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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Eden (00:01):
So I was late diagnosed.
I only actually got mydiagnosis last summer, which was
an amazing, amazing thing forme because it explained a lot.
And when I first found out andI was telling people and I
thought people were going to sayreally no, that can't be.
But everyone was like yes, yeah.
(00:21):
So that was quite shockingbecause I thought I was masking
super well, right, wasn't um andum yeah, but I would say my
anxiety went from 80 percentmost of the time to maybe like
10 to 20 percent.
(00:42):
That's incredible either.
It just I noticed in the firstmonth because I'd I've had lots
of talking, therapies and stuff,but obviously we didn't know
that was just.
We didn't know my brain wasprocessing differently.
So all the techniques that wetried they worked, but then they
didn't and I felt like a hugefailure and it turned out they
(01:04):
just weren't the righttechniques for me.
And so instead of, for example,if I went into a coffee shop, I
would feel really panicky.
Once I knew actually I hadthese sensory issues, it was
like, oh, I don't feel in danger, it's just there's a spot like
there.
I can hear that fridge buzzing,those people out there having
an argument, and I can hear allof it.
(01:24):
And I'm trying to focus on theperson I'm actually with.
And once I realized that's whatwas going on, I didn't feel in
danger.
But I've been trained to think.
That's what I thought, becausethat's why I must be having
these panic attacks.
Amy (01:39):
Welcome to Advancing with Amy's Mental Health Warrior and
Neuro Spicy Mama, where we diveinto real stories, unfiltered
experiences and powerfulinsights about mental health,
neurodivergence and living yourmost authentic life.
I'm your host, amy, and today'sepisode is all about discovery,
(02:00):
validation and empowerment aswe sit down with the incredible
Eden Gruger.
Eden shares her late-diagnosedautism journey, the challenges
and triumphs of understandingherself and how embracing her
neurodivergence transformed herworld.
This is an honest, heartfeltconversation.
You won't want to miss it.
(02:20):
Let's jump in.
You won't want to miss it.
Let's jump in.
All right, everybody, todaywe're speaking to Eden Gruger,
eden, welcome.
Thank you, amy.
Glad to be here.
Oh, glad to have you.
Eden (02:42):
Tell me a little bit about how you found out that you had
autism.
So it was actually social media.
A lot of people are sneeryabout social media, but it can
work for good as well as ill.
So I followed this couple.
They just popped up on myTikTok and I was interested
because the lady had blue hair.
So it caught my attention andso I followed this couple and
(03:06):
it's called ADHD Love and shehad ADHD and he was apparently
neurotypical.
But the bit that caught myattention was that he said oh,
I've just done thisquestionnaire and I've
discovered that I'm autistic,and they were talking about that
, and so I love questionnaires.
I mean that's a clue in itselfand I thought I'm going to do
that of questionnaires.
I mean that's a clue in itselfand I thought I'm going to do
(03:28):
that, so it's called the RADSquestionnaire.
So I did this, did it, and soit's 60 is the average
neurotypical female score.
The most she could score was200 and I scored 175.
I scored 175.
I know right.
So I laughed for about threequarters of an hour and then I
(03:49):
thought well, that was obviouslywrong.
So I did it again in a bit of atemper and I scored 185.
So then the next day I wastelling my assistants, I was
telling my friends and they werekind of you know, there could
be something in it.
So I started to do someresearch.
The more I heard about autismin females, the more I thought
(04:12):
this sounds familiar.
So I decided to go ahead andget a facial diagnosis.
And yeah, and I did.
That happened last summer andI'm official.
Amy (04:24):
I've got the badge.
So for those out there thatmight think they have autism too
, can you explain a little bitabout what the professional
testing was like?
Eden (04:32):
Yeah, so the first stage with the people that I saw was
that myself, my dad and my bestfriend all did questionnaires
about what I'm like, how Iinteract, what I'm like day to
day, and a lot of myquestionnaire was about the
(04:54):
things that I'm secretlythinking and things that I'm
doing in ways that I felt likethere was a disconnect between
myself and the other people.
So that was the first stage.
And then I went and we had ameeting with a psychologist and
then I had a three-hour meetingwith a speech and language
(05:16):
therapist and they did lots ofdifferent tests.
They didn't feel like tests,but that's because I like tests.
So, but it was kind of almostlike some of them were like word
games, things like that, lovethat stuff, yeah.
And then you go away for anhour, they have a conference
(05:37):
about you, come back and thenthey tell you what they think.
And I did a really autisticthing in my assessment.
So she said yes, we think youare, and so I had a bit of a cry
.
She said why are you crying?
I said because I kind ofthought you would say that, but
(05:57):
to hear that it's a real thing,that's validating but also
confusing.
I was 50 then and it felt likehow can I be 50 and just finding
this out myself?
Um, and then we talked a bitand then it went quiet and I
thought, ah, it's, it's comingto an end, now it's time for us
to go.
And then the chat started upagain.
I was, okay, no, it's not timeto go.
(06:17):
And then it died down again.
I thought, oh, it's time to go.
And no, it wasn't.
And this happened three or fourtimes and in the end there was a
.
I said sorry, is this the timewhen I go?
I was like when is this goingto end?
I don't know the signals.
I'm much better If I go tosomeone's house.
I'd much rather they say youknow, I'll drop you off at seven
(06:37):
or I've got people coming, so Iknow when the end is.
Like how do you really knowwhen is the end?
How do you know?
How do you know you're not outstaying, you're welcome.
Are they really thinking, oh, Iwish you would go, or are they
happy that you're there?
How do you know?
I don't know, right?
So yeah, so yeah, it was reallyfun.
And I cried all the way home Ihave to say that home and I was
(07:01):
saying to my best friend who'dgone with me.
Well, maybe they made a mistake.
And she said I love you.
They didn't make a mistake andwe all need that friend, so yeah
, Well that's good, that yourfriends and family support you.
Yeah, I mean, I think my dad, mydad's 78.
So he is just kind of reallyunsure about the whole thing
(07:30):
because he feels like, well, wedidn't have it.
And when he was on holiday Iphoned him to tell him the
results and he said, well, whatare they going to do about it?
That was his first instinct.
Well, what are they going to doabout it?
And I said, well, short of abrain transplant, you're stuck
with me.
This is how I am.
Good news, also less good news,and we just had a bit of a
laugh about it.
(07:52):
But, yeah, I think because I wasthe disruptive child.
I was a child that always hadthe questions that you might ask
me to do something, and I'mgoing to clarify that.
You know which, when you're achild and when you grew up in
the 70s, that was not a goodlook, you know.
It's just, I've told you to dothis.
I'm the parent, you will do thething, and I'd be.
