UFC Nashville: Lewis Stops Teixeira, UFC 318 Storylines, Craig Jones & Chris Algieri Join The Show

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (33:00):
Hm reveal reveale.

Speaker 2 (33:28):
Look at this now, timpeted group. Jesus, Oh do you
want to?

Speaker 3 (33:47):
She's doing its time to. Oh yeah, it's Monday, July
fourteenth of the twenty five. Let's kick off a bad
ass combat sports week like only we can do Today

(34:07):
on Morning Combat, I'm Brian Campbell, the suburban Connecticut king
of all things cringe maybe maybe or maybe maybe pale
health and distinguished gentlemanship. But next to me is a
do DC's finest. He's a pretty damn good fight analyst
for a guy that refuses to fight. They call him

(34:28):
Luke Thomas. Hey, Luke, how are you?

Speaker 1 (34:30):
What's up? HEC? How was your weekend?

Speaker 3 (34:32):
It was heavy on work, but I will say this,
the work was fun because Box was back this past
weekend with those back to back NYC cards And I
don't know if you checked the combat schedule for Saturday,
but it's more loaded than one of your adult diapers
in about twenty five years. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (34:51):
I took a dump that breached the surface today, So
that's okay.

Speaker 3 (34:55):
You're crowding like the King of England. Hey, we have
a loaded show for you today. Not only are we
going to recap UFC Nashville, Taylor's Serato three and really
a bad ass, balls out All Action Ring three card
from NYC. Over the over the past weekend, we are
going to look ahead in a big way with special guests.

(35:17):
At noon Eastern, former world champion and a fine boxing analyst,
Chris al Jerry will join us live from Las Vegas
as we set the stage for Pacqui al Barrios. We
got Who's Sick du Bois Part two this weekend. A
lot going on, and then at twelve thirty pm Eastern today,
we're gonna press pause on BC's feces and how about

(35:37):
we welcome a live guest. When I say live, I
mean live in Luke's office, Craig Jones of Jiu Jitsu,
Grappling and Prostitution Circles. Luke, I am fired up for
this should.

Speaker 1 (35:50):
Be a fun one.

Speaker 4 (35:51):
As you indicated, you know there's the boxing over the
weekend was great. The combat Sports calendar, at least in
terms of main events this coming weekend is outstanding, so
a lot to enjoy and get.

Speaker 3 (36:04):
To Absolutely, Luke Thomas. It maybe early morning on the
East coast, but now is a good time to remember
where tequila's story actually began. I need to tell you
this because the seventeen ninety five folks Quervo invented tequila,
and since then you already know that Quervo has stayed
true to its roots, same family, same land, same passion.

(36:26):
In fact, two hundred and thirty years later, Cuervo's still
here in every pore and every margarita and every celebration.
So enjoy that tequila that invented tequila. Yeah, it's Quervo,
the tequila that started it all. So why don't you
proximo Quervo dot com and please drink responsibly, and why
don't you get fired up? For two days from now, Wednesday,
July sixteenth, live on the Morning Combat YouTube channel, Quervo

(36:49):
presents UFC three to eighteen pregame preview with bc lt
Jed Meshu the second and how about this? Have you
seen the shit? Get I moved to Wednesday? Also, So
Luke Thomas, we're going to be rocking out with a
little bit of that blanco, if you know what I'm saying,
as Cuervo and Company brings us a fun outing this Wednesday.

Speaker 4 (37:09):
Yeah, this one's going to be a real good time
and as an indicate that main event for USC three
eighteen a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
The rest of the card, you know, a little hit
or miss.

Speaker 4 (37:16):
But I think a little bit of our friends at
Cuervo is going to make it all all all a
good time.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
How about absolutely absolutely here sobsolutely Chris al Jerry. Today
at noon Eastern we'll look at the boxing Craig Jones
live on this broadcast at twelve thirty to talk about
leaving the B team and all things CGI two in
the future of the Jesuites. So a lot to get
into today. We may or may not have time for

(37:42):
have you seen this year or I'm sorry DMS from donks.
We'll get to that as it comes. Follow us on
the handles below, including our extended YouTube channels. Don't miss
Luke's Luke's political substack is making some moves these days,
right I'll.

Speaker 4 (37:56):
Tie Yeah, dude, I just secured an interview. I won't
be able to do it till later in August, but
I might be my best one yet. I'm pretty excited
about it. Also, I just want to say, like, I'm
sorry for the folks. We'll try to get to DMS.
I think it's a decent chance we'll do. Have you
seen this shit? I apologize we're not gonna be able
to get to it today in all likelihood, but some
of this stuff came together last minute, so we're just

(38:16):
making the best of what we have available to us.

Speaker 1 (38:19):
So we appreciate everyone's understanding.

Speaker 3 (38:21):
And a quick killo to our producer, director of Bong,
enthusiast and betting expert. He's one half of the Main
Card Minute podcast. He came here on a one way
ticket by way of a horned Australian's ball bag. Yeah
it is Luke Nosita. But Luke, you mentioned to us
off camera that today we got a guest from Long
Island and an azzie in the building. This is like
your super Bowl, right.

Speaker 5 (38:42):
It really is.

Speaker 6 (38:42):
And we got Chris Algeria and Craig Jones because you
know I'm the Aussie, the Australia. No, but you called
me a betting expert to intro MEBC went perfect this weekend,
six for six on the main Card, so let's go
big weekend, big weekend for main carme min.

Speaker 5 (38:56):
Also, my boy asked me to be his best man
this weekend.

Speaker 1 (38:58):
That was a high one.

Speaker 5 (38:59):
Ah, yes, a pretty big weekend in the Nocita household.

Speaker 3 (39:03):
All right, all right, decent boyfriend too. You know you
got to give Luke Nosita that credit right there? All right,
fired up, thank you for joining us, Luke. I had
something I wanted to say about.

