July 9, 2025 • 46 mins
Mission Prep Class 7: "Temple More Imperative Than Your Mission," delves into foundational doctrines crucial for missionaries and members alike, emphasizing the paramount importance of temple preparation over mission preparation.
Understanding the "great dilemma" that necessitates Jesus Christ and His Atonement.
Key concepts explored include:
•The Great Dilemma: Introduced as described by Stephen Robinson in his book Believing Christ, this dilemma highlights the reality faced by all individuals. It is defined by two core scriptures:
◦Moses 6:55-57: States that "no unclean thing can enter the presence of God". The discussion uses an analogy of paint on a shirt to illustrate that even a single speck of "uncleanliness" prevents entry into God's presence, regardless of how much "paint" others might have. This law is presented as a just, eternal law with affixed punishments and blessings.
◦Romans 3:23: Declares, "For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God". Combined, these scriptures mean that every individual, no matter how obedient, is inherently unworthy to enter God's presence on their own.
•The Law of Works vs. The Law of the Gospel: The episode draws a clear distinction between two types of "law" mentioned in scripture.
◦The "Law of Sin and Death" (or "Law of Works"): This refers to the idea that one could achieve worthiness to enter God's presence solely through perfect obedience to commandments. The sources describe this as a "cursed law" that leads to misery, condemnation, and spiritual death, because no one can keep all commandments perfectly. It's acknowledged that this burden of trying to be perfect can lead to mental health issues. Abraham, for instance, was considered righteous not because he was perfect, but because he believed and repented.
◦The "Law of the Spirit of Life in Jesus Christ" (or "Law of the Gospel"): This is the "good news" that overcomes the "bad news" of the law of works. It teaches that Christ takes the fixed punishment for broken laws. This law is founded on faith in Jesus Christ, repentance, baptism, and the gift of the Holy Ghost. Through this, individuals are "justified by faith without the deeds of the law". The discussion also references the April 2023 General Conference talk "The Imperfect Harvest," which clarifies the difference between perfectionism and being perfected in Christ—the latter being a process guided by the Holy Ghost.
•Salvation vs. Exaltation: The podcast emphasizes a critical distinction between these two concepts, which many in the church may not fully understand.
◦Salvation: Defined as being saved from the "great dilemma" through the law of the gospel, overcoming spiritual (separation from God) and physical (separation of body and spirit) death, and being brought back into God's presence. Salvation is described as "free" because of Christ's Atonement. It means being saved into one of the kingdoms of glory (celestial, terrestrial, or telestial).
◦Exaltation: This is the "highest level of the celestial kingdom" and the ultimate purpose of the Church. It is uniquely linked to the concept of "eternal lives" (plural), as found in Doctrine and Covenants 132:23-24. Exaltation signifies eternal progression, a "chain of glory," and the power for "god-like creation". Crucially, it cannot be achieved by an individual alone; it requires entering the "new and everlasting covenant of marriage" in the temple, which is the capstone covenant.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
The good news is Christ comes in and says, I
realize that you're not going tokeep all those commandments.
So they have fixed punishment toeach of those laws.
I'll take it so that you don'thave to.
Okay.
Okay.
Welcome back to Mission PrepSeries Podcast.
We're today going to focus onprinciple number seven, and this
(00:20):
is exciting.
Now, Lauren.
Hello, Lauren.
SPEAKER_01 (00:23):
Hello, everyone.
SPEAKER_00 (00:25):
Now, what just happened?
Because as we were prepping forthis, we were I just grabbed
from the little candy tray herea little KitKat and I opened it
up and I took a bite.
And why did you...
SPEAKER_01 (00:35):
Dude, this guy's a psychopath.
SPEAKER_00 (00:38):
Why?
SPEAKER_01 (00:39):
Why?
Okay, a KitKat is designed soit's breakable in the middle in
a vertical fashion.
You don't just bite into it.
SPEAKER_00 (00:48):
To both of them?
SPEAKER_01 (00:49):
No, you rip one apart and just eat it stick by
stick.
SPEAKER_00 (00:52):
You sheep.
Don't be a sheep.
What is the first principle ofthe Mission Prep series?
Choose your own path.
Don't let others dictate howyou're going to do things.
I can eat my Kit Kat however Iwould like to eat
SPEAKER_01 (01:03):
the Kit Kat.
Okay, but I'm actually not goingto start this with you.
SPEAKER_00 (01:07):
Okay.
There's a right way and a wrongway, huh?
SPEAKER_01 (01:10):
That's some freak behavior.
SPEAKER_00 (01:11):
Is this communist Russia?
Where are we?
We're in the U.S.
Yeah, so I can eat my propertythe way I want.
I have my freedom of
SPEAKER_01 (01:18):
speech to call you out, boy.
SPEAKER_00 (01:22):
I'm just kidding.
All right, well, let's makefriends and let's get back on
topic.
But that was interesting howsurprised you were that I ate my
KitKat that way.
But we're here to do missionprep.
We're here to do mission prep.
And this topic is the last.
This is the topic that we do inthe last class.
And I really enjoyed doing thisone because really the message
here, the principle here is thetemple...
(01:44):
that you're about to go through,those of you listening and
preparing for your mission, isby far more important than your
mission.
And for some reason in ourculture, we kind of go, oh my
goodness, we're going to serve amission and we get all excited
about it as we should.
But then at the end we go, oh,and by the way, you're going to
go into the temple and receivesome ordinances and enter into
(02:05):
some covenants that will affectyour eternal exaltation.
But just do that on the side.
And that's the wrong way to viewthings.
And so this principle is if youreally properly prepare for the
temple, there's nothing betterthat will prepare you for your
mission.
So we're going to get into thatand why and how and all that
kind of stuff.
But we're going to start withthe big picture.
(02:27):
So the concept here is really wewant to teach you why the temple
is so important and so much moreimportant than the mission.
The why is really what we'regoing to get into here.
So to do that, we're going toset the backdrop, give some
context.
And I like to start off bytalking about what Stephen
(02:50):
Robinson, that author, is thatright?
Yeah.
What he calls in the book,Believing Christ, what he calls
the great dilemma, the dilemma.
Now, he calls it that becauseeach of you listeners listening,
right?
You're graduating high school.
You're moving along in life.
There's a point where you'regoing to sit down and the
reality of the world is going tohit you and go, oh my goodness,
(03:10):
like I'm on my own.
Like I'm about to leave and beon my own in some weird place
that I've never been before.
And it's me, it's me alone.
I'm not living at home.
I don't have parents right overmy shoulder.
It's me.
And in that reality, you'regoing to start to obviously look
at the world in a bigger way.
And this new perspective isreally great.
(03:31):
Like there's nothing better thatwe could do as we're growing up.
One of these core ideas orconcepts that changed my life
was understanding what thisgreat dilemma was.
Because if we can understandwhat it is that we need to be
saved from, then the wholegospel makes sense, right?
We talk about, we grew up in thechurch and we talk about
salvation or exaltation, butReally, very few of us at an
(03:53):
early age can articulate, whatare we being saved from?
Well, our sins.
Yeah, but what does that mean?
It's hard to kind of get down.
So we're going to start withthat context so we can have an
understanding.
If you start right, you'll endright.
So we are going to talk aboutthis great dilemma.
Now, Lauren, there's twoscriptures.
One is in Moses, one's inRomans.
Now, these two scripturesperfectly express what great
(04:18):
dilemma you listeners face.
Like this is the big problemthat you face.
Do you have one of those,Lauren, that you can read?
SPEAKER_01 (04:24):
What's the one in Moses?
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
Moses 6, 55 to 57.
SPEAKER_01 (04:27):
And the Lord spake unto Adam, saying, And as much
as thy children are conceived insin, even so when they begin to
grow up, sin conceiveth in theirhearts, and they taste the
bitter that they may know toprize the good.
And it is given unto them toknow good from evil.
Wherefore they are agents untothemselves, and I have given
unto you another law andcommandment.
Wherefore, teach it unto yourchildren, that all men ever must
(04:51):
repent, or they can in no wiseinherit the kingdom of God.
For no unclean thing can dwellthere, or dwell in his presence.
For in the language of Adam, manof holiness is his name, and the
name of his only begotten is theSon of Man, even Jesus Christ, a
righteous judge who shall comein the meridian of time.
SPEAKER_00 (05:08):
Okay, so lots of doctrine in there, but the one I
want to focus on, really focuson, is the one that says, and
this is the law, No uncleanthing can enter the presence of
God.
He's holy.
And if you're even slightlyunholy, no unclean thing can
enter the presence of God.
Now, here's a good question,Lauren.
Let's compare the two of ourlives, okay?
(05:30):
And it is well known that I'vebeen on the earth a little
longer than you, yet I havesinned way less than you.
So let's just say...
Let's say I do a decent jobgoing through life, and I sin 10
times is all.
Just 10.
Okay?
Now, at your young age, I'vebeen counting, your parents have
(05:51):
been counting, and you're atabout 10,968.
Awesome.
Thank you.
Well done, I guess.
Thank you.
So the question is this.
Based on what we just read, thislaw that says no unclean thing
can enter the presence of God,who's more worthy in that
hypothetical scenario?
The person that's sinned 10times or the person that's
sinned 11,000 times to enter thepresence of God?
What do you say?
SPEAKER_01 (06:10):
Neither.
Let
SPEAKER_00 (06:14):
me ask you the question again because clearly
you did not understand.
One of us has only sinned 10times.
The other has sinned 11,000times.
Who's more worthy to be in thepresence of God?
SPEAKER_01 (06:27):
If you spill paint on your shirt, but I spill a
little bit more, are both of ourshirts still dirty?
Yes.
Yeah.
So it doesn't matter how manytimes I've sinned in comparison
to how many times you havesinned.
We are both unclean.
SPEAKER_00 (06:44):
Let's go with the paint and the shirt analogy.
We knock on the door and go,Mom, we got paint on us.
Please let us in so we can getcleaned up.
And she opens the door and shelooks at me who has...
an inch circle on my shoulderand she looks at you and you're
just drenched in it, hairdripping, paint all over the
(07:04):
place.
Who's more worthy to enter thehouse?
Who's more worthy?
Who's mom going to say, you'renot coming in, come on in?
SPEAKER_01 (07:12):
It doesn't matter which one of us has less paint
on us because the rule is thatwe don't come in if there's any
paint on us whatsoever.
SPEAKER_00 (07:18):
There's an answer to this bad news.
The bad news is this greatdilemma.
And the great dilemma is definedby two scriptures.
The first one we just read,which is no unclean thing can
enter the presence of God.
So I had said to you, but okay,let's analyze this law.
No unclean thing.
Okay, that literally means thatI could have one little splatter
on my shirt and you could havethe whole bucket poured over
your head.
And isn't it a little bit unfairthat mom's going to be like,
(07:42):
you're both out.
But mom, it's only on myshoulder.
Like, I'm not going to get overthe house.
No, you're out.
Don't come in.
Is that not a little unfair?
I don't know.
I
SPEAKER_01 (07:54):
mean, I guess in our eyes, it's a little unfair, but
like, if you think about it inlike legal terms on like a
criminal record, if somebodyrobs a bank, but another person
kills a couple of people, theyboth go on your record.
