April 26, 2025 • 40 mins
In this episode, Reed sits down with John L. Cook, Jr., Past Grand Master (2010). John recounts several life-changing experiences: growing up in Georgia, serving in Vietnam, graduating from Cornell University, and finding true purpose in life through the power of brotherhood.
Together, they explore John’s many talents: competitive bass fishing, the MLK Tennis Club, passion for gun & coin collecting, and more.
”The one thing I see in young Masons today is the fact that they love it. They want to be Masons. But their shortcoming is coming into the lodge, doing the work, and when they go out that door, they forget that they are Masons. We as their leaders are not doing enough to get them down that road of saying, ‘Masonry is a way of life.’ “
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Welcome back to another episodeof Minnesota Masonic Histories
(00:03):
and Mysteries.
Our guest today is a member ofTussler Summit Lodge number 2 63
in Roseville.
Having served as WorshipfulMaster in 1999, he He has been a
faithful servant to the craftover the past 30 years, serving
on the Board of MinnesotaMasonic Charities, our
jurisprudence committee, thekids ID program, and was
(00:24):
installed as Grandma of Masonsin Minnesota in 2010.
Welcome, John L.
Cook, Jr.
Thank you very much.
I'm glad to be here.
We are all about authenticrelationships, getting to know
our members better.
Tell us more about you.
You were born in Georgia,correct?
I was born in Atlanta, Georgia.
(00:45):
Uh, I come from a family of fivechildren.
Uh, my mother and father wasalso raised in Georgia, in a
small town called Norcross,Georgia.
we grew up about 21 miles northof Atlanta in a little city
called Roswell, Georgia.
(01:06):
Five siblings, five siblings.
Where were you in that order?
I am number two andunfortunately, as of today, uh,
there's only three members leftin my family.
Uh, I had, there were three boysand two girls.
Both my parents have passed onand both of my sisters has, has
(01:29):
passed on.
I have a sister that was onethat was older than me and other
than that my other sister, bothof them are gone and my, my, uh,
two brothers, we are the onescarrying on the cook name at the
time.
How do you think being numbertwo in that order of five kids
(01:50):
shaped you?
It's always different if you'reoldest in the middle or the
youngest, but then how did thatwork out?
It probably shaped me a littlebit different than normal,
simply because my sister, whowas the oldest, I'm 11, she's 11
months older than me.
But then after, after I wasborn, seven years later, my
(02:12):
parents decided to have anotherfamily of three kids.
So, surprise.
So it, there's a seven year,seven year gap between me and
the next boy and my family.
You think that led you to getalong better, maybe not
overlapping in activities orbeing in that different age?
Not get along better, but duringthat time of life and, and
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growing up in the south, you dida lot of babysitting.
So, uh, my parents had had, uh,built in babysitters for their
family.
So that turned out really well.
So what led you to departGeorgia?
Did you go straight toMinnesota, or where did your
life journey take you?
No, I, I, um.
I, I landed in Minnesota becauseI was in graduate school here at
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the university.
Um, I came directly fromcollege, which was Cornell
University in Ithaca, New York.
and when I arrived here, um, Iwind up meeting a woman, my
daughter's mother at the presenttime.
(03:23):
And I got married, had a kid,and I wanted to go to grad cont
I, I had to stop grad school.
So then after I stopped gradschool, I said, uhoh, I'm
married the kid on the way.
I gotta find a job.
So I wound up going back to acompany, be that I originally
(03:44):
went to known as Ford MotorCompany.
I worked there.
And, uh, what did you, what didyou do at Ford?
I, I worked as a, uh, dealeraccount manager, and that's, so,
I say Ford, but all myexperience in Ford was under
Ford mode of credit.
So I've, I've never been in, I,I've toured in assembly plant,
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but all my work was in thefinancial words world of Ford
Credit.
And I wind up being here and.
Been here the whole time.
How many years now?
Since 75.
I've been here since 75, 50years.
50 years I've been here.
And uh, uh, my daughter is stillhere.
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She's, uh, now she has twogirls.
So there's, uh, myself, mydaughter, and two
granddaughters, and we do a lotof hanging out together.
I.
What's life as a grandparent?
Is it as busy as everyone saysIt is definitely as busy because
there is a little three year gapbetween the two girls and I'm
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always the one being calledsaying, Papa, can you go here?
Papa, can we go there?
So it is, it is definitely.
And and so far, the interestingpart is they have actually taken
up my hobbies as well, so.
I, I have to put in my littleteaching part of their hobby,
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along with hiring somebody toteach them some of the, the real
things about my hobby.
Well, you have a lot of hobbiesI like to ask on this podcast.
What's something most peopledon't know about you?
And I don't know that many ofour members quite appreciate the
vast interest that you havebetween fishing, gun collecting
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tennis.
Where to start?
Well, you even left outta onebecause my, my third hobby is,
uh, coin collecting.
I've been collecting coins nowfor about 10 years, that's been
intriguing because I've, my twograndkids like that hobby as
well.
Really?
That's one that they've, yes,yes.
Yeah, they've caught on to thathobby.
(05:58):
As well as tennis, they caughton to those two hobbies in my
life so that it keeps me very,very well connected with them.
Are you a tennis pro?
You teach, teach lessons,correct?
I teach lessons only to certainpeople.
my dream in life when I firststarted tennis was, you know,
you gotta have a a, a goal outthere.
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My goal was always to Wimbledon.
I tore my Achilles heels and I,I, I got messed up, so I stopped
and, and stuff, so I didn't makethat part.
So all of a sudden, the teachingthat I do is with youth groups.
We have a, a organization in inMinnesota called the Martin
(06:40):
Luther King Tennis Club.
I teach out of that group'causewe bring in summer camp kids to
teach tennis to, and that'swhere I do most of my teaching.
At How long have you playedtennis?
Did that start as a young age orwhen you were No, no.
It actually started after I cameout Vietnam and uh, I was home
(07:01):
in.
I went to this tennis court.
I wanted to learn to play itearly.
But you know how sometimes yougo to the park and you see these
boards where you can hit upagainst the wall?
Yes.
Well, every time I hit the ball,it went over the board, so I
couldn't, I couldn't.
So finally something said, youneed to learn this game.
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So I met some folk.
In the Martin Luther King tennisbox.
I started learning.
Then I took some privatelessons, more private lessons,
and then that, that started meon my way.
Been been playing ever since.
Been playing ever since.
Have you ever played on grass atWimbledon or compared the clay
to grass?
To just the regular?
I had an opportunity to play on,on, it wasn't grass.
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It was, it was, it would've beenclay.
Dirt on a, on a, on a dirtsurface in Georgia.
How was it?
Is it weird?
Is it, does it play the same?
It's it just slower.
Slower.
It's slower.
Okay.
The, the fastest court is the,is is the concrete court.
Uh, the, the, the, the regularred clay that you see on TV is
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slower, is the slowest court.
The one in the middle would bethe grass.
Is it slippery?
Is it, does that no injuriesoccur on when you get on the
clay or no?
Not much.
Not much.
Because what they do is they,they groom it very well and
before they get ready for theplaying starts, they dry.
It's dry.
So you don't do a lot.
(08:28):
Yeah.
Sometimes people do slip it itBut, but it's not often.
Okay.
Let's talk about fishing.
I know of a few brothers andfriends that have gone fishing
with you and have said it's,it's not just simply casting and
sitting there.
You are a serious bassfisherman.
Yes, yes.
I been, up until this summer, Itraveled probably to.
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Four tournaments a year outsideof the state of Minnesota.
