June 11, 2024 • 43 mins
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Ever wondered how the CEO of a major tech company balances the intense demands of running a business with the equally challenging task of parenting?
On this episode of MasterStroke with Monica and Sejal, they sit down with Nick Mehta CEO of Gainsight
to explore his heartfelt journey of navigating both worlds. Nick opens up about the stereotypes men face in parenting roles, sharing personal stories that shine a light on the importance of authenticity and humanity in leadership.
Nick’s authenticity and transparency shape not only his approach to leadership but also his parenting philosophy.
Georgianna Moreland - Creator, Executive Producer & Managing Editor;
Matt Stoker - Editor
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Monica Enand (00:02):
You are a man on our show and we are asking you
about the challenges ofparenting and that question and
being a CEO.
That question was usuallyreserved for women.
Nick Mehta (00:13):
Yeah, 100%, yeah, totally.
Georgianna Moreland (00:15):
Welcome to Masterstroke with Monica Enid
and Sejo Petrzak Conversationswith founders, ceos and
visionary leaders in tech andbeyond.
Monica Enand (00:30):
Well, welcome to Masterstroke with Sejal and
Monica, and today I am soexcited that we get to welcome a
very special guest.
Nick Methaf, who is the CEO ofGainsight, is joining us today,
and I've known Nick for a reallylong time, and I'm not just
known Nick, but I have admiredyou for all the time that I've
(00:52):
known you you know over a decadeat least, probably 15 years and
so I wanted to, I want to makesure that our audience really
gets a chance to get to knowNick in this episode.
We're also celebrating Father'sDay coming up, so we want to
talk with Nick about all kindsof things.
So welcome, nick.
Nick Mehta (01:11):
Thank you, monica.
Thank you, sejal.
It's an honor to be here.
I've admired both of you too,so right back at you and, yeah,
I saw some of the things we'regoing to talk about.
It's going to be fun.
Monica Enand (01:19):
I have to say that , nick, one of the things I most
admire about you is howhonestly and transparently
you've talked about kind of allthe challenges of life and being
a parent and being a human.
You know, I actually reallybelieve that everyone who knows
you has had the benefit ofknowing you and just the world,
even the people who don't knowyou personally are a little less
(01:43):
lonely because of you.
Oh, monica, thank you I reallydo believe that and you know,
I'm actually just thrilled thatwe can ask you.
You know you are a man on ourshow and we are asking you about
the challenges of parenting andthat question and being a CEO.
That question was usuallyreserved for women.
Nick Mehta (02:06):
Yeah, 100% yeah.
I'm glad you asked me yeah.
Monica Enand (02:09):
So I mean and I'm thrilled that you know you can
talk so openly about it but canyou talk a little bit about?
Do you think it's?
Do you just do that becauseyou're, that's just naturally
who you are and you'reauthentically who you are?
Do you do you ever think likeit's important to do that?
Nick Mehta (02:25):
The honest answer is it's the former.
I think there are benefits, I'msure, for other people, but
it's actually like the biggestbenefit is for me.
For me, I am the mostcomfortable when I am myself.
And it's interesting, like ourcompany mission statement,
purpose statement, gainsight isnot about customer success or
success, it's to be living proof.
(02:47):
You can win in business whilebeing human first, and the idea
of human first is all of us canbe human beings first.
We can think of our customersas human beings first.
Our teammates, our alumni,everyone, right Everyone, our
investors, even private equitypeople, are human beings.
I don't know if you guys figuredthat out.
It's a little.
You have to go deep.
No-transcript, it's.
(03:35):
It helps a lot, but also ithelps me.
You know that I can feel like Itruly am myself and that
there's not two versions of me,like the work version of me and
the non-work version of me, andI think that's one sad thing.
I think it's getting better inbusiness.
But there was this feeling likeyou got to be this professional
at work, right, and you got tonot be emotional and you can't,
(03:55):
you know you can't, you know,talk too much about things
outside of work.
And this is where, especiallypeople that had significant
commitments out of work reallysuffered, you know, and now it's
like.
No, you know, like I'm a human,that's it, you know, and that's
, and so I think that's makes mefeel better.
Sejal Pietrzak (04:11):
Well, it's interesting because work is so
much a part of life and life isso much a part of work.
It just becomes intertwinedwith who you are and what you do
, and then, and then you're evenmore successful.
Nick Mehta (04:23):
That's right, and you know it's funny, even the
term I'm big believer like I'mtrying to understand terminology
.
And so we say work life balancebut like, logically, work is
part of your life.
So it's actually a strange eventerm that people use, right,
and I never liked the balancepart either, because it implies
that they're at odds with eachother.
And so, you know, some peoplesay work life blend.
You know different ways ofsaying this, but to me it is a
(04:44):
bit of a it's unfortunate thatwe think of work as being
opposite of life right now.
I think part of that is somepeople really don't love their
job, and that's very sad, right,and they don't have the
autonomy, privilege, wealth tobe able to just go do something
else.
Some of them, that's just, theyhave to do it to make ends meet
, to do it to make ends meet.
Sejal Pietrzak (05:06):
How have you juggled the demands of being a
CEO and being, you know, thisgreat dad who fixes the Wi-Fi
every day?
Nick Mehta (05:13):
Yeah, I mean it's so interesting because, like, do
any of us ever feel like greatparents, like I mean I really
care about it so much, I put somuch work into it?
I don't feel great because,like there's always something
that's not perfect, you know,and also you wonder I was
talking to my brother about thistoo like it's also like not
(05:34):
even clear what the goal is,right.
So people in a very cliched waysay, I just want my kids to be
happy, but I'm like it's alittle more complicated than
that because, like, there isvalue in struggling right, and
they don't actually have as muchstruggle as our parents did,
right.
There's value in not beinghappy sometimes or being
frustrated or losing a game.
(05:55):
In some ways, sheltering themtoo much is not great.
But on the flip side you don'twant to scar them and make it so
that they can't move forward,and so I would say Stagel, one
of the things I wrestle with isliterally like what am I
optimizing for?
What am I trying for?
It's not like business.
I feel like one of the thingsthat's very interesting about
business probably why I love itis it's a game.
It's a game, there's ascoreboard, there's like EBITDA
(06:18):
revenue, whatever, and it's kindof like being it's not a game
with your kids, Right.
Sejal Pietrzak (06:23):
Such an interesting insight.
Oh my goodness, you're so right.
Nick Mehta (06:27):
So and it's like I love games because it's just
like and work, by the way, isless of a game than a sport Like
, I think, a coach of a sportsteam.
It's super interesting becauseit's a very well defined set of
rules.
If you're a football coach,your goal is to win the Super
Bowl.
That's it.
There's no other like ambiguityabout it.
And with parents it's socomplicated.
You know your kids like.
One thing that's so humbling isyou know your kids are all can
(06:51):
be so different, with similargenetics.
And like your first kid couldbe easy.
And then you're like, oh my God, we're crushing it as parents.
And then the next kid can bereally challenging.
And you're like wait, we're notperfect, Right, and so there's
a lot of humility.
I think that comes out of it.
But, tying back to youroriginal question, for me it's
just like.
It's just I care a lot about it.
(07:12):
Not that I care that I'm somewise sage on parenting and I'm
going to make my kids perfect.
It's truly that I just lovebeing a parent.
Like that's it.
It's funny, it's a lot likework, Like yeah, I don't know.
Okay, I'm a good CEO.
I guess I don't know Like, butI love my job.
I literally love it.
I'm weird, Like I'm.
I'm like I can't wait for mynext zoom call or my next
(07:33):
podcast or whatever.
And I love parenting.
I love like picking up mydaughter from theater yesterday
and like trying she's 15 and mykids and I'm trying to like pull
like a few words about her dayout.
You know what I mean.
Like that, it's like how wasyour day?
And it's like four words putthe headphones on, I'm like tell
me more, right?
(07:54):
And then like, funny way, rightthis morning I was, um, what
are you going to a meeting?
And I like saw my daughter walkyou out and you have a nanny
that's driving her daughter toschool.
And I was like, literally I likepull my car up next to my
daughter, like cranked up, likewhatever was on music it was BTS
and I just started dancing inthe car and my daughter's
probably like you're so cringe,dad, but also, like you can see,
(08:17):
that she loves it, and so Ithink for me, a big part of it
is purely passion and love.
That's it.
Like I can't say I'm great atit or I have all these skills or
tips, or I can write a book oranything.
None of that I can just say Ilove my kids so much.
Sejal Pietrzak (08:32):
Yeah, and then when they feel that
unconditional love that means somuch and that matters so much,
even if you talk about balancingthe time of being a CEO and
balancing the time with kids,but even if you give them, I
think, less time, when that timeis really quality time and they
really feel that sense ofengagement and love and fun with
(08:54):
you dancing, you know, to musicin your car.
I mean, that's what they'regoing to remember, it's not how
many hours.
Nick Mehta (09:00):
When we grew up, parents were way less involved,
like there was like the wholelike go play outside and see us,
see you for dinner.
They're not tracking you onlike a GPS phone app, right.
They're not always checking inon your homework every day Like
it wasn't this thing.
Your society wasn't ascompetitive with college either,
but it wasn't this thing oflike obsession, and so parents
(09:23):
actually spent less timeparenting back then than they do
now, which is reallyinteresting, right, because we
think, oh, everyone's so busynow and we don't parent enough.
Back then they spent way lesstime because they weren't just
like on their kids all the time,because they let their kids be
themselves, you know.
So that's another interestingthing.
I don't think it's ours Like.
For me, another thing is justlike literally it's a little
(09:45):
cliched, but being present.
So when I'm on the weekends, Ilike do this silly thing which
is I turn my email off on myphone, I delete my work apps.
I like like it's just like Idon't want any eruption because
I just want to enjoy being withthe kids.
I got my laptop if I need to dosomething, right, and so I
think there's some element ofpresence, and what things people
struggle with now is they'relike I want to spend enough
hours on this and this andworking kids, so I'm going to do
(10:07):
both things at the same timeand be with the kids.
I'm going to be doing like myphone, but I'm checking
Instagram.
I'm going to be at work doingthe kid stuff, and I think that
that's something that may makeus all feel very frenetic,
potentially.
