December 11, 2024 • 41 mins
Join Jordan Ryan as he shares his journey from the Navy to becoming a holistic wellness advocate. Discover his transition to plant medicine and the world of adaptogens, including crafting unique mushroom-infused coffee blends. Explore the benefits of functional mushrooms and their cultural impact, enriched by personal experiences and customer testimonials. Jordan emphasizes embracing a holistic lifestyle for wellness, advocating for natural health and veteran mental health. The episode concludes with ways to connect with Jordan for further insights into this innovative fusion of mushrooms and coffee.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
This is Vybe Science, a top 100 wellnesspodcast presented by the Radcast Network.
Breaking wellness barriers and making healthtruly personal.
Here are your hosts, Ryan Alford and ChrisHansen.
Hello, and welcome to Vybe Science.
We're always taking you to the highest vibes.
(00:21):
We're bringing you the best in modern medicine,the best in alternative wellness because it's
all about mind, body, and energy.
So we got Jordan Ryan today.
He is the founder and CEO of Wind and SeaCoffee.
What's up, Jordan?
What's up, Ryan?
What's up, Chris?
Thanks for having me on today.
(00:42):
Yes.
Chris and I are pumped to have you.
Chris, how's Miami today, brother?
I feel like a dog.
I'm sitting here basking in the sun.
I'm getting a little sleepy, relaxed.
I'm feeling good because we got a good guesttoday, and I'm stoked for the conversation.
Get that mid-afternoon vibes there in Miami.
But, Jordan, we're pumped to have you on, beingthe
(01:04):
too, man.
Hey.
Everybody loves coffee.
Our energy in one way, shape, or form,especially when it gets infused and done.
That's why I always love the infused things,you know, like I like combining my stuff
together.
Like that's the best world.
Totally.
Yeah.
Jordan, where's home for you?
(01:24):
Did I hear San Diego?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'm based out of San Diego, California,originally from Albuquerque, New Mexico.
So, I don't know if you've seen Breaking Bad,but it's pretty spot on, dude.
It really captures, like, something about thatplace.
But, yeah.
Anyway, I moved to Oregon, did four years ofcollege there, joined the military, kinda got
(01:48):
stationed around a few different places, andthen, mostly based out of San Diego and
Oceanside.
And, yeah.
Now this is where I call home.
So I love it.
Yeah, man.
Has the coffee thing been, like, a lifelonginterest or just something purely that kinda
came out of, you know, I know, and we'll get toyour story here shortly, but I'm just curious
(02:08):
if coffee was always in the blood, so to speak.
So, you know, honestly, not in a sense that Iwas like a coffee connoisseur or anything like
that growing up.
You know?
I mean, I drank coffee, but, you know, I neverreally thought about it all that much.
And I think, you know, being in the military, Imean, our nation's wars are fueled on caffeine
(02:32):
and nicotine.
You know?
So that was sort of, like, really where you'relike, alright.
Jesus.
My real relationship started with coffee.
But in that sense, you're not you're not again,you're not really looking at it from the flavor
profiles and the roast and stuff.
You're just like, you know, what's gonna get methrough the night kind of, you know, vibe?
(02:55):
But then coming out, you know, getting intoholistic wellness, which, you know, we can get
into.
But, yeah, what you were just saying in theintro about, like, infusing something,
combining those things, you know, there's thisconcept called habit stacking.
And when I was, you know, first getting intosome of this holistic medicine, plant medicine,
(03:17):
adaptogens, etcetera, you know, you're buyingtinctures and capsules and this type of stuff,
but they're kind of just sitting in yourcabinet and you're not getting any benefit if
you're not taking them.
So I would forget to take them.
So I was like, man, how do I figure out a wayof, you know, I'm already making this time
every single day.
I don't need to remember.
It's first thing to think about when I get upin the morning is I'm gonna go make coffee.
(03:38):
Right?
So you go over there and what if, you know,that it kinda occurred to me, like, what if I
could combine these two steps?
And that way, just the ritual of making coffeeand enjoying it was to kinda like taking my
medicine in the sense.
I love the habit stacking.
Maybe Chris has heard of that.
I haven't heard of that, but I like that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's it's hard because, you know, new habitsare hard and they have to be sustainable.
(04:02):
It's gotta be something you can do for the longrun.
You have to enjoy it.
And one of the best easiest ways ofimplementing a new habit is if you can have it
stack with something that you're already doing.
So, kind of like a life hack concept thatapplies to other things, but I just adapted it
to my product and, yeah, made sense for me.
How's, were you, the Navy thing getting into,you know, the armed services, like, was that
(04:29):
historical?
Like, you knew you were gonna do that?
Like, what led to that sort of path and maybeleading to, you know, your unfortunate injury
and things like that.
But what was kind of the background that ledinto the military experience?
Yeah.
So, you know, I do have like, my dad was in theAir Force.
My sister was in the Air Force, but I didn'treally have like, I wasn't, like, following a
(04:53):
family tradition or anything like that.
Honestly, I was in college.
I was an undergraduate at the University ofOregon, and I was a finance major.
And I liked I loved college, loved Oregon,loved, you know, studying finance.
But right around, like, my sophomore year,probably, like, we're you know, you or maybe
(05:15):
junior year.
That's what I was like.
Your junior year, you're kinda looking at,like, okay.
I better go to career fairs.
I gotta figure out, like, we gotta get a job.
So I'm walking around.
I'm kinda looking.
I'm like, yeah.
I never really thought about, like, what is afinance job?
You know?
So I'm going to all these, and I'm seeing it'slike it's like banks and, you know, like,
credit unions.
I'm like, dude, what did I just do to myself?
(05:35):
Like, I 0% want to do this.
I felt like I, you know, I was like a martialartist.
Like, I loved being outside and like, just, youknow, I was kind of like, like an adrenaline
junkie, you know, bombing hills and stuff likethat.
And so being 21 and that kind of facing thisprospect of like, oh, you're just gonna go be a
(05:55):
desk jockey for, like, the, you know, theremainder of your working career.
I just felt like I was sort of like wasting myyouth and sort of this, like, fire that I had
to to go do something fun and exciting, thatwasn't, work at a bank.
And so, kind of against, the best wishes of mymom who when I told her, she was, like, very
(06:19):
upset.
But, yeah, I was like, I wanna join the Navy.
I wanna be a Navy SEAL.
Like, I've, you know, this is this is, what I'mgonna do after school.
And, yeah.
So that that went over like a lead balloon,but, you know?
Yeah.
I'm sure.
I mean, I don't know how long your dad's here.
My dad was also in the Air Force.
(06:39):
So there
Oh, nice.
Remind me of that.
So we appreciate your service here being
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Veterans Day week, the week of this recording.
Appreciate that.
Did your dad do, like, a lifelong server orjust did, like, a normal tour?
Like
No.
Just like a normal tour.
So he he's funny.
He, like, he is, like, the the least veteranveteran.
Like, he didn't even know he could get VAhealth care.
(07:02):
Like, he was just sort of, you know, I think hewent I don't remember the order of this, but he
was in the Forest Service and then the AirForce.
It may have been Air Force then Forest Service.
But while he was in the Forest Service, he,like, lived in a tent for, like, four years.
You know?
He was just, like, kind of like a hippie alittle bit up in, like, Big Bear area.
(07:23):
So Lake Arrowhead, that kind of so I think forhim, it was just sort of like I don't know.
Like, maybe something a little similar now thatI'm thinking about it.
Like, he's just like, I don't really wanna growup yet, and I'd rather go eat mushrooms in a
tent.
You know?
So
There you go.
One more way to do it.
One more way to
do it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
(07:45):
Talk about your, you know, the process.
I mean, so you end up getting an injury.
I think that fueled a lot of your passion intothe coffee business.
What happened there?
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So, I in this in the military, I'm actually atthis point, I'm kind of fast forwarding through
some of my military service, but I went to aship and then I became a medic, so a corpsman,
(08:10):
and specifically within the Marine SpecialOperations community.
So the MARSOC community.
I think they're called Raider Battalions now.
But at the time, there it was MARSOC.
In any case, I'm a medic and I'm going throughtraining and doing some other stuff, and I
have, like, a bad back injury.
(08:33):
And at some point, you know, I'm here trying torecover.
I'm trying to get back into my job, dude, youknow, because your reputation is everything.
You know, you don't you don't wanna let anybodydown, all the stuff.
And at some point, it's occurring to me that,like, I may not get better at it.
Like, this that may be the end of this road,you know?
And that was, like, a huge, like, oh, you know,just sink in my the pit of my stomach.
(08:57):
Like, my identity is heavily tied into my jobtitle.
I might be losing my job, which is losing, youknow, my income, losing all this other stuff.
I'm losing my identity.
I'm losing respect in my community.
I'm losing mobility.
You know, I can't run or lift or, you know, doany of these things that I like.
(09:21):
And so I went through like a really kind ofdark period.
At this time, I was, you know, gettinginjections, taking different medications, going
to physical therapy, doing, you know,surgeries, all this stuff, you know, trying to
figure out how to make myself better so I canget back to my job.
