S2 Ep11: "What Are You Willing to Lose?" Asks Bettermaker's Marek "Maro" Walaszek

In this episode, Ken interviews Marek Walaszek -- the founder of Bettermaker. In their discussion, they explore what it's like to make a business in the recording industry: the do's and the don'ts, and what you might have to give up in order to achieve success.

#bettermaker

Episode Transcript

(00:14):
Hi everyone and welcome to another episode of Metal
Mastermind. I'm here with a very, very
special guest, a good friend anda amazing developer in the audio
community. His name is Marek Valechek and
he goes by his artist name Maro Marek.
Why don't you say hello to our audience?

(00:35):
We are all metal musicians and are eager to learn a little bit
more about Better Maker and Marothe Artist.
Hey everybody, my name is Maro and happy to be here.
You know, thanks game for. Inviting me, yeah.
So just a little back story here.
Marek and I, we connected while being a part of audio educators

(00:57):
groups and as many of you guys know, I am a audio educator out
in New York City. I've connected with a lot of
audio educators across the worldand Monarch is a very proponent
and supporter of audio education.
He actually has quite taken our feedback and actually
implemented these things in his software so that when you guys

(01:20):
open up, you know, any of the plugins from Better Maker or
even I'm sure in the manuals, there's always going to be some
information on how things are used and what's the best way to
explain them are ways that he's asked us, which is really,
really humbling. So thank you for looking to us
for inspiration on that because,you know, we, we love using your

(01:42):
stuff. Mark, can you tell us a little
bit about like the workings or the, the, the beginnings of how
better Maker got started? Oh yeah, of course, first of
all, I'm a music producer and a sound engineer and that's,
that's the main thing. So I'm not just a guy that makes
electric electronics or codings.And that's, that goes strictly

(02:04):
from my from my needs and my heart what I'm doing.
So I was a mix engineer that anda producer for a long time
before I started Better Maker and I was working with a lot of
projects that were outside Poland because I have my studio
in more so Poland. And so I had a lot of recalls

(02:24):
daily. And I was looking at my
synthesizers and like was figuring out why the
synthesizers can be recalled andcan be managed to MIDI or any
other protocols, Sysix or whatever and why does my gear
not have those possibilities? So Long story short, I I got
some money from a very prominentactually Fanta worldwide Fanta

(02:49):
commercial that I did music too.And really.
That's. Amazing.
And, and I invested all that money into into turning my live
room into a workshop. That's incredible.
So I made that so I so Long story short, 1 1/2 years of

(03:09):
development and I did my first MIDI recalled EQ that sparked a
lot of interest on music less the biggest by then the biggest
show gear show in Frankfurt, Germany.
So I made like 10 of them and went back with We are for new

(03:29):
distributors for a gear that wasshown for the first time ever.
Nobody knew me and I started literally from scratch as a
entrepreneur in that industry. I never, I never even imagined
that I will go so far and you know, with 0 knowledge of how
the business works and 0 knowledge how to build a brand.

(03:52):
You know, like I was always a musician.
You know, do you think that being a musician helped with
those CEO qualities? Being a music producer for sure,
because as a music producer you have to be a manager.
So you have to and you have to work with the most difficult
clients you can imagine. Clients that don't show up,

(04:14):
clients that show up intoxicated, clients that have
their own little egos that they have to, you know, you have to
groom. Yeah, yeah.
You know, metal. Metal is totally excluded from
that. No, I'm just kidding.
Oh my gosh. Yeah.
No, I could totally see how a lot of the skill sets of being a

(04:35):
music producer are really important here in in owning your
own business. I mean, operating your own
studio, you have to know all theinsurance and outs from the top
to bottom. You have to take care of the
finances, you have to find clients, you have to build
relationships. These are all things that ACEO
has to do too. And it just so happens that, you
know, hey, look, here I am as well, I'm also ACEO, so how

(04:58):
about that? So this is kind of a thing, I
think with a lot of artists whenthey get into music, they forget
that the business part of it actually really encompasses so
much of what you do on a day-to-day basis.
It's you building your brand andidentity so that it can be
spread across the world. And that's that's really at at

