April 23, 2025 • 25 mins
What happens when you've checked all the boxes of success but still feel something's missing? James Walters, photographer, author, and host of "A Joyful Rebellion" podcast, joins us to explore the transformative power of creative risk-taking and authentic living.
James shares his fascinating journey from commercial photographer (who initially used photography to escape math class) to wedding photographer capturing unpredictable moments, to helping others tell their brand stories. This evolution mirrors his philosophy on life—embracing change and finding fulfillment through creative expression and self-awareness.
At the heart of our conversation is the concept of a "joyful rebellion," that pivotal moment when you realize external success markers aren't bringing internal fulfillment. James explains how many people diligently follow others' scripts—parents, teachers, society—only to discover they're not living their own story. The rebellion comes in reclaiming authorship of your life, sometimes through small adjustments and other times through complete reinvention.
Perhaps most surprising is James's counterintuitive approach to creativity: making certain aspects of life intentionally "boring." By streamlining decisions about wardrobe, food, or other personally low-priority areas, we free mental energy for pursuits that genuinely matter. As James puts it, "Look for something in your life that you can make boring, repetitive, a no-brainer, and that leaves so much more space to put your energy into being creative."
James also discusses his books—from "Accessory to Marriage" chronicling outrageous wedding photography stories to "Meditations of the Mundane," where he photographs and creates stories about everyday discarded objects. His current project aims to help children develop storytelling skills through photography.
Listen now to discover why awareness is the essential first step to meaningful change and embrace James's powerful mantra: "Nothing changes if nothing changes." Your own joyful rebellion might be closer than you think.
Want to be a guest on Living the Dream with Curveball? Send Curtis Jackson a message on PodMatch, here: https://www.podmatch.com/hostdetailpreview/1628631536976x919760049303001600
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Living the Dream Podcast with
Curveball, if you believe youcan achieve.
Welcome to the Living the Dreamwith Curveball Podcast, a show
where I interview guests thatteach, motivate and inspire.
(00:24):
Where I interview guests thatteach, motivate and inspire.
Today, I am joined by authorpodcast host James Walters.
James hosts a show called AJoyful Rebellion.
He is an author.
As I said, he is a dad, he isthe creative director of a
(00:44):
photography company and his goalis to help people live their
best lives by taking creativerisks and sharing their stories
with others.
So we're going to be talking toJames about everything that
he's up to his show and anythingelse he wants to talk about.
So, james, thank you so muchfor joining me.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Curtis, thank you for having me.
This is going to be fun today.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Absolutely.
Why don't you start off bytelling the listeners a little
bit about yourself?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, well, when I was growing up, I loved to
create little worlds, thingsthat didn't exist, that I could
see.
And when I got into high schoolI realized I could really do
that through photography and Ibecame fascinated with it and,
truth be told, it was also agreat way to get out of math
(01:29):
class because I could switch ascience for, which was
photography for math.
A little fun fact.
I don't think you can do thatanymore, but ended up going to
college for it.
I came out, did commercialphotography for several years
and I love that because it waslike creating little worlds
within reality and did a lot ofcommercial advertising stuff
(01:53):
like that.
And then I got bored with thatso I wanted to start working
with people more.
I wanted to start working withless predictable situations.
So I got into the world ofphotographing weddings, where
you have to be creative on aspur of the moment and anything
could happen.
So that was a lot of fun.
And then, of course, kind oftransitioned out of that and now
(02:16):
I do a lot of branding.
I work with creative people,entrepreneurs, to help them tell
the story of what they're allabout, tell the story of their
brand if they're selling aservice, an idea, whatever it
might be.
But that got me thinking a lotabout creativity, because the
people I work with are socreative and they are having a
(02:38):
good time being creative.
And then, on the other hand, Italked to other folks who were
like, man, I wish I could becreative like that.
I'm thinking, yeah, you couldif you put some priority on it.
And that got me really wantingto get that message out there,
that creativity is not really anoption.
(03:00):
It's essential for a reallyfulfilling life, which is why I
started the podcast A JoyfulRebellion a couple of years ago.
And so every week I talk topeople now who have been through
their own joyful rebellion.
And that's a time in your lifewhere you've checked off all the
boxes of what you thoughtsuccess would be, but you're
(03:20):
just not feeling it Right.
And then you're thinking, ok,so what do I do now to get that
fulfillment?
And I talk to people everysingle week who have done it and
now they help other people doit much in the way that you're
helping people with this podcast, Right?
So that's kind of brings us allthe way from where this began
(03:41):
to where it's going right now.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Well, what does it truly mean to lead a joyful
rebellion?
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah, when it comes to the joyful rebellion part,
there's always this impetus,this realization that everything
you were told when you weregrowing up, everything you were
told when you were in school, itkind of got you where you are.
