Bernie Schultz "Are You Happy?" on MERCER-221

Bernie Schultz is a 9-time Bassmaster Classic qualifier and truly one of the most complete pros in fishing-not just on the water but off. Schultz’s resume includes success as a writer, an illustrator, lure designer and an angling educator. However, the most important lesson in his life may have come in his early 20’s when he asked a friend, “Are you Happy?”

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
He is a nine time Bassmaster Classic qualifier and a guy that
I've wanted to get on this show for quite some time.
Bernie Schultz joins me this week on.
I'm Bob Cobb for the Bassmaster.Welcome to Mercer.

(00:25):
Welcome one. Welcome all friends, family,
freeloaders, fishing freaks, andof course you, my humpers.
Happy hump day to all of you andwelcome into the Awkwardly
honest fishing podcast that goesby my last name, which is
Mercer. This is the 221st edition of the
Mercer Podcast and I hope wherever you're watching or
listening from that life is treating you well.

(00:47):
It is a big week in the fishing world.
Orlando, FL is where I cast is going down South.
A lot of folks from the fishing world are migrating to Orlando
to get together and sweat and and talk about what I'm
predicting will be Daiso Rama 2025.

(01:08):
There will be an insane amount of tentacles and dice style
baits released at this year's show, as always is.
I mean, there's a trend that always follows, and that is a
big trend in fishing. So yeah, if you want to dice,

(01:29):
good thing. Good.
Well, there'll be a lot to choose from, let's just put it
that way. Special shout out to Kyle
Patrick. Kyle Patrick.
Boy, what a scary situation. Literally almost had a heart
attack and it all started from atick.

(01:49):
Got bit by tick had no idea about it.
His temperature started to spike.
He had 104° temperature. Went to the emergency room.
I'd not educated enough to explain it I just know what me
and him of course responded backand forth but literally had a
lot of issues with his heart andit's going to be in hospital for

(02:11):
the next week. Hopefully he's back in time for
Lake Saint Clair. I'm sure he will be but scary
scary stuff. So check yourself for ticks
cause Kyle Patrick about as healthy a dude as I know found
himself in the hospital and he'sthere right now.

(02:31):
So thoughts and prayers to Kyle and I'd like you guys to help me
and send out some of those thoughts and prayers as well to
him because he's a great dude and scary, scary situation for
all of us. I mean, anybody that spends time

(02:52):
in the outdoors, you, you risk that.
And it's scary to think of just how quick and he had no idea.
He even got bit. He had no idea until he went to
the hospital. So Bernie Schultz are going to
be a fun show here this week. And I mean, if I was better at
my job, we would have recorded the conversation we had after we

(03:15):
recorded. But we got talking about all the
new baits being released at I cast and how nothing's really
new. I mean, he showed me the first
spy bait that was like from the 1800's, the first frog from the
1800s. So nothing's really new, but it
is a new version of. But yeah, if I was a lot

(03:36):
smarter, better at my job, that's would have been the
topic. But we cover a lot of things.
Bernie has had an incredible career.
He's been around for a long time.
He's seen a lot of different things and he is never short of
sharing his opinion. And once again, he is exactly
that guy, which makes for a verygood podcast.
So buckle up and enjoy this one with the one and only Bernie.

(04:02):
Schultz, Bernie Schultz, thank you for doing this.
I've been a big fan of yours foryears.
I was a fan of yours long beforethe Elite series.
I remember you fishing Canadian Opens and at that time there
wasn't a lot of Americans that would come up and compete in
those events. You obviously contended in a
bunch of them, one one of them Ibelieve.

(04:24):
And so that was kind of a big deal that Bernie Schultz is is
coming to Kingston to compete inthe Canadian Open.
So that's I think when my fandomof you started.
Yeah, those are fond memories. I I love that fishery, as you
all know. And it first time I went there
was for a bass event. It was actually a team

(04:45):
tournament that Ray Scott put onand we went out of Clayton and I
just fell in love with the placeand just started going back
every year and I found out aboutthe Canadian Open and entered
that. Got to be friends with some of
the Canadian anglers, Azumi, DanCrawford, God, there's, you
know, big gym and I don't know, I just each year it seemed like

(05:08):
I stayed longer and longer. I actually won two.
I won the Canadian Open and theyhad a tournament, I think it
might have run one or two years,the Canadian Cup, which was a
real Prairie and I won that tournament but had a lot of high
finishes in the Open that that was a a really well run
tournament, lot of fun. Did you ever meet Lynn Johnson
back in the day? I remember Lynn vaguely, but I

(05:31):
do remember Lynn. I didn't know he's going to
raise 2 killers on tour that I had to begin with.
I'd have buried him a long time ago.
But yeah, Lynn's a good guy. And Johnston's are.
They're awesome fishermen, both boys.
They in fact, I got a up close and personal lesson with Chris
at the last event on 10 killer. We were fishing the same stretch

(05:53):
and I I made the mistake of fishing off the fish, try to
double back and he got there ahead of me And boy, it was a
clinic. He he really tore them up.
Yeah, they, they have been a problem from the day like that.
I mean, they would, they've beenwinning tournaments since they
were little kids. Like, it's crazy.

(06:14):
I mean, Lynn spent a bunch of time with them in the boat.
And and here's the bad news. They spend a bunch of time in
the boat with their kids. Like when they're not in elites,
you almost never see Corey and Chris on the water, not with
their kids like that. Their kids are in the boat with
them all the time. And I'm like, look at those
little savages. They look like cute little kids,
but in 15 years? They're in training.

(06:37):
Mckinney's going to be like, I hate those kids.
Yeah, they're in training. He just didn't know it yet.
Yeah. You've been around a long time
fishing bass and being part of bass in many ways.
Yeah. When you look at what it was
like year one versus today, I mean, is, is there any

(07:00):
similarities anymore? I mean, it's yeah, yes and no.
I mean, the guys that are getting into the sport now are
much younger on average when they enter this, you know, the
top tiers of competitive fishing.
The average age is much younger.I think the mean when I was in,

(07:22):
you know, just getting started, I think was like mid 30s.
And now it's, I got to believe that at least the, you know,
each year it's got to be dropping.
It's got to be getting close to,if not below 30, maybe in the
upper 20s. And, and I think it'll continue
to, to go younger. Probably the most noticeable

(07:42):
thing for me when I got on tour,it was a learning curve.
The kids that come in now, or I shouldn't say just kids because
there are some older guys that are coming in.
They're so well versed. They're they're very prepared.
I learned a lot when I got on tour.
You know, back then it was they were draw tournaments.
So you're paired with an anotherpro.

