January 7, 2025 • 43 mins
Would you like to start the new year with a harmonious home? Meet parenting coach Debbie Kravitz of Growing Change Parent Coaching. Listen in as she shares invaluable insights on fostering deep connections with your children, navigating various parenting styles, and the impact of technology on family interactions. Listeners will gain practical tips and strategies for becoming more effective and supportive parents, ultimately emphasizing the importance of connection in raising emotionally healthy children......and um.....parents!
• Discusses her journey from teaching to coaching
• Explains the evolution of parenting styles
• Highlights the significance of establishing clear boundaries
• Focuses on the boundaries needed for screentime
• Offers actionable strategies for building stronger family connections
• Encourages understanding and valuing different parenting styles
• Discusses the importance of empathy and emotional regulation in family dynamics
• Emphasizes that parenting is a journey of growing together
You do not want to miss this episode!
Growing Change Parent Coaching
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi Jeanette, Hi Rachel.
Today we have a phenomenalepisode with someone that I love
very much.
Her name is Debbie Kravitz.
She has been an early childhoodeducator for more than 30 years
.
She's been teaching and guidingparents and children, but now
she is mostly teaching parents.
(00:20):
She is a parenting coach, andit's called Growing Change
Parenting Coaching because, asyou'll understand from this
episode, she's really coachingparents on how to be better
parents, find connection withtheir children, no matter what
your parenting style is.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
I like that.
I like that.
You know it's not about that.
Our kids brains are stilltrying to figure out, you know,
until he's 26, I'd say maybe 56,but yeah, yeah.
So it's a great episode withlots of tips.
You'll be really surprised.
You'll learn some things thatyou've never heard before.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
There's a lot of parenting noise out there, I
think you know, especially onsocial media and all these tips
and tricks and whatever.
We've heard a lot of differentperspectives on parenting as a
culture, but I think Debbiereally crystallizes key things
that everyone can benefit from,Even if your kids are young
(01:46):
adults.
You'll be able to get somethingfrom this episode.
Hi, Debbie, Thank you so muchfor coming on.
Lost in Jersey.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
I am thrilled to be here with you both.
We're so excited.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Yes, and for everyone to know, I know Debbie because
I was the very, very fortunatehuman being that got to have my
daughter June, have her twoyears in a row at the Montclair
Co-op as her teacher.
And what's so wonderful overthere at the Co-op for the I was
only there for the early ages,but is that parents assist in
(02:26):
the classroom, so I got toreally see firsthand how magical
Debbie is with kids.
It and it taught me a lot aboutmy own parenting.
Welcome, debbie, and we'd loveto first hear how you got to New
Jersey and then we can talkmore about what you're doing
today.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
All right.
So 26 years ago we moved herefrom Brooklyn, like everybody
else that my husband and I arereally are from Brooklyn, born
there, and so we're our threekids, and we lived in Park Slope
like everybody else and we havethree children.
(03:05):
They're grown and so now, butat the time they were quite
small and we needed, of course,more space and I never saw
myself living in a suburb, Inever really saw myself leaving
Brooklyn.
But here we are and I had areally rough transition like
moving to the suburbs andacclimating to Montclair, and we
(03:28):
moved in the middle of theschool year, in December, and it
was the snowiest winter of mylife.
I never knew snow every singleday.
It was like snow chains inschool and it was like a whole
new reality for me.
I had a really rough go at itand fast forward.
26 years later, I never want toleave Montclair.
(03:51):
That is a very common story yeahit worked its magic on you,
yeah, and we know we have suchfirm roots here and such a
wonderful life.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
Do you remember when the shift happened to accepting
Because you said you had areally hard time transitioning.
Do you remember?
Have you ever been like youknow?
I remember when I all of asudden was like, okay, this is
home.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
It happened when our youngest went to Rand and that's
when I kind of met parents thatwere like me.
My older two we moved in themiddle of the school year.
They couldn't get into RAND sothey were put into Hillside
Initial Wayne and that wasn'treally quite my jam Then went to
(04:37):
RAND.
Like everything changed for me.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Is it more artsy?
What was the vibe that wasdifferent for me?
Is it more artsy?
What was the what was the vibethat was different?
It?
Speaker 3 (04:45):
felt more like like Brooklyn people that were in my
life, you know.
It was just a different kind ofvibe and I became like really
involved in the school, even asa working mom.
But that was like a shift andit took a couple of years for me
to get there and you know.
And then I started makingfriendships with parents that
(05:07):
were like me and I found poorgroup.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Well, so you got.
You got into the school systemand did you?
How did you become a parentingcoach?
Is that, was that something youwere always involved in, or was
that evolved over time?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
It evolved over time.
When I first moved to MontclairI started teaching at Union
Congregational over on CooperAvenue.
So I was there for a long time.
I taught threes there and afterlike 10 years there I went to
the co-op and I was at the co-opfor a long time.
I taught threes and then pre-Kand after like a lot of years
(05:42):
teaching I had also taught inBrooklyn.
I've been a teacher for a longtime Parent teacher conferences
were becoming more and moreinteresting.
They were starting to includemore challenges that parents
were having at home.
They weren't only talking aboutschool, they were becoming more
about the whole child at schooland at home.
I got to see that the need isgreat for parent support and I
(06:09):
never heard of parent coaching.
I didn't even know such aprofession existed.
But my job in being a teacherespecially when you teach at the
co-op you're more than ateacher.
You really do become a part ofeveryone's family in your own
way without crossing anyboundaries.
But there really is aninclusivity there and one day I
(06:34):
took an adult ed class inMontclair at night with another
teacher friend of mine and itwas there that I learned about
parent coaching and it likeelectrified me when I learned
about it Came home and I startedsearching for programs and I
was really surprised that parentcoaching as its own niche
(06:57):
exists and you can go to aparent coaching school.
There's lots of life coachingschools and coaching programs
but I really knew I wanted tohone in just on parent coaching
and I found a program and, likegoing back to college, I had to
get references and get mytranscript from college.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
I made it happen and made it happen Right.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
Right and apply and get accepted and you know, went
back to school.
But the fun part is when schoolstarted.
It started in March of 2020.
Oh, my goodness, the world wentcrazy.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Well, it seems like then there was a lot going on
about parenting styles withinthe home, so it was perfect.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
It really magnified everything.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
Yes, so it came at a crazy time of schools, when
virtual including my own rightso even preschool teachers
became online teachers.
So you know you're now teachingpre-K on Zoom.
I happened to have COVID.
I was one of the first peopleto have COVID on.
I got COVID on March 17th 2020.
(08:06):
Wow, and started coachingschool.
They all were fine.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Wow, that's intense.
You probably learned thingsthat if that event did not
happen, that you know it wouldhave been more rote.
I mean like the old school ways, but they just introduced a
whole new.
Like you were learning in realtime.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
You know, parents were so scared right.
There was so much fear ineverybody.
It was so brutally hard.
Everyone was working from home.
But I had a chance to giveparents structure to help make
this a little bit easier.
To help make this a little biteasier.
So, like every day, we gave theparents like their own homework
(08:48):
, like the schedule of what theday will look like today.
So it gave them some shape andform to an otherwise out of
control feeling.
Yeah, of being mysterious andreally, really hard.
So like we even factored in fortheir day when the kids are
going to eat lunch.
Of being mysterious and really,really hard.
So like we even factored in fortheir day when the kids are
(09:08):
going to eat lunch and whenthey're going to have like a
break and have free time, andwhat to do with that free time,
how they're going to go throughtheir garbage and look for
recyclables and bring it backout to us, and what we're going
to do with those found materials.
We really helped give them someshape to a shapeless day.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
One thing that I'm really interested to talk to you
about is all the differentparenting styles there are out
there.
I have to admit, I saw thisthing a few years ago, where
there's all these differentparenting styles.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
You mean like attachment parenting?
Yeah, free range parenting.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Being in the classroom for as many years as I
have, I think I've got to seethem all.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah you definitely have, so do you assess.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Do you do you?
When you talk to parents thatcome to you, do you assess what
their parenting style is firstand then try to work within that
parenting style, or bringing inmore inclusive other styles in
or something?
It's a really great question.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
So when I first start working with a client, we're
really working on trust andgetting to know each other and
creating a relationship, and themodel that I use is a
positive-based model based onpositive psychology.
