Ep. 16 | Big Pharma, Big Lies, Big Questions | Natty Linquist - Mind Body Mushroom

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Couple.
I have like I think we've run out on from theepisodes.
We're on Season 2 probably.
Season 2?
Yeah.
That was sick.
Apparently, that's a good way to do it is to doit like in seasons.
And so Season 1, I got like 10 episodes.
And that stays with like a similar theme?
That's kind of like ideally, you know, reallywhat I think it's for is just for like, it's

(00:23):
something Google.
Like Google or however it like.
The algorithm.
Yeah, like the other indices however indexesyour shit is better than if you have like a
trailer like every season you have a trailerand then you do seasons.
And stuff.
Like that.
That's what I'm sorry dude, but I don't youknow who really knows.
Just been trying to so today, we're what's up,everyone?

(00:45):
Welcome to Mind Body Mushroom.
Today is kind of a casual episode.
I'm with my boy Nice to go.
Natty Lindquist.
Good to see you, sir.
Round 2.
You remember him from Season 1.
We talked about we're over at the park.
We talked about, all sorts of We've got a lot.
Of things here.
We kinda hit a bunch of topics.
Pharmaceuticals, politics.

(01:05):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's right.
And so today, we kinda took a look at someheadlines that are floating around in the news
and we're just gonna kinda reflect on them.
And some of these headlines, you know, kindatouch on the stuff that we talked about last
time.
So I figured who better to have on?
Let's go.
I'm excited.
Let's do it.
So oh, also today, I'm on using my old phone.

(01:29):
Something's going on my battery.
It's like progressively dying so we are playingbeat the clock.
We're probably about 40%.
So talk fast?
Yeah.
We're talk fast.
So, anyway, that's where we're at.
So, how's that pouch?
Oh, fuck.
I took it out because I was no.
No.
I still I wanna hear.
I was I just took it out because I was drinkingthat
fucking thing.
Yeah.
We're doing nootropics, dog.

(01:50):
Nootropics.
Yeah.
Give them a
Oh, dude.
Let's go.
Fully Loaded Alpha.
Nootropics.
All it is is no nicotine.
It's just alpha GPC, tyrosine, and GABA.
So just neurotransmitters.
The good stuff.
Yeah.
Mango flavor, tastes nice.
And today's show is also brought to you by Windand Sea Coffee, the world's best whole bean

(02:11):
adaptogenic infused coffee and coffee products.
Check us out in the link below.
Anyway, on to today's topics.
We got, alright.
Wellness influencers aligning with politicalmovements.
Wellness influencers on Instagram such asKendra Needham, Carly Schengham and Courtney
Swan have merged their platforms with politicalmovements notably Donald Trump's Make America

(02:36):
Great Again supporters to form the Make AmericaHealthy Again campaign.
Those doctors?
Are they just I
think these are like, just like Instagraminfluencers.
You know, so we talked about
this identification?
Yeah.
And I don't know specifically these people likeit's probably worth looking into.
And this, it's an Atlantic article so it's kindof like talking shit about them.
But we talked about this last time.

(02:58):
I think we talked about this last time.
Yeah.
How there's all of these like in moms and stuffon influencers that on social media that have
kind of built these brands around like, hey, alot of the food that we're giving our kids is
harmful and so, you know, trying to likereeducate people to show how like the food

(03:20):
pyramid, the FDA food pyramid is like bullshit.
Upside down.
Yeah.
And then that's what we talked about last time.
And then these people were, you know, postingstuff and then they would get comments and
commentary and like stitches and stuff fromactual certified dietitians and nutritionists
that would go on there and just berate thesewomen and tell them that they were passing

(03:44):
harmful misinformation and that there's noscience behind what they're saying and stuff
like this.
And so that was what, you know, and anyway thatwas kind of where it's like the experts are
talking about how these armchair experts, youknow, don't really know what they're talking

(04:05):
about and just put the fries in the bag, stayin your lane and let keep
them as your total.
Yeah.
Keep them as your total.
We'll handle the nutrition.
You know?
And then here you go.
Yeah.
You know, RFK and Trump and let them beforeeven they're inaugurated into the
administration.
There's already they're already running shit.
Yeah.
There's already, like, bans on red number 3,like, food dye.

(04:30):
What are the yellow ones too?
Yeah.
I'm sure.
I think yellow number 5 is one of the worstones.
Dude, that's
a crazy I mean, that's a that's a packedconversation right there.
Because Yeah.
I don't know.
I was do you listen to Modern Wisdom, ChrisWilliamson?
No.
No.
So he's a podcast fan.
He had this lady on.
I can't remember her name.
And she's not she's what we would call one ofthese influencers.

(04:51):
Mhmm.
But she's done a lot of research, and she hasher own platform called Foodbabe.
And she was getting
Oh, I've heard of the Foodbabe.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's huge.
It's like Yeah.
Multimillionaire, huge platform.
But she was talking about how she was justputting out the stuff you just said.
The stuff that, like, RFK standing for ofeating single-ingredient foods, getting away

(05:13):
from ultra-processed foods, like pretty commonstuff that you would consider to be healthy
advice.
Yeah.
Right.
Like, not controversial.
Yeah.
Exactly.
You would think.
Right?
Like, Whole Foods isn't like a controversialbusiness because they're selling you healthier
food.
Yeah.
But all of a sudden, it's like a totalcontroversy.
30 years.
Yeah.
And she was getting, like, death threats fromthese Harvard Ivy League doctors, like, real

(05:38):
clinicians, dietitians telling her what she'ssaying is completely wrong, and the science
backs up what they were saying.
Mhmm.
And so there's this whole, like, I would say,like, an epidemic of which I find the
influencers to be helpful, where they'reputting out sometimes less educated advice, but
they're putting out, for the most part, goodsound advice just a little bit more simplified.

(06:01):
Mhmm.
And then you have a lot of these doctors whowork for big pharmaceutical companies or work
for the government, and they're pushing acompletely different agenda.
So it's like, okay.
Do we believe the government and bigpharmaceutical companies, which we don't really
have a whole lot of reason to believe anymoresince after the whole COVID epidemic?
And there's a pharmaceutical company.

(06:22):
I believe it was Pfizer or a subsidiary ofPfizer who they put out a drug.
It was one family.
I have to find out what the family is who ownedthis part of Pfizer.
And they put out this drug, and there'sliterally memos that show of the higher-ups,
the execs going back and forth saying, like, weknow that this is going to kill a lot of
people, but but it's gonna be highlyprofitable.
Mhmm.

(06:43):
And they made, like, $15 billion off of this.
And then they got fined for all the people whodied, all the lawsuits, $5
Yeah.
So they it's cheaper to pay for the fines of
They made $10
dollars.
I
don't know the exact numbers, but billions ofdollars off of this and it's just crazy.
So crazy.
You know, my theory in and it's it's a littlebit of a theory I suppose, but it's it's

(07:05):
there's some truth there is that these bigchemical manufacturers, the big pharma, and big
food are kind of these like giant conglomerateyou know public private kind of you know like
you got the monopoly.

(07:26):
Pharmaceuticals, one telling the government.
And they're all they're all working together.
So so for example, it's like, you know, if thebig food goes to their buddies in big chemical
and says, hey.
Do you have any chemicals that, you know, wecan use to make our food cheaper but more
desirable, you know, more addictive, morepalatable, you know, get that more umami,

(07:50):
sweeter, whatever, but, you know, just likevery very cost and like, we got you, fam.
Don't worry.
And so now, they're buying chemicals from themthat are increasing their profits.
So now, they're kind of like helping each otherand then like, oh, well, yeah, all these
weird-ass chemicals that you're putting in thefood are making people sick, but no worries.
We got you.
Big Pharma over here.

(08:10):
They're there to supply you the medications,the GLP-1s and all those other things that
you're going to now be taking because you havediabetes from the artificial sweeteners and all
this other stuff that you're
you're overweight.
And you're overweight.
And then they're all kind of operating togetherand then bring in Big Health Insurance involved
in there and we're not—we're denied, defend,and delay.

(08:34):
You know that's the whole thing with this whichis kind of our next story we can go into, and
then where do you think these pharmaceuticalcompanies and the chemical companies are
getting a lot of their ingredients to pursuetheir stuff from Big Oil.
Uh-huh.
Right?
It's all petroleum-based stuff.
So you see, like, the five most like
And you have the government regulating all ofthis.

(08:55):
Yeah.
Or allowing it.
And it's all a revolving door because it's likeexecutives at these big companies—Pfizer,
Kroger, Moderna, DuPont.
All that stuff.
Yeah.
They all become the EPA chief, the FDA chief,the NIH head, you know, all of these.

(09:16):
So it's all just like one big, you know, scamand we're the suckers, you know.
Dude, and you'll see a lot of these people whowork for, like, the FDA, yeah, or work for the
USDA, they'll retire and they'll get a jobstraight into pharmaceutical
companies.
Right.
Right.
It's like a revolving door.
It's a revolving door, dude.

(09:36):
That's what it is, and so it's like, you know,and if it's not them themselves, which I've
seen this picture, it shows like FDA and thenlike the company that the FDA is supposed to be
regulating and same person.
But even in the times where it's not the exactsame person, it's their buddy.
It's their, you know, it's a colleague.

(09:57):
It's somebody that, like, all these people knoweach other because they've all been working up
through the industry together and workingthrough the same organizations.
So, yeah.
It's very incestuous, and there's moreincentive to sort of like self-deal than there
is to like really, yeah, you know, do your job.
A hundred percent.
And that brings us back to the originalquestion, which is I think why we see so many

(10:21):
of these influencers, people who are, like,looking into this for themselves,
and
being, like, okay.
Starting to see what the truth is about food,about how our body naturally heals, how we
don't need all of these chemicals andmedications, which, don't get me wrong, there's
a place for that.
Right.
Right.
Totally.
Dismissing all that western medication isawesome.
For sure.
And I'm not, like, I'm not a dietitian.

