April 9, 2025 • 46 mins
What's up gremlyns,
The journey to authenticity often requires stepping out of not just one closet, but many. Master Cat Artemis, celebrated Leatherman with titles including Mister Sister Leather 2017, Miss Tuff Drag Diva 2018, Mister Alamo City Leather 2022-23, takes us through his remarkable life transformation from closeted military serviceman to proud community leader.
Cat's story begins in the shadow of the military's hostile policies toward LGBTQ+ individuals, where he witnessed firsthand how a moment of vulnerability during confession led to a fellow serviceman's discharge within 48 hours. These experiences forced him to maintain a heterosexual facade, complete with marriage and children, while his authentic self remained hidden beneath layers of societal expectations.
The heart of this episode revolves around a love story that transcends oceans. What began as a simple Facebook connection with a British man named Stuart evolved through Skype calls and emotional support during Cat's difficult divorce. Their relationship blossomed into a proposal at San Antonio's Tower of Americas—now "their tower"—visible from anywhere in the city as a constant reminder of their commitment.
Beyond personal narrative, Cat offers wisdom gained through decades of experience. His financial advice resonates with brutal honesty: monitor your finances, avoid excessive credit, and recognize that meaningful achievement requires investment—not just in monetary terms, but in relationships and personal growth. His perspective on masculinity challenges traditional leather community standards, suggesting protection rather than dominance as the true measure of strength.
Have you faced your own multiple closets? What financial wisdom would have helped your younger self? Join the conversation and follow the Mature Mischief Podcast for our follow-up "Freaky Friday" episode where Master Cat continues his fascinating story!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's up, grimmins?
Welcome back to another podcast.
My name is Jesse James.
I hope everyone is doing it anddoing it well.
You know the drill.
This is the Mature MischiefPodcast.
You know it's not the samewithout Didi Every time I do
this.
I know she's not here at themoment, y'all, but she will be
(00:20):
joining us here soon, shortly,on the next episode.
She is currently working rightnow.
If you can hear my voice rightnow, I'm just a little under the
weather with allergies that aregoing on right now.
I do have a special guest herewith me today.
He is going to be on here withus today, on Hump Day Wednesday,
which is going to be today.
His name is Cat Artemis.
(00:41):
He is one of my favoritefavorite longtime friends.
I got to know him through theyears at Kinky Carnival.
He is a master, so he does goby Master Cat Artemis.
He's a Mr Sister Leather of2017, mr Tough Drag Diva of 2018
, and Mr Alamo City Leather of2022 and 2023.
He's also a great, greatcomposer.
(01:03):
He's one of my favorites that Ilove to listen to anytime he's
on a computer.
He is actually here today.
He's finally come out of thewoodworks from his man cave and
from the cave, from the stoneages, just to be here today with
me today.
Master cat, how are you?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
doing.
I'm doing good and it lookslike the dogs are happy about it
.
Yeah, they are happy about itoh, they're all happy they're.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
They're just having a ball um on that.
Yeah, it was so.
Uh.
So, master cat, welcome to themature mischief podcast.
Uh, we've rebanded everythinghere because we, when you
started on here, it was theslice of life yes, and it was a
very kinky, outgoing, uh, veryoutspoken page.
(01:47):
Mature mischief is the same way.
We're just more of an adult,you know, trying to get through
life as as adults here on that,you know, that's not.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
So no, it's not and real quick.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
With that being said, I know it, you know it and the
whole world fucking knows it.
I am your host, jesse james,and master cat is going to be my
co-host today.
So quake with fair, yeah, soI'm actually really excited
about that.
Oh, normally I would have my uh, my, my best friend here with
us, uh, on this podcast heretoday, but I think there was a
(02:18):
mix up on our communicationsbecause she thought the podcast
was you were going to be here alot later and I told her no, it
was at three o'clock.
I could have sworn.
I told her at three, but thatwas a miscommunication on both
our hands.
She was like I should haveasked what time he was going to
come and whatnot and whatever.
I was like no, no, I know, Iknow, I know.
I'm sorry, bestie, I'm sorry,but anywho, tell me a little bit
(02:41):
about yourself as an adultliving in this world of today's
politics and how you're dealingwith and being with everything.
How have you lived life to your?
Speaker 2 (02:52):
fullest.
Just learning to be who I amgoing through and coming out of
so many damn closets that Ididn't realize how many closets
have you come out of, I don'tknow.
Let's see First of all comingout as being a gay man.
And then, when I did that and Ijoined, you know, the Bears
suddenly realized oh wait, aminute, he's kinky, he doesn't
(03:13):
just want to kiss, yeah.
And then and he wears leather.
So I had to come out of theleather closet and say I'm a
leatherman.
And then you know saying, ohyeah, by the way, I'm into BDSM.
And then finally telling peopleand posting it live as, by the
way, I am no longer a Catholicor a Christian, I am a witch,
yeah, and that one really rockedthe world.
(03:35):
So it's kind of interesting.
You know doing some of mymeditations and some of my.
I'm writing this journal thatkeeps going on forever and ever.
But there's a certain pointwhere I had to realize that
anybody before my divorce is notin my circles anymore.
It's like people.
After that, when I finallylanded at the annex one night as
(03:56):
a scared bear who is afraid toask for a second diet.
Coke has come all this way.
How old are you, mastercat?
Has come all this way?
How old are?
Speaker 1 (04:03):
you Master Cat.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Well, this life I am 61 right now, nice, I mean, of
course, I'm one of those.
Being a witch, I believe inmultiple lives.
So yeah, god knows, I've beencalled an ancient spirit before.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
That's why I said bring your cave from the Stone
Ages.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
I studied when we had it on Papyrus and we thought
that was the best thing ever.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
I had your first autograph and the handprint.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It's still on the cave, so I appreciate it I was
the one who did the originalcave drawings in france exactly,
we were the first ones to drawthe dick pics on the wall like
oh, we thought that was oh,that's five dicks.
I'm taking it once.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
So you've, you've, you've learned uh throughout.
When did you come out?
Uh, were you a late bloomer aswell?
Speaker 2 (04:54):
I ended up being a late bloomer because, with my
era, it was dangerous to be gayin the military right.
It was instant.
I mean we shouldn't do that.
This probably could be that, no,you're fine but it was instant
discharge, like within 48 hours.
I mean I literally watchedsomebody get thrown out in 48
hours.
That was actually a fellowchoir member when I was singing
(05:15):
in one of the chapel choirs.
Right literally, it's a sadstory.
It I might tell the story justbecause it's going to infuriate
some people and it's also beenleading towards my getting out
of the monotheistic religionsand getting into the
polytheistic things likeWiccanism is.
This young man was obviouslyflaming gay, but of course he
(05:36):
and I we all had to keep itunder wraps.
We kind of knew about eachother but we didn't say anything
.
But the organist who wascontracted had a husband, and
this is way back in the 80s wheneven that wasn't allowed and
you know, being a husband was anex, you know unofficial thing
back then.
Right, well, basically whathappened was the organist and
his boyfriend decided to makehim the throuple.
(05:57):
Hey, yeah, I can keep goingspeaking of throuples back there
.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
I know right, Our pups are amazing.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
And then what happened was you know, they
broke up with him.
And he got angry about it.
And he was so angry about itthat when it was time around the
Lenten season to go toconfession, he confessed to the
chaplain how angry he was aboutthings, and the chaplain,
instead of doing absolving andforgetting, basically said you
turn yourself into yourcommander, or I will in the
morning.
(06:28):
so oh wow so instead of being acatholic priest, he turned back
into a military officer anddecided I'm gonna bust this fag,
yeah, and so and I knew aboutthis because where I worked it
was basically the hr, thepersonnel building, it was back
then they called it theconsolidated base personnel
office and all the personnelthings for the, you know, the
(06:49):
military was there.
So I was kind of like like likehard, it was very hardcore.
And the point is is I had thejob of going around to all the
command sections to get thingssigned off like decorations and
performance and separationpackages, and there was his name
and I saw it and as I waswalking back in he's smoking a
cigarette outside back when wecould still smoke outside.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Right.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
And you know, he was just pretending like nothing was
happening.
And I confronted him and Iassuming his name was Jesse I
said, jesse, don't fuck with me,I already know what it is, I've
got your package right here.
Why?
Why the fuck did you even talkto a chaplain?
Yeah, you know, and that's whenI started to realize you have
to be very careful who you cameout to.
And it wasn't even in the 90swhen Don't Ask, don't Tell came
out.
It was actually Don't Ask,don't Tell, Don't Pursue,
(07:34):
because they used to witch huntpeople they thought were gay,
right, and so hiding all thattime and even, unfortunately, I
guess, getting married because Ithought I had to, because it
was just at a certain point, Ihad a certain rank, and why is
he still single?
Kind of the murmurs like that,you know what's he doing on the
weekends, kind of things likethat.
So you know.
(07:59):
So ultimately, after 21 years,I got divorced Because I got
found out when I went to college.
Everybody knew and I would gointo clubs and people knew.
But I would always have todrive home and realize I had to
put this costume back on of thestraight man and all that kind
of stuff.
And then, when it finally blewup, she found a book hiding
under the.
We lived in Squalor back then.
(08:19):
She didn't know how to keep ahouse clean and it was always a
mess, and she finally found thisbook, written by bill brent,
called the ultimate guide toanal sex for men.
Now, how do you explain as a no, as a church organist, church
pianist, choir leader, uh, allthat other stuff.
And you know, got raising threechildren, straight man,
(08:42):
supposedly, right supposedly,and music minister, and all this
other stuff.
How do you explain having thisbook?
It's like, what am I going todo?
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Am I going to continue to license it?
I borrowed it from a friend.
Well, why would I want to knowabout this stuff?
I'm not going to be, you knowso.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
I was trying to do it on you, baby, oh God no.
Oh dear.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
God no it was.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
It was like a rough time period for you and
everything.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
What was?
Speaker 1 (09:07):
what is it like?
Because I know that, uh, somefan was asking me.
It's just like your time periodand being at the age of you are
what was finances like for youback in the day?
Like how did you handle yourfinances back then?
Or how, how has everythingshifted from then to now?
Oh dear god.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
Back then.
Of course, being active duty,the budget is very, very tight.
Right, raising three kids washard Cause you're you're retired
military.
I'm retired military andretired teacher, so I've got two
pensions coming in.
I've asked my house for nearlyfive decades, so it's time to
enjoy my garden and things likethat.
But it was.
(09:45):
It was hard because we neverseemed to have enough to make
ends meet.
She didn't really have a jobthat paid, she did minimum wage
and she broke her back doingstuff.
So it's, you know, it was.
It was tough.