We do get to uncover theirparenting style, but not until
around session number four,because in the first few
(10:31):
sessions we're really getting toknow each other and me, getting
to know what their strengthsare and where the life and the
joy is in their family and whatit is they want to accomplish.
When we find that out, then Igive them an assessment to do
(10:51):
and it doesn't judge them.
It lets them know what theirparenting strengths are.
It doesn't say you're a goodparent or bad parent, it just
says this is your dominantparenting style and these are
all the positives of thatparenting style and with those
positives also comes thechallenges parenting style.
(11:12):
And with those positives alsocomes the challenges.
And the challenges of thisparticular parenting style is
what some parents need help topush through.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
What's the percentage of time when you meet with
parents and they're on the samepage and they're not on the same
page?
I'm always curious about that,because there are definitely
times, obviously over the yearsthat we've been parenting, that
Bill and I are like exactly onthe same page, we have a similar
style.
And then there are othersituations where it's like we're
both aliens and we're coming atit from a total, from our own
(11:40):
baggage, obviously, from our ownchildhood.
What do you find?
Speaker 3 (11:44):
sometimes we'll we'll have a parent with the same
dominant parenting style.
That happens sometimes, butmost of the time it's a mixture
which helps, because then it'sgiving the children more right.
They're not only getting thesame parenting style from two
parents.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
That is very interesting that you said that I
like that.
You just said that Because mostpeople believe that you should
be on the same page, right,because most people believe that
you should be on the same page,right?
Is there certain things thatyou should be on the same page
about, like maybe the goals?
You're saying that it'sactually good to have two
parents, like you know.
When they say, go ask mom, goask dad, you know that kind of
(12:22):
thing.
It's like you know mom alwayssays yes, or dad, you know that
kind of thing.
That might actually be a goodthing.
You're saying.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
It can be a great thing, especially if one parent
is quite rigid and the otherparent is more flexible.
Interesting because we can seerigidity as being like super
uptight.
But with rigidity can comeclear limits and boundaries yeah
.
And if the other parent hassome flexibility, clear limits
and boundaries yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
And if the other parent has some flexibility,
then a child is learning both.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
Yeah, I love that I love hearing that.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
I mean, that seems so new.
I've never heard that before.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Yeah, I've never heard anyone else say that.
And also I think, with lookingat our kids now that are in
college, when they're figuringout other relationships with
either a significant other orwith other friends or people
from other communities, it isgood for them to have an idea of
there's many ways to go aboutthis thing called life.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Right.
I think that that's a greatlife.
Lesson is that people aredifferent.
Sometimes there's going to be amad parent, you know, in the
room, you know.
So I think that's interesting.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
And don't get me wrong, it's really important for
parents to be aligned incertain areas, but not in
everything.
Yeah, it helps if core valuesare in alignment.
Right that you know our familyis charitable.
You know that that's a corevalue to us, that we as a family
(13:52):
believe in serving others like.
That's awesome, but we don'thave to be alike in everything,
because that's not genuine, it'salso not really possible, and
it means that somebody has togive up being their authentic
self for the other.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
We had talked briefly a bit before about parenting
tips and things that are likereally core, that can help
people.
What I loved is that you saidit was to help build strong
connections.
At the end of the day, what youreally want is a good, strong
connection with your child,which will then be the basis for
everything else that happens.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
So that is like really the essence of what it is
.
We're looking to tighten andembolden, because without that
connection, it doesn't matterhow many tips and strategies me
or anyone gives you, it won't belong lasting, it will be very,
very temporary and it's allfixable At all ages and stages
(14:51):
of life.
It's fixable.
How do you build thoseconnections?
It starts with setting clearand consistent boundaries.
You want to be reallyconsistent every day, which
means that the routine is thesame every day, so that the
child has a sense of safety andknows what to expect.
Every day has a structure and aroutine that is comfortable.
(15:14):
When you teach early childhoodeducation, you know that that is
like one of the most importantparts of making a successful
classroom is that the childrenknow what to expect all day long
so that they can transitionfrom one thing to another.
Then there's the importance ofpositive reinforcement and mild
(15:35):
praise.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
Mild praise.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Mild praise yeah Right, we don't have to go crazy
, but mild praise, this is great.
And we want more of thiswithout overdoing it.
Yeah, we want more of thiswithout overdoing it.
Yeah, because when we overdo it, then we have a child that is
always seeking praise and I callthem praise junkies and they
(15:59):
constantly need youracknowledgement, and that has
its own problem.
Right, yeah, yeah, yeah, andit's annoying.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Well, there's also the, there's also the.
You know the.
The flip side of that is when aparent you, you know, you see
this and you know books andwhatever in your own life that
one parent is very hard toplease, you know, and that
you're always seeking their, youknow, you're always trying to
make them acknowledge you andthey never do.
Speaker 3 (16:30):
That's true.
Yeah, we can talk about that alot, especially with the
influence of devices taking ourattention away.
That is truly true, and kidshave to work really hard at
getting their parents connectionand they do that in the only
way they know how to, and oftenit's by misbehaving and they
(16:51):
don't realize they're doing it,but they but that.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
That's what they're doing.
They're seeking attention.
Speaker 3 (16:56):
I like to reframe that, that they're not seeking
attention.
I like to reframe it as theyare seeking connection, okay, in
the only way they know how,that if they knew a different
way they would do it, so it'slike to make the parent look up
from their phone or their laptopor their work they have to do
something pretty drastic or it'snot going to happen.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Sometimes that is really true, it's an interesting
thing because there's so muchfocus put on the kids and
devices these days that I'mnoticing and I'm hearing the
shift to the adult, because theadult has become just as
culpable of, you know, beingoverusing or too connected to
(17:39):
the.
I don't know if it's going tochange because I mean, this is
how we do our work, I mean thisis how we're doing this, this is
how you do everything.
Everything is connected to thisand how to find these structure
, to make that time and connect,as you said, to the world
around us, not not only our kids, but the world you know it's
not going to change right.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Phones aren't going anywhere.
They're only going to becomemore complex and we don't even
know what they're going to belike in 10 years from now.
But if we don't put in a limitand a boundary with how we
relate to our phones, then ourchildren are going to continue
to do these things to let usknow that they need us.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
What do we do when it's like, but the parent is
doing it?
You know it's like, how do wenot do it in front of our kids?
It's almost like.
You know it's like drinking orsomething.
It's like how do you not bedrinking all the time in front
of your?
You know you can't do it, but Ican do it.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
That's a good example that you gave.
Do you choose to drink in frontof your child all the time?
I would hope that most parentsconsciously don't, right,
because you know that you aresetting an example of your
relationship with alcohol or anysubstance my child is watching,
(18:59):
yeah, all the time.
Boundary with our relationshipwith our phone.
Then how will our childrenunderstand how to put in limits
and boundaries with theirdevices or anything in their
life?
We are constantly setting theexample.
(19:21):
And for working parents thathave like two phones a work
phone and a personal phone andthat work phone is constantly
pinging, what message is ourchild receiving?
Right, that this is my priority?
Speaker 1 (19:38):
It's a really complicated.
It's a mixed message kind offor the kid, because you're
physically there but you're not.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
You're not present, right.
They are connected to us.
They know what we are feeling.
They know when we are feelingtense, they know when we are
frustrated, they know when weare sad.
They know when we are joyful.
They are a part of us.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Working with you in the classroom and with my own
kids and their differentpersonalities took a lot to
really hammer home the idea thatI can't take everything they do
personally, because it is aboutwhat they're needing.
And then, if I'm not regulatedin my own feelings, we both
(20:19):
escalate each other.
The comfort of a solid motheror father at the moment that's
okay in themselves and can sortof give them that strength for
the moment that they need it,rather than escalating the two
(20:39):
of us.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Exactly, and then you can co-regulate.
Each of you help the other tocalm down and have this back and
forth.
Yes, where your warmth andpresence radiates to your child,
they receive it and they'reable to get it back to you.
I always remind parents thatit's parent coaching, it's not
(21:02):
your child coaching.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
It's a really complicated thing because of the
fact of the new way that wework and parents do have stress,
they do have these pressures ofneeding trying to find that.