(10:42):
I'm not a doctor.
Mhmm.
I'm a trainer, so this is stuff I'm passionateabout, but I haven't done the studies to, I
guess, have that accredited reputation.
But, dude, all I would say is, like, look intoit for yourself.
Yeah.
And educate yourself because it's not just whatyou think it is.
And I think people are reaching this inflectionpoint right now where the mistrust in the
government and, like, media and doctors

(11:04):
Mhmm.
is at an all-time low after the COVID epidemic,after the obesity epidemic that's reached an
insane high.
Mhmm.
And, yeah, it's just the government's offeringa lot of quick fixes.
Like, yeah, GLP-1s are quick fixes.
And they work.
Right.
Well, and like there's a, you know, there whatwas I just about to say about, give me a

(11:28):
second.
Oh, God.
The government benefits from I'm, like, totallyjust keep going to the next point.
I like I like I like I had it for a second andI lost it but it's no big deal.
I think it's like I think it's kind of coolthat RFK is using a lot of these people to put

(11:48):
out just simple advice like getting rid of theguys.
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
Well, what I was gonna say is when you'retalking about athletes like, you know, like
you're you being an athlete, you know, look atany elite athlete, you know, most of them
aren't certified dietitians and nutritionistsand every single one of them will tell you that
it starts with the food that you eat.
You know what I mean?

(12:08):
Every single one of them is trying to eatclean, eat whole foods, eat healthy because
they see a direct one-to-one correlationbetween their output and how and their success
in that regard and the food that they theirinput.
And you know what I mean?
So, you don't have to be like there there isthis sort of like you have to be an expert.
You have to go to our schools.
You have to go which
is what they want you to believe.

(12:28):
Yeah.
So you listen
to them.
You know?
But, this is do you know who Sam Harris is?
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
I like Sam Harris, and he's a good balance tothe other.
He's an interesting guy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He's a guy.
Like, again I agree with a lot of what he says.
I disagree with some things, but he's veryanti-RFK and this is an area
He is.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Where, in some ways obviously I disagree withhim, but he makes a good point and it's this.

(12:50):
Is although we are kind of in this phase rightnow where we're pushing back on expertise and
being like faith institutions is at an all-timelow, people saying do your own research, that
type of stuff.
And what he says to that is when someone saysdo your own research, what they're kind of

(13:10):
saying is don't trust these experts, but youhave eventually, you end up finding a new proxy
for expertise.
So, is it now confirmation bias?
Yeah.
Yes.
Absolutely.
That's absolutely 100% related to and it's kindof but what they're saying in the sense is that
like, okay.
So, you know, Fauci, fuck that guy.
You know, don't trust the experts.

(13:31):
You know, but RFK, trust RFK or trust thisdietitian or not dietitian, but like this food
influencer, like the Food Babe on Instagram.
So his argument would be that like it's it'snot possible to get away from expertise unless
you're going to go you know, run all thesestudies yourself in which case that's like
saying, you know, I don't know.
The earth sure looks flat.

(13:52):
Like, you know, you can't just trust your ownthing.
So you do have to defer on some level tosomebody else who alleges they know more than
you.
Right?
And so, he's very much an institutionalist andso he's arguing that, you know, trusting RFK or
trusting the Food Babe is still trustingexperts, just experts who actually haven't been

(14:13):
properly like vetted and haven't gone throughthe rigorous support.
I see.
What he's saying.
I mean, honestly, that's a good point.
It's a good point.
I always like to look at, like, whenever I lookat government officials or doctors or Fauci,
for example, RFK's.
Like, I just look at the fruit that they've putout.
Right.
What their action is actually done and well,and follow the money, dude.

(14:34):
And follow the money.
Exactly.
That's the other part of it too.
Is that like I think what Sam Harris likedoesn't take into account when he says that
because what he's saying it's it's valid.
It's actually it truly is a valid point.
But to Sam Harris, he's saying the goldstandard is a study that has come comes out of
Harvard.
So some person on social media, while theymight be right, they are not qualified to like

(14:58):
make these claims and whereas this person fromHarvard might be.
But what I would argue is that anyone, youknow, you're working for the NIH, you're
working for the FDA, you're working for any ofthese things.
Those people are being indoctrinated byincentive structures that they are blind to.
They don't know
It's human instinct.
Yeah.
Exactly.
This you're getting praise.

(15:18):
You're in your own echo chamber
where you're
not hearing right.
And then it just becomes an us versus themmentality.
And you're being told that you are right.
That's why you're here.
You're in this madrasa of health which is, youknow, these universities, all these other,
like, peasants out there, you know, they mighta broken clock's right twice a day, but, like,
we are giving you the the truth, you know, andyou see it even with, like, veterinary

(15:43):
services.
Like, look at the food that vets will trygiving your dog when you're trying to like
ascertain like a food allergy or something likethat.
You're trying to get the, you know, it's thisvery Western medical laboratory-based approach
and to the vet, they all kind of operate thesame way.

(16:04):
So you're like, well, maybe that's because thatis the pinnacle of truth.
It's like maybe or maybe it's because whoeveris certifying and then ultimately training all
of these vets through their accredited schoolsand whatever, you know, there's an incentive
structure there and there's, like, a reasonthat all of them are spinning out the same
shit.
Dude, you're 100% right.

(16:25):
Follow the money every time.
Follow the money, dude.
Follow the money.
For the case of, like, going off what you said,Anthony Fauci.
Yeah.
Dude, have you read the book, "The Real AnthonyFauci"?
I've not, but I've heard.
Oh, okay.
Yeah.
I've heard, like, excerpts and stuff from itand, like, but I've not read it myself.
I haven't read the whole thing.
Yeah.
I was
listening to it on audiobook.
Yeah.
Some of the claims that RFK makes about Fauci.

(16:47):
Uh-huh.
You're like, bro, if this isn't right.
Right.
He'll be
getting sued.
Yeah.
Then why aren't you suing him?
Why aren't
you suing him?
He
hasn't gotten any lawsuits.
Right.
And the stuff he's done with the polioepidemic, like, just murking, basically,
thousands of kids in Africa for this testing.
And, yeah, during the COVID epidemic, he'slike, if you don't listen to Anthony Fauci,
you're not listening to the science.

(17:07):
Yeah.
He's like, you become the science.
Right.
That's the claim you're starting to make, like,because we are accredited by, uh-huh, by these
corporations and universities, automatically,it gives you a reputation that you're supposed
to uphold, and people just aren't buying thatanymore.
Yeah.
It sounds a lot like religion.
Right?
Like, the Catholic Church.
Yeah.
You know, that was the whole deal and that waslike the Protestant Reformation was the whole

(17:30):
that was like the whole deal was thatCatholicism was about like you need the church
is the intermediary between you and God.
Yeah.
You know, that's we go in you, you know, doyour confessionals and do all this stuff and
that, you know, and then the Protestants werelike, you actually don't need an intermediary.
You can have a direct relationship with God.
And that kind of like cut out the church andthat's why there was, you know, this huge Yeah.

(17:52):
Catholic Protestant, you know, likeReformation.
Reformation.
There'd be boring and shit that you know soit's kind of similar deal.
It was Martin Luther.
Yeah.
Martin Luther.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Exactly.
And that but that was you know it's a similardeal with this is that like, you know the you
know the Fauci's, the the experts, the doctorsyou know they become the chosen prophets.

(18:14):
Yeah.
That they chose.
Yeah.
No one else chose them.
Exactly.
And they're like, you know, we, you know, thinkabout, like, have you ever read, like, a
medical study or, like, a legal brief oranything like that?
Like, you know, college.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You know, so but you're like, dude, thelanguage is so esoteric and, like, just
convoluted for seemingly no reason.

(18:35):
You're like, you don't part.
Yeah.
They do it on purpose, dude.
They do it on purpose.
I remember I was a psychology minor.
My freshman year ended up switching to computerscience at some point, but we would do one of
our, like, first assignments was going througha psychology, like, you know, study and just,
like, kind of translating it, you know, and be,like, alright.
What does this mean?
And then you kind of write it in, like, normallanguage.

(18:57):
And so it's like what's funny is that youactually can do that.
You can read the whole thing and turn it into,so why not just write it in the normal
language?
Because they don't want your fucking They
don't want you
to know.
Unwashed ass to know about it.
They don't want you to learn it.
They want it to be, you know, same thing with,like, legal stuff.
Read a contract.
Good Lord.
You think there's a simpler way of puttingthat?

(19:18):
But they want you to use an attorney.
Yeah.
You know, paid thousands of dollars for you to
do that.
And then, if you're an attorney, you're like,yeah.
Well, I just spent three fucking years goingthrough this whole thing, like, you know, and I
know how to read it in this language.
So I'm cool if they're keeping it like that.
Yeah.
You know, I don't wanna work myself out of ajob.
A hundred
I think, like, I mean, Sam, like to go back toSam Harris, being the institutionalist he is,

(19:40):
like, I get that because this is how ourAmerican structure has worked for the last,
whatever, 300 years.
Right.
But we've realized that since, like, the 1960sthat a lot of shit has been going down and
we're being lied to about a lot of stuff.
Like, that's just open in the open.
Yeah.
Like, documents have been released.
Whistleblowers have come forth.
Right.
But I guess what I'm saying by do your ownresearch is, like, the cool thing about living

(20:04):
in America is information's public
for the
most part.
So you can get all the data you wanna see fromthe NIH.
Like, maybe you don't even trust theseinstitutions, but the data is still there and,
like
Right.
Oh, that's a really good point.
Hopefully, there's a really good point.
And balances to be able to actually have gooddata.
Uh-huh.
But even just looking at, like, okay,ultra-processed food or high fructose corn

(20:24):
syrup, like, the effect that that has, you canlook at the obesity epidemic in America.
You can look at the inflection point in, like,I think it was, like, 1978 and see, okay, this
is when ultra-processed foods and high fructosecorn syrup were implemented into Yeah.
USDA.
Right.
It's like, okay.
You can you can make an educated reasonableguess as to why that is.

(20:45):
Right.
And you don't have to be an expert to do that.
You just have to be able to interpret data.
Well, yeah.
And like we're sitting here operating like allinstitutions are just, you know, mean the best
and these earnest—I mean, I just saw somethingthe other day talking about how, I don't know
the year that they did this, but Coke spentlike a shitload of money lobbying the

(21:05):
government so that they would allow Cokeproducts to be purchased with food stamps.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
That was like a whole thing because, you know,there's a lot of stuff that you kind of can't
buy with food stamps nowadays, with the otherstuff.
But yeah, that was the thing.
They're like, We want.
Yeah.
Exactly.
And so, they had to go and be like, Well, no.