And, and so I wind up fishing onwhat is known as the FLW
circuit, uh, which is a, a a amedium, not a medium, but a
sidebar to the National BassAssociation League.
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it's, it's very difficult.
It is hard work.
And I can remember all the yearsthat I've been fishing and I
lived around my neighbors andthey would say, oh, bring me a
couple of fish back.
I said, no way.
I throw'em back in the water.
I'm tired when I come home.
So it's, it's different.
(09:37):
And the reason why I stillprobably have, fishing as my
number one, uh, hobby is simplybecause.
Um, when you, when you, I fishspecifically for one species of
fish, which is bath and what ithas done for me, it, it allows
you to do numerous things, inother words, techniques, while
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you are on the water.
And it is really fascinatingthat you can be on the same lake
and you use three or fourdifferent techniques to catch
the fish.
Because the fishes fish arepocket into one area in another
area, they could be schooling updifferently and you have to use
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different techniques to catch'em.
And that's what really intriguesme is because I, I, I never
wanted to be a fisherman that,that, that just setting one of
those spots and try to wait on afish to come to me.
But that's what, what makes itinteresting.
You move around, you trydifferent techniques and it goes
really well.
Time really flies.
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I realized what a novice I am inthe fishing department having
grown up.
We go to Big Pine Lake nearPerham, Minnesota.
It would just be, sit there,drift.
Mm-hmm.
And hope.
Mm-hmm.
Cross your fingers.
Well there, there was somemarkers out there, but I had no
idea that there was such a depthof technique and process to
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this.
It is a very strong.
Um, technique and process, butat the present time, competition
is really, really strong simplybecause what is happening in the
fishing world, period is theworld of electronics, just like
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the world itself has become atechnological world.
Fishing has become a technologyworld.
There are some guys who you willgo on their boat and they'll
have five different screens thatthey're looking at.
They're doing five differentthings in the water.
Like what?
Beyond the depth finder.
What else was It is a, it is adepth finder, but they're also
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called, for example, there'sanother depth finder out there
that's called the 360, because adepth finder.
From the actual screen, it takesyou down a cone and you are only
looking at a certain part.
But a 360 now gives you thevision all the way around your
boat to see where the fishreally are.
(12:11):
Wow.
And so you could, you canactually move them from that.
And, and, and they also, theother important thing today
about the electronics is bathwill move.
On, they like solid ground,solid sand.
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So the screens will now tell youwhat's by color variation, where
you, what, what is on the bottomof the lake?
Is this unique to bass only?
Is this applied to Northerns andwalleye and other It applies
because everybody's getting intothis electronic thing.
Okay.
Yes.
Yes.
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And, and.
I, I think I'm so, I ha I haveto say it this way.
I'm sort of good at it, butbecause I don't have all the
electronics that a lot of guyshave, but what they actually do
is, is you are getting very,very close to the fact of going
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to the death finders.
And now being able to tell, tellyou what species that is in the
water.
No kidding.
Yes.
And it's not just by size andthe shape of the fish.
I'm telling you, these screens,they, these, they are coming up
with some awesome pictures thatwill get you very, very close.
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How do you feel about that?
Does that spoil the process,the, the technique involved?
Is it, is it too, does anyonefeel like this is.
Too much insight.
There is, there is, there is alot of fight going on out there
at the present time.
As a matter of fact, the BASS,which is the um, uh, national
Bass Association, they actuallyare limiting the amounts of
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electronics you can have on yourboat for a fishing tournament
because there are, there,there's everybody you know with,
you buy a boat.
And you got 5, 6, 7 pieces ofelectronic on your boat that
equipment alone could probablyput you somewhere around 20,
$30,000 or more just for theelectronics.
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And so some of the guys who areused to fishing don't use all of
that stuff.
They like the old way of, let mego find the fish.
Okay.
I can picture someone showing upat a competition and being that
guy that has the boat justloaded down with.
Way too much on the electronicand technology side.
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It, it can happen.
But, but, um, when, when theystarted making these changes,
they put'em in rules.
They just don't say no more.
When you, when you, when you'reout there fishing on the BASS
circuit or the FLW circuit, theyhave what is known as the
tournament rules.
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It's gonna be right there in therules of what you can and cannot
have.
So the guy could come with that,in other words, but he's got to
disconnect some of that.
Sure.
Before he could actually usethat boat.
Where's the next tournament?
Where are you headed next toAlabama.
in the middle of May to LakeGunther.
It might be a little steamy inAlabama by, uh, next month.
It's gonna be steamy in Alabama.
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But I, I, the good part aboutgoing to this tournament is
that's where my baby brotherlived.
Oh, not too far from that.
He's about an hour from thelake.
So I'll, I'll get to, toactually hang out with him for a
while.
I'll pre fish him for a whilewhen I go outta state.
It's normally a 14 day tripbecause you want to expend at
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least seven to eight days ofpracticing on that water.
No kidding.
Yeah.
A week.
Yes.
And so he'll help you with thator he'll join you.
Your brother will he'll join me.
He'll join me.
Okay.
And what we do is we'll use ourelectronics to get where we need
to get because it is a true factthat that, that the fish.
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Uh, you won't find them all overthe lake.
They're gonna be in certainpockets, in certain areas.
And what you want to do in yourpre, in your planning is
eliminate all the, what we calldead water.
No fish in them that you wannafish.
So that's why we go and spendthat time.
Grandkids get into fishing.
You said they were into the coincollecting any family that
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wanted to be a part of this too.
The grand fit grandkids onlyinto fishing at the introductory
stage.
In other words, they like panfishing.
Okay.
So I live on, I, I have anoutlet to a lake at my house.
Uh, and that's when they comeand that's when I, I teach them
what I know because that's alsohow I started learning how to
pan and fish.
And then you go from there.
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But, uh, at the present time.
I don't think neither.
It'll be a hobby to them morethan me, because one wants to be
an actress and the other one isinto, uh, um, forgot what, what
my oldest one college major isat the moment, but it'll come to
me.
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How, how old are they?
Uh, my oldest, my granddaughteris 17 and the young one is 15.
Fun age, I would imagine.
And they're open to age.
Yes.
And you're a gun collector?
Yes.
When did that start?
When I went to college.
what happened when I went tocollege was the fact that I went
to Cornell and Cornell is inIthaca, New York.
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Not to be confused with theCornell in Iowa.
That's right.
Yes, that's right.
That's right.
So, so when I got there, I wasusing my GI bill.
But I wanted to, I needed tomake a little money, so I got a
summer job at the Ithaca GunCompany, and they had at one the
summer that I was there, theyhad a gun show, and that's when
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I got hooked.
What were you doing in your jobwith them?
Assembling guns.
No kidding Shotguns.
It's got Ithaca guns or shotgunson the assembly line.
Yes.
it was just fun doing it.
And that got you hooked.
That got me hooked and the firstthing that, that, that really
hooked me was the fact that Iadmired the, uh, the double
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barrel shotgun because in theold version when I was there, it
was side by side.
Now the new version is.
So it, it was really just thatthing and being a part, being
able to, to feel it, to be apart of it was something that I
wanted.
And I said, oh, I gotta, I gottahave these.
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And my actual, my parents cameto my graduation and that's what
they actually brought me, boughtme, was mine that a gun that I
had seen.
Did you get to try the.
New things as they came out whenyou worked there?
No.
Did they?
No.
They didn't have a range.
You could go Nothing.
Okay.
No, it, it, I was actually inthe assembly plant.
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So it was all parts and labored?
Yes.
At that particular time.
And then that's just grown overthe years.
Your collection, it had grown,grown over the years.
Pistols, rifles?
Nope.