(05:21):
the bare bones where it where itcomes down to.
So yeah, go ahead. Well, that that I always say to
that you have to choose two things or you do music or you're
in the music business. So, so basically when you, when
you make, when you make a track,for example, that you want to be
successful, this is a product that you have to put on a shelf

(05:44):
and try to sell, you know, and your, your job after the product
is made is to sell that product and not, you know, make another
one and you know, and shelf it again because it, it can go
endlessly. You know, if you don't have a
team around you, you're blessed.If you have a team around you
that will be selling that product, then you're then you're

(06:06):
a factory, a music factory. You know, like basically you
have to be when you're an independent artist, you have to
be the music factory and the distributor at the same time and
the reseller. So the whole change is exactly
as it would be. And any other product like
better maker or microphones or Idon't know, cereal or butter?

(06:31):
Yeah, yeah, it's, it's a lot of the same skill sets.
And we, I mean, we love the independent music industry for
it giving a lot of freedom to, you know, do whatever you want
to do. But it also means that it
there's a lot more responsibility.
So we have to be more educated on this topic, you know, and

(06:52):
that's kind of what this podcastis here for, right?
So we talked about these things and we want to, you know, it it,
you know, communicate what has been our experience or what is
the best way that we've seen other people do it.
And those are, you know, clues that help us to not hit every
single bump along the road. You know, so it's it's really

(07:13):
great to hear that. And so with better maker, you
guys, you started from the ground up.
You, you really kind of came with this idea that audio in
software should be able to synchronize with audio and
analog and you're using that through the functions, right?

(07:33):
So, you know, plus or minus or this or that.
And that can help to recall a lot of analog gear because I
mean, let's face it, one of the big things that we talked about
so much when it comes to analog is make sure you got a camera
out, make sure you got a, you know, your notes out because
you're going to be riding a whole lot.
But this is one of those things that we can take that idea and

(07:57):
say, well, we don't need to actually do that.
We can still love our analog andwe can still have the thing that
digital is really good at which is data.
So it makes a lot of sense to me.
And you are also a very inspiredby a lot of classic pieces of
gear. You know, in our conversations

(08:18):
when we are discussing better maker software or hardware,
there's a whole lot of praise for, you know, the old pull tags
or the s s, LS and all these kinds of things.
Is there anyone actually that? I'm curious do you have anyone
favorite piece of like vintage gear that's like yours or maybe

(08:38):
you've used in some other rooms?And that will be kind of awkward
thing because my favorite piece of gear is actually at
Electronics LA 3A and I have 4 of them.
Those are great, I use those on vocals all.
The time, yeah, because they arenot so colored as as LA 2A and

(09:01):
but they do the exactly the samejob.
So they are, let's say As for the As for the reliability, they
are more recolorable because youcan set and forget and drive
them for this incoming signal actually or the mic signal and
you have don't you don't have tochange the tubes.

(09:21):
So you, you have to, you have torecap them every, I don't know,
10 years and that's it. Yeah, that's actually a really,
really great point. And LA 3 as I I, like I said,
I'd love them on vocals for a long time.
And actually it's because they didn't have the tubes because
the tubes sound great when you want to add harmonic richness,
but that's not always the case, nor is it in the necessarily the

(09:44):
stage that I use the LA 3A in sowell.
For example, sorry for interrupting, but you're
absolutely right because for example, you are going from like
87 into a into a 73. So you already have that tube
kind of warmness plus the saturation of the of the Karn
Hill amp capo that that bumps your bottom and then you will be

(10:09):
saturating it together with withsomething.
And I think it's already a lot if you are doing if you are
going in hot with the signal. So basically, yeah.
So that would be the answer, yeah.
Why you do you? Do you find yourself using
analog in the way that you do kind of have a little bit of a

(10:31):
repeatable factor and you just base everything on the input
signal as you mentioned? Yes, yes, yes, exactly.
Like I, I have that with like when I don't have a recall, I'm
just finding that finding a sweet spot in my favorite use
and I don't change it. I just drive this the incoming
signal. So LA 3A is perfect for that

(10:51):
because it doesn't have any controls and but but I do the
same with the stressor. I do the same with let's me look
through my gear with the BBX 160.
So yes, so so I have my favoritesetting that I just drive in,
drive in and it's very rare thatI updated, updated and then I

