December 16, 2025 • 35 mins
Welcome to Wickedly Branded: Marketing, Magic, and The Messy Middle, the podcast where real conversations meet real strategies. I'm your host, Beverly Cornell, founder and fairy godmother of brand clarity at Wickedly Branded. With over 25 years of experience, I’ve helped hundreds of entrepreneurs awaken their brand magic, attract the right people, and build businesses that light them up.
In this powerful episode, Marianne shares how she climbed out of financial struggle, discovered her mission to “make good people crazy wealthy,” and built her framework for magnetic public speaking that converts without feeling salesy.
We talk clarity, confidence, monetizing your message, building authority, and why speaking, from stages to podcasts, remains one of the fastest ways to grow your business.
If you’ve ever feared visibility, questioned your voice, or struggled to turn your brilliance into bookings, this conversation will reignite your courage and give you practical steps to step boldly onto your next stage, physical or digital.
Three Key Marketing Topics Discussed:
1. Audience-Centered Speaking & Authentic Visibility: Marianne explains how focusing on the audience, not yourself, removes stage fright and creates deeper connection.
2. Monetizing Your Message Beyond the Speaker Fee: She breaks down the two revenue streams of speaking, fees and backend offers, and why relying only on the fee leaves 60% of revenue on the table.
3. Brand Activation Through Personal Story & Repetition: Marianne shares how clarity evolves through repetition, repurposing, and practice, including why messy first drafts, imperfect early podcasts, and continued refinement lead to powerful brand alignment.
Follow Marianne:
Marianne | LinkedIn
Marianne Hickman | Instagram
Marianne Hickman | Website
Dare to be Wickedly Branded
P.S. Take the first step (will only take you 3 minutes) to awaken your brand magic with our personalized Brand Clarity Quiz
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Beverly (00:11):
Did you know that only one in 10 people who speak on
stage ever convert thatspotlight into actual income?
Today's guest knows exactly howto change that.
I'm your host, Beverly Cornell.
I am the founder and fairygodmother of brand Clarity.
At Wickedly Branded, we havehelped hundreds of overwhelmed
overachieving consultants,creatives, and coaches awaken
their brand magic and boldlybring their marketing to life so
(00:33):
they feel more confident andattract their absolute favorite
and most profitable clients.
Today I'm joined by MarianneHickman.
She's an international speaker,personal speaking mentor.
And the founder of MarianneHickman.
Marianne has been featured inover 2,400 stages worldwide and
is on a mission to help businessowners transform their story
(00:55):
into actual revenue, teachingthem how to monetize their
message with confidence andauthenticity.
Her motto says it all make goodpeople crazy wealthy.
I'm so excited to have you here,Marianne.
Thank you for joining me today.
Marianne (01:08):
Beverly, I just love what you bring to the table.
Beverly (01:10):
I love it.
Marianne, I wanna talk a littlebit how you got to here.
What led you to start thisbusiness and what did the early
days look like for you as thefounder and as a speaker, in
your business?
Marianne (01:22):
I find myself talking about Mrs.
Wilson more than I ever thoughtI would.
She was my seventh gradeteacher.
She taught English, she alsotaught drama, and she was the
first one.
She said, Marianne, I reservedthis word for probably two or
three people a year outta myclass, but you are a scholar.
And as a seventh grader, I waslike, oh, I feel so smart.
She told me to compete in aspeaking competition when I was
(01:45):
12 and being the youngest of 10kids, I thought a speaking
competition meant an argument.
That was just a fancy word forit turns out.
I went and spoke at an optimistspeech club where they brought
kids in and had them compete.
And when I got on stage at thisevent I was surprised, but also
when, this is gonna make mesound really egotistical, I
promise I'm not this way all thetime.
(02:06):
But when I won first place, Iwas like, oh, that felt natural.
I wanna do this more.
Wasn't a one time thing.
So then I went on to regionalsand competed there and I went on
to state and I lost.
And I was so grateful that I didbecause I got to see.
People that beat me and whatthey did and how they were
better than me.
And I was like, wow, okay, now Ican learn.
And then I promptly forgot abouteverything.
Kept going to school and I keptlistening to the societal.
(02:29):
Go to college, get a bunch ofdebt go get a good job, quote
unquote, and fall into thesystem, fall into the machine.
And it wasn't until I was fastforward, married with five kids
at the time.
My husband really struggled tohold down a job.
We went through 11 jobs in thefirst 10 years of our marriage
(02:50):
that he held.
I stepped in and went to work,and I remember when the 11th job
failed.
I was like, okay, I think I justneed to go and make the money
for the family.
Is that what I need to do?
Because I'm willing, I just needyou to say so.
So I did, and I became aconference junkie.
I went to speech conferencesabout speaking.
It was like inception, right?
And then I go and learn allabout this.
And I'll never forget this oneevent that I went to and I got a
(03:12):
hats off to Kirk Duncan, he gaveus almost no time at all, but 30
seconds on stage.
And he said the point is not to.
Absorb the spotlight.
That's not the point when wespeak, the point is to look at
the audience and shine thespotlight from the stage on
them.
They are why we are here.
You've already got some level ofcredibility, but the point is
(03:33):
that the audience, they are therock stars I was like, oh my
gosh.
You're right.
And that's the crux ofeverything that I do when I
train public speaking.
And I'm not gonna say it wasglamorous.
Once I learned enough about howto communicate, how to speak,
how to do a really good call toaction, we started climbing
outta this money pit that wewere in.
The reason I hesitate to saythat is because that's not a
(03:54):
permanent thing.
Anyone that's ever made anymoney in any entrepreneurship
journey knows that it's likeriding a rollercoaster.
You are spending a lot of timewhite knuckling it, which is why
most people hop off the ride orthey take the exit before they
even get on.
I'm not gonna sit here and say,we've achieved a permanent
financial freedom, blah, blah,blah.
No.
But what we have achieved is apermanent way to generate it
(04:17):
whenever we need to.
Beverly (04:18):
You have a replicatable system of sorts to be able to do
that.
You said something that caughtmy attention, what's really
important I think that I hearover and over again with my
clients is we always positionthem as the hero and us as the
guide.
It's always about them.
And how do you help them get towhere they need to go, right?
(04:39):
And so you focusing on theaudience, I think is huge.
You're up there.
Because you have the medicinethat they need and you're there
to deliver the medicine in someway.
One little taste.
Maybe it's like a drug.
You're like a drug dealer.
Marianne.
Marianne (04:52):
Here's some dopamine free.
No, that's why I put theserotonin molecule in my logo.
Beverly (04:56):
I love it so much.
Maybe that was subconsciouslywhy I chose that as a metaphor
today.
But yeah, I think when you do itfor the right reasons to serve
others, that creates moreauthenticity, creates more
connection than if you do it foryourself.
And it's some kind ofegotistical thing.
When I remind myself it's aboutthem, it takes the pressure off
(05:16):
of me.
Marianne (05:16):
All that stage fright is just gone.
And that's the thing, when wehave a conversation, just you
and me, or you have aconversation with your best
friend and they ask you forhelp.
Stage fright is so self-centric.
When we have stage fright, it'sbecause we're nervous about what
we look like or what about me?
But it's not about that.
It's about what can I do foryou?
That it is the magic wand thatsays, how do I eliminate being
(05:37):
full of stage fright, which isdifferent from nervous, by the
way.
I think there's a healthy amountof that.
Am I gonna do.
A good enough job serving.
I care.
Beverly (05:44):
I care.
I want to make sure that theyget what I want them to get out
of this.
And if I do this well, I knowthey will get it.
It's that kind of excitementthat I have, nervousness that I
have for sure.
When we talk to our clientsabout getting their messaging
right for their website and forwho they are what do they
deliver, the transformation theyoffer, who they help.
(06:05):
When we get that right Marianne,it creates confidence.
Marianne (06:09):
It does.
And that's what takes us so muchwork.
To get that right.
There's like phases to it.
It takes tweaking and it takesrefining and it takes work.
That's when the magic happens.
Beverly (06:18):
There's so much to say here because we work on
messaging all day long with ourclients.
And understanding them is one ofthe most wonderful, amazing
things.
I have found that I've been intheir shoes.
I remember what it felt like tofeel burnout.
So it's real easy for me to getin touch with those fears, the
realities of their life.
Marianne (06:38):
I don't think as entrepreneurs, we give ourself
enough credit for this to trythings.
And the process of elimination,the same thing came to speaking.
At first, I worked with allkinds of speakers, but I knew
this process of elimination, andnow I'm like, oh, I love working
with accomplished businessowners who are already in their
business, but they've been askedto speak and are what do I do?
(06:59):
So now I work with them.
When you're in the processtrying to figure out what you
like, first of all, there'sthat.
Second of all, how do we figureout what our audience wants?
And there's two keys here, andI'm sure you talk about this all
the time.
Number one is remember where youwere five years ago, what were
you praying for five years ago?
And then if you're ever confusedabout what your audience wants
or needs, don't be afraid tojust ask them.
