Crafting Creativity in the Brewing World with Robbie Narquis

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Robbie Narcos.
How are ya, robbie narcos?
How are you?

Speaker 2 (00:30):
hey doing great thanks for having me up here
yeah, it's good to have you outhere man at my place at the
teacup studio.

Speaker 1 (00:38):
I'm here first time, first time, and uh, I mean the
bed looks pretty or the couchlooks pretty rancid, not rancid,
just a little out of place.
It's huge Out of shape.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but, dude,welcome, welcome.
Long time no see, but a longtime since you've been on the

(00:59):
podcast.
A lot of things have changed,not just in my podcast, but in
the brewing world, the homebrewing world.
So, robbie dude, you ever thinkyour beer would be the
highlight of December 2024?

Speaker 2 (01:17):
I had no idea that that would happen.
Yeah, I mean being on Instagramand everything.
I like putting out some videosevery once in a while and
sometimes some stick and doeverything and get maybe 5,000,
10,000 views on some stuff.
That's pretty cool anddifferent in the world.
But with this one in Decemberwith the tree beer, yeah, it's

(01:40):
topped over 2 million 2 millionviews on Instagram on a reel.
I didn't think I was in thatkind of game when I was doing it
and it's reached people acrossthe entire world that way.
People who weren't even inbrewing it just pops up because
it was trending so much.
Yeah, one of the top trendingvideos of like the last two

(02:04):
weeks.

Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, compare and contrast from last year.
I know you made a video lastyear.

Speaker 2 (02:08):
Yeah, this is the fifth year I've done it, so I've
done a video every year, okay Idon't know what truly made this
one different.
Besides, maybe just video workis just getting a little bit
better.
Is it the music?
I don't know is it thesoundtrack.

Speaker 1 (02:20):
I think soundtrack can help yeah soundtrack can
help.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
I, I know that does help boost certain areas.
But if soundtrack is saturated,stuff moves quick.
Yeah, so for me to get a lot ofviews really quick, that
probably happened.
And then when the metrics andeverything see something that's
getting a lot of views quicklyon a soundtrack that gets a lot

(02:45):
of traffic, they usually stickthose to the top, even though
people are turning videos withthat music pretty quick.
Okay, all right, I just kind ofwanted a jolly Christmas
background with that music andthat's just kind of how it
turned out with the Treebear.

Speaker 1 (03:03):
Have you looked at from last year's to this year's
numbers?

Speaker 2 (03:08):
Yes, last year I did get like 500,000.

Speaker 1 (03:11):
500,000, but not compared to this year.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
And I do have about, I don't know.
There's about 2,000, 2,500followers more than last year.
Okay, but just with this videoand its own, I've doubled.

Speaker 1 (03:25):
Yeah, my okay, do you think?
Do you think it has to do withhomebrewing as a?

Speaker 2 (03:32):
whole, I would say I don't know, because there was a
spike in 2020.
A lot of people staying at home, of course, the yeah you know
what um came along and, uh, alot of people wanted to do some
hobbies and brewing got kind ofbig again for some people and
it's been a couple years now.
People's attention spansusually last one to two years on

(03:55):
a hobby, especially if itdoesn't kick off.
So, honestly, the past year ortwo, I'd say it's actually died
down a little bit.
The hobby in general, thepeople who have stuck it out,
are the people that are doing alot more different things and
yeah, that's the whole point ofhome brewing is experimenting.
I'm not here turning barrelsamount of beer.
I mean my system, I mean youcould, I could, yeah, you could,

(04:17):
but I just do.
I do a half barrel full-sizekeg set up right now and you're
happy with I'm happy with thateven though it's high in demand
high in demand.
It goes quick, but that's that'swhy it's good.
It's a good system for me, towhere I don't have stuff hanging
around but but I'm not.

Speaker 1 (04:30):
I'm not cheesing.
I mean, you are high in demand.
You got a lot of my buddieswere gonna come in here.
One of my buddies was gonnacome here and get some of your
brew, yeah, but uh, you know,just have a couple, yeah, um
that's the point he couldn'tmake it, but we will touch base,
yeah the homebrewing stuff.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
It's cool.
I mean, I tried to dedicate mybeer to something greater and
everything, and so I do that andmy beer is free.
I can't sell my beer, of course, that's one day homebrewing.
One day, one day but I got lotsof cool hats and shirts.
That's why I do what you gaveme.

Speaker 1 (05:04):
I do Thank you.

Speaker 2 (05:05):
I do lots of cool artwork with my brand, my logo,
yeah, and that's kind of how Ican get beer out by showing off
I'm going to wear that.

Speaker 1 (05:13):
Yeah, the hat wear looks great, the beading Looks
great.
Yeah, thank you, thank you.
But yeah, also, you do a lot ofwork etching.
Yeah, yeah, your own etching.
Yeah, my wife what is it?

Speaker 2 (05:28):
yeah, it's laser engraving.
Yeah, laser, my wife has that.
She does a ton of work withthat.
I play around with it as wellwith my brewing, uh, logos and
things.
But yeah, that's my wife's kindof gig.
She knows a little, a lot ofthe tricks and things like that.
And uh, yeah, now we're gettinginto leather patches and heat
pressing onto hats.
Now we're doing into leatherpatches and heat pressing onto
hats.
Now we're doing our own hats.
I'm wearing one of them rightnow, one of our new ones.

(05:49):
And the etcher does that, yeah,we can laser right onto the
patch, and then we just got ahat press.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
Now do you glue it on ?
Yeah, it's a heated hat.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
Okay, but I tried to rip one.
I wanted to see how good theywere.
Yeah, I pressed, did the pressand tried to rip it off, and it
was pretty much impossible.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
So you got a whole system you have to really yank
on that thing.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
Your hat would be ruined by the time you deal with
that.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
You have a whole system in your garage.

Speaker 2 (06:17):
It's a fun.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
Not only, it's our hobbies.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yeah.
My wife and I like to work andkeep things interesting with
creating.
We're a bunch of creators there.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
Yes, you are With four kids.
Don't know how you do it Withfour kids.

Speaker 2 (06:32):
Don't know how you do it.
Four kids under seven.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
So do you think the homebrewing, your homebrewing,
is a hobby.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
Yes, currently it's definitely a hobby for me.
I mean, my day job is kind ofwhat keeps me going with all
that, being able to come home tonot only having awesome kids
and a family that's loving andcaring, but something to do on
my own time.
And the beer really kind ofkeeps me going, even if I'm not

(07:02):
even in.
My interest is much more in thecreation and the artwork and
the art of brewing.
Yeah, I love dealing with umdistributors and stuff like that
.
I try to make sure all my beers,of course, are grown here in
washington, but majority of myingredients are usually always
either the grain the grain ispretty much always from eastern

(07:23):
washington uh, from farmers, andso I get to know the farmers
that way.
That's kind of how I reallywant to make sure that.
And then, of course, the hopsare all yakima valley.
Um, being this close to yakimavalley, it's pretty much yeah,
that's pretty much how you getyour hops around here, but
getting them fresh and beingable to go straight to the
farmer and know them by name andthem knowing me and their and

(07:43):
them trusting you.
Yeah, knowing that supportivethat they am for me just being
this humble home brewer yeah,just little little things, but
the beer speaks for itself fromwhat people have told me, more
than just a home brewer.
And when you start dealing withall your products are winning

(08:04):
competitions and I'm not justusing plastic buckets and
letting stuff ferment on a whim.
Everything is controlled.
I pretty much have 100% scaleddown full brewery in my garage
where it's yeah, everything'sstainless glycol chiller system,
all fermentation is controlledto a tenth of a degree and

(08:25):
everything trying to keep itjust as consistent as I can.
And I know going from this levelto commercial level, that's
always the big change, like,yeah, I can make it at this
level, but scaling up andeverything, and that's when
things kind of change.
So I am starting to get into I.
I do know a lot of the brewersaround here yakimaima Valley,

(08:45):
spokane, small cities I know atleast a couple at each in each
city, and I know that they wantto keep doing stuff.
I've done a couple upscales ofmy recipes with them and they've
always turned out great.
They've they've been able tosell out my recipes out there.

Speaker 1 (09:01):
Which ones ones, if you don't mind me asking um.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
So last year, or yeah , last year, I did a um an india
pale lager which is ipa butuses lager yeast and just a
little bit lighter bodied uhuses house.
But that was my saw all day.
That was I won that.
That was a competition that Iwon and was able to scale up my
recipe up at Black Label Brewingin.

Speaker 1 (09:27):
Spokane Yep.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
And, yeah, I've started to become good friends
with those guys up there.
Every time I'm in Spokane, stopby and they want to keep doing
more with me.
And then a new brewery that'sjust out of Yakima or Natchez,
just outside Natchez, and Titanor Teton, wherever however, they

(09:49):
want to say that Titan, umshort head brewing.
Good buddy Chris over there.
He started this brewery he was,uh, kind of like the
experimental brewer at YakimaValley hops and then started his
own brewery and he started that.
He opened up this past spring.

Speaker 1 (10:09):
Him and I are going to be doing a brew next month,
him and I are coming up with arecipe to do so.
We'll scale up a recipetogether up there.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
Okay, and I know he's what's the bird?
Uh, his name's chris my lorry.

Speaker 1 (10:14):
Okay, what's the brewery?

Speaker 2 (10:14):
the brewery's called short head short head, okay,
yeah so he was, uh, in thequarry industry, he was operator
.
So a short head is basically, Ithink, the machine that
basically crunches all thegravel and everything Makes
sense.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
Yeah, makes sense.
Okay, all right.
So where are you going to getsomething local?

Speaker 2 (10:33):
Like a space.
No A space to sell or somethingon tap, just a person that will
share your recipe.

Speaker 1 (10:39):
You can share your recipe, not so much you know,
going there and show them what'sdone.
I mean pretty much you're gonnago, yeah, and show them what's
how it's done.
But like, when are you gonnashare a recipe and make a
presence in tri-cities?
Um?

Speaker 2 (10:58):
I hope that sometime soon.
I know weed heads has been.
They just opened up a, they'recoming up on their year
anniversary and I know they'rejust getting things situated.
But I know the guys there andthey keep saying, yeah, we need
to do something together, let'sdo a collective, we need to brew
together.
So I think it's coming, I don'tknow when.

Speaker 1 (11:17):
Patience, Patience young Jedi.

Speaker 2 (11:19):
Yeah, exactly, it'll come someday, someday, and it'll
for me.