You know, how do you manage notshowing it to your kid while
you're in the same house withthem?
You know it's.
It's very complex.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Yeah it.
It is very complex and it'spossible.
There has to be a willingnessright To be reflective, to look
within and, like Rachel said, tobe more conscious of your
parenting.
What it is that I might bedoing that is contributing to
this hardship right now.
What are the words I'm choosingto use?
(21:46):
What is my facial expressionlike?
Am I reacting or am Iresponding?
Speaker 1 (21:53):
That's also.
It's like the differencebetween reacting and responding
could be like 10 deep breaths orleaving the room.
I used to give myself timeoutswhen the kids were young.
When I felt myself losing it, Iwas like I'm going to go
upstairs.
Just give me five minutes,maybe 10, and I'll be back,
(22:13):
cause I know whatever I sayright now is insane.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
But that is a tool in your toolkit all the time that
you can do that.
Yeah, your rational brain cansay Whoa, mom is overwhelmed,
mom is going to do something sothat she can calm herself down.
And then I'm coming right backand we'll figure it out together
(22:38):
.
That, rachel, is how childrenlearn how to self regulate, to
cope.
Yeah, how to deal, they learnfrom you by watching what you do
, and every time you step awayto get it together, you're
teaching them that they havethat ability too.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Well, that brings me to when parents fight, because
you know, of course, there's,you know, varying levels, like
some people that never, everargue, and then there's some
people that argue all the time,constantly fighting, and then
there's the you know, thespectrum of you know, whatever
it is, and I think that we fallin the spectrum.
(23:17):
You know, sometimes we fightand sometimes it's gotten really
bad.
Right, I'm always like shh,don't let them hear, you know
you don't want to, you know youdon't want to, you know that
kind of thing.
And then he'll be like theyneed to learn that we fight and
then we get over it.
And I do agree with that and Ithink that that's true.
What is your thoughts on familyparents fighting, that both?
Speaker 3 (23:36):
are true, and let me just like be very clear that I
am not a therapist.
Okay, I do not have have youknow background, I you know, so
I am, I mean.
I am a parent coach.
Okay, um, that both are true.
Yeah, that not allconversations should be heard by
(23:58):
children their children, andthey deserve to stay in a
child's world at the same time.
Yes, m and dads fight, justlike siblings fight, and we talk
about it and we make it better.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Do you tell people to put themselves in the other's
shoes?
A lot I feel like I'mconstantly saying to do that,
but I want them to be able tounderstand the other person and
I get so frustrated when my kidsdon't.
Speaker 3 (24:28):
I want parents to put themselves in their child's
feet, not in their shoes, intheir feet.
That empathy is critical inthese tips that we were talking
about earlier.
Yeah, that empathy is acritical piece and that we want
our children to be empathetic intheory, but they don't know how
(24:50):
to be that unless we model thatall the time.
But to understand that theirbrain is immature and
undeveloped and it is that wayuntil they're 26 years old.
Right, they have a growing,evolving brain.
Some conversations do notbelong in the ears of children
because they just simply do notunderstand and they will do all
(25:15):
they know to do to make sense ofit and it may not be right.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Right as we move on to our connect, the connecting
paradigm of tips.
That yeah about people's umisolating or the social
connection to people in theworld today, um, as we have been
reading and we see amongstourselves even, and our
(25:40):
teenagers and our younger kidsmaking less eye contact, they're
less, you know, extroverted um,they're not dating as much like
you hear all these things goingaround and we see it in our own
lives too.
The other day, I would say I'vemade a lot of mistakes.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
My kids, my.
My son was a waiter at arestaurant and he was like mom
you know, a lot of times thekids in the restaurant have
their headphones on and I waslike I go, I have screwed up so
much on you guys, but that's theone thing you were never
allowed to do is look at adevice at the table at dinner,
yeah, even at home.
No, yeah, if anything, I'm theone now that's like wait, let me
(26:22):
check.
You know, you know, but yeah, I, that's the probably the only
thing I did.
Good, so why?
Why?
Speaker 3 (26:29):
did you do that?
Why did you make a there are nodevices at the table kind of
culture in your, your home?
Why did you do that?
Speaker 2 (26:38):
um, I felt like it was the one place that we could
maybe talk about other things.
You know, like it just somehowlearned to communicate, and I
just also thought it lookedterrible.
I just thought it just thoughtit seemed, it just felt wrong.
It just felt wrong.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
Okay.
So what I think I'm hearing isthat you were looking for
connection with your children atthat time of day.
Yeah, right, it's anopportunity for connection.
Yeah, there is no connection ifsomeone has headphones on and a
screen in front of them.
Right, we know that.
(27:15):
If the choice is between youand the device, we know where
the child's interests are goingto go.
Right, clear as a bell.
And there's this pivotal bookthat's out right now the Anxious
Generation.
Yeah, I read it and everyoneshould be reading it, and it is
the explanation for why childrenare indoors so much, having
(27:39):
trouble with their socialrelationships, not outside, not
in nature, not going to thestore to buy mom, you know, a
container of milk at WatsonPlaza.
They're not.
They're not engaging with theworld.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
You think that's another thing of fear.
Is that parents have maybe anirrational fear of letting kids
outside, or it's a fear ofupsetting them, or what is it
that's preventing parents fromputting in stronger boundaries
around screens they don't wantto?
Speaker 3 (28:13):
Here's an example.
My husband and I were on WalnutStreet about three years ago.
We were on Walnut Street, oneof my favorite streets in
Montclair, and there was alovely young couple with a brand
new baby in a beautifulcarriage, like not a stroller,
like a, a beauty right, and thisis a teeny, tiny new baby.
(28:36):
And on the handle of thisbeautiful carriage was phone
facing this baby playing.
Wow, wow.
That seems so crazy that thatwould be, or a baby where they
walked and made boo-boo soundand say, right, you hear the
(29:00):
birds, the other birds rightyeah, doing that I mean putting
ourselves back into those years.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
I remember because we didn't have the phone I
remember just Milo screaming inthe stroller, just it was just
so embarrassing.
Right, add that with Ellie.
But like you know, you're justwalking with your kid just
completely losing their mind andyou're just trying anything to
(29:29):
make them quiet.
So I mean I understand thisthing is a magic device, yeah,
to make it stop if you're on theairplane.
Do you guys remember flyingwith your kid on the airplane
and everybody wants your kid toshut the fuck up?
Speaker 3 (29:46):
you're, you're right, you know, flying, flying.
There's all kinds of exceptionsfor for airplanes.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
You're like you can, yeah, totally I agree.
Speaker 3 (29:57):
I coach a lot of parents and a lot of parents
have a similar complaint.
Their kids are not eating atthe table, they're eating their
food, dinner is taking an hour,they can't sit still and their
kid is on an iPad.
Once they figure out what isgetting in the way, it's that
they're watching YouTube videosat the table and remember their
(30:19):
brain is immature and they can'tdo both.
They can't eat and watch thisvideo.
They can only do one of thosethings.
Once the parent gets strongenough to eliminate all devices
from the table always for momand dad too they start eating
better.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
I do believe that we can adjust and make changes and
have hope that, even though youknow we may have made many
mistakes and are constantlymaking mistakes, we can always
work towards improving.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Yes, and it is hard, and it's going to be harder to
take away a device rather thanhave never introduced it in the
first place.
Right, like a pacifier, right,my kids use the pacifier as well
.
But the beautiful thing about apacifier is like oh my God, god
, I can't find it anywhere.
Right, you can't find it like Idon't know.
(31:12):
Right, you can do that.
You can do that with a phonetoo, but it's a lot harder.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
withdrawal is very different yeah, I think that's
why it was so interesting.
Janet, you mentioned likealcohol.
You know that it modelingalcohol and you wouldn't do it
all day long.
Yeah, you wouldn't be sittingthere like hey, honey it is a
withdrawal um, when you see yourkid, when you take a device
away, um, and they really arestruggling, but then, like two
(31:42):
days later, they're in like sucha better mood and everything is
much better, and you're like,oh, it really is like a drug.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Well, if we connected even more to the addiction of
drugs and alcohol.