(08:04):
Ideally you would split the day,whether whose boat you went in,
somebody got to run the boat half the day and then the other
guy should but didn't always work out that way.
But you know, there's a lot of lessons made that way.
You know, a lot of information gained that way.
Watching a guy up close like that and the two of you working
together in many cases to develop patterns or figure out

(08:27):
what, what lure, what depth, whatever that doesn't happen
now, you know, you're on your own.
You're you know, you're out there and we don't even have Co
anglers. I, I have to tell you, when we
had Co anglers, I sometimes I benefited by having a Co angler
in the back of the boat. Sometimes I got stung by having
a Co angler in the back of the boat.
You know, they're, they're catching your fish as well as

(08:48):
you are. And over the course of a four
day event that's very costly when there's only so many fish
to go around. But yeah, I think the biggest
difference for me, Dave, is the fact that the the newest
generations of anglers are so well educated and prepared
compared to when I started it. Like I said, it was a complete,

(09:12):
you know, it's overwhelming. I I thought I knew how to fish
until I got on tour and then I realized I had a ton to learn.
Yeah, it's now you don't have time.
I mean that now it's you're goneif you if it takes which I mean,
is it tough? Why do you think that's

(09:32):
happening? Like, is this just the evolution
of the sport that it's getting younger, or why do you think
it's happening? Electronics is is a big factor
in the most recent years. It's I point the finger at
electronics. Kids are born with cell phones
in their hands these days. And that starts it.
You know, those are the steppingstones.
And it's, you know, video games and, you know, everything's

(09:56):
electronic now. None of that existed when when
you and I got started, when I was an illustrator for bass,
everything was done by hand. Now it's all digital.
And I, you know, I became obsolete.
I chose not to learn to illustrate, you know, in a
digital manner. So I kind of, you know, got

(10:16):
phased out by that technology and that's kind of happening to
me in fishing now. I'm trying to keep up, but it's
it's tough. The kids are so well, they're
they're just comfortable with it.
And it's not comfortable for a guy that fishes by instinct or
by, you know, trial and error. Guys of my generation and maybe,
you know, somewhere in between the newest generations, Keith

(10:40):
Combs, guys like that. They're they're more traditional
in their approach. It's trial and error.
You know, you gain what you learn as you go and and you draw
on experience and none of that seems to matter anymore.
It seems like it's all about electronics.

(11:00):
Yeah, it is a big factor. And I mean, you used one
example. I mean, I read an article a
little while ago about digital disturbance and, and how it's
affected every business. I mean, and you just used a
prime example of illustration. I mean, we saw how digital
disruption has affected. I'm sure you also remember
listening to. Photographers talk about.

(11:21):
Digital cameras and being like, yeah, that's not, I mean, if you
think of the just the never mindcompeting at a competition, but
like the act of like, I just take pictures at a wedding, not
to demean that, but to catch themoment at a wedding, the kiss,
whatever before was a lot more difficult than it is now.
You, you not only catch the moment, but you can check right

(11:44):
and see. And obviously you see what's
happened with that. Is that something that is a good
thing in your opinion or is it it's got to it's going to happen
or like it's? Weird.
It's, it's inevitable. I mean, it's, it's change is
inevitable. It's, it's, it's a constant and

(12:04):
you can either keep up with it or you can get buried by it.
And I'm trying to keep up, but it's, it's challenging and, and
you know, I'm kind of a purist. I, I appreciate the sport all
the way back to its very beginnings.
I'm well know I'm, I'm into the history of the sport, the tackle
related to the sport and its development.

(12:25):
And that purist approach a lot of times gets you in trouble.
I don't always keep an open mind.
I'm, I'm trying to make things work when they shouldn't or when
there's something better that you know, is, is applicable.
So I don't know. I, I like your, you know,
comparison to photography because it, you know, a purest

(12:46):
photographer probably hated digitized cameras, digital
cameras. I mean cameras nowadays, they'll
take a picture before you pull the trigger.
Literally. And it's perfect.
Literally, yeah. And it's perfect.
So I don't know, I'm caught in between Dave.
I'm, you know, I'm, I'm trying to think young, but I'm an old
guy and with a lot of old habits.

(13:08):
Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you look at video
cameras, they literally take like they'll cash 30 seconds, 15
seconds before you've even hit. So so if you missed the hook
set, you didn't miss the hook set.
Like, I mean, it's it is wild that way.
Is this the biggest? Throughout your career you've

(13:31):
obviously seen a lot of changes.Is this the biggest single
change? It's monumental for sure.
It seems like, you know, other than the political battles in
the past where new tours would develop and, and some of the

(13:53):
anglers would go one way and others would stay loyal.
Those were big transitional periods, but I think electronics
probably define the evolution ofthe sport as good as anything.
I mean, when the when the flasher, when I started fishing,
we used flashers and we're pretty good with them.
You could get a lot done with a flasher, but that's all we had.

(14:14):
And then the paper graph came out and that was a controversy
in its own right. You know, a lot of guys didn't
like paper graphs. They thought, oh, that's, that's
not right. That's it's, you know, you're
now you can take, you know, pictures of the bottom of, you
know, of structure, whatever thebottom of the lake looks like.
And then side scanning came out and that was controversial.
So every phase in the development of electronics as it

(14:38):
relates to fishing is controversial to some degree.
But I think with Ford facing sonar, that is the most talked
about and and you either love itor you hate it.
It's almost like there's no in between.
I really like the technology. I'm challenged with it.
But I'm sure you've heard this on, you know, previous

(14:58):
interviews that everything that we learned up until Ford facing
sonar showed up, you could pretty much throw out the
window. I, you know, I was trained to
believe that bass travelled on underwater highways and they had
these stopping points and, you know, they had these routes and
they, they, you know, it's like migration that's out the window,

(15:21):
that the fish use the entire water column.
Yeah. They relate to structures along
Creek channels or, you know, physical objects like stumps or
Lily pads or whatever it is. But they swim way more randomly
than I thought. And, and it took forward facing
sonar to to teach me that, you know, live scope to teach me

(15:43):
that fish are using pretty much the whole water column and
they're doing it randomly. Yeah, they're schooling fish.
But there's a whole lot of rogues out there that we didn't
realize and they're constantly moving around or suspending.
So I, you know, in that sense, Ireally love the technology.
It's, it's open my eyes to what really is happening down there.

(16:05):
But competing with young guys, that's, that's a different,
that's, that's a whole differentthing.
You brought up draw tournaments and everybody knows that's how
it started, where you would split the boat with somebody.
How different is the forward facing Sonar evolution if it was
draw events now? Oh, yeah, that's, yeah, that's

(16:25):
tough. I don't know how that would
work, to be honest with you. I mean, I guess two guys can
still do that. And I don't know, guys were so
headstrong. I mean, when you get in a sport,
you're pretty confident what you're doing.
You, you know, you want to compete, you want to prove
yourself. And back when they were draw
terms, there's a lot of head button going on.

(16:48):
If you lost the coin toss, you felt like immediately you were
at a disadvantage. In many cases, it worked out in
your favor. You know, you might have thought
you were on fish, but the guy you drew was way better off and
had enough to share, you know, where your your day was actually
better than had you chose to go to your fish.

(17:09):
But then there were times when it cost you, so you know to try
and incorporate 4 facing sonar in that scenario.
I don't know how that would work.
I'm sure it would make for some good TV if if nothing else.
Yeah, there could be some. Somebody might end up swimming
in that deal. Did people sometimes end up

(17:29):
swimming in the draw tournaments?
Burning. No, but there was some pretty
ugly confrontations. I was easy to get along with.
I mean, I was younger at that phase and I was.
I wanted to learn. I was smart enough to know right
away that I didn't know squat. I mean, I, I, I, I figured out
in a hurry. I better just listen to these

(17:49):
guys, observe these guys and hope I draw, draw the right guy
on a given body of water to to really, you know, maximize the
input. And I was lucky, I drew some
some I had great draws, learned a lot in a short period of time
and started getting some momentum on my own.
And then we eventually had the, you know, Co angler deal.

