January 10, 2023 • 51 mins
Karyn Seitz is known as The Happiness Mentor.
What is happiness? And what is preventing us from being fully happy?
Like many of us, Karyn was chasing success externally, and outsourcing her happiness to others. As she did, the void and imposter syndrome got bigger. Despite the spiritual seeking and achievements, she still didn’t feel like she was “enough.” That is, until she realized this truth.
SHE was the problem…and therefore the solution.
In this episode:
- Why the pursuit of happiness leads to unhappiness
- Is happiness a choice?
- Releasing external validation and becoming “enough”
- Setting boundaries (including with ourselves) is an act of self-love
- Offering self-love and healthy discipline through parenting ourselves
- Why YOU are the answer you’ve been searching for your whole life
Karyn supports others to find their version of happiness, and to have both the self-love and self-discipline to create it. You can learn more about Karyn’s work and the programs she offers at https://ahappinesscourse.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:10):
The way we've been doing workand leadership is deeply broken.
Whether you're healing fromburnout or just looking for a
better way to run your company,you're in the right place. What
is the future of work even looklike? That is a question we get
to answer together. Afterworking with 1000s of executives
and entrepreneurs around theworld. I know that the deepest
leadership issues are deeplyhuman. We've got to heal
(00:32):
ourselves if we want to heal theworld. Welcome to the new self
Podcast where each week, I'llhelp you explore topics that
will level up your leadershipand your life. I'm your host,
Nicole Belisle. I'm a leadershipexpert and Reiki master, and I
believe the secret to moreconscious work and leadership is
self healing, grab a seat andget cozy because we're about to
(00:53):
go on a journey.
I am joined today by a wonderfulguest, Karen Seitz. She is known
as the happiness mentor. Andtoday we're going to look at the
nuances of what happiness evenis, how do we cultivate it
within ourselves and stoplooking for it externally? Karen
(01:17):
is someone who has done a ton ofspiritual seeking, and came to
realize that the answer wasn'tanywhere out there. Outside of
herself, she came to a profoundrealization that she herself was
the problem. She was theconstant. And she took
responsibility for that Karenbelieves that happiness is a
(01:41):
choice that is accessible to allof us to make experts like Karen
who have taken the time to getinto the nitty gritty to
understand the nuance can helpus all fast track our insights,
she will be sharing insightstoday that could take years if
not a lifetime to understand.
And we get to learn that fromher. Now. Throughout the
(02:04):
episode, I invite you to tuneinto your unique definition of
these concepts. Becauseultimately, you're in the
driver's seat of your life ofyour success, and happiness. And
Karen is going to help you stayin that driver's seat. Without
further ado, let's dive into theepisode. Karen, I'm so excited
(02:25):
to share space with you and havethis conversation today. Thank
you so much for being on the newself podcast. Thank you for
having me, Nicole, it's reallynice to be here. And I look
forward to the conversationwe're gonna have. Likewise, I
know that you have been on areally incredible journey of
self seeking spiritual seeking.
(02:49):
And you're you're known as ahappiness mentor. So what what's
your story? How did you go fromkind of questioning the
definition of success to being ahappiness mentor, because that's
a really interesting title thatyou're embodying here. Well, my
journey really started very muchlike others, were in my adult
(03:13):
life, I got trapped in thepursuit of happiness. And what
happened is, I was looking topeople in things to make me
happy. And I was looking tospiritual journey to make me
happy. And all the while I waschasing and checking the boxes
(03:36):
of the things that I thoughtwould make me happy. So getting
a degree, starting a business,getting married,
becoming a yoga teacher becominga Reiki Master becoming a
meditation teacher becoming ashamanic healer, and
practitioner, starting a healingpractice all these things.
(03:58):
Under the guise of thinking, ifI do this, if I do this next
thing, then I'll finally feelcomplete, then I'll finally feel
whole, then I'll finally behappy and my life. Yet what
ended up happening was I justkept seeking, I just kept
chasing, because those thingsnever actually worked to make me
(04:20):
happy. Because one thing that weall know whether we know how to
apply it in our lives or not,but what we all know is that no
one and no thing can make youhappy that happiness is an
inside job. But I had no pathand no way to know how to
actually cultivate thathappiness within myself. And
(04:40):
everything I was doing wasn'tworking. The books I was
reading, weren't working, yogawasn't working. Reiki wasn't
working, meditation wasn'tworking. And I found myself in
my early 30s Still feeling veryinsecure. Very much in a facade
of making it look like I had itall.
together, but feeling like amess inside, and many areas of
(05:04):
my life still looks like a mess.
And I started to question like,is, is this it? Like, is this
going to be my life? Is thiswhat it's going to look like?
And feeling very much like,what's the point. And then,
very fortunately, I met mymentors, who really helped me to
(05:27):
start to build a relationshipwith myself and to teach me what
that actually looks like. Andthrough that process, I was able
to find a direct path tocultivating inner happiness,
which is how I became thehappiness mentor.
Amazing. I love what you'reilluminating here around
(05:47):
happiness being an inside job,right? Because I think that
there is such a trap in thinkingthat that comes from somewhere
outside of us. And even if wepresent as being really
successful, I know that myselfas well, in times when I on the
outside have looked like I hadit together or looked like
(06:10):
things were going really well.
There still can be that thatimposter syndrome. Within of
Wait a minute, I'm supposed tobe happy I should there's that
word should be happy with all ofthese things. So were you
experiencing this, this sameversion of of not being enough?
Or what what did that look like?
(06:33):
Inside as you were recognizing,wait a minute, I'm I'm here,
with all of these externalsuccesses, and something is
still off, drop drop us intowhat that really felt like?
Well, it really dives intounderstanding the experience of
being unhappy. And recognizingthat our very human Pursuit of
(06:59):
Happinessis a big, big red flag that we
are actually unhappy. Becausewhen we are happy,
we stopped seeking.
And the very fact that I wascontinuing to seek in almost a
desperation of finding the nextthing that I thought would make
(07:20):
me feel okay in my life was thevery trap that I was spinning
in, that kept me feeling notenough. That kept me feeling
empty on the inside, lost,confused about who I was, I
often share that I felt like alittle girl trapped inside a
(07:41):
woman's body, and needing topretend to be confident needing
to wear this mask and facade tothe outside world to make me
feel that I was okay. I lookedto people to tell me what to do
in my life, whether that wastherapists, books, healers,
friends, family, I was lookingfor all my answers outside of
(08:03):
me,which left me with the complete
inability to trust myself, orbelieve in myself to make
choices to think for myself, andto navigate my life as an adult
woman. And really feel like Iknew how to do life, and I
didn't. And that was really theinternal experience, which
(08:23):
everything I just shared, Nicoleis the internal experience of
being unhappy. And it stems fromthis place of always wanting
what we don't have thinking,once I get this, whether it's an
achievement, or an accolade, orletters behind our name, or a
degree or a marriage or kids,whatever it is, we think is
(08:47):
going to give us thatexperience or status of success.
That's in that trap of thepursuit of happiness and being
unhappy, which I define beingunhappy as always wanting what I
don't have. And when we live inthat experience. That's where we
have that internalinsight, insecurity and constant
(09:13):
doubt in ourselves that I justdescribed, which is what I was
living in constantlyon a path of seeking on a path
of trying to find happiness on apath of trying to find myself
and coming up short every singletime. Thank you so much for
illuminating that, that core orroot cause of the self doubt in
(09:35):
all of this because I thinkoften when we're feeling that
void within have to yourdefinition of being unhappy,
right, like always wanting whatwe can't have always in that
Chase. That is such a it'salmost celebrated in the
entrepreneurial world right tokeep chasing the thing, grow the
(09:55):
business, make it bigger.
or rise in the ranks, like be bethe best version of yourself all
these ideals that we that we getsold or conditioned into. And
then when we don't achieve it,there's yeah, there's just that,
that unhappiness that that canreally settle in. So, so how,
(10:17):
how did you? How did you pullyourself out of this? What what
ultimately, were some of thepractices or the mindset shifts
that that led you to start torewire a bit and find happiness?
Well, really, I had to have anawakening,
(10:39):
I really first had to,and with the help of my mentors,
because I wasso stuck in my own stories that
I, like, I would have told youwhile I was in my path, and
doing all the things I wasdoing, in my own doom version of
myself, and trying to protectmyself from being exposed from
(11:05):
what was really going on, Ireally believed that I was
happy, I really believed I hadit together, I really believed I
was on this great path formyself. But my external world
reflected something verydifferent to me. And
fortunately, meeting my mentorsis where I had the opportunity
(11:26):
to really have an innerawakening, that shifted my
perspective, in a way that wastransformational and life
changing. And they really taughtme how to be honest with myself.