(08:13):
I will do it, but I want toknow why.
I want to know what's this, andthat was tricky for them, for
sure.
That makes sense, and I was veryyeah, I was very into
everything and you know I wasthat, I was the autistic kid
that liked reading encyclopedias.
I was that kind of autistic kid.
So, yeah, I was all right withreading, but you know I I guess
(08:37):
I was not the easiest to parentwhen you didn't have the full
manual that's a good way to lookat it.
Amy (08:44):
You didn't have the full manual.
I love that, yeah, yeah,because when my daughter was
finally diagnosed at 12, Itotally changed the way I parent
her.
It was a whole new world.
So yeah, that diagnosis doeshelp.
Eden (08:59):
And that's fabulous that you were able to say that what
you were doing maybe wasn't theright fit for her and it would
be fantastic for another kid,but you needed to do it
differently and I think that's areally precious thing if you
can be that parent, right, right.
Amy (09:14):
Yeah, because my son has ADHD, but that's it.
And I had parented him the wayI had started parenting my
daughter and it was not workingthe way I had started parenting
my daughter and it was not worthreading.
So tell me a little bit more,because you also said I was
reading that you have a littlebit of trouble being alone.
(09:35):
Can you talk?
Eden (09:36):
about that a little bit.
Yeah, so, because I always hadsuper high anxiety, mainly
because of these sensory issues,because I didn't know I had,
and I was told I was put intotherapy as soon as I, you know,
I was, I think, about 12, assoon as it really started and
and I just I had this phobia ofbeing alone.
(09:58):
It's hard to say where it camefrom.
There's a million reasons andno reasons, if you know what I
mean.
And I went into therapy andthere was lots of different
techniques that they tried, thatthey offered to me, including
medication which I refused totake, and none of the solutions
(10:19):
that they offered seemed to makethe science a bit different.
And they would ask me, as a 12and 13-year-old well, how do you
feel?
I don't know, I don't know.
And because I didn't have thelanguage and even as I grew
older, I have a lot of feelings,but actually articulating what
(10:45):
they are, that's a differentkettle of fish and it's, yeah, a
lot of times people think andI've heard lots of people say,
oh, autistic people, they don'thave a full range of feelings.
Yeah, we really, really do,it's just that we don't
articulate them in the same wayand also we can't name them.
It's just that we don'tarticulate them in the same way
(11:05):
and also we can't name them.
It's just a big feeling, and somy feelings were coming out in
panic attacks, and then thisgradually turned into a phobia,
of a real phobia of being on myown, which, as you can imagine,
is tricky that's understatementof the millennium.
(11:26):
Yeah, so that's been reallytricky.
I, you know I'm working on itall the time, but yeah, I'm just
never on my own at the moment,and that's a shame, because I
love my own comfort.
Amy (11:41):
So do you live alone.
Eden (11:44):
So do you live alone?
So I have my own home, but I soI have.
So here in the UK there'ssomething called a personal
budget that you can get if youare a disabled person, that
everybody's entitled to apersonal budget.
Now don't get me wrong, youhave to fight for it.
They don't just give it to you.
But if you, if you haveapprovable needs that you need
(12:10):
support to do to live anindependent life, which luckily
I was able to prove that and Ifought for it and I got a budget
.
So I have some money that meansthat I can employ assistance.
So I, when I'm home, I havesome money that means that I can
employ assistance.
So when I'm home, I have myassistants at home with me and
otherwise I'm with my dad, andluckily I always say he's my dad
(12:35):
, but he's also my mate, sowe're really fortunate that we
get on and he's very mellow,which is handy.
Amy (12:42):
That is nice.
Well, it's good that you founda way to kind of work around it
and to give yourself a good life.
Eden (12:50):
Yeah.
Amy (12:51):
Yeah.
Eden (12:51):
I would like, you know, I would like my independence back
and you know, and it is a workin progress, I've not given up
on it, but it's tricky to it'stricky to maneuver.
I mean, everyone's got stuff intheir life that's tricky to
it's tricky to maneuver.
I mean everyone's got stuff intheir life that's tricky.
You know, I'm not out of theordinary.
My circumstances might appearout of the ordinary, but we've
(13:14):
all got stuff.
Amy (13:16):
Oh, definitely.
Can you tell me a little aboutwhat exactly happens when you
have an anxiety attack?
What exactly?
Eden (13:24):
happens when you have an anxiety attack.
Yeah, so for me it is aninstantaneous.
It's like my what I call my mebrain.
So my I'm currently 51, so my51-year-old brain turns off and
it's like I can't process whatI'm supposed to be doing.
(13:45):
I have, obviously, all theclassics the shaking, the
palpitations, the feeling faint,the breathlessness, the wobbly
legs, pins and needles in thehand.
I have all the classics, thegood old classics.
But I also feel I think the bestway to describe it is I feel
(14:06):
like I need to escape myself.
I think that's the best way Ican explain it and you can't do
that.
I tend to um, I want to run,but you can't run because that's
not safe and also my legs arewobbly, I can't breathe.
How am I going to be running?
(14:26):
So, yeah, in the moment itfeels the worst.
I know, intellectually andlogically, you know, I know that
nothing's going to happen, but,as I've, you know, and there's
lots of memes that say never inthe history of calming down has
anyone ever calmed down frombeing told to calm down, and
(14:48):
that's, you know, logically, Iknow what it is, but in the
moment that does not matter,right?
So what do you do to calm down,so I try to remember to breathe
.
That's a super important one,sounds easy, but I know I talk
to myself.
That's a super important one,sounds easy, but I know I talk
to myself.
I'm a massive verbal processor.
So I talk to myself and Iremind myself that nothing is
(15:13):
actually happening, that I'mokay, I'm wherever I am, and I
will sort of say, oh right, comeon, let's get ourselves a glass
of water and oh, let's chatwith the dog.
And you know, I have thisexternal monologue to try and I
guess, to keep myself presentbecause in the present, nothing
(15:34):
is actually happening.
It's the future worry and alsomaybe past experiences that
couple together, that add fuelto the panic fire.
I think a lot of us maybe likethat, but I'm open to hearing
people's different experiences,for sure.
(15:54):
But yeah, that's I think that'swhat it's me, that I'm
projecting a negative outcome.
So, yeah, I've just tried tokeep myself present and the dog.
If I feel I sing to my dog, hedoesn't like it, but I will do
it One of the disadvantages ofbeing my dog, I'm afraid that's
funny.
(16:15):
It doesn't mean it's funny.
Amy (16:17):
When you're calming down and you've basically got to the
point where you can breatheagain and all that good stuff.
Are you able to go back to whatyou were doing?