They usually say it takes aboutthree days to get over the
physical connection to thewithdrawal and then you, you
know, probably maybe three, alittle more than three days for
the, because you got to go andyou see your friend with it, and
anyway they don't have themental capacity to understand,
(32:12):
you know, and they're come backwith it.
I wanted to bring up something,as we're coming to the end,
that I have recently stumbledupon that I actually love, about
a new kind of thing that'shappening in parenting.
Two things One I'll just sayreally quickly is I noticed I
saw these through reels thatinstead of saying I'm proud of
(32:33):
you, they people are being.
You're not supposed to say thatanymore.
It's like it's like it's like I.
It's like are you proud ofyourself, did you?
You know, it's like, it's sotricky, like to shift your cause
.
I was filling out thegraduation thing and I was like
I'm wait good.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Just love, yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
No, I don't know, I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
There's anything wrong with being proud and
letting your child know that.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (33:05):
But we want them to be able to be proud of
themselves as well.
Yeah, so that they're notlooking for your validation all
the time yes, but that they growtheir own.
You know self-esteem by knowingthat they just tackled a really
hard math problem and figuredit out Right, that you
(33:26):
persevered.
Yeah, it was hard and you stuckwith it and you got it yeah,
but when I got through a year ofcoaching school and got my
certification, I'm a petitewoman.
I was three inches taller.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Were you proud of yourself.
I was really proud, I reallywas.
I really got through somethingbig.
I'm going to just say it I'mproud of you, thank you.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
It was big, you know, but I did get to just finish
with you just talking about.
You know the parenting tips.
Yeah, you know deeperconnection, yeah, so we talked
about, like you know, the clearand consistent boundaries and
mild praise.
Don't have to go crazy, butlet's remember to encourage
(34:19):
independence, and I always tellparents in school don't do for
your child what they're capableof doing for themselves.
Yeah, that's really good.
And the child that refuses toput on their socks and shoes?
When they know how to put ontheir socks and shoes, there's a
reason they're not doing it.
They're seeking something.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
They need something and they're not getting it, and
so, then, might as well askyourself what is it that they
need, rather than thinking thatthey're frustrating you on
purpose.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Exactly, and they're just trying to make you late
that we model calm, respectfulcommunication.
The way we talk to them is theway they will learn to talk to
us in return.
Right yeah, that we fosterproblem-solving skills, that we
let them figure it out with usas their partner on standby, but
(35:14):
we let them come up withsolutions.
That we limit screen time andthat we put in clear limits and
boundaries, and that changes atdifferent ages, but we stick to
it.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Yeah, I think that's important too is sticking to it.
We stick to it.
Speaker 3 (35:31):
That will promote their social, emotional life
outside the home, that they goback to having playdates and I
know sleepovers is not a thinganymore and I can't believe it,
but now they're calledsleep-unders.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
I know what is that I don't know what that is.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
What is it a sleep under?
Yeah, they go home, right, theygo they can stay late, right,
but they don't actually sleep attheir friend's house but how
are they gonna sneak out?
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I mean, that is part of growing up exactly, but not
anymore.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
You see how complex this is, how there's so little
trust, right?
Well, I mean, I think that, ohmy gosh.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
That is just really showing how, because there's so
little trust in our society andwith our own neighbors that it's
affecting our children and howthey're going to grow up, oh
gosh.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Yeah, that sleepovers are a thing.
Oh gosh, yeah, that'ssleepovers, everything of the
past.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Yeah, I'm so grateful that we had so many sleepovers
and tragic, terrifying momentsthat mean it made it made for a
life and everybody got through.
You know, think about that.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
If your child is so mistrusting of the world, of the
universe, what do you do whenyou get lost?
You need directions, you know,you know like 100% struggle and
figure it out.
But parents swoop in to savethe day and every time we do
that we are preventing them fromlearning a life skill.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
Also teaching them that they can't do it by
themselves, that we don't thinkthey can do it.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
They can't.
Did you watch and I hope youdid on Netflix?
I think it's called Big Enough.
It's either called Big Enoughor Old Enough.
No, it's a Japanese reality TVshow.
They take the subway bythemselves, they're wearing a
tracking device which they don'tknow.
(37:39):
They're thinking they'rewearing an amulet and there's
farmer crews running after them.
They're never alone, butthey're without their parent and
they're sent on an errand bythemselves.
To like, cross the street, goto the store, pick up four
things and come back they'relike three what they're?
(38:01):
In a diaper, in a in a lot bythe heavy diaper.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
That's fascinating.
Speaker 3 (38:08):
All kinds of challenges, all kinds of
challenges.
It's fantastic, it's so cool.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
You know the good news about.
I think the good news aboutthis conversation is, even
though there's a lot happeningright now with, like, the book,
the Anxious Generation, is thatthere's some corrections are
happening.
You know, I think in all youknow, like all areas, we're
starting to see it.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
We're protecting them and caring for them and afraid
for them, but then we're notconnecting with them.
We're not connecting with them.
They're like driving us crazy.
So we like trap them likeanimals in the house, but we're
not like paying attention tothem.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (38:45):
Like, when was the last time I think about?
If a parent goes to a child andsays I've got like three half
hour, what do you want to dotogether?
Like what would that feel liketo a five year old, to a 10 year
old?
Speaker 1 (39:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:01):
I'm all yours.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
What do you want to do?
That's pretty magical.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Right, yeah, I mean, I remember doing that with them
and they don't want to hang outwith you.
Speaker 3 (39:14):
But there are those stolen moments.
I used to have some of my bestconversations with my daughters,
like just in the car driving toSharon Miller's dance studio
Yep, in that 10 minute drive.
Yeah, they were just momentsfor connection.
It doesn't have to be, you know, something like orchestrated
(39:34):
and planned in a trip to Disneyworld.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
Going to the store, yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:40):
Right when you are attuned to them.
They know it and feel it, yeah,and the more they're with us
when we meet them where they are, then they're not so resistant
to be with us again the nexttime.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Can you explain that, Because I think it makes sense
to me intellectually.
But what does that look like asmeeting them where they are?
Speaker 3 (40:01):
Take a step back and understand them at their age and
stage in their development, andit's especially true with
teenagers that are reallylearning to separate themselves
from their parents and they'reworking really hard at creating
an identity in some way.
But to me, where they are is tounderstand where they are in
(40:22):
their development and what it isthey are about to appreciate
them for the child that they are.
We can't change them.
All we can do is appreciatethem.
They change themselves becausewe get them.
We've met them where they are.
If your child is shy right Likesuper shy what does it feel like
(40:44):
if you say like go kiss AuntMartha and you make them like
Aunttha's going to feel reallyhurt if you don't kiss her hello
or kiss her goodbye, oh well,what would it feel like if you
said to aunt martha june's notreally into giving kisses, she
likes to wait and then I guessthat's validating that them that
(41:06):
they're okay for the way theyare right and you have to kiss
aunt martha, and they're okayfor the way they are Right and
you don't have to kiss anymore,and they're constantly evolving,
so we have to grow with them.
That's why my practice is calledGrowing Change, because we are
growing change in ourselves asparents and how we understand
our child, and that we growalongside them, because we have
(41:28):
to grow together.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
It's so nice to have had this conversation.
I think this will be a reallyhelpful episode for every parent
out there, no matter what stagetheir kid is in.
Speaker 3 (41:42):
I'm so glad I love doing this with you both.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Great Well, thank you so much we really appreciated
that, and we both.
I think my big takeaway wasthat the well there's many, but
I really, really enjoyedlearning that it's okay to not
be on the same page.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
Yeah it is.
Will you give us a quick shoutout to something that you love
about?
New Jersey Can be anything.
Speaker 3 (42:08):
Oh my gosh.
Well, it's called the gardenstate for a reason, like, I am
always like wowed by everybody'sgarden.
But farm stands, farmer'smarkets I just love the farmer's
market.
I love that there's oneeverywhere you go in New Jersey
and they're just amazing.
But it's just a.
(42:29):
It's a great place to raise afamily and Montclair has just
been an amazing bonus in ourlife and we just love it here.
And actually now that our kidscome back as adults, they see
Montclair in a whole new waythat they didn't as children
growing up here.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
That's good you get it right, they get it.
Yeah, Well, we're glad to haveyou here and we're glad to have
had you on the podcast.