Because as I was stuck in mystories, of what I thought my
life was of who I thought I was,I couldn't see clearly where I
(11:48):
was really at and what was goingon with me and my life. So the
moment of, of having thisinternal awakening, the big aha,
was really seeing that I was theproblem in my life, that
(12:08):
everything else I had been doingto try to figure myself out,
not to mention our culture, or,you know, family, friends, all
unknowingly reinforced andenabled me to put the power and
control outside of me. And tobelieve that it was my past that
it was my upbringing, that itwas my failed relationships,
(12:31):
that it was my husband, that itwas all these things outside of
me that I have no control overto change, which kept me going
around in circles. So to have amoment of awakening to recognize
and see that I was the problemin my life was a turning point
for me to actually start toconnect with myself. And, and
(12:57):
what I had to see in hindsight,was that everything else I had
been doing, thinking I wasconnecting with myself,
actually kept me disconnected.
Because in my spiritual path, Iwas always trying to become some
supreme version of myself somehigher version of me, or some
(13:22):
enlightened version of me, Ididn't want to be carrot. I want
it to be something much granderand much more than Karen. And
myself, so there was noconnection to me. It wasn't
until I could see myself as asthe problem in my life, that I
(13:44):
could actually begin to moveforward and see the choices and
decisions I was making. Thatkept me feeling really bad about
myself that kept me alwayschasing and seeking and wanting
what I didn't have beingunhappy. And that was a pivotal
moment that really allowed me todiscover there is a me in here.
(14:09):
And then that path began to leadto really building a
relationship with myself into apath of self actualizing, which
is a journey in itself, that wecan continue to grow and learn
on for our entire lives. And inorder to be on a path of self
actualizing becoming the bestversion of myself and using life
(14:34):
to grow and learn about who I amand to develop internal self
value. I had to realize how Iwas constantly looking to my
external world, to define me, togive me a sense of value and who
I am to define who I am, andrecognizing that's what cuts me
(14:57):
in that pursuit of happiness andtherefore unhappy
He is always looking to myexternal world to define who I
was to define success for me.
And to be on a path of becomingthe best version of myself not
for how it looks to anybodyelse, or for the The next award
or accomplishment orachievement. But just for me,
because of who I want to be, andthe character and integrity of
(15:22):
the kind of person, I want toknow myself as that that's a
true path of self actualizing,where it's just for me, and
through that path, I began tobuild internal self value and to
actually feel good about who Iam, which then allowed me to
develop internal happiness,which I know we'll get into and
(15:45):
okay, what is happiness?
Wow, what I'm what's reallystanding out to me in what
you're sharing is partly thatyou broke the cycle of
outsourcing your identity, yourworth your value by by going
inward and letting thatrelationship to yourself to that
(16:09):
North Star and what integrityreally looks like for you. Like
letting that be the thing thatis enough and learning to love
that self. I just think thatthat is it's so and we're not
taught that at all. So we're,we're not taught that. And if I
can add, Nicole, that we don'twant that it's much more
(16:34):
alluring, tohave the achievements in our
life to go after the externalthings that we think will make
us happy because we're we'regetting something that gives us
this temporary fulfillment orfeeling accomplished or feeling
successful. And that's whetherthat's more money, whether
(16:57):
that's a house, whether that'shaving children, whether that's
getting married, whether that'sclimbing, the corporate ladder,
whether that's having asuccessful business, those
things are all much morealluring to us, then the true
journey of happiness, andsuccess is all you get is
yourself, these things are theretoo. But they're not what you're
(17:21):
striving for, you're really juststriving for that experience of
yourself to feel good about whoyou are. And when we're unhappy.
And we don't feel good aboutourselves, and we feel insecure
and we feel not enough. It'skind of like, like get his knee.
We don't actually want ourselveswe want anything but ourselves.
(17:43):
So it's, it's a That in itselfis a challenge for us to
actually want to pursueintegrity, pursue character,
pursue being the best version ofourselves, when all we get in
the end is us. Exactly. Yeah.
Somehow it doesn't seem asglitzy or as glamorous in a way.
(18:07):
And so I can understand why yousay that, that happiness, or at
least our conventional way ofdefining it is a bit of a trap.
And so So now that you've you'verealized that you've had that
awakening, what, what is thatinternalized happiness that
you're experiencing? And walk usthrough what that what that
(18:30):
feels like and what the innerlandscape now is for you? Oh,
good. Yeah, that's a reallygreat place to go next, so that
we're laying a foundation ofreally understanding what
happiness is. Because, quitefrankly, we, we really have it
all wrong. In our society, inour culture, just even aside
(18:51):
from that, just in ourhumaneness and how we are wired.
So what we want to believehappiness is, is all of the
external achievement, it is thesuccess, it's having the money,
it's having the lifestyle, it'shaving the freedom.
It's feeling happy. That's whereI got really trapped in the
(19:14):
pursuit of happiness andespecially on my spiritual
journey, is I was chasing afeeling I was chasing like, that
blissed out feeling you mighthave after a really great yoga
class or that blissed outfeeling you might have
aftermath meditating, which Inever really achieved. I was
horrible at meditating andreally didn't enjoy it. And it
(19:37):
was always a fight and astruggle. But I know some people
have that kind of blissed out,zen experience after meditating
and that's what we want tobelieve happiness is that it's
this feeling. It's thiskind of elated state, and
experience of ourselves. It'snot that Not
(20:01):
at all. So how I definehappiness is that it's really a
state of being. And it's anexperience of yourself.
Where it's the opposite ofunhappy if unhappy, as I always
want, what I don't have,have happiness is, I only want
to be me.
(20:24):
And I only want the life I have,not because of
what I have in my life, notbecause of what I get to do, or
what I don't have in my life.
But it really is this internalexperience of no lack, and no
wantin one's life, where you have a
(20:45):
deep acceptance of who you are,and a deep acceptance of the
life that you have, even withthe challenges, even with the
shortcomings, even with theflaws. Because you're in life
for the sole purpose of growingand learning about yourself, to
understand who you are. And inthat experience, you create a
(21:08):
feeling of, of actually feelingreally good about who you are.
And having that internal selfvalue, where you know, you're
going to be okay, no matterwhat. And in the experience of
being happy, you cease to lookand seek for your meaning and
(21:31):
purpose outside of you.
And you become your own meaningand purpose, that it's not about
finding value in the people andthings in your life. In order to
be happy, you must valueyourself.
And so it's it's shifting fromthis constant seek of external
(21:54):
value in our lives, to reallydeveloping internal value. What
the natural argument that cancome up, Nicole, is, well, that
sounds really selfish and reallyself centered, because that's
all gosh, she said, It's allabout you. It's all about me.
But that's not actually whathappens when we live in a place
(22:15):
of wanting our meaning andpurpose and our value to come
from the people and things inour lives. What actually happens
in our relationships is that weneed the people in our lives to
be something for us to feelokay, and to give us that sense
of meaning and purpose. And thatactually unknowingly leads to an
experience of beingmanipulative, and controlling.
(22:39):
And then being very upset, andhurt, when somebody is not
fulfilling that role that you'vesecretly assigned to them to be
something for you. It's whenwe're complete and whole within
ourselves, and we don't needsomething or somebody to fill
that hole in us, that we canactually experience life for the
(22:59):
reality of what it is, andaccept the people in our lives
for who they are, and not needthem to be anything for us. So
when I'm striving to be the bestversion of me, by seeking my
value, and seeking my meaningand purpose in me, then that
benefits everybody. Because ifI'm being the best version of
(23:21):
me, I'm not being manipulativeand controlling, I'm actually
being accepting, empathetic,compassionate, and wanting
people to just be who they are,and using those relationships to
grow and learn about myself andbe the best that I can be in
those relationships. And thatbenefits everybody. So it's
(23:42):
actually the most, or the leastselfish path that one could take
is is developing the internalmeaning and purpose within
oneself, and valuing oneself.
It almost sounds like a bit of afast track in a way to that that
ripple effect that we can haveof of leaders in our own lives
(24:07):
because I think a lot of the alot of the behaviors or the
patterns that can be moretraumatic that you're
describing, right of beinghighly reactive, manipulating,
needing someone to be somethingfor us.
This this is so normalized. Andin our community here we talk a
lot about things like worktrauma, and breaking the pattern
(24:31):
of some of these more negativebehavioral or relational habits
by breaking the pattern withinfirst so talk to us a bit about
self leadership and because itbecause I'm really getting in
what you're saying thatthat it is a bit of a fast track
to go inward to to rewrite tochoose yourself and to have
(24:55):
enough repsHave your own integrity and have
your own self love to be able totrust yourself again, right?
Because one of my favoritedefinitions of, of trust it or
self trust, rather, is thatthat's actually what confidence
is. And and we all I think wantto, on some level, feel
(25:17):
confident in the lives thatwe're building for ourselves and
the companies that we'releading. So, so help us
understand a bit more about whatis self leadership and why why
start there? Like what, what aresome of the other benefits we
can expect from starting there?
