem where to take my money out
(35:30):
, to pay for the meal and to getback out the restaurant.
I had to stop people that washaving meals to ask them to help
me get back down the stairs soI could leave the restaurant.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Oh my God, you're crazy.
You are crazy, and speaking ofyou, saying that you got injured
in 1988.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
That was before the American Disability Act correct
Yep.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
What was that?
Like man.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
It was like trying to invent a wheel that never been
made.
It wasn't trying to reinventthe wheel, it was making the
wheel because, um, I was one.
After I left rehab, I was oneof the first kids in a
wheelchair to go to a regularhigh school.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
I remember going back to school.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
Yeah, I remember going up curve cuts on one end
of the street and getting to theother end of the block and it's
not a curve cut there, so I hadto come all the way back down,
go down a curve cut right up thestreet and to the next curve
cut K to get to where I wantedto go to.
But when I got hurt and leftrehab they had one high school
(36:51):
in the city that if you weredisabled you had to go to this
high school and for a couple ofweeks I went there and for me it
wasn't right for me and theperson that I was before before
I got hurt, I was a shy kid,didn't say much, was in the
background, only time I wasvocal was on the football field
(37:15):
and that person would haveaccepted standing at that high
school.
But, as I tell people, when Igot hurt Kenneth Jennings the
football player died and KennethJennings the man was born and
Kenneth Jennings the man was notgoing to accept them telling me
I had to go to this high school.
So at that point I battled withthe Board of Education to go
(37:40):
back to Simeon and the excusethat they gave me, why they told
me I shouldn't be able to goback to the semi-high, was they
told me.
I wouldn't be able to keep upacademically with the rest of
the students.
Speaker 2 (37:51):
But you're cognitively fine.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Huh.
You're cognitively fine, yeah,and that's why I explained to
them.
I say, do y'all not understand?
My body was injured, not mymind.
So I still got my mind.
So I threatened to sue them.
So they that way, they startedgiving me different tests and
everything that I could take anddo to show that I would be able
(38:17):
to compete with the rest of thestudents academically.
So I ended up graduating ontime and I increased my GPA from
a 2.55, 2.6.
I graduated with a 3.75.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Nice man.
Speaker 3 (38:35):
And what I had to do to get to that point.
I was taking classes while Iwas at rehab when I left there.
I left in April, so I was inbetween the hospital and rehab.
I was there six months in a day.
I got hurt October 8th and Ileft rehab April 9th and
(38:57):
immediately went after.
I fought to get back intoschool.
I went back to Symbiont it wasprobably late April and so I
finished the rest of the yearthere, and during the summertime
I had a summer school class inthe morning, I had a tutor in
the middle of the day and I hada class at night at one of the
(39:17):
local colleges, just so I couldcatch up, so I'd be able to
graduate on time with myclassmates.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Dude hats off to you, man.
That's amazing.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
That's how bad I wanted it.
I didn't want this to go awayin.
No how for people to say, oh hehad to graduate late because of
what happened to him.
No, I wouldn't take that as noexcuse.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
So walk me through the progression of your life.
So you went to high school, Didyou go to college?
Speaker 3 (39:51):
Yeah, People thought I was crazy for this too.
After I graduated I decidedthat I wanted to go away to
college like everybody elsewould, Like.
I didn't get hurt, andinitially I got accepted to
Florida A&M.
And yeah, and my family was likehow you going to do this?
(40:12):
My thing was I don't know.
I'll find out when I get there.
So I was planning on going toFlorida A&M and at that time I
was on government assistance andthey sent me a letter stating
that if I go away to leave thestate to go to school, I was
going to have to pay for itmyself.
So at that time I couldn'tafford to pay for it myself and
(40:35):
so I ended up going to SouthernIllinois in Carbondale, and at
that time that was the numberone party school in the nation.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Oh, yeah, that's how you.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
Yeah, it is.
So we got our party all downthere, and this was back in 1990
.
So you partied.
Oh yeah, I got my party.
You were partying, that's whenI finally realized I wasn't an
athlete, no more.
Because, before then I stillfelt like I was an athlete, so I
(41:04):
wasn't drinking.
I was an athlete, so I wasn'tdrinking, I wasn't smoking, I
wasn't doing nothing.
I'm like I'm an athlete, Ican't do none of that.
So I got down there, um, and Iwas literally sleeping in the
regular dorm bed and I wouldhave pillows on the floor in
front of me because I would layon my side at night to go to
sleep.