Like you're both being heldaccountable for whatever you did
that made you unworthy orunclean.
SPEAKER_00 (08:13):
Good.
So fairness is defined by law,right?
Just because objectively orsubjectively, I'm like, well,
that doesn't seem fair.
It A law exists, whatever thatlaw is.
And if it's a just law, is itAlma or Nephi that describes
that where there's a law,there's a punishment and there's
a blessing, right?
For every law, there's anaffixed punishment and an
(08:34):
affixed blessing.
That is just eternal nature ofthings.
And when we're dealing with thelaw, the only thing that's fair
is what is the just response tothat law.
If I keep it, then there's acertain blessing tied to it.
If I break it, there's a certainpunishment tied to it.
That's fair.
(08:55):
Whether I think it's fair ornot, it doesn't matter, right?
So if the law literally says youcannot enter this home with
paint on you, not even a speckof paint, if that's just the law
and it's a just law, then yeah,neither of us can enter the
house.
It doesn't matter how much paintyou have or how much paint I
have.
And that is the law that isdefined in this scripture we
just read in Moses.
(09:15):
No unclean thing can enter thepresence of God, not with one
sin, and not with a thousandsins.
In fact, Paul, the apostle Pauleven said it like this.
He says, if you're guilty ofone, you're guilty of all
because of this law.
So I'm not going to pretend tounderstand the nature of this
law.
Like, sure, my subjective viewof things is that doesn't seem
very fair if I do a better jobthan you do throughout my life.
(09:37):
But I think part of the reasonfor this law is it doesn't
matter.
God doesn't look at us and has achecklist for how much good you
do.
He doesn't.
The point is, He is our fatherand his plan for us is for us to
become like him.
And in order to become like him,we have to be people of
holiness.
We have to be pure.
So that's just the law.
(09:58):
Okay.
So the second part of the greatdilemma, which makes this law
even worse.
Do you have that one by chance?
This is Romans 3, 23.
It's real short.
SPEAKER_01 (10:09):
For all have sinned and come short of the glory of
God.
SPEAKER_00 (10:11):
How many have sinned?
SPEAKER_01 (10:13):
All.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
That's the dilemma.
is that you listeners, itdoesn't matter how well you're
doing, right?
It doesn't matter how obedientor faithful you are.
In fact, this refers back tothat beautiful talk in the last
conference from Sister Arunia.
God doesn't look at, it's notthis checklist of how many good
things you've done versus howmany bad things you've done.
This law, the great dilemma lawof no unclean thing can enter
(10:41):
the presence of God and everysingle one of you have sinned,
equally makes all of us unworthyto be in God's presence.
Now, question the law, don'tlike the law?
Okay, but it exists.
This is clean law.
This is just law.
And it is just, right?
If a law has a fix to punishmentand blessing and you don't keep
the law, the law's there.
So this is the great dilemma.
(11:02):
This is bad news for all of us.
So you listeners, as you facethis religion, put the atonement
aside, right?
Put faith aside and repentanceand covenants and Jesus Christ
and the atonement.
Put it all aside.
and just take a fresh look atwhy this is a dilemma for you.
It's a dilemma becausethroughout scripture, God
commands you to obey him, keepthe commandments, keep the law.
(11:27):
And that commandment to do that,you're required to do.
And if you break it just once,then you are out.
Sin and death has grasped youand you are unworthy to enter
God's presence.
Again, putting the atonementaside, putting all that aside,
you on your own, On your own,without any covenant or without
any religious relationship, onyour own, you are exposed to the
(11:52):
law, and the law condemns you.
So this is fascinating, Lauren.
I did a study on the word thelaw throughout Scripture, and
there's really two categories ofwhen the Scriptures talk about
the law.
I'll give you an example.
This is pretty fascinating.
This is really, I love this.
So in Romans 8, it says this,there is therefore now no
condemnation to them which arein Jesus Christ.
(12:13):
So again, now let's bring backin Jesus Christ.
He's saying, you're notcondemned if you walk after the
flesh, but after the spirit.
Now here's the law.
He says this, for the law of thespirit of the life in Jesus
Christ hath made me free fromthe law of sin and death.
Okay, now this is weird, right?
Because I always read inscriptures, there's one law.
There's the law of God.
(12:34):
But here it's talking about itas if there are two different
laws.
What do you think the differenceis?
It says, the law of the spiritof life in Christ hath made me
free from the law of sin anddeath.
Okay, so if the atonement didn'texist, if we put faith in Christ
aside, then that scripture wouldread differently.
It would literally just say, thelaw of sin and death makes me
(12:57):
not free, makes me captive,right?
Right?
So what do you think is thedifference between, or what is
the law of the spirit of life inJesus Christ, or the law of the
gospel?
And what is, well, let's askthat first.
What do you think the law of sinand death is?
Why is God's law called sin anddeath?
That is not a very positivespin.
If I'm explaining to someone,hey, God has a law, I'm going to
(13:19):
be like, it's a good law.
It teaches us how to be happy.
It teaches us how to become morelike him.
It's good, right?
And then you look at me and go,well, this says it's sin and
death.
In fact, a couple more.
It says...
It is the, just go through allthese tags I have in scriptures
that talks about it.
It's the law of suffering.
It's the law of sin and death.
It's the cursed law.
(13:41):
It's called the law of works.
So like 40 instances I findwhere it's really negatively
scary talking about the law.
Why do you think that is?
SPEAKER_01 (13:48):
Honestly, my take on that would be, I think it, puts
into perspective what we wouldbe subjected to if we didn't
have Jesus Christ.
Like that, the principle thatpeople rarely change unless they
(14:10):
see how it would benefit themtype of thing, where it's like,
if I don't know, or if I know myfate and I know it's something
that falls in the category ofthe law of sin and death, I'm
probably going to want to do allthat I can to avoid that, if
that makes sense.
SPEAKER_00 (14:25):
It makes sense.
if you ever talk to Protestantor evangelical or Orthodox or
Catholics, this is a fascinatingsubject.
They say there's a bigdifference between, the big
debate has been for thousands ofyears, are we saved by works or
are we saved by grace or faith?
And the fascinating thing here,so let's go to Galatians 3.11.
(14:48):
Here's what this says.
But know this, that no man isjustified by the law in the
sight of God.
No man is justified by the law.
Okay, what does that mean,Lauren?
What do you think that means?
No man is justified by God, bythe sight of God.
No man is justified by the law.
SPEAKER_01 (15:06):
None of us can keep it, so we can't be justified by
it.
SPEAKER_00 (15:09):
So back to the two principles, right?
The two scriptures that definethe great dilemma.
All of you will sin.
All of you listeners sin, nomatter how hard you try.
And because of that, you are notjustified to be in the presence
of God, right?
Right.
So when the scriptures talkabout it as the law of works,
what they're basically saying isthis.
Putting Christ aside, if youexpect from yourself to keep the
(15:32):
law perfectly or the law ofworks is what is going to make
you worthy to be in God'spresence, that is condemnation.
That is sin and death.
That is a cursed way to look atlife.
That is going to make youmiserable.
Lauren, do you...
I don't know if your generationis a little more affected by
this than past generations,but...
I do feel like this burden thatmany of you kids your age feel
(15:56):
on the mission to be obedientkind of crushes you.
Not that you shouldn't.
You should strive to beobedient.
That's the message ofscriptures.
He commands us to be obedient.
But I hear a lot of storiesabout kids going, I'm just not
that great at keeping all therules.
And maybe I'm not worthy enough.
And maybe I don't read enough orstudy enough.
There's this burden I feel thatcomes from a lot of kids today.
(16:20):
Do you see that?
SPEAKER_01 (16:21):
A
SPEAKER_00 (16:22):
lot of mental health issues are coming from this
pressure that kids feel to beperfect.
SPEAKER_01 (16:27):
Yeah, I agree.
SPEAKER_00 (16:28):
Now here's what I would say to that.
The only reason that exists isbecause you are trying to live
by the law of works.
You look at this big checklistof all these commandments and
you're just trying to keep themso rigorously and so faithfully,
but you fail.
And so this great dilemmapresses down on you because you
can't be clean and yet you thinkyou're supposed to be clean on
(16:49):
your own terms.
accord by your own works.
But this is why it's called thelaw of sin and death, the cursed
law, the law of works.
It's because when you rely onyourself, you will always be
miserable.
You will always fall short.
Okay, but at the beginning wealso read, in contrast to the
law of sin and death or the lawof works, there's something
called the law of the light orlife in Christ or the law of the
(17:13):
gospel.
It's the answer to the bad news,right?
The gospel, the word means goodnews.
And the bad news is, No uncleanthing can enter the presence of
God.
And you've all sinned.
And you're all trying to livethis law of works.
Prove, you know, get thereyourself.
That's the bad news.
You fail.
The good news is Christ comes inand says, I realize that you're
not going to keep all thosecommandments.
(17:34):
So they have fixed punishment toeach of those laws.
I'll take it so that you don'thave to.
What a guy.
So what is the message ofmissionaries?
Our one goal is to go out andteach people the law of the
gospel, which is faith, In JesusChrist, repentance, baptism, and
the gift of the Holy Ghost.
(17:54):
We're trying to teach the worldthat you are crushed by the law
of works.
You're dead.
You are forever pushed out ofthe presence of God.
We're here to deliver to you thegospel, the law of the gospel,
this plan of Jesus Christ, whichis founded in faith, repentance,
baptism, and the gift of theHoly Ghost.
So it's a beautiful thing,right?
So that's how we overcome thisgreat dilemma.
(18:16):
We go out as missionaries and weteach people to come unto
Christ.
starting with faith, and thenyour faith leads you to
repentance.
And in those conditions, Christsays, okay, let's enter into a
covenant, and I will be the onethat suffers for all those
broken laws.
So the law of works is fulfilledin Christ.
And you don't have to be subjectto the law of works, just to
(18:36):
faith and repentance and thesecovenants.
SPEAKER_01 (18:39):
And something that I ran into a lot as a missionary,
and I'm sure that you ran intothis as well a couple times,
Sean, is...
Oftentimes, kind of how you weretalking about earlier,
missionaries put pressure onthemselves for not being
perfectly obedient.
I think a lot of the people thatI was able to teach felt that
same way.
Obviously, they weren'tmissionaries, but in the sense
where they wanted to enter intothis covenant with Christ, but
(19:02):
they didn't fully understandthis principle, this law of the
gospel.
And so maybe they didn't saytheir prayers one day, they
weren't reading theirscriptures, or they couldn't
stop smoking for whatever Xamount of time.
And they get crushed.
And something that I foundreally helpful for my friends as
(19:22):
well as other missionaries,there's a talk given in the
April 2023 conference called TheImperfect Harvest.
And I read it a lot.
And he talks about how God makesall of our efforts.
He doesn't waste any of ourefforts.
And it talks about thedifference between perfectionism
and being perfected in Christ.
Nice.
And I just wanted to share aquote from it.
(19:44):
It says, Remember thatperfectionism is not the same as
being perfected in Christ.
Perfectionism requires animpossible, self-inflicted
standard that compares us toothers.