Yeah, well, I think, if I canspeak a little bit to I love
(25:41):
what you're saying, like thissounds a bit like fast track.
And it absolutely is. Becausewhat we don't realize that we
are actually seeking when wechase external success, and we
chase the things outside of usto give us a good life or to
make us feel whole and complete,is we get so far away from
(26:07):
ourselves. And what we don'trealize we're seeking in those
things.
Is ourselves, what we've beensearching for our whole lives
that we had no idea we weresearching for, is actually
experiencing herself.
So it is a fast track toeverything that you've ever
(26:27):
wanted. Because everythingyou've ever wanted is you. And
it's not outside of you.
You live within yourself. Andthat's where I think in, in
going in the direction of reallytalking about self leadership,
this is also a really good timeto define what success is. And
then that's going to set us upto really talk about self
(26:50):
leadership. So if successisn't the awards, it's not the
accomplishments, it's not thechecking the boxes of what we
believe will be a good life.
We have to totally redefinedsuccess. So it's not the
traditional definition of whatour culture and society
(27:13):
unknowingly and I don't believe,from an ill intended place,
reinforces and enables, it'sjust our humaneness and it's
just the structure of thereality that we live in our
lives. But how I define success,which is, is going to happen in
and develop through selfleadership. Success is knowing I
(27:39):
have done my best.
And I feel good about who I am.
Success is knowing I've done mybest. And I feel good about who
I am. Not because anybody elseis telling me I've done my best,
or that I should feel good, or Ishould be proud of myself is a
(28:00):
deep knowing and experience thanmyself, that I know, I have done
my best. And I feel good aboutmyself for having done my best.
That's what successes, and ithappens through this concept of
self leadershipon the journey of self
(28:20):
actualizing. And the beauty ofusing self actualization. And
the process of self leadership,to cultivate this kind of
successis that it doesn't require a
certain amount of money. Itdoesn't require a degree. It
doesn't require letters behindyour name. It doesn't require a
(28:44):
marriage or kids or a house.
Every single human has theability to self actualize. It's
why Maslow and Maslow'shierarchy of needs, the very
pinnacle of Maslow's hierarchyis self actualization.
(29:06):
And what might be one person'sbest and best version of
themselves can look verydifferent from another person's
best version of themselves. Andit's not a hierarchy. It's not a
better than or a moreestablished path or not. I know
for me, that my purpose in mylife, what's going to allow me
(29:28):
to express myself and my fullestpotential is being a thought
leader. And that's the path andthe journey that I am on, not
for the end result of being athought leader being well known.
But to really express and pushmyself in a way that allows me
to be the best that I can be andexpress myself fully in life.
(29:52):
And so it doesn't matter whatour path is and what that looks
like to be our best version ofourselves. Anyone can do it
It doesn't require any of thetraditional definitions or
ideals that we have as a cultureor society, of what's going to
be successful. And the pathof self actualizing, of pushing
(30:13):
ourselves to our potential andbeing the best version of
ourselves solely for theexperience of knowing who we are
and feeling good aboutourselves, is what you have
asked about, which is selfleadership.
And how I talk about and how Idefine self leadership is
(30:34):
actually a termcalled parenting oneself.
Actually, being ableto get off of a track of doing
what we want, when we want.
And having clear structure inour lives, that pushes us to
(30:56):
making choices and decisionsthat are best for us and doing
what we know we need to do,even when we don't want to do
it.
And not from a place of poweringthrough, and making ourselves do
the things we know we need todo.
(31:18):
But actually, from a veryconscious, self aware place, of
parenting ourselves to do thethings we need to do
for the purposeof developing internal self
value. So an example being so Ilove food. And one of my
challenges in lifehas been being an emotional
(31:41):
eater, and stuffing my feelingsand stuffing my emotions with
food.
And when I do that, not only isthat not good for my physical
health, more importantly, whichI think my physical health is a
reflection of, it's not good formy emotional health. Because
(32:02):
when I stuff and I push down andI suppress with food, I don't
feel good about who I am notbecause of what I'm eating, but
because I'm avoiding myself, andI'm avoiding dealing with what's
being shaken up in me. So I pairmyself around food not
(32:23):
for weight, not for physicalreasons, but actually is a path
of showing myself I'm worth it.
I'm worth it on a Tuesday nightto say no to the Ben and Jerry's
in the freezer that I like toenjoy on a Friday or Saturday
night, right. And I do that notfrom a place of powering through
but actually catching myself.
(32:45):
And and we all know this. So forbeing honest, actually catching
myself and my adult tempertantrum of stomping my not
literally but internally,stomping my feet right and
laying on the floor kicking andscreaming, I'm like, No, but I
was the Ben and Jerry's did Iwant to now and catching myself
in that temper tantrum, just toactually have a conversation
(33:07):
with myself almost like youwould with a child of No, Karen.
We're not going to do thattonight. Because you know, if
you do that, you're not gonnafeel good about yourself, you're
gonna set yourself on a path ofthen making other choices
tonight, that aren't going tomake you feel good about
yourself. And then you'resetting yourself up for not a
great date tomorrow. So knowthat Ben and Jerry's has for
(33:28):
Friday, and we're leaving it in.
We're not, we're not doing that.
And when I do that, at from aplace of self leadership and
parenting myself, it starts withthe small things like that,
which is why I'm using thisexample.
We feel really good about who weare. Because we've shown
ourselves I care about me, I'mworth it enough to tell myself
(33:51):
No. And to do the thing I needto do for me, the focus isn't on
doing what you know you shoulddo and just powering yourself
through it is a very consciousintent to know why you're doing
it in this path of what we'retalking about to self actualize.
And be happy to feel good aboutwho you are. The that's why you
(34:13):
beat yourself. And it's not forthe external rewards is not for
what you're gonna get at the endof it. When you practice self
leadership through parentingyourself.
Again, the only thing you get isyou, which is the very thing
that fills you and makes youfeel complete and whole in your
life so that you can have thatsuccess in terms of the
(34:34):
definition that I outlined inthe beginning.
There's so much wisdom in inwhat you're sharing and with the
with the parenting. I find thisso interesting because similar
to how you said these practices,this taking on of self
leadership, anyone can do it, itdoesn't cost any money. So
(34:56):
therefore it's accessible to anyhuman being
It feels like with theparenting, no matter where we
came from, or what ourupbringing was, what the
dynamics were with our parentalfigures, we get to cultivate
that, that inner familystructure or that inner culture
of self love honoring our ownboundaries, right? Because I
(35:19):
think, I think at least at leastfor me, when it comes to
burnout, a huge part of whereburnout is coming from, is me
actually steamrolling my ownboundaries, over and over to
push myself beyond the thresholdto, to skip those inner
conversations that you'redescribing, where you get to
slow down, take the sacred pauseand say, Wait a minute, you
(35:43):
know, Karen, we're gonna havethis boundary, we're gonna wait
till Friday. And so I'm hearinghow, how loving our self talk
can actually be, especially whenwe look at it through this lens
of, of being our own parent touphold those boundaries with
ourselves and to, to loveourselves into a sense of deep
(36:06):
security. There's so much innersecurity that that I'm feeling
in what in what you're saying.
And I think that gets to be thebedrock and the soil from which
this confidence then grows. Soam I getting that right? Is that
your experience of thisparenting practice? Yeah, well,
I'm glad you tied it in, in withburnout and, and what we
(36:29):
typically do and what leads toburnout is this. powering
throughbeing sped up, racing through
life, I would say I primarilywork with women. And I know you
shared your audience isprimarily women, we, we really
struggle. And in my ownexperience, as a woman working
(36:52):
with many women, and justunderstanding that we have
different issues and hang ups,as, as women than men, we really
struggled to be very sped upinternally, and racing through
life, and powering through lifeand just getting it done in, in,
in. There's a term one of myclients uses that I like like
(37:15):
grinding it out, which is thevery opposite of self leadership
and the very opposite ofparenting oneself. And it's in
that experience, what we'rereally doing and that racing
through life and being sped up,which is what leads to burnout
is we're racing through seekingthat external reward, whatever
(37:36):
it is that we're chasing,whether it's more money, whether
it's the successful business,whether it's getting the
promotion, whatever it is inlife, that's what we're chasing,
and that that seeking thatexternal value, is then what
leads to burnout. Because evenif we get that external value,
it maybe makes us feel good andaccomplished for a little bit.
(38:01):
But then it's like we're abucket with holes in it. And it
just leaks right out. And thenwe're chasing and running right
after the next thing. Andthere's no me in that
experience, and I just getemptier and emptier and emptier
and emptier, which then is whatleads to burnout. So the
experience of filling yourselfback up to where there is a You
(38:22):
and you, you do feel full withinyourself, is what we're talking
about and parenting yourself.
And self leadership, it'sactually the very thing that
then connects you to yourself,and allows you to begin to
develop self awareness, andactually then be able to be in
(38:45):
control of your emotional state.