(11:16):
have to have a sticky note on it.
So for me to remember that previous projects where has a
different setting. Well, I kind of actually also
it's pretty, it's pretty smart in some ways because if you are
very, you know, familiar with your room, you're very familiar

(11:36):
with the gear that you use, there are certain expectations
out of the gear that you can predict.
So there are things that if the source material isn't living up
to, it can kind of give a clue as to where you need to maybe
address something rather than, you know, just reaching for the
gear right there and then. I think that's a very

(11:57):
interesting workflow. And, you know, I'm actually an
all digital person here. I did experiment with hybrid for
a little while and I always found it to be a little bit more
cumbersome. But I think that's just because
of my, my studios needs. I don't think analog fits for
every single studio, nor does all digital, you know, have to

(12:18):
be the only limitation. Too many studios.
I love the analog hardware and what it did to my music though
that, but I I did notice that when it came to working in
future formats like Atmos and stuff like that, I was like,
whoa, this is this is a little bit more troublesome than I

(12:39):
expected it to be for stereo. It was perfect.
Yeah, you would have to have like 5 different 5 stereo units
to to drive Atmos, right? Yeah, I mean, I mean like, or
just get literally a console that like Bob Clear Mountains
doing and that's what he does. He prints all his Atmos on just
another console, which is just kind of insane to me.

(13:01):
So yeah, no Atmos and analog is very, very difficult.
And actually, wait, aren't you kind of in the middle of
experimenting with building an Atmos studio?
I'm done actually right now, yeah.
I I, I had an open. I had the Atmos opening on the
22nd of May. Amazing.
Well, tell us about it. What was that like and what are

(13:23):
you using? Well I I'm using the OR the
fronts I'm using my favorite ATCone 10s.
Then I want to have the frontal ATC50 but right now I have a
JBL6 330I it's an old it's a very old passive big monitor

(13:48):
that I that I had a 5.1 set up of it earlier on.
And for the for the ceiling, I have the JBL SC8 SCS 8 and they
are six of them. There are six six of them.
And for the sides I have JBL 5336.

(14:10):
So, so I went for a kind of A and for the and another
different, different thing. I have two different 2 Neumann
SAB Subs that K8540 probably forthe for the LFE.
So for a different, a different speaker for different, you know,

(14:33):
purpose. And people were like shocked
because normally people tend to go for one brand or something
like that. But I want to still have my one
10s for the main sound that I get.
But the rest I would I wanted tohave like kind of a cinema
experience more than a hi-fi experience.
That's why I went for cinema speakers.

(14:55):
Oh yeah? Well, you know, Dolby was made
from cinema. And it does make.
It makes a ton of sense. I'm, I'm, I'm very interested.
I'm actually using cinematic speakers here in my studio,
Miller and Kreisel. So these are, you know, very,
very well equipped for things like THX and all those kinds of
things. But you know, by any means, I

(15:17):
haven't seen a lot of Miller andKreisel in studio work.
You know, actually there is one mixer and it's a good one.
It's it's Chris Lord algae. He's used them in case before.
So I was like, yes, OK, I got one guy there.
But you know, as far as everybody else, everybody just
comes in. They're like, you know, what are
these right. And when you start doing things
like Atmos, it's kind of fun because I feel like you can make

(15:41):
it the way you want it. And there are certain guidelines
that they recommend, but I've seen other engineers like Joel
Hamilton here in Studio G in NewYork, he's he's modified his
Atmos room to make it sound whatbest suits him.
And I think with immersive as you're working in it, the more

(16:03):
familiar you are, just like we say here with stereo and your
own room, the more you're familiar with your setup in the
corks about it, the better it'llbe for you.
So you know, is better Maker exploring more into the
immersive realm or is that just a a Morrow thing?
No, it's like, well, Better Maker is always about like,

(16:28):
first of all, I, I have to be the first user, you know, and
that's, that has to suit me. And then the others, because
it's not, it's not an eagle trip, but it's something that
will be practical. You know, and I and I talk with
people like you about functionalities and, you know,
and we are figuring out what would be the best, you know,

(16:52):
thing to, to, to publish. But As for sure when I will
grow, when Atmos will grow, onlyI will get the sense of needing
some of the plugins that you know, that I'm missing right now
or at most for, you know, that Icould release.

