Suge Knight, Midlife Fame, and Tracee Ellis Ross' Diss on Middle-Aged Men

Diddy heads to court, with Suge Knight weighing in as an unexpected pundit. Marvel’s Thunderbolts are shaping up to be the midlife Avengers—while Pedro Pascal (The Last of Us) and Walton Goggins (The White Lotus) prove that middle age is a prime time for stardom. Meanwhile, Will pushes back on Tracee Ellis Ross’ recent remarks about toxic masculinity among middle-aged men.

Thanks for listening--keep on marauding!

Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_03 (00:06):
Welcome to Midlife Marauders with Will and Max.

SPEAKER_00 (00:13):
I don't think we can escape Mr.
Sean Puffy Combs, a.k.a.
Diddy.
He's all over my feed and at thetrial and everything.

SPEAKER_03 (00:22):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (00:24):
What are your impressions?

SPEAKER_03 (00:26):
You know, I think the big news is Cassie taking
the stand.
You know, she's pregnant.
She's a very sympatheticcharacter and just, you know, I
think...
I don't know.
I just feel like, how did he getaway with this for so long?
Right.
Like, and you know, for somebodywho's so brilliant, how could
you be so stupid or think thatthis wouldn't come out?

(00:48):
Right.
So that's always kind of in theback, back of my mind, like, how
is this happening that it's onlynow coming out?
Right.
Or, only recently coming out.
Um, and I guess, you know,people been paid their hush
money and, um, you know, Cassiewas young when she was involved
with him.
And so she probably wasn'tthinking straight, you know, but

(01:08):
I just think that he, you know,maybe, maybe things have changed
because, you know, in this dayand age with social media, it's
easy, like for rumors to spread.
Right.
So maybe he was under able tokeep it under wraps because, um,
Social media wasn't as prevalentback then.
But anyhow, I just I just amamazed that it's been kept under

(01:30):
wraps for so long.
So how about you?
I mean,

SPEAKER_00 (01:33):
well, for me, it's like you've you've heard of tall
tales, some things in thebackground, you know, nothing
that you could substantiate, youknow, rumors, write it off is
like.
Just Hollywood talk, rumors.
Somebody's got

SPEAKER_03 (01:49):
beef with somebody else and they're making shit up.

SPEAKER_00 (01:51):
Yeah, that sort of thing.
People will exaggerate thingsand that sort of thing.
But people like 50 Cent havebeen talking about Puffy for a
long time, about how he's just adifferent cat and he's a little
off and can be a little weirdand that sort of thing.
And you just kind of like...

(02:13):
you know, that's not coming fromcredible sources, so to speak.
So, you know, and, and, and, andit's like, it's almost humorous
until it's not until it's likethrown into your face, you know,
obviously with the video of himbeating Cassie, that's when it
really came to a head.

(02:34):
But I'm not, I'm not surprised.
I mean, you talk about like howhe, How could he get away with
this?
I mean, it's money, power,respect.
And I think it's hubris on hispart.
You know, people think they'reabove the law.

SPEAKER_03 (02:49):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (02:51):
And, you know, he's so well-connected.
I'm sure that, you know, there'ssome cover-ups and some hush
money and some payoffs and thatsort of thing.
But, you know, it's all comingto a head.
I mean, I guess it's not

SPEAKER_03 (03:06):
uncommon, like you're saying, with like–

SPEAKER_00 (03:08):
Yeah, no, no, no.
I mean, these kind of scandalsand these kind of things, you
know, they go on for years.
And then, you know, when youfinally hear about them, like,
oh my gosh, how did that last solong?
And it's like, well, that's whatthey are.
You know, you never really...
hear about the short-termscandals, the two-week things.

(03:30):
These are things that have goneon for years and years and
years.

SPEAKER_03 (03:33):
And I guess he has no other choice than to plead
not guilty, but come on.
Does he really think thateverybody was just going along

SPEAKER_00 (03:42):
with it because they

SPEAKER_03 (03:42):
enjoyed it, enjoyed getting beat and

SPEAKER_00 (03:45):
drugged?
Here's the thing.
I don't follow the trial thatclosely.
It's not like I'm a courtreporter or anything, but It's
like all I've heard so far isthe domestic abuse stuff, right?
But he's on trial forconspiracy.

(04:06):
Right, sex trafficking.
And moving

SPEAKER_03 (04:08):
people

SPEAKER_00 (04:08):
across borders, right?
Across states, I mean.
Right, right, right.
So I'm waiting for the shoe todrop on those type of deals.