I was very fortunate that goingto college was because I was
labeled a disabled vet at thetime and so I was allowed to go
(10:08):
to UTSA and get my music degree.
Otherwise that would have beena fortune to pay for.
Right Because even right down.
You're right down the streetfrom UTSA, Right, it is not
cheap to go there.
It's not, no, no, it's not.
And not for something speciallike a music program, because
(10:31):
there's always there's actuallyextra costs, Like you have to
pay extra for your music and youhave to buy all these other
things, and it was always kindof hard to tell.
You know something like theveterans administration that
buying sheet music was mytextbook.
Every semester my professor hadto send a letter to say this is
his textbook for this course.
You need to pay for this orreimburse him.
It was a mess, but whathappened was I finally graduated
and I got a job as a teacherand comparatively to what I was
(10:52):
getting before, that was alittle bit more, so we lived a
little more comfortable, butthen it got me.
Well, if we've got more now, wecan spend more.
Let's buy more religiousgoodies for the house and all
that stuff.
So it ultimately got to thepoint that when I divorced then
it really got bad because I tookon most of the debts, Right,
Just to get rid of her.
Oh shit, yeah, Just to get ridof her.
It was my husband you, you knowStuart really well was really
(11:16):
pissed about the agreement Imade.
The courts found that I was theprimary custodian of the of the
children and I waived childsupport because I knew she
couldn't afford it, right, and Ieven, even though it wasn't
required in our state, I offeredher spousal support for three
years, right, and you know, sixhundred dollars a month for
three years, that's a lot, thatis a lot of money.
(11:37):
That's like twenty fourthousand dollars roughly,
roughly yeah and so you know hewas pissed.
When I did this is, look, Igotta get rid of him and got rid
of her, not her.
This was her back then.
I finally have the right gendernow, uh so, but it was.
It was rough even then, and so,finally, when the last payment
was done with spousal supports,things got a little bit better,
but it wasn't until wedownscaled from the house that
(12:00):
we're in and got into the housewe live in now, right, right,
and we'll have y'all's house.
By the way, my house isbeautiful it is beautiful the
garden.
The garden is getting basicallymanicured right now and the pool
is almost ready to get in whenit gets to 90 degrees, again
we're we're getting in it, soyou need to come down and get it
.
Yeah, um, my, our, our,leatherman, they're waiting for
(12:22):
me to announce the pool partyit's like, yeah, like 50
leatherman and little jockstraps and uh and speedos
sitting in my pool, the life, ohmy god, it's so beautiful, I
live vicariously through you, sobut uh, come to the party.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Well, you know my schedule, my schedule is always
so busy, but um, I it's um, it'sone of those things, because
I'm I see myself and I've alwaysbeen curious about I.
We're a big gap in age betweenyou and I, though, but we
understand each other thoroughlyas adults, right?
So we go and we're like, ohshit, how do we manage and
everything.
What was it like finding Stuartfor you and your love life and
(12:59):
your companionship?
Because we've talked about lovedown here, we talked about sex,
we've talked about hate, wetalked about backstabbing.
My thing is, what was thechemistry between you two?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
That is quite the story.
Yeah, in fact, we're actuallycoming up on an anniversary,
real soon.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Oh, how long have you been together really quickly
before you start your story.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
We finally started meeting each other, believe it
or not, on Facebook Really OnFacebook, because you've got to
remember, go back in thetimeline, those of us who
remember way back in the 2010s.
Right, I started Facebook in2009, got divorced at the end of
2000.
But at the beginning of 2010,this was when we liked to
collect a lot of friends,especially if they were cute and
hot.
(13:38):
Right, and there was this oneguy that was this really hot
cowboy picture he had with ashirtless cowboy and he had,
like you know, the 3 000 friendson it, and when he would post
something, 350 people wouldwould add on to the thread and
not normally saying anythingother than to say, oh, you're so
hot, you know, or answer hisquestion, right, um, he was an
(14:00):
interesting person because hewas also a professor of music at
another university, and so whenI wrote him to say all the
stuff I didn't write aboutperson because he was also a
professor of music at anotheruniversity, and so when I wrote
him to say all the stuff Ididn't write about, how hot he
was, I talked about how I likecertain theory and how I like
this kind of stuff, and hestarted writing back to me about
this.
He says you're one of the fewpeople that are talking to me
and not treating me like a sexobject.
You're treating me about,unable to talk my language of
music, and so we started that.
(14:22):
But anyway, stuart, language ofmusic, right, and he said so we
started that.
But anyway, stewart was also afriend of his because, again, we
all subscribe to people who arehot and look good, right, and
he has normal he's.
We still do that now.
I don't think it's changed in2025 either, but, uh, 15 million
years later, we're still doingsome things the same yeah, right
the thing about it is stewartput something down there that
(14:43):
was obviously a Britishcolloquial and I remember from
living in the UK for four yearsin the military that the dog's
bollocks was definitely not anAmerican term, that's a British
term.
The dog's bollocks, itbasically means it's really,
really good.
And so I decided I'd click onhis profile and, sure enough,
yep, he lives in the UK.
He lived in this uh town calledmilton keynes.
(15:05):
I knew where that was.
It was kind of near cambridgeand all that stuff.
I had been through it likemaybe once, right.
Um, so it's okay, I kind ofknow where he was from and I
went through all his picturesand he was really kind of cute.
So I kept looking at morepictures, because that's what we
do when we see people'sprofiles.
We still do that now I do.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
We stalk I do, I still look at stuff on FetLife
especially.
Oh God, good old FetLife.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, fetlife, cause they're there.
If you are not, by the way, Iam a Leatherman and I am a
kinkster.
If you are not in FetLife yet,you really should get there,
especially if you live a life ofleather, because kink kind of
goes along with it for the.
But you really should, becauseFetleaf's got a whole bunch of
stuff on it.
They really do.
They really do, oh my God.
But anyway, back to Facebookwhere you have to kind of police
(15:48):
what you're doing.
He only had one video and thenhe was basically on there and I
heard that little accent and itwas like he was basically saying
you know, sorry guys, I looklike shit, but this is my chance
to try to make a video video,because he was trying to figure
out his equipment and itrecorded and it got up there to
facebook.
And so I finally wrote him backafter I saw all the pictures
(16:08):
and stuff and I said I beg yourpardon to differ, but I don't
think you're.
You look like shit, you'reactually kind of cute.
And that's when it started.
And then facebook messengerback and forth for a while, and
then stewart said this thing onetime have you ever heard of a
thing called Skype?
Speaker 1 (16:27):
And.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Skype was the biggest latest thing.
That's where you could callpeople and not have to pay if it
was computer to computer Right.
It was just starting in late2009, early 2010.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
Oh God, Skype was so amazing back in the day.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
Oh, it was.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I remember being a young person, being on skype and
doing things that I shouldn'thave been doing, but don't we
all so?
You know, that's a differentstory so fine.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
You know, at one point I was afraid to get it.
I said this is something elsegoing on.
And my uh, my co-worker, whowas a theater teacher where I
was at I was teaching choir andorchestra and she said, oh no,
skype's kind of fun.
They just won't let us do it atschool because it's a push me,
pull you kind of thing and youcan't control what the content
is on the other end.
(17:13):
So you can't control the content.
So I finally got Skype and Iwrote Stuart and I says here's
my login and we finally, on the28th of April 2010, we made our
very first Skype connection.
And here he comes up on thescreen and he's got the British
(17:34):
accent.
He looks at me and goes, ohhello.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
And I mean that he has such a beautiful British
accent.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Oh, he's got a beautiful accent.
I'm just like, oh God, and hehasn't lost it yet either.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
No, he hasn't.
And he's such a good lookingguy too now, even in his age,
it's just like man.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
He looks like a sexy granddad.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Y'all too, Like the whole beard, everything.
I've seen some older picturesof you where it was just like
trimmed back and everything andit's like that's not cat.
I'm like no way.
And then you have your beard.
I'm just like man, the full ZZTop beard, the vols easy top
beard and everything on that.
So when did it become anofficial meetup?
When was that and how did y'allplan?
Speaker 2 (18:13):
that because it's different.
Now all the skype calls backand forth with like two school
boys laughing about stuff andsharing me sharing american
comedians and him sharingbritish humor, because I love
british humor I love britishhumor because the first thing I
said to him after he said thatoh hello was hi, I was hi, I
like Monty Python, and he rolledhis eyes.
(18:33):
He almost wanted to end theconversation there but he
decided, no, this cuteAmerican's talking to me and
it's like.
So we started the conversationand we were going back and forth
and then when shit happened andthe book got found and the
divorce was starting, he was thebest friend in my ear keeping
me from doing something rashduring a divorce.
(18:54):
And somewhere in the middle ofthe summer, of all that going on
, while the cooling off, whilethe waiting period was going on
and the bantering was going backand forth between me and my now
ex-wife, he went to Egypt andhe spent, you know, down there
internet is not readilyavailable like here, so he was
spending like 35 bucks a day toget the internet access and he
(19:15):
would skype me from from egypt,and now we're eight hours apart,
right?
so, uh, he would get up in themiddle of the night to talk to
me as I was getting ready to goto bed, and then, finally, the L
word came out love.
And that's what happened.
We realized when this is allover with, I'm going to ask you
for your hand.
And so we started all that.
(19:37):
He was again.
He was basically my best friend, listening in, because
sometimes I would have anearpiece in my ear because my
computer was open and the screenwas minimized.
But he's watching her rant andscream at me and all that stuff.
He's in my ear saying keep calm, don't react.
That's what she wants you to do.
She wants you to do somethinglike hit her or something like
that.
Right, and she's got somethingyou know.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
So I stay quiet and just let the process work, which
is really hard for most men todo, right, and so because we
live in this area Now, we livein this area even before now,
and then it's masculinity, right, so we live in this time period
on that.
So let's finish on that note.
How do you feel about?
Speaker 2 (20:20):
masculinity.
Now we have so many peoplearound, our entire spectrum of
you know, from ultra masculineto feminine and androgynous and
everything in between.
I do not like machismo.
That I don't believe ismasculinity, but I do believe.
(20:40):
I'm a cis male and I'm notashamed of being a cis male, but
I respect all my trans andnon-binary.
I live in that world with them.
My masculinity, if anything,would be the, the urge to
protect, right?
Uh, if anything else, not.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
Look at me, get over here, boy although I do that's
really impressive, although I dodo that in a scene.
You like that boy, you're likethat sir yes, sir, get your ass
over here.
Oh yeah, oh, daddy, you know,it's me again you know it's so
funny because we have the gayvoice right.
We like we don't listen to itor we don't pay attention like
(21:17):
we.