A lot of entrepreneurs thinkthat makes them look weak or
(07:21):
like they don't know anything,but your audience loves it.
I open every event with askingmy audience, and it's not
rhetorical.
I said, raise your hand and tellme, because I might throw away
my entire slide deck becauseit's not what you need.
Beverly (07:31):
That's brave.
So one thing that I have foundthat has really helped me as a
speaker is obviously doing thepodcast, but also being a guest
on other people's podcasts.
And I have done this for about ayear and a half now, and I have
a master's in communication,when I talk to my clients, we
talk about visibility andauthority building, and one way
you can do this through podcaststo being a guest like you are
(07:52):
right now.
There's lots of ways to buildauthority.
There's all kinds of things youcan do to get out in the world
and share your messaging.
I was not good at the beginning.
Marianne (08:01):
join the club
Beverly (08:02):
and people expect themselves to be perfect the
first time.
And I say no.
If you look at my very firstpodcast, it's a train wreck.
And it's not me at all.
But if you look at myself nowand how I run a podcast episode,
it's very different.
Then I started to have thesephrases like that's me.
After a year and a half, I havequite a few of those I can pull
(08:25):
out as examples and metaphors.
And they're much more naturaland they're totally me but it is
an art.
You must practice.
I think you have to do it morethan just a couple times to be
really good at it.
Marianne (08:35):
Oh, of course.
So this is what's reallyimportant.
Conversely, as important is themessage that we will spend our
lives talking about.
Because how we spend our time ishow we spend our life.
And that's why when you get soclear on that, you become so
emboldened by it.
Speaking of communications, youno longer care about all of the
(08:55):
fluff.
You no longer care if it's quotedone blah, blah, blah.
Of course, you're welcome tofeedback.
Where it's so important thatthis comes out of me, that I
don't care what the wrappingpaper looks like anymore.
Beverly (09:05):
So I think when you get to a certain age, and I also
believe a certain level in yourbusiness where you have some
safety and comfort that allowsyou some breathing room to be
bold.
I just wrote a blog post thismorning about good marketing
versus wicked marketing and thedifference of that.
And I want Wicked.
(09:26):
'cause Wicked is more authentic.
Wicked does all the things thatyou want it to do.
If you're of good marketing,it's your playing it safe.
(10:41):
You're blending in, you're doingall of that.
So be more wicked.
Marianne (10:45):
Yeah.
And whatever that looks like,the thing that you're scared to
say, it should probably be thething that you say.
Beverly (10:49):
Here we go.
I have a question about yourbrand.
When you first started, how didyou come up with your logo and
how has it developed over theyears and really how does it
feel like you?
Marianne (11:01):
Okay.
So I wanted something that Icould own forever and I learned
that there have been reallythree waves.
Of industry over the last coupleof centuries.
The first wave was theindustrial revolution where now
we have assembly lines andcompanies are being built
because we have a process.
Then we have the 1950s goldenboom of the corporation where
(11:21):
all of our high-rise buildingswere built and all of our
downtown cities and thecorporation.
Now we're seeing this thirdwave, which is the rise of the
personal brand.
Social media has really madethat possible for us because
anyone can do it.
There's no excuses.
Anymore.
You don't need a multimilliondollar high rise building.
Beverly (11:37):
Even if you wanna be a VP of marketing somewhere, or
you want to be a tech director,you need to have a personal
brand.
You need to build yourauthority.
Marianne (11:47):
Absolutely.
I went to an event with RyanPineda, who's a big guy in the
real estate space.
Huge event.
We're talking like 1200 peoplethere, and he said something so
well articulated, he said,nobody can do business with you
if they don't know who you are.
And there's a trust factor thatunfortunately does get abused.
There's no doubt about that.
But there's a trust factor whenit comes to working with people.
(12:09):
I think we miss as a society,which is why the rise of the
personal brand solves that.
Beverly (12:13):
Oh, and AI is only making that more apparent that
we need the human connection.
Marianne (12:17):
I'm not against ai.
It's really fun.
But don't lie to me.
Just don't tell me it's you.
Beverly (12:21):
Agreed.
You talked a little bit aboutwho your favorite people are.
Small business owners who arepretty established, they wanna
build more visibility andauthority?
Talk about who they are and thenwhat your process is, the
transformation that you offer.
Marianne (12:35):
Okay.
So this is perfect because I'llgive a prime example.
So my friend, she lives in Miamiand she has done astronomically
amazing things.
Her husband sold their companyfor a couple billion dollars,
i'm not exactly sure how longago it.
But she came from nothing.
And so when she was given theresponsibility and the blessing
of this affluence, she took itvery seriously.
(12:56):
She said, I've got to dosomething impactful.
So she started buying schools.
She bought an elementary school,gutted it, changed out the
staff, changed out theircurriculum and made it something
brand new.
And she's revolutionizingeducation for kids.
She gutted the entire lunchsystem.
They only feed lunch from a farmthat she now owns.
She now owns a regenerativehealth clinic down in Miami.
(13:19):
She's been targeted, especiallyin 2020, by news organizations
for her stance and for herbeliefs, which asked her to
speak last year at Turning PointUSA on her message,'cause it
dovetailed with their mission sostrongly, she called me, she
said I have this big speakingengagement.
I need your help.
We worked together I didn'twrite her speech for her, but I
gave her the framework of thespeech.
(13:40):
I have this formula for all ofthis, and I brought this to her
and said, our job is to fillthis in for you, put your ink on
this framework.
And as we worked together forthe course of six weeks, we
rehomed the speech, I deliveredit for her a lot.
She delivered it back.
And then she took the stage atT-P-U-S-A last year.
And just I watched her speechand my jaw hit the floor.
She did so well.
(14:00):
It was so amazing.
She moved the audience.
And the best part about the waywe construct speeches is to give
the audience somethingsubstantive that they can take.
It is a free resource that thenthis is the cool thing about
combining marketing with publicspeaking is when you do it
right, customers knock on yourdoor and they're like, I know
that you mentioned this, but canyou help me?
(14:20):
How much do you charge?
I need this problem solved somuch.
And then we, as entrepreneurs,we say, now hang on just a
second lemme make sure I canactually solve this for you
before we have a transactionhere.
You would be much more benefitedto whisper into the ears of your
audience members than you arescreaming on the house tops when
nobody can hear you.
That's the process.
Beverly (14:37):
I love it so much.
The idea of a framework.
Is there any particular tip youwanna give to our listeners
today of how they could getstarted in doing this within
your framework?
Marianne (14:47):
Oh, absolutely.
So I, like you said, get thereps in.
So what I tell people to do,when they're very first started
getting into the world of publicspeaking, it's simply
podcasting.
It's a digital stage, but it'sstill a stage.
And people are like, okay, howdo I get booked on more?
So I've aggregated a list ofover a thousand podcasts.
You can keyword search it bytopic.
And I just give that away.
And if you go to mariannehickman.com/guest, you get
(15:08):
access.
Find the shows that youraudience is listening to.
The last 50% is split into twocategories.
One of them is your niche notthat I'm talking about your
niche market.
I'm talking about yourinterests.
Chances are there's somecrossover there.
And then the other half of that50% is authority figures.
Get on shows with people who areauthorities in your space.
Beverly's an authority in myspace, so I'm stoked to share
(15:32):
what we're talking about herebecause she's talking marketing
and you have to have marketing.
I used to just.
Have such a wedgie when Ithought of the word marketing,
'cause I'm like, oh my gosh, Isuck at this.
But you know what it's nodifferent than a beautiful
presentation of your food at arestaurant or lovely wrapping
paper on a gift or picking thenice outfit that just makes you
(15:52):
feel like a million bucks whenyou walk out the house.
It's the thing that makes peoplelook at you and say, Ooh, that
was tasty.
What more do you have?
Beverly (15:59):
Yes, it should show up.
So I don't know if you can seein, but I actually have pink
hair.
I have a lot of things, likeeven my water bottle is sparkly.
I was in a lunch line at anetworking event with probably
about a thousand people andimmediately they knew it was me.
And that's what good brandingdoes, is helps people see you
exactly across the room.
That is how it's supposed to be.
(16:19):
It can be so powerful forrecognition and connection.
So this season's big question isall about activation.
I know that in a speech you'reactivating your brand and your
marketing at probably thehighest level.
So what is the biggest challengethat most of your clients face
to get that message and thatbrand to feel and look like you?
Marianne (16:42):
It first comes from a lack of clarity, like we talked
about before.
But the unfortunate part of thatis that when people aren't
clear, they tend to not doanything.
Beverly (16:51):
Okay.
So how do you monetize?
How do you monetize the speech?
Marianne (16:54):
Okay, so this is the symptom, and the reason that
this is so important is becausewe can will often get on stage
and altruistically want to give.
It's a great thing to want todo, but unless you're being
nourished, you'll burn out.
Unsustainably,
Beverly (17:08):
hello.
Raising my hand.
Marianne (17:09):
Right.
We give and we, which is a greatthing.
I'm not saying stop giving.
And if you lack any faith inthis, look at all of the people
who are, oh, what's a nice wayto put this riffraff in the
world who are not doing goodthings with plenty of money?