(17:13):
Maybe I would be looking into some analog processors, you
know, that could be like multi channel Atmos, I don't know,
compressors, Eqs or whatever that can be, you know, connected
by, I don't know, DB 25, you know.
Got to be that's got to be really exciting to sort of think
about that. So you my my ears perked up.

(17:34):
You can't see my ears. They're hidden behind my
headphones, but they perked up and that's awesome.
I mean like getting into anything at most on the better
maker side is super amazing for me and for everybody else who
loves using your stuff. So I think hopefully that maybe
when you're exploring, maybe you'll find some things that

(17:56):
also help stereo back into research of Atmos too.
These are. All things.
Yeah, these are all things. That I'm very excited for.
The problem is that I mostly work on logic and not Pro Tools.
Yeah, I'm a logic guy. Well, that's fine, but what

(18:17):
what? What are the problems that you
find that are from? Because in logic you can reuse
every plugin you can imagine in in the surround environment and
immersive environment. Because it turns itself to a
multimodal plugin immediately. And as I know in protos that's

(18:38):
not the case. You have to have a dedicated
plugin. Yeah.
You, you, you can. Yeah, they categorize them.
So you do have multi channel versus multi mono.
It has to be an intentional choice to turn it multi mono.
Yeah. So, so basically they're like
it's much more easy because because they they standardize

(19:00):
that Apple renderer and stuff like that.
So it's much more easy to work in Atmos in logic than in
protos. You don't have to bridge
anything and stuff like that. So I don't know when I will find
these obstacles that other people get, you know?
Well, I I'll tell you one thing.Working in Immersive with

(19:24):
Immersive plugins, one thing that I love to see is some way
to sort of universally like moveparameters around with maybe one
function, right? For example, like time delays or
something like that, where maybethere's like a dial and I can
just sort of like use it as a way to, yeah, macro moves, but

(19:47):
they all respond to a variable. Something like that would be
amazingly useful, which I haven't really seen in Immersive
yet, so, but there's an idea, you know?
I'll. Take.
I'll put my signature on the patent so.
OK, let me check. I, I will tell you, I will tell
you one thing because I found a plug in that I'm very interested

(20:07):
right now in and I want to try it out.
That's partially a solution of. It's called the energy pattern
from sound particles, and it's and it's.
Up. Yeah, and it automates, I just,
I just found out about it today and it and it automates spatial

(20:30):
movement. So you can do like those, you
know, kind of spiral effects andyou know, and immersive panning,
auto panning. That is very, very cool.
That is something I'm definitelygoing to explore, so thank you
for the tip. All good.
Yeah, so, so I mean, Marek, whenit comes to the future, even as

(20:54):
an artist, because you actually released an audio musical, it's
called Rejects, something that Iwas actually very inspired by
while working on my own audio musical, which is amazing to see
that somebody is on the same journey as doing something.
You know what, What's the futurefor your music?
Are you going to continue to do more audio musical as a

(21:16):
continuation of this project? Yeah, I'm working on on music
all the time with for somebody, for other people and maybe I
will be releasing some singles of my own too, but but I'm
looking at rejects tool for surein in some future, you know,
like I right now I right now I'mdoing a polished version of

(21:39):
rejects. So I'm, I'm getting all the
Polish top artists to join the project, you know, to, to, to
make it simply a Polish musical.So it will be easier for me to,
for example, stage it, you know,and make a, make a concert out
of it or something like that. Because because the the lineup

(21:59):
that I got on my first album is just impossible to gather.
You know, wow. Well, you know guys for you
listening on the podcast, we just did a video on creating a
concept. So check out Marek's and his his
thing, his thing, his project isMorrow.
So if you look up Marek, you'll you'll probably find more better

(22:22):
maker stuff. But if you look up Morrow and
you look up rejects, look, listen to this work.
It's very, very cool. It's an amazing.
It's got a lot of electronica sounds and industrial and all
this kind of stuff and you're hearing a narrative unfold.
So if you're familiar with my work in Homeric, this is another
type of thing that's very similar to that kind of concept.

(22:44):
So this is great. I'm so excited to really talk
about it. And hearing that there's going
to be a continuation to rejects is super exciting.
And you know, you've talked alsoabout the the future of a lot of
things in Better Maker Morrow. I think this is going to be a
freaking amazing time for BetterMaker and your music.
And what are some things do you think?