Speaker 4 (39:14):
Everyone on the internet thinks you're gonna talk about Connor
McGregor's pecker.

Speaker 3 (39:18):
That was it. That was when I forgot to bring
up thank you so much. Yeah, hey, look at the
unit on that guy. What was that a cock ring?
What are we doing here? That guy's a gird hole.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
Luke, Yeah, it's pretty fucking gross.

Speaker 3 (39:31):
So he sent Dick. So this is the same twenty
four hour period where photos emerge of Connor with a
new mistress on the beach, and then he gets caught
sending stick picks to uh, a singer rapper.

Speaker 1 (39:42):
What was the lady's name, Azaleah Banks? I think is
her name?

Speaker 3 (39:45):
Yes, and she outed him by going public with the uh.

Speaker 4 (39:49):
You just have to imagine if he sent that to her,
he's probably sent that like a million times to other
people right.

Speaker 3 (39:56):
Far of jen Sturger, probably a lot of different.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
That's a old school pool right there.

Speaker 3 (40:01):
Wow, you go, wow, wow, what a gross human.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
That man, right, he's terrible. He's terrible.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
Yeah, he reminds me of all those people who go
to Morning Combat at gmail dot com and do the
same to Mikey. But you know that's neither here nor there.
All right, that's it. We got to get into it.
We got a busy show. Topic number one begins right now.
UFC Nashville over the weekend was a fight night card that, hey,
wasn't that strong on paper? I thought we got fireworks
through a lot of it, including in that main event

(40:29):
when Derek Lewis pissed all over Talis and to share
of the young heavyweight in just thirty five seconds. He
got him out of there. Now look already the UFC
record holder for most career KOs. The forty year old
Lewis would say leading up to this fight that he
felt disrespected by being put in there with a guy
who only had one UFC fight coming in. So not

(40:49):
only did the Black Beast get in his best shape
in eleven years, he rebounded from very early damage to
get another TKO finish, and afterwards he played all his hits,
including a new one, a mock urination on the corner
of Tashera who he accused his team of speaking to
him in Brazilian. He'd didn't understand, but he's sure they

(41:09):
were talking shit. So, Luke Thomas, this now puts the
lovable Lewis at three wins in his last four, all
by knockout, yet albeit against second rate competition. Yet, even
though when given a chance to call out his next opponent,
Lewis hilariously called out his own wife and made a
few sex jokes there, they were talking on the broadcast

(41:31):
about the idea of Lewis potentially cutting the line as
a fresh opponent for tom Aspinall. So, Luke, if this
was allowed for a guy who fought for its title
once before and just won't go away in this heavyweight division,
would you be insulted by it? Given the extreme lack
of depth, that maybe, just maybe Derek Lewis could be

(41:52):
in line for Tom Aspinall.

Speaker 4 (41:54):
I don't think that's crazy, nor should it be seen
as crazy, nor should it be seen as anything for
even undesirable. I mean, obviously everyone's mileage is going to
vary in terms of what fights get them excited and
who they think is deserving. But we said it on
Friday's MK. We deserves to be repeated here. Heavyweight is
kind of like flyweight now, and guys are going to
get title shots, maybe more quickly than you might imagine.

(42:17):
In this particular case, they're going to get one. It's
been a while since he fought DC, but you know,
under let's say, relatively expedited circumstances, given the winning streak.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
And I'm basically okay with it.

Speaker 4 (42:30):
I'm not saying he has to be next for Tom
Aspen all if they wanted to make the serial Gone fight,
is that is the better fight, at least in theory
that we think, because you would imagine on some level
Gone might be able to give Tom some problems. And
it's a fresh matchup. This one is too, but you
know that one's a little bit more of a higher caliber. However, Dude,
Derek Lewis is beloved, Derek Lewis is. You can make

(42:51):
an argument argument about who is the best knockout artist
of all time, but he is certainly, at a bare minimum,
the most prolific and the most prolific in this heavyweight
to vision people like him, he's guaranteed action. It's a
fresh matchup. The division needs some help. Guys are going
to get expedited title shots.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
I this is great. I don't know.

Speaker 4 (43:13):
I mean, this is this is them making the best
of the circumstances that they have. And whatever else you
want to say about a fight between Tom Aspinall and.

Speaker 1 (43:22):
Derek Lewis, it won't be boring.

Speaker 4 (43:23):
And if I maybe see saying one more thing, tom
Aspitall is obviously very very good. But one of the
reasons why the John Jones fight was important was for
ed many reason subting unification blah blah blah.

Speaker 1 (43:32):
But there are a lot of unknowns about.

Speaker 4 (43:34):
Tom Aspitall and some of the stuff that shows up
on tape about his chin being high in the air
and getting clipped. You know, Derek Lewis, I don't know
that I would favor him to win, but that kind
of threat cannot be dismissed either. I've seen guys get
wrecked trying to be nonchalant about knockout threats the kind
that Derek Lewis poses. So I understand it's unusual.

Speaker 5 (43:55):
BC.

Speaker 4 (43:55):
This is not how other divisions in a healthy way
would operate. But we are where we are, and this
is a pretty good option.

Speaker 3 (44:02):
Yeah, I'm surprised that I'm not upset by it, I
mean there really is a wasteland of potential options for
him gone not coming off the strongest performance. So there's
a lot of questions out there. I'm not trying to
act like Lewis's defeated top right opposition, but I wonder
if that even matters Long Island. Can we show the
side by side here as Luke Thomas needs to be

(44:23):
awarded for mentioning last week that Lewis did come in
maybe just four pounds under the heavyweight.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
You're it? You got senteled again, did I? So?

Speaker 4 (44:31):
The image on the right is from a video that
is ai.

Speaker 3 (44:35):
Okay, okay, man, I get Mma senteld like no one's business.

Speaker 4 (44:39):
I large just wondered how can fake news spread because
it seems so obviously fake, And then I met Dullard's
like you and I get.