And sometimes you look aroundand externally you say, okay,
(04:14):
I've got the family.
My parents said that would becool, I've got the degree.
My teachers in high school saidthat would be useful and I got
the job.
My professors in college saidthat that's what I needed to be
successful and support thefamily and do all of those
things.
But sometimes you look aroundand a lot of people I talk to
(04:37):
have looked around andexternally they've got all those
things, they've got all thatsuccess.
Internally they've got allthose things, they've got all
that success.
And internally they feel likeman, there's got to be more.
I mean I'm happy but I'm notfulfilled.
(04:57):
And that's when the joyfulrebellion part comes in, because
a lot of times to get to whereyou want to be, you've got to
rebel against all of thosethings people told you along the
way.
In some sometimes it's smallways, you know you've got to go
against your family programming.
Sometimes it is in bigger ways,like I've had guests on who
realized that they weren't withthe right partner or they were
(05:17):
not even remotely in the rightindustry and just kind of burned
down their career and theirlife.
And now they're sailing halfwayaround the world on a boat for
the last several years andthey're loving it.
So that's the joyful rebellionpart.
It's got to be joyful, though,because if you're going to have
a fulfilling life, it's notsomething that should seem like.
(05:38):
I mean, it's going to take alot of effort in cases, but it
should bring you joy.
It shouldn't be something thatseems like a chore.
You should be going towardssomething that you really want
to do, and sometimes it takespeople half a lifetime to figure
that out.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Well, you also talk about how being boring in some
ways is crucial to creativity.
Explain that one to thelisteners.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
And in some ways it's crucial to creativity Explain
that one to the listeners.
We all have things that areimportant to us and we all have
things that, eh, we they'renecessary, super necessary, but
also we don't really care howthey get done, which is why I
came up with this thought in mylife, uh, for myself, about,
(06:38):
okay, what are the things Idon't really care about too much
me personally, and it onlyreally affects me, and I started
streamlining those to the pointwhere they were just boring.
So, for example, for me, Ipretty much wear the same
t-shirt jeans combo every day,and that's not a new thing.
(07:00):
People have heard of that.
Some CEOs do it and it's one ofthose.
Okay, take away the decisionfatigue.
And so I've heard that a littlebit on the podcast uh, other
podcasts I've been on and andI'm like, yeah, okay, that's
where it starts.
Is you being boring, in acertain way, being predictable?
But once you get going on that,it, the decision fatigue, is
(07:25):
the first thing that goes awayin that part of your life.
But the next thing that happensis the confidence and the not
only in yourself because you've,you've got this one decision
handled, but it's the confidencein the people around you
knowing, okay, this person'sgoing to show up in this way
pretty darn consistently, andother things in their life may
be a little unpredictable.
(07:45):
But you know person's going toshow up in this way pretty darn
consistently, and other thingsin their life may be a little
unpredictable, but they're goingto show up in the same, pretty
much in the same outfit and theycan joke about it whatever they
want to do, but that gives themconfidence too and that gives
them trust in you.
Same thing can go for food.
That's true for me.
I eat about the same five basicthings to try to make sure
they're healthy.
I eat about the same, you know,five basic things to try to
make sure they're healthy.
And outside of that, I feellike I've got my food situation
(08:09):
locked down and again I don'thave to think about it too much,
I don't have to write out anelaborate grocery list and meal
prep and all those things,because I've got that handled.
And again, that's just anotherthing that's boring in my life.
So I can go in a thousanddifferent directions in the
things that do really interestme.
(08:30):
So I always tell people this isvery personalized.
If you are a fashionista, donot try to make your wardrobe
boring because that's not goingto feel great.
That's not going to feel greatIf you are foodie.
What you eat is not the placeto make it boring, but maybe you
don't care about your clothesso much.
(08:51):
So look for something in yourlife that you can make boring,
you can make repetitive, you canmake it no brainer, and that
leaves so much more space to putyour energy into being creative
, if that's what you want to doenergy into being creative.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
if that's what you want to do, Well, talk about the
most important lesson that youhave learned after interviewing
over a hundred people on yourshow about their joy for
rebellion.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Yeah, that's the most fun thing because I didn't
expect it and it makes so muchsense, like everything does in
hindsight.
Right, it comes down toawareness and that sounds so
simple, but I mean, you wouldnot believe how many people are
walking around you and maybe youwill, but if you're listening,
(09:37):
like there are things thatyou're just not aware of right
now.
There are things that I'mtrying to heighten my awareness
through this experience oftalking to lots and lots of
people about awareness, butthere are things that I'm still
not aware of.
It's unfolding all the time andit's a self-discovery.