Speaker 1 (11:23):
I think they're sleeping on you.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yeah, I mean, they're sleeping on you.
I understand the business sideof things.
They want to make sureeverything, especially in a
first year.
But I know Weed Heads wants todo a lot of collaboration stuff.
They just did a collaborationwith Valley Brewing in Yakima.
They're wanting to do some andthey did it with what's the
brewery over in Pasco Sage.

Speaker 1 (11:46):
Sage.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
That one was solid.
They did a collective with them, that one was solid.
That's the thing.
That's just different.
I felt like in the Tri-Citiesscene is not as much
collaborations between thebreweries.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
Well, you can't collaborate a lot like Varietal.
I mean Varietal has they're themaster of collaborators, so
it's like sunny side yeah, yeah,awesome, yeah, but no, I think
stuff is.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
I think if they want to know that to survive in this
industry, they're gonna have tocome together a little bit more.
It's kind of breweries gonna.
Breweries are still justpopping, popping off, going away
, um, yeah, and there's some newones coming, but there's also
ones leaving at the same time,so it's it's a hard industry
right now.
I had 2019 when so I starteddoing this brewing, kind of like

(12:32):
2017 time frame.
I did some uh, it was in thewine industry before that.
If people listen to the lastpodcast, I kind of talked about
how I started with myfermentation and everything in
the wine industry.
But 2017 is when I reallystarted getting into brewing.
And then 2019, just a new yearof 2020 as well.
I had like a business planBecause I wanted to maybe do

(12:54):
this full time not full time butlike side gig as well as my day
job and kind of just do like aweekend place to have beer and
yeah beer on tap somewhere, acouple taps and not make a big
deal out of it, but also make abig deal out of it as in you
have to go in to get it or elseit's gonna be gone.
I kind of like that, that Idon't want to just mass produce

(13:16):
and just have my stuffeverywhere.
I kind of want it to be thislittle kind of thing, and I'm
not sure I know people would say, oh, you should just go as big
as it can go.
I was like, but for my personalfeeling, I like that kind of
niche little oh, you need to gothere.
If you're not going to be thereat this time, okay, you might
be screwed out of a beer.

Speaker 1 (13:38):
Yeah, yeah not knowing, knowing the system,
knowing your system, knowing howbeer around here is and you
know elsewhere.
Do you find it as a littleniche or do you find yourself
knowing that if you do putyourself out there, it's a lot
bigger than you think?
Yeah, oh yeah, but right nowyou're just sticking to your

(14:01):
guns and you're going small,sticking small, yep.
Right now you're just stickingto your guns and you're you're
going.
You're going small, stickingsmall, yep, even though, like
you have what you have, the uh,the three series which is
phenomenal, right, which the thearchangel.

Speaker 2 (14:18):
Yes, oh yeah.
Yeah, that's a series I put outthis year.
Yes, and it's something I'mgoing to probably be doing every
year.
Yeah, but I'm going to make itdifferent every year, so it's
going to be a different hop.
So how that went for the peoplethat don't know or has followed
, I did an Archangel series.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
I wanted you on for that one.

Speaker 2 (14:32):
Yeah, I did an Archangel series, which was
basically I brewed the same beer, same base beer, three times in
a row, but just changed out thedifferent hops in each one.
I wanted a different series ofhops in each beer, but the same
base.

Speaker 1 (14:45):
So phenomenal um.
It's a good way.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
It's a good way to like taste through some hops and
kind of see what works together, what doesn't.
Um, to me, all they, all thosevarieties that I did with each
of those series, turned out towork really well together so,
but one or two really stood out.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
Yeah, it was two right two and two or three.
Um, it was probably the same,it was two right Two or three.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
I knew it was, it was probably the, so it was St
Michael, st Gabriel and StRaphael.
St Raphael was the one that waslike a lot of Australian New
Zealand hops, so it's a lot moretropical.
It was a more tropical style,whereas the St Michael, of
course, st Michael's the triedand true OG angel.

Speaker 1 (15:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:26):
So he's, he got all the ones that are like your
traditional style hops withCitra and Citra and Idaho 7.

Speaker 1 (15:38):
You really tasted the Idaho 7.

Speaker 2 (15:40):
Yeah, so that was like very citrus forward, how
you usually want an IPA verycitrus and then St Gabriel the
messenger like very citrusforward.
I usually want an IPA verycitrus and then St Gabriel the
Messenger.
I forgot which one.
The Gabriel one was the onethat had like Centennial Simcoe
hops.

Speaker 1 (15:54):
Okay, what inspired you to do that?
Those three archangels andthose three beers.

Speaker 2 (16:02):
Yeah, I kind of just I knew I wanted to try different
hop series.
I didn't.
That's kind of what I, withbeing a home brewer, I can kind
of do in these do these littleexperiments and not have to
worry about turning them orworrying about having to make
them again.
I'm kind of just doing a fullgo at them.
But what really drew me to itwas, I mean, archangels are a

(16:25):
major presence for me and a lotof my faith and stuff like that,
being Catholic and everythinglike that, I just kind of wanted
to think of something that wentwell in three and I know
there's three main archangelsand it kind of just worked out
that way and so each year nowI'm going to re-release them
every year, but it's going to bea different hop series every

(16:47):
time.
So there's some breweries thatdo that, that they have like a
rotating beer that changes outthe hops and that's kind of like
this is my kind of version.
But then I want to do it so Ihave three at a time so people
can have three beers side byside and then kind of taste
through that, cause that'ssomething that I really like
doing and, coming from the wineindustry, like it's a lot about

(17:10):
tasting a lot, a lot aboutknowing where your crop comes
from and yeah, so it's.
it's really fun.
I think I'm not just here tojust drink beer and then just
drink, and then just drink LikeI'm really wanting to dive
deeper into every beer I drinkand okay um, kind of like wine
and everything like that.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
But um, so you have that, you have tasters, and then
you've had all positive reviewsin that yeah, people loved it.

Speaker 2 (17:38):
Uh, when people want some, I'm usually okay with
sending some stuff out to peopleand, pretty much like I said, I
can't sell the.
I'm usually okay with sendingsome stuff out to people and,
pretty much like I said, I can'tsell the beer, I'm okay with
that.
But I usually sell a swag itemwith that and that usually
covers it.
Like I said, my day job coversa lot of this that I'm doing.
I just kind of want to breakeven and the money I make off

(18:00):
any of the swag and stuff likethat just goes straight back
into ingredients.
Like I'm not using this to makeany sort of capital gains on
anything.
Basically just the art.
It's just the cover, the coverthe fun.
And I love doing that, so I'mnot necessarily worried about
getting in.
People want to try it Like,yeah, I'm okay, I'm not a

(18:20):
stickler on people.

Speaker 1 (18:21):
Why not keep one on tap?
Because you the stickler onpeople.
Why not keep one on tap?
Because you have that garageand you do have guests
throughout your neighborhoodvisiting you right, Good old
neighbors and you know they havea lot to say.
They have a lot to say.
Why not have one of those beerslike the most voted?
You know, high voting beer.
Yeah, on tap year round Allaround.

Speaker 2 (18:43):
Hey, it's a good idea , why not?
Like I said, I'm down forpeople telling me things and I'm
down to listen, but there's a,like I said, I can have beers
going like that if we want.
I just don't know.
I have like six recipes that Iknow, that are nailed down, and

(19:05):
ones that I know.
That's something that I wouldtruly want to scale up.
I'd have to bring up on mynotes which in each and every
single one.
But I mean, I think I have,like I have a pale ale, two IPAs
and then a lager, a pilsner, sothat's two, three, four five.
So that's two, three, four five.

(19:29):
Um, one more, I think it's.
Then it's more like a, a darkerbeer that I had, but it's no,
no, it's the, my irish red,that's what?
Yeah, darker.
So it's an irish beer that Imake every single year for saint
patrick's day.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
I know I like that yeah, you normally stick with
seasons yeah, I try to doseasonal styles and keep it
going and not yes.

Speaker 2 (19:46):
Yeah, With my time.
Like I said, my time has beenshortened.

Speaker 1 (19:50):
The past year or two.
Congrats on the baby.
Yeah, with new baby again.

Speaker 2 (19:54):
and just kind of going through that motion again.
But it's fun I love.
I wouldn't want anythingdifferent yeah.

Speaker 1 (20:02):
But you brew year-round and it is crazy the
time that you find to brew yeahand, yes, you have your oldest
daughter.
Yep, you know, helping you out.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
Yeah, she comes in and she's my good hop edition,
but with little kid with thearchangel.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
You have two other hot seasonal beers and that's
the pumpkin yep the crazyimperial imperial automail yeah,
yeah, yeah, that one's the main, uh, main staple yeah, and then
that's my heavy hitter you havethe the tree beer yes, those
two are you're known for yeah, Iknow soon.

(20:42):
Archangels will soon be there,as high up as the tree beer and
the pumpkin beer.
Yeah, when will you have onethat stays in year in, year out
and you just make it just foryou?

Speaker 2 (20:58):
Constantly making sure it's there all the time
yeah.
I would say I might need to geta couple of these people
together and we're going to haveto vote on which one, because I
could say my own thing.
Everyone has a different palate, what everyone likes, and I
know there's people that justlike variety as well.
That's me, being one person.
Yes, I like knowing thatbreweries have stuff on tap all

(21:21):
the time the same ones, but I'malso a person that wants to go
in and try something differentevery time yeah, but if it ain't
broke, don't yeah exactly I'mnot.
Yeah, I'm not trying to fix orchange anything, but yeah, it's
um a lot of these beers.
I'm just getting nailed downbut I will.
If that's something that wewant to do, we can definitely I
can make it happen.

(21:41):
Okay, I can make it.
It's not like I can't make abeer on tap all the time.

Speaker 1 (21:48):
With your Imperial the Autumn.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
Pumpkin Yep the Old.

Speaker 1 (21:51):
Souls, the Old Souls, right.
How many people homebrewers oranybody out there have you seen
brew that kind of beer the wayyou do?

Speaker 2 (22:01):
I've seen just throughout social media, of
course.
It's kind of where you can kindof see all this stuff do?
I've seen, uh, just throughoutsocial media, of course it's
kind of where you can kind ofsee all this stuff.
I've seen it a handful of times.
I don't know about to the scalethat I'm doing.
Yeah, actually, like mashingthe entire beer in a pumpkin.
I'm sure someone else has doneit before, I mean I.
There's probably people thathave done it.
Don't video it or somethinglike that.
I don't think I'm doing.