So thank you so much for comingon.
Speaker 3 (42:56):
Thank you so much.
Have a great day, everybody,you too.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Thank you, Debbie.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
Bye, bye-bye.
Speaker 1 (43:05):
This podcast is produced by Rachel Martens and
Jeanette Afsharian.
Please follow us on Facebookand Instagram.
We hope you share this pod withyour friends and family and let
us know what you think.
Check out our website atlostinjerseysite and don't
forget to get lost.
Hi Jeanette, Hi Rachel.
Today we have a phenomenalepisode with someone that I love
very much.
Her name is Debbie Kravitz.
She has been an early childhoodeducator for more than 30 years
.
She's been teaching and guidingparents and children, but now
she is mostly teaching parents.
(00:20):
She is a parenting coach, andit's called Growing Change
Parenting Coaching because, asyou'll understand from this
episode, she's really coachingparents on how to be better
parents, find connection withtheir children, no matter what
your parenting style is.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
I like that.
I like that.
You know it's not about that.
Our kids brains are stilltrying to figure out, you know,
until he's 26, I'd say maybe 56,but yeah, yeah.
So it's a great episode withlots of tips.
You'll be really surprised.
You'll learn some things thatyou've never heard before.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
There's a lot of parenting noise out there, I
think you know, especially onsocial media and all these tips
and tricks and whatever.
We've heard a lot of differentperspectives on parenting as a
culture, but I think Debbiereally crystallizes key things
that everyone can benefit from,Even if your kids are young
(01:46):
adults.
You'll be able to get somethingfrom this episode.
Hi, Debbie, Thank you so muchfor coming on.
Lost in Jersey.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
I am thrilled to be here with you both.
We're so excited.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Yes, and for everyone to know, I know Debbie because
I was the very, very fortunatehuman being that got to have my
daughter June, have her twoyears in a row at the Montclair
Co-op as her teacher.
And what's so wonderful overthere at the Co-op for the I was
only there for the early ages,but is that parents assist in
(02:26):
the classroom, so I got toreally see firsthand how magical
Debbie is with kids.
It and it taught me a lot aboutmy own parenting.
Welcome, debbie, and we'd loveto first hear how you got to New
Jersey and then we can talkmore about what you're doing
today.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
All right.
So 26 years ago we moved herefrom Brooklyn, like everybody
else that my husband and I arereally are from Brooklyn, born
there, and so we're our threekids, and we lived in Park Slope
like everybody else and we havethree children.
(03:05):
They're grown and so now, butat the time they were quite
small and we needed, of course,more space and I never saw
myself living in a suburb, Inever really saw myself leaving
Brooklyn.
But here we are and I had areally rough transition like
moving to the suburbs andacclimating to Montclair, and we
(03:28):
moved in the middle of theschool year, in December, and it
was the snowiest winter of mylife.
I never knew snow every singleday.
It was like snow chains inschool and it was like a whole
new reality for me.
I had a really rough go at itand fast forward.
26 years later, I never want toleave Montclair.
(03:51):
That is a very common story yeahit worked its magic on you,
yeah, and we know we have suchfirm roots here and such a
wonderful life.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
Do you remember when the shift happened to accepting
Because you said you had areally hard time transitioning.
Do you remember?
Have you ever been like youknow?
I remember when I all of asudden was like, okay, this is
home.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
It happened when our youngest went to Rand and that's
when I kind of met parents thatwere like me.
My older two we moved in themiddle of the school year.
They couldn't get into RAND sothey were put into Hillside
Initial Wayne and that wasn'treally quite my jam Then went to
(04:37):
RAND.
Like everything changed for me.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Is it more artsy?
What was the vibe that wasdifferent for me?
Is it more artsy?
What was the what was the vibethat was different?
It?
Speaker 3 (04:45):
felt more like like Brooklyn people that were in my
life, you know.
It was just a different kind ofvibe and I became like really
involved in the school, even asa working mom.
But that was like a shift andit took a couple of years for me
to get there and you know.
And then I started makingfriendships with parents that
(05:07):
were like me and I found poorgroup.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Well, so you got.
You got into the school systemand did you?
How did you become a parentingcoach?
Is that, was that something youwere always involved in, or was
that evolved over time?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
It evolved over time.
When I first moved to MontclairI started teaching at Union
Congregational over on CooperAvenue.
So I was there for a long time.
I taught threes there and afterlike 10 years there I went to
the co-op and I was at the co-opfor a long time.
I taught threes and then pre-Kand after like a lot of years
(05:42):
teaching I had also taught inBrooklyn.
I've been a teacher for a longtime Parent teacher conferences
were becoming more and moreinteresting.
They were starting to includemore challenges that parents
were having at home.
They weren't only talking aboutschool, they were becoming more
about the whole child at schooland at home.
I got to see that the need isgreat for parent support and I
(06:09):
never heard of parent coaching.
I didn't even know such aprofession existed.
But my job in being a teacherespecially when you teach at the
co-op you're more than ateacher.
You really do become a part ofeveryone's family in your own
way without crossing anyboundaries.
But there really is aninclusivity there and one day I
(06:34):
took an adult ed class inMontclair at night with another
teacher friend of mine and itwas there that I learned about
parent coaching and it likeelectrified me when I learned
about it Came home and I startedsearching for programs and I
was really surprised that parentcoaching as its own niche
(06:57):
exists and you can go to aparent coaching school.
There's lots of life coachingschools and coaching programs
but I really knew I wanted tohone in just on parent coaching
and I found a program and, likegoing back to college, I had to
get references and get mytranscript from college.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
I made it happen and made it happen Right.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
Right and apply and get accepted and you know, went
back to school.
But the fun part is when schoolstarted.
It started in March of 2020.
Oh, my goodness, the world wentcrazy.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Well, it seems like then there was a lot going on
about parenting styles withinthe home, so it was perfect.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
It really magnified everything.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
Yes, so it came at a crazy time of schools, when
virtual including my own rightso even preschool teachers
became online teachers.
So you know you're now teachingpre-K on Zoom.
I happened to have COVID.
I was one of the first peopleto have COVID on.
I got COVID on March 17th 2020.
(08:06):
Wow, and started coachingschool.
They all were fine.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Wow, that's intense.
You probably learned thingsthat if that event did not
happen, that you know it wouldhave been more rote.
I mean like the old school ways, but they just introduced a
whole new.
Like you were learning in realtime.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
You know, parents were so scared right.
There was so much fear ineverybody.
It was so brutally hard.
Everyone was working from home.
But I had a chance to giveparents structure to help make
this a little bit easier.
To help make this a little biteasier.
So, like every day, we gave theparents like their own homework
(08:48):
, like the schedule of what theday will look like today.
So it gave them some shape andform to an otherwise out of
control feeling.
Yeah, of being mysterious andreally, really hard.
So like we even factored in fortheir day when the kids are
going to eat lunch.
Of being mysterious and really,really hard.
So like we even factored in fortheir day when the kids are
(09:08):
going to eat lunch and whenthey're going to have like a
break and have free time, andwhat to do with that free time,
how they're going to go throughtheir garbage and look for
recyclables and bring it backout to us, and what we're going
to do with those found materials.
We really helped give them someshape to a shapeless day.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
One thing that I'm really interested to talk to you
about is all the differentparenting styles there are out
there.
I have to admit, I saw thisthing a few years ago, where
there's all these differentparenting styles.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
You mean like attachment parenting?
Yeah, free range parenting.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Being in the classroom for as many years as I
have, I think I've got to seethem all.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah you definitely have, so do you assess.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Do you do you?
When you talk to parents thatcome to you, do you assess what
their parenting style is firstand then try to work within that
parenting style, or bringing inmore inclusive other styles in
or something?
It's a really great question.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
So when I first start working with a client, we're
really working on trust andgetting to know each other and
creating a relationship, and themodel that I use is a
positive-based model based onpositive psychology.
We do get to uncover theirparenting style, but not until
around session number four,because in the first few
(10:31):
sessions we're really getting toknow each other and me, getting
to know what their strengthsare and where the life and the
joy is in their family and whatit is they want to accomplish.
When we find that out, then Igive them an assessment to do
(10:51):
and it doesn't judge them.
It lets them know what theirparenting strengths are.