Sejal Pietrzak (10:19):
So I agree completely with that.
You know, we talk about beingpresent uh often in our podcast
and and being present reallymakes a difference, um, and you
know time boxing it.
So if you're gonna have to beon your phone, go away for an
hour uh, get your thing done andthen come back, but be super
present, so that's and every nowand then if you do have to
multitask, it actually it's upfor me.
Nick Mehta (10:40):
sometimes I'm proud, like the other day I was like
on a work call, the likeTerminix or Orkin, like spray
person came in unexpectedly.
The dogs were going crazybecause of that.
I was then like trying to getthe kids dinner while I'm on the
work call.
You know it's like, andactually sometimes you're like
(11:01):
oh wow, I can do some stuff.
So that makes you proud too.
Sejal Pietrzak (11:06):
That's really good.
Nick Mehta (11:07):
I'm sure both of you had many experiences like that.
Sejal Pietrzak (11:09):
Especially working from home since COVID.
Now you know I mean it's sodifferent because you never have
to deal with, you know, peoplecoming to your house or dogs
barking or making dinner whenyou were sitting in an office,
right, totally.
Nick Mehta (11:24):
Exactly, we launched Gainsight in 2013,.
More than 10 years ago, whichis crazy.
And, monica, you grounded outeven longer than I have.
So 10 years, I mean, it's justnuts, right?
Yeah, just flies by.
Monica Enand (11:40):
That's amazing how quick it goes.
Sejal Pietrzak (11:43):
That's incredible.
So, nick, we know that.
You know you talk about 10years flying by and Gainsight,
you know, like many companies,has had chapters during your 10
years CEO over the last 10 years.
Talk a little bit about thosechapters.
You know all three of us havebeen CEOs under Vista Equity
(12:03):
Partners and that's how we atleast that's how I met you and
that's how I met Monica.
I know you two, nick and Monica, knew each other before as you
talked about.
But can you walk us throughsome of the chapters of
Gainsight and how you thoughtabout your priority as CEO in
each of those chapters?
Yeah, absolutely yeah.
It's interesting because we douse that term chapters at
Gainsight?
Nick Mehta (12:23):
I think absolutely.
Yeah, it's interesting becausewe do use that term chapters at
Gainsight.
I think we stole it.
I think ServiceNow does thisand probably a lot of companies,
because you know, if you run acompany for a while, you need to
help people understand.
Okay, there's a new phase ofthe company, right, every year
there's a new phase, but what weended up doing is about every
two years we had a new chapterand we actually called them.
Like you know, the company'scalled Gainsight, so we called
(12:43):
them G1, like Gainsight phaseone, g2, g3, g4.
And you know, start out, g1 wasall about actually a very
unusual thing, which is we werebuilding software for an
industry and kind of jobfunction that barely existed,
which is kind of a crazy idea.
Honestly, I don't know why wedid it.
In hindsight, I'm like that wasnuts when, early on in the
(13:05):
business in 2013, if you went onLinkedIn, there were probably
about a thousand people in theworld that had a customer
success manager title andprobably half of them worked at
Salesforce, who really was theone who came up with this
concept way back when.
And you think about it, youknow both.
You know total addressablemarket really well, right, you
know our software is a fewthousand dollars per person per
year.
The TAM for our business waslike a few million dollars
(13:27):
literally, which is not a goodidea.
But you know we said hey, overtime more and more businesses
are going to have theserecurring revenue business
models you know SaaS, but alsolike consumption, cloud, telco,
all these different recurringrevenue business models and they
can't run their business thesame way where they sell to a
customer and walk away.
They've got to have a way tomanage that customer post sale.
(13:47):
And so the first phase of thecompany G1, was about
evangelizing the concept ofcustomer success, not Gainsight,
but actually like the job, therole both of you built.
You know CS teams.
You know what I'm talking aboutand what the way that that
played out was.
All kinds of things Like, forexample, we wrote a book on
customer success which becamekind of like the authoritative
(14:07):
you know thing on CS.
It sold like 100,000 copies,which is insane.
Like it's a very nerdy littleniche, but within that niche a
lot of people read it and madeit like their starter class on
CS and then we actually ended upwriting four more books.
So we're kind of like a bookpublisher and with software on
the side, I mean it's crazy.
So we wrote these books.
We started a conference calledPulse, which wasn't about
(14:31):
Gainsight, was about theindustry of customer success,
and Monica knows it.
Monica Enand (14:36):
It's super fun.
It was a blast always, by theway.
Nick Mehta (14:38):
We appreciate it, yeah, and you and your team and
we it's, it's.
We tried to make it like theplace to go to get better at
customer success, either as aCSM or a leader, and that
started out in 2013.
Actually, the way it startedout was pretty interesting.
Where we, we were like, hey, weneed to get this new profession
going and we said, well, maybethese people want to meet each
other.
So we threw a happy hour in ouroffice.
(14:59):
It was not a good office and itwas above, and it was above a
bar, which was kind of cool, butit was just not a nice office,
right, and we threw this happyhour.
We said, hey, come to ouroffice.
And we went to Safeway, whichis a grocery store, if you don't
know, in the Bay Area, and webought, you know, cheese trays
and like really cheap wine andlike.
We sent an email and said, well, maybe 20 people come.
Like 100 people showed up andwe're like they didn't come for
(15:20):
the office because the officesucks.
They didn't come from like theSafeway, wine or cheese.
They came to meet each otherand we said, well, we should
make this a bigger thing, and sohence we created this
conference called Pulse and itstarted in 2013.
First year we had about 300people there.
Over the years, you know, nowmulti thousands of people.
This year it's in St Louis andwe do one in November in Europe
(15:41):
in Amsterdam, and then we doroadshows and so this thing
became a really big thing ofjust like thought leadership,
building community.
So that all started in kind oflike chapter one, if you will.
Chapter two was G2, was aboutus building the product to
really meet the needs not justof small companies, but also
made in big size companies.
(16:01):
And a little funny story therelike one of our first big
customers was IBM.
We also had a few others, likeWorkday and Okta and others, but
IBM was like the first reallybig company that was using
Gainsight and they came to Pulsein 2014.
Now you know, maybe 900 peopleat Pulse, but it felt really big
, like the event feels reallybig and IBM's at dinner, like
(16:21):
with us in, like a VIP dinner,and one of the executives says
so how big is Gainsight?
Are you like half a billion ofrevenue?
A billion of revenue, andliterally we were like 5 million
of AR.
And so it was funny because wehad to like fake until you make
it.
And we ended up getting veryfortunate.
Like IBM, a very small group byGainsight and you know, had to
(16:49):
like build the product out andit didn't work, and evolve it
and eventually they become amultimillion dollar client, and
so that second phase was reallymaking the product work for mid
to large size companies.
Third phase was then, you know,competitive market like
anything and really make sure weend up being the leader.
And obviously we have a lot ofrespect for the competitors in
our market.
There's always new ones,probably similar to both of your
businesses, right, there'salways new companies out there.
Back then there were like fournew crops all the time, but we
were very fortunate in thatthird phase to kind of pull away
(17:10):
from everyone.
We're, I don't know, eighttimes the size of the number two
player in our space now.
So that was like phase three.
Phase four was about startingto become multi-product and this
might be something other folksare going on this journey.
Right, we had one product, butour vision was always not just
about a customer success teamhow do we make a whole company
manage that customer journey ina proactive way and how make
(17:34):
everyone customer centric.
And so we got into like productanalytics and adoption.
We eventually, a few yearslater, got into customer
community software, customertraining last year and so very
similar.
You know, any company trying tobuild a portfolio.
And then phase five, where weall kind of reconnected we
called G5, was we were veryfortunate to partner with Vista.
Vista is a big private equityfirm.
(17:55):
They bought a majority stake inGainsight not all of it, but a
majority stake and the wholeidea was partner with them, get
a great win for everyoneinvolved to that point investors
, employees, etc.
But then do something much,much bigger and it's been
awesome.
We really enjoyed working withthem.
Obviously, like the SaaS worldhas changed so much, they did
the deal at the end of 2020.
Everything came roaring up andit was like we were like, oh my
(18:15):
gosh, we're going to have anexit in like two years, right,
and then everything camecrashing down in terms of
valuations.
But this has been an awesomepartner.
Sejal Pietrzak (18:23):
It's interesting because I think and Monica, you
were a founder as well, but itfeels like those chapters are
very similar to other companies'chapters, as you think about
the growth story.
Monica Enand (18:36):
Absolutely.
And you know it's so funny tohear you talk about the early
days and I know you kind of havewritten and been a thought
leader on category creation andI was thinking about all the
entrepreneurs that I've met withand they'll come to me with
this great idea and they're likewe have this, like we're
innovating a new product andwe're innovating in this new
(18:56):
market and we're going to likeinnovate in the org chart.
We're not going to have an orgchart and we're going to
innovate culturally and we'renot going to innovate.
And they've got like, and Ijust sit there and like get
hives and I'm like, okay, couldyou pick one thing not to
innovate on?
Could you please not, do notthrow everything out and start
(19:16):
and try to do everything byyourselves.
Nick Mehta (19:17):
It's so interesting you said that, monica, because,
like in the beginning, you know,I don't think we were that
extreme, but definitely likethat direction.
I remember we're like, oh, wedon't need performance reviews,
a lot of people have that wedon't need, we can just like, we
don't need to worry about, likecomp bans, compensation bans.
You know we're going to doeverything our own way.
And I remember reading itmight've been Paul Graham,
somebody like some you know wisetech person on Twitter.
(19:40):
They were like, you know, findthe one or two things that you
do uniquely and then doeverything else like the
standard way.
First of all, there's a reason.
It's the standard way and Ithink we're all realizing that
now we're like, yeah, I get whypeople do performance reviews
Right.
Some of these things were likesuspended because of the bubble.
And then second is like howmuch cognitive bandwidth you
have to like reinvent everything.
(20:01):
It sounds good, but actuallylike what if you just reinvented
your product and maybe your,whatever it is, whatever is
unique to your company orculture, but why not do some
other stuff just like thestandard way?
Like you don't need to reinventthe way you do like IT security
, but definitely don't reinventthat.
Don't, don't be creative there,just do whatever.
Don't reinvent legal, don'treinvent.