(22:22):
I'm doing something crazy, ofcourse, but I don't video it or
something like that.
I don't think I'm doing.
I'm doing something crazy, ofcourse, but I don't know if it's
never not been done.
I know people do pumpkin beersevery year and I know they serve
beer out of pumpkins atmultiple different breweries
around the United States.
I know that they serve them outof it.
Um, but for me, actuallygetting a giant pumpkin at my
house, gutting it, toasting it,it, and then mashing an entire

(22:46):
half barrel beer inside of this285 pound pumpkin, I'd say
that's.
That's definitely unique.
Yeah, um, and whether peoplethink that it really does
something, uh, that's for themto choose and not not just say
it without trying it.
Um, and I understand everyonedoesn't like pumpkin beers.
I'm not even necessarily apumpkin beer fan yeah I mean, I

(23:07):
like this beer because it's alot more of the earthy take on
it, where it's not just pumpkinspice, it has vanilla beans, it
has some cinnamon added to it,nutty, I have roasted pecans and
walnuts in it, so it's a lotmore going on.
And, yeah, the vanilla beansare soaked in bourbon for a
couple weeks beforehand as well.

Speaker 1 (23:28):
What inspired you to do that beer?
That was, and continue thatbeer.

Speaker 2 (23:34):
Yeah, so me and a friend of mine who used to do
some brewing together for fun,when I was first kind of getting
started, our families went toPumpkin Patch together and we
said let's try to find thebiggest one, just to find the
biggest one We've.
Our families went to pumpkinpatch together and we said let's
try to find the biggest one,but just to find the biggest one
.
We weren't even thinking ofbeer.
I was like once we startedseeing some of these big ones
were like we could probably putliquid or something that we
could make alcohol sound and solet's.

(23:56):
And then we were getting thatand so it kind of started.
First two years we did it, soyears we did it.
So I've yeah, I've been doingthat beer six, six or seven
years now.
Okay, um, always I've alwaysmade mine dark and so it's kind
of a friend and I we used to.
Just the first two years wekind of did it together and then
I just kind of continued doingit every year and just kind of

(24:17):
modifying it ever so slightlyand just kind of getting it to
the way that I want it.
But I kind of like that whereit's just slightly different
every year.
I usually keep a can or twofrom the year prior and taste
them side by side.
And of course that's an age andsee how that goes, but it's
usually a 9% or higher beer.
So it's usually my beer.

(24:38):
I want to have around a nicefall campfire and everything
like that.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
You got any people that try to copycat?
Yeah, they come and talk to you.
Yeah, usually there's people.

Speaker 2 (24:52):
Yeah, I'm, I'm.
I'm not a person wherenothing's a secret.
I'll tell everyone my recipes.
That, for a brewing world, Imean, everyone's gonna make a
beer different.
It's a different system,different location, different
grain.
I'm more than happy to givetips or pointers or whatever
people want, and I know there'sa couple of people that tried

(25:12):
doing it a different way, wherethey would a lot of people would
just get smaller pumpkins andthen roast them and cut them up
and then put them into the mashas well that way, which I think
is perfect way of doing it.
Like you can do that too For me.
I way um, which I think isperfect way of doing it.
Like that you can do that toofor me.
I like putting on.
I have the neighbors over.
We kind of make it a wholething.
It's a show, it's fun.
Yeah, you get to put a bunch ofhot wart and grain inside of a

(25:35):
giant pumpkin.
It's, it's fun, it's really funto do um, and it kind of goes
to that point where I'm just I'mdoing that part for fun.

Speaker 1 (25:43):
I'm not trademarking anything on that, okay what
about the pumpkin that justkeeps you going on, man?
Because pumpkin, you know psls,it's high in the female world.
Oh yeah, it's high and you know, and that's why I tried to make
it a much more darker, earthylike even though it's a higher

(26:03):
in alcohol, it's a drier beer.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
It's not sweet.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
I'm not a sweet beer guy, so usually my stuff is
fermented pretty good.
And yeah, I'm fine with thecriticism on people.
Like people can say whateverthey want.
They have their own thoughts.
I'm not doing it to.
I'm doing it because it's fun.
And I mean I'm doing it it'sfun and I mean I'm doing these
multiple years and I keepgetting good feedback from
people that want it greatfeedback and I usually have no

(26:28):
issues getting rid with a half akeg, so I I'll keep doing it
half a keg gives you how manybeers um yeah, I think that's.
It's usually like 120 to 130pints or so it.
That's a lot.

Speaker 1 (26:43):
Yeah, that's a lot.
Yeah, have you ever considered?
You know somebody say, hey, man, if you brew this, I'll put it
in my shop, or you know whoever,wherever, and you ever feel

(27:07):
like once somebody?

Speaker 2 (27:07):
finds out.
Once you know your fans findout where it's at, you think
it'll sell out in a day, twodays.
Less than that could be.
Yeah, I think it could.
Um, if people want to.
There's people that want tocontract me to do some and
you've had some talks.
Yeah, there's some talks and I'mfine with the talks and if
stuff moves forward, it movesforward.
I'm not pushing anything.
Like I said, I'm kind of justmoving with the flow of it right
now.
Um, things are coming up withdoing stuff at these commercial

(27:30):
breweries now for me and, yeah,kind of do things that way and
um, hopefully, when do thosecollaboration beers?
That it does go quick and good.
That's I, that's what I wantfor the brewery I'm helping out
and brewing a beer at a breweryI want.
I wanted to sell it quick,purely because I want that if
I'm doing stuff at that brewery,I value that brewery and I want

(27:51):
them to do good too.
I want yeah and if for somereason, bringing me in does that
, for that I don't know.
That's always a crazy thoughtin my mind that people would
bring me in to make their beersell.
I don't know.
I don't know how many peoplewould do that, but maybe I don't
know, maybe I'm just too humbleon that.
You're too humble man, you'retoo humble dude.

(28:13):
I mean, I've had your beer Itried it all, yeah no, I, I've
had it all and I, you know, I'mnot, I'm, I'm humble for you,
dude but this is like there'sbeer all over and there good
beer, and I don't want people tothink that there can't be good
beer other places.
Good beer can come out ofanywhere.

Speaker 1 (28:30):
So the home brewing world in Tri-Cities Mm-hmm,
you're part of it.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
Yeah, there's a good club about the whole.
Yeah, mid-columbia ZymergyAssociation it's a great club.
Gets it's a great club.
It gets a lot of people started.
A lot of people, I would sayCome and go.
Yeah, there's some come andgoers, but there's also the
people that have been there along time and there's people
that usually just come to tasteand kind of learn their

(28:55):
knowledge on more tasting stuffand where they're not doing as
much of the brewing on their own.
But we're open in this club forpeople just to get more
knowledge on everything.
It's not just a kegger club ondrinking on once every Thursday,
it's everything's tasting andwe have quarterly competitions.

Speaker 1 (29:13):
And yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:14):
I try to make sure that just kind of display hey,
this is beers that you can makeat home, like I mean.
Yes, it takes equipment andsome time and years of knowledge
, but it can be made to whereyou can make some of the best
beer at home.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Okay, so when did you start going to the home brewing
meetings?

Speaker 2 (29:36):
It was probably like 2017, 2018.

Speaker 1 (29:38):
Yeah, Okay.
How has the numbers been?
Have they just fluctuated?

Speaker 2 (29:43):
At the beginning it was pretty low, but then, yeah,
I would say it's definitely goneup in the past couple years.
We're staying pretty consistentnow Steady.
Yeah, the people that havestuck with it are staying there.
And yeah, with being Tri-Cities, there's people that come in
and then leave and move andstuff like that.

(30:04):
There's people that come in andthen leave and move and stuff
like that.

Speaker 1 (30:06):
It's probably a silly question, but do a lot of them
share the same love for the gameas you do?
Yeah, there's a handful.

Speaker 2 (30:16):
I wouldn't say everyone.
Some people just make beer tomake beer.

Speaker 1 (30:19):
Yeah, like just to get by, like dude Coors Light,
you know, not necessarily noeveryone's pretty crafty.

Speaker 2 (30:25):
Everyone wants to make a different craft beer,
like there's people that want tojust do the craziest thing
every single time.

Speaker 1 (30:31):
But you know what I mean.
Like hey, dude, you know Idon't want to purchase Coors
Light at the store.
I'm going to make my light beer.

Speaker 2 (30:37):
Yeah, that's the thing People thought Brewing
would be like oh, you're goingto save money on beer.
It's like eh not really.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
Yeah right, seeing what you do, you want to do more
you want to do more.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
You want to keep doing more.
If you're interested in it.
It'll just push you to want tobuy more.
Buy more equipment, theequipment.
But my equipment has beensteady for the past two years to
where I haven't had to reallybuy anything equipment-wise.
So say it's it's coming around.
But yeah, it's still.

Speaker 1 (31:02):
It's still an investment, but just like any
hobby, yeah, I wouldn't say it'smore expensive than some other
basic hobbies, though right youcan get into money quick, if I
mean just if you're doinghunting, like you're spending
more money doing any sort ofhunting right right you could
buy a crazy good brewery systemjust for like one or two
firearms or bows, like yeah,okay but you seeing what you,

(31:26):
you spend right, whether it's anew keg or a new refrigerator,
or new freezer or whatever youknow, I try to make a lot of it
my own too yeah fabricatingthings up on my own where um
just kind of making it to thestyle of the system that I want.

Speaker 2 (31:42):
So I try to save money that way, buying some used
and going out and drilling andbut it's all paid off.
It's all paid off.

Speaker 1 (31:49):
Oh yeah, long run whether for reviews or, you know
, compliments that kind of thing, you know, you seeing you your
stuff and seeing shy dogs, youknow.
Oh yeah, it does get speedy man, yeah, so what?
What brings you to continue onjust brewing every day, dude?

