October 17, 2025 • 39 mins
Abby and Alan talk about the middle films in the Friday the 13th franchise: Part 5 through Part 8.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_02 (00:18):
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode
of the Lunatics Radio HourPodcast.
I'm Abby Brinker, sitting herewith Alan Kudan.
SPEAKER_00 (00:27):
Hello.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
And today we are continuing our discussion of the
Friday the 13th horrorfranchise.
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
We like this franchise.
SPEAKER_02 (00:35):
We do.
I'm having a lot of fun watchingit.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
It's great.
SPEAKER_02 (00:38):
It is great.
It's it's a lot more fun than Ithought it was gonna be.
SPEAKER_00 (00:41):
A lot more fun.
It's it's it's honestly verydifferent.
Like, yeah, I was reallyexpecting this to be like
Halloween.
It's a pretty heavy duty slasherfranchise, and like Friday 13th
is like a pinnacle slasherfranchise.
However, I feel like Friday the13th perfectly bridges the gap
(01:02):
between mm the seriousness ofMichael Myers and the goofy,
silly bitchness of FreddieKruger.
Yeah.
Apparently, I actually I saw Isaw this as a meme.
He only says bitch asurprisingly few amount of times
in the entire series.
And the vast majority of thesetimes are in the movie Freddie
(01:22):
versus Jason.
SPEAKER_02 (01:23):
Oh, I'm so excited to watch that.
SPEAKER_00 (01:26):
But that's that's part three.
So we're actually only going totalk about the middle four
movies of five, six, seven,eight.
Yep.
So this is gonna be like alittle mini episode or a bridge
episode.
SPEAKER_02 (01:36):
Because there's gonna be so much to talk about
when we get to nine and beyond.
And and there's a lot to talkabout with these, but those ones
are just so iconic, and there'sa lot of really crazy jump in
the shark moments to get into.
SPEAKER_00 (01:49):
Yeah, and yeah, we'll we'll we'll certainly get
through it, but a quick recap islike one through four.
They're trying hard to likebuild mythos and a very scary
franchise.
Yeah, and it gets kind of sillytowards the end, but it's
nothing on five through eight,which is straight up bust to
(02:12):
silly town.
SPEAKER_02 (02:13):
I don't I don't want to undersell these middle movies
though, because I'm gonna saythis right now, and and we we're
almost through watching all ofthem, so this could change.
But right now, in this moment,my favorite Friday the 13th
movie exists in this middlepack, which I'll get to as we
talk about it.
SPEAKER_00 (02:30):
Very exciting.
I don't know if I agree withthat.
That's also your own opinion.
But that's because I know what'scoming.
Of one through eight, however, Ido think that the second batch
of movies is much, much morefun.
All right, well, let's justlet's get into it.
SPEAKER_02 (02:45):
All right, let's get into it.
Yeah, I agree.
These they just I feel like eachmovie gets more and more fun to
me.
So far.
To me.
All right, so let's talk aboutFriday the 13th, 5, a new
beginning.
SPEAKER_00 (02:57):
It's part five.
SPEAKER_02 (02:58):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (02:58):
Which is kind of important because they make it
seem like it's one solid story.
Right.
And it's not.
It's not.
SPEAKER_02 (03:07):
Yeah.
But it hits theaters in 1985.
Here's a fun fact (03:10):
the MPAA actually forced the filmmakers
to cut out a very significantportion of the movie.
16 scenes.
SPEAKER_00 (03:20):
What?
SPEAKER_02 (03:21):
Because they they said that those scenes were too
gory.
SPEAKER_00 (03:24):
Whoa, that's cool.
SPEAKER_02 (03:24):
It made it one of the most censored films of the
80s.
SPEAKER_00 (03:28):
Is it has it since been released, re-released?
SPEAKER_02 (03:31):
I don't know, but it actually comes up again in
another one of the films we'regonna talk about today.
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Oh, that's such a bummer.
I I don't know.
Well, I I really hope that thethe un that the unrated version
is issues.
SPEAKER_02 (03:43):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
So we pick up the movie, so wepick up the story with Tommy.
Again, as a reminder, Tommy isthe child in the fourth movie
that we thought finally killedJason, but also might become the
next version of Jason, right?
Because he gives the camera thatknowing look at the end.
SPEAKER_00 (03:59):
Well, and he also like rips out all his hair and
looks just like kid Jason.
SPEAKER_02 (04:06):
Yep.
And that in that in the fourthfilm, it's play and then the
fourth film, Tommy is played byCorey Feldman.
In the fifth film, we pick himup as an adult.
So Tommy, now being much older,is being brought to a halfway
house for troubled youth.
This movie is really interestingbecause, as you might expect,
you know, brutal murders startto plague the area around the
(04:27):
halfway house and the otherpeople living and working there,
right?
You know, a tale as old as time.
But we also experience Tommy'shallucinations of Jason from his
childhood trauma, right?
So he's trying to work throughand he's in this halfway house
because of his trauma from Drafrom Jason as these murders are
starting to pop up around him.
(04:47):
So in this movie, Tommy iswithdrawn, he's clearly
unstable, he's an unreliablenarrator.
Like at first, when we seeJason, we think it's Jason, and
then we realize it's ahallucination.
I'll just a side note here,which I love the series for.
He's totally different beforeand after this.
Not only is he played by adifferent actor, even as an
(05:07):
adult Tommy, but he's everymovie.
SPEAKER_00 (05:10):
Tommy is a different actor.
SPEAKER_02 (05:11):
Yeah, which is like the kind of quirk that I'm here
for.
But also like James Bond.
Yeah, his personality isdifferent.
SPEAKER_00 (05:18):
Uh yes.
He's like an outlier.
Differ different writers is theeasy solution.
But also, they're just like, youknow, but there's also no reason
to even have Tommy.
SPEAKER_02 (05:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (05:28):
None whatsoever.
They just push it through.
SPEAKER_02 (05:31):
They want they want some kind of thread.
SPEAKER_00 (05:33):
Also, what year uh are we 1985.
1985.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (05:38):
Okay, so we're led to believe that Jason is the
murderer.
But at the end of the movie, wefind out that it's actually Roy
Burns, a character whose son iskilled at the beginning of the
movie.
The fifth film is fascinating tome because A of its setting,
which again is in this grouphome for like troubled youth
dealing with mental healthissues.
It's like this dark kind ofsubtext, but then it still
(06:02):
remains quite campy.
It totally, it it's like thisweird tonal shift for me.
It's like a weird, strangeoutlier of the series.
SPEAKER_00 (06:11):
I mean, probably because of the institution, but
it felt very much, and you saidthis while we were watching it,
felt very much like HalloweenH2O.
SPEAKER_02 (06:18):
Right, where it's like a contained environment,
and yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:21):
And she's older, yeah, right.
And Lori's all paranoid.
Right.
And like she's seeing things,but maybe she's not actually
seeing things, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (06:31):
Yeah, totally.
Another outlier here, whichmakes this movie so special, is
that the main killer in thismovie isn't Jason.
SPEAKER_00 (06:40):
Which, what a callback to number one.
SPEAKER_02 (06:42):
Right.
This installment feels likeequal parts Twin Peaks,
Roadhouse, Texas ChainsawMassacre, and I would even say
Halloween 3 because it justfeels like a side quest in the
way that Halloween 3 is like aside quest.
Like the Michael Myers isn't athing, Jason isn't a thing, like
Jason's a thing, but he's notthe main antagonist.
Director Danny Steinman camefrom the adult film world
(07:06):
actually.
And he later in an interviewsaid that he felt like the set,
the shoot for the Fifth, Friday,the 13th movie felt out of
control.
SPEAKER_00 (07:16):
Out out of control.
Is there more context to that?
SPEAKER_02 (07:19):
I think just that he struggled with managing a film
of this size.
SPEAKER_00 (07:23):
Well, right.
He was trying to make CitizenKane.
SPEAKER_02 (07:26):
He was trying to make, you know, a porn movie.
SPEAKER_00 (07:28):
And they had to cut out all his favorite scenes.
SPEAKER_02 (07:30):
Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (07:31):
What what if all the scenes that got cut out were not
for violence, but forpornography?
SPEAKER_02 (07:36):
Here's the thing about Friday the 13th, and and
slasher films in general.
I don't know.
Like I i I this is like a broad,huge statement that I'm about to
make, so bear with me.
But I think sex is much betterthan violence.
Like it seems less dangerous, Isuppose, to make a movie about
sex than to make a movie abouthyperviolence.
SPEAKER_00 (07:57):
Yeah, but this country was raised on a
different set of puritanicalvalues.
SPEAKER_02 (08:02):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (08:03):
Where sex is the absolute devil.
SPEAKER_02 (08:05):
Which is very hypocritical.
This movie, and we talked aboutthis a little bit at the end of
the last episode, but it wasinitially meant to launch the
Corey Feldman character of Tommyinto, you know, the new killer.
But essentially there was somebacklash, and so they decided to
pivot the plot.
SPEAKER_00 (08:21):
Okay, so that was actually.
That was the intention.
SPEAKER_02 (08:23):
Yeah.
Great.
Yeah.
So we weren't crazy.
They weren't crazy, but theyjust decided to not do that.
SPEAKER_00 (08:28):
They decided to make him crazy.
SPEAKER_02 (08:30):
Yeah.
They they gaslit all of us,including Tommy.
SPEAKER_00 (08:32):
That's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_02 (08:34):
Yeah.
The other interesting thing hereis that Corey Feldman, who plays
the kid, actually does notappear in the opening dream
sequence where he's it's like anage-appropriate moment for him
to appear because it like filmedin his backyard, because it was
when he was shooting theGoonies.
SPEAKER_00 (08:51):
Oh.
Yeah.
Well, I mean, good for him.
SPEAKER_02 (08:53):
Yeah.
The film has a very low ratingon Rotten Tomatoes, 16%.
What?
But even still, with a budget of2.2 million, the film grossed
21.9 million in the US boxoffice.
SPEAKER_00 (09:08):
Okay, yeah.
This is not cinematic gold.
No.
However, it is so much fun.
SPEAKER_02 (09:14):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (09:14):
Which I mean, we're gonna keep saying this about the
entire series.
Like, this is what makes campyhorror amazing.
SPEAKER_02 (09:21):
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (09:22):
They look at it with just the right amount of
seriousness where you'reinvested in it, but also like
it's goofy, it's silly, andthat's okay.
It's a good time.
SPEAKER_02 (09:32):
Yeah, it is a good time.
It also makes the point, right,that these films, even though it
has 16% on rotten tomatoes,continue to turn a massive
profit.
They continue to be money-makingmachines for Paramount.
SPEAKER_00 (09:45):
Yeah, good luck having your independent rom-com
with 16% on Rotten Tomatoes,turn a profit.