It doesn't say you're a goodparent or bad parent, it just
says this is your dominantparenting style and these are
all the positives of thatparenting style and with those
positives also comes thechallenges parenting style.
(11:12):
And with those positives alsocomes the challenges.
And the challenges of thisparticular parenting style is
what some parents need help topush through.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
What's the percentage of time when you meet with
parents and they're on the samepage and they're not on the same
page?
I'm always curious about that,because there are definitely
times, obviously over the yearsthat we've been parenting, that
Bill and I are like exactly onthe same page, we have a similar
style.
And then there are othersituations where it's like we're
both aliens and we're coming atit from a total, from our own
(11:40):
baggage, obviously, from our ownchildhood.
What do you find?
Speaker 3 (11:44):
sometimes we'll we'll have a parent with the same
dominant parenting style.
That happens sometimes, butmost of the time it's a mixture
which helps, because then it'sgiving the children more right.
They're not only getting thesame parenting style from two
parents.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
That is very interesting that you said that I
like that.
You just said that Because mostpeople believe that you should
be on the same page, right,because most people believe that
you should be on the same page,right?
Is there certain things thatyou should be on the same page
about, like maybe the goals?
You're saying that it'sactually good to have two
parents, like you know.
When they say, go ask mom, goask dad, you know that kind of
(12:22):
thing.
It's like you know mom alwayssays yes, or dad, you know that
kind of thing.
That might actually be a goodthing.
You're saying.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
It can be a great thing, especially if one parent
is quite rigid and the otherparent is more flexible.
Interesting because we can seerigidity as being like super
uptight.
But with rigidity can comeclear limits and boundaries yeah
.
And if the other parent hassome flexibility, clear limits
and boundaries yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
And if the other parent has some flexibility,
then a child is learning both.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
Yeah, I love that I love hearing that.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
I mean, that seems so new.
I've never heard that before.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Yeah, I've never heard anyone else say that.
And also I think, with lookingat our kids now that are in
college, when they're figuringout other relationships with
either a significant other orwith other friends or people
from other communities, it isgood for them to have an idea of
there's many ways to go aboutthis thing called life.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Right.
I think that that's a greatlife.
Lesson is that people aredifferent.
Sometimes there's going to be amad parent, you know, in the
room, you know.
So I think that's interesting.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
And don't get me wrong, it's really important for
parents to be aligned incertain areas, but not in
everything.
Yeah, it helps if core valuesare in alignment.
Right that you know our familyis charitable.
You know that that's a corevalue to us, that we as a family
(13:52):
believe in serving others like.
That's awesome, but we don'thave to be alike in everything,
because that's not genuine, it'salso not really possible, and
it means that somebody has togive up being their authentic
self for the other.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
We had talked briefly a bit before about parenting
tips and things that are likereally core, that can help
people.
What I loved is that you saidit was to help build strong
connections.
At the end of the day, what youreally want is a good, strong
connection with your child,which will then be the basis for
everything else that happens.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
So that is like really the essence of what it is
.
We're looking to tighten andembolden, because without that
connection, it doesn't matterhow many tips and strategies me
or anyone gives you, it won't belong lasting, it will be very,
very temporary and it's allfixable At all ages and stages
(14:51):
of life.
It's fixable.
How do you build thoseconnections?
It starts with setting clearand consistent boundaries.
You want to be reallyconsistent every day, which
means that the routine is thesame every day, so that the
child has a sense of safety andknows what to expect.
Every day has a structure and aroutine that is comfortable.
(15:14):
When you teach early childhoodeducation, you know that that is
like one of the most importantparts of making a successful
classroom is that the childrenknow what to expect all day long
so that they can transitionfrom one thing to another.
Then there's the importance ofpositive reinforcement and mild
(15:35):
praise.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
Mild praise.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Mild praise yeah Right, we don't have to go crazy
, but mild praise, this is great.
And we want more of thiswithout overdoing it.
Yeah, we want more of thiswithout overdoing it.
Yeah, because when we overdo it, then we have a child that is
always seeking praise and I callthem praise junkies and they
(15:59):
constantly need youracknowledgement, and that has
its own problem.
Right, yeah, yeah, yeah, andit's annoying.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Well, there's also the, there's also the.
You know the.
The flip side of that is when aparent you, you know, you see
this and you know books andwhatever in your own life that
one parent is very hard toplease, you know, and that
you're always seeking their, youknow, you're always trying to
make them acknowledge you andthey never do.
Speaker 3 (16:30):
That's true.
Yeah, we can talk about that alot, especially with the
influence of devices taking ourattention away.
That is truly true, and kidshave to work really hard at
getting their parents connectionand they do that in the only
way they know how to, and oftenit's by misbehaving and they
(16:51):
don't realize they're doing it,but they but that.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
That's what they're doing.
They're seeking attention.
Speaker 3 (16:56):
I like to reframe that, that they're not seeking
attention.
I like to reframe it as theyare seeking connection, okay, in
the only way they know how,that if they knew a different
way they would do it, so it'slike to make the parent look up
from their phone or their laptopor their work they have to do
something pretty drastic or it'snot going to happen.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Sometimes that is really true, it's an interesting
thing because there's so muchfocus put on the kids and
devices these days that I'mnoticing and I'm hearing the
shift to the adult, because theadult has become just as
culpable of, you know, beingoverusing or too connected to
(17:39):
the.
I don't know if it's going tochange because I mean, this is
how we do our work, I mean thisis how we're doing this, this is
how you do everything.
Everything is connected to thisand how to find these structure
, to make that time and connect,as you said, to the world
around us, not not only our kids, but the world you know it's
not going to change right.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Phones aren't going anywhere.
They're only going to becomemore complex and we don't even
know what they're going to belike in 10 years from now.
But if we don't put in a limitand a boundary with how we
relate to our phones, then ourchildren are going to continue
to do these things to let usknow that they need us.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
What do we do when it's like, but the parent is
doing it?
You know it's like, how do wenot do it in front of our kids?
It's almost like.
You know it's like drinking orsomething.
It's like how do you not bedrinking all the time in front
of your?
You know you can't do it, but Ican do it.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
That's a good example that you gave.
Do you choose to drink in frontof your child all the time?
I would hope that most parentsconsciously don't, right,
because you know that you aresetting an example of your
relationship with alcohol or anysubstance my child is watching,
(18:59):
yeah, all the time.
Boundary with our relationshipwith our phone.
Then how will our childrenunderstand how to put in limits
and boundaries with theirdevices or anything in their
life?
We are constantly setting theexample.
(19:21):
And for working parents thathave like two phones a work
phone and a personal phone andthat work phone is constantly
pinging, what message is ourchild receiving?
Right, that this is my priority?
Speaker 1 (19:38):
It's a really complicated.
It's a mixed message kind offor the kid, because you're
physically there but you're not.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
You're not present, right.
They are connected to us.
They know what we are feeling.
They know when we are feelingtense, they know when we are
frustrated, they know when weare sad.
They know when we are joyful.
They are a part of us.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Working with you in the classroom and with my own
kids and their differentpersonalities took a lot to
really hammer home the idea thatI can't take everything they do
personally, because it is aboutwhat they're needing.
And then, if I'm not regulatedin my own feelings, we both
(20:19):
escalate each other.
The comfort of a solid motheror father at the moment that's
okay in themselves and can sortof give them that strength for
the moment that they need it,rather than escalating the two
(20:39):
of us.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Exactly, and then you can co-regulate.
Each of you help the other tocalm down and have this back and
forth.
Yes, where your warmth andpresence radiates to your child,
they receive it and they'reable to get it back to you.
I always remind parents thatit's parent coaching, it's not
(21:02):
your child coaching.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
It's a really complicated thing because of the
fact of the new way that wework and parents do have stress,
they do have these pressures ofneeding trying to find that.
You know, how do you manage notshowing it to your kid while
you're in the same house withthem?
You know it's.
It's very complex.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Yeah it.
It is very complex and it'spossible.
There has to be a willingnessright To be reflective, to look
within and, like Rachel said, tobe more conscious of your
parenting.
What it is that I might bedoing that is contributing to
this hardship right now.
What are the words I'm choosingto use?
(21:46):
What is my facial expressionlike?