(20:22):
You know what I mean.
Like reinvent the things thattruly are unique about your
company.
Monica Enand (20:25):
Yeah, no, I think it's hard for entrepreneurs and
founders.
I think part of the reason forme, part of the reason I became
a founder and I think it's justpart of the personality type is
that you constantly see thingsand want to do them differently
and better.
And you want, look, it's noteasy to found a company and so
there's got to be some payoff init.
(20:47):
And the payoff has got to belike I get the autonomy to make
all these decisions and try allthese things and do all these
things.
And you know, you talked aboutthe different parts, phases and
the different partners, and Ihave to say, like, for me, as I
went through those chapters, Iappreciated the influence of
those different partners.
You know, because, like, forinstance, when I got to the
(21:08):
VISTA phase, you know, they cameand said, yeah, you need to
just do these basic things thatI wasn't doing, and I was like I
don't want to.
And then, you know, when I gotpast the initial reaction is I
don't want to.
And then, when I got past the Idon't want to, then I was like,
oh, maybe you guys have a point, maybe I should just do those
(21:32):
things.
Sejal Pietrzak (21:33):
Well, it's so interesting that so many of
those best practices are bestpractices for a reason right.
Nick Mehta (21:40):
I love it and it's interesting because one of the
since we all, you know, noteveryone watching is familiar
with Vista, but you know, one ofthe things they do really well
is try to help everyone getbetter, every portfolio company,
both through things they'velearned but also from meeting
great CEOs like you two.
And uh, one of the phrases Iheard them say, which I love, is
like we don't want learn it all, know it alls, we want learn it
(22:02):
alls.
Right, and I don't know if theytold you that expression, I
love that expression and um, andI think that that's kind of a
thing, that open-mindedness.
It's kind kind of weird becauseyou're right, monica, like one
of the like characteristics ofwanting to start a company is
like having your own vision andwanting to do it your own way,
and yet you also there's a lotof benefit to being open-minded,
(22:23):
to improving but not losingyour core Right, and so that
like finding out, like for me,one of the things that's been
interesting is where am I goingto be open-minded about stuff
and where I'm going to beopen-minded about stuff and
where I'm going to be like youknow what?
No, we're just going to do itthis way, not just with visti,
even with my team right, andover the years, I've kind of
gotten the point.
I'm like, yeah, these are thethings.
I just know, as a simpleexample is, I just know our
culture and it doesn't like, youknow, if, hey, no, we're not
(22:45):
going to fire that person thatway, that's just not going to
happen.
We're not going to fire thatperson that way, that's just not
going to happen.
We're not going to allow thatto.
No, we're not going to.
You know, actually very recently, literally last week, there's a
customer and they, they wanted,um, they, they basically paid
for one of our products.
They lose, we lose a lot ofmoney because of the way that
they're using.
And so, you know, we were liketrying to, you know, gracefully,
(23:08):
in're not going to do that,like we're not going to do the
thing that we wouldn't want todo.
One of our values is goldenrule treat people the way we
want to be treated.
And so we're like, yeah, we'lllose money for another month or
two while they, you know, givethem a migration path to move
off.
This is like our analyticsproduct, which their product
analytics takes a lot ofinfrastructure and it just
wasn't making money for usno-transcript.
Monica Enand (24:02):
You, I'm thinking about partnering with Vista, and
I think what I remember sayingto you at that time was like and
and I think this is good advicefor anybody who's thinking
about moving into a new chapterin a company or thinking if
that's what you're thinkingabout is think about like there
are certain things you're goingto have to let go of and there
are certain things that you gotto hold on to.
And being sort of articulate, Iremember saying like there are
(24:24):
certain things that you are justgoing to have to let go of and
do it their way, and then thereare certain things that you got
to know and you can't.
It can never be all or nothing.
Nick Mehta (24:35):
Well, it's interesting.
You said that because when Ipeople call me thank you first
of all for that, because thatgot me here and paying it
forward A lot of people call meand say, hey, I'm thinking about
partnering with Vista orwhoever private equity and one
of the things I tell them islike I think it's great, it's
really good.
It is like I think it's great,it's really good, it lets you
transform your company, allthese awesome things.
You just have to be likeopen-minded and transparent.
And if you're not open, ifyou're like a control freak who
(24:59):
doesn't want to share anyinformation and doesn't want
anyone giving you ideas, I justdon't think you're.
It doesn't even matter if it'sprivate equity or anything else.
Sejal Pietrzak (25:03):
You're not going to last as CEO talked a little
bit about advice that we wouldgive to CEOs who are going to
(25:25):
potentially partner withinvestors.
What would you say toexecutives who are, or even
folks who are looking to becomeexecutives?
If you could pick a couple ofthings that have really
resonated and worked well inyour experience for executives
to get promoted to be successful, what would you say?
(25:45):
I mean, it could be anything.
Nick Mehta (25:47):
Yeah, that's a really good question, and we're
trying to actually codify that alittle bit with like a
leadership expectations document, and that's something I think
is for me I wish we'd done itsooner where we have like this,
you know, basically like set ofprinciples and then we're
actually evaluating people onthem, cause I think it's a
little different than everyonein your company where you may
have your values in your company, you do like evaluation on
(26:08):
those.
This is like what do you expectfrom your leaders?
And I think one of the things Iwill say there's that like
famous expression I don't knowwhere it came from, but to those
who much is given, much isexpected, right.
And I'll say, like the hardestjob in Gainsight is gonna be the
leaders and, by the way, it'svery rewarding in many ways.
But I'm unapologetically ask alot from them.
(26:29):
And I think there are just someexamples that like or how I
think about it.
One that I think you all canimagine is really ownership,
right, like truly owningsomething and not saying like
you know, we all know thisexperience of like somebody
points a problem out but thendoesn't jump on and say how do
we help?
Right, and I'm like, yeah, likethat's cool.
(26:49):
I mean, if somebody just gaveme the list of all the problems
at Gainsight, it's like 10,000,right, it's overwhelming.
Now it's good to know thatthere's like a big problem, but
I love it when people are likehere's the problem and here's
what I'm going to go do to helpsolve that problem.
Right, and that's actually alot that jumps out to me.
(27:17):
A second thing that I've seen isbasically being able to be calm
through the ups and downs.
Right, and I think the problemis, you know, if you're like a
leader and you get stressed outor upset or whatever it like
wears on your team and almostbecomes like 10 X on your team,
like, if you're moderatelystressed, they become super
stressed, right.
And so I think the second thingis being able to be calm
(27:37):
through ups and downs.
How do you get to the pointwhere this emotional composure
because I know you all have thesame experience you know, when
you're running a company oryou're a leader, literally,
you're like one meeting is likesomebody leaving the company and
they're unhappy, and the nextmeeting is you're recruiting a
new candidate.
The next meeting is a customerthat's unhappy and churning, and
the next one is a new prospectand the next one's your investor
(27:57):
meeting, and you always have tojust like kind of like, put
your game face on and go to thatnext meeting and like, forget
about the last one for a secondRight, and I think that's
something I expect.
Another one that might beinteresting is I call it like
altitude, so being able to gofrom like 30,000 feet to three
feet.
So what do I mean by that?
Well, I need people, my leaders, to be able to go all the way
from, like what's the long-termstrategy?
(28:19):
Some people call it you know,you guys know the term value
creation plan.
Like how are we going to createvalue for all of our
stakeholders right Up there?
What's our vision?
All that Down to like what areour priorities to the year?
Think about the next one's like10,000 feet.
Down to.
What's the plan for this?
One priority down to likemaking the slides for a customer
meeting.
Right, and I think, by the way,like last night, I'm making
(28:41):
slides for a customer meeting.
We have 1100 people gain site.
Like all of us want to carry ourown weight and I think some
leaders are able to be down inthe details but not able to see
the bigger picture, the 30,000feet, and some are able to many
of the worst bosses that we'veever worked for work at 30,000
feet and then aren't able to godown to the details.
They're kind of like the personin the boat yelling row but not
(29:04):
carrying an oar themselves, andso I expect our leaders to do
all that.
And it's interesting because Ithink that's very hard.
I'm like, oh my gosh, I have somuch empathy.
I know this is really hard.
I know I'm like giving you tonsof feedback and all that.
And actually very recently wejust hired a president at
Gainsight who's amazing.
He works for me and he's likeNick, you got to be even more
direct.
So I've been working on that ofbeing even more candid with my
(29:27):
team, so they know what I expect.
Sejal Pietrzak (29:35):
We talked in a previous episode about how
important it is to come to yourleader with solutions, not just
sharing what the problem is, andthat's really valuable.
And then also, you know,staying calm under pressure.
I like the last notion as wellof being really direct, you know
, and being candid.
(29:56):
And for those getting thefeedback, I always love
transparency, I love candidfeedback, even in this podcast,
you know, I get very clear,candid feedback about things
that people love in the podcastand things they'd love to see
changed or more different typesof topics, et cetera.
Right, so it's great to bedirect.
Monica Enand (30:15):
It just saves time , it's efficient there is this
sort of like crazy, brillianthuman that we think about in the
entrepreneurial space or in thetech space, and I think, like
people are just smarter whenthey're calm, like we're all
smarter human beings, like ourbrains.
When we don't have cortisol or,you know, all of those
(30:36):
chemicals running around in ourbrains, our frontal lobes are
engaged, you know, and ouramygdala is not, you know,
hijacking our frontal lobe.
And I think we've talked a lotabout like, how do you manage
your kind of?
Because I'm not a calm person,like, by nature, I'm not a calm
person and so I my journeypersonally, has been a lot of
(30:57):
like figuring out what are theways in which I can calm myself
down so that I can be smarter,make better decisions,
communicate better.
But then, like you said, it'slike a wave, it amplifies the
effect on the people around youand I, you know I definitely
have learned that lesson thehard way.
Well, it's so interesting,Monica.
Nick Mehta (31:17):
You said that because I know you both have
probably done some of these too.
I feel like a huge thing as aCEO, founder, entrepreneur,
leader, it doesn't matter isunderstanding yourself and like
where, what inside you are yournatural energies.
But I think that the thing thatfor me has been great very tied
to what you just said, Monicais like there's things that I
naturally will do Like unabated.