And none of these things were working.
And in addition to them not really working, Iwas having a lot of second- and third-order
(09:45):
side effects from the medications or, you know,just bad reactions to, you know, surgery or
injection or whatever the case is.
And so I kind of shifted my mindset at thatpoint to be like, if I'm going to have to
manage this for the long run, I want to figureout how to do it in a sustainable way that is
(10:06):
not going to negatively impact the health of myorgans or, you know, I just don't want to
be—during the summer, I'm going through the VAhealth care system, which isn't as bad as it's
kind of chalked up to be.
But I'm walking to the hospital and you seethese, like, salty Vietnam vets and they're,
you know, waiting in line for their pharmacystuff and yelling at some clerk because they're
(10:32):
cutting him off on the pills that, you know,he's—and it was really sad and it was kind of
an eye-opening, like, I bet that guy didn'tthink he was gonna be there either.
You know what I mean?
Like, I bet he when he was my age or he was,you know, 21 or 20, he didn't think he would be
yelling for opioids at, you know, somebody atthe VA hospital.
(10:54):
And I'm like, I don't—I don't want to be that.
I really, really don't.
And so I need to figure out how to manage this.
And so that's what kinda got me exploring plantmedicine.
And beyond that, just like holistic health ingeneral.
I mean, even stuff as simple as, like, yoga,man.
Like, yoga, super transformational Pilates.
I started doing Pilates about two years ago.
(11:16):
Amazing, dude.
It was actually created for, like, I think inWorld War II.
Yeah.
It was, like, for for, like, like, war veteransthat have gotten injured, you know, and then it
became just the the thing that chicks do to getjuicy booties.
But hey.
I'm a polite
guy too, though.
That's why.
I love it.
She's a possum.
The
only other deuce.
(11:37):
Yes.
It's your name.
And maybe you'll have
a great name.
Yeah.
That speaks
so I
love it in proudly.
The don't don't don't blow our secret.
I mean, this is know.
Yeah.
If you know, you know.
That's right.
That's right.
But stuff like that.
You know, I was doing sound baths.
I tried that, you know, a whole bunch of, like,I did ketamine therapy.
I did, I haven't done ayahuasca, but I've donea number of mushroom trips and, I'm trying to
(12:01):
think of another ice baths.
And then on a more daily use basis, I wastaking CBD and functional mushrooms, which were
helping kind of manage that stress andinflammation through, like, your cortisol
production, kind of dampens that down, helpsyou get better sleep, just helps that, you
(12:21):
know, head to toe.
There's all these different mushrooms and theykind of affect different systems.
But essentially, what they're trying to do,what all this is trying to do is get you back
into what state of homeostasis, which is, like,essentially just balance where you feel good.
You don't feel fatigue.
You don't feel brain fog.
You don't feel anxiety or stress or any of thatstuff.
(12:44):
And so, yeah, that was kinda that was what Iwas doing.
And then like I mentioned earlier, it was like,all right, great.
You know, figured one thing out, but now Igotta figure out how to remember to take it
every day.
And so that's what kinda led me to coffee andthe rest is history.
What's the when we say adaptogens
Mhmm.
Let's have a little bit of a I don't know forour audience.
(13:06):
And even me, Joel, on some level.
It's a buzzword right now.
Right?
It's all the first messaging, but what is it?
Yeah.
Totally.
Totally.
So let's let's break down that what thatexactly means and what are adaptogens,
the
different types maybe, and and the types maybein your coffee.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So adaptogens does adaptogen adaptogen mean?
Well, it's actually it's kinda funny becauseit's a it seems like this very, like, esoteric
(13:29):
word, like adaptogen.
What?
But really, like, what it is is sort of in thetitle.
It's an adaptogen.
So it helps your body adapt to externalstressors.
That's largely, you know, like a blanket term.
That's what it is.
It's kind of also an umbrella term that housesother different superfoods, I guess, with it's
(13:52):
at some point, you're, like, trying to figureout other synonyms to call them without you
know what I mean?
So adaptogens are this blanket term thatincludes roots, fungi, herbs, and plants that
all help your body adapt to external stressors.
So some that you have probably heard of, ifyou're not familiar with, like, the functional
mushrooms and all that stuff, ginseng.
(14:13):
Ginseng is an adaptogen.
Ashwagandha is an adaptogen.
Those would be under the, like, root, Ibelieve.
I believe both of those are kind of roots.
But
Is lion's mane considered an adaptogen?
Yes.
Yes.
So there's It's
a functional mushroom.
One of the categories is a functional mushroom.
Functional mushrooms are one of these.
(14:34):
They would be under, like, the fungi categoryof the adaptogen.
And, yeah, there's there's a whole bunch.
Lion's mane is one of them.
Another one that people wouldn't think is onebut is is shiitake.
Like, shiitake mushrooms, those are a medicinalmushroom.
And I like to tell people when they get kindof, like, oh, it's just gonna you know, they're
they're a little bit concerned about, what it'sgonna do?
(14:57):
Am I gonna pass a drug test?
I'm like, you should be as worried about thisas you are about eating shiitake mushrooms.
You know what I mean?
It's that level of risk that you're taking.
But yes.
So lion's mane is one of them.
Lion's mane is actually this prettycrazy-looking mushroom, like a giant white
ball.
It looks like a lion's head, kind of.
And it's really good for cognitive function,memory, focus, creativity.
(15:23):
And I think one of the coolest things aboutlion's mane is its ability to regenerate nerve
and brain cells, which was something that, youknow, up until fairly recently, was, you know,
if you lost nerve function or, you know, youhad, like, a traumatic brain injury that was,
you know, killed a lot of brain cells, that wassort of like, man, you know, that sucks.
(15:45):
You know?
But we didn't know there was a way to kinda getyou back.
Now, you know, Paul Stamets, have you heard ofthat guy?
He's like the mushroom king.
He's been on Rogan, oh, yeah, times.
He has this concept.
He calls it the Stamets stack, I believe.
And it's lion's mane, psilocybin, likemicrodose psilocybin, and niacin.
(16:06):
So, like, vitamin B, whatever B number thatniacin is.
But what it does, so the niacin helps flush andget all of the, like, polysaccharides,
beta-glucans, out into the distal extremities.
So, like, your fingertips and, like, toes allacross.
And then the psilocybin and lion's mane arewhat are helping regenerate, you know, these
(16:31):
nerve and brain cells.
So, it's pretty miraculous stuff.
And I think the real magic happens sort of inthe formulation and the combination.
So because you can have functional mushroom oreven with other adaptogens formulated for
focus, you know, formulated for sleep.
And, hey, I just, like, I have a hard timefalling asleep.
(16:55):
Well, if you take chamomile, jujube, polygala,and reishi, you know, you'll be knocked out
and, you know, for the rest of the night andwake up not feeling hungover or like you, you
know, if you tried doing it with a nightcapkind of deal.
So, yeah, it's pretty awesome.
I love it.
I always just thought the shiitake is referredby hibachi.
(17:18):
I
was lots of side.
Hungry.
Egg roll.
By hibachi.
I love the hibachi.
You know?
Yeah.
You catch the shrimp in your mouth.
Yeah, dude.
Yeah.
I was like, taste some.
They sounded good.
But I do love some mushrooms.
I like I say I like eating them, though.
Like, the all kinds.
(17:39):
Yeah.
So Oh, totally.
Totally.
I did not know that.
I did not know.
I learned something.
We're students on this show too.
That's why we have great guests on like you,like learning, you know, that shiitake is
actually an adaptogen in its own right.
Yeah.
Yeah, it is.
And, what, what sort of led to yourformulation?
(18:00):
You like when you're making the coffee and whatare the things that kind of inspired your
blends?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So our very first products were justCBD-infused because, you know, at this point,
I'm kind of riding out my time in the military,like I'm being medically separated.
(18:21):
And I wanted to smoke weed so bad, dude.
But I was just like, it's not worth, like,blowing all of my benefits, you know, in the
final stretch right now.
But I was like, I never really tried CBD.
And I hear, you know, it has all thesebenefits, blah blah blah.
So I started taking it and, you know, you don'tget high from CBD.
It doesn't have that same sort of psychoactiveeffects, but it was really helping with sort of
(18:47):
my anxiety.
It was helping me sleep better.
And so then I was taking it with coffee becausenow caffeine was sort of like spiking my
anxiety too.
If I'm already feeling anxious and like, I'mnot like, oh, god.
Not in a good mental space, you go and throw astimulant in on that mix, and your cortisol is
(19:08):
going way up.
You're gonna you're gonna feel jittery.
You're gonna feel anxious.
So I started I was taking CBD in the morning.
And, anyway, my first product was infusing itwith CBD, and that was sort of what I was
trying to do was sort of help mitigate thejittery, anxious feelings of caffeine.
But trying to scale a CBD-infused food companyis like smashing your face against the wall
(19:35):
because it feels good when you stop.
Like, it dude, it was so brutal.