But the one thing that so manyof my guests on the podcast have
(10:01):
in common is they've gonethrough their joyful rebellion,
but none of that could happenuntil they became aware that all
of the things that they thoughtwere the answer in their life,
they thought were going to makethem happy, bring them joy they
started to realize that, no,this is not the thing, and it
(10:24):
some of them took years torealize that.
Some of them, it took a tragedy, some of them it took a health
scare to realize that theyneeded to start making their
future very different from whattheir present and what their
past was, and it came throughthat awareness.
And everybody comes toawareness a little bit
(10:46):
differently.
Some is gentle and they read abook and they're like, oh, I'm
aware that I do this certainthing, I should probably do
something different, but forsome people they need it.
You know a literal car crash.
I've had a couple of thoseguests on a health scare,
(11:07):
whatever it might be that reallygets them to confront their
mortality.
Sometimes it takes somethingthat big to come to an awareness
about their own life.
So if there's anything I'velearned, it's awareness is
everything.
(11:34):
Well, you know, you talk a lotin your bio about how people
should be the author of theirown story.
Explain to the listeners whatyou mean by that formative years
.
We're getting a lot of inputfrom other people, people who
care about us, people who wantto see us do well, right.
But they're coming from theirown perspective and their
(11:56):
perspective is limited to whatthey've had happen in their life
, their experiences, theirperceptions of those experience,
their upbringing right.
So a lot of times it's ageneration or more removed.
And so if you're being raisedby your grandparents, I hung out
with my grandparents a lot, butI was getting two generations
(12:18):
like removed information and solike what it was like when they
were growing up, which is verydifferent from what it was like
when I grew up and it's gonna bethe same thing for my kids, my,
my kids children.
So I guess, when it comes towriting your own story,
sometimes you have thoseinfluences and they're really
(12:42):
positive and they do mean well.
But sometimes people just clickthe easy button and they're like
, okay, cool.
Dad said I should be a dentistbecause they do pretty good, so
I'm gonna go ahead and go todental school.
I don't know if I'm gonna likeit or not, I'm gonna come out
with a ton of debt and uh, butbut I'll have that degree, I'll
be a dentist and man, I hope Ilike it, and so that I've heard
(13:06):
that story so many times andthat's an example of when
someone's really not holding thepen when they are writing the
story of their own life.
Now I'm all for and I tell mykids all the time I'm like try a
million different things, seewhat you like and then just get
rid of the stuff you don't.
(13:28):
But it's important to at leasthave those experiences so that
you can go about the directionyou want without having to worry
about anyone else's input.
It's always good to listen toother people's input, but don't
feel like they should be writingthe words for you in the story
(13:49):
of your life.
So that's what I mean by beingthe author of your own story,
because a lot of people also,you know, before their joyful
rebellion they realize, oh mygosh, I've been playing out,
I've been acting along on thisscript that someone else wrote,
whether it was their family orwhether it was their boss or
(14:09):
whatever it was.
They realized I'm not living myown life and that's also part
of the joyful rebellion isstarting to.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
So tell us about any upcoming projects that you're
working on.
Well, I guess, before we dothat, tell the listeners about
your books.
Tell us where we can get themfrom and what we can expect when
we read them.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah, well, I've got two and they're wildly different
.
The first one is more like amemoir.
I wrote it about a decade ago,but when I got out of
advertising photography I neededa different challenge and I
described it a little bit before.
I used to go into a studioevery day.
(14:52):
I would work with advertisingclients.
It was great, reallychallenging creatively, but it
was the same place every day andI was in total control of
everything that happened infront of the camera.
And that's fun for about adozen years or so.
But it started to, you know,itch at me that, hey, there
(15:13):
could be something else outthere and so, luckily, within
photography, there are a hundreddifferent careers you can have.
So I switch from advertisingphotography into wedding
photography, which when I was incollege, I said I would never
do in a million years.
When I was in college, I said Iwould never do in a million
years.
When I was in college, weddingphotography did not seem
interesting or fun at all.
But 10 years later it did seeminteresting because it presented
(15:37):
a new challenge.
It was people who may or maynot show up on time.
It was situations andenvironments that might not be
optimal for good photographs,like the weather, for example,
or maybe there's constructionwhere we thought we were going
to be photographing and we haveto figure out plan B, and that
(15:58):
kept me on my toes.
But also working with peoplekeeps you on your toes because I
was no longer working withprofessional models, I was
working with just everydaypeople and I had to bring the
energy to get them to feelcomfortable and look great.
So it was a whole new challengeand that got me into wedding
(16:20):
photography and that.
Coming back to the book about it, though, every time I told
someone, you know you meetpeople for the first time and
they say, oh, what do you do?
And I said, well, I'm aphotographer Never said weddings
, but they assumed, oh, you meanlike weddings.
And I said, yeah, like weddings.
And they say, oh my gosh, thefirst thing they said was you
(16:41):
must see some insane stuffbehind the scenes at weddings.