(21:26):
Because they were like, No.
It's not for fucking Coke.
It's for cheese and shit.
They're like, Well, what if?
And so, they went and spent more money.
So it's like quit pretending that this is likeit's just like these companies just want poor
people to eat.
Like, you know, they're trying to—they'relooking for any way that they can find a new
channel, a new avenue, a new 1% you know,revenue

(21:47):
boost.
Their responsibility is to their shareholders.
Yeah.
Exactly.
You know?
Exactly.
You've only, like, in a way, you can't blamethem because that's just the way the business
model is.
You have to—it's like legal.
That's so
you legally you're supposed to be raising share
on.
Right.
100%.
There was also I don't know if it was Coke.
It was one of these companies.
Again, same thing, lobbying.
Scientists paid them out.

(22:07):
This is all open now too.
It was basically Big Sugar paid out thesescientists to say that the problem with obesity
wasn't sugar.
It was saturated fat.
And that's when the whole war on saturated fat,like on butter, cheese, red meat, all that came
out.
Like, this stuff is bad for you.
Yeah.
Sugar is not the problem.
Right.

(22:27):
Drink skim
milk.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Drink this so you don't
get fat?
Lactose free soy milk.
Right.
And you'll be good.
Right.
This is real health.
Right.
Yeah, dude.
It's wild.
It's just it's a cool time to be alivehonestly.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And that's that's kinda that's that's part ofit too is that like now nowadays and right now,
just like we're we're sort of gettingoverloaded but with information.

(22:48):
It's really hard for the average person to kindof like parse like what's true, what's not
true, you know, etc.
But at the very least, like we are we haveaccess to the information like there the truth
is out there somewhere.
You just have to figure out how to discernbetween the bullshit and and to get to the
truth.
But, you know, 50 years ago, the the truthwasn't out there.

(23:11):
Mhmm.
The truth was, you know, that we had like Stopagain.
A little nipple that we could, you know, comeand get our information from and that nipple
was it was freaking,
what's cable news.
Yeah.
Whatever the cable news.
I'm doing it was like it's like, you know,channels 3, 5, and 7 type news.
You know?
And so now it's like, yeah, you don't have toget it from the standard fare.

(23:35):
As podcasters like Right.
Right.
Exactly.
So, another story that was kind of interestingthat I'll be done talking about is the
assassination of
Oh, yeah.
UnitedHealth CEO.
That was pretty crazy.
I was gonna ask you
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Of course.
Because you're
you're an entrepreneur.
You have a lot of businesses going on, like,you got a lot going on.

(23:56):
And with all this kind of this information thatyou're talking about, like, we're that we're
just being fed constantly.
Like, we're being right.
Almost like, our attention is for sale at
this point.
It's probably the most, the finite resource.
Yeah.
Right.
And it used to be like, it used to be land,right?
Mhmm.
Now we've used up all the land.
Yeah.
So now they're diving into our attention and,like, how do you, I'm actually really curious.

(24:17):
Like, how do you basically silence yourselfand, like, keep yourself calm and keep your
your soul at peace with all of this stuff goingon.
Yeah.
You do.
So I kind of view it as if I just like, I mean,I'm a normal person, so I have a million
different, you know, interests and whatever,but I would kind of like bucket it into two

(24:41):
kind of like main categories of like stuff Ispend a lot of time doing.
And on one hand, it's like very mundane, youknow, work type stuff, you know, how do I grow
my business, how do I get more customers, howdo I do more events, how do I, you know,
streamline processes, whatever.
Just do stuff that's very like—and within thatis also, you know, who am I voting for, what

(25:07):
type of, you know, what regular news headlineam I reading, whatever.
And then on the other hand, like when I needlike a kind of like a break from the real
world, I am very intrigued by likeparapolitics, conspiracy topics, paranormal

(25:28):
stuff like, you know, just like the weird shit.
And a lot of it, you know, I've been interestedin that stuff since I was like a kid, but I did
psychedelics for the first time.
I was probably like 16.
Okay.
Shrooms?
Yeah.
Shrooms.
Okay.
And that was maybe like the beginning of it.
You know, then a little bit smoking weed andjust having like high conversations where
you're like exploring like those types oftopics.

(25:50):
Those are the fun ones.
But then, I got really into it.
I mean, I've read Tibetan Book of the Dead.
I read so many books.
In the past like three or four months, I'veread three books on, or two and a half books on
the Anunnaki, like the Sumerian—yeah, Sumeriangods.
Oh, wow.
So I'm sure you know all about like GrahamHancock.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
For sure.
The third book that I'm halfway—or I'm not evenhalfway through it—but it's the third book that

(26:12):
I'm reading.
It's it's a Zecharia Sitchin's book because Icall it 12th Planet.
Okay.
But, anyway, like that type of stuff is sort oflike my, yeah.
It's like, you know, just another, like,interest.
And so I'll kind of, when I need a break from,like, the mundane real world, I'll kind of,
like, dive into these more kind of, like,mind-expanding, yeah, like topics.

(26:35):
That's super fascinating.
It's super fascinating, and it's cool, andlike, but and there's also people, though, you
know, they get really into that, and thenthey're like, you know, they get blackpilled
where you're like, oh my God.
It's all bullshit.
Well, you know, like, everything is controlled.
Everything's enough.
Everything's a conspiracy.
Everything's a conspiracy.
And so the gaming.
Like, it kinda is on some level due to real,like, the more you're, like, really and

(26:58):
seriously, like, really do research stuffyou're like, oh my God, dude, like, so much it
really is connected whenever.
But for me, the way that I kind of keep from,you know, getting too discouraged and, like,
having it is is my first bucket.
I gotta pay the bills, dude.
I gotta build my company.
I'm doing really cool things, like I'm helpingpeople.

(27:19):
I'm, I'm, I'm making products that, you know,and, and it's like I focus on what's happening
kind of right in front of me and then what'shappening kind of wherever.
The stuff that kind of sits in the middle thatis is probably the toughest for me because it
doesn't there's not really an escape from it.
It feels like it's some of the, like, sometimesforeign policy, stuff like that.

(27:43):
Like, for example, I don't know if you know of,like, the drones that have been going all over.
Yeah.
So I've been following that, like, superclosely too.
What do you think that is?
So I think there's there's two things going onand there are drones, like actual drones, and
then there are orbs.
They're like these UAP kind of like lights inthe sky.

(28:03):
We don't really know and people are seeing bothand it kind of is getting conflated because you
know there's like people are referring to thedrones as like UFOs and then yeah.
And then people are also on the flip side,they're just they're kind of putting it all as
just drones as in like there's a mundaneexplanation it's drones.
What is the gut?
Like has the government released anything onthis?

(28:23):
Because it doesn't seem like they've said awhole lot.
So, not really but that kind of has tippedtheir hand a little bit as to what is going on
because there there's a lot of them and they'reonly flying at night.
Yeah.
Primarily.
This
is like New Jersey.
Right?
And in New Jersey, there there's a lot of spotsthey're seeing in like Pennsylvania.
They're seeing them kind of in a lot of spotsnow but, yes, primarily in New Jersey.

(28:47):
And so you're thinking, okay.
There's only three countries on Earth thatcould produce drone technology that like this
sophisticated.
It's like China, Russia and the US.
Well, if it's China or Russia, we would haveshot them down.
So that leaves one option basically.
It's the US.
And it kind of explains why the government isnot freaking out about them.

(29:10):
You know, they're kinda just like, yeah,there's nothing to worry about.
Like, we got this in control.
Like, we don't know what they are but like it'sall good.
But if they if they didn't like whatever theyif it's new technology whether it's reverse
engineering, some UAP technology or what, don'tyou think they'd be flying them out in like the
ocean away from people?
Right.
Right.
So I don't think they're testing new tech.
I think these drones, like, I saw some stuff.

(29:32):
This guy was like a drone expert.
He had some aviation dude, and he was veryfamiliar with different drone stuff, and he
lent some insights that have since been kind ofconfirmed a little bit.
So he said this type of drone is a superclassified, crazy drone.

(29:55):
Right?
And what it does, and especially why they'reflying them at night, is because they're likely
using thermal imaging because if you do it inthe day, you're getting misreads because the
sun's heating up stuff.
Okay.
If you do it at night when everything is cool,if the thing that you're looking for is hot,
then you can see it much better.
And if you're not using thermal, then there'sliterally no point in flying them at night

(30:15):
because you can't see anything.
So they're probably looking for something withthermal imaging.
They're going around the coastline, and thenwhat kind of came out since then is there's
been a whistleblower leak or some sort ofreport that the U.S.
is looking for some sort of nuclear somethingthat was, this is what they're saying at least,

(30:38):
was in transit on a ship and was supposed tomake port at New Jersey, and then it's not on
the ship.
So they don't know if it fell off or if it gotstolen or what's going on.
So that's kind of why the government is beingso quiet about stuff.
Like they're like, oh, you know, but hey, we'regood.
Everything's fine.
Like don't worry.
Don't freak out.

(30:58):
But but what even like that drone guy and whatis that that is not acknowledging the fact that
there are also orbs.
Like dude, ABC News posted a video that theytook of like zoomed in on one of these orbs and
you see it like it was doing like a There's abunch of that.

(31:19):
Those are not the drones.
Yeah.
That
is not what they're talking about.
There's there's also a video too of, one of thedrones.
You can see it has, like, the blinking lightsand it's flying towards, this orbit.
It's just sort of, like, sitting there.
It's super far up in the sky at night.
It gets, like, right over it and then it justkind of, like, looks like the orb, like, it's
just, like, one light.
And then underneath the orb, you just see thedrone falling out of the sky and just goes

(31:41):
like, if that's a real video and caveat allthat shit, so you have no idea what you're
watching.
But assuming that it's all like real, then it'sshowing that though there are 2 different
things.
They're not like working together and it youknow, this is like a probably a super expensive

(32:02):
super classified advanced tech drone.
You know, they're not flying it to just likecrash and shit.
So why would they do that?
Why would they do that?
You know, so there's something else going onand then when you look at, you know, some of
the UFO, history and lore I guess about it isis been in some of the stuff that's actually
been acknowledged about UFOs is that they'vebeen spotted around nuclear facilities.

