October 31, 2025 • 27 mins
Crystal does a deep dive into the work of Clifford Carnicom’s research on morgellons.
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(00:00):
Good morning. It's crystal clear here to
remind you that you are not infected.
We are infected, woven into something we no longer control.
If your scan is speaking, then the world's gone mute.
Let's help it talk again. We're not pleading for
(00:21):
legitimacy from science. We are accusing the culture of
scientism that is more dogmatic than Catholicism.
Pope, meet CDCCDC, meet Pope. We're just early adopters of the
singularity and whatever else may be in our broken futures.
(00:44):
But the future doesn't have to be broken, people.
There's plenty of things we can build here in the now, 'cause I
got the elixir that could fix her right up.
Doesn't cure anything in the medical sense, but we can
restore dignity, coherence, and artistry.
We can cease to be case studies and become cultural theorists of
(01:05):
our own lives. The point is to make alienation
and erasure visible enough to touch so that the next social
invention can begin. I would love to hear from you.
I would love to have you on the show more morgillons@gmail.com.
We're going to have a great episode today.
Thank you for listening and staytuned.
(01:44):
Clifford Carnicom In the case ofthe Sky Snot, tonight, on more
mortal lawns, we investigate a man who looked up and never
quite looked down again. Clifford Carnicom, Scientist,
sky watcher, and possibly the only person who has ever tried
to interview a cloud. He began, as all profits do,
with a question. Why is the sky so stringy?
(02:08):
When normal people saw contrails, Carnicom saw
messages. When we saw cumulus, he saw
culpability. He started collecting samples.
Hair like fibers, gooey threads,tiny glitter bits like a magpie
with a microscope. Some people collect stamps.
Clifford collected air guilt. Soon his living room became a
laboratory, his website a cathedral, and his vacuum
(02:30):
cleaner and national security risk.
He posted graphs, photos, please, and occasionally,
recipes for emergency vinegar solutions.
The government, of course, nevercalled him back, but the wind
did, repeatedly. Eyewitnesses report that
Carnicom once shouted at a cirrus formation.
I know what you're doing up there.
And the cloud replied nothing, which only deepen the mystery.
(02:52):
What was Clifford after truth, fame, or simply a really good
reason to own a laser pointer? We may never know, but his
legacy lives on. Every time someone films the sky
and zooms in way too far, Clifford Carnicom nods somewhere
in the stratosphere. Told you who is Clifford
Carnicom with? Anybody that with morgalons for
(03:12):
any period of time has heard of Clifford Carnicom.
Hello Carnicom Institute, What do they do over there?
Who is this guy? Yeah.
You guys ever wonder? I've wondered.
I've busted a lot of quacks on here, so we'll see what's going
to happen today. I just did a deep dive on this
guy on the Internet, and I'll tell you what I learned.
(03:37):
Clifford Karnikom. He was born Clifford Bruce
Stewart in 1953. He is an American researcher
known for his work on geoengineering and chemtrail
theories. Before entering the public eye
as a controversial investigator,Carnicom had a 15 year career as
a federal employee across three agencies, the US Department of
(03:58):
Defense, the Bureau of Land Management, and the US Forest
Service. According to Carnicom
Institute's records, he worked as a technical research
scientist on DoD modeling systems, including weapons and
geophysical models, and even held a top secret SCI security
clearance. He was selected for two years of
intensive graduate study mathematics, statistics,
(04:20):
computer science and geodesic under DoD sponsorship.
Carnicom received several accolades during his government
tenure including being named Defense Mapping Agency Aerospace
Center Employee of the Year and earning A Geodetic Sciences
Award for Outstanding Technical Performance.
He earned ABS, Bachelors of Science and Surveying and
(04:40):
Photogrammetry cum laude from California State University,
Fresno and pursued further graduate level coursework via
Ohio State University and Washington University under DoD
programs. After leaving federal service,
Carnicom moved to Santa Fe, NM, where he spent 17 years as a
self-employed computer and networking consultant.
This diverse technical background spanning cadastral
(05:02):
land surveying, geodesic computer programming, and data
analysis set the stage for his later independent research into
environmental anomalies. Notably, Carnicom incorporated
Carnicom Institute in 2008 as a New Mexico nonprofit, which by
2011 obtained 5O1C3 status as a tax exempt scientific and
educational organization. He serves as president and
(05:25):
director of the Institute, whichframes its mission as conducting
scientific research and public education relating to the
consequences of geoengineering and bioengineering in service of
public welfare. What does a land surveyor do
y'all? Because I had no idea.
A land surveyor is apparently responsible for measuring and
mapping land features and boundaries, often for government
or legal purposes. For example, the US Department
(05:46):
of the Interior notes that professional land surveyors
quote, map complex terrain and unique or rugged topography, and
establish, re establish and investigate land and property
boundaries. So I guess in practice this
means using specialized equipment and techniques to
determine precise locations of property lines, landmarks, and
geographic features. So cadastral surveyors focus on
(06:07):
defining official boundaries of land parcels critical for Dee's
development and public Land Management.
And his Carnicom's work with theBLM as a cadastral surveyor
involved applying these skills to public domain lands, where he
even developed software to improve large scale land data
operations. This surveying background gave
Carnicom a solid foundation and precision measurement, data
(06:28):
collection, and geospatial analysis, which he later applied
to his independent environmentalstudies.
So this guy's more legit than I was really expecting to find so
far. Shall we go on transition to
independent research and the chemtrail theory?
In the late 1990s, after years of government and consulting
work, Karnikom turned his attention to unusual atmospheric
(06:53):
phenomena, specifically the emerging chemtrail quote UN
quote conspiracy theory. The chemtrail theory posits that
some aircraft contrails normal water vapor.
Condensation trails are actuallydeliberate aerosol spraying of
chemicals or biological agents. So Carnicom became one of the
earliest and most prominent researchers in this movement.