You are treated on one hand like a legitcompany because you are you're legal in all 50
states.
You're taxed.
You gotta do all the paperwork and all thatstuff.
But on the other hand, you are conflated withcannabis, so people are afraid to take you.
Platforms don't let you advertise.
(19:55):
You can't do Google Ads.
You can't accept PayPal.
You can't accept Stripe.
You can't—it's like all these freaking rules.
And, you know, but I was getting customers thatwere like, I love this.
Like, this is the first coffee that, you know,tastes good, but also is giving me these
benefits.
Blah blah blah.
Anyway, so I started—I was really involved inthis space now and just exploring all these
(20:17):
different things.
I had also, you know, I went to school up inOregon.
You know, I was very familiar with psychedelicmushrooms.
So and I'd known that there was a lot ofmovement in this space through like MAPS, which
is like the study of psychedelic research forPTSD.
There's a lot of stuff going on.
So I was like, I want to learn more about themushroom side of things and the mushroom
(20:38):
science.
And so then I started exploring all thesedifferent mushrooms.
I was finding different tinctures and whatnotand trying to figure out how I can infuse it.
Essentially, what I landed on was a distillatethat is glycerin-based.
A lot of extracts are alcohol-based, whichtastes like shit, and they're, like, very,
(20:59):
like, you know?
So if you're gonna infuse your coffee with it,it's just gonna, like, totally ruin your
coffee.
So I found one where the flavor was very mild.
It was glycerin-based, so it's water soluble,and it just didn't taste like shit.
And all the mushrooms, I mean, they were tripleextracted, which, like, 10x the beta-glucans.
(21:20):
So I'm seeing a bunch of stuff right now.
I'll, like, kinda back up for a second.
So, within these functional mushrooms, thereare a number of different compounds that are
beneficial.
But one of the big ones is called abeta-glucan, and it's specifically found in
mushrooms.
(21:41):
And when you get these extracts, you oftentimesit might be like a dried mushroom and it could
be like double extracted.
That's pretty common.
And so you might get, like, you know, 10percent, let's say, beta-glucan levels.
Well, based on this triple extracted distillatewith, you know, it has 14 different mushrooms.
(22:01):
So, again, we're kind of like a head-to-toething.
We were getting 10x the beta-glucan output.
So all this to say that it made it verybioavailable, which means your body can
actually get the benefits from the extracts.
And I was finding that, yeah, I was having awhole bunch of benefits in regards to, like,
(22:25):
stress support, sleep support, not having thatmidday crash, you know, when you drink your
coffee and then, you know, you're like, oh,God.
I'm, like, zonked out.
It's helping give kind of this sustained energyover a longer period of time, kinda closer to,
like, an L-theanine, if people are familiarwith, like, matcha.
That's what people love matcha for these daysis because it's a little bit of caffeine, but
(22:47):
it's also this other molecule calledL-theanine, which doesn't have that, like, that
caffeine does, you know.
But, yeah, that was a long answer to say.
We just found the stuff that worked well,tasted good because I was trying all these
other mushroom coffees and coffee substitutesand Mud\Wtr and RYZE and Four Sigmatic, all
(23:09):
this stuff.
And almost every one of them to the T is reallyselling you on the benefits of mushrooms
because they're real, 100%.
But all of them tasted awful, and you had to doso much crap to it to make it sustainably
enjoyable.
And I'm like, what habit am I really gonnastick with if I'm like, okay, time for coffee?
(23:33):
You know?
And so I wanted to be the mushroom coffee forcoffee lovers.
We use whole bean coffee, so it's not ground.
We use a liquid distillate when we're infusing.
So, you know, like I mentioned about thebioavailability and just whole bean coffee
stays fresh longer, you know, so we can reallyfocus on the flavor profile.
(23:54):
It's whole beans, so you can grind if you likeFrench press or if you want to do espresso, you
know, and grind really, really fine.
You could do that, and you don't have torethink your morning routine, I guess.
Chris, I know you turned me on to a lot of thefunctional mushrooms, so I know you've been a
proponent for a long time.
(24:16):
Yeah.
I'm stoked to try it because I've, like, triedall these different blends and, like, you named
a few brands, MUD/WTR.
It was so complicated.
Like, here's your frother.
Here's the creamer, and it's just like, dude.
And maybe we're just so ingrained with coffeeculture.
You know?
(24:39):
But I think you made a great point, which isthey haven't made one for coffee lovers.
Right?
They've jumped on the novelty of it, and it'scool, and I love the innovation of it.
But and that was something me, like, Idefinitely appreciate coffee.
I'm by no means some connoisseur.
Right?
But taste was always kinda off, you know, ormaybe even their blends were just not vibing
(25:05):
with me sometimes.
Some were too strong.
Some I didn't feel anything at all.
So I'm stoked to try, but I just love the factthat you explained even the extraction because
that's the most important thing maybe you saidwas there's so many brands, you know, putting
this stuff on the label.
Right?
You go to Amazon.
There's a million brands selling functionalmushrooms.
(25:25):
So I think, like, you just educated us on that.
I'm curious.
Okay.
These brands I've been using, what extractionmethod are they using?
Because we have doctors on all the time when wetalk about bioavailability.
Right?
So if it's only 10% bioavailability, it'spointless.
I wanna drink my normal coffee, and I'll takea, you know, a supplement.
But if you figure out a way to do it, I'm superintrigued to try yours.
(25:48):
Oh, dude.
I can't wait to send you guys some.
But, yeah, that's I agree, man.
I mean, I tried those.
One time I was making a MUD\WTR.
It was the first time I had, like, gotten it.
It was really early morning.
It's probably, like, 6 a.m., and it was stillkinda dark out.
And, put the frother in the cup and, you know,boiling water in there, and I there's a get
away.
You're supposed to hit it at, like, an angle, Iguess, but I didn't know this.
(26:08):
So I just go straight down, and it creates,like, a mud water volcano, like, sport and I'm
like, dude, it is too early for this shit.
You know?
People like coffee.
They like the coffee culture.
They like, you know, I I I was just doing abunch of, like, pitch decks and stuff this last
year.
And so I was going through all these differentstatistics, and I see there's something so 75
(26:30):
percent of Americans drink coffee yesterday.
It was the single highest pulled drink abovebottled water, and then tap water was number
three.
Like, it was higher than water.
And, I forget the exact number, but, I think itwas maybe, like, something a really high
percentage of people have tried to quit coffeebecause they hear you know, they're like, oh, I
(26:53):
don't like that.
It makes me feel or caffeine's bad, whatever itis.
And, like, 9 out of 10 of those people comeback within 30 days.
And the number one reason that they attributeis taste.
They like coffee.
They like the smell of it.
They like, you know, walking to a coffee shop,and just like there is culture around it too.
(27:15):
You know?
And I think that's something that is hard forpeople to just give up because there's a health
benefit to something else.
You know?
It's about how long I lasted when I quit—30days.
That's absolutely
And I live.
There's three coffee shops around my place.
So it's like,
Yes.
It's hard to walk.
(27:35):
Yeah.
I see coffee.
And if you close your eyes, the smell,
because there's there's a there's at thispoint, there's emotional ties to that.
Right?
There's totally.
Totally.
How do we know when the adaptogens are, youknow, like, Chris and I have had this
discussion, you know, and we're we're in thespace.
(27:57):
We own Vacay, a plant-based company, and talkwith a lot of different people.
And if people don't feel something, it's hard,you know, or they're not doing regular blood
work.
It's, like, hard to get people excited aboutdifferent things.
Do they do you get feedback to people and,like, when you're drinking your coffee, like,
(28:17):
you feel different?
Is there and I'm not talking about, like, abuzz as much as just, you know, certain effect.
Yeah.
So, yes.
And to acknowledge what you're saying as true,some of these things are subtle, or you have to
take them, you know, for an extended period oftime.
It's not like, you know, let's call I'm tryingto think of something you could take.
(28:39):
I call it like a Tylenol or something whereyou're like, I'm in pain.
You take one Tylenol.
I'm not in pain.
Like, that's a pretty, like, a b.
Okay.
You can you can this one, you may have to takeit for a week or and different people are gonna
respond slightly differently.
But I have gotten a lot of positive feedback.
And one of the most okay.
(29:02):
Here's two positive stories that I had acustomer that purchased our mocha powder.
So it was our local mocha.
It's like a mushroom hot cocoa mix.
Right?
I mix it with my coffee and I kind of make,like, a mocha at home, you know?
But in any case, so he had purchased some and,he wrote me, you know, a couple weeks later.
(29:24):
And he was like, I've been taking your stufffor about a week, and I wanted to try if it if
it was working.
So, he was doing some, like, data entry inExcel.
Okay?
So Monday, he was doing it.
Tuesday, he was doing it.
He said, Monday, I did my normal thing, took,you know, 30 milligrams of Adderall, and we
(29:45):
just kinda, you know, hit it hard.
He's like, I was ripping my Juul, like the vapepen all day.
And he's like, by 5 o'clock, I was just like,you know, like, tweaking, just feeling awful,
you know, and he's like, but I got x number ofcells entered.