(32:29):
They have deactivating it.
Even activating them.
That was another one.
You know, like, they've turned them on and off.
They've done various different things.
And so that kinda, you know, all that kind ofstarts making sense now.
It's like, okay, they're government dronespossibly looking for some sort of material they
think could have been smuggled out of Ukraineor something.

(32:49):
Again, like, where anything involving, like,the origins or the what is the nuclear stuff,
you will never know.
They're not gonna tell you any of that, youknow.
Unless some whistleblower comes out.
Unless a whistleblower.
Right.
And then he dead.
Yeah.
Exactly.
You know?
So and even if they find the thing, they're notgonna be like, hey, guys.
We found the we
found it.
We're good.
They're just gonna be like, no.
No.

(33:10):
It's crazy.
I have no idea.
You know?
Yeah.
But I told you there was nothing to worry aboutthough.
Right?
So, like, we'll probably, like, never know,but, allegedly, there was, like, some Ukraine
had this is, like, many, many years ago.
They had, like, stolen some nuclear materialout of Russia or it could have been vice versa,

(33:31):
but it's one of those things.
Like, it was one of the same for a smallcountry that, like, didn't have nuclear attack,
stole nuclear attack.
And any time that happens, like, you probablyalso don't have the infrastructure to, like,
keep it secure.
Yeah.
So it's very possible that it got stolen againor something like that.
That's wild.
Yeah.
For but pretty fucking wild.
Yeah.

(33:52):
Now the other wild story is that the healthcare CEO.
Oh, yeah.
That's another one I've been—have you beenkinda following on that?
We've been following a little bit.
Yeah.
Mostly through, like, social media and stuff.
But, dude, yeah, I mean, educate me a littlebit on it.
Yeah.
Alright.
Cool.
So basically, this is—this is wild now.
I'll kind of like talk through what it—like themainstream story is or like what?

(34:12):
The conspiracy theories and like the numbersand like the very precise things that have been
happening that you're like, okay, one, he's avaledictorian so he's super smart.
And just like the little bit
of autism possibly.
For sure.
I mean dude, you can't be that smart
and
not have that right?
Right, right.
No.
Yeah.
So, I—I dude, I have no idea because again,there's so—there's like evidence that kind of

(34:35):
pushes me in either direction.
So, main story December 4.
In the morning in Manhattan, CEO ofUnitedHealth Group, like a subsidiary, I was
like the main company because apparentlyUnitedHealth is like the ninth largest company
in the world.
Mhmm.
Like the the big, like, umbrella corp.

(34:55):
Yeah.
The conglomerate is, like, one so it was amassive
You know what it is?
The company that owns it?
Like, the parent company?
No.
I think it's called UnitedHealth.
Oh, it is.
But then they, like, they're—they havesubsidiaries that maybe are also called
UnitedHealth
or something
Like that.
But, anyway, so the guy Brian Thompson who gotshot was a CEO of one of the subsidiary
companies of UnitedHealth.
But, anyway, so, early in the morning inManhattan, Brian Thompson comes out of a hotel

(35:21):
door that he was staying at and he was headingto this conference and like seconds after he
walks out of the door, a dude rolls up with abackpack, jacket, mask, and a gun with a
suppressor, like a handgun with a suppressor,and just like starts, you know, one shot, the
guy kind of like turns around doesn't fight andthen he realizes and the gun probably jams.

(35:43):
I think that's what's going on.
So there's the if you put a suppressor like asilencer on a handgun and you don't also put
this other device that helps.
So how a semi-automatic handgun works is thelike blast, like the the way that the gas comes
out of the the barrel when after you shoot,that helps the whole like thing cycle, so that

(36:11):
the next round comes up.
So the recoil and like the way that the gas theway that gas works, it like helps the gun work.
So when you put this suppressor on there, itkind of messes with the way that the gun cycles
that's why it jammed.
Mhmm.
And so so he jams the guy you know tap rackbang you know clears the jam, shoots again,
does it again.
He seemed very comfortable like he knew thatwas gonna happen and like he was just like,

(36:34):
yeah.
For sure.
You know, you would think I mean, you wouldn'teven have to think if this was the guy, the
alleged shooter, the Luigi Mangione.
This is allegedly the first person he's evermurdered in cold blood.
Yeah.
Seems really
a clean slate.
Seems more
than a clean slate.
Complete dude.
I mean, you're like more than a clean slate.
Yeah.
Super successful internships, all that.

(36:56):
So that's your background.
Okay?
That's who you are.
And you're mad about the health care engineer.
Like, for sure, we're mad about a bunch ofstuff.
There's a bunch of stuff I'd shake my fist at.
You know?
Right?
Right.
So and let's say you get to the point whereyou're gonna do it, dude.
I'm gonna do it.
I'm gonna go.
I'm gonna go.
Do you think you'd be just cool as a cucumberjust like plugging a dude in the back at 3 to 8

(37:18):
range, you know, and just operating a gun whoyou've lived in New York and Pennsylvania, not
a freaking farm.
You know, why do you even know you've beenshooting guns often in your lifetime?
Okay.
Now, then they're saying that this was a3D-printed ghost gun, so you probably, you
know, was a tech guy.
You could figure out how to 3D print something,but still like that's kind of a specific thing

(37:40):
to do.
Yeah.
You know, and then you know how it's gonnaoperate.
You know that it's like how practiced are youat this?
You know, he just seemed very like cool andthen he just like casually walks away, crosses
the street, gets on a bike and rides away.
Right?
Allegedly rolls through Central Park and leavesthe backpack and then disappears, probably gets

(38:04):
on a Greyhound bus.
That's what they think.
Okay.
Then they find the backpack days later filledwith Monopoly money.
I don't know that dude.
It's crazy.
Yeah.
So, and then, you know, on the bullet casings,you know, it allegedly says like, deny, defend,
depose.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
So that's
like auto or whatever?

(38:25):
Yeah.

That's what it's like (38:25):
the deny, delay, defend, you know, it's like the—it's a book about the
health care and stuff.
But again, it's not really clear.
How is this on the bullet casings?
Like you wrote them in Sharpie
or you
engraved them?
Okay.
What?
It takes a whole—They're engraved?
How the heck did you engrave rounds?
You know, that's pretty wild and like, okay.

(38:49):
And then, the monopoly money is so like, thisis super planned.
No.
Then, you disappear for five days and you getcaught in a McDonald's and there's all these
clues online.
Who knows if he's actually left them or if it'sother people like claiming to be him or
whatever the case is.
And then—and what do they find?

(39:10):
So, day of, he gets rid of the backpack.
It's filled up and bobbing with the money.
He changes his coat.
They find some others.
There's
a gun in the backpack?
No.
Oh.
They find the gun on him five days later withthe fake ID that he used to check into the
hostel and his manifesto.

(39:30):
Well, that's pretty convenient.
That's pretty much everything you need to puthim away as the guy.
So
So you think there's someone else?
I don't know because that's what I'm saying.
It's like there's some evidence to indicatelike you're—you're—you were kind of a martyr on
this.
You're like, I will go to jail for this so thatI get my five minutes in court where I can rail

(39:56):
against the—say what you want to say and do mymanifesto and make a public spectacle about it.
Right?
If that's the case, then why are you runningaway for five years?
Yeah.
Right.
Why are you changing your clothes and hiding?
He had, like, $9,000 in cash including foreignmoney.
What do you need foreign money for?
That's like somebody who's gonna run away fromthe country.

(40:18):
So if you're running, which one is it, dude?
Are you running away from the country andtrying to hide your identity or are you trying
to go to court and make a whole platform overyour assassination?
And that was a but you can't do both.
And then his attorney says that there actuallywasn't any evidence to connect him to, you

(40:38):
know, he had the gun?
The thing.
Yes.
Because that's what that's what there's that'swhat the attorney said.
Again, I don't really know how.
There's also there's been a bunch ofmisreporting.
So allegedly, he first, was reported that hehad gotten away on a Citi bike.
You know, like one of those, like, city the c IElectric bikes.
Yeah.
Electric bikes that you can like.

(40:58):
And then it came out that actually thatprobably wasn't the case.
It wasn't a Citi Bike.
It was a different type of bike.
And then there's a picture of there's allthere's like three or four different pictures
of him from security cam.
One at the Starbucks, one in the hostel, one atMcDonald's, all these different places.
And in one of them I don't remember wherespecifically this one was from, but they're

(41:21):
saying this is the shooter.
It's a guy and the coat is different though.
But he's got the hood on.
He's got the mask and somebody put a side byside.
So there's like his mugshot.
This is after he got arrested, the picture thatthey posted and then the picture from five days
prior when he's at the Starbucks and hiseyebrows are not the same.
Really?

(41:41):
In the mugshot, he has almost like a unibrow.
He's got like some big bushy, you know,eyebrows.
Those eyebrows here.
The photo of him from like the Starbucks, hiseyebrows are like this far apart.
You know, and so I showed up to her.
She said, well, maybe he waxed them.
I'm like, yeah.
That would make sense if in his mugshot he hadclean eyebrows.
It has
to be the other way around.
But it
has to be the other way around.

(42:01):
Yeah.
So that doesn't make sense.
So
So no one really knows,
No one really knows, dude.
And then like his family was like, likecommented on the whole thing recently and
they're just like they said something like, welove Luigi and we wish him the best.
You know, like, you wish him the best?
Yeah.
What the hell?
That's a really weird statement.

(42:22):
Figure a kid who's in court.
Figure a kid who's in court.
Not like this is someone like him.
Like, we we this is there's no way.
There must
be a mistake.
Yeah.
This is injust.
Like, you we want to figure they're just like,we wish them the best.
Hey, thoughts and prayers like what a weirdresponse.
And then, his family has so the Mangione familyname, they have like, buildings at

(42:46):
universities, like, one, Loyola MarymountUniversity.
There's, like, a library or something with,like, a Mangione.
Right?
They they also a bunch of, retirement homes,like, they that have the name on there.
Because they own a big, like, health caresubsidiary or, like, a retirement home type

(43:06):
thing.
Wow.
Dude, this is fascinating.
I thought it was a lot more
cut and
dry than right.
What this is.
Because it seemed like from what I saw, like,it showed how planned out that it was for him.
But I don't know about the mug shots, how thosethings aren't lining up.
Right.
Right.
I I read somewhere that before this hadhappened, like, he had his clean slate.
Everything was cool.
And then he was, like, gone for three months.
Right?
Yeah.