Nope.
Only shotguns.
Only shotguns.
I only, I only actually own onepistol.
That's all I own is one pistol.
Never have really wanted on, butI've always collected, uh,
shotguns.
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How often are you at gun showsor at other, do you have no
other collectors?
Has that turned into a smallnetwork of friends and, and
collector?
That's what actually happened tome here in Minnesota.
I, I met four or five guys thatwere collectors and what we
actually did was we moved to,we, we traveled around in the
state to Wisconsin, to Iowa.
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They have, they have gun showsall the time, all around uh, you
are always looking to see.
What's new, what's old?
But my collecting of guns isreally not probably the way a
normal collector would look atit.
It's more so about I like this,you know, it was like the one
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that my parents brought me theside by side.
I mean, I don't own a overunder.
I don't own a double bear over,under, no, I don't own it.
It's, it's just so, it's justthat feeling and just that, just
that technique.
That's all.
So one of my questions was goingto be what's something most
people don't know about you?
And we have learned, I havelearned a lot, I've known you
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for a number of years.
This is, this is why we do this.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I, and I think as, as Imentioned when we started, the
other one was, was, uh, wascollecting coins.
Yes.
I got into coin collecting.
Just because I started reading abook about coins, and I think
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the fascinating part about coinsto me is I don't think nobody in
America realized unless you workat a place like this, how many
coins in the world There reallyis.
So I, I was reading this bookand the title, title of this
book is Get Rich with YourPocket Change.
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And it tells you about the factthat some of the, the most
precious coins out there arestill in people's pocket.
Okay.
They're still in circulation.
Yes.
I mean, as long as, for example,let me give you a very quick
one.
The, the easy one is the LincolnPenny.
Lincoln Penny has been inexistence since 1909.
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And there are not millions ofLincoln's pennies.
There are trillions of them, butthere are several coins.
And what make coins this, thesecoins unique is an era has been
made on the coin and on the 1909coin, the one thing that happens
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is there is a designer of thecoin and he gets to put his
initials on the coin.
Right under the date, and on the1909, there were two batches
made.
One without, which was an errorand one with, so you could have
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a 1909 in this hand and it'd beworth millions of dollars.
You could have a 1909 In thishand, it is only worth a penny.
That's how, that's, that's whatmakes it interesting to me.
So it's, it's a constant.
Looking and examining coins toknow what it's worth.
How many coins do youapproximately own?
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Probably about 3,500, and that'san assortment of pennies.
I only like pennies, quarter andquarters, and now I've gone
strictly into silver.
Because now the other thingabout coins is the most precious
content, which is silver and,and you, you have to, all coins
(23:03):
don't have 99.9% silver.
And so knowing that, so I wentback into the books and that, I
figured out which of that.
So what happens is it's likemaking an investment.
I have all these coins and yousay they worth$3,500.
No, they're not, because theprice started at what is the
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market of an ounce of silvertoday.
Sure.
So that makes it very, veryinteresting.
Have you ever been at a coinshow or with a collector and had
a, a nice surprise that you haveone in your possession that's
worth far more than you everanticipated?
No.
'cause I examined them withcoins very thoroughly of what I
got.
But what I, what I do have, I dohave.
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I think I'm very much aware ofmine because there's enough
value to those coins and becausethey're all in my house, I have
to know what the insurance priceI need.
Sure.
I have, all of them are insured.
I.
The only some of my coins now, Ibegin to give off to my, to my
two granddaughters.
Once they learn, they are bothinto, into the, the baby is into
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the young one, in other words isinto Penny's, and my oldest one
is into quarters.
And I have not turned loose anyof my silver dollars yet.
Okay.
So that's, that's the biggestpart of my collection.
That must be fun watching themdiscover this whole process.
Oh yeah.
Oh yeah.
One thing we haven't discussedspecifically yet today is what
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led to your interest in becominga Freemason?
Now that's a very interesting,stubborn story.
If I had to say so myself.
I had, when I moved toMinnesota, I met this, this
brother.
His name was Robert Starkey.
And Robert Starkey was afisherman, so I'm on this
(24:59):
fishing boat with him.
One day we were just outfishing, we were just out having
fun.
This is before I really, reallygot started in the fishing and,
and, and, and.
Let me, let me, let me say thisas I make this piece is, is the
fact that I used to call, wecall him sloping Bob, so I might
use that phrase.
So Robert Starkey is slopingBob.
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So I was on this boat with Boband he was, he was, he was on
the trolling motor and he handedme this little card and the card
said, what is a mason?
I said, he said, Hmm, read this.
I said, okay.
(25:42):
So I read the card and then Igave it back to him and he said,
what do you think?
I said, what about the card?
I said, yeah, it looksinteresting.
He said, so this is aboutMasonry, so what do you think?
I said, yeah, it's a good idea.
So at that particular point intime, he must know he gonna talk
(26:03):
me into it.
'cause he handed me a petition.
I've been a Mason ever since.
That's how I got started.
That's, that's my startingblock.
Slopping Bob introduced me toMasonry.
Well, we're grateful forslopping Bob Absolutely.
For having that conversation.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
You've done so many things forthe craft over the past 30 plus
(26:28):
years.
To the outsider, we summarizefree masonry as authentic
friendship, personaldevelopments, building
community.
How should we best pursue doingthose things and not just
talking about those things.
I think the one thing that, thatwe as Masons, uh, having a
(26:54):
struggling problem with today isrecruitment.
And I had a, a mason to say thisto me one time.
He said, you know, masonry is abelly to belly thing.
You, you want to, you, you, youneed to meet a, a, a man,
(27:14):
examine his character, and theninvite him to be a mason.
That's belly to belly.
That to me has been the, theturning point for me and where I
stand because I, I see our craftnot at the present time
following just that one littletechnique.
(27:36):
Uh, we had so many masons yearago that we didn't have to look,
and now that we are startinglooking, we, we are forgetting
the teaching part that we needto be teaching the incoming
masons that they need to asktheir friends.
I.
Asking a friend is still bellyto belly asking a friend part of
(27:57):
that bigger relationshipbuilding process.
I think this gets misunderstooda lot, that we don't advocate
going out to a perfect strangerand saying, Hey, stranger, come
and join this, but someone thatwe know well, yeah, someone that
we can vouch for.
Yeah.
And say, Hey, this is a good,good pain.
Good man, good person who.
Really already maybe embracessome of our core values, have
(28:21):
that conversation.
what I keep seeing is such ayearning for what we stand for.
I.
We can't assume that everyone'sseeing our websites and our
resources or our social mediapresence understand what that
means.
Right.
To your point, belly to belly.
Have the conversation.
Got to have that conversation.
Yeah.
Why haven't you asked me aboutmy Masonic cloud?
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What level of interest do youhave in learning more?
Kinda like slop and bomb, right?
That's what he did.
That's what he did.
He asked me and he found out andhe, so that was a good thing.
And I, I think that the realturn of where we are today, I.
Is, you know, we can look backover our history and we can say
(29:03):
at one point in time we had70,000 masons and all that was
about.
Belly to belly.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, you could, you, you gotto imagine that that's what it
was, simply because there was notelephone, no cell phones.
These, these brothers was goingon a horse and carriage and
(29:23):
talking to people.
And I think that's the big thingthat, that, that we have lost a
little love and, and we need to,I think time changes things, but
communication never changes.
No matter how you do it, I meane even if, if your best friend
(29:44):
is a friend that you talk to onthe telephone all the time, it
doesn't mean you still can'tintroduce him to the term of
masonry.
Mm-hmm.
It's the fact that you didn'ttalk about it.
