Episode 6: The Mood Dudes Unpack Healthy Masculinity in the Modern Era

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What does healthy masculinity actually look like in today's world? The Mood Dudes tackle this provocative question head-on in a candid, thought-provoking conversation that challenges traditional notions of what it means to be a man.

Join clinical therapists Immanuel, James, and Joey as they break down the artificial barriers between "masculine" and "feminine" tasks, revealing how many gendered expectations are simply life skills everyone should master. With refreshing honesty, they explore why men often struggle to express platonic affection for one another without discomfort or fear of judgment. Their discussion illuminates how historical economic concerns and religious misinterpretations have shaped harmful attitudes toward male emotional expression.

The conversation takes a fascinating turn when James shares cognitive neuroscience research about potential differences in male and female brain function, sparking a lively debate about nature versus nurture. Rather than settling for simplistic answers, the therapists examine how biology interacts with socialization to create our understanding of gender.

Drawing from personal experience, each therapist shares financial wisdom they wish they'd known at age 18 – from the importance of emergency funds to avoiding impulsive purchases – connecting financial wellbeing directly to mental health. Throughout the episode, they emphasize critical thinking, encouraging listeners to question whether traditional masculine roles actually serve them or those they love.

Whether you're struggling with outdated expectations, curious about healthier expressions of masculinity, or simply interested in understanding men's mental health better, this episode offers compassionate insights and practical suggestions for moving forward. Subscribe now and join the conversation about redefining masculinity for a healthier, more authentic life.

#ManeUpMemphis

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You have to tell me what you are consuming, because
I just see a spoon going to asour cream cup and then going to
your mouth.
That's all I see.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Once again.
Why are you worried aboutwhat's in my mouth, what's?

Speaker 1 (00:13):
in your mouth Nothing but questions.
I'm concerned for yourwell-being.

Speaker 3 (00:15):
Nothing but questions Capital One what's in your
wallet Exactly?

Speaker 1 (00:20):
No, this is a wellness check at this point,
because why are you eating sourcream?
Is everything okay?

Speaker 2 (00:27):
I can eat sour cream on whatever I want to eat sour
cream on.

Speaker 1 (00:30):
I'm not talking about your dietary autonomy.
I'm talking about the decisionto raw dog sour cream.
What is happening?
Are you okay?

Speaker 2 (00:39):
First of all, who is doing it the way that you
phrased that?
Also you no, absolutely notSorry.
No, absolutely not Sorry.
Check the group chat.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
That is rice, that's a new phrase, that is rice.
That is rice We'll just strikethat from the record.
We're not striking it, we'rekeeping it.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
So that was right.
So you're just eating rice.
Okay, I'm not mad at that Riceis great.

Speaker 2 (01:01):
So it's okay to quote unquote raw dog rice, but it's
not okay to raw dog sour cream?

Speaker 1 (01:07):
Absolutely, Absolutely.
One will get you judged andpossibly assessed.
One will not.
And while we're on the topic ofrice, being that girl like,
what's your favorite side dish?
Mine is rice, obviously.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
I thought you were going to say like so, joey,
speaking of rice?

Speaker 2 (01:28):
Ha, I was prepared for that.
I was prepared to help you out,bro.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (01:32):
I'm just kidding.
You would never say that to mebro, I needed that laugh.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
It's been a day.
Oh my god, it's been a day.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
Thank you, Joey that's what I'm here for cell
phones and comedic relief.
But yeah, like, okay, I thinkwe got a good template, we got
some good energy starting offthe show Nobody's going to
answer the question.

(02:01):
And then if you watch the veryfirst part of our recording,
it's Emmanuel laughing because Imessed up the cue on the 5, 4,
3, 2, 1.
And you guys were laughing.
I don't know if you caught that, but it's kind of like we
caught like mid-blooper.
You guys were laughing at me.
Yeah, I hurt my feelings.
No, I'm just kidding, that wasfunny.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
Are we having feelings behind comedy?
Did it really hurt yourfeelings?
No, I'm just kidding, that wasfunny.
Are we hiding feelings behind?

Speaker 3 (02:26):
comedy.
Did it really hurt yourfeelings?
No, no, no, no, no, no.
That part was real.
That was real.
Don't peer into my soul, okay.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
You know I highly enjoy peering into people's
souls.
It's a bad style.
Yes, we all do.

Speaker 3 (02:38):
Let's be real, we all kind of do.
That's why we're in this game.
So this is true, this is true.
I think we, we take a.
We, I mean we I think we allgenuinely enjoy you know the
process, the, the layers, thedigging and the questioning and
all this other stuff.
But you know that's, that's why, like, it takes a certain kind

(02:58):
of person, I think, to be atherapist or a mental health
professional.
So, yeah, I just think we'reall we all have.
Like you know I keep comingback to like the avengers, I
just think we all have.
Like you know I keep comingback to, like the Avengers.
And, like you know, we all haveour own superpowers and our own
like special skills and ourlenses are all kind of like
pointing in different directions.
You know, and I just love thatI plan on learning a lot of

(03:19):
stuff from you guys I alreadyhave.
But like, yeah, like it's justcool, you know stuff from you
guys I already have but like,yeah, like it's just the, it's
just cool.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
You know I'm here for it, so I think that was
supposed to be the springboardto us, talking about superheroes
as it relates to us.
And so, if you joined us forour last episode, it was stated
by me that I attribute.
Well, we were asking what wouldbe like your parallel or you

(03:52):
know your superhero.
So I was like James gives mevery much Doctor Strange, right,
because he's very textbook, butyou have to learn a lot and
it's as strength of as it reallyis.
I'm not even being sarcasticfor lot and it's as strength of
it as it really is.
I'm not even being talkativelike for real.
And then Joey, as you probablyhave discovered, joey is the

(04:14):
calm one of the group, but healso means business and that
gave me very much CaptainAmerica.
But, like the recent CaptainAmerica, did you watch the movie
, joey?

Speaker 3 (04:24):
I'm going to have to say no, I didn't Shame, but I
did watch another movie I wouldlike to talk to you guys a
little bit about, so we can havelike a little movie segment.
But I want, if you guys haveseen the movie Her by Spike
Jonze with Joaquin Phoenix?
No, neither of you.
Oh man, I'm going to watchCaptain America and then you

(04:46):
guys have to watch her.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
Okay, and then we wanted you guys, the audience,
to tell us what do you think ourcorresponding superhero will be
.
So just comment on ourInstagram, youtube, tiktok,
facebook wherever you're seeingor listening to this if you're
not driving and tell us what doyou think.
Think, maybe by the end of thisepisode, what superhero you
think goes with each clinicianhere.

(05:09):
We would love to know.
And also, they never answer myquestion about their favorite
side dish, so tell us yourfavorite side dish.
Um, so I don't feel lonely,thank you.
And we're we're celebrating Ihate you.
We're celebrating men's mentalhealth awareness month, and it
is not 12 midnight, so we'restill going.
Hate you.
We're celebrating Men's MentalHealth Awareness Month, and it
is not 12 midnight, so we'restill going to get into it.
It's so much into the sociologyand the psychology of what we

(05:33):
call masculinity and there's somany lenses you can put on micro
meso.
What's that micro?
But like, I think, for thecontext of our conversation,
like Micro, but like, I think,for the context of our
conversation, like Westernmasculinity what does?
that look like, you know, andhow can we?
There's so many conversationsaround it happening, you know.

(05:56):
People want to redefine it,people want to tear it down,
people want to build it up.
There's so much around it.
I'll be interested to hear whatyou guys think like healthy.
I want to hear both what do youthink toxic masculinity is and
what do you think healthymasculinity is?
And then how can we supportthose definitions or tear them

(06:18):
down, even beyond Men's MentalHealth Awareness Month?