(31:37):
You know, I will naturally besuper energetic, meet lots of
people, right, Get excited, bepassionate.
I won't naturally be supercandid with people, I won't
naturally go super deep onsomething, I won't naturally
really try to understand thefinancial model.
And then sometimes you know, asa CEO, you have to do
(31:58):
everything and so sometimes youhave to sort of be like, hey,
I'm going to force myself to dothis, Just like.
Sometimes, if you're notsomebody that works out and you
want to work out or eats healthy, you create these habits to
make you do the things you don'tnaturally do.
And it's actually when Iinterview candidates like, for
example, sales leadership, right, I always say okay, unabated.
Are you naturally going out tomeet a customer?
(32:19):
Are you naturally going in tospend time with the team on the
operations pipeline.
Whatever, there's no wronganswer.
Just tell me what you naturallydo, and does that align with
what I need for the job?
Monica Enand (32:38):
We are going to be celebrating Father's Day soon,
nick, and I'm very sorry to knowthat you lost your father
earlier this year.
Was this year right?
It was in 2023, but yeah, yeah,calendar year.
Oh, I'm very sorry to know thatyou lost your father earlier
this year.
It was this year, right.
Nick Mehta (32:49):
It was in 2023, but yeah.
Sejal Pietrzak (32:51):
Yeah, calendar year.
I'm so sorry.
Nick Mehta (32:53):
Oh, thanks, Sejal.
I appreciate it.
It happens to everyone,obviously, but it's still a
meaningful part of life.
Monica Enand (32:58):
Oh, absolutely, and we'd love to honor him by
spending a little time talkingabout him, and I think we know
that you've joked about.
Maybe your mom was more the oneputting the pressure on you the
Indian parents that putpressure on you Both of them,
both of them Different ways,yeah.
But we'd like to.
Obviously, your parents didsomething right, because you did
(33:18):
carve your own path and youtook risks and you felt the
freedom, like Sejal and I havetalked about, like the privilege
that we feel from our parentsand we we also did a mother's
day episode with our daughtersand they were able to talk about
, like um, the privilege thatthey've gotten from us.
But maybe you could spend alittle time talking about your
(33:40):
dad and, uh, what do you thinkhe did right and and that led
you to to being able to be thisunique person not just unique in
fashion, but unique in careerchoices.
Nick Mehta (33:55):
That probably definitely didn't come from my
parents.
So I think probably both of you, whenever I think about all
three of us, have been fortunateto have success and lots of
amazing things and but I'm likethe turning something into
something more versus turningnothing into something.
(34:16):
I think, like a lot ofimmigrants turn nothing into
something.
You know, my dad's like he, sohe's so our family's Gujarati,
which part of you guys know, butpart of India for folks
watching, and but he grew up ina city called Bangalore, which
is in South India, and he grewup, I mean, his family was
really poor, I'm not like on thestreets poor, but like you know
, kind of one click up such thathis parents couldn't afford to
(34:38):
raise him and the other kids.
And so his parents lived inMumbai and they had him go to
live with his grandmother inBangalore.
Tons of people in a very smallamount of space, right, because
lots of extended family.
He said he studied under astreet lamp.
I'm not exactly sure you neverknow with your parents, like how
much of it's like a little bitof a stretch or not, right?
So he said like the lightswould go out in the house.
(35:00):
He studied under a street lamp.
But you know it's crazy becauselike now, like America is so
diverse and embracing.
I know we can always do better,but like where we were it's not
even a like you can't evencompare it Right and you know
there was no ability to callhome back then.
(35:22):
It was.
I mean just you think about theimmigrant experience back then.
I mean it's just amazing.
Or even people before that, thebravery that they had, the grit
one he did two degrees, one waslike in idaho and one was in
montana.
Talk about like, like fish outof water.
I think that there weredefinitely more animals or like
elk than there were.
Indian people by like, by athousand fold or a million fold
(35:43):
probably, you know.
Eventually ended up at thiscompany, digital equipment,
which is like a hot company.
And my mom has this little likeyou.
You save the memorabilia.
She has this memo he typed upin 1975 that said, hit to his
boss we should start buildingcomputers for people at home.
(36:05):
I saw my brother last weekendand I feel like as we get older,
at least for me I don't knowabout y'all I almost feel like
it's like you're I'm constantly,constantly thinking about our
parents and like the mystery ofwhat their life was and then
what our life is because of them.
But my dad really wanted tolike have us no surprise, you
know, be successful.
And I think there's, you know,good and bad about that, the
(36:26):
kind of like, you know, theimmigrant experience in terms of
how they parent.
My fun fact when I was a littlekid, my mom put like an Albert
Einstein poster above my bed andthat like looked at me.
I love science actually, so itended up being cool.
And then, when years later,epilogue, when they sold their
house in Pittsburgh, they movedto California seven, eight years
(36:48):
ago, and my mom brought theAlbert Einstein poster to me and
it's actually right next to me.
You can't see it here Causeshe's like you can still be a
scientist even now, right?
And?
And then my dad was a businessperson but none of his stuff
would end up ever being big.
So I remember when I was alittle kid and I'm sitting in
the living room and my dad pullsout like Time Magazine which
you know, folks that don't know,is like an old big magazine and
(37:09):
it has like person of or noyoungest self-made billionaire,
bill Gates, and my dad's likeI'd love to have you do
something like this someday.
And I'm like, oh my God, fromthen on, albert Einstein, bill
Gates, I'm never going to besatisfied with my own career.
There's no doubt it's game over.
Yeah, so Wow, they did so muchfor us and they're just I can
(37:31):
tease them all that, but youknow they're caring.
I mean truly.
It was like the only thing thatmatters is their kids.
People see it as a cliche, butmy gosh, like they really didn't
do anything else.
Which is actually honestly oneof the shadows, which is when my
dad retired and you know wewere gone and you know he just
didn't have anything, whichactually he ended up.
You know not to bum everyoneout, but he ended up getting
dementia, which is really brutal, and I do think some of that is
(37:54):
like, as you think aboutpost-career, like having things
to occupy your mind, I think itactually does matter.
You never know what causes thatstuff, but there's definitely
research that shows that keepingan active mind matters.
Monica Enand (38:05):
So I've certainly learned that.
Does a podcast count?
A?
Nick Mehta (38:08):
podcast counts.
You are all sharp in yourbrains listening to this podcast
.
It's going to cure all yourdiseases for sure.
Angel and Monica promise, oryou get your money back.
Monica Enand (38:21):
It's important to be thoughtful post-parents,
because you know my kids andSejal's, you know at college,
our daughter's at college, andlike my kids are gone and it's
like, oh yeah, there's, it's,it's a, it's a hard thing, but
it's something you have toactually be thoughtful about.
Sejal Pietrzak (38:43):
Totally, you know, you think.
You said you think a lot aboutwhat your parents went through
and you know where you are today.
And there's the second step ofthat, which is then.
I also think so much aboutwhere our children are today and
you could compare it to twogenerations ago.
Night and day, right, right,not only in terms of the
(39:05):
technology and life andeverything else, but so much
even around the privilegecompared to studying under a
street lamp, and I meanliterally as you were talking
(39:33):
about that.
I got a little emotionalthinking about that because I've
, you know, whenever I've beento India, I see kids doing that
kind of thing at night and youthink about where those, how
much those kids are driven tosucceed in life and make things
better.
I remember my dad alwaystelling me that he left India to
come to America to have abetter life for his family.
This has been reallyinteresting, nick, as you think
(39:58):
about just being a parent.
What advice would you have forparents who are also, you know,
working leaders, executives,ceos?
Any last pieces of advice youwould give?
Nick Mehta (40:13):
Yeah, it's funny.
Like I said, I'm not a hugeadvice person because everyone's
on their own journey, but Iwill say for me, you know a few
things that have been reallyrewarding.
One is actually trying toengineer presence into my life.
So presence to me is like helpsme, kind of engineer presence
into my life.
So presence to me is like helpsme.
The second thing I think thathelps me a lot is just
(40:33):
remembering that they're goingto remember the love and passion
and that's.
And, by the way, like whatever,wherever they meet you, because
you know, if you have littlekids, you know your little kids
want to hang out with you andspend time with you and it's
amazing, amazing and so awesome.
Sometimes you might beoverwhelmed by it.
And then you know you get toyour parent, your kids are
teenagers and actually myteenagers have been amazing.
(40:54):
But, um, you know they get busyand sometimes they get a little
snarky, or sometimes they're,they're with their friends, and
then just realize, like you canbe, you can love them and just
love them and don't expectanything back, just love them,
right, right.
And then I think the third oneis for me you know people talk
about modeling, like what youknow, modeling in yourself what
(41:15):
you know you hope other peopledo, and so I show them, like,
how excited I am about things atwork or otherwise, and I think
they, they just see that theyabsorb that right, cause kids
are not actually just, it's notlike you're like kid, do this,
or here's the list of things Iwant to teach you.
They're just watching, right,we are too.
I was watching when I was a kidand it's not even they're
(41:35):
consciously watching,subconsciously.
So I think remember that, likeyou're modeling the future of
your kids for good and bad, bythe way, like there's probably
lots of things I do that arelike bad role models, right, but
I try to do some.
They're good and I thinkthey're watching, which is good,
it's so true.
Sejal Pietrzak (41:50):
I agree with all of those and I love this notion
that you say, which I've neverheard before which is everyone's
on their own journey, so it'snot really giving advice, but
I'll tell you what's worked forme and I think I'm going to
start following that.
I think true, and I neverthought about it that way.
That's good.
Thanks, nick.
Monica Enand (42:08):
Well, Nick, we wish you a very happy Father's
Day and to all the fathers whoare listening happy Father's Day
.
Happy Father's Day to myhusband and Sejal, I'm sure
Happy.
Sejal Pietrzak (42:21):
Father's Day.
My husband and my dad and myfather-in-law.
Yeah, happy Father's Day toeveryone and thanks so much,
nick.
Happy Father's Day to you andit was great having you on the
show.
Nick Mehta (42:30):
I loved it.
This is so fun.
You guys ask great questions.
I respect both of you so much.
Thank you.
Sejal Pietrzak (42:34):
And thank you to our executive producer,
Georgiana Moreland.