And this was early 2000, mid2000s at this point, and I'm
like, yeah, I do actually, if Ithink about it, and I got enough
of those questions and commentsthat I started writing things
down as they happen and beforelong, like seven years in, I had
(17:04):
a book worth of information, sothat one's called accessory to
marriage.
That's the first book and it'sjust the subtitle is chronicles
of outrageousness from my lifeas a wedding photographer and
it's a fun little trip downmemory lane.
A lot of short stories andthey're easy to digest and
(17:25):
hilarious.
From what I'm told it's that'snot my assessment, but people
tell me that.
But my most recent project, 10years after the first book, just
came out in the fall of lastyear and it has been a blast.
But it's a coffee table book.
It's my very first book thathas photos in it, believe it or
(17:47):
not, and they're all black andwhite.
And I got to reflecting on mytime as a commercial
photographer and in that fieldwe tend to objectify people a
lot, and not in a bad way, butin the way like, let's say, I
(18:09):
was working for a company thatmade jeans and they want to show
off their jeans and get peopleto buy them.
Well, it's much more appealingif you can show a model wearing
those jeans because people cannow see how they fit.
You sort of see the curves, allthat, that kind of stuff.
It's more relatable if a personis wearing jeans than if
(18:31):
they're just laying there on theground.
So we would hire a model, andwe didn't care what the model's
name was, we didn't care.
You know how they were doingthat day.
I mean, we, we had all of thosethings behind the scenes in the
studio, but as far as theperson who ended up in that
photo, they were really just thething that was holding the
(18:52):
jeans on in the photo, and sothey were kind of objectified in
that way and I thought, wellgosh, what would happen If I
took everyday objects and Ipersonified them?
So instead of objectifyingpeople, I'm personifying objects
, and I love to walk aroundplaces.
(19:14):
I walk a lot, I love historiccities and I just started
noticing there were things thatI would pass, that everybody
else would pass too.
The first thing I ever saw was ahair tie, and, just like one of
those ponytail holders rightthat women lose all the time,
it's either on the wrist or intheir hair or it's on the ground
, and I saw one and had a littledirt around it.
(19:34):
I could tell it'd been therefor a few weeks maybe, and I
just got to thinking, wow,what's the story behind this?
How did it get here?
Who used to have it?
Does this little hair tie missthe person that discarded it or
lost it or whatever the case was.
So I started photographingthings like that, things that
were mundane, and the book'scalled Meditations of the
(19:56):
Mundane and it was a blast.
I went to so many differentcities and just photographed
things that people walk by everyday, made up really fun stories
about them.
Things that people walk byevery day, made up really fun
stories about them, and both ofthose books can be found at my
website, jameswalterscom.
Pretty straightforward there.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Okay, tell us about any upcoming projects that
you're working on that listenersneed to be aware of.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Yeah, I've got one.
I'm actually working with agroup of students.
I've never done this before, butI'm hosting a summer camp
through an Arts Center that'shere in my home state in North
Carolina and working with thempretty closely.
I'm going to be doing a week inJune and it's all about
photography and storytelling andin conjunction with that I'm
(20:46):
creating a book.
It's's called the Little Bookof Special Powers and it's going
to be for kids that are between9 and 14.
So it's going to be aimed atthat age range, but it's all
about exercises and things thatthey can do to further explore
their storytelling abilities,and through words, like the
(21:09):
written word, but also throughphotography and cameras are
everywhere Now they're in ourpocket even as young as nine
years old and 14.
So want to get those kids whoare involved with it, or
eventually get the book, to beable to communicate.
I mean, storytelling reallycomes down to communication
(21:31):
right, and people love stories,and so if they have that ability
to craft a story and getsomeone interested, they're
going to have some specialpowers that other people their
age won't have.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
Okay, well, you answered my next question your
website, jameswalterscom.
So close us out with some finalthoughts.
Maybe, if that was something Iforgot to talk about, that you
would like to touch on, or anyfinal thoughts you have for the
listeners.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Yeah, very much.
You know, someone asked me on apodcast last year.
They said hey, if you weregoing to write a billboard, you
know it's got to be short andit's got to be immediately
readable, but it's got to have agood message behind it.
What would that billboard say?
And for me, that billboardwould say nothing changes if
(22:23):
nothing changes.
And that seems a little weird ofa thing to say, but it's
something that through my work,through my life, through meeting
a lot of other people on mypodcast, tends to be true is, if
you don't like what yourcurrent situation is, you you
(22:46):
want to really look around andsee what little things you can
change.
And sometimes it starts outsmall and it grows a little
bigger as you get moreconfidence, as you get a little
more courage.
Taking action gives you thatconfidence and before you know
it, your whole life could bedifferent.
If you want it to be, just bymaking changes.