SPEAKER_02 (09:53):
Right, right.
And again, I just I really lovethe campiness and the silliness
of this.
It doesn't take itself tooseriously as a franchise.
And I really wasn't expectingthese movies to shift in tone so
drastically between, but theydo, especially with the movies
that we're going to get intonow, like the later, mid to mid
to later of the franchise films.
(10:13):
The next year in 1986, Fridaythe 13th, Jason Lives, so part
six was released.
Here's the thing (10:19):
this is my favorite movie so far in the
franchise.
SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
Okay, why?
SPEAKER_02 (10:24):
This movie rocks.
SPEAKER_00 (10:26):
Okay, moving on.
SPEAKER_02 (10:28):
It's unhinged in a delightful way.
Like the opening feels likehocus pocus.
It's like this pure 80s, likeDisney.
There's something about it,there's like also this meta-ness
to this movie where it feelslike uh similar to Scream, but
well before Scream.
Even the caretaker of thecemetery like gives the audience
a wink.
(10:48):
Like there's just this funplayfulness.
It feels more polished, it feelslike it's set in again, it's
like a 90s dream Disney World,but with violence.
Like, I don't know.
There's something about thatthat's really delightful to me.
SPEAKER_00 (11:02):
I'm gonna be honest with you.
Five, six, and seven, I'm gonnaneed reminders because we watch
them back to back and they feellike a fever dream.
SPEAKER_02 (11:11):
Well, this is the one where another reason why I
love it so much is because webecome supernatural in this
movie.
This is the film where Jason islike a reanimated zombie corpse.
SPEAKER_00 (11:24):
Okay, so this is the one that establishes the
precedent that he is a thiswalking juggernaut zombie thing.
SPEAKER_02 (11:30):
Yeah, so the film opens with Tommy, again played
by a totally different actor,Marlon Brando, as an adult in a
graveyard on a stormy night.
And we can kind of assume thathe's there, he's trying to
cremate Jason.
He opens up the grave, he digsto his grave, opens it up, he's
got gasoline.
I think he's trying to make sureJason's body is really destroyed
because he's so suspicious thathe's gonna come back and he just
(11:52):
can't move on mentally, right?
He's dealing with that.
So, through a series ofunfortunate events, he actually
conducts lightning into hiscorpse after stabbing him with a
metal pole from the fence, whichreanimates him.
So essentially, when he opensthe coffin, he's spooked and
he's like, ah, so he puts thisuh like metal spear into Jason,
(12:13):
lightning hits it, Frankensteinscene, he's reanimated, and now
he's supernatural.
SPEAKER_00 (12:20):
You shouldn't ever Frankenstein somebody.
It's a bad idea.
Sorry, you should neverFrankenstein a serial killer.
It's a bad idea.
SPEAKER_02 (12:27):
It's a you know what?
I sh I'll go as far as to sayyou should never Frankenstein
anybody.
Having just watchedFrankenshooker for the first
time, don't Frankensteinanybody.
SPEAKER_00 (12:37):
I don't know.
I feel like Frankenstein has itstime and place.
SPEAKER_02 (12:40):
You haven't watched Frankenshooker yet.
I also just have to mention, andthis is like a thing, this, you
know, the the James Bondintroduction, which was done as
part of this like self-awaremeta-campiness, was done on
purpose.
There's like this, you know,that like iconic circular James
Bond.
They do that at the beginning ofthis movie as a title sequence,
and they did it on purpose.
SPEAKER_00 (13:01):
Well, I mean, I imagine they do it on purpose.
SPEAKER_02 (13:02):
Yeah, but it's just so silly.
It's so silly.
Okay, so Jason, as he does,makes his way back to Camp
Crystal Lake, which is nowcalled Camp Forest Green.
SPEAKER_00 (13:11):
Why?
SPEAKER_02 (13:12):
Because the town's trying to move on, they're
trying to like dissociate fromwhat happened.
And as he tends to do, he startsto kill everyone and anyone that
he comes across.
Throughout a lot of this movie,Tommy, who again is totally
different, like new Tommy, istrying to convince the local
sheriff that Jason is back, butno one believes him, except for
the sheriff's hot daughter.
(13:33):
Like, literally, it's like somuch of the movie is him being
like, help, help, there's akiller.
Jason's back, Jason's back, andeveryone's like, Tommy, you're
just fucked up, right?
You're just, you weretraumatized as a kid, and now
nobody believes you.
It's like gaslighting up thewazoo.
The end, the end of this one iswild.
So essentially, Tommy luresJason out into the lake with
(13:55):
this idea of chaining him to ananchor, setting him on fire.
It's like this whole crazything.
And after some struggle and likeback and forth and blah blah
blah, Jason does end up chainedat the bottom of the lake.
SPEAKER_00 (14:08):
Which smart move.
SPEAKER_02 (14:11):
It's like sort of, but it feels like it defies
gravity and science that he helike stands upright on this like
neck chain and doesn't just flipup out of it.
Like it's well, Jason isbuoyant.
Just in his head?
Well, his whole body's buoyant.
Yeah, but well, he anybody elsewould flip up.
Why?
No what?
No.
Because your legs are buoyant.
SPEAKER_00 (14:30):
But he's tied by his legs in his head.
SPEAKER_02 (14:32):
No, just by his his th neck.
SPEAKER_00 (14:34):
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (14:35):
I think.
That's why I'm like so.
SPEAKER_00 (14:37):
Well, he's wearing heavy boots.
Oh, okay, sure.
And he's like he's a blo he's abloated corpse.
SPEAKER_02 (15:04):
He also gets like fucked up by the rudder of the
boat, right?
SPEAKER_00 (15:07):
So that's really Yeah, he gets whacked by the old
boat.
SPEAKER_02 (15:09):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (15:09):
You know, this establishes like the if you when
you have like, you know, the thethe unstoppable monster, you
just gotta contain it.
You can't kill him, so you gottatrap him.
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (15:20):
Uh, which, great.
It's it's it's a wonderfultrope.
And so now you have the thing oflike Jason's weakness is being
imprisoned in the blake that hedied.
Right.
Cool, that's a cool mythos.
We like that.
SPEAKER_02 (15:33):
It is cool.
I immediately recognized thatsix was gonna be my favorite
one.
And again, there's still twomore for us to watch, so we'll
see.
But there's even like thisbizarre social commentary in the
movie that's not bizarre on itsown, but bizarre in a Friday the
13th movie.
One of the characters uses acredit card that's called
American Excess instead ofAmerican Express, which again,
(15:54):
like, yeah, I'm aligned.
But why in a Friday the 13thmovie are we making this point
about American spending?
SPEAKER_00 (16:00):
Isn't it just like a Greek credit card?
SPEAKER_02 (16:03):
It is, but it's I don't know, it just feels like a
feels like a point.
Yeah.
So Jason lives had a budget ofthree million, the biggest so
far in the franchise.
And it generated 19.5 million inthe US.
So as you're gonna start tonotice, the ROIs are going down
slightly.
Still a great ROI, but it'sgoing down a bit.
SPEAKER_00 (16:23):
Well, right, but you know, dude with these movies,
you want bigger and better everytime.
That's a surefire way to like atleast get people to see it the
first time.
Yeah.
If you can make an incrediblemovie, great.
But that's what gets butts andseats.
And I just again, I thought itwas such a smart move to
establish all the supernaturalstuff.
(16:44):
Yeah.
It's a good pivot in the series.
The same thing happened inHalloween, but way, way too late
in the series.
Well, they've already cementedall the rules of Michael Myers,
or like kind of kept it a bitambiguous of like, you know,
just like maybe what the plotrequires.
Yeah.
Until all of a sudden someone'slike, nope, he runs on evil.
SPEAKER_02 (17:05):
Right.
Okay.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
It gives us like the motivationto keep making the movies.
So part of the reason why somepeople think that the ROI is
starting to slip a little bithere is that there's some
competition in the market.
Notably, Nightmare on Elm Streetwas released the year before,
and its sequels were starting toroll out.
So there's not just Halloweenand Friday the 13th.
(17:28):
Now there's also Nightmare onElm Street.
SPEAKER_00 (17:30):
Which is so good.
SPEAKER_02 (17:31):
It is good, yeah.
It's time for a rewatch.
Maybe I'll watch the first onethis October.
SPEAKER_00 (17:37):
First one, first one's fine, but again, it's like
the first Friday the 13th.
SPEAKER_02 (17:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (17:43):
It's like it hasn't found its charm yet.
SPEAKER_02 (17:46):
Yeah, totally.
SPEAKER_00 (17:47):
It's a good movie.
It just hasn't found its charm.
SPEAKER_02 (17:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (17:49):
And like that, that is a weird thing about these
movies.
There's like this cozy charm tothem.
SPEAKER_02 (17:54):
There is.
SPEAKER_00 (17:54):
It's which is weird to say about watching people get
like s stabbed in lacerated.
SPEAKER_02 (18:00):
In the worst, brute, most brutal way possible.
SPEAKER_00 (18:03):
Um, and also just like we as Friday 13th keeps
going on in the franchise, thekills are getting more unique.
SPEAKER_02 (18:11):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (18:11):
Which is great.
You you want to see cool,elaborate things.
You know, we're not like sawlevel deaths, nor should we,
because like which we wouldbreak the character.
He's like a he's he's he's thislike mindless juggernaut zombie.
SPEAKER_01 (18:23):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
He just kills you fast.
Right.
Cool.
You know, Freddie Krueger toyswith people.
He needs you afraid.
So there's like all these.
No, Jason just shows up and hestabs you.
Um, but how do you make thatinteresting?
SPEAKER_01 (18:36):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (18:37):
I do think it's funny though, that I don't know,
I don't know if it was thismovie or a different one, but
it's something that happens inmultiple Friday the 13th.
He does exactly what MichaelMyers does.
Uh, there's a where there's apart in the movie where there's
the final girl running around,finding all of the bodies one by
one, and then there's just likethe killer just like kind of
(19:00):
popping out, yeah, just to watchher reaction and be like, hey,
look at this picture I made.
SPEAKER_02 (19:05):
Yeah, I'm gonna talk about that too when we get
there.
There's so much that borrowsfrom these other films that come
out around it for sure.
And it's also one of thosethings where there's only so
many ways to to set up a slashermovie that follows this specific
format, right?
Where it's in, you know, I wouldsay again, like Halloween,
Friday the 13th, Nairobi and ElmStreet follow like a pretty
(19:28):
similar specific format.
And even though there's somedeviation and tonal differences
and all this stuff, in thisworld where there's teenagers
being hunted by a male killerwith a weapon, right?
It's it's a pretty like limitedscope.
And so we're gonna have somemoments that feel similar.
SPEAKER_00 (19:43):
But also we're only we're you know, we're already up
to movie number six, and we'reonly up to 1985.