You have to start thatconversation.
The person that is a Mason, weare the original social network.
Death predating all of thattechnology and no matter how
(30:08):
connected we might feel in thatvirtual online sense, that never
substitutes face-to-face, friendto friend.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I'm gonna pose a couple ofrandom questions to you.
Okay.
In, in the pursuit of getting toknow you better.
What seemingly small thingchanged your life forever?
(30:36):
Are we talking in terms ofmasonry or just my life?
Yeah, anything.
Vietnam.
Vietnam was the biggest changerin my life.
Um, I go, I fight.
I do think that a lot of peopledon't realize that I would, I'm
(30:56):
in the infantry in other, all Idid in Vietnam was carry a gun.
All I did in Vietnam was shootat people.
All I did in Vietnam was getshot at.
And then I come home and I haveto, to um, readjust and I can't
remember being at the Thinkcloud va.
(31:20):
And one of the socialpsychologists actually said to
me, he said, you, you were only18 when that was happening, so
you should be done.
Got over that, and I had to lookat him and I had to say to
myself, I said, wait a minute.
No matter what it is, if youkill somebody, no matter how it
(31:41):
was done, you don't forget thatman.
I didn't ever see thatpsychologist again.
I told, I told everybody becausehe didn't understand the fact
that this is not something thatchanged, that happens to you.
This is something that changesyour life forever.
Not for day.
Forever.
Forever.
Forever.
(32:01):
Yeah.
Yes, yes.
So that's my biggest change.
But other than that, I'velearned to adjust.
I mean, the good thing about me,I had some loving parents.
When I came home from Vietnam, Ithink I stayed, no, no farther
than my parents' yard for almostsix or eight months.
(32:23):
So by the time I got home and,and went through those six or
eight months, people hadrecognized me being home.
So they didn't ask me manyquestions, and so I was able to,
I've been able to live my lifebecause a lot of people don't
know that I'm a veteran.
So I let it, I just let it pass,and you let it lay and you don't
talk about it.
(32:45):
And that's what the way I'velearned to live my life thank
you for your service to thiscountry.
Well, I think one of the biggestthings about about that is just
like I said, a lot of peopledon't recognize that, um, you
know, you say, well, you're inthe service and you say, yeah.
And I says, where in Vietnam,everybody in Vietnam don't have
(33:08):
to carry, didn't carry a gun.
I mean, the supply people thatwere people that stayed in a
secure camp, but I mean, my lifewas in the jungle all the time.
I.
It, it was, it was, it was very,very different.
If you could ask any livingperson a question and be assured
(33:31):
of a true answer, who would youask?
Who would I ask?
It would really depend upon thequestion.
If I was asking a question aboutMasonry, I would ask the people,
(33:52):
the two brothers that started mealong my way, Jerry Johnson and
Russ Meister.
If it was about my life, I'dprobably be questioning myself.
And making sure that I was onthe right path.
Um, I think I, I, I, I say thatsimply because I'm the oldest of
(34:17):
the group in my house, so Idon't know.
But, but my, my question is al,my thing would always be what's
the question?
And then I would know the rightperson to go to if it was really
something more than anythingelse, I'd go to my pastor.
And, and, and I look at, at, atRust and Mice, Russ and Jerry,
(34:41):
as the two men in my life whostarted me on my Masonic
journey, they saw in mesomething that I think I don't
see in myself.
They saw leadership in me that Ididn't even know about, and they
started me in these jobs, uh,which was, at that time the, uh,
uh, I would, my first job inMasonry was a Dr.
(35:03):
And then, then I took over forRuss at the district rep at, I
mean, not at the district rep asthe area deputy.
And so those kind of thingsstarted me.
And from that work I got to, touh, the next person that came
in, I came in contact with, withNeil.
Neil, Neil Meyer Nemeyer.
Mm-hmm.
The late Neil Nemeyer and myMasonic term, we called him my,
(35:26):
my fraternal father.
And.
He also saw things in me that Ididn't see, and he started me.
And that's what started myMasonic journey into, uh, being,
um, um, becoming the grandma.
When I think about Jerry Russand our late friend and brother
Neil, true gems.
(35:48):
Mm-hmm.
And such, such pillars.
But it is another testament tothat.
Unintentional mentoring thathappens in the moment that we
That's correct.
You don't even realize it.
That is correct.
They see something in you.
Yep.
And we hopefully are doing thatnow for our younger generation.
Mm-hmm.
That identifying that guy's gotsomething.
Yes.
And how do we help encouragehim, buoy him up and cultivate
(36:14):
whether it's being a leader.
Or an influencer or someone whotruly is that Mason in their
heart first.
And, and especially in, in our,in in today's times, that's
really how you have to look atit, because the, the one thing I
see in Young Masons today is thefact that they love it.
(36:39):
They, they want to be Masons,but.
Their shortcoming is coming intothe lodge and doing the work,
and when they go out, theyforget that they're masons.
You know, I, I, I think that'sthe biggest thing that's
happening, and I think that'sbecause we as, as, as their
(37:04):
leaders are not doing enough to,to get them down that road of
saying.
Masonry is a way of life.
It is not just coming into yourlodge.
It's about your being a truemason and following the tenets
of masonry, brotherly love,relief and truth.
(37:24):
And I think that's what we haveto do.
And we have to, we, we, we areat that point of finding young
men, but we not quitecultivating them to that
standard.
They would because I think.
We sometimes look at because theworld changes so fast, we are
looking too much at, okay, theworld's changed.
We don't have to do thatanymore.
(37:45):
No, Uhuh belly and belly tobelly will never go away when it
comes to masonry, because that'sthe true grit.
Because the, the, the one thing,the difference today is you have
to teach, give the man theknowledge of what masonry is so
that when he goes home.
(38:06):
And he talks to his wife.
His wife got to agree to it toosometimes, because it is no
longer the man.
It's, it's about a, a shared,shared relationship in a
marriage today.
So you have to take it veryevery way you can.
There's definitely anopportunity for us to help
(38:27):
advise counsel on being a masonall the time.
Tolerance, brotherly love reliefon social media outside of the
lodge setting.
It's not just something we dowhen we get together and have a
meeting.
Right.
It's something, is it in yourheart then?
Your heart, or is it justsomething you just say the
(38:49):
words?
Mm-hmm.
Where, where the merch.
Mm-hmm.
I, I agree with that very muchbecause given the number of
years that I've been in masonry,one thing, one thing that I, I,
I, you can notice.
Especially even doing ourdegrees.
There are some guys, these youngguys, they love it.
(39:11):
I mean, they just love it.
They, they, it's unbelievablethe way they can handle
learning.
All of the stuff that theylearn, sometimes they stop
because again, when they go outthat door, they forget that
they're masons.
It's like, it's like beingalmost in a theater sometimes.
(39:33):
You know?
This is, no, this is nottheatrical.
The words that you're saying isa way of life, not a theater.
So that's the, that's what weare going through at the present
time.
Learning how to tear down thatwall to, to make sure it's a
part of that young man's life.
John L.
Cook, Jr.
(39:54):
It has been a pleasure havingyou in studio today.
I feel like we could talk forhours.
Oh yeah, I, I agree with you,but it's only a short period of
time.
We'll do it again.
We will do it again.
We'll do it again.
But it's, it's nice outside.
There's tennis to be played.
There's fishing equipment to beworked, worked on before your
next trip.
(40:14):
But thank you for coming instudio and I can't wait to do
this again.
Your mother.
Welcome.
I appreciate you very much forhaving me.
And this has been anotherepisode of Minnesota Masonic
Histories and Mysteries.
