Principles, Conflict, and Community

Danny and Tyler return for an engaging and introspective conversation about reestablishing rhythms, the deep benefits of jiu-jitsu, and navigating complex societal conversations. Tyler shares personal insights about returning to the mat after his medical treatments, highlighting jiu-jitsu's role in physical health, mental regulation, and community connection.

The discussion dives into balancing modern and postmodern perspectives, including the importance of maintaining one's principles while respecting differing viewpoints. They touch on sensitive issues such as gender, feminism, and patriarchy, emphasizing the value of open, respectful dialogue and the power of validating one's own identity without compromising mutual respect.

Danny addresses the emotional challenges of teaching children and adults, reflecting on patience, engagement, and the joy found in nurturing growth in others. Tyler opens up about recent studies in therapy, specifically the nuanced differences between modernist and postmodernist therapeutic approaches.

The episode concludes with heartfelt reflections on supporting mental health, the importance of building strong community bonds, and the upcoming "Tap Out Cancer" jiu-jitsu event. Danny and Tyler reinforce their shared commitment to fostering conversations that encourage personal growth, understanding, and mutual respect.

Episode Transcript

Danny (00:00):
Yo, welcome Here we are. Back again. Back again.

Tyler (00:10):
Trying to get in the rhythm. Yeah. Find find find a
new a new new

Danny (00:16):
Yeah. Normal. Yeah. Your your new normal and your new how
we're gonna do things. We'reback to just podcasting every
other week, which is good.
Yeah. Creating content andgetting back to the thing that
we love the most, which ishanging out and training and
Yeah. And being around eachother and being around the mat
or our friends. Yeah. Tonightwas fun.
It's a nice one. Cheers.

Tyler (00:36):
Yeah. Cheers.

Danny (00:37):
Thanks for your help today. Thank you. Appreciate
you.

Tyler (00:39):
Yeah. Those kids are fun. Those girls, man.

Danny (00:41):
Those girls. Dude, that's insane,

Tyler (00:42):
Dude, the one her face her face, she'd

Danny (00:45):
Oh, yeah.

Tyler (00:45):
She'd snarl, and I could tell she was getting in the
other girl's head.

Danny (00:48):
Gangster. Yeah. We had we for my classes on Thursday,
they're really, really long. Youwere able to see what I go
through with, like, those twoclasses. I always Mike and I
talk about it a lot because heteaches Wednesday day Mhmm.
And teaches Wednesday, all kidsclasses, and then Wednesday

(01:09):
night. And by the time weusually get him on Wednesday
night, he's pretty he's prettybeat up Yeah. From competing.
It's a lot. Right?
And so my Thursdays, I go towork, and then I come in and I
teach that 04:00 class, which isa little guy's class. Mhmm. And
it takes every bit of your CPUunit to stay engaged, to not
lose your patience, to laugh, tokeep them interested because

(01:29):
it's so boring for them. Some ofthose kids have been there doing
the same thing. You could seethat Jackson kid.
He's just like, oh, we have todo this again. But it's like,
yeah, we have to do this untilit's almost damn perfect. Right?
Yeah. And then you have youngkids.
Reeve is four, hit that. Yeah.And he was one of the better
listeners Yeah. Of the group.Right?

(01:49):
Yeah. And so my brain has tostay engaged. But then that next
class comes in and they're sofun. They're so good to be.
They're such cool kids, but thetwo girls were going at it.
And I I made them stay in forevery round Yeah. Because no
submissions, and they went ateach other every round.

Tyler (02:08):
Every time. They

Danny (02:09):
No back down. No no no backing down from each other and
just going at each other. And Iwas like, hey, no submission
case. You're back in. You'regoing.

Tyler (02:17):
Keep going.

Danny (02:17):
And what a fun little group of kids, you know, and
then the adults come in and andthen your brain has to turn on
for adults. And and and we havea curriculum on on some of those
nights where you're like, wehave to cover these things. We
have to make sure that we coverthem. And I think that I'm
getting better at the adultsbeing engaged in what I'm

(02:39):
teaching.

Tyler (02:39):
I think you did great tonight. I think you did great.
I really enjoyed the class.Like, was good it was good,
like, little refresher. Like, Iknow we learn that white to blue
all the time.
And in a lot of ways when Ifirst started jujitsu, I felt
that same way as those littlekids, you're like, oh, we're
doing

Danny (02:53):
the white to blue again. Again. Oh,

Tyler (02:54):
we're doing We're doing headlock escapes. Yeah. But like
it makes sense, right? Like youhave you ever been in any sort
conflict. Right?
You realize that like, prettyquickly your brain goes to like
fight or flight and mush. So ifyou haven't learned to regulate
that part of your system, if youhaven't learned to kind of
breathe through the initialfeelings, you're stuck in

(03:18):
reaction mode. Yeah.

Danny (03:19):
For

Tyler (03:19):
sure. You don't have you don't have the opportunity to to
kind of higher level think andthat's the beauty of jujitsu.

Danny (03:24):
It is. That's And and we've talked about this before
that like sometimes, you know,where jujitsu has gone on social
media, I'm not a big fan of it.You know? Yeah. I love watching
the old school guys.
I love watching the new schoolguys. I like their I like some
of the stuff that they do. Butall the drama and the bullshit
that they bring to the table andall the the personalities and
all the, like, social mediabullshit, I'm not a fan of it,

(03:46):
you know. And it and it turns meoff from social media because
I'm like, I don't I don't Idon't care to engage in things
like that. Right?
Like, I'm not a jiu jitsu to tobe a a person. Yeah. A
personality. Yeah. The problemis is I have a big personality.
Right? Yeah. Everybody at theacademy knows who Danny is. Yep.
Right?
Yeah. But I hope what they knowis that I preach self defense,

(04:08):
staying healthy Yeah. Andstaying on the mats as long as
you can. And Yeah. And focusingon that.
And and when you have thingsthat you went through, like, get
back to the mat because thenyou're gonna be so much happier
tonight

Tyler (04:19):
I know.

Danny (04:20):
And Yeah. How we do things, you know. And and when
at the end of the day, ourbodies change, our minds change,
everything changes when you whenyou surrender to Mhmm. To
something like that, to adiscipline. Right?
Yeah. Everything changes. Theway you outlook and things, it
changes.

Tyler (04:36):
And it's it's easy to, like, once you break the streak
of going, like, for my my in myspecific case, right, like not
being on the mat. You you'recompletely demotivated. You are
I'm starting from ground zero.Sure. I'm starting from ground
zero building that habit overagain Yeah.
Which sucks because jujitsu is apassion of mine. Like I've I've
I've enjoyed it on multiplelevels. People always ask me
like why jujitsu and I'm like,mentally it was the best thing

(04:59):
for me. Physically, it'scompletely changed my body. And
then we're not even talkingabout like the benefits of just
kind of regulating the nervoussystem, knowing how to defend
myself.
Right? It's all of these thingscombined. The community that

Danny (05:13):
How stoked was everybody to see you did it?

Tyler (05:15):
Oh, yeah. It was awesome.

Danny (05:16):
Yeah.

Tyler (05:16):
It was awesome. I love I mean, I I loved it. It it

Danny (05:19):
It's exactly what you

Tyler (05:20):
needed. Yeah. I I felt like after being at home, I'm
kind of now to this point whereI'm off a cycle of treatment.
And for for what it's worth,like, I'm I'm I'm I should be
like normal right now. Right?
I I'm not, but like, I have nonothing no draws on my time from
a a treatment standpoint. Onlyneed to kind of just rest and

(05:41):
kind of, like I said, learn tolive in this new normal. Mhmm.