(23:06):
But if you want it to stayexactly the same, just make sure
you don't make any changes andlife will kind of happen around
you.
But that's what I would leaveeveryone with is is, if there's
anything you want to bedifferent, just remember nothing
changes if nothing changesthat's the perfect message.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
Ladies and gentlemen, james JamesWalterscom, please
be sure to follow rate, review.
Share this episode to as manypeople as possible.
Jump on your favorite podcastapp.
Follow us.
Leave us a review.
Check out the show.
For more information on theLiving the Dream with Curveball
podcast, go towwwcurveball337.com.
(23:50):
Thank you for listening andsupporting the show, james.
Thank you for all that you'redoing to make the world a better
place and thank you for joiningme.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Thank you, curtis, it was a blast.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
For more information on the Living the Dream with
Curveball podcast, visitwwwcurveball337.com.
Until next time, keep livingthe dream.
Welcome to the Living the Dream Podcast with
Curveball, if you believe youcan achieve.
Welcome to the Living the Dreamwith Curveball Podcast, a show
where I interview guests thatteach, motivate and inspire.
(00:24):
Where I interview guests thatteach, motivate and inspire.
Today, I am joined by authorpodcast host James Walters.
James hosts a show called AJoyful Rebellion.
He is an author.
As I said, he is a dad, he isthe creative director of a
(00:44):
photography company and his goalis to help people live their
best lives by taking creativerisks and sharing their stories
with others.
So we're going to be talking toJames about everything that
he's up to his show and anythingelse he wants to talk about.
So, james, thank you so muchfor joining me.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Curtis, thank you for having me.
This is going to be fun today.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Absolutely.
Why don't you start off bytelling the listeners a little
bit about yourself?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, well, when I was growing up, I loved to
create little worlds, thingsthat didn't exist, that I could
see.
And when I got into high schoolI realized I could really do
that through photography and Ibecame fascinated with it and,
truth be told, it was also agreat way to get out of math
(01:29):
class because I could switch ascience for, which was
photography for math.
A little fun fact.
I don't think you can do thatanymore, but ended up going to
college for it.
I came out, did commercialphotography for several years
and I love that because it waslike creating little worlds
within reality and did a lot ofcommercial advertising stuff
(01:53):
like that.
And then I got bored with thatso I wanted to start working
with people more.
I wanted to start working withless predictable situations.
So I got into the world ofphotographing weddings, where
you have to be creative on aspur of the moment and anything
could happen.
So that was a lot of fun.
And then, of course, kind oftransitioned out of that and now
(02:16):
I do a lot of branding.
I work with creative people,entrepreneurs, to help them tell
the story of what they're allabout, tell the story of their
brand if they're selling aservice, an idea, whatever it
might be.
But that got me thinking a lotabout creativity, because the
people I work with are socreative and they are having a
(02:38):
good time being creative.
And then, on the other hand, Italked to other folks who were
like, man, I wish I could becreative like that.
I'm thinking, yeah, you couldif you put some priority on it.
And that got me really wantingto get that message out there,
that creativity is not really anoption.
(03:00):
It's essential for a reallyfulfilling life, which is why I
started the podcast A JoyfulRebellion a couple of years ago.
And so every week I talk topeople now who have been through
their own joyful rebellion.
And that's a time in your lifewhere you've checked off all the
boxes of what you thoughtsuccess would be, but you're
(03:20):
just not feeling it Right.
And then you're thinking, ok,so what do I do now to get that
fulfillment?
And I talk to people everysingle week who have done it and
now they help other people doit much in the way that you're
helping people with this podcast, Right?
So that's kind of brings us allthe way from where this began
(03:41):
to where it's going right now.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Well, what does it truly mean to lead a joyful
rebellion?
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah, when it comes to the joyful rebellion part,
there's always this impetus,this realization that everything
you were told when you weregrowing up, everything you were
told when you were in school, itkind of got you where you are.
And sometimes you look aroundand externally you say, okay,
(04:14):
I've got the family.
My parents said that would becool, I've got the degree.
My teachers in high school saidthat would be useful and I got
the job.
My professors in college saidthat that's what I needed to be
successful and support thefamily and do all of those
things.
But sometimes you look aroundand a lot of people I talk to
(04:37):
have looked around andexternally they've got all those
things, they've got all thatsuccess.
Internally they've got allthose things, they've got all
that success.
And internally they feel likeman, there's got to be more.
I mean I'm happy but I'm notfulfilled.
(04:57):
And that's when the joyfulrebellion part comes in, because
a lot of times to get to whereyou want to be, you've got to
rebel against all of thosethings people told you along the
way.
In some sometimes it's smallways, you know you've got to go
against your family programming.
