Fire Safety with The Madison Fire Department

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Good morning. I'm Robin Colbert and this is Madison Forum.
I guess this morning is Bill Sullivan. He is the
fire Marshal with Madison's Fire Department. Bill, thanks so much
for joining me. I know this is a real busy
time of year for the fire department.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Yes it is, and thank you for having me on
the show today.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
Absolutely so. I was just looking over some tidbits from
fire department about the busiest days of the year. They
say the top three fire days Thanksgiving. Okay, that's in
the rear view, but we have Christmas, even Christmas Day.
Those are the other two that make up the top three.
Of course they're on the horizon. And how did we

(00:41):
do on Thanksgiving Day? Was it? Was it busy? Or
were people safer this time around or what?

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah? I think we're we're a little bit better this
time around. I think hopefully somebody's been listening to some
of the messaging we've been putting out about cooking safety. Yeah,
and with that being our number one cause the fires
on those.

Speaker 1 (00:58):
Three days, and with looking safety, I can see with
you know, somebody putting something in the oven and forgetting
about it with common cause, I don't need to tell you,
not necessarily holiday season, just college party season, kids putting
frozen pizzas after they've had maybe too much to drink
in the oven forgetting or you know, passing out starting

(01:18):
to fire with that. I'm always just kind of mystified
though about the stovetop. You know, somebody putting something on
the top of the stove and that and that's caused
some cooking fires. It's like, how can you forget that?

Speaker 2 (01:29):
But you know, at this time of the year, we
got a lot of distractions with family and friends coming
over and visiting. You know, we got a lot of
the stress with our busy lives, trying to make sure
that we're getting everything accomplished in a short amount of times.
We're prepared for the holiday season, and those little things
eat those eat up that are take our attention away

(01:50):
and add to those distractions and we walk away. And
it doesn't take long in today's environment for a fire
to turn to get out of hand real quickly. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
So now for Christmas, in the holiday season leading up
to the actual holiday, how have the calls been coming
in for MFD.

Speaker 2 (02:11):
Well, we've been busy, actually, I think we just cleared
from a pretty significant fire this morning, and I don't
have any details on that yet, you know, but yes,
we will stay busy. Unfortunately for well, we'll probably expect
to see three or four buyers in the next rest
of this month, you know, kind of our average. And unfortunately,

(02:35):
we need people to be a little more attentative to
what they're doing and their surroundings, and don't be afraid
to call nine one one if they suspect anything, and
call early rather than waiting till it's out of hands.

Speaker 1 (02:48):
Yeah, I can see that scenario where you know, you're
in the kitchen, maybe a paper towel catches on a
gastove flame or something like that, and you think that
you've got it under control, and before you know it,
it's and those can those can take off pretty quickly,
never mind your house, putting your own self at risk, Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (03:07):
Right, we want we would rather that people get out
of the house, have their home evacuation planing, get out
of the house, and then call nine to one one.
It doesn't hurt our feelings if we get turned around
at all. We'd rather do that and maybe just one
crow comes by and visits and confirms that everything's out.

(03:27):
That's that's a much better scenario for a.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
Lot of businesses or government departments when the Christmas holiday
rolls around, it's kind of a skeleton schedule. But I'm
guessing on for the fire department though, you you can't
do a skeleton schedule. You have to actually do you
have more people on hand.

Speaker 2 (03:48):
We do not necessarily staff up, but we do maintain
our same level of staffing throughout the year three sixty five,
so that doesn't change for us unless there's a major
like event going on in the city. Otherwise we're at
our same staffing every day.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
Some of the safety tips that I've seen the fire
department putting out online. By the way, anybody with any
questions over fire safety or what have you, Madison Fire
Department website a very good source of information. Looking here.
You know, candles this time of year, we will and
candles actually what for the past couple of decades, they

(04:27):
really made a resurgence. I don't know how many stupid
candle parties I've been invited to over the past twenty years,
but people just really all of a sudden, We're like, well, oh, candles,
So you got to hate candles, don't you.