Speaker 3 (44:46):
Well, you know, I did drop out of college to
be fair. But Luke the larger point, he obviously got
motivated to get in really good shape and proven point.
He typically does that over his because his elite career
has had so many highs and lows in you know,
bad stretches where he's not training hard, not running. He's
done that before coming off of losses. This time it

(45:06):
felt like maybe he realized there was an opening with
John Jones not coming through that door. So I got
to ask you, is a motivated and fit Derek Lewis,
even at age forty, still about equally as dangerous as
he's ever been when he does make these runs at
the belt. That of course ended with the loss to
Daniel Cormier at MSG. He badly lost an interim title

(45:29):
fight to Cyril Gone in Houston that time. But Luke like,
he's kind of the same dangerous. If he's in shape,
he's hella dangerous. And that's the bottom line.

Speaker 4 (45:37):
Right I again, he could get taken down and thrashed.
I mean, not too long ago, Sergei Spivak submitted him
in the first round. We kind of have to be
honest about what we have here. He is a limited
fighter in very key and fundamental ways. However, he's also
a very dangerous fighter in key and fundamental ways. And
to the point you raised, BC, this is something I've
actually we'll talk about later when we talk about UFC

(45:59):
three eighteen. We kind of associate Max Holloway's peak when
he was champion in the featherweight division. But BC I
went back and I watched their second fight. If you
compare the guy who fought to some poorier then to
the guy who knocked out justin Gaegee, it's just a
massively different guy.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
And so to the point you raise, you kind of associate.

Speaker 4 (46:15):
Guys with their peak moment in terms of, you know,
where they reached heights a relative to the rest of
the division.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
But I do agree with you.

Speaker 4 (46:24):
I mean, for example, like that one thing where he
pretends to be injured and then floors guys. He tried
it again here at it to an extent, set up
some of the offense he was able to score Ultimately
in the end, he has a ton of veteran savvy.
He doesn't panic in bad spots. So he's got limits,
and the limits are real, and they probably will end

(46:44):
up costing him against the guy as well rounded as
Tom Aspinall. However, however, his knockout power cannot be denied
at all. His veteran savvy cannot be denied at all,
His ability to get off of bottom.

Speaker 1 (46:56):
Cannot be denied at all.

Speaker 4 (46:58):
And again, given the state of the division, and are
these things enough to warrant a title shot and to
have least a modicum of interest in it.

Speaker 1 (47:06):
I would argue that it would.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
I have to agree with you. Let's hear from Lewis,
who talks exactly what Luke mentioned about playing possum with
the share, which really opened the door for that thirty
five second finish.

Speaker 7 (47:16):
I was acting like someone was in my eye and
I was waiting for him to get a little closer.
He ain't get close enough for the first time. So
I really was trying to make it, trying to sell it,
make it seem like he had got me in my
eye pretty good, and.

Speaker 5 (47:29):
Shit, that's what happened. I called him.

Speaker 7 (47:31):
Then I noticed he was trying to pull himself up
on a cage. I'm like, man, come on, man, he
had me hit my own leg. I'm trying to knock
my own leg out of sod. Yeah, so it was
messed up.

Speaker 5 (47:44):
Did you expect the ref to come in and stop
it right there?

Speaker 7 (47:46):
Yes, I expect the ref should have been stopping See
went in and out a couple of times. It was
like before he even started grabbing a cage.

Speaker 8 (47:54):
So when you threw that left hand, did you know
if it connected it, it was going to send him down.

Speaker 7 (47:59):
I know if if I throw anything at anybody, no
matter what it is, I know it is going to
go now. He was the king of the Texicab droves
in Brazil. Wow, But no, I don't want to easy
fighting like that. I want you know, of course, I
would like to do one more run at the title
it that'd be good.

Speaker 3 (48:17):
Too much, too soon for to share? It seemed that way.
But Luke, what do you make of the stoppage which
has gotten a lot of talk. I felt in real
time like it was too soon to shera did aggressively
break the rules and use the cage to lift himself up.
Maybe that led to the referees' decision. How did you
view it?

Speaker 1 (48:34):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (48:34):
I didn't care for the stoppage, but I want to
be clear. I you know, it seemed like Derek was good.
I mean my view as Derek was based on the
way that that one went. He was going to win
no matter what I mean. It was almost no circumstance
where I think he wouldn't have won. And I'm not
in any way mad that he won, But I didn't
love the stoppage. And I keep seeing these arguments made
about the stoppage that I just don't understand.

Speaker 1 (48:54):
I'm being dead serious. I don't understand at all.

Speaker 4 (48:56):
People are pointing out that he used the fence to stand,
he put his fingers. You can push on the fence,
but you obviously can't grab the inside of it, right,
and so he did that is against the rules. But
first of all, I'm just gonna say, like the nature
of the rules itself, that's much more important when someone's
trying to return you to the mat.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
But okay, putting that aside, just did he break the rules?
He broke the rules.

Speaker 4 (49:15):
But if you're going to if the referee is going
to stop about based on a foul like grabbing the fence,
and in particular this is actually itemized four fence grabbing
a they typically have to give a warning. But even
that you could say, oh, I didn't want to do
it because it was you.

Speaker 1 (49:30):
Know, in the heat of the moment. You can do
it on a DQ.

Speaker 4 (49:34):
So if you decide as a referee that grabbing the
fence was so egregious in this particular case, you can
just disqualify him. And you could even say, hey, listen,
he did it right at the moment where he was
about to be finished. This is an egregious foul right,
like fouling your way to prevent a stoppage in some
kind of way, then it should have been a DQ.
But people are not making that argument. What they're making
the argument is, oh, he broke the rules, he was

(49:54):
getting pounded on, therefore that's a stoppage. And I'm like,
that's actually not how the rules were at all. That's
not what they say, that's not what they show, that's
not what they call for. And people are also saying BC, oh,
grabbing the fence to get to get to your feet
is not intelligent defense. It's the definition of intelligent defense,
building height, getting to your feet. That's exactly what someone

(50:16):
should be doing. Now, they shouldn't be doing it by
grabbing the fence. So the method of how he did
it is a problem. But the notion that like, because
you broke a rule and you are also getting pounded on,
therefore you can just call it.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
You can, but it has to be a DQ.