(23:06):
Have you ever given the applauseto what?
What is the most important thingthat an independent artist
should really be focused on? Like what do you?
Do you have anything in mind that you'd like to share?
An independent, independent artist, which should focus on

(23:27):
that. That's a question that it's hard
to answer because it's like the answer is it depends because,
because it, it depends on what the artist is seeking for in his
agenda. You know, like if the
independent artist want to make the money on it or, or make a

(23:48):
living or wants to express himself and, or, or herself and
in, in a particular way, or he'slooking just for an eagle trip,
or he's looking for people that will listen to his story.
So, and there are so many different things that people,
there are so many different causes that people join our

(24:12):
music family, you know, and artist family that it's very
hard to to describe a one way because everybody has their own
path in it. So I can answer one of them.
For example, if you're a commercial, if you want to go
commercial as an independent artist, because independent
artist can do commercial also. Like it's not a, it's not a

(24:35):
shame to sell your music becausepeople want to listen to it.
So then then we are getting backto the beginning of our talk.
So focus on focus on the product, put make a great sound
that you are sure of and try to sell it as you would be on the
Shark's Tank. Right.

(24:57):
Yeah, that's that's. Great.
That's great. Because you're, you're, you're
really talking about it as an investment in, in, in time and
money. And you know, if you're going to
be doing this on a commercial viable, you know, path, you got
to think about what those guys are thinking too.
And for anybody who's going to get involved, especially like

(25:18):
for those of you who might be interested in going the route of
doing a record label, you got tothink about how the record
labels going to think and what are they looking for.
Money, they are looking for money.
So what's your what's your story?
Who can relate to what's your demographic?
How many merchandise can you sell and are you in the

(25:39):
mainstream or off stream or how many festivals can you play?
Is there festivals that will cover your genre?
All really. Great questions.
Yeah. And Maro, have you, have you
taken the time and done a tour with your personal artistry or
are you, is it conceptual? I I sometimes play as DJ sets

(26:05):
basically because it's hard to, it's hard to play.
It's hard to gather all the those people because I'm not a
performing artist. So it's hard to gather those
people that are in the front. So most of the times I I just
play DJ sides that are around that kind of darkest dystopian
area that I that I presented in my album.

(26:28):
Which is very popular in that part of the world.
I know. Well, you know, like that's our
reality to some point. Well.
That's amazing, you know, and when it comes to, you know,
artists and and and looking to do like their balance of touring
versus production, I mean, like that's AI feel like it's a

(26:49):
really good conversation as welltoo.
I mean, is do you feel like yourjourney has taken you away from
doing things like touring and stuff like that to focus on, you
know, Better Maker, etcetera andwhatnot?
Well, yes, yes, that better maker took a lot of my attention
and it it it cries for more and more.

(27:12):
So yeah, I feel a little bit guilty of, you know, pushing
better back her more because it,it gives me more money and and I
I lost a little bit of myself, you know, and what, what I
wanted to do. And I have to divide my my life

(27:33):
in 3D. So my family, my kids, the
better maker and being a music producer.
And the first part is Marrow music because Marrow is not
exactly the same guy as the Marek as music producer because
I have to run the studio. I have I am a mix engineer.
I'm a producer for other people.So basically at the end there

(27:58):
are five pieces of that cake. Wow.
And do you have anything you want to tell the audience about
if they are choosing a path thatforces them to walk away and not
really walk away? Because I know you still do your
thing, but they may have to choose this more than their
music. Is there anything that you want

(28:20):
to share about that? Yes, the the thing that I did
wrong in in the in the 1st placeand now I'm trying to to get
that straight is that I didn't do intervals for for the second
thing. So I tried to micromanage
everything at once and I didn't get like get myself the time to,

(28:43):
to, to concentrate on one thing at a time.
So give myself a month of concentrating on better maker,
get myself a month of concentrating on doing marrow or
marrow music. As for the music, as a music
producer, quality time with my family, it always, always
scattered around, you know, and I, I did like 2 hours of going

(29:06):
with my boys to a pool and then I was doing 1/1 and 1/2 hour of
this and that. So I was half assed in
everything. So yeah, concentrate on on
longer periods of time on, on onparticular things.
So if you have a day job, then do that day job the best you