(43:26):
And no one knows where he went?
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
Supposedly, he was, like, staying in, well, hegoes to Hawaii in kind of, like, a digital
nomad, like, little co-op type deal where it's,like, a lot of other, like, tech bros, but they
go and they kind of it was like a hostel typedeal and, you know, whatever.
But, yeah, he goes there and then kind ofdisappears.
That was like the last anyone his his momreported him missing about a month prior to the

(43:53):
murder, which is weird in its own right.
Yeah.
Another weird kind of caveat to this wholething or it could be a possible connection,
probably not, but just another weird littledata point is, you know, the second Trump
shooter?
Yeah.
The guy I forgot his name.
What's his name?
But he
or something, Clay?
Yeah.
Greg?

(44:13):
Yeah.
Not the crook.
Not Thomas Matthew Proust.
Not that guy.
Yeah.
That was the guy at the first shooter on theroof.
Oh, yeah.
Okay.
The second
one.
This is the one at the golf course.
Yes.
So that guy, he was, like, a blond dude, like,middle-aged, and had done a bunch of, like,
weird shit lower.
He was, like, going to Ukraine and trying to,like, recruit people to, like, fight for
Ukraine.

(44:33):
Or, like, just going places and trying torecruit people to fight for Ukraine.
It's weird kinda, like,
that same, like, level of weird stuff going on.
The same with Crooks as well.
Like, he was right.
Found around CIA FBI buildings.
Dude.
They, like, alleged the big ticket to hisphone.
Right.
His apartment was professionally scrubbed.
Oh, my God.
That's so weird.
It's wild, dude.
Yeah.
Well, the second guy, apparently, right beforehe attempted to shoot Trump, he was also in

(45:01):
Hawaii.
So it's just this kind of a weird connection.
I don't know exactly the same place.
Like I didn't I don't I that was kind of anoffhand comment.
I hadn't really looked into okay.
Yet, but if it is true and it's it's just kindof weird like a guy with no other real history
of doing something like this, you know, goes toHawaii and then
This other dude, yeah.

(45:22):
Yeah.
He comes and tries shooting the president.
You know, this dude out, you know, no issue.
He goes to Hawaii, comes back, and now all of asudden he's just stoned to
the fucking killer.
You doing.
You know?
So he goes I thought it was chill down there.
Yeah.
What?
So, yeah, that's kinda interesting.
But yeah.
So he disappears for a little bit, and it'sdefinitely not like as cut and dry.

(45:45):
Oh, other weird thing too is like so the hotelthat the guy came out of, first of all, how did
you know that he was gonna where he was gonnabe for this conference and stuff like that?
Like, maybe okay.
Maybe LinkedIn post or something.
Like, you can maybe ascertain it, especially ifyou're good on the Internet, good at sleuthing
around.
Mhmm.
But he knew, supposedly, the building of thathotel, it's like there's multiple entrances.

(46:11):
Like, it's not just like one door that goes outto the street.
He could have gone out through that door.
He could have gone out through anotherdifferent door.
He could have left 10 minutes sooner.
He could have left 10 minutes after, like, whoknows?
Perfect timing.
Perfect timing.
Perfect place.
He just knew exactly where it was gonna be,which could indicate that there was some sort
of inside knowledge.
Like, Luigi Mangione was not an inside.

(46:33):
He would Yeah.
He wouldn't There's no way that Luigi wouldhave known where he would be from external
publicly available sources.
Like, you might be able to tell he's gonna beat this conference and like, okay, maybe.
But like the way that he was it was so preciseand so He had to.
Yeah.
You had to have someone on the inside.
You either have somebody on the inside or it'sit's not even you.
It's like If

(46:53):
your family is that rich, I mean
Yeah.
You can do whatever you want.
Right.
Right.
Especially if you're commenting stuff like,wish you the best.
Yeah.
No.
Like, they turned like, throw them under thethe bus.
Maybe it was like, you know, the family isinvolved in some way.
Hey, dude.
Something like that.
And they're just like, you know, like, it waslike a business interest type deal and they're
like, well, we'll kinda let our kid fall on thesword.

(47:17):
We'll frame our kid in some way.
I'm just making this up entirely, but, like,just as a theory.
Who knows?
You know, let's frame him and then, yeah, we'llobviously pay to get him out or whatever.
We'll do it, but it's a way of them kind of,like, enacting their own sort of internal,
mhmm.
Like, you saw the, what, what company is this?
OpenAI.

(47:37):
So, I don't know his name.
He was like an Indian name, like Sundarsomething, but he was a whistleblower at
OpenAI.
He just came out and whistleblowed and thensaid that there was something about, something
they were doing was illegal or they're lying topeople or something like this.

(48:00):
I don't remember exactly what the claim was.
It's not like a, like, super explosive claim,but, you know, something that to people in the
know, it's like a bad thing that he went on tothat ended up dead 2 days after he
Interesting dude.
That's crazy.
Crazy.
So this is something I mean, think about allthe Boeing people.
Yeah.
Like I would argue even more so than thegovernment, like, the people think of like, oh,

(48:23):
it's like a G-man, you know, some CIA assassinthat comes and gets you.
Like, I think that does happen for sure.
But I think more so in other countries that theU.S.
government is doing it.
When it when shit like that's happening in theU.S., I think more often than it being the
government, it's it's like private industry.
Yeah.
It's these multibillion-dollar companies thatyou know have many many billions on the line

(48:49):
like they you know what I mean?
Like it's it's not just, oh, we can all hangout together.
There's a Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Will come out clean.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Exactly.
You know, it's like they they have the themotive.
They have the means and you know they
They can do whatever they want.
Yeah.
And the government the government has thesemassive bailouts for these companies so the
government doesn't care.
Right.
Right.

(49:09):
percent.
I think a lot of like that the tomfoolery oflike that type of like, you know,
whistleblowers ending up like dead.
It's oftentimes, you know, private industriesthat can hire them in some of that.
Even if they don't kill you, they'll make surethat you never get a job again.
Right.
Right.
If you
knew Jay Bhattacharya?
Did Jay Bhattacharya or something like that?
He's a he's an epidemiologist, like a reallywell-known I think he's at Stan I think he's at

(49:32):
Stanford.
And during the whole COVID epidemic, he was oneof the first doctors to come out and be like,
yo, guys.
This isn't right.
Like, this virus or this vaccine doesn't workthe way we thought it would.
It's an mRNA.
It's not a traditional vaccine.
And he was against the mandate.
As soon as that happened, they startedcanceling him, calling him like a quack,
calling him all sorts of names.

(49:53):
Lost his job, lost his lab, lost his research.
Twitter banned him.
And then just, like, I think, like, a month agoor not, maybe it's a little bit longer,
Twitter—or X—reinstated him.
Everything's back.
And it's, like, everything's coming full circlenow.
It's so fucked up, dude, and especially whenwe, like, when the Twitter Files came out and,
like, it was showing how all these companieshave, like, actual intelligence assets that are

(50:18):
on the payroll there.
Like there's literal, like, FBI agents, CIAagents that work in, like, content moderation.
Yeah.
At Meta or at Twitter.
You know?
Censorship.
Yeah.
A hundred percent.
So it's not it's like it's like they're they'reif the government wants the people to believe a
certain thing, you know, like, the vaccine issafe and effective and blah blah blah, you

(50:39):
know, and that's the party line.
They can put their thumbs on the scale at thesesocial media companies to pressure the
companies to censor this.
Which Zuckerberg came out and said.
Yeah.
Exactly.
He just fucking said that.
Yeah.
You know?
So it's like it's I think it's like maybe I'llto an extent it is this, but I think it is less

(51:02):
that, like, oh, Mark Zuckerberg's woke or, youknow, that the necessarily, like, just your
run-of-the-mill employee there is putting inimposing their own, like
opinions and opinions.
on.
I'm gonna censor that.
No.
I'm not gonna censor that.
I mean, these are directives that come downfrom somewhere, and I think they're coming down

(51:22):
from the only people that have pressure.
Yeah.
On these companies, which is like thegovernment, like the intel agencies.
So, yeah.
They can just get and we've known that since,like, the '60s.
Mhmm.
You know, that, like, Operation Mockingbird.
Mhmm.
I mean, the newspapers, they would have literalintelligence agents on the payroll, and they

(51:42):
could catch and kill stories.
They do whatever they want.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's like it's it's that's really, yeah.
Charles Manson, all that.
Yeah.
Crazy stuff going on.
Right.
Right.
Dude, yeah.
I was just have you seen this?
It's a clip.
It's called I think it's called I CallBullshit.
And it's a convention put on by it's funded bysome government entity, and it's essentially,
like, there's these huge platforms forcensorship on misinformation and

(52:06):
disinformation.
And they're making the case of, like, okay.
And this is what the World Economic Forum isalso working on.
It's like the case of by having all of thesesocial media accounts and, like, influencers
putting out this essentially rebellion.
Right.
On what our agenda is, it's harming theeconomy.

(52:27):
It's harming democracy.
Because now the people who are in charge ofeverything can't effectively put out their
agenda, which is harming the economy becausethey're not being able to put out the bills,
laws that they want to put out.
Right.
So if you're someone who thinks that whateverparty you vote for, like, that's the only way,
these people have our best interests at heart,then you'd follow that.
But these conventions are literally puttingstuff out how we should censor misinformation,

(52:52):
and they use, like, some of Trump's tweets,some of RFK's tweets, stuff that has been
proven to be right.
This was back during they made this back duringthe COVID epidemic.
Wow.
And so a lot of the disinformation was stuffthat's proven now 2 years later to be
completely right.
Right.
And it's like, okay.
If we enact, it's like, who gets to decidewhat's true and what's not true?