We're outright, we're atflamboyant when you're in
leather, when I'm in a certaintype of area, you know it's like
yo get your ass over here andthen you just see, you just see,
guys, just like whoa that thatcame out of them too, like holy
shit, but for me.
But at the time it's like hey,how you doing master cat, I
don't really do a lot of therupalisms.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
Anyway, yeah, I don't .
I mean I nothing against mydrag queens, because they have
the whole language of their ownright and I get it, but leather
is usually.
You know, leather hastraditionally been.
I'm a dude right where we'rehaving to break out of that old
tradition of stuff.
I call myself a recoveringtraditionalist right meaning.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Well, because it all started with what?
Tom and finland, I want to saythat finland is one of the
aspects of it.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
but it really started , gay leather especially started
way back with the militaryleaving world war two and these
guys I know it did that, but thewhole masculinity like where it
fits was in the whole Tom andFinn yeah it started off with
like oh, we can be gay, but wecan also be masculine.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
So it gave us this picture where people were taking
it and trashing it in a waythat's not supposed to be.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
It was supposed to be art, you know and the thing is,
a lot of those guys areanatomically impossible to reach
, unless you.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
You know it's some of them, they're, they're over,
they're overweight they're notover, they're overly buffed, or
they're what we call uh.
In today's um anime it's calledbada yeah, where they're just
overly buffed and overly justlike it's kind of a hyperbole of
what the actual right you knowyou know people are like oh, I
just love that about that art.
It's so hot, I wish men wouldlook more.
(22:56):
I was like dude, that's.
You're putting a lot of highexpectations on men and what
we're supposed to look like,right, you know?
Because I know I'm a bear, butI'm a fat bear, but I'm also a
bear that's happy with his body.
Same here, you know.
So it's just like you know I.
I just don't see the wholemasculinity between men, you
know what I mean.
So that's kind of the but inyou.
So what was the proposal likewhen the whole came down to it?
(23:19):
come back to first circle onthat because I like we love
getting off subject, so but wedo I want to come back to it
because I want to know like thisis like true love at its true
finest.
You know, this is like peopleare.
We're on hump day, it ishalfway through winds.
We're halfway through the week.
You know the weekends ridearound the corner.
We're just enjoying it.
Give me a little.
You know gay proposal, what wasthat like?
Speaker 2 (23:41):
well, for us.
We I get divorced at thebeginning of november of 2010,
finally, and that was a wholeother story, but we won't get
into that.
So Stuart basically showed uptwo weeks later and we ended up
having to stay in a hotelbecause the ex was still living
at the house at the moment andobjected to him being there, and
, of course, I had to be carefulbecause the documents weren't
finalized Right.
So while we were there, Idecided I was going to take him
(24:05):
to the Tower of Americas, right,and I decided I was going to
take him to the Tower ofAmericas, right.
And not realizing he's afraidof heights, my husband.
Well, what I told him was andfor anybody that wants to go to
the Tower, the view isspectacular.
But if you don't want to seethe elevator, go up, look at the
back wall.
And I made him look at the backwall, and I kind of held him,
(24:30):
and so when we got up there, wewalked around in the observation
thing and then we went aroundto the out there, where it's
blowing wind all the time.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
It's so high up there it is.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
And I finally got him to the northwest side of the
tower so it was overlookingtowards Converse, because that's
where I lived at one point andthen, basically, I dropped to my
knee out there and I proposedto him up on the Tower of
Americas.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Oh, that is so cute.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
So, no matter where we are in the city, when we
would see the tower because thetower is so tall, you can see it
almost in every point of thecity at some point we would say
baby, there's our tower.
And so we went downstairs afterthat and we were in the gift
shop.
We happened to see a lesbiancouple there and I was like we
just proposed, we just proposedand they were just so they
didn't know what to do with us.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
So they gave us a hug and said congratulations and
then we went that evening.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
We went to luther's when it used to be good and it
used to exist and it was thatlittle shack on the on the side
in the old parking lot beforethey built the tobin lofts,
right, and there was a dragqueen that was, uh, the maitre d
at the time, right, and weshowed him the rings and it was
like because he put a ring on meas well, because then he
kneeled down and did it to metoo- it was like even steven's
(25:35):
here, so, and she was like yaythat is so cute.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
So it's so cute, that's what happened.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
And then we started the immigration.
We got legally married inmassachusetts because it was one
of the only states we could getlegally married in in 2012.
First I went over to the UK totalk to his sister and talk to
his great aunt and his cousinshe's like the only living family
.
He's got over there now, right,and wanted to make sure they
(26:02):
were cool with it and all thatstuff.
And they were like, absolutely,you can take him, you can take
him.
And they were like, absolutely,you take him, you take him.
No, they had said to me what myfamily said to him when they
were saying yes, absolutely,because you know, kat just
brightened up in his lifeBecause they knew I went through
hell during the divorce, right.
(26:23):
And so when this was allhappening, you know my mother
had met him when we were doing aSkype call, oddly enough at a
thing, and she got to meet him.
That way, the whole family getto meet him one day and he's
telling me that you got to dothis, you got to do that, right.
Yeah, he hates when I do thatvoice of a sorry baby.
I know you're gonna hear thisbut, kick you.
He's gonna kick my ass like hereally is.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
But when you didn't stop, I, I was just recording.
I didn't realize You're goingto get me in trouble with that.
No, no dinner for you.
Yeah, no joke, I love his meals.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
His meals are delicious.
So after that was done, his momsaid he's right for you.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
That was it Seal of approval.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
That's pretty much so .
Finally, when we were gettingmarried in the summer of 2012,
uh, he came over and we decidedwe were going to go see my
parents in florida.
Yeah, and it was a whirlwindtour.
We went there, spent a coupleof days with them and when we
were coming down the escalator,we could see the you know, the,
(27:25):
the short, the bad shorts of anold person, and I'm like.
I'm wearing.
Now my turn.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Your turn, my turn to wear the tacky shorts.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
And they really.
I said there they are.
And so as soon as we got offthe escalator, mom went to go
rub and hug him and all thatstuff.
And dad went to go hug him andshe looked at me and went you
can go get the luggage.
I was like mom.
So I knew, I knew he says she,she wanted to meet him so bad in
person because she saw what hewas doing to keep me sane during
(27:58):
the divorce thing and keep megoing.
And so after that we flew up tonew England and we flew up to
Massachusetts and it was weirdbecause the hometown I grew up
in, the clerk, was a friend ofmy mother's.
So we did that and some of myhigh school friends came to see
the ceremony or came tocongratulate us.
My brother and my sister and mynephews came around to witness
(28:20):
it all and it was just a civilceremony at the end of the like
on a Friday evening.
So it was.
We just simply done because Ididn't want to do a church
wedding.
I knew that wasn't going tohappen.
Right, right after I gotmarried in 2012, I ended up, uh.
I ended up, uh, quitting my jobas a music minister right at
(28:40):
one of the local catholicchurches um that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (28:44):
That's awesome.
So now that've come full circlewith your husband now y'all
been together since the dawn ofdays he's going to kill you.
Since y'all been married sincethe dawn of days, since
dinosaurs roamed Was y'all'sfirst pet a triceratops?
No, I'm kidding, it was apterodactyl.
It was a pterodactyl.
I could see it For some reason.
(29:04):
I can see just you riding on it.
Yeah, pretty much.
You even freaked out the dog abit.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Sorry, there buddy.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
He's afraid of me now , Now that we're fast forward
we're 2025.
We've gotten to play for alittle bit here and there on it,
which we'll talk about it onthe next episode here.
So prepare for that one on thatepisode.
What advice could you giveadults now who are coming into
(29:34):
their adulthood, so from 18 andup?
What advice could you give themnow to help them out in their
life?
What piece of advice could yougive them?
Speaker 2 (29:42):
The most practical one.
Monitor your finances.
Don't extend your credit toomuch.
We had to, like I said, I hadto dig myself out of a financial
nightmare after the divorce.
I would say pick yourcommitments carefully.
(30:03):
It's one thing to have nightflings and all that kind of
stuff.
It's all about the quick hitand the parties and the multiple
partners and all that stuffSometimes sometimes depends on
what you want to do.
But understand that anythingyou want is going to take
investment.
It's going to take investmentand if you are of the mindset
that it needs to be handed toyou on a silver platter for you
(30:23):
to do anything, that's, that'snot.
I'm a baby boomer, right, soyou're hearing a lot of people
are gonna go okay, boomer, um,but I'm of the, I'm of the
generation that you worked for,everything you got right and so
you know, instant gratification,which seems to be the big thing
now, is only a temporary fix.
(30:45):
It's only a temporary thing.
Working on a relationship for along time, um, and knowing
where everybody is in yourdartboard right, in other words,
stewart is right there in themiddle on the, on the bullseye,
and then boys that are collaredto me are probably in the next
next ring, and then closefriends like yourself are there
too, right, I mean, I would, Iwould carla you if I, if I could
(31:08):
.
But no, you've already spokenfor so many other places.
So, and the polyamory thing youhave to understand and respect
those if you are doing apolyamorous relationship.
It is a spider web and you haveto make sure that all these
nodes understand who's got avested interest in you god for
real.
Well, this is the thing, andpolyamory is actually, for me, I
think it's more natural thanmonogamy, and the thing is it
(31:31):
does take maturity.
So I mean to go back to thequestion if you're 18 to 21 or
those really young ages, you'restill working on your maturity.
Right, it's going to take awhile.
Guys, be patient with yourself.
You're going to fuck up.
You're going to do stuff.
God God, I'm just lucky.
My fuck ups were before theinternet.
Oh my God.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
You know, we still in that page.
Aaron, doesn't matter what ageyou are, we're still going to
have those fuck ups.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Oh, yeah, I still have them.
Yeah, we still have them.
Some of the things I just said,stuart's going to say I fucked
up.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
I think one of the main things that I've learned
over the years in my last fiveor six podcasts that I've had
over the, you know you can learnand grow from them, because I
remember some things that I'vesaid to you as well, and I know
that calling out people anddoing certain things and whatnot
can be detrimental to a lot ofpeople.
But I do those call outs forreasons, because it's like you
(32:25):
need to pay attention to whatyou're doing, what you're going
on, because if you're not payingattention to anything that what
is going on in today's life,and it takes an episode or
somebody to do it live, to putyou in the limelight, because
that's where you want to beright and you've been called out
on.
That's where the, that's wherepeople are just like, oh shit,
you know, like or they play thevictim, they play the victim.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
So it's like you.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
You can't play the victim forever.
You've got to realize that whatyou're doing.
I know that I might fall forsome things here and there, and
I I've actually come out of thewoodwork since I look I've
apologized.