Georgianna Moreland (42:37):
Thank you for listening today.
We would love for you to followand subscribe.
Monica and Sejo would love tohear from you.
You can text us directly fromthe link in the show notes of
this episode.
You can also find us on theLinkedIn page at Masterstroke
Podcast with Monica Enid andSejo Petrzak.
Until next time.
You are a man on our show and we are asking you
about the challenges ofparenting and that question and
being a CEO.
That question was usuallyreserved for women.
Nick Mehta (00:13):
Yeah, 100%, yeah, totally.
Georgianna Moreland (00:15):
Welcome to Masterstroke with Monica Enid
and Sejo Petrzak Conversationswith founders, ceos and
visionary leaders in tech andbeyond.
Monica Enand (00:30):
Well, welcome to Masterstroke with Sejal and
Monica, and today I am soexcited that we get to welcome a
very special guest.
Nick Methaf, who is the CEO ofGainsight, is joining us today,
and I've known Nick for a reallylong time, and I'm not just
known Nick, but I have admiredyou for all the time that I've
(00:52):
known you you know over a decadeat least, probably 15 years and
so I wanted to, I want to makesure that our audience really
gets a chance to get to knowNick in this episode.
We're also celebrating Father'sDay coming up, so we want to
talk with Nick about all kindsof things.
So welcome, nick.
Nick Mehta (01:11):
Thank you, monica.
Thank you, sejal.
It's an honor to be here.
I've admired both of you too,so right back at you and, yeah,
I saw some of the things we'regoing to talk about.
It's going to be fun.
Monica Enand (01:19):
I have to say that , nick, one of the things I most
admire about you is howhonestly and transparently
you've talked about kind of allthe challenges of life and being
a parent and being a human.
You know, I actually reallybelieve that everyone who knows
you has had the benefit ofknowing you and just the world,
even the people who don't knowyou personally are a little less
(01:43):
lonely because of you.
Oh, monica, thank you I reallydo believe that and you know,
I'm actually just thrilled thatwe can ask you.
You know you are a man on ourshow and we are asking you about
the challenges of parenting andthat question and being a CEO.
That question was usuallyreserved for women.
Nick Mehta (02:06):
Yeah, 100% yeah.
I'm glad you asked me yeah.
Monica Enand (02:09):
So I mean and I'm thrilled that you know you can
talk so openly about it but canyou talk a little bit about?
Do you think it's?
Do you just do that becauseyou're, that's just naturally
who you are and you'reauthentically who you are?
Do you do you ever think likeit's important to do that?
Nick Mehta (02:25):
The honest answer is it's the former.
I think there are benefits, I'msure, for other people, but
it's actually like the biggestbenefit is for me.
For me, I am the mostcomfortable when I am myself.
And it's interesting, like ourcompany mission statement,
purpose statement, gainsight isnot about customer success or
success, it's to be living proof.
(02:47):
You can win in business whilebeing human first, and the idea
of human first is all of us canbe human beings first.
We can think of our customersas human beings first.
Our teammates, our alumni,everyone, right Everyone, our
investors, even private equitypeople, are human beings.
I don't know if you guys figuredthat out.
It's a little.
You have to go deep.
No-transcript, it's.
(03:35):
It helps a lot, but also ithelps me.
You know that I can feel like Itruly am myself and that
there's not two versions of me,like the work version of me and
the non-work version of me, andI think that's one sad thing.
I think it's getting better inbusiness.
But there was this feeling likeyou got to be this professional
at work, right, and you got tonot be emotional and you can't,
(03:55):
you know you can't, you know,talk too much about things
outside of work.
And this is where, especiallypeople that had significant
commitments out of work reallysuffered, you know, and now it's
like.
No, you know, like I'm a human,that's it, you know, and that's
, and so I think that's makes mefeel better.
Sejal Pietrzak (04:11):
Well, it's interesting because work is so
much a part of life and life isso much a part of work.
It just becomes intertwinedwith who you are and what you do
, and then, and then you're evenmore successful.
Nick Mehta (04:23):
That's right, and you know it's funny, even the
term I'm big believer like I'mtrying to understand terminology
.
And so we say work life balancebut like, logically, work is
part of your life.
So it's actually a strange eventerm that people use, right,
and I never liked the balancepart either, because it implies
that they're at odds with eachother.
And so, you know, some peoplesay work life blend.
You know different ways ofsaying this, but to me it is a
(04:44):
bit of a it's unfortunate thatwe think of work as being
opposite of life right now.
I think part of that is somepeople really don't love their
job, and that's very sad, right,and they don't have the
autonomy, privilege, wealth tobe able to just go do something
else.
Some of them, that's just, theyhave to do it to make ends meet
, to do it to make ends meet.
Sejal Pietrzak (05:06):
How have you juggled the demands of being a
CEO and being, you know, thisgreat dad who fixes the Wi-Fi
every day?
Nick Mehta (05:13):
Yeah, I mean it's so interesting because, like, do
any of us ever feel like greatparents, like I mean I really
care about it so much, I put somuch work into it?
I don't feel great because,like there's always something
that's not perfect, you know,and also you wonder I was
talking to my brother about thistoo like it's also like not
(05:34):
even clear what the goal is,right.
So people in a very cliched waysay, I just want my kids to be
happy, but I'm like it's alittle more complicated than
that because, like, there isvalue in struggling right, and
they don't actually have as muchstruggle as our parents did,
right.
There's value in not beinghappy sometimes or being
frustrated or losing a game.
(05:55):
In some ways, sheltering themtoo much is not great.
But on the flip side you don'twant to scar them and make it so
that they can't move forward,and so I would say Stagel, one
of the things I wrestle with isliterally like what am I
optimizing for?
What am I trying for?
It's not like business.
I feel like one of the thingsthat's very interesting about
business probably why I love itis it's a game.
It's a game, there's ascoreboard, there's like EBITDA
(06:18):
revenue, whatever, and it's kindof like being it's not a game
with your kids, Right.
Sejal Pietrzak (06:23):
Such an interesting insight.
Oh my goodness, you're so right.
Nick Mehta (06:27):
So and it's like I love games because it's just
like and work, by the way, isless of a game than a sport Like
, I think, a coach of a sportsteam.
It's super interesting becauseit's a very well defined set of
rules.
If you're a football coach,your goal is to win the Super
Bowl.
That's it.
There's no other like ambiguityabout it.
And with parents it's socomplicated.
You know your kids like.
One thing that's so humbling isyou know your kids are all can
(06:51):
be so different, with similargenetics.
And like your first kid couldbe easy.
And then you're like, oh my God, we're crushing it as parents.
And then the next kid can bereally challenging.
And you're like wait, we're notperfect, Right, and so there's
a lot of humility.
I think that comes out of it.
But, tying back to youroriginal question, for me it's
just like.
It's just I care a lot about it.
(07:12):
Not that I care that I'm somewise sage on parenting and I'm
going to make my kids perfect.
It's truly that I just lovebeing a parent.
Like that's it.
It's funny, it's a lot likework, Like yeah, I don't know.
Okay, I'm a good CEO.
I guess I don't know Like, butI love my job.
I literally love it.
I'm weird, Like I'm.
I'm like I can't wait for mynext zoom call or my next
(07:33):
podcast or whatever.
And I love parenting.
I love like picking up mydaughter from theater yesterday
and like trying she's 15 and mykids and I'm trying to like pull
like a few words about her dayout.
You know what I mean.
Like that, it's like how wasyour day?
And it's like four words putthe headphones on, I'm like tell
me more, right?
(07:54):
And then like, funny way, rightthis morning I was, um, what
are you going to a meeting?
And I like saw my daughter walkyou out and you have a nanny
that's driving her daughter toschool.
And I was like, literally I likepull my car up next to my
daughter, like cranked up, likewhatever was on music it was BTS
and I just started dancing inthe car and my daughter's
probably like you're so cringe,dad, but also, like you can see,
(08:17):
that she loves it, and so Ithink for me, a big part of it
is purely passion and love.
That's it.
Like I can't say I'm great atit or I have all these skills or
tips, or I can write a book oranything.
None of that I can just say Ilove my kids so much.
Sejal Pietrzak (08:32):
Yeah, and then when they feel that
unconditional love that means somuch and that matters so much,
even if you talk about balancingthe time of being a CEO and
balancing the time with kids,but even if you give them, I
think, less time, when that timeis really quality time and they
really feel that sense ofengagement and love and fun with
(08:54):
you dancing, you know, to musicin your car.
I mean, that's what they'regoing to remember, it's not how
many hours.
Nick Mehta (09:00):
When we grew up, parents were way less involved,
like there was like the wholelike go play outside and see us,
see you for dinner.
They're not tracking you onlike a GPS phone app, right.
They're not always checking inon your homework every day Like
it wasn't this thing.
Your society wasn't ascompetitive with college either,
but it wasn't this thing oflike obsession, and so parents
(09:23):
actually spent less timeparenting back then than they do
now, which is reallyinteresting, right, because we
think, oh, everyone's so busynow and we don't parent enough.
Back then they spent way lesstime because they weren't just
like on their kids all the time,because they let their kids be
themselves, you know.
So that's another interestingthing.
I don't think it's ours Like.
For me, another thing is justlike literally it's a little
(09:45):
cliched, but being present.
So when I'm on the weekends, Ilike do this silly thing which
is I turn my email off on myphone, I delete my work apps.
I like like it's just like Idon't want any eruption because
I just want to enjoy being withthe kids.
I got my laptop if I need to dosomething, right, and so I
think there's some element ofpresence, and what things people
struggle with now is they'relike I want to spend enough
hours on this and this andworking kids, so I'm going to do
(10:07):
both things at the same timeand be with the kids.
I'm going to be doing like myphone, but I'm checking
Instagram.
I'm going to be at work doingthe kid stuff, and I think that
that's something that may makeus all feel very frenetic,
potentially.
Sejal Pietrzak (10:19):
So I agree completely with that.
You know, we talk about beingpresent uh often in our podcast
and and being present reallymakes a difference, um, and you
know time boxing it.
So if you're gonna have to beon your phone, go away for an
hour uh, get your thing done andthen come back, but be super
present, so that's and every nowand then if you do have to
multitask, it actually it's upfor me.