(07:14):
He recalls that quote. Since the beginning of 1999,
there has been the systematic injection of massive amounts of
particulate matter into our atmosphere using aircraft as the
medium, framing the issue as a covert global operation.
By 1999, he had launched a website, originallycarnicom.com,
later Carnicom institute.org, todocument his observations, data
(07:37):
and hypothesis about these persistent trails in the sky.
Carnicom is often credited by chemtrail believers as bringing
a scientific approach to the topic.
He avoids the term chemtrail in favor of aerosol, arguing it's
more precise. In a 2003 interview he explained
that he distinguishes between 4 separate phenomena, classic
contrails, deliberate aerosol trails, natural clouds and what
(07:58):
he called aerosol banks, man made haze layers.
This taxonomy was meant to give the discussion scientific
clarity as Carnicom felt the loose use of chemtrail muddied
the waters. He asserted that contrails, ice
crystal clouds from engine exhaust, dissipate with known
physics, whereas the lingering spreading plumes he observed
behaved differently, indicating particulate aerosols.
(08:22):
Carnicom stance is that these lingering aerosol plumes are
real and intentional, even if mainstream scientists and
agencies insist they are just normal contrails.
Starting in 1999 to 2000, Carnicom began collecting
environmental samples related tothe alleged aerosol spraying.
One key focus was the wispy, fibrous material, sometimes
reported falling from the sky, filaments or webs.
(08:45):
Carnicom famously submitted a fiber sample to the US
Environmental Protection Agency in 1999 for identification.
After a year and a half, the EPAreturned the sample
uncharacterized, offering no explanation.
Frustrated by the lack of official analysis, Carnicom
undertook his own study of theseenvironmental filaments.
He concluded they were not spider webs or common materials,
(09:06):
despite a private lab report suggesting the material could be
a spider silk, which Carnicom strongly disputed as undeniably
false. Instead, he hypothesized the
filaments contained a cross domain bacteria, CDB, an
anomalous microorganism exhibiting properties of
multiple biological domains. In later years, Karnikom linked
(09:26):
this filament, CDB, to the mysterious dermatological
condition known as morgalons Morgellons.
And we know who those people are.
And we have skin lesions with fibrous materials.
So Carnicom's position is that aerosolized fibers and
Morgalon's fibers are the same phenomena, whereas the
mainstream medical view considers Morgalon psychosomatic
or misidentified textile fibers.Carnicom has published dozens of
(09:49):
research papers and reports on his website, often dense with
technical data ranging from atmospheric physics to
microbiology. For instance, a 2002 Carnicom
paper listed analysis of aerosolfallout samples containing
elements like barium, calcium, magnesium, titanium, and
microscopic fibers, substances he believed were not from normal
contrails. He also has reported finding
(10:10):
unusual desiccated red blood cells and biological agents and
samples feeding into theories oflarge scale bioengineering.
These claims are extremely controversial as they contradict
established science. No peer reviewed studies have
verified such findings, and agencies like the EPA and NOAA.
NOAA attribute persistent sky trails solely to normal jet
(10:30):
exhaust under certain atmospheric conditions, plus
increased air traffic. By the early 2000s, Carnacom
became a well known figure in alternative media.
He appeared on radio programs like Coast to Coast AM to
discuss chemtrails, and he cultivated a following through
his online post. In 2005, he released a feature
length documentary titled Aerosol Crimes AKA Chemtrails.
(10:53):
Notably, Carnacom made this filmfreely available public domain,
stating there was quote no profit motive and encouraging
wide copying and distribution. The documentary, based on five
years of research, compiled photographic evidence,
interviews and Carnicom's analysis to argue the secret
aerosol programs were underway. It became a touchstone for the
chemtrail activist community. Carnicom later presented at
(11:13):
conferences such as the 2011 Consciousness Beyond Chemtrails
in Los Angeles, where he spoke on geoengineering and
bioengineering, the unmistakablelink, although time ran out
before he could finish his talk.That sucks.
Throughout these years, Carnicomincreasingly emphasized the
public health implications of chemtrails, bridging into
(11:34):
investigations of Morgans quote nano fibers and other potential
biological fallout. So more recently, he did an
interview in 2022 with our friend Doctor Anna Maria
Mahalia. One of Carnacom's recent high
profile engagements was an interview with Doctor Anna
Maria, MD, PhD conducted on December 26th, 2022.
(11:54):
Doctor Milhasia is a medical doctor and researcher known for
investigating nanotechnology in the blood, specifically strange
self assembling structures observed in samples from
COVID-19 vaccine vials and in patients blood.
In the interview, available via video on Rumble and as a written
summary on Doctor Milhalshia's Substack, the two discussed the
intersection of Karnikom's environmental findings with
(12:16):
Milhalshia's medical findings. A major topic was Karnikom's
cross domain bacteria CDB and its relation to both Morgalon's
disease and possible contents ofCOVID-19 vaccines.
Karnikom described his decades long study of the airborne
filaments CDB, including how he first discovered them in 1999
and the lack of identification by authorities.
Doctor Milhalsia, who has been examining polymer like filaments
(12:38):
and metallic particles in vaccine vial residues and an
unvaccinated versus vaccinated individual's blood, found
Karnikom's work resonated with her observations.
Both concluded that the odd fibrous hydrogel like materials
appearing in some vaccinated persons, sometimes forming
lengthy blood clots or rubbery structures post mortem, seem to
be the same type of substance Karnikom found in the
environment. In the interview, Doctor
(12:59):
Milhalcia is identified as a board member of the National
American Renaissance Movement National Arm, an organization
that in 2024 partnered with Carnicom to preserve his
research. She and Carnicom compared notes
on the microscopic characteristics of these
filaments, noting they exhibit self assembling polymerizing
behaviors and contain metallic elements like aluminum, barium,
(13:20):
and titanium. They further asserted that these
filaments can induce blood coagulation and immune system
harm, tying together the chemtrail and anti COVID vaccine
narratives into a unified theoryof a bioengineering attack on
humanity. In summary, the Milhalcia
Carnicom interview underscores Carnicom belief that aerosol
dispersal programs and certain biomedical interventions are
connected pieces of a covert transhumanist or depopulation
(13:43):
agenda. Doctor Milhalcias presence lent
and MD support to Carnicoms longstanding claims.