Danny (05:45):
Yeah. And and that's a big because jujitsu was such a
big part of your life and howyou were regulating and self
regulating and not having it, itit it's like that longing for
something. Right? And and youhave longings for for things
like, you know, learning. I'vebeen really, really thinking
about, like, learning, like,constantly learning, constantly

(06:06):
learning, putting myself Mhmm.
In positions where I'm alwayslearning. Never taken, like, a I
got this role. Yeah. Like, Ihave this. I've got this down.
Even at work, like, you know,the last couple of weeks, I've
been like, no, just learn. Justlike be in a learning state at
all times. Don't don't ever feellike you've got things figured

(06:28):
out. Yeah. You know?
And how how how do we do that?How as men do we stay in that
learning state when your life isand and your family requires you
to be the the leader all thetime, you know, the pack leader.

Tyler (06:40):
Yeah. Well, I mean, I I think you're absolutely right. I
think that's the beauty ofjujitsu, right? It forces you to
constantly be learning becausethe moment the minute you think
that you you know or you have itall, you know, a Craig Jones
pops up or a Gordon Ryan popsup, right? And they've they make
a fool of you.

Danny (06:59):
And you know what's funny is along those topics is that
those guys, they're it it seemslike sometimes that there's
they're always changingacademies, always changing
things in their life. And sothen, is it that they is it is
it the is it the reality thatthey are talented and they're
young and they're, like, got gotthis ability. Right? But do they

(07:19):
have do they have it figured outenough to be in a learning state
for themselves? Right?
But because it always seems likeand they're at a different
academy. They're never, like,they're never with a place
longer than a couple years. Youknow, you have all those the
drama that happens with with allthose big personalities where
Mike and I were talking about ityesterday, and you figure that

(07:42):
guy's been at the same placewith the same thing for twelve,
thirteen years. Right? Mhmm.
And it sometimes, you know, itseems like the academy is pretty
small. But maybe that's the wayyou like it. Maybe that's why.
It's because there's so muchloyalty and so much like, we
give so much to each other. Wewanna be good friends and

(08:04):
partners to each other.

Tyler (08:05):
Yeah.

Danny (08:06):
It would be hard to walk into that. Yeah. As an outsider.

Tyler (08:11):
Yeah. Oh, I I I can only imagine. I can only imagine. I I
wonder like how do you handlelike when you come into some
information, new informationthat conflicts with perhaps how
you've previously seen theworld. Yeah.
I'm I'm I'm wondering becauseI've I've dealt with this
situation recently in in myschool studies. Right? I'm just

(08:34):
we're studying the thedifference between modernist and
post modernist kind oftherapeutic models. And what's
interesting is that I see thesetwo models, and I'll explain
them here in a sec, they reallydo kind of reflect back to me
kind of the current state ofaffairs. So modernist would kind
of be a a view of the worldthat, you know, there's kind of

(08:59):
absolute truth, you know, thethe therapist is kind of a
authority figure.
They have a particular set ofskill skills. The the you know,
they will treat a presentingproblem with a, you know, a
specific treatment. Right?You'll do x, y, and z. Whereas a
postmodernist is there's nothere's no singular truth.

(09:23):
Everybody's truth is is theirtruth.

Danny (09:25):
It's yours. Sure.

Tyler (09:26):
Yeah. And so like for me, I've had a lot of like growing
up LDS. I've I've I'm reallydeconstructing some of this
stuff for a couple of reasons.One is I see you know, we see
things like DEI. Right?
Diversity Equality. Equality andinclusion. Inclusion. Right?
Forever that's been like a hugea huge thing.
And I'm like, for me, DEI wasnever very principled. Right?

(09:49):
Because when you put somebody ona pedestal and you say this
person deserves this becausepreviously they haven't had it,
you're doing the exact thingthat you don't want people to
do. Right.

Danny (10:02):
Well, and it's and and interesting enough, like, for
all intents and purposes, like,you know, I'm a person of color.
Right. Right? And so people,like, give DEI as far as, like,
for myself, but I in my personalpersonal belief. Right?
Yeah. I don't believe that I'vegotten anything anything because

(10:23):
of my because of my couple.

Tyler (10:25):
So here's here's an I mean, this this so that's
fascinating because I was gonnaask this this question as well.
There are women that arefeminists.

Danny (10:32):
For sure.

Tyler (10:33):
There are women that aren't feminists.

Danny (10:35):
Agreed.

Tyler (10:35):
Are there men that are not included as part of the
patriarchy?

Danny (10:40):
I would say yes. I would say yes. I would say that there
are men that don't know whatit's like to be a patriarchal
figure. Right. Patriarchalfigure.
Because let's say let's say thatmy wife is the breadwinner.
Right. Right? And my wife makesthe money. Right.
Right? And she, for all intentsand purposes, gets to make a lot

(11:05):
of decisions. Yeah. Right? Yeah.
So let's say you as a man haveto take a backseat role to your
wife who who makes money. Thenlet's say she says, no. No. No.
You can make the decisions.
And then it feels like, oh,you're giving me you're giving
me the ability to make Yeah. Oh,you're giving that to me. Right?

(11:26):
So patriarch let's say, youknow, let's say a gut a gay
couple. Right.
Right? Yeah. I mean, you know,how how can they be patriarchal
if there's no children involved?

Tyler (11:38):
Right. Well, I mean, that you would say that they
benefited from, you know, beingmales in a male dominated world.
And I'm like, I'm with you, Iagree. I don't know I don't know
that like feminist or not, Idon't think that women would
agree. Yeah.

(11:59):
I would be surprised. I mean, II have not surveyed any women.
I'm not here to speak for women,but I kind of get this
impression from what I see inthe nightmare that is social
media, what I in the nightmarethat is kind of the the the
dating scene scene that's outthere, that there's a lot of
there's a lot of women that arebeing coming emboldened in like
this, the feminist movement. Andand from from my perspective, I

(12:23):
see feminism for me, feminism isto to women what the patriarchy
is to men. Sure.
And so

Danny (12:31):
We'll be in and so, like, let's say let's say there's a
woman, and, you know, and Idon't I don't and my own, you
know, you know my views onthings. Right? I have a very
strong opinion about things, andI don't wanna turn people off of
how I feel. Sure. Because myopinions are very strong about
certain things.
Right. Right? But to be afeminist doesn't mean that you

(12:53):
have to have testosterone and toboat to beat your chest. Right.
As soon as you start doing that,that's a different that's a
different energy.
Yeah. Right? But to have beliefsand to have strong beliefs and
have strong values in what awoman's role is Yeah. Is very
can be very feminist. And Ibelieve in that.

(13:14):
I believe in that. Same thingwith patriarchal. Yeah. I
believe that you can be strongas a man Mhmm. And and know your
role.
Right?

Tyler (13:21):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Danny (13:22):
And to understand that, like, there's some people that
are going to run at the fireMhmm. And there's gonna be some
people that sit back and makesure that everybody stays behind
the fire line. Yeah. Right?Yeah.
We all have our jobs to do.Right? Yeah. And again, my
opinions are very strong aboutcertain things. Yeah.
With the way social media andthe way that platforms allow you

(13:45):
to voice your opinion withoutany kind of reprimand or any
kind of back talk or any kind oflike let's say I have a
different opinion, and then youraise your voice, I raise my
voice, you raise your voice, butwe're doing it on a keyboard.
Right. There's a differencethere. That's a different. If
we're standing in front of eachother, I'm like, we wouldn't be
talking like that to each otherYeah.

(14:05):
If we were standing

Tyler (14:06):
Sure.

Danny (14:07):
In front of each other. Yeah. Yeah. Even sometimes,
like, you know, with myrelationships with certain
women. Mhmm.
It's like, you're you're notallowed to talk to me like that.
Yeah. And I and I'll be veryblunt, like, hey. Because I
can't talk to you in the sameway. Right.
Right? Because then your husbandhas to get involved, and now me
and your husband have conflictall over the fact that you chose

(14:27):
to take a tone with me or saywords to me that I don't agree
with Yeah. And I would notreciprocate back to you. Right.
And I try to say that verycalmly.
And sometimes, I come off aschauvinistic

Tyler (14:39):
Right.