Here's this, here's that I voteup to it in writing.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Yeah uh, if you go to fat life, I've just recently
released a collection ofwritings oh, I saw that about
where we'll talk about wherethings went wrong with several
of the boys that are no longerwith me, and most of the time it
was me fucking up right, or itbreaks down to three things
either I fucked up, which is thenorm, or they did something
(33:18):
that was egregious or stewartfor some reason, got offended by
them and out they went right.
And as soon as he vetoes them,I by default, like a christmas
light, have got to say look,it's kind of awkward to try to
play with you somewhere else.
He's, he's, let me do that.
But then he knows who I'm goingto play with.
He's kind of like, well, okay,if you awkward to try to play
with you somewhere else, he's,let me do that.
But then he knows who I'm goingto play with.
He's kind of like, well, okay,if you want to go to that.
(33:39):
He doesn't want to know thatI'm playing with the person
who's seeing them.
Right, there's even some people.
He's forbid me to have contactwith Right.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
I'm not one of them.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
No, you're not.
Obviously, you come over fordinner all the time.
Oh that I haven't stepped onanybody's toes either.
No and no, you wouldn't,because you're a little more
mature, I mean.
But there's some people that Ican play with outside of the
outside of the house and that'sfine.
You know he's like, he's greatwith that.
But there's other people's likeI don't even want you having
(34:09):
contact with them, right them,block them and all that stuff.
So it's like you know it's you.
It can be awkward when thathappens, but yeah, those are the
three things, but most of thetime it was me fucking up or
learning life lessons.
I mean my very first boy in thestories it's called Nella.
I call him Nella and it wasbecause I was so busy being a
(34:31):
title holder for the first timeand taking care of what my needs
were, forgetting.
As a dominant and as the daddy,I need to be watching out for
my boy meeting his needs right.
And when he succeeded me in thetitle uh, of mr sister, leather
is the very last one um, hedidn't really want to do a lot
of it and I got very criticalpublicly about it instead of
talking to him privately.
(34:51):
You know we always say praisein public, criticize in private,
right, and I kind of did theopposite.
So that, along with the factthat he had other influences
going on, and for anybody thatwants to know something about
all the weird names in there,you know like I call him Nella
on here, but if you look at thespelling and put it backwards,
(35:14):
then you'll see what the realname is.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
All the names are spelled backwards on purpose so
they can't be tracked or tracedor anything like that.
Or tagged by mistake and fetlife.
And all of a sudden, if thisperson has a fet life, I got
like, oh shit, cat's talkingabout me.
I was like well, I'm talkingthe truth, or at least the way I
saw it.
Yeah, your perspective of thetruth, right but I what I did is
I owed up to things.
It goes back to what you firstsaid.
I've not only owed up to andspoke about the stories, I've
written them down so they're inwriting and people are seeing
(35:43):
what I'm displaying it andthat's kind of as a leader in
the community.
It's kind of like I've got todo that kind of stuff and be
transparent to a point rightabout stuff and, you know, not
walk around like I am perfectbecause I want to earn my wear
cap every day, and there aredays I just look at myself and I
(36:03):
go what the hell, were theythinking?
Speaker 1 (36:08):
There's not too many masters left.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Some of the masters have moved away from town, the
ones that covered me, me.
It's very sad.
Going back to the opening thingabout masculinity,
unfortunately one of my dearmentors and his wife and their
subs all had to move to anotherstate because they're afraid,
because some of them are trans.
They're afraid to, uh, they'reafraid to stay in texas, so they
(36:32):
moved to a blue state yeah andI that's fair, fair enough, and
I get it.
It's very fair.
I understand that, but it's avery sad thing that I don't have
that mentor in town anymorethat I could go and drive to and
say hey look, I know you'reanother master and I'm supposed
to have it all together now as amaster too.
But I really need advice onthis, right.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Right, right, you know, I get it.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
Just understand, guys , that the leaders in our
community no matter what yourtitle is for them or what
they're doing, your titleholders, your presidents of any
groups and all this stuff theyneed sometimes the support back
when they're always having to dostuff.
I'm thinking of people that arein charge of stuff.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
Especially youngsters , because we know we 18, 19, 20,
21 to 24 years old, we weforget about them.
Sometimes we forget that they,they want to join in on the fun
too as well, and when you'redoing things that are like at a
club, that's 21 and up andthey're excluded, they, they
just want to be able to have funbecause they're already in
(37:32):
adulthood or 18.
But a lot of us don't reallyplay with 18, 19, 20, because
they can't go to the bar, theycan't go.
They can't go to the bar andmeet us because everything is 21
and up, which I get, which Iget.
Right, because it's like that'swhy the dungeons are so popular
.
Yeah, because it's just likeyou know, you want to be able to
play with them, but we alsoforget that they're also human
(37:52):
beings too.
They need they.
They're looking for mentorships.
And it's crazy because I'vealways find doms 18, 19, 20 that
are just like oh, I'm, I'mdominant.
I've been doing this since I was15.
I'm like okay, great, in orderfor you to be more of a dom in
this time and age, but your ageis at now we need to kind of,
you need a mentorship assomebody to get you to where you
(38:13):
need to be in baby steps.
I can introduce you to a fewdoms and whatnot, and masters
too as well, that can kind ofhelp you and guide you along the
way.
That is great.
If you think that you are a domperson, that you can do what
you're doing, we've got to makea name for yourself and you have
to show your skills, because,just because you're here in this
in this day and age, you haveto show your skills.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
In this day and age you have to show your skills.
Oh, and when somebody is thatyoung and claiming they're a
master or a dom or all thatother kind of stuff it's like.
First of all, I don't want tohear about experience when you
were a teenager, that'stechnically getting into some
really interesting taboo stuff.
Taboo stuff that's even taboofor the BDSM community.
But when you call yourself that, are you able to prove your
(38:57):
worth with your techniques andyour abilities and stuff like
that.
I'm not trying to diss somebodywho's young.
They may be a fast burner, theymay be a fast learner and I
know young people that are doingvery well at that stuff.
And it doesn't also mean on theother side that just because
somebody is in their antiqueages like me, with no
replacement parts available,that we automatically know
(39:19):
everything All right.
It is a matter of.
I mean, I've been doing kinkfor about 25 years.
I know from the turn of thecentury because I remember from
the turn of the century.
But I was doing stuff that evenin a place like that, like a
nudist party or something likethat, that had a playroom right,
(39:40):
I not only was wanting to have,you know, sex and all that kind
of stuff, but I was wanting topaddle people or flog them or
right and do all that kind ofstuff and play a little rough
and slap and tickle.
So it was like I was always thekinky one.
They were like I don't know ifI want to play.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
You know he's cute, but he wants to spank me there's
, there's a lot of there's a lotthat goes into it, though, but
yeah, on there, so we'll savethat one for the next, our next
episode here for freaky fridayoh, so we get to talk dirty on
freaky friday.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
We get to talk dirty, oh yes, oh yes.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
So this is behaving um, and I appreciate you coming
on to the mature mish of uh catand you've been uh a hoot and
you've been amazing um on beingon here and I know that you were
on a previous uh youtube video.
Where were you?
Where were you?
That was that was.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
That was uh.
Ltj reads um so shout out tohim yeah, shout out, yeah,
absolutely shout, because he'smy iml brother.
I love him because he ended upbeing contestant number one he
lost it.
When the glitter came outduring the number ceremony and
he realized he was number one,the look on his face was the
face crack of the century.
Speaker 1 (40:44):
That's fucking awesome.
Speaker 2 (40:45):
But Lewis, or LTJ reads he does a show called
Throwing Light and his motto isif you're not throwing light,
you're not acting right.
And that's true because he'strying to show positive things
as well and to meet him, he's tomeet him in person.
He's absolutely a sweetheart.
I mean, I know him, him and Ihave had some conversation.
(41:06):
Like I've had conversationswhen I'm with you, I've had
conversations with Lewis as well.
Right, and this is anotherthing about our community.
It isn't always about theclothes.
It isn't always about theclothes it isn't always about
the bdsm and the play.
It isn't always about throwingthe boy in the sling and
everything else like that.
It's a lot of times about theconnection, the relationships,
the one-on-one conversations, alot of times over coffee or a
(41:27):
hookah or a cigar right.
Those are the big ones.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
I like the hookah ones especially the hookah ones
are always fun, especially whenit was me and you we were
talking on it and all that stuff.
Oh dear God.
So we can find you on there andeverything.
And where can everyone find youat?
On social media?
Speaker 2 (41:42):
On social media.
The biggest place to find me isFetLife, because I really hide
it there.
It's Kat underscore Artemis,and Artemis is spelled like the
goddess of the hunt, so C-A-Tunderscore A-R-T-E-M spelled
like the goddess of the hunt, socat underscore a r, t, e, m, I
s.
Uh, cat and artemis arecapitalized.
You can find me on facebook,but in this last year I have not
(42:03):
posted anything original.
I've been liking things andI've been adding comments here
and there, and there's a reasonwhy because I haven't reached
the year in the day yet since Ilost my job, and so this whole
year I have been not postinganything other than sharing
something once in a while.
But if you look, there's nooriginal postings of my own
(42:23):
there.
Yeah, which?
Speaker 1 (42:25):
made it.
You know you made it very hardto share everything with you.
I'm just like I need you toshare and post because I need
more questions, more peoplethat's why I need you to do it.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
I'm just like on groups, groups, but I didn't say
anything because what's goingto happen is weirdly enough.
Um, the friday of austin kinkweekend will be a year and a day
, the first day I officially wastold I can't go back and be a
teacher.
Really, my official letter thatI received, uh, after the whole
(42:54):
crap happening, I went toschool on the Tuesday and my
principal called me in and askedme if I knew who this person
was, and they blocked her off ofthere.
And then by the middle ofTuesday, people were calling,
blowing up my phone, saying doyou know what's going on?
Do you know what's going on?
And I'm having to try to textthem because I'm teaching.
And so HR meets with me onTuesday afternoon and just tells
(43:15):
me that they're aware of thisand all that stuff.
Show the picture that she'sposting circles.
They have it blown up, theycircle the patch that says suck
my dick on it.
And then they say, okay, we'llgo home, we'll contact you, but
they wait until Tuesday night totell me don't come to work in
the morning and so we'll getback with you.
And so go all day on wednesdaywondering what the fuck are they
(43:37):
going to do?
That is horrible.
And then they wait until 5 30on wednesday to say we're going
to give you your letter.
You need to come to the hroffice.
And I told them okay, call mewhen it is actually in print and
ready to be served.
That's not waiting forsignatures, right?
I told them, I literally wantto come in, get the business
done and get.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
I don't want to sit in a waiting room to and we're
going to pause right there for ato be continued there, because
we're going to go on that withthere for more of a freaky
friday on our podcast.