Eden (16:30):
Yeah, I try to.
Yeah, I mean what I try to do.
So I'll give you an example.
So for my dad's birthday he's78, but he's still super
adventurous.
So he decided he wanted to doan indoor skydive for his
birthday, which was in March,and I booked it for him.
He asked me to go with him.
(16:51):
I had one of my assistants withme, so he went up on the train
and we drove and met him thereand I assumed that it was going
to be outside, but when we gotthere, no, it was inside this
huge center in London and um Ione of the things as an autistic
person that really bothers meis lines, so I I just don't seem
(17:14):
to be able to filter them.
So we went into this place andthere were floor tiles running
one way and then there was woodcladding going another way, and
then there was ceiling tilesgoing another way, and then
there was spotlight and therewas music and there and I walked
in and I thought, wow, this isa lot.
So we stopped in the entrancehallway, I took some breaths and
I knew that I'm always nearlyalways late for everything.
(17:35):
So I thought, come on, we needto start walking.
I started walking and I juststopped.
I couldn't.
I couldn't walk forward, Icouldn't walk backwards, and I
was talking to my assistant andshe was talking to me and I just
couldn't move and all I wantedwas to get out, because shutting
my eyes wasn't going to help,because I needed to stay present
(17:56):
.
But everywhere I looked it waslike stimulation overload.
I was feeling super panicky.
But we came out, we went back in, we came out, we went back in
and eventually it calmed downand so I I did walk, I will go.
So, if you know, I try to.
I don't want to end on a noteof I had to stop this because I
(18:18):
panicked, because then the nexttime I need to go into that
situation, I should think, yeah,but that I had to leave last
time because I panicked.
It's not a good outcome.
So I need to.
Once I feel okay which, once ithappens then I normally feel,
conversely, really, reallyrelaxed, and I think it's just
because I'm so relieved that I'mnot panicking anymore that I
(18:40):
suddenly feel super relaxed.
I'm like, yeah, I can do that,that's easy, and then I'll do
the thing so you get tired afterthat.
Amy (18:54):
I'm so tired.
Yeah, lover, big lover of theafternoon, nap me too, but I
don't have any excuse, that'snot, you know, um, but no, and I
know.
Eden (18:59):
I think that's the other thing.
That's been a major thing forme to understand that my energy
works.
It doesn't work the way I mightlike it to.
So if I've done something andit's a big thing I'm going to be
tired.
If I've had an eight nights andI'm asking myself to do
something, it's going to be moreof a problem.
If I haven't eaten properly,it's going to be a problem.
So I need to take I really needto take care of myself we all do
(19:23):
but I need to be extra mindfulto make sure that I've eaten not
just a breakfast, but a properbreakfast with lots of protein,
so that I've got the energy todo the thing.
And then I will need a latenight, an early night, if I've
had a late night, to balance itout.
So I think we all have ourquirks and our foibles, and I
(19:48):
think we're all in the sameposition that as we get older,
especially as we head intomidlife, that we want to really
know ourselves and be mindfuland respectful of what we
actually need, and me findingout I was autistic was just
another string to that actuallyneed.
(20:08):
And me finding out I wasautistic was just another string
to that.
Um, you know, so I, yeah.
I think we're probably all onthe same journey, but on
different paths.
Amy (20:13):
Do you look back at your childhood and things stand out
now that you go?
Oh, that makes sense nowdefinitely, yeah, definitely.
Eden (20:22):
Loud noises and things like that were always a big
problem.
And I very clearly remember Iwas in infant school, so I guess
I was four, maybe five and wewere having a music lesson and
they were drumming and it wasdriving me nuts.
And this kid and I evenremember his name I won't say it
, but he even remember his firstand surname and he started
(20:44):
screaming and I thought, oh well, I can't scream now, even
though I'd love to, becausethey're going to think I'm just
copying him.
That's why girls are maskingthat's funny, but you know I
don't.
I learned to read um before Iwent to school and they were
sending me from the infantschool across to the junior
school to go to their librarybecause I'd read all the infant
(21:06):
books and I was too advanced forwhat they could offer.
Again, I think that's quite anaverage autistic experience.
Yeah, I agree, at least with mydaughter, at least.
Amy (21:18):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So when you're having thisexperience, do you notice at all
what other people are, howthey're reacting to it, or do
you worry about that, or are youjust too in the moment?
I?
Eden (21:32):
think that when I was younger I was super focused on
what other people were thinking.
As I've got older and I'veasked people that have been with
me, they say from the outsideyou wouldn't know anything was
happening and so it's all redalarm inside, but on the outside
it's all calm, which in a wayis good because you know it
(21:57):
means that I can pass throughthe world as an acceptable human
being.
Even the fact that I say thatshows how I really feel about it
, that you know, having panicdisorders and stuff is not
socially acceptable.
It's not because you're beinginconvenient.
You're probably being loud, youmight be being disruptive, and
(22:19):
that's not how society is set up.
Amy (22:22):
You need to just be mellow, be quiet, earn your money, pay
your taxes, shut up and yeah,not doing that, unfortunately we
have another question, um doyou have friends or do you know
anybody else?
That is a female adult withautism um, so not officially,
(22:44):
but um.
Eden (22:46):
So I struggled terribly with friendships.
Female friendships were acomplete bizarre experience to
me, because I am very blunt andum, and people will be talking
to you about things and theydon't want to hear that you
(23:07):
think their boyfriend isabsolutely bad news or that
they're making terrible lifechoices or that their dress
looks horrible.
I now know these things, butwhen, particularly when I was
younger, and I would just thinkbut surely people want the truth
and the truth is, amy, no, theydon't right they don't.
I do and and a lot of people do,but they don't want the pure,
(23:30):
unadulterated, unfiltered truth.
They want a managed truth.
Yeah, um so, but I have.
I've definitely learned to bebetter but and and.
So because I didn't, I triedreally hard to fit in and I
think if you're trying to fit inbut you don't, it is jarring to
people because they knowsomething's off and they don't
(23:50):
know what it is.
But it's incongruous becausethey know something's not right
but you're presenting as if youare like them, but they can sort
of tell somehow that you're not.
So, yeah, it didn't go well.
However, in the last year, I'vemade a couple of really, really
good friends, sort of say sincethe beginning of 2024.
(24:11):
And one of those, she wasdiagnosed with ADHD, which I
know it's different.
We are on a wavelength.
And then I have another reallyreally excellent friend, who is
even blunter than me, which Ilove, and I spoke to her just
before I came on to speak to youand she said I know I'm not
(24:33):
diagnosed, but I'm definitelysomething.
And I said you are definitelysomething and I'm sure she's
definitely neurodiverse.