Danny (14:39):
As that women don't get a voice. Right. That's not what
I'm saying. We yeah. Not whatI'm saying.
I'm just saying that we havedifferent roles in life.

Tyler (14:48):
Well, and I think out of out of respect. Right? Like, you
wouldn't necessarily, like, Iwouldn't corner some somebody's
wife. I wouldn't corner Mistyand like Sure. You know what I
mean?
In or chew her ass or like, youknow what I mean? Like, I I keep
it pleasant. I'm I'm I'm kind.If she needs help with
something, I'd help her, butlike, my relationship is is with

(15:08):
you and by extension of myrelationship with you

Danny (15:11):
Agree.

Tyler (15:11):
I I I honor her role in your life.

Danny (15:13):
Agree.

Tyler (15:14):
But I'm not like you you know what I mean? Like, I'm not
Yeah. We I'm not there to like

Danny (15:19):
We've had an incidence where people have reached out to
me over certain people and I hadto remind them like, hey. Yeah.
But it's not cool to me. Like,you're not allowed to talk to me
like that

Tyler (15:29):
Yeah.

Danny (15:29):
About about this person because Yeah. You should
probably talk to my wife aboutthat. Yeah. Not me because I'm
going to have a different tonethan my wife. Which And and that
extension of like, I I value whoyou are.
Yeah. So remember that. But Idon't I don't personally live in
that world where we get to talkto each other like that. Yeah.
Yeah.
Do you know what I'm saying?Yeah. Especially with between

(15:50):
men and women's relationship.

Tyler (15:52):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. When I would agree, we can

Danny (15:54):
you were saying.

Tyler (15:54):
Yeah. We have civil discourse. Right? We have a
civil discourse, but it there isa boundary that probably needs
to be drawn, and I don't want Idon't want the perception of
that boundary being violated inany way.

Danny (16:04):
In any way. On my own accord or yours? Yeah. Yeah. My
my own things.
And so then you think thinkabout, like, some of those
personalities and some of thosethings that that come out on
keyboard or, like Yeah. Youknow, they're talking and I'm
thinking, would you say that ifwe were sitting across from each
other? And then if I saidsomething back to you, are you
okay with my with my howpassionate I am about Yeah. What

(16:27):
what I believe, you know, how Ibelieve in. And and my wife
understands how I believe.
My wife understands that aboutme. And sometimes she'll say,
woah, woah, woah, you know Yeah.That you're coming off pretty
aggressive and prettychauvinistic and I'll have to
rethink. And sometimes if I'm ina mood, I'll be like, well,
that's the way it is, you know?Yeah.

(16:49):
That's the way it is. That'sthat's the way that's way I
think. There is That's the Ibelieve.

Tyler (16:52):
There is a first principle rule. Right? Like, we
can be what what I think we'vetried to do as a society is
really we've tried to legislatewe've tried to legislate
equality. And I get it.Sometimes with if something is
so out of balance, you may needto step in and and correct the
balance so things become morebalanced.
But I think if you you continueto poke at it, it will

(17:13):
ultimately slide the other way.And and so we've created all
these rules and we've tried tocreate we've tried to create a
universal truth for everybodyvia these rules. Meanwhile,
we're all trying to say, look atme, look at me, I'm equal. I'm
different. Accept my view.
Accept my view. No. Look at myview. Your view doesn't matter.

(17:33):
My view, my view, my view.
Right? Like, and that's kind ofwhat I see in these in some of
these community in some of thesecommunities. Right? Like I don't
have a problem with with, youknow, somebody's sexual
orientation or their desire toto to transition genders. I
don't.
What you do with your life isyou on you. It's when you now

(17:55):
start forcing me when you whenyou tell me when you tell me
there is no such thing as as asuniversal truth, but you also
have to now accept

Danny (18:04):
my truth.

Tyler (18:04):
You now have to start calling me my my pronouns, but
but universal. There's nothere's no universal truth.

Danny (18:10):
And, like You and I have talked about this before that
you and I don't practice thoseat home. No. We don't practice
that kind of, like, we are kind.We are genuine. We are, like, I
accept you for who you are.
Yeah. But I do not practice someof these things at home that
you're requiring of me. Samewith you. You're like you're
like, I don't I I if you looklike a duck, you're a duck.
Yeah.
Sorry. That's just the way mylife is. Right. Right? And we

(18:31):
practice those things.
And so how how when you thinkabout, like, going back to your
original original bringing upthis topic Yeah. Would you
consider yourself modern orpostmodern? Oh, and when you're
studying, do you see yourselfas, like, this is gonna be this

(18:52):
would be really weird if I gotsomebody that I didn't a client
that I'm like, I don't know howto deal with you because we're
different we have differentideas.

Tyler (19:00):
Yeah. Think I think that's one of the biggest
things. Right? As a one of thereasons I decided to kind of go
with marriage and family therapyis because I was excited, not
necessarily excited by the idea,but I felt like I needed the the
credential. I felt like I neededthe credential because the
credential helped addcredibility.

Danny (19:18):
I see. And

Tyler (19:20):
and basically, what I'm learning in school is that like,
really in a postmodern world,like, it's not important. Sure.
What's important is being ableto hold space and and I can see
benefits for both. Because thelast thing I would want to do
and and I only because I've hadgreat therapists myself, the

(19:41):
last thing I would want to do isjust continue to get somebody
stuck in their confirmationbias.

Danny (19:45):
Oh, sure.

Tyler (19:45):
And I I feel like I feel like in a in a in a world at
large today, we we are doingthat.

Danny (19:52):
Well, and a lot of it has to do with the fact that, like,
you feel like you have tovalidate a lot of validation
comes validation really mattersright now. Yeah. Yeah. Like,
validating validating things.Like, you know me the way that I
deal with my boys and children.
Like, if your feelings areupset, like, I don't validate
your feelings. Yeah. You know, Idon't validate.

Tyler (20:13):
Well, you shouldn't.

Danny (20:13):
Hey. We gotta we gotta move on from this. Let's move
on. Right? But when we go and wevalidate all little tiny things
and we give, you know, youngchildren the ability to make
decisions quickly on somethingthat could affect their life
along not today, but fifteenyears from now, but I'm
validating it right now.

(20:34):
Yeah. We give almost a loadedweapon to them. Yeah. Yeah. And,
know, validation really it doesmatter sometimes.
Right? Yeah. But there's timeswhen it's gotta be like, no.
Yeah. No.
Yeah. That's no. No. That's notthe way you think about it. No.
You're thinking about it wrong.No. You're you're approaching
this wrong. And strong malefigures sometimes have to say,

(21:00):
no. Yeah.
Oh. Yeah. No. Sorry. That's notthe way life is.
Yeah. No. Be tougher.

Tyler (21:05):
And it's okay to take a stance and then and come back to
it and say, oh, I've I'vechanged my mind or I've I've got
new information.

Danny (21:12):
Yeah. And we've talked about this before, like having a
pillow in a hand. Right? Yeah.Yeah.
Like having a pillow, likehaving a pill a pillow, like
having somebody that you can goto and be in a pillow and being
like, man, I need some comfortright now. Yeah. But then
sometimes, there comes the handwith because life is tough
sometimes. Yeah. And as a singlefather, sometimes you've gotta

(21:32):
pick and choose whether you'rethe pillow in the hand.
Because you said before, withthe girls, you tend to be
sometimes a pillow. With BenMhmm. It's like, there's no way.
Yeah. No.
Your job is to be the hand.Yeah. Right? And Yep. Then go to
the mom for the pillow.
Yep. You know? Yep. And I thinkvalidation comes in lots of
forms. And I think, like, waysof looking at things, to you and

(21:56):
I because of where we stand.
I always believe this. If youhave a religious background,
there's nothing you can do aboutthat. Right. You're going to
still feel those religiousideologies and ties. Yep.
Even if you do not believe inthe religion, you believe

Tyler (22:17):
Mhmm.