And that is, is really theexperience and the journey of
being happy is having thatcontrol within yourself. And
getting out of this chaos anddrama that we live in when we're
racing and running and poweringthrough our life. And choosing
(39:06):
to slow down and actuallybecoming in control of our
emotional state, which is whatmakes happiness choice. I love
that I love thinking ofhappiness as a choice and the
reframe that you're helping uswith here around responsibility
and discipline, being a reallyhealthy and positive and even
(39:29):
loving thing, right like thisgets to be an act of self love
is with ourselves. It is wellyou know, we can think about
Nicole, I have a short, reallyshort little story from a client
that really helps paint thispicture.
When we think about how kidsfeel cared for in loved
(39:51):
kids feel cared for and lovedwhen parents hold boundaries,
and they hold their kidsaccountable and will actually
say no and stickTo the consequences when it when
a child acts out or doessomething they're not supposed
to. And a parent actuallyfollows through and sticks with
the known consequence for thatbehavior. Even when a child
throws a temper tantrum andrebels like I did, you actually
(40:14):
feel loved. And you actuallyfeel supported. So it's the
very, very same thing with us asadults, when we parent
ourselves. And we hold thoseboundaries for ourselves. That's
where we feel cared for andloved. And I had a client who
shared with me as I was teachingher this very concept. She was a
woman in corporate Americacompletely burnt out when she
(40:38):
came to me. And I taught herparenting herself and everything
we're talking about today. Andshe shared when we were on this
section, in my, my program, sheshared Yeah, I had a friend when
I was a teenager. And I grew upin a household where my parents
told me, No, they stuck to theboundaries, they stuck to the
consequences. But I had a friendwhose mom let her do whatever
(41:00):
she wanted. And her mom was likeher best friend, and she never
got in trouble. And I thoughtlike, that would be the best.
Like if I just had parents letme do whatever I wanted. And she
said, she remembered her friendactually telling her when they
were growing up, she rememberedher saying to her, I wish my
parents loved me enough to tellme no.
(41:24):
Wow.
That is that's profound that isabsolutely profound. And
connecting this, this sacred No,our ability to tell ourselves
No, or even to set boundariesexternally as that it almost
sounds like that's yet anotherfast track to happiness and
holding a really safe, securecontainer for ourselves. And
(41:48):
yet, I think especially forfemale entrepreneurs and
business owners, that boundarysetting piece can be so
difficult, we feel bad about it,we, we say no, and then second
guess it and want to, you know,overpower our own our own
boundaries to people, please,and get that external
(42:10):
validation. So it's, it's such avicious cycle. But I think, I
think the power of what you'resharing here is the power of
what's possible, on the otherside of learning to say, No,
doing the parenting that you'vehighlighted, a different
experience that that's possible.
And I think that in and ofitself, is is so motivating for
(42:30):
us to, to take the risk tosaying no, and then learning to
pick ourselves up. Yeah, inwhatever comes right. You
mentioned that earlier of, I getto be here for myself, no matter
what I get to be the stableparental figures essentially. So
it's Yeah, so much wisdom, inthat you really get to grow and
(42:55):
learn about yourself, you areable to see the part of you
that's really scared to say no,or see the part of you that is
for for me, and I know manypeople can relate to this, I
don't enjoy group texts. And Idon't enjoy group texting with
family, I love my family verymuch. But like the group texts
can get out of control. And isnot how I prefer to have a
(43:19):
relationship with the peoplethat I love in that I care
about. It seems very impersonal.
And it's just, it feels veryobligate story. And I'm supposed
to and so I've learned to notrespond in group texts, not from
a place of this is who I am. AndI don't like group texts and
(43:41):
being a brat about it. Butactually from a place of caring
about myself enough to be trueto who I am. And when I set the
boundaries for me, I can't tellmy family, hey, don't send me
group texts that's putting thepower and control outside of
myself and I can't change them.
But when I set that boundary bynot responding to group texts
are very seldom responding tothem. And maybe directly texting
(44:04):
the person that started it, ifit's something I want to respond
to and acknowledge. That's mebeing true to myself. And what
happens when, when I set thatboundary of who I am and this is
how I communicate and how I bestinteract. Then those people in
my life actually feel cared for.
(44:26):
Because I'm not wishy washy, andall over the place or when I say
hey, no, Friday night, I'dreally just like to unwind I'm
not going to come out fordrinks, you know, if it's a
friend or whatever, and they,they they begin to know Oh,
yeah, Karen. Karen doesn'treally like to come out on a
Friday night. She likes to be athome and spend time with her
husband and just chill. So I'msetting forth who I am and
(44:50):
showing people who I am and andhow to interact with me from a
very loving place, not from alike I give no F's
I use or I do what I want. And Idon't care what people think.
There's no self love in that.
And there's no love andrelationships from that place.
It's very intentional. It comesfrom a kind place, and it feels
vulnerable and uncomfortable.
(45:14):
But that's where you grow andlearn about yourself. And that's
where the, the self actualizingand becoming the best version of
yourself comes in. And then youactually create that trust and
love in your relationships. It'svery counterintuitive to us very
counterintuitive. It is it is,but the nuances that you're
(45:34):
describing, it's, I think thateven this example with the, with
the group text is so relatable.
Yeah, and I think sometimes whenwe, when we love ourselves
enough to set the boundary andcreate a new standard for
ourselves, whatever that versionis, for us, those around us get
to see, oh, wait a minute, I cando that, too. I don't really
(45:56):
like group texts either. Like, Ican do that. So I think
sometimes one of the most, thebest or healthiest impacts that
we can have on other people issimply by living in our own
truth and integrity. And livingas a model for that in our own
way. And being an embodiedinvitation to help remind people
(46:19):
that you get to do this too,we're not stepping on the toes
of of others by by lovingourselves, really, because
that's, that's what this is, isleading ourselves to love. And
when we don'tset those appropriate
boundaries.
(46:42):
And be true to ourselves. Sousing the group texting again,
as a, an example, when I goagainst what, what's true to me,
and like, this doesn't feel likehow I want to communicate with
people every once in a while isfine, like, but I don't want to
have this back and forthconversation on group text,
nothing personal. It's just notwho I am. It's not comfortable
(47:04):
to me.
When I go against myself inthat,
to please my family or whoeveror friends or whoever it is,
then I'm being fake, andmanipulative.
And I'm not being myself. Andthat's where it becomes a mess
later on. And people get hurtlater on. And it's
(47:27):
counterintuitive to us. But whenI'm not myself, then I'm not
being loving. And I'm not reallygenuinely showing up in my
relationships, I'm being a fakeversion of myself to get back
and return. That approval,acceptance, validation,
belonging, whatever it is. Andthat's where we just we spend
and we get caught in drama andchaos in our lives, and we can't
(47:50):
figure ourselves out. And wewonder why we're so stuck, or
why we're so burnt out. It'slike going against ourselves and
not being true to who we are.
Definitely. And I imagine we'renot finding much happiness in in
that inner misalignment. There'seither, yeah, so this, this
(48:10):
whole definition right of, ofhappiness being us being the
thing that we're chasing, Ithink is such a beautiful place
to perhaps end and I'm curious,tell us a little bit about how
you how you work with people,and where people can can find
(48:30):
you, of course, so how I workwith people
is, is very different thantraditional therapy or even
coaching. So how I work withclients is very much as a
teacher. So I have a 10 weekhappiness course, which is an
educational program, to reallyteach my clients the foundation
(48:54):
of a lot of what we've beentalking about today, and a very
simple roadmap to happiness. Andit's an experiential program. So
as opposed to being moreinformation, and intellectual, I
teach in a way that allowspeople to take these concepts
and really apply them in theirlives so that they're
(49:14):
experiencing it and recognize,you know, oh my gosh, this, this
is work and there are this isthis does work and I there is a
me, and they're having throughthe program, internal awakening,
like I did, to have that shiftfrom being externally focused to
connecting with oneself andreally learning how to build
(49:37):
internal self value, which isthat foundation of happiness. So
it's a 10 week program. It'svery much rooted and being
committed to oneself andlearning to be accountable to
oneself. So I, Ireally set that as the
foundation there's very littleone on one time with
(50:00):
We're getting into the storiesin the past in the upbringing
because none of that'snecessary. It's really us
meeting for me to make sure thatyou're holding yourself
accountable and what you'relearning, doing the homework for
yourself, and you're connectingthe dots with what you're
learning, so that my clients areempowered to realize you have
everything you already need. Youjust needed somebody with the
(50:21):
key to unlock it in you. And nowtake it and run with it. So if
that speaks to anyone listening,you can find me at my website, a
happiness course.com Learn moreabout me there and be able to
contact me there, to learn moreand potentially be on a path
that feels right to you tobuilding inner happiness.
(50:45):
Beautiful, Karen, thank you somuch for the work that you're
that you're doing in the worldand the message that you're
bringing, I have thoroughlyenjoyed getting to be in your
presence and witness all thewisdom that you're sharing. So
thank you so much for being onthe podcast. You're welcome.