Speaker 3 (06:24):
Whatever superhero wants to go first.
Let's see so toxic.
I think toxic is being overused.
I'm just going to throw thatout there.
I think the term toxic is wayoverused.
I mean, yes, there is atechnical definition of toxic,
but if we're just talking aboutwhat is I?

(06:44):
What does masculinity meanright now?
And I think me personally, Ithink it's in flux.
There's a lot of, uh, you know,with gender, gender roles and
expectations are evolving andthings like that and like the,
the archetype of what a man wasin, like the 1980s, you know, is
way different than what, uh, amodern man is in 2025, and I

(07:08):
think that's that's going to bea moving target, and so there's
no, I don't think there's anyright or wrong answer per se,
but I think there is more of apush to to a more sensitive, um,
version of masculinity I meanat least that's what I ascribe
to, and and I I struggled withthat for a long time as far as,
like you know, maskingsensitivity and I think there's

(07:30):
a lot of sensitive guys outthere that really, you know,
feel the need to put that thatkind of, you know, um, I don't
know, machismo out there in likea certain way, and it's not not
, you know, it's just a societalpressure.
But I think that pressure isgetting a little bit lower and
lower into where now, you know,masculinity is a little bit

(07:56):
fluid in some ways.
But toxic masculinity, I thinkit's pretty clear, you know it's
misogyny, it's, you know,mean-spirited and built on, you
know, things from a really badtime in our history, you know.

(08:17):
So, things like that.
Definitely, I think we're we'redoing our best to try to tamp
down the toxic part and reallyramp up the, you know, sensitive
, rational, like just center,more centered version of
masculinity, whatever that lookslike.

Speaker 2 (08:35):
I don't know, I'm not a sociologist, but, um, yeah,
I'd be being able to see thatsomebody else wants to learn
something that you know how todo and then being able to teach
them and help them to grow right, and also understanding your

(08:58):
limits.
As a person who teaches, likeI've known people who have said,
like I'm not a teacher, don'task me about and Z, okay, I know
not to go to your school, Imean that's just not part of
your skill set.
But for people who are able toteach stuff down and then like,
hopefully, for teaching our kidsto read, whatever metaphorical
stove they're about to touchthey can read.

(09:29):
Not to do that Right, like, ifyou need to, you can open a book
and you can figure out how toconnect the car, the car battery
cables.
Don't ask me I need to readthat book, but, yeah, you can
find out that information.
Isn't that a?

Speaker 3 (09:48):
masculine trope.
Sorry not to interrupt, butisn't that kind of a masculine
trope where you've got to learnhow to?
Every guy has to know how tochange a car tire.
Yeah, I don't know how tochange a car tire, but the
battery it's been 10 years sinceI've done that.

Speaker 2 (10:02):
Yeah, I'm not trying to electrocute myself.
I'm going to look on YouTubefirst or call my dad.
On the toxic side it's more so,like the machismo or putting on
airs thing like you weretalking about before.
I think that people try to bestoic but they don't do a great

(10:22):
job Like they don't like.
Either they're not the bookietype and they're not reading
what stoicism is, or they getthis idea in their head about
what it means to be a man ortough or whatever right and
they're trying to act on that,but it's like a little kid's
impression of what a man issupposed to be and we've had
several generations of that, soit's just gotten progressively
worse and results in what we'vegot today.

Speaker 1 (10:48):
That is an excellent point.
We have had people pretendingor cosplaying or just projecting
what their idea of, becausethey never had a template or the
template they had wasn'thealthy, and I guess a part of
them recognized that or didn'tand and they continued, or they
tried to find it out on theirown and maybe struggled with

(11:09):
that.
But I appreciate you guyssharing that.
I even had to reevaluate thequestion, even though I posed it
, because for me, especiallythis Men's Mental Health
Awareness Month, I wanted andthis was a theme in the men's
collective that we had thatwe're still buzzing off from,

(11:32):
but Baptist Memorial Health,where Mainland Memphis was a
sponsor in a breakout sessionmen to be healthy in their
person, in their self, withoutthe attachment of anything
little, especially a gender roleor this construct and that's

(11:54):
arguable or debatable ofmasculinity.
Right, because what ismasculine?
What is masculinity?
Does it have a purpose?
If so, what is that?
How does that translate with me?
It is so layered, so complex asan antithesis to femininity.

(12:16):
I do not think it's that.
I think it is a balance tofemininity and vice versa.
I also think masculinity,especially in the Western lens,

(12:38):
is just to serve a purpose.
Western lens is just to serve apurpose.
Right, it is to be a buttressto society.
Right?
Biologically we have differentmakeups, so we have attributed
these features and these factorsto masculinity.
So if you are biologically amale and you do not show these

(13:04):
things, biologically a male andyou do not show these things,
then now you're quote, unquotemasculinity is now challenged,
right, and then it works forboth ways.
I will say, over the years,though, there has been a I don't
want to say progression, but Iwant to say progression that
some things that we have calledmasculine and feminine are

(13:25):
literally just life skills.
Like to James point like I'mnot insulting you this time for
once to James point about youknow how to charge a car battery
.
Yeah, that's a life skill thathas nothing to do with being a
man or a woman or otheridentifier.
Like you need to know how tocharge a battery.
Now to the same coin.

(13:47):
There were some ladies at mychurch and they were charging
their car battery and I gotoffended because I was feet away
and I was like why didn't youask me?
I could have did that for you.
Some would call it chivalry,whatever, but I do think it is a
life skill, a lot of things weattribute to it.

(14:08):
Changing a tire, that'smasculine.

Speaker 3 (14:10):
No, that's a life skill, or you know the laundry
for for a guy.
You know like I do the laundry,I help out with the laundry, I
do the cooking.
You know like, so yeah, like Ithink we're kind of beyond those
rigid I hope so.

Speaker 1 (14:22):
so Please wash your drawers.
That is disgusting.
You're not washing your drawersin the name of masculine.
You're going to be masculineand stinky.
That is disgusting.

Speaker 2 (14:33):
Women have memes about people like that.
Yeah, you don't want to be theskid mark guy.

Speaker 1 (14:39):
At your big age that's fine You're like 2'3"
pushing forward.
But post-potty train, even lateelementary school, you may
still master it, but you're 35talking about oh, I'm not going
to wash my clothes becausethat's not a woman's job.
Okay.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
You're going to be in the ER for a skin rash you
can't do nothing with.

Speaker 1 (15:04):
So, I just think that is the first point of
conversation like reallydelineating the difference
between what is masculine andthen what's just like neutral or
you know a life skill orwhatever, and then take off this
dichotomous view of it, likeit's not masculine or feminine
or hard or soft, it's whateverbenefits the unit you know.

(15:28):
Like you mentioned, joe, youhelp out.
You have a small child.
I'm sure it makes sense for youto help out.
It has nothing to do withmasculine or feminine, energy or
masculinity or femininity, andI really want men to embrace the
concept of, first of all,critical thinking.
I really want men to embracethe concept of, first of all,
critical thinking for this month.
Ask yourself these questions,right.
What is the reason behind this?

(15:49):
Was I socialized this way?
Does this serve me?
We talked about toxicmasculinity.
Is this toxic, and is it toxicfor me or those that I love?
That is the real question.
Because, to your point, joy,you were saying things are
overused and I would agree,because I think toxic is a
little bit subjective.
Now, abuse, that is very clear,but toxic is subjective, and I

(16:13):
see James want to say somethingGo ahead, jump ahead.

Speaker 2 (16:14):
I do want to jump in on the point that you made about
do we use our critical thinkingskills for what is masculine
and what is not?
Because if we think, if wethink way back in society, like
most jobs used to be manuallabor right, right, okay and we
also had structured society formen to be the only people

(16:35):
bringing in income at that time,right.
So it was very easy to make arole division.
But has society kept up withthe way that work is done and
who is doing outside an incomerevenue type of work?
Because if we're going to stickto the old system, then yeah,

(16:56):
it doesn't make sense to docertain things.
If you're a man, because it'sworking on the idea that you've
been out in the field or workingin a factory or doing something
laborious all day and you don'thave the energy to do anything
but to kick your feet up onceonce you're at home, because
that's all that home is therefor.
For if this is your role, right, right, that's not what we're
seeing in today's society.
Every job is not go out andbreak your body anymore um, for

(17:22):
some people it is and find yourway around that.
Do what works for your family.
Also, if that is not yourstructure, don't use that
structure.
It's not for you.