Am I reacting or am Iresponding?
Speaker 1 (21:53):
That's also.
It's like the differencebetween reacting and responding
could be like 10 deep breaths orleaving the room.
I used to give myself timeoutswhen the kids were young.
When I felt myself losing it, Iwas like I'm going to go
upstairs.
Just give me five minutes,maybe 10, and I'll be back,
(22:13):
cause I know whatever I sayright now is insane.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
But that is a tool in your toolkit all the time that
you can do that.
Yeah, your rational brain cansay Whoa, mom is overwhelmed,
mom is going to do something sothat she can calm herself down.
And then I'm coming right backand we'll figure it out together
(22:38):
.
That, rachel, is how childrenlearn how to self regulate, to
cope.
Yeah, how to deal, they learnfrom you by watching what you do
, and every time you step awayto get it together, you're
teaching them that they havethat ability too.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Well, that brings me to when parents fight, because
you know, of course, there's,you know, varying levels, like
some people that never, everargue, and then there's some
people that argue all the time,constantly fighting, and then
there's the you know, thespectrum of you know, whatever
it is, and I think that we fallin the spectrum.
(23:17):
You know, sometimes we fightand sometimes it's gotten really
bad.
Right, I'm always like shh,don't let them hear, you know
you don't want to, you know youdon't want to, you know that
kind of thing.
And then he'll be like theyneed to learn that we fight and
then we get over it.
And I do agree with that and Ithink that that's true.
What is your thoughts on familyparents fighting, that both?
Speaker 3 (23:36):
are true, and let me just like be very clear that I
am not a therapist.
Okay, I do not have have youknow background, I you know, so
I am, I mean.
I am a parent coach.
Okay, um, that both are true.
Yeah, that not allconversations should be heard by
(23:58):
children their children, andthey deserve to stay in a
child's world at the same time.
Yes, m and dads fight, justlike siblings fight, and we talk
about it and we make it better.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Do you tell people to put themselves in the other's
shoes?
A lot I feel like I'mconstantly saying to do that,
but I want them to be able tounderstand the other person and
I get so frustrated when my kidsdon't.
Speaker 3 (24:28):
I want parents to put themselves in their child's
feet, not in their shoes, intheir feet.
That empathy is critical inthese tips that we were talking
about earlier.
Yeah, that empathy is acritical piece and that we want
our children to be empathetic intheory, but they don't know how
(24:50):
to be that unless we model thatall the time.
But to understand that theirbrain is immature and
undeveloped and it is that wayuntil they're 26 years old.
Right, they have a growing,evolving brain.
Some conversations do notbelong in the ears of children
because they just simply do notunderstand and they will do all
(25:15):
they know to do to make sense ofit and it may not be right.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Right as we move on to our connect, the connecting
paradigm of tips.
That yeah about people's umisolating or the social
connection to people in theworld today, um, as we have been
reading and we see amongstourselves even, and our
(25:40):
teenagers and our younger kidsmaking less eye contact, they're
less, you know, extroverted um,they're not dating as much like
you hear all these things goingaround and we see it in our own
lives too.
The other day, I would say I'vemade a lot of mistakes.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
My kids, my.
My son was a waiter at arestaurant and he was like mom
you know, a lot of times thekids in the restaurant have
their headphones on and I waslike I go, I have screwed up so
much on you guys, but that's theone thing you were never
allowed to do is look at adevice at the table at dinner,
yeah, even at home.
No, yeah, if anything, I'm theone now that's like wait, let me
(26:22):
check.
You know, you know, but yeah, I, that's the probably the only
thing I did.
Good, so why?
Why?
Speaker 3 (26:29):
did you do that?
Why did you make a there are nodevices at the table kind of
culture in your, your home?
Why did you do that?
Speaker 2 (26:38):
um, I felt like it was the one place that we could
maybe talk about other things.
You know, like it just somehowlearned to communicate, and I
just also thought it lookedterrible.
I just thought it just thoughtit seemed, it just felt wrong.
It just felt wrong.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
Okay.
So what I think I'm hearing isthat you were looking for
connection with your children atthat time of day.
Yeah, right, it's anopportunity for connection.
Yeah, there is no connection ifsomeone has headphones on and a
screen in front of them.
Right, we know that.
(27:15):
If the choice is between youand the device, we know where
the child's interests are goingto go.
Right, clear as a bell.
And there's this pivotal bookthat's out right now the Anxious
Generation.
Yeah, I read it and everyoneshould be reading it, and it is
the explanation for why childrenare indoors so much, having
(27:39):
trouble with their socialrelationships, not outside, not
in nature, not going to thestore to buy mom, you know, a
container of milk at WatsonPlaza.
They're not.
They're not engaging with theworld.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
You think that's another thing of fear.
Is that parents have maybe anirrational fear of letting kids
outside, or it's a fear ofupsetting them, or what is it
that's preventing parents fromputting in stronger boundaries
around screens they don't wantto?
Speaker 3 (28:13):
Here's an example.
My husband and I were on WalnutStreet about three years ago.
We were on Walnut Street, oneof my favorite streets in
Montclair, and there was alovely young couple with a brand
new baby in a beautifulcarriage, like not a stroller,
like a, a beauty right, and thisis a teeny, tiny new baby.
(28:36):
And on the handle of thisbeautiful carriage was phone
facing this baby playing.
Wow, wow.
That seems so crazy that thatwould be, or a baby where they
walked and made boo-boo soundand say, right, you hear the
(29:00):
birds, the other birds rightyeah, doing that I mean putting
ourselves back into those years.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
I remember because we didn't have the phone I
remember just Milo screaming inthe stroller, just it was just
so embarrassing.
Right, add that with Ellie.
But like you know, you're justwalking with your kid just
completely losing their mind andyou're just trying anything to
(29:29):
make them quiet.
So I mean I understand thisthing is a magic device, yeah,
to make it stop if you're on theairplane.
Do you guys remember flyingwith your kid on the airplane
and everybody wants your kid toshut the fuck up?
Speaker 3 (29:46):
you're, you're right, you know, flying, flying.
There's all kinds of exceptionsfor for airplanes.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
You're like you can, yeah, totally I agree.
Speaker 3 (29:57):
I coach a lot of parents and a lot of parents
have a similar complaint.
Their kids are not eating atthe table, they're eating their
food, dinner is taking an hour,they can't sit still and their
kid is on an iPad.
Once they figure out what isgetting in the way, it's that
they're watching YouTube videosat the table and remember their
(30:19):
brain is immature and they can'tdo both.
They can't eat and watch thisvideo.
They can only do one of thosethings.
Once the parent gets strongenough to eliminate all devices
from the table always for momand dad too they start eating
better.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
I do believe that we can adjust and make changes and
have hope that, even though youknow we may have made many
mistakes and are constantlymaking mistakes, we can always
work towards improving.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Yes, and it is hard, and it's going to be harder to
take away a device rather thanhave never introduced it in the
first place.
Right, like a pacifier, right,my kids use the pacifier as well
.
But the beautiful thing about apacifier is like oh my God, god
, I can't find it anywhere.
Right, you can't find it like Idon't know.
(31:12):
Right, you can do that.
You can do that with a phonetoo, but it's a lot harder.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
withdrawal is very different yeah, I think that's
why it was so interesting.
Janet, you mentioned likealcohol.
You know that it modelingalcohol and you wouldn't do it
all day long.
Yeah, you wouldn't be sittingthere like hey, honey it is a
withdrawal um, when you see yourkid, when you take a device
away, um, and they really arestruggling, but then, like two
(31:42):
days later, they're in like sucha better mood and everything is
much better, and you're like,oh, it really is like a drug.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Well, if we connected even more to the addiction of
drugs and alcohol.
They usually say it takes aboutthree days to get over the
physical connection to thewithdrawal and then you, you
know, probably maybe three, alittle more than three days for
the, because you got to go andyou see your friend with it, and
anyway they don't have themental capacity to understand,
(32:12):
you know, and they're come backwith it.
I wanted to bring up something,as we're coming to the end,
that I have recently stumbledupon that I actually love, about
a new kind of thing that'shappening in parenting.
Two things One I'll just sayreally quickly is I noticed I
saw these through reels thatinstead of saying I'm proud of
(32:33):
you, they people are being.