(29:26):
can. You know, do a side hustle if
you need to to gather money for getting a SO if you go for
holidays, don't go for holidays.Just lock yourself in the studio
for those two weeks. Right.
Yeah, that, that's a really, really great piece of advice.
I think it's very practical. I think if you, if you figure

(29:47):
out, you know, the balance that happens in your life, you know,
whether or not it's like, hey, Iwork 2 jobs, but maybe, you
know, on that one Saturday, I can devote at least a block of
time, whether it's an hour to three hours or something like
that, to just being able to say this is dedicated time to this
thing, right? I think that's a very, very good
approach. And actually, you know, for, for

(30:09):
students, if you're, if you're, if you're learning about, you
know, time management, which I know a lot of students are
struggling with, get yourself ona calendar, like start really
like blocking out time for yourself and feeling out what's
the best rhythm for you through your day-to-day.

(30:31):
If you, if you unlock that, I, Ipromise there's going to be so
much more productivity comes outof it naturally.
It's yeah. It's like when you were saying,
you know, you were doing everything at once.
You were just like, you had all this energy and you're just
like, I just have to like use every ounce of it all the time,
but then you're just left running on empty all the time.

(30:51):
So. That's true.
It's not good for the engine, right.
And that's, that's where we callburnout for, for a lot of folks,
and I'm, I've certainly experienced, it's burnout.
It's actually one of the reasonswhy I walked away from working
Good Morning America, because itwas just so many things day
after day. I was teaching during the day
and then I'd work literally overnights at GMA for the next

(31:15):
act that was coming on. And then I'd have to have like 4
hours of sleep for the next gig.I had no time for myself.
And it took the pandemic to actually, you know, realize that
for me that I had to stop. And I actually did get to
finally finishing that album that I was working on.
And it would took ten years in total.

(31:35):
So, yeah, these are these are things that we're telling you
now as an audience from our own personal, you know, professional
lives, that if you're aspiring to create something and you want
to create something and it's great, it's going to take more
time. It's going to take more effort,
which is why if this is all you could see yourself doing is

(31:59):
being a part of the music industry, whether because you
wanted to create art or you wanted to figure out how to make
money from art, this is the commitment.
It's wanting to do this because you can't see yourself doing
anything else, right? And Malrick, I know that your

(32:19):
love of audio is just as paramount and it's helped so
many people. If this is the first time you've
ever heard of Better Maker, takea look at some of their
equipment. It's readily accessible in so
many marketplaces, Sweetwater, Vintage King and all that kind
of stuff, and you'll find them everywhere being used by

(32:40):
professionals all over the world.
And some of them are very big heavy hitters.
And I think that's just a beautiful thing, right?
You know that your passion for wanting to create better audio
and more practical tools for yourself, inspired by and giving
respect to vintage pieces of equipment, but with a modernized

(33:04):
take to preserve it but to also expand upon it.
I've been impressed by Better Maker for such a long time.
I still continue to be impressedby it.
I I got to get the new compressor.
Consider it done. It is, it is.
It's just help me and my friendsso much.
So there's a reason why I got the shirt today.

(33:25):
So that's all I got to say aboutit.
Thank you so much. Anytime, anytime, my friend.
Thank you everybody. It's been such a great time
having Maricon's our podcast. And if you want to find out more
about resources for metal artists, Metal mastermind.com

(33:45):
has everything you need in orderto learn about music production
or get songwriting or guitar bass.
We've got it. So there's all the resources
there for you and you can also find Better Maker, I'm sure
Better maker dot EU, Is that correct?
Yeah.eu.com also works. Right.

(34:06):
And you can also find their pluginsurance on Plug in Alliance
and all. Yeah, and Sweetwater.
And Sweetwater as well, so great.
So these and these tools, I'm telling you guys, I use them on
a day-to-day basis when it comesto using professional work.
I'm sure they'll be great for you too all.
Right, so figure out the contest.

(34:27):
I will give away all the set of my plug insurance.
Done. Well, you heard it here on the
podcast, so yes, we'll host that.
You got it. Consider that done too.
So everybody, thank you so much.And until next time, always
remember to create your own sound.