Sometimes it is in bigger ways,like I've had guests on who
realized that they weren't withthe right partner or they were
(05:17):
not even remotely in the rightindustry and just kind of burned
down their career and theirlife.
And now they're sailing halfwayaround the world on a boat for
the last several years andthey're loving it.
So that's the joyful rebellionpart.
It's got to be joyful, though,because if you're going to have
a fulfilling life, it's notsomething that should seem like.
(05:38):
I mean, it's going to take alot of effort in cases, but it
should bring you joy.
It shouldn't be something thatseems like a chore.
You should be going towardssomething that you really want
to do, and sometimes it takespeople half a lifetime to figure
that out.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Well, you also talk about how being boring in some
ways is crucial to creativity.
Explain that one to thelisteners.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
And in some ways it's crucial to creativity Explain
that one to the listeners.
We all have things that areimportant to us and we all have
things that, eh, we they'renecessary, super necessary, but
also we don't really care howthey get done, which is why I
came up with this thought in mylife, uh, for myself, about,
(06:38):
okay, what are the things Idon't really care about too much
me personally, and it onlyreally affects me, and I started
streamlining those to the pointwhere they were just boring.
So, for example, for me, Ipretty much wear the same
t-shirt jeans combo every day,and that's not a new thing.
(07:00):
People have heard of that.
Some CEOs do it and it's one ofthose.
Okay, take away the decisionfatigue.
And so I've heard that a littlebit on the podcast uh, other
podcasts I've been on and andI'm like, yeah, okay, that's
where it starts.
Is you being boring, in acertain way, being predictable?
But once you get going on that,it, the decision fatigue, is
(07:25):
the first thing that goes awayin that part of your life.
But the next thing that happensis the confidence and the not
only in yourself because you've,you've got this one decision
handled, but it's the confidencein the people around you
knowing, okay, this person'sgoing to show up in this way
pretty darn consistently, andother things in their life may
be a little unpredictable.
(07:45):
But you know person's going toshow up in this way pretty darn
consistently, and other thingsin their life may be a little
unpredictable, but they're goingto show up in the same, pretty
much in the same outfit and theycan joke about it whatever they
want to do, but that gives themconfidence too and that gives
them trust in you.
Same thing can go for food.
That's true for me.
I eat about the same five basicthings to try to make sure
they're healthy.
I eat about the same, you know,five basic things to try to
make sure they're healthy.
And outside of that, I feellike I've got my food situation
(08:09):
locked down and again I don'thave to think about it too much,
I don't have to write out anelaborate grocery list and meal
prep and all those things,because I've got that handled.
And again, that's just anotherthing that's boring in my life.
So I can go in a thousanddifferent directions in the
things that do really interestme.
(08:30):
So I always tell people this isvery personalized.
If you are a fashionista, donot try to make your wardrobe
boring because that's not goingto feel great.
That's not going to feel greatIf you are foodie.
What you eat is not the placeto make it boring, but maybe you
don't care about your clothesso much.
(08:51):
So look for something in yourlife that you can make boring,
you can make repetitive, you canmake it no brainer, and that
leaves so much more space to putyour energy into being creative
, if that's what you want to doenergy into being creative.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
if that's what you want to do, Well, talk about the
most important lesson that youhave learned after interviewing
over a hundred people on yourshow about their joy for
rebellion.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Yeah, that's the most fun thing because I didn't
expect it and it makes so muchsense, like everything does in
hindsight.
Right, it comes down toawareness and that sounds so
simple, but I mean, you wouldnot believe how many people are
walking around you and maybe youwill, but if you're listening,
(09:37):
like there are things thatyou're just not aware of right
now.
There are things that I'mtrying to heighten my awareness
through this experience oftalking to lots and lots of
people about awareness, butthere are things that I'm still
not aware of.
It's unfolding all the time andit's a self-discovery.
But the one thing that so manyof my guests on the podcast have
(10:01):
in common is they've gonethrough their joyful rebellion,
but none of that could happenuntil they became aware that all
of the things that they thoughtwere the answer in their life,
they thought were going to makethem happy, bring them joy they
started to realize that, no,this is not the thing, and it
(10:24):
some of them took years torealize that.
Some of them, it took a tragedy, some of them it took a health
scare to realize that theyneeded to start making their
future very different from whattheir present and what their
past was, and it came throughthat awareness.
And everybody comes toawareness a little bit
(10:46):
differently.
Some is gentle and they read abook and they're like, oh, I'm
aware that I do this certainthing, I should probably do
something different, but forsome people they need it.
You know a literal car crash.
I've had a couple of thoseguests on a health scare,
(11:07):
whatever it might be that reallygets them to confront their
mortality.
Sometimes it takes somethingthat big to come to an awareness
about their own life.
So if there's anything I'velearned, it's awareness is
everything.
(11:34):
Well, you know, you talk a lotin your bio about how people
should be the author of theirown story.