Speaker 1 (17:33):
Oh my God.
Yes, do James, do we agree?

Speaker 2 (17:36):
on something, but yes , do something that works for
you.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
If you want to be the archetypal, I bring home the
bacon type guy.
You cannot be a broke guy Likeno.
If you want a kept wife, youhave to meet the conditions for
the lifestyle that you want.
It's not automatic and that'swhy you are so anxious and upset
and irritable all the timebecause you're trying to fit
into a role that you don't match.

(18:01):
No, no, no, how somebody getsfree of that.

Speaker 2 (18:04):
I was born with an X and Y chromosome.
I am entitled to this.

Speaker 1 (18:08):
No, you're entitled to what you produce, which I
really just hate.
I said that because I want usto not have our identity
connected to what we produce,because that's our problem now.
Nonetheless, in this context,it has to work, and if it does
not work, it just doesn't.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
Do not connect your identity to overproduction.
Correct you cannot work withmaterials that are not there.
You cannot burn yourself up andthink that you're still going
to have enough of you left overfor tomorrow.
It's just not going to workthat way, it's not Okay, I got
to interject a little something.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
I'm curious Now.
We've been talking a lot aboutmen's stuff, but how, if you're
a female listener, what shouldthey be taking away?
What should they be thinkingabout from this conversation?
That they could learn somethingor glean something about the
male identity and the male likewhat we're talking about?
What do you think women cantake away from this conversation

(19:04):
?

Speaker 1 (19:06):
I'm not answering that till July 1st.
It's still men's mental health.
No, I'm joking.
I think they should also againgetting away from roles and
assignments.
Right?
How does the lifestyle I wantfit with this other person,

(19:37):
right?
Do their goals and I don't know,just talk about romantically,
which, of course, is where mymind goes to.
And we can, we can go there,but because it's like one of the
easiest examples.
Because it's like one of theeasiest examples, but do our
goals align right?
Does what you see for thefuture match and or support what
I want to do for the future?
Because I also think that's amyth that you have to
necessarily want to do the samething.

(19:58):
I just think it doesn't have tobe the exact same thing, it
just needs to align.
I think that's how you havehealthier relationships, whether
they be romantic or whatever.
But just again back to criticalthinking.
I think that'll stop all thiswar between, especially online,
which is half of it ispropaganda.

(20:19):
But this war between men andwomen, no, you don't see like
manatees fighting each other, oryou know birds fighting, like
female-male birds fighting eachother.
Why are we doing that?

Speaker 3 (20:35):
Like that's not no, I think we got bigger fish to fry
, you know, we got bigger thingsto talk about.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
Hello, hello, like I think so.
If you are a female listenerand you probably are, because I
don't know I was about to getstereotypical I'm back.
I don't know a lot of men wholisten to podcasts healthy ones
anyway.
I listen to podcasts sometimesdo you listen to bad ones too?

(21:04):
What's a bad one?
That's way too much.
I listen to podcasts sometimes.
How many do you listen to badones, to what's a bad one?
That's way too much.
Tell us which bad podcast.

Speaker 2 (21:10):
You're listening to Emmanuel.

Speaker 3 (21:12):
I don't listen to garbage podcasts.
I like to learn and grow anddevelop.
I listen to finance stuff.
I listen to psychology.
Have you guys listened toEsther esther perel's um
relationship podcast, where sheactually does live sessions with

(21:33):
couples in the podcast space?
Yeah, is that ethical?
First of all, uh, they signed arelease.
They know what they're gettinginto.

Speaker 1 (21:42):
It's a whole thing, yeah, but um sounds a little Dr
Phil, but okay you know, dr Philcarried for generations at
least two decades, which is ageneration he really did oh, I
don't want to go there.
I'm not going there.
I'm not going there for anothershow, that is another show.

(22:03):
But to answer your question,joey, no, because I didn't even
realize people actually listenedto podcasts until I married my
wife and you know the wholetrope about not trope, but
saying that opposites attract.
It is true, I listened to musicduring that 24-7.

(22:24):
I remember she was driving ussomewhere for a date because you
know I'm allowing us, I don'thave to control everything and
we got in the car and I was likewhat is this?
It was so foreign to me.
Like you're willingly listeningto people talk in the car while
you drive.
Like I hate commercials.

(22:45):
I do not have one streamingservice except for YouTube that
is not commercial free.
My Spotify is commercial free.
All my streamers and I havelike 10, not even exaggerating
are commercial free.
Why are you talking?
Shut up talking to me, right,but so the concept of listening
to people, which is might soundcontradictory because we're

(23:06):
literally recording a podcast.
It was so foreign to me and it'shilarious because obviously I
love talking and to be a greatspeaker you have to have
excellent listening skills.
They actually have to be betterthan your speaking skills, but
something about just listeningto people with like for leisure

(23:29):
just blew my mind.
I was like what?
But you know, to the biggertopic at hand, it's okay to
explore things that are notimmediately to your nature,
Right, and even have someexchange.
There are maybe two podcasts,including this one, that I would

(23:52):
genuinely listen to, Like forreal, and now I have heard
listening to music almost asloud as mine.
So there is a beautiful exchangethat happens with this, if you
want to call it masculinefeeling energy.
But you have to have.
It's a skill.
You have to have the opennessand the skill set to allow that
to happen and not alloweverything to be such a
challenge.

(24:13):
We'll see how you can integrateit if need be, you know, and I
think we will have muchhealthier relationships and
again not just romantic If youjust allow people to be their
genuine selves, without thisattachment or expectation of a
label.
that is a social construct, mostlikely tied to capitalism if
we're in the West.
So yeah let that be Points.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
James, you've been awfully quiet, okay.

Speaker 2 (24:45):
This goes back to some research that I read back
in undergrad, so it's been someyears.
I don't know if this is currentanymore, but I remember when I
was in the cognitiveneuroscience program that we
were looking at some MRI studiesand it turns out that dudes are
not using as much of theirbrains as ladies are, as much of

(25:10):
their brains as ladies are, andso I get a lot of people who
are asking me about like arelationship, and I'm just like
I need for y'all to understandthat we are not on the same
level of thinking that y'all areon.
Dudes are using like two orthree maybe four if we're lucky
brain areas connected at a timelike, let's see, we look at like
a puppy or something, right,and the first thing that pops
into our mind is, oh, that's acute puppy.
And then, oh, I want that puppy.

(25:31):
And then like, oh, it costs toomuch for me to get that puppy.
And then we're done, right,it's like we're just going can
adopt this puppy, but I knowthat my friend is looking for a
puppy.
I should ask her if she wantsthis puppy.
And then like, oh, actually,so-and-so has an allergy, but

(25:53):
this other friend was alsolooking for a puppy, right?
So that's like six differentthings that she's balancing on
like the daily basis with anygiven subject, and so dudes are
not.
This came up on the mri right,and so they're looking at um
blood flow and so they wereassuming that different brain
areas that were getting moreblood are more activated, right,

(26:14):
and so they were looking atthis and they're finding out
that women.
Well, what they theorize isthat women have more brain
interconnectivity for differentsubjects that they're thinking
about at a time than men do,which kind of explains, you know
, like, when men and women getinto arguments, it's like how
could you not consider that x, yand z were a factor in the

(26:36):
situation?
It's just like, well, we'resimpler than you, we did not.
We did not.
That is the answer.
Is not that we knew about it,like maybe we did, but it wasn't
online.
It wasn't an online brain areafor us question.