Speaker 2 (32:14):
um, I would say just the uncertainty of the brewing
industry currently and trulymaking enough money to, um,
basically supply what my I meanmy first thing is my family.
So, making sure that I can do itgood enough to uh supply my

(32:35):
family with everything that theyneed, and I know that if I did
want to turn this around and doit, I'd have support of my
family.
But right now my day job isgood, oh yeah, and I'm not
having any issues with it, andit's paying for my family and
it's paying for my hobby.
So it's a good thing right nowand it's a good spot, but, um,

(32:56):
but yeah, I would say that's themain thing is just the
uncertainty of the industry,which right now it's just with
this upcoming year uh, I knowthere's talk about all the
tariffs and stuff like that, notto get too political on things
I don't really.
I know there's going to be a lotof change in just prices in
general, and any time a price israised for a brewery that's

(33:17):
just less money.
Or the time beer is going to bemore.
I mean, yeah, you're going intostores to get a craft four-pack
of Tallboys.
Now it's $15, $16.
Whereas just five, just five,six years ago.
You get them for 11.
Yeah, so it's.
I mean, it's going up a dollaror two every year for a pack.
I would say, right, I got you soit's going quick and there's

(33:41):
gonna I think there's gonnastart being less and less people
that are willing to spend thatamount.
And just turning back to thecheaper stuff, I don't know
there's a lot of people that arestill interested in it.
I know that that want that willcontinue to pay I mean I still
will if it's something but itwill have to be a beer that
sticks out, though.

(34:01):
I'm not going to just go andjust buy just another basic beer
for the same price of something.
That's Ooh, that always tryingto, and that's kind of where I'm
trending with some of thesedifferent styles of beers.
I want stuff to kind of stickout and people I mean there's
people that love what thosethings that I do and people
think it's the dumbest thingthat I'm doing, like, but to

(34:21):
each their own people think it'sthe dumbest.

Speaker 1 (34:23):
Oh yeah, like what?
The tree, the hate?
Yeah, there's plenty of hate.
The hate.

Speaker 2 (34:28):
Oh it's, it's so fun, I like it doesn't bother me.
I think it's hilarious thatpeople would get so worried
about things.
There's people that oh I don'tknow people worry about such a
small little, minuscule thing,about a beer making people sick
somehow all right, man, you gothomebrewing.
Give us, give us people thinkhomebrewing is always gonna make

(34:49):
you sick, but that's the peoplethat you don't have any control
over.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
You're not cleaning, everything is so sanitation.

Speaker 2 (34:57):
I think there's probably some miscommunications
On people thinking that I justrun the beer Through the tree
and then just put it straight inthe fermenter, whereas it gets
all reboiled, everything back.

Speaker 1 (35:08):
How many times?

Speaker 2 (35:12):
I recirculate.
That's about four or five fullturns of all the, all the wart
being uh touched by the, by theluge and yeah branches and stuff
like that.
But then that's only halfwaythrough my process and then it's
I stop that and then I get theboiling going again for another
30 minutes after everything'skind of been touched and I kind

(35:35):
of get the flavor profile I want.
I can kind of taste it as it'sgoing and kind of know, the
extract extracting all theflavors that I want are there
what's speaking of tree beer?

Speaker 1 (35:44):
I haven't mentioned that.

Speaker 2 (35:45):
I wanted to, yeah, I guess we'll start.

Speaker 1 (35:48):
Well.
What's it mostly taste of orconsist of this year?
Has it changed?

Speaker 2 (35:52):
Yes, this year I changed the recipe.
A lot yeah, I changed it too,because I wanted more body in
this beer.
The past couple of years it'sbeen much lighter, like 6%.
This year I bumped it up to 7%.
And I added some more rye and Iadded some honey rye.
So I wanted a little bit, notnecessarily like sweet sweet,

(36:12):
but it just rye sweetness, Ifthat kind of makes sense.

Speaker 1 (36:17):
But it's the caramel rye.
I've never had a rye that wassweet.

Speaker 2 (36:20):
Yeah, but it's a caramel.
It was adding a honey rye.
So I use yeah, sorry, not acaramel rye honey rye.
So it's a different kind of.
It's a rye that's toasteddifferently and it has some
honey aspect to it.
So I just add a little bit moreof that.
The rye kind of gives morespiciness.

(36:42):
I just wanted much more of awinter yeah, A winter tree IPA.
And yeah, this whole thing ofthis beer is definitely a
historic style beer.
Uh, like finish finish origin,historical origin origin beer.
There's a uh, I think it was.
It's kind of it's like a winethey call it sati and it's like
a wine that finish used to makeand they used to run beer

(37:02):
through like a trough, like acarved out trough of which you
show and now, yeah, and that'skind of what I do I.
I run it down a luge, um, butmine's reboiled.
Their old style is like it'sall like farmhouse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah so it's allgets all the nice yeast out in
the nature and they kind of justferment it that way and that's

(37:22):
why it was a farmhouse wine thatthey used to make back in the
historic days.
And I just kind of put thePacific Northwest twist on it to
make it in the historic daysand I just kind of put it the
Pacific Northwest twist on it tomake make it an IPA.
And people are IPA haters andpeople will say, oh, it's
another IPA, another thing,Another.

Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yeah, I was like well , it seems like the haters are
winning, so let's, let's, let'sgo.
Yeah, it's funny how you justkeep it simple, you're like it's
funny, and then you go on andYou're like, yeah, the haters,
the haters, so let's go awayfrom the haters, oh yeah.
What's the biggest complimentyou've had so far in this 2
million viewed video.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
Biggest compliment there's a couple people who are
actual head brewers at breweriesthat have posted comments
saying I've been brewing for thepast 25, 30 years.
I have never seen anythingcrazy like this this is awesome
crazy.
So that's kind of I like thosekind of things just because it's
crazy or weird or differentyeah um, that's kind of really

(38:19):
what I wanted to focus on, justsomething different.
But it the thing is, it works.
It's not just uh, yes, it's agood video and it grabs
attention, but the beer isactually, honestly, one of my
favorite beers that I make andit's got kind of all the flavors
that I like.
Personally, I wouldn't say thisis everyone's favorite.

(38:41):
I like that kind of resinous,pine, woodsy flavor and that's
exactly what you get out of itwith the cutting cutting into
the wood and extracting justsome of the extra flavors of it
out of that, and then pineneedles.
I love a really good piney ipalike.
That's a flavor that I reallylike.
I always go back to, um, butyeah, that's it's.

(39:06):
How many pints have you had?
of your own supply, since umI've honestly probably have only
had like a six pack okay,because everyone else wanted it
yeah it was pretty much allaccounted for before I even had
it in the keg.
Yeah, so I was able to have I.
I think in my own personalstock I was able to have 16
beers okay, but everything else,everything else Is it gone,

(39:29):
yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:29):
What.

Speaker 2 (39:31):
So everyone that wanted, everyone that wanted, I
put it.
I made a list.
Yeah, Made a list and checkedit twice.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
For Christmas, even before you did Okay, yeah, it
was before it was even kegged.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
I said I remember Because I know people want it.
My friends, I always make surethe people who come and taste my
stuff often get the first dibs.

Speaker 1 (39:51):
Jesse get his first dibs, oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
Yep, all my neighbors .
Yeah, we're all good.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
Man, how many four six-packs did Jesse get man?

Speaker 2 (40:03):
Oh, I limited it.
Yeah, yep, okay, so he just gotthe one four-pack.
With that said I mean, like I Isaid I have a couple of my own
private stock.
I mean those will be special,though I had to save a couple
for next year, because I'd liketo do that, I like to taste the
last years to this year's andhave you even considered a uh

(40:24):
winter, uh competition?
um, I, I did want to try and doit.
I wouldn't really know.
I think I'd have to put it intospecialty IPA or just IPA class
.
I guess it's just kind of hardin these competitions.

(40:44):
They make the competitions, youmake them to the BJCP style,
they have a style guidelines.
If you kind of go out of thatzone, you make them to the BJCP
style and they have a styleguidelines, right.
And if you kind of go out ofthat zone, you get docked, even
if it's good, yeah, because forthis you're trying to make it to
style Okay, and it's good thatthey made a specialty IPA
category, because that kind ofgives free reign on what to do.

(41:06):
But some for the judges.
Maybe that judge liked a hazy,that was better, and it's kind
of hard putting it up againstsomething dude exactly.
Yeah, I need to try and do it,you did your red lager correct
yeah the irish, yeah the irishred yeah, last year correct yes
it's time to move on that oneget your imperial in.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
Yeah, get the tree beer in.
Yep, what's stopping you fromthat?

Speaker 2 (41:32):
is it more so?
Is I kind of, just kind of?

Speaker 1 (41:36):
go through that.
Huh, you're not afraid, are youno?

Speaker 2 (41:39):
not afraid.
No, I do you kind of submiteverything, but I think I just
got distracted, honestly, andall the other people wanting it,
and you have to send in threebeers in, so it's like why don't
you do that?

Speaker 1 (41:54):
Imperial.
This one and then some other,like the one that you did at the
wedding your buddy's.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:03):
The one that was actually the national winner or
national medalist, See theSawdown Unda.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (42:10):
The Pilsner zealand pilsner.
Yeah, yeah, that's so.
What's stopping you?

Speaker 1 (42:16):
nothing, really, because you've been doing this.
You've been doing this for awhile besides just being busy
and just not really I don't knowand I don't know.

Speaker 2 (42:24):
I mean, if I enter something in the competition and
it does, well, it'm curiouswhat would I mean, yeah, I do
like entering competitions, butI kind of just do it when the
competition time works out forme.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
I'm not necessarily I'm curious what this is gonna
do.
I don't know your label.

Speaker 2 (42:42):
You have tree beard yeah, imperial, they go in.
They go in unlabeled, so it'sempty it's high in demand and
your friends and people aroundtri-cities that know of oh yeah,
and about you exactly who's notsaying it's high in demand and,
uh, award-winning well like Isaid, across the globe I've I
sent probably 20 packages out umwith shirts and everything like

(43:07):
that in it, um labels and stufflike that.
There's people that want it.
I mean, there's people thatthink it's the craziest thing
ever and they would have no idea.
Some people were skeptical andwanted some anyway and they're
like, hey, can I get a?
Can?
I?
Just want to try this.
I don't know if I'm even goingto like it, honestly, I just
want feedback.

(43:28):
What I do is I want to makesure that I get a feedback from
them.
So yeah, buy a shirt, get freebeer.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
That's usually how I go with my stuff.
What is it going to take foryou to understand that your beer
is high in demand?
I'm not just saying that as afriend and a consumer.
Yep, can't drink right now andI'm not drinking guys because
I'm in treatment and I got mythird treatment out of four
coming tomorrow but can't drinkto start brewing for them year

(44:09):
round.
Would you do it if the pay'sright or if it works out?