And just in case I fell forwardand fell out the bed, I had
(41:30):
pillows on the floor, just incase.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Who was helping you?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
They assigned me a caregiver while I was there, and
it made the biggest difference.
So my teammates I didn't knowthey went there and I found out
they went there.
So I used to sleep a lot oftimes in their room, but they
were the same people that taughtme how to drink too.
I remember we had a time wherewe was going out and so they
(41:59):
said we should go to the liquorstore.
And man, we ain't grown either.
We go to the liquor store andthey we ain't grown either.
We go to the liquor store andthey say we finna get a case of
beer.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
You rolling there.
Speaker 3 (42:09):
Yeah, so when you say a case of beer, what you
thinking?
You think they finna get a caseof beer, yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
They got a case of 40s.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
Whoa, yes, I'm like what we supposed to do with this
.
I said, oh, this is for theweek.
They said, no, that's fortonight.
For tonight, like no, ain't noway Right.
So I started gettingcomfortable drinking and I used
to have this real long straw,and so it would fit down in the
(42:44):
40 bottle and still long enoughfor me to drink out of it.
So we used to have thisdrinking game to see who could
drink the most the fastest, youknow you're strong, so yes, you
could drink fast.
I was wearing them out and soonce I got so drunk, I'm trying
to roll down the sidewalk and Icouldn't go straight.
(43:04):
So I would roll all the wayover to the grass and turn just
before I rolled off into thegrass and then come all the way
back down and go right near thecurb before I roll off the curb
and turn back and forth.
So I'm zigzagging going downthe street because I was too
drunk to ride straight.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
You could have gone DUI.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Most definitely Driving under the influence.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
So let me ask you a question, coach.
So we have this little whitestraw next to you.
When did you so that basicallyallows you to move and control
your chair, correct?
Speaker 3 (43:45):
Yep, I have a S and puff wheelchair.
Okay, this is one of the thingsthat they taught me how to use
when I was in the rehab center,and it helped change my life
because it gave me theopportunity to be mobile.
Mobile yes, so I didn't have towait for someone to push or move
(44:05):
me around, which was extremelyimportant, and the way that it
works, like I said, sipping puff.
So I blow hard to go forward, Isip in hard to go reverse, I
blow in lightly to go right andsip in lightly to turn left and
literally I go everywhere inthis chair.
(44:27):
And when I go everywhere, Itell people about a story.
A few years ago, when I wascoaching at Simeon, we Coaching,
you were coaching.
Yeah, I coach high schoolfootball.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
I'm quite sure you're going to get into it.
You're right on everything, man.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
Yeah, I know we're going to get into that a little
bit.
And so we made it to thechampionship game and somehow my
ride to the game got mixed upso I didn't have no ride to the
championship game.
So the game was about two and ahalf miles away.
Speaker 2 (45:02):
You did not, yeah, you drove.
Speaker 3 (45:05):
Got in my chair, left out and went to the game.
But that was the easy part.
Yeah, the hard part was it wasin the middle of a blizzard.
Speaker 2 (45:15):
Get the fuck out of here.
Are you serious?
Speaker 3 (45:18):
Yes.
So I'm literally in the streetriding through the game in the
middle of a blizzard and I couldbarely see in front of me.
So I know people in cars werebarely seeing me either.
And thank God, I prayed.
I was praying all the way thereand all the way back and by the
time I got to the game I hadabout two inches of snow on my
(45:39):
table.
That's how bad it was snowing.
So I had somebody go outside,got to the game and scoop all
this snow off my table and wentto coaching.
Speaker 2 (45:51):
That takes grit.
I'll tell you that.
Speaker 3 (45:55):
I was a believer that , and I think it got a lot to do
with football just like withyou being in the service that
you don't believe in lettingnothing stop you.
Speaker 2 (46:05):
Yeah, service, yeah, that you don't really even let
nothing stop you.
Speaker 3 (46:07):
Yeah, that's so you, you, you live into the max and
you push it to the max yeah andthat's the same thing I do.
Speaker 2 (46:12):
I push it to the max so, so, coach, you get
introduced on how to be mobilewith this wheelchair.
Then they obviously give you awheelchair.
What were more wheelchairs likeback then compared to now?
Speaker 3 (46:28):
um, oh they, they was a lot harder to drive.
They're a lot easier to drivenow.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
Um what about, like the tires?
Speaker 3 (46:40):
oh you had.
You had air in the tires backthen and so any given time you
could be out.