How much more than do youdeserve to be funded?
Okay, so let's just get thatmindset issue outta the way.
At first, you deserve to haveyour mission funded.
Okay, so let's talk about howit's done as a speaker.
(17:31):
There are two ways that you getpaid to do what you do.
Number one is through yourspeaker fee, and I'm telling you
right now, increase your speakerfee.
Number two, if your speaker feeis the only way that you're
getting paid, you are leaving60% of your revenue on the
table.
You're not able to take it home.
All right.
which brings me to the secondway to get paid to speak.
You speak, you take a check, andthen you leave and you're done.
(17:52):
However, that is not sustainablebecause you have to be working
in order to bring in therevenue.
If your speech has anything ofsubstance to it, then people are
going to want more of what yougave them already.
People are going to want more ofyou.
They're going to want more ofyour knowledge, they're going to
want more of your expertise.
They want more actionable steps.
(18:12):
Which then leads us to, you'renot just a speaker, you're in
some ways a trainer or a coachor a facilitator of some kind.
That's the difference betweenspeakers and facilitators.
You're making things easier forother people and that doesn't
end with the stage.
You have to have something,whether it's an ebook or a
database or a resource guide ora quiz, not just something
gimmicky, something that'sactually going to make lives
(18:33):
better.
I'm going to continue to give.
And we live in a beautiful daywhere you can continue to do
that digitally all day long.
You take this email list and yougive so much value and then you
ask.
But you don't ask for a take.
You ask for more ideas.
So I just did this week.
I said, I'm hosting a speakingcompetition.
If you were to come, what wouldyou expect to see there?
What would be really fun foryou?
(18:53):
And then you get the input andthey help you build it.
They help you build yourproduct.
And then you launch thatproduct.
And if you follow the formula,then you create a sustainable
income.
And if you do it right, you caneven put it on autopilot to
where now in your CRM, which youbetter have if you're in
business, if you don't have one,call me.
you create so much value thatthey are on the edge of your
(19:14):
seat for release day.
Imagine having customers.
That form lines around yourbusiness like they do around an
Apple building when a new phonecomes out.
They want it because it solvesreal problems for them.
Imagine having an opening launchday with a product and a digital
course, an evergreen productthat solved the problem so well
that you sold out.
That's what we're creating, notjust gimmicky courses that you
(19:37):
can get for a dime a dozen.
We're talking about real problemsolving, real testimonials, real
people knocking on your door andsaying, I dunno what I would've
done without you.
Beverly (19:45):
I often share with my clients that when you are on
social media, you are leasingyour space.
But when you own your list,that's the investment in your
you can message them anytime youwant.
There's no algorithm present forpreventing it.
that is the thing you want to beable to have at the end of the
day.
Yes.
So that when you launch or whenyou need feedback or when you
(20:06):
need the things, you have thislist.
So if you could put yourinformation into one bucket, one
strategy.
Email marketing is so much morepowerful and can be used from
the stage, can be used from apodcast, can be used for many
things to be able to grow andgive value all day long.
So if there's one thing that Iwould say to piggyback on what
(20:26):
you're saying is build youremail list.
Marianne (20:28):
Yes.
Yes.
You own it like you said it.
A lot of people will look atthat and say, oh, email is dead.
It's not.
It's so far from that.
And there are people that don'tcheck their email.
That's fine.
But your people do.
Beverly (20:38):
And if you are sharing a message that they want to
open, they'll actually look foryour emails.
They will wait.
For your emails.
Marianne (20:44):
No, I have a couple that I'm like, I'm not deleting
that.
I love it.
Beverly (20:47):
So there are people who do this really well, and you can
be one of those people for sure.
Absolutely.
100%.
But yeah, build your email list.
It is the one thing.
And even if you were to sellyour business, that's something
that has the value, especiallyif you're working from
virtually, you don't have anoffice, don't have inventory,
those kinds of things.
That is something that can be areally important part of your
business for sure.
(21:08):
Oh,
Marianne (21:08):
100%.
We.
Close the doors.
We still own the business.
And the thing that makes thisbusiness valuable is the email
list.
It's a 30,000 person email listthat we actually can right now,
even though the brick andmortars closed, we can continue
to nurture.
We can continue to providevalue.
And so when our doors open againon this side business that we
have there's a line around thebuilding.
(21:28):
Because we have created so muchvalue for the client base.
Beverly (21:31):
Yeah, I agree completely.
Okay.
This is the magic hat.
And there's tons of questions inhere, and I'm gonna let the
universe just decide what we'regonna talk about today.
How fun is that?
So it is rapid fire.
A little bit more fun.
How do you want your customersto feel after working with you?
Marianne (21:49):
How do I want my customers to feel?
I want them to feel like theyare the light bulb that turned
on.
I want them to feel like, notthat just they have the light
bulb, but that they're likeemitting it.
I want them to feel like theyare in their zone of genius,
that they are having fun doingwhat they're doing.
That they are just energized bybeing on stage.
(22:09):
I hope people are having fun.
Beverly (22:10):
I love that.
How do you keep yourentrepreneurial spirit alive?
What do you feed it?
Marianne (22:16):
Ooh, that is an interesting one.
All you gotta do is just go toIndeed and look for jobs and
then say nope.
Actually I really enjoy what I'mdoing.
Thanks.
Beverly (22:24):
No.
Absolutely.
I can't imagine If your brandhad a theme song, what would it
be and why?
Marianne (22:30):
The name of my company on paper is, this is me, LLC.
I'm a Greatest Showman superfan.
Beverly (22:34):
Exactly why we're BFFs,
Marianne (22:36):
right.
Bearded lady and all.
That is our theme song.
Beverly (22:40):
That's a great song.
I love it.
What's something in yourbusiness that brings you pure
joy?
Marianne (22:45):
Podcasting.
I get to meet the coolestpeople.
And you know what it does whenyou start a podcast for your
business, you get to have thebest excuse in the book.
To get someone's attention.
And I've had the most incrediblepeople on my show because of the
podcast.
Beverly (22:58):
Yes.
I would a hundred percent agree.
What's a common misconceptionabout your industry that you'd
love to debunk?
Marianne (23:05):
Okay, so this not only is it a common misconception,
but is the number one questionthat I get is, how do I get more
stages?
You are not going to be sittingin your house one day.
Have some recruiter knock onyour door and say, Hey, we wanna
pay you$10,000 to appear onstage.
It's not gonna happen.
This is what I tell people.
If you wanna speak more, quitwaiting for the TED stage.
(23:26):
Quit waiting for the 10 x stage.
Just quit waiting for that andgo out and produce your own
stuff.
Start your own podcast.
Get on as many podcasts as youcan simultaneously.
Use that resource if you need tostart your own event series.
So stop waiting for the stage.
Stop waiting for the recruiterto call you.
Beverly (23:43):
Oh my gosh.
It's like the build of the namewill come, no.
I used to think the work wouldspeak for itself, that I just
would keep my head down and dothe work.
And that would be it.
Marianne (23:53):
It's tempting to think that it really is, and you do
have to do the work,
Beverly (23:56):
You have to do the work, but you also have to show
up and be visible to have thoseopportunities.
Last question from the magicalhat.
What was the moment you realizedyour business was successful?
Marianne (24:07):
This came at the end of our first year as freedom
from W2.
And when the company startedtanking, I got cut.
And so I said, now it's time.
I can't go back to a W2.
I just have to make this happenon my own.
And my husband was, I love thisman.
He just said, game on.
Let's go.
And he had so much faith in meand I had so much faith in him,
and we built this together.
At the end of that first year,we were doing our profit and
(24:28):
loss sheet together.
And as we looked through thenumbers we're like, oh my gosh.
Our first year in business, whenwe closed six figures, I was
like, okay, let's go.
We know what doesn't work tosome degree, based on this first
year, we know what does, let'sfocus on what continues to work.
And we've just been doing thatever since.
And we just continue to do moreof what works and less what
doesn't.
Then that's how we'll spend therest of our days,
Beverly (24:47):
and that's how you should look at what is working,
do more of that, what's notworking, do less of that or
tweak it and see if it does workdifferently.
That's why analytics are soimportant.
'Cause you need to know if it'sworking or not.
I'm bringing out the wand.
I'm going to waive the wand andwe're going to go back let's
just go back to 12-year-oldMarianne who did her first
speech.
And give her a piece of advicethat you wish she knew then that
(25:09):
would help her throughout herlife.
Marianne (25:10):
I wish I had told her to keep speaking.
I wish she had.
I didn't think speaking could bea career.
When I was 12 and I did thatcompetition, I was like, that's
cool.
And then I went back right intothe school mill.
I went right back into the finda good career and, I remember
sitting in my Italian class as apregnant mother of soon to be
five kids studying the, becausethe GE or the class requirement
(25:31):
needed to be fulfilled somehow.
Everyone's 10 years younger thanme and way less pregnant than
me.
And I'm like, what am I doinghere?