Thank you very much for havingme.
(51:05):
The inner work is often thehardest work, but it is the work
required for lasting change anda healthier future for us all.
If you found the show valuableplease leave a review and
subscribe. You can also take adeeper dive with me at Nicole
belisle.com Thanks again forbeing here and showing up for
your new self. Your future selfwas certainly thank you
The way we've been doing workand leadership is deeply broken.
Whether you're healing fromburnout or just looking for a
better way to run your company,you're in the right place. What
is the future of work even looklike? That is a question we get
to answer together. Afterworking with 1000s of executives
and entrepreneurs around theworld. I know that the deepest
leadership issues are deeplyhuman. We've got to heal
(00:32):
ourselves if we want to heal theworld. Welcome to the new self
Podcast where each week, I'llhelp you explore topics that
will level up your leadershipand your life. I'm your host,
Nicole Belisle. I'm a leadershipexpert and Reiki master, and I
believe the secret to moreconscious work and leadership is
self healing, grab a seat andget cozy because we're about to
(00:53):
go on a journey.
I am joined today by a wonderfulguest, Karen Seitz. She is known
as the happiness mentor. Andtoday we're going to look at the
nuances of what happiness evenis, how do we cultivate it
within ourselves and stoplooking for it externally? Karen
(01:17):
is someone who has done a ton ofspiritual seeking, and came to
realize that the answer wasn'tanywhere out there. Outside of
herself, she came to a profoundrealization that she herself was
the problem. She was theconstant. And she took
responsibility for that Karenbelieves that happiness is a
(01:41):
choice that is accessible to allof us to make experts like Karen
who have taken the time to getinto the nitty gritty to
understand the nuance can helpus all fast track our insights,
she will be sharing insightstoday that could take years if
not a lifetime to understand.
And we get to learn that fromher. Now. Throughout the
(02:04):
episode, I invite you to tuneinto your unique definition of
these concepts. Becauseultimately, you're in the
driver's seat of your life ofyour success, and happiness. And
Karen is going to help you stayin that driver's seat. Without
further ado, let's dive into theepisode. Karen, I'm so excited
(02:25):
to share space with you and havethis conversation today. Thank
you so much for being on the newself podcast. Thank you for
having me, Nicole, it's reallynice to be here. And I look
forward to the conversationwe're gonna have. Likewise, I
know that you have been on areally incredible journey of
self seeking spiritual seeking.
(02:49):
And you're you're known as ahappiness mentor. So what what's
your story? How did you go fromkind of questioning the
definition of success to being ahappiness mentor, because that's
a really interesting title thatyou're embodying here. Well, my
journey really started very muchlike others, were in my adult
(03:13):
life, I got trapped in thepursuit of happiness. And what
happened is, I was looking topeople in things to make me
happy. And I was looking tospiritual journey to make me
happy. And all the while I waschasing and checking the boxes
(03:36):
of the things that I thoughtwould make me happy. So getting
a degree, starting a business,getting married,
becoming a yoga teacher becominga Reiki Master becoming a
meditation teacher becoming ashamanic healer, and
practitioner, starting a healingpractice all these things.
(03:58):
Under the guise of thinking, ifI do this, if I do this next
thing, then I'll finally feelcomplete, then I'll finally feel
whole, then I'll finally behappy and my life. Yet what
ended up happening was I justkept seeking, I just kept
chasing, because those thingsnever actually worked to make me
(04:20):
happy. Because one thing that weall know whether we know how to
apply it in our lives or not,but what we all know is that no
one and no thing can make youhappy that happiness is an
inside job. But I had no pathand no way to know how to
actually cultivate thathappiness within myself. And
(04:40):
everything I was doing wasn'tworking. The books I was
reading, weren't working, yogawasn't working. Reiki wasn't
working, meditation wasn'tworking. And I found myself in
my early 30s Still feeling veryinsecure. Very much in a facade
of making it look like I had itall.
together, but feeling like amess inside, and many areas of
(05:04):
my life still looks like a mess.
And I started to question like,is, is this it? Like, is this
going to be my life? Is thiswhat it's going to look like?
And feeling very much like,what's the point. And then,
very fortunately, I met mymentors, who really helped me to
(05:27):
start to build a relationshipwith myself and to teach me what
that actually looks like. Andthrough that process, I was able
to find a direct path tocultivating inner happiness,
which is how I became thehappiness mentor.
Amazing. I love what you'reilluminating here around
(05:47):
happiness being an inside job,right? Because I think that
there is such a trap in thinkingthat that comes from somewhere
outside of us. And even if wepresent as being really
successful, I know that myselfas well, in times when I on the
outside have looked like I hadit together or looked like
(06:10):
things were going really well.
There still can be that thatimposter syndrome. Within of
Wait a minute, I'm supposed tobe happy I should there's that
word should be happy with all ofthese things. So were you
experiencing this, this sameversion of of not being enough?
Or what what did that look like?
(06:33):
Inside as you were recognizing,wait a minute, I'm I'm here,
with all of these externalsuccesses, and something is
still off, drop drop us intowhat that really felt like?
Well, it really dives intounderstanding the experience of
being unhappy. And recognizingthat our very human Pursuit of
(06:59):
Happinessis a big, big red flag that we
are actually unhappy. Becausewhen we are happy,
we stopped seeking.
And the very fact that I wascontinuing to seek in almost a
desperation of finding the nextthing that I thought would make
(07:20):
me feel okay in my life was thevery trap that I was spinning
in, that kept me feeling notenough. That kept me feeling
empty on the inside, lost,confused about who I was, I
often share that I felt like alittle girl trapped inside a
(07:41):
woman's body, and needing topretend to be confident needing
to wear this mask and facade tothe outside world to make me
feel that I was okay. I lookedto people to tell me what to do
in my life, whether that wastherapists, books, healers,
friends, family, I was lookingfor all my answers outside of
(08:03):
me,which left me with the complete
inability to trust myself, orbelieve in myself to make
choices to think for myself, andto navigate my life as an adult
woman. And really feel like Iknew how to do life, and I
didn't. And that was really theinternal experience, which
(08:23):
everything I just shared, Nicoleis the internal experience of
being unhappy. And it stems fromthis place of always wanting
what we don't have thinking,once I get this, whether it's an
achievement, or an accolade, orletters behind our name, or a
degree or a marriage or kids,whatever it is, we think is
(08:47):
going to give us thatexperience or status of success.
That's in that trap of thepursuit of happiness and being
unhappy, which I define beingunhappy as always wanting what I
don't have. And when we live inthat experience. That's where we
have that internalinsight, insecurity and constant
(09:13):
doubt in ourselves that I justdescribed, which is what I was
living in constantlyon a path of seeking on a path
of trying to find happiness on apath of trying to find myself
and coming up short every singletime. Thank you so much for
illuminating that, that core orroot cause of the self doubt in
(09:35):
all of this because I thinkoften when we're feeling that
void within have to yourdefinition of being unhappy,
right, like always wanting whatwe can't have always in that
Chase. That is such a it'salmost celebrated in the
entrepreneurial world right tokeep chasing the thing, grow the
(09:55):
business, make it bigger.
or rise in the ranks, like be bethe best version of yourself all
these ideals that we that we getsold or conditioned into. And
then when we don't achieve it,there's yeah, there's just that,
that unhappiness that that canreally settle in. So, so how,
(10:17):
how did you? How did you pullyourself out of this? What what
ultimately, were some of thepractices or the mindset shifts
that that led you to start torewire a bit and find happiness?
Well, really, I had to have anawakening,
(10:39):
I really first had to,and with the help of my mentors,
because I wasso stuck in my own stories that
I, like, I would have told youwhile I was in my path, and
doing all the things I wasdoing, in my own doom version of
myself, and trying to protectmyself from being exposed from
(11:05):
what was really going on, Ireally believed that I was
happy, I really believed I hadit together, I really believed I
was on this great path formyself. But my external world
reflected something verydifferent to me. And
fortunately, meeting my mentorsis where I had the opportunity
(11:26):
to really have an innerawakening, that shifted my
perspective, in a way that wastransformational and life
changing. And they really taughtme how to be honest with myself.
Because as I was stuck in mystories, of what I thought my
life was of who I thought I was,I couldn't see clearly where I
(11:48):
was really at and what was goingon with me and my life. So the
moment of, of having thisinternal awakening, the big aha,
was really seeing that I was theproblem in my life, that
(12:08):
everything else I had been doingto try to figure myself out,
not to mention our culture, or,you know, family, friends, all
unknowingly reinforced andenabled me to put the power and
control outside of me. And tobelieve that it was my past that
it was my upbringing, that itwas my failed relationships,
(12:31):
that it was my husband, that itwas all these things outside of
me that I have no control overto change, which kept me going
around in circles. So to have amoment of awakening to recognize
and see that I was the problemin my life was a turning point
for me to actually start toconnect with myself. And, and
(12:57):
what I had to see in hindsight,was that everything else I had
been doing, thinking I wasconnecting with myself,
actually kept me disconnected.