Nick Mehta (10:40):
sometimes I'm proud, like the other day I was like
on a work call, the likeTerminix or Orkin, like spray
person came in unexpectedly.
The dogs were going crazybecause of that.
I was then like trying to getthe kids dinner while I'm on the
work call.
You know it's like, andactually sometimes you're like
(11:01):
oh wow, I can do some stuff.
So that makes you proud too.
Sejal Pietrzak (11:06):
That's really good.
Nick Mehta (11:07):
I'm sure both of you had many experiences like that.
Sejal Pietrzak (11:09):
Especially working from home since COVID.
Now you know I mean it's sodifferent because you never have
to deal with, you know, peoplecoming to your house or dogs
barking or making dinner whenyou were sitting in an office,
right, totally.
Nick Mehta (11:24):
Exactly, we launched Gainsight in 2013,.
More than 10 years ago, whichis crazy.
And, monica, you grounded outeven longer than I have.
So 10 years, I mean, it's justnuts, right?
Yeah, just flies by.
Monica Enand (11:40):
That's amazing how quick it goes.
Sejal Pietrzak (11:43):
That's incredible.
So, nick, we know that.
You know you talk about 10years flying by and Gainsight,
you know, like many companies,has had chapters during your 10
years CEO over the last 10 years.
Talk a little bit about thosechapters.
You know all three of us havebeen CEOs under Vista Equity
(12:03):
Partners and that's how we atleast that's how I met you and
that's how I met Monica.
I know you two, nick and Monica, knew each other before as you
talked about.
But can you walk us throughsome of the chapters of
Gainsight and how you thoughtabout your priority as CEO in
each of those chapters?
Yeah, absolutely yeah.
It's interesting because we douse that term chapters at
Gainsight?
Nick Mehta (12:23):
I think absolutely.
Yeah, it's interesting becausewe do use that term chapters at
Gainsight.
I think we stole it.
I think ServiceNow does thisand probably a lot of companies,
because you know, if you run acompany for a while, you need to
help people understand.
Okay, there's a new phase ofthe company, right, every year
there's a new phase, but what weended up doing is about every
two years we had a new chapterand we actually called them.
Like you know, the company'scalled Gainsight, so we called
(12:43):
them G1, like Gainsight phaseone, g2, g3, g4.
And you know, start out, g1 wasall about actually a very
unusual thing, which is we werebuilding software for an
industry and kind of jobfunction that barely existed,
which is kind of a crazy idea.
Honestly, I don't know why wedid it.
In hindsight, I'm like that wasnuts when, early on in the
(13:05):
business in 2013, if you went onLinkedIn, there were probably
about a thousand people in theworld that had a customer
success manager title andprobably half of them worked at
Salesforce, who really was theone who came up with this
concept way back when.
And you think about it, youknow both.
You know total addressablemarket really well, right, you
know our software is a fewthousand dollars per person per
year.
The TAM for our business waslike a few million dollars
(13:27):
literally, which is not a goodidea.
But you know we said hey, overtime more and more businesses
are going to have theserecurring revenue business
models you know SaaS, but alsolike consumption, cloud, telco,
all these different recurringrevenue business models and they
can't run their business thesame way where they sell to a
customer and walk away.
They've got to have a way tomanage that customer post sale.
(13:47):
And so the first phase of thecompany G1, was about
evangelizing the concept ofcustomer success, not Gainsight,
but actually like the job, therole both of you built.
You know CS teams.
You know what I'm talking aboutand what the way that that
played out was.
All kinds of things Like, forexample, we wrote a book on
customer success which becamekind of like the authoritative
(14:07):
you know thing on CS.
It sold like 100,000 copies,which is insane.
Like it's a very nerdy littleniche, but within that niche a
lot of people read it and madeit like their starter class on
CS and then we actually ended upwriting four more books.
So we're kind of like a bookpublisher and with software on
the side, I mean it's crazy.
So we wrote these books.
We started a conference calledPulse, which wasn't about
(14:31):
Gainsight, was about theindustry of customer success,
and Monica knows it.
Monica Enand (14:36):
It's super fun.
It was a blast always, by theway.
Nick Mehta (14:38):
We appreciate it, yeah, and you and your team and
we it's, it's.
We tried to make it like theplace to go to get better at
customer success, either as aCSM or a leader, and that
started out in 2013.
Actually, the way it startedout was pretty interesting.
Where we, we were like, hey, weneed to get this new profession
going and we said, well, maybethese people want to meet each
other.
So we threw a happy hour in ouroffice.
(14:59):
It was not a good office and itwas above, and it was above a
bar, which was kind of cool, butit was just not a nice office,
right, and we threw this happyhour.
We said, hey, come to ouroffice.
And we went to Safeway, whichis a grocery store, if you don't
know, in the Bay Area, and webought, you know, cheese trays
and like really cheap wine andlike.
We sent an email and said, well, maybe 20 people come.
Like 100 people showed up andwe're like they didn't come for
(15:20):
the office because the officesucks.
They didn't come from like theSafeway, wine or cheese.
They came to meet each otherand we said, well, we should
make this a bigger thing, and sohence we created this
conference called Pulse and itstarted in 2013.
First year we had about 300people there.
Over the years, you know, nowmulti thousands of people.
This year it's in St Louis andwe do one in November in Europe
(15:41):
in Amsterdam, and then we doroadshows and so this thing
became a really big thing ofjust like thought leadership,
building community.
So that all started in kind oflike chapter one, if you will.
Chapter two was G2, was aboutus building the product to
really meet the needs not justof small companies, but also
made in big size companies.
(16:01):
And a little funny story therelike one of our first big
customers was IBM.
We also had a few others, likeWorkday and Okta and others, but
IBM was like the first reallybig company that was using
Gainsight and they came to Pulsein 2014.
Now you know, maybe 900 peopleat Pulse, but it felt really big
, like the event feels reallybig and IBM's at dinner, like
(16:21):
with us in, like a VIP dinner,and one of the executives says
so how big is Gainsight?
Are you like half a billion ofrevenue?
A billion of revenue, andliterally we were like 5 million
of AR.
And so it was funny because wehad to like fake until you make
it.
And we ended up getting veryfortunate.
Like IBM, a very small group byGainsight and you know, had to
(16:49):
like build the product out andit didn't work, and evolve it
and eventually they become amultimillion dollar client, and
so that second phase was reallymaking the product work for mid
to large size companies.
Third phase was then, you know,competitive market like
anything and really make sure weend up being the leader.
And obviously we have a lot ofrespect for the competitors in
our market.
There's always new ones,probably similar to both of your
businesses, right, there'salways new companies out there.
Back then there were like fournew crops all the time, but we
were very fortunate in thatthird phase to kind of pull away
(17:10):
from everyone.
We're, I don't know, eighttimes the size of the number two
player in our space now.
So that was like phase three.
Phase four was about startingto become multi-product and this
might be something other folksare going on this journey.
Right, we had one product, butour vision was always not just
about a customer success teamhow do we make a whole company
manage that customer journey ina proactive way and how make
(17:34):
everyone customer centric.
And so we got into like productanalytics and adoption.
We eventually, a few yearslater, got into customer
community software, customertraining last year and so very
similar.
You know, any company trying tobuild a portfolio.
And then phase five, where weall kind of reconnected we
called G5, was we were veryfortunate to partner with Vista.
Vista is a big private equityfirm.
(17:55):
They bought a majority stake inGainsight not all of it, but a
majority stake and the wholeidea was partner with them, get
a great win for everyoneinvolved to that point investors
, employees, etc.
But then do something much,much bigger and it's been
awesome.
We really enjoyed working withthem.
Obviously, like the SaaS worldhas changed so much, they did
the deal at the end of 2020.
Everything came roaring up andit was like we were like, oh my
(18:15):
gosh, we're going to have anexit in like two years, right,
and then everything camecrashing down in terms of
valuations.
But this has been an awesomepartner.
Sejal Pietrzak (18:23):
It's interesting because I think and Monica, you
were a founder as well, but itfeels like those chapters are
very similar to other companies'chapters, as you think about
the growth story.
Monica Enand (18:36):
Absolutely.
And you know it's so funny tohear you talk about the early
days and I know you kind of havewritten and been a thought
leader on category creation andI was thinking about all the
entrepreneurs that I've met withand they'll come to me with
this great idea and they're likewe have this, like we're
innovating a new product andwe're innovating in this new
(18:56):
market and we're going to likeinnovate in the org chart.
We're not going to have an orgchart and we're going to
innovate culturally and we'renot going to innovate.
And they've got like, and Ijust sit there and like get
hives and I'm like, okay, couldyou pick one thing not to
innovate on?
Could you please not, do notthrow everything out and start
(19:16):
and try to do everything byyourselves.
Nick Mehta (19:17):
It's so interesting you said that, monica, because,
like in the beginning, you know,I don't think we were that
extreme, but definitely likethat direction.
I remember we're like, oh, wedon't need performance reviews,
a lot of people have that wedon't need, we can just like, we
don't need to worry about, likecomp bans, compensation bans.
You know we're going to doeverything our own way.
And I remember reading itmight've been Paul Graham,
somebody like some you know wisetech person on Twitter.
(19:40):
They were like, you know, findthe one or two things that you
do uniquely and then doeverything else like the
standard way.
First of all, there's a reason.
It's the standard way and Ithink we're all realizing that
now we're like, yeah, I get whypeople do performance reviews
Right.
Some of these things were likesuspended because of the bubble.
And then second is like howmuch cognitive bandwidth you
have to like reinvent everything.
(20:01):
It sounds good, but actuallylike what if you just reinvented
your product and maybe your,whatever it is, whatever is
unique to your company orculture, but why not do some
other stuff just like thestandard way?
Like you don't need to reinventthe way you do like IT security
, but definitely don't reinventthat.
Don't, don't be creative there,just do whatever.
Don't reinvent legal, don'treinvent.
(20:22):
You know what I mean.
Like reinvent the things thattruly are unique about your
company.
Monica Enand (20:25):
Yeah, no, I think it's hard for entrepreneurs and
founders.
I think part of the reason forme, part of the reason I became
a founder and I think it's justpart of the personality type is
that you constantly see thingsand want to do them differently
and better.