Speaker 2 (04:40):
H Yeah, we have a love relationship with me and
my wife. Yeah, but yees, candles, you know, if they're
used correctly, they're a nice feature. Nice spreads some ambiance
and whether you're doing that for a sense or what
have you. But the big thing is is using those safely,
like by putting on a solid surface again, not walking away,

(05:02):
not leaving them unattended. If you do those couple of things,
you'll be fine. But it's those that we use them
a lot. We've become complacent, we leave the room, we
forget about the cats and the dogs or the kids
running around, and maybe they actually bump into a table
or knock something over or throw a ball. That's when
we see lots of issues.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
Have candles come as far as overcoming discarded cigarette materials
as causing fires Over the past couple of years, with
the decrease in smoking rates, whether it's an increase to
vapor what have you, have you seen that change around
or smoking materials still way up there too.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
So smoking materials are still way up there significantly. I
have not compared the two to see which one is
kind of still the lead. Yeah, but there we do
go to a significant number of calls with improperly discarded
smoking materials. The issue that we see a lot lately
is putting them out in potted plants. People go buy
their potted plants, they have them on their deck and

(06:05):
then they think that that is just dirt. But most
of our potted plants that we buy now are peat
moss material that is very combustible, so that that has
probably been one of our more common fires from smoking
discard smoking materials recently.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, I remember it was probably several years back. Now,
I can't tell you the exact year, but I remembered
that exact cause. Sparked some at a department complex, some
huge blaze that just really got out of hand. Yes, Yeah,
so that's that's definite. No. Now, Now, as far as
when it comes to holiday lights, you should always go

(06:42):
for the lights that look for the mark U L. Right,
and what does L stand for?

Speaker 2 (06:47):
Correct? Look for U L. It's called understands for underwriter laboratories.
They test a lot of things and you kind of
got to understand what they're testing for. But for the
most part, they're testing to make sure or that they
don't overheat, they're not going to be a shock hazard,
and a few other safety things like that they don't
necessarily test for how well the product works other than

(07:11):
the safety elements of it, and that's kind of their focus.
But yes, please look for lighting that is or decorations
that are you well lifted, and then also make sure
that lifting is. Whether it's an indoor product or an
outdoor product, A lot of that has to do with
what kind of heat is going to be dissipated, sure,
whether tightness weather appropriate, So make sure that those match

(07:34):
where you're using them, whether indoor outdoors.

Speaker 1 (07:37):
Absolutely, because you think about you know, you're stringing these
puppies around highly flammable items like a Christmas tree. Whether
it be from the fireman's point of view, do you
prefer the use of an artificial tree or a natural tree?
Which one is the bigger fire hazard? Or are they

(07:57):
created equally?

Speaker 2 (07:58):
I would say at this point there I have created equally.
You know, really they've become the load. They're typically not
necessarily the source of the fire, but when a fire
does start, they add significantly that fire load. If we're
talking natural trees, the biggest best thing you can do
for if you're purchasing a natural tree is make sure

(08:19):
you purchase one that has been more freshly cut right,
so the leaves aren't falling off when you purchase it,
and then make sure you're watering that on a regular basis.
If you do that, that that really reduces the risk
of cut trees. And then when you're talking artificial trees again,
looking for that UL label to make sure that that

(08:41):
is it meets all the safety features that it should meet,
and then also checking the decorations and the wire on that.
And if you can keep the source of your fire,
keep candles, space heaters, and the and the lights are
in good working order, it shouldn't be a problem.

Speaker 1 (08:56):
You guys don't ever run into like the back in
the old in days, maybe the cratchet's putting candles on
their their trees. I mean, you never run into a
scene like that anymore, do it.

Speaker 2 (09:08):
I have not personally seen that lately. I have heard
from a friend of a friend that somebody was still
doing that dot But you know, for the most part,
we're really pushing if you if you like the idea
of having a candle on the tree like in the
Bob Tragic Days, we would highly recommend who actually we

(09:30):
would say don't ever do that, but we would say
that your choice better choice. Would be to used LED
lighted candles right the long way. Some of them are
have a time setting, some of them can be done
by light and the simple they're much simpler and safer.