SPEAKER_03 (04:18):
What I thought was interesting about the case is
when all of a sudden you hearSuge Knight you know, chiming
in, talking to, to Chris Cuomo,who, you know, you haven't
another midlifer who you haven'tseen in a bit, but it was just
funny that he had become thisanalyst and given his side of

(04:40):
the story and talking about howTrump is going to pardon Diddy,
which could happen, you know,because, you know, Trump likes
his celebrities.
But then also Suge Knight,trying to maybe coming up with a
way that he can get out, youknow?

SPEAKER_00 (04:55):
Yeah, for sure.
I mean, and you got to take allthis with a grain of salt with
him.
I mean, obviously they've,they've got beef, long standing
beef, but you're right.
It is, it is interesting to seethese new sources going to him
for his opinions and weighing inon what's going on with that.
Yeah.
Yeah.

(05:15):
So yeah, it's, it's wild.
It's wild all the way around.
Yeah.
Have you had a chance to see theThunderbolt movie yet?

SPEAKER_03 (05:26):
Yes, I saw it a few weeks ago with my kids.
And a lot of midlifers in that.
I was actually surprised at howmany midlifers have major roles
in that.
David Harbour.
It

SPEAKER_00 (05:37):
is.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 (05:39):
I mean, Julia Louis- Go ahead and run them off.
She's older.
Sebastian Stain.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (05:45):
Yeah, I think he's early 40s.
Yeah.
I mean, it's hard to believethat- You already said David
Harbour.

SPEAKER_03 (05:51):
Winter Soldier is- A midlifer.

SPEAKER_00 (05:55):
He's a baby midlifer, but yeah, he's up
there.
Yeah, it's– well, did you andyour kids like the movie?

SPEAKER_03 (06:06):
So one of my kids said it was a 6.5.
I think maybe I would have givenit a 7.
Okay.
I feel like there's a lot ofsimilarities with other movies,
you know, and I think they werereally– Yeah.
Yeah.
trying hard to make it funnywith, you know, you, when it's
always a little bit tricky whenyou have like people doing

(06:27):
accents, you know, and so DavidHarbor and, um,

SPEAKER_00 (06:30):
Florence Pugh.

SPEAKER_03 (06:31):
Yeah.
Florence Pugh.
Yeah.
Who's actually, she's a greatactress, I think.
Great actor.
So, but I think it's always, Idon't know.
I get distracted by that.

SPEAKER_00 (06:41):
Yeah.
Um, I thought it was a prettygood movie.
The problem is, um, I was seeingreviews.
I actually waited a little bitlonger than I normally would to
watch one of these movies.
I am a Marvel head, fulldisclosure.
But I think when you're seeingcommercials for it, it's the

(07:01):
best Marvel movie since Endgame.
They keep pushing that.
Don't put that pressure

SPEAKER_03 (07:06):
on me.
I know.
Who's saying

SPEAKER_00 (07:08):
that?
Yeah.
But again, it was good to seethe midlifers that you mentioned
in the movie.
It's funny to me, though,because I've thought that, you
know, we're coming upon a timewhere they're trying to usher in
a younger generation of actorsplaying these roles.

(07:33):
And I think we are going to seethat.
But again, they, you know, theyhave to rely on the older
established stars before theycan get that going.
You know, even with the.
The movies that are coming out,the Doomsday movies and all that
stuff, you know, they'rebringing back the old X-Men

(07:55):
cast.
Not even the younger one, butwe're talking about like Ian
McKellar and the guy that playedPatrick Stewart.
But yeah, they're bringing backthose guys.
You know, obviously RobertDowney Jr.
is back involved now as Dr.
Doom.
So at some point, we're going tohave to slide these guys out of

(08:17):
the way and get some newer starsin there.
But I guess this is a goodthing.

SPEAKER_03 (08:21):
It's good for us as midlifers because it shows that
there's still good roles outthere.
You still can be the star.
You still can draw an audience.
So it's actually positive in alot of ways.
And we've talked about someother series, like TV series
that are streaming, wherethere's a lot of midlifers who
are kind of in the biggest roleof their lives now.
In midlife.

SPEAKER_00 (08:42):
Right.
Yeah, no, I agree with you.
The point I wanted to make wasthe problem with these movies is
ever since Infinity War andEndgame.
Uh-oh, you're going to break itdown.
Those were the apex Marvelmovies, right?