Because yeah've just, and we,our conversations, they start in
one place and they go, and oneminute we're talking about this
and then we one of us haschanged it, but we pick up the
ball and we just run.
We're just there so yeah, andthen I have another friend who
(24:58):
is a bit younger, who is reallyautistic, is waiting on her
official diagnosis.
Yeah, and you know that'sreally interesting seeing how
she's coping with that.
With someone in their 20s it'sa really different experience
because she's still got all thatdesire to fit in Right.
Amy (25:18):
I'm curious when you say you were blunt and now you've
learned not to be you knowpretty much Do you get bothered
by that feeling?
Is it like, oh my God, I wantto say this, but I can't?
Eden (25:32):
Sometimes, but I think when I so my big thing would be
if somebody was really annoyingme, I would want to say you are
really annoying me and this iswhy you're annoying me and I
need you to stop, because I feellike I want to punch you.
(25:53):
I'm not going to punch anybody,it's just that I.
It's that level of annoyance.
But what I've realized is thatI might just I absolutely might
be that annoyed, but is thatperson going to feel okay with
that message, Because theyaren't wanting to annoy me?
Or is there a different waythat I could say?
(26:16):
Is there a different way Icould say or I've just I've
literally just listened to theMel Robbins book Let them so,
let them do whatever, let me dowhatever.
And honestly, that's been a gamechanger, because you know, if
someone's being annoying or ifthere's something that I think
(26:39):
I'll just say this thing becauseI think they're doing whatever
or whatever, that I just say tomyself just say this thing,
because I think they're doingwhatever or whatever.
That I just say to myself.
Do you know what?
Let them be annoying, let themmake this mistake, let me just
be here for them if things don'tgo well, let me carry on being
their cheerleader.
Let me remove myself.
Let me put my earbuds in, so Ihaven't got to listen to this
Something other than me saying,do you know what?
(27:02):
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Because if you, even if you arein my world, I'm saying things
with the deepest love andrespect.
It's not received like thatright and that's not good,
because I love the people andI'm not wanting to hurt them or
squish their feelings.
(27:23):
That makes sense.
Amy (27:26):
yeah and I.
I listened to that audiobooktoo, and it was amazing.
It makes you much more relaxedwhen you're in a situation that
is not, you know, the optimumdefinitely and and as humans,
she's absolutely right.
Eden (27:41):
we feel safe when we're in control, and we are not in
control of the vast majority ofeverything.
Amy (27:48):
Oh, that's so true.
The only thing we're in controlof is how we react to things.
Eden (27:54):
Absolutely.
Amy (27:55):
Yeah, Now you've actually written?
Eden (28:02):
have you written about these subjects?
So I have written for justchecking for myself.
Yes, I've written four fictioncollections that are
particularly the one aboutfriendship is very much from the
point of view of being aneurodiverse woman navigating
female friendships the firstthree that I'd written before I
(28:25):
even knew I was autistic.
But people have read them andsaid, yeah, you, you can tell
that you're writing from adifferent point of view.
So I don't think I could writein a different way because I am
myself.
So you know, I know we, we arewriting.
We're not writing aboutourselves, but I think if your
brain works in this differentway, you can't help but write in
(28:50):
the way that your brain works.
I don't, that's Right, right.
So I have my four fictioncollections, which are
collections of short storiesaround topics.
So the first one's dating.
The second one is calledlaughing at myself.
The second one, and that was alot about mess-ups that I have
(29:12):
made a lot of times throughbeing diverse and not knowing,
and I've just learned to laughat myself.
Because what else are you goingto do?
I don't want to sit in a cornercrying and feeling miserable
about myself.
I want to be able to laugh atmyself.
So that was that one.
And then there's Friends, andthen there's another one which
(29:33):
is just a short collectioncalled Funny Bird, and that was
a range of things.
There's one about a taxi driver, there's one about a therapist.
You know, that's a bit of aanti-collection collection.
Yeah.
Amy (29:46):
I'm really interested in in the book that you wrote about
friendship.
So what is that?
A book that would be good for ateenager at all?
I'm wondering about my daughterpotentially potentially, I mean
, it's not got.
Eden (30:01):
I think that female friendship, yeah, I mean, I
would say that, um, you know,once a teenager gets to a point
where they're a real teenagerand they're not like a child on
the cusp, and they are reallyquestioning how is this working,
yeah, I like to think that anywoman, young or older, would be
(30:29):
able to read it and think alsoit's not just me.
You know, there are thingsabout female friendship that are
confusing, that there are waysof being that are not
necessarily okay, and we talkvery much and it's absolutely
great that we talk to cheerleadeach other, but there are some
people they're not good for youand they shouldn't get to be
your friend because they're notgood enough, and that's talked
(30:51):
about in.
You know some of the stories aswell, that you know things that
are not great and you know howthe characters navigate that.
So, yeah, what's the name ofthe book?
Friends Like these.
Oh, I like that, and that comesfrom the.
You know the saying we'refriends like these who need
enemies.
Amy (31:12):
I like that.
That is clever Good, All right.
Well, I have really enjoyedtalking to you today, so is
there anything you'd like to sayto listeners that might be
going through the same thingright now wondering hey, I'm 50,
is it even worth gettingdiagnosed?
I?
Eden (31:31):
think, personally, it is worth getting diagnosed, if
nothing else but to validateyour experience.
Your experience, so and it is aself-diagnosis, and that's
where I started that's reallyimportant, really important to
(31:52):
know who you are, why you areand what do you need to do to be
your most content and calmversion of yourself.
But as, particularly if we aredealing with professionals,
everything has got to be anxietyor hormone, doesn't it?
That's our choices.
(32:12):
You can be anxious anddepressed, or you can have weird
hormones.
You can't just have somethingelse or be different or need
something else, and so I thinkanything that enables us to go
to these professionals when weneed help, support, advice,
treatment for anything, foranything at all, if we can say,
(32:37):
look, this is my situation, thisis the reality, and get it on
your records, so much the better.
Amy (32:45):
Yeah, I love that.
I tend to agree with you.
I think a diagnosis is veryhelpful.
Well, thank you so much forcoming on today, Eden.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you so much for joining uson this episode of Advancing
with Amy's Mental Health Warriorand NeuroSpicy Mama.
A huge thank you to our guestEden for sharing her story with
(33:07):
such honesty, humor and wisdom.
If Eden's journey resonatedwith you or you learned
something new about autism oranxiety or the power of
self-discovery, remember you'renot alone and it's never too
late to understand yourself moredeeply.
If you enjoyed today'sconversation, be sure to
subscribe, leave a review andshare this episode with someone
(33:30):
who needs it.
Until next time, keep advancing, warrior.