So tune in more with katartemis here with us on the
mature mischief podcast I he isdefinitely our first host here
on the podcast here and I can'twait to have him more and more
other people to come onto thepodcast to share their
experiences with being an adultin the community and also being
(44:19):
the LGBT member, or even just amember in general, of being just
an adult itself, and Iappreciate you so much for
coming in.
So thank you so much, Iappreciate that.
And tune in on Friday forFreaky Friday for more of Kat
Artemis here on my MatureMischief podcast.
I am your host, jesse James,and Cat is my co-host today,
(44:41):
just time-varying for filling infor Sister D aka DD.
So, dd, I hope you're listeningto the podcast.
We miss you, girl.
Come back on here and we needto get you back, girl.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
Love you.
Speaker 1 (44:52):
Bye.
What's up, grimmins?
Welcome back to another podcast.
My name is Jesse James.
I hope everyone is doing it anddoing it well.
You know the drill.
This is the Mature MischiefPodcast.
You know it's not the samewithout Didi Every time I do
this.
I know she's not here at themoment, y'all, but she will be
(00:20):
joining us here soon, shortly,on the next episode.
She is currently working rightnow.
If you can hear my voice rightnow, I'm just a little under the
weather with allergies that aregoing on right now.
I do have a special guest herewith me today.
He is going to be on here withus today, on Hump Day Wednesday,
which is going to be today.
His name is Cat Artemis.
(00:41):
He is one of my favoritefavorite longtime friends.
I got to know him through theyears at Kinky Carnival.
He is a master, so he does goby Master Cat Artemis.
He's a Mr Sister Leather of2017, mr Tough Drag Diva of 2018
, and Mr Alamo City Leather of2022 and 2023.
He's also a great, greatcomposer.
(01:03):
He's one of my favorites that Ilove to listen to anytime he's
on a computer.
He is actually here today.
He's finally come out of thewoodworks from his man cave and
from the cave, from the stoneages, just to be here today with
me today.
Master cat, how are you?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
doing.
I'm doing good and it lookslike the dogs are happy about it
.
Yeah, they are happy about itoh, they're all happy they're.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
They're just having a ball um on that.
Yeah, it was so.
Uh.
So, master cat, welcome to themature mischief podcast.
Uh, we've rebanded everythinghere because we, when you
started on here, it was theslice of life yes, and it was a
very kinky, outgoing, uh, veryoutspoken page.
(01:47):
Mature mischief is the same way.
We're just more of an adult,you know, trying to get through
life as as adults here on that,you know, that's not.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
So no, it's not and real quick.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
With that being said, I know it, you know it and the
whole world fucking knows it.
I am your host, jesse james,and master cat is going to be my
co-host today.
So quake with fair, yeah, soI'm actually really excited
about that.
Oh, normally I would have my uh, my, my best friend here with
us, uh, on this podcast heretoday, but I think there was a
(02:18):
mix up on our communicationsbecause she thought the podcast
was you were going to be here alot later and I told her no, it
was at three o'clock.
I could have sworn.
I told her at three, but thatwas a miscommunication on both
our hands.
She was like I should haveasked what time he was going to
come and whatnot and whatever.
I was like no, no, I know, Iknow, I know.
I'm sorry, bestie, I'm sorry,but anywho, tell me a little bit
(02:41):
about yourself as an adultliving in this world of today's
politics and how you're dealingwith and being with everything.
How have you lived life to your?
Speaker 2 (02:52):
fullest.
Just learning to be who I amgoing through and coming out of
so many damn closets that Ididn't realize how many closets
have you come out of, I don'tknow.
Let's see First of all comingout as being a gay man.
And then, when I did that and Ijoined, you know, the Bears
suddenly realized oh wait, aminute, he's kinky, he doesn't
(03:13):
just want to kiss, yeah.
And then and he wears leather.
So I had to come out of theleather closet and say I'm a
leatherman.
And then you know saying, ohyeah, by the way, I'm into BDSM.
And then finally telling peopleand posting it live as, by the
way, I am no longer a Catholicor a Christian, I am a witch,
yeah, and that one really rockedthe world.
(03:35):
So it's kind of interesting.
You know doing some of mymeditations and some of my.
I'm writing this journal thatkeeps going on forever and ever.
But there's a certain pointwhere I had to realize that
anybody before my divorce is notin my circles anymore.
It's like people.
After that, when I finallylanded at the annex one night as
(03:56):
a scared bear who is afraid toask for a second diet.
Coke has come all this way.
How old are you, mastercat?
Has come all this way?
How old are?
Speaker 1 (04:03):
you Master Cat.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Well, this life I am 61 right now, nice, I mean, of
course, I'm one of those.
Being a witch, I believe inmultiple lives.
So yeah, god knows, I've beencalled an ancient spirit before.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
That's why I said bring your cave from the Stone
Ages.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
I studied when we had it on Papyrus and we thought
that was the best thing ever.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
I had your first autograph and the handprint.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It's still on the cave, so I appreciate it I was
the one who did the originalcave drawings in france exactly,
we were the first ones to drawthe dick pics on the wall like
oh, we thought that was oh,that's five dicks.
I'm taking it once.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
So you've, you've, you've learned uh throughout.
When did you come out?
Uh, were you a late bloomer aswell?
Speaker 2 (04:54):
I ended up being a late bloomer because, with my
era, it was dangerous to be gayin the military right.
It was instant.
I mean we shouldn't do that.
This probably could be that, no,you're fine but it was instant
discharge, like within 48 hours.
I mean I literally watchedsomebody get thrown out in 48
hours.
That was actually a fellowchoir member when I was singing
(05:15):
in one of the chapel choirs.
Right literally, it's a sadstory.
It I might tell the story justbecause it's going to infuriate
some people and it's also beenleading towards my getting out
of the monotheistic religionsand getting into the
polytheistic things likeWiccanism is.
This young man was obviouslyflaming gay, but of course he
(05:36):
and I we all had to keep itunder wraps.
We kind of knew about eachother but we didn't say anything
.
But the organist who wascontracted had a husband, and
this is way back in the 80s wheneven that wasn't allowed and
you know, being a husband was anex, you know unofficial thing
back then.
Right, well, basically whathappened was the organist and
his boyfriend decided to makehim the throuple.
(05:57):
Hey, yeah, I can keep goingspeaking of throuples back there
.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
I know right, Our pups are amazing.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
And then what happened was you know, they
broke up with him.
And he got angry about it.
And he was so angry about itthat when it was time around the
Lenten season to go toconfession, he confessed to the
chaplain how angry he was aboutthings, and the chaplain,
instead of doing absolving andforgetting, basically said you
turn yourself into yourcommander, or I will in the
morning.
(06:28):
so oh wow so instead of being acatholic priest, he turned back
into a military officer anddecided I'm gonna bust this fag,
yeah, and so and I knew aboutthis because where I worked it
was basically the hr, thepersonnel building, it was back
then they called it theconsolidated base personnel
office and all the personnelthings for the, you know, the
(06:49):
military was there.
So I was kind of like like likehard, it was very hardcore.
And the point is is I had thejob of going around to all the
command sections to get thingssigned off like decorations and
performance and separationpackages, and there was his name
and I saw it and as I waswalking back in he's smoking a
cigarette outside back when wecould still smoke outside.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Right.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
And you know, he was just pretending like nothing was
happening.
And I confronted him and Iassuming his name was Jesse I
said, jesse, don't fuck with me,I already know what it is, I've
got your package right here.
Why?
Why the fuck did you even talkto a chaplain?
Yeah, you know, and that's whenI started to realize you have
to be very careful who you cameout to.
And it wasn't even in the 90swhen Don't Ask, don't Tell came
out.
It was actually Don't Ask,don't Tell, Don't Pursue,
(07:34):
because they used to witch huntpeople they thought were gay,
right, and so hiding all thattime and even, unfortunately, I
guess, getting married because Ithought I had to, because it
was just at a certain point, Ihad a certain rank, and why is
he still single?
Kind of the murmurs like that,you know what's he doing on the
weekends, kind of things likethat.
So you know.
(07:59):
So ultimately, after 21 years,I got divorced Because I got
found out when I went to college.
Everybody knew and I would gointo clubs and people knew.
But I would always have todrive home and realize I had to
put this costume back on of thestraight man and all that kind
of stuff.
And then, when it finally blewup, she found a book hiding
under the.
We lived in Squalor back then.
(08:19):
She didn't know how to keep ahouse clean and it was always a
mess, and she finally found thisbook, written by bill brent,
called the ultimate guide toanal sex for men.
Now, how do you explain as a no, as a church organist, church
pianist, choir leader, uh, allthat other stuff.
And you know, got raising threechildren, straight man,
(08:42):
supposedly, right supposedly,and music minister, and all this
other stuff.
How do you explain having thisbook?
It's like, what am I going todo?
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Am I going to continue to license it?
I borrowed it from a friend.
Well, why would I want to knowabout this stuff?
I'm not going to be, you knowso.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
I was trying to do it on you, baby, oh God no.
Oh dear.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
God no it was.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
It was like a rough time period for you and
everything.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
What was?
Speaker 1 (09:07):
what is it like?
Because I know that, uh, somefan was asking me.
It's just like your time periodand being at the age of you are
what was finances like for youback in the day?
Like how did you handle yourfinances back then?
Or how, how has everythingshifted from then to now?
Oh dear god.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
Back then.
Of course, being active duty,the budget is very, very tight.
Right, raising three kids washard Cause you're you're retired
military.
I'm retired military andretired teacher, so I've got two
pensions coming in.
I've asked my house for nearlyfive decades, so it's time to
enjoy my garden and things likethat.
But it was.
(09:45):
It was hard because we neverseemed to have enough to make
ends meet.
She didn't really have a jobthat paid, she did minimum wage
and she broke her back doingstuff.
So it's, you know, it was.
It was tough.
I was very fortunate that goingto college was because I was
labeled a disabled vet at thetime and so I was allowed to go
(10:08):
to UTSA and get my music degree.
Otherwise that would have beena fortune to pay for.
Right Because even right down.
You're right down the streetfrom UTSA, Right, it is not
cheap to go there.
It's not, no, no, it's not.
And not for something speciallike a music program, because
(10:31):
there's always there's actuallyextra costs, Like you have to
pay extra for your music and youhave to buy all these other
things, and it was always kindof hard to tell.
You know something like theveterans administration that
buying sheet music was mytextbook.
Every semester my professor hadto send a letter to say this is
his textbook for this course.
You need to pay for this orreimburse him.
It was a mess, but whathappened was I finally graduated
and I got a job as a teacherand comparatively to what I was
(10:52):
getting before, that was alittle bit more, so we lived a
little more comfortable, butthen it got me.