Welcome back to another episodeof Minnesota Masonic Histories
(00:03):
and Mysteries.
Our guest today is a member ofTussler Summit Lodge number 2 63
in Roseville.
Having served as WorshipfulMaster in 1999, he He has been a
faithful servant to the craftover the past 30 years, serving
on the Board of MinnesotaMasonic Charities, our
jurisprudence committee, thekids ID program, and was
(00:24):
installed as Grandma of Masonsin Minnesota in 2010.
Welcome, John L.
Cook, Jr.
Thank you very much.
I'm glad to be here.
We are all about authenticrelationships, getting to know
our members better.
Tell us more about you.
You were born in Georgia,correct?
I was born in Atlanta, Georgia.
(00:45):
Uh, I come from a family of fivechildren.
Uh, my mother and father wasalso raised in Georgia, in a
small town called Norcross,Georgia.
we grew up about 21 miles northof Atlanta in a little city
called Roswell, Georgia.
(01:06):
Five siblings, five siblings.
Where were you in that order?
I am number two andunfortunately, as of today, uh,
there's only three members leftin my family.
Uh, I had, there were three boysand two girls.
Both my parents have passed onand both of my sisters has, has
(01:29):
passed on.
I have a sister that was onethat was older than me and other
than that my other sister, bothof them are gone and my, my, uh,
two brothers, we are the onescarrying on the cook name at the
time.
How do you think being numbertwo in that order of five kids
(01:50):
shaped you?
It's always different if you'reoldest in the middle or the
youngest, but then how did thatwork out?
It probably shaped me a littlebit different than normal,
simply because my sister, whowas the oldest, I'm 11, she's 11
months older than me.
But then after, after I wasborn, seven years later, my
(02:12):
parents decided to have anotherfamily of three kids.
So, surprise.
So it, there's a seven year,seven year gap between me and
the next boy and my family.
You think that led you to getalong better, maybe not
overlapping in activities orbeing in that different age?
Not get along better, but duringthat time of life and, and
(02:35):
growing up in the south, you dida lot of babysitting.
So, uh, my parents had had, uh,built in babysitters for their
family.
So that turned out really well.
So what led you to departGeorgia?
Did you go straight toMinnesota, or where did your
life journey take you?
No, I, I, um.
I, I landed in Minnesota becauseI was in graduate school here at
(03:02):
the university.
Um, I came directly fromcollege, which was Cornell
University in Ithaca, New York.
and when I arrived here, um, Iwind up meeting a woman, my
daughter's mother at the presenttime.
(03:23):
And I got married, had a kid,and I wanted to go to grad cont
I, I had to stop grad school.
So then after I stopped gradschool, I said, uhoh, I'm
married the kid on the way.
I gotta find a job.
So I wound up going back to acompany, be that I originally
(03:44):
went to known as Ford MotorCompany.
I worked there.
And, uh, what did you, what didyou do at Ford?
I, I worked as a, uh, dealeraccount manager, and that's, so,
I say Ford, but all myexperience in Ford was under
Ford mode of credit.
So I've, I've never been in, I,I've toured in assembly plant,
(04:06):
but all my work was in thefinancial words world of Ford
Credit.
And I wind up being here and.
Been here the whole time.
How many years now?
Since 75.
I've been here since 75, 50years.
50 years I've been here.
And uh, uh, my daughter is stillhere.
(04:29):
She's, uh, now she has twogirls.
So there's, uh, myself, mydaughter, and two
granddaughters, and we do a lotof hanging out together.
I.
What's life as a grandparent?
Is it as busy as everyone saysIt is definitely as busy because
there is a little three year gapbetween the two girls and I'm
(04:53):
always the one being calledsaying, Papa, can you go here?
Papa, can we go there?
So it is, it is definitely.
And and so far, the interestingpart is they have actually taken
up my hobbies as well, so.
I, I have to put in my littleteaching part of their hobby,
(05:13):
along with hiring somebody toteach them some of the, the real
things about my hobby.
Well, you have a lot of hobbiesI like to ask on this podcast.
What's something most peopledon't know about you?
And I don't know that many ofour members quite appreciate the
vast interest that you havebetween fishing, gun collecting
(05:36):
tennis.
Where to start?
Well, you even left outta onebecause my, my third hobby is,
uh, coin collecting.
I've been collecting coins nowfor about 10 years, that's been
intriguing because I've, my twograndkids like that hobby as
well.
Really?
That's one that they've, yes,yes.
Yeah, they've caught on to thathobby.
(05:58):
As well as tennis, they caughton to those two hobbies in my
life so that it keeps me very,very well connected with them.
Are you a tennis pro?
You teach, teach lessons,correct?
I teach lessons only to certainpeople.
my dream in life when I firststarted tennis was, you know,
you gotta have a a, a goal outthere.
(06:19):
My goal was always to Wimbledon.
I tore my Achilles heels and I,I, I got messed up, so I stopped
and, and stuff, so I didn't makethat part.
So all of a sudden, the teachingthat I do is with youth groups.
We have a, a organization in inMinnesota called the Martin
(06:40):
Luther King Tennis Club.
I teach out of that group'causewe bring in summer camp kids to
teach tennis to, and that'swhere I do most of my teaching.
At How long have you playedtennis?
Did that start as a young age orwhen you were No, no.
It actually started after I cameout Vietnam and uh, I was home
(07:01):
in.
I went to this tennis court.
I wanted to learn to play itearly.
But you know how sometimes yougo to the park and you see these
boards where you can hit upagainst the wall?
Yes.
Well, every time I hit the ball,it went over the board, so I
couldn't, I couldn't.
So finally something said, youneed to learn this game.
(07:23):
So I met some folk.
In the Martin Luther King tennisbox.
I started learning.
Then I took some privatelessons, more private lessons,
and then that, that started meon my way.
Been been playing ever since.
Been playing ever since.
Have you ever played on grass atWimbledon or compared the clay
to grass?
To just the regular?
I had an opportunity to play on,on, it wasn't grass.
(07:46):
It was, it was, it would've beenclay.
Dirt on a, on a, on a dirtsurface in Georgia.
How was it?
Is it weird?
Is it, does it play the same?
It's it just slower.
Slower.
It's slower.
Okay.
The, the fastest court is the,is is the concrete court.
Uh, the, the, the, the regularred clay that you see on TV is
(08:07):
slower, is the slowest court.
The one in the middle would bethe grass.
Is it slippery?
Is it, does that no injuriesoccur on when you get on the
clay or no?
Not much.
Not much.
Because what they do is they,they groom it very well and
before they get ready for theplaying starts, they dry.
It's dry.
So you don't do a lot.
(08:28):
Yeah.
Sometimes people do slip it itBut, but it's not often.
Okay.
Let's talk about fishing.
I know of a few brothers andfriends that have gone fishing
with you and have said it's,it's not just simply casting and
sitting there.
You are a serious bassfisherman.
Yes, yes.
I been, up until this summer, Itraveled probably to.
(08:56):
Four tournaments a year outsideof the state of Minnesota.
And, and so I wind up fishing onwhat is known as the FLW
circuit, uh, which is a, a a amedium, not a medium, but a
sidebar to the National BassAssociation League.
(09:17):
it's, it's very difficult.
It is hard work.
And I can remember all the yearsthat I've been fishing and I
lived around my neighbors andthey would say, oh, bring me a
couple of fish back.
I said, no way.
I throw'em back in the water.
I'm tired when I come home.
So it's, it's different.
(09:37):
And the reason why I stillprobably have, fishing as my
number one, uh, hobby is simplybecause.