Speaker 2 (44:16):
fun schedule yeah, I mean, I definitely would want it
to make worth worth my while.
Same cake, the cake that you,you do yeah, so if like to do
this at a brewery that's alreadyestablished and just be a help
out, or or like a a restaurantthat wants to have a house beer
and they have a location where Ican go, and that's what's

(44:36):
really holding me back.
I mean my location.
Yes, it's still technicallyresidential, so I can't really
do anything about that, unless Igot a separate building to do
it in.

Speaker 1 (44:47):
But what if they say, hey, you got you, you get what?
Uh, a contract?
Saying, hey, you keep the housebeer year round.
You change it when you feellike changing.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
Yeah, you think that's something I want to get
interested for yeah, I think andthat's something I'd want to
get into first, honestly beforedipping my entire thing, because
that's another thing I'm prettyspecific on what I want yeah,
and I don't want to just jump Idon't want to jump into a
commercial scene, I don't wantto just hey, I'm making good
beer, let's just start a brewery.

(45:17):
yeah, I'm for me.
That is years out of my graspand what I want to do, because I
don't want it to just start upand like, oh what, what do I do?
I want to like start slow andjust kind of work up into that
really slow, and not just throweverything into one Right, and
then if I just have this giantsetup and everything right away

(45:41):
and something doesn't work outor it just doesn't seem to be
the right place, or anythinglike that, I don't want to be
that deep in.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
Yeah.
So so let's say, somebodyoffers you that, yeah, no
questions asked, you'll, you'lldo it.
Yeah, I would love to.
If the price isn't right, yeah,does the price have to be right
for you to?
Go on or is it?

Speaker 2 (46:03):
still the love of the game.
Love of the game at that pointtoo, because I wouldn't it would
, it wouldn't be a full-timething, and I wouldn't want it to
be full-time right now in mylife.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
I mean it could be if it's high in demand.
Yeah, that's what I'm justsaying.

Speaker 2 (46:15):
Yeah, it could.
It could turn that way and ifit does and everything looks
right, I'll accept that.
Okay, like I said, with myfaith in everything, I kind of
let things kind of work in thatdirection.
I'm not forcing anything.
If it kind of comes to me andeverything's good, I kind of
accept that and kind of know thecalling's there.
I know people say, oh, I'm sureyou've already had a calling.

(46:38):
Oh, your beer's great.
I was like people have madegreat beer for a long time but
it's a whole different makingyour brewery but not homebrewing
here, man.

Speaker 1 (46:46):
Yeah, that's true.
Growing up especially, oh yeah,in college homebrewing was shit
yep, it was awful you know, andthat was the pacific, it was
just make it as much bitter oras much alcohol as you could
exactly, and it was just likeyou know what the good beer is
deschutes or rogue at the timeand that you know I went to
school pacific northwest.
So it was either a rogue ordeschutes, you know, and, and

(47:07):
people bring their homebrew andit's just like, oh my god, let's
, let's, let's go back todeschutes.
You know, and, and people bringtheir home brew and it's just
like, oh my god, let's, let's,let's go back to deschutes, or
let's go back to rogue or youknow, whatever that's already
been crafted and at the store,oh yeah, um, but that right
there, when people continue totell you they like it, they like

(47:28):
it, they like it, and they likeit, they like it and it's doing
good in competitions.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
I know it's there.
And I know, people are justitching.
But, maybe I kind of want tolet those people have that itch
for a long time.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
But a lot of people have been itching for how long,
though, like how long, how longYou've been homebrewing, for how
long?

Speaker 2 (47:46):
Yeah, 2017.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
So, three eight years coming up eight years, coming
up on eight years, and you'vemastered.
Do you feel, like I would saythe past.

Speaker 2 (47:55):
I would say the past four years has been where best
beers come out of yours, just ingeneral for me like my best
beers.
The past four years have beenreally good and each year it's
gotten better and I'm findingways to make things more
efficient.
I'm finding each year I'mlearning a little bit
differently on how to make myprocess just a little bit better
, a little bit easier.

Speaker 1 (48:17):
Um but, then that's but then you see some people
that went from home brewing toyou know big brewing and it's
just straight up ass yeah I knowand that's always in the back
of my mind, but, um, I don'tknow why that would.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
I don't really understand why that would happen
.
It's either that or they justaren't cleaning as deep as they
are.
I mean, yes, it's, it's.
I guess it's a little biteasier to clean a smaller setup,
but you just have to like Ialways tell people you're a
glorified janitor when you're abrewer, you're 80 cleaning%
cleaning.
20% of it's the fun brewingpart.
But if you go into that really,truly knowing that you're going

(48:57):
to be cleaning, have the bestcleaning setup.
That's the main thing.
Have the best cleaning setupand have the best fermentation
control.
A brew system is a brew system.
You can make beer out of anysort of setup.
It doesn't have to be crazyspecial for that part.
It all truly, in my mind,depends on your sanitization and

(49:17):
your fermentation control.
You can make the best beer andyou put it in a fermenter and
it's not clean.
It'll be the worst beer ever.

Speaker 1 (49:24):
So that was where I always try to focus my main work
on Cleaning, sanit,sanitization, fermentation
control when people fail,especially like when you see the
breweries going out of business, does that scare you a bit?
It does scare you on wanting totake it to another level.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
Yeah, I would say that's the main thing that's
holding me back.
I'm not main thing and justknow it.
In the industry in general,it's a hard industry.
It's a hard industry just to bea brewery.
Yeah, and I know if I started abrewery it would have to turn
into having a kitchen and stufflike that, and not even it has
to be big.
But it's the only way you'retruly going to kind of cut your

(50:05):
cut your limit on is you'regoing to need to have something
else.
Okay, and I don't really want tostart a brewery to be able to
do it, to have to do somethingelse.
So it would have to come intowhere I'd have to have someone
to help me with or do that withme.
And I had to have the rightperson, right, I can't just
choose a buddy, buddy or justeven a.
But I can't even just choose abuddy, like I don't want

(50:34):
something to get ruined becauseof this.
I don't want a friendship toget ruined.
I don't want, I don't want themto think it's just, oh, my
friend's starting this breweryand I'm gonna help him out.
Every so often it's like I'veI'm a little adhd.
I guess you would say on that,unlike, and it's nothing against
people, it's just my own, I gotyou I kind of have to have.
Even if it's something I don'teven really know that much about
, I still kind of want to havecontrol over it, and I don't

(50:54):
know if that might not sit wellwith a lot of people I want to
get on there.
I would probably have to makesure that they're good on that
and have to just kind of let goas best I could.

Speaker 1 (51:02):
But I just want to know what to be an owner man.
I just want to know what's itgonna take for for you to
understand, like dude, what's itgoing to take for you to move
up?
So you're being honest.

Speaker 2 (51:14):
Industry is sporadic, I would say that's maybe a
couple of years and it settlesout and people figure out what's
working in a brewery scene.
Because there was such a masspopulation of like uptick in
breweries.
Yeah, past five to eight yearsthere's been a ton and then
they've died and then there wasa massive break off where there

(51:34):
was even good breweries closingor and for me it's not even if I
made something, made a breweryand it turned out to be really
good, I don't even know how Iwould take if I know some of
these bigger brewery, if I wentbigger and I started just doing

(51:54):
more and more instead of justbeing like this small, really
niche craft yeah, homebrew, nothomebrew, but just brewery in
general um, here in uh,tri-cities area.
If it went to where you need tostart making more bigger, let's
go 10 barrel system, let's gobig start, just start

(52:15):
distributing, um, and it getsdistributing and then get some
of the the big, the big brewerycompanies come in and say, hey,
we want to buy, buy you out orsomething.
I don't know how I would dealwith that because, honestly,
that's a huge.
I know there's people that say,oh, nothing with big beer, I

(52:36):
don't have any, truly anythingagainst big beer, yeah they're
there.
They're a big company.
They buy smaller breweries outand hopefully that there's a
couple that have done it reallywell, that they've kept a lot of
the same people at those smallbreweries and they still
continue to make good beer.
They just they got bought outand they have a lot more money
now to do a lot more.
Yeah, and I have nothingagainst brewers that do that or

(52:56):
breweries that do that.
I don't I know there's peoplein the craft beer scene that
have that don't like when smallbreweries do that.
Yeah, they think it hurt.
I mean, yeah, I don't know if Iguess they think it hurts.
I mean, yeah, I don't know ifit I guess it can't.
It hurts the industry, I guess.
But as a personal, personalthing, it's like the best thing,
best feeling.
I'm sure you did something goodand there's a big company that

(53:19):
wants to buy you.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (53:20):
And I know people don't want to sell out.
But for me, if I sold out mysetup or my thing and they said,
oh, we'll still have your brew,I wouldn't and I get tons more
money.
I don't know.
It's a business, I want to makeit.
I'm not just doing it for thelove of the craft and I love it
for the craft, but it's alsostill a business.

(53:43):
I think that's where a lot ofpeople can get themselves in
trouble.
They're doing it so much forthe love of craft that they
aren't thinking about all theother stuff that comes with it
All the people that have beenbought out.

Speaker 1 (53:54):
they're back in the game, right?

Speaker 2 (53:55):
Like.

Speaker 1 (53:56):
Legion and Cloudburst correct.

Speaker 2 (53:58):
Yeah, didn't they?

Speaker 1 (54:01):
They were bought out.

Speaker 2 (54:02):
Oh, they were.
Okay, I didn't know if theywere.
They started back again correct?

Speaker 1 (54:06):
I believe so.

Speaker 2 (54:07):
Yeah, I know, hot Valley got bought out.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
There's bigger hit and miss with some things, but
it was the water.
It all tastes the same.
It's always the water, alwaysthe water.
So what's next on your list?
Man, we got the tree beer outof the way.
Mm-hmm, I think you should makemore of it.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
But next year.
My wife gave me the idea thatonce we take down our Christmas
tree, that just make anotherbeer out of it like hey you got
another tree, you can just tryit again.
That is tempting and then shesaid we could see how it tastes
from different after it's sat upin the house for a month and

(54:53):
see if it'd be a bit drier yeah,I'd probably just not be as
much.
Yeah, not as much extractionout of it.

Speaker 1 (55:02):
But who knows, who knows?
But what's?
What's next, man um?