Well, if we've got more now, wecan spend more.
Let's buy more religiousgoodies for the house and all
that stuff.
So it ultimately got to thepoint that when I divorced then
it really got bad because I tookon most of the debts, Right,
Just to get rid of her.
Oh shit, yeah, Just to get ridof her.
It was my husband you, you knowStuart really well was really
(11:16):
pissed about the agreement Imade.
The courts found that I was theprimary custodian of the of the
children and I waived childsupport because I knew she
couldn't afford it, right, and Ieven, even though it wasn't
required in our state, I offeredher spousal support for three
years, right, and you know, sixhundred dollars a month for
three years, that's a lot, thatis a lot of money.
(11:37):
That's like twenty fourthousand dollars roughly,
roughly yeah and so you know hewas pissed.
When I did this is, look, Igotta get rid of him and got rid
of her, not her.
This was her back then.
I finally have the right gendernow, uh so, but it was.
It was rough even then, and so,finally, when the last payment
was done with spousal supports,things got a little bit better,
but it wasn't until wedownscaled from the house that
(12:00):
we're in and got into the housewe live in now, right, right,
and we'll have y'all's house.
By the way, my house isbeautiful it is beautiful the
garden.
The garden is getting basicallymanicured right now and the pool
is almost ready to get in whenit gets to 90 degrees, again
we're we're getting in it, soyou need to come down and get it
.
Yeah, um, my, our, our,leatherman, they're waiting for
(12:22):
me to announce the pool partyit's like, yeah, like 50
leatherman and little jockstraps and uh and speedos
sitting in my pool, the life, ohmy god, it's so beautiful, I
live vicariously through you, sobut uh, come to the party.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Well, you know my schedule, my schedule is always
so busy, but um, I it's um, it'sone of those things, because
I'm I see myself and I've alwaysbeen curious about I.
We're a big gap in age betweenyou and I, though, but we
understand each other thoroughlyas adults, right?
So we go and we're like, ohshit, how do we manage and
everything.
What was it like finding Stuartfor you and your love life and
(12:59):
your companionship?
Because we've talked about lovedown here, we talked about sex,
we've talked about hate, wetalked about backstabbing.
My thing is, what was thechemistry between you two?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
That is quite the story.
Yeah, in fact, we're actuallycoming up on an anniversary,
real soon.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Oh, how long have you been together really quickly
before you start your story.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
We finally started meeting each other, believe it
or not, on Facebook Really OnFacebook, because you've got to
remember, go back in thetimeline, those of us who
remember way back in the 2010s.
Right, I started Facebook in2009, got divorced at the end of
2000.
But at the beginning of 2010,this was when we liked to
collect a lot of friends,especially if they were cute and
hot.
(13:38):
Right, and there was this oneguy that was this really hot
cowboy picture he had with ashirtless cowboy and he had,
like you know, the 3 000 friendson it, and when he would post
something, 350 people wouldwould add on to the thread and
not normally saying anythingother than to say, oh, you're so
hot, you know, or answer hisquestion, right, um, he was an
(14:00):
interesting person because hewas also a professor of music at
another university, and so whenI wrote him to say all the
stuff I didn't write aboutperson because he was also a
professor of music at anotheruniversity, and so when I wrote
him to say all the stuff Ididn't write about, how hot he
was, I talked about how I likecertain theory and how I like
this kind of stuff, and hestarted writing back to me about
this.
He says you're one of the fewpeople that are talking to me
and not treating me like a sexobject.
You're treating me about,unable to talk my language of
music, and so we started that.
(14:22):
But anyway, stuart, language ofmusic, right, and he said so we
started that.
But anyway, stewart was also afriend of his because, again, we
all subscribe to people who arehot and look good, right, and
he has normal he's.
We still do that now.
I don't think it's changed in2025 either, but, uh, 15 million
years later, we're still doingsome things the same yeah, right
the thing about it is stewartput something down there that
(14:43):
was obviously a Britishcolloquial and I remember from
living in the UK for four yearsin the military that the dog's
bollocks was definitely not anAmerican term, that's a British
term.
The dog's bollocks, itbasically means it's really,
really good.
And so I decided I'd click onhis profile and, sure enough,
yep, he lives in the UK.
He lived in this uh town calledmilton keynes.
(15:05):
I knew where that was.
It was kind of near cambridgeand all that stuff.
I had been through it likemaybe once, right.
Um, so it's okay, I kind ofknow where he was from and I
went through all his picturesand he was really kind of cute.
So I kept looking at morepictures, because that's what we
do when we see people'sprofiles.
We still do that now I do.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
We stalk I do, I still look at stuff on FetLife
especially.
Oh God, good old FetLife.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, fetlife, cause they're there.
If you are not, by the way, Iam a Leatherman and I am a
kinkster.
If you are not in FetLife yet,you really should get there,
especially if you live a life ofleather, because kink kind of
goes along with it for the.
But you really should, becauseFetleaf's got a whole bunch of
stuff on it.
They really do.
They really do, oh my God.
But anyway, back to Facebookwhere you have to kind of police
(15:48):
what you're doing.
He only had one video and thenhe was basically on there and I
heard that little accent and itwas like he was basically saying
you know, sorry guys, I looklike shit, but this is my chance
to try to make a video video,because he was trying to figure
out his equipment and itrecorded and it got up there to
facebook.
And so I finally wrote him backafter I saw all the pictures
(16:08):
and stuff and I said I beg yourpardon to differ, but I don't
think you're.
You look like shit, you'reactually kind of cute.
And that's when it started.
And then facebook messengerback and forth for a while, and
then stewart said this thing onetime have you ever heard of a
thing called Skype?
Speaker 1 (16:27):
And.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Skype was the biggest latest thing.
That's where you could callpeople and not have to pay if it
was computer to computer Right.
It was just starting in late2009, early 2010.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
Oh God, Skype was so amazing back in the day.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
Oh, it was.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I remember being a young person, being on skype and
doing things that I shouldn'thave been doing, but don't we
all so?
You know, that's a differentstory so fine.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
You know, at one point I was afraid to get it.
I said this is something elsegoing on.
And my uh, my co-worker, whowas a theater teacher where I
was at I was teaching choir andorchestra and she said, oh no,
skype's kind of fun.
They just won't let us do it atschool because it's a push me,
pull you kind of thing and youcan't control what the content
is on the other end.
(17:13):
So you can't control the content.
So I finally got Skype and Iwrote Stuart and I says here's
my login and we finally, on the28th of April 2010, we made our
very first Skype connection.
And here he comes up on thescreen and he's got the British
(17:34):
accent.
He looks at me and goes, ohhello.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
And I mean that he has such a beautiful British
accent.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Oh, he's got a beautiful accent.
I'm just like, oh God, and hehasn't lost it yet either.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
No, he hasn't.
And he's such a good lookingguy too now, even in his age,
it's just like man.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
He looks like a sexy granddad.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Y'all too, Like the whole beard, everything.
I've seen some older picturesof you where it was just like
trimmed back and everything andit's like that's not cat.
I'm like no way.
And then you have your beard.
I'm just like man, the full ZZTop beard, the vols easy top
beard and everything on that.
So when did it become anofficial meetup?
When was that and how did y'allplan?
Speaker 2 (18:13):
that because it's different.
Now all the skype calls backand forth with like two school
boys laughing about stuff andsharing me sharing american
comedians and him sharingbritish humor, because I love
british humor I love britishhumor because the first thing I
said to him after he said thatoh hello was hi, I was hi, I
like Monty Python, and he rolledhis eyes.
(18:33):
He almost wanted to end theconversation there but he
decided, no, this cuteAmerican's talking to me and
it's like.
So we started the conversationand we were going back and forth
and then when shit happened andthe book got found and the
divorce was starting, he was thebest friend in my ear keeping
me from doing something rashduring a divorce.
(18:54):
And somewhere in the middle ofthe summer, of all that going on
, while the cooling off, whilethe waiting period was going on
and the bantering was going backand forth between me and my now
ex-wife, he went to Egypt andhe spent, you know, down there
internet is not readilyavailable like here, so he was
spending like 35 bucks a day toget the internet access and he
(19:15):
would skype me from from egypt,and now we're eight hours apart,
right?
so, uh, he would get up in themiddle of the night to talk to
me as I was getting ready to goto bed, and then, finally, the L
word came out love.
And that's what happened.
We realized when this is allover with, I'm going to ask you
for your hand.
And so we started all that.
(19:37):
He was again.
He was basically my best friend, listening in, because
sometimes I would have anearpiece in my ear because my
computer was open and the screenwas minimized.
But he's watching her rant andscream at me and all that stuff.
He's in my ear saying keep calm, don't react.
That's what she wants you to do.
She wants you to do somethinglike hit her or something like
that.
Right, and she's got somethingyou know.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
So I stay quiet and just let the process work, which
is really hard for most men todo, right, and so because we
live in this area Now, we livein this area even before now,
and then it's masculinity, right, so we live in this time period
on that.
So let's finish on that note.
How do you feel about?
Speaker 2 (20:20):
masculinity.
Now we have so many peoplearound, our entire spectrum of
you know, from ultra masculineto feminine and androgynous and
everything in between.
I do not like machismo.
That I don't believe ismasculinity, but I do believe.
(20:40):
I'm a cis male and I'm notashamed of being a cis male, but
I respect all my trans andnon-binary.
I live in that world with them.
My masculinity, if anything,would be the, the urge to
protect, right?
Uh, if anything else, not.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
Look at me, get over here, boy although I do that's
really impressive, although I dodo that in a scene.
You like that boy, you're likethat sir yes, sir, get your ass
over here.
Oh yeah, oh, daddy, you know,it's me again you know it's so
funny because we have the gayvoice right.
We like we don't listen to itor we don't pay attention like
(21:17):
we.
We're outright, we're atflamboyant when you're in
leather, when I'm in a certaintype of area, you know it's like
yo get your ass over here andthen you just see, you just see,
guys, just like whoa that thatcame out of them too, like holy
shit, but for me.
But at the time it's like hey,how you doing master cat, I
don't really do a lot of therupalisms.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
Anyway, yeah, I don't .
I mean I nothing against mydrag queens, because they have
the whole language of their ownright and I get it, but leather
is usually.
You know, leather hastraditionally been.
I'm a dude right where we'rehaving to break out of that old
tradition of stuff.
I call myself a recoveringtraditionalist right meaning.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Well, because it all started with what?