It's worth noting that these claims are quote, highly
controversial and not recognizedby mainstream science.
Duh. They blend conspiracy theories,
quote UN quote about geoengineering with those about
vaccines. Nonetheless, the interview has
been influential in certain alternative health End Quote
truth communities and it has ledto ongoing collaborations.
(14:06):
For example, Carnicom's site haspublished joint reports with
Doctor Mahalosia in 2023 on topics like differential blood
clotting and vaccinated versus unvaccinated blood, and
identification of CDB structuresin blood via spectroscopy.
Dr. Mahalosia, A Romanian American physician, has herself
become a noted figure in anti vaccine and anti transhumanism
(14:27):
circles. So today Clifford Carnicom
continues his research through the Carnicom Institute, which he
founded. The institute has relocated to
Wallace, ID as of the mid 2000 tens and it remains a hub for
Carnicom's publications and projects.
All of Carnicom's research papers dating back to 1999 are
available in an online library and he regularly post updates.
(14:47):
Topics in 2023-2024 include synthetic blood versus natural
blood, advanced spectroscopy of environmental filaments, and
further CDB analysis. In late 2024, Carnicom signed an
agreement with the National American Renaissance Movement,
National Arm, a nonprofit led byDavid Meiswinkel, Esquire, to
act as a trustee of Carnicom's extensive unpublished lab notes
(15:10):
and intellectual property. The goal is to preserve and
eventually disseminate his 25 years of findings through a
consortium of nonprofits under an alliance of nonprofit
corporations for public benefit.This suggests Carnicom is
planning for the longevity of his work beyond himself by
entrusting it to aligned groups.National Arm frames the research
as vital to countering, quote, global health threats from
geoengineering and bioengineering from a
(15:32):
monetization and outreach standpoint.
Because this is what I always want to know, where's the money?
How's this dude getting money? Carnicom positions his Institute
as a non commercial public benefit organization.
On the Carnicom Institute website, a disclaimer explicitly
states we do not advocate any particular products, protocols,
or therapies. Their role is research and
(15:52):
education. Indeed, unlike some fringe
researchers, Carnicom does not appear to sell cure all
supplements or proprietary devices.
Instead, funding is solicited through donations and
memberships. The Institute's Support Us page
invites readers to donate or become a friend with options for
recurring monthly donations. 10 or $20 subscriptions.
Because Carnicom Institute is A5O1C3, nonprofit donations are
(16:14):
tax deductible. This donor model is a primary
way Carnicom monetizes his work,essentially via crowdfunding by
supporters who believe in the cause.
The Institute also publishes a periodic newsletter and
maintains a presence on platforms like Sub Stack and
Telegram, likely to widen its audience and attract patronage.
(16:36):
Carnicom has produced some mediafor sale or donation in the
past. For example, his physical DVD's
of the Aerosol Crimes documentary were once offered.
However, as noted, he later madethe film free online.
The institute's website does notlist books or merchandise
authored by Carnicom beyond his research papers, which are free.
(16:57):
An interesting aside is that Carnicom is listed as an artist
on a Print on Demand art site selling photography and artwork
prints, so this suggests a personal hobby that provides a
minor income stream. It's separate from his chemtrail
research, but it is one of the few commercial ventures
connected to his name. Overall, Carnicom's monetization
(17:18):
strategy focuses on membership donations and perhaps speaking
engagements. Where he presents at conferences
or on podcasts, donations are often encouraged.
He emphasizes that his work is, quote for the public welfare,
aligning with the nonprofit ethos.
So let's talk about some of the controversies and
contradictions. So his work sits in a domain
(17:41):
fraught with controversy, scientific and skeptical
criticism. Mainstream scientists, pilots
and public health officials overwhelmingly dismiss the
chemtrail conspiracy theory, pointing out that increased air
traffic and atmospheric conditions explain persistent
contrails without invoking a secret spray program.
As the Skeptics Dictionary quipped, chemtrails are unknown
(18:04):
chemicals by unknown people for some unknown purpose,
highlighting the lack of concrete evidence.
But Rational Wiki, known for debunking pseudoscience,
specifically calls out Carnicom's claims.
For instance, this website alleged chemtrail fallout
contains substances like barium,calcium, magnesium, and
microscopic fiber, Skeptics argue have never BeenVerified by
(18:26):
independent, peer reviewed analysis.
That doesn't mean they're untrue, it just means that no
one else is looking at it. But I do think that there have
been people since Carnicom started doing this that
definitely found microplastics in the air.
So I don't know. In one forum discussion, a
former aviation professional remarks that no secret aerial
(18:48):
spraying program exists and thatobserved flight patterns are
consistent with normal air routes and atmospheric physics,
only to be accused by chemtrail believers of lying or being part
of cover up. This illustrates the highly
polarized responses to Carnicom's work.
Supporters see him as revealing a hidden truth, while experts
regard his conclusions as incorrect and born of
(19:09):
confirmatory bias. The Morgalons and health claims
Carnicom's foray into bioengineering.
Morgalon's research has attracted additional skepticism.
We all know about the CDC study.We're not even going to
reference that. His insistence that Morgalon's
(19:29):
is linked to Airbo, to airborne nano fibers, and now to vaccine
contents is therefore at odds with medical consensus, which
means nothing. Some worry that promoting these
ideas can lead patients away from proven medical care.
Well, we know what's proven in terms of the vaccines.