(30:06):
Okay?
He said, the next day, he was like, I'm gonnatry just doing this with the LocoMocha.
He said, I didn't hit my Juul all day.
He took, like, 5 milligrams or 10 milligrams.
Like, it was like a fraction of the Adderallthat he had taken.
And he said by the end of the day, he, like, hehad gotten more inputted and felt way better at
(30:30):
the end of the day.
So that was, like, a very, like, he was kind ofdoing the experiment on himself.
Like, okay.
What happens when I do it the way I'm doing it?
And then what happens when I try thisalternative?
And, you know, could some of that benefit beattributed to not ripping your Juul all day
and, you know, taking 20 milligrams fewer ofAdderall that day?
(30:53):
You know, probably.
I'll acknowledge that.
But, you know, the point is by implementingthis product, he was able to make better habits
on that second day and be just as productiveand ultimately feel better.
You know, because one thing that we get caughtin is this, like, cycle.
(31:14):
So perfect example is, like, you wake up,you're super tired, you know, you slam your
coffee, you go to work, you're working, you hitthat 3 o'clock wall, you crush an energy drink,
you work till 5, but the half-life of thatcaffeine is operating on you till, like, 9 p.m.
So you have a shitty night's rest or let's backit up a little bit.
(31:35):
You're not feeling tired, right?
So now you crush two nightcap whiskeys, so youcan get to sleep.
You wake up the next day, you're, like, kindahungover.
You didn't sleep very well, so you drink morecoffee to get you through the next day.
And do you see how we create these feedbackloops that spiral to the bottom?
You know?
And, like, before you know it, you feel likeshit.
(31:56):
You're always tired.
You're not sleeping.
You know?
And this is just your existence, and you'reconstantly playing internal chemistry, you
know, with the internal chemistry strat to getyou back to just feeling like normal.
So I think what this does by implementing it isit helps you break those kinds of destructive
cycles so that you can let your body kinda getback to that place of normal.
(32:19):
And I also believe that you gotta do this inconjunction with a whole lifestyle of holistic
stuff.
Like, you should, you know, go outside for alittle bit, do some exercise, walk around, eat
good foods, you know, spend time with yourfamily.
All of these things are part of a holisticlifestyle.
And if you were implementing all of thesethings, I guarantee your life would feel
(32:44):
better.
You would be, you know, more productive as thebest version of you.
It's kinda how I like to frame it as you'retrying to be the best version of you.
Yeah.
That's the key.
And that's at the end of the day, what we'retrying to do is empower people with knowledge
and these things.
Because I think a lot of people go through thatcycle of, you know, stimulants, non-stimulants.
I mean, a lot of different things.
(33:05):
And, you know, knowing that there's thesemodalities in different outlets that some get
highlighted more than others and, you know,don't require a prescription or, you know,
don't have the habitual nature to them thatmight actually help you kill or kick some
habits.
(33:26):
That's the shame of it all.
Right?
That it takes, I don't know, destigmatizingthese things.
You know, it's crazy.
Well, that's I was just gonna say, you you saidit earlier.
We kinda talked about this briefly in thepreshow, but, like, it's the destigmatizing and
the normalizing and the educating, that I seemy you know, yes.
(33:46):
I'm selling a product, but the reason I'm onyour podcast is because I'm trying to sell
coffee.
It's because I want to my mission is to be anadvocate and to help educate people, and
especially people in the veteran community ormaybe anyone that is living, like, a
high-stress life but isn't culturally inundatedwith some of these, you know, hippie-dippie
(34:12):
modalities.
I live in Southern California, dude.
Like, there I could throw a cat and hit fouryoga studios.
Yep.
You know?
But I'd be okay with that personally, but
I'll probably get some hate mail, but I'm justnot
a cat guy.
Not a cat guy.
Not a cat guy.
Yeah.
Chris has four of
them, but, you know, I still love them.
(34:33):
It's a increase
in music too.
No.
I'm
gonna be totally.
I'm gonna.
Chris has, like,
a he
Chris has, like, a 120-pound lab sitting infront of him.
He's a big boy.
So I'm screwed with him.
That's awesome.
Everybody.
(34:55):
But people in, like, the military and lawenforcement and even just people you know, I
don't like to break everything down into, like,political, you know, divides, but, like, you
could say that people traditionally more rightof center, more conservative leaning, may have
more of an aversion to things like mushrooms.
(35:17):
Oh, is that a drug?
You know?
Or like, I don't know.
I don't trust any of that hippie dippy woo woostuff.
You know?
Anyone with that mindset.
Let's step away from politics.
Does anyone with that mindset want to be outthere and be like, Hey, you know, I'm an
athlete.
I'm a veteran.
I'm an aggressive, you know, person.
I'm an entrepreneur.
(35:37):
Like, you know, I'm a hard charger.
But I have found that by implementing some ofthese, like, softer, more, like, balanced
approaches into my life, it has made everythingbetter.
You know?
And when I'm out there just lifting every day,like, I'm just gonna go lift weights, you know?
It's like it's too much you know, if you needyin and yang, it's too much yang.
(36:01):
You need to implement some yin.
And so I want I'm here to advocate for the yinside of things to these communities that are a
little more the Yang Gang, you know.
For sure.
That's the irony Chris and I, you know, areconscious on
I can see it.
Too.
You know, we're not the leftist guys normallyeither.
(36:22):
Rather furthest thing from it.
Right.
Definitely more independent than anything, butI think Yeah.
But definitely hard-charging, entrepreneurial,and definitely, I think this is where the
politics got to get out of the way of thepractical, like reality of evolution.
(36:42):
And like, we live really with some dated shit.
And it's like the fact that we have soldierscoming back from serving our country and having
to fight to get to, you know, potentially the,you know, like the mushrooms or even the MDMA
stuff, like all the stuff that's being provento, like, be some of the, it's it's just
(37:05):
nonsense.
And because of lifelong, you know, the war ondrugs and all that stuff.
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
And that's where I think what's so awesomeabout, like, the kind of overlap between
veteran mental health and psychedelic researchis it is truly a bipartisan issue.
(37:29):
You know, left, right, center, up, down, black,white, doesn't matter.
Yeah.
Everyone is in agreement that, hey.
If this is helping the veterans, like, weshould, like, at least study it.
Right?
You know?
It doesn't mean we need to go just put it forsale on every street corner, but, like, let's
why aren't we doing more to understand howthese things could help veterans and then by
(37:56):
extension, the rest of the rest of us.
You know?
But, I think the veteran component has been avery crucial piece to getting past that war on
drugs mindset.
Nailed it.
Oh, where can I keep up with you, man?
Everything you're doing, your call, see allthat stuff.
Yeah.
So, if you guys wanna give me a follow, it's onat windandseacoffee.
(38:20):
And there it's windandseacoffee.
There's no "d" in the "and." Alsowindandseacoffee.com, that's where you order
everything.
We also do monthly subscriptions.
You get everything 30% off if you want itcoming to your house regularly.
You can mix and match super easy.
Also, I started a podcast, like, two to threemonths ago ish.
(38:45):
It's called, the Mind Body Mushroom.
And, yeah, it's pretty, like, in its earlystages, you know, but I'm just sort of I don't
wanna have, like, analysis paralysis where I'mlike, oh, I don't wanna release this?
It's not perfect.
I don't have a good intro.
I don't have, you know what I mean?
So I'm just like, screw it, dude.
Let's just record it, publish it, and just getin the habit of doing this week in, week out.
(39:10):
And before you know it, you know, then a year,two years, three years, all of a sudden you're,
like, you've built something that is worth it.
But the mission there is just doing exactlywhat we did here.
You know, talking about people's stories, howholistic health has transformed their life,
and, you know, trying to find tips that otherpeople can take away.
(39:35):
See if there's anywhere else.
I got a YouTube channel, just windandseacoffeeon YouTube, and that's pretty much it.
You know, I love if you guys find me onanything, you have any questions, shoot me a
DM.
I'm very approachable, and I think a hugecomponent of this is trying to build community.
So that's what I want.
It's not weird if you guys reached out to me,please do.
(39:57):
I think it's awesome.
And I love the way that social media andpodcasting and all this stuff has been able to
connect each other and really move thisindustry and this movement forward.
Totally agree.
Any final words, Chris?
I'm stoked to try the coffee and justappreciate you coming on, Jordan.
We covered a lot of different topics, and Ithink a lot of important things.
(40:21):
So I'm stoked about what you're doing, and
I
encourage everyone to check it out.
Win and See coffee.
Yeah.
Thank you, Jordan.
Appreciate you coming on.
Hey, guys.
You can find us at vibescience.com.
You'll find all the links, the insights, andthe sparks from today's episode with Jordan.
We'll have links to his coffee, his socialmedia, and YouTube channel, all at
(40:41):
vibescience.com, and we appreciate you forlistening.
We're always trying to take you to your highestvibe.
We'll see you next time on Vibe Science.
The content discussed on this show is providedfor reference and educational purposes.