Tom and finland, I want to saythat finland is one of the
aspects of it.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
but it really started , gay leather especially started
way back with the militaryleaving world war two and these
guys I know it did that, but thewhole masculinity like where it
fits was in the whole Tom andFinn yeah it started off with
like oh, we can be gay, but wecan also be masculine.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
So it gave us this picture where people were taking
it and trashing it in a waythat's not supposed to be.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
It was supposed to be art, you know and the thing is,
a lot of those guys areanatomically impossible to reach
, unless you.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
You know it's some of them, they're, they're over,
they're overweight they're notover, they're overly buffed, or
they're what we call uh.
In today's um anime it's calledbada yeah, where they're just
overly buffed and overly justlike it's kind of a hyperbole of
what the actual right you knowyou know people are like oh, I
just love that about that art.
It's so hot, I wish men wouldlook more.
(22:56):
I was like dude, that's.
You're putting a lot of highexpectations on men and what
we're supposed to look like,right, you know?
Because I know I'm a bear, butI'm a fat bear, but I'm also a
bear that's happy with his body.
Same here, you know.
So it's just like you know I.
I just don't see the wholemasculinity between men, you
know what I mean.
So that's kind of the but inyou.
So what was the proposal likewhen the whole came down to it?
(23:19):
come back to first circle onthat because I like we love
getting off subject, so but wedo I want to come back to it
because I want to know like thisis like true love at its true
finest.
You know, this is like peopleare.
We're on hump day, it ishalfway through winds.
We're halfway through the week.
You know the weekends ridearound the corner.
We're just enjoying it.
Give me a little.
You know gay proposal, what wasthat like?
Speaker 2 (23:41):
well, for us.
We I get divorced at thebeginning of november of 2010,
finally, and that was a wholeother story, but we won't get
into that.
So Stuart basically showed uptwo weeks later and we ended up
having to stay in a hotelbecause the ex was still living
at the house at the moment andobjected to him being there, and
, of course, I had to be carefulbecause the documents weren't
finalized Right.
So while we were there, Idecided I was going to take him
(24:05):
to the Tower of Americas, right,and I decided I was going to
take him to the Tower ofAmericas, right.
And not realizing he's afraidof heights, my husband.
Well, what I told him was andfor anybody that wants to go to
the Tower, the view isspectacular.
But if you don't want to seethe elevator, go up, look at the
back wall.
And I made him look at the backwall, and I kind of held him,
(24:30):
and so when we got up there, wewalked around in the observation
thing and then we went aroundto the out there, where it's
blowing wind all the time.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
It's so high up there it is.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
And I finally got him to the northwest side of the
tower so it was overlookingtowards Converse, because that's
where I lived at one point andthen, basically, I dropped to my
knee out there and I proposedto him up on the Tower of
Americas.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Oh, that is so cute.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
So, no matter where we are in the city, when we
would see the tower because thetower is so tall, you can see it
almost in every point of thecity at some point we would say
baby, there's our tower.
And so we went downstairs afterthat and we were in the gift
shop.
We happened to see a lesbiancouple there and I was like we
just proposed, we just proposedand they were just so they
didn't know what to do with us.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
So they gave us a hug and said congratulations and
then we went that evening.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
We went to luther's when it used to be good and it
used to exist and it was thatlittle shack on the on the side
in the old parking lot beforethey built the tobin lofts,
right, and there was a dragqueen that was, uh, the maitre d
at the time, right, and weshowed him the rings and it was
like because he put a ring on meas well, because then he
kneeled down and did it to metoo- it was like even steven's
(25:35):
here, so, and she was like yaythat is so cute.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
So it's so cute, that's what happened.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
And then we started the immigration.
We got legally married inmassachusetts because it was one
of the only states we could getlegally married in in 2012.
First I went over to the UK totalk to his sister and talk to
his great aunt and his cousinshe's like the only living family
.
He's got over there now, right,and wanted to make sure they
(26:02):
were cool with it and all thatstuff.
And they were like, absolutely,you can take him, you can take
him.
And they were like, absolutely,you take him, you take him.
No, they had said to me what myfamily said to him when they
were saying yes, absolutely,because you know, kat just
brightened up in his lifeBecause they knew I went through
hell during the divorce, right.
(26:23):
And so when this was allhappening, you know my mother
had met him when we were doing aSkype call, oddly enough at a
thing, and she got to meet him.
That way, the whole family getto meet him one day and he's
telling me that you got to dothis, you got to do that, right.
Yeah, he hates when I do thatvoice of a sorry baby.
I know you're gonna hear thisbut, kick you.
He's gonna kick my ass like hereally is.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
But when you didn't stop, I, I was just recording.
I didn't realize You're goingto get me in trouble with that.
No, no dinner for you.
Yeah, no joke, I love his meals.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
His meals are delicious.
So after that was done, his momsaid he's right for you.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
That was it Seal of approval.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
That's pretty much so .
Finally, when we were gettingmarried in the summer of 2012,
uh, he came over and we decidedwe were going to go see my
parents in florida.
Yeah, and it was a whirlwindtour.
We went there, spent a coupleof days with them and when we
were coming down the escalator,we could see the you know, the,
(27:25):
the short, the bad shorts of anold person, and I'm like.
I'm wearing.
Now my turn.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Your turn, my turn to wear the tacky shorts.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
And they really.
I said there they are.
And so as soon as we got offthe escalator, mom went to go
rub and hug him and all thatstuff.
And dad went to go hug him andshe looked at me and went you
can go get the luggage.
I was like mom.
So I knew, I knew he says she,she wanted to meet him so bad in
person because she saw what hewas doing to keep me sane during
(27:58):
the divorce thing and keep megoing.
And so after that we flew up tonew England and we flew up to
Massachusetts and it was weirdbecause the hometown I grew up
in, the clerk, was a friend ofmy mother's.
So we did that and some of myhigh school friends came to see
the ceremony or came tocongratulate us.
My brother and my sister and mynephews came around to witness
(28:20):
it all and it was just a civilceremony at the end of the like
on a Friday evening.
So it was.
We just simply done because Ididn't want to do a church
wedding.
I knew that wasn't going tohappen.
Right, right after I gotmarried in 2012, I ended up, uh.
I ended up, uh, quitting my jobas a music minister right at
(28:40):
one of the local catholicchurches um that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (28:44):
That's awesome.
So now that've come full circlewith your husband now y'all
been together since the dawn ofdays he's going to kill you.
Since y'all been married sincethe dawn of days, since
dinosaurs roamed Was y'all'sfirst pet a triceratops?
No, I'm kidding, it was apterodactyl.
It was a pterodactyl.
I could see it For some reason.
(29:04):
I can see just you riding on it.
Yeah, pretty much.
You even freaked out the dog abit.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Sorry, there buddy.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
He's afraid of me now , Now that we're fast forward
we're 2025.
We've gotten to play for alittle bit here and there on it,
which we'll talk about it onthe next episode here.
So prepare for that one on thatepisode.
What advice could you giveadults now who are coming into
(29:34):
their adulthood, so from 18 andup?
What advice could you give themnow to help them out in their
life?
What piece of advice could yougive them?
Speaker 2 (29:42):
The most practical one.
Monitor your finances.
Don't extend your credit toomuch.
We had to, like I said, I hadto dig myself out of a financial
nightmare after the divorce.
I would say pick yourcommitments carefully.
(30:03):
It's one thing to have nightflings and all that kind of
stuff.
It's all about the quick hitand the parties and the multiple
partners and all that stuffSometimes sometimes depends on
what you want to do.
But understand that anythingyou want is going to take
investment.
It's going to take investmentand if you are of the mindset
that it needs to be handed toyou on a silver platter for you
(30:23):
to do anything, that's, that'snot.
I'm a baby boomer, right, soyou're hearing a lot of people
are gonna go okay, boomer, um,but I'm of the, I'm of the
generation that you worked for,everything you got right and so
you know, instant gratification,which seems to be the big thing
now, is only a temporary fix.
(30:45):
It's only a temporary thing.
Working on a relationship for along time, um, and knowing
where everybody is in yourdartboard right, in other words,
stewart is right there in themiddle on the, on the bullseye,
and then boys that are collaredto me are probably in the next
next ring, and then closefriends like yourself are there
too, right, I mean, I would, Iwould carla you if I, if I could
(31:08):
.
But no, you've already spokenfor so many other places.
So, and the polyamory thing youhave to understand and respect
those if you are doing apolyamorous relationship.
It is a spider web and you haveto make sure that all these
nodes understand who's got avested interest in you god for
real.
Well, this is the thing, andpolyamory is actually, for me, I
think it's more natural thanmonogamy, and the thing is it
(31:31):
does take maturity.
So I mean to go back to thequestion if you're 18 to 21 or
those really young ages, you'restill working on your maturity.
Right, it's going to take awhile.
Guys, be patient with yourself.
You're going to fuck up.
You're going to do stuff.
God God, I'm just lucky.
My fuck ups were before theinternet.
Oh my God.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
You know, we still in that page.
Aaron, doesn't matter what ageyou are, we're still going to
have those fuck ups.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Oh, yeah, I still have them.
Yeah, we still have them.
Some of the things I just said,stuart's going to say I fucked
up.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
I think one of the main things that I've learned
over the years in my last fiveor six podcasts that I've had
over the, you know you can learnand grow from them, because I
remember some things that I'vesaid to you as well, and I know
that calling out people anddoing certain things and whatnot
can be detrimental to a lot ofpeople.
But I do those call outs forreasons, because it's like you
(32:25):
need to pay attention to whatyou're doing, what you're going
on, because if you're not payingattention to anything that what
is going on in today's life,and it takes an episode or
somebody to do it live, to putyou in the limelight, because
that's where you want to beright and you've been called out
on.
That's where the, that's wherepeople are just like, oh shit,
you know, like or they play thevictim, they play the victim.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
So it's like you.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
You can't play the victim forever.
You've got to realize that whatyou're doing.
I know that I might fall forsome things here and there, and
I I've actually come out of thewoodwork since I look I've
apologized.
Here's this, here's that I voteup to it in writing.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Yeah uh, if you go to fat life, I've just recently
released a collection ofwritings oh, I saw that about
where we'll talk about wherethings went wrong with several
of the boys that are no longerwith me, and most of the time it
was me fucking up right, or itbreaks down to three things
either I fucked up, which is thenorm, or they did something
(33:18):
that was egregious or stewartfor some reason, got offended by
them and out they went right.
And as soon as he vetoes them,I by default, like a christmas
light, have got to say look,it's kind of awkward to try to
play with you somewhere else.
He's, he's, let me do that.
But then he knows who I'm goingto play with.
He's kind of like, well, okay,if you awkward to try to play
with you somewhere else, he's,let me do that.
But then he knows who I'm goingto play with.
He's kind of like, well, okay,if you want to go to that.
(33:39):
He doesn't want to know thatI'm playing with the person
who's seeing them.
Right, there's even some people.