(18:12):
I fished FLWA lot before bass. Well, I actually did them both,
but dedicated some years to FLW and then came back over to bass.
And so I, you know, Co anglers were a a phase in my development
that overall I think was beneficial.
You know, there's when you have another, another lure in the

(18:33):
water, you're getting more information.
You know, it may not be you catching the fish, but you can,
you can sometimes gain somethingfrom the guy in the back of the
boat. And I tried to keep an open mind
and I learned a lot from the guys in the back of the boat.
In many cases they were really talented.
In some cases they're really lucky.
But whatever brought the, you know, the information, I didn't

(18:54):
care. I just, you know, I was
basically a sponge. For more information.
So long before you threw your hat in a national tour and fish
bass or FLW, when did you have amoment where you were like, when
did you figure out I have to figure out a way to fish for a
living? Yeah, it's it's funny you bring

(19:17):
that up, but we were talking. I was travelled out to the
Classic with Shaw. Shaw's my neighbor by the way.
And anyway, we did a lot of talking you.
Won't have any trouble with Gators if he's your neighbor I
guess. No, he's he's good at that.
He knows how to wrestle a Gator.Good at a lot of things really.
But anyway, we were talking about the old times.

(19:39):
You know, you're talking about a12 hour drive a lot to talk
about. But I don't know, I, I, I just,
I got in a club by default. I, I was going to the Universe
University of Florida right herein Gainesville.
And one of my instructors was ina bass club and he figured out

(19:59):
that I like to fish. I guess by the shirts I wore, I
don't know. But anyway, we started fishing
together and he said, man, you need to be in our club.
We meet on Mondays at this placenext to campus and you're too
good a fisherman, you should come join our club.
So he talked me into it and I had no intention to fish in a
tournament. I was just more curious about

(20:20):
what the club was about and see who in town had similar
interests and. Next thing I know, my name's in
a hat and I drew out with Shaw Grigsby in a night tournament.
That was my first draw in a tournament ever, and it was an
incredible experience. Shaw didn't win, but he was
second and it was a top water deal the whole night and I

(20:42):
learned a ton in that one night.Today's high tech fishing world
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That kind of got me into tournament fishing on the club

(21:05):
level and then Shaw invited me to fish some some buddy
tournaments with him and I was fishing with some other guys and
one thing went led to another and next thing I know I'm
fishing state and regional tournaments.
The Redman Tour came to Florida.I jumped in.
I went to their championship andwon the Gator division, won a
boat. The phone started ringing and

(21:26):
sponsors are, you know, wanting to use my endorsement and I
guess being in a 12 month fishery that was helpful.
I was young and I don't know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't intimidated
by media or any of that stuff, but I was able to communicate
with with writers and videographers and photographers

(21:48):
all that. So I don't know, one, one day
all of a sudden I realized, man,I don't really want to work for
a living if I can fish. So I'm going to try this and see
what happens here. If you if you hadn't, have gone
this route, what do you think you would have been doing for a
living? I would have been an
illustrator. In fact, I had a job offer from
Travel magazine in New York to come up there.

(22:10):
And do you know that it was basically a graphics position?
A buddy of mine who I collaborated with at the
university, it was kind of our senior thesis.
He, he was a copywriter and I was an illustrator.
So we worked together on a campaign for the Civitan
Regional Blood Center. And our campaign was published,

(22:32):
and he used that in his portfolio.
And he got a job with Travel Guide Magazine.
And they asked him who did the illustrations.
And he said, a buddy of mine, well, I still have one more
quarter to go in school before Igraduated.
He graduated a little ahead of me and was already in New York.
And he calls me up and says, man, these people want to hire

(22:53):
you. And I said, OK, that sounds
good. I'll be done in June.
I'll come up and we'll work out.When that date came, I called
him. I started getting anxious about
it. I called him.
I said, are you happy in New York?
I'm trying to picture myself in New York City, you know,
Manhattan working and wearing a suit, going to work and all
that. He said, dude, as soon as I can

(23:15):
get a job somewhere else, I'm out of here.
And that ended it for me. I, I, you know, we both surfed,
we both fished. And I knew if he wasn't happy, I
wouldn't be happy there. So I've been and that and
fishing was starting to get going at that time.
That's when I was in the club and, and seeing a little bit of
success there. And I did referral artwork

(23:37):
around town for a couple of years and, and that's what kept
me going. I lived in a one bedroom
apartment for 100 bucks a month.I mean, you, you couldn't beat
it. So I, I didn't have a whole lot
of overhead and I had a whole lot of free time because I was
basically, you know, dictating my own schedule.
I draw at night and fish in the daytime.

(23:58):
Wow, yeah, that that stands out to me is different for a lot of
people because at that age, whenever people have job
opportunities, most of the time they equate happiness to a
dollar sign. They're like, well, I'm going to
make how much and the big city or whatever you you know, but
for you to. I mean, I think for somebody at

(24:21):
your point to look at somebody and say are you happy?
That makes total sense, but did did it stand out as different a
way of thinking? Well, like what did that come
from did that? Is that just a ingrained in a
surf bump to search for happiness or I?
Think so I, I mean, you know, heand I were, we had so many
similar interests and we were good buddies.

(24:41):
We, I mean, we did a lot of beach trips together and I, I
just, I've figured I'd better check with him before I commit
to this. There's a big commitment leaving
Florida to go live in a huge city.
I did spend my high school yearsin Miami, so I was used to big
city environmental, you know, dense population, but there was
water all around me, you know, that had the beach.

(25:03):
I had, I lived on a canal that went to the Bay.
The Keys were right there. We were in the keys all the time
fishing. So I just, New York just seemed
so foreign, just a concrete jungle And I, I was trying to
figure in my mind, how am I going to be happy in that?
So I felt like I better check with him before I commit to
anything. I didn't want to waste anybody's

(25:24):
time. I they're trying to set up an
interview, a date, and I just, Idon't know, I just got anxious
as as it approached and glad I asked because in retrospect I'm
I think I made a good choice. I'd say.
I would say, do you still, I know you don't, you know, you
say you got kind of phased out of of the illustration world.

(25:48):
Do you still do art yours recreationally?
Yeah, a little bit. I, you know, I, I did a series
for Bass and it's kind of interesting how I got started
illustrating for Bassmaster. But do you remember Tim Tucker,
the famous writer? Yeah, Tim was right here in
Gainesville. And and because Shaw and I were
so close, we were his subjects in a lot of articles.