If I had just pursued a speakingcareer at that point, whether
it's to lead a speaking chapter,whether it's to get into debate
in high school, I wish that Iwould have kept with it and
gotten a decade and a half aheadof where I am now and just kept
(25:54):
talking.
I wish I had done that.
Beverly (25:55):
What would she say to you of where you are now?
Marianne (25:58):
She would be like, wait, that's all you do in
addition to being a mom, whichis awesome.
I didn't think that what I saidmattered.
I didn't think that my voice hadany weight to it at all.
People listen to you.
Are you kidding me?
What happened?
That's what she would say.
She would be dumbfounded.
Beverly (26:12):
I love it when our younger selves are proud of
ourselves.
Like they're shocked at likewhere we've come.
Marianne (26:16):
We owe it to them where we are with the magic
wands.
We are the fairy godmothers.
Like you said, that the youngerversion of ourselves we're
counting on
Beverly (26:23):
Yes, absolutely.
And dreams can change and whatwe want can change, and my
dreams have shifted.
But it's interesting how thethings I believed in then still
matter now.
Those things haven't changed.
It's just how they come to benow is a little bit different.
Okay.
So I'm waving it again, andwe're gonna go far into the
future.
People are at your funeral andsomeone is giving your eulogy.
(26:45):
What are they gonna say aboutyou as a business person and how
you've affected the world?
Marianne (26:50):
this sounds, again, ordering on egotistical, and I
don't want that because I wantto be known for the good that
not just happened at my hands,but here's what I want at my
funeral, I want the people thatlistened to the speaker that I
trained to be there.
I don't need the credit.
My funeral can actually be verysmall, here's what I really hope
(27:12):
for is that as I'm looking downat the funeral, I'm somehow able
to see the, maybe they'll becomevisual'cause I'll have the right
celestial tools or something.
But the ripple effect, so thepeople that I trained to speak,
they're better off because I wasin their lives.
And then the people that theyspoke to, they're better off
because that speaker was intheir life.
(27:32):
And then the kids who went toschool with the kids of those
people didn't get bulliedbecause they became better
parents.
So I hope to look down andsomehow see.
The ripple effect or the goldenthreads that said, okay, this
person who will never know yourname this person was healed, or
this person became a betterteacher.
Yeah.
Because you taught the personthat taught them.
(27:53):
That's what I hope to see.
Beverly (27:55):
When I think of the ripple effect, it's not just the
business owners that I help, butit's their teams that now are
stronger and then they're ableto do more work in the
communities, which makes thecommunity stronger, which gives
opportunities to people whomaybe never had the opportunity.
I want that as well.
And you're right, I don't needthe credit.
Like I just want people to havethe magic and make the world
better.
Marianne (28:15):
what I stand before God accountable for.
Beverly (28:17):
Yes, absolutely.
I did what I did with my lifeand this life you gave me has to
have meaning and impact in thatway.
I take that responsibility veryseriously in my work.
So yes, I would absolutely 100%agree with you.
Okay.
The last question is, what doesbeing wickedly branded mean to
you?
(28:37):
How do you show up wickedlybranded and what advice would
you give to our listeners to bemore wickedly branded?
Marianne (28:43):
Be nice to the garbage man.
I worked at a big venue and Ihad events there.
It is as often as twice a monthsometimes.
And then once a month and thenwe did once a quarter.
I was there a lot.
I'll always remember Thomas, hewas the backstage guy who made
sure the trash cans were emptiedand he made sure the chairs were
set out and he made sure theparking lot cones were in the
(29:03):
right spot.
And Thomas, he had a beautifulvoice.
I caught him singing in theparking lot one day.
But you should know the name ofthe person that pours your
coffee.
You should know the name of theperson that takes out the trash.
And how you treat those peopleshould match how you treat your
dream celebrity.
That's just integrity.
Just, and that there's gonna bea chapter in a book I write
(29:24):
someday called Know their CoffeeOrder, know them that well.
There was a man who emptied thegarbage, and he was such a sweet
man and I always made it a pointto hold the door open while he
brought the trash can inside.
And it is reminiscent of Estherin the scriptures when she helps
the people who really need it.
Same with Mother Theresa.
She helps the people that reallyneed it.
She's kind to the people that weusually pass right over.
(29:46):
That's the thing is just beperson of integrity.
That is the same to the peoplewho empty your garbage as the
people whose hand you would bewishing to shake one day.
Beverly (29:54):
And that's the way your brand and marketing should feel
too.
Marianne (29:56):
Yeah.
Beverly (29:57):
That's exactly the way it should feel.
your story is so powerful to mebecause there was a gentleman in
my last job, who was animmigrant to this country who
took care of our trash for usand he would come in every day
and I was always working reallylate'cause I'm.
We do.
I have a problem.
I love my work.
That's the problem.
And he came in and the office isquiet.
He'd come in and I'm like, oh,hello Ola.
How are you today?
(30:17):
And he's I'm very fine Ms.
Beverly, how are you?
And he was so sweet.
And I would ask him his familyand ask him what he is up to.
And just, he was a person, andevery once in a while I'd come
in the next morning and he wouldhave a chocolate on my desk he
was so incredibly sweet.
And I just think that nobodyreally saw him.
These are people who are workingvery hard.
(30:37):
He took very great pride in hiswork too.
I do believe that there's somany people around you that has
a story that you should be andyou will learn something and
you'll gain something.
And like I said, like he leaveme a little chocolate or like a
little note saying good morningor something.
It was just so incredibly sweet.
And he was much older, probablylike older than my dad.
So he was much older and justincredibly sweet.
And you just never know whatyou're going to find if you ask
(31:00):
some questions and get to knowthem.
Marianne (31:02):
Yeah.
And you never know if they'regonna be nicer when they go
home.
Cause they met you
Beverly (31:05):
and they got appreciated at work.
Okay.
So Marianne, you talked a littlebit about 2026 has some pretty
cool things coming.
What is coming in 2026 thatyou're doing a little different,
that you're nervous, excitedabout?
Marianne (31:17):
Yeah, very nervous, excited about this.
Okay.
In this year, I do a lot ofgroup work right now and it is
so fulfilling.
The calls are so fun.
We create a lot oftransformation and I wanna do
bigger stuff.
So I'm morphing that group workand what we're gonna continue to
book people on podcasts likecrazy.
That is so fun to do.
We're gonna continue to teachpublic speaking, but I'm taking
it on from group and putting itin one-on-one because I find
(31:38):
that's most effective.
Okay.
And we're doing a bunch oftravel.
I've been to over 17 countries,physically in person.
I've got a list of podcastsdigitally.
And you know what I really wannado?
I wanna take a group of reallycool people and go do podcasting
in Iceland and go do podcastingin Costa Rica and record
episodes with this beautifulbackdrop.
Because I am such a betterperson when I travel and I
(32:00):
immerse myself in the culturesof strangers and other people, I
become more understanding.
I become more.
Curious.
So we're gonna take toursstarting next year.
We're gonna be taking more toursand we're gonna see more places.
We're gonna create stories worthtelling from the stage.
We're gonna createtransformation and we're gonna
do it with a group of peoplethat loves to tell travel
stories without soundingbraggadocio about it because it
(32:23):
is just it's so fun.
And you know what?
We're gonna be sending a lot oftime nurturing marriages as
well.
Especially for theentrepreneurs, and this is the
part of me that's nervous sizesbecause it, it is as is shift in
branding for me.
It is a shift in, in focus forme.
Those people that are runningbusinesses in a marriage face
challenges unlike any other.
Your marriage is the mostimportant relationship other
(32:45):
than your God.
And you know what it's like towant to report your husband to
hr, but he is HR and what it'slike to not see eye to eye on an
email that needs to go out andto have this three day long
argument where you give eachother the silent treatment
because someone ruffled theirfeathers the wrong way.
And we have got to get back toour marriages being the safe
haven.
Or everything that we arebuilding as speakers, as
(33:07):
entrepreneurs.
So some of our retreats we're ofcourse gonna talk about the
process of speaking, how to makemoney from stage and how to do
it sustainably, but built on afoundation where your marriage
is safe and.
And that's what we're gettinginto next year.
Beverly (33:18):
So exciting.
Thank you for sharing with ustoday to be the first to know.
Marianne (33:22):
Yeah.
I haven't shared it with anybodyyet.
Beverly (33:24):
Where can listeners connect with you and your work?
Where can they find you?
Marianne?
Marianne (33:27):
I'm most active on Instagram, but if you wanna just
text me and get real and have aconversation, just text me.
It's 8 0 1 5 0 9 5 4 9 5.
I just, I'd love to just chatwith people and connect with
them.
I'm all over.
If you wanna keep your distanceand still be a voyeur, just go
on social media.
Beverly (33:41):
Awesome.
I just really enjoyed our timetogether.
So for my listeners, I reallyhoped that you enjoyed this
incredible conversation withMarianne.
I just love her energy.
I love what she had to say.
I think really what we say allthe time from our perspective,
from Wickedly branded, you justreinforced everything Marianne,
so thank you.