(53:13):
Right.
You're putting the power in the hands of thesepeople, these electives, some of them not even
elected.
Totally.
Who get to make all the decisions.
No.
A hundred percent, dude.
And, I mean, it's like literally from 1984,like, the Ministry of Truth.
Yeah.
And, I think what's challenging, I guess, onsome level is I was talking with my dad the

(53:34):
other day about this and I don't remember howit got like misinformation or disinformation
got brought up, but he was talking about likehow, you know he's kind of a boomer.
You know that there's so much shit.
He's like, man, there should just be like a,you know, like a third party that just, you
know, vets everything and just tells you ifit's true or not true.
And I'm like, that's a great concept, but whocontrols that?

(53:57):
And you know, how do we know who's auditingthem?
And, you know, I'm like, have you read 1984?
Like, that thought has been thought.
Yeah.
You know?
And it's actually dystopian, not utopian.
Yeah.
You know?
It's like all the people who say, like, okay.
That communism didn't work, but this form ofcommunism, this is the good of it.
Right.
Right.
We've seen multiple forms of it.

(54:18):
Yeah.
It's never worked.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Exactly.
And so it's like a better you know, what isbetter than there being an arbiter of truth,
even AI, like even AI as arbiter of truth.
I've talked about, there's a really greatpodcast guys up in Del Mar, called the Skeptiko
Okay.
Podcast.
Anyway, his latest kind of iteration of thepod, like, for the past, like, season, you

(54:43):
know, like, year or so, has been him doing alot of, like, AI stuff.
You'll have, like, a podcast with AI as theguest.
You know?
Really?
Yeah.
So then somebody will bring on a third guest,and they'll talk about stuff or Oh, shit.
He'll go over a past interview that he did withAI.
You know, it's really interesting.
That's wild, dude.
Yeah.
And so, he's gotten so like if you go and ifyou went and asked ChatGPT or something like

(55:08):
that, you know, is there life after death?
You know?
Well, there's no evidence to suggest somethingblah blah.
And then he's like, that's interesting.
What about Dr.
Sam Parnia?
What about, you know, Dr.
Jeff Kripal?
What about and he'll just start, you know, andthis and he'll like, here here's the study.
Here so he'll start like feeding it the thingor tell and it'll be like, oh, yes.

(55:28):
Actually, and then he can get it to kind ofchange its opinion, you know, and then he'll be
like, why did you change your opinion?
They're like, I thought your truth andtransparency is your mandate, like, be truthful
with me here and blah blah.
Like, you're right.
I'm so sorry, you know, and so with
the structures that the creators
Yeah.
It's like it's that truth and safety or, like,trust and safety layer that they do to protect

(55:48):
people from disinformation, misinformation.
And so, he brought on a guest one time that hewas kinda like showing this to and the guest
was like, yeah, that's great except for thatdidn't really fix the problem because if you
are coming to AI and you don't already knowabout all these studies.
Yeah.
You can't like fucking leverage it intosubmission, you know, and you just ask it for,

(56:13):
you know, is life after death real or anything?
Is there any evidence?
It's just been tied the first thing.
And then if you've already built ChatGPT to belike the arbiter of truth, now whatever it says
You don't have to research
it yourself.
Yeah.
You don't research it.
Yeah.
And so, Alex Tsakiris, the host of Skeptiko, hesays, like, well, it's not about replacing our

(56:38):
current institutions and arbiters of truth withAI.
That's not what, you know, I'm not trying tosuggest that that is the direction.
Mhmm.
What I'm trying to suggest is that with AI,like, with ChatGPT, these LLMs, you can get to
the truth.
You can get to the truth if you know how tolike press it and ask it and like that might be

(57:00):
the closest that we'll get.
And in in some ways, it's better Yeah.
Because we don't want to just listen to theword system.
To the computer says, you know.
You don't want that.
I wanna challenge.
We wanna You wanna be able
to challenge it.
You wanna be able to do that.
And he's like, right now, the like, withoutthis, it's Google.
Yeah.
Or
Yeah.
Or one of these other, like, that's that's allyou got, dude.

(57:21):
Like, you wanna go find out their own
set of structures and forms that they'redirecting you
to check Google.
Yeah.
Especially Google.
You know, you can get some of these other ones,but, like
Go back, dude.
Follow the money.
Look at what goo how much money Yeah.
You could
put into the election
agency.
Totally.
Totally.
And intelligence agencies.
I mean, all all these fucking tech companiesdo.
Like, how do you think they even existed?
Like, it's a fucking ARPA and DARPA and
Yeah.
You know, you know, the In-Q-Tel and all these,like, CIA SMIRPA.

(57:44):
Yeah.
SMIRPA.
SMMAGMA.
All of these random dudes, I think at the endof the day, it's just, like realizing that
people are inherently flawed.
Like, deep down, we're all
Yeah.
We're all sinful, flawed creatures.
Right.
And I think when you operate under thatassumption of, like, okay, some people don't
have your best interest at heart.
Right.
Not that you
should always go around mistrusting and beingskeptical of everybody because I'm not for

(58:07):
that.
I like to put things, like, in the middle.
If you start at 50, you can go either way.
Right.
But, like, yeah, we're all we're all sinful.
And you see that how yeah, people have theirown interests at heart always.
People are selfish.
We're all greedy.
We're all just trying to scrap to the top toget what we want.
And then there's those few individuals thatyou'll see, like, whether they're leaders or

(58:28):
they're your friends, and you're like, dude,this person, like, they have pure intentions
but it's so rare.
Totally.
Yeah.
Totally.
Yeah.
I think that the skill eventually becomes it'slike, how do we have a realistic view of the
world knowing like this idea that noinstitution would ever do anything in your

(58:49):
that's not in your best interest.
Like some people really think that which isit's
like the
National Institutes of Health, dude.
That's what they care about, health, and you'relike, okay, on some level, yeah.
I'm not saying that they're an evil institutionthat only does bad things and everyone that
works there is bad and hates you, you know, butthere's probably some good that they do, and
there's also, like you said, they're human, andthey're following incentives that may not be in

(59:15):
your favor.
So, like, you have to operate on thatassumption, like a realistic view of what the
world is.
And then now you have to be able to beinformation literate and be able to get
information from all sorts of sources andidentify where the bias is.
Yeah.
Because there is no unbiased thing.
I remember arguing with people, this is evenlike a couple years ago, where I would be like,

(59:39):
well, Fox is like a right-wing news thing.
I'm like, no.
Fox is fair and balanced.
CNN is, you know, left-wing.
I'd be like, well, no.
CNN is like, yeah, maybe a little bit, but it'snot really like that, you know, that.
And now I'm like, CNN is fucking off theirgoddamn rocker sometimes, like, it's very
left-wing.
Fox is very right-wing and they're all

(01:00:01):
owned by the same company.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Exactly.
Exactly.
Exactly.
Like Disney, you know.
Yeah.
But at the end of the day, it's like it doesn'thave PBD has a bias.
Sam Harris, yeah, has a bias.
Joe Rogan has a bias.
Elon Musk has a bias.
Everyone has a bias, and so what you have tofigure out how to do is how to identify what
that person's bias is, and that doesn't meaneverything that they're saying is wrong or

(01:00:25):
should be discounted.
It should just be that there's a bias.
Yeah.
There's a lens.
With a grain of salt.
Yeah.
A hundred percent.
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
For anybody.
Right.
Yeah.
You know, and knowing that you will nevernecessarily get to objective truth with a
capital T, but you can suss out the truth by,you know, okay.
What are people over here kind of saying?

(01:00:46):
What do people care?
What is foreign media?
What does Al Jazeera say about it?
What does the BBC say about this thing?
You know, and then, you can piece together, youknow, something that is approximating what
looks like truth.
What is
going on in that?
Because there is something is Yeah.
The truth.
Something is a
truth and everything.
Right.
Right.
It's just you're not gonna unless, you know,you've experienced it and even then, you know,

(01:01:08):
it's like, you know, if if you are a goodexample, five dudes are there's an elephant in
a dark room and there's like five differentdoors.
Okay?
So this is actually a it was a regularreligious metaphor but you can adapt to a lot
of stuff.
So the original metaphor is an elephant in adark room and you have a rabbi, a

(01:01:28):
priest, a bunch
of other like religious dudes.
And so, one guy is over there and he's feelingthe trunk and he's like, oh, the truth is it's
it's long.
It's like a big rubber hose, you know, and kindof and then he talks to the next guy.
He's like, that's not the truth.
Like, you're crazy.
It's like a big strong tree trunk, you know,and he's feeling the leg of and then the other
guy's feeling the ear.

(01:01:49):
He's like, you're all wrong.
It's this.
You know, and they're all arguing about shit.
And in reality, they're all
They're just seeing it from differentperspectives.
You know?
So we're sitting here arguing whether or notit's a it's a tree trunk or, you know, a tusk.
A tusk or something.
And it's like even if we're looking at theexact same thing, we're going to have our own

(01:02:09):
biases.
Yeah.
To it.
So just being aware that that's how that's howshit goes.
Yeah.
You know.
And then you can be open-minded because you'relike, damn, I guess I didn't think of it from
that perspective.
Just like we're talking about the drone shit.
Yeah.
Is it fucking UFOs?
Is it government drones?
Is it some combination of the two?
You know?
Yeah.
Maybe.
Probably a little bit of all those things andmaybe the closest I will get to it is here.

(01:02:31):
Here's what everyone's saying.
Yeah.
You know, I don't really know but, you know, I
like you're open-minded enough to put that outthere because most people like I don't know
what it is, but most people want to naturallybelieve that they are we're all good.
Yeah.
We're all we know the truth.
Right.
And we're like, we're part of the right tribe,but we're part of the left tribe.
Yeah.
This is my team.
Uh-huh.
You don't care about truth at that point.

(01:02:51):
You care about being right.
You care about winning because this is theAmerican way.
Totally.
You wanna win.
Totally.
And yeah.
Dude, it's it's pretty wild.
Yeah.
I think the left-right divide is like thebiggest, sort of like manufactured distraction.
Yeah.
It's purely manufactured.
And make money off of fear.
Totally.
It's the matrix.
Totally.