Danny (22:17):
In what God said and what he has preached. In some way or
form, you believe that you thatGod put you here for purpose

Tyler (22:27):
Yeah.

Danny (22:27):
As a man. Yeah. And and and and there's nothing you can
do about that. Right. Whetheryou believe it or not.
Yeah. Believe it not. Like,there's nothing you can do. You
could denounce as much as youwant, and in the back of your
mind, no, that's probably nothow I feel.

Tyler (22:40):
Yeah. It's so it's so

Danny (22:42):
You know?

Tyler (22:42):
It's so interesting. I don't know if you've watched any
of the, like, the lives ofMormon House, like, the true
lives of Mormon House. It'sabsolutely garbage TV. And I've
only watched it because I comeyou know what I mean? I come
from that space and I hear thesepeople.
There's an episode in thissecond season where one of the
one of the influencers has istalking with her mother and her

(23:06):
father. And they're all veryactive in the Mormon church. And
they're talking about how thisyoung lady now has a child with
a dude she had a one night standwith that kind of developed into
this really toxic relationshipthat's been kind of the center
of the TV show. And the dadstorms out and he basically she

(23:28):
he basically yells, he's yellingat the daughter, you slept with
him after three days. What doesthat say about you?
And he storms out of the room.And so, like, you've if you get
on in social media, all the postMormon people that are, like,
they're saying, oh, what a whata fucking asshole this guy is.
What a, you know, this is thethis is the patriarchy. And I'm
like, I mean, in in a way, Ikinda agree he could have worded

(23:51):
it better. Right?
Like, he probably shouldn't havetold his daughter that. At the
same time, like, he's onlydescribing her actions. Yeah.
Right? Like Yeah.
I don't I don't want to be rude,but at the same time, like, if
you don't like how people aregoing to describe that or talk

(24:11):
about it, then why are you doingit?

Danny (24:14):
Then don't do it.

Tyler (24:15):
Yeah.

Danny (24:16):
And and it it it comes down to, like, our moral compass
and our moral values. Right.Right? There's nothing we can do
about that. Mm-mm.
There's literally nothing we cando about it. We can fight it all
we want. We can we can denounceit as much as we want, wake up
the next day and still realizewe have those moral compasses.
We have those moral values.Right.
And when people take it out ofcontext or, like, if I say

(24:41):
something to you and it's frommy own moral grounds, and the
other part is judgmental. That'sthat's where people, like, take
it the wrong way is, like, itcomes off as judgmental. Right?
Like, like, you know me, like, Ihave I do have a strong faith in
certain things. Mhmm.
But I also believe a lot ofother things. And I also, like,

(25:04):
take a lot of other things intoaccount before I pass judgment
on people. Right. I also don'tpreach my own testimony.

Tyler (25:13):
Yeah. Yeah.

Danny (25:14):
You know, like, that that's one thing that I I I
struggle with with LDS people.

Tyler (25:18):
Yeah. Yeah.

Danny (25:19):
Is it's like, they always have a testimony. They always
have a testimony. You alwayshave, this is my testimony. And
I think, okay, I get that. Butyou also have lots of vices
Mhmm.
Lots of sins that go againstwhatever you're saying on your
testimony, you know. And that'swhy I don't prophesize.

Tyler (25:41):
It's it's it's interesting because I've I've
def I see that. Right? And I'vedefinitely been a part of that
and I've definitely proselyzed,you know what I mean? Like, for
for that particular group. AndI've had to I've had to step
back and I'm I have gottenreally comfortable and really
okay with not knowing the truth.
Not like, it's so freeing to beable to say, I don't know. And

(26:03):
and I don't have to know whatthe truth is. That's a problem.
We're hung on this truth. Youknow, the concept of truth is is
is where I've really kind ofbeen tumbling and that's why I
bring up this postmodernistmodernist kind of theme for
today because it it comes downto truth.
What is truth? Yeah. If you'retelling me there is no absolute
truth, there's only subjectivetruth, then is that really

(26:24):
truth? Yeah. Because truth to meis universally accepted.
Sure. And it's universallyaccepted so that we can live in
a world that is a little bitmore peaceful, that has a little
bit more rules. Right? Theuniversal the universal truth
would be that the speed limitout in front of my house is
whatever it is, 35 miles

Danny (26:42):
an hour.

Tyler (26:42):
Right? And we all agree to it. We may not always follow
the rules Yeah. We'll do ourbest but the universal accepted
truth is that it's 35 and we getalong as a society in general
when people kind of obey and andgo by those those those rules.
Sure.
I mean, that's that's just kindof one one example that I've
I've I've I've been kindastewing on.

Danny (27:06):
You know what's funny about for me for truth when I
hear truth?

Tyler (27:09):
Yeah.

Danny (27:09):
I always think about math.

Tyler (27:15):
Oh, yeah.

Danny (27:15):
I always think of like like, math. Yeah. Like, how to
get to how math, like, math andall of these formulas and all of
these principles and all thesethings. And they're they always
talk about the truths of thetruths like And that always,
like, ground that always I thinkabout, like, how many branches

(27:38):
can grow off of, like, math,like, anything to do with math
and, like.

Tyler (27:44):
That's interesting. You're you're absolutely right.
Right? No matter how you do,there there's always one answer.

Danny (27:49):
One Yeah. Yeah. Formulas and I do this formula for this
Yeah. Yeah. And I need to dothis order of operations for
this and and I think about math.
But then what that does is itboils me down to like how I live
my day to day life Mhmm. Is mytruth.

Tyler (28:04):
Yeah. Yeah.

Danny (28:05):
My truths are these are my truths. Mhmm. And that's
again why, you know, sometimes,like, I'll be like, Tyler, no.
Like, we gotta you have to livelike this. Yeah.
Yeah. And sometimes I'm prettypassionate about, like, things
Yeah. That I that I see and thatI want for my friends. Mhmm.
Because I tell them to myself,you know, I I I tell them those

(28:27):
truths to myself.

Tyler (28:28):
Yeah.

Danny (28:29):
And lately, we've been really working on on our
relationship with God and andreally, really, really working
on our relationship with God.And some people shared a couple
podcasts with me, and I justfelt like it was right at the
right time, right at the rightmoment of of where my
relationship with God was andand how rooted I actually am in

(28:52):
religion and and how I believe,you know, and how I live my day
to day life. But people alwaysyou know, if you if you if you
get super, super, super, nope,this is the way it is. Nope,
this is the way it is, then theychallenge you. Right?

Tyler (29:08):
Yeah.

Danny (29:08):
Then you get angry and you get frustrated, but I even
if I get challenged, I don'thonestly mind because I don't I
whatever you believe is what youbelieve in. Right. Whatever I
believe is what I believe in.And how I believe is just my own
personal my own personal truth.

Tyler (29:22):
When it's that it's that self awareness into your own am
I am I am I acting on aconfirmation bias. Right? Mhmm.
Right? Am I and and you you'vekind of mentioned that that you
do this and we didn't I didn't Ididn't call it at that point,
but like, we all we all do this.
Right? We we we develop opinionsfrom where we believe truth to
be in our lives.

Danny (29:43):
Yeah. Yeah. Sure.

Tyler (29:43):
Right? And so it's it's the true awareness, you know, if
somebody's bringing mesomething, am I responding with
a confirmation virus? Or do Ihave the self awareness to say,
I may hold this this otherprinciple true or different than
what they are telling me, butI'm I'm able to kind of hold
space and allow them to speaktheir truth even though it

(30:05):
conflicts with my truth.

Danny (30:07):
Right. Right. And I think, like, for you and I,
because we do so much so muchwork with other people Yeah. You
know, and since we're stillworking on ourselves and we
Yeah. And we're still, like,work in project process work in
process in progress Mhmm.

(30:28):
We're still living we're we'restill, like, where where every
day you could find something newthat you're like, actually,
yeah, my mind changes. I kindabelieve like that.