Thank you.
So I was late diagnosed.
I only actually got mydiagnosis last summer, which was
an amazing, amazing thing forme because it explained a lot.
And when I first found out andI was telling people and I
thought people were going to sayreally no, that can't be.
But everyone was like yes, yeah.
(00:21):
So that was quite shockingbecause I thought I was masking
super well, right, wasn't um andum yeah, but I would say my
anxiety went from 80 percentmost of the time to maybe like
10 to 20 percent.
(00:42):
That's incredible either.
It just I noticed in the firstmonth because I'd I've had lots
of talking, therapies and stuff,but obviously we didn't know
that was just.
We didn't know my brain wasprocessing differently.
So all the techniques that wetried they worked, but then they
didn't and I felt like a hugefailure and it turned out they
(01:04):
just weren't the righttechniques for me.
And so instead of, for example,if I went into a coffee shop, I
would feel really panicky.
Once I knew actually I hadthese sensory issues, it was
like, oh, I don't feel in danger, it's just there's a spot like
there.
I can hear that fridge buzzing,those people out there having
an argument, and I can hear allof it.
(01:24):
And I'm trying to focus on theperson I'm actually with.
And once I realized that's whatwas going on, I didn't feel in
danger.
But I've been trained to think.
That's what I thought, becausethat's why I must be having
these panic attacks.
Amy (01:39):
Welcome to Advancing with Amy's Mental Health Warrior and
Neuro Spicy Mama, where we diveinto real stories, unfiltered
experiences and powerfulinsights about mental health,
neurodivergence and living yourmost authentic life.
I'm your host, amy, and today'sepisode is all about discovery,
(02:00):
validation and empowerment aswe sit down with the incredible
Eden Gruger.
Eden shares her late-diagnosedautism journey, the challenges
and triumphs of understandingherself and how embracing her
neurodivergence transformed herworld.
This is an honest, heartfeltconversation.
You won't want to miss it.
(02:20):
Let's jump in.
You won't want to miss it.
Let's jump in.
All right, everybody, todaywe're speaking to Eden Gruger,
eden, welcome.
Thank you, amy.
Glad to be here.
Oh, glad to have you.
Eden (02:42):
Tell me a little bit about how you found out that you had
autism.
So it was actually social media.
A lot of people are sneeryabout social media, but it can
work for good as well as ill.
So I followed this couple.
They just popped up on myTikTok and I was interested
because the lady had blue hair.
So it caught my attention andso I followed this couple and
(03:06):
it's called ADHD Love and shehad ADHD and he was apparently
neurotypical.
But the bit that caught myattention was that he said oh,
I've just done thisquestionnaire and I've
discovered that I'm autistic,and they were talking about that
, and so I love questionnaires.
I mean that's a clue in itselfand I thought I'm going to do
that of questionnaires.
I mean that's a clue in itselfand I thought I'm going to do
(03:28):
that, so it's called the RADSquestionnaire.
So I did this, did it, and soit's 60 is the average
neurotypical female score.
The most she could score was200 and I scored 175.
I scored 175.
I know right.
So I laughed for about threequarters of an hour and then I
(03:49):
thought well, that was obviouslywrong.
So I did it again in a bit of atemper and I scored 185.
So then the next day I wastelling my assistants, I was
telling my friends and they werekind of you know, there could
be something in it.
So I started to do someresearch.
The more I heard about autismin females, the more I thought
(04:12):
this sounds familiar.
So I decided to go ahead andget a facial diagnosis.
And yeah, and I did.
That happened last summer andI'm official.
Amy (04:24):
I've got the badge.
So for those out there thatmight think they have autism too
, can you explain a little bitabout what the professional
testing was like?
Eden (04:32):
Yeah, so the first stage with the people that I saw was
that myself, my dad and my bestfriend all did questionnaires
about what I'm like, how Iinteract, what I'm like day to
day, and a lot of myquestionnaire was about the
(04:54):
things that I'm secretlythinking and things that I'm
doing in ways that I felt likethere was a disconnect between
myself and the other people.
So that was the first stage.
And then I went and we had ameeting with a psychologist and
then I had a three-hour meetingwith a speech and language
(05:16):
therapist and they did lots ofdifferent tests.
They didn't feel like tests,but that's because I like tests.
So, but it was kind of almostlike some of them were like word
games, things like that, lovethat stuff, yeah.
And then you go away for anhour, they have a conference
(05:37):
about you, come back and thenthey tell you what they think.
And I did a really autisticthing in my assessment.
So she said yes, we think youare, and so I had a bit of a cry
.
She said why are you crying?
I said because I kind ofthought you would say that, but
(05:57):
to hear that it's a real thing,that's validating but also
confusing.
I was 50 then and it felt likehow can I be 50 and just finding
this out myself?
Um, and then we talked a bitand then it went quiet and I
thought, ah, it's, it's comingto an end, now it's time for us
to go.
And then the chat started upagain.
I was, okay, no, it's not timeto go.
(06:17):
And then it died down again.
I thought, oh, it's time to go.
And no, it wasn't.
And this happened three or fourtimes and in the end there was a
.
I said sorry, is this the timewhen I go?
I was like when is this goingto end?
I don't know the signals.
I'm much better If I go tosomeone's house.
I'd much rather they say youknow, I'll drop you off at seven
(06:37):
or I've got people coming, so Iknow when the end is.
Like how do you really knowwhen is the end?
How do you know?
How do you know you're not outstaying, you're welcome.
Are they really thinking, oh, Iwish you would go, or are they
happy that you're there?
How do you know?
I don't know, right?
So yeah, so yeah, it was reallyfun.
And I cried all the way home Ihave to say that home and I was
(07:01):
saying to my best friend who'dgone with me.
Well, maybe they made a mistake.
And she said I love you.
They didn't make a mistake andwe all need that friend, so yeah
, Well that's good, that yourfriends and family support you.
Yeah, I mean, I think my dad, mydad's 78.
So he is just kind of reallyunsure about the whole thing
(07:30):
because he feels like, well, wedidn't have it.
And when he was on holiday Iphoned him to tell him the
results and he said, well, whatare they going to do about it?
That was his first instinct.
Well, what are they going to doabout it?
And I said, well, short of abrain transplant, you're stuck
with me.
This is how I am.
Good news, also less good news,and we just had a bit of a
laugh about it.
(07:52):
But, yeah, I think because I wasthe disruptive child.
I was a child that always hadthe questions that you might ask
me to do something, and I'mgoing to clarify that.
You know which, when you're achild and when you grew up in
the 70s, that was not a goodlook, you know.
It's just, I've told you to dothis.
I'm the parent, you will do thething, and I'd be.