But to the listeners, I reallyhope that this episode lit a
(34:02):
fire under you, gave you a lotof new ideas and most of all,
inspired you to take some.
Action.
Take a step to do something foryour business, whether it's to
get out there and be on morepodcast, to maybe go speak in
your local chamber, whatever itis, but to start doing those
reps to show up, because here isthe thing.
Your message matters, your workmatters, and the world needs to
(34:26):
hear what you have to say.
Marketing isn't just aboutvisibility.
It's also about that impact,those golden threads that
Marianne talked about.
It's about connecting with theright people in a way that feels
absolutely 100% true to you.
So show up or keep showing up.
Keep sharing your brilliance andkeep making magic in the world.
(34:46):
And hey, if you ever feel stuck,know that you don't have to do
it alone.
You've got Marianne to help you.
I'm here to help you.
We wanna turn your spark intothe wildfire it was meant to be.
But until next time, I dare youto be wickedly branded.
Did you know that only one in 10 people who speak on
stage ever convert thatspotlight into actual income?
Today's guest knows exactly howto change that.
I'm your host, Beverly Cornell.
I am the founder and fairygodmother of brand Clarity.
At Wickedly Branded, we havehelped hundreds of overwhelmed
overachieving consultants,creatives, and coaches awaken
their brand magic and boldlybring their marketing to life so
(00:33):
they feel more confident andattract their absolute favorite
and most profitable clients.
Today I'm joined by MarianneHickman.
She's an international speaker,personal speaking mentor.
And the founder of MarianneHickman.
Marianne has been featured inover 2,400 stages worldwide and
is on a mission to help businessowners transform their story
(00:55):
into actual revenue, teachingthem how to monetize their
message with confidence andauthenticity.
Her motto says it all make goodpeople crazy wealthy.
I'm so excited to have you here,Marianne.
Thank you for joining me today.
Marianne (01:08):
Beverly, I just love what you bring to the table.
Beverly (01:10):
I love it.
Marianne, I wanna talk a littlebit how you got to here.
What led you to start thisbusiness and what did the early
days look like for you as thefounder and as a speaker, in
your business?
Marianne (01:22):
I find myself talking about Mrs.
Wilson more than I ever thoughtI would.
She was my seventh gradeteacher.
She taught English, she alsotaught drama, and she was the
first one.
She said, Marianne, I reservedthis word for probably two or
three people a year outta myclass, but you are a scholar.
And as a seventh grader, I waslike, oh, I feel so smart.
She told me to compete in aspeaking competition when I was
(01:45):
12 and being the youngest of 10kids, I thought a speaking
competition meant an argument.
That was just a fancy word forit turns out.
I went and spoke at an optimistspeech club where they brought
kids in and had them compete.
And when I got on stage at thisevent I was surprised, but also
when, this is gonna make mesound really egotistical, I
promise I'm not this way all thetime.
(02:06):
But when I won first place, Iwas like, oh, that felt natural.
I wanna do this more.
Wasn't a one time thing.
So then I went on to regionalsand competed there and I went on
to state and I lost.
And I was so grateful that I didbecause I got to see.
People that beat me and whatthey did and how they were
better than me.
And I was like, wow, okay, now Ican learn.
And then I promptly forgot abouteverything.
Kept going to school and I keptlistening to the societal.
(02:29):
Go to college, get a bunch ofdebt go get a good job, quote
unquote, and fall into thesystem, fall into the machine.
And it wasn't until I was fastforward, married with five kids
at the time.
My husband really struggled tohold down a job.
We went through 11 jobs in thefirst 10 years of our marriage
(02:50):
that he held.
I stepped in and went to work,and I remember when the 11th job
failed.
I was like, okay, I think I justneed to go and make the money
for the family.
Is that what I need to do?
Because I'm willing, I just needyou to say so.
So I did, and I became aconference junkie.
I went to speech conferencesabout speaking.
It was like inception, right?
And then I go and learn allabout this.
And I'll never forget this oneevent that I went to and I got a
(03:12):
hats off to Kirk Duncan, he gaveus almost no time at all, but 30
seconds on stage.
And he said the point is not to.
Absorb the spotlight.
That's not the point when wespeak, the point is to look at
the audience and shine thespotlight from the stage on
them.
They are why we are here.
You've already got some level ofcredibility, but the point is
(03:33):
that the audience, they are therock stars I was like, oh my
gosh.
You're right.
And that's the crux ofeverything that I do when I
train public speaking.
And I'm not gonna say it wasglamorous.
Once I learned enough about howto communicate, how to speak,
how to do a really good call toaction, we started climbing
outta this money pit that wewere in.
The reason I hesitate to saythat is because that's not a
(03:54):
permanent thing.
Anyone that's ever made anymoney in any entrepreneurship
journey knows that it's likeriding a rollercoaster.
You are spending a lot of timewhite knuckling it, which is why
most people hop off the ride orthey take the exit before they
even get on.
I'm not gonna sit here and say,we've achieved a permanent
financial freedom, blah, blah,blah.
No.
But what we have achieved is apermanent way to generate it
(04:17):
whenever we need to.
Beverly (04:18):
You have a replicatable system of sorts to be able to do
that.
You said something that caughtmy attention, what's really
important I think that I hearover and over again with my
clients is we always positionthem as the hero and us as the
guide.
It's always about them.
And how do you help them get towhere they need to go, right?
(04:39):
And so you focusing on theaudience, I think is huge.
You're up there.
Because you have the medicinethat they need and you're there
to deliver the medicine in someway.
One little taste.
Maybe it's like a drug.
You're like a drug dealer.
Marianne.
Marianne (04:52):
Here's some dopamine free.
No, that's why I put theserotonin molecule in my logo.
Beverly (04:56):
I love it so much.
Maybe that was subconsciouslywhy I chose that as a metaphor
today.
But yeah, I think when you do itfor the right reasons to serve
others, that creates moreauthenticity, creates more
connection than if you do it foryourself.
And it's some kind ofegotistical thing.
When I remind myself it's aboutthem, it takes the pressure off
(05:16):
of me.
Marianne (05:16):
All that stage fright is just gone.
And that's the thing, when wehave a conversation, just you
and me, or you have aconversation with your best
friend and they ask you forhelp.
Stage fright is so self-centric.
When we have stage fright, it'sbecause we're nervous about what
we look like or what about me?
But it's not about that.
It's about what can I do foryou?
That it is the magic wand thatsays, how do I eliminate being
(05:37):
full of stage fright, which isdifferent from nervous, by the
way.
I think there's a healthy amountof that.
Am I gonna do.
A good enough job serving.
I care.
Beverly (05:44):
I care.
I want to make sure that theyget what I want them to get out
of this.
And if I do this well, I knowthey will get it.
It's that kind of excitementthat I have, nervousness that I
have for sure.
When we talk to our clientsabout getting their messaging
right for their website and forwho they are what do they
deliver, the transformation theyoffer, who they help.
(06:05):
When we get that right Marianne,it creates confidence.
Marianne (06:09):
It does.
And that's what takes us so muchwork.
To get that right.
There's like phases to it.
It takes tweaking and it takesrefining and it takes work.
That's when the magic happens.
Beverly (06:18):
There's so much to say here because we work on
messaging all day long with ourclients.
And understanding them is one ofthe most wonderful, amazing
things.
I have found that I've been intheir shoes.
I remember what it felt like tofeel burnout.
So it's real easy for me to getin touch with those fears, the
realities of their life.
Marianne (06:38):
I don't think as entrepreneurs, we give ourself
enough credit for this to trythings.
And the process of elimination,the same thing came to speaking.
At first, I worked with allkinds of speakers, but I knew
this process of elimination, andnow I'm like, oh, I love working
with accomplished businessowners who are already in their
business, but they've been askedto speak and are what do I do?
(06:59):
So now I work with them.
When you're in the processtrying to figure out what you
like, first of all, there'sthat.
Second of all, how do we figureout what our audience wants?
And there's two keys here, andI'm sure you talk about this all
the time.
Number one is remember where youwere five years ago, what were
you praying for five years ago?
And then if you're ever confusedabout what your audience wants
or needs, don't be afraid tojust ask them.
A lot of entrepreneurs thinkthat makes them look weak or
(07:21):
like they don't know anything,but your audience loves it.
I open every event with askingmy audience, and it's not
rhetorical.
I said, raise your hand and tellme, because I might throw away
my entire slide deck becauseit's not what you need.
Beverly (07:31):
That's brave.
So one thing that I have foundthat has really helped me as a
speaker is obviously doing thepodcast, but also being a guest
on other people's podcasts.
And I have done this for about ayear and a half now, and I have
a master's in communication,when I talk to my clients, we
talk about visibility andauthority building, and one way
you can do this through podcaststo being a guest like you are
(07:52):
right now.
There's lots of ways to buildauthority.
There's all kinds of things youcan do to get out in the world
and share your messaging.
I was not good at the beginning.
Marianne (08:01):
join the club
Beverly (08:02):
and people expect themselves to be perfect the
first time.
And I say no.
If you look at my very firstpodcast, it's a train wreck.