Um, when you, when you, I fishspecifically for one species of
fish, which is bath and what ithas done for me, it, it allows
you to do numerous things, inother words, techniques, while
(10:02):
you are on the water.
And it is really fascinatingthat you can be on the same lake
and you use three or fourdifferent techniques to catch
the fish.
Because the fishes fish arepocket into one area in another
area, they could be schooling updifferently and you have to use
(10:23):
different techniques to catch'em.
And that's what really intriguesme is because I, I, I never
wanted to be a fisherman that,that, that just setting one of
those spots and try to wait on afish to come to me.
But that's what, what makes itinteresting.
You move around, you trydifferent techniques and it goes
really well.
Time really flies.
(10:46):
I realized what a novice I am inthe fishing department having
grown up.
We go to Big Pine Lake nearPerham, Minnesota.
It would just be, sit there,drift.
Mm-hmm.
And hope.
Mm-hmm.
Cross your fingers.
Well there, there was somemarkers out there, but I had no
idea that there was such a depthof technique and process to
(11:07):
this.
It is a very strong.
Um, technique and process, butat the present time, competition
is really, really strong simplybecause what is happening in the
fishing world, period is theworld of electronics, just like
(11:27):
the world itself has become atechnological world.
Fishing has become a technologyworld.
There are some guys who you willgo on their boat and they'll
have five different screens thatthey're looking at.
They're doing five differentthings in the water.
Like what?
Beyond the depth finder.
What else was It is a, it is adepth finder, but they're also
(11:50):
called, for example, there'sanother depth finder out there
that's called the 360, because adepth finder.
From the actual screen, it takesyou down a cone and you are only
looking at a certain part.
But a 360 now gives you thevision all the way around your
boat to see where the fishreally are.
(12:11):
Wow.
And so you could, you canactually move them from that.
And, and, and they also, theother important thing today
about the electronics is bathwill move.
On, they like solid ground,solid sand.
(12:32):
So the screens will now tell youwhat's by color variation, where
you, what, what is on the bottomof the lake?
Is this unique to bass only?
Is this applied to Northerns andwalleye and other It applies
because everybody's getting intothis electronic thing.
Okay.
Yes.
Yes.
(12:53):
And, and.
I, I think I'm so, I ha I haveto say it this way.
I'm sort of good at it, butbecause I don't have all the
electronics that a lot of guyshave, but what they actually do
is, is you are getting very,very close to the fact of going
(13:17):
to the death finders.
And now being able to tell, tellyou what species that is in the
water.
No kidding.
Yes.
And it's not just by size andthe shape of the fish.
I'm telling you, these screens,they, these, they are coming up
with some awesome pictures thatwill get you very, very close.
(13:37):
How do you feel about that?
Does that spoil the process,the, the technique involved?
Is it, is it too, does anyonefeel like this is.
Too much insight.
There is, there is, there is alot of fight going on out there
at the present time.
As a matter of fact, the BASS,which is the um, uh, national
Bass Association, they actuallyare limiting the amounts of
(14:00):
electronics you can have on yourboat for a fishing tournament
because there are, there,there's everybody you know with,
you buy a boat.
And you got 5, 6, 7 pieces ofelectronic on your boat that
equipment alone could probablyput you somewhere around 20,
$30,000 or more just for theelectronics.
(14:22):
And so some of the guys who areused to fishing don't use all of
that stuff.
They like the old way of, let mego find the fish.
Okay.
I can picture someone showing upat a competition and being that
guy that has the boat justloaded down with.
Way too much on the electronicand technology side.
(14:42):
It, it can happen.
But, but, um, when, when theystarted making these changes,
they put'em in rules.
They just don't say no more.
When you, when you, when you'reout there fishing on the BASS
circuit or the FLW circuit, theyhave what is known as the
tournament rules.
(15:02):
It's gonna be right there in therules of what you can and cannot
have.
So the guy could come with that,in other words, but he's got to
disconnect some of that.
Sure.
Before he could actually usethat boat.
Where's the next tournament?
Where are you headed next toAlabama.
in the middle of May to LakeGunther.
It might be a little steamy inAlabama by, uh, next month.
It's gonna be steamy in Alabama.
(15:24):
But I, I, the good part aboutgoing to this tournament is
that's where my baby brotherlived.
Oh, not too far from that.
He's about an hour from thelake.
So I'll, I'll get to, toactually hang out with him for a
while.
I'll pre fish him for a whilewhen I go outta state.
It's normally a 14 day tripbecause you want to expend at
(15:45):
least seven to eight days ofpracticing on that water.
No kidding.
Yeah.
A week.
Yes.
And so he'll help you with thator he'll join you.
Your brother will he'll join me.
He'll join me.
Okay.
And what we do is we'll use ourelectronics to get where we need
to get because it is a true factthat that, that the fish.
(16:05):
Uh, you won't find them all overthe lake.
They're gonna be in certainpockets, in certain areas.
And what you want to do in yourpre, in your planning is
eliminate all the, what we calldead water.
No fish in them that you wannafish.
So that's why we go and spendthat time.
Grandkids get into fishing.
You said they were into the coincollecting any family that
(16:26):
wanted to be a part of this too.
The grand fit grandkids onlyinto fishing at the introductory
stage.
In other words, they like panfishing.
Okay.
So I live on, I, I have anoutlet to a lake at my house.
Uh, and that's when they comeand that's when I, I teach them
what I know because that's alsohow I started learning how to
pan and fish.
And then you go from there.
(16:48):
But, uh, at the present time.
I don't think neither.
It'll be a hobby to them morethan me, because one wants to be
an actress and the other one isinto, uh, um, forgot what, what
my oldest one college major isat the moment, but it'll come to
me.
(17:08):
How, how old are they?
Uh, my oldest, my granddaughteris 17 and the young one is 15.
Fun age, I would imagine.
And they're open to age.
Yes.
And you're a gun collector?
Yes.
When did that start?
When I went to college.
what happened when I went tocollege was the fact that I went
to Cornell and Cornell is inIthaca, New York.
(17:31):
Not to be confused with theCornell in Iowa.
That's right.
Yes, that's right.
That's right.
So, so when I got there, I wasusing my GI bill.
But I wanted to, I needed tomake a little money, so I got a
summer job at the Ithaca GunCompany, and they had at one the
summer that I was there, theyhad a gun show, and that's when
(17:55):
I got hooked.
What were you doing in your jobwith them?
Assembling guns.
No kidding Shotguns.
It's got Ithaca guns or shotgunson the assembly line.
Yes.
it was just fun doing it.
And that got you hooked.
That got me hooked and the firstthing that, that, that really
hooked me was the fact that Iadmired the, uh, the double
(18:15):
barrel shotgun because in theold version when I was there, it
was side by side.
Now the new version is.
So it, it was really just thatthing and being a part, being
able to, to feel it, to be apart of it was something that I
wanted.
And I said, oh, I gotta, I gottahave these.
(18:37):
And my actual, my parents cameto my graduation and that's what
they actually brought me, boughtme, was mine that a gun that I
had seen.
Did you get to try the.
New things as they came out whenyou worked there?
No.
Did they?
No.
They didn't have a range.
You could go Nothing.
Okay.
No, it, it, I was actually inthe assembly plant.
(18:57):
So it was all parts and labored?
Yes.
At that particular time.
And then that's just grown overthe years.
Your collection, it had grown,grown over the years.
Pistols, rifles?
Nope.
Nope.
Only shotguns.
Only shotguns.
I only, I only actually own onepistol.
That's all I own is one pistol.
Never have really wanted on, butI've always collected, uh,
shotguns.