And you want, look, it's noteasy to found a company and so
there's got to be some payoff init.
(20:47):
And the payoff has got to belike I get the autonomy to make
all these decisions and try allthese things and do all these
things.
And you know, you talked aboutthe different parts, phases and
the different partners, and Ihave to say, like, for me, as I
went through those chapters, Iappreciated the influence of
those different partners.
You know, because, like, forinstance, when I got to the
(21:08):
VISTA phase, you know, they cameand said, yeah, you need to
just do these basic things thatI wasn't doing, and I was like I
don't want to.
And then, you know, when I gotpast the initial reaction is I
don't want to.
And then, when I got past the Idon't want to, then I was like,
oh, maybe you guys have a point, maybe I should just do those
(21:32):
things.
Sejal Pietrzak (21:33):
Well, it's so interesting that so many of
those best practices are bestpractices for a reason right.
Nick Mehta (21:40):
I love it and it's interesting because one of the
since we all, you know, noteveryone watching is familiar
with Vista, but you know, one ofthe things they do really well
is try to help everyone getbetter, every portfolio company,
both through things they'velearned but also from meeting
great CEOs like you two.
And uh, one of the phrases Iheard them say, which I love, is
like we don't want learn it all, know it alls, we want learn it
(22:02):
alls.
Right, and I don't know if theytold you that expression, I
love that expression and um, andI think that that's kind of a
thing, that open-mindedness.
It's kind kind of weird becauseyou're right, monica, like one
of the like characteristics ofwanting to start a company is
like having your own vision andwanting to do it your own way,
and yet you also there's a lotof benefit to being open-minded,
(22:23):
to improving but not losingyour core Right, and so that
like finding out, like for me,one of the things that's been
interesting is where am I goingto be open-minded about stuff
and where I'm going to beopen-minded about stuff and
where I'm going to be like youknow what?
No, we're just going to do itthis way, not just with visti,
even with my team right, andover the years, I've kind of
gotten the point.
I'm like, yeah, these are thethings.
I just know, as a simpleexample is, I just know our
culture and it doesn't like, youknow, if, hey, no, we're not
(22:45):
going to fire that person thatway, that's just not going to
happen.
We're not going to fire thatperson that way, that's just not
going to happen.
We're not going to allow thatto.
No, we're not going to.
You know, actually very recently, literally last week, there's a
customer and they, they wanted,um, they, they basically paid
for one of our products.
They lose, we lose a lot ofmoney because of the way that
they're using.
And so, you know, we were liketrying to, you know, gracefully,
(23:08):
in're not going to do that,like we're not going to do the
thing that we wouldn't want todo.
One of our values is goldenrule treat people the way we
want to be treated.
And so we're like, yeah, we'lllose money for another month or
two while they, you know, givethem a migration path to move
off.
This is like our analyticsproduct, which their product
analytics takes a lot ofinfrastructure and it just
wasn't making money for usno-transcript.
Monica Enand (24:02):
You, I'm thinking about partnering with Vista, and
I think what I remember sayingto you at that time was like and
and I think this is good advicefor anybody who's thinking
about moving into a new chapterin a company or thinking if
that's what you're thinkingabout is think about like there
are certain things you're goingto have to let go of and there
are certain things that you gotto hold on to.
And being sort of articulate, Iremember saying like there are
(24:24):
certain things that you are justgoing to have to let go of and
do it their way, and then thereare certain things that you got
to know and you can't.
It can never be all or nothing.
Nick Mehta (24:35):
Well, it's interesting.
You said that because when Ipeople call me thank you first
of all for that, because thatgot me here and paying it
forward A lot of people call meand say, hey, I'm thinking about
partnering with Vista orwhoever private equity and one
of the things I tell them islike I think it's great, it's
really good.
It is like I think it's great,it's really good, it lets you
transform your company, allthese awesome things.
You just have to be likeopen-minded and transparent.
And if you're not open, ifyou're like a control freak who
(24:59):
doesn't want to share anyinformation and doesn't want
anyone giving you ideas, I justdon't think you're.
It doesn't even matter if it'sprivate equity or anything else.
Sejal Pietrzak (25:03):
You're not going to last as CEO talked a little
bit about advice that we wouldgive to CEOs who are going to
(25:25):
potentially partner withinvestors.
What would you say toexecutives who are, or even
folks who are looking to becomeexecutives?
If you could pick a couple ofthings that have really
resonated and worked well inyour experience for executives
to get promoted to be successful, what would you say?
(25:45):
I mean, it could be anything.
Nick Mehta (25:47):
Yeah, that's a really good question, and we're
trying to actually codify that alittle bit with like a
leadership expectations document, and that's something I think
is for me I wish we'd done itsooner where we have like this,
you know, basically like set ofprinciples and then we're
actually evaluating people onthem, cause I think it's a
little different than everyonein your company where you may
have your values in your company, you do like evaluation on
(26:08):
those.
This is like what do you expectfrom your leaders?
And I think one of the things Iwill say there's that like
famous expression I don't knowwhere it came from, but to those
who much is given, much isexpected, right.
And I'll say, like the hardestjob in Gainsight is gonna be the
leaders and, by the way, it'svery rewarding in many ways.
But I'm unapologetically ask alot from them.
(26:29):
And I think there are just someexamples that like or how I
think about it.
One that I think you all canimagine is really ownership,
right, like truly owningsomething and not saying like
you know, we all know thisexperience of like somebody
points a problem out but thendoesn't jump on and say how do
we help?
Right, and I'm like, yeah, likethat's cool.
(26:49):
I mean, if somebody just gaveme the list of all the problems
at Gainsight, it's like 10,000,right, it's overwhelming.
Now it's good to know thatthere's like a big problem, but
I love it when people are likehere's the problem and here's
what I'm going to go do to helpsolve that problem.
Right, and that's actually alot that jumps out to me.
(27:17):
A second thing that I've seen isbasically being able to be calm
through the ups and downs.
Right, and I think the problemis, you know, if you're like a
leader and you get stressed outor upset or whatever it like
wears on your team and almostbecomes like 10 X on your team,
like, if you're moderatelystressed, they become super
stressed, right.
And so I think the second thingis being able to be calm
(27:37):
through ups and downs.
How do you get to the pointwhere this emotional composure
because I know you all have thesame experience you know, when
you're running a company oryou're a leader, literally,
you're like one meeting is likesomebody leaving the company and
they're unhappy, and the nextmeeting is you're recruiting a
new candidate.
The next meeting is a customerthat's unhappy and churning, and
the next one is a new prospectand the next one's your investor
(27:57):
meeting, and you always have tojust like kind of like, put
your game face on and go to thatnext meeting and like, forget
about the last one for a secondRight, and I think that's
something I expect.
Another one that might beinteresting is I call it like
altitude, so being able to gofrom like 30,000 feet to three
feet.
So what do I mean by that?
Well, I need people, my leaders, to be able to go all the way
from, like what's the long-termstrategy?
(28:19):
Some people call it you know,you guys know the term value
creation plan.
Like how are we going to createvalue for all of our
stakeholders right Up there?
What's our vision?
All that Down to like what areour priorities to the year?
Think about the next one's like10,000 feet.
Down to.
What's the plan for this?
One priority down to likemaking the slides for a customer
meeting.
Right, and I think, by the way,like last night, I'm making
(28:41):
slides for a customer meeting.
We have 1100 people gain site.
Like all of us want to carry ourown weight and I think some
leaders are able to be down inthe details but not able to see
the bigger picture, the 30,000feet, and some are able to many
of the worst bosses that we'veever worked for work at 30,000
feet and then aren't able to godown to the details.
They're kind of like the personin the boat yelling row but not
(29:04):
carrying an oar themselves, andso I expect our leaders to do
all that.
And it's interesting because Ithink that's very hard.
I'm like, oh my gosh, I have somuch empathy.
I know this is really hard.
I know I'm like giving you tonsof feedback and all that.
And actually very recently wejust hired a president at
Gainsight who's amazing.
He works for me and he's likeNick, you got to be even more
direct.
So I've been working on that ofbeing even more candid with my
(29:27):
team, so they know what I expect.
Sejal Pietrzak (29:35):
We talked in a previous episode about how
important it is to come to yourleader with solutions, not just
sharing what the problem is, andthat's really valuable.
And then also, you know,staying calm under pressure.
I like the last notion as wellof being really direct, you know
, and being candid.
(29:56):
And for those getting thefeedback, I always love
transparency, I love candidfeedback, even in this podcast,
you know, I get very clear,candid feedback about things
that people love in the podcastand things they'd love to see
changed or more different typesof topics, et cetera.
Right, so it's great to bedirect.
Monica Enand (30:15):
It just saves time , it's efficient there is this
sort of like crazy, brillianthuman that we think about in the
entrepreneurial space or in thetech space, and I think, like
people are just smarter whenthey're calm, like we're all
smarter human beings, like ourbrains.
When we don't have cortisol or,you know, all of those
(30:36):
chemicals running around in ourbrains, our frontal lobes are
engaged, you know, and ouramygdala is not, you know,
hijacking our frontal lobe.
And I think we've talked a lotabout like, how do you manage
your kind of?
Because I'm not a calm person,like, by nature, I'm not a calm
person and so I my journeypersonally, has been a lot of
(30:57):
like figuring out what are theways in which I can calm myself
down so that I can be smarter,make better decisions,
communicate better.
But then, like you said, it'slike a wave, it amplifies the
effect on the people around youand I, you know I definitely
have learned that lesson thehard way.
Well, it's so interesting,Monica.
Nick Mehta (31:17):
You said that because I know you both have
probably done some of these too.
I feel like a huge thing as aCEO, founder, entrepreneur,
leader, it doesn't matter isunderstanding yourself and like
where, what inside you are yournatural energies.
But I think that the thing thatfor me has been great very tied
to what you just said, Monicais like there's things that I
naturally will do Like unabated.
(31:37):
You know, I will naturally besuper energetic, meet lots of
people, right, Get excited, bepassionate.
I won't naturally be supercandid with people, I won't
naturally go super deep onsomething, I won't naturally
really try to understand thefinancial model.
And then sometimes you know, asa CEO, you have to do
(31:58):
everything and so sometimes youhave to sort of be like, hey,
I'm going to force myself to dothis, Just like.