And it's not me at all.
But if you look at myself nowand how I run a podcast episode,
it's very different.
Then I started to have thesephrases like that's me.
After a year and a half, I havequite a few of those I can pull
(08:25):
out as examples and metaphors.
And they're much more naturaland they're totally me but it is
an art.
You must practice.
I think you have to do it morethan just a couple times to be
really good at it.
Marianne (08:35):
Oh, of course.
So this is what's reallyimportant.
Conversely, as important is themessage that we will spend our
lives talking about.
Because how we spend our time ishow we spend our life.
And that's why when you get soclear on that, you become so
emboldened by it.
Speaking of communications, youno longer care about all of the
(08:55):
fluff.
You no longer care if it's quotedone blah, blah, blah.
Of course, you're welcome tofeedback.
Where it's so important thatthis comes out of me, that I
don't care what the wrappingpaper looks like anymore.
Beverly (09:05):
So I think when you get to a certain age, and I also
believe a certain level in yourbusiness where you have some
safety and comfort that allowsyou some breathing room to be
bold.
I just wrote a blog post thismorning about good marketing
versus wicked marketing and thedifference of that.
And I want Wicked.
(09:26):
'cause Wicked is more authentic.
Wicked does all the things thatyou want it to do.
If you're of good marketing,it's your playing it safe.
(10:41):
You're blending in, you're doingall of that.
So be more wicked.
Marianne (10:45):
Yeah.
And whatever that looks like,the thing that you're scared to
say, it should probably be thething that you say.
Beverly (10:49):
Here we go.
I have a question about yourbrand.
When you first started, how didyou come up with your logo and
how has it developed over theyears and really how does it
feel like you?
Marianne (11:01):
Okay.
So I wanted something that Icould own forever and I learned
that there have been reallythree waves.
Of industry over the last coupleof centuries.
The first wave was theindustrial revolution where now
we have assembly lines andcompanies are being built
because we have a process.
Then we have the 1950s goldenboom of the corporation where
(11:21):
all of our high-rise buildingswere built and all of our
downtown cities and thecorporation.
Now we're seeing this thirdwave, which is the rise of the
personal brand.
Social media has really madethat possible for us because
anyone can do it.
There's no excuses.
Anymore.
You don't need a multimilliondollar high rise building.
Beverly (11:37):
Even if you wanna be a VP of marketing somewhere, or
you want to be a tech director,you need to have a personal
brand.
You need to build yourauthority.
Marianne (11:47):
Absolutely.
I went to an event with RyanPineda, who's a big guy in the
real estate space.
Huge event.
We're talking like 1200 peoplethere, and he said something so
well articulated, he said,nobody can do business with you
if they don't know who you are.
And there's a trust factor thatunfortunately does get abused.
There's no doubt about that.
But there's a trust factor whenit comes to working with people.
(12:09):
I think we miss as a society,which is why the rise of the
personal brand solves that.
Beverly (12:13):
Oh, and AI is only making that more apparent that
we need the human connection.
Marianne (12:17):
I'm not against ai.
It's really fun.
But don't lie to me.
Just don't tell me it's you.
Beverly (12:21):
Agreed.
You talked a little bit aboutwho your favorite people are.
Small business owners who arepretty established, they wanna
build more visibility andauthority?
Talk about who they are and thenwhat your process is, the
transformation that you offer.
Marianne (12:35):
Okay.
So this is perfect because I'llgive a prime example.
So my friend, she lives in Miamiand she has done astronomically
amazing things.
Her husband sold their companyfor a couple billion dollars,
i'm not exactly sure how longago it.
But she came from nothing.
And so when she was given theresponsibility and the blessing
of this affluence, she took itvery seriously.
(12:56):
She said, I've got to dosomething impactful.
So she started buying schools.
She bought an elementary school,gutted it, changed out the
staff, changed out theircurriculum and made it something
brand new.
And she's revolutionizingeducation for kids.
She gutted the entire lunchsystem.
They only feed lunch from a farmthat she now owns.
She now owns a regenerativehealth clinic down in Miami.
(13:19):
She's been targeted, especiallyin 2020, by news organizations
for her stance and for herbeliefs, which asked her to
speak last year at Turning PointUSA on her message,'cause it
dovetailed with their mission sostrongly, she called me, she
said I have this big speakingengagement.
I need your help.
We worked together I didn'twrite her speech for her, but I
gave her the framework of thespeech.
(13:40):
I have this formula for all ofthis, and I brought this to her
and said, our job is to fillthis in for you, put your ink on
this framework.
And as we worked together forthe course of six weeks, we
rehomed the speech, I deliveredit for her a lot.
She delivered it back.
And then she took the stage atT-P-U-S-A last year.
And just I watched her speechand my jaw hit the floor.
She did so well.
(14:00):
It was so amazing.
She moved the audience.
And the best part about the waywe construct speeches is to give
the audience somethingsubstantive that they can take.
It is a free resource that thenthis is the cool thing about
combining marketing with publicspeaking is when you do it
right, customers knock on yourdoor and they're like, I know
that you mentioned this, but canyou help me?
(14:20):
How much do you charge?
I need this problem solved somuch.
And then we, as entrepreneurs,we say, now hang on just a
second lemme make sure I canactually solve this for you
before we have a transactionhere.
You would be much more benefitedto whisper into the ears of your
audience members than you arescreaming on the house tops when
nobody can hear you.
That's the process.
Beverly (14:37):
I love it so much.
The idea of a framework.
Is there any particular tip youwanna give to our listeners
today of how they could getstarted in doing this within
your framework?
Marianne (14:47):
Oh, absolutely.
So I, like you said, get thereps in.
So what I tell people to do,when they're very first started
getting into the world of publicspeaking, it's simply
podcasting.
It's a digital stage, but it'sstill a stage.
And people are like, okay, howdo I get booked on more?
So I've aggregated a list ofover a thousand podcasts.
You can keyword search it bytopic.
And I just give that away.
And if you go to mariannehickman.com/guest, you get
(15:08):
access.
Find the shows that youraudience is listening to.
The last 50% is split into twocategories.
One of them is your niche notthat I'm talking about your
niche market.
I'm talking about yourinterests.
Chances are there's somecrossover there.
And then the other half of that50% is authority figures.
Get on shows with people who areauthorities in your space.
Beverly's an authority in myspace, so I'm stoked to share
(15:32):
what we're talking about herebecause she's talking marketing
and you have to have marketing.
I used to just.
Have such a wedgie when Ithought of the word marketing,
'cause I'm like, oh my gosh, Isuck at this.
But you know what it's nodifferent than a beautiful
presentation of your food at arestaurant or lovely wrapping
paper on a gift or picking thenice outfit that just makes you
(15:52):
feel like a million bucks whenyou walk out the house.
It's the thing that makes peoplelook at you and say, Ooh, that
was tasty.
What more do you have?
Beverly (15:59):
Yes, it should show up.
So I don't know if you can seein, but I actually have pink
hair.
I have a lot of things, likeeven my water bottle is sparkly.
I was in a lunch line at anetworking event with probably
about a thousand people andimmediately they knew it was me.
And that's what good brandingdoes, is helps people see you
exactly across the room.
That is how it's supposed to be.
(16:19):
It can be so powerful forrecognition and connection.
So this season's big question isall about activation.
I know that in a speech you'reactivating your brand and your
marketing at probably thehighest level.
So what is the biggest challengethat most of your clients face
to get that message and thatbrand to feel and look like you?
Marianne (16:42):
It first comes from a lack of clarity, like we talked
about before.
But the unfortunate part of thatis that when people aren't
clear, they tend to not doanything.
Beverly (16:51):
Okay.
So how do you monetize?
How do you monetize the speech?
Marianne (16:54):
Okay, so this is the symptom, and the reason that
this is so important is becausewe can will often get on stage
and altruistically want to give.
It's a great thing to want todo, but unless you're being
nourished, you'll burn out.
Unsustainably,
Beverly (17:08):
hello.
Raising my hand.
Marianne (17:09):
Right.
We give and we, which is a greatthing.
I'm not saying stop giving.
And if you lack any faith inthis, look at all of the people
who are, oh, what's a nice wayto put this riffraff in the
world who are not doing goodthings with plenty of money?
How much more than do youdeserve to be funded?
Okay, so let's just get thatmindset issue outta the way.
At first, you deserve to haveyour mission funded.
Okay, so let's talk about howit's done as a speaker.
(17:31):
There are two ways that you getpaid to do what you do.
Number one is through yourspeaker fee, and I'm telling you
right now, increase your speakerfee.
Number two, if your speaker feeis the only way that you're
getting paid, you are leaving60% of your revenue on the
table.
You're not able to take it home.
All right.
which brings me to the secondway to get paid to speak.
You speak, you take a check, andthen you leave and you're done.
(17:52):
However, that is not sustainablebecause you have to be working
in order to bring in therevenue.
If your speech has anything ofsubstance to it, then people are
going to want more of what yougave them already.
People are going to want more ofyou.
They're going to want more ofyour knowledge, they're going to
want more of your expertise.