Speaker 4 (50:33):
It's not grounds for saying they're not intelligently defending themselves.
In fact, it's the opposite of that. So I didn't
love the stoppage, but I don't in any way view
the result as like illegitimate Derek Lewis was gonna fucking win.
He was gonna fucking win. I just didn't give with
so much one as smoothly as it could.

Speaker 9 (50:50):
Do.

Speaker 3 (50:50):
You agree with the black best saying he was kind
of in and out of consciousness leading up to that.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
He might be right. I mean, obviously he's the closest
one to that.

Speaker 4 (51:00):
A little harder for me to tell on before we
got on the broadcast again, Dude, he was gonna whim like,
this is not some controversial like.

Speaker 1 (51:07):
Oh my god, the guy got robbed.

Speaker 4 (51:09):
No, it's just it's just the method of how it
was done doesn't make a lot of sense.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
But he might be right.

Speaker 4 (51:14):
He might the guy might have been out, and so
it's want to be as clear as I possibly can.

Speaker 1 (51:18):
I have zero issue with Derek Lewis winning.

Speaker 4 (51:20):
I just think if you're going to make the argument
that grabbing the fence should it should be penalized, the
penalty for it is a point and or a DQ.

Speaker 1 (51:27):
It's not.

Speaker 4 (51:27):
Oh, he's not intelligently defending himself. Building height is intelligent defense, period.

Speaker 3 (51:32):
Yeah, something Joe Rogan has really never worked on at all.

Speaker 1 (51:36):
Loop To be.

Speaker 3 (51:36):
Fair, we got Dana White reacting to the stoppage by
the way breaking news. Dana White was at a Fight
Night card. He reacted to the stopage. He talked about
the Trump phone call and addressed that idea we're bringing
up is Derek Lewis in the title picture. Let's hear
from the boss.

Speaker 10 (51:50):
You're sitting there, you watching Derek get a knockout, and
then President Trump just COEs you on the spot.

Speaker 11 (51:54):
No, Derek came over and said, where's the President. I said,
he's not here tonight. I said, but he's and I
got him on the phone and put him on the
phone with him.

Speaker 5 (52:03):
Do what Derek want to say? I have no idea.
You have to ask him.

Speaker 1 (52:05):
I don't know what they talked about.

Speaker 10 (52:06):
Maybe he's trying to book himself a fight on the whitecot.

Speaker 5 (52:09):
That's whatever he's trying to do right now.

Speaker 10 (52:11):
So then, obviously, with that being said, Derek could really,
if you look at the division as it is, be
maybe one fight away from getting a title shot next
to someone.

Speaker 11 (52:18):
That I think that's the way the heavyweight division has
always been. I mean, these guys, uh, you know, they
don't have to cut. Some of them have to cut,
but they don't have to cut a lot of weight,
and you know the fighting. A fight can turn with
one punch, whoever lands that big shot, and they were
both trying to land them and he got them.

Speaker 5 (52:36):
I thought the.

Speaker 11 (52:36):
Stoppage was a little fast, you know, Yeah, but that
is what it is.

Speaker 3 (52:43):
I didn't think it was a little fast too as well.
Just for the record, there also real quick not that
you know, maybe people I don't know. Look if you
care about the contents of that Donald Trump call, but
it was interesting when they came, when they came back
from commercial and the d L was on the line,
I did catch Derek Lewis pre fight interview in which
he said that he would love to talk to Trump,

(53:04):
but he was referencing all the prior convictions that he
was hoping to get pardoned on his record. But they
did catch up with Derek Lewis afterwards to ask him
that question. His response was predictably out of bounds.

Speaker 10 (53:16):
Let's listen, and when did you know you wanted to
speak to President Trump?

Speaker 7 (53:21):
Oh, I've been telling the ain't a couple of weeks.
Now I need to talk to him about something.

Speaker 10 (53:28):
Could you tell us what that something is? No, man, No,
would it be about maybe fight against classified.

Speaker 7 (53:35):
Yeah, yeah, it's classified. It's almost something about terrorists and
stuff like that.

Speaker 10 (53:39):
Oh, serious, serious stuff. Are they just signing you up?
You're going to join the FBI.

Speaker 7 (53:46):
We don't like the FBI right now, I mean Trump.
They're trying to they're trying to get that list out
of us. So I had to call. I had to
tell the president a, you know, make sure they don't
let my name.

Speaker 5 (54:00):
On that list.

Speaker 3 (54:01):
You know, look that lips. That list would be the
Epstein list and he definitely didn't kill himself. Are you
of the bat Oh wait, we're not on Luke Thomas Substack.
I was gonna ask if you were of the belief
that Trump is now switching gear just to avoid assassination.
Or maybe that's too deep for a Monday morning.

Speaker 1 (54:21):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (54:22):
I did see him get booed at the FIFA World
Cup or a Club World Cup final.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
That was funny.

Speaker 3 (54:26):
All right, we got a loaded show, so we got
to keep it going. Let's go to this co main event,
which has brought out some responses here as a welterweight
tilt between the rising Gabriel Bondfeme and the plus forty
veteran wonder Boy Stephen Thompson ends in a three round
split decision and a brutal gash on the leg. First,
can we show this picture on wonder Boy Thompson's leg good.

Speaker 1 (54:50):
Is fucking in sick bored.