At the very least, there's an inverse relationship between
(19:54):
COVID infection and getting boosters.
That's from the CDC, y'all. That means that you are more
likely to get COVID if you've had a vaccine.
That's you can look that up. So Doctor Mahalcia, Karnicom's
colleague, likewise has faced criticism for spreading
unfounded theories about vaccines containing self
(20:15):
assembling. Quote, nanotech.
Can't confirm or deny that. Transparency and fundraising
issues within the activist community.
There have been questions about Carnicom's handling of funds and
data. In the early 2000s, Carnicom and
a colleague, the late researcherJeff Rensse, and or David
Peterson. Accounts vary.
I don't know what that means, but him and a friend organized a
(20:39):
chemtrail research fund to raisemoney for further studies.
By one report, about $6000 was collected with a promise to
publicly account for its use. Critics on Metabunk and other
forums have noted that no such accounting was ever presented.
Similarly, despite Carnicom's many technical papers, none have
undergone formal peer review or been published in scientific
(21:00):
journals, a point of contention when he labels his work
scientific research. I mean, we could say a lot about
why that definition of science, depending upon the religion of
science, accepting you into their folds is problematic, but
(21:20):
I think that's sort of speaks for itself.
So this lack of external validation, combined with
fundraising questions has LED even some fellow anti and
geoengineering activists to distance themselves from the
Karnik Holmes Institute. Carnicom did respond in in at
least one case by publishing an article Environmental Filament
(21:40):
False Report, detailing how a lab he paid in 1999 gave a
result he considered erroneous. His willingness to disclose that
an analysis was false could be seen as commendable
transparency. Yet it also underscores that his
conclusions often conflict with outside laboratories.
Another area of contradiction isCarnicom's portrayal as an
(22:02):
unbiased researcher versus his clear advocacy stance.
The institute claims to be non political and not aligned with
any ideology, but Carnicom's alliances sometimes tell a
different story. For instance, the national arm
that now champions his work is an organization with a grandiose
name. American Renaissance in its
title can be confusing as there are unrelated groups with that
(22:24):
phrase and a mission to quote, educate the public on the
assault upon them through chemtrails and vaccines.
Cardicom's involvement with suchgroups and with figures like
Doctor Mihalcia placed him firmly in a community that is
skeptical of government and mainstream science.
While not a contradiction per SE, it does contrast with his
early career as ADOD supported scientist.
(22:45):
It raises the question of what led a once insider with a top
secret clearance to become convinced that the government is
conducting secret air assault operations on its own citizens.
Carnicom has hinted that there are those who do not seek Full
disclosure of events. There may be the opinion that
it's better the public doesn't know certain things and that
(23:06):
only reasons of national security might ever justify
secrecy. In his view, the existence of a
covert spring program is a truththat must be exposed for the
public good, even if authoritiesdeny it, An outlook that defines
his post government career. In summary, Carnicom is a
complex figure, a highly educated former government
scientist who applied his analytical skills to an
(23:27):
unconventional inquiry and became a prominent voice in the
chemtrails and morgalon's movements.
His biography includes credible achievements in surveying in
computer science, yet the work he is now best known for is
considered fringe pseudoscience by the wider scientific
scientific community who are knuckleheads.
He continues to publish and promote his findings through the
(23:47):
Karnikom Institute, selling his ideas mainly by soliciting
donations rather than commercializing products.
His involvement in interviews like the one with Doctor Anna
Maria Mahalcia shows an ongoing effort to link environmental
conspiracy narratives with current events like the
pandemic, which has brought intohis appeal in some circles while
deepening the skepticism and criticism from others.
(24:09):
As such, Carnecom remains a controversial figure, a
polarizing figure illustrative of the collision between citizen
driven research and established science.
The documentation he's produced,replete with data analysis and
passionate claims, ensure that the debate around chemtrails are
related phenomena will have a detailed record, even as experts
dismiss the premise of that debate.
(24:33):
So I'm kind of surprised this guy seems a little bit more
legit than I think I've always given him credit for.
Although a couple things. So you send it to a lab, the lab
says it's spider web, and you say hell no it's not.
But then you never send it to another lab.
(24:53):
That doesn't make sense to me, especially if your whole entire
reputation depends upon it and you believe that the entire
world is being assaulted by the government covertly.
I would think that you would go to the ends of the earth to
determine what the fuck that filament shit was.
I don't know. There could be something I'm
(25:14):
missing. Please write the show if you
know more, more morgolons@gmail.com.
Cliff, if you're listening, you're welcome to come on the
show. I'm not paying you because I
don't do that and I don't get $6000 off of doing this show.
But if I said that I was going to tell everybody about how I
(25:35):
use the money that I make off ofthis show, I would sure as hell
follow through with that promise.
I don't know, just a little sketchy, but this doesn't mean
anything. I'm not accusing him of
anything. I'm just saying that these are
the things that stand out to me 'cause you know me, I'm always
looking out for snake oil salesman quacks, hacks and whack
(25:58):
jobs who want to exploit our fears to sell us $300 bottles of
tea tree oil spray. I don't know.
This guy doesn't seem to be doing that for me personally.
The jury is out on on chemtrails.
(26:20):
I certainly have seen some instances of shit falling out of
the sky that looked a hell of a lot like morgalons under
microscopy. So, you know, my confidence
rating is maybe like a 90 or something percent confident that
there's definitely something going on, that he's on to
(26:43):
something. But I'm not sure it's relation
to morgalons. Definitely not sure.
In summation, you have learned nothing.
You're welcome. Keep coming back.
If you have thoughts or commentsabout Clifford Carnicom or if
you are Clifford Carnicom, send me an e-mail at
morgalons@gmail.com or leave a comment in the comment section.
(27:03):
Rate the show, leave a review, tell everybody on Facebook that
we exist and we're cool and Reddit and all those other
things that people go on on the Internet.