This causes guilt and anxietyand can make us want to withdraw
and isolate ourselves.
But becoming perfected in Christis another matter.
It is the process lovinglyguided by the Holy Ghost of
(20:04):
becoming more like the Savior.
SPEAKER_00 (20:06):
Living that way without trying to perfect
yourself, that is a cursed life.
It's miserable.
It's crushing.
It's a law.
It's a world of sin and death.
And that's why the scripturescall it a cursed law or the law
of sin and death.
Now, Abraham understood thisprinciple.
Here's what it says aboutAbraham.
For if Abraham were justified bythe law of works, then he hath
(20:29):
to glory in himself.
and not of God.
In other words, if you're tryingto argue that someone can
perfect themselves or live thislaw of works, like if Abraham
lived his life and was justifiedby all of his works, then he
should glory in himself and notof God.
But then it says, for whatsayeth the scripture?
Abraham believed God.
It didn't say he was perfect.
It didn't say he kept all thecommandments all the time.
(20:51):
It said he believed and it wascounted unto him for
righteousness.
So Abraham wasn't considered,everyone would say, Abraham the
prophet was a righteous person.
But this is trying to say hewasn't considered righteous
because he was so obedient.
He was considered righteousbecause he believed and
repented.
And then it says, now to him whois justified by the law of works
(21:12):
is the reward reckoned of graceor of debt.
In other words, if I could keepall the commandments all the
time, then it would be...
I would have earned it myself,but the fact that we can't
requires this wonderful Savior.
So the last verse here says,"...but to him that seeketh not
to be justified by the law ofworks, but believeth on him who
justifieth not the ungodly, hisfaith is counted for
(21:37):
righteousness." So faith,repentance, baptism, and moving
of the Holy Ghost is counted tous for righteousness in Christ,
not in ourselves.
And that's a humbling thought,but that is a very important
thought.
So missionaries, you guyspreparing, you're going out to
lead souls to Christ and savethem from this great dilemma.
SPEAKER_01 (21:58):
I think it's so beautiful that, you know, within
this law, perfection is stillour ultimate goal.
But Christ basically tells us,okay, until you can get there,
I'll let you use mine.
And there's a scripture that Ilove that talks more about this.
It's Doctrine and Covenantssection 76.
It's verse 69.
And it's talking about the namesof those who are written in
(22:20):
heaven.
And it says, These are they whoare just men made perfect
through Jesus, the mediator ofthe new covenant, who wrought
out this perfect atonementthrough the shedding of his own
blood.
So I think that perfectlyencompasses everything that
we've been talking about.
SPEAKER_00 (22:35):
Beautifully.
SPEAKER_01 (22:36):
You know, this law that we are...
We feel like sometimes maybewe're...
That
SPEAKER_00 (22:46):
was Spanish.
That was a return missionary foryou.
SPEAKER_01 (22:50):
That we're like fine to this, this law of sin and
death.
And then we have the opportunityto go out and preach this good
news.
And it's not just good news,like mortally, but it's eternal
good news.
Like guys, listen to this.
Like you have the chance to bemade whole through a man that,
knows you perfectly and died foryou so you can have this
(23:13):
opportunity to become perfect.
SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
Yes, amazing.
The last part, because I justlove how Paul, the Apostle Paul,
talks about this.
This is in Romans 3.
He says, he's basically saying,look, I'm so happy because I'm
living the covenant.
I'm so happy as a disciple ofJesus Christ.
But then he says this, but whereis boasting then?
Like, can I boast in this?
And he says, it is excluded.
By what law?
(23:37):
Should I boast the law of works?
Nay, but by the law of faith.
In other words, the joy that Ireceive, can I boast like I've
done it?
I'm awesome.
I'm so happy.
Can I boast because of the lawof works because I've kept all
the laws?
And he's like, no, I boastbecause I'm happy because Christ
fills me with joy because Ibelieve in him.
It's faith.
He says, therefore, we concludethat a man is justified by faith
(24:00):
without the deeds of the law.
It's not the...
So listeners...
You have to build your faith byfeasting on the words of Christ
and praying and serving others,and you will understand and
realize you can't do this onyour own.
Without him, you are suffering.
You are cursed.
You are dead.
You are out of the presence ofthe Father.
Don't rely on yourselves.
(24:22):
That's not the message.
You're not here to learn how tobecome perfect yourself.
It's impossible.
You strive, but you strive to doit because you love Jesus Christ
for what he did for you, notbecause...
of your own pride and saying, Ican do it myself.
I have many friends, Lauren, whoaren't humble enough to say, I
need, I can't do it on my own.
(24:44):
I need help.
So many adults who are somiserable in life because of
their pride that says, I don'twant to have to rely on someone
else.
I'm good enough.
I want to be the one that doesthis.
Give me the glory.
And they're miserable, Lauren.
but those who are humble andturn to Christ.
Okay.
Beautiful, beautiful doctrine.
So thanks listeners for bearingthrough that.
I wanted to set the stage forwhat this principle is about.
(25:05):
Okay.
So we haven't even got into theprinciple.
This is just the backdrop.
So how does that apply to thisprinciple?
Temple is more important thanyour mission.
Here's how it applies.
Not only do you need tounderstand what the great
dilemma is, which you do now.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:20):
But you also need to understand though, to overcome
the great dilemma, you needsalvation, right?
but I want to teach you thedifference between two words
that so many in our church don'tunderstand the difference about.
And I took a long time to tryand figure this out, still
trying to figure it out.
The difference between what issalvation or being saved and
what is exaltation or beingexalted, right?
(25:42):
So when we understand the greatdilemma, we know that Christ
comes in and says, I will giveyou the law of the gospel.
And if you obey through faith,repentance, baptism, and the
Holy Ghost, then you'rejustified.
Like in other words, I save you.
That is being saved from thegreat dilemma.
So there you go.
There's the definition forsalvation, right?
So spiritual death is bydefinition, a separation of you,
(26:05):
your spirit from God's presence.
Physical death is a separationof your body from your spirit,
right?
It's all about separation,separation, separation,
separation.
That's what spiritual andphysical death are.
Those are the two dilemmas thatstand, or the two obstacles that
stand in your way to becominglike your father in heaven.
Christ comes in and says, I willovercome physical, the death of
(26:27):
physical separation.
I will resurrect you.
And then he says, I willovercome the spiritual death
separation on the condition thatyou have faith in me, repent,
get baptized, receive the giftof the Holy Ghost.
Okay, that's defining salvation.
Lauren, what's the differencebetween salvation and and
exaltation.
Because what I'm preaching hereis this.
(26:48):
The temple is not aboutsalvation.
The temple is about exaltation.
And if we listen to what theprophets have said for the last
10 years, here's what they say.
The purpose of the church is notsalvation alone.
The purpose of the church isexaltation, the highest level of
the celestial kingdom.
So I'm going to teach you.
(27:08):
We're going to talk about whatdoes the temple have to do with
that.
But what are your thoughts?
What's the difference betweensalvation and And exaltation,
it's so crazy.
Like, it's so important, yetit's a hard concept.
SPEAKER_01 (27:20):
I think about the scriptures throughout the Bible
and the Book of Mormon, and itsays because of the atonement of
Jesus Christ, salvation is madefree.
Like, salvation is free for allmen.
There's so many scriptures thattalk about salvation being free.
And it's true, right?
There's not much that we do onour end in comparison.
We don't earn it.
Exactly.
We don't have to work for itbecause it's something that's
(27:41):
already given to us, right?
But exaltation...
is something that you worktowards.
It's something that you trulyearn.
Because I feel like it's aoutward representation of our
commitment to Jesus Christ andgetting that perfection.
But I think it's, for me, it'slike, okay, I'm telling Jesus
(28:03):
Christ, like, okay, I trust youand I know that you're going to
get me there, so I'm willing todo what you need me to do.
And those steps to get there areActually, well, I was going to
say it's how you get toexaltation, but that doesn't
really answer your question.
I
SPEAKER_00 (28:20):
love it.
It's such a complicated issuethat it's just so hard to like
really explain, right?
SPEAKER_01 (28:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
I mean, I'll challenge a little bit of what
you said because even exaltationwe don't earn.
We don't earn it on our own.
I don't think there'll ever be apoint where we can say we
reached perfection.
I keep all the commandments allthe time.
We will always have to rely onthe savior for that.
SPEAKER_01 (28:44):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:45):
And the, and, and the, the, well, okay, let's talk
about the difference betweensalvation and exaltation.
There's a beautiful, beautifulscripture in DNC 132.
Can you turn there?
So DNC 132, this talks about allthe kingdoms and what the
differences are and why theyexist.
And, and, There's, in verses 23through 24, do you have that?
SPEAKER_01 (29:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:08):
Okay, read that real quick, and this will give us a
beginning understanding of whatexaltation is and how it differs
from salvation.
SPEAKER_01 (29:15):
But if ye receive me in the world, then shall ye know
me, and shall receive yourexaltation, that where I am ye
shall be also.
SPEAKER_00 (29:22):
Okay, that's talking about receiving me is the law of
the gospel, right?
Converting to Christ, basically,okay?
UNKNOWN (29:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:29):
And he's saying, you'll be with me because where
I'll be, you'll be.
That's overcoming sin and death.
That's overcoming theseparation.
That's being brought back intothe presence of God.
This
SPEAKER_01 (29:38):
is eternal lives to know the only wise and true God
and Jesus Christ whom he hathsent.
I am he.
SPEAKER_00 (29:45):
You read that wrong.
You said this is eternal lives.
There's not a term eternallives, Lauren.
It's just eternal life, right?
Listeners, you would all arguethis with me, right?
You've never once heard in anychurch service or through any
scripture someone say, okay, thegoal of the gospel is to get
eternal lives.
(30:05):
It doesn't say that, Lauren.
You read that wrong.
It's eternal life.
SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
Unless someone printed this Doctrine and
Covenants wrong, I am notincorrect.
SPEAKER_00 (30:15):
Wait, it actually says eternal lives, doesn't it?
This is eternal lives.
Wait, wait, wait, wait.
Again, I just want to emphasize.
If I had all you listeners in aroom and I said, hey, The
scriptures talk about eternallife.
Oh, no, wait.
They talk about eternal lives.
And I said to you, which onedoes our church preach?
I think all of you would sayeternal life, right?
(30:38):
This is my work and my glory tobring to pass the immortality
and eternal life of man.
That's probably the mostwell-known scripture in our
church.
It's eternal life, Lauren.
It's not eternal lives.
That doesn't make any sense.
Okay, read it again.
SPEAKER_01 (30:53):
This is eternal lives, right?
To know the only wise and trueGod and Jesus Christ whom he
hath sent.
I am he.
Receive ye therefore my law.
SPEAKER_00 (31:02):
Okay.
So this is beginning to teach usabout what exaltation is.
There is an eternal law that hasto do with living in God's
presence and in the presence ofJesus Christ.
And it has something to do witheternal lives, plural lives that
are eternal.
(31:22):
Huh?
Okay, this is interesting.
This is so interesting.
So I guess my question would bethis to you, Lauren.