Speaker 1 (09:48):
Absolutely. I remember if my grandmother having the bubble lights,
which I would think are I mean as opposed to
a candle. Anything's way safer than that. But it does
appear to be pretty safe.

Speaker 2 (09:59):
Yeah, And the other thing that's changed with our lighting
is with the LED Christmas lights as well. They don't
produce the same kind of heat that the lights we
used to string back in the seventies, right, you know,
so that is also really helped reduce our sources of ignition.
So make sure you have more modern string lighting. Using

(10:24):
LEDs also will be a nice dafty feature.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
Yeah, my husband big stickler on the LEDs, and for
good reason, and I kind of wonder why did it
even sell. You would think, I don't know what the
regulations are in the holiday light to core industry. But
you know, since LEDs have become the go to, why
those old fashioned fire hazards are still around?

Speaker 2 (10:47):
Yeah? I think some of it's like somebody might be
finding something on eBay or some people like there's a
lot of nostalgia retrofit groups out there that will bring
some of those things a light or back on the market.
And unfortunately, that's why we we need to rely on
people to be looked again looking for that UL label
when they purchased that some of these things are purchased

(11:09):
overseas and shipped in and they don't go through the
same safety protocols as other manufacturers being in the United States.

Speaker 1 (11:17):
Yeah, and that probably ties into my question here. I
was going to ask about when we were talking about
the artificial trees of fire department recommen, you make sure
that it is fire reheardant, And I was trying to think,
why would somebody, Why would a manufacturer put one out
because you know there are going to be lights on
that Why would you put one out that was not?
But again, a lot of shipments from overseas, I'm guessing yeah, yeah, if.

Speaker 2 (11:41):
It's processed through a reputable company from the United States,
it's going to be fire retarded and it's going to
have that u AL lifting. It's just going to be Again,
there's so many things that we can purchase through the
Internet that don't go through the same protocols, so be
cognizant of where you're purchasing your product.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
Absolutely, and that extra the extra savings you might think
you're getting from a cheaper, less safe tree, Yeah, you
could lose all that if your house goes up in flames.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
So the reason there's the reason that it's cheaper.

Speaker 1 (12:12):
Yeah. Absolutely. And then the power strips, and I know
I've been I have been guilty of this in the past.
I'm trying to do better here and not overloading loading
power strips, and I like how you put it, Yeah,
the daisy chain of extension courts.

Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yeah. Yeah, So power strips have come a long way.
So the modern ones are definitely much significant improvements and
quality over something that might have been purchased ten to
fifteen years ago. A lot of them have a lot
of some built infuses and some overrides some safety features.

(12:50):
So do take a look at that. Look at the
wattage that that power strip is designed for. The more
robust commercial grade, obviously you can put more power through
it versus something that you might buy the dollar store.
So take a look at that. Also, you're lighting, they

(13:11):
typically the manufacturer will tell you how many a maximum
number of lights that you can string together interconnected, whether
that's three, five or seven. So take a look at
that as well. Make sure you're not overloading. And when
you overload the electrical system, what happens is it generates
excess heat as it's trying to push the electricity through there,

(13:33):
and then that's where the failure typically comes in, and
in overheats, a prodcusts too close to that or the
wire can'ticipate that heat, and then that melts and catches
the virus.

Speaker 1 (13:44):
You know, I'm visualizing as you're talking here about overloaded
power strips or outlets. You've seen the movie A Christmas Story, Yeah,
and you know the scene where the old the old
man is plugging in, Oh the leg lamp, that's what
he's plugging in, and that just catastrophe of cords and plugins.
Is that must give you PTSD whenever you see that?