Speaker 2 (55:07):
hopefully I'll do my um, dark days, dark lager again.
I don't know if you got to havethat one I'd make.
I'd make that one every january.
So this will be the third yearof it.
Uh, the first year I made it.
It was good, but there wasdefinitely something I wanted to
change on it.
So last year made those changesand I think it worked out great

(55:29):
.
So this year I'm going to tryto recreate it.
Um, basically same recipe.
So it's a dark lager.
Uh, dark check, dark checklager.
Good to have in winter.
You can still have a couple sitby the fire.
Feels nice.
Um, and it's.
It's a beer that I've hadneighbors and people who try to

(55:51):
stay on top of the stuff thatI'm brewing, that try everything
I make.
Yeah, and they said this is oneof the top ones that they love
and I, and it's one that Ireally like.
It's.
It's good.
It doesn't have anythingdifferent or crazy going.
It's definitely moretraditional style.
I don't have anything going toocrazy with it besides using the
eastern washington grown grain,which I think really puts the

(56:13):
different aspect on my beers.

Speaker 1 (56:14):
Okay, and what about March?
You'll have your Irish.

Speaker 2 (56:20):
Yep, yeah, I'll be doing that.
I have a couple.
Like I said, I'm going to startand do that Archangel series
again.

Speaker 1 (56:29):
That'll be in the spring Spring summer-ish End of
spring, yeah, end of spring time.

Speaker 2 (56:34):
So I would say between the dark lager and the
Irish beer I have there's twobeers I want to brew, but mostly
for culminating on gatheringtogether these new hops that
I've come in contact with theindustry, okay, that not too
many beers have been made out ofthem.
So I'm gonna do basically abasic smash beer.

(56:57):
So it's just gonna do a singlegrain and a single hop, but it's
a brand new hop I've never usedbefore.
From from uh yakima valley hopsthe company but it's through a
couple different farmers.
Okay, there's uh over here inyakima valley is it?
a secret.
No, um, so one of them is goingto be with.
I think some breweries haveused it already.

(57:17):
I think even weedheads madesome with uh crush hop called
crush.
It was an hbc hop.
Hbc is the hop breeding, hopbreeding, cumulative, and that's
how they do.
They come up with new hops andthey start out as numbers and
it's like a 10-year process toget a pop with a number, to have
a name okay.

(57:37):
So it's a huge thing and theseit's really cool to see these
new uh hops come into play.
Um, crush has been.
There's been breweries.
I've done it.
I want to just kind of do it onit on its own, okay, see how it
tastes fully on its own palate,kind of do a couple different
editions of it within that beerand then test it out.
So I'm probably going to dothose, but they're I'm going to

(58:00):
do like slightly smaller batchesjust to kind of do them really
quick, okay, and so I can domaybe two at once so I can have
two base the same base beers andjust change out the hops.
Which is a little bit differentthan the Archangels, because
the Archangels is is an actualgrain bill and it has much more
than just one type of grain.
This doing a smash beer kind ofmakes it so I can have the

(58:23):
profile of these hops and kindof figure out where they would
mix in.
Good Cause doing that, thesehops might come back up again in
the Archangel series on how Iblend these hops together.
So one's yeah the Crush.
And then there's a new hopcalled Anchovy.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
Does it smell?

Speaker 2 (58:42):
No, then why Anchovy?
Why are they making it?

Speaker 1 (58:45):
like it's a bud from marijuana.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
Yeah, why are?

Speaker 1 (58:48):
they doing that.

Speaker 2 (58:48):
Yeah, so there's a whole thing behind that and I
know the guy who named it has awhole thing.
Uh, I I can't remember thewhole story, but it's the guy
who named it has some reasonbehind it.
But it's supposed to come outlike jolly rancher hard candy.
That's what the hop is supposedto give, that sweet, hard candy

(59:10):
.

Speaker 1 (59:10):
Why are they doing that?
It's almost like a strain ofmarijuana, I know well, it's a
sister.

Speaker 2 (59:15):
It's a sister, sister plant.

Speaker 1 (59:17):
Yeah, but still I know yeah it's funny are you
gonna mess around with the idahohops?
Oh, any more of those or no?

Speaker 2 (59:29):
there are a couple, but I'm not sure.
I don't have any on my my listcurrently, but I know there's
always some that come.
I mean, I always like I usuallyhave idaho seven in, yeah, and
ip it's so idaho seven is in oneof my stage ipas that idaho

(59:49):
seven is is a hop that I usuallytry to always have.

Speaker 1 (59:53):
So when the arch angle, arch angle angels come
back out.
Yep, will you have more of thatthis year than last year?

Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
um, probably not.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
I'll probably still uh no wait, that's during hockey
season.
We had a lot of that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
Yeah, the end.
Not enough of it.
Yes, exactly yeah, right duringplayoffs.
So yes, so, what.

Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
I'm saying or asking is can you please have more of
that?

Speaker 2 (01:00:22):
So I think last year I actually did only do 10-gallon
batches.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
Yeah, it wasn't enough.

Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
So this year I will make a half barrel of each.
Okay, so this year I will makea half barrel of each, and one
whole keg of each will be cannedoff right away.
So then I have cans set up.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
I can't believe you're doing cans dude.
Yeah, canning A lot of peoplestay away from cans because of
the price, but here you arecanning away.

Speaker 2 (01:00:45):
I don't know.
I know bottles.
Bottles is just it'll make it'slike 10 times more work to
bottle.
It's so easy to can.
I was lucky enough to be giftedthe canner that I got my my
single canner when I originallygot it from someone who is
invested into me and they say ifthis helps you and gets me more

(01:01:07):
beer, my way yeah I'll get thatfor you.
So that was that was a goodthing to come along on my way.
And yeah, it's the same kind ofcanners that they have at a
brewery where it's just a singlecanner.
But I can do the 12 ounce cansor the 16 ounce okay, and I know
I like doing the 16 ounce cans.
The 12 ounce cans I can do for,uh, competitions okay so I

(01:01:28):
usually send the smaller cans tocompetitions.
They don't need as big of a canfor their judging.

Speaker 1 (01:01:34):
And for the next competition, your tree beer and
Imperial will be gone.

Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
right, let's see All right, maybe next year because,
like I said, I don't have any toturn around to a competition
right now.
I got you, we'll see.

Speaker 1 (01:01:45):
But you always have a competition somewhere,
someplace.

Speaker 2 (01:01:49):
Yeah, and you tell me about.
But you always have acompetition somewhere, someplace
, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
I've been out of it and you tell me about it and I'm
like dude what For real?

Speaker 2 (01:01:52):
There's just a posting on the national, the USA
Home Brewers website and youcan check every single state
that's having a competition andyou can just route them their
way, get them all on theirlabels and everything like that.
It's all blank cans but youhave a write-in label to put on
it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:11):
So are you going to the uh winter hop fest?

Speaker 2 (01:02:16):
Hmm, I am not.

Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
Last year you went to the wall, of wall right, or did
not know, okay.

Speaker 2 (01:02:22):
But this year I might , okay, I might.
I don't know if I'm going to goto the one in Ellensburg or the
one in Walla Walla this year.

Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
I think it's the same thing.

Speaker 2 (01:02:30):
Yeah, they're on the same day.
Yeah, yeah, I don't know whythey did that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
I think it's because of the Walla Walla beer parlor
guy.
Yeah, I'm not.

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
Yeah, I don't know, I am much.
I mean, I like those events.
Those are fun, but I can have alot more fun at home too.

Speaker 1 (01:02:50):
I've had a lot of crap beer there too, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:53):
I can be at home and I can invite six people over and
I said each bring your own pack, and then we can have our own
little thing, have your ownwinter fest.
Open up the garage we can havea TV on.
There's hockey going, so we'llhave the hockey games on.
That's kind of my, I my.
I mean, yeah, big events arefun and all, but I'm much more

(01:03:15):
comfortable doing tastings on myown and things like that how
are the blackhawks speaking ofhockey?

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
how are they doing?

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
yeah, probably the same as any other year oh gosh
even with badar, they're justyeah, they're not.
They're not cutting it as much,but I think they're doing
better than last year yeah, butthat's not saying much how's
little miss marquess?
Doing.
She's doing great.
She's loving her.
This is her.
She's been doing hockey for ayear now, but this is her first

(01:03:43):
season on a team.
We go to our first tournamentnext weekend in Lewiston.

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
Really, we're already getting on the tournament scene
.
You talk about your homebrewing system.
I know Dude hockey is the mostexpensive sport.

Speaker 2 (01:04:00):
Traveling.

Speaker 1 (01:04:02):
Oh, my God.

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
How fun Daddy and Mom .

Speaker 1 (01:04:05):
And it started.
Yes, oh, my gosh.
So we talked about a lot of lotof things, great reviews, rave
reviews on your beer, not justfrom me, but others um not just
jesse too.
Shout out to jesse and yourneighbors and everything else
we've talked about moving on up.
Do you ever feel like you'lllose your this, the love of the

(01:04:29):
game, the hobby.
Do you ever think that?

Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
I mean there's always a possibility for something.
Um, I'm in the mindset of, if Iget called in different
directions to do something else,I'll.
I kind of do that.
Like I said, uh, faith ispretty prominent in me and if
something gets called for me inthat way to do something
different or to stop what I'mdoing and focus elsewhere.
I don't know if brewery andbrewing will ever totally go

(01:04:54):
away, but I could see if timecame to it, to where I couldn't
do as much.
It's not like it would tear meapart.
I sort of I have a mindset of Ineed to do what's right, I need
to do everything that's here.
The brewing is extra and that'swhat.
It's kind of fun, it's my fun,I like doing it and it's good,

(01:05:19):
people like it.
So I'm going to keep doing ituntil something else happens.
I'm just going to kind of keepgoing with the flow on that way.

Speaker 1 (01:05:28):
What if people don't like it?
Then I want to hear about it,because I want to know what's
wrong.
I'm just going to kind of keepgoing with the flow on that way.
What if people don't like it?
What if?

Speaker 2 (01:05:31):
Then I want to hear about it because I want to know
what's wrong.
I want to know if they I don'twant to just hear I mean.
That's why I think, like I say,I keep saying it's funny when I
hear those comments becausenone of those people have ever
tasted it.
I don't say something that's badbefore I've even tasted it.
I'll say it.
I'll hear what other peoplehave tasted and say, yeah, it's
bad.
I'll still want to taste it onmy own, though, because

(01:05:54):
everyone's palate's different.
I know there's yeah, it'ssocial media.
Whenever you get into that thattwo million mark.
Yeah, I guess once you get tothat, I guess when you get into
that you just get all the randos.