(26:11):
And we were just handy for photoshoots, handy for, you know,
just, we're just a phone call away for an interview.
And he did a story with me on fishing hydrilla at its various
stages of growth. And he sent the story in and
Dave Preck saw it and send it tothe art department.
Well, the art department really wasn't familiar with what I was

(26:34):
trying to convey in the in the story.
So they asked Tim to have me do some stick figure drawings, you
know, so to speak of what I was trying to convey so they could
have their in house artists interpret that and put it in a
in a layout. Well, I drew what I thought it
should look like. And the next thing I know, Dave

(26:55):
Pratt calls me because you want to be an illustrator for bass.
And I said, sure, why not? This will make my mom happy.
She paid for my college and I, if I can finish, as long as I
doesn't interrupt with my tournaments, yeah, I'll do it.
Well, next. That led to a 10 year stint as
an illustrator with bass. And Dave got to the point where
he saw some of my writing. I was writing for a regional

(27:17):
publication and a little bit forFlorida Sportsman back then,
which was the Bible for fishermen in Florida.
And he saw that I could write. He said, do you want to do a
series on techniques? I want, I'd like you to call
the, you know, I'd like to call it techniques illustrated.
It would be yours to write and illustrate and I'd like to do it
for a year. And I said, sure, I can do that.

(27:40):
And it was so popular, Dave, it ran almost five years and I
ended it only because at that point I was fishing FLW and bass
and having a lot of success in both.
I was making their championship.I was making the Classic, I was
finishing high in tournaments, Iwon a couple tournaments and so

(28:01):
meeting deadlines was getting increasingly more difficult.
I was on the road a lot. I was trying to pre fish a lot.
So that kind of ended, but I kept the writing part going.
You know, illustrating took moretime than writing.
So I've been a columnist for BASS since the early 90s.
Wow, wow. So do you, I mean you say you a

(28:25):
little bit like do you recreationally some days you
wake up and say I want, I want to draw like.
I want to draw. I sketch, doodle sometimes every
once in a while I'll get a request to to Draw Something for
someone, but I'm not doing it asyou know, supplement to my
income or anything. I still have the skills.
I'm not, I don't have any kind of shakes or anything that

(28:47):
people my age usually get, so I still have that.
But I don't know, maybe when I'moff the tour I might pick up art
again. Yeah, Wow.
Have you always been like, I mean, if you write and if you
draw? I mean, have you always been
attracted to the arts, so to speak?
Yeah, yeah. Ever since I was a kid, I was

(29:08):
raised up until high school, I lived in North Central Florida
in a place called Sanford, kind of east of Orland.
It's, it's gotten swallowed by Orlando.
But there was a time when Sanford was bigger than Orlando.
And Sanford was a port city on the Saint Johns River in Lake
Monroe. And I lived on a lake that was
adjacent to a stream that flowedinto the Saint Johns River.

(29:32):
So I had a lot of water around me as a kid, but I lived outside
of town, so I didn't have any friends until I got a little
older. We lived, you know, on a lake on
one side of the lake pretty muchby ourselves.
So I entertained myself fishing,traipsing through the woods and,
and drawing, you know, drawing those experiences.
I guess, you know, the arts. I wouldn't say I'm a, you know,

(29:59):
a conceptual artist. I'm an illustrator.
I just, I like to, you know, draw on paper.
I don't, I don't try to visualize these, you know, these
profound concepts, real cerebralconcepts.
And, you know, I don't, I don't,I'm not that deep a thinker when
it comes to art. I just like to draw what appeals
to me. Well, I mean, it, it's you.

(30:22):
I, I remember, I remember your illustrations from Bassmaster
magazine. I mean, I, I think weirdly
enough, I've always said becauseI've done a lot of work in video
over the years and I, I always look at illustration and I look
at still pictures as like, it's wild.
They have an advantage. Like, and I use the example of
if you take a video of a boat jumping over this giant wave,

(30:45):
you'll watch that video and you'll be like, wow, that's
incredible. But after you watch it 10 times,
you're like, I've seen it. But if you have a picture or a
drawing of that same boat, you can look at it for years.
It's amazing, like how the humanmind works that if you almost
give less to somebody, it gives them more.

(31:06):
Like, I mean, over I have an Overstreet picture in my house
and I look at it all the time. It's actually the spot he took a
picture of the exact spot where Forrest Gump stopped running.
And it's just like the highway and the, you know, the the
mountains behind it and everything.
That's a really cool. But I'm like, if that I've seen

(31:27):
that scene, the movie, and I could never tell you exactly
what it looked like, but I've stared at that picture for years
because it's it's like you give the human mind less and somehow
it creates more. We're really lucky in our sport,
the fact that it attracts so many talented people outside of

(31:47):
the fishing skills. I mean, we got great
photographers, great writers, videographers, producers.
And I mean, this sport is blessed with a lot of talent.
I mean, Sago and, and Andy and Gerald Crawford, the old, you
know, back in the day and, and Overstreet and you know,

(32:08):
Shannon, I mean, there's so many, so many guys, I can't even
think all their names. This is a lot of really talented
people around our sport. And then the writers, there's
less emphasis on print media than there used to be, obviously
because of social media and those multiple platforms have
kind of, you know, put it, you know, and made it.
I don't want to say antiquated, but it is dated to some degree

(32:30):
when you compare the, you know, the lead time with print
magazines and stuff like that compared to immediate, you know,
the the immediate aspects of social media or or digital
platforms. But we are lucky to have the
talent around us that we do and and documenting the sport.
I think that's what elevated thesport as much as the anglers.

(32:53):
It I think it's the people around us that prop us up and in
our, excuse me, documenting the sport as it goes, very
important. Bob Cobb, you know, Dave Prec
can do guys like that. Do you think that's got to do?
I mean, I, I have a theory that everybody who's part of this, no
matter what you are, you're partof it because you love it.

(33:17):
You're not part of like you didn't move to New York to chase
money. You're part you.
You decided that this is more important than money to me.
And I think everybody's like, like photographers, you know,
there's very few people, writers, you, every single
facet, anybody that's connected to it, even Trip Weld and

(33:38):
tournament directors. I mean, he didn't become a
tournament director because he was like, oh, that's a quick way
for me to make a bunch of money.He doesn't did it because he
loves it. You know, it's passion.
Passion about what they do. I think that's throughout the
ranks, whatever your degree of involvement with the sport,

(34:00):
there's a, it's all about passion and, and wanting to be a
part of it. I've been lucky.
I mean, I haven't set any records on the scales, you know,
that I've survived a lot of decades doing what I like to do.
But I, I think it's probably because I could write a little
bit, I could draw a little bit and I could fish a little bit.
And lucky for me, there weren't a lot of guys that could do all

(34:21):
three. So I was able to survive that
way. And it's about survival.
I mean, if you know, you get down to it's very competitive in
each of those sectors, but I waslucky enough to to be able to
bridge those three skill sets and, and, and make a living kind
of craft a living out of it. If you could go back and give

(34:44):
year one Bernie the first, firstbass, master of event you fish,
first big tour level of event you fish.
If you could give that guy some advice the night before that all
happened, what would it be? Slow down.
You know, when you're first getting started, you're going a
mile a minute, it you need to slow down and, and really think

(35:06):
things through. I, I may be ADHD, I'm not sure,
but, or ADD something that kind of accelerates me through, you
know, the process on tournament day and I'm thinking instead of
focusing, you know, does that make sense?
I'm kind of scrambling my thoughts and I I think early in

(35:27):
my career I, I needed to slow down and I would have had a lot
more success. Last half of my career.
I've probably fished too slow. I, I remember something Terry
Scroggin said to me after weighing in an elite tournament
one day came over and says, man,were you broke down?
I mean, I almost came over and see if you're OK.