Thank God I never had anopportunity where I caught a
flat, but I know people that hadthat was out in their
wheelchairs and they got a flatand basically you're trying to
get back home any way that youcan.
You have to have someone tohelp you and it's like having a
(47:05):
car.
When your car goes on the flat,you basically driving on the
rim trying to get back to adestination, but unlike a car
where you could basically takeit to a lot of different places
to get to that tire fix, youcouldn't do that with your
wheelchairs.
You had to make arrangementsfor someone to either come
(47:26):
change the tire or you had tocome pick up your chair and
change the tire, and that's thelast thing you wanted to do is
have someone to come pick upyour chair, because you were
going to be out without yourchair for about a week.
Speaker 2 (47:40):
so something as simple as just having your tire
I was going to ask what was thedifference with accommodations
for people who had disabilitiesbefore and after the American
Disability Act.
Speaker 3 (47:54):
Things got a whole lot better after the American
Disability Act Because we hadsomeone finally fighting for us,
because we had someone finallyfighting for us, someone that we
could depend on with thegovernment and everybody else
that understood that they justcouldn't look at us as second
class citizens.
They had to look at us and giveus respect, like they had to
(48:18):
give everyone else.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (48:20):
And that was huge, and that was huge.
And for the people that went inand sat in at the Senate and
Congress to make this law, toput this law, I give them all
the respect in the world,Because without them I would
(48:46):
hate to see what position wewould still be in if they didn't
do what they had to do.
They sacrificed a lot, a lot,in order for all of us that's
disabled to be able to have therespect that we deserve.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
Well, thank God for those congressmen.
Speaker 3 (48:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:56):
Thank God for that, because the ADA has helped me a
lot too.
Speaker 3 (49:00):
And.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
I can also be like, hey, this is an ADA compliant
and you could complain, and theyactually, like you know,
figured out.
You know the restaurant or theplace you go to.
So you live in the city ofChicago, correct?
Yes.
And have you bounced around orhave you just had one house?
Speaker 3 (49:23):
I've bounced around quite a bit.
After I came back from collegeI was still trying to find
myself, and so I remember wellbefore I go there.
Another piece of adaptiveequipment that I use is my mouse
.
Stick right here.
Speaker 2 (49:43):
Yes, please show me this.
I use this to use stick righthere.
Yes, please show me this.
Speaker 3 (49:46):
I use this to use my phone with.
Speaker 2 (49:49):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (49:52):
To use the phone with computers, turn light switches
on and off Pretty mucheverything.
I consider this my third hand.
Speaker 2 (50:00):
Yeah, me too Okay.
So you have to tell me when wasthe mouth stick introduced?
Speaker 3 (50:06):
It was introduced to me while I was still in rehab,
okay, and for me it wasn't ashard to have.
A lot of people like they'renot used to having something in
their mouth, but with playingfootball I was always used to
having a mouthpiece in my mouth,so that wasn't a huge
adjustment for me, learning howbecause my head was my neck and
(50:28):
my neck was still weak.
Just the fact of trying to holdit up was difficult.
Um, because not only did I havea neck brace on before, um, I
initially, when I first got hurt, I had a halo on too, and for
people that don't know what ahalo brace is, it's a metal
brace that's from your headgoing to your shoulders with
(50:51):
poles and they literally screwit into your head and I'm not
joking, I'm talking literallyscrew it into your head to keep
you perfectly stable.
So when that came off, it feltlike my head wore 100 pounds,
(51:11):
and so and well, some of myfriends think, or my family
think, my head probably do wear100 pounds for real.
But that's beside the point.
But I had to when they let me,taught me to wheel with the
wheelchair and my mouse stick,the two most pieces of adaptive
(51:32):
equipment that I ever had,because the chair gave me
mobility.
The mouse stick gave me anotherform of having a voice, to be
able to communicate witheverybody else by using my phone
to be able to turn channels tobe able to hit buttons.
Like I said, it was a thirdhand for me well, what is, uh?
Speaker 2 (51:55):
the mouse stick, like before and now, since, like ai,
is like taking over and liketechnology, because a mouse
stick usually was used forpainting and writing, and like
flipping the page of a book.
How did it progress?
Like even with smartphones,like when you got your first
smartphone.
(52:16):
Was it amazing?
Speaker 3 (52:18):
oh yeah, it was amazing, but I, even today, I
still don't use all the AItechnology or the voice commands
to use my phone.
I still like using my stick,like I'm writing a book right
now and I'm using my stick to doit.
I don't like all the voicecommands because with the voice
(52:40):
commands it still make mistakes.
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