Speaker 1 (26:49):
Question, ladies, I can hear you.
My ear is burning right now.
Is that a nature versus nurturething?
Because, some some can say thatand it could be a cop-out.
Well, I don't like this becauseI'm a man, which is literally
what we're talking about now.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
You see what I'm saying right, but they did not
go into that.
That was not what was studied,right.
They were just looking atwhether or not certain stimuli
activate more brain areas formen or for women.
Typically women have more brainactivity.
Um, with the, with the dudes.
We don't know if it's becausethat's the way that we're

(27:25):
socialized, because with a lotof dudes we don't socialize them
to spend a lot of time thinkingor considering how other people
feel about things a lot of thetime it's just like alright, are
you done with this task, get upand go do another task.
Oh, you fell down.
Can you get over it?

Speaker 1 (27:41):
I would make.
I'm not a gambling man, but Iwould bet Joey's last dollar.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
What Joey's Bet?
Your own dollar man up?
Okay, I would bet.

Speaker 1 (27:54):
James last bottle of conditioner, that it is
socialization cause?
There is no way, because we areall organic intelligence, right
?
If socialization?
There is no way.
We are all organic intelligence.
If we would be socializedotherwise, if we weren't born

(28:15):
into these roles, you see whatI'm saying.
If it wasn't hunt, protectreproduce, that is primary and
it's instinctual and it shouldbe there.
Doesn't hunt, protect reproduce?
That is primary and it'sinstinctual and it should be
there.
I'm sorry, I can be very PCsometimes.
I can just hear all therebuttals, but I've trained

(28:37):
myself to do that because of thenature of work that I do, but
that's another conversation.
That should be there becausethat's instinctual, that is
biology.
Some can argue otherwise.

Speaker 2 (28:48):
My point is that there is more to you than that,
you see what I'm saying, rightand that's where the epigenetic
argument comes in Is that, yes,it can be because of the way
that we're being raised, butalso your brain grows new
pathways based on what you'reexposed to and what you repeat.
Right, and so it's both.

(29:09):
It's a good chance that it'sboth, not only that we are
encouraging women to think aboutmore things at a time and that
we consider that we teach kids,young boys, to consider less at
a time, but also that throughrepetition of this encouragement
and telling them this is howyou have to behave, that this is
the way that their brain isdeveloping, just like um, with

(29:31):
the I don't know which part ofthe brain actually does numbers,
but I know the parietal love iskind of related to words, right
?
If you make somebody grow upreading a bunch and doing a
bunch of like poetry spoken word, um, somebody grow up reading a
bunch and doing a bunch of likepoetry spoken word, anything
like that, anything verbal, thatbrain area is going to be a lot
more developed than like maybethe occipital lobe.

(29:52):
If they're not spending a lotof time looking at various
things or artwork, right, likethey might not be able to tell
the difference between like redand magenta, but they can tell
you all about Shakespeare, Idon't know, just hypothetical
example there.

Speaker 1 (30:06):
Now see what I call them Doctor Strange Textbook
Textbook.

Speaker 3 (30:12):
And I'm going to be the mediator slash middle ground
guy because I've always beenfascinated with the nature
versus nurture, discussion anddebate.
And I think part of the reasonwhy is because because it I feel
like it's not a binary thing,you know it's.
It's always like a spectrum,like somewhere in the middle, or

(30:34):
a combination, a confluence ofall these other different
factors that come into like,because you know how, you know
some, some guys are born, youknow, with more like tough
exterior or a tough persona,like it's almost like like maybe
it's even a hormonal thingwhere some guys are just quicker

(30:55):
to anger, maybe, or they have,you know just more testosterone
than other guys and they're just, they just are built that way.
That's their biology.
But that doesn't mean that thatcan't, that same person can't
be a sensitive, thoughtful,caring, compassionate person.
And that's where you know, thebiology meets the socialization
and you know you can have, youknow, an archetypical

(31:15):
bodybuilder, big guy that youthink is going to be super mean
and, and you know, aggressive,and it turns out he's just a big
teddy bear, you know.
So, yeah, I don't know like it's, I don't know how the there is.
I don't think there is a reallysatisfying answer, but it is
something to think about and Ithink you know both sides really
do kind of you guys both gavesome really good insights into

(31:40):
you know the biologicalfunctions of you know how our
brains are naturally wired.
You know James was saying ofhow our brains are naturally
wired.
You know what James was saying.
But then, like, ourconditioning, our social
conditioning, you know, canoverride some of that genetic
wiring in some ways.
So yeah, I don't know it's amixed bag for me and I'm going
to die on that fence.

(32:00):
I'm going to sit on this fenceuntil I turn into a scarecrow.
All right, a scarecrow, yeah,that's where my mind went
Scarecrow.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
Why not a skeleton?

Speaker 2 (32:16):
Because he's built different Emmanuel.

Speaker 1 (32:18):
Dang leave him alone.
Is it something in your DNA?
You don't go to a skeleton, yougo to a scarecrow.

Speaker 3 (32:24):
I guess I identify with Team Scarecrow.

Speaker 2 (32:27):
Joey doesn't age.
Remember what?
So Joey doesn't age.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
That's true.
Well, we established that inthe last episode.
So there's that.
If you are watching this, Joey,please make this a short.
If you are watching this,please tell us how old you think
Joey is.
If you are right, I will likeyour comment.
You thought I was going to giveyou a prize, no, but if you are
right, I will like your comment, because I am still shocked to

(32:55):
this day.
I'm still shocked.

Speaker 3 (32:58):
You know it's funny.
I have a fond memory of goingto Six Flags in Atlanta and they
had that game where it was acarnival game where they guess
your age, and I smoked them Eventhis was in my early 20s.

Speaker 1 (33:14):
See, I was going to give you a hint.

Speaker 3 (33:17):
It's definitely a thing.
It's an Asian.
Don't raise anything.
Yeah, I think we'll put thatout there.
Yes, all right.
Well, that was a really Ireally like that discussion
honestly, because you know wereally covered a lot of
different aspects of masculinity.
You know we, we touched on, youknow, the socialization part,

(33:39):
we touched on the biologicalpart and I don't know, I think.
And then you know I really Ireally wanted to picture a
female listening audience andlike, okay, what are they going
to glean from this type ofconversation?
So I really appreciate you guysjumping in and really giving it
your all and yeah, so if youguys have any feedback or

(34:01):
comments or questions, we'regoing to be engaged.
On the YouTube all the commentsections I'm pretty responsive,
pretty active.
We might even go into theReddit category.
I don't know, I haven't done aReddit page yet, but if we can
even have our own Mood Dudes orour own man Up Memphis subreddit

(34:21):
, I don't know, that's a littlepremature, we'll put a pin in
that.
But just a little bit of aself-congratulation for us we
just passed 50 downloads for ourepisode.
Woo, thank you guys.
We appreciate it so much.
50 episodes to me it's a hugedeal.

(34:43):
I don't know about you guys,but I'm just over the moon.

Speaker 1 (34:45):
Manuel's impressed.
He's like let's'm just over themoon, manuel's not impressed.

Speaker 3 (34:49):
He's like let's get to 50k and then we can celebrate
.
Correct, oh man.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
And it's dope because I'm doing it with you, aw.

Speaker 3 (35:02):
See, that's healthy male affection right there.
That's the kind of stuff weshould be normalizing.
You know, I've been watching alot of clips about manhood and
the male experience and JoshJohnson actually, who just so
happens to be coming to Memphis.

(35:23):
And you know, josh, if you havesome extra time and you want to
talk to some Memphis peoplemade up Memphis podcast, you
know we might be, interested inhaving you.
I mean if our schedules align.
But anyways, all I have to saywe want to chat.
We loved I shared in the groupchat your bit about.