Because in my spiritual path, Iwas always trying to become some
supreme version of myself somehigher version of me, or some
(13:22):
enlightened version of me, Ididn't want to be carrot. I want
it to be something much granderand much more than Karen. And
myself, so there was noconnection to me. It wasn't
until I could see myself as asthe problem in my life, that I
(13:44):
could actually begin to moveforward and see the choices and
decisions I was making. Thatkept me feeling really bad about
myself that kept me alwayschasing and seeking and wanting
what I didn't have beingunhappy. And that was a pivotal
moment that really allowed me todiscover there is a me in here.
(14:09):
And then that path began to leadto really building a
relationship with myself into apath of self actualizing, which
is a journey in itself, that wecan continue to grow and learn
on for our entire lives. And inorder to be on a path of self
actualizing becoming the bestversion of myself and using life
(14:34):
to grow and learn about who I amand to develop internal self
value. I had to realize how Iwas constantly looking to my
external world, to define me, togive me a sense of value and who
I am to define who I am, andrecognizing that's what cuts me
(14:57):
in that pursuit of happiness andtherefore unhappy
He is always looking to myexternal world to define who I
was to define success for me.
And to be on a path of becomingthe best version of myself not
for how it looks to anybodyelse, or for the The next award
or accomplishment orachievement. But just for me,
because of who I want to be, andthe character and integrity of
(15:22):
the kind of person, I want toknow myself as that that's a
true path of self actualizing,where it's just for me, and
through that path, I began tobuild internal self value and to
actually feel good about who Iam, which then allowed me to
develop internal happiness,which I know we'll get into and
(15:45):
okay, what is happiness?
Wow, what I'm what's reallystanding out to me in what
you're sharing is partly thatyou broke the cycle of
outsourcing your identity, yourworth your value by by going
inward and letting thatrelationship to yourself to that
(16:09):
North Star and what integrityreally looks like for you. Like
letting that be the thing thatis enough and learning to love
that self. I just think thatthat is it's so and we're not
taught that at all. So we're,we're not taught that. And if I
can add, Nicole, that we don'twant that it's much more
(16:34):
alluring, tohave the achievements in our
life to go after the externalthings that we think will make
us happy because we're we'regetting something that gives us
this temporary fulfillment orfeeling accomplished or feeling
successful. And that's whetherthat's more money, whether
(16:57):
that's a house, whether that'shaving children, whether that's
getting married, whether that'sclimbing, the corporate ladder,
whether that's having asuccessful business, those
things are all much morealluring to us, then the true
journey of happiness, andsuccess is all you get is
yourself, these things are theretoo. But they're not what you're
(17:21):
striving for, you're really juststriving for that experience of
yourself to feel good about whoyou are. And when we're unhappy.
And we don't feel good aboutourselves, and we feel insecure
and we feel not enough. It'skind of like, like get his knee.
We don't actually want ourselveswe want anything but ourselves.
(17:43):
So it's, it's a That in itselfis a challenge for us to
actually want to pursueintegrity, pursue character,
pursue being the best version ofourselves, when all we get in
the end is us. Exactly. Yeah.
Somehow it doesn't seem asglitzy or as glamorous in a way.
(18:07):
And so I can understand why yousay that, that happiness, or at
least our conventional way ofdefining it is a bit of a trap.
And so So now that you've you'verealized that you've had that
awakening, what, what is thatinternalized happiness that
you're experiencing? And walk usthrough what that what that
(18:30):
feels like and what the innerlandscape now is for you? Oh,
good. Yeah, that's a reallygreat place to go next, so that
we're laying a foundation ofreally understanding what
happiness is. Because, quitefrankly, we, we really have it
all wrong. In our society, inour culture, just even aside
(18:51):
from that, just in ourhumaneness and how we are wired.
So what we want to believehappiness is, is all of the
external achievement, it is thesuccess, it's having the money,
it's having the lifestyle, it'shaving the freedom.
It's feeling happy. That's whereI got really trapped in the
(19:14):
pursuit of happiness andespecially on my spiritual
journey, is I was chasing afeeling I was chasing like, that
blissed out feeling you mighthave after a really great yoga
class or that blissed outfeeling you might have
aftermath meditating, which Inever really achieved. I was
horrible at meditating andreally didn't enjoy it. And it
(19:37):
was always a fight and astruggle. But I know some people
have that kind of blissed out,zen experience after meditating
and that's what we want tobelieve happiness is that it's
this feeling. It's thiskind of elated state, and
experience of ourselves. It'snot that Not
(20:01):
at all. So how I definehappiness is that it's really a
state of being. And it's anexperience of yourself.
Where it's the opposite ofunhappy if unhappy, as I always
want, what I don't have,have happiness is, I only want
to be me.
(20:24):
And I only want the life I have,not because of
what I have in my life, notbecause of what I get to do, or
what I don't have in my life.
But it really is this internalexperience of no lack, and no
wantin one's life, where you have a
(20:45):
deep acceptance of who you are,and a deep acceptance of the
life that you have, even withthe challenges, even with the
shortcomings, even with theflaws. Because you're in life
for the sole purpose of growingand learning about yourself, to
understand who you are. And inthat experience, you create a
(21:08):
feeling of, of actually feelingreally good about who you are.
And having that internal selfvalue, where you know, you're
going to be okay, no matterwhat. And in the experience of
being happy, you cease to lookand seek for your meaning and
(21:31):
purpose outside of you.
And you become your own meaningand purpose, that it's not about
finding value in the people andthings in your life. In order to
be happy, you must valueyourself.
And so it's it's shifting fromthis constant seek of external
(21:54):
value in our lives, to reallydeveloping internal value. What
the natural argument that cancome up, Nicole, is, well, that
sounds really selfish and reallyself centered, because that's
all gosh, she said, It's allabout you. It's all about me.
But that's not actually whathappens when we live in a place
(22:15):
of wanting our meaning andpurpose and our value to come
from the people and things inour lives. What actually happens
in our relationships is that weneed the people in our lives to
be something for us to feelokay, and to give us that sense
of meaning and purpose. And thatactually unknowingly leads to an
experience of beingmanipulative, and controlling.
(22:39):
And then being very upset, andhurt, when somebody is not
fulfilling that role that you'vesecretly assigned to them to be
something for you. It's whenwe're complete and whole within
ourselves, and we don't needsomething or somebody to fill
that hole in us, that we canactually experience life for the
(22:59):
reality of what it is, andaccept the people in our lives
for who they are, and not needthem to be anything for us. So
when I'm striving to be the bestversion of me, by seeking my
value, and seeking my meaningand purpose in me, then that
benefits everybody. Because ifI'm being the best version of
(23:21):
me, I'm not being manipulativeand controlling, I'm actually
being accepting, empathetic,compassionate, and wanting
people to just be who they are,and using those relationships to
grow and learn about myself andbe the best that I can be in
those relationships. And thatbenefits everybody. So it's
(23:42):
actually the most, or the leastselfish path that one could take
is is developing the internalmeaning and purpose within
oneself, and valuing oneself.
It almost sounds like a bit of afast track in a way to that that
ripple effect that we can haveof of leaders in our own lives
(24:07):
because I think a lot of the alot of the behaviors or the
patterns that can be moretraumatic that you're
describing, right of beinghighly reactive, manipulating,
needing someone to be somethingfor us.
This this is so normalized. Andin our community here we talk a
lot about things like worktrauma, and breaking the pattern
(24:31):
of some of these more negativebehavioral or relational habits
by breaking the pattern withinfirst so talk to us a bit about
self leadership and because itbecause I'm really getting in
what you're saying thatthat it is a bit of a fast track
to go inward to to rewrite tochoose yourself and to have
(24:55):
enough repsHave your own integrity and have
your own self love to be able totrust yourself again, right?
Because one of my favoritedefinitions of, of trust it or
self trust, rather, is thatthat's actually what confidence
is. And and we all I think wantto, on some level, feel
(25:17):
confident in the lives thatwe're building for ourselves and
the companies that we'releading. So, so help us
understand a bit more about whatis self leadership and why why
start there? Like what, what aresome of the other benefits we
can expect from starting there?
Yeah, well, I think, if I canspeak a little bit to I love
(25:41):
what you're saying, like thissounds a bit like fast track.
And it absolutely is. Becausewhat we don't realize that we
are actually seeking when wechase external success, and we
chase the things outside of usto give us a good life or to
make us feel whole and complete,is we get so far away from
(26:07):
ourselves. And what we don'trealize we're seeking in those
things.
Is ourselves, what we've beensearching for our whole lives
that we had no idea we weresearching for, is actually
experiencing herself.