Tyler (30:39):
Yeah. I

Danny (30:39):
kinda believe like that. Or it could reground you to some
of your things that you didprior to while you were you
know, there's some lot of thingsthat come from LDS that you may
go Mhmm. Actually, I don't mindthat. I actually believe that.
Right.
You know? Yeah. I may notbelieve it to the point that I'm
going to prophesize or I'm goingto testimony about it. Yeah.

(31:00):
Yeah.
But I may believe it, you know?Mhmm. And when we work with men
and we work with people, our jobis not to really give our own
personal ideologies. We wannagive round about things, but
like, you're really listeninglistening to them and helping

(31:23):
them find their path Yeah. Rightin their course.

Tyler (31:26):
Yeah.

Danny (31:26):
And sometimes you're like, I don't believe any single
thing that you're saying. Yeah.But you're gonna get to you're
gonna get to your truth. Yep.Whether it's modern or
postmodern.
Yeah. And that's the hard partfor me is sometimes is, like,
with when I'm talking to peoplewho have some very modern

(31:48):
ideologies.

Tyler (31:49):
Yeah.

Danny (31:49):
I'm like, wow. Yeah. I gotta wrap my head around what
you're saying because

Tyler (31:54):
Right.

Danny (31:55):
I don't wanna like, my facial features may come off as
super fucking judgy. Yeah. Youknow?

Tyler (32:00):
Yeah. It was just so funny because I actually went on
a date and like had thisconversation about the the the
transgender issue.

Danny (32:10):
Oh,

Tyler (32:10):
sure. And and I had to check myself and I'm I'm all I'm
all for having civil discourse.I'm never going to I I probably,
you know, things may get heatedbut I probably won't ever let
you get me too out of balance.Right? That's been my goal.
But I I I thought of the thekind of the common analogy. Do
you know what Pluto is?

Danny (32:30):
The planet?

Tyler (32:32):
Is it a planet?

Danny (32:33):
No. I don't actually don't know if it is or not.

Tyler (32:35):
It's it was a planet when I grew up, was growing Like, we
we did

Danny (32:38):
Yeah. Was a planet. Yeah. It was the planet.

Tyler (32:41):
We found out recently is, like, in, like, 2,000 something
or other that it's like it'snot. It's like a dwarf star or
something. Yeah.

Danny (32:48):
Right? Or or that's their their idea that

Tyler (32:50):
it's a star. Their idea. It's using the scientific
method. Right? It was a planetuntil some new information came
in

Danny (32:55):
and changed Did

Tyler (32:56):
Pluto change?

Danny (32:58):
No. Pluto did not view of it did.

Tyler (33:00):
Plea we our understanding of definition of of people So
why haven't what you know, whyhaven't we applied that same
logic to to to gender? What isthe purpose of gender?

Danny (33:12):
Well, it describes who you are to to in my own opinion
of Sure.

Tyler (33:16):
Sure. Sure. Sure. And I don't wanna put you on the spot
here, but like, when I think oflike I like to think in in terms
of first principles. And firstprinciples is a way of breaking
down big complex problems intothe smallest portion of the
problem.
And so for me, I ask myself,what is the first principle of
gender? Well, in in in thecurrent use of gender, the first

(33:38):
principle would be thepropagation of the species. So
in order for the human speciesto

Danny (33:43):
Progress.

Tyler (33:43):
To progress or to continue to survive, it we have
to pass on our our genes to thenext generation. We do that
through through the male andfemale species. The second
principle would be, okay, I'm ina medical scenario and I'm about
to provide you some medicationthat could potentially be
impacted by your your genderassigned approach.

Danny (34:07):
Your chemical makeup.

Tyler (34:09):
Right. So has gender changed or does the definition
does the definition that we'reusing to describe gender need to
change? Because I'm all I'm allfor you being a they, them,
zers, z, zics, whatever. But Ithink we need to make sure that
we're we're we're having thesame conversation because I I
truly believe that one party isnot having that they're they're

(34:32):
arguing over the definition of aword. Gender, I don't believe
has changed.
Our need to propagate ourspecies has not changed. Sure.
Right? And and gender may befluid, and there may be multiple
quote unquote genders dependingon how you look at the science.
But the reality is at the at theat the very core of what what I
believe gender to be is is thatthat, you know, biological need

(34:56):
to I agree.
To to to procreate the species.So

Danny (34:59):
And I and I believe like you I believe that you can
describe yourself however youwant to describe yourself. Sure.
I don't care. Yeah. But at theend of the day, you are either a
boy or a girl.

Tyler (35:09):
Sure.

Danny (35:10):
One way or the other. Right. And in my opinion, my my
my personal the my personalfaith Mhmm. Is that God assigned
God Mhmm. Put you into a capsuleRight.
And you chose you chose Yeah.You get to chose. Yeah. You
know, when you're when you're mymy personal opinion is that you

(35:31):
choose Mhmm. Your parents, youchoose your life, and you choose
to be either a boy or a Yeah.
And and modernization and andpeople's thoughts and how we
give people we give the key to,like, your own. No. Be who you
are. Be what you wanna be. Dothis.

(35:52):
It's like, yeah. Yeah. Youshould. Yeah. Right.
Do whatever you wanna do. But atthe end of the day, God did give
you God God you and God cametogether with this together.
Yeah. You know? And again, I,you know, I I have that personal
belief.
Personal it's my personal And ifwe if we talk about it, if you

(36:12):
want to fight your opinion, Iwill give you 100% space and I
will never raise my voice. Iwon't I won't try to tell you
that you're wrong. Mhmm. I won'tI won't treat you any different.
Right.
I won't treat you any differentRight. As long as you don't
treat me any different.

Tyler (36:27):
Right.

Danny (36:27):
Right? And that's that to me is the cool part of learning,
growing, being a vehicle forpeople who need that
clarification and that space oflike, man, your your mind could
be super chaotic.

Tyler (36:46):
Right.

Danny (36:46):
Let's calm it down just a tiny bit, you know. Yeah. And
for you for for that whole ideaof of, you know, how do we
modern and postmodern. Yeah. Howdo you deal with it?
Yeah. How do you how? Like,especially, like, if you're
aggressive about, you know, DAI,Doge, Tesla. I hate I hate

(37:11):
Trump. I hate Biden.
I hate this. It's like, yeah.Okay. Right. Why?

Tyler (37:15):
But and and Did it

Danny (37:17):
really impact your life that

Tyler (37:18):
much? Yeah. Yeah. Is it

Danny (37:19):
really impacting your life that much? Or are you just
so I'm standing firm in the factthat somebody gave me a platform
to be strong and to be Yeah. AndI and this is the only time I
could be strongest. I hateinsert whatever the fuck you
wanna insert.

Tyler (37:35):
Right. 99% of the time, people are just projecting their
view of the world on you. And sothat's why I I think that like
the concept of, like, don't tryto sell me this is the new truth
when it's your perception of thetruth.

Danny (37:49):
I agree.

Tyler (37:49):
We can't have we can't say that there is no such thing
as universal truth whilemandating that other people live
by our dash definition

Danny (37:59):
I agree.

Tyler (37:59):
Definition of truth. Agree. And I'm not I I don't I
think I think this has been avery interesting conversation,
right, where like we're dancingkind of on this we're dancing on
this fault line, right, where wehave we have a fissure between
us as a as a human species. It'sleft, it's right, it's I agree.

(38:19):
It's advocate or it's nonadvocate.
It's the patriarchy, it'sfeminism, it's it's everything
seems to come down to just an aor b bullying decision. And I'm
like, again, we go back to firstproblem. What is the first
problem? It's either is theretruth or is there not truth?

Danny (38:35):
Right.

Tyler (38:35):
What is what does truth look like?