(19:18):
How often are you at gun showsor at other, do you have no
other collectors?
Has that turned into a smallnetwork of friends and, and
collector?
That's what actually happened tome here in Minnesota.
I, I met four or five guys thatwere collectors and what we
actually did was we moved to,we, we traveled around in the
state to Wisconsin, to Iowa.
(19:40):
They have, they have gun showsall the time, all around uh, you
are always looking to see.
What's new, what's old?
But my collecting of guns isreally not probably the way a
normal collector would look atit.
It's more so about I like this,you know, it was like the one
(20:00):
that my parents brought me theside by side.
I mean, I don't own a overunder.
I don't own a double bear over,under, no, I don't own it.
It's, it's just so, it's justthat feeling and just that, just
that technique.
That's all.
So one of my questions was goingto be what's something most
people don't know about you?
And we have learned, I havelearned a lot, I've known you
(20:21):
for a number of years.
This is, this is why we do this.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I, and I think as, as Imentioned when we started, the
other one was, was, uh, wascollecting coins.
Yes.
I got into coin collecting.
Just because I started reading abook about coins, and I think
(20:44):
the fascinating part about coinsto me is I don't think nobody in
America realized unless you workat a place like this, how many
coins in the world There reallyis.
So I, I was reading this bookand the title, title of this
book is Get Rich with YourPocket Change.
(21:07):
And it tells you about the factthat some of the, the most
precious coins out there arestill in people's pocket.
Okay.
They're still in circulation.
Yes.
I mean, as long as, for example,let me give you a very quick
one.
The, the easy one is the LincolnPenny.
Lincoln Penny has been inexistence since 1909.
(21:31):
And there are not millions ofLincoln's pennies.
There are trillions of them, butthere are several coins.
And what make coins this, thesecoins unique is an era has been
made on the coin and on the 1909coin, the one thing that happens
(21:52):
is there is a designer of thecoin and he gets to put his
initials on the coin.
Right under the date, and on the1909, there were two batches
made.
One without, which was an errorand one with, so you could have
(22:14):
a 1909 in this hand and it'd beworth millions of dollars.
You could have a 1909 In thishand, it is only worth a penny.
That's how, that's, that's whatmakes it interesting to me.
So it's, it's a constant.
Looking and examining coins toknow what it's worth.
How many coins do youapproximately own?
(22:39):
Probably about 3,500, and that'san assortment of pennies.
I only like pennies, quarter andquarters, and now I've gone
strictly into silver.
Because now the other thingabout coins is the most precious
content, which is silver and,and you, you have to, all coins
(23:03):
don't have 99.9% silver.
And so knowing that, so I wentback into the books and that, I
figured out which of that.
So what happens is it's likemaking an investment.
I have all these coins and yousay they worth$3,500.
No, they're not, because theprice started at what is the
(23:25):
market of an ounce of silvertoday.
Sure.
So that makes it very, veryinteresting.
Have you ever been at a coinshow or with a collector and had
a, a nice surprise that you haveone in your possession that's
worth far more than you everanticipated?
No.
'cause I examined them withcoins very thoroughly of what I
got.
But what I, what I do have, I dohave.
(23:49):
I think I'm very much aware ofmine because there's enough
value to those coins and becausethey're all in my house, I have
to know what the insurance priceI need.
Sure.
I have, all of them are insured.
I.
The only some of my coins now, Ibegin to give off to my, to my
two granddaughters.
Once they learn, they are bothinto, into the, the baby is into
(24:13):
the young one, in other words isinto Penny's, and my oldest one
is into quarters.
And I have not turned loose anyof my silver dollars yet.
Okay.
So that's, that's the biggestpart of my collection.
That must be fun watching themdiscover this whole process.
Oh yeah.
Oh yeah.
One thing we haven't discussedspecifically yet today is what
(24:34):
led to your interest in becominga Freemason?
Now that's a very interesting,stubborn story.
If I had to say so myself.
I had, when I moved toMinnesota, I met this, this
brother.
His name was Robert Starkey.
And Robert Starkey was afisherman, so I'm on this
(24:59):
fishing boat with him.
One day we were just outfishing, we were just out having
fun.
This is before I really, reallygot started in the fishing and,
and, and, and.
Let me, let me, let me say thisas I make this piece is, is the
fact that I used to call, wecall him sloping Bob, so I might
use that phrase.
So Robert Starkey is slopingBob.
(25:22):
So I was on this boat with Boband he was, he was, he was on
the trolling motor and he handedme this little card and the card
said, what is a mason?
I said, he said, Hmm, read this.
I said, okay.
(25:42):
So I read the card and then Igave it back to him and he said,
what do you think?
I said, what about the card?
I said, yeah, it looksinteresting.
He said, so this is aboutMasonry, so what do you think?
I said, yeah, it's a good idea.
So at that particular point intime, he must know he gonna talk
(26:03):
me into it.
'cause he handed me a petition.
I've been a Mason ever since.
That's how I got started.
That's, that's my startingblock.
Slopping Bob introduced me toMasonry.
Well, we're grateful forslopping Bob Absolutely.
For having that conversation.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
You've done so many things forthe craft over the past 30 plus
(26:28):
years.
To the outsider, we summarizefree masonry as authentic
friendship, personaldevelopments, building
community.
How should we best pursue doingthose things and not just
talking about those things.
I think the one thing that, thatwe as Masons, uh, having a
(26:54):
struggling problem with today isrecruitment.
And I had a, a mason to say thisto me one time.
He said, you know, masonry is abelly to belly thing.
You, you want to, you, you, youneed to meet a, a, a man,
(27:14):
examine his character, and theninvite him to be a mason.
That's belly to belly.
That to me has been the, theturning point for me and where I
stand because I, I see our craftnot at the present time
following just that one littletechnique.
(27:36):
Uh, we had so many masons yearago that we didn't have to look,
and now that we are startinglooking, we, we are forgetting
the teaching part that we needto be teaching the incoming
masons that they need to asktheir friends.
I.
Asking a friend is still bellyto belly asking a friend part of
(27:57):
that bigger relationshipbuilding process.
I think this gets misunderstooda lot, that we don't advocate
going out to a perfect strangerand saying, Hey, stranger, come
and join this, but someone thatwe know well, yeah, someone that
we can vouch for.
Yeah.
And say, Hey, this is a good,good pain.
Good man, good person who.
Really already maybe embracessome of our core values, have
(28:21):
that conversation.
what I keep seeing is such ayearning for what we stand for.
I.
We can't assume that everyone'sseeing our websites and our
resources or our social mediapresence understand what that
means.
Right.
To your point, belly to belly.
Have the conversation.
Got to have that conversation.
Yeah.
Why haven't you asked me aboutmy Masonic cloud?
(28:42):
What level of interest do youhave in learning more?
Kinda like slop and bomb, right?
That's what he did.
That's what he did.
He asked me and he found out andhe, so that was a good thing.
And I, I think that the realturn of where we are today, I.
Is, you know, we can look backover our history and we can say
(29:03):
at one point in time we had70,000 masons and all that was
about.
Belly to belly.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, you could, you, you gotto imagine that that's what it
was, simply because there was notelephone, no cell phones.
These, these brothers was goingon a horse and carriage and
(29:23):
talking to people.
And I think that's the big thingthat, that, that we have lost a
little love and, and we need to,I think time changes things, but
communication never changes.
No matter how you do it, I meane even if, if your best friend
(29:44):
is a friend that you talk to onthe telephone all the time, it
doesn't mean you still can'tintroduce him to the term of
masonry.
Mm-hmm.
It's the fact that you didn'ttalk about it.