In salvation, where are thepotential places that you'll go
if you're saved?
After the judgment, as we knowthrough the revelations for our
(31:44):
prophets, it's not just heavenand hell.
SPEAKER_01 (31:47):
The celestial kingdom?
Yes.
The terrestrial kingdom?
Yes.
The celestial kingdom.
SPEAKER_00 (31:52):
Uh-huh.
So...
If I get to the lower kingdom,the telestial kingdom, is that
considered salvation?
SPEAKER_01 (32:00):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:00):
It is.
That's a saved state, right?
If I get to the terrestrial,same thing.
And if I get to the celestial,that's the same thing.
So I like when the prophets getup in conference and say, Christ
saves us all in one of thosekingdoms.
But then they talk a lot aboutsalvation.
But there is a kingdom, thecelestial kingdom, and there are
(32:21):
three levels that Paul talksabout.
And the highest level is thelevel where we achieve eternal
lives.
Okay, what does that mean toyou?
What do you think?
SPEAKER_01 (32:33):
Salvation is something personal, right?
When you have faith, you repent,you're baptized, you receive the
gift of the Holy Ghost, that'sbetween you and Jesus Christ and
Heavenly Father, right?
Exaltation, I mean, think aboutit.
one of the most important thingsthat you can do in the temple is
to get sealed to your family.
And so in that moment, you'renot only receiving exaltation
(32:55):
for yourself, but also for yourfamily.
SPEAKER_00 (32:59):
Why is that important?
Do you think your opinion, justyour opinion?
Well, like, why wouldn't you behappy?
Just I'm saved.
I'm, I'm, I'm going to liveforever in the presence of one
of the Godhead.
I'm good.
SPEAKER_01 (33:12):
Cause I love my family.
UNKNOWN (33:15):
Oh,
SPEAKER_00 (33:15):
I also love your family.
Okay, so you're interpretingeternal lives as a plurality of
your eternal progression, inother words.
SPEAKER_01 (33:28):
Like eternal posterity.
Oh,
SPEAKER_00 (33:30):
okay.
SPEAKER_01 (33:32):
Oh my gosh.
But also, this just came to mymind.
If you are a missionary andyou're out preaching the law of
the gospel and you're helpingother people Be baptized.
You're helping other peoplereceive salvation and progress
towards exaltation.
You're also helping thoseeternal lives too.
Oh my
SPEAKER_00 (33:53):
God.
And does not the scripture saythat the greatest thing you can
do on this planet is to gopreach repentance to the people.
If you work your entire livesand bring and save it, be one
soul to Christ, how great shallbe your joy through eternities
with those souls.
SPEAKER_01 (34:10):
Wow.
UNKNOWN (34:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (34:12):
So Abraham three 26, can you get that?
SPEAKER_01 (34:16):
Oh yes.
SPEAKER_00 (34:17):
Okay.
So Abraham three 26 says thisand they who keep their first
estate shall be added upon.
And they who keep not theirfirst estate shall not have
glory in the same kingdom withthose who keep their first
estate.
And they who keep their secondestate shall have glory added
upon their heads forever andever.
This is weird language, right?
The first estate simply means inthe pre-immortal existence, we
(34:38):
had a choice to follow Satan'splan or Christ's plan.
Those of us who are here, wechose Christ's plans.
We kept our first estate.
We came here.
The second estate, if we keepthe second estate, that means we
choose the law of the gospel.
We come to Christ and we enterinto God's presence.
And if we keep that, it saysthis, you will have glory added
upon your head forever and ever.
(34:59):
What the heck is glory?
Any idea?
You want to take a shot atglory?
That's weird.
It's a weird concept, but what'sglory?
It's related to eternal lives.
Okay, you don't have to.
I see you're angry in your face.
Watch this.
Okay, watch this.
Watch this.
Our Father in Heaven explainedit through Scripture like this.
Jesus Christ came to the earth.
(35:20):
He lived a perfect life.
He died on his own accord, bothspiritually and physically.
And then the Father gave himpower to rise up again and
overcome physical death andspiritual death.
Now, when Jesus Christproclaimed or achieved his
victory over sin and death, whathe did is he took that glorified
(35:41):
kingdom of his and he presentedit to his Father.
This is the way Joseph Smithdescribes it.
And when Jesus presents that tohis Father, his Father, who is
all glory, gets glorified evenmore.
And Jesus takes his place in a,in like a hierarchical, like,
like if you look at the, uh, ifGod is above all and Jesus
Christ succeeds him and becomeslike him, Jesus Christ takes his
(36:05):
place.
And what does it do to thefather?
SPEAKER_01 (36:06):
Exalts
SPEAKER_00 (36:07):
him.
It exalts him even higher andgives him even more glory.
Now take Jesus Christ who looksat his beloved daughter, Lauren,
and says, Lauren, please comeunto me.
Have faith, repent, be baptized,receive the gift of the Holy
Ghost, and then receive the fivecovenants, and then sixth, in
the temple, and your exaltationwill be complete.
And what you will do is, I'massuming, you will present your
(36:30):
kingdom to the Savior, and hewill then present it to the
Father.
And not only do you get exalted,but the Savior gets exalted, and
then the Father gets exalted.
SPEAKER_01 (36:38):
What a great chain reaction.
SPEAKER_00 (36:40):
No, but this concept of exaltation, if you just look
at the word, what does exaltmean?
To lift up.
To become higher, right?
To exalt is to keep growing.
So if eternal exaltation oreternal lives, that means this
chain of glory and exaltation upand up and more and more and
growing.
This is eternal progress thatcan only be done in the plural.
(37:06):
It can't be done if I am singleand alone.
It can't.
You cannot be exalted if you'resingle.
That's what the scripture says.
You think I'm condemning youright now.
I'm not, Laura.
I'm not speaking to you.
Because here's what thescripture says.
It says, in D&C 132, it talksabout how those of us who will
(37:30):
be in the celestial kingdom butdon't enter into the new and
everlasting covenant ofmarriage, we will be angels
living single forever, for alleternity.
Go read it.
It's in there.
So the new and everlastingcovenants that we enter into in
the temple...
are all designed to lead us tothat ultimate covenant, which is
called the new and everlastingcovenant of marriage.
(37:53):
So when me and my wife aresealed together after we've
received all those othercovenants that build up to that
in the temple, we are now in thecovenant of exaltation.
Not just salvation, butexaltation.
And why is it called eternallives?
It's because my spouse and Iwill have the power, the
God-like creation power, tocontinue to create life.
(38:14):
throughout all eternity.
It's awesome.
It's amazing.
It really is.
This is blasphemy to Orthodoxchurches.
They don't like this.
They don't like this at all.
But it is true.
It is absolutely true, and it isbeautiful.
So you preparing missionaries,when you enter the temple, and
why you should focus on thatover your mission, this is why.
(38:35):
Because when you come untoChrist and live the law of the
gospel of faith, repentance,baptism, and gift of the Holy
Ghost, you achieve salvation.
But in order to receive thatwhich God has prepared for you,
which is exaltation, you have toreceive five more covenants.
And those five covenants youreceive through the endowment.
And those are the covenants ofexaltation.
And those ultimately arerequired in order for you to
(38:56):
eventually meet your spouse andenter into that new and
everlasting covenant ofmarriage.
And that is the capstone for youentering exaltation.
That is by far more importantthan the year and a half or two
years you're going to spendHelping others come.
You need to come yourself toexaltation.
(39:16):
You do.
And then you're more worthy ormore prepared or more excited to
go out and lead others tosalvation and ultimately
exaltation.
I'm thrilled that you guys talkso much.
We didn't talk about temples asmuch to our investigators, but
you guys are all about it.
SPEAKER_01 (39:32):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (39:33):
Why?
Tell me more about that.
Like you guys are, that's likethe, it seems like the capstone
isn't baptism.
You guys are all, my son andyou, you get all stoked when
they, they went to the temple.
I'm like, what do you mean?
They got there and they're like,no, they just did baptisms.
And I'm like, oh, that doesn'tseem as cool as they are.
But you guys are so stoked aboutit.
Why?
SPEAKER_01 (39:49):
Yeah.
In almost every ward slashbranch that I served in, the
ward mission leader, whoever ishelping with missionary work had
a plan, a missionary plan forthe ward, a work, Ward mission
plan is what it's called.
And the goal was always to getthem to the temple within 30
days of their baptism.
Why do you think that is?
I
SPEAKER_00 (40:08):
mean, I think I know why.
You tell me why.
SPEAKER_01 (40:10):
No, I'm asking
SPEAKER_00 (40:11):
you.
Oh, why?
Okay.
Well, I think it's becausethere's a difference between
salvation and exaltation.
And the temple is the only wayto get exaltation.
And these people understand,your ward and your leaders
understand that yourinvestigator is great that
they're saved.
But that's not the purpose ofthe church is to exalt them.
Right?
And so if they can get to the,oh, you're asking why in 30
days?
SPEAKER_01 (40:31):
No, I was just asking, like, well, yeah, no, I
was just asking,
SPEAKER_00 (40:35):
like, why?
I think the answer is this wholelesson.
The whole lesson.
Why a leader who understandsthis concept of exaltation is
going to go, oh, it's sowonderful you're baptized.
We've got to get you toexaltation.
Was that what you were lookingfor?
SPEAKER_01 (40:48):
Yeah.
No, no, no, yeah.
That truly is the reason.
The 30-day thing, I don't knowwho came up with that, but it's
a good way for, our friends toavoid hitting a plateau, to
plateauing, right?
Because typically friends areexcited and they're taking
lessons and they're doing allthese things so that they can
(41:09):
achieve baptism.
But if they have a checkpointpast baptism, which is working
to go to the temple, doingfamily history work, things like
that, when they understand thatit's more than just baptism, you
want to push them to get thereso they don't stop and get
SPEAKER_00 (41:23):
So it's a pragmatic way for you to continue to work
with them and have them keepcommitments that build their
faith and have something to lookforward to.
But also, what happens when theyactually step foot in that
temple?
What happens to their soul?
What happens to their spirit?
What happens to their minds andtheir hearts?
It's such a beautiful, magical,spiritual place that it changes
them.
And then eventually, a yearlater, when they can actually
(41:45):
get their own endowments out,hopefully these wards are
teaching them about exaltation.
Then everything changes.
Like that, the saints in theearly days of the restoration,
before they were kicked out ofevery place and were going to
like migrate, the Lord said,you're not going anywhere until
you build that temple.
So put all your resources intobuilding that temple because I
need to endow you with the powerto endure what's about to come
(42:07):
at you.
And that endowment is what eachof us get in the temple.
You listeners, you need theseordinances, these covenants of
exaltation.
You need them.
in order to come to Christ andto truly overcome sin and death
and be with the Father forever.
It endows you with power to be abetter missionary.
Prepare for the temple.
(42:28):
Don't just prepare for yourmission.
The temple is by far moreimportant for your exaltation.
That's the whole point.
So take the time to study it.