Danny (38:37):
I also believe that you and I, personally, are able to
dance around that fault linepersonally just because we help
because we we we are you know,our our our job or our our
principles or or our what we areput on this earth to do is to

(39:00):
help Yeah. People. Yes. So wecan't we also don't want to,
like Right. Stand on our firmboundaries and our firm lines
and turn off potential peoplewho Right.
May not agree with what we'retalking about. Yeah. But if you
really wanted to get down to thenitty gritty of it, like, I have
my truth. Yeah. I do have mytruth.

(39:21):
Right. And and even if you gotupset with me, even if you told
me that I was wrong, even if youscreamed in my face, spit in my
face, told me I was a piece ofshit, it wouldn't change a
single thing of how I believed.Not one single thing. I wouldn't
change a single thing. I don't Idon't my influences come from
learning Yeah.
From talking, from trustingYeah. And from absorbing factual

(39:48):
relationships. Yes. Factualthings. Factual things.
Like, when we talk, when we havedeep sauna sessions, when we
have deep Mhmm. Deep sessions,when we have, alright, let's
let's all get super drunk ontequila and beer, have Misty
cook us kick her kick ass

Tyler (40:09):
food Yeah.

Danny (40:10):
Sit out by two different fires

Tyler (40:12):
Yeah.

Danny (40:12):
And let's fucking talk. Yeah. And we all walk away from
there. Nobody upset. Everybodybelieving in each other and and
and how beautiful was that?
Yeah. We we literally it wasamazing that night.

Tyler (40:26):
Yeah. Oh, yeah. It was yeah.

Danny (40:28):
And we're talking about the other night. We had a big
party at my house, and tequilawas flowing, beer was flowing.

Tyler (40:35):
The food was delicious.

Danny (40:36):
Food was delicious, and not one voice was raised. Mm-mm.
Not one person got upset. Butthere was some deep heavy
conversations at times Yeah.Where we were like, wow, this is
this is this is heavy.
Yeah. You know, we were and wewere we were all able to, like,
talk. Yeah. Sometimes talk overeach other and

Tyler (40:54):
But that's I mean, and but I think that's I think
that's that's that's where weneed to get to, right? Like how
do we have how do we figure outhow to get back to a place of
balance and civil discourse?

Danny (41:04):
And and who cares if we don't believe and don't agree
with each other. Right? Butlet's love each other.

Tyler (41:09):
Why do I why do I have to be well, I mean, I I understand,
like, I'm starting to come to anunderstanding that, like, when
we look at this projection thatthat people have, I have to be
right. When they are so adamantabout being right, they are
protecting something inthemselves.

Danny (41:24):
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean? So like This
is my boss.

Tyler (41:26):
I'm insecure in my identity. Like if you are truly
secure in your identity, youdon't need fucking confirmation.
Agree. You're you're you'reconfirming, you're validating
yourself.

Danny (41:36):
Right.

Tyler (41:37):
Not in a narcissistic way, but in a way that says, I'm
I'm I'm solid I have a solidunderstanding and and knowledge
of who I am. I have a selfesteem and a self worth that I
can I can carry throughdifficult conversations?

Danny (41:49):
I agree.

Tyler (41:50):
I don't need to become dysregulated. I don't need to
shout. I don't need to, youknow, I can I can

Danny (41:57):
Yeah? Yeah. Yeah.

Tyler (41:57):
You know what mean? I agree. Yeah. I can have a
conversation. And if I'm wrong,I'm wrong.
Or if I'm if I'm if we're in adisagreement and and we
disagree, we we did we justdisagree and we see it we see it
differently. Or perhaps I'mright. I don't need to rub it in
your face. I don't need to win.I don't need to it doesn't need
to be me versus you Sure.
In a in an argument. What whatdoes that really do?

Danny (42:18):
Well, and yeah. And and especially now with the with the
actual point of the there needsto be a winner, there needs to
be Right. There needs to besomebody who's right. Right.
There does come a point whereyou're like, I don't know if I
care.
I don't

Tyler (42:36):
Right? I I I see it as that the the need to be right is
a is a bill of goods thatperhaps capitalism has sold us
based on the idea that there'snot enough of scarcity. Right?
There's scarcity in this world.There's not enough.
True. You know what I mean?There's if if we were really to
kinda get outside of that thatthe concept of there's not

(42:58):
enough because when you create asense of urgency through
scarcity, people are more likelyto buy. Right.

Danny (43:03):
Right.

Tyler (43:03):
Right. Oh, I've only got this one Jeep left. You know,
you go to the car,

Danny (43:06):
go Yeah.

Tyler (43:07):
We only got this one model left and it's this color
is the color you want. Right?They create this scarcity for
you so it drives your compulsivebuying behavior.

Danny (43:14):
Yeah.

Tyler (43:14):
And we we do that on a grander scale. I think we're
seeing that almost weaponized inin political arena

Danny (43:21):
Yeah.

Tyler (43:21):
In in I mean, the social media arena, like, we we we
weaponize

Danny (43:27):
Relationships.

Tyler (43:28):
Relationships.

Danny (43:29):
Relationships. I mean, how often have you personally
thought the grass is greener?The grass is greener. You know?
I mean, I I'm there are timeswhen I thought, like, the grass
was greener.
Yeah. You know? But then I hadto reground myself and be like,

(43:50):
no, fuck that.

Tyler (43:50):
You know where the grass is greenest? Where you fucking
water it. Water it.

Danny (43:54):
Yeah. Where you fertilize it. Yeah. Where you put care.
Into it.

Tyler (43:57):
Yeah. Yeah. You have hard conversations. And you get a
patch that maybe dies and you'vegotta repair that patch. Right?
That's

Danny (44:04):
And I think, like, for you and sorry, mean to cut you
off. You're good. But our ourour you and I sometimes, like,
we sometimes come off asflippant or non caring or, like,
we don't give a shit. But it'snot that, it's just that I want
you to understand that you haveyour own space. Yes.
And whatever I believe doesn'thave to change who you are as a

(44:26):
person. Yes. And whatever youbelieve doesn't have to change
me.

Tyler (44:30):
Right.

Danny (44:31):
My job, personal job is not to change you. Yeah. It's to
guide you and to encourage youto be a better to be better and
to not not find the new the newtoy that's so much better. So or
the new idea that's so muchbetter or the the new principle

(44:54):
that's so much better. Mhmm.
Because I promise you, you knowwhat's gonna happen? You're
gonna fall back to that concreteprinciple that was there before.
Yep. The concrete principle, theconcrete foundation that was
there before. Mhmm.
And when when you when you it isan interesting conversation, and
you can go in differentdirections with it because I

(45:17):
don't want to turn I don't wantto upset anybody. I don't want
to I don't want you to thinkthat, like, I'm this
chauvinistic pig Mhmm. And andand live this life of, like, no.
I'm I'm I no. I fuck up all thetime.
I fuck up. I say stupid shit.Yeah. I do stupid shit. Yeah.
Right? And sometimes, like, mywife is, like, knock it the fuck

(45:39):
off. Yeah. Like, you're you'reyou should hear how you're
talking and I'm thinking, I Idon't hear how I'm talking.
Right.

Tyler (45:45):
And it's okay. Can put me in check. Yeah. You can put me
in check. Yeah.
I I I'm I'm okay with that. Atthe same time, like, what is the
thing? Stand stand for nothingand you'll fall for anything?

Danny (45:57):
Yeah.

Tyler (45:58):
Right? Like that's the thing. There it does need to
become a point where

Danny (46:01):
I'm an oak tree.

Tyler (46:02):
As a man, I don't know if this is necessarily as true for
women, like the need to to bethis. But as a man, I might need
to take a stand.

Danny (46:10):
Yeah. You have to yeah.

Tyler (46:10):
I might to take a stand. Yeah. And it's it's it's not
necessarily that the stand hasto be I'm right or wrong. I'm
taking a stand because it isatypically more of a I don't
even know if I want to say itthat way now that I'm saying it
out loud. Like, it's there is alevel of authority.

(46:32):
There's a level of you seem youseem you seem weaker as a man if
you don't have an opinion.

Danny (46:43):
Or if your opinion changes constantly.