(01:06:14):
And it get all the randos andit's all the you check on, you
check who they are and it's likepeople with no followers or
following nothing, so they'rejust there to do that.
Whatever russian bots yeah,whatever they, they can do
whatever they want.
But I'm in the aspect ofmindset.
I love hearing what people haveto say about it.
I like people being critical ofthat.
I want to know if what theythink would make it better.
If it's, if they say somethingand I don't think that's what
would make it better, I'll stilltake into account.

(01:06:36):
Yeah, but maybe I won't changeit.
Still, in the end, it's my beerand what I wanted to taste will
that change, and that'severyone, everyone's different
right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
Will that change whether or not you continue or
not?

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
no, no no, uh I, I will still continue you'll be
that homebrew.

Speaker 1 (01:06:51):
That just does it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:52):
It's also, who knows what will happen in this world
in the next years?
Uh, having brewing knowledgeand ways to make alcohol is
probably a pretty good thing toknow, so I think yeah, yeah that
could be everyone's alwaysgonna want it back the day it
was safer than drinking water,you know?
Yeah, I mean that was the wholereason behind it yeah.
But I know there's a lot in theindustry right now on people

(01:07:18):
going NA on alcoholic beers.

Speaker 1 (01:07:22):
It's a huge thing.

Speaker 2 (01:07:24):
And people doing smaller.
There's even a thing of likemaking smaller cans, like people
who were making 16 ounce cansare now doing 12 ounce cans
because, uh, and at least forcanning they could almost sell
it for the same but there's nothaving to give as much out.
But then they're also sayingthey're also putting the spin on
it.
It's like, well, you're notdrinking a pint, so you're

(01:07:46):
drinking a 12 ounce.
Cancer, the 16 ounce, andyou're drinking 12 ounce cans of
the 16 ounce and you're like,oh, the healthier way.
I was like a lot of things aregoing health nut and people are
wanting to non-alcoholic A lotof people not drinking as much
alcohol.
I know there was a I thinkthere was some sort of tally
that went out there or somethinglike that on asking people who

(01:08:07):
are like in their 20 to 25 yearolds.

Speaker 1 (01:08:13):
I don't think are drinking as much.
They're too busy doing fentanylor doing whatever heroin dude
yeah, doing stuff that's worsebut, there's a lot more people
looking for alternative yeah uh,alternative ways to enjoy.

Speaker 2 (01:08:27):
I mean, there's the place here in town, what's that
kindred spirits here that's anentire non-alcoholic bar oh
really yeah, that's over thereoff g way, I think.
But that's cool and they'vebeen around for the past.
I don't.
I don't know how long they'vebeen open a year or two and so
bar like hey, let's.

Speaker 1 (01:08:44):
Yeah, they make soda pop.

Speaker 2 (01:08:46):
Yeah, it's.
Yeah, it's good.
Yeah, it's not just soda, butit's yeah, I mean they they have
.
Yeah, it's not just soda, butit's yeah, I mean they have like
the non-alcoholic beers.
And so it's still a process andit's still an art in my mind.
So I don't have anythingagainst the non-alcoholic stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:08:59):
But if it doesn't taste good, I'm still yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
If it tastes good, then I'll be.

Speaker 1 (01:09:04):
I don't have anything against it gonna drink beer for
the flavor, drink beer for theplus.
I'm just saying I want to buzz.
You know, I got a buddy thatdrinks nas and I smell.

Speaker 2 (01:09:17):
It smells just like mine, but it's just like yeah,
oh yeah that, that, that extrafeel that you get out of a beer
after a hard work week.
Yeah, I gotcha, I'm not.
I'm not one to try to go toocrazy.
I mean, yeah, there's someevents and occasions that
happens at but, I try not tomake.

(01:09:37):
I try to respect it.
I respect the craft, I respecteverything that comes of it.
It's a gift.
I don't see it as somethingthat's just there to get me
trashed.

Speaker 1 (01:09:47):
That's not that just there to get me trashed.
That's not.
That's not how I am.
I got you, I got you, buteverything is good trash.

Speaker 2 (01:09:54):
No, no, no, no, no.
But there is that.
You take that I mean the samewith it.
You have have a beer at the endof the week and or a beer or
two, and that's that's what ittruly does.
Oh yeah, feelings that I haveafter a hard working week
because I try not to drinkduring the work week.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
Just so much going on during work week I don't have
anything to slow me down, really, so yeah um, for me it's, it's
a good relaxation that kind oftakes just it just takes the
edge off yeah, and your uhpromotion of other beers in the
weekend.
I like that, yeah, like how youdo that, oh yeah, it's like a

(01:10:29):
dessert beer or or dinner and orwhatever evening pairing
pairings.
Yeah, yeah, dude, try to pairit up.
I mean, like I said, that'syeah, that's all comes back from
that wine industry yeah that'spretty cool aspect of me.

Speaker 2 (01:10:42):
I like that, and there's a lot of people that,
yeah, they don't really carewhere the beer comes from, but
that's kind of where I like topush.
And there's people that like,oh, I never really thought of it
, yeah and then where's this?
Beer, what farmer?

Speaker 1 (01:10:54):
then when I see the pairing and I see the uh alcohol
content, I'm like bro, how areyou doing?
I'm like oh, it's a thursday,never mind yeah, probably off
friday.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
Yeah, I don't work fridays.

Speaker 1 (01:11:04):
Yeah, I just like oh my god, there's no way.
And then there's some that I'mlike dude, I got trashed on that
one.
I can't even stand the smell ofit, and I smell it as I'm
reading it off your Instagrampost yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:11:23):
The social media has been a really good way for me to
just kind of track everythingas well.
That's originally what I turnedinstagram into was for me to
just track everything and kindof be able to look back on the
scene.
But then a lot of peoplestarted liking it and I'm like
I'm just a just a home brewer.
Still, people always ask oh,where do I get this, where do I
get this, how can we?
I was like and they're like ohwell, that's really cool.

(01:11:44):
You're doing all this reallycool stuff as a small little
home brewer, but as a homebrewer it's a pretty big scale
for me for what I'm doing, soit's it's fun, sure you've
inspired a lot and in the yeah,not the madness, drunkenness but
the art

Speaker 1 (01:12:00):
yeah, art of home brewing not what I was talking
about of just getting smashed oryou know, back in the days when
it was just a shoots and rogueand then homebrew.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
Yeah, yeah, so it's turned out good and, yeah,
there's been people that havemade recipes of mine and they've
tried to make it out, make iton their own, and so that's
really fun for me to see.
I like seeing other peoplewanting to try something that
I've created, do a lot of peoplego through you for startup?

(01:12:31):
Yeah, there's a couple.
I've had a lot of people whoare brand new brewers and same
with our club.
I've had a couple of peoplethat are just starting out, that
want to come by and just see mybrew day and I'm like, well,
this has been a lot of finessingand a lot of years they've
gotten to this to make it thissmooth.
So don't think that you're goingto come and watch me and this
is how it's going to be for youwhen you go home and do it.

(01:12:51):
But you'll kind of understandthe process.
So, like I say, I allow whoeverwants to come by on a brew day
If they know that I'm brewing.
Yeah, come on over, hang out.
It's usually a fun hangout.

Speaker 1 (01:13:04):
It's not too crazy?
Yeah, it is, especially ifJesse and the gang show up.

Speaker 2 (01:13:08):
Yeah, neighbors show up, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:13:09):
Yeah, I have to make sure?

Speaker 2 (01:13:11):
Yeah, it's a good thing I have my timer on my brew
setup, or else I might getdistracted.

Speaker 1 (01:13:18):
Yeah, yeah, oh yeah.
So when will you have a nitro?

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
It's always been a thought, because I've honestly
wanted to make the imperialautomail nitro please do, or at
least have a keg of it.
That's nitro please do becauseI thought that would be cool.
Um yeah, I don't have.
I haven't really gone into thatdirection of changing anything
in that way.
Uh, I know nitro can be kind offinicky to deal with also.

Speaker 1 (01:13:49):
Certain places around here can do nitro, so can you
yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:54):
Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:13:55):
So can you.

Speaker 2 (01:13:55):
I know I can figure it out, don't worry, all right.

Speaker 1 (01:13:59):
But the Imperial needs to be in on that yeah, I
would say so too, especially ifit's almost 10.
Yeah, let me know.
So good year coming up.

Speaker 2 (01:14:18):
It's looking good.
Yeah, right, I've got on.
My recipe lists are all cominggood.
Um, I haven't set out.
I try to plan as much as I canfor the year because I like to
buy all my stuff at once.
It just it's always cheaper tobuy everything at once.
Yeah and I.
They usually have a good saleat the end of the year for hops
and everything like that.
But, um, I am going to try.

(01:14:41):
I have made a scotch ale before.
That was one of my first andI've never read and I never
brought it back, probablybecause I don't think it was
that good but I would have toretry it.
But I think if I retry it now Imight be able to figure it out.
Okay, I am going to trysomething different, or I'm
bringing back a recipe from thedead.

(01:15:02):
That kind of fell out on me.
I tried it once and it was good.
I think I just needed to addmore hops because it was.
It was very watery in theaspect, because the beer that
I'm trying to make is 100calorie beer oh, okay uh, so
it's like an ultra but that's 90right, yeah, I don't know.

(01:15:24):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, uh, but, andso I just called yeah.
So it's trying to make ahundred calorie beer.
That basically has a lot of hotflavor, though, but I think I
was worried about adding toomuch, because it's only going to
be 4% Not bad, so it's reallylow.
That's something I wanted tomake in the summer, so that's a
new thing I'm kind of trying toredo, but there's a way Like an

(01:15:46):
all day supper drinker yeah.
But when you're going that lowyou have a heart like, like I
said, last time I made it wasjust too watery.
But there's ways you can dothat by adding body to it
without adding caloric uh youcan use monk fruit monk fruit
sugar and so that won't ferment.
So it's a way to brew the beerand you can back, you can kind

(01:16:08):
of bring that up to where itkind of brings some body to it.
It wouldn't just sweeten it,but it it would.
Yeah, but sometimes that monkfruit stuff can put a weird
tinge on flavors on whenever youget those zero cal caloric
sugars and something.
It kind of be different.
What made you want to do that?

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
um, since all the craft beers are hefty.
But here you are trying to go.