(35:49):
And I said, Nah, he goes well, why you sit in one spot so, so
long? And I said, well, I figured the
fish were coming to me. He goes, have you ever heard of
the element of surprise? And I'm like, what do you mean
by that? He goes, well, you got to let
them breathe a while, you know, go do something else, come back.
And which Van Damme made a career out of by cycling through
several areas, letting them rest, going to the next.

(36:10):
I was guilty of not doing that on too many occasions.
I, I sat on spots sometimes in fear of losing that, that
position, you know, that, that spot or, you know, missing and
missing part of the window when they do decide to feed.
But yeah, I fish glacial speed nowadays and it looks like I'm

(36:31):
broke down sometimes, but I got a lot of patience that I didn't
have when I was young. Well, that advice from Scroggins
as I write, because Scroggins isone of the I mean, he doesn't
get in for whatever reason. People talk about speed with Van
Damme and stuff, but as a guy who's covered a lot of you guys
on the water, Scroggins is one of the fastest anglers.

(36:54):
I mean, me and Overstreet used to talk about it all the time
and, and we talked to him about it and his answer, you know,
being Scroggin be like hammer. When do you usually catch him?
After you've been there 1/2 hourwhen you just first roll up.
And. When you think about it like
that, there's a mean. It makes sense.
Yeah, there's a lot of truth to that.
I mean, he's the other extreme. I'm, I'm too slow.
He may be too fast. I don't know, you know, And part

(37:18):
of that's his St. John's River training.
People don't realize that, but you're fishing a tide and that
tide is, is kind of a different parts of the river is going off.
You know, the the wind, the bitewindow happens at a certain
phase of the tide during his, you know, course of an 8 hour
day. He's trying to maximize his

(37:39):
opportunities by hitting these different spots at the peak part
of the tide. And I think that's why he, you
know, he carried that training with him to stagnant waters
like, you know, lakes or reservoirs that don't have
moving water at all the time. He's just a fast-paced angler.
He's had a lot of success. He has, he has.

(38:03):
I'm going to ask you a question that I don't know if you're
comfortable with answering, but I, I know you, I don't ever
think you've never, I think you've answered any question
I've ever asked you. So I'm pretty sure you'll answer
this. Avco not only makes incredible
outdoor clothing, but they care about anglers with their 10%
pledge Avco. And the shed.
Family donate at least 10% of the company's profits to

(38:24):
conservation and making fishing better.
Now back to the show. Who are the top three most
impressive pros that you've evercompeted against?
Oh, hate to put it, knock it down to three.
Well, you can go whatever direction, but we've only got so
much time. I have a loyalty to Shaw and,

(38:48):
and Shaw, he's a, he's a great angler.
He's proven himself. He's won a bunch of tournaments
and nearly won a classic just bymissed it by Oz one time.
But I think that the thing that impressed me most about Shaw is
his character in competition, his sportsmanship.

(39:09):
I have a lot of respect for that.
He plays by the rules, doesn't bend the rules.
There's no Gray area. It's black and white.
And he's on the right side of the rules.
And he's also, you know, very fair on the water.
He doesn't like territorial disputes.
He would try to work with somebody rather than confront

(39:31):
them or have or be confronted. So he's he's in the top three
for that reason. Roland Martin.
And I know Roland's a controversial person, but I know
Roland from outside of bass fishing.
We'd get a lot of Tarpon and saltwater fishing together.
And Roland is a genius. I mean, he literally can

(39:52):
navigate by the stars. I've seen it.
And he he's adept at catching bass as as well as catching
Tarpon with a fly rod. I mean, the guy was so eat up
with fly rod fishing for Tarpon.He made his own fly reel.
He had, he bought a lathe, Barstock aluminum and milled his
own fly rail. True story.

(40:15):
I got the, I got the cast with it.
It was rough, but it worked. And, and you know, somebody that
could do that and is that passionate about the sport And,
and, you know, we, we spent a lot of hours on, on flats
chasing Tarpon. He's just a really good
fisherman at a bunch of levels, you know, not just bass fishing.

(40:38):
He's he's he's familiar with a lot of different species and
very adept at, at pursuing thosespecies.
And he's, you know, brilliant when it comes to electronics,
navigation, all that. He, I mean, he knows the sport
at a lot of levels people never even consider.
So maybe he's in there and is ascontroversial as he is for some.

(41:01):
To me, I just, I appreciate his,you know, his ability on, on all
those different levels of the sport.
God, to narrow it down to 1/3. I mean, you got to appreciate
Rick Klein just for what he's achieved.
Very cerebral. He, he kind of thinks
differently than anybody I've ever been around in the sport.

(41:24):
And I, I have an appreciation for that.
And he's a good teacher. I, I learned a lot from Rick on
the water and off the water. He taught me lessons.
He didn't even realize he was teaching me.
You know, I just absorbed thingsfrom him by observation.
But Dave, there are so many guys.
I mean, I could go on and on about, you know, we're talking

(41:48):
about pro anglers. You know, there are a lot out
there. I I I'd like to think I learned
something from just about anybody I was in contact.
With what do you think people learn from you?
Oh, I don't know. I I mean, I was in a good

(42:08):
position to teach people with myseries Techniques Illustrated.
The concept of Techniques Illustrated, which random
Bassmaster for five years was take a pro with his best
technique and convey that to thereader.
And so I interviewed these guys like, you know, Guido had been

(42:30):
on trying to catch a bass, a cruising bass.
I did a, a piece on him on site fishing, cruising bats.
And a lot of people think of himas strictly a bed fisherman when
it comes to site fishing. But he was really skilled at
fooling a fish that was just swimming down the bank.

(42:50):
He knew how to he knew the angleto present the lure, how to
tease the bait, how to let the bait descend just at the right
time where the fish wouldn't be spooked, but would be attracted
or not turned off. You know, it just there was,
there was a fine line in, in making that lure rendezvous with
the fish at the right time. And he was, he was the best at
that. I don't know.

(43:14):
There's just there's so many guys that that taught me things
like that. But I think that was the
advantage I had as I was able toget one-on-one with the pro and,
you know, absorb what it was that he did so well and then
convey that to the reader both through illustration and the the
text. And you did it at a time where,

(43:35):
I mean, if you're hearing this now and you're like, well, yeah,
we can watch live and see that we can.
I mean, you were exposing stuff that nobody yet.
There was no other way you'd ever get to.
I mean, even if you look at Bob Cobb and me have joked about it,
where I mean the old Bassmaster shows get so much notoriety and
people say how great they are and and they were at the time,

(43:58):
but very rarely did they ever catch a lot of what actually
happened in the tournament. You know what I mean?
Like it was or with the leader, you know what I mean?
Like there is a lot of it was a lot of made-up stuff, but to
make a show which what you do, so you were exposing it at a
time where nobody would expose it.

(44:18):
Did you ever, as a competitor, did you ever have trouble with
that, like trying to get certainguys to give you the goods?
Now, once you know, once they saw where it was going back
then, Bassmaster was a a huge way to promote your sponsor.
That platform was was invaluable.
It was kind of a, you know, the,the best place to promote

(44:42):
product because everybody at that time, that period in our
sport read Bassmaster or other similar publications.
And so printed material was, wasa, a, a way to ensure your
relationships with your sponsorsand, and most guys saw the, the
wisdom in using, you know, utilizing that platform.