You have to start thatconversation.
The person that is a Mason, weare the original social network.
Death predating all of thattechnology and no matter how
(30:08):
connected we might feel in thatvirtual online sense, that never
substitutes face-to-face, friendto friend.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I'm gonna pose a couple ofrandom questions to you.
Okay.
In, in the pursuit of getting toknow you better.
What seemingly small thingchanged your life forever?
(30:36):
Are we talking in terms ofmasonry or just my life?
Yeah, anything.
Vietnam.
Vietnam was the biggest changerin my life.
Um, I go, I fight.
I do think that a lot of peopledon't realize that I would, I'm
(30:56):
in the infantry in other, all Idid in Vietnam was carry a gun.
All I did in Vietnam was shootat people.
All I did in Vietnam was getshot at.
And then I come home and I haveto, to um, readjust and I can't
remember being at the Thinkcloud va.
(31:20):
And one of the socialpsychologists actually said to
me, he said, you, you were only18 when that was happening, so
you should be done.
Got over that, and I had to lookat him and I had to say to
myself, I said, wait a minute.
No matter what it is, if youkill somebody, no matter how it
(31:41):
was done, you don't forget thatman.
I didn't ever see thatpsychologist again.
I told, I told everybody becausehe didn't understand the fact
that this is not something thatchanged, that happens to you.
This is something that changesyour life forever.
Not for day.
Forever.
Forever.
Forever.
(32:01):
Yeah.
Yes, yes.
So that's my biggest change.
But other than that, I'velearned to adjust.
I mean, the good thing about me,I had some loving parents.
When I came home from Vietnam, Ithink I stayed, no, no farther
than my parents' yard for almostsix or eight months.
(32:23):
So by the time I got home and,and went through those six or
eight months, people hadrecognized me being home.
So they didn't ask me manyquestions, and so I was able to,
I've been able to live my lifebecause a lot of people don't
know that I'm a veteran.
So I let it, I just let it pass,and you let it lay and you don't
talk about it.
(32:45):
And that's what the way I'velearned to live my life thank
you for your service to thiscountry.
Well, I think one of the biggestthings about about that is just
like I said, a lot of peopledon't recognize that, um, you
know, you say, well, you're inthe service and you say, yeah.
And I says, where in Vietnam,everybody in Vietnam don't have
(33:08):
to carry, didn't carry a gun.
I mean, the supply people thatwere people that stayed in a
secure camp, but I mean, my lifewas in the jungle all the time.
I.
It, it was, it was, it was very,very different.
If you could ask any livingperson a question and be assured
(33:31):
of a true answer, who would youask?
Who would I ask?
It would really depend upon thequestion.
If I was asking a question aboutMasonry, I would ask the people,
(33:52):
the two brothers that started mealong my way, Jerry Johnson and
Russ Meister.
If it was about my life, I'dprobably be questioning myself.
And making sure that I was onthe right path.
Um, I think I, I, I, I say thatsimply because I'm the oldest of
(34:17):
the group in my house, so Idon't know.
But, but my, my question is al,my thing would always be what's
the question?
And then I would know the rightperson to go to if it was really
something more than anythingelse, I'd go to my pastor.
And, and, and I look at, at, atRust and Mice, Russ and Jerry,
(34:41):
as the two men in my life whostarted me on my Masonic
journey, they saw in mesomething that I think I don't
see in myself.
They saw leadership in me that Ididn't even know about, and they
started me in these jobs, uh,which was, at that time the, uh,
uh, I would, my first job inMasonry was a Dr.
(35:03):
And then, then I took over forRuss at the district rep at, I
mean, not at the district rep asthe area deputy.
And so those kind of thingsstarted me.
And from that work I got to, touh, the next person that came
in, I came in contact with, withNeil.
Neil, Neil Meyer Nemeyer.
Mm-hmm.
The late Neil Nemeyer and myMasonic term, we called him my,
(35:26):
my fraternal father.
And.
He also saw things in me that Ididn't see, and he started me.
And that's what started myMasonic journey into, uh, being,
um, um, becoming the grandma.
When I think about Jerry Russand our late friend and brother
Neil, true gems.
(35:48):
Mm-hmm.
And such, such pillars.
But it is another testament tothat.
Unintentional mentoring thathappens in the moment that we
That's correct.
You don't even realize it.
That is correct.
They see something in you.
Yep.
And we hopefully are doing thatnow for our younger generation.
Mm-hmm.
That identifying that guy's gotsomething.
Yes.
And how do we help encouragehim, buoy him up and cultivate
(36:14):
whether it's being a leader.
Or an influencer or someone whotruly is that Mason in their
heart first.
And, and especially in, in our,in in today's times, that's
really how you have to look atit, because the, the one thing I
see in Young Masons today is thefact that they love it.
(36:39):
They, they want to be Masons,but.
Their shortcoming is coming intothe lodge and doing the work,
and when they go out, theyforget that they're masons.
You know, I, I, I think that'sthe biggest thing that's
happening, and I think that'sbecause we as, as, as their
(37:04):
leaders are not doing enough to,to get them down that road of
saying.
Masonry is a way of life.
It is not just coming into yourlodge.
It's about your being a truemason and following the tenets
of masonry, brotherly love,relief and truth.
(37:24):
And I think that's what we haveto do.
And we have to, we, we, we areat that point of finding young
men, but we not quitecultivating them to that
standard.
They would because I think.
We sometimes look at because theworld changes so fast, we are
looking too much at, okay, theworld's changed.
We don't have to do thatanymore.
(37:45):
No, Uhuh belly and belly tobelly will never go away when it
comes to masonry, because that'sthe true grit.
Because the, the, the one thing,the difference today is you have
to teach, give the man theknowledge of what masonry is so
that when he goes home.
(38:06):
And he talks to his wife.
His wife got to agree to it toosometimes, because it is no
longer the man.
It's, it's about a, a shared,shared relationship in a
marriage today.
So you have to take it veryevery way you can.
There's definitely anopportunity for us to help
(38:27):
advise counsel on being a masonall the time.
Tolerance, brotherly love reliefon social media outside of the
lodge setting.
It's not just something we dowhen we get together and have a
meeting.
Right.
It's something, is it in yourheart then?
Your heart, or is it justsomething you just say the
(38:49):
words?
Mm-hmm.
Where, where the merch.
Mm-hmm.
I, I agree with that very muchbecause given the number of
years that I've been in masonry,one thing, one thing that I, I,
I, you can notice.
Especially even doing ourdegrees.
There are some guys, these youngguys, they love it.
(39:11):
I mean, they just love it.
They, they, it's unbelievablethe way they can handle
learning.
All of the stuff that theylearn, sometimes they stop
because again, when they go outthat door, they forget that
they're masons.
It's like, it's like beingalmost in a theater sometimes.
(39:33):
You know?
This is, no, this is nottheatrical.
The words that you're saying isa way of life, not a theater.
So that's the, that's what weare going through at the present
time.
Learning how to tear down thatwall to, to make sure it's a
part of that young man's life.
John L.
Cook, Jr.
(39:54):
It has been a pleasure havingyou in studio today.
I feel like we could talk forhours.
Oh yeah, I, I agree with you,but it's only a short period of
time.
We'll do it again.
We will do it again.
We'll do it again.
But it's, it's nice outside.
There's tennis to be played.
There's fishing equipment to beworked, worked on before your
next trip.
(40:14):
But thank you for coming instudio and I can't wait to do
this again.
Your mother.
Welcome.
I appreciate you very much forhaving me.
And this has been anotherepisode of Minnesota Masonic
Histories and Mysteries.
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