Plan on going tons a lot so i'lljust quick story in the wind
when i got my call i was superexcited i was so blessed that my
we had a neighbor who's thisolder guy named ed jesperson
this guy was amazing he's fromnew york he's the first take
(42:49):
president brooklyn he's aconvert he just was full of
enthusiasm and power he's thisolder dude and he shook when he
talked and he had this deep newyork accent and he came to me
and he's like shawny if you willgo with me i will go with you
every day to the temple for thenext three months i'm like whoa
what fits a lot, man.
I got a job.
I don't know.
I, he negotiated with me and webasically decided every other
(43:09):
day.
So three days or four days aweek for, for months at a time,
we, before my mission, we wentto the temple and it changed my
life.
We would go.
And at first I'd watch him andhe'd just pay attention.
Then we'd get into the celestialroom and he'd sit down and go,
Shawnee, here's what I learnedtoday.
And this was amazing.
And this spirit touched me thisway.
And did you notice that in thething?
And, and after a while, I'mlike, Holy cow, this guy's
(43:33):
really learning in here.
And I started learning in there.
And we started having thesespiritual discussions in the
celestial room in the temple.
And it was so powerful.
And man, by the time I got intothe MTC, I was so faithful and
so repentant and sounderstanding of my covenants
and the goal of salvation andexaltation that I was on fire.
(43:54):
This really assisted me, Lauren,in serving with all my heart,
might, mind, and strength.
So I really, we really do urgeyou guys out there preparing for
your missions.
Get to the temple as soon as youcan and go as often as you can.
It is power that you are beingendowed with to go be a good
missionary and lead souls toChrist.
Thanks for coming.
Thanks for joining.
See you next week.
The good news is Christ comes in and says, I
realize that you're not going tokeep all those commandments.
So they have fixed punishment toeach of those laws.
I'll take it so that you don'thave to.
Okay.
Okay.
Welcome back to Mission PrepSeries Podcast.
We're today going to focus onprinciple number seven, and this
(00:20):
is exciting.
Now, Lauren.
Hello, Lauren.
SPEAKER_01 (00:23):
Hello, everyone.
SPEAKER_00 (00:25):
Now, what just happened?
Because as we were prepping forthis, we were I just grabbed
from the little candy tray herea little KitKat and I opened it
up and I took a bite.
And why did you...
SPEAKER_01 (00:35):
Dude, this guy's a psychopath.
SPEAKER_00 (00:38):
Why?
SPEAKER_01 (00:39):
Why?
Okay, a KitKat is designed soit's breakable in the middle in
a vertical fashion.
You don't just bite into it.
SPEAKER_00 (00:48):
To both of them?
SPEAKER_01 (00:49):
No, you rip one apart and just eat it stick by
stick.
SPEAKER_00 (00:52):
You sheep.
Don't be a sheep.
What is the first principle ofthe Mission Prep series?
Choose your own path.
Don't let others dictate howyou're going to do things.
I can eat my Kit Kat however Iwould like to eat
SPEAKER_01 (01:03):
the Kit Kat.
Okay, but I'm actually not goingto start this with you.
SPEAKER_00 (01:07):
Okay.
There's a right way and a wrongway, huh?
SPEAKER_01 (01:10):
That's some freak behavior.
SPEAKER_00 (01:11):
Is this communist Russia?
Where are we?
We're in the U.S.
Yeah, so I can eat my propertythe way I want.
I have my freedom of
SPEAKER_01 (01:18):
speech to call you out, boy.
SPEAKER_00 (01:22):
I'm just kidding.
All right, well, let's makefriends and let's get back on
topic.
But that was interesting howsurprised you were that I ate my
KitKat that way.
But we're here to do missionprep.
We're here to do mission prep.
And this topic is the last.
This is the topic that we do inthe last class.
And I really enjoyed doing thisone because really the message
here, the principle here is thetemple...
(01:44):
that you're about to go through,those of you listening and
preparing for your mission, isby far more important than your
mission.
And for some reason in ourculture, we kind of go, oh my
goodness, we're going to serve amission and we get all excited
about it as we should.
But then at the end we go, oh,and by the way, you're going to
go into the temple and receivesome ordinances and enter into
(02:05):
some covenants that will affectyour eternal exaltation.
But just do that on the side.
And that's the wrong way to viewthings.
And so this principle is if youreally properly prepare for the
temple, there's nothing betterthat will prepare you for your
mission.
So we're going to get into thatand why and how and all that
kind of stuff.
But we're going to start withthe big picture.
(02:27):
So the concept here is really wewant to teach you why the temple
is so important and so much moreimportant than the mission.
The why is really what we'regoing to get into here.
So to do that, we're going toset the backdrop, give some
context.
And I like to start off bytalking about what Stephen
(02:50):
Robinson, that author, is thatright?
Yeah.
What he calls in the book,Believing Christ, what he calls
the great dilemma, the dilemma.
Now, he calls it that becauseeach of you listeners listening,
right?
You're graduating high school.
You're moving along in life.
There's a point where you'regoing to sit down and the
reality of the world is going tohit you and go, oh my goodness,
(03:10):
like I'm on my own.
Like I'm about to leave and beon my own in some weird place
that I've never been before.
And it's me, it's me alone.
I'm not living at home.
I don't have parents right overmy shoulder.
It's me.
And in that reality, you'regoing to start to obviously look
at the world in a bigger way.
And this new perspective isreally great.
(03:31):
Like there's nothing better thatwe could do as we're growing up.
One of these core ideas orconcepts that changed my life
was understanding what thisgreat dilemma was.
Because if we can understandwhat it is that we need to be
saved from, then the wholegospel makes sense, right?
We talk about, we grew up in thechurch and we talk about
salvation or exaltation, butReally, very few of us at an
(03:53):
early age can articulate, whatare we being saved from?
Well, our sins.
Yeah, but what does that mean?
It's hard to kind of get down.
So we're going to start withthat context so we can have an
understanding.
If you start right, you'll endright.
So we are going to talk aboutthis great dilemma.
Now, Lauren, there's twoscriptures.
One is in Moses, one's inRomans.
Now, these two scripturesperfectly express what great
(04:18):
dilemma you listeners face.
Like this is the big problemthat you face.
Do you have one of those,Lauren, that you can read?
SPEAKER_01 (04:24):
What's the one in Moses?
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
Moses 6, 55 to 57.
SPEAKER_01 (04:27):
And the Lord spake unto Adam, saying, And as much
as thy children are conceived insin, even so when they begin to
grow up, sin conceiveth in theirhearts, and they taste the
bitter that they may know toprize the good.
And it is given unto them toknow good from evil.
Wherefore they are agents untothemselves, and I have given
unto you another law andcommandment.
Wherefore, teach it unto yourchildren, that all men ever must
(04:51):
repent, or they can in no wiseinherit the kingdom of God.
For no unclean thing can dwellthere, or dwell in his presence.
For in the language of Adam, manof holiness is his name, and the
name of his only begotten is theSon of Man, even Jesus Christ, a
righteous judge who shall comein the meridian of time.
SPEAKER_00 (05:08):
Okay, so lots of doctrine in there, but the one I
want to focus on, really focuson, is the one that says, and
this is the law, No uncleanthing can enter the presence of
God.
He's holy.
And if you're even slightlyunholy, no unclean thing can
enter the presence of God.
Now, here's a good question,Lauren.
Let's compare the two of ourlives, okay?
(05:30):
And it is well known that I'vebeen on the earth a little
longer than you, yet I havesinned way less than you.
So let's just say...
Let's say I do a decent jobgoing through life, and I sin 10
times is all.
Just 10.
Okay?
Now, at your young age, I'vebeen counting, your parents have
(05:51):
been counting, and you're atabout 10,968.
Awesome.
Thank you.
Well done, I guess.
Thank you.
So the question is this.
Based on what we just read, thislaw that says no unclean thing
can enter the presence of God,who's more worthy in that
hypothetical scenario?
The person that's sinned 10times or the person that's
sinned 11,000 times to enter thepresence of God?
What do you say?
SPEAKER_01 (06:10):
Neither.
Let
SPEAKER_00 (06:14):
me ask you the question again because clearly
you did not understand.
One of us has only sinned 10times.
The other has sinned 11,000times.
Who's more worthy to be in thepresence of God?
SPEAKER_01 (06:27):
If you spill paint on your shirt, but I spill a
little bit more, are both of ourshirts still dirty?
Yes.
Yeah.
So it doesn't matter how manytimes I've sinned in comparison
to how many times you havesinned.
We are both unclean.
SPEAKER_00 (06:44):
Let's go with the paint and the shirt analogy.
We knock on the door and go,Mom, we got paint on us.
Please let us in so we can getcleaned up.
And she opens the door and shelooks at me who has...
an inch circle on my shoulderand she looks at you and you're
just drenched in it, hairdripping, paint all over the
(07:04):
place.
Who's more worthy to enter thehouse?
Who's more worthy?
Who's mom going to say, you'renot coming in, come on in?
SPEAKER_01 (07:12):
It doesn't matter which one of us has less paint
on us because the rule is thatwe don't come in if there's any
paint on us whatsoever.
SPEAKER_00 (07:18):
There's an answer to this bad news.
The bad news is this greatdilemma.
And the great dilemma is definedby two scriptures.
The first one we just read,which is no unclean thing can
enter the presence of God.
So I had said to you, but okay,let's analyze this law.
No unclean thing.
Okay, that literally means thatI could have one little splatter
on my shirt and you could havethe whole bucket poured over
your head.
And isn't it a little bit unfairthat mom's going to be like,
(07:42):
you're both out.
But mom, it's only on myshoulder.
Like, I'm not going to get overthe house.
No, you're out.
Don't come in.
Is that not a little unfair?
I don't know.
I
SPEAKER_01 (07:54):
mean, I guess in our eyes, it's a little unfair, but
like, if you think about it inlike legal terms on like a
criminal record, if somebodyrobs a bank, but another person
kills a couple of people, theyboth go on your record.
Like you're both being heldaccountable for whatever you did
that made you unworthy orunclean.
SPEAKER_00 (08:13):
Good.
So fairness is defined by law,right?
Just because objectively orsubjectively, I'm like, well,
that doesn't seem fair.
It A law exists, whatever thatlaw is.
And if it's a just law, is itAlma or Nephi that describes
that where there's a law,there's a punishment and there's
a blessing, right?
For every law, there's anaffixed punishment and an
(08:34):
affixed blessing.
That is just eternal nature ofthings.
And when we're dealing with thelaw, the only thing that's fair
is what is the just response tothat law.
If I keep it, then there's acertain blessing tied to it.
If I break it, there's a certainpunishment tied to it.
That's fair.
(08:55):
Whether I think it's fair ornot, it doesn't matter, right?
So if the law literally says youcannot enter this home with
paint on you, not even a speckof paint, if that's just the law
and it's a just law, then yeah,neither of us can enter the
house.
It doesn't matter how much paintyou have or how much paint I
have.
And that is the law that isdefined in this scripture we
just read in Moses.
(09:15):
No unclean thing can enter thepresence of God, not with one
sin, and not with a thousandsins.
In fact, Paul, the apostle Pauleven said it like this.
He says, if you're guilty ofone, you're guilty of all
because of this law.
So I'm not going to pretend tounderstand the nature of this
law.