(45:05):
So I, it wasn't really hard. And, and I'd approach them in a
way where it was non threatening.
I wasn't asking them to give up,but you know, the goods on
everything. I just, you know, let's talk
about flipping or let's talk about skipping or let's talk
about, you know, top water. If I did a piece with Charlie
Campbell, who had retired by thetime I got to him.

(45:25):
So he wasn't threatened by anything, but he, I basically,
he, he taught me how to walk a top water walking bait around a
stump, literally around a stump.And, and I was so, you know,
taken by that and, and how he did it.
I said, I want to, I want to feature this.
And he said, yeah, that'd be great.

(45:47):
So I, I did him in that, in thatrole.
And God, I'm trying to think of all the different guys I did.
But there was, I mean, these things ran five years and there
was 10 publications a year, I believe maybe 9 or 10.
So there was a lot of them that I did.
Some of them are on my website. There's a few that I, I gleaned
and put on my website. One was Van Damme with, with

(46:09):
Sluggo style worm. Sorry about the phone ringing in
the background, but you know. Is that is that a landline I
hear? It's a landline and we never
answer it. It's it's there for security.
You know, that's the only reasonwe keep it is for the alarm.
But, but hopefully it'll end soon.

(46:30):
But you know, that was a, that was a way to convey current
skill sets, you know, things that were happening that were
current, you know, nowadays it'sall YouTube.
But back then that's what we had.
And there was a delay. I mean, if you're waiting on Bob
Cobb's, you know, document documentation of, of say the

(46:51):
Okeechobee Open or whatever it was, it was a month later, 3-3
weeks to a month later. The magazine was slow, but it
was a little quicker. And, you know, I don't know that
that seemed to be the best way to convey techniques and and
strategies for catching more bass.
And a lot of people followed that column.

(47:12):
It it got to be really popular. And that's why it ran longer
than the year that it was supposed to.
Yeah, I, I think sometimes people forget how far things
have come and how quick, you know what I mean?
Like it. You'll hear people be like,
well, why don't they have a camera in every single boat and
all these and, and trust me, as a fan, I would love to see that.
Everybody would love to see that, but you also have to be

(47:34):
realistic and be like Trip Weldon still remembers off the
top of his head the number he used to call the BASS offices.
There was an actual number of BASS hotline that you would call
so he could hear at the end of the day.
And this was he remembers. He told me like he remembers it
being like, wow, this is amazingthat I can actually call.

(47:54):
And there's a recorded message that says in today's tournament,
Bernie Schultz is in 10th place.So and so is in 9th place.
So and so and like with their weights.
And he was like, the, it was amazing that I could get that
information like that. So in, in that short period of
time. And now we have live bass
fishing. And I mean it, it's, it's wild

(48:16):
how much it's changed huge. Transformation and not that many
years, you know, it's it's it's it's a pretty incredible.
We literally do have a camera inevery boat now with the personal
cameras. But yeah, I don't know it it's
cool that I was able to experience that be a part of
that and still be a part of what's going on today.

(48:38):
I don't know how relevant I am, but I'm still here.
I'm not dead yet. So hopefully I can still
contribute to the sport in some way.
And, and and that's basically, Ijust want to leave it better
than it. Then I found it, you know,
hopefully help people catch morefish.
Has that been your goal since day number one or did you not
have thought long term thoughts?Was it just I want to make a

(49:01):
living? Well, initially, yeah, I just
want to figure out how to make aliving in the sport.
And I didn't realize how important illustration and
writing would be to my survival until later.
It was kind of a nuisance at thetime and I I like seeing my
stuff published, but it's like trying to fit that in and pre
fish for tournaments and, and becompetitive.

(49:23):
And back then I was a lot more competitive and the wheels were
starting to gain momentum. And I don't know, later on I
realized, you know, it's probably a good thing that I was
able to write and illustrate or I'd have been long gone.
As you all know, attrition is huge in this sport.
And back then it was even, I want to say it was even greater

(49:44):
because there were fewer tours. Yeah.
Now there's a lot of different places a guy can land if he
wants to compete professionally.Back then there, there weren't
many options and you got flushedout pretty quick if you weren't
competitive or if you didn't have the sponsor support.
So who are you away from fishing?

(50:05):
What what to to use a hacky line?
What's a weekend that Bernie's really like?
What like if you can't go fishing, what is a weekend that
Bernie's really like? What do you want to do?
I'd like to play with antique tackle and and network with
other collectors, research the lures that I find interesting.

(50:27):
I write about them. In fact, my column at Bass
Masters featured a number of of different antique lures relative
to how they relate to contemporary lures.
Like I did a series called The First of the First crank bait,
the first swim bait, the first plopper, the first chatter bait.

(50:49):
You know, people nowadays think all that stuff's current and it
you know, it just happened. It just somebody had, you know,
a light bulb went off and they invented the chatter bait.
Well, the truth is that was started a lot longer ago than
people might realize. The first swim bait would try
nineteen O 7, the first hollow bodied frog 1895 the first crank

(51:15):
bait 1916. You know, there's a a long
history with lures in each of those categories.
All categories, spinner baits, top waters, jerk baits goes way
back farther than people realize.
And I, I like that and I have anappreciation for that.

(51:36):
I like to share that with people.
Once I do the research and, or Iget informed by other collectors
on, on something that I think ispertinent, especially if it
relates to something that's trending in our sport today.
I like to relate that to, to, topeople like, you know, whether
it's through phone conversations, whether I do a

(51:59):
video, whether I do a column at bassmaster.com or, or however I
do it. I like to, to communicate the
past to the present people out there that are, that are, you
know, passionate about sport. I think it's important.
So, but that's still fishing. If you didn't, if you couldn't
go fishing, you couldn't look atold lures, you couldn't talk

(52:19):
about it. What do you do?
Like what? Sunday you got the day free.
What are you? Doing yard, I don't know.
I kind of like doing that. My wife and I like working in
the yard a little bit, just because I'm on the road so much.
Most people are playing. People work in the yard.
What's he talking about? That's.
Just being home though. Be rewarded.
Yeah. It's being home, appreciating,

(52:40):
you know, where you you're dwelling, where you are, what
you've made. We are we're empty nesters now,
but the kids still come home. And my oldest boy brings his
grandbaby with when they come and visit.
And you know, so we still have, there's still a home base, so to
speak. And and we try to make it as

(53:02):
appealing to them as we can so we can coax them to come more
often. If you had to design, you've
seen incredible pros come throughout this sport.
But if, if you if me and you could play weird science and
design the perfect up, we're going to design a pro and you
can put 3 traits into that pro to be successful, to be the

(53:26):
future superstar of this sport. What 3 traits are you designing
into this human individual? OK, first of all, he'd have to
be athletic. Think you need to be athletic so
you can have any stamina, you know, 8 hour days.
Actually in practice they can beas much as 12 and 13, maybe even

(53:50):
14 hour days when we go north inthe photo period.
So long, but you got to have a lot of stamina need to be
healthy and and and sharp, you know, stay focused throughout
the day. So, so physically that's that's
one aspect you, you got to meet the criteria for that.
Next, you'd have to be really skilled with electronics.