Yeah, they really sound themout.
Yeah, but also it's it'simportant to keep the context of
like they're still writing theprecedent.
Right.
Yes, there's been other moviesmade already, but it's not like
(20:05):
this has been done for decadesso far.
SPEAKER_02 (20:07):
Right.
Halloween came out in 78.
It's been six years, sevenyears.
Yeah.
Jason Lives was directed by TomMcLachlan.
McLachlan was faced with thetask of bringing Jason back to
the series, especially afterfans missed him in five, right?
He wasn't in five, he wasn't apart of it.
Now McLachlan had to figure outhow to bring him back with a in
a in a way that was exciting,and I think he does that with
(20:30):
the opening and the Frankensteinscene for sure.
McLachlan was a longtime horrorfan, especially of the classic
monster films, which again Ithink you can see in the
Frankenstein reanimationsequence from the beginning.
He also wanted to add humor tothe franchise.
He, which, okay, I might arguethat there was already humor in
the franchise, but he wanted topurposefully add intentional
(20:51):
humor, and I think he did a goodjob.
Like I again, I think the toneof six felt scary and had like
funny moments for sure.
Agreed.
The movie also features threesongs from this band.
Do you know which band it is,Alan?
Nope.
Alice Cooper.
Wow.
Including a song called He'sBack, The Man Behind the Mask.
(21:12):
I think about uh Dream Warriorsa little bit with you know, just
like having one band sort ofrepresent your sequel.
SPEAKER_00 (21:18):
Who did Dream Warriors?
SPEAKER_02 (21:19):
Doken, that metal band.
Remember that we watched themusic video?
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:24):
I forgot about that.
SPEAKER_02 (21:25):
Yeah.
I think it's kind of like a funthing when you have these like
hardcore bands making these like80s music videos to go with
these slasher movies.
SPEAKER_00 (21:32):
I mean 80s and metal went hand in hand.
SPEAKER_02 (21:34):
Ugh, yeah.
The good old days.
SPEAKER_00 (21:39):
What's your favorite uh 80s metal band?
SPEAKER_02 (21:41):
Dawkins.
SPEAKER_00 (21:42):
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (21:43):
Yeah.
I'm a fan.
Too bad they didn't work out.
Alright, just when you think,things can't get any better,
right?
We've had this like hocus pocusFrankenstein reanimation.
Where can the series possibly gofrom here that's any better?
SPEAKER_00 (22:00):
Hard to say.
But we have to.
Dare I say Friday the 13th, partseven?
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
Folks, we have telekinesis.
SPEAKER_00 (22:08):
What was this one called?
SPEAKER_02 (22:10):
It is called Friday the 13th, part seven, A New
Blood from 1988.
SPEAKER_00 (22:14):
An excellent year.
SPEAKER_02 (22:16):
The concept was literally Jason versus Carrie.
That was like the concept of themovie.
It was cool.
SPEAKER_00 (22:22):
It works really, really well.
SPEAKER_02 (22:24):
I wish it was Carrie because she would have fucked
him up.
But it ended up being this girlnamed Tina who battles Jason
until the very end.
Tina! We pick up this movieright where the last one ended,
with Jason still being chained,still being chained, not
floating up to the bottom ofCrystal Lake, still vertically
floating in the same exactposition.
SPEAKER_00 (22:46):
He floats like um a naval mine.
SPEAKER_02 (22:49):
Yeah, but he's a man.
SPEAKER_00 (22:52):
But he's a man.
SPEAKER_02 (22:54):
Then we jump ahead in time a bit and we meet Tina.
So Tina's dealing with somechildhood trauma.
SPEAKER_00 (23:00):
She's dealing with some stuff, okay?
SPEAKER_02 (23:01):
Of when her dad died on this very lake.
SPEAKER_00 (23:04):
Uh, dare I say, when she killed him.
SPEAKER_02 (23:07):
But she returns to the lake with her mom and a
doctor who's studying herbecause she has telekinetic
powers.
We realize pretty quickly thather therapist is horrible,
manipulative, and abusive, andhe's trying to exploit her.
But her powers start to get outof hand, and so she accidentally
brings Jason back to life.
SPEAKER_00 (23:27):
An honest mistake.
SPEAKER_02 (23:29):
Oh, yeah, I'm I'm not mad at her about it.
SPEAKER_00 (23:31):
And, you know, then we get to see a cool Jason
versus telekinesis battle.
Yeah.
Which is really freaking cool.
SPEAKER_02 (23:37):
It is.
Jason starts on his typicalmurder spree, and Tina starts to
use her mind powers to fightback.
Tina manages to actually trapJason back in the lake.
I mean, there's just so manysimilarities here to Carrie, and
it's very purposefully done thatway, right?
Carrie came out in 1976.
(23:58):
So it was certainly apre-established fan favorite by
this time.
This is about a decade later, alittle over 12 years later.
Okay, so this is the moviewhere, similar to Halloween,
Tina starts to find all of herdead friends as the movie gets
on, and all of that sort of actsas fuel, right, to piss her off.
New Blood was directed by JohnCarl Bulcher, a prolific
(24:18):
filmmaker who's worked on asmany special effects teams as
films he's directed.
So his IMGB is sort of split.
No, it's more, but it's likehe's directed a hand uh, you
know, 10 or 12 or whatever, buthe's also been like head special
effects guy on that many.
It reminds me of Stan Winston,who directed Pumpkin Head and
again was a special effectsperson, and you can see that
(24:39):
influence both in Pumpkin Headand in the seventh installment
of Friday the 13th.
There's really like a shift, Iwould say, in the movie towards
special and practical effects,uh, which is really fun.
But similar to Five, A NewBlood, a lot of this movie was
censored.
And so some of his really coolspecial effects work, including
(25:01):
this like fully exposed rib cageof Jason, is censored and cut
out.
SPEAKER_00 (25:06):
Oh, this is the one where he walks around looking.
Okay, so this version of Jason,I think, is probably one of the
(25:40):
most iconic Jason looks, andpeople don't realize it.
Uh, I don't know.
SPEAKER_02 (25:46):
Oh, it's interesting you say that actually.
SPEAKER_00 (25:48):
I don't I don't know exactly why.
SPEAKER_02 (25:50):
I do.
SPEAKER_00 (25:50):
Um, but I'm gonna I'm gonna guess uh that this is
the this is the version that allthe Halloween stores latched
onto as the the official Jasoncostume.
SPEAKER_02 (26:01):
I think it's also because stunt man Kane Hotter
plays Jason for the first time,and then he really becomes the
the like actor.
He goes on to play him for infour films.
And he kind of I think there'ssomething missing maybe up until
this point, even though we're sodeep in the series, like this uh
stability of of who Jason is inevery film it's different.
(26:24):
And in this movie, Kane Hotter,I think, helps to identify and
define Jason, you know, for therest of the series.
SPEAKER_00 (26:31):
Well, beyond just like the actor, just like the
the actual look of the makeupwith the exposed parts, the
chain around the neck.
SPEAKER_02 (26:40):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (26:40):
I didn't realize how familiar this look was until I
saw it again in the movie.
SPEAKER_02 (26:45):
Well, I bet also for you, like I wonder if video
games use this, right?
Because you play video gamesmore than I do.
SPEAKER_00 (26:52):
What would that have to do with my fam with Jason?
SPEAKER_02 (26:54):
Isn't he a character in some of them?
SPEAKER_00 (26:56):
In what games?
SPEAKER_02 (26:57):
Isn't there like a game where there's like you
could play like Mike Myers, likea villain's game?
SPEAKER_00 (27:01):
You're talking about Dead by Daylight.
SPEAKER_02 (27:03):
Yeah.
Like I wonder if they use thislook in those things.
SPEAKER_00 (27:06):
Uh well, there's a bunch of skins.
I don't know.
Yeah.
He's like he's definitely inthat game, but you can there's
like every horror villain that'spopular is in that game.
SPEAKER_02 (27:15):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:15):
I'm just saying there's moments Maybe, but I
mean I feel like I associatethis look with like early 2000s.
Sure.
Oh, I wonder if this is the samelook that they use in Freddie
versus Jason.
Maybe.
We'll find out when we get therevery soon.
Maybe I wonder if that's whereit's from.
Because that was my first introto Friday the 13th.
SPEAKER_02 (27:32):
Yeah.
I think it might have been minetoo.
My sister made me go see I thinkit was Freddie versus Jason.
SPEAKER_00 (27:38):
Well, we'll get we'll we'll jump in ahead.
SPEAKER_02 (27:40):
Yeah.
Okay, so fascinating.
There's a full body burn in thismovie where Kane Hodder, the
stunt man who plays Jason, youknow, has a full body burn.
It lasted 40 seconds, which atthe time was the longest in
Hollywood history.
SPEAKER_00 (27:53):
That's kind of terrifying.
SPEAKER_02 (27:54):
Yeah.
40 seconds.
And similar to part five, thisfilm's gore was cut in a huge
way by the MPAA.
The uncut version of this one ismostly lost.
SPEAKER_00 (28:06):
That's a shame.
SPEAKER_02 (28:08):
Okay, new blood was made for 2.8 million, and it
brought in 19.2 million.
So the ROI is standing strong.
SPEAKER_00 (28:15):
Still going, still going well.
SPEAKER_02 (28:16):
Still going well, yeah.
All right, everybody, here isthe moment we've been waiting
for.
Again, you think, okay, we havetelekinesis, we have a
reanimated Jason, FrankensteinJason.
Where could the series go fromhere?
Well, we can go to Manhattan.
In 1989, the masterpiece, Fridaythe 13th, part eight, Jason
Takes Manhattan, was released.
SPEAKER_00 (28:38):
And this was when the series officially jumps the
shark.
SPEAKER_02 (28:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:43):
In the best possible way.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (28:46):
And then it's only up from here, baby.
So first we have to address theelephant in the room.
How did Jason get to Manhattan?
SPEAKER_00 (28:53):
Excellent question.
And we finally, after years ofwondering, we finally learn
where Crystal Lake is.
Hoboken.
In it's in Hoboken.
SPEAKER_02 (29:06):
It's gotta be.
Because it's somehow connectedby river system to Manhattan.
SPEAKER_00 (29:11):
Which means, I mean, I guess it could be anywhere
along the Atlantic, but No,Jason kind of like walks along
the swims, walk treads waterbehind the boat and then gets to
Manhattan.
It cannot be far.
SPEAKER_02 (29:24):
No, he gets on the boat.
He's on the boat.
SPEAKER_00 (29:27):
He's he's on the boat, yeah.
But then he's off the boat.
SPEAKER_02 (29:30):
Yeah.
I mean he's supernatural, he'spowerful.
SPEAKER_00 (29:33):
Yeah, but there's a good chunk of time where he's
trailing the boat in the water.