Speaker 2 (14:08):
Oh yes, yes, So I mean it should be one
plug for one outlet, right, So if you've got to
a duplex outlet, you should plug going two things into that.
And also if you're experiencing circuit breakers that are being
tripping on a regular basis, that circus being overloaded and
you need to have somebody come in and take a

(14:29):
look at that, or or start unplugging some things because
that will be another source of an issue. So simply
just going down and flipping the circuit breaker back on
that and as an indication that there's something being overloaded,
that's just being overworked somewhere.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
Yeah, because these things, these fires, they might start out little,
they can spread so rapidly, and especially with a material
like a Christmas tree, uh, fueling it on, I mean,
it can go poof and no time.

Speaker 2 (15:01):
I'm guessing absolutely, Robin. Were you know a long time ago,
we used to studies used to kind of indicate that
we had about ten to fifteen minutes from to get
out of a home when a fire was discovered. That
time has now been reduced to about two to three minutes.
And that's really based on the amount of material and

(15:24):
the type of material we keep in our homes. That
artificial Christmas tree, all of our furniture mostly is made
out of some type of plastic base, whether that's the
glues or the material itself. We don't make furniture out
of cotton and wood and steel like we did many

(15:45):
years ago. So that fuel load is what the real
issue is becoming that the fire can grow real rapidly
and we significantly reduce anyone's time to get out of
a home. And again that's why we really talk harp
on get out called nine one. One has that home
escape plan. Make sure you have good working smoke alarms.

(16:06):
The smoke alarm is going to tell you it's time
to get out, and you really need to move what
that smoke alarm goes off, because if it's a pre
burning fire is not it's going to be a matter
of a minute before that space where that fire is
at is untenable and we have a significant issue.

Speaker 1 (16:24):
Yeah. Absolutely, And outdoors, you know, decorating outside, it's also
every year you just see more and more of it's
it's it's very Hallmark movie asque. I have outdoor lights,
love it. A lot of people do. The inflatables, but
is this increasing fire risks those big inflatables? Are they

(16:46):
pretty safe for what?

Speaker 2 (16:48):
So? I don't have any personal experience with the inflatables
being a real issue other than again, like you noted
that the more stuff we put out there, that just
creates more load and is the electrical system able to
support that load? That's probably the first thing I would
be looking at be.

Speaker 1 (17:08):
Worried about because they're also getting bigger. I mean, yeah,
you're getting.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
Bigger and all. And I'll come down to the motor,
what kind of motor it has, how big it is.
And again, well I re hit that theme that you
all lifting right, is that is that all properly grounded
and built to an industry safe standard is critical. So again,
do take a look at that when you're stringing those

(17:33):
things together and making sure you have a good power
source that can supply all of those things.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
And then you know, a popular way of decorating, of course,
make sure they're outdoor lights, but draping the outdoor lights
on your shrubbery around your house. Now the natural shrubbery,
does that fuel a fire like an artificial tree or
is that a slower burn?

Speaker 2 (17:59):
It would burn, you know, it would burn just as
just as fast as a as a Christmas tree. But
a lot that's going to be depending on what kind
of leaves and stuff is on that on that tree.
But if it's never green, that's planted in the ground,
more than likely it's going to be properly watered, you know,
so it's going to have to be able to pull
some moisture into the into the limbs and whatnot. So

(18:21):
it's but so it is a concern. But again, the
biggest thing that we're more really concerned about is what's
starting the fire. The Christmas tree, the bush in the
in the front yard, that's not what the what starts
the fire. Starting the fire is going to be the
improper maintenance of those of those lights or using the
wrong lights.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Yeah. And of course, and a more serious culprit with
your electrical system if for whatever reason, I suppose when
when we make the switch into the heating season, uh,
to be extra safe, that should always you should always
get a once over at your home, should you not
just make sure that your electrical your home's electrical grid

(19:04):
is okay.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
Yeah, So from from the you know, from the heating perspective,
you know, we see a significant number of call false
calls when the electrical systems electric basebort heating first starts
up in the air. The big thing is before you
turn those on, make sure that they're clean of dust
and everything else, because that kind of gives off in