(01:03:11):
And they know that like I think they're kind oftapping into that, like, human desire for
belonging to a tribe.
Yeah.
You know?
And so, it's like people It's
all DNA.
It's ancestral.
Yeah.
It is.
It is.
For sure.
And even, you know, this guy Junger, he wrote
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Have you read any of those just see.

(01:03:32):
Yeah.
He he well, he did, he was like a journalist.
Joe Rogan one time.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He did, he did, the Restrepo, that documentarywhere they went to Afghanistan in that valley.
But he wrote this other one called Tribe andit's about, like, tribalism and how, like, it's
how it's hardwired into, like, our brains.

(01:03:52):
Yeah.
And he kinda determined that even conservativeversus, like, liberal or whatever, a good some
part of that is maybe your upbringing, yourfamily, your exposure, your experiences, but
another portion of it is genetic.
Mhmm.

(01:04:12):
And that there is like a very real so there's avery real advantage on a society basis to be
of, weary of outsiders.
Yeah.
To protect what Yeah.
Is ours.
You had to.
You know?
Right.
Survive.
We
don't wanna change too quickly because we wegotta fucking, you know, hold on.
Yeah.
The things are done this way for a reason.
Like, we, you know, we can't just be giving outeverything to everybody or we're not gonna have

(01:04:35):
anything for ourselves.
Right?
So that's, like, hardwired into a tribe.
But if a tribe like that never opens up theirdoors to the outside world, never, you know,
then they're not gonna be able to grow.
They're not gonna be able to to procreate and
To learn.
And learn.
Yeah.
And define new technologies and access newresources and do all of that stuff.

(01:04:58):
So having somebody like some people in thattribe that are willing to hey, even though that
person looks different and lives over themountain, like, maybe they got something to to
give.
We should invite them over.
Right?
But then on the flip side, if you have a tribethat is way too, like, liberal and they're just
like, "Yeah, we're all peace and love.
Everyone's cool and like, everyone in?

(01:05:19):
Yeah.
Let everybody in."
They're gonna get overrun, dude.
They're gonna be, you know, pillaged and, like,burnt to the ground and, you know, so they need
some people to be like, "Hold up.
Like, let's freaking throw some spears out andmaybe, like, pat these guys down before we just
let them into our thing.
We'll start with a few of them." Right?
And then we'll see if it's chill.
Yeah.
And if there's any benefit there.

(01:05:39):
So both of those things are sort of, like,needed.
Yeah.
To do that balance.
Right.
100%.
So I think that tribalism is hardwired into ourthing like the left and right.
And I think the powers that be kind ofunderstand that.
Yeah.
And so they love the way they use it againstit.
Right?
And it becomes like cheering for a footballteam.
It becomes like, "Oh, dude."

(01:06:00):
Trump's the best or like, you know, howeveryone knows Trump's kind of like a cult of
personality and there's people who are super,super into him.
But what's even crazier is how people got thatway about Kamala Harris.
Yeah.
Like no one
Real quick.
Real quick.
No one liked her.
Real.
No one liked her and then they're like, "Youknow, she's the best thing ever.

(01:06:21):
She's so fun.
She's so cute." And you're like, "You guysdon't really think that."
Right?
Like, you're
just sort of like you're you're doing what youwhat you think is right because why is
this is your party?
That's your party.
Dude, but the crazy thing is how they like, thepeople for the majority who voted for Kamala
didn't vote for her because they liked her.

(01:06:41):
You can ask her what policies do you like?
What do you like about her?
Right.
They don't know.
She's good vibes.
I don't know.
Right.
But they voted for her because they hated him.
Because they hated Trump.
And that's what they would do.
Fear that people can use to sell you.
Right.
To it's like so effective, you know.
But really, I think the divide, like, the realdivide is between it it's not left and right.

(01:07:02):
It's up and down.
Mhmm.
It's the top versus the bottom.
And the top, they vote to vote for bothparties.
Yeah.
They they donate to both parties.
They do this because they don't really care whowins.
They just they wanna make sure Yeah.
Whoever wins, they have a guy on the insidethat owes them a few favors, right?
You know, so it's it's the Like

(01:07:22):
some people just wanna see the world burn too.
For sure.
I mean, that's what's like, wow.
Like, dude, all this stuff with the with the,
with
the with the yeah.
Well, yes, George Soros for sure but, likewhat's happening in, the Middle East right now
Yeah.
Kinda wild like Syria falling.
You the Ukraine Russia war.
Like, how there are people that are just tryingto keep it.

(01:07:46):
Prolonging fire.
And you're like, dude, why?
Why make so
much money off of that.
Which is just a wild thing.
Like, you guys are still living on this sameEarth.
Right?
Yeah.
Like, you guys, you know what I mean?
Like, you want a world war.
I don't I don't get who wants a world war.
Who who wants that?
Yeah.
You know?
And maybe, apparently, somebody.
But you're like, what the fuck?
Why?
Yeah.
What are their motivations?
Yeah.
Maybe because they profit off of that.

(01:08:08):
People think that far is to, like, aren't trulyunderstanding what the ramifications of what
they're dealing with is.
They just see us like, well, America's numberone.
We can do whatever the fuck we wanna do.
We're just gonna keep these wars going inanother country.
These
proxy wars.
We'll we'll funnel them.
We'll keep the fire burning because we're justpumping out guns and machines and hell, yeah.
Why not keep this thing going?
It doesn't affect me directly.

(01:08:28):
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
I think that there's like what I would calllike a mundane incentive.
So like, we make more money when there's wars.
We sell more bullets when there's wars.
Like that's And I'm sure that that isabsolutely a part of it.
What I can't tell is if there is also a part ofit that is, like, beyond that.

(01:08:49):
Like, spiritual or, like, some shit like that.
Dude, I was
just gonna say I, my personal opinion on this,and this is just because I'm a I'm a Christian.
A verse that I look to a lot is, I think it'sin Ephesians.
And Paul's writing to the church, and he says,our battle isn't against flesh and blood, but
it's against principalities in the heavenlyplaces.
So it's like, you and I, people, like, sayyou're you're left, I'm right.

(01:09:12):
Like, the battle isn't between us.
We think it is, but it's really between, yeah,it's between God and Satan.
Right.
And the Bible says that Satan is the ruler ofearth here now.
Mhmm.
God sent him down because he tried to overtakeheaven.
Mhmm.
God sent him down to earth, and now he'sinfected it.
And now, like, the rest of the story is Godtrying to refine his people and to heal all of

(01:09:37):
us.
Right.
And, yeah, that's the true battle.
Like, Jesus, before he died, his last wordswere forgive them.
They don't know what they're doing.
Right.
And it's like, yeah, I I don't like to take theresponsibility off of myself.
It's like, oh, it's like this is the devilmaking me do it.
But it I mean, in a way, it is.
But we have to decide whether or not we'regoing to follow that path the way by whatever.

(01:09:58):
It starts by partying, whatever.
It starts by a lot of different things and youfall into a dark path and it can lead to a
bunch of things.
We start that initial step and then the enemyjust feeds into that.
Yeah.
And he starts filling us with fear, with anger,with hatred, and that's what causes us to do
things.
Right.
And so but, yeah, the battle is not between uspeople.

(01:10:18):
And I think, like, if we if we understood that,there'd be a lot more peace.
But we're so focused on being angry at eachother, we can't even think about, like, well, a
lot of people don't even believe in God orbelieve that there are demons.
Right.
Right.
It's
like, dude, I've seen that stuff living inAfrica.
Wow.
Really?
Yeah.
Oh, dude.
I wanna I wanna ask you that next question butbefore I do, I wanna just interject something

(01:10:40):
here that's kinda interesting because I Ireally wanna hear that.
That's super interesting.
So one of the things I'm not really religiouslike I think the more I kind of like I say
study all a lot of this stuff, it kind of I'mI'm very clear that there's, like, a light and
dark and, like, okay, which side do you kindawanna be with, like, within religions, you
know, I I think Jesus is, like, an absolute,like, one of the best things you could look up

(01:11:03):
towards.
Like, there was, like, nothing negative abouthim.
Yeah.
Or whatever.
However you wanna view him as, you know, aprophet, the Messiah, like, whatever.
Just like like you I don't even think you haveto look into it that deep if you just emulate,
like, that dude's behavior, like, you're good.
You live a good life.
But, to what you said earlier so I just wannapreface it well.
This I'm not coming really from a religiousbackground, but I but I'm I know religion.

(01:11:25):
I know, like, a lot of Christianity and stufflike that.
And so what you're saying about how, like,Lucifer being, like, the ruler of this earth
even prior to, Christianity, there's, like, aGnostic Christianity, like, Gnosticism, and,
Gnost the Gnosticism views the demiurge as,like, the creator of his world.

(01:11:46):
Gnosticism is essentially The Matrix.
Like, if you've ever seen the movie The Matrix,you know there's an architect who built this
prison planet that we're all sort of living inthis illusion, you know, we're kind of trapped
in there.
And so if this earth is ruled by Lucifer orruled by the demiurge or some sort of prison

(01:12:08):
planet, I think what people have figured out,and this even predates Christianity, going back
to the Sumerians and going back to thesethings, is that if you can align yourself with
the ruler of this realm, then you will be setup to be on top of the heap of this realm,

(01:12:30):
which is why, like, it doesn't prove that thisis the case, but it lends credence to the claim
that there are elites who are Saturnian.
Yeah.
Luciferian, you know, satanic, whatever.
And they're doing that because, if you thinkabout what Jesus said, it's like there's a

(01:12:55):
higher chance of a camel going through the eyeof a needle than a rich man.
Right?
It's all about not
being rich.
Kingdom.
Yeah.
It's not about being rich.
It's not about being elite.
It's not about having power.
It's not about any of that.
It's the opposite.
It's the opposite.
It's about love and compassion and generosity.
Well, who at the top in our realm is about loveand compassion?

(01:13:16):
Nobody.
Nobody, buddy.
And the people who are, if they make it, thoseare the people who have managed to somehow
circumnavigate the matrix.
Yeah.
To get on top because their love has transpiredand motivated so many people.
They put them up there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Totally.
But, dude,
you see,
I was listening to, I think it was one of theserappers, like, YNW Melly or something or

(01:13:38):
Uzi.
It was like a recent interview with something
like that.
Yeah.
And he was talking about how there's there's aclause in his I don't know what podcast is
about.
There's a clause in his contract where hewasn't even allowed to say the name Jesus.
And so why would you put that in a contract?
Yeah.
How weird.
And, yeah.
Like, it it there's so many, like, theBaphomet.
Yeah.