(08:13):
I will do it, but I want toknow why.
I want to know what's this, andthat was tricky for them, for
sure.
That makes sense, and I was veryyeah, I was very into
everything and you know I wasthat, I was the autistic kid
that liked reading encyclopedias.
I was that kind of autistic kid.
So, yeah, I was all right withreading, but you know I I guess
(08:37):
I was not the easiest to parentwhen you didn't have the full
manual that's a good way to lookat it.
Amy (08:44):
You didn't have the full manual.
I love that, yeah, yeah,because when my daughter was
finally diagnosed at 12, Itotally changed the way I parent
her.
It was a whole new world.
So yeah, that diagnosis doeshelp.
Eden (08:59):
And that's fabulous that you were able to say that what
you were doing maybe wasn't theright fit for her and it would
be fantastic for another kid,but you needed to do it
differently and I think that's areally precious thing if you
can be that parent, right, right.
Amy (09:14):
Yeah, because my son has ADHD, but that's it.
And I had parented him the wayI had started parenting my
daughter and it was not workingthe way I had started parenting
my daughter and it was not worthreading.
So tell me a little bit more,because you also said I was
reading that you have a littlebit of trouble being alone.
(09:35):
Can you talk?
Eden (09:36):
about that a little bit.
Yeah, so, because I always hadsuper high anxiety, mainly
because of these sensory issues,because I didn't know I had,
and I was told I was put intotherapy as soon as I, you know,
I was, I think, about 12, assoon as it really started and
and I just I had this phobia ofbeing alone.
(09:58):
It's hard to say where it camefrom.
There's a million reasons andno reasons, if you know what I
mean.
And I went into therapy andthere was lots of different
techniques that they tried, thatthey offered to me, including
medication which I refused totake, and none of the solutions
(10:19):
that they offered seemed to makethe science a bit different.
And they would ask me, as a 12and 13-year-old well, how do you
feel?
I don't know, I don't know.
And because I didn't have thelanguage and even as I grew
older, I have a lot of feelings,but actually articulating what
(10:45):
they are, that's a differentkettle of fish and it's, yeah, a
lot of times people think andI've heard lots of people say,
oh, autistic people, they don'thave a full range of feelings.
Yeah, we really, really do,it's just that we don't
articulate them in the same wayand also we can't name them.
It's just that we don'tarticulate them in the same way
(11:05):
and also we can't name them.
It's just a big feeling, and somy feelings were coming out in
panic attacks, and then thisgradually turned into a phobia,
of a real phobia of being on myown, which, as you can imagine,
is tricky that's understatementof the millennium.
(11:26):
Yeah, so that's been reallytricky.
I, you know I'm working on itall the time, but yeah, I'm just
never on my own at the moment,and that's a shame, because I
love my own comfort.
Amy (11:41):
So do you live alone.
Eden (11:44):
So do you live alone?
So I have my own home, but I soI have.
So here in the UK there'ssomething called a personal
budget that you can get if youare a disabled person, that
everybody's entitled to apersonal budget.
Now don't get me wrong, youhave to fight for it.
They don't just give it to you.
But if you, if you haveapprovable needs that you need
(12:10):
support to do to live anindependent life, which luckily
I was able to prove that and Ifought for it and I got a budget
.
So I have some money that meansthat I can employ assistance.
So I, when I'm home, I havesome money that means that I can
employ assistance.
So when I'm home, I have myassistants at home with me and
otherwise I'm with my dad, andluckily I always say he's my dad
(12:35):
, but he's also my mate, sowe're really fortunate that we
get on and he's very mellow,which is handy.
Amy (12:42):
That is nice.
Well, it's good that you founda way to kind of work around it
and to give yourself a good life.
Eden (12:50):
Yeah.
Amy (12:51):
Yeah.
Eden (12:51):
I would like, you know, I would like my independence back
and you know, and it is a workin progress, I've not given up
on it, but it's tricky to it'stricky to maneuver.
I mean, everyone's got stuff intheir life that's tricky to
it's tricky to maneuver.
I mean everyone's got stuff intheir life that's tricky.
You know, I'm not out of theordinary.
My circumstances might appearout of the ordinary, but we've
(13:14):
all got stuff.
Amy (13:16):
Oh, definitely.
Can you tell me a little aboutwhat exactly happens when you
have an anxiety attack?
What exactly?
Eden (13:24):
happens when you have an anxiety attack.
Yeah, so for me it is aninstantaneous.
It's like my what I call my mebrain.
So my I'm currently 51, so my51-year-old brain turns off and
it's like I can't process whatI'm supposed to be doing.
(13:45):
I have, obviously, all theclassics the shaking, the
palpitations, the feeling faint,the breathlessness, the wobbly
legs, pins and needles in thehand.
I have all the classics, thegood old classics.
But I also feel I think the bestway to describe it is I feel
(14:06):
like I need to escape myself.
I think that's the best way Ican explain it and you can't do
that.
I tend to um, I want to run,but you can't run because that's
not safe and also my legs arewobbly, I can't breathe.
How am I going to be running?
(14:26):
So, yeah, in the moment itfeels the worst.
I know, intellectually andlogically, you know, I know that
nothing's going to happen, but,as I've, you know, and there's
lots of memes that say never inthe history of calming down has
anyone ever calmed down frombeing told to calm down, and
(14:48):
that's, you know, logically, Iknow what it is, but in the
moment that does not matter,right?
So what do you do to calm down,so I try to remember to breathe
.
That's a super important one,sounds easy, but I know I talk
to myself.
That's a super important one,sounds easy, but I know I talk
to myself.
I'm a massive verbal processor.
So I talk to myself and Iremind myself that nothing is
(15:13):
actually happening, that I'mokay, I'm wherever I am, and I
will sort of say, oh right, comeon, let's get ourselves a glass
of water and oh, let's chatwith the dog.
And you know, I have thisexternal monologue to try and I
guess, to keep myself presentbecause in the present, nothing
(15:34):
is actually happening.
It's the future worry and alsomaybe past experiences that
couple together, that add fuelto the panic fire.
I think a lot of us maybe likethat, but I'm open to hearing
people's different experiences,for sure.
(15:54):
But yeah, that's I think that'swhat it's me, that I'm
projecting a negative outcome.
So, yeah, I've just tried tokeep myself present and the dog.
If I feel I sing to my dog, hedoesn't like it, but I will do
it One of the disadvantages ofbeing my dog, I'm afraid that's
funny.
(16:15):
It doesn't mean it's funny.
Amy (16:17):
When you're calming down and you've basically got to the
point where you can breatheagain and all that good stuff.
Are you able to go back to whatyou were doing?
Eden (16:30):
Yeah, I try to.