All right, have a wonderful day,night, evening, year.
I love you guys. Stay tuned.
Good morning. It's crystal clear here to
remind you that you are not infected.
We are infected, woven into something we no longer control.
If your scan is speaking, then the world's gone mute.
Let's help it talk again. We're not pleading for
(00:21):
legitimacy from science. We are accusing the culture of
scientism that is more dogmatic than Catholicism.
Pope, meet CDCCDC, meet Pope. We're just early adopters of the
singularity and whatever else may be in our broken futures.
(00:44):
But the future doesn't have to be broken, people.
There's plenty of things we can build here in the now, 'cause I
got the elixir that could fix her right up.
Doesn't cure anything in the medical sense, but we can
restore dignity, coherence, and artistry.
We can cease to be case studies and become cultural theorists of
(01:05):
our own lives. The point is to make alienation
and erasure visible enough to touch so that the next social
invention can begin. I would love to hear from you.
I would love to have you on the show more morgillons@gmail.com.
We're going to have a great episode today.
Thank you for listening and staytuned.
(01:44):
Clifford Carnicom In the case ofthe Sky Snot, tonight, on more
mortal lawns, we investigate a man who looked up and never
quite looked down again. Clifford Carnicom, Scientist,
sky watcher, and possibly the only person who has ever tried
to interview a cloud. He began, as all profits do,
with a question. Why is the sky so stringy?
(02:08):
When normal people saw contrails, Carnicom saw
messages. When we saw cumulus, he saw
culpability. He started collecting samples.
Hair like fibers, gooey threads,tiny glitter bits like a magpie
with a microscope. Some people collect stamps.
Clifford collected air guilt. Soon his living room became a
laboratory, his website a cathedral, and his vacuum
(02:30):
cleaner and national security risk.
He posted graphs, photos, please, and occasionally,
recipes for emergency vinegar solutions.
The government, of course, nevercalled him back, but the wind
did, repeatedly. Eyewitnesses report that
Carnicom once shouted at a cirrus formation.
I know what you're doing up there.
And the cloud replied nothing, which only deepen the mystery.
(02:52):
What was Clifford after truth, fame, or simply a really good
reason to own a laser pointer? We may never know, but his
legacy lives on. Every time someone films the sky
and zooms in way too far, Clifford Carnicom nods somewhere
in the stratosphere. Told you who is Clifford
Carnicom with? Anybody that with morgalons for
(03:12):
any period of time has heard of Clifford Carnicom.
Hello Carnicom Institute, What do they do over there?
Who is this guy? Yeah.
You guys ever wonder? I've wondered.
I've busted a lot of quacks on here, so we'll see what's going
to happen today. I just did a deep dive on this
guy on the Internet, and I'll tell you what I learned.
(03:37):
Clifford Karnikom. He was born Clifford Bruce
Stewart in 1953. He is an American researcher
known for his work on geoengineering and chemtrail
theories. Before entering the public eye
as a controversial investigator,Carnicom had a 15 year career as
a federal employee across three agencies, the US Department of
(03:58):
Defense, the Bureau of Land Management, and the US Forest
Service. According to Carnicom
Institute's records, he worked as a technical research
scientist on DoD modeling systems, including weapons and
geophysical models, and even held a top secret SCI security
clearance. He was selected for two years of
intensive graduate study mathematics, statistics,
(04:20):
computer science and geodesic under DoD sponsorship.
Carnicom received several accolades during his government
tenure including being named Defense Mapping Agency Aerospace
Center Employee of the Year and earning A Geodetic Sciences
Award for Outstanding Technical Performance.
He earned ABS, Bachelors of Science and Surveying and
(04:40):
Photogrammetry cum laude from California State University,
Fresno and pursued further graduate level coursework via
Ohio State University and Washington University under DoD
programs. After leaving federal service,
Carnicom moved to Santa Fe, NM, where he spent 17 years as a
self-employed computer and networking consultant.
This diverse technical background spanning cadastral
(05:02):
land surveying, geodesic computer programming, and data
analysis set the stage for his later independent research into
environmental anomalies. Notably, Carnicom incorporated
Carnicom Institute in 2008 as a New Mexico nonprofit, which by
2011 obtained 5O1C3 status as a tax exempt scientific and
educational organization. He serves as president and
(05:25):
director of the Institute, whichframes its mission as conducting
scientific research and public education relating to the
consequences of geoengineering and bioengineering in service of
public welfare. What does a land surveyor do
y'all? Because I had no idea.
A land surveyor is apparently responsible for measuring and
mapping land features and boundaries, often for government
or legal purposes. For example, the US Department
(05:46):
of the Interior notes that professional land surveyors
quote, map complex terrain and unique or rugged topography, and
establish, re establish and investigate land and property
boundaries. So I guess in practice this
means using specialized equipment and techniques to
determine precise locations of property lines, landmarks, and
geographic features. So cadastral surveyors focus on
(06:07):
defining official boundaries of land parcels critical for Dee's
development and public Land Management.
And his Carnicom's work with theBLM as a cadastral surveyor
involved applying these skills to public domain lands, where he
even developed software to improve large scale land data
operations. This surveying background gave
Carnicom a solid foundation and precision measurement, data
(06:28):
collection, and geospatial analysis, which he later applied
to his independent environmentalstudies.
So this guy's more legit than I was really expecting to find so
far. Shall we go on transition to
independent research and the chemtrail theory?
In the late 1990s, after years of government and consulting
work, Karnikom turned his attention to unusual atmospheric
(06:53):
phenomena, specifically the emerging chemtrail quote UN
quote conspiracy theory. The chemtrail theory posits that
some aircraft contrails normal water vapor.
Condensation trails are actuallydeliberate aerosol spraying of
chemicals or biological agents. So Carnicom became one of the
earliest and most prominent researchers in this movement.