Sometimes, if you're notsomebody that works out and you
want to work out or eats healthy, you create these habits to
make you do the things you don'tnaturally do.
And it's actually when Iinterview candidates like, for
example, sales leadership, right, I always say okay, unabated.
Are you naturally going out tomeet a customer?
(32:19):
Are you naturally going in tospend time with the team on the
operations pipeline.
Whatever, there's no wronganswer.
Just tell me what you naturallydo, and does that align with
what I need for the job?
Monica Enand (32:38):
We are going to be celebrating Father's Day soon,
nick, and I'm very sorry to knowthat you lost your father
earlier this year.
Was this year right?
It was in 2023, but yeah, yeah,calendar year.
Oh, I'm very sorry to know thatyou lost your father earlier
this year.
It was this year, right.
Nick Mehta (32:49):
It was in 2023, but yeah.
Sejal Pietrzak (32:51):
Yeah, calendar year.
I'm so sorry.
Nick Mehta (32:53):
Oh, thanks, Sejal.
I appreciate it.
It happens to everyone,obviously, but it's still a
meaningful part of life.
Monica Enand (32:58):
Oh, absolutely, and we'd love to honor him by
spending a little time talkingabout him, and I think we know
that you've joked about.
Maybe your mom was more the oneputting the pressure on you the
Indian parents that putpressure on you Both of them,
both of them Different ways,yeah.
But we'd like to.
Obviously, your parents didsomething right, because you did
(33:18):
carve your own path and youtook risks and you felt the
freedom, like Sejal and I havetalked about, like the privilege
that we feel from our parentsand we we also did a mother's
day episode with our daughtersand they were able to talk about
, like um, the privilege thatthey've gotten from us.
But maybe you could spend alittle time talking about your
(33:40):
dad and, uh, what do you thinkhe did right and and that led
you to to being able to be thisunique person not just unique in
fashion, but unique in careerchoices.
Nick Mehta (33:55):
That probably definitely didn't come from my
parents.
So I think probably both of you, whenever I think about all
three of us, have been fortunateto have success and lots of
amazing things and but I'm likethe turning something into
something more versus turningnothing into something.
(34:16):
I think, like a lot ofimmigrants turn nothing into
something.
You know, my dad's like he, sohe's so our family's Gujarati,
which part of you guys know, butpart of India for folks
watching, and but he grew up ina city called Bangalore, which
is in South India, and he grewup, I mean, his family was
really poor, I'm not like on thestreets poor, but like you know
, kind of one click up such thathis parents couldn't afford to
(34:38):
raise him and the other kids.
And so his parents lived inMumbai and they had him go to
live with his grandmother inBangalore.
Tons of people in a very smallamount of space, right, because
lots of extended family.
He said he studied under astreet lamp.
I'm not exactly sure you neverknow with your parents, like how
much of it's like a little bitof a stretch or not, right?
So he said like the lightswould go out in the house.
(35:00):
He studied under a street lamp.
But you know it's crazy becauselike now, like America is so
diverse and embracing.
I know we can always do better,but like where we were it's not
even a like you can't evencompare it Right and you know
there was no ability to callhome back then.
(35:22):
It was.
I mean just you think about theimmigrant experience back then.
I mean it's just amazing.
Or even people before that, thebravery that they had, the grit
one he did two degrees, one waslike in idaho and one was in
montana.
Talk about like, like fish outof water.
I think that there weredefinitely more animals or like
elk than there were.
Indian people by like, by athousand fold or a million fold
(35:43):
probably, you know.
Eventually ended up at thiscompany, digital equipment,
which is like a hot company.
And my mom has this little likeyou.
You save the memorabilia.
She has this memo he typed upin 1975 that said, hit to his
boss we should start buildingcomputers for people at home.
(36:05):
I saw my brother last weekendand I feel like as we get older,
at least for me I don't knowabout y'all I almost feel like
it's like you're I'm constantly,constantly thinking about our
parents and like the mystery ofwhat their life was and then
what our life is because of them.
But my dad really wanted tolike have us no surprise, you
know, be successful.
And I think there's, you know,good and bad about that, the
(36:26):
kind of like, you know, theimmigrant experience in terms of
how they parent.
My fun fact when I was a littlekid, my mom put like an Albert
Einstein poster above my bed andthat like looked at me.
I love science actually, so itended up being cool.
And then, when years later,epilogue, when they sold their
house in Pittsburgh, they movedto California seven, eight years
(36:48):
ago, and my mom brought theAlbert Einstein poster to me and
it's actually right next to me.
You can't see it here Causeshe's like you can still be a
scientist even now, right?
And?
And then my dad was a businessperson but none of his stuff
would end up ever being big.
So I remember when I was alittle kid and I'm sitting in
the living room and my dad pullsout like Time Magazine which
you know, folks that don't know,is like an old big magazine and
(37:09):
it has like person of or noyoungest self-made billionaire,
bill Gates, and my dad's likeI'd love to have you do
something like this someday.
And I'm like, oh my God, fromthen on, albert Einstein, bill
Gates, I'm never going to besatisfied with my own career.
There's no doubt it's game over.
Yeah, so Wow, they did so muchfor us and they're just I can
(37:31):
tease them all that, but youknow they're caring.
I mean truly.
It was like the only thing thatmatters is their kids.
People see it as a cliche, butmy gosh, like they really didn't
do anything else.
Which is actually honestly oneof the shadows, which is when my
dad retired and you know wewere gone and you know he just
didn't have anything, whichactually he ended up.
You know not to bum everyoneout, but he ended up getting
dementia, which is really brutal, and I do think some of that is
(37:54):
like, as you think aboutpost-career, like having things
to occupy your mind, I think itactually does matter.
You never know what causes thatstuff, but there's definitely
research that shows that keepingan active mind matters.
Monica Enand (38:05):
So I've certainly learned that.
Does a podcast count?
A?
Nick Mehta (38:08):
podcast counts.
You are all sharp in yourbrains listening to this podcast
.
It's going to cure all yourdiseases for sure.
Angel and Monica promise, oryou get your money back.
Monica Enand (38:21):
It's important to be thoughtful post-parents,
because you know my kids andSejal's, you know at college,
our daughter's at college, andlike my kids are gone and it's
like, oh yeah, there's, it's,it's a, it's a hard thing, but
it's something you have toactually be thoughtful about.
Sejal Pietrzak (38:43):
Totally, you know, you think.
You said you think a lot aboutwhat your parents went through
and you know where you are today.
And there's the second step ofthat, which is then.
I also think so much aboutwhere our children are today and
you could compare it to twogenerations ago.
Night and day, right, right,not only in terms of the
(39:05):
technology and life andeverything else, but so much
even around the privilegecompared to studying under a
street lamp, and I meanliterally as you were talking
(39:33):
about that.
I got a little emotionalthinking about that because I've
, you know, whenever I've beento India, I see kids doing that
kind of thing at night and youthink about where those, how
much those kids are driven tosucceed in life and make things
better.
I remember my dad alwaystelling me that he left India to
come to America to have abetter life for his family.
This has been reallyinteresting, nick, as you think
(39:58):
about just being a parent.
What advice would you have forparents who are also, you know,
working leaders, executives,ceos?
Any last pieces of advice youwould give?
Nick Mehta (40:13):
Yeah, it's funny.
Like I said, I'm not a hugeadvice person because everyone's
on their own journey, but Iwill say for me, you know a few
things that have been reallyrewarding.
One is actually trying toengineer presence into my life.
So presence to me is like helpsme, kind of engineer presence
into my life.
So presence to me is like helpsme.
The second thing I think thathelps me a lot is just
(40:33):
remembering that they're goingto remember the love and passion
and that's.
And, by the way, like whatever,wherever they meet you, because
you know, if you have littlekids, you know your little kids
want to hang out with you andspend time with you and it's
amazing, amazing and so awesome.
Sometimes you might beoverwhelmed by it.
And then you know you get toyour parent, your kids are
teenagers and actually myteenagers have been amazing.
(40:54):
But, um, you know they get busyand sometimes they get a little
snarky, or sometimes they're,they're with their friends, and
then just realize, like you canbe, you can love them and just
love them and don't expectanything back, just love them,
right, right.
And then I think the third oneis for me you know people talk
about modeling, like what youknow, modeling in yourself what
(41:15):
you know you hope other peopledo, and so I show them, like,
how excited I am about things atwork or otherwise, and I think
they, they just see that theyabsorb that right, cause kids
are not actually just, it's notlike you're like kid, do this,
or here's the list of things Iwant to teach you.
They're just watching, right,we are too.
I was watching when I was a kidand it's not even they're
(41:35):
consciously watching,subconsciously.
So I think remember that, likeyou're modeling the future of
your kids for good and bad, bythe way, like there's probably
lots of things I do that arelike bad role models, right, but
I try to do some.
They're good and I thinkthey're watching, which is good,
it's so true.
Sejal Pietrzak (41:50):
I agree with all of those and I love this notion
that you say, which I've neverheard before which is everyone's
on their own journey, so it'snot really giving advice, but
I'll tell you what's worked forme and I think I'm going to
start following that.
I think true, and I neverthought about it that way.
That's good.
Thanks, nick.
Monica Enand (42:08):
Well, Nick, we wish you a very happy Father's
Day and to all the fathers whoare listening happy Father's Day
.
Happy Father's Day to myhusband and Sejal, I'm sure
Happy.
Sejal Pietrzak (42:21):
Father's Day.
My husband and my dad and myfather-in-law.
Yeah, happy Father's Day toeveryone and thanks so much,
nick.
Happy Father's Day to you andit was great having you on the
show.
Nick Mehta (42:30):
I loved it.
This is so fun.
You guys ask great questions.
I respect both of you so much.
Thank you.
Sejal Pietrzak (42:34):
And thank you to our executive producer,
Georgiana Moreland.
Georgianna Moreland (42:37):
Thank you for listening today.
We would love for you to followand subscribe.
Monica and Sejo would love tohear from you.
You can text us directly fromthe link in the show notes of
this episode.
You can also find us on theLinkedIn page at Masterstroke
Podcast with Monica Enid andSejo Petrzak.
Until next time.
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