(35:48):
You know this tiktok trendthat's going viral.
That's basically guys callingother guys and telling them good
night like like basicallywishing them like hey, man, I
just wanted to say I hope youhave a good night, man, sleep
tight.
You know, and it's meant to befunny but, as Josh Johnson tells

(36:10):
the story really well andreally funny, he basically
observed in this trend that guyswere actually kind of like low
key connecting with each other.
Even though this was like afunny gag, it actually brought a
couple of guys to like reallyhave a conversation and turned
into like a real thing and areal connection.

(36:31):
So I just really appreciated,you know, a comedian like josh
johnson like elevating that kindof discussion to to his on his
platform, you know, and I thinkhe's doing a really good job of
asking some of these tougherquestions about manhood and
masculinity and just in generalsociety and culture.

(36:52):
So he's really good.
Excited to see.
I have tickets.
I'm going to go ahead and sayI'm a fanboy, I have tickets to
his show.
He's got two shows in Memphiscoming up next month and we're
going to try to get the MoveDude crew out there if we can.
And we're going to try to getthe Move Dude crew out there if
we can.
But yeah, if you're a JoshJohnson fan, you know, shout us

(37:13):
a comment, you know, say we loveJosh Johnson or something, and
you know, maybe we can get himon the show.

Speaker 1 (37:22):
Josh, you owe us a check as much as Joey talks
about you.
My God, you owe at least somebackstage passes.

Speaker 3 (37:30):
I'm listening.
I, low-key, have been kind ofstalking him honestly.
But you know, out of love, josh, if you're listening, I'm sorry
.
He didn't say that, josh, hedidn't mean that.

Speaker 1 (37:40):
Hey, that's just somebody else in the group who
name starts with J.
Can we?
I'm sick of it.

Speaker 3 (37:45):
Y'all.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
I'm not joking, our audience, literally.
There's like three group chatsand one of them everyone's name
starts with J, except for mineand our founder, rachel.
What is that about?
You want to?

Speaker 2 (37:57):
know what that's about.

Speaker 1 (37:58):
No, not if it's coming from you.
James, Change your name Justlegally change it.
Never and I don't use the wordnever often.
I don't use the word neveroften.
I don't use words like never,always, forever, unless I really
mean it.
I would never change my nameEver in life.
What about Jemangro?
Yeah, I was about to say.

Speaker 3 (38:19):
Absolutely not Never.

Speaker 1 (38:22):
No one does not.

Speaker 3 (38:22):
You can have a really nice name.
You can have a really nice Jname.

Speaker 2 (38:29):
James go away like listen.
I want to talk about something.
Millions of people are namedjames.
You should try it.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
Try it for a day no okay, emmanuel, you, you, you
had something you wanted tobring to the table.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
I just wanted him to fill that period after I said no
, because you know it was allover your face.
Listen, I think, oh, I don'tknow, that's a can of worms, but
let's go fishing.
So to that TikTok trend thatI'm aware that you are talking
about, james, I was in anothersimilar space like this.

(39:05):
We were having someconversation around Men's Mental
Health Month and they weresaying how men not as much these
days in certain circles, butcan be very dichotomous in their
view when it comes to affection.
Either it's none or it'sperceived homosexual, and
whether there's a negativeconnotation to that or not,

(39:26):
that's up to the individual.
But it can never just begenuine love or affection, it
can never just be, bro.
I always have to have somemotive behind it, which I think
is toxic.
But I'd be curious to know yourthoughts on that.
Why is that so polar, sospectrum with men?
Why can't we just let it bewhat it is?

(39:49):
Because I think most men wouldknow if somebody is flirting
with you, but maybe you justhaven't been exposed enough to
understand, you know.
Oh no, this is literally justplatonic love, you know.

Speaker 3 (40:04):
Here's my theory His wheels are turning, he's got
something going All right, james, go ahead.
Here's my theory.
His wheels are turning.
He's got something going.
All right, james go ahead.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
Here's my theory Throughout time and throughout
history and throughoutcivilizations, homosexuality has
been frowned upon.
Right, because we can't amasswealth if our son is homosexual,
if our daughter is homosexual.
Right, we need our kids tomarry and to build wealth.
It's always capitalism.
It always goes back tocapitalism In any case.

(40:33):
Case that's why people get sodamn mad is because we've had
families over generations tryingto build this wealth and we
have like one homosexual kid.
And then what do you mean?
We can't build wealth anymore,that everything I did was for
nothing.
And then people are flying intorages.
Right?
In addition to that, there'salso religious um caveats
motivations it is, um, to treathomosexual people badly, right?

(40:58):
so with all that, again, are weusing roles that fit our current
society because the homosexualkids can still build wealth and
pass that off to somebody else?
Again, are we using roles thatfit our current society Because
the homosexual kids can stillbuild wealth and pass that off
to somebody else?
They can pass that off to aniece or a nephew.
Why did it always have to be adirect descendant?
It didn't, but because that'swhat the role required.

(41:19):
That's what everybody just didand nobody questioned it for a
long time.
That's my theory anyway.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
I just want to say this go ahead, I'm sorry and
with that being dangerous right.

Speaker 2 (41:32):
Nobody, no guy, wants to express any type of
affection for another man, lestit be in this day and age of
people not understanding what ishomosexual, what is just a
friendship.

Speaker 1 (41:42):
Nobody wants to be called a homosexual because then
we get cut off from our supportnetworks, we get cut off from
our business, we get cut offfrom everything and ostracize
which is why there's such a highrate of anxiety and depression
and suicide ideations in thelgbtqia plus community, because
men are already socialized tonot talk and then you're going

(42:04):
to have the nerve to be ahomosexual man and throw some
other layers in there.
Don't be a bipoc homosexual man.
Oh, yeah, it's.
You have all so many strikesagainst you and it's not healthy
.
But what I wanted to interjecton earlier when you brought in
the religious component, I canspeak for all religions, but I
am a youth uh, youth and youngadult pastor.

(42:26):
I've been actually today makes12 years.
I've been in the clergy.
When people use the argument ofthank you, joey.
When people use the argument ofSodom and Gomorrah thank you,
james please do your research.
Sodom and Gomorrah was notdestroyed because of
homosexuality.
Sodom and Gomorrah is where weget the word sodomy.

(42:47):
It was non-consensual sex.

Speaker 3 (42:51):
Okay, it was I don't know if I can say that over the
air but it was grape Right.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
It was that.
That is why Sodom and Gomorrahwas destroyed, because men were
literally sexually assaultingother men.
Okay, and that's because therewas a consensual homosexual
encounter.
That is two different things.
Do your research.
I just want to put that outthere for those who may be part

(43:18):
of the religious community whoare listening to this.
Thank you for your time.

Speaker 2 (43:22):
Cancel.
Emmanuel, specifically MoodDudes, will still be
broadcasting every other Monday,for all it is.

Speaker 3 (43:29):
I love that.
I love that.

Speaker 2 (43:33):
As an aside Made Up, Memphis does not endorse the
views or opinions of any of theindividual Mood Dudes.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
Correct no real, Real talk.

Speaker 3 (43:41):
He doesn't want to get his head blown off by Amanda
Waller.

Speaker 2 (43:45):
What are you doing to get these threats?
Lots is always on your mindBecause you're always doing
something.
Stop doing stuff.
That's an assumption.
Every thought that comes intoyour head doesn't need to come
out of your mouth.

Speaker 1 (43:57):
That's what you're doing to hold her.
You heard that ticker ticketingyour head because Amanda.

Speaker 2 (44:02):
Waller is about to blow your head off.
I don't have this Because Idon't do things that she doesn't
like.

Speaker 1 (44:06):
I've never pushed her to that point.
Don't make me call her on theair.