Like, sure, my subjective viewof things is that doesn't seem
very fair if I do a better jobthan you do throughout my life.
(09:37):
But I think part of the reasonfor this law is it doesn't
matter.
God doesn't look at us and has achecklist for how much good you
do.
He doesn't.
The point is, He is our fatherand his plan for us is for us to
become like him.
And in order to become like him,we have to be people of
holiness.
We have to be pure.
So that's just the law.
(09:58):
Okay.
So the second part of the greatdilemma, which makes this law
even worse.
Do you have that one by chance?
This is Romans 3, 23.
It's real short.
SPEAKER_01 (10:09):
For all have sinned and come short of the glory of
God.
SPEAKER_00 (10:11):
How many have sinned?
SPEAKER_01 (10:13):
All.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
That's the dilemma.
is that you listeners, itdoesn't matter how well you're
doing, right?
It doesn't matter how obedientor faithful you are.
In fact, this refers back tothat beautiful talk in the last
conference from Sister Arunia.
God doesn't look at, it's notthis checklist of how many good
things you've done versus howmany bad things you've done.
This law, the great dilemma lawof no unclean thing can enter
(10:41):
the presence of God and everysingle one of you have sinned,
equally makes all of us unworthyto be in God's presence.
Now, question the law, don'tlike the law?
Okay, but it exists.
This is clean law.
This is just law.
And it is just, right?
If a law has a fix to punishmentand blessing and you don't keep
the law, the law's there.
So this is the great dilemma.
(11:02):
This is bad news for all of us.
So you listeners, as you facethis religion, put the atonement
aside, right?
Put faith aside and repentanceand covenants and Jesus Christ
and the atonement.
Put it all aside.
and just take a fresh look atwhy this is a dilemma for you.
It's a dilemma becausethroughout scripture, God
commands you to obey him, keepthe commandments, keep the law.
(11:27):
And that commandment to do that,you're required to do.
And if you break it just once,then you are out.
Sin and death has grasped youand you are unworthy to enter
God's presence.
Again, putting the atonementaside, putting all that aside,
you on your own, On your own,without any covenant or without
any religious relationship, onyour own, you are exposed to the
(11:52):
law, and the law condemns you.
So this is fascinating, Lauren.
I did a study on the word thelaw throughout Scripture, and
there's really two categories ofwhen the Scriptures talk about
the law.
I'll give you an example.
This is pretty fascinating.
This is really, I love this.
So in Romans 8, it says this,there is therefore now no
condemnation to them which arein Jesus Christ.
(12:13):
So again, now let's bring backin Jesus Christ.
He's saying, you're notcondemned if you walk after the
flesh, but after the spirit.
Now here's the law.
He says this, for the law of thespirit of the life in Jesus
Christ hath made me free fromthe law of sin and death.
Okay, now this is weird, right?
Because I always read inscriptures, there's one law.
There's the law of God.
(12:34):
But here it's talking about itas if there are two different
laws.
What do you think the differenceis?
It says, the law of the spiritof life in Christ hath made me
free from the law of sin anddeath.
Okay, so if the atonement didn'texist, if we put faith in Christ
aside, then that scripture wouldread differently.
It would literally just say, thelaw of sin and death makes me
(12:57):
not free, makes me captive,right?
Right?
So what do you think is thedifference between, or what is
the law of the spirit of life inJesus Christ, or the law of the
gospel?
And what is, well, let's askthat first.
What do you think the law of sinand death is?
Why is God's law called sin anddeath?
That is not a very positivespin.
If I'm explaining to someone,hey, God has a law, I'm going to
(13:19):
be like, it's a good law.
It teaches us how to be happy.
It teaches us how to become morelike him.
It's good, right?
And then you look at me and go,well, this says it's sin and
death.
In fact, a couple more.
It says...
It is the, just go through allthese tags I have in scriptures
that talks about it.
It's the law of suffering.
It's the law of sin and death.
It's the cursed law.
(13:41):
It's called the law of works.
So like 40 instances I findwhere it's really negatively
scary talking about the law.
Why do you think that is?
SPEAKER_01 (13:48):
Honestly, my take on that would be, I think it, puts
into perspective what we wouldbe subjected to if we didn't
have Jesus Christ.
Like that, the principle thatpeople rarely change unless they
(14:10):
see how it would benefit themtype of thing, where it's like,
if I don't know, or if I know myfate and I know it's something
that falls in the category ofthe law of sin and death, I'm
probably going to want to do allthat I can to avoid that, if
that makes sense.
SPEAKER_00 (14:25):
It makes sense.
if you ever talk to Protestantor evangelical or Orthodox or
Catholics, this is a fascinatingsubject.
They say there's a bigdifference between, the big
debate has been for thousands ofyears, are we saved by works or
are we saved by grace or faith?
And the fascinating thing here,so let's go to Galatians 3.11.
(14:48):
Here's what this says.
But know this, that no man isjustified by the law in the
sight of God.
No man is justified by the law.
Okay, what does that mean,Lauren?
What do you think that means?
No man is justified by God, bythe sight of God.
No man is justified by the law.
SPEAKER_01 (15:06):
None of us can keep it, so we can't be justified by
it.
SPEAKER_00 (15:09):
So back to the two principles, right?
The two scriptures that definethe great dilemma.
All of you will sin.
All of you listeners sin, nomatter how hard you try.
And because of that, you are notjustified to be in the presence
of God, right?
Right.
So when the scriptures talkabout it as the law of works,
what they're basically saying isthis.
Putting Christ aside, if youexpect from yourself to keep the
(15:32):
law perfectly or the law ofworks is what is going to make
you worthy to be in God'spresence, that is condemnation.
That is sin and death.
That is a cursed way to look atlife.
That is going to make youmiserable.
Lauren, do you...
I don't know if your generationis a little more affected by
this than past generations,but...
I do feel like this burden thatmany of you kids your age feel
(15:56):
on the mission to be obedientkind of crushes you.
Not that you shouldn't.
You should strive to beobedient.
That's the message ofscriptures.
He commands us to be obedient.
But I hear a lot of storiesabout kids going, I'm just not
that great at keeping all therules.
And maybe I'm not worthy enough.
And maybe I don't read enough orstudy enough.
There's this burden I feel thatcomes from a lot of kids today.
(16:20):
Do you see that?
SPEAKER_01 (16:21):
A
SPEAKER_00 (16:22):
lot of mental health issues are coming from this
pressure that kids feel to beperfect.
SPEAKER_01 (16:27):
Yeah, I agree.
SPEAKER_00 (16:28):
Now here's what I would say to that.
The only reason that exists isbecause you are trying to live
by the law of works.
You look at this big checklistof all these commandments and
you're just trying to keep themso rigorously and so faithfully,
but you fail.
And so this great dilemmapresses down on you because you
can't be clean and yet you thinkyou're supposed to be clean on
(16:49):
your own terms.
accord by your own works.
But this is why it's called thelaw of sin and death, the cursed
law, the law of works.
It's because when you rely onyourself, you will always be
miserable.
You will always fall short.
Okay, but at the beginning wealso read, in contrast to the
law of sin and death or the lawof works, there's something
called the law of the light orlife in Christ or the law of the
(17:13):
gospel.
It's the answer to the bad news,right?
The gospel, the word means goodnews.
And the bad news is, No uncleanthing can enter the presence of
God.
And you've all sinned.
And you're all trying to livethis law of works.
Prove, you know, get thereyourself.
That's the bad news.
You fail.
The good news is Christ comes inand says, I realize that you're
not going to keep all thosecommandments.
(17:34):
So they have fixed punishment toeach of those laws.
I'll take it so that you don'thave to.
What a guy.
So what is the message ofmissionaries?
Our one goal is to go out andteach people the law of the
gospel, which is faith, In JesusChrist, repentance, baptism, and
the gift of the Holy Ghost.
(17:54):
We're trying to teach the worldthat you are crushed by the law
of works.
You're dead.
You are forever pushed out ofthe presence of God.
We're here to deliver to you thegospel, the law of the gospel,
this plan of Jesus Christ, whichis founded in faith, repentance,
baptism, and the gift of theHoly Ghost.
So it's a beautiful thing,right?
So that's how we overcome thisgreat dilemma.
(18:16):
We go out as missionaries and weteach people to come unto
Christ.
starting with faith, and thenyour faith leads you to
repentance.
And in those conditions, Christsays, okay, let's enter into a
covenant, and I will be the onethat suffers for all those
broken laws.
So the law of works is fulfilledin Christ.
And you don't have to be subjectto the law of works, just to
(18:36):
faith and repentance and thesecovenants.
SPEAKER_01 (18:39):
And something that I ran into a lot as a missionary,
and I'm sure that you ran intothis as well a couple times,
Sean, is...
Oftentimes, kind of how you weretalking about earlier,
missionaries put pressure onthemselves for not being
perfectly obedient.
I think a lot of the people thatI was able to teach felt that
same way.
Obviously, they weren'tmissionaries, but in the sense
where they wanted to enter intothis covenant with Christ, but
(19:02):
they didn't fully understandthis principle, this law of the
gospel.
And so maybe they didn't saytheir prayers one day, they
weren't reading theirscriptures, or they couldn't
stop smoking for whatever Xamount of time.
And they get crushed.
And something that I foundreally helpful for my friends as
(19:22):
well as other missionaries,there's a talk given in the
April 2023 conference called TheImperfect Harvest.
And I read it a lot.
And he talks about how God makesall of our efforts.
He doesn't waste any of ourefforts.
And it talks about thedifference between perfectionism
and being perfected in Christ.
Nice.
And I just wanted to share aquote from it.
(19:44):
It says, Remember thatperfectionism is not the same as
being perfected in Christ.
Perfectionism requires animpossible, self-inflicted
standard that compares us toothers.
This causes guilt and anxietyand can make us want to withdraw
and isolate ourselves.
But becoming perfected in Christis another matter.
It is the process lovinglyguided by the Holy Ghost of
(20:04):
becoming more like the Savior.
SPEAKER_00 (20:06):
Living that way without trying to perfect
yourself, that is a cursed life.
It's miserable.
It's crushing.
It's a law.
It's a world of sin and death.
And that's why the scripturescall it a cursed law or the law
of sin and death.
Now, Abraham understood thisprinciple.
Here's what it says aboutAbraham.
For if Abraham were justified bythe law of works, then he hath
(20:29):
to glory in himself.
and not of God.
In other words, if you're tryingto argue that someone can
perfect themselves or live thislaw of works, like if Abraham
lived his life and was justifiedby all of his works, then he
should glory in himself and notof God.
But then it says, for whatsayeth the scripture?
Abraham believed God.
It didn't say he was perfect.
It didn't say he kept all thecommandments all the time.
(20:51):
It said he believed and it wascounted unto him for
righteousness.
So Abraham wasn't considered,everyone would say, Abraham the
prophet was a righteous person.
But this is trying to say hewasn't considered righteous
because he was so obedient.
He was considered righteousbecause he believed and
repented.
And then it says, now to him whois justified by the law of works
(21:12):
is the reward reckoned of graceor of debt.
In other words, if I could keepall the commandments all the
time, then it would be...