They want more actionable steps.
(18:12):
Which then leads us to, you'renot just a speaker, you're in
some ways a trainer or a coachor a facilitator of some kind.
That's the difference betweenspeakers and facilitators.
You're making things easier forother people and that doesn't
end with the stage.
You have to have something,whether it's an ebook or a
database or a resource guide ora quiz, not just something
gimmicky, something that'sactually going to make lives
(18:33):
better.
I'm going to continue to give.
And we live in a beautiful daywhere you can continue to do
that digitally all day long.
You take this email list and yougive so much value and then you
ask.
But you don't ask for a take.
You ask for more ideas.
So I just did this week.
I said, I'm hosting a speakingcompetition.
If you were to come, what wouldyou expect to see there?
What would be really fun foryou?
(18:53):
And then you get the input andthey help you build it.
They help you build yourproduct.
And then you launch thatproduct.
And if you follow the formula,then you create a sustainable
income.
And if you do it right, you caneven put it on autopilot to
where now in your CRM, which youbetter have if you're in
business, if you don't have one,call me.
you create so much value thatthey are on the edge of your
(19:14):
seat for release day.
Imagine having customers.
That form lines around yourbusiness like they do around an
Apple building when a new phonecomes out.
They want it because it solvesreal problems for them.
Imagine having an opening launchday with a product and a digital
course, an evergreen productthat solved the problem so well
that you sold out.
That's what we're creating, notjust gimmicky courses that you
(19:37):
can get for a dime a dozen.
We're talking about real problemsolving, real testimonials, real
people knocking on your door andsaying, I dunno what I would've
done without you.
Beverly (19:45):
I often share with my clients that when you are on
social media, you are leasingyour space.
But when you own your list,that's the investment in your
you can message them anytime youwant.
There's no algorithm present forpreventing it.
that is the thing you want to beable to have at the end of the
day.
Yes.
So that when you launch or whenyou need feedback or when you
(20:06):
need the things, you have thislist.
So if you could put yourinformation into one bucket, one
strategy.
Email marketing is so much morepowerful and can be used from
the stage, can be used from apodcast, can be used for many
things to be able to grow andgive value all day long.
So if there's one thing that Iwould say to piggyback on what
(20:26):
you're saying is build youremail list.
Marianne (20:28):
Yes.
Yes.
You own it like you said it.
A lot of people will look atthat and say, oh, email is dead.
It's not.
It's so far from that.
And there are people that don'tcheck their email.
That's fine.
But your people do.
Beverly (20:38):
And if you are sharing a message that they want to
open, they'll actually look foryour emails.
They will wait.
For your emails.
Marianne (20:44):
No, I have a couple that I'm like, I'm not deleting
that.
I love it.
Beverly (20:47):
So there are people who do this really well, and you can
be one of those people for sure.
Absolutely.
100%.
But yeah, build your email list.
It is the one thing.
And even if you were to sellyour business, that's something
that has the value, especiallyif you're working from
virtually, you don't have anoffice, don't have inventory,
those kinds of things.
That is something that can be areally important part of your
business for sure.
(21:08):
Oh,
Marianne (21:08):
100%.
We.
Close the doors.
We still own the business.
And the thing that makes thisbusiness valuable is the email
list.
It's a 30,000 person email listthat we actually can right now,
even though the brick andmortars closed, we can continue
to nurture.
We can continue to providevalue.
And so when our doors open againon this side business that we
have there's a line around thebuilding.
(21:28):
Because we have created so muchvalue for the client base.
Beverly (21:31):
Yeah, I agree completely.
Okay.
This is the magic hat.
And there's tons of questions inhere, and I'm gonna let the
universe just decide what we'regonna talk about today.
How fun is that?
So it is rapid fire.
A little bit more fun.
How do you want your customersto feel after working with you?
Marianne (21:49):
How do I want my customers to feel?
I want them to feel like theyare the light bulb that turned
on.
I want them to feel like, notthat just they have the light
bulb, but that they're likeemitting it.
I want them to feel like theyare in their zone of genius,
that they are having fun doingwhat they're doing.
That they are just energized bybeing on stage.
(22:09):
I hope people are having fun.
Beverly (22:10):
I love that.
How do you keep yourentrepreneurial spirit alive?
What do you feed it?
Marianne (22:16):
Ooh, that is an interesting one.
All you gotta do is just go toIndeed and look for jobs and
then say nope.
Actually I really enjoy what I'mdoing.
Thanks.
Beverly (22:24):
No.
Absolutely.
I can't imagine If your brandhad a theme song, what would it
be and why?
Marianne (22:30):
The name of my company on paper is, this is me, LLC.
I'm a Greatest Showman superfan.
Beverly (22:34):
Exactly why we're BFFs,
Marianne (22:36):
right.
Bearded lady and all.
That is our theme song.
Beverly (22:40):
That's a great song.
I love it.
What's something in yourbusiness that brings you pure
joy?
Marianne (22:45):
Podcasting.
I get to meet the coolestpeople.
And you know what it does whenyou start a podcast for your
business, you get to have thebest excuse in the book.
To get someone's attention.
And I've had the most incrediblepeople on my show because of the
podcast.
Beverly (22:58):
Yes.
I would a hundred percent agree.
What's a common misconceptionabout your industry that you'd
love to debunk?
Marianne (23:05):
Okay, so this not only is it a common misconception,
but is the number one questionthat I get is, how do I get more
stages?
You are not going to be sittingin your house one day.
Have some recruiter knock onyour door and say, Hey, we wanna
pay you$10,000 to appear onstage.
It's not gonna happen.
This is what I tell people.
If you wanna speak more, quitwaiting for the TED stage.
(23:26):
Quit waiting for the 10 x stage.
Just quit waiting for that andgo out and produce your own
stuff.
Start your own podcast.
Get on as many podcasts as youcan simultaneously.
Use that resource if you need tostart your own event series.
So stop waiting for the stage.
Stop waiting for the recruiterto call you.
Beverly (23:43):
Oh my gosh.
It's like the build of the namewill come, no.
I used to think the work wouldspeak for itself, that I just
would keep my head down and dothe work.
And that would be it.
Marianne (23:53):
It's tempting to think that it really is, and you do
have to do the work,
Beverly (23:56):
You have to do the work, but you also have to show
up and be visible to have thoseopportunities.
Last question from the magicalhat.
What was the moment you realizedyour business was successful?
Marianne (24:07):
This came at the end of our first year as freedom
from W2.
And when the company startedtanking, I got cut.
And so I said, now it's time.
I can't go back to a W2.
I just have to make this happenon my own.
And my husband was, I love thisman.
He just said, game on.
Let's go.
And he had so much faith in meand I had so much faith in him,
and we built this together.
At the end of that first year,we were doing our profit and
(24:28):
loss sheet together.
And as we looked through thenumbers we're like, oh my gosh.
Our first year in business, whenwe closed six figures, I was
like, okay, let's go.
We know what doesn't work tosome degree, based on this first
year, we know what does, let'sfocus on what continues to work.
And we've just been doing thatever since.
And we just continue to do moreof what works and less what
doesn't.
Then that's how we'll spend therest of our days,
Beverly (24:47):
and that's how you should look at what is working,
do more of that, what's notworking, do less of that or
tweak it and see if it does workdifferently.
That's why analytics are soimportant.
'Cause you need to know if it'sworking or not.
I'm bringing out the wand.
I'm going to waive the wand andwe're going to go back let's
just go back to 12-year-oldMarianne who did her first
speech.
And give her a piece of advicethat you wish she knew then that
(25:09):
would help her throughout herlife.
Marianne (25:10):
I wish I had told her to keep speaking.
I wish she had.
I didn't think speaking could bea career.
When I was 12 and I did thatcompetition, I was like, that's
cool.
And then I went back right intothe school mill.
I went right back into the finda good career and, I remember
sitting in my Italian class as apregnant mother of soon to be
five kids studying the, becausethe GE or the class requirement
(25:31):
needed to be fulfilled somehow.
Everyone's 10 years younger thanme and way less pregnant than
me.
And I'm like, what am I doinghere?
If I had just pursued a speakingcareer at that point, whether
it's to lead a speaking chapter,whether it's to get into debate
in high school, I wish that Iwould have kept with it and
gotten a decade and a half aheadof where I am now and just kept
(25:54):
talking.
I wish I had done that.
Beverly (25:55):
What would she say to you of where you are now?
Marianne (25:58):
She would be like, wait, that's all you do in
addition to being a mom, whichis awesome.
I didn't think that what I saidmattered.
I didn't think that my voice hadany weight to it at all.
People listen to you.
Are you kidding me?
What happened?
That's what she would say.
She would be dumbfounded.
Beverly (26:12):
I love it when our younger selves are proud of
ourselves.
Like they're shocked at likewhere we've come.
Marianne (26:16):
We owe it to them where we are with the magic
wands.
We are the fairy godmothers.
Like you said, that the youngerversion of ourselves we're
counting on
Beverly (26:23):
Yes, absolutely.