Explain to the listeners whatyou mean by that formative years
.
We're getting a lot of inputfrom other people, people who
care about us, people who wantto see us do well, right.
But they're coming from theirown perspective and their
(11:56):
perspective is limited to whatthey've had happen in their life
, their experiences, theirperceptions of those experience,
their upbringing right.
So a lot of times it's ageneration or more removed.
And so if you're being raisedby your grandparents, I hung out
with my grandparents a lot, butI was getting two generations
(12:18):
like removed information and solike what it was like when they
were growing up, which is verydifferent from what it was like
when I grew up and it's gonna bethe same thing for my kids, my,
my kids children.
So I guess, when it comes towriting your own story,
sometimes you have thoseinfluences and they're really
(12:42):
positive and they do mean well.
But sometimes people just clickthe easy button and they're like
, okay, cool.
Dad said I should be a dentistbecause they do pretty good, so
I'm gonna go ahead and go todental school.
I don't know if I'm gonna likeit or not, I'm gonna come out
with a ton of debt and uh, butbut I'll have that degree, I'll
be a dentist and man, I hope Ilike it, and so that I've heard
(13:06):
that story so many times andthat's an example of when
someone's really not holding thepen when they are writing the
story of their own life.
Now I'm all for and I tell mykids all the time I'm like try a
million different things, seewhat you like and then just get
rid of the stuff you don't.
(13:28):
But it's important to at leasthave those experiences so that
you can go about the directionyou want without having to worry
about anyone else's input.
It's always good to listen toother people's input, but don't
feel like they should be writingthe words for you in the story
(13:49):
of your life.
So that's what I mean by beingthe author of your own story,
because a lot of people also,you know, before their joyful
rebellion they realize, oh mygosh, I've been playing out,
I've been acting along on thisscript that someone else wrote,
whether it was their family orwhether it was their boss or
(14:09):
whatever it was.
They realized I'm not living myown life and that's also part
of the joyful rebellion isstarting to.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
So tell us about any upcoming projects that you're
working on.
Well, I guess, before we dothat, tell the listeners about
your books.
Tell us where we can get themfrom and what we can expect when
we read them.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah, well, I've got two and they're wildly different
.
The first one is more like amemoir.
I wrote it about a decade ago,but when I got out of
advertising photography I neededa different challenge and I
described it a little bit before.
I used to go into a studioevery day.
(14:52):
I would work with advertisingclients.
It was great, reallychallenging creatively, but it
was the same place every day andI was in total control of
everything that happened infront of the camera.
And that's fun for about adozen years or so.
But it started to, you know,itch at me that, hey, there
(15:13):
could be something else outthere and so, luckily, within
photography, there are a hundreddifferent careers you can have.
So I switch from advertisingphotography into wedding
photography, which when I was incollege, I said I would never
do in a million years.
When I was in college, I said Iwould never do in a million
years.
When I was in college, weddingphotography did not seem
interesting or fun at all.
But 10 years later it did seeminteresting because it presented
(15:37):
a new challenge.
It was people who may or maynot show up on time.
It was situations andenvironments that might not be
optimal for good photographs,like the weather, for example,
or maybe there's constructionwhere we thought we were going
to be photographing and we haveto figure out plan B, and that
(15:58):
kept me on my toes.
But also working with peoplekeeps you on your toes because I
was no longer working withprofessional models, I was
working with just everydaypeople and I had to bring the
energy to get them to feelcomfortable and look great.
So it was a whole new challengeand that got me into wedding
(16:20):
photography and that.
Coming back to the book about it, though, every time I told
someone, you know you meetpeople for the first time and
they say, oh, what do you do?
And I said, well, I'm aphotographer Never said weddings
, but they assumed, oh, you meanlike weddings.
And I said, yeah, like weddings.
And they say, oh my gosh, thefirst thing they said was you
(16:41):
must see some insane stuffbehind the scenes at weddings.
And this was early 2000, mid2000s at this point, and I'm
like, yeah, I do actually, if Ithink about it, and I got enough
of those questions and commentsthat I started writing things
down as they happen and beforelong, like seven years in, I had
(17:04):
a book worth of information, sothat one's called accessory to
marriage.
That's the first book and it'sjust the subtitle is chronicles
of outrageousness from my lifeas a wedding photographer and
it's a fun little trip downmemory lane.
A lot of short stories andthey're easy to digest and
(17:25):
hilarious.
From what I'm told it's that'snot my assessment, but people
tell me that.
But my most recent project, 10years after the first book, just
came out in the fall of lastyear and it has been a blast.
But it's a coffee table book.
It's my very first book thathas photos in it, believe it or
(17:47):
not, and they're all black andwhite.