(54:12):
There's no way around it. You're going to have to be
really comfortable with them and, and you know, utilize them
and, and every opportunity trying to incorporate them.
But then the third would be to have an, an old school
perspective, a more instinctual approach to the game.
You know, in case you're, you know, you don't have the benefit

(54:36):
of your electronics or say you're on a shallow water
fishery, it's muddy and the fishare shallow.
You know, draw on your instincts, how you know what
what lures, what presentations. I think an old school approach
needs to be incorporated in that, you know, for building the
perfect angler. I think those three things.

(54:56):
So instinct, electronics and athleticism.
Yeah, pretty much pretty. Strong what about passion and
and like, do they not need that?Isn't that all of that fueled by
you have to love it. Yeah, that I assume that was a
given. So, you know, that's if, if you

(55:17):
don't have the passion, your this isn't a sport for you, you
know. Are you still as passionate
about this sport as? I am.
I am. Yeah.
For me, when I'm not on tour, it's more about inshore
saltwater fishing. I, I much more enjoy that
there's no one watching. There's no cameras.

(55:38):
There's no, you know, writers, photographers.
No, no sponsor pressure, no media pressure.
There's none of that. It's, you know, I'm in my own
world out there and I'm sharing it with whoever I'm in the boat
with for that day. And it's just it that to me is
very rewarding, very fulfilling.I, I use light tackle a lot of

(56:02):
times I'm bear hunting with a switch.
I mean, I'm, I chase Tarpon witha 10 LB spinning outfit.
You know, I'm using braid, but it's £10 braid.
I'm using a heavy leader, but it's still 10 LB braid trying to
catch 60 and 80 LB Tarpon or 30 LB snook, you know, with that
same rod. But, and I see a lot of fish I'm

(56:23):
never going to catch because I don't use live bait.
I'm, I'm a purist in that sense.I, I like using artificials.
But yeah, that that's I'm passionate and I still have the
drive for that in in tournaments.
Probably not like I did when I was young, but I was hungry and
one to prove myself. I want to make it in the sport.

(56:45):
When I was young, I figured, youknow, if I don't catch another
fish, Dave, I'll probably caughtmy share.
But I do like competing. And once I'm there in the mode,
tournament mode, I think I'm as competitive up here as anybody
on the water. Then always play out that way.
I've had a lot of failures, but I'm taking a lot of chances.

(57:07):
I want to win, so I'm taking chances that I probably wouldn't
have 10 or even especially 20 or30 years ago, I would have never
taken those chances. And I'm getting burned a lot.
The other thing is I don't get any help, you know, and that's
probably why I'm at the bottom of the standing.
So it's, I'm trying to do it, trying to make it happen.

(57:30):
And, and you know, I'm on the wrong side of the, the
hourglass. Now I realize that time's
ticking and and I'm running out of time to do the things I want
to do in the sport, but I still have the drive to, especially
once I'm there, once I get thereand, and I'm in, you know, in
battle mode. I guess there's a way to look at
it. 2 events left in 2025. What's your mindset going into

(57:54):
those? I like both venues.
I've had success at both venues.The the best I ever finished at
Detroit on Lake Saint Clair was fourth.
The first time bass went there. I finished fourth on largemouth.
Believe it or not, I tried to make a small mouth work,
couldn't and I wish I dedicated every day all day to the

(58:14):
largemouth. I think I would have won.
I caught more weight each day. Back then you fish four days.
It was a top 100 and my weights got stronger each day and I laid
off of them the first day. I only had 1/2 day because I
spent the first half trying to catch small mouth and they
would. I couldn't make it work.
We didn't have all the finesse techniques back then.

(58:36):
It was spinner baits and jerk baits and you might drag a
Carolina rig around or somethinglike that or a tube.
We had tubes but I couldn't makeit work.
And so the second-half of the day I went and caught a good
Stringer of largemouth and got off of them because I thought,
you know, there's three more days to this event.
I don't want to burn them up. And there was an unlimited

(58:57):
supply. I had no idea how many fish I
was on every day. My weights got better and I
climbed the ladder board up to 4th and I've made checks there
numerous times since then. You know, I love small mouth
fishing and, and now it's all about small mouth.
You can catch the odd largemouthand have a, you can even have a

(59:18):
good string or a largemouth. But to do it four days in a row,
that's, that's going to be a real challenge at, at Detroit.
So I'm looking forward to that. And then when we get to
lacrosse, it's all about largemouth.
You can catch good small mouth, but it's like the inverse of, of
what Detroit offers you. You're going to have, you're
going to be hard pressed to catch 4 days of, of quality

(59:41):
stringers of, of, of small mouth.
Your, your odds are better with largemouth there.
But I like both fisheries. I I I like what's ahead.
It'll be a fun end to the season2 very different events, too.
I mean, we're not going to be onSabine where people are trying,
you know, hoping to get a limit.I mean, you're going to have a
lot of limits. And then, Oh yeah, it, it's

(01:00:03):
they're going to be, it'll be a fun end to the season.
Yeah, both will be a game of Oz.It's hard to separate yourself
from the field when it's Oz and if you get behind, it's almost
impossible to catch up. It, It's really difficult when a
game, you know, when, when that game is so tightly played, you

(01:00:24):
know what guys will be tied at multiple weight levels.
You know, like you could come inwith 20 lbs and there'd be 5
other guys tied with you and, and there'll be another 20 there
within ounces of you. So it's it's hard to separate
yourself. You can catch him and not catch
him. Like, I mean, people come in,

(01:00:44):
that's right, check in. They're like, I had a great day
and then by the end of the way and they're like, I didn't have
a great day anymore. I mean, it's, it's pretty wild.
You know, that was true for Tim Killer.
I, you know, ever since Cliff retired from the tour, everybody
knows I traveled with, most people know I traveled with

(01:01:04):
Prince for years and I miss him.He was best roommate ever, but
I'm with a group of guys now they're they keep it fun and
they keep it regimented. I mean, we're we're serious
about it's Will Davis Junior, Tim Dubey and Mark Menendez and
I, we talked about this after 10killer that you can be catching

(01:01:25):
fish at 10 killer thinking you're gaining ground when
you're only digging yourself a hole there.
You know, you get a lot of bitesthere, but the weights are so
tight and it's hard to get the kicker fish to climb the
leaderboard. You think you're doing well and
and you're really losing ground.I've run a Yamaha outboard for
over 30 years. It has got me home safe each and

(01:01:48):
every time. If you enjoy this podcast,
remember Yamaha supports it and they care enough about you to
make this ad read very. Short Now back to the show.
What's the greatest advice you've ever been given in your
life? And I know that's a crazy
question, but if you had to think of.

(01:02:09):
You know, my dad taught me my work ethic.
My mom and my dad, both of them work.
I, I think time on the water. Whoever said it first is
probably, I mean as you, as it relates to fishing.
I'm trying to answer your question in that context.
Time on the water is the best advice you can give anybody.