Speaker 3 (54:52):
That is from a checked kick right there in the end,
though that the fight was a little bit back and forth,
and there was an argument that maybe wonder Boy should
have gotten the win. As we quickly look at the
picture of these scorecards which go down as a split decision,
you see Mike Bell giving rounds one in three to
bone Fime, same as Dave Terrelli. But it was Rick

(55:12):
Winter who gave rounds two and three for wonder Boy,
and it felt like Mma Twitter agreed with him most
Luke was WonderBoy screwed out of a victory in this
fight that he fought through some tough moments there to shine.

Speaker 4 (55:27):
I definitely think there's a case for WonderBoy here for sure.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
I mean, I put.

Speaker 4 (55:34):
The scorecards up one more time if you can, okay,
So so my scorecard is Rick Winters. But if you
notice everyone is unanimous on rounds one and two, So
then the question becomes what about round three and how
did you score it? And my answer would be I
scored it for for WonderBoy, But BC, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (55:49):
Thank you long on Luke.

Speaker 4 (55:50):
I don't know if it's the same people and what
I'm about to say, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
But I definitely hear a lot of people saying, well.

Speaker 4 (55:59):
You know, I don't like stand ups and I don't
like referee involvement, and if you're being held against the
defence so you're being controlled on the ground, it's your
job to fix it. And I've been trying to explain
to people this is not a great way to organize
a sport. It doesn't make a lot of sense. You
need the referees to intervene when positions get stalled out,

(56:19):
and it looked to MEBC like Bonfieme was stalling them out.
He was clinching him up against the fence, stalling him out,
not doing necessarily a ton of meaningful offense, but just
keeping Wonder Boy there to kind of run out the clock.
The referee, in my judgment, should have been more willing
to break it up. But the bigger point is he

(56:39):
should have been empowered to do that. I cannot believe
that people make arguments for stalling in MMA because that's
exactly what you're going to get. Guys can neutralize one another,
but then they can't extract themselves from the situation that
they're in, and it just holds steady. You need to
empower referees to break them apart, because BC, the thing

(57:01):
that I really I took from this was WonderBoy striking
is still like I wasn't sold on Bonfime on Friday Show,
and I'm still not really sold on Bonfme. He's obviously
got some ability, but I don't know if he's all
that great wonder boy at age what is he forty
two at this point? Like whatever number he is, his striking,
particularly a distance, is still crisp. It's still pretty fast,

(57:23):
it's still accurate, like it's very very effective even at
this late stage of his career.

Speaker 1 (57:30):
And I'm not saying we have to break him up
so that you could see more of it.

Speaker 4 (57:34):
But if guys are just using control positions to stall
out rounds, break them apart, and if the rules don't
allow for it, we should make the rules allow for it.
I don't know if that's how everyone else feels, but
I just hear this debate all the time about no
if you're held down, it's your job.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
To get up.

Speaker 4 (57:53):
This is giving the guy who is doing the stalling
all the license they need to keep it up.

Speaker 1 (57:58):
And in my judgment, BC, that's what Bonfime did.

Speaker 3 (58:01):
Yeah, I would agree with you. I also thought when
he got hurt at the end of round two, it's
sort of changed his desire to mix it up there
with the forty two year old Thompson Luke. This is
five losses in six fights now for wonder Boy. Even
if the general public says, hey, we need a deeper
examination of this fight, I think you said what we learned,
which is true that even with that sort of dark

(58:23):
record turn with five defeats and six fights, they've come
against very good competition. He's clearly showing you that he's
still got it at this level, which is a credit
to the shape he's kecked himself in and the incredible
speed and reaction times he's always held. But was this
the fight that tells you Bone Theme or at least
brother g Bone Theme here isn't going to get over

(58:44):
that hump that he's got the flashy submission skills. He
could take out the B minus guys in spectacular fashion.
But he may never get over that hill to true contention.

Speaker 4 (58:53):
Yeah, this was this was an opportunity for him, and
yes he got the W but he didn't pass the time.
I mean, I think we can all kind of agree
with that. At this point, You're right, the b minus guys,
he might be able to feast on them, you know,
quick guillotines and a number of other things he can do.
But wonder Boy has been kind of been serving as
a guy. Hey, can you graduate to the next level

(59:16):
in this division? That's what wonder Boy has been kind
of offering for people. And some of the better ones
have obviously been able to get past, but Bonfieme had
to eke to the finish line install his way to
do it. This was not a very convincing win such
that you can call it a win, I mean technically
a win obviously, but such as you can call it
like an authoritative victory.

Speaker 1 (59:33):
It's this. This was none of those things. I think
this is the reason why a lot of us were like,
you know, Bonfim's.

Speaker 4 (59:39):
Good, He's not really good. This was just a reminder
of that. He kind of is what he is at
this point. He'll beat some guys for sure, but I
don't know if he's going to ascend to the top
of this division anytime.

Speaker 3 (59:49):
Yeah, I'm with you on there. Hey, let's talk about
featherweight Steve Garcia at thirty three years old, who extended
his win streak to six with a thirty twenty seven
I believe across the board performance against Calvin cater a
shutout it was dominant. Is Steve Garcia a legitimate player
at one forty five moving forward?

Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
Yes, I do think he is. I thought this was
a nice win.

Speaker 4 (01:00:09):
He was a little nervous early, but I thought he
really settled in the longer that fight went.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
He got smoother and smoother.

Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
His combinations got better, and you could just tell he
was thinking more on his feet as the time went on,
and that's why some of the striking got better over
the course of that bout. So I want to be
very clear, I'm absolutely taking nothing from him. Your question
was is he a real player in this The answer
is absolutely yes. In this division he is someone to note.

(01:00:36):
The wind streak is legitimate. This was a very I
would say, a good opponent, certainly, and he's doing interesting things.
He is putting together a skill set and a run
that simply cannot be denied. However, b see, However, I
think if you watch tape from Cater from a few
years ago, there's really no way to deny that. Like
he's lost a step and people point to like Max

(01:00:58):
beating him up as one of the things that could
have been one. But I thought he rebounded from that
a little bit well. But the ACL surgery and everything else,
Like he's just not the same guy.