(19:27):
order when they first start up. But for the most part, yeah,
we want to make sure that there isn't any kind
of damage to any of the wiring or the circuits
or any of the or and all the guards are
in plate, so kids playing next to them don't get
don't burn themselves. That's probably the biggest thing with electric heating,

(19:47):
and then also with if you've got gas heating or
oil furnace or something along that line. Is also making
sure that you get a annual check up on your
furnace to make sure that it's burning properly, because that
product of the process of combustion, one of the by
products is carbon monoxide. And as long as we have

(20:08):
that all sealed up and it's working properly, that's all
being exhausted to the exterior. But if there's some type
of a crack in the heat exchanger or the exhaust piping,
then that's putting that into the home. And that you know,
carbon dioxide is a colorless, order less gas, And the
only way somebody's going to know that that's there is

(20:29):
that they have a carbon monoxide alarm in their home.

Speaker 1 (20:33):
And which there shouldn't even be in question in this
day and age. You should always have if you got
it's just as important as your smoke alarm.

Speaker 2 (20:42):
Absolutely, yeah, we should have a carbon dioxide alarm on
every floor level at a minimum.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
Okay, do you guys run into in the city, but
there are plenty of old building sold construction in town.
Do you run into people using heating oil much anymore?

Speaker 2 (21:02):
I can't recall. I think most everything has changed over,
but I can't say that for certain that there's not
still a handful.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
Out there multi unit housing there is. Isn't there a
requirement that new construction they all have to be equipped
with sprinklers? Correct?

Speaker 2 (21:26):
Yeah, so homes that were built or part buildings that
were built. You know, somewhere around twenty fifteen the number
went down. So it started at eight units or more
or more than a unit, sorry, and now now it's
down to three units or more. New construction now has

(21:47):
requirement for fire sprinklers, right, and fire sprinklers is like
having a firefighter in every room. We've had some significant
successes with the sprinklers controlling a fire into the room
of origin in I think we've had a ten fire
sprinkler saves a number. I just saw this this this morning, Oh,

(22:07):
jee that have occurred this year. We've had ten fire
sprinkler activations that contained a fire before the fire department
got there, which makes a huge difference because we're putting
the water on the fire almost immediately once the temperature
reaches one hundred and fifty five or two hundred degrees,
depending what the sprink what type of sprinkler head you have,

(22:29):
and that really gives you the time to get out.
We talked a bit ago about smoke alarms tell you
it's time to get out. Fire sprinklers gives.

Speaker 1 (22:37):
You the time to get out, to get yep, to
get out. And I would think too, as the owners
of this property, I can't excite the old building's obviously
what the grandfathered in. They don't have to go and
be retrofitted with the sprinklers or is there something in
the works that would require that.

Speaker 2 (22:52):
Correct right now, you know, we typically do not have
a whole lot of codes and standards are retroactive. So yes,
once once the product building was built, they get to
stay in compliance with that code. That was an effect
at the time that the building was built. However, doesn't
mean you can't retrofit. So there are some tax advantages

(23:14):
that somebody is a property owner and they would like
to look at that. Some of the tax codes have
changed recently to be able to write off that whole
retrofit project off that that cost or four years compared
to the old version of thirty plus years. So there's
some definitely some tax advantages now. But also we see

(23:37):
a lot of people start to look at the downtime
that they if they were to experience a fire, probably
loses more revenue sure than the cost of put in.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
The spring for system in absolutely, and also I would
think for liability or for insurance purposes, I would I
would be guessing. I'm guessing, but it seems logical to
me that your premiums would be adjusted and lower than
if you didn't have this sprinkler system.

Speaker 2 (24:01):
Yeah, I would if you if you more interested in
looking at that. Definitely, top agents, there is some breaks,
some some are offering breaks. What that is changes based
on the on the company and also maybe the significance
of the risk. Right, you know that we don't know
that there's a different fire loss for a single family

(24:23):
home versus a you know, one hundred thousand storage facility, right,
So there's definitely some so that that number is going
to change drastically. So it's a little tough to pinpoint,
but there definitely is an option for.