Speaker 3 (44:13):
I've never pushed her to that point, sir.
We should have Miss Miss on theshow with the new dudes.
I'm going to have to talk toher because I think she would
love that.
Honestly, she's been reallysupportive of this little
endeavor, this side project thatwe got going, of this little
endeavor, this side project thatwe got going.
And then we're also doingregular interviews with Made Up
Memphis team members, and weactually got a couple people who

(44:37):
are not true members, as far asI understand that actually want
to be on the show as well.
So if you feel like you havesomething to bring to Memphis
that you think needs to behighlighted and maybe you're
doing something really good, oryou want to highlight an
organization that's doing reallygood in the city, then shoot us
an email and maybe we'llfeature you guys.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
Michelle Obama.

Speaker 3 (45:00):
Oh yeah, oh yeah.
We're manifesting.
So this is our manifestingsegment.
So we're going to manifest abunch of people that we want to
have on the podcast.
So Manuel has voted forMichelle Obama.

Speaker 2 (45:11):
Please today.

Speaker 3 (45:14):
And what was your logic behind Michelle Obama?
Oh no, that was James' logic.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
So we want to invite Mrs Michelle Obama, because she
helped to get Orange Mountainnamed as one of Memphis'
historic districts as one of thefirst self-sufficient black
communities.

Speaker 3 (45:32):
I love that.
There's a lot of history inOrange Mountain and I know a lot
of people.
It gets a bad rap but they'retrying to revitalize in Orange
Mountain, aren't they Revitalize?
It's never really, wasn't therea school or a library that got
refurbished in Orange Mound soit was.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
We installed one of the Memphis libraries behind one
of the community centers inOrange Mound recently.
It's never really been asituation where we have tried to
let it go downhill.
There's always been people.
There's been just as manypeople trying to build Orange

(46:13):
Mound up as we have had badactors tearing it down.
It's a constant cycling.
Things are always evolving inOrange Mound.

Speaker 3 (46:21):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
If you want to know.

Speaker 3 (46:25):
I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (46:26):
Joy Go ahead.

Speaker 3 (46:27):
I was going to say.
That's part of what we'retrying to.
We're trying to bring thecommunity members and the big
players together and, like youknow, really address some of
these things at a more systemic,macro level.
You know, and we're just, youknow, we're worth the worker
bees, but we're also, you know,we're thinking big Might as well
, you know, and we're going toshoot our shot and see what

(46:51):
happens.
But yeah, speaking of shootingshots, memphis Grizzlies we got
any intel on Memphis Grizzlies?
Oh, yes, I wanted to bring upin the previous episode I had
mentioned, not our episode, butepisode five that's coming out
soon that I wanted to meet theJapanese Grizzlies player, yuki

(47:13):
Kawamura.
And yeah, I'm actually tryingto meet him, I'm trying to get
his autograph.
So if anyone from the Grizzliesis listening, that would be
really cool.
My mom is coming in from Japanliterally tomorrow and she's a
huge fan.
A lot of Japanese people arejust over the moon between
Shohei Otani, who's a baseballplayer in the Dodgers, and then

(47:37):
Kawamura for the Grizzlies.
There's a Japanese pride there.
That's hard to explain, butthey just are fanatic about
their Japanese players playingin American sports.
So she's just happy to becoming and visiting.
She was disappointed that therewasn't going to be a game, but
I'm still trying to figure out away to get her at least meet

(47:58):
him, take a picture with him orsomething like that.

Speaker 1 (48:00):
I hope that happens for you, Joey.

Speaker 3 (48:03):
Yes, we'll see what happens and you know, if it
doesn't happen, I try, you know.
But yeah, so we're manifesting.
Hey, let's have Yuki come onthe show.
That would be man, that wouldbe a dream.
So I'm probably need aninterpreter, because my Japanese
is subpar.
I will go ahead and admit it.

Speaker 2 (48:21):
Doing an on-the-spot interview with your mom there.

Speaker 3 (48:24):
Ooh, I think he has an interpreter.
I mean he's a pretty big dealin Japan, Like I mean, I think
people are not reallyunderstanding how high.
Like he has an ad campaign withAsics which I'm trying to get
his shoes from Japan, I'm tryingto get my mom to bring me some
shoes from Japan his basketballshoes.

Speaker 1 (48:45):
Mm-hmm.

Speaker 3 (48:46):
Because those will be collector's items someday, I
think.
At least for me, and then I'mtrying to get her to bring me
some Japanese jerseys of hisfrom Japan.
We'll see how that goes.
I'll keep you guys in the loop.
But okay, james, what's yourmanifestation?
Who do you want to bring to thepodcast?

Speaker 2 (49:07):
I would want to bring Okay.
So podcast I would want tobring okay.
So there's an artist named megsieve and she's done a lot.
She shares a lot about workthat she's done on herself and
surviving um toxic personalities.
I would want to talk to her,and what?
Was her name again megsiversiveru megsive Siv Just call her
Meg.
Siv Subaru like the vehicle.

(49:29):
No, that's a Subaru.
This is S-Y-V.

Speaker 3 (49:37):
Meg Siv.
Alright, we'll put it in theshow notes and then we'll add
them and, you know, say, hey, wementioned you guys.
So I think Emmanuel alsomentioned Brene Brown, which
would be for social workers.

Speaker 1 (49:51):
We don't care about her.
I want to bring Meg theStallion.
I was going to say that beforeyou said Meg Sif, so don't think
that I thought about her.
I actually thought about herwhen Joey said that his Japanese
is a little rusty, because Ican say a few things in Japanese
, like noni, and that's justfrom watching anime.

(50:13):
I can say dang it, I lost it.
It's how you say oishi, thatmeans delicious right.
But I can also say okonekatsugu Watashi Wasta, which
means I make money on a star.
Because if y'all didn't know,james and Joey and our listeners

(50:33):
, I am a hottie.
I love Megan Thee Stallion andif you know Megan Thee Stallion,
you know that she loves herJapanese culture, particularly
anime.
But like I would oh my God, Iwould, oh my God, I would love
to interview Megan.
The style, megan, if you arelistening to this.
I know you have your platformsfor mental health.

(50:56):
So does Taraji B Henson,specifically for men.
So you come on too, because Iknow y'all are friends.
I would love I'm sorry, wewould love to interview you guys
.
Oh, I would.
I listen to things I would dofor that interview.

Speaker 3 (51:16):
I probably shouldn't say over the air that's for the
special episode.
We're going to have like awhole special.
You know how some of thepodcasters have like the secret
episodes or whatever.
The bonus shows yeah, so we'llhave a bonus show someday.

Speaker 1 (51:27):
I love you, Megan.

Speaker 3 (51:30):
All right.
Well, I mean, that's a prettygood spread and I really I think
, yeah, we've got a goodspectrum, we've got sports,
we've got entertainment, we'vegot, you know, mental health.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:44):
I mean yes, her, bring her on the show, please.

Speaker 3 (51:48):
Okay, we need a social media team for somebody
to reach out to.
Mostly, it's just me beingannoying and trying to grab
people on the internets, butyeah, so okay, we got some
momentum there.
I will keep you guys updated onif we make any contact and I'll

(52:10):
go ahead and say going back tojosh johnson, I'm sorry if I've
annoyed you with my comments onlike facebook and things like
that, so I apologize.
I realize that it's probablyannoying, but it comes from love
because I genuinely have beenwatching your stuff for a while
and no harm.
But yeah, we're just big fansand we're excited to see you in

(52:34):
Memphis.
Well, guys, was there anythingelse that we wanted to touch on
or any?

Speaker 2 (52:41):
updates from the last episode.
I don't think any updates, butI'm still going to shill for the
show.
If you have any questions,please send them to info at
maynotmemphisorg.
We would love to field yourquestions.
You can also find Joey'sinformation in our show notes
down below.
Any type of questions aboutmental health or relationships,

(53:04):
or am I crazy?
Be ready for us to say yes,though, because a lot of people
in memphis I don't know, we wehave some dysfunctional families
and some dysfunctionalsituations.
Um, you might be doingsomething crazy, but we'll at
least help you straighten it out.
Um, absolutely, please send usquestions.
We love to hear from people andwe love to answer questions yes
, oh, and that reminds me I, Iwe did.