Speaker 2 (01:16:34):
A little bit lighter.
Yeah, well, there's been some.
Like I said, there's peoplethat are trying to make better
health decisions.
I guess people can say withtheir drinking, and this is
something that maybe someonewill be more interested if they
see.
This is something that maybesomeone will be more interested
if they see.
So I know there's, there'speople that I talked to like, oh
, I usually I won't, I won'ttouch anything over six percent

(01:16:55):
or anything under, or I onlyhave light beers.
I wanted to get.
That's blasphemy.
I want, yeah, I wanted to havepeople that are the coors light
drinkers, are the miller lightdrinkers or whatever, yeah,
rainier drinkers, which it'sgreat.
I hey, I like, I like a goodrain, I like a good rainier and
a good, uh, miller, but at itsown time.

(01:17:17):
Um, for me it's, yeah, bringingthat craft scene to that, to
that level where you get, whereyou can get nice hot flavors and
without it just being bitterand without just doing that, but
then also saying, hey, it'sonly 100 calories and you can,
you can go to a festival, youcould go, you could bring, you

(01:17:37):
could bring a growler, you coulddrink the whole growler and
you'll still be.
You'd probably be fine yeah,what?

Speaker 1 (01:17:42):
what about sours?

Speaker 2 (01:17:44):
no, I haven't really different uh, purely because
when I have a sour, I usuallyonly want a taster.
Yeah, I can't drink an entirepint usually.

Speaker 1 (01:17:53):
You haven't had the right one, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:17:55):
I like wild ales, I like all the stuff from Frame, I
like all their wild stuff.
But, like I said, I have toshare a bottle with someone
whenever I get one.
I can't drink the whole thing,and it's usually I have to drink
that last because then mypalate's just ruined for
drinking anything else.

Speaker 1 (01:18:12):
What about last one man, Last question, your style,
your beer, that kind of thing.
What about barrel age man?

Speaker 2 (01:18:22):
I've actually had some contact with this new small
barrel company.
I think they're man.
Where are they they out of?
They're out of somewhere inoregon I forgot somewhere
portland area, outside outskirtsor something where they're
making these small scale barrelsthat you can change out the

(01:18:44):
staves on the inside, but it'sits own container.
It's its own like mini barrel,but you can change out staves
and stuff in it okay and so I've.
I've reached out to them andthey said that, uh, it's
something that they, if I putsomething out for them or like,
try to use their product and Iwould get like a discount to get

(01:19:05):
one.
Okay, but it, that is somethingI've been interested in and
wanting to do um with.
Um, I, if I do ever any woodand I do add some wood into the
all souls pump the imperialautomail, but that's added in
when I'm doing the vanilla beansand bourbon.

(01:19:26):
That's all kind of its ownlittle extract that I make.
But that's just with some woodchips, but with this way doing
some barrel-age stuff, I'vedefinitely wanted to do Okay.
And there's Solar Spirits herein town.
They have some extra bourbonbarrels.
They have some extra smallstuff that they do some stuff on

(01:19:47):
.
So they usually do a sale.
They usually sell their stuffoff every like once a year or
something like that.
So I might want to go in andget a okay, a small barrel of
that too and then add I'd have,honestly, my the imperial
automail would be great to do.

Speaker 1 (01:20:07):
I was gonna ask you what beer would you.

Speaker 2 (01:20:09):
Yeah, it would probably be that.

Speaker 1 (01:20:10):
Okay, I mean for my recipe.

Speaker 2 (01:20:11):
but it's either that or I can make a new one.
Okay, In barrel age something.

Speaker 1 (01:20:15):
And if you had to pick a barrel, what kind of
barrel would it be?
Like a Chardonnay barrel.

Speaker 2 (01:20:24):
Like would you try that Go lighter?
Yeah, I mean I would.
I think I'd want to do awhiskey barrel for a dark, for a
dark beer, okay, but if I wasto do a lighter beer, yeah, I
think I would.
It's either that, or I do arosé barrel, or if they use a
rosé.
Yeah, yeah, Do something offthat.
I mean, I know sometimes rosésaround here.
Some are just uh, in stainlessthat they don't add rosé to

(01:20:47):
barrels sometimes.
But there's plenty of wineriesthat do and I could probably
find one.
But usually with that stuffit's all big I'd have to get,
and those full-size barrels are60 gallons.

Speaker 1 (01:21:00):
Yes, I've seen them.
Tanium showed me and he hadlike 60 of them.
I know he's all on the side ofhis house, I'm like oh my God,
you need a lot of product.

Speaker 2 (01:21:09):
Yeah, so I always thought of doing that on brewing
a beer and just keep brewing,batch after batch after batch.
Yeah, trying to fill I'd haveto do.
I guess I'd only have to dolike three batches to get it to
the level.
I don't know if I'd ferment inthe barrel and see how that goes
, because you can ferment in thebarrel and that'd be kind of

(01:21:31):
cool.

Speaker 1 (01:21:32):
Yeah, Since you're canning, since you know things
are busting a bit, yeah, thecanning is good.
When do you think you'll beable to sell legit?
Sell your brews, but be pickyon putting them out until you

(01:21:52):
know it's high in demand.

Speaker 2 (01:21:53):
It's either that, like I said, if something comes
up to where I get a situationwhere there's a place that wants
to contract me to brew stufffor them on for like a house
beer, or like a restaurant thatwants, yeah, house beer, but
they have a location where I cango and do that, and so maybe I
can use that location to makesome one-offs on my own and then

(01:22:17):
just kind of sell that my own.
But main thing is is just um, Iknow I have recipes already
that'd be ready to go, so it'skind of whenever that facility
shows up, okay, or when I get alocation where I can have
everything approved to be ableto do that, yeah, I don't, I
won't ever have it approved todo it at my house well, tier

(01:22:38):
metery uses that.

Speaker 1 (01:22:40):
Uh, that one winery yeah, right these long ship,
yeah long ship yeah, what's yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:22:47):
I just have to go to a brewery that has extra time.

Speaker 1 (01:22:51):
I guess.
Yeah, I'm just saying man.
Well, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:22:56):
I know that's the craze.
That's the number one questionI get asked when is this going
to happen?
When is this like?
I'm just keeping people ontheir toes, I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:23:03):
Future is looking bright.

Speaker 2 (01:23:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:23:05):
Dude.
You got to wear shades, bro,because I just can't wait until
you pop off.
I'm a huge fan of yours.
You know that this is yoursecond time on here.
Yeah, great beer Can't drinkright now.
I think I'm going to be veryselective when I can get back to
drinking, but I'm not in ahurry.
But I'll have one or two hereand there, but definitely when

(01:23:27):
it's playoff season, playoffhockey season and the arch
angels back, I'll make anexception, maybe three to four.
But, dude, I'm a huge fan.
I know a lot of people are ahuge fan of yours.
I think you know you're toohumble and um, which is good,
but it also can be bad, becausewe see what you're capable of

(01:23:50):
doing.
I know you're, you can see ittoo, but you just want to stay
back and make sure you know playsafe.

Speaker 2 (01:23:56):
When it does happen, I want it to be good.
I don't want to yeah, I don'twant to show up at a place and
have all these things go wrongand yeah and be a bad name right
off the bat and like all thishype, and then it's like, oh,
that was a letdown no, no, Ithink that's when you're getting
in your own way probably but,dude, I'm excited for you, man,
I'm excited for what's come.

Speaker 1 (01:24:18):
Love your beers, always will love your beers, and
I will tell you which ones arehorrible and not too many.
Not a big red lager fan or RedL, and you know that.

Speaker 2 (01:24:29):
But, dude, any other beer.

Speaker 1 (01:24:30):
Yes, it is personal, but man just curious, how did
this episode go?
Good yeah, Went as planned, ifthat.

Speaker 2 (01:24:42):
Yeah, I mean I assumed yeah coming here Because
you were like what are we goingto talk about?
Yeah, and.

Speaker 1 (01:24:45):
I think it just went great yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:24:47):
Talking about this is great.
I always like sharing thelittle aspects of all the beers
I do.
Giving a little bit more info,yeah, but, like I said, if
people ever want more info, theycan reach out to me on my
instagram and your instagram isit's at chainsaw brewing.

Speaker 1 (01:25:02):
Okay, and it will be in the the description.
Yeah, anything else?

Speaker 2 (01:25:05):
yeah, it's a if you want to see some cool brewing
videos I try to make especiallykeep those going and I kind of
show off my process oneverything my canning setup I
people ask questions oh how doyou do this?
It's like not necessarily doinginstructional videos, but just
showing my process.
Not, I'm not doingstep-by-steps for people, but

(01:25:26):
the video is showing that.
I'm not on my videos talking,it's all pure videos with music.

Speaker 1 (01:25:32):
So yeah, yeah, and it shows on the tree beer.

Speaker 2 (01:25:34):
You know that yeah, that's hitting two million plus.

Speaker 1 (01:25:38):
It's crazy.
It's crazy, but that's good manhave you?
Have you thought about umgetting paid through social
media now?

Speaker 2 (01:25:45):
I had lots of questions, lots of people that I
was like, honestly, I guess youdon't necessarily get paid by
Instagram.
You'd have to be.
You have to do stuff for, likeother companies.
So if there's companies thatwant to do stuff for me, I guess
reach out, but I'm not lookinginto that.

Speaker 1 (01:26:03):
Yeah, yeah.
Has any companies hit you up?
Uh-uh, oh, you got to be Okay.
Yeah, I think you need to startselling yourself.

Speaker 2 (01:26:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:26:12):
Oh, you got to be.

Speaker 2 (01:26:12):
Okay, yeah, I think you need to start selling
yourself.
Yeah, that's funny, but yeah,we got that.
Who knows, with all theproducts of the companies that I
use for my beers, who knowsthey might want to do some stuff
for them?
I know all the grain, the grainfarmers and the maltsters and
the hop guys I'm all really goodcontacts with.

(01:26:33):
They always hook me up good.
I guess you could say it'sthrough that.
That's just a personalrelationship I have with them.

Speaker 1 (01:26:44):
I like how we upgraded from your brewery to
the teacup studio.
The third time's a charm.
We'll end up doing somethingeventually.
You know coming up down theroad, but dude, until next time
Until next time Thank you much.
It's been a pleasure having youGuys hit them up.
Chainsaw Brewing.

(01:27:04):
If you guys don't know who heis, you're going to find out
real soon.
You're probably living under arock if you haven't.
But guys, reach out to him.
It's good brew, good brew,great brew and uh, yeah, until
next time, guys.

(01:27:28):
We'll see you next time.

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