SPEAKER_02 (29:37):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:38):
So it can't be far.
SPEAKER_02 (29:40):
So here's my thing.
For how the lake is portrayed,think about the first movie when
she's on her little canoe.
It's like a pond, really, right?
And then okay, it becomes like afull-blown like lake you'd have
a camp on, like LakeWinnipegasaki, something like
that.
But for how this lake isportrayed, the scale of the
cruise boat that they end uptaking.
(30:03):
It's impressive.
Is crazy because it's not onlythis like little boat that's
gonna go on these little likeinlet rivers that again somehow
connect to Manhattan, it's it'slike a full steamship with like
cabin suites and bedrooms, andthe professor is the steamer.
The professor has his whole likeyou know, whatever.
It's Titanic leaves in tenminutes.
(30:23):
It's wild.
So Jason is again reanimated,this time by an electric cable
that kind of sparks him back tolife as he's trapped in the
lake.
SPEAKER_00 (30:31):
They gotta stop Frankenstein, this guy.
SPEAKER_02 (30:33):
He's I know.
You'd think they'd have a betterhandle on him.
Jason decides to board thecruise boat that's filled with
high schoolers, and it's kind oflike a Congrats graduation trip
for them.
By the time the boat arrives inManhattan, which is quite Quite
far into the movie.
SPEAKER_00 (30:49):
Hang on.
It's not just quite far into themovie.
We are 80% through the movie bythe time we get to Manhattan.
SPEAKER_02 (30:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:57):
You could tell they just wanted the goofy title of
Jason Takes Manhattan.
Yeah.
But why spend 80% of the movieworking your way there and
trying to justify why he's inManhattan?
SPEAKER_02 (31:11):
Yeah.
But why?
But they don't even they don'tdo a good job of justifying it.
Like to me, it's such a weakplot that he trailed this boat.
I don't know.
SPEAKER_00 (31:19):
It is.
So it's like rip rip off theband-aid.
Oh, he's in Manhattan now.
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (31:22):
We don't even need to know.
Yeah.
It's a logistical nightmare.
SPEAKER_00 (31:26):
Do what so many other horror movies have done of
researchers put him in a box.
SPEAKER_02 (31:31):
Uh-oh, he gets out.
Right.
Just like Jason X, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (31:34):
Uh-oh, right, though.
That's Jason X.
SPEAKER_02 (31:36):
Okay, so Jason has killed most people on the boat
by the time he gets toManhattan.
In the city, Jason continuesstalking a few teens that had
survived on the cruise ship thathe wasn't able to kill.
What takes him down, you mightask?
Toxic City Waste.
Despite its name, the majorityof the movie takes place on said
ship and was actually filmed inVancouver.
(31:56):
Only a small portion was filmedin Manhattan.
I think it was actually filmedlike in Times Square like at 3
a.m.
And I just like it ended up withlike a huge crowd of people
watching them on the side.
SPEAKER_00 (32:07):
That was a Ninja Turtles reference.
SPEAKER_02 (32:09):
Oh, I I wouldn't have gotten that.
SPEAKER_00 (32:11):
Get your shit together.
SPEAKER_02 (32:12):
This is the last Paramount Jason movie after this
New Line Cinema takes over therights.
SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
After this, it's just Criterion Collection.
SPEAKER_02 (32:21):
So Jason Takes Manhattan had the highest budget
to date at 5 million, and itbrought in 14.3 million in the
US.
And though the ROI continues toshrink, there will be four more
Jason movies in the franchise.
SPEAKER_00 (32:35):
And I hope f four more after that.
SPEAKER_02 (32:38):
I hope so too.
And this is just a fun fact.
The stunt man who ended upplaying Jason Wright for the
next four movies, Kane Hotter,he said that when this crowd was
assembled and he was in TimesSquare, that it was the proudest
moment of his life.
Like he felt so much pride doingthat and having all these people
care to watch.
Fans often call this movie oneof the worst unmaskings of
(33:01):
Jason.
SPEAKER_00 (33:02):
He does look kind of silly.
SPEAKER_02 (33:03):
His face looks like a weird, sort of melty
puppet-like face.
It's not as spooky as it was inother movies.
There's also a fun moment inthis movie where there's a boxer
named Julius who gets his headpunched off, which is um like a
fan favorite, and it also waslike extraordinarily complicated
to choreograph.
SPEAKER_00 (33:24):
Oh yeah, they gotta punch someone's fucking head
off.
That's not easy.
SPEAKER_02 (33:27):
It's not easy.
SPEAKER_00 (33:28):
But the it's that sequence is so long.
SPEAKER_02 (33:32):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (33:32):
So long.
Him just like bashing Jasonagain and again every time he
takes the tiniest step back, andthen he just gets too tired.
SPEAKER_02 (33:40):
Yeah, but it's kind of like I don't know.
There's something about thatkill that's kind of satisfying.
SPEAKER_00 (33:44):
Oh, yeah, just but wax wax him.
SPEAKER_02 (33:47):
Wax him, yeah.
So this was the first movie thatreally takes Jason out of Camp
Crystal Lake.
SPEAKER_00 (33:52):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (33:53):
And it begs a lot of questions about how he's gonna
get back.
SPEAKER_00 (33:56):
Well, he just he takes the ferry.
SPEAKER_02 (33:59):
And I you know it's probably off the subway.
It's so close.
Sure, he just takes the light,the light rail to Hoboken.
The light rail?
Yeah.
What's the light rail?
Well, ones you could take thepath to Hoboken, then there's a
light rail which goes likedeeper into New Jersey.
SPEAKER_00 (34:14):
Oh, MJ Transit.
SPEAKER_02 (34:16):
That's right.
And then there's NJ Transit,which is trains.
Yeah.
There's three ways.
Three ways to get around.
At least.
And buses, of course.
I guess he has a lot of options.
Ferries, buses.
The Jitney.
That's in Long Island.
It's not New Jersey.
Nice try though.
I mean, here's the thing.
I'm all for Boat Jason.
I'm all for Manhattan.
Jason.
(34:36):
I just wish this movie, likewhat I feel like happens now a
little bit, my bigger critiqueis that these premise, the
premise for some of these moviesthat we're gonna get into next
episode, but especially Jasontakes Manhattan, they're so wild
to your point.
Like they wanted that to be thethe tagline.
And it doesn't go hard enoughfor me.
I just wish it went harder.
I wish it totally threw cautionto the wind.
(34:59):
And you know, Jason was just onsome kind of Manhattan rampage,
it just doesn't go there.
SPEAKER_00 (35:04):
Absolutely.
No, it the the the New Yorkportion of this film is so
small.
Yeah.
Such I mean, I get it, it'sprobably very expensive
comparatively to shoot in NewYork.
Yeah.
But there's what there's there'sways.
We did not have to spend so longon the boat.
SPEAKER_02 (35:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:20):
And like we love boat movies.
I love boats.
And this is a pretty dumb boatmovie.
SPEAKER_02 (35:25):
Yeah.
Because the boat also like itdoesn't give us that much.
Like I think if you okay, ifwe're on the boat, there could
be more nautical, nauticallyinclined kills or something.
And there's a little bit ofthat, but it's it's pretty, it's
all pretty like standard.
I don't know.
SPEAKER_00 (35:38):
Why aren't we seeing Jason impale people with
anchors?
SPEAKER_02 (35:41):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (35:42):
That's cool.
We like that.
SPEAKER_02 (35:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:44):
You know, break somebody over the the break
someone's back over the a steampipe.
SPEAKER_02 (35:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:49):
That's cool.
SPEAKER_02 (35:50):
I mean, the one of the greatest subplots of this
movie is really the therelationship between the captain
and his son.
SPEAKER_00 (35:57):
Yeah.
And his yeah, his poor,disapproving father.
Yeah.
And he just wants to be a littlelittle junior captain.
SPEAKER_02 (36:07):
He just wants his father to be proud of him, and
he's not quite figured it outyet.
SPEAKER_00 (36:12):
I know.
He's like, all right, son,what's the first thing you do?
Oh, we do this.
SPEAKER_02 (36:17):
No! Then he like runs away crying.
It's so sad.
It's so sad.
Oh my gosh.
We are having so much fun withthis series.
I hope you guys are too.
It's been really lovely toreturn again to this format and
to just deep dive into an iconicfranchise that I hadn't seen.
So I feel like I'm long overdueto watch through all of these.
(36:38):
Right now, for me, six is thefilm to be.
Alan, what's your favorite sofar?
SPEAKER_00 (36:42):
Um, the telekinesis carry.
SPEAKER_02 (36:46):
Yeah, seven.
Yeah.
That's a really good one, too.
SPEAKER_00 (36:48):
It's so fun.
SPEAKER_02 (36:48):
It's so fun.
SPEAKER_00 (36:49):
I really thought Jason Takes Manhattan was gonna
be for me.
SPEAKER_02 (36:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (36:52):
It's just it's a weak showing.
It's fun and it's goofy, but thethe bar was set really high by
seven.
SPEAKER_02 (36:58):
Yeah, very true.
I also want to mention that wehave a horror book club that we
meet a few times a year withsome horror fans, and we pick a
book and we collectively get ona Zoom call, so it doesn't
matter where you're located, andwe talk about it.
On October 27th, we are going tomeet to talk about Victorian
Psycho.
Victorian Psycho came out thisyear, so it's really fun to be
(37:19):
reading a novel that is socurrent.
It was written by VirginiaFietto, and so far I'm having a
lot of fun with it.
It's also pretty quick.
I'm a really slow reader, andI've read it a few times before
bed, and I'm at like 50%.
So I would say if you're lookingto get into a horror novel,
something spooky, set the scenefor the days leading up to
(37:41):
Halloween, come join us.
All you have to do is join ourDiscord for information about
how to join, or just DM us onsocial media and I will make
sure that you get the link.
SPEAKER_00 (37:50):
Well, I'm very excited to wrap up this series
with the final four uh Jasonmovies because they're the
silliest.
Because I I don't I feel likethey're gonna at least be the
most unique.
SPEAKER_02 (38:01):
Absolutely.
I'm really excited as well.
We have a few more to go, soI'll I won't say anything, but
we're gonna come back next week.
We're gonna talk about the theremaining four, and then of
course, as a follow-up to all ofthis, we are going to have a
really cool packed episodefeaturing Friday the 13th
adjacent horror stories.
SPEAKER_00 (38:22):
Adjacent?
SPEAKER_02 (38:23):
Ah, nice, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (38:25):
We're pointing at each other.
SPEAKER_02 (38:27):
You can't see because it's a podcast, but we
are pointing.
So, anyway, thank you guys somuch for listening.
Stay spooky.
I hope you're enjoying yourOctober and opening up your mind
as the veil continues to thin.