(09:03):
The highest grossing, thehighest rated movies.
And then these other movies thatcome after it, they're fine.
But then when you know thatthere's another big event like
Infinity War and Endgame that'son the horizon, to me, it kind

(09:24):
of lessens the values of thesemovies that precede that, in my
opinion.
Wait,

SPEAKER_03 (09:29):
so the Thunderbolts come after?
They did, right?
Because everybody haddisappeared, right?
Because of...
All the old ones are gone,right?
So they're the new...

SPEAKER_00 (09:42):
Right.
Yeah.
They're the new Avengers.
But they're bringing back allthe old established people for
the Doomsday thing, which is theequivalent of Infinity War and
Endgame.
That's the big, big, global,impactful...

(10:02):
cosmic thing that's comingaround the corner.
So I think these movies,although they're good, when
people can see that, oh, thenext big thing is coming, I
think it kind of devalues theseother movies that have to fall
in between.
Yeah, and at a certain point,it's

SPEAKER_03 (10:19):
like, how many more can you do before people stop

SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
watching?
I think it's been over 30 Marvelmovies so far, so it's not going
away.

SPEAKER_02 (10:32):
So

SPEAKER_03 (10:36):
other midlifers who are, you know what I was saying,
at the peak of their career,what about Pedro Pascal and Last
of Us?
I mean, he's 50, you know, he'sbeen around for a bit, but, you
know, I think he really, I thinkhis peak is now, right?
Don't you think this is hispeak?

(10:56):
biggest role.
We have Mandalorian, which isbig too, but Narcos.
But I think this is definitelyone that appeals to a lot of
people.

SPEAKER_00 (11:05):
Well, don't forget, he's also going to be Mr.
Fantastic.
Oh, right.

SPEAKER_03 (11:10):
But that's what I'm saying.
It's actually very interesting,right?
It wasn't like he was a youngerstar, like a Brad Pitt, who just
kept making movies.
It's like he didn't reallybecome famous until midlife.
And he's still...
you know, I think a huge draw.

SPEAKER_00 (11:28):
Yeah.
But these roles, I agree withyou a hundred percent, but these
roles are of men in theirmidlife years.
So it works perfectly for him.
You know, it's not like they hadto, to, to tailor it for him.
No, these, these, these peoplethat he are playing out in the
Mandalorian, I don't know, butyou know, Joel from the last of

(11:48):
us and Mr.
Fantastic, they're, they're,Their characters are his age.
Right,

SPEAKER_03 (11:56):
but they could have picked anybody else his age,
right?
There's

SPEAKER_02 (11:59):
a lot of actors

SPEAKER_00 (12:00):
out there.
They could have.
Yeah, of course.
Shout out to him.
These are roles of a lifetime.
I salute him.
So far, he's doing a great job.
Yeah, and he's also

SPEAKER_03 (12:15):
all around on social media, having fun, wearing funny
outfits or You know, superstylish thing.
So I think he's definitely gotthis playful young side to him,
younger side.
So maybe that keeps him current,too, and appealing to younger
audiences.

SPEAKER_00 (12:31):
100%.
Yeah, I think he's doing abang-up job.
Are you watching The Last of Us?
Have you been keeping up with

SPEAKER_03 (12:39):
it?
I haven't watched it.
Was it yesterday's episode?
But I've been watching.
And I kind of have thislove-hate relationship with Last
of Us because it, like, scaresthe crap out of me.
But then I'm like, oh, I can'tstop, right?
I got to see what happens,right?
It's so violent.

SPEAKER_00 (12:53):
And I'm not, like, you don't play the game, do

SPEAKER_03 (12:56):
you?
What's that?

SPEAKER_00 (12:59):
No, I never played the game.
That doesn't make itexhilarating and titillating
that it scares you and excitesyou at

SPEAKER_03 (13:06):
the same time?
I don't know.
I mean.
I think there's definitely thehuman element to it, you know,
because I like drama.
So if it didn't have therelationships, I probably
wouldn't.
If it was like pure horror, puregore, I definitely wouldn't like
it.
But there's the story to it,which I do like.
And I have to say that PedroPascal is a big draw, you know.

SPEAKER_00 (13:36):
Max, I know we gave...
Pedro Pascal, his flowers.
But I also want to give someflowers out to Walton Goggins.

SPEAKER_03 (13:48):
Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (13:48):
Walton.
I want to give him his flowers.
You know, he's getting a lot ofacclaim now for his role in The
White Lotus.
But I've always been a huge,huge fan of his.
He's our age.
He's in his 50s, right?