You're not supposed to say thatanymore.
It's like it's like it's like I.
It's like are you proud ofyourself, did you?
You know, it's like, it's sotricky, like to shift your cause
.
I was filling out thegraduation thing and I was like
I'm wait good.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Just love, yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
No, I don't know, I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
There's anything wrong with being proud and
letting your child know that.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (33:05):
But we want them to be able to be proud of
themselves as well.
Yeah, so that they're notlooking for your validation all
the time yes, but that they growtheir own.
You know self-esteem by knowingthat they just tackled a really
hard math problem and figuredit out Right, that you
(33:26):
persevered.
Yeah, it was hard and you stuckwith it and you got it yeah,
but when I got through a year ofcoaching school and got my
certification, I'm a petitewoman.
I was three inches taller.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Were you proud of yourself.
I was really proud, I reallywas.
I really got through somethingbig.
I'm going to just say it I'mproud of you, thank you.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
It was big, you know, but I did get to just finish
with you just talking about.
You know the parenting tips.
Yeah, you know deeperconnection, yeah, so we talked
about, like you know, the clearand consistent boundaries and
mild praise.
Don't have to go crazy, butlet's remember to encourage
(34:19):
independence, and I always tellparents in school don't do for
your child what they're capableof doing for themselves.
Yeah, that's really good.
And the child that refuses toput on their socks and shoes?
When they know how to put ontheir socks and shoes, there's a
reason they're not doing it.
They're seeking something.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
They need something and they're not getting it, and
so, then, might as well askyourself what is it that they
need, rather than thinking thatthey're frustrating you on
purpose.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Exactly, and they're just trying to make you late
that we model calm, respectfulcommunication.
The way we talk to them is theway they will learn to talk to
us in return.
Right yeah, that we fosterproblem-solving skills, that we
let them figure it out with usas their partner on standby, but
(35:14):
we let them come up withsolutions.
That we limit screen time andthat we put in clear limits and
boundaries, and that changes atdifferent ages, but we stick to
it.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Yeah, I think that's important too is sticking to it.
We stick to it.
Speaker 3 (35:31):
That will promote their social, emotional life
outside the home, that they goback to having playdates and I
know sleepovers is not a thinganymore and I can't believe it,
but now they're calledsleep-unders.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
I know what is that I don't know what that is.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
What is it a sleep under?
Yeah, they go home, right, theygo they can stay late, right,
but they don't actually sleep attheir friend's house but how
are they gonna sneak out?
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I mean, that is part of growing up exactly, but not
anymore.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
You see how complex this is, how there's so little
trust, right?
Well, I mean, I think that, ohmy gosh.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
That is just really showing how, because there's so
little trust in our society andwith our own neighbors that it's
affecting our children and howthey're going to grow up, oh
gosh.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Yeah, that sleepovers are a thing.
Oh gosh, yeah, that'ssleepovers, everything of the
past.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Yeah, I'm so grateful that we had so many sleepovers
and tragic, terrifying momentsthat mean it made it made for a
life and everybody got through.
You know, think about that.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
If your child is so mistrusting of the world, of the
universe, what do you do whenyou get lost?
You need directions, you know,you know like 100% struggle and
figure it out.
But parents swoop in to savethe day and every time we do
that we are preventing them fromlearning a life skill.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
Also teaching them that they can't do it by
themselves, that we don't thinkthey can do it.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
They can't.
Did you watch and I hope youdid on Netflix?
I think it's called Big Enough.
It's either called Big Enoughor Old Enough.
No, it's a Japanese reality TVshow.
They take the subway bythemselves, they're wearing a
tracking device which they don'tknow.
(37:39):
They're thinking they'rewearing an amulet and there's
farmer crews running after them.
They're never alone, butthey're without their parent and
they're sent on an errand bythemselves.
To like, cross the street, goto the store, pick up four
things and come back they'relike three what they're?
(38:01):
In a diaper, in a in a lot bythe heavy diaper.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
That's fascinating.
Speaker 3 (38:08):
All kinds of challenges, all kinds of
challenges.
It's fantastic, it's so cool.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
You know the good news about.
I think the good news aboutthis conversation is, even
though there's a lot happeningright now with, like, the book,
the Anxious Generation, is thatthere's some corrections are
happening.
You know, I think in all youknow, like all areas, we're
starting to see it.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
We're protecting them and caring for them and afraid
for them, but then we're notconnecting with them.
We're not connecting with them.
They're like driving us crazy.
So we like trap them likeanimals in the house, but we're
not like paying attention tothem.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (38:45):
Like, when was the last time I think about?
If a parent goes to a child andsays I've got like three half
hour, what do you want to dotogether?
Like what would that feel liketo a five year old, to a 10 year
old?
Speaker 1 (39:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:01):
I'm all yours.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
What do you want to do?
That's pretty magical.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Right, yeah, I mean, I remember doing that with them
and they don't want to hang outwith you.
Speaker 3 (39:14):
But there are those stolen moments.
I used to have some of my bestconversations with my daughters,
like just in the car driving toSharon Miller's dance studio
Yep, in that 10 minute drive.
Yeah, they were just momentsfor connection.
It doesn't have to be, you know, something like orchestrated
(39:34):
and planned in a trip to Disneyworld.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
Going to the store, yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:40):
Right when you are attuned to them.
They know it and feel it, yeah,and the more they're with us
when we meet them where they are, then they're not so resistant
to be with us again the nexttime.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Can you explain that, Because I think it makes sense
to me intellectually.
But what does that look like asmeeting them where they are?
Speaker 3 (40:01):
Take a step back and understand them at their age and
stage in their development, andit's especially true with
teenagers that are reallylearning to separate themselves
from their parents and they'reworking really hard at creating
an identity in some way.
But to me, where they are is tounderstand where they are in
(40:22):
their development and what it isthey are about to appreciate
them for the child that they are.
We can't change them.
All we can do is appreciatethem.
They change themselves becausewe get them.
We've met them where they are.
If your child is shy right Likesuper shy what does it feel like
(40:44):
if you say like go kiss AuntMartha and you make them like
Aunttha's going to feel reallyhurt if you don't kiss her hello
or kiss her goodbye, oh well,what would it feel like if you
said to aunt martha june's notreally into giving kisses, she
likes to wait and then I guessthat's validating that them that
(41:06):
they're okay for the way theyare right and you have to kiss
aunt martha, and they're okayfor the way they are Right and
you don't have to kiss anymore,and they're constantly evolving,
so we have to grow with them.
That's why my practice is calledGrowing Change, because we are
growing change in ourselves asparents and how we understand
our child, and that we growalongside them, because we have
(41:28):
to grow together.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
It's so nice to have had this conversation.
I think this will be a reallyhelpful episode for every parent
out there, no matter what stagetheir kid is in.
Speaker 3 (41:42):
I'm so glad I love doing this with you both.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Great Well, thank you so much we really appreciated
that, and we both.
I think my big takeaway wasthat the well there's many, but
I really, really enjoyedlearning that it's okay to not
be on the same page.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
Yeah it is.
Will you give us a quick shoutout to something that you love
about?
New Jersey Can be anything.
Speaker 3 (42:08):
Oh my gosh.
Well, it's called the gardenstate for a reason, like, I am
always like wowed by everybody'sgarden.
But farm stands, farmer'smarkets I just love the farmer's
market.
I love that there's oneeverywhere you go in New Jersey
and they're just amazing.
But it's just a.
(42:29):
It's a great place to raise afamily and Montclair has just
been an amazing bonus in ourlife and we just love it here.
And actually now that our kidscome back as adults, they see
Montclair in a whole new waythat they didn't as children
growing up here.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
That's good you get it right, they get it.
Yeah, Well, we're glad to haveyou here and we're glad to have
had you on the podcast.
So thank you so much for comingon.
Speaker 3 (42:56):
Thank you so much.
Have a great day, everybody,you too.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Thank you, Debbie.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
Bye, bye-bye.
Speaker 1 (43:05):
This podcast is produced by Rachel Martens and
Jeanette Afsharian.
Please follow us on Facebookand Instagram.
We hope you share this pod withyour friends and family and let
us know what you think.
Check out our website atlostinjerseysite and don't
forget to get lost.
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