Speaker 3 (53:24):
We did talk in the pre-show like that we were gonna
, we're gonna, bring up a moneything.
So, uh, I asked jasmine inepisode five if she could give
her 18 year old self somefinancial advice.
What would it be her?
Before I even finished thequestion, she was like do not
max out your credit cards.

(53:45):
So she had that one ready to goand we talked about it a little
bit.
But yeah, so I guess this isgoing to be a running segment on
anyone who comes on the show.
So I might as well get youguys' takes on this, because you
know it's part of the show now.
So who wants to go first?
18-year-old self money adviceSave the S-A-V-E.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
I don't have to write paper scissors for that one,
james, because I don't want tosay I have like regret Because I
was learning, you know, andthat would be the main thing,
because I can spend.
I don't mean just spend as inblow money, I mean budget, make
investments, make money moves.
But as far as like, when I saysave I literally mean just

(54:37):
accumulate.
I don't mean save with ROI orinvestment, that's a different
thing.
I will say most rich people Iknow, like me and their status
and up, they don't reallyexplore the concept of saving
like other people's do, outsideof cash, like they all have a
cash savings, but all the otherincome is invested.

(54:58):
So what we will call I'm notgoing to say we, because I'm
rich too but what most somewould call saving, they call
investing.

Speaker 2 (55:07):
You see what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
And I would say so now that I've said that out loud
, I would tell my 18-year-oldself to invest and have an
emergency fund, because that'sreally the term have an
emergency fund and invest.
Other than that, I think I didokay Still learning and growing
and I would choke me by the neckbecause so many things could be

(55:29):
avoided, especially my early20s.
That broke era.
Oh my god.
I'm so glad that's over, butlike I could have avoided so
much if I just saved andinvested, you know.
But yeah, that's what I wouldsay.
How about you guys?

Speaker 2 (55:46):
probably, yeah, save.
I'm glad that you went into howto.
But yeah, that's what I wouldsay how about you guys?
Probably, yeah, safe.
I'm glad that you went into howto safe, because I would have
challenged you, because mythings would have been safe too.
But specifically I would havesaid do what you can to not move
out from home ASAP.
Rent is expensive and it takesup a good amount of your check
and the jobs around you ain'tgoing to be paying nothing for a

(56:09):
good minute for at least 10years.

Speaker 3 (56:11):
so stay at home, so kind of build a financial
foundation first, before youkind of just go out and flail
which is what a lot of youngpeople do is they just kind of
wing it and they get a coupleroommates?
Maybe that's exactly what I did.
I just got some roommates, madesome dumb decisions and did not

(56:32):
manage my my money well.
So, yeah, I would say for methe biggest thing 18 year old me
struggled with was just kind oflike mindless shopping on on
things that didn't really like.
Because I was big into movies,like I had a DVD collection and

(56:53):
you know I would always want toget like the special edition or
the limited edition, and it waslike a collector thing and a
movie nerd thing and I probablyspent a good amount of money on
just DVDs.
And then the irony and the sadirony is still kind of A part of
me still dies every time I tellthe story.
But I lost all of my DVDcollection in a fire in 2003.

(57:16):
And the icing on the cake was Ididn't know anything about
property insurance.
None of us had insurance, soall of our stuff was just burnt
up and we had to start fromscratch.
So that's my cautionary tale isyou can spend all your money on

(57:37):
these items, these things, andthen they can just go up in
smoke.
So I would tell myself,18-year-old self go out and do
things.
Go out and explore andexperience life while you're
young.
Not to say that I didn't, but Iwould have done it in a little
bit more intentional, mindfulway as much as an 18-year-old
can be intentional and mindful,because that's not really

(57:58):
something that comes natural toa lot of teenagers mindful way
as much as an 18 year old can beintentional and mindful you
know what I mean, because that'snot really something that comes
natural to a lot of teenagers.
But yeah, that's some good, youknow good advice for future
listeners If you're 18 oryounger.
You know we do have a financialliteracy component to our
program at made up Memphis andyou know I can sit here and talk

(58:22):
all day about you know, thepsychology of finance and things
like that.
But yeah, I mean that's kind ofwhat we're here.
You know we're here to try tochange the narrative around
money but also change thenarrative around mental health.
So if you like our vibe, youlike what we're doing, you know
give us, you know like thumbs up, subscribe, share it.

(58:44):
You know sharing goes a longway.
Sharing is caring.
I just made that up.
I've never heard thatexpression before, so that's
like a new thing that just cameup with that.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
So I like you should say it more you're going that
probably trademark that sharingis caring.

Speaker 3 (58:58):
You know like it rhymes, it's original, it's
unique, so um you're welcomeuniverse.
Um, but yeah, I, I really uh,yeah, so I mean, uh, we got, we
got a lot of good stuff today,guys, I really I enjoyed this
conversation.
We're coming up on an hour ofrecording, so that's pretty,

(59:20):
that's pretty good.
Um, so next the next episode.
Uh, what are what are weteasing?
What are we?
What are we going to talk about?
Or are we just gonna kind ofwing it Next time on?

Speaker 2 (59:34):
Mood Dudes.

Speaker 3 (59:37):
On the next Mood.

Speaker 2 (59:38):
Dudes.
We talk about Emmanuel'sdarkest secrets.

Speaker 1 (59:42):
I'm perfectly fine with that, but I'm hoping Megan
Thee Stallion will be on ournext episode.

Speaker 3 (59:48):
So that's what I'm hoping about, Since I've been
taking on annoying Josh Johnsonand Yuki Kawamura.
So I think your mission now isto try to use your clout to try
to get into making the stallions.
Dms.
I think you can do it.
I believe in you.
You have to do it now honestly,I probably could.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
That's the funny part um, see it um we'll see.

Speaker 3 (01:00:14):
Okay, yeah, okay, challenge accepted.
And and then, james, you mightas well reach out to your
prospective therapist influencertype.
And yeah, maybe that'ssomething that we could explore
is reaching out to other socialmedia therapists and people in

(01:00:34):
the mental health field and kindof talk their brains, pick
their brains mental health fieldand kind of talk, talk their
their brain to pick their brains.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
You know who else I want to come on the show.
I want your friend trend tocome on the show.
I want mr blake w to come onthe show.
Your friend, what, your friendtrend?
Okay, she's a friendshipinfluencer.

Speaker 3 (01:00:53):
And I also want, um, mr blake w, who's kind of like a
self-respecting boundariesinfluencer okay, yeah, so we're
gonna have to start exploringthe mental health influencer
space, um, you know, just tolearn from them.
And actually there's a there'sa therapist that does have a
podcast, um, called sell thecouch.

(01:01:16):
I think, um, I'm friends withhim on linkedin.
I might have to reach out tohim because he, he would be a
good, uh, a good person to talkto, because he can also talk
about the entrepreneurial sideof therapy and how to build a
business and the business sideof things, because I mean, I
don't know about you guys, butin grad school they didn't talk
about business stuff, you know.
So that's, that's probably awhole, a whole episode, right

(01:01:38):
there is.

Speaker 2 (01:01:39):
Do we get to talk to the baby?
Therapist?

Speaker 3 (01:01:42):
Oh, oh, you're talking about Okay, yeah well,
I'm a baby therapist, so no,joey, you've been doing this for
a minute.

Speaker 2 (01:01:49):
Okay, well, to the brand new, the shiny ones.

Speaker 3 (01:01:52):
Oh, okay, the shiny.
So we should start partneringwith schools like Memphis
University.

Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
Yeah, rachel, I think you should start working on
that.

Speaker 3 (01:02:04):
It's funny how we're talking to Rachel through the
podcast because we know she'sgoing to listen to this
eventually.

Speaker 1 (01:02:10):
She's waiting for the opportunity to blow.
James' head out of his head.