(07:14):
He recalls that quote. Since the beginning of 1999,
there has been the systematic injection of massive amounts of
particulate matter into our atmosphere using aircraft as the
medium, framing the issue as a covert global operation.
By 1999, he had launched a website, originallycarnicom.com,
later Carnicom institute.org, todocument his observations, data
(07:37):
and hypothesis about these persistent trails in the sky.
Carnicom is often credited by chemtrail believers as bringing
a scientific approach to the topic.
He avoids the term chemtrail in favor of aerosol, arguing it's
more precise. In a 2003 interview he explained
that he distinguishes between 4 separate phenomena, classic
contrails, deliberate aerosol trails, natural clouds and what
(07:58):
he called aerosol banks, man made haze layers.
This taxonomy was meant to give the discussion scientific
clarity as Carnicom felt the loose use of chemtrail muddied
the waters. He asserted that contrails, ice
crystal clouds from engine exhaust, dissipate with known
physics, whereas the lingering spreading plumes he observed
behaved differently, indicating particulate aerosols.
(08:22):
Carnicom stance is that these lingering aerosol plumes are
real and intentional, even if mainstream scientists and
agencies insist they are just normal contrails.
Starting in 1999 to 2000, Carnicom began collecting
environmental samples related tothe alleged aerosol spraying.
One key focus was the wispy, fibrous material, sometimes
reported falling from the sky, filaments or webs.
(08:45):
Carnicom famously submitted a fiber sample to the US
Environmental Protection Agency in 1999 for identification.
After a year and a half, the EPAreturned the sample
uncharacterized, offering no explanation.
Frustrated by the lack of official analysis, Carnicom
undertook his own study of theseenvironmental filaments.
He concluded they were not spider webs or common materials,
(09:06):
despite a private lab report suggesting the material could be
a spider silk, which Carnicom strongly disputed as undeniably
false. Instead, he hypothesized the
filaments contained a cross domain bacteria, CDB, an
anomalous microorganism exhibiting properties of
multiple biological domains. In later years, Karnikom linked
(09:26):
this filament, CDB, to the mysterious dermatological
condition known as morgalons Morgellons.
And we know who those people are.
And we have skin lesions with fibrous materials.
So Carnicom's position is that aerosolized fibers and
Morgalon's fibers are the same phenomena, whereas the
mainstream medical view considers Morgalon psychosomatic
or misidentified textile fibers.Carnicom has published dozens of
(09:49):
research papers and reports on his website, often dense with
technical data ranging from atmospheric physics to
microbiology. For instance, a 2002 Carnicom
paper listed analysis of aerosolfallout samples containing
elements like barium, calcium, magnesium, titanium, and
microscopic fibers, substances he believed were not from normal
contrails. He also has reported finding
(10:10):
unusual desiccated red blood cells and biological agents and
samples feeding into theories oflarge scale bioengineering.
These claims are extremely controversial as they contradict
established science. No peer reviewed studies have
verified such findings, and agencies like the EPA and NOAA.
NOAA attribute persistent sky trails solely to normal jet
(10:30):
exhaust under certain atmospheric conditions, plus
increased air traffic. By the early 2000s, Carnacom
became a well known figure in alternative media.
He appeared on radio programs like Coast to Coast AM to
discuss chemtrails, and he cultivated a following through
his online post. In 2005, he released a feature
length documentary titled Aerosol Crimes AKA Chemtrails.
(10:53):
Notably, Carnacom made this filmfreely available public domain,
stating there was quote no profit motive and encouraging
wide copying and distribution. The documentary, based on five
years of research, compiled photographic evidence,
interviews and Carnicom's analysis to argue the secret
aerosol programs were underway. It became a touchstone for the
chemtrail activist community. Carnicom later presented at
(11:13):
conferences such as the 2011 Consciousness Beyond Chemtrails
in Los Angeles, where he spoke on geoengineering and
bioengineering, the unmistakablelink, although time ran out
before he could finish his talk.That sucks.
Throughout these years, Carnicomincreasingly emphasized the
public health implications of chemtrails, bridging into
(11:34):
investigations of Morgans quote nano fibers and other potential
biological fallout. So more recently, he did an
interview in 2022 with our friend Doctor Anna Maria
Mahalia. One of Carnacom's recent high
profile engagements was an interview with Doctor Anna
Maria, MD, PhD conducted on December 26th, 2022.
(11:54):
Doctor Milhasia is a medical doctor and researcher known for
investigating nanotechnology in the blood, specifically strange
self assembling structures observed in samples from
COVID-19 vaccine vials and in patients blood.
In the interview, available via video on Rumble and as a written
summary on Doctor Milhalshia's Substack, the two discussed the
intersection of Karnikom's environmental findings with
(12:16):
Milhalshia's medical findings. A major topic was Karnikom's
cross domain bacteria CDB and its relation to both Morgalon's
disease and possible contents ofCOVID-19 vaccines.
Karnikom described his decades long study of the airborne
filaments CDB, including how he first discovered them in 1999
and the lack of identification by authorities.
Doctor Milhalsia, who has been examining polymer like filaments
(12:38):
and metallic particles in vaccine vial residues and an
unvaccinated versus vaccinated individual's blood, found
Karnikom's work resonated with her observations.
Both concluded that the odd fibrous hydrogel like materials
appearing in some vaccinated persons, sometimes forming
lengthy blood clots or rubbery structures post mortem, seem to
be the same type of substance Karnikom found in the
environment. In the interview, Doctor
(12:59):
Milhalcia is identified as a board member of the National
American Renaissance Movement National Arm, an organization
that in 2024 partnered with Carnicom to preserve his
research. She and Carnicom compared notes
on the microscopic characteristics of these
filaments, noting they exhibit self assembling polymerizing
behaviors and contain metallic elements like aluminum, barium,
(13:20):
and titanium. They further asserted that these
filaments can induce blood coagulation and immune system
harm, tying together the chemtrail and anti COVID vaccine
narratives into a unified theoryof a bioengineering attack on
humanity. In summary, the Milhalcia
Carnicom interview underscores Carnicom belief that aerosol
dispersal programs and certain biomedical interventions are
connected pieces of a covert transhumanist or depopulation
(13:43):
agenda. Doctor Milhalcias presence lent
and MD support to Carnicoms longstanding claims.