We'll talk to you soon.
SPEAKER_01 (38:40):
Bye bye.
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode
of the Lunatics Radio HourPodcast.
I'm Abby Brinker, sitting herewith Alan Kudan.
SPEAKER_00 (00:27):
Hello.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
And today we are continuing our discussion of the
Friday the 13th horrorfranchise.
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
We like this franchise.
SPEAKER_02 (00:35):
We do.
I'm having a lot of fun watchingit.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
It's great.
SPEAKER_02 (00:38):
It is great.
It's it's a lot more fun than Ithought it was gonna be.
SPEAKER_00 (00:41):
A lot more fun.
It's it's it's honestly verydifferent.
Like, yeah, I was reallyexpecting this to be like
Halloween.
It's a pretty heavy duty slasherfranchise, and like Friday 13th
is like a pinnacle slasherfranchise.
However, I feel like Friday the13th perfectly bridges the gap
(01:02):
between mm the seriousness ofMichael Myers and the goofy,
silly bitchness of FreddieKruger.
Yeah.
Apparently, I actually I saw Isaw this as a meme.
He only says bitch asurprisingly few amount of times
in the entire series.
And the vast majority of thesetimes are in the movie Freddie
(01:22):
versus Jason.
SPEAKER_02 (01:23):
Oh, I'm so excited to watch that.
SPEAKER_00 (01:26):
But that's that's part three.
So we're actually only going totalk about the middle four
movies of five, six, seven,eight.
Yep.
So this is gonna be like alittle mini episode or a bridge
episode.
SPEAKER_02 (01:36):
Because there's gonna be so much to talk about
when we get to nine and beyond.
And and there's a lot to talkabout with these, but those ones
are just so iconic, and there'sa lot of really crazy jump in
the shark moments to get into.
SPEAKER_00 (01:49):
Yeah, and yeah, we'll we'll we'll certainly get
through it, but a quick recap islike one through four.
They're trying hard to likebuild mythos and a very scary
franchise.
Yeah, and it gets kind of sillytowards the end, but it's
nothing on five through eight,which is straight up bust to
(02:12):
silly town.
SPEAKER_02 (02:13):
I don't I don't want to undersell these middle movies
though, because I'm gonna saythis right now, and and we we're
almost through watching all ofthem, so this could change.
But right now, in this moment,my favorite Friday the 13th
movie exists in this middlepack, which I'll get to as we
talk about it.
SPEAKER_00 (02:30):
Very exciting.
I don't know if I agree withthat.
That's also your own opinion.
But that's because I know what'scoming.
Of one through eight, however, Ido think that the second batch
of movies is much, much morefun.
All right, well, let's justlet's get into it.
SPEAKER_02 (02:45):
All right, let's get into it.
Yeah, I agree.
These they just I feel like eachmovie gets more and more fun to
me.
So far.
To me.
All right, so let's talk aboutFriday the 13th, 5, a new
beginning.
SPEAKER_00 (02:57):
It's part five.
SPEAKER_02 (02:58):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (02:58):
Which is kind of important because they make it
seem like it's one solid story.
Right.
And it's not.
It's not.
SPEAKER_02 (03:07):
Yeah.
But it hits theaters in 1985.
Here's a fun fact (03:10):
the MPAA actually forced the filmmakers
to cut out a very significantportion of the movie.
16 scenes.
SPEAKER_00 (03:20):
What?
SPEAKER_02 (03:21):
Because they they said that those scenes were too
gory.
SPEAKER_00 (03:24):
Whoa, that's cool.
SPEAKER_02 (03:24):
It made it one of the most censored films of the
80s.
SPEAKER_00 (03:28):
Is it has it since been released, re-released?
SPEAKER_02 (03:31):
I don't know, but it actually comes up again in
another one of the films we'regonna talk about today.
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Oh, that's such a bummer.
I I don't know.
Well, I I really hope that thethe un that the unrated version
is issues.
SPEAKER_02 (03:43):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
So we pick up the movie, so wepick up the story with Tommy.
Again, as a reminder, Tommy isthe child in the fourth movie
that we thought finally killedJason, but also might become the
next version of Jason, right?
Because he gives the camera thatknowing look at the end.
SPEAKER_00 (03:59):
Well, and he also like rips out all his hair and
looks just like kid Jason.
SPEAKER_02 (04:06):
Yep.
And that in that in the fourthfilm, it's play and then the
fourth film, Tommy is played byCorey Feldman.
In the fifth film, we pick himup as an adult.
So Tommy, now being much older,is being brought to a halfway
house for troubled youth.
This movie is really interestingbecause, as you might expect,
you know, brutal murders startto plague the area around the
(04:27):
halfway house and the otherpeople living and working there,
right?
You know, a tale as old as time.
But we also experience Tommy'shallucinations of Jason from his
childhood trauma, right?
So he's trying to work throughand he's in this halfway house
because of his trauma from Drafrom Jason as these murders are
starting to pop up around him.
(04:47):
So in this movie, Tommy iswithdrawn, he's clearly
unstable, he's an unreliablenarrator.
Like at first, when we seeJason, we think it's Jason, and
then we realize it's ahallucination.
I'll just a side note here,which I love the series for.
He's totally different beforeand after this.
Not only is he played by adifferent actor, even as an
(05:07):
adult Tommy, but he's everymovie.
SPEAKER_00 (05:10):
Tommy is a different actor.
SPEAKER_02 (05:11):
Yeah, which is like the kind of quirk that I'm here
for.
But also like James Bond.
Yeah, his personality isdifferent.
SPEAKER_00 (05:18):
Uh yes.
He's like an outlier.
Differ different writers is theeasy solution.
But also, they're just like, youknow, but there's also no reason
to even have Tommy.
SPEAKER_02 (05:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (05:28):
None whatsoever.
They just push it through.
SPEAKER_02 (05:31):
They want they want some kind of thread.
SPEAKER_00 (05:33):
Also, what year uh are we 1985.
1985.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (05:38):
Okay, so we're led to believe that Jason is the
murderer.
But at the end of the movie, wefind out that it's actually Roy
Burns, a character whose son iskilled at the beginning of the
movie.
The fifth film is fascinating tome because A of its setting,
which again is in this grouphome for like troubled youth
dealing with mental healthissues.
It's like this dark kind ofsubtext, but then it still
(06:02):
remains quite campy.
It totally, it it's like thisweird tonal shift for me.
It's like a weird, strangeoutlier of the series.
SPEAKER_00 (06:11):
I mean, probably because of the institution, but
it felt very much, and you saidthis while we were watching it,
felt very much like HalloweenH2O.
SPEAKER_02 (06:18):
Right, where it's like a contained environment,
and yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:21):
And she's older, yeah, right.
And Lori's all paranoid.
Right.
And like she's seeing things,but maybe she's not actually
seeing things, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (06:31):
Yeah, totally.
Another outlier here, whichmakes this movie so special, is
that the main killer in thismovie isn't Jason.
SPEAKER_00 (06:40):
Which, what a callback to number one.
SPEAKER_02 (06:42):
Right.
This installment feels likeequal parts Twin Peaks,
Roadhouse, Texas ChainsawMassacre, and I would even say
Halloween 3 because it justfeels like a side quest in the
way that Halloween 3 is like aside quest.
Like the Michael Myers isn't athing, Jason isn't a thing, like
Jason's a thing, but he's notthe main antagonist.
Director Danny Steinman camefrom the adult film world
(07:06):
actually.
And he later in an interviewsaid that he felt like the set,
the shoot for the Fifth, Friday,the 13th movie felt out of
control.
SPEAKER_00 (07:16):
Out out of control.
Is there more context to that?
SPEAKER_02 (07:19):
I think just that he struggled with managing a film
of this size.
SPEAKER_00 (07:23):
Well, right.
He was trying to make CitizenKane.
SPEAKER_02 (07:26):
He was trying to make, you know, a porn movie.
SPEAKER_00 (07:28):
And they had to cut out all his favorite scenes.
SPEAKER_02 (07:30):
Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (07:31):
What what if all the scenes that got cut out were not
for violence, but forpornography?
SPEAKER_02 (07:36):
Here's the thing about Friday the 13th, and and
slasher films in general.
I don't know.
Like I i I this is like a broad,huge statement that I'm about to
make, so bear with me.
But I think sex is much betterthan violence.
Like it seems less dangerous, Isuppose, to make a movie about
sex than to make a movie abouthyperviolence.
SPEAKER_00 (07:57):
Yeah, but this country was raised on a
different set of puritanicalvalues.
SPEAKER_02 (08:02):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (08:03):
Where sex is the absolute devil.
SPEAKER_02 (08:05):
Which is very hypocritical.
This movie, and we talked aboutthis a little bit at the end of
the last episode, but it wasinitially meant to launch the
Corey Feldman character of Tommyinto, you know, the new killer.
But essentially there was somebacklash, and so they decided to
pivot the plot.
SPEAKER_00 (08:21):
Okay, so that was actually.
That was the intention.
SPEAKER_02 (08:23):
Yeah.
Great.
Yeah.
So we weren't crazy.
They weren't crazy, but theyjust decided to not do that.
SPEAKER_00 (08:28):
They decided to make him crazy.
SPEAKER_02 (08:30):
Yeah.
They they gaslit all of us,including Tommy.
SPEAKER_00 (08:32):
That's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_02 (08:34):
Yeah.
The other interesting thing hereis that Corey Feldman, who plays
the kid, actually does notappear in the opening dream
sequence where he's it's like anage-appropriate moment for him
to appear because it like filmedin his backyard, because it was
when he was shooting theGoonies.
SPEAKER_00 (08:51):
Oh.
Yeah.
Well, I mean, good for him.
SPEAKER_02 (08:53):
Yeah.
The film has a very low ratingon Rotten Tomatoes, 16%.
What?
But even still, with a budget of2.2 million, the film grossed
21.9 million in the US boxoffice.
SPEAKER_00 (09:08):
Okay, yeah.
This is not cinematic gold.
No.
However, it is so much fun.
SPEAKER_02 (09:14):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (09:14):
Which I mean, we're gonna keep saying this about the
entire series.
Like, this is what makes campyhorror amazing.
SPEAKER_02 (09:21):
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (09:22):
They look at it with just the right amount of
seriousness where you'reinvested in it, but also like
it's goofy, it's silly, andthat's okay.
It's a good time.
SPEAKER_02 (09:32):
Yeah, it is a good time.
It also makes the point, right,that these films, even though it
has 16% on rotten tomatoes,continue to turn a massive
profit.
They continue to be money-makingmachines for Paramount.
SPEAKER_00 (09:45):
Yeah, good luck having your independent rom-com
with 16% on Rotten Tomatoes,turn a profit.
SPEAKER_02 (09:53):
Right, right.