The content is not an attempt to practicemedicine or provide specific medical advice.
Always consult your personal physician formedical advice and proper diagnosis.
Thanks for listening.
(41:02):
This is Vibe Science.
To learn more or watch full episodes, visitvibesciencepodcast.com.
Here's to discovering your highest vibe.
This is Vybe Science, a top 100 wellnesspodcast presented by the Radcast Network.
Breaking wellness barriers and making healthtruly personal.
Here are your hosts, Ryan Alford and ChrisHansen.
Hello, and welcome to Vybe Science.
We're always taking you to the highest vibes.
(00:21):
We're bringing you the best in modern medicine,the best in alternative wellness because it's
all about mind, body, and energy.
So we got Jordan Ryan today.
He is the founder and CEO of Wind and SeaCoffee.
What's up, Jordan?
What's up, Ryan?
What's up, Chris?
Thanks for having me on today.
(00:42):
Yes.
Chris and I are pumped to have you.
Chris, how's Miami today, brother?
I feel like a dog.
I'm sitting here basking in the sun.
I'm getting a little sleepy, relaxed.
I'm feeling good because we got a good guesttoday, and I'm stoked for the conversation.
Get that mid-afternoon vibes there in Miami.
But, Jordan, we're pumped to have you on, beingthe
(01:04):
too, man.
Hey.
Everybody loves coffee.
Our energy in one way, shape, or form,especially when it gets infused and done.
That's why I always love the infused things,you know, like I like combining my stuff
together.
Like that's the best world.
Totally.
Yeah.
Jordan, where's home for you?
(01:24):
Did I hear San Diego?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'm based out of San Diego, California,originally from Albuquerque, New Mexico.
So, I don't know if you've seen Breaking Bad,but it's pretty spot on, dude.
It really captures, like, something about thatplace.
But, yeah.
Anyway, I moved to Oregon, did four years ofcollege there, joined the military, kinda got
(01:48):
stationed around a few different places, andthen, mostly based out of San Diego and
Oceanside.
And, yeah.
Now this is where I call home.
So I love it.
Yeah, man.
Has the coffee thing been, like, a lifelonginterest or just something purely that kinda
came out of, you know, I know, and we'll get toyour story here shortly, but I'm just curious
(02:08):
if coffee was always in the blood, so to speak.
So, you know, honestly, not in a sense that Iwas like a coffee connoisseur or anything like
that growing up.
You know?
I mean, I drank coffee, but, you know, I neverreally thought about it all that much.
And I think, you know, being in the military, Imean, our nation's wars are fueled on caffeine
(02:32):
and nicotine.
You know?
So that was sort of, like, really where you'relike, alright.
Jesus.
My real relationship started with coffee.
But in that sense, you're not you're not again,you're not really looking at it from the flavor
profiles and the roast and stuff.
You're just like, you know, what's gonna get methrough the night kind of, you know, vibe?
(02:55):
But then coming out, you know, getting intoholistic wellness, which, you know, we can get
into.
But, yeah, what you were just saying in theintro about, like, infusing something,
combining those things, you know, there's thisconcept called habit stacking.
And when I was, you know, first getting intosome of this holistic medicine, plant medicine,
(03:17):
adaptogens, etcetera, you know, you're buyingtinctures and capsules and this type of stuff,
but they're kind of just sitting in yourcabinet and you're not getting any benefit if
you're not taking them.
So I would forget to take them.
So I was like, man, how do I figure out a wayof, you know, I'm already making this time
every single day.
I don't need to remember.
It's first thing to think about when I get upin the morning is I'm gonna go make coffee.
(03:38):
Right?
So you go over there and what if, you know,that it kinda occurred to me, like, what if I
could combine these two steps?
And that way, just the ritual of making coffeeand enjoying it was to kinda like taking my
medicine in the sense.
I love the habit stacking.
Maybe Chris has heard of that.
I haven't heard of that, but I like that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's it's hard because, you know, new habitsare hard and they have to be sustainable.
(04:02):
It's gotta be something you can do for the longrun.
You have to enjoy it.
And one of the best easiest ways ofimplementing a new habit is if you can have it
stack with something that you're already doing.
So, kind of like a life hack concept thatapplies to other things, but I just adapted it
to my product and, yeah, made sense for me.
How's, were you, the Navy thing getting into,you know, the armed services, like, was that
(04:29):
historical?
Like, you knew you were gonna do that?
Like, what led to that sort of path and maybeleading to, you know, your unfortunate injury
and things like that.
But what was kind of the background that ledinto the military experience?
Yeah.
So, you know, I do have like, my dad was in theAir Force.
My sister was in the Air Force, but I didn'treally have like, I wasn't, like, following a
(04:53):
family tradition or anything like that.
Honestly, I was in college.
I was an undergraduate at the University ofOregon, and I was a finance major.
And I liked I loved college, loved Oregon,loved, you know, studying finance.
But right around, like, my sophomore year,probably, like, we're you know, you or maybe
(05:15):
junior year.
That's what I was like.
Your junior year, you're kinda looking at,like, okay.
I better go to career fairs.
I gotta figure out, like, we gotta get a job.
So I'm walking around.
I'm kinda looking.
I'm like, yeah.
I never really thought about, like, what is afinance job?
You know?
So I'm going to all these, and I'm seeing it'slike it's like banks and, you know, like,
credit unions.
I'm like, dude, what did I just do to myself?
(05:35):
Like, I 0% want to do this.
I felt like I, you know, I was like a martialartist.
Like, I loved being outside and like, just, youknow, I was kind of like, like an adrenaline
junkie, you know, bombing hills and stuff likethat.
And so being 21 and that kind of facing thisprospect of like, oh, you're just gonna go be a
(05:55):
desk jockey for, like, the, you know, theremainder of your working career.
I just felt like I was sort of like wasting myyouth and sort of this, like, fire that I had
to to go do something fun and exciting, thatwasn't, work at a bank.
And so, kind of against, the best wishes of mymom who when I told her, she was, like, very
(06:19):
upset.
But, yeah, I was like, I wanna join the Navy.
I wanna be a Navy SEAL.
Like, I've, you know, this is this is, what I'mgonna do after school.
And, yeah.
So that that went over like a lead balloon,but, you know?
Yeah.
I'm sure.
I mean, I don't know how long your dad's here.
My dad was also in the Air Force.
(06:39):
So there
Oh, nice.
Remind me of that.
So we appreciate your service here being
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Veterans Day week, the week of this recording.
Appreciate that.
Did your dad do, like, a lifelong server orjust did, like, a normal tour?
Like
No.
Just like a normal tour.
So he he's funny.
He, like, he is, like, the the least veteranveteran.
Like, he didn't even know he could get VAhealth care.
(07:02):
Like, he was just sort of, you know, I think hewent I don't remember the order of this, but he
was in the Forest Service and then the AirForce.
It may have been Air Force then Forest Service.
But while he was in the Forest Service, he,like, lived in a tent for, like, four years.
You know?
He was just, like, kind of like a hippie alittle bit up in, like, Big Bear area.
(07:23):
So Lake Arrowhead, that kind of so I think forhim, it was just sort of like I don't know.
Like, maybe something a little similar now thatI'm thinking about it.
Like, he's just like, I don't really wanna growup yet, and I'd rather go eat mushrooms in a
tent.
You know?
So
There you go.
One more way to do it.
One more way to
do it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
(07:45):
Talk about your, you know, the process.
I mean, so you end up getting an injury.
I think that fueled a lot of your passion intothe coffee business.
What happened there?
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So, I in this in the military, I'm actually atthis point, I'm kind of fast forwarding through
some of my military service, but I went to aship and then I became a medic, so a corpsman,
(08:10):
and specifically within the Marine SpecialOperations community.
So the MARSOC community.
I think they're called Raider Battalions now.
But at the time, there it was MARSOC.
In any case, I'm a medic and I'm going throughtraining and doing some other stuff, and I
have, like, a bad back injury.
(08:33):
And at some point, you know, I'm here trying torecover.
I'm trying to get back into my job, dude, youknow, because your reputation is everything.
You know, you don't you don't wanna let anybodydown, all the stuff.
And at some point, it's occurring to me that,like, I may not get better at it.
Like, this that may be the end of this road,you know?
And that was, like, a huge, like, oh, you know,just sink in my the pit of my stomach.
(08:57):
Like, my identity is heavily tied into my jobtitle.
I might be losing my job, which is losing, youknow, my income, losing all this other stuff.
I'm losing my identity.
I'm losing respect in my community.
I'm losing mobility.
You know, I can't run or lift or, you know, doany of these things that I like.
(09:21):
And so I went through like a really kind ofdark period.
At this time, I was, you know, gettinginjections, taking different medications, going
to physical therapy, doing, you know,surgeries, all this stuff, you know, trying to
figure out how to make myself better so I canget back to my job.
And none of these things were working.
And in addition to them not really working, Iwas having a lot of second- and third-order
(09:45):
side effects from the medications or, you know,just bad reactions to, you know, surgery or
injection or whatever the case is.