It's worth noting that these claims are quote, highly
controversial and not recognizedby mainstream science.
Duh. They blend conspiracy theories,
quote UN quote about geoengineering with those about
vaccines. Nonetheless, the interview has
been influential in certain alternative health End Quote
truth communities and it has ledto ongoing collaborations.
(14:06):
For example, Carnicom's site haspublished joint reports with
Doctor Mahalosia in 2023 on topics like differential blood
clotting and vaccinated versus unvaccinated blood, and
identification of CDB structuresin blood via spectroscopy.
Dr. Mahalosia, A Romanian American physician, has herself
become a noted figure in anti vaccine and anti transhumanism
(14:27):
circles. So today Clifford Carnicom
continues his research through the Carnicom Institute, which he
founded. The institute has relocated to
Wallace, ID as of the mid 2000 tens and it remains a hub for
Carnicom's publications and projects.
All of Carnicom's research papers dating back to 1999 are
available in an online library and he regularly post updates.
(14:47):
Topics in 2023-2024 include synthetic blood versus natural
blood, advanced spectroscopy of environmental filaments, and
further CDB analysis. In late 2024, Carnicom signed an
agreement with the National American Renaissance Movement,
National Arm, a nonprofit led byDavid Meiswinkel, Esquire, to
act as a trustee of Carnicom's extensive unpublished lab notes
(15:10):
and intellectual property. The goal is to preserve and
eventually disseminate his 25 years of findings through a
consortium of nonprofits under an alliance of nonprofit
corporations for public benefit.This suggests Carnicom is
planning for the longevity of his work beyond himself by
entrusting it to aligned groups.National Arm frames the research
as vital to countering, quote, global health threats from
geoengineering and bioengineering from a
(15:32):
monetization and outreach standpoint.
Because this is what I always want to know, where's the money?
How's this dude getting money? Carnicom positions his Institute
as a non commercial public benefit organization.
On the Carnicom Institute website, a disclaimer explicitly
states we do not advocate any particular products, protocols,
or therapies. Their role is research and
(15:52):
education. Indeed, unlike some fringe
researchers, Carnicom does not appear to sell cure all
supplements or proprietary devices.
Instead, funding is solicited through donations and
memberships. The Institute's Support Us page
invites readers to donate or become a friend with options for
recurring monthly donations. 10 or $20 subscriptions.
Because Carnicom Institute is A5O1C3, nonprofit donations are
(16:14):
tax deductible. This donor model is a primary
way Carnicom monetizes his work,essentially via crowdfunding by
supporters who believe in the cause.
The Institute also publishes a periodic newsletter and
maintains a presence on platforms like Sub Stack and
Telegram, likely to widen its audience and attract patronage.
(16:36):
Carnicom has produced some mediafor sale or donation in the
past. For example, his physical DVD's
of the Aerosol Crimes documentary were once offered.
However, as noted, he later madethe film free online.
The institute's website does notlist books or merchandise
authored by Carnicom beyond his research papers, which are free.
(16:57):
An interesting aside is that Carnicom is listed as an artist
on a Print on Demand art site selling photography and artwork
prints, so this suggests a personal hobby that provides a
minor income stream. It's separate from his chemtrail
research, but it is one of the few commercial ventures
connected to his name. Overall, Carnicom's monetization
(17:18):
strategy focuses on membership donations and perhaps speaking
engagements. Where he presents at conferences
or on podcasts, donations are often encouraged.
He emphasizes that his work is, quote for the public welfare,
aligning with the nonprofit ethos.
So let's talk about some of the controversies and
contradictions. So his work sits in a domain
(17:41):
fraught with controversy, scientific and skeptical
criticism. Mainstream scientists, pilots
and public health officials overwhelmingly dismiss the
chemtrail conspiracy theory, pointing out that increased air
traffic and atmospheric conditions explain persistent
contrails without invoking a secret spray program.
As the Skeptics Dictionary quipped, chemtrails are unknown
(18:04):
chemicals by unknown people for some unknown purpose,
highlighting the lack of concrete evidence.
But Rational Wiki, known for debunking pseudoscience,
specifically calls out Carnicom's claims.
For instance, this website alleged chemtrail fallout
contains substances like barium,calcium, magnesium, and
microscopic fiber, Skeptics argue have never BeenVerified by
(18:26):
independent, peer reviewed analysis.
That doesn't mean they're untrue, it just means that no
one else is looking at it. But I do think that there have
been people since Carnicom started doing this that
definitely found microplastics in the air.
So I don't know. In one forum discussion, a
former aviation professional remarks that no secret aerial
(18:48):
spraying program exists and thatobserved flight patterns are
consistent with normal air routes and atmospheric physics,
only to be accused by chemtrail believers of lying or being part
of cover up. This illustrates the highly
polarized responses to Carnicom's work.
Supporters see him as revealing a hidden truth, while experts
regard his conclusions as incorrect and born of
(19:09):
confirmatory bias. The Morgalons and health claims
Carnicom's foray into bioengineering.
Morgalon's research has attracted additional skepticism.
We all know about the CDC study.We're not even going to
reference that. His insistence that Morgalon's
(19:29):
is linked to Airbo, to airborne nano fibers, and now to vaccine
contents is therefore at odds with medical consensus, which
means nothing. Some worry that promoting these
ideas can lead patients away from proven medical care.
Well, we know what's proven in terms of the vaccines.
At the very least, there's an inverse relationship between
(19:54):
COVID infection and getting boosters.