Speaker 2 (01:02:14):
Yes, I think you just want this to happen, because
this is your impending doom.
You just want to share it withpeople.
It's not happening, though.
Another person I want you justwant this to happen, because you
know this is your impendingdoom.
You just want to share it withpeople.
It's not happening, though.
Another person that we need tosegue on the show is Dr Raquel
Martin from National.
She's great, okay.

Speaker 3 (01:02:32):
Yeah, we'll have to put all these into the show
notes and start tagging them.
Uh-oh, what's going on?
What?

Speaker 1 (01:02:40):
question do you have in your mouth, sir?
I don't know what James isfussing about.
I don't know, oh man.

Speaker 2 (01:02:48):
James is being James.

Speaker 1 (01:02:50):
Hey audience, One more thing I've got for you.

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
I don't know why I responded to that, but yes, go
ahead.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Oh, one more thing.

Speaker 3 (01:02:59):
Yes, okay, go ahead.
Oh, one more thing.
Yes, okay, what is happening?

Speaker 2 (01:03:09):
you said you said hey , audience, and I responded yes,
like like a person.

Speaker 1 (01:03:12):
This play-by-play by joey laswell and emmanuel waris
you know, sometimes I wonder howwe got here, because one day I
didn't know y'all and now I'mbeing berated by your
personalities.
I don't understand.
In addition to guessing Joey'sage and commenting what

(01:03:33):
superheroes you think we are andyour favorite side dish that
they still haven't answered,also guess what you think our
zodiac sign is.
I would love to know.
Not the Chinese one, but ifyou're into that, you can let us
know.
I have a fortune.

Speaker 2 (01:03:54):
I just want to let everybody know that this is a
safe space and we listen and wedon't judge.
However, we does not include mein the situation.
We is them too.
I will judge you if you are astar racist oh, my god, I'm not
doing it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
Just tell us I'm.
I'll be curious to know whatyou think our yes zodiac signs
are.

Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
That's it so it going to be like half roast or a
third roast and then two thirdsis going to be like okay, let's
talk about that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:25):
I will judge you about this specifically.

Speaker 1 (01:04:27):
What does that sound like, you guys?
What horoscope, not horoscope.
What zodiac is that?
What does the zodiac of Jamessound like?
And I don't even know, jameswill confirm if we're right or
not, because that's just who heis.

Speaker 2 (01:04:40):
I'll tell you what my Zodiac sign is.
What'd you say?
I'll tell you what my Zodiacsign is.
Okay, then what is it?
Once everybody has, how arethey going to guess if they
already know?
Emmanuel?

Speaker 3 (01:04:52):
Because Increase audience, engagement, engagement
.

Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
Yeah, that happened.
Yeah, so shout out to MainUpMemphis.
Thank you, joy and James, forsharing time with me this
evening.
I'm going to resume eatingtacos and I look forward to our
next podcast.
If you haven't already like,follow, share MainUp Memphis,
including the podcast and reelsand whatever else awesomeness

(01:05:19):
that we release on our variousplatforms um again, if you have
questions, we're gonna.

Speaker 3 (01:05:25):
We're on substack now .
That, too, made it happen.
So, yeah, writing.
So if you're um, you knowaspiring writer or you, you're a
writer and you want tocontribute some articles, or you
know anyone, mainupmemphis team, we're going to start doing
some articles and stuff.
Yes, yes, I'm signing out.

(01:05:47):
Well, James, you got anything.
Any last sage words of wisdomyou want to impart onto the
world?

Speaker 2 (01:05:56):
Keep your star racist comments to yourself, oh God,
because nine times out of tenyou will be wrong.
Keep your star racist commentsto yourself, because nine times
out of ten you will be wrongwell, you use your platform for
that, so I hope you feel goodabout that.
I do we need to stop being?
That's your message to theworld we need to stop being star
racist.
That's my message to the world.

Speaker 3 (01:06:16):
Yes, that's the hill.
He's dying on everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:06:19):
So is he going to turn into a scarecrow?

Speaker 2 (01:06:22):
too no I'm going to morph now.

Speaker 3 (01:06:26):
Now I'm just imagining me with a scarecrow
body and somebody making a memeof me as a scarecrow.
That's, that's great.
I just, I just it's like badluck, brian.
You know, I just did.
Oh man, all right.
So, emmanuel, do you got anyany?

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
any last parting thoughts Nope, but I will say
I'm the best sign out of all ofthem.
And the next thing I will sayfor real, for real man please,
please, please, please, please,please, please.
Continue addressing your mentalhealth in a healthy way,
whether that be seeing atherapist or a life coach or

(01:07:05):
whatever your preferred helpingpractitioner is.
Clinician is Take your medicineif you need to, please see or
start seeing a physical I meanprimary care physician if you
have not, get your teeth clean,get your eyes checked, get a
haircut, get your teeth clean.
Get your eyes checked, get ahaircut, Get your nails done,
Get a pedicure, Do your laundry.

(01:07:25):
Oh my God, yes, Take time torelax, Go fishing.
Do some pro-socials Engage inprotective factors Like who is
your emergency contact?
Do people know where you are?
Like?
Address is your emergencycontact?
Do people know where you are?
Like address your finances?
Because there is a correlation,heavy correlation, between your

(01:07:47):
mind and your wallet.
Or you know financial portfolio.
So, yeah, all that.
Explore your interpersonalrelationships.
Do you have good coping skills?
Do people like talking to you?
Don't be like James.
Do people?
That is the top recommendation.
Don't be like James.

Speaker 2 (01:08:07):
I talk to people for a living.
What are you talking about?
Don't be like James.
Don't have good boundaries,don't you tell people.

Speaker 1 (01:08:15):
You don't tell people I have bad boundaries and the
best thing you can do for yourmental health awareness is not
be like James no, I'm kidding Isto stick around and make sure
that you're plugged in with thisawesome resource here at
Memphis.
We are here to help, we arehere to serve, we are here to
help keep you away from James,and we are here to make sure

(01:08:37):
that your mental health isadjusted in a healthy way.

Speaker 3 (01:08:43):
We do this with James so that you guys don't have to.

Speaker 1 (01:08:51):
Thanks, joey, that's all I got.

Speaker 3 (01:08:54):
All right.
Well, I guess my partingthoughts, you know, in light or
in honor of Mr Johnson, call upone of your buddies.
If you're a guy, call up one ofyour buddies, wish them good
night.
You know, even if it's a joke,do it and see what happens.
You know, tell us what happened.
You know, comment and say, hey,I've reached out to my best bud

(01:09:15):
of you know many years and wehaven't talked in a while.
And so, yeah, like, just dothat.
I'm going to do that myself.
So I encourage everybody to dothat.
Yeah, take care of your mentals, take care of your physicals,
take care of your financials,take care of each other.
You know we're, we're all inthis together, and I think

(01:09:35):
there's a lot of division outthere and let's just you, and
let's just try to come togetheras humans, as people, and be
kind, be kind, not nice, right,james, be kind, you got it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:48):
You got it there we go.

Speaker 3 (01:09:48):
All right, yes, I'm listening, I'm paying attention.
Okay, all right, guys.
Well, I appreciate your time.
I really do.
This is my therapy right now istalking to you guys, getting
this out there into the worldand just kind of shining a light
on this wonderful organizationand the city of Memphis, yeah,

(01:10:12):
so, thank you everybody forcoming to my TED talk, or our
TED talk.
I should say, yeah, we shoulddo a three-way TED Talk.
That would be fun to watch.
All right, we're manifestingthat too.

Speaker 1 (01:10:28):
Yeah, for real, for real.

Speaker 3 (01:10:30):
Wherever Ted is, where's Ted?
But we're going to have a talkwith Ted, all right?
Well, that's it for the MoodDudes Made Up Memphis podcast
man.
We just we're happy to be here.
We're loving you guys and thankyou so much for the support so
far and this is just taking off.

(01:10:50):
So thank you guys and have agreat, great evening.