Yeah, I mean what I try to do.
So I'll give you an example.
So for my dad's birthday he's78, but he's still super
adventurous.
So he decided he wanted to doan indoor skydive for his
birthday, which was in March,and I booked it for him.
He asked me to go with him.
(16:51):
I had one of my assistants withme, so he went up on the train
and we drove and met him thereand I assumed that it was going
to be outside, but when we gotthere, no, it was inside this
huge center in London and um Ione of the things as an autistic
person that really bothers meis lines, so I I just don't seem
(17:14):
to be able to filter them.
So we went into this place andthere were floor tiles running
one way and then there was woodcladding going another way, and
then there was ceiling tilesgoing another way, and then
there was spotlight and therewas music and there and I walked
in and I thought, wow, this isa lot.
So we stopped in the entrancehallway, I took some breaths and
I knew that I'm always nearlyalways late for everything.
(17:35):
So I thought, come on, we needto start walking.
I started walking and I juststopped.
I couldn't.
I couldn't walk forward, Icouldn't walk backwards, and I
was talking to my assistant andshe was talking to me and I just
couldn't move and all I wantedwas to get out, because shutting
my eyes wasn't going to help,because I needed to stay present
(17:56):
.
But everywhere I looked it waslike stimulation overload.
I was feeling super panicky.
But we came out, we went back in, we came out, we went back in
and eventually it calmed downand so I I did walk, I will go.
So, if you know, I try to.
I don't want to end on a noteof I had to stop this because I
(18:18):
panicked, because then the nexttime I need to go into that
situation, I should think, yeah,but that I had to leave last
time because I panicked.
It's not a good outcome.
So I need to.
Once I feel okay which, once ithappens then I normally feel,
conversely, really, reallyrelaxed, and I think it's just
because I'm so relieved that I'mnot panicking anymore that I
(18:40):
suddenly feel super relaxed.
I'm like, yeah, I can do that,that's easy, and then I'll do
the thing so you get tired afterthat.
Amy (18:54):
I'm so tired.
Yeah, lover, big lover of theafternoon, nap me too, but I
don't have any excuse, that'snot, you know, um, but no, and I
know.
Eden (18:59):
I think that's the other thing.
That's been a major thing forme to understand that my energy
works.
It doesn't work the way I mightlike it to.
So if I've done something andit's a big thing I'm going to be
tired.
If I've had an eight nights andI'm asking myself to do
something, it's going to be moreof a problem.
If I haven't eaten properly,it's going to be a problem.
So I need to take I really needto take care of myself we all do
(19:23):
but I need to be extra mindfulto make sure that I've eaten not
just a breakfast, but a properbreakfast with lots of protein,
so that I've got the energy todo the thing.
And then I will need a latenight, an early night, if I've
had a late night, to balance itout.
So I think we all have ourquirks and our foibles, and I
(19:48):
think we're all in the sameposition that as we get older,
especially as we head intomidlife, that we want to really
know ourselves and be mindfuland respectful of what we
actually need, and me findingout I was autistic was just
another string to that actuallyneed.
(20:08):
And me finding out I wasautistic was just another string
to that.
Um, you know, so I, yeah.
I think we're probably all onthe same journey, but on
different paths.
Amy (20:13):
Do you look back at your childhood and things stand out
now that you go?
Oh, that makes sense nowdefinitely, yeah, definitely.
Eden (20:22):
Loud noises and things like that were always a big
problem.
And I very clearly remember Iwas in infant school, so I guess
I was four, maybe five and wewere having a music lesson and
they were drumming and it wasdriving me nuts.
And this kid and I evenremember his name I won't say it
, but he even remember his firstand surname and he started
(20:44):
screaming and I thought, oh well, I can't scream now, even
though I'd love to, becausethey're going to think I'm just
copying him.
That's why girls are maskingthat's funny, but you know I
don't.
I learned to read um before Iwent to school and they were
sending me from the infantschool across to the junior
school to go to their librarybecause I'd read all the infant
(21:06):
books and I was too advanced forwhat they could offer.
Again, I think that's quite anaverage autistic experience.
Yeah, I agree, at least with mydaughter, at least.
Amy (21:18):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So when you're having thisexperience, do you notice at all
what other people are, howthey're reacting to it, or do
you worry about that, or are youjust too in the moment?
I?
Eden (21:32):
think that when I was younger I was super focused on
what other people were thinking.
As I've got older and I'veasked people that have been with
me, they say from the outsideyou wouldn't know anything was
happening and so it's all redalarm inside, but on the outside
it's all calm, which in a wayis good because you know it
(21:57):
means that I can pass throughthe world as an acceptable human
being.
Even the fact that I say thatshows how I really feel about it
, that you know, having panicdisorders and stuff is not
socially acceptable.
It's not because you're beinginconvenient.
You're probably being loud, youmight be being disruptive, and
(22:19):
that's not how society is set up.
Amy (22:22):
You need to just be mellow, be quiet, earn your money, pay
your taxes, shut up and yeah,not doing that, unfortunately we
have another question, um doyou have friends or do you know
anybody else?
That is a female adult withautism um, so not officially,
(22:44):
but um.
Eden (22:46):
So I struggled terribly with friendships.
Female friendships were acomplete bizarre experience to
me, because I am very blunt andum, and people will be talking
to you about things and theydon't want to hear that you
(23:07):
think their boyfriend isabsolutely bad news or that
they're making terrible lifechoices or that their dress
looks horrible.
I now know these things, butwhen, particularly when I was
younger, and I would just thinkbut surely people want the truth
and the truth is, amy, no, theydon't right they don't.
I do and and a lot of people do,but they don't want the pure,
(23:30):
unadulterated, unfiltered truth.
They want a managed truth.
Yeah, um so, but I have.
I've definitely learned to bebetter but and and.
So because I didn't, I triedreally hard to fit in and I
think if you're trying to fit inbut you don't, it is jarring to
people because they knowsomething's off and they don't
(23:50):
know what it is.
But it's incongruous becausethey know something's not right
but you're presenting as if youare like them, but they can sort
of tell somehow that you're not.
So, yeah, it didn't go well.
However, in the last year, I'vemade a couple of really, really
good friends, sort of say sincethe beginning of 2024.
(24:11):
And one of those, she wasdiagnosed with ADHD, which I
know it's different.
We are on a wavelength.
And then I have another reallyreally excellent friend, who is
even blunter than me, which Ilove, and I spoke to her just
before I came on to speak to youand she said I know I'm not
(24:33):
diagnosed, but I'm definitelysomething.
And I said you are definitelysomething and I'm sure she's
definitely neurodiverse.