Tyler (46:45):
If you if you're constantly flip flopping. Right?

Danny (46:47):
No. Believe no. Yeah. You're right. No.
Yeah. You're right. You're likeWhat?

Tyler (46:51):
It's I

Danny (46:51):
can tell you anything.

Tyler (46:52):
Right? And I think that's probably why I'm I mean,
obviously, we have thisplatform, the podcast. We share
a lot. I tend to be probably anovershare in a lot of cases.

Danny (47:02):
How many times have we gotten a text message or an
email that said, this is reallywhat you're doing? You're like,

Tyler (47:09):
oh, oops. Yeah.

Danny (47:11):
That is not what I meant.

Tyler (47:13):
Right? Or to, like, leave the hospital and, like, talk to
some of the people I've I've atthe hospital, then, like, they
know they know more about methan I, like, realize that I
told them.

Danny (47:24):
Yeah.

Tyler (47:24):
Yeah. And I'm like, oh, I can't believe I shared all that
with you.

Danny (47:28):
Yeah. You and I are open books. Yeah. We are so open
books. And it's good because,like, the conversation can
continue on Yeah.
And on and But it's an it'sfunny because I don't believe
that in any way, shape, or form,we've changed our who we are,

(47:48):
our values. Yeah. I think westand by who we are. I think we
stand we stand united sometimesof like, no, we're gonna stand.
We're gonna we're we're we haveto make this stand in this
decision Mhmm.
Because we are patriarchal.Yeah. We we really are. I'm a
patriot I'm a I I know I am. Iknow that I know for a fact that
sometimes my boys tell me,nothing I do is enough.

(48:12):
Yeah. And I'm like, that's nottrue. Yeah. That's not true.
Yeah.
It's just that you could domore. Yeah. You know? And and
they're like, that's that's itin itself that in itself is what
I'm trying to tell you. It'slike, no, I get it.
Yeah. I get that. I get thatabout I get that. Yeah. There
there has to be a head.
There has to be the there has tobe the person that's the head.

(48:32):
And my wife is very she has afeminist. She has some feminist
values. She does. I don't And Iencourage some of those things.
Sure. I encourage some of them.And then there's other times
when I have to remind her, like,what you're doing is taking a
stance that I have to defend.And if I don't believe in what
you're saying, then I'm notgonna defend you, but I will

(48:57):
defend you personally.

Tyler (48:59):
Yeah. Right. Right. And I'm not I'm I sure as hell don't
wanna be called up for a warthat you've started on a topic I
don't necessarily

Danny (49:07):
You know my wife. Yeah.

Tyler (49:08):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I I mean, I think you're absolutely
right. I don't think there'sanything wrong inherently with
being a feminist.
I don't think that there'sanything inherently wrong with
being patriarchal or masculine.Right? Like, where we become out
of balance is when we the veryfact that we are out of balance.
Sure. The very fact that wecannot sit and in you know, the

(49:33):
idea the idea would be a yin anda yang.
Right? There's a there's areason why the male and the
female fit together like fuckingLego pieces. Right? And and and
when you look at our physicalbodies, you have to understand
that our mental models are aresimilar. They lock together
similarly and we have to find wehave to find that transcendent
plane where we where we where wemeet.

Danny (49:54):
Sure.

Tyler (49:55):
We cannot personalize our feminism. We cannot personalize
our masculine, you know, ourpatriarchy into into something
toxic for our partner.

Danny (50:04):
I agree. Right? That's a that's a cool way to put it.
Yeah. That's a really coolthat's a cool way to to wrap
around because then, you know,it it it definitely leaves open
more context and more ways oflooking at things.

Tyler (50:21):
Right.

Danny (50:21):
And I'm sure that we'll get a lot of feedback sometimes
about what we talked abouttonight. Yeah. And we, I think
we both have agreed that we'rethat we're going to use our
platform to to entice someconversation and entice, know,
people's questioning Yeah. Whowe are as people because we've

(50:43):
been doing this for a long time.Yeah.
You know, and and we're notgonna shy away from subjects,
context Mhmm. Or who we are aspeople. Yeah. You know? At the
end of the day, like, 100%, Ihave your back.
Yeah. You have my back. Yeah.But we also know that we'll
protect those around us howeverwe see fit.

Tyler (51:02):
Right. And I think that there's some ideas that are
worth protecting.

Danny (51:05):
Sure.

Tyler (51:06):
And sometimes sometimes you need to put your you need
to, you know, stretch your neckout a little bit for those
ideas. I I I will add that we webuilt this platform really with
the concept that men don't getthe the they don't seek the
mental help that they need fromtime to time. Right? We're
building a common unity of menthat build stronger men, not
just for our generation, but thenext generation to come. I

(51:30):
believe in so doing that it willbenefit feminist, non feminist,
whatever that that, you know, byby creating men who are more
confident in who they are, theydon't need they don't need the
the excuse me, the selfprotectionism of breaking that

(51:50):
shit down if that's what peoplewant to believe.
Sure. We'll we'll go about we'llgo up about living our purpose.
But we built this platformadditionally to to if we could
stop one person from harmingthemselves.

Danny (52:02):
Agreed.

Tyler (52:03):
And and we primarily focused on men, but I would add
that the same rings true if Iknew somebody was struggling,
and this happens all the timecoming out of coming out coming
out as as as gay or or whateverin the Mormon church. There are
there are people that thatstruggle so much that they end
up killing themselves over itbecause they cannot fit in.

(52:25):
Yeah. They can't fit into themodel. It's the model that
they're trying to fit in is sorigid and closed that they just
don't fit in and so they harmthemselves.
And for me, that's not okayeither. Mhmm. That's not okay
either. It it would be helpingthem shepherd themselves to a
place of safety and realizingperhaps you don't need
validation from those people.Perhaps we need to validate
ourselves.
And and we need to be happy. Andso I'll add them to that list

(52:48):
of, hey, if you are seriouslyconsidering hurting yourself,
reach out. Like Yeah. You'restruggling. You're struggling.
I'll listen. I may not agree,but I'll listen and I will be a
safe space for you.

Danny (53:00):
And you won't even know that I don't agree.

Tyler (53:03):
Yeah. You won't

Danny (53:03):
I'll I'll give you so much safe space.

Tyler (53:05):
Does not my opinion does not matter.

Danny (53:07):
Yeah. We we talk about this a bunch of times that like
you said, that we, one person,one single man, one single man
Mhmm. If we save that person,that person saves two, three,
four. Now we're compounding thefact that, like, at the end of
the day, men's mental health andhaving the ability to be strong

(53:29):
in your moral compass Mhmm.Matters more than agreeing or
shying away from conflict.
Yep. Yeah. Right? And I do wannasay that we did lose an we did
lose another young man who'soverseas right now. I got a

(53:50):
phone call today that thatanother young man took his life,
and and and we don't want that.
No. And so, you know, we'reputting together a couple care
packages for the troops that areover there right now and that
are dealing with this thing. Andso, you know, keep your mind,
keep your eyes open, keep yourmind open. Remember that there

(54:10):
are there are people over therethat are serving that that are
struggling. Right?
Mhmm. And we need to ensure thatthey're that men are healthy.
Mhmm. You know, men and womenare healthy.

Tyler (54:22):
Mhmm.

Danny (54:22):
And we don't need to force feed them bullshit. Mhmm.
Let's just remember, it's okayto have difference of opinions.
Mhmm. It's okay to stand on yourvalues, and it's okay to have
healthy conflict.
Mhmm. Right? And so that youngman who chose to to take that

(54:45):
route, we feel for him. Yeah.And we feel for him.
We feel Yeah. We feel I I feelstrongly for him because I'm
lucky my boys, you know, theythey they feel strong about
themselves, you know, and so wewanna continue that and we wanna
continue to grow that. Yeah. Andthat's what we're doing this
for. We're doing this tocontinue to grow and to continue
to remind men and women thatthere's something out there that

(55:08):
will help you.
There's somebody out there thatwill listen to you. Yeah. You
know? Yeah. And so the troopsthat are over there and if you
wanna donate, if you wanna givesome give anything, they'll take
anything.
We're gonna put together thepair of cat care packages, I'll
put together on the Instagramwhat they need Yeah. And and
just donate. I'm gonna puttogether a couple things.