And I got to reflecting on mytime as a commercial
photographer and in that fieldwe tend to objectify people a
lot, and not in a bad way, butin the way like, let's say, I
(18:09):
was working for a company thatmade jeans and they want to show
off their jeans and get peopleto buy them.
Well, it's much more appealingif you can show a model wearing
those jeans because people cannow see how they fit.
You sort of see the curves, allthat, that kind of stuff.
It's more relatable if a personis wearing jeans than if
(18:31):
they're just laying there on theground.
So we would hire a model, andwe didn't care what the model's
name was, we didn't care.
You know how they were doingthat day.
I mean, we, we had all of thosethings behind the scenes in the
studio, but as far as theperson who ended up in that
photo, they were really just thething that was holding the
(18:52):
jeans on in the photo, and sothey were kind of objectified in
that way and I thought, wellgosh, what would happen If I
took everyday objects and Ipersonified them?
So instead of objectifyingpeople, I'm personifying objects
, and I love to walk aroundplaces.
(19:14):
I walk a lot, I love historiccities and I just started
noticing there were things thatI would pass, that everybody
else would pass too.
The first thing I ever saw was ahair tie, and, just like one of
those ponytail holders rightthat women lose all the time,
it's either on the wrist or intheir hair or it's on the ground
, and I saw one and had a littledirt around it.
(19:34):
I could tell it'd been therefor a few weeks maybe, and I
just got to thinking, wow,what's the story behind this?
How did it get here?
Who used to have it?
Does this little hair tie missthe person that discarded it or
lost it or whatever the case was.
So I started photographingthings like that, things that
were mundane, and the book'scalled Meditations of the
(19:56):
Mundane and it was a blast.
I went to so many differentcities and just photographed
things that people walk by everyday, made up really fun stories
about them.
Things that people walk byevery day, made up really fun
stories about them, and both ofthose books can be found at my
website, jameswalterscom.
Pretty straightforward there.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Okay, tell us about any upcoming projects that
you're working on that listenersneed to be aware of.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Yeah, I've got one.
I'm actually working with agroup of students.
I've never done this before, butI'm hosting a summer camp
through an Arts Center that'shere in my home state in North
Carolina and working with thempretty closely.
I'm going to be doing a week inJune and it's all about
photography and storytelling andin conjunction with that I'm
(20:46):
creating a book.
It's's called the Little Bookof Special Powers and it's going
to be for kids that are between9 and 14.
So it's going to be aimed atthat age range, but it's all
about exercises and things thatthey can do to further explore
their storytelling abilities,and through words, like the
(21:09):
written word, but also throughphotography and cameras are
everywhere Now they're in ourpocket even as young as nine
years old and 14.
So want to get those kids whoare involved with it, or
eventually get the book, to beable to communicate.
I mean, storytelling reallycomes down to communication
(21:31):
right, and people love stories,and so if they have that ability
to craft a story and getsomeone interested, they're
going to have some specialpowers that other people their
age won't have.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
Okay, well, you answered my next question your
website, jameswalterscom.
So close us out with some finalthoughts.
Maybe, if that was something Iforgot to talk about, that you
would like to touch on, or anyfinal thoughts you have for the
listeners.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Yeah, very much.
You know, someone asked me on apodcast last year.
They said hey, if you weregoing to write a billboard, you
know it's got to be short andit's got to be immediately
readable, but it's got to have agood message behind it.
What would that billboard say?
And for me, that billboardwould say nothing changes if
(22:23):
nothing changes.
And that seems a little weird ofa thing to say, but it's
something that through my work,through my life, through meeting
a lot of other people on mypodcast, tends to be true is, if
you don't like what yourcurrent situation is, you you
(22:46):
want to really look around andsee what little things you can
change.
And sometimes it starts outsmall and it grows a little
bigger as you get moreconfidence, as you get a little
more courage.
Taking action gives you thatconfidence and before you know
it, your whole life could bedifferent.
If you want it to be, just bymaking changes.
(23:06):
But if you want it to stayexactly the same, just make sure
you don't make any changes andlife will kind of happen around
you.
But that's what I would leaveeveryone with is is, if there's
anything you want to bedifferent, just remember nothing
changes if nothing changesthat's the perfect message.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
Ladies and gentlemen, james JamesWalterscom, please
be sure to follow rate, review.
Share this episode to as manypeople as possible.
Jump on your favorite podcastapp.
Follow us.
Leave us a review.
Check out the show.
For more information on theLiving the Dream with Curveball
podcast, go towwwcurveball337.com.
(23:50):
Thank you for listening andsupporting the show, james.
Thank you for all that you'redoing to make the world a better
place and thank you for joiningme.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Thank you, curtis, it was a blast.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
For more information on the Living the Dream with
Curveball podcast, visitwwwcurveball337.com.
Until next time, keep livingthe dream.
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