Speaker 1 (01:01:08):
And I'm not saying that to be disparaging.

Speaker 4 (01:01:09):
We like the New England cartel, we like Tyson Chardier,
we like Calvin Cator. But the tape for if you
guys don't believe me and you're a Fight Pass subscriber
or whatever, just go look a few fights so good
night and aof format, I would say, a few years ago,
go look at some of the ones, the performances he
was turning in and he just looked a little bit
more dynamic, ready, light on his feet, thinking, and he

(01:01:31):
just seems to get caught flat footed or just be
there to be hit a lot more than he once did. Now,
defense was never necessarily his strongest suit, but there was
just more going on. It seems like there's just less
he's able to do less now over the course of time.
So Steve absolutely is leveling up. But I don't think
that that's the entire story. Part of the story is

(01:01:52):
the decline of Cater.

Speaker 3 (01:01:54):
Yeah, Cater did have the upper hand on Rob Funt
in that most recent DraftKings commercial with John Annick where
he's putting it minute choke hold there in the Draftings studio,
So hopefully he gets some of that cheddar. You mentioned
Tyson Chardier, How about I mentioned Morgan Charier? Charier Charier.

Speaker 1 (01:02:10):
I don't speak French. I have no fucking ideas.

Speaker 3 (01:02:12):
I should learn his name soon. Look, because this featherweight,
it's exciting his balls and him and Nate the train
in the UFC put on nearly three rounds of back
and forth bad shit craziness, Charier getting an absolutely brutal
knockout in the finish, and to be fair, he was
largely getting the better of the very straight ahead land
where who loves to just square up and throw three

(01:02:33):
punch combinations. Only it broke through and it worked for
a while. Were you as entertained as I was? Because
I was like doing like the Arsenio wo woo pump
fists during this I was fired up.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
This was great.

Speaker 4 (01:02:44):
Yeah, this was the one where I was a little
bit confused about how it would go. Pre fight, I
was like, well, Morgan has never dealt with someone like
Nate in his face, just kind of putting on pressure.
But we thought that Morgan was the better striker and
that that would show up, and for like two rounds
that was like it was. It was kind of a
mix of both of those things, and it just seemed
like the end he was like, you know what, I'm
just going to close the show here and be the
more dynamic striker and that's kind of what you got

(01:03:05):
in the end. So like, to me, this was actually
something of a nice test for Morgan to pass. I
wouldn't say he did it with flying colors, but he
certainly did a very good job and I think dealt
with a little bit of adversity, showed some skill. I
will say, you know, some of the wrestling it was interesting,
like he would get to Landwueir's hips very quickly, land
where with a hard whizzard was able to like really

(01:03:27):
challenge some of those positions. So like this was some
real resistance that he faced from a guy who was
not as technically skilled but had that dog in him.
We all know that Nate land Where is famous for that,
and trying to deal with that is not so simple.
So the fact that he got it done in the
end maybe took him a little bit longer than you
would have preferred, but got the job done hand raised,
authoritative finish.

Speaker 1 (01:03:46):
Pretty good job by the Frenchman. Pretty good job, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
I mean Landware has such great conditioning to go with
his love of getting involved in blood and guts wars.
They never stopped coming. I like that chariar didn't break.
I did see a lot of criticism online of people saying,
stop shoulder rolling and trying to point fight this crazy guy.
This guy's going to try to make it a bat
shit crazy brawl. And the quicker you identify that meet
him halfway and get him out of there, the easier

(01:04:11):
the job will be. I wonder if Charie Er learns
a lesson here, Luke, because he did have the striking
advantage when they would exchange at the same time and
every time he touched lane where he was moving him.
So I'm glad he finally found that before the fight
ended and was able to get him out of there.
But a fun bit of theater. I gotta jump down
to that undercard, Luke. I was fired up for Johnny
Walker's brother, the heavyweight vaulter Walker, to come in here

(01:04:35):
and make his UFC debut and then need less than
a minute to do crazy shit, get a quick submission,
act like a maniac. Is this now the preferred crazy
Walker brother, not just from the standpoint of potentially spreading
his seed all over Scotland, but coming in and doing crazy, exciting,
highlight reel shit.

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
I'm gonna say this.

Speaker 4 (01:04:56):
Obviously, getting wins like this are fun, they stand out,
they're interesting. He's gotten several of them now, and at heavyweight,
it's unusual to see someone who can, you know, just
sit for fifty to fifty heel hooks.

Speaker 1 (01:05:09):
Basically.

Speaker 4 (01:05:10):
On the other side, I just want to be clear,
this is a gimmicky way to win. You are going
to beat some guys along the way doing this, absolutely,
but you're not going to win a title doing this,
and you're probably not going to beat a number one contender,
maybe even the fighter before that. I mean, heavyweight's a
little thin, so it's harder to say. He might be
able to take this pretty far just doing this, but
there is a very big difference between guys who can

(01:05:30):
clamp for quick submissions and then guys who can methodically
set it up. And the ones who can methodically set
it up have a significantly higher skill base. So heavyweights
a little weak. And this is a fun thing he's doing.
You can't deny it, but I just I'm not sure
how far you're going to be able to take something
like this without the other portions of the skill set.

Speaker 3 (01:05:52):
Well, let me dead wrong myself. That was not his
UFCA debut. As you mentioned, he's not had four fights
in the UFC's three and one since lost to Luca
bresh Luca Uh, Luca Don Luca Lucas Bresky Uh with
the fishes there unanimous decisions straight that. Since then, it's
been three straight heel looks and what do you say,

(01:06:15):
gimmicky submissions? Are you referencing the Mackenzie team.