I would have earned it myself,but the fact that we can't
requires this wonderful Savior.
So the last verse here says,"...but to him that seeketh not
to be justified by the law ofworks, but believeth on him who
justifieth not the ungodly, hisfaith is counted for
(21:37):
righteousness." So faith,repentance, baptism, and moving
of the Holy Ghost is counted tous for righteousness in Christ,
not in ourselves.
And that's a humbling thought,but that is a very important
thought.
So missionaries, you guyspreparing, you're going out to
lead souls to Christ and savethem from this great dilemma.
SPEAKER_01 (21:58):
I think it's so beautiful that, you know, within
this law, perfection is stillour ultimate goal.
But Christ basically tells us,okay, until you can get there,
I'll let you use mine.
And there's a scripture that Ilove that talks more about this.
It's Doctrine and Covenantssection 76.
It's verse 69.
And it's talking about the namesof those who are written in
(22:20):
heaven.
And it says, These are they whoare just men made perfect
through Jesus, the mediator ofthe new covenant, who wrought
out this perfect atonementthrough the shedding of his own
blood.
So I think that perfectlyencompasses everything that
we've been talking about.
SPEAKER_00 (22:35):
Beautifully.
SPEAKER_01 (22:36):
You know, this law that we are...
We feel like sometimes maybewe're...
That
SPEAKER_00 (22:46):
was Spanish.
That was a return missionary foryou.
SPEAKER_01 (22:50):
That we're like fine to this, this law of sin and
death.
And then we have the opportunityto go out and preach this good
news.
And it's not just good news,like mortally, but it's eternal
good news.
Like guys, listen to this.
Like you have the chance to bemade whole through a man that,
knows you perfectly and died foryou so you can have this
(23:13):
opportunity to become perfect.
SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
Yes, amazing.
The last part, because I justlove how Paul, the Apostle Paul,
talks about this.
This is in Romans 3.
He says, he's basically saying,look, I'm so happy because I'm
living the covenant.
I'm so happy as a disciple ofJesus Christ.
But then he says this, but whereis boasting then?
Like, can I boast in this?
And he says, it is excluded.
By what law?
(23:37):
Should I boast the law of works?
Nay, but by the law of faith.
In other words, the joy that Ireceive, can I boast like I've
done it?
I'm awesome.
I'm so happy.
Can I boast because of the lawof works because I've kept all
the laws?
And he's like, no, I boastbecause I'm happy because Christ
fills me with joy because Ibelieve in him.
It's faith.
He says, therefore, we concludethat a man is justified by faith
(24:00):
without the deeds of the law.
It's not the...
So listeners...
You have to build your faith byfeasting on the words of Christ
and praying and serving others,and you will understand and
realize you can't do this onyour own.
Without him, you are suffering.
You are cursed.
You are dead.
You are out of the presence ofthe Father.
Don't rely on yourselves.
(24:22):
That's not the message.
You're not here to learn how tobecome perfect yourself.
It's impossible.
You strive, but you strive to doit because you love Jesus Christ
for what he did for you, notbecause...
of your own pride and saying, Ican do it myself.
I have many friends, Lauren, whoaren't humble enough to say, I
need, I can't do it on my own.
(24:44):
I need help.
So many adults who are somiserable in life because of
their pride that says, I don'twant to have to rely on someone
else.
I'm good enough.
I want to be the one that doesthis.
Give me the glory.
And they're miserable, Lauren.
but those who are humble andturn to Christ.
Okay.
Beautiful, beautiful doctrine.
So thanks listeners for bearingthrough that.
I wanted to set the stage forwhat this principle is about.
(25:05):
Okay.
So we haven't even got into theprinciple.
This is just the backdrop.
So how does that apply to thisprinciple?
Temple is more important thanyour mission.
Here's how it applies.
Not only do you need tounderstand what the great
dilemma is, which you do now.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:20):
But you also need to understand though, to overcome
the great dilemma, you needsalvation, right?
but I want to teach you thedifference between two words
that so many in our church don'tunderstand the difference about.
And I took a long time to tryand figure this out, still
trying to figure it out.
The difference between what issalvation or being saved and
what is exaltation or beingexalted, right?
(25:42):
So when we understand the greatdilemma, we know that Christ
comes in and says, I will giveyou the law of the gospel.
And if you obey through faith,repentance, baptism, and the
Holy Ghost, then you'rejustified.
Like in other words, I save you.
That is being saved from thegreat dilemma.
So there you go.
There's the definition forsalvation, right?
So spiritual death is bydefinition, a separation of you,
(26:05):
your spirit from God's presence.
Physical death is a separationof your body from your spirit,
right?
It's all about separation,separation, separation,
separation.
That's what spiritual andphysical death are.
Those are the two dilemmas thatstand, or the two obstacles that
stand in your way to becominglike your father in heaven.
Christ comes in and says, I willovercome physical, the death of
(26:27):
physical separation.
I will resurrect you.
And then he says, I willovercome the spiritual death
separation on the condition thatyou have faith in me, repent,
get baptized, receive the giftof the Holy Ghost.
Okay, that's defining salvation.
Lauren, what's the differencebetween salvation and and
exaltation.
Because what I'm preaching hereis this.
(26:48):
The temple is not aboutsalvation.
The temple is about exaltation.
And if we listen to what theprophets have said for the last
10 years, here's what they say.
The purpose of the church is notsalvation alone.
The purpose of the church isexaltation, the highest level of
the celestial kingdom.
So I'm going to teach you.
(27:08):
We're going to talk about whatdoes the temple have to do with
that.
But what are your thoughts?
What's the difference betweensalvation and And exaltation,
it's so crazy.
Like, it's so important, yetit's a hard concept.
SPEAKER_01 (27:20):
I think about the scriptures throughout the Bible
and the Book of Mormon, and itsays because of the atonement of
Jesus Christ, salvation is madefree.
Like, salvation is free for allmen.
There's so many scriptures thattalk about salvation being free.
And it's true, right?
There's not much that we do onour end in comparison.
We don't earn it.
Exactly.
We don't have to work for itbecause it's something that's
(27:41):
already given to us, right?
But exaltation...
is something that you worktowards.
It's something that you trulyearn.
Because I feel like it's aoutward representation of our
commitment to Jesus Christ andgetting that perfection.
But I think it's, for me, it'slike, okay, I'm telling Jesus
(28:03):
Christ, like, okay, I trust youand I know that you're going to
get me there, so I'm willing todo what you need me to do.
And those steps to get there areActually, well, I was going to
say it's how you get toexaltation, but that doesn't
really answer your question.
I
SPEAKER_00 (28:20):
love it.
It's such a complicated issuethat it's just so hard to like
really explain, right?
SPEAKER_01 (28:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
I mean, I'll challenge a little bit of what
you said because even exaltationwe don't earn.
We don't earn it on our own.
I don't think there'll ever be apoint where we can say we
reached perfection.
I keep all the commandments allthe time.
We will always have to rely onthe savior for that.
SPEAKER_01 (28:44):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:45):
And the, and, and the, the, well, okay, let's talk
about the difference betweensalvation and exaltation.
There's a beautiful, beautifulscripture in DNC 132.
Can you turn there?
So DNC 132, this talks about allthe kingdoms and what the
differences are and why theyexist.
And, and, There's, in verses 23through 24, do you have that?
SPEAKER_01 (29:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:08):
Okay, read that real quick, and this will give us a
beginning understanding of whatexaltation is and how it differs
from salvation.
SPEAKER_01 (29:15):
But if ye receive me in the world, then shall ye know
me, and shall receive yourexaltation, that where I am ye
shall be also.
SPEAKER_00 (29:22):
Okay, that's talking about receiving me is the law of
the gospel, right?
Converting to Christ, basically,okay?
UNKNOWN (29:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:29):
And he's saying, you'll be with me because where
I'll be, you'll be.
That's overcoming sin and death.
That's overcoming theseparation.
That's being brought back intothe presence of God.
This
SPEAKER_01 (29:38):
is eternal lives to know the only wise and true God
and Jesus Christ whom he hathsent.
I am he.
SPEAKER_00 (29:45):
You read that wrong.
You said this is eternal lives.
There's not a term eternallives, Lauren.
It's just eternal life, right?
Listeners, you would all arguethis with me, right?
You've never once heard in anychurch service or through any
scripture someone say, okay, thegoal of the gospel is to get
eternal lives.
(30:05):
It doesn't say that, Lauren.
You read that wrong.
It's eternal life.
SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
Unless someone printed this Doctrine and
Covenants wrong, I am notincorrect.
SPEAKER_00 (30:15):
Wait, it actually says eternal lives, doesn't it?
This is eternal lives.
Wait, wait, wait, wait.
Again, I just want to emphasize.
If I had all you listeners in aroom and I said, hey, The
scriptures talk about eternallife.
Oh, no, wait.
They talk about eternal lives.
And I said to you, which onedoes our church preach?
I think all of you would sayeternal life, right?
(30:38):
This is my work and my glory tobring to pass the immortality
and eternal life of man.
That's probably the mostwell-known scripture in our
church.
It's eternal life, Lauren.
It's not eternal lives.
That doesn't make any sense.
Okay, read it again.
SPEAKER_01 (30:53):
This is eternal lives, right?
To know the only wise and trueGod and Jesus Christ whom he
hath sent.
I am he.
Receive ye therefore my law.
SPEAKER_00 (31:02):
Okay.
So this is beginning to teach usabout what exaltation is.
There is an eternal law that hasto do with living in God's
presence and in the presence ofJesus Christ.
And it has something to do witheternal lives, plural lives that
are eternal.
(31:22):
Huh?
Okay, this is interesting.
This is so interesting.
So I guess my question would bethis to you, Lauren.
In salvation, where are thepotential places that you'll go
if you're saved?
After the judgment, as we knowthrough the revelations for our
(31:44):
prophets, it's not just heavenand hell.
SPEAKER_01 (31:47):
The celestial kingdom?
Yes.
The terrestrial kingdom?
Yes.
The celestial kingdom.
SPEAKER_00 (31:52):
Uh-huh.
So...
If I get to the lower kingdom,the telestial kingdom, is that
considered salvation?
SPEAKER_01 (32:00):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:00):
It is.
That's a saved state, right?
If I get to the terrestrial,same thing.
And if I get to the celestial,that's the same thing.
So I like when the prophets getup in conference and say, Christ
saves us all in one of thosekingdoms.
But then they talk a lot aboutsalvation.
But there is a kingdom, thecelestial kingdom, and there are
(32:21):
three levels that Paul talksabout.
And the highest level is thelevel where we achieve eternal
lives.
Okay, what does that mean toyou?
What do you think?
SPEAKER_01 (32:33):
Salvation is something personal, right?
When you have faith, you repent,you're baptized, you receive the
gift of the Holy Ghost, that'sbetween you and Jesus Christ and
Heavenly Father, right?
Exaltation, I mean, think aboutit.
one of the most important thingsthat you can do in the temple is
to get sealed to your family.
And so in that moment, you'renot only receiving exaltation
(32:55):
for yourself, but also for yourfamily.
SPEAKER_00 (32:59):
Why is that important?
Do you think your opinion, justyour opinion?