(01:02:32):
You're not going to learn it reading books and looking
YouTube videos forever. And you're going to have to get
out there and apply those thingsuntil you do that.
And, and you got to be out thereto take in what's going on
around you, You know, learn to read the signs and you know,
birds diving or wind direction changes, current starts flowing

(01:02:54):
or subtleties, any subtlety, water clarity, water
temperature, pH, any of that stuff.
You're going to learn that on the water and trial and error.
Even with electronics, it's about presentation and, and what
presentation work, what presentation didn't work and
trying to hone those skills. So I say time on the water is

(01:03:16):
the best advice I've been given and that I can pass along.
You've given a lot to this sportand I thank you for that.
What is the sport of fishing given to you?
I mean a livelihood. You know, Dave, like I said
earlier, I haven't set any records in the sport, but I've
had a lot of success in other areas.

(01:03:37):
I helped develop some of the most successful lures for
numerous companies. I helped developed gear, you
know, not lure specifically, butgear and rods, reels, tackle
boxes, and I can hang my hat on a lot of that.
I, I really enjoyed the boardroom as much as, as, as

(01:03:58):
being on the water, helping companies succeed, being a part
of that, being a part of marketing, advertising.
I know what makes a good ad and and I was able to, you know,
pass that to some of the companies I worked with.
I got I got fulfillment in that being able to to illustrate for,

(01:04:21):
you know, bass master all those years for bass times, all those
years illustrating books for Roland Martin and and Bill Dance
and the best of bass master. That was rewarding writing for
all the different publications and you know, just fishing
inside line, helping companies develop product design product
like the spinner baits I designed for Hildebrandt, the

(01:04:45):
lures I helped develop with Rapala, working with Mark Fisher
at Rapala. There was a lot of reward in
that. Still a lot of reward in that.
And nowadays getting to work with my son who my oldest son,
he's a Rep, we talked about that.
We share some of the same companies, you know, he wraps

(01:05:06):
them and I I promote them. So we cross paths quite a bit,
whether it's an in store promotion or ICAST or the
classic or, or whatever, having that connection, you know, with
family and a professional level is, is that's rewarding.
So the sports been good. My wife was able to be a stay at
home mom. She did a, a remarkable job with

(01:05:29):
both our boys. They're both healthy and, and
both on their own. And so I was very fortunate in
in that regard. The sport gave back to me what I
needed to survive and and prosper in that regard.
So I've got no complaints. Well, you've given lots of sport
and I just need you to make me one promise.

(01:05:50):
After you win Saint Clair, you come back on.
Oh, yeah, I'm, I'm open to you anytime.
I'm a fanboy and people don't realize, you know, and I want to
write your story. You keep saying no, but at some
point I'm going to crack the nutand get it.
Get get your story. People don't realize like when

(01:06:10):
we take off in the morning, there's a hundred guys lined up
and we go through that, that process of boat check and, and
you know, live well check and all that kill switch.
And meanwhile you're giving basically a, a, a condensed
version of each guy's resume right off the top of your head.

(01:06:31):
And that's remarkable. And it's, it's almost like
you're in a savant in some ways when it comes to regurgitating
that stuff. And then when we get to the
stage, people see you looking atthe scale.
They may think you're looking atnotes, but we know the truth.
All that stuff's in your head and you're flawless with it.
It's, it's remarkable that you can remember each guy, what he

(01:06:53):
did in the last tournament, whathe did last year, what he's done
over his career. You know, they're sponsors, You,
you know, their families and, and it's all like that.
I, I don't know how you do it. I mean, I, I struggle with
recall and you're just, you're phenomenal in that regard and
we're lucky to have you because of that.

(01:07:13):
Well, thank you. That's true.
I'm not good with compliments. Well, I'm sorry, but that's the
truth. That's the way other guys see
it. I appreciate it and and I will
one simple answer. It's the same reason that people
passion. I love what I do.
I don't know that I could like Ialways joke where people see how

(01:07:33):
much I do at a bass event and I run around.
They're like, oh, you got so much energy.
And I'm like, it's amazing. If you put me on that
construction crew, they would belike, Mercer is the laziest
dude. But if you love something, and I
mean, I'll let you write I've it's not that I don't want you
to. I just always feel like it's I'm

(01:07:55):
the intro guy. Shouldn't be a story about me.
It should be stories about otheranglers like that they I'm a
weirdo. But it you've been on the
podcast, I can't say no anymore.So any, anything you want,
Bernie. Everybody's got a story, you
know, I, I just feel like everybody has a story.

(01:08:17):
Whatever degree you're involved with the sport and however
successful you've been in the sport, everybody has a story.
How did it get, how did it get to where they are?
And, and I like to tell those stories and I've done so I would
invite anybody that's watching this to Google some of the stuff
I've written for Bassmaster, forinside Line, for just fishing in

(01:08:38):
Canada. You know, I write, I write
outside the box. I don't write about technique
all the time. I don't write about specific
lures and you know how they're applied.
I talk about people at times. You know, I did a series called
Lessons from Legends and I featured guys like Forestwood,

(01:08:59):
Ray Scott, Ken Cook, Shaw Grigsby, Guido Hibdon and all
those guys teach you some Aaron Martins.
It was less about technique. Most people think about
technique, they think of Aaron Martins, you know, all about
tackle, all about preparation, all about execution.

(01:09:19):
But he taught me some other things.
And and so I'd invite anybody watching this to go and find
those columns. Look for lessons from Legends
Bassmaster on Google in a Googlesearch and you'll find them.
They're they're great stories about those individuals and, and
their path to where they ended up.

(01:09:40):
And then the first lure series that I did, learn about the
history of the sport, learn about the first crankbait, the
first swim bait, the first hollow bodied frog, all those, I
did a bunch of those things and they're very insightful, not
because I wrote them, but because of the material that I
was able to find on them. It, it speaks to how our sport

(01:10:04):
got to where it is today. And to me that that's extremely
important. I, I feel like anglers,
especially at our level, are obligated to know the history of
the sport, something about it anyway and how we got to where
we are. A lot of people think that, you
know, it just happened in the 60s.
This our sport's been going on since the 1800s and before so,

(01:10:27):
and I'm talking about bass fishing.
Yeah, no, a health healthy respect for, for the past is
very, very important. I mean, that's, that's your
foundation, that's what got you there.
Got us all here. And if you forget about the
past, just like your house, if you forget about the foundation,
it doesn't matter how beautiful the outside of your house is.

(01:10:49):
Guess what? It all comes crumbling down.
So it's the. House of Cards, That's right.
But thank you, Bernie. I've enjoyed this.
Yeah, something different. I I appreciate the opportunity.
So we'll see you in a few weeks time at Lake Saint Clair.
You will. So that's it, that's all a great
conversation with Bernie Schultz.
We will definitely have him on again to talk about Bates and

(01:11:13):
kind of the evolution of so manyBates that I kind of teased at
the beginning of this show. I hope you enjoyed this one.
This has been Mercer 221 and guess what?
Next Wednesday you can listen toMercer 2/22 and the Wednesday
after that 220 you. Get the pattern.
Right, I will see you next Wednesday.
Hope you have a great week. Enjoy being and as always, Bob

(01:11:37):
Cobb, take it away. Thanks for watching.
Please like, comment and subscribe because Bob Cobb of
the Bass Masters told you to youhere.