And so I kind of shifted my mindset at thatpoint to be like, if I'm going to have to
manage this for the long run, I want to figureout how to do it in a sustainable way that is
(10:06):
not going to negatively impact the health of myorgans or, you know, I just don't want to
be—during the summer, I'm going through the VAhealth care system, which isn't as bad as it's
kind of chalked up to be.
But I'm walking to the hospital and you seethese, like, salty Vietnam vets and they're,
you know, waiting in line for their pharmacystuff and yelling at some clerk because they're
(10:32):
cutting him off on the pills that, you know,he's—and it was really sad and it was kind of
an eye-opening, like, I bet that guy didn'tthink he was gonna be there either.
You know what I mean?
Like, I bet he when he was my age or he was,you know, 21 or 20, he didn't think he would be
yelling for opioids at, you know, somebody atthe VA hospital.
(10:54):
And I'm like, I don't—I don't want to be that.
I really, really don't.
And so I need to figure out how to manage this.
And so that's what kinda got me exploring plantmedicine.
And beyond that, just like holistic health ingeneral.
I mean, even stuff as simple as, like, yoga,man.
Like, yoga, super transformational Pilates.
I started doing Pilates about two years ago.
(11:16):
Amazing, dude.
It was actually created for, like, I think inWorld War II.
Yeah.
It was, like, for for, like, like, war veteransthat have gotten injured, you know, and then it
became just the the thing that chicks do to getjuicy booties.
But hey.
I'm a polite
guy too, though.
That's why.
I love it.
She's a possum.
The
only other deuce.
(11:37):
Yes.
It's your name.
And maybe you'll have
a great name.
Yeah.
That speaks
so I
love it in proudly.
The don't don't don't blow our secret.
I mean, this is know.
Yeah.
If you know, you know.
That's right.
That's right.
But stuff like that.
You know, I was doing sound baths.
I tried that, you know, a whole bunch of, like,I did ketamine therapy.
I did, I haven't done ayahuasca, but I've donea number of mushroom trips and, I'm trying to
(12:01):
think of another ice baths.
And then on a more daily use basis, I wastaking CBD and functional mushrooms, which were
helping kind of manage that stress andinflammation through, like, your cortisol
production, kind of dampens that down, helpsyou get better sleep, just helps that, you
(12:21):
know, head to toe.
There's all these different mushrooms and theykind of affect different systems.
But essentially, what they're trying to do,what all this is trying to do is get you back
into what state of homeostasis, which is, like,essentially just balance where you feel good.
You don't feel fatigue.
You don't feel brain fog.
You don't feel anxiety or stress or any of thatstuff.
(12:44):
And so, yeah, that was kinda that was what Iwas doing.
And then like I mentioned earlier, it was like,all right, great.
You know, figured one thing out, but now Igotta figure out how to remember to take it
every day.
And so that's what kinda led me to coffee andthe rest is history.
What's the when we say adaptogens
Mhmm.
Let's have a little bit of a I don't know forour audience.
(13:06):
And even me, Joel, on some level.
It's a buzzword right now.
Right?
It's all the first messaging, but what is it?
Yeah.
Totally.
Totally.
So let's let's break down that what thatexactly means and what are adaptogens,
the
different types maybe, and and the types maybein your coffee.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So adaptogens does adaptogen adaptogen mean?
Well, it's actually it's kinda funny becauseit's a it seems like this very, like, esoteric
(13:29):
word, like adaptogen.
What?
But really, like, what it is is sort of in thetitle.
It's an adaptogen.
So it helps your body adapt to externalstressors.
That's largely, you know, like a blanket term.
That's what it is.
It's kind of also an umbrella term that housesother different superfoods, I guess, with it's
(13:52):
at some point, you're, like, trying to figureout other synonyms to call them without you
know what I mean?
So adaptogens are this blanket term thatincludes roots, fungi, herbs, and plants that
all help your body adapt to external stressors.
So some that you have probably heard of, ifyou're not familiar with, like, the functional
mushrooms and all that stuff, ginseng.
(14:13):
Ginseng is an adaptogen.
Ashwagandha is an adaptogen.
Those would be under the, like, root, Ibelieve.
I believe both of those are kind of roots.
But
Is lion's mane considered an adaptogen?
Yes.
Yes.
So there's It's
a functional mushroom.
One of the categories is a functional mushroom.
Functional mushrooms are one of these.
(14:34):
They would be under, like, the fungi categoryof the adaptogen.
And, yeah, there's there's a whole bunch.
Lion's mane is one of them.
Another one that people wouldn't think is onebut is is shiitake.
Like, shiitake mushrooms, those are a medicinalmushroom.
And I like to tell people when they get kindof, like, oh, it's just gonna you know, they're
they're a little bit concerned about, what it'sgonna do?
(14:57):
Am I gonna pass a drug test?
I'm like, you should be as worried about thisas you are about eating shiitake mushrooms.
You know what I mean?
It's that level of risk that you're taking.
But yes.
So lion's mane is one of them.
Lion's mane is actually this prettycrazy-looking mushroom, like a giant white
ball.
It looks like a lion's head, kind of.
And it's really good for cognitive function,memory, focus, creativity.
(15:23):
And I think one of the coolest things aboutlion's mane is its ability to regenerate nerve
and brain cells, which was something that, youknow, up until fairly recently, was, you know,
if you lost nerve function or, you know, youhad, like, a traumatic brain injury that was,
you know, killed a lot of brain cells, that wassort of like, man, you know, that sucks.
(15:45):
You know?
But we didn't know there was a way to kinda getyou back.
Now, you know, Paul Stamets, have you heard ofthat guy?
He's like the mushroom king.
He's been on Rogan, oh, yeah, times.
He has this concept.
He calls it the Stamets stack, I believe.
And it's lion's mane, psilocybin, likemicrodose psilocybin, and niacin.
(16:06):
So, like, vitamin B, whatever B number thatniacin is.
But what it does, so the niacin helps flush andget all of the, like, polysaccharides,
beta-glucans, out into the distal extremities.
So, like, your fingertips and, like, toes allacross.
And then the psilocybin and lion's mane arewhat are helping regenerate, you know, these
(16:31):
nerve and brain cells.
So, it's pretty miraculous stuff.
And I think the real magic happens sort of inthe formulation and the combination.
So because you can have functional mushroom oreven with other adaptogens formulated for
focus, you know, formulated for sleep.
And, hey, I just, like, I have a hard timefalling asleep.
(16:55):
Well, if you take chamomile, jujube, polygala,and reishi, you know, you'll be knocked out
and, you know, for the rest of the night andwake up not feeling hungover or like you, you
know, if you tried doing it with a nightcapkind of deal.
So, yeah, it's pretty awesome.
I love it.
I always just thought the shiitake is referredby hibachi.
(17:18):
I
was lots of side.
Hungry.
Egg roll.
By hibachi.
I love the hibachi.
You know?
Yeah.
You catch the shrimp in your mouth.
Yeah, dude.
Yeah.
I was like, taste some.
They sounded good.
But I do love some mushrooms.
I like I say I like eating them, though.
Like, the all kinds.
(17:39):
Yeah.
So Oh, totally.
Totally.
I did not know that.
I did not know.
I learned something.
We're students on this show too.
That's why we have great guests on like you,like learning, you know, that shiitake is
actually an adaptogen in its own right.
Yeah.
Yeah, it is.
And, what, what sort of led to yourformulation?
(18:00):
You like when you're making the coffee and whatare the things that kind of inspired your
blends?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So our very first products were justCBD-infused because, you know, at this point,
I'm kind of riding out my time in the military,like I'm being medically separated.
(18:21):
And I wanted to smoke weed so bad, dude.
But I was just like, it's not worth, like,blowing all of my benefits, you know, in the
final stretch right now.
But I was like, I never really tried CBD.
And I hear, you know, it has all thesebenefits, blah blah blah.
So I started taking it and, you know, you don'tget high from CBD.
It doesn't have that same sort of psychoactiveeffects, but it was really helping with sort of
(18:47):
my anxiety.
It was helping me sleep better.
And so then I was taking it with coffee becausenow caffeine was sort of like spiking my
anxiety too.
If I'm already feeling anxious and like, I'mnot like, oh, god.
Not in a good mental space, you go and throw astimulant in on that mix, and your cortisol is
(19:08):
going way up.
You're gonna you're gonna feel jittery.
You're gonna feel anxious.
So I started I was taking CBD in the morning.
And, anyway, my first product was infusing itwith CBD, and that was sort of what I was
trying to do was sort of help mitigate thejittery, anxious feelings of caffeine.
But trying to scale a CBD-infused food companyis like smashing your face against the wall
(19:35):
because it feels good when you stop.
Like, it dude, it was so brutal.
You are treated on one hand like a legitcompany because you are you're legal in all 50
states.
You're taxed.
You gotta do all the paperwork and all thatstuff.
But on the other hand, you are conflated withcannabis, so people are afraid to take you.
Platforms don't let you advertise.
(19:55):
You can't do Google Ads.