Well, like, why wouldn't you behappy?
Just I'm saved.
I'm, I'm, I'm going to liveforever in the presence of one
of the Godhead.
I'm good.
SPEAKER_01 (33:12):
Cause I love my family.
UNKNOWN (33:15):
Oh,
SPEAKER_00 (33:15):
I also love your family.
Okay, so you're interpretingeternal lives as a plurality of
your eternal progression, inother words.
SPEAKER_01 (33:28):
Like eternal posterity.
Oh,
SPEAKER_00 (33:30):
okay.
SPEAKER_01 (33:32):
Oh my gosh.
But also, this just came to mymind.
If you are a missionary andyou're out preaching the law of
the gospel and you're helpingother people Be baptized.
You're helping other peoplereceive salvation and progress
towards exaltation.
You're also helping thoseeternal lives too.
Oh my
SPEAKER_00 (33:53):
God.
And does not the scripture saythat the greatest thing you can
do on this planet is to gopreach repentance to the people.
If you work your entire livesand bring and save it, be one
soul to Christ, how great shallbe your joy through eternities
with those souls.
SPEAKER_01 (34:10):
Wow.
UNKNOWN (34:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (34:12):
So Abraham three 26, can you get that?
SPEAKER_01 (34:16):
Oh yes.
SPEAKER_00 (34:17):
Okay.
So Abraham three 26 says thisand they who keep their first
estate shall be added upon.
And they who keep not theirfirst estate shall not have
glory in the same kingdom withthose who keep their first
estate.
And they who keep their secondestate shall have glory added
upon their heads forever andever.
This is weird language, right?
The first estate simply means inthe pre-immortal existence, we
(34:38):
had a choice to follow Satan'splan or Christ's plan.
Those of us who are here, wechose Christ's plans.
We kept our first estate.
We came here.
The second estate, if we keepthe second estate, that means we
choose the law of the gospel.
We come to Christ and we enterinto God's presence.
And if we keep that, it saysthis, you will have glory added
upon your head forever and ever.
(34:59):
What the heck is glory?
Any idea?
You want to take a shot atglory?
That's weird.
It's a weird concept, but what'sglory?
It's related to eternal lives.
Okay, you don't have to.
I see you're angry in your face.
Watch this.
Okay, watch this.
Watch this.
Our Father in Heaven explainedit through Scripture like this.
Jesus Christ came to the earth.
(35:20):
He lived a perfect life.
He died on his own accord, bothspiritually and physically.
And then the Father gave himpower to rise up again and
overcome physical death andspiritual death.
Now, when Jesus Christproclaimed or achieved his
victory over sin and death, whathe did is he took that glorified
(35:41):
kingdom of his and he presentedit to his Father.
This is the way Joseph Smithdescribes it.
And when Jesus presents that tohis Father, his Father, who is
all glory, gets glorified evenmore.
And Jesus takes his place in a,in like a hierarchical, like,
like if you look at the, uh, ifGod is above all and Jesus
Christ succeeds him and becomeslike him, Jesus Christ takes his
(36:05):
place.
And what does it do to thefather?
SPEAKER_01 (36:06):
Exalts
SPEAKER_00 (36:07):
him.
It exalts him even higher andgives him even more glory.
Now take Jesus Christ who looksat his beloved daughter, Lauren,
and says, Lauren, please comeunto me.
Have faith, repent, be baptized,receive the gift of the Holy
Ghost, and then receive the fivecovenants, and then sixth, in
the temple, and your exaltationwill be complete.
And what you will do is, I'massuming, you will present your
(36:30):
kingdom to the Savior, and hewill then present it to the
Father.
And not only do you get exalted,but the Savior gets exalted, and
then the Father gets exalted.
SPEAKER_01 (36:38):
What a great chain reaction.
SPEAKER_00 (36:40):
No, but this concept of exaltation, if you just look
at the word, what does exaltmean?
To lift up.
To become higher, right?
To exalt is to keep growing.
So if eternal exaltation oreternal lives, that means this
chain of glory and exaltation upand up and more and more and
growing.
This is eternal progress thatcan only be done in the plural.
(37:06):
It can't be done if I am singleand alone.
It can't.
You cannot be exalted if you'resingle.
That's what the scripture says.
You think I'm condemning youright now.
I'm not, Laura.
I'm not speaking to you.
Because here's what thescripture says.
It says, in D&C 132, it talksabout how those of us who will
(37:30):
be in the celestial kingdom butdon't enter into the new and
everlasting covenant ofmarriage, we will be angels
living single forever, for alleternity.
Go read it.
It's in there.
So the new and everlastingcovenants that we enter into in
the temple...
are all designed to lead us tothat ultimate covenant, which is
called the new and everlastingcovenant of marriage.
(37:53):
So when me and my wife aresealed together after we've
received all those othercovenants that build up to that
in the temple, we are now in thecovenant of exaltation.
Not just salvation, butexaltation.
And why is it called eternallives?
It's because my spouse and Iwill have the power, the
God-like creation power, tocontinue to create life.
(38:14):
throughout all eternity.
It's awesome.
It's amazing.
It really is.
This is blasphemy to Orthodoxchurches.
They don't like this.
They don't like this at all.
But it is true.
It is absolutely true, and it isbeautiful.
So you preparing missionaries,when you enter the temple, and
why you should focus on thatover your mission, this is why.
(38:35):
Because when you come untoChrist and live the law of the
gospel of faith, repentance,baptism, and gift of the Holy
Ghost, you achieve salvation.
But in order to receive thatwhich God has prepared for you,
which is exaltation, you have toreceive five more covenants.
And those five covenants youreceive through the endowment.
And those are the covenants ofexaltation.
And those ultimately arerequired in order for you to
(38:56):
eventually meet your spouse andenter into that new and
everlasting covenant ofmarriage.
And that is the capstone for youentering exaltation.
That is by far more importantthan the year and a half or two
years you're going to spendHelping others come.
You need to come yourself toexaltation.
(39:16):
You do.
And then you're more worthy ormore prepared or more excited to
go out and lead others tosalvation and ultimately
exaltation.
I'm thrilled that you guys talkso much.
We didn't talk about temples asmuch to our investigators, but
you guys are all about it.
SPEAKER_01 (39:32):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (39:33):
Why?
Tell me more about that.
Like you guys are, that's likethe, it seems like the capstone
isn't baptism.
You guys are all, my son andyou, you get all stoked when
they, they went to the temple.
I'm like, what do you mean?
They got there and they're like,no, they just did baptisms.
And I'm like, oh, that doesn'tseem as cool as they are.
But you guys are so stoked aboutit.
Why?
SPEAKER_01 (39:49):
Yeah.
In almost every ward slashbranch that I served in, the
ward mission leader, whoever ishelping with missionary work had
a plan, a missionary plan forthe ward, a work, Ward mission
plan is what it's called.
And the goal was always to getthem to the temple within 30
days of their baptism.
Why do you think that is?
I
SPEAKER_00 (40:08):
mean, I think I know why.
You tell me why.
SPEAKER_01 (40:10):
No, I'm asking
SPEAKER_00 (40:11):
you.
Oh, why?
Okay.
Well, I think it's becausethere's a difference between
salvation and exaltation.
And the temple is the only wayto get exaltation.
And these people understand,your ward and your leaders
understand that yourinvestigator is great that
they're saved.
But that's not the purpose ofthe church is to exalt them.
Right?
And so if they can get to the,oh, you're asking why in 30
days?
SPEAKER_01 (40:31):
No, I was just asking, like, well, yeah, no, I
was just asking,
SPEAKER_00 (40:35):
like, why?
I think the answer is this wholelesson.
The whole lesson.
Why a leader who understandsthis concept of exaltation is
going to go, oh, it's sowonderful you're baptized.
We've got to get you toexaltation.
Was that what you were lookingfor?
SPEAKER_01 (40:48):
Yeah.
No, no, no, yeah.
That truly is the reason.
The 30-day thing, I don't knowwho came up with that, but it's
a good way for, our friends toavoid hitting a plateau, to
plateauing, right?
Because typically friends areexcited and they're taking
lessons and they're doing allthese things so that they can
(41:09):
achieve baptism.
But if they have a checkpointpast baptism, which is working
to go to the temple, doingfamily history work, things like
that, when they understand thatit's more than just baptism, you
want to push them to get thereso they don't stop and get
SPEAKER_00 (41:23):
So it's a pragmatic way for you to continue to work
with them and have them keepcommitments that build their
faith and have something to lookforward to.
But also, what happens when theyactually step foot in that
temple?
What happens to their soul?
What happens to their spirit?
What happens to their minds andtheir hearts?
It's such a beautiful, magical,spiritual place that it changes
them.
And then eventually, a yearlater, when they can actually
(41:45):
get their own endowments out,hopefully these wards are
teaching them about exaltation.
Then everything changes.
Like that, the saints in theearly days of the restoration,
before they were kicked out ofevery place and were going to
like migrate, the Lord said,you're not going anywhere until
you build that temple.
So put all your resources intobuilding that temple because I
need to endow you with the powerto endure what's about to come
(42:07):
at you.
And that endowment is what eachof us get in the temple.
You listeners, you need theseordinances, these covenants of
exaltation.
You need them.
in order to come to Christ andto truly overcome sin and death
and be with the Father forever.
It endows you with power to be abetter missionary.
Prepare for the temple.
(42:28):
Don't just prepare for yourmission.
The temple is by far moreimportant for your exaltation.
That's the whole point.
So take the time to study it.
Plan on going tons a lot so i'lljust quick story in the wind
when i got my call i was superexcited i was so blessed that my
we had a neighbor who's thisolder guy named ed jesperson
this guy was amazing he's fromnew york he's the first take
(42:49):
president brooklyn he's aconvert he just was full of
enthusiasm and power he's thisolder dude and he shook when he
talked and he had this deep newyork accent and he came to me
and he's like shawny if you willgo with me i will go with you
every day to the temple for thenext three months i'm like whoa
what fits a lot, man.
I got a job.
I don't know.
I, he negotiated with me and webasically decided every other
(43:09):
day.
So three days or four days aweek for, for months at a time,
we, before my mission, we wentto the temple and it changed my
life.
We would go.
And at first I'd watch him andhe'd just pay attention.
Then we'd get into the celestialroom and he'd sit down and go,
Shawnee, here's what I learnedtoday.
And this was amazing.
And this spirit touched me thisway.
And did you notice that in thething?
And, and after a while, I'mlike, Holy cow, this guy's
(43:33):
really learning in here.
And I started learning in there.
And we started having thesespiritual discussions in the
celestial room in the temple.
And it was so powerful.
And man, by the time I got intothe MTC, I was so faithful and
so repentant and sounderstanding of my covenants
and the goal of salvation andexaltation that I was on fire.
(43:54):
This really assisted me, Lauren,in serving with all my heart,
might, mind, and strength.
So I really, we really do urgeyou guys out there preparing for
your missions.
Get to the temple as soon as youcan and go as often as you can.
It is power that you are beingendowed with to go be a good
missionary and lead souls toChrist.
Thanks for coming.
Thanks for joining.
See you next week.
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