Because yeah've just, and we,our conversations, they start in
one place and they go, and oneminute we're talking about this
and then we one of us haschanged it, but we pick up the
ball and we just run.
We're just there so yeah, andthen I have another friend who
(24:58):
is a bit younger, who is reallyautistic, is waiting on her
official diagnosis.
Yeah, and you know that'sreally interesting seeing how
she's coping with that.
With someone in their 20s it'sa really different experience
because she's still got all thatdesire to fit in Right.
Amy (25:18):
I'm curious when you say you were blunt and now you've
learned not to be you knowpretty much Do you get bothered
by that feeling?
Is it like, oh my God, I wantto say this, but I can't?
Eden (25:32):
Sometimes, but I think when I so my big thing would be
if somebody was really annoyingme, I would want to say you are
really annoying me and this iswhy you're annoying me and I
need you to stop, because I feellike I want to punch you.
(25:53):
I'm not going to punch anybody,it's just that I.
It's that level of annoyance.
But what I've realized is thatI might just I absolutely might
be that annoyed, but is thatperson going to feel okay with
that message, Because theyaren't wanting to annoy me?
Or is there a different waythat I could say?
(26:16):
Is there a different way Icould say or I've just I've
literally just listened to theMel Robbins book Let them so,
let them do whatever, let me dowhatever.
And honestly, that's been a gamechanger, because you know, if
someone's being annoying or ifthere's something that I think
(26:39):
I'll just say this thing becauseI think they're doing whatever
or whatever, that I just say tomyself just say this thing,
because I think they're doingwhatever or whatever.
That I just say to myself.
Do you know what?
Let them be annoying, let themmake this mistake, let me just
be here for them if things don'tgo well, let me carry on being
their cheerleader.
Let me remove myself.
Let me put my earbuds in, so Ihaven't got to listen to this
Something other than me saying,do you know what?
(27:02):
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Because if you, even if you arein my world, I'm saying things
with the deepest love andrespect.
It's not received like thatright and that's not good,
because I love the people andI'm not wanting to hurt them or
squish their feelings.
(27:23):
That makes sense.
Amy (27:26):
yeah and I.
I listened to that audiobooktoo, and it was amazing.
It makes you much more relaxedwhen you're in a situation that
is not, you know, the optimumdefinitely and and as humans,
she's absolutely right.
Eden (27:41):
we feel safe when we're in control, and we are not in
control of the vast majority ofeverything.
Amy (27:48):
Oh, that's so true.
The only thing we're in controlof is how we react to things.
Eden (27:54):
Absolutely.
Amy (27:55):
Yeah, Now you've actually written?
Eden (28:02):
have you written about these subjects?
So I have written for justchecking for myself.
Yes, I've written four fictioncollections that are
particularly the one aboutfriendship is very much from the
point of view of being aneurodiverse woman navigating
female friendships the firstthree that I'd written before I
(28:25):
even knew I was autistic.
But people have read them andsaid, yeah, you, you can tell
that you're writing from adifferent point of view.
So I don't think I could writein a different way because I am
myself.
So you know, I know we, we arewriting.
We're not writing aboutourselves, but I think if your
brain works in this differentway, you can't help but write in
(28:50):
the way that your brain works.
I don't, that's Right, right.
So I have my four fictioncollections, which are
collections of short storiesaround topics.
So the first one's dating.
The second one is calledlaughing at myself.
The second one, and that was alot about mess-ups that I have
(29:12):
made a lot of times throughbeing diverse and not knowing,
and I've just learned to laughat myself.
Because what else are you goingto do?
I don't want to sit in a cornercrying and feeling miserable
about myself.
I want to be able to laugh atmyself.
So that was that one.
And then there's Friends, andthen there's another one which
(29:33):
is just a short collectioncalled Funny Bird, and that was
a range of things.
There's one about a taxi driver, there's one about a therapist.
You know, that's a bit of aanti-collection collection.
Yeah.
Amy (29:46):
I'm really interested in in the book that you wrote about
friendship.
So what is that?
A book that would be good for ateenager at all?
I'm wondering about my daughterpotentially potentially, I mean
, it's not got.
Eden (30:01):
I think that female friendship, yeah, I mean, I
would say that, um, you know,once a teenager gets to a point
where they're a real teenagerand they're not like a child on
the cusp, and they are reallyquestioning how is this working,
yeah, I like to think that anywoman, young or older, would be
(30:29):
able to read it and think alsoit's not just me.
You know, there are thingsabout female friendship that are
confusing, that there are waysof being that are not
necessarily okay, and we talkvery much and it's absolutely
great that we talk to cheerleadeach other, but there are some
people they're not good for youand they shouldn't get to be
your friend because they're notgood enough, and that's talked
(30:51):
about in.
You know some of the stories aswell, that you know things that
are not great and you know howthe characters navigate that.
So, yeah, what's the name ofthe book?
Friends Like these.
Oh, I like that, and that comesfrom the.
You know the saying we'refriends like these who need
enemies.
Amy (31:12):
I like that.
That is clever Good, All right.
Well, I have really enjoyedtalking to you today, so is
there anything you'd like to sayto listeners that might be
going through the same thingright now wondering hey, I'm 50,
is it even worth gettingdiagnosed?
I?
Eden (31:31):
think, personally, it is worth getting diagnosed, if
nothing else but to validateyour experience.
Your experience, so and it is aself-diagnosis, and that's
where I started that's reallyimportant, really important to
(31:52):
know who you are, why you areand what do you need to do to be
your most content and calmversion of yourself.
But as, particularly if we aredealing with professionals,
everything has got to be anxietyor hormone, doesn't it?
That's our choices.
(32:12):
You can be anxious anddepressed, or you can have weird
hormones.
You can't just have somethingelse or be different or need
something else, and so I thinkanything that enables us to go
to these professionals when weneed help, support, advice,
treatment for anything, foranything at all, if we can say,
(32:37):
look, this is my situation, thisis the reality, and get it on
your records, so much the better.
Amy (32:45):
Yeah, I love that.
I tend to agree with you.
I think a diagnosis is veryhelpful.
Well, thank you so much forcoming on today, Eden.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you so much for joining uson this episode of Advancing
with Amy's Mental Health Warriorand NeuroSpicy Mama.
A huge thank you to our guestEden for sharing her story with
(33:07):
such honesty, humor and wisdom.
If Eden's journey resonatedwith you or you learned
something new about autism oranxiety or the power of
self-discovery, remember you'renot alone and it's never too
late to understand yourself moredeeply.
If you enjoyed today'sconversation, be sure to
subscribe, leave a review andshare this episode with someone
(33:30):
who needs it.
Until next time, keep advancing, warrior.
Thank you.
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