UNKNOWN (14:06):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 (14:07):
Yes, I think early.
Let me look that up because hewas on SNL.
It was really funny because

SPEAKER_00 (14:14):
he's a sex symbol now, right?
53.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
53.
Shout out to him.
He talks about being a sexsymbol now with receding hair
and all this other stuff, whichmade me laugh.
Yeah, that was funny.
No, he's been doing this thingfor a while.
He was–

SPEAKER_03 (14:30):
He's another one, right?
He's been acting for a while.
His name is Pedro Pascal, butreally is kind of hitting his
stride or his peak in terms ofpeople knowing him.
Right.
Becoming a household name now.

SPEAKER_00 (14:41):
Right, yeah.
But yeah, he's been acting sincethe early 90s, late 80s.
Yeah, for a while.
But he's always been like thesesupporting characters.
I remember him in The Shield.
I don't know if you ever watchedthat back in the day.
I

SPEAKER_03 (14:56):
did not.

SPEAKER_00 (14:57):
But- I remember him in The Shield.
He did a good job there.
And then he started appearing insome Quentin Tarantino movies.
I remember him in DjangoUnchained.

SPEAKER_03 (15:11):
I saw him in Justified.
I didn't watch all of theseasons of Justified, but he was
really good in Justified.

SPEAKER_00 (15:17):
Yeah, Hateful Eight.
And then he started doing...
shows with...
What's my man's name fromEastbound and Down?
I can't think of it

SPEAKER_02 (15:27):
right now.

SPEAKER_00 (15:28):
But he did...
He's in The Righteous Gemstones.
If you haven't seen that, it ishilarious.

SPEAKER_03 (15:34):
Is it Danny?

SPEAKER_00 (15:36):
Danny McBride.
There you go.
And he was also in VicePrincipals as well, too.
And there's also that one...
What's that

SPEAKER_03 (15:44):
one that was on HBO recently?
Let me look it up.
You know, where he plays the...
Like the guy back for theskeleton guy.
Have you seen that one?

SPEAKER_00 (15:54):
Oh, that wasn't HBO.
That was Prime.
Fallout.
Yeah, Fallout.
Fallout, yes, yes.
Also a very good series.
Very violent, too.
I think season two is coming outlater this year, so I'm really
looking forward to that.

SPEAKER_03 (16:09):
Yeah, so see, that's proof, too, right?
All these big roles he has arein his 50s, early 50s.

SPEAKER_02 (16:18):
let's

SPEAKER_03 (16:24):
talk about tracy ellis ross i mean this was in
the news a while ago when shedid some podcasts with michelle
obama but she talked about notwanting to date people her age
and she's in her 50s right

SPEAKER_00 (16:37):
yes she's definitely in her 50s uh well okay That's
fine.
But her reasons were that men,and she said she was
generalizing, that she said menher age are steeped in toxic

(17:01):
masculinity.

SPEAKER_03 (17:02):
So what do you think that means?

SPEAKER_00 (17:04):
Now, just, I don't know.
Being too old-fashioned?
Being too traditional?
Right, kind of.
I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 (17:14):
Backwards.
Conservative, maybe.
Maybe like thinking about rolesin the household, like
expectations.

SPEAKER_00 (17:25):
Yeah.
As a man of that age, I mean, Itake offense to that.
Well, she did admit she wasgeneralizing,

SPEAKER_03 (17:33):
right?
So she was just saying ingeneral, men her age.

SPEAKER_00 (17:38):
In general, that means more than...
Right.
And that

SPEAKER_03 (17:42):
could be true.
You know, people are, you know,you grow up in a certain age or
decade and you're going to havethose.
I definitely learned a lot or Ithought, you know, seeing my
parents, how they interactedwith each other impacted me in
my marriage.
Right.
And so I think that's what she'ssaying is that.
men her age kind of picked up onthese things from their parents

(18:05):
who were of the older generationwhere it was like the woman
stayed at home or the womancooked you know and cleaned and
so I think that's what she'ssaying or like the man has to
protect the woman or maybe theman is intimidated by because
she's a very successful she hasa successful career right she's
very independent so maybe that'swhat she's saying

SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
yeah but I again I'm struggling with the words toxic
masculinity um I don'tnecessarily know what that
means.
It's one of

SPEAKER_03 (18:34):
those things that people throw around.
I think

SPEAKER_00 (18:38):
it's a nebulous term.
You know what I mean?
I don't know if I could defineit either.
It's being old-fashioned.
What does masculine mean?
In

SPEAKER_03 (18:46):
that sense, it's meaning masculine is a negative
thing.
It's like a caveman.