Speaker 4 (01:06:19):
That's also yes, that's another guy. He didn't have the
ability to methodically set it up. He could just jump
and then clamp, and that's you, dude. You can beat
a lot of guys with a quick clamp. It's actually
very very effective clamp. You get my point. I'm just
saying that's very different than Charles Olavera. Charles Olavera has
a clamp too, But if you can't get it, that's fine.

(01:06:40):
He'll just methodically set it up and then submit you
from there. That's what I'm talking about. There's a big
gap between those kinds of guys. So is he dangerous, yes,
but there's a difference.

Speaker 3 (01:06:49):
Yeah, he's exciting his ship. What else from this undercard
moved you over the weekend, Luke?

Speaker 4 (01:06:54):
The opening bout I thought was actually pretty interesting between
the ladies here. You know, I complain all the time
that's not that exciting with the women fight, but this
was a very different kind.

Speaker 3 (01:07:02):
Of They were mismatches. They put two chick mismatches down there,
and they were exciting.

Speaker 4 (01:07:05):
Right, that's fine, But at least they delivered, right. I
Mean sometimes I've seen some mismatches and they the person
couldn't put the other one away. At least in this
particular case, you got with Fatima Klein with a nice
sort of head kick finish. Also, Mike Davis is very good.
Mike Davis had a bit of a like, you know,
a rough run early in his UFC career, where sometimes
he didn't perform up to level with an injury he had.
I think he had a tough fight against a dieke

(01:07:26):
YUSAF on Contender series, and maybe that was I believe
that's right. But in this fight against Mitch Ramirez, he
showed a lot of freaking skill and he's well rounded.
And this is a guy who I think at this
point is starting to get to more of the a
little bit of the methodical side of setting up offense,
not just submissions.

Speaker 1 (01:07:41):
So I really liked that as well.

Speaker 4 (01:07:43):
I thought that Jake Matthews Winter cheating and Jikwani was
a little anticlimactic because it happened so quickly. Also, shots
to Chris Curtis going down to one seventy. He had
to kind of, you know, gut it out late into
the fight, but Max Griffin made it hard for him.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
He still got the job done, So well done by him.

Speaker 3 (01:08:01):
Oh long Island, Luke, you are a you know, die
hard when it comes to these prelimbs. How will you
remember forty one year old Lauren Murphy now that she
says goodbye.

Speaker 5 (01:08:10):
To the US. Oh God, that fight was awful. I'm
not gonna lie, I think, Luke.

Speaker 6 (01:08:14):
Not giving Jake Matthews' credit there, man, dude, that was
a sick fight.

Speaker 3 (01:08:17):
Shout out Jake Matthews missions.

Speaker 4 (01:08:20):
But Kwani, it's like this is something I mean, I
know he's a black belt now, but it's like.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
This is something he's always kind of struggled with, you know.

Speaker 6 (01:08:27):
Yeah, but Jake Matthews. Nice to get a bounce back.
Oh actually, I think that's a few in a row
now for him. But either way, he always like looks
good against someone and then kind of falters.

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
Yeah, And maybe that's it.

Speaker 4 (01:08:36):
Maybe that's why I'm feeling. Yeah, and it's a nice one.

Speaker 5 (01:08:40):
Both people.

Speaker 6 (01:08:40):
You already shout it out, you know, I Fatima Kleine
from Long Island, gorgeous head kick, and Mike Davis from
Upstate New York, you know, shut out.

Speaker 3 (01:08:46):
Just saying this guy's always calling out the locals, the Aussies,
the Long Island as all those people.

Speaker 1 (01:08:52):
Upstate New York is the land that time forgot.

Speaker 5 (01:08:54):
There you go, I'll agree with that.

Speaker 3 (01:08:56):
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Speaker 4 (01:09:43):
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Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
Indeed, well done, Let's go to topic number two. It
took place in New York City, Madison Square Garden and
Netflix with the Big Trilogy between Katie Taylor and Amanda
Serrano and asking these two future Hall of Famers to
out deliver their legendary first two fights was already going
to be a difficult challenge, But despite a fantastic promotion

(01:10:47):
from Jake Paul's Most Valuable Promotions and Netflix and an
absolutely electric atmosphere at MSG on Friday Night, along with
some great production from Netflix, you Gotta Shout it Out,
their third third fight turned out to be very tent
to yet competitive kind of felt in real time like
a bit of a dud. Despite the split decision result,
there wasn't much outrage this time, as Katie Taylor earned

(01:11:09):
a deserved victory her third overall against Serrano. Luke was
this victory more of the result of Katie Taylor at
thirty nine, proving once and for all that she's the
more superior boxer of the two. Or do you bring
up an Amanda Serrano's very questionable game plan and maybe
even her lack of urgency that ultimately cost her in

(01:11:29):
the end.

Speaker 1 (01:11:30):
Yeah, I think it's both.

Speaker 4 (01:11:31):
I mean, Katie Taylor going to and Ozho was no scandal.
We've been over this a million times. It was no scandal.
I thought Serrano won at least one of those.

Speaker 1 (01:11:39):
But it's not a scandal, and I had no problem
with it.

Speaker 4 (01:11:41):
But to me, it left a little bit of doubt,
like what is actually possible if they can make the adjustments?
And we all thought on Friday, quite wrongly, that this
was going to be a barn Murner. This was definitely
quite a letdown for me. It was not a bad fight.
I'm not gonna sit in and sale it was some
kind of terrible affair, But it wasn't very good and
it wasn't very interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:11:58):
Sorry match, Luke. Be honest, it kind of felt like
this why I'm at your time.

Speaker 1 (01:12:00):
But it wasn't horrible. It just wasn't much. It just
was you know, was whatever.

Speaker 4 (01:12:07):
That's not to say Netflix didn't do an unbelievable job,
and then Jake Paul as well, which I'm sure we'll
talk about, but just sticking with the fight BCE. I
hated Amanda Serrano's game plan.