And again, I just I really lovethe campiness and the silliness
of this.
It doesn't take itself tooseriously as a franchise.
And I really wasn't expectingthese movies to shift in tone so
drastically between, but theydo, especially with the movies
that we're going to get intonow, like the later, mid to mid
to later of the franchise films.
(10:13):
The next year in 1986, Fridaythe 13th, Jason Lives, so part
six was released.
Here's the thing (10:19):
this is my favorite movie so far in the
franchise.
SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
Okay, why?
SPEAKER_02 (10:24):
This movie rocks.
SPEAKER_00 (10:26):
Okay, moving on.
SPEAKER_02 (10:28):
It's unhinged in a delightful way.
Like the opening feels likehocus pocus.
It's like this pure 80s, likeDisney.
There's something about it,there's like also this meta-ness
to this movie where it feelslike uh similar to Scream, but
well before Scream.
Even the caretaker of thecemetery like gives the audience
a wink.
(10:48):
Like there's just this funplayfulness.
It feels more polished, it feelslike it's set in again, it's
like a 90s dream Disney World,but with violence.
Like, I don't know.
There's something about thatthat's really delightful to me.
SPEAKER_00 (11:02):
I'm gonna be honest with you.
Five, six, and seven, I'm gonnaneed reminders because we watch
them back to back and they feellike a fever dream.
SPEAKER_02 (11:11):
Well, this is the one where another reason why I
love it so much is because webecome supernatural in this
movie.
This is the film where Jason islike a reanimated zombie corpse.
SPEAKER_00 (11:24):
Okay, so this is the one that establishes the
precedent that he is a thiswalking juggernaut zombie thing.
SPEAKER_02 (11:30):
Yeah, so the film opens with Tommy, again played
by a totally different actor,Marlon Brando, as an adult in a
graveyard on a stormy night.
And we can kind of assume thathe's there, he's trying to
cremate Jason.
He opens up the grave, he digsto his grave, opens it up, he's
got gasoline.
I think he's trying to make sureJason's body is really destroyed
because he's so suspicious thathe's gonna come back and he just
(11:52):
can't move on mentally, right?
He's dealing with that.
So, through a series ofunfortunate events, he actually
conducts lightning into hiscorpse after stabbing him with a
metal pole from the fence, whichreanimates him.
So essentially, when he opensthe coffin, he's spooked and
he's like, ah, so he puts thisuh like metal spear into Jason,
(12:13):
lightning hits it, Frankensteinscene, he's reanimated, and now
he's supernatural.
SPEAKER_00 (12:20):
You shouldn't ever Frankenstein somebody.
It's a bad idea.
Sorry, you should neverFrankenstein a serial killer.
It's a bad idea.
SPEAKER_02 (12:27):
It's a you know what?
I sh I'll go as far as to sayyou should never Frankenstein
anybody.
Having just watchedFrankenshooker for the first
time, don't Frankensteinanybody.
SPEAKER_00 (12:37):
I don't know.
I feel like Frankenstein has itstime and place.
SPEAKER_02 (12:40):
You haven't watched Frankenshooker yet.
I also just have to mention, andthis is like a thing, this, you
know, the the James Bondintroduction, which was done as
part of this like self-awaremeta-campiness, was done on
purpose.
There's like this, you know,that like iconic circular James
Bond.
They do that at the beginning ofthis movie as a title sequence,
and they did it on purpose.
SPEAKER_00 (13:01):
Well, I mean, I imagine they do it on purpose.
SPEAKER_02 (13:02):
Yeah, but it's just so silly.
It's so silly.
Okay, so Jason, as he does,makes his way back to Camp
Crystal Lake, which is nowcalled Camp Forest Green.
SPEAKER_00 (13:11):
Why?
SPEAKER_02 (13:12):
Because the town's trying to move on, they're
trying to like dissociate fromwhat happened.
And as he tends to do, he startsto kill everyone and anyone that
he comes across.
Throughout a lot of this movie,Tommy, who again is totally
different, like new Tommy, istrying to convince the local
sheriff that Jason is back, butno one believes him, except for
the sheriff's hot daughter.
(13:33):
Like, literally, it's like somuch of the movie is him being
like, help, help, there's akiller.
Jason's back, Jason's back, andeveryone's like, Tommy, you're
just fucked up, right?
You're just, you weretraumatized as a kid, and now
nobody believes you.
It's like gaslighting up thewazoo.
The end, the end of this one iswild.
So essentially, Tommy luresJason out into the lake with
(13:55):
this idea of chaining him to ananchor, setting him on fire.
It's like this whole crazything.
And after some struggle and likeback and forth and blah blah
blah, Jason does end up chainedat the bottom of the lake.
SPEAKER_00 (14:08):
Which smart move.
SPEAKER_02 (14:11):
It's like sort of, but it feels like it defies
gravity and science that he helike stands upright on this like
neck chain and doesn't just flipup out of it.
Like it's well, Jason isbuoyant.
Just in his head?
Well, his whole body's buoyant.
Yeah, but well, he anybody elsewould flip up.
Why?
No what?
No.
Because your legs are buoyant.
SPEAKER_00 (14:30):
But he's tied by his legs in his head.
SPEAKER_02 (14:32):
No, just by his his th neck.
SPEAKER_00 (14:34):
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (14:35):
I think.
That's why I'm like so.
SPEAKER_00 (14:37):
Well, he's wearing heavy boots.
Oh, okay, sure.
And he's like he's a blo he's abloated corpse.
SPEAKER_02 (15:04):
He also gets like fucked up by the rudder of the
boat, right?
SPEAKER_00 (15:07):
So that's really Yeah, he gets whacked by the old
boat.
SPEAKER_02 (15:09):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (15:09):
You know, this establishes like the if you when
you have like, you know, the thethe unstoppable monster, you
just gotta contain it.
You can't kill him, so you gottatrap him.
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (15:20):
Uh, which, great.
It's it's it's a wonderfultrope.
And so now you have the thing oflike Jason's weakness is being
imprisoned in the blake that hedied.
Right.
Cool, that's a cool mythos.
We like that.
SPEAKER_02 (15:33):
It is cool.
I immediately recognized thatsix was gonna be my favorite
one.
And again, there's still twomore for us to watch, so we'll
see.
But there's even like thisbizarre social commentary in the
movie that's not bizarre on itsown, but bizarre in a Friday the
13th movie.
One of the characters uses acredit card that's called
American Excess instead ofAmerican Express, which again,
(15:54):
like, yeah, I'm aligned.
But why in a Friday the 13thmovie are we making this point
about American spending?
SPEAKER_00 (16:00):
Isn't it just like a Greek credit card?
SPEAKER_02 (16:03):
It is, but it's I don't know, it just feels like a
feels like a point.
Yeah.
So Jason lives had a budget ofthree million, the biggest so
far in the franchise.
And it generated 19.5 million inthe US.
So as you're gonna start tonotice, the ROIs are going down
slightly.
Still a great ROI, but it'sgoing down a bit.
SPEAKER_00 (16:23):
Well, right, but you know, dude with these movies,
you want bigger and better everytime.
That's a surefire way to like atleast get people to see it the
first time.
Yeah.
If you can make an incrediblemovie, great.
But that's what gets butts andseats.
And I just again, I thought itwas such a smart move to
establish all the supernaturalstuff.
(16:44):
Yeah.
It's a good pivot in the series.
The same thing happened inHalloween, but way, way too late
in the series.
Well, they've already cementedall the rules of Michael Myers,
or like kind of kept it a bitambiguous of like, you know,
just like maybe what the plotrequires.
Yeah.
Until all of a sudden someone'slike, nope, he runs on evil.
SPEAKER_02 (17:05):
Right.
Okay.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
It gives us like the motivationto keep making the movies.
So part of the reason why somepeople think that the ROI is
starting to slip a little bithere is that there's some
competition in the market.
Notably, Nightmare on Elm Streetwas released the year before,
and its sequels were starting toroll out.
So there's not just Halloweenand Friday the 13th.
(17:28):
Now there's also Nightmare onElm Street.
SPEAKER_00 (17:30):
Which is so good.
SPEAKER_02 (17:31):
It is good, yeah.
It's time for a rewatch.
Maybe I'll watch the first onethis October.
SPEAKER_00 (17:37):
First one, first one's fine, but again, it's like
the first Friday the 13th.
SPEAKER_02 (17:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (17:43):
It's like it hasn't found its charm yet.
SPEAKER_02 (17:46):
Yeah, totally.
SPEAKER_00 (17:47):
It's a good movie.
It just hasn't found its charm.
SPEAKER_02 (17:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (17:49):
And like that, that is a weird thing about these
movies.
There's like this cozy charm tothem.
SPEAKER_02 (17:54):
There is.
SPEAKER_00 (17:54):
It's which is weird to say about watching people get
like s stabbed in lacerated.
SPEAKER_02 (18:00):
In the worst, brute, most brutal way possible.
SPEAKER_00 (18:03):
Um, and also just like we as Friday 13th keeps
going on in the franchise, thekills are getting more unique.
SPEAKER_02 (18:11):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (18:11):
Which is great.
You you want to see cool,elaborate things.
You know, we're not like sawlevel deaths, nor should we,
because like which we wouldbreak the character.
He's like a he's he's he's thislike mindless juggernaut zombie.
SPEAKER_01 (18:23):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
He just kills you fast.
Right.
Cool.
You know, Freddie Krueger toyswith people.
He needs you afraid.
So there's like all these.
No, Jason just shows up and hestabs you.
Um, but how do you make thatinteresting?
SPEAKER_01 (18:36):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (18:37):
I do think it's funny though, that I don't know,
I don't know if it was thismovie or a different one, but
it's something that happens inmultiple Friday the 13th.
He does exactly what MichaelMyers does.
Uh, there's a where there's apart in the movie where there's
the final girl running around,finding all of the bodies one by
one, and then there's just likethe killer just like kind of
(19:00):
popping out, yeah, just to watchher reaction and be like, hey,
look at this picture I made.
SPEAKER_02 (19:05):
Yeah, I'm gonna talk about that too when we get
there.
There's so much that borrowsfrom these other films that come
out around it for sure.
And it's also one of thosethings where there's only so
many ways to to set up a slashermovie that follows this specific
format, right?
Where it's in, you know, I wouldsay again, like Halloween,
Friday the 13th, Nairobi and ElmStreet follow like a pretty
(19:28):
similar specific format.
And even though there's somedeviation and tonal differences
and all this stuff, in thisworld where there's teenagers
being hunted by a male killerwith a weapon, right?
It's it's a pretty like limitedscope.
And so we're gonna have somemoments that feel similar.
SPEAKER_00 (19:43):
But also we're only we're you know, we're already up
to movie number six, and we'reonly up to 1985.
Yeah, they really sound themout.