Speaker 1 (24:36):
That, all right. And and homeowner, I mean single single
family homeowners, I mean, you can get a sprinkler system
put in. Right, I'm guessing maybe some of the bigger
McMahon probably I.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
Wouldn't say that as many as I would like to see,
but they are out there. We just recently worked with
work work with a gentleman that is uh had an
accident and is paraplegic and now all of a sudden
he's and he's in his home by himself. Oh yeah,
you know at times, and this has given him the

(25:10):
freedom to be able to not have to worry about that. Sure,
So you know, those those are those are things to
think about. Also, people that have pets that are left
home during the day while they're at work. Right, your
pets aren't gonna be able to get out on their own,
So a fire sprinker system can can assist with that.

(25:31):
And if you're looking to build, there are options to
put it in as part of the plumbing system and
intertwineos and save some save some money and be able
to protect your family and your loved ones and your home.

Speaker 1 (25:47):
Yeah, I'm guessing I'm guessing it costs some but it's
an investment that could you know, who knows if you
don't know if it could possibly save your life. You
can't predict if, oh, we would have had a bad
house fire. But yeah, especially Yeah, I'm just gonna say that.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
And there are a couple of home developers that do
offer the option to put it in. Obviously you need
to bring that up to them and if you're interested
in building. So our first step was trying really trying
to get people to understand that it is available and
get the developers and the builders on board to know

(26:26):
that hey, if I offer this, maybe we'll get a
handful of people to take this option and install that
in their in their new home. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:35):
I've been talking with Bill Sullivan. He is the farshal
fire marshall and with the City of Madison's fire department.
Just have a few minutes left here, Bill, I did
want to just kind of do an overview of the year.
Uh and I can't recall did we have any fatal
fire fatalities this year in Madison?

Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yeah, unfortunately we have. I want to say the number
is two, which is a little high for us. We've
had a pretty good track record, but also a city
of our size, the you know, comparatively, we are much
better off than other cities our size. We tend to

(27:15):
average between four and five. But the big thing is
is if people take care of their own articulatle onus
on themselves and really think about fire safety all the time.
All of these fires are preventable because they're predictable. So
if we can prevent the fires, then then we can

(27:37):
reduce the fire fire death and make our safe, you know,
our community safer that way.

Speaker 1 (27:44):
And again, let's just hop out to the car for
a minute. We've been hearing some pretty scary stories and
these have been going on over the years, it seems
recently with electric vehicles, fire safety in your vehicle, and
some people might think, what it's good to have one
of those. I don't know what the actual name is

(28:04):
for the window breakers or what have you, those tools.
I know I have one now in my car. If
you can explain, well.

Speaker 2 (28:12):
Yeah, I don't know the actual term of them either.
There's a couple of them are called like spring loaded
punches or or whatnot, and that's really designed for some reason.
If your electric power goes out. Some of the newer
cars you have to have powered open your doors. You know,
you can break a window and find out a window
if for some reason you're you're stuck in there. I

(28:35):
wouldn't say that we see a lot of people use
them or see a lot of use of them, but
it is a tool that that is available out there.
The big thing that we see with the electrical vehicles
now and even some of the e bikes is the
lithium batteries. There's a lot of energy and a small

(28:56):
package and when those get damaged, and that damage could
be from getting hit, that damage could be from being overcharged,
charged with the wrong charger, a lot of different things,
maybe even a manufacturer defect. But when that happens, when
they fail, they have failed pretty violently because there's so

(29:19):
much energy being released at once, and they caused some
pretty significant fires.

Speaker 1 (29:23):
Yeah, so Justina, now, as a precaution, I ordered mine
online and uh never, I hope I never have to
use it. But it was, you know what, like fifteen
bucks or something. It's small price for peace of mind.
So we've come up on our time here, Bill, It's
gone by really quick. Bill Sullivan, my guest this morning.
Bill is the fire marshal with the city of Madison's

(29:44):
fire department. You've been listening to Madison Forum