So it is a fast track toeverything that you've ever
(26:27):
wanted. Because everythingyou've ever wanted is you. And
it's not outside of you.
You live within yourself. Andthat's where I think in, in
going in the direction of reallytalking about self leadership,
this is also a really good timeto define what success is. And
then that's going to set us upto really talk about self
(26:50):
leadership. So if successisn't the awards, it's not the
accomplishments, it's not thechecking the boxes of what we
believe will be a good life.
We have to totally redefinedsuccess. So it's not the
traditional definition of whatour culture and society
(27:13):
unknowingly and I don't believe,from an ill intended place,
reinforces and enables, it'sjust our humaneness and it's
just the structure of thereality that we live in our
lives. But how I define success,which is, is going to happen in
and develop through selfleadership. Success is knowing I
(27:39):
have done my best.
And I feel good about who I am.
Success is knowing I've done mybest. And I feel good about who
I am. Not because anybody elseis telling me I've done my best,
or that I should feel good, or Ishould be proud of myself is a
(28:00):
deep knowing and experience thanmyself, that I know, I have done
my best. And I feel good aboutmyself for having done my best.
That's what successes, and ithappens through this concept of
self leadershipon the journey of self
(28:20):
actualizing. And the beauty ofusing self actualization. And
the process of self leadership,to cultivate this kind of
successis that it doesn't require a
certain amount of money. Itdoesn't require a degree. It
doesn't require letters behindyour name. It doesn't require a
(28:44):
marriage or kids or a house.
Every single human has theability to self actualize. It's
why Maslow and Maslow'shierarchy of needs, the very
pinnacle of Maslow's hierarchyis self actualization.
(29:06):
And what might be one person'sbest and best version of
themselves can look verydifferent from another person's
best version of themselves. Andit's not a hierarchy. It's not a
better than or a moreestablished path or not. I know
for me, that my purpose in mylife, what's going to allow me
(29:28):
to express myself and my fullestpotential is being a thought
leader. And that's the path andthe journey that I am on, not
for the end result of being athought leader being well known.
But to really express and pushmyself in a way that allows me
to be the best that I can be andexpress myself fully in life.
(29:52):
And so it doesn't matter whatour path is and what that looks
like to be our best version ofourselves. Anyone can do it
It doesn't require any of thetraditional definitions or
ideals that we have as a cultureor society, of what's going to
be successful. And the pathof self actualizing, of pushing
(30:13):
ourselves to our potential andbeing the best version of
ourselves solely for theexperience of knowing who we are
and feeling good aboutourselves, is what you have
asked about, which is selfleadership.
And how I talk about and how Idefine self leadership is
(30:34):
actually a termcalled parenting oneself.
Actually, being ableto get off of a track of doing
what we want, when we want.
And having clear structure inour lives, that pushes us to
(30:56):
making choices and decisionsthat are best for us and doing
what we know we need to do,even when we don't want to do
it.
And not from a place of poweringthrough, and making ourselves do
the things we know we need todo.
(31:18):
But actually, from a veryconscious, self aware place, of
parenting ourselves to do thethings we need to do
for the purposeof developing internal self
value. So an example being so Ilove food. And one of my
challenges in lifehas been being an emotional
(31:41):
eater, and stuffing my feelingsand stuffing my emotions with
food.
And when I do that, not only isthat not good for my physical
health, more importantly, whichI think my physical health is a
reflection of, it's not good formy emotional health. Because
(32:02):
when I stuff and I push down andI suppress with food, I don't
feel good about who I am notbecause of what I'm eating, but
because I'm avoiding myself, andI'm avoiding dealing with what's
being shaken up in me. So I pairmyself around food not
(32:23):
for weight, not for physicalreasons, but actually is a path
of showing myself I'm worth it.
I'm worth it on a Tuesday nightto say no to the Ben and Jerry's
in the freezer that I like toenjoy on a Friday or Saturday
night, right. And I do that notfrom a place of powering through
but actually catching myself.
(32:45):
And and we all know this. So forbeing honest, actually catching
myself and my adult tempertantrum of stomping my not
literally but internally,stomping my feet right and
laying on the floor kicking andscreaming, I'm like, No, but I
was the Ben and Jerry's did Iwant to now and catching myself
in that temper tantrum, just toactually have a conversation
(33:07):
with myself almost like youwould with a child of No, Karen.
We're not going to do thattonight. Because you know, if
you do that, you're not gonnafeel good about yourself, you're
gonna set yourself on a path ofthen making other choices
tonight, that aren't going tomake you feel good about
yourself. And then you'resetting yourself up for not a
great date tomorrow. So knowthat Ben and Jerry's has for
(33:28):
Friday, and we're leaving it in.
We're not, we're not doing that.
And when I do that, at from aplace of self leadership and
parenting myself, it starts withthe small things like that,
which is why I'm using thisexample.
We feel really good about who weare. Because we've shown
ourselves I care about me, I'mworth it enough to tell myself
(33:51):
No. And to do the thing I needto do for me, the focus isn't on
doing what you know you shoulddo and just powering yourself
through it is a very consciousintent to know why you're doing
it in this path of what we'retalking about to self actualize.
And be happy to feel good aboutwho you are. The that's why you
(34:13):
beat yourself. And it's not forthe external rewards is not for
what you're gonna get at the endof it. When you practice self
leadership through parentingyourself.
Again, the only thing you get isyou, which is the very thing
that fills you and makes youfeel complete and whole in your
life so that you can have thatsuccess in terms of the
(34:34):
definition that I outlined inthe beginning.
There's so much wisdom in inwhat you're sharing and with the
with the parenting. I find thisso interesting because similar
to how you said these practices,this taking on of self
leadership, anyone can do it, itdoesn't cost any money. So
(34:56):
therefore it's accessible to anyhuman being
It feels like with theparenting, no matter where we
came from, or what ourupbringing was, what the
dynamics were with our parentalfigures, we get to cultivate
that, that inner familystructure or that inner culture
of self love honoring our ownboundaries, right? Because I
(35:19):
think, I think at least at leastfor me, when it comes to
burnout, a huge part of whereburnout is coming from, is me
actually steamrolling my ownboundaries, over and over to
push myself beyond the thresholdto, to skip those inner
conversations that you'redescribing, where you get to
slow down, take the sacred pauseand say, Wait a minute, you
(35:43):
know, Karen, we're gonna havethis boundary, we're gonna wait
till Friday. And so I'm hearinghow, how loving our self talk
can actually be, especially whenwe look at it through this lens
of, of being our own parent touphold those boundaries with
ourselves and to, to loveourselves into a sense of deep
(36:06):
security. There's so much innersecurity that that I'm feeling
in what in what you're saying.
And I think that gets to be thebedrock and the soil from which
this confidence then grows. Soam I getting that right? Is that
your experience of thisparenting practice? Yeah, well,
I'm glad you tied it in, in withburnout and, and what we
(36:29):
typically do and what leads toburnout is this. powering
throughbeing sped up, racing through
life, I would say I primarilywork with women. And I know you
shared your audience isprimarily women, we, we really
struggle. And in my ownexperience, as a woman working
(36:52):
with many women, and justunderstanding that we have
different issues and hang ups,as, as women than men, we really
struggled to be very sped upinternally, and racing through
life, and powering through lifeand just getting it done in, in,
in. There's a term one of myclients uses that I like like
(37:15):
grinding it out, which is thevery opposite of self leadership
and the very opposite ofparenting oneself. And it's in
that experience, what we'rereally doing and that racing
through life and being sped up,which is what leads to burnout
is we're racing through seekingthat external reward, whatever
(37:36):
it is that we're chasing,whether it's more money, whether
it's the successful business,whether it's getting the
promotion, whatever it is inlife, that's what we're chasing,
and that that seeking thatexternal value, is then what
leads to burnout. Because evenif we get that external value,
it maybe makes us feel good andaccomplished for a little bit.
(38:01):
But then it's like we're abucket with holes in it. And it
just leaks right out. And thenwe're chasing and running right
after the next thing. Andthere's no me in that
experience, and I just getemptier and emptier and emptier
and emptier, which then is whatleads to burnout. So the
experience of filling yourselfback up to where there is a You
(38:22):
and you, you do feel full withinyourself, is what we're talking
about and parenting yourself.
And self leadership, it'sactually the very thing that
then connects you to yourself,and allows you to begin to
develop self awareness, andactually then be able to be in
(38:45):
control of your emotional state.
And that is, is really theexperience and the journey of
being happy is having thatcontrol within yourself. And
getting out of this chaos anddrama that we live in when we're
racing and running and poweringthrough our life. And choosing
(39:06):
to slow down and actuallybecoming in control of our
emotional state, which is whatmakes happiness choice. I love
that I love thinking ofhappiness as a choice and the
reframe that you're helping uswith here around responsibility
and discipline, being a reallyhealthy and positive and even
(39:29):
loving thing, right like thisgets to be an act of self love
is with ourselves. It is wellyou know, we can think about
Nicole, I have a short, reallyshort little story from a client
that really helps paint thispicture.