Yeah, but also it's it'simportant to keep the context of
like they're still writing theprecedent.
Right.
Yes, there's been other moviesmade already, but it's not like
(20:05):
this has been done for decadesso far.
SPEAKER_02 (20:07):
Right.
Halloween came out in 78.
It's been six years, sevenyears.
Yeah.
Jason Lives was directed by TomMcLachlan.
McLachlan was faced with thetask of bringing Jason back to
the series, especially afterfans missed him in five, right?
He wasn't in five, he wasn't apart of it.
Now McLachlan had to figure outhow to bring him back with a in
a in a way that was exciting,and I think he does that with
(20:30):
the opening and the Frankensteinscene for sure.
McLachlan was a longtime horrorfan, especially of the classic
monster films, which again Ithink you can see in the
Frankenstein reanimationsequence from the beginning.
He also wanted to add humor tothe franchise.
He, which, okay, I might arguethat there was already humor in
the franchise, but he wanted topurposefully add intentional
(20:51):
humor, and I think he did a goodjob.
Like I again, I think the toneof six felt scary and had like
funny moments for sure.
Agreed.
The movie also features threesongs from this band.
Do you know which band it is,Alan?
Nope.
Alice Cooper.
Wow.
Including a song called He'sBack, The Man Behind the Mask.
(21:12):
I think about uh Dream Warriorsa little bit with you know, just
like having one band sort ofrepresent your sequel.
SPEAKER_00 (21:18):
Who did Dream Warriors?
SPEAKER_02 (21:19):
Doken, that metal band.
Remember that we watched themusic video?
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:24):
I forgot about that.
SPEAKER_02 (21:25):
Yeah.
I think it's kind of like a funthing when you have these like
hardcore bands making these like80s music videos to go with
these slasher movies.
SPEAKER_00 (21:32):
I mean 80s and metal went hand in hand.
SPEAKER_02 (21:34):
Ugh, yeah.
The good old days.
SPEAKER_00 (21:39):
What's your favorite uh 80s metal band?
SPEAKER_02 (21:41):
Dawkins.
SPEAKER_00 (21:42):
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (21:43):
Yeah.
I'm a fan.
Too bad they didn't work out.
Alright, just when you think,things can't get any better,
right?
We've had this like hocus pocusFrankenstein reanimation.
Where can the series possibly gofrom here that's any better?
SPEAKER_00 (22:00):
Hard to say.
But we have to.
Dare I say Friday the 13th, partseven?
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
Folks, we have telekinesis.
SPEAKER_00 (22:08):
What was this one called?
SPEAKER_02 (22:10):
It is called Friday the 13th, part seven, A New
Blood from 1988.
SPEAKER_00 (22:14):
An excellent year.
SPEAKER_02 (22:16):
The concept was literally Jason versus Carrie.
That was like the concept of themovie.
It was cool.
SPEAKER_00 (22:22):
It works really, really well.
SPEAKER_02 (22:24):
I wish it was Carrie because she would have fucked
him up.
But it ended up being this girlnamed Tina who battles Jason
until the very end.
Tina! We pick up this movieright where the last one ended,
with Jason still being chained,still being chained, not
floating up to the bottom ofCrystal Lake, still vertically
floating in the same exactposition.
SPEAKER_00 (22:46):
He floats like um a naval mine.
SPEAKER_02 (22:49):
Yeah, but he's a man.
SPEAKER_00 (22:52):
But he's a man.
SPEAKER_02 (22:54):
Then we jump ahead in time a bit and we meet Tina.
So Tina's dealing with somechildhood trauma.
SPEAKER_00 (23:00):
She's dealing with some stuff, okay?
SPEAKER_02 (23:01):
Of when her dad died on this very lake.
SPEAKER_00 (23:04):
Uh, dare I say, when she killed him.
SPEAKER_02 (23:07):
But she returns to the lake with her mom and a
doctor who's studying herbecause she has telekinetic
powers.
We realize pretty quickly thather therapist is horrible,
manipulative, and abusive, andhe's trying to exploit her.
But her powers start to get outof hand, and so she accidentally
brings Jason back to life.
SPEAKER_00 (23:27):
An honest mistake.
SPEAKER_02 (23:29):
Oh, yeah, I'm I'm not mad at her about it.
SPEAKER_00 (23:31):
And, you know, then we get to see a cool Jason
versus telekinesis battle.
Yeah.
Which is really freaking cool.
SPEAKER_02 (23:37):
It is.
Jason starts on his typicalmurder spree, and Tina starts to
use her mind powers to fightback.
Tina manages to actually trapJason back in the lake.
I mean, there's just so manysimilarities here to Carrie, and
it's very purposefully done thatway, right?
Carrie came out in 1976.
(23:58):
So it was certainly apre-established fan favorite by
this time.
This is about a decade later, alittle over 12 years later.
Okay, so this is the moviewhere, similar to Halloween,
Tina starts to find all of herdead friends as the movie gets
on, and all of that sort of actsas fuel, right, to piss her off.
New Blood was directed by JohnCarl Bulcher, a prolific
(24:18):
filmmaker who's worked on asmany special effects teams as
films he's directed.
So his IMGB is sort of split.
No, it's more, but it's likehe's directed a hand uh, you
know, 10 or 12 or whatever, buthe's also been like head special
effects guy on that many.
It reminds me of Stan Winston,who directed Pumpkin Head and
again was a special effectsperson, and you can see that
(24:39):
influence both in Pumpkin Headand in the seventh installment
of Friday the 13th.
There's really like a shift, Iwould say, in the movie towards
special and practical effects,uh, which is really fun.
But similar to Five, A NewBlood, a lot of this movie was
censored.
And so some of his really coolspecial effects work, including
(25:01):
this like fully exposed rib cageof Jason, is censored and cut
out.
SPEAKER_00 (25:06):
Oh, this is the one where he walks around looking.
Okay, so this version of Jason,I think, is probably one of the
(25:40):
most iconic Jason looks, andpeople don't realize it.
Uh, I don't know.
SPEAKER_02 (25:46):
Oh, it's interesting you say that actually.
SPEAKER_00 (25:48):
I don't I don't know exactly why.
SPEAKER_02 (25:50):
I do.
SPEAKER_00 (25:50):
Um, but I'm gonna I'm gonna guess uh that this is
the this is the version that allthe Halloween stores latched
onto as the the official Jasoncostume.
SPEAKER_02 (26:01):
I think it's also because stunt man Kane Hotter
plays Jason for the first time,and then he really becomes the
the like actor.
He goes on to play him for infour films.
And he kind of I think there'ssomething missing maybe up until
this point, even though we're sodeep in the series, like this uh
stability of of who Jason is inevery film it's different.
(26:24):
And in this movie, Kane Hotter,I think, helps to identify and
define Jason, you know, for therest of the series.
SPEAKER_00 (26:31):
Well, beyond just like the actor, just like the
the actual look of the makeupwith the exposed parts, the
chain around the neck.
SPEAKER_02 (26:40):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (26:40):
I didn't realize how familiar this look was until I
saw it again in the movie.
SPEAKER_02 (26:45):
Well, I bet also for you, like I wonder if video
games use this, right?
Because you play video gamesmore than I do.
SPEAKER_00 (26:52):
What would that have to do with my fam with Jason?
SPEAKER_02 (26:54):
Isn't he a character in some of them?
SPEAKER_00 (26:56):
In what games?
SPEAKER_02 (26:57):
Isn't there like a game where there's like you
could play like Mike Myers, likea villain's game?
SPEAKER_00 (27:01):
You're talking about Dead by Daylight.
SPEAKER_02 (27:03):
Yeah.
Like I wonder if they use thislook in those things.
SPEAKER_00 (27:06):
Uh well, there's a bunch of skins.
I don't know.
Yeah.
He's like he's definitely inthat game, but you can there's
like every horror villain that'spopular is in that game.
SPEAKER_02 (27:15):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:15):
I'm just saying there's moments Maybe, but I
mean I feel like I associatethis look with like early 2000s.
Sure.
Oh, I wonder if this is the samelook that they use in Freddie
versus Jason.
Maybe.
We'll find out when we get therevery soon.
Maybe I wonder if that's whereit's from.
Because that was my first introto Friday the 13th.
SPEAKER_02 (27:32):
Yeah.
I think it might have been minetoo.
My sister made me go see I thinkit was Freddie versus Jason.
SPEAKER_00 (27:38):
Well, we'll get we'll we'll jump in ahead.
SPEAKER_02 (27:40):
Yeah.
Okay, so fascinating.
There's a full body burn in thismovie where Kane Hodder, the
stunt man who plays Jason, youknow, has a full body burn.
It lasted 40 seconds, which atthe time was the longest in
Hollywood history.
SPEAKER_00 (27:53):
That's kind of terrifying.
SPEAKER_02 (27:54):
Yeah.
40 seconds.
And similar to part five, thisfilm's gore was cut in a huge
way by the MPAA.
The uncut version of this one ismostly lost.
SPEAKER_00 (28:06):
That's a shame.
SPEAKER_02 (28:08):
Okay, new blood was made for 2.8 million, and it
brought in 19.2 million.
So the ROI is standing strong.
SPEAKER_00 (28:15):
Still going, still going well.
SPEAKER_02 (28:16):
Still going well, yeah.
All right, everybody, here isthe moment we've been waiting
for.
Again, you think, okay, we havetelekinesis, we have a
reanimated Jason, FrankensteinJason.
Where could the series go fromhere?
Well, we can go to Manhattan.
In 1989, the masterpiece, Fridaythe 13th, part eight, Jason
Takes Manhattan, was released.
SPEAKER_00 (28:38):
And this was when the series officially jumps the
shark.
SPEAKER_02 (28:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:43):
In the best possible way.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (28:46):
And then it's only up from here, baby.
So first we have to address theelephant in the room.
How did Jason get to Manhattan?
SPEAKER_00 (28:53):
Excellent question.
And we finally, after years ofwondering, we finally learn
where Crystal Lake is.
Hoboken.
In it's in Hoboken.
SPEAKER_02 (29:06):
It's gotta be.
Because it's somehow connectedby river system to Manhattan.
SPEAKER_00 (29:11):
Which means, I mean, I guess it could be anywhere
along the Atlantic, but No,Jason kind of like walks along
the swims, walk treads waterbehind the boat and then gets to
Manhattan.
It cannot be far.
SPEAKER_02 (29:24):
No, he gets on the boat.
He's on the boat.
SPEAKER_00 (29:27):
He's he's on the boat, yeah.
But then he's off the boat.
SPEAKER_02 (29:30):
Yeah.
I mean he's supernatural, he'spowerful.
SPEAKER_00 (29:33):
Yeah, but there's a good chunk of time where he's
trailing the boat in the water.
SPEAKER_02 (29:37):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:38):
So it can't be far.