And dreams can change and whatwe want can change, and my
dreams have shifted.
But it's interesting how thethings I believed in then still
matter now.
Those things haven't changed.
It's just how they come to benow is a little bit different.
Okay.
So I'm waving it again, andwe're gonna go far into the
future.
People are at your funeral andsomeone is giving your eulogy.
(26:45):
What are they gonna say aboutyou as a business person and how
you've affected the world?
Marianne (26:50):
this sounds, again, ordering on egotistical, and I
don't want that because I wantto be known for the good that
not just happened at my hands,but here's what I want at my
funeral, I want the people thatlistened to the speaker that I
trained to be there.
I don't need the credit.
My funeral can actually be verysmall, here's what I really hope
(27:12):
for is that as I'm looking downat the funeral, I'm somehow able
to see the, maybe they'll becomevisual'cause I'll have the right
celestial tools or something.
But the ripple effect, so thepeople that I trained to speak,
they're better off because I wasin their lives.
And then the people that theyspoke to, they're better off
because that speaker was intheir life.
(27:32):
And then the kids who went toschool with the kids of those
people didn't get bulliedbecause they became better
parents.
So I hope to look down andsomehow see.
The ripple effect or the goldenthreads that said, okay, this
person who will never know yourname this person was healed, or
this person became a betterteacher.
Yeah.
Because you taught the personthat taught them.
(27:53):
That's what I hope to see.
Beverly (27:55):
When I think of the ripple effect, it's not just the
business owners that I help, butit's their teams that now are
stronger and then they're ableto do more work in the
communities, which makes thecommunity stronger, which gives
opportunities to people whomaybe never had the opportunity.
I want that as well.
And you're right, I don't needthe credit.
Like I just want people to havethe magic and make the world
better.
Marianne (28:15):
what I stand before God accountable for.
Beverly (28:17):
Yes, absolutely.
I did what I did with my lifeand this life you gave me has to
have meaning and impact in thatway.
I take that responsibility veryseriously in my work.
So yes, I would absolutely 100%agree with you.
Okay.
The last question is, what doesbeing wickedly branded mean to
you?
(28:37):
How do you show up wickedlybranded and what advice would
you give to our listeners to bemore wickedly branded?
Marianne (28:43):
Be nice to the garbage man.
I worked at a big venue and Ihad events there.
It is as often as twice a monthsometimes.
And then once a month and thenwe did once a quarter.
I was there a lot.
I'll always remember Thomas, hewas the backstage guy who made
sure the trash cans were emptiedand he made sure the chairs were
set out and he made sure theparking lot cones were in the
(29:03):
right spot.
And Thomas, he had a beautifulvoice.
I caught him singing in theparking lot one day.
But you should know the name ofthe person that pours your
coffee.
You should know the name of theperson that takes out the trash.
And how you treat those peopleshould match how you treat your
dream celebrity.
That's just integrity.
Just, and that there's gonna bea chapter in a book I write
(29:24):
someday called Know their CoffeeOrder, know them that well.
There was a man who emptied thegarbage, and he was such a sweet
man and I always made it a pointto hold the door open while he
brought the trash can inside.
And it is reminiscent of Estherin the scriptures when she helps
the people who really need it.
Same with Mother Theresa.
She helps the people that reallyneed it.
She's kind to the people that weusually pass right over.
(29:46):
That's the thing is just beperson of integrity.
That is the same to the peoplewho empty your garbage as the
people whose hand you would bewishing to shake one day.
Beverly (29:54):
And that's the way your brand and marketing should feel
too.
Marianne (29:56):
Yeah.
Beverly (29:57):
That's exactly the way it should feel.
your story is so powerful to mebecause there was a gentleman in
my last job, who was animmigrant to this country who
took care of our trash for usand he would come in every day
and I was always working reallylate'cause I'm.
We do.
I have a problem.
I love my work.
That's the problem.
And he came in and the office isquiet.
He'd come in and I'm like, oh,hello Ola.
How are you today?
(30:17):
And he's I'm very fine Ms.
Beverly, how are you?
And he was so sweet.
And I would ask him his familyand ask him what he is up to.
And just, he was a person, andevery once in a while I'd come
in the next morning and he wouldhave a chocolate on my desk he
was so incredibly sweet.
And I just think that nobodyreally saw him.
These are people who are workingvery hard.
(30:37):
He took very great pride in hiswork too.
I do believe that there's somany people around you that has
a story that you should be andyou will learn something and
you'll gain something.
And like I said, like he leaveme a little chocolate or like a
little note saying good morningor something.
It was just so incredibly sweet.
And he was much older, probablylike older than my dad.
So he was much older and justincredibly sweet.
And you just never know whatyou're going to find if you ask
(31:00):
some questions and get to knowthem.
Marianne (31:02):
Yeah.
And you never know if they'regonna be nicer when they go
home.
Cause they met you
Beverly (31:05):
and they got appreciated at work.
Okay.
So Marianne, you talked a littlebit about 2026 has some pretty
cool things coming.
What is coming in 2026 thatyou're doing a little different,
that you're nervous, excitedabout?
Marianne (31:17):
Yeah, very nervous, excited about this.
Okay.
In this year, I do a lot ofgroup work right now and it is
so fulfilling.
The calls are so fun.
We create a lot oftransformation and I wanna do
bigger stuff.
So I'm morphing that group workand what we're gonna continue to
book people on podcasts likecrazy.
That is so fun to do.
We're gonna continue to teachpublic speaking, but I'm taking
it on from group and putting itin one-on-one because I find
(31:38):
that's most effective.
Okay.
And we're doing a bunch oftravel.
I've been to over 17 countries,physically in person.
I've got a list of podcastsdigitally.
And you know what I really wannado?
I wanna take a group of reallycool people and go do podcasting
in Iceland and go do podcastingin Costa Rica and record
episodes with this beautifulbackdrop.
Because I am such a betterperson when I travel and I
(32:00):
immerse myself in the culturesof strangers and other people, I
become more understanding.
I become more.
Curious.
So we're gonna take toursstarting next year.
We're gonna be taking more toursand we're gonna see more places.
We're gonna create stories worthtelling from the stage.
We're gonna createtransformation and we're gonna
do it with a group of peoplethat loves to tell travel
stories without soundingbraggadocio about it because it
(32:23):
is just it's so fun.
And you know what?
We're gonna be sending a lot oftime nurturing marriages as
well.
Especially for theentrepreneurs, and this is the
part of me that's nervous sizesbecause it, it is as is shift in
branding for me.
It is a shift in, in focus forme.
Those people that are runningbusinesses in a marriage face
challenges unlike any other.
Your marriage is the mostimportant relationship other
(32:45):
than your God.
And you know what it's like towant to report your husband to
hr, but he is HR and what it'slike to not see eye to eye on an
email that needs to go out andto have this three day long
argument where you give eachother the silent treatment
because someone ruffled theirfeathers the wrong way.
And we have got to get back toour marriages being the safe
haven.
Or everything that we arebuilding as speakers, as
(33:07):
entrepreneurs.
So some of our retreats we're ofcourse gonna talk about the
process of speaking, how to makemoney from stage and how to do
it sustainably, but built on afoundation where your marriage
is safe and.
And that's what we're gettinginto next year.
Beverly (33:18):
So exciting.
Thank you for sharing with ustoday to be the first to know.
Marianne (33:22):
Yeah.
I haven't shared it with anybodyyet.
Beverly (33:24):
Where can listeners connect with you and your work?
Where can they find you?
Marianne?
Marianne (33:27):
I'm most active on Instagram, but if you wanna just
text me and get real and have aconversation, just text me.
It's 8 0 1 5 0 9 5 4 9 5.
I just, I'd love to just chatwith people and connect with
them.
I'm all over.
If you wanna keep your distanceand still be a voyeur, just go
on social media.
Beverly (33:41):
Awesome.
I just really enjoyed our timetogether.
So for my listeners, I reallyhoped that you enjoyed this
incredible conversation withMarianne.
I just love her energy.
I love what she had to say.
I think really what we say allthe time from our perspective,
from Wickedly branded, you justreinforced everything Marianne,
so thank you.
But to the listeners, I reallyhope that this episode lit a
(34:02):
fire under you, gave you a lotof new ideas and most of all,
inspired you to take some.
Action.
Take a step to do something foryour business, whether it's to
get out there and be on morepodcast, to maybe go speak in
your local chamber, whatever itis, but to start doing those
reps to show up, because here isthe thing.
Your message matters, your workmatters, and the world needs to
(34:26):
hear what you have to say.
Marketing isn't just aboutvisibility.
It's also about that impact,those golden threads that
Marianne talked about.
It's about connecting with theright people in a way that feels
absolutely 100% true to you.
So show up or keep showing up.
Keep sharing your brilliance andkeep making magic in the world.
(34:46):
And hey, if you ever feel stuck,know that you don't have to do
it alone.
You've got Marianne to help you.
I'm here to help you.
We wanna turn your spark intothe wildfire it was meant to be.
But until next time, I dare youto be wickedly branded.
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