He's forbid me to have contactwith Right.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
I'm not one of them.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
No, you're not.
Obviously, you come over fordinner all the time.
Oh that I haven't stepped onanybody's toes either.
No and no, you wouldn't,because you're a little more
mature, I mean.
But there's some people that Ican play with outside of the
outside of the house and that'sfine.
You know he's like, he's greatwith that.
But there's other people's likeI don't even want you having
(34:09):
contact with them, right them,block them and all that stuff.
So it's like you know it's you.
It can be awkward when thathappens, but yeah, those are the
three things, but most of thetime it was me fucking up or
learning life lessons.
I mean my very first boy in thestories it's called Nella.
I call him Nella and it wasbecause I was so busy being a
(34:31):
title holder for the first timeand taking care of what my needs
were, forgetting.
As a dominant and as the daddy,I need to be watching out for
my boy meeting his needs right.
And when he succeeded me in thetitle uh, of mr sister, leather
is the very last one um, hedidn't really want to do a lot
of it and I got very criticalpublicly about it instead of
talking to him privately.
(34:51):
You know we always say praisein public, criticize in private,
right, and I kind of did theopposite.
So that, along with the factthat he had other influences
going on, and for anybody thatwants to know something about
all the weird names in there,you know like I call him Nella
on here, but if you look at thespelling and put it backwards,
(35:14):
then you'll see what the realname is.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
All the names are spelled backwards on purpose so
they can't be tracked or tracedor anything like that.
Or tagged by mistake and fetlife.
And all of a sudden, if thisperson has a fet life, I got
like, oh shit, cat's talkingabout me.
I was like well, I'm talkingthe truth, or at least the way I
saw it.
Yeah, your perspective of thetruth, right but I what I did is
I owed up to things.
It goes back to what you firstsaid.
I've not only owed up to andspoke about the stories, I've
written them down so they're inwriting and people are seeing
(35:43):
what I'm displaying it andthat's kind of as a leader in
the community.
It's kind of like I've got todo that kind of stuff and be
transparent to a point rightabout stuff and, you know, not
walk around like I am perfectbecause I want to earn my wear
cap every day, and there aredays I just look at myself and I
(36:03):
go what the hell, were theythinking?
Speaker 1 (36:08):
There's not too many masters left.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Some of the masters have moved away from town, the
ones that covered me, me.
It's very sad.
Going back to the opening thingabout masculinity,
unfortunately one of my dearmentors and his wife and their
subs all had to move to anotherstate because they're afraid,
because some of them are trans.
They're afraid to, uh, they'reafraid to stay in texas, so they
(36:32):
moved to a blue state yeah andI that's fair, fair enough, and
I get it.
It's very fair.
I understand that, but it's avery sad thing that I don't have
that mentor in town anymorethat I could go and drive to and
say hey look, I know you'reanother master and I'm supposed
to have it all together now as amaster too.
But I really need advice onthis, right.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Right, right, you know, I get it.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
Just understand, guys , that the leaders in our
community no matter what yourtitle is for them or what
they're doing, your titleholders, your presidents of any
groups and all this stuff theyneed sometimes the support back
when they're always having to dostuff.
I'm thinking of people that arein charge of stuff.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
Especially youngsters , because we know we 18, 19, 20,
21 to 24 years old, we weforget about them.
Sometimes we forget that they,they want to join in on the fun
too as well, and when you'redoing things that are like at a
club, that's 21 and up andthey're excluded, they, they
just want to be able to have funbecause they're already in
(37:32):
adulthood or 18.
But a lot of us don't reallyplay with 18, 19, 20, because
they can't go to the bar, theycan't go.
They can't go to the bar andmeet us because everything is 21
and up, which I get, which Iget.
Right, because it's like that'swhy the dungeons are so popular
.
Yeah, because it's just likeyou know, you want to be able to
play with them, but we alsoforget that they're also human
(37:52):
beings too.
They need they.
They're looking for mentorships.
And it's crazy because I'vealways find doms 18, 19, 20 that
are just like oh, I'm, I'mdominant.
I've been doing this since I was15.
I'm like okay, great, in orderfor you to be more of a dom in
this time and age, but your ageis at now we need to kind of,
you need a mentorship assomebody to get you to where you
(38:13):
need to be in baby steps.
I can introduce you to a fewdoms and whatnot, and masters
too as well, that can kind ofhelp you and guide you along the
way.
That is great.
If you think that you are a domperson, that you can do what
you're doing, we've got to makea name for yourself and you have
to show your skills, because,just because you're here in this
in this day and age, you haveto show your skills.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
In this day and age you have to show your skills.
Oh, and when somebody is thatyoung and claiming they're a
master or a dom or all thatother kind of stuff it's like.
First of all, I don't want tohear about experience when you
were a teenager, that'stechnically getting into some
really interesting taboo stuff.
Taboo stuff that's even taboofor the BDSM community.
But when you call yourself that, are you able to prove your
(38:57):
worth with your techniques andyour abilities and stuff like
that.
I'm not trying to diss somebodywho's young.
They may be a fast burner, theymay be a fast learner and I
know young people that are doingvery well at that stuff.
And it doesn't also mean on theother side that just because
somebody is in their antiqueages like me, with no
replacement parts available,that we automatically know
(39:19):
everything All right.
It is a matter of.
I mean, I've been doing kinkfor about 25 years.
I know from the turn of thecentury because I remember from
the turn of the century.
But I was doing stuff that evenin a place like that, like a
nudist party or something likethat, that had a playroom right,
(39:40):
I not only was wanting to have,you know, sex and all that kind
of stuff, but I was wanting topaddle people or flog them or
right and do all that kind ofstuff and play a little rough
and slap and tickle.
So it was like I was always thekinky one.
They were like I don't know ifI want to play.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
You know he's cute, but he wants to spank me there's
, there's a lot of there's a lotthat goes into it, though, but
yeah, on there, so we'll savethat one for the next, our next
episode here for freaky fridayoh, so we get to talk dirty on
freaky friday.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
We get to talk dirty, oh yes, oh yes.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
So this is behaving um, and I appreciate you coming
on to the mature mish of uh catand you've been uh a hoot and
you've been amazing um on beingon here and I know that you were
on a previous uh youtube video.
Where were you?
Where were you?
That was that was.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
That was uh.
Ltj reads um so shout out tohim yeah, shout out, yeah,
absolutely shout, because he'smy iml brother.
I love him because he ended upbeing contestant number one he
lost it.
When the glitter came outduring the number ceremony and
he realized he was number one,the look on his face was the
face crack of the century.
Speaker 1 (40:44):
That's fucking awesome.
Speaker 2 (40:45):
But Lewis, or LTJ reads he does a show called
Throwing Light and his motto isif you're not throwing light,
you're not acting right.
And that's true because he'strying to show positive things
as well and to meet him, he's tomeet him in person.
He's absolutely a sweetheart.
I mean, I know him, him and Ihave had some conversation.
(41:06):
Like I've had conversationswhen I'm with you, I've had
conversations with Lewis as well.
Right, and this is anotherthing about our community.
It isn't always about theclothes.
It isn't always about theclothes it isn't always about
the bdsm and the play.
It isn't always about throwingthe boy in the sling and
everything else like that.
It's a lot of times about theconnection, the relationships,
the one-on-one conversations, alot of times over coffee or a
(41:27):
hookah or a cigar right.
Those are the big ones.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
I like the hookah ones especially the hookah ones
are always fun, especially whenit was me and you we were
talking on it and all that stuff.
Oh dear God.
So we can find you on there andeverything.
And where can everyone find youat?
On social media?
Speaker 2 (41:42):
On social media.
The biggest place to find me isFetLife, because I really hide
it there.
It's Kat underscore Artemis,and Artemis is spelled like the
goddess of the hunt, so C-A-Tunderscore A-R-T-E-M spelled
like the goddess of the hunt, socat underscore a r, t, e, m, I
s.
Uh, cat and artemis arecapitalized.
You can find me on facebook,but in this last year I have not
(42:03):
posted anything original.
I've been liking things andI've been adding comments here
and there, and there's a reasonwhy because I haven't reached
the year in the day yet since Ilost my job, and so this whole
year I have been not postinganything other than sharing
something once in a while.
But if you look, there's nooriginal postings of my own
(42:23):
there.
Yeah, which?
Speaker 1 (42:25):
made it.
You know you made it very hardto share everything with you.
I'm just like I need you toshare and post because I need
more questions, more peoplethat's why I need you to do it.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
I'm just like on groups, groups, but I didn't say
anything because what's goingto happen is weirdly enough.
Um, the friday of austin kinkweekend will be a year and a day
, the first day I officially wastold I can't go back and be a
teacher.
Really, my official letter thatI received, uh, after the whole
(42:54):
crap happening, I went toschool on the Tuesday and my
principal called me in and askedme if I knew who this person
was, and they blocked her off ofthere.
And then by the middle ofTuesday, people were calling,
blowing up my phone, saying doyou know what's going on?
Do you know what's going on?
And I'm having to try to textthem because I'm teaching.
And so HR meets with me onTuesday afternoon and just tells
(43:15):
me that they're aware of thisand all that stuff.
Show the picture that she'sposting circles.
They have it blown up, theycircle the patch that says suck
my dick on it.
And then they say, okay, we'llgo home, we'll contact you, but
they wait until Tuesday night totell me don't come to work in
the morning and so we'll getback with you.
And so go all day on wednesdaywondering what the fuck are they
(43:37):
going to do?
That is horrible.
And then they wait until 5 30on wednesday to say we're going
to give you your letter.
You need to come to the hroffice.
And I told them okay, call mewhen it is actually in print and
ready to be served.
That's not waiting forsignatures, right?
I told them, I literally wantto come in, get the business
done and get.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
I don't want to sit in a waiting room to and we're
going to pause right there for ato be continued there, because
we're going to go on that withthere for more of a freaky
friday on our podcast.
So tune in more with katartemis here with us on the
mature mischief podcast I he isdefinitely our first host here
on the podcast here and I can'twait to have him more and more
other people to come onto thepodcast to share their
experiences with being an adultin the community and also being
(44:19):
the LGBT member, or even just amember in general, of being just
an adult itself, and Iappreciate you so much for
coming in.
So thank you so much, Iappreciate that.
And tune in on Friday forFreaky Friday for more of Kat
Artemis here on my MatureMischief podcast.
I am your host, jesse James,and Cat is my co-host today,
(44:41):
just time-varying for filling infor Sister D aka DD.
So, dd, I hope you're listeningto the podcast.
We miss you, girl.
Come back on here and we needto get you back, girl.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
Love you.
Speaker 1 (44:52):
Bye.
Host
Jesse James
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