SPEAKER_02 (29:40):
So here's my thing.
For how the lake is portrayed,think about the first movie when
she's on her little canoe.
It's like a pond, really, right?
And then okay, it becomes like afull-blown like lake you'd have
a camp on, like LakeWinnipegasaki, something like
that.
But for how this lake isportrayed, the scale of the
cruise boat that they end uptaking.
(30:03):
It's impressive.
Is crazy because it's not onlythis like little boat that's
gonna go on these little likeinlet rivers that again somehow
connect to Manhattan, it's it'slike a full steamship with like
cabin suites and bedrooms, andthe professor is the steamer.
The professor has his whole likeyou know, whatever.
It's Titanic leaves in tenminutes.
(30:23):
It's wild.
So Jason is again reanimated,this time by an electric cable
that kind of sparks him back tolife as he's trapped in the
lake.
SPEAKER_00 (30:31):
They gotta stop Frankenstein, this guy.
SPEAKER_02 (30:33):
He's I know.
You'd think they'd have a betterhandle on him.
Jason decides to board thecruise boat that's filled with
high schoolers, and it's kind oflike a Congrats graduation trip
for them.
By the time the boat arrives inManhattan, which is quite Quite
far into the movie.
SPEAKER_00 (30:49):
Hang on.
It's not just quite far into themovie.
We are 80% through the movie bythe time we get to Manhattan.
SPEAKER_02 (30:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:57):
You could tell they just wanted the goofy title of
Jason Takes Manhattan.
Yeah.
But why spend 80% of the movieworking your way there and
trying to justify why he's inManhattan?
SPEAKER_02 (31:11):
Yeah.
But why?
But they don't even they don'tdo a good job of justifying it.
Like to me, it's such a weakplot that he trailed this boat.
I don't know.
SPEAKER_00 (31:19):
It is.
So it's like rip rip off theband-aid.
Oh, he's in Manhattan now.
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (31:22):
We don't even need to know.
Yeah.
It's a logistical nightmare.
SPEAKER_00 (31:26):
Do what so many other horror movies have done of
researchers put him in a box.
SPEAKER_02 (31:31):
Uh-oh, he gets out.
Right.
Just like Jason X, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (31:34):
Uh-oh, right, though.
That's Jason X.
SPEAKER_02 (31:36):
Okay, so Jason has killed most people on the boat
by the time he gets toManhattan.
In the city, Jason continuesstalking a few teens that had
survived on the cruise ship thathe wasn't able to kill.
What takes him down, you mightask?
Toxic City Waste.
Despite its name, the majorityof the movie takes place on said
ship and was actually filmed inVancouver.
(31:56):
Only a small portion was filmedin Manhattan.
I think it was actually filmedlike in Times Square like at 3
a.m.
And I just like it ended up withlike a huge crowd of people
watching them on the side.
SPEAKER_00 (32:07):
That was a Ninja Turtles reference.
SPEAKER_02 (32:09):
Oh, I I wouldn't have gotten that.
SPEAKER_00 (32:11):
Get your shit together.
SPEAKER_02 (32:12):
This is the last Paramount Jason movie after this
New Line Cinema takes over therights.
SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
After this, it's just Criterion Collection.
SPEAKER_02 (32:21):
So Jason Takes Manhattan had the highest budget
to date at 5 million, and itbrought in 14.3 million in the
US.
And though the ROI continues toshrink, there will be four more
Jason movies in the franchise.
SPEAKER_00 (32:35):
And I hope f four more after that.
SPEAKER_02 (32:38):
I hope so too.
And this is just a fun fact.
The stunt man who ended upplaying Jason Wright for the
next four movies, Kane Hotter,he said that when this crowd was
assembled and he was in TimesSquare, that it was the proudest
moment of his life.
Like he felt so much pride doingthat and having all these people
care to watch.
Fans often call this movie oneof the worst unmaskings of
(33:01):
Jason.
SPEAKER_00 (33:02):
He does look kind of silly.
SPEAKER_02 (33:03):
His face looks like a weird, sort of melty
puppet-like face.
It's not as spooky as it was inother movies.
There's also a fun moment inthis movie where there's a boxer
named Julius who gets his headpunched off, which is um like a
fan favorite, and it also waslike extraordinarily complicated
to choreograph.
SPEAKER_00 (33:24):
Oh yeah, they gotta punch someone's fucking head
off.
That's not easy.
SPEAKER_02 (33:27):
It's not easy.
SPEAKER_00 (33:28):
But the it's that sequence is so long.
SPEAKER_02 (33:32):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (33:32):
So long.
Him just like bashing Jasonagain and again every time he
takes the tiniest step back, andthen he just gets too tired.
SPEAKER_02 (33:40):
Yeah, but it's kind of like I don't know.
There's something about thatkill that's kind of satisfying.
SPEAKER_00 (33:44):
Oh, yeah, just but wax wax him.
SPEAKER_02 (33:47):
Wax him, yeah.
So this was the first movie thatreally takes Jason out of Camp
Crystal Lake.
SPEAKER_00 (33:52):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (33:53):
And it begs a lot of questions about how he's gonna
get back.
SPEAKER_00 (33:56):
Well, he just he takes the ferry.
SPEAKER_02 (33:59):
And I you know it's probably off the subway.
It's so close.
Sure, he just takes the light,the light rail to Hoboken.
The light rail?
Yeah.
What's the light rail?
Well, ones you could take thepath to Hoboken, then there's a
light rail which goes likedeeper into New Jersey.
SPEAKER_00 (34:14):
Oh, MJ Transit.
SPEAKER_02 (34:16):
That's right.
And then there's NJ Transit,which is trains.
Yeah.
There's three ways.
Three ways to get around.
At least.
And buses, of course.
I guess he has a lot of options.
Ferries, buses.
The Jitney.
That's in Long Island.
It's not New Jersey.
Nice try though.
I mean, here's the thing.
I'm all for Boat Jason.
I'm all for Manhattan.
Jason.
(34:36):
I just wish this movie, likewhat I feel like happens now a
little bit, my bigger critiqueis that these premise, the
premise for some of these moviesthat we're gonna get into next
episode, but especially Jasontakes Manhattan, they're so wild
to your point.
Like they wanted that to be thethe tagline.
And it doesn't go hard enoughfor me.
I just wish it went harder.
I wish it totally threw cautionto the wind.
(34:59):
And you know, Jason was just onsome kind of Manhattan rampage,
it just doesn't go there.
SPEAKER_00 (35:04):
Absolutely.
No, it the the the New Yorkportion of this film is so
small.
Yeah.
Such I mean, I get it, it'sprobably very expensive
comparatively to shoot in NewYork.
Yeah.
But there's what there's there'sways.
We did not have to spend so longon the boat.
SPEAKER_02 (35:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:20):
And like we love boat movies.
I love boats.
And this is a pretty dumb boatmovie.
SPEAKER_02 (35:25):
Yeah.
Because the boat also like itdoesn't give us that much.
Like I think if you okay, ifwe're on the boat, there could
be more nautical, nauticallyinclined kills or something.
And there's a little bit ofthat, but it's it's pretty, it's
all pretty like standard.
I don't know.
SPEAKER_00 (35:38):
Why aren't we seeing Jason impale people with
anchors?
SPEAKER_02 (35:41):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (35:42):
That's cool.
We like that.
SPEAKER_02 (35:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:44):
You know, break somebody over the the break
someone's back over the a steampipe.
SPEAKER_02 (35:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:49):
That's cool.
SPEAKER_02 (35:50):
I mean, the one of the greatest subplots of this
movie is really the therelationship between the captain
and his son.
SPEAKER_00 (35:57):
Yeah.
And his yeah, his poor,disapproving father.
Yeah.
And he just wants to be a littlelittle junior captain.
SPEAKER_02 (36:07):
He just wants his father to be proud of him, and
he's not quite figured it outyet.
SPEAKER_00 (36:12):
I know.
He's like, all right, son,what's the first thing you do?
Oh, we do this.
SPEAKER_02 (36:17):
No! Then he like runs away crying.
It's so sad.
It's so sad.
Oh my gosh.
We are having so much fun withthis series.
I hope you guys are too.
It's been really lovely toreturn again to this format and
to just deep dive into an iconicfranchise that I hadn't seen.
So I feel like I'm long overdueto watch through all of these.
(36:38):
Right now, for me, six is thefilm to be.
Alan, what's your favorite sofar?
SPEAKER_00 (36:42):
Um, the telekinesis carry.
SPEAKER_02 (36:46):
Yeah, seven.
Yeah.
That's a really good one, too.
SPEAKER_00 (36:48):
It's so fun.
SPEAKER_02 (36:48):
It's so fun.
SPEAKER_00 (36:49):
I really thought Jason Takes Manhattan was gonna
be for me.
SPEAKER_02 (36:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (36:52):
It's just it's a weak showing.
It's fun and it's goofy, but thethe bar was set really high by
seven.
SPEAKER_02 (36:58):
Yeah, very true.
I also want to mention that wehave a horror book club that we
meet a few times a year withsome horror fans, and we pick a
book and we collectively get ona Zoom call, so it doesn't
matter where you're located, andwe talk about it.
On October 27th, we are going tomeet to talk about Victorian
Psycho.
Victorian Psycho came out thisyear, so it's really fun to be
(37:19):
reading a novel that is socurrent.
It was written by VirginiaFietto, and so far I'm having a
lot of fun with it.
It's also pretty quick.
I'm a really slow reader, andI've read it a few times before
bed, and I'm at like 50%.
So I would say if you're lookingto get into a horror novel,
something spooky, set the scenefor the days leading up to
(37:41):
Halloween, come join us.
All you have to do is join ourDiscord for information about
how to join, or just DM us onsocial media and I will make
sure that you get the link.
SPEAKER_00 (37:50):
Well, I'm very excited to wrap up this series
with the final four uh Jasonmovies because they're the
silliest.
Because I I don't I feel likethey're gonna at least be the
most unique.
SPEAKER_02 (38:01):
Absolutely.
I'm really excited as well.
We have a few more to go, soI'll I won't say anything, but
we're gonna come back next week.
We're gonna talk about the theremaining four, and then of
course, as a follow-up to all ofthis, we are going to have a
really cool packed episodefeaturing Friday the 13th
adjacent horror stories.
SPEAKER_00 (38:22):
Adjacent?
SPEAKER_02 (38:23):
Ah, nice, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (38:25):
We're pointing at each other.
SPEAKER_02 (38:27):
You can't see because it's a podcast, but we
are pointing.
So, anyway, thank you guys somuch for listening.
Stay spooky.
I hope you're enjoying yourOctober and opening up your mind
as the veil continues to thin.
We'll talk to you soon.
SPEAKER_01 (38:40):
Bye bye.
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