(01:13:58):
And a lot of these, like, the goat andIlluminati and a lot of these cultish satanic
symbols are at the top of a lot of thesemassive companies.
And you see a lot of cult-like behavior in yousee a lot of cult-like behavior in, like,
what's that, Bohemian Grove.
Like, a lot of those, those are the high-upelite people.
Yeah.
And, they're not worshiping Jesus.
That's for sure.

(01:14:18):
Right.
You know?
Right.
And, have you known Napoleon Hill?
Yeah.
The guy wrote Think and Grow Rich?
He wrote this book called Outwitting the Devil.
Yeah.
I've read that, actually.
You've read it?
Yeah.
Bro.
Mhmm.
I just finished
it.
Yeah.
So fascinating.
Yeah.
I love how like, when he's talking to thedevil, I was like, yeah.
I can't gain control of people who havedefiniteness of purpose and who can think for
themselves.
The only people I can control are the drifters.

(01:14:40):
Oh, that's interesting.
And it's like, yeah, it's the people who, likeyou said, are just being—they don't have an
opinion of their own.
They don't do the research.
They just listen to whatever is getting put in.
Right.
The enemy, Satan, what Demiurge?
Right.
Yeah.
Demiurge.
Yeah.
Whatever.
Though that person's drifting, he's justinputting that voice into you, which is another
thing, like, understanding that we're not alonein our own mind.
Yeah.
There are other voices that come in.

(01:15:02):
And those are the people that he has controlof.
Right.
You look around, you're like, dude, look at howpeople are just fighting for money, for
success.
We'll do whatever it takes to get to the top ofthat heap.
Totally.
And it's like, yeah, there's not many peoplewho actually can think for themselves and have
a purpose outside of fame and success andmoney.
So rare.

(01:15:22):
And if you do, then they don't they can't useyou as a tool.
And so, like, yeah, you know, that's great.
You're talented.
You know, I I don't know that Taylor Swift isthe most talented singer on planet Earth.
There probably are others.
But she's been allowed to get to that, like,state in of her career because of what she is.

(01:15:43):
But before we, forget, I want tell me about,Africa.
Dude, so I guess I'll preface this by sayinghow how at least I've I've seen the the enemy
work when when they I'd say, like, darkness,evil
Yeah.
Satan.
How I've seen them work here versus in Africaor rather than Uganda is very different.

(01:16:09):
Interesting.
In Uganda, people believe in that stuff.
Yeah.
They believe in God, Muslims, lots ofChristians, lots of voodoo, witch doctors Yeah.
Animists, people who believe in whatever,animals, spirits.
That's huge.
Right.
So everyone believes in this stuff, which givesit that power.
Yeah.
And so out there, then you see people who aredemon-possessed.

(01:16:29):
A lot more common.
You see people who, yeah, are actual witchdoctors and they actually have, not much, but
they have power.
I
have an adopted brother who, like, there's thiswhole story.
But, basically, witch doctors were involved,and they almost killed this guy through
incantations and
Really?
Yeah.
Enchantments, all of that.
But you come here and okay.

(01:16:50):
People don't believe in this stuff.
People don't believe in demons.
It's like, yeah, like, maybe ghosts, all that.
But no one really believes, like, okay, there'sa supernatural.
There's a God.
There's a devil.
Not many people believe in that.
So Satan works in different ways here.
He works through you look at, like, what the inthe Bible called the abominations.
Pride, lust, envy, greed, gluttony.

(01:17:12):
You look at these things, these things are allcelebrated here.
Pride.
Yeah.
You have a whole month called pride.
Yeah.
Envy.
Like, yeah.
Lust.
100%.
Sex is everything.
Gluttony.
America is the most obese place in the world.
Greed.
Give me as much as I can.
Like, it's all about us.
It's all about hedonism, self-satisfaction.
Right.
So it's like, okay.
The devil works in a different way here,obviously.

(01:17:34):
But in Uganda, this stuff is pretty common.
I guess, a a story that so I was probably 12when this happened.
So my dad's a pastor.
He's a church.
He was preaching.
And in the middle of his sermon, this ladystarted screaming.
This is back when we had we didn't even have abrick and mortar.
We just had tents.
She started screaming hysterically.

(01:17:55):
So my dad and some of the other pastors ranover to her and started praying over her,
casting out the demon in Jesus' name.
After a couple of minutes, all of a sudden,this lady screams her last scream, falls down.
No joke.
All I remember seeing is, like, not like not itwasn't like smoke or anything.

(01:18:17):
It was just like a—I didn't even know if Iactually saw it or I felt it, but I remember
seeing this, like, darkness move across theceiling.
And it was really quick.
Boom.
And I was like, damn.
What the—what was that?
And then all of a sudden, the sound system inthe church, noise
Woah.
No way.
Like, weird, weird sounds.

(01:18:38):
Didn't nothing, that I could understand.
Right.
Like, just noises.
And then the entire sound system in the entirechurch exploded.
Broke.
They had to buy a new sound system.
It completely exploded.
And there's hundreds of people here.
Yeah.
Like, if you don't believe in that type ofstuff
Right.
It's like, what—what was that?
You
can't explain that.

(01:18:58):
Yeah.
Yeah.
But people here won't see it.
So it's like seeing is believing.
And if they saw it, they'd be like, well, it'sbecause you're using bad wiring and that.
Yeah.
Like, it's like, yeah.
You'll find they'll find some possible and Ithink that is like it's like a form of, like
self-soothing, you know, because it's reallyscary to think.
I one of the things that like frustrates me alot when people say like people who look into

(01:19:25):
conspiracies or I hate the term conspiracytheorist because it's such a fucking throw out
but like conspiracy theorist it it's like itit's just people who can't deal with the the
fact that the world is complex and things arerandom and that's a really hard for people to
understand.
So it's it's a lot more, like comforting toattribute things to, you know, coordinated

(01:19:51):
malice of some sort, you know, that there'sthat there are really isn't things we're all
just doing nothing, you know, like, justbarreling through random, like, space and time.
It's like, no.
No.
No.
There's there are people at the top who aredoing it.
And I'm like my pushback is I'm like, I thinkit is less comforting to think that there are

(01:20:12):
people and institutions and forces that existin the world that are bad, you know, that are
objectively bad and it's not just random andit's not like it is collusion.
It is, you know, bad spirituality or weirdentities, nonhuman entities that are

(01:20:34):
influencing people in different ways and, like,I don't think it can happen on subtle levels
too.
So, you know, in these positions of power wherepeople make decisions that influence a lot of
people's lives, if you are a nonhuman entity,you know, I'm just saying it that way to

(01:20:54):
broaden it beyond Christianity but, you know, ademon or whatever the case is, an alien, an
interdimensional being.
Go to the people that are making decisions andrather than having to influence every single
person, you influence that person and then whatthey do influences everybody else.

(01:21:15):
And now it's normal shit.
Like, why does the world suck?
Well, because our lawmakers make shitty laws.
Yeah.
You know, it's a very real, mundane answer.
You know?
But why are lawmakers making shitty laws?
Maybe it's because of incentives, but maybe,you know, money and stuff like that.
Don't even make sense.
Right.
Right.
Especially, like I mean, this is a verycontroversial topic, which it shouldn't be, but
it's like the surgical castration andmutilation of children.

(01:21:40):
Yeah.
Right.
And that shouldn't even be controversial.
The fact that, like, in California andWashington, you can be 10 years old.
You don't even have to ask your parents, andyou can get a life-changing surgery.
Yeah.
And that's all in the name of love.
Uh-huh.
If we
love these kids, this is what we should do.
But it's like, dude, that doesn't make anysense to me.
Like, if you're 18,
do what you wanna do.
That's fine.
But to say this is in love, and if you don't,you're transphobic.

(01:22:04):
Mhmm.
You're a bigot.
You're somehow racist.
Right.
But it's like it's like, dude, make it makesense.
It doesn't make any sense.
Yeah.
Like, the mutilation of, like, children for thesake of their benefit.
Yeah.
They're like and no one and if you even pauseto question it
Yeah.
It's like, you know, they don't even want youto think that hard about it because so they can

(01:22:24):
just label you as, like, some bad bad person.
Yeah.
And, yeah, it's like literally 19 years old.
So so and that that's a perfect example ofsomething where you can look and find the
mundane incentives and and which is this.
Mhmm.
If you get a 10-year-old on hormone medication,you have them for the rest of their lives.
Yeah.
Dude, that's x.

(01:22:45):
Like, you know, why would we just pay for someshit when they're sick?
We can we can get them now and then we canshoot them forever.
So, like, there's a very, like, regular normal,but maybe whoever thought of that brilliant
plan was some executive at some company orsome, you know, politician or whatever and
there's just a little voice in the back.

(01:23:05):
Yeah.
That's just like, hey, do you think about that?
Think of the money.
Yeah.
Wait.
I just thought of something.
Yeah.
And it's like it's that little it's, you know,it's not him in a dark snacking room.
How do we castrate children?
You know, there's some horned guy in the othercorner.
It's like, I don't I think it like you said,maybe it's just the society because we're in
America and it's like it's it's you gotta be alittle more subtle.

(01:23:27):
But I do think that there are probably, youknow, kind of like the whispering.
Yeah.
I agree.
In the ear people and then that starts goingdown because and then you're you to normal go
to here, like, this doesn't make any fuckingsense.
You know?
It's wild, bro.
Super wild.
Let me check the battery on this thing.
It's where we're at.
What time is it?
It is, 2, 3rd damn.
Oh, yeah.
We fucking We've been

(01:23:48):
on it.
We've been on it.
We've been on it.
We've been

All Episodes

Ep. 16 | Big Pharma, Big Lies, Big Questions | Natty Linquist

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Crime Junkie

24/7 News: The Latest

Stuff You Should Know

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ep. 16 | Big Pharma, Big Lies, Big Questions | Natty Linquist