Tyler (55:28):
Yeah. I've done a pretty shitty job keeping the Instagram
up and running. Personally, Ijust haven't wanted to spend
time on social media these days.

Danny (55:36):
It's not our it's not our it's not I don't believe it's
our platform.

Tyler (55:38):
It's it's really not. It's not I don't think it's a a
plot I don't know. I I I have somany mixed opinions. Like, I
think I think it's great and Ithink it's terrible all at the
same I know. Like but that'sthat's a whole another episode.
Oh, always. Man, I reallyappreciate this conversation.

Danny (55:54):
You're good.

Tyler (55:54):
I'm I'm grateful as as hell to have you in my life. It

Danny (55:58):
was fun.

Tyler (55:59):
Yeah. Just to chat and

Danny (56:00):
Today was good. We needed today. We haven't we hadn't hung
out with each other like that.Yeah. We have plans for the
weekend.
We're gonna hang out thisweekend. We're gonna get
together and we have summer campcoming up. We have fights. We
have sponsorships available. Wehave we have we we we are

(56:21):
constantly trying to build Mhmm.
Our our what what we're tryingto sell and what we're trying to
do for people

Tyler (56:28):
Yeah.

Danny (56:29):
Which is just overall health, overall well-being Mhmm.
Overall trust in in what you'redoing, and don't don't take it
the wrong way. Don't take whatwe said the wrong way today. You
know? We're passionate.
We get going, and we talk. Thisis a lot of times what happens
is is you would Yeah. Starttalking. And luckily for us,
most of the time, our moralvalues encompasses align with

(56:52):
each other. Yeah.
And so we don't ever have to,like, have disagreements. And
I'm always, like, grateful aboutthat, you know, because because
we we agree along the same Yeah.Party lines. Yeah. You

Tyler (57:03):
know? It's it's it it really is. And it's it's I mean,
but at the same time, you'vealso you've also challenged me.
You've challenged some of my ownbeliefs. You've, you know,
caused me to spread my wings andstretch a little bit.
And I and I'm I really amgrateful for that. I'm even
though I may seem resistant atfirst, I take a little bit I
take a little bit to to to warmup to it. I really

Danny (57:22):
Talking on the each shoulder. Tyler, gotta do it.
Tyler, go go go. Yeah.

Tyler (57:26):
Yeah. So grateful for you. So what do you got coming
up in the next couple weeks?

Danny (57:33):
We are working pretty hard with we have I I put
together a men's group Yeah.That that you're a part of that
we are that's growing. I'vegotten lots of phone calls and
text messages from those guysthat are appreciative of it. We
are planting at the Oconeehousehold.

Tyler (57:54):
I

Danny (57:54):
am constantly planting flowers, moving things around
that Misty wants. She likes tomove flowers around that and I
try to save them. I try to keepthem healthy. Yeah. And that's
really honestly, like, wethere's so much going into

(58:15):
summer camp right now that I'mpretty

Tyler (58:16):
Yeah.

Danny (58:16):
Pretty headstrong in that. And then

Tyler (58:19):
Do you have the dates for camp again?

Danny (58:20):
Yeah. July. '7 black belt fights, three brown belt fights,
and they're gonna be fun. It'sgonna be a good time. I think
it's gonna be a really goodcamp, summer camp.
Lots of people coming in. I'mworking a lot. Misty's working a
lot because we're we're going toMexico soon, and we're just

(58:43):
trying to we're we're thebiggest thing that we're trying
to do is, like I told you, I'mtrying to decide if I'm gonna
stick around after December atmy job or if I'm gonna just call
it quits in December and move onto something else. And that's
kind of what we're taking inright now.

Tyler (58:55):
An exciting an exciting new adventure.

Danny (58:57):
And you? Let's see. You have kids are out of school?

Tyler (59:00):
Kids are out of school. Tomorrow's tomorrow's the last
day.

Danny (59:02):
Let's go.

Tyler (59:03):
I'm excited for them. They've they've worked hard.
They both all of them have gotgood grades. I will be headed to
Denver, July Twelfth through thefifteenth. I'm going to
volunteer at the Tap Out CancerJujitsu tournament there.

Danny (59:21):
Let's go.

Tyler (59:23):
My hope is that we will get a Tap Out Cancer tournament
here in Salt Lake.

Danny (59:29):
Let's

Tyler (59:29):
go. But that's that's one of my own proclivities. A lot of
people don't know this, but likeSalt Lake, LDS General actually
leads the country in blood basedcancer research and or like they
are the the hospital that I wasin is literally one of the
highest ranked hospitals forblood borne cancers. And I've

(59:52):
been really blessed not justhaving insurance. You know, a
lot of people, you know, havingthis kind of sickness still end
up having major major bills.
I was the benefactor of a agrant that helped pay for a lot
of my has helped me pay for alot of my medication.

Danny (01:00:09):
I

Tyler (01:00:12):
surprised myself and made some really good adult decisions
at my last open open enrollment.So I'm not feeling the the
financial pressure, but the onething about being the the
healthiest person in my unit forthat month that I was there is
that I witnessed a lot of peoplethat were suffering and, you

(01:00:32):
know, know that things likethese grants, things like this
this money helps them Good. Justease some of that that stress.
Because if you're stressed andyou're trying to recover from
cancer

Danny (01:00:42):
Doesn't happen.

Tyler (01:00:43):
It's just it's just not healthy. And let's be honest,
Utah has a great history ofjujitsu here Sure. In this this
valley. I think we'd we'dbenefit really well from having
a cool a cool tournament thatI'm stoked. That people could
raise awareness with.
So I will start raising moneyfor Park City Jiu Jitsu. So

(01:01:04):
whatever money I end up raisingfor Park City Jiu Jitsu will be
the Park City Jiu Jitsu donationthat goes to Top Out Cancer. And
then so I'll be working I'llalso be working a scoring booth
for for the tournament inDenver. For using. Since I kinda
have those skills.

Danny (01:01:19):
That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Again, that yeah. I'm
super grateful for thisconversation and and we we
welcome and appreciate anyfeedback, any concerns, anything
that you think that Tyler and Iare full of shit on or that you
agree on Yeah.
We we love we love that. And ifyou see Tyler and I around, by

(01:01:42):
all means, like, hit us up, talkto us. We're gonna have the bus
out Oh, okay. Over the weekend.So excited.
We're gonna drive around. We'regonna be in Park City. We will
be on July 5. We will be at theSUP festival at Deer no. No.
Sorry. At Jordan L. We'll be onthe beach. We'll have the bus

(01:02:03):
out. We will be hanging outthere.
We may be even live broadcastingYeah. If we can, if if if you
have the day off. July 5, I'mracing. I'm gonna do the race.
So if anybody else wants to comeout and challenge me, we're
gonna I'm I'm doing the racewith for that.
And, yeah, we'll be around. Thebus will be out. We'll be I

(01:02:25):
think that we're gonna do acouple farmers market. We're
gonna do a couple flowers withsome people that are gonna put
their flowers out of the bus,and we'll go hang out there and
set up the bus and do that.

Tyler (01:02:35):
That'll be awesome.

Danny (01:02:36):
I think we got we got that going on. The summer's
gonna be fun.

Tyler (01:02:38):
It's here. It's eighty eighty degrees already.

Danny (01:02:40):
I can't wait.

Tyler (01:02:40):
Can't wait.

Danny (01:02:41):
K.

Tyler (01:02:41):
Well, I appreciate it everybody. Thank you. We'll see
you on the next episode.

Danny (01:02:44):
See you guys.