You can't accept PayPal.
You can't accept Stripe.
You can't—it's like all these freaking rules.
And, you know, but I was getting customers thatwere like, I love this.
Like, this is the first coffee that, you know,tastes good, but also is giving me these
benefits.
Blah blah blah.
Anyway, so I started—I was really involved inthis space now and just exploring all these
(20:17):
different things.
I had also, you know, I went to school up inOregon.
You know, I was very familiar with psychedelicmushrooms.
So and I'd known that there was a lot ofmovement in this space through like MAPS, which
is like the study of psychedelic research forPTSD.
There's a lot of stuff going on.
So I was like, I want to learn more about themushroom side of things and the mushroom
(20:38):
science.
And so then I started exploring all thesedifferent mushrooms.
I was finding different tinctures and whatnotand trying to figure out how I can infuse it.
Essentially, what I landed on was a distillatethat is glycerin-based.
A lot of extracts are alcohol-based, whichtastes like shit, and they're, like, very,
(20:59):
like, you know?
So if you're gonna infuse your coffee with it,it's just gonna, like, totally ruin your
coffee.
So I found one where the flavor was very mild.
It was glycerin-based, so it's water soluble,and it just didn't taste like shit.
And all the mushrooms, I mean, they were tripleextracted, which, like, 10x the beta-glucans.
(21:20):
So I'm seeing a bunch of stuff right now.
I'll, like, kinda back up for a second.
So, within these functional mushrooms, thereare a number of different compounds that are
beneficial.
But one of the big ones is called abeta-glucan, and it's specifically found in
mushrooms.
(21:41):
And when you get these extracts, you oftentimesit might be like a dried mushroom and it could
be like double extracted.
That's pretty common.
And so you might get, like, you know, 10percent, let's say, beta-glucan levels.
Well, based on this triple extracted distillatewith, you know, it has 14 different mushrooms.
(22:01):
So, again, we're kind of like a head-to-toething.
We were getting 10x the beta-glucan output.
So all this to say that it made it verybioavailable, which means your body can
actually get the benefits from the extracts.
And I was finding that, yeah, I was having awhole bunch of benefits in regards to, like,
(22:25):
stress support, sleep support, not having thatmidday crash, you know, when you drink your
coffee and then, you know, you're like, oh,God.
I'm, like, zonked out.
It's helping give kind of this sustained energyover a longer period of time, kinda closer to,
like, an L-theanine, if people are familiarwith, like, matcha.
That's what people love matcha for these daysis because it's a little bit of caffeine, but
(22:47):
it's also this other molecule calledL-theanine, which doesn't have that, like, that
caffeine does, you know.
But, yeah, that was a long answer to say.
We just found the stuff that worked well,tasted good because I was trying all these
other mushroom coffees and coffee substitutesand Mud\Wtr and RYZE and Four Sigmatic, all
(23:09):
this stuff.
And almost every one of them to the T is reallyselling you on the benefits of mushrooms
because they're real, 100%.
But all of them tasted awful, and you had to doso much crap to it to make it sustainably
enjoyable.
And I'm like, what habit am I really gonnastick with if I'm like, okay, time for coffee?
(23:33):
You know?
And so I wanted to be the mushroom coffee forcoffee lovers.
We use whole bean coffee, so it's not ground.
We use a liquid distillate when we're infusing.
So, you know, like I mentioned about thebioavailability and just whole bean coffee
stays fresh longer, you know, so we can reallyfocus on the flavor profile.
(23:54):
It's whole beans, so you can grind if you likeFrench press or if you want to do espresso, you
know, and grind really, really fine.
You could do that, and you don't have torethink your morning routine, I guess.
Chris, I know you turned me on to a lot of thefunctional mushrooms, so I know you've been a
proponent for a long time.
(24:16):
Yeah.
I'm stoked to try it because I've, like, triedall these different blends and, like, you named
a few brands, MUD/WTR.
It was so complicated.
Like, here's your frother.
Here's the creamer, and it's just like, dude.
And maybe we're just so ingrained with coffeeculture.
You know?
(24:39):
But I think you made a great point, which isthey haven't made one for coffee lovers.
Right?
They've jumped on the novelty of it, and it'scool, and I love the innovation of it.
But and that was something me, like, Idefinitely appreciate coffee.
I'm by no means some connoisseur.
Right?
But taste was always kinda off, you know, ormaybe even their blends were just not vibing
(25:05):
with me sometimes.
Some were too strong.
Some I didn't feel anything at all.
So I'm stoked to try, but I just love the factthat you explained even the extraction because
that's the most important thing maybe you saidwas there's so many brands, you know, putting
this stuff on the label.
Right?
You go to Amazon.
There's a million brands selling functionalmushrooms.
(25:25):
So I think, like, you just educated us on that.
I'm curious.
Okay.
These brands I've been using, what extractionmethod are they using?
Because we have doctors on all the time when wetalk about bioavailability.
Right?
So if it's only 10% bioavailability, it'spointless.
I wanna drink my normal coffee, and I'll takea, you know, a supplement.
But if you figure out a way to do it, I'm superintrigued to try yours.
(25:48):
Oh, dude.
I can't wait to send you guys some.
But, yeah, that's I agree, man.
I mean, I tried those.
One time I was making a MUD\WTR.
It was the first time I had, like, gotten it.
It was really early morning.
It's probably, like, 6 a.m., and it was stillkinda dark out.
And, put the frother in the cup and, you know,boiling water in there, and I there's a get
away.
You're supposed to hit it at, like, an angle, Iguess, but I didn't know this.
(26:08):
So I just go straight down, and it creates,like, a mud water volcano, like, sport and I'm
like, dude, it is too early for this shit.
You know?
People like coffee.
They like the coffee culture.
They like, you know, I I I was just doing abunch of, like, pitch decks and stuff this last
year.
And so I was going through all these differentstatistics, and I see there's something so 75
(26:30):
percent of Americans drink coffee yesterday.
It was the single highest pulled drink abovebottled water, and then tap water was number
three.
Like, it was higher than water.
And, I forget the exact number, but, I think itwas maybe, like, something a really high
percentage of people have tried to quit coffeebecause they hear you know, they're like, oh, I
(26:53):
don't like that.
It makes me feel or caffeine's bad, whatever itis.
And, like, 9 out of 10 of those people comeback within 30 days.
And the number one reason that they attributeis taste.
They like coffee.
They like the smell of it.
They like, you know, walking to a coffee shop,and just like there is culture around it too.
(27:15):
You know?
And I think that's something that is hard forpeople to just give up because there's a health
benefit to something else.
You know?
It's about how long I lasted when I quit—30days.
That's absolutely
And I live.
There's three coffee shops around my place.
So it's like,
Yes.
It's hard to walk.
(27:35):
Yeah.
I see coffee.
And if you close your eyes, the smell,
because there's there's a there's at thispoint, there's emotional ties to that.
Right?
There's totally.
Totally.
How do we know when the adaptogens are, youknow, like, Chris and I have had this
discussion, you know, and we're we're in thespace.
(27:57):
We own Vacay, a plant-based company, and talkwith a lot of different people.
And if people don't feel something, it's hard,you know, or they're not doing regular blood
work.
It's, like, hard to get people excited aboutdifferent things.
Do they do you get feedback to people and,like, when you're drinking your coffee, like,
(28:17):
you feel different?
Is there and I'm not talking about, like, abuzz as much as just, you know, certain effect.
Yeah.
So, yes.
And to acknowledge what you're saying as true,some of these things are subtle, or you have to
take them, you know, for an extended period oftime.
It's not like, you know, let's call I'm tryingto think of something you could take.
(28:39):
I call it like a Tylenol or something whereyou're like, I'm in pain.
You take one Tylenol.
I'm not in pain.
Like, that's a pretty, like, a b.
Okay.
You can you can this one, you may have to takeit for a week or and different people are gonna
respond slightly differently.
But I have gotten a lot of positive feedback.
And one of the most okay.
(29:02):
Here's two positive stories that I had acustomer that purchased our mocha powder.
So it was our local mocha.
It's like a mushroom hot cocoa mix.
Right?
I mix it with my coffee and I kind of make,like, a mocha at home, you know?
But in any case, so he had purchased some and,he wrote me, you know, a couple weeks later.
(29:24):
And he was like, I've been taking your stufffor about a week, and I wanted to try if it if
it was working.
So, he was doing some, like, data entry inExcel.
Okay?
So Monday, he was doing it.
Tuesday, he was doing it.
He said, Monday, I did my normal thing, took,you know, 30 milligrams of Adderall, and we
(29:45):
just kinda, you know, hit it hard.
He's like, I was ripping my Juul, like the vapepen all day.
And he's like, by 5 o'clock, I was just like,you know, like, tweaking, just feeling awful,
you know, and he's like, but I got x number ofcells entered.
(30:06):
Okay?
He said, the next day, he was like, I'm gonnatry just doing this with the LocoMocha.
He said, I didn't hit my Juul all day.
He took, like, 5 milligrams or 10 milligrams.