That's from the CDC, y'all. That means that you are more
likely to get COVID if you've had a vaccine.
That's you can look that up. So Doctor Mahalcia, Karnicom's
colleague, likewise has faced criticism for spreading
unfounded theories about vaccines containing self
(20:15):
assembling. Quote, nanotech.
Can't confirm or deny that. Transparency and fundraising
issues within the activist community.
There have been questions about Carnicom's handling of funds and
data. In the early 2000s, Carnicom and
a colleague, the late researcherJeff Rensse, and or David
Peterson. Accounts vary.
I don't know what that means, but him and a friend organized a
(20:39):
chemtrail research fund to raisemoney for further studies.
By one report, about $6000 was collected with a promise to
publicly account for its use. Critics on Metabunk and other
forums have noted that no such accounting was ever presented.
Similarly, despite Carnicom's many technical papers, none have
undergone formal peer review or been published in scientific
(21:00):
journals, a point of contention when he labels his work
scientific research. I mean, we could say a lot about
why that definition of science, depending upon the religion of
science, accepting you into their folds is problematic, but
(21:20):
I think that's sort of speaks for itself.
So this lack of external validation, combined with
fundraising questions has LED even some fellow anti and
geoengineering activists to distance themselves from the
Karnik Holmes Institute. Carnicom did respond in in at
least one case by publishing an article Environmental Filament
(21:40):
False Report, detailing how a lab he paid in 1999 gave a
result he considered erroneous. His willingness to disclose that
an analysis was false could be seen as commendable
transparency. Yet it also underscores that his
conclusions often conflict with outside laboratories.
Another area of contradiction isCarnicom's portrayal as an
(22:02):
unbiased researcher versus his clear advocacy stance.
The institute claims to be non political and not aligned with
any ideology, but Carnicom's alliances sometimes tell a
different story. For instance, the national arm
that now champions his work is an organization with a grandiose
name. American Renaissance in its
title can be confusing as there are unrelated groups with that
(22:24):
phrase and a mission to quote, educate the public on the
assault upon them through chemtrails and vaccines.
Cardicom's involvement with suchgroups and with figures like
Doctor Mihalcia placed him firmly in a community that is
skeptical of government and mainstream science.
While not a contradiction per SE, it does contrast with his
early career as ADOD supported scientist.
(22:45):
It raises the question of what led a once insider with a top
secret clearance to become convinced that the government is
conducting secret air assault operations on its own citizens.
Carnicom has hinted that there are those who do not seek Full
disclosure of events. There may be the opinion that
it's better the public doesn't know certain things and that
(23:06):
only reasons of national security might ever justify
secrecy. In his view, the existence of a
covert spring program is a truththat must be exposed for the
public good, even if authoritiesdeny it, An outlook that defines
his post government career. In summary, Carnicom is a
complex figure, a highly educated former government
scientist who applied his analytical skills to an
(23:27):
unconventional inquiry and became a prominent voice in the
chemtrails and morgalon's movements.
His biography includes credible achievements in surveying in
computer science, yet the work he is now best known for is
considered fringe pseudoscience by the wider scientific
scientific community who are knuckleheads.
He continues to publish and promote his findings through the
(23:47):
Karnikom Institute, selling his ideas mainly by soliciting
donations rather than commercializing products.
His involvement in interviews like the one with Doctor Anna
Maria Mahalcia shows an ongoing effort to link environmental
conspiracy narratives with current events like the
pandemic, which has brought intohis appeal in some circles while
deepening the skepticism and criticism from others.
(24:09):
As such, Carnecom remains a controversial figure, a
polarizing figure illustrative of the collision between citizen
driven research and established science.
The documentation he's produced,replete with data analysis and
passionate claims, ensure that the debate around chemtrails are
related phenomena will have a detailed record, even as experts
dismiss the premise of that debate.
(24:33):
So I'm kind of surprised this guy seems a little bit more
legit than I think I've always given him credit for.
Although a couple things. So you send it to a lab, the lab
says it's spider web, and you say hell no it's not.
But then you never send it to another lab.
(24:53):
That doesn't make sense to me, especially if your whole entire
reputation depends upon it and you believe that the entire
world is being assaulted by the government covertly.
I would think that you would go to the ends of the earth to
determine what the fuck that filament shit was.
I don't know. There could be something I'm
(25:14):
missing. Please write the show if you
know more, more morgolons@gmail.com.
Cliff, if you're listening, you're welcome to come on the
show. I'm not paying you because I
don't do that and I don't get $6000 off of doing this show.
But if I said that I was going to tell everybody about how I
(25:35):
use the money that I make off ofthis show, I would sure as hell
follow through with that promise.
I don't know, just a little sketchy, but this doesn't mean
anything. I'm not accusing him of
anything. I'm just saying that these are
the things that stand out to me 'cause you know me, I'm always
looking out for snake oil salesman quacks, hacks and whack
(25:58):
jobs who want to exploit our fears to sell us $300 bottles of
tea tree oil spray. I don't know.
This guy doesn't seem to be doing that for me personally.
The jury is out on on chemtrails.
(26:20):
I certainly have seen some instances of shit falling out of
the sky that looked a hell of a lot like morgalons under
microscopy. So, you know, my confidence
rating is maybe like a 90 or something percent confident that
there's definitely something going on, that he's on to
(26:43):
something. But I'm not sure it's relation
to morgalons. Definitely not sure.
In summation, you have learned nothing.
You're welcome. Keep coming back.
If you have thoughts or commentsabout Clifford Carnicom or if
you are Clifford Carnicom, send me an e-mail at
morgalons@gmail.com or leave a comment in the comment section.
(27:03):
Rate the show, leave a review, tell everybody on Facebook that
we exist and we're cool and Reddit and all those other
things that people go on on the Internet.
All right, have a wonderful day,night, evening, year.
I love you guys. Stay tuned.
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