When we think about how kidsfeel cared for in loved
(39:51):
kids feel cared for and lovedwhen parents hold boundaries,
and they hold their kidsaccountable and will actually
say no and stickTo the consequences when it when
a child acts out or doessomething they're not supposed
to. And a parent actuallyfollows through and sticks with
the known consequence for thatbehavior. Even when a child
throws a temper tantrum andrebels like I did, you actually
(40:14):
feel loved. And you actuallyfeel supported. So it's the
very, very same thing with us asadults, when we parent
ourselves. And we hold thoseboundaries for ourselves. That's
where we feel cared for andloved. And I had a client who
shared with me as I was teachingher this very concept. She was a
woman in corporate Americacompletely burnt out when she
(40:38):
came to me. And I taught herparenting herself and everything
we're talking about today. Andshe shared when we were on this
section, in my, my program, sheshared Yeah, I had a friend when
I was a teenager. And I grew upin a household where my parents
told me, No, they stuck to theboundaries, they stuck to the
consequences. But I had a friendwhose mom let her do whatever
(41:00):
she wanted. And her mom was likeher best friend, and she never
got in trouble. And I thoughtlike, that would be the best.
Like if I just had parents letme do whatever I wanted. And she
said, she remembered her friendactually telling her when they
were growing up, she rememberedher saying to her, I wish my
parents loved me enough to tellme no.
(41:24):
Wow.
That is that's profound that isabsolutely profound. And
connecting this, this sacred No,our ability to tell ourselves
No, or even to set boundariesexternally as that it almost
sounds like that's yet anotherfast track to happiness and
holding a really safe, securecontainer for ourselves. And
(41:48):
yet, I think especially forfemale entrepreneurs and
business owners, that boundarysetting piece can be so
difficult, we feel bad about it,we, we say no, and then second
guess it and want to, you know,overpower our own our own
boundaries to people, please,and get that external
(42:10):
validation. So it's, it's such avicious cycle. But I think, I
think the power of what you'resharing here is the power of
what's possible, on the otherside of learning to say, No,
doing the parenting that you'vehighlighted, a different
experience that that's possible.
And I think that in and ofitself, is is so motivating for
(42:30):
us to, to take the risk tosaying no, and then learning to
pick ourselves up. Yeah, inwhatever comes right. You
mentioned that earlier of, I getto be here for myself, no matter
what I get to be the stableparental figures essentially. So
it's Yeah, so much wisdom, inthat you really get to grow and
(42:55):
learn about yourself, you areable to see the part of you
that's really scared to say no,or see the part of you that is
for for me, and I know manypeople can relate to this, I
don't enjoy group texts. And Idon't enjoy group texting with
family, I love my family verymuch. But like the group texts
can get out of control. And isnot how I prefer to have a
(43:19):
relationship with the peoplethat I love in that I care
about. It seems very impersonal.
And it's just, it feels veryobligate story. And I'm supposed
to and so I've learned to notrespond in group texts, not from
a place of this is who I am. AndI don't like group texts and
(43:41):
being a brat about it. Butactually from a place of caring
about myself enough to be trueto who I am. And when I set the
boundaries for me, I can't tellmy family, hey, don't send me
group texts that's putting thepower and control outside of
myself and I can't change them.
But when I set that boundary bynot responding to group texts
are very seldom responding tothem. And maybe directly texting
(44:04):
the person that started it, ifit's something I want to respond
to and acknowledge. That's mebeing true to myself. And what
happens when, when I set thatboundary of who I am and this is
how I communicate and how I bestinteract. Then those people in
my life actually feel cared for.
(44:26):
Because I'm not wishy washy, andall over the place or when I say
hey, no, Friday night, I'dreally just like to unwind I'm
not going to come out fordrinks, you know, if it's a
friend or whatever, and they,they they begin to know Oh,
yeah, Karen. Karen doesn'treally like to come out on a
Friday night. She likes to be athome and spend time with her
husband and just chill. So I'msetting forth who I am and
(44:50):
showing people who I am and andhow to interact with me from a
very loving place, not from alike I give no F's
I use or I do what I want. And Idon't care what people think.
There's no self love in that.
And there's no love andrelationships from that place.
It's very intentional. It comesfrom a kind place, and it feels
vulnerable and uncomfortable.
(45:14):
But that's where you grow andlearn about yourself. And that's
where the, the self actualizingand becoming the best version of
yourself comes in. And then youactually create that trust and
love in your relationships. It'svery counterintuitive to us very
counterintuitive. It is it is,but the nuances that you're
(45:34):
describing, it's, I think thateven this example with the, with
the group text is so relatable.
Yeah, and I think sometimes whenwe, when we love ourselves
enough to set the boundary andcreate a new standard for
ourselves, whatever that versionis, for us, those around us get
to see, oh, wait a minute, I cando that, too. I don't really
(45:56):
like group texts either. Like, Ican do that. So I think
sometimes one of the most, thebest or healthiest impacts that
we can have on other people issimply by living in our own
truth and integrity. And livingas a model for that in our own
way. And being an embodiedinvitation to help remind people
(46:19):
that you get to do this too,we're not stepping on the toes
of of others by by lovingourselves, really, because
that's, that's what this is, isleading ourselves to love. And
when we don'tset those appropriate
boundaries.
(46:42):
And be true to ourselves. Sousing the group texting again,
as a, an example, when I goagainst what, what's true to me,
and like, this doesn't feel likehow I want to communicate with
people every once in a while isfine, like, but I don't want to
have this back and forthconversation on group text,
nothing personal. It's just notwho I am. It's not comfortable
(47:04):
to me.
When I go against myself inthat,
to please my family or whoeveror friends or whoever it is,
then I'm being fake, andmanipulative.
And I'm not being myself. Andthat's where it becomes a mess
later on. And people get hurtlater on. And it's
(47:27):
counterintuitive to us. But whenI'm not myself, then I'm not
being loving. And I'm not reallygenuinely showing up in my
relationships, I'm being a fakeversion of myself to get back
and return. That approval,acceptance, validation,
belonging, whatever it is. Andthat's where we just we spend
and we get caught in drama andchaos in our lives, and we can't
(47:50):
figure ourselves out. And wewonder why we're so stuck, or
why we're so burnt out. It'slike going against ourselves and
not being true to who we are.
Definitely. And I imagine we'renot finding much happiness in in
that inner misalignment. There'seither, yeah, so this, this
(48:10):
whole definition right of, ofhappiness being us being the
thing that we're chasing, Ithink is such a beautiful place
to perhaps end and I'm curious,tell us a little bit about how
you how you work with people,and where people can can find
(48:30):
you, of course, so how I workwith people
is, is very different thantraditional therapy or even
coaching. So how I work withclients is very much as a
teacher. So I have a 10 weekhappiness course, which is an
educational program, to reallyteach my clients the foundation
(48:54):
of a lot of what we've beentalking about today, and a very
simple roadmap to happiness. Andit's an experiential program. So
as opposed to being moreinformation, and intellectual, I
teach in a way that allowspeople to take these concepts
and really apply them in theirlives so that they're
(49:14):
experiencing it and recognize,you know, oh my gosh, this, this
is work and there are this isthis does work and I there is a
me, and they're having throughthe program, internal awakening,
like I did, to have that shiftfrom being externally focused to
connecting with oneself andreally learning how to build
(49:37):
internal self value, which isthat foundation of happiness. So
it's a 10 week program. It'svery much rooted and being
committed to oneself andlearning to be accountable to
oneself. So I, Ireally set that as the
foundation there's very littleone on one time with
(50:00):
We're getting into the storiesin the past in the upbringing
because none of that'snecessary. It's really us
meeting for me to make sure thatyou're holding yourself
accountable and what you'relearning, doing the homework for
yourself, and you're connectingthe dots with what you're
learning, so that my clients areempowered to realize you have
everything you already need. Youjust needed somebody with the
(50:21):
key to unlock it in you. And nowtake it and run with it. So if
that speaks to anyone listening,you can find me at my website, a
happiness course.com Learn moreabout me there and be able to
contact me there, to learn moreand potentially be on a path
that feels right to you tobuilding inner happiness.
(50:45):
Beautiful, Karen, thank you somuch for the work that you're
that you're doing in the worldand the message that you're
bringing, I have thoroughlyenjoyed getting to be in your
presence and witness all thewisdom that you're sharing. So
thank you so much for being onthe podcast. You're welcome.
Thank you very much for havingme.
(51:05):
The inner work is often thehardest work, but it is the work
required for lasting change anda healthier future for us all.
If you found the show valuableplease leave a review and
subscribe. You can also take adeeper dive with me at Nicole
belisle.com Thanks again forbeing here and showing up for
your new self. Your future selfwas certainly thank you
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