Like, it was like a fraction of the Adderallthat he had taken.
And he said by the end of the day, he, like, hehad gotten more inputted and felt way better at
(30:30):
the end of the day.
So that was, like, a very, like, he was kind ofdoing the experiment on himself.
Like, okay.
What happens when I do it the way I'm doing it?
And then what happens when I try thisalternative?
And, you know, could some of that benefit beattributed to not ripping your Juul all day
and, you know, taking 20 milligrams fewer ofAdderall that day?
(30:53):
You know, probably.
I'll acknowledge that.
But, you know, the point is by implementingthis product, he was able to make better habits
on that second day and be just as productiveand ultimately feel better.
You know, because one thing that we get caughtin is this, like, cycle.
(31:14):
So perfect example is, like, you wake up,you're super tired, you know, you slam your
coffee, you go to work, you're working, you hitthat 3 o'clock wall, you crush an energy drink,
you work till 5, but the half-life of thatcaffeine is operating on you till, like, 9 p.m.
So you have a shitty night's rest or let's backit up a little bit.
(31:35):
You're not feeling tired, right?
So now you crush two nightcap whiskeys, so youcan get to sleep.
You wake up the next day, you're, like, kindahungover.
You didn't sleep very well, so you drink morecoffee to get you through the next day.
And do you see how we create these feedbackloops that spiral to the bottom?
You know?
And, like, before you know it, you feel likeshit.
(31:56):
You're always tired.
You're not sleeping.
You know?
And this is just your existence, and you'reconstantly playing internal chemistry, you
know, with the internal chemistry strat to getyou back to just feeling like normal.
So I think what this does by implementing it isit helps you break those kinds of destructive
cycles so that you can let your body kinda getback to that place of normal.
(32:19):
And I also believe that you gotta do this inconjunction with a whole lifestyle of holistic
stuff.
Like, you should, you know, go outside for alittle bit, do some exercise, walk around, eat
good foods, you know, spend time with yourfamily.
All of these things are part of a holisticlifestyle.
And if you were implementing all of thesethings, I guarantee your life would feel
(32:44):
better.
You would be, you know, more productive as thebest version of you.
It's kinda how I like to frame it as you'retrying to be the best version of you.
Yeah.
That's the key.
And that's at the end of the day, what we'retrying to do is empower people with knowledge
and these things.
Because I think a lot of people go through thatcycle of, you know, stimulants, non-stimulants.
I mean, a lot of different things.
(33:05):
And, you know, knowing that there's thesemodalities in different outlets that some get
highlighted more than others and, you know,don't require a prescription or, you know,
don't have the habitual nature to them thatmight actually help you kill or kick some
habits.
(33:26):
That's the shame of it all.
Right?
That it takes, I don't know, destigmatizingthese things.
You know, it's crazy.
Well, that's I was just gonna say, you you saidit earlier.
We kinda talked about this briefly in thepreshow, but, like, it's the destigmatizing and
the normalizing and the educating, that I seemy you know, yes.
(33:46):
I'm selling a product, but the reason I'm onyour podcast is because I'm trying to sell
coffee.
It's because I want to my mission is to be anadvocate and to help educate people, and
especially people in the veteran community ormaybe anyone that is living, like, a
high-stress life but isn't culturally inundatedwith some of these, you know, hippie-dippie
(34:12):
modalities.
I live in Southern California, dude.
Like, there I could throw a cat and hit fouryoga studios.
Yep.
You know?
But I'd be okay with that personally, but
I'll probably get some hate mail, but I'm justnot
a cat guy.
Not a cat guy.
Not a cat guy.
Yeah.
Chris has four of
them, but, you know, I still love them.
(34:33):
It's a increase
in music too.
No.
I'm
gonna be totally.
I'm gonna.
Chris has, like,
a he
Chris has, like, a 120-pound lab sitting infront of him.
He's a big boy.
So I'm screwed with him.
That's awesome.
Everybody.
(34:55):
But people in, like, the military and lawenforcement and even just people you know, I
don't like to break everything down into, like,political, you know, divides, but, like, you
could say that people traditionally more rightof center, more conservative leaning, may have
more of an aversion to things like mushrooms.
(35:17):
Oh, is that a drug?
You know?
Or like, I don't know.
I don't trust any of that hippie dippy woo woostuff.
You know?
Anyone with that mindset.
Let's step away from politics.
Does anyone with that mindset want to be outthere and be like, Hey, you know, I'm an
athlete.
I'm a veteran.
I'm an aggressive, you know, person.
I'm an entrepreneur.
(35:37):
Like, you know, I'm a hard charger.
But I have found that by implementing some ofthese, like, softer, more, like, balanced
approaches into my life, it has made everythingbetter.
You know?
And when I'm out there just lifting every day,like, I'm just gonna go lift weights, you know?
It's like it's too much you know, if you needyin and yang, it's too much yang.
(36:01):
You need to implement some yin.
And so I want I'm here to advocate for the yinside of things to these communities that are a
little more the Yang Gang, you know.
For sure.
That's the irony Chris and I, you know, areconscious on
I can see it.
Too.
You know, we're not the leftist guys normallyeither.
(36:22):
Rather furthest thing from it.
Right.
Definitely more independent than anything, butI think Yeah.
But definitely hard-charging, entrepreneurial,and definitely, I think this is where the
politics got to get out of the way of thepractical, like reality of evolution.
(36:42):
And like, we live really with some dated shit.
And it's like the fact that we have soldierscoming back from serving our country and having
to fight to get to, you know, potentially the,you know, like the mushrooms or even the MDMA
stuff, like all the stuff that's being provento, like, be some of the, it's it's just
(37:05):
nonsense.
And because of lifelong, you know, the war ondrugs and all that stuff.
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
And that's where I think what's so awesomeabout, like, the kind of overlap between
veteran mental health and psychedelic researchis it is truly a bipartisan issue.
(37:29):
You know, left, right, center, up, down, black,white, doesn't matter.
Yeah.
Everyone is in agreement that, hey.
If this is helping the veterans, like, weshould, like, at least study it.
Right?
You know?
It doesn't mean we need to go just put it forsale on every street corner, but, like, let's
why aren't we doing more to understand howthese things could help veterans and then by
(37:56):
extension, the rest of the rest of us.
You know?
But, I think the veteran component has been avery crucial piece to getting past that war on
drugs mindset.
Nailed it.
Oh, where can I keep up with you, man?
Everything you're doing, your call, see allthat stuff.
Yeah.
So, if you guys wanna give me a follow, it's onat windandseacoffee.
(38:20):
And there it's windandseacoffee.
There's no "d" in the "and." Alsowindandseacoffee.com, that's where you order
everything.
We also do monthly subscriptions.
You get everything 30% off if you want itcoming to your house regularly.
You can mix and match super easy.
Also, I started a podcast, like, two to threemonths ago ish.
(38:45):
It's called, the Mind Body Mushroom.
And, yeah, it's pretty, like, in its earlystages, you know, but I'm just sort of I don't
wanna have, like, analysis paralysis where I'mlike, oh, I don't wanna release this?
It's not perfect.
I don't have a good intro.
I don't have, you know what I mean?
So I'm just like, screw it, dude.
Let's just record it, publish it, and just getin the habit of doing this week in, week out.
(39:10):
And before you know it, you know, then a year,two years, three years, all of a sudden you're,
like, you've built something that is worth it.
But the mission there is just doing exactlywhat we did here.
You know, talking about people's stories, howholistic health has transformed their life,
and, you know, trying to find tips that otherpeople can take away.
(39:35):
See if there's anywhere else.
I got a YouTube channel, just windandseacoffeeon YouTube, and that's pretty much it.
You know, I love if you guys find me onanything, you have any questions, shoot me a
DM.
I'm very approachable, and I think a hugecomponent of this is trying to build community.
So that's what I want.
It's not weird if you guys reached out to me,please do.
(39:57):
I think it's awesome.
And I love the way that social media andpodcasting and all this stuff has been able to
connect each other and really move thisindustry and this movement forward.
Totally agree.
Any final words, Chris?
I'm stoked to try the coffee and justappreciate you coming on, Jordan.
We covered a lot of different topics, and Ithink a lot of important things.
(40:21):
So I'm stoked about what you're doing, and
I
encourage everyone to check it out.
Win and See coffee.
Yeah.
Thank you, Jordan.
Appreciate you coming on.
Hey, guys.
You can find us at vibescience.com.
You'll find all the links, the insights, andthe sparks from today's episode with Jordan.
We'll have links to his coffee, his socialmedia, and YouTube channel, all at
(40:41):
vibescience.com, and we appreciate you forlistening.
We're always trying to take you to your highestvibe.
We'll see you next time on Vibe Science.
The content discussed on this show is providedfor reference and educational purposes.
The content is not an attempt to practicemedicine or provide specific medical advice.
Always consult your personal physician formedical advice and proper diagnosis.
Thanks for listening.
(41:02):
This is Vibe Science.
To learn more or watch full episodes, visitvibesciencepodcast.com.
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
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