SPEAKER_00 (18:51):
You're a caveman.
That's like saying beingfeminine is a negative thing.
Right.
It

SPEAKER_03 (18:58):
comes with certain ideas, I'm sure.
Anyhow, so do you not agree?
So you don't agree with it?
Do you find it offensive becauseyou are her age and you don't
feel like you're overlytraditional?
Or do you feel like you have asimilar personality to somebody
who's 10, 20 years younger thanyou?
I mean, you date women who areyounger, right?

SPEAKER_00 (19:20):
Yes.
Yes, I do.

UNKNOWN (19:23):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (19:24):
But it's not because I feel women my age are, well,
there's also aspects ofavailability as well, too.
Women my age generally aren'tsuper available.
You

SPEAKER_03 (19:38):
think?
Are you saying like women, don'tyou think there's a lot of women
who are single, maybe divorced?
In

SPEAKER_00 (19:46):
their 50s?
Yeah.
No.
And I mean, are we going to turnthis into a dating podcast?
Because we can.
You know, I'll put it this way,Max.
Here we go.
One of my buddies, I said thisone time.

(20:08):
He said he was asked to describehis type, right?
He says his type is whoeverlikes me.

SPEAKER_03 (20:19):
Aw.
He

SPEAKER_00 (20:23):
said that seriously?
Seriously.
And I'm rolling with thatnarrative.
Now, obviously, there'slimitations and barriers and
that sort of thing.
But again, my type is whoeverlikes me.
I tend to like women that likeme, right?

(20:43):
Of course.
You're not going to likesomebody who doesn't like you

SPEAKER_03 (20:46):
unless you like being

SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
ignored or something.
Right.
But it's not like I'm lookingfor this type of person.
Right, right.
You know when you know, right?
Whether it's race.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, forsure.
But generally, it's not mehoning in or pinpointing
somebody and saying, I want her.
It's usually, for whateverreason, either she tells me or I

(21:13):
find out, hey, I like you.
So then this person becomes...
attractive to me.
Okay.
Now, I don't know if that'sbecause of age or whatever.
It sounds like you're in

SPEAKER_03 (21:25):
elementary school.

SPEAKER_00 (21:28):
Hey, it does.
She likes me, so I like her.
Yeah, so now I like her.
Yeah, you see what I'm saying?
It just makes life easy for me.
But listen, Tracy, I don't likethe way you generalized men my
age.
It is, that's your experiences.
You can do that.

(21:48):
I think there are some fine menout there my age, including
myself, who would love to treata beautiful woman, a successful
woman yourself, as a queen thatyou should be treated.
I hate the fact that yougeneralized us as being toxic,
masculine individuals.

(22:10):
But I think it's also somewhatof a I think it's also somewhat
of a cop-out, too.
I'm not going to lie to you,Max.

SPEAKER_03 (22:16):
You mean like a defense mechanism?
Maybe people aren't

SPEAKER_00 (22:20):
chasing her?
Yeah, I think she just likesyounger men, and that's fine.
Right,

SPEAKER_03 (22:25):
she could just be attracted to younger men.
You know, some people have atype, right?
I'm attracted to.
She could just be attracted toyounger.

SPEAKER_00 (22:31):
Correct, correct.
Yeah, it may even be beyond aphysical attraction.
She likes their energy, the waythey treat her, blah, blah,
blah, you know?
And I think that's the way sheshould have addressed it.
I don't think she should havetorn us down.
You know, she's saying all thisfrom the experiences she's had
with men.

(22:51):
And who's to say how many menshe's had that are our age.
What's the sample size?
But just say what you like.
Don't tear down a whole spectrum

SPEAKER_03 (23:00):
of men.
Well, maybe

SPEAKER_00 (23:00):
she's had enough bad experiences.

SPEAKER_03 (23:03):
Maybe she's had enough bad experiences with men
her age that have made her thinkit.
Yeah, of

SPEAKER_00 (23:09):
course we have.
Yeah, but yeah.
Yeah.
And I'm not going to negate orminimize what she's gone
through, you know, and she cansay and do whatever she wants.
So I just think that she couldhave done a better way of said
it a better way without tearing,tearing us down.

(23:30):
Thanks for joining us for thisepisode of Midlife Marauders.
Follow us on social media andwherever you stream your
podcast.

SPEAKER_03 (23:38):
We also want to give a big shout out to Frank Moyne
at Moyne music for providing thebeats for our theme music and to
our listeners.
Keep on marauding and see younext time.