Speaker 1 (01:12:17):
I hated it.

Speaker 4 (01:12:18):
She is an offense first fighter, and that was a
defense first plan. If you have, if you're that kind
of fighter, your offense first and your game plan is
defense first, you can do that for a little while, right,
I'm gonna slow bleed the flight fight and then change
and turn it up late.

Speaker 1 (01:12:32):
But she never did. How do you expect to beat
Katie Taylor.

Speaker 4 (01:12:36):
When the range at what you're fighting and the pace
at what you're fighting is something that uniquely advantages her,
and it's a pace that she can maintain the entire fight.

Speaker 1 (01:12:45):
That was That was not a winning game plan. That
was not a winning effort.

Speaker 4 (01:12:49):
Now people have rightly pointed out that, like the fact
that after twenty rounds in a long career, both of
them were probably, you know, not necessarily looking forward to
a blood and guts kind of fight, which I can
appreciate that I.

Speaker 3 (01:12:59):
Certain to be to be fair, it didn't have to
be blood and guts.

Speaker 1 (01:13:02):
It didn't have to be. It could have been more
than what it was.

Speaker 4 (01:13:03):
I understand it's not either or, but the thing is,
Serrano doesn't know how to calibrate, right. She's either all
in or she's all out, and she was all out,
and so I think Katie Taylor was like, sweet, I'm
happy to box on the outside, and dude, people are
calling that fight close. The rounds were not like a
huge swing one way or the other. But it looked
to me like Katie was definitely the superior boxer between them,

(01:13:24):
especially on the terms of which they were fighting. She
was the one of the Olympic pedigree. She was the
one who was landing and exiting. She was coming over
the top with the jab, she was catching her with
check hooks and then exiting, and Serrano never really did
anything to adjust it. Again, if she's shop worn and
she just didn't want to go through the war anymore,
I get it. But the game plan that she had,
she was never gonna win with that. You could fight

(01:13:46):
Katie Taylor a hundred times with that game plan. If
you're a man of Serrano, you're gonna lose all one hundred.
I freaking hated hated, hated that game plan.

Speaker 3 (01:13:56):
It wasn't just a bad game plan, in my opinion,
I think it was poor execution of that game plan.
She stood from distance far too out, spamming jabs that
really had no chance of connecting, and it wasn't like
she was spamming those to set up her left crosses.
I feel like she didn't use the weapons that she
brought to the table there. Maybe crowding her given the
two minute rounds and really trying to get her on

(01:14:18):
the inside going to the body would have been a
better strategy. But the fact that she had no adaptability
during such a big fight on such a grand stage
that so many people work so hard to build, and
obviously they were part of building that. In a lot
of ways, I felt bad for her after having two
fights in which she performed so well where you can
make an argument for both, she just did. I mean,

(01:14:39):
she didn't even look good in that game plan. And look,
this is where those two minute rounds, which when it's
fast paced, when it's all action like the first two
fights in which Toronto was pushing a crazy pace, those
are hard to score because there's just so much happening.
Or both are having success. But when you do the
opposite in two minute rounds and you hold the ball
and you slow it down and then we're base in

(01:15:00):
the end, gonna judge were the three four punches of
Taylor off of clean countershots in which she got in
and out more valuable than the spamming jabs, some of
which touched Taylor A couple body shots from Serrono. Yeah,
Taylor's shots are gonna win out. They're cleaner, they're powerful,
they're more memorable. Her technique was better, Everything about it
was better. So it wasn't just a disappointment for me

(01:15:21):
in the game plan. It was the lack of an adjustment.
She didn't even execute that well. And I really thought
her corner with Jordan Malnado, her brother in law, manager
and trainer, there was really just no talk of adjustments.
Maybe they felt they were deeper in the fight than
they were in terms of the scores, and obviously with
the split decision, they weren't that far off. But still,
if Toronto had won a backdoor decision here, it wouldn't

(01:15:43):
have been this triumphant moment. It would have been for
the third straight fight. Maybe the wrong fighter one, right,
I mean, she clearly did not get the better of
the two. Now, I don't think she deserves the full
on meme treatment, but Luke Boxing Twitter gave it to
her after the fight.

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Ifjord is fucking brutal giving.

Speaker 3 (01:16:00):
Her the Edgar Berlanga Puerto Rico parade after he lost
to Canelo experience right there. I feel bad for Serrano
because she has fought so well in this series up
to that point. We talk about it, We should talk
about it. They promoted the absolute shit out of this card.
I love the production, which they spent a shit on
on and it worked. It looked great. I don't know.

(01:16:24):
I mean, I didn't necessarily love Sean Grandy, who I
thought did a great job calling the fights. I didn't
love his over the top salesmanship that we're watching this
classic we'll never forget.

Speaker 4 (01:16:34):
No, I'll just kind of operate under the assumption that
this fight was just as good as the first two.

Speaker 3 (01:16:37):
And yeah, and I don't And I'm not necessarily blaming
the two fighters in this case because a lot of
times in boxing history, a big war in one fight
will lead to a like look at Perrera Morales, one
of the greatest trilogies of all time. The Mexican War
number two was not a war. It was a It
was a safe sort of point fighting decision. It happened

(01:17:00):
at times, But considering the stakes, considering what was put
into it, I don't know if this main event was
the best advertisement for women's boxing when it was really
set up to be the perfect one moving forward.

Speaker 4 (01:17:11):
Yeah, it see something to I mean, I realized women's
boxing is in a different place than men's boxing, right,
So like some of these questions are not together altogether unfair,
but like turning every single women's fight into a referendum
on women's boxing just seems a little bit much to me. Again,
the fight was not great, we can all say that,
but it was promoted expertly. The production looked fucking incredible,

(01:17:31):
you know, it just didn't deliver, and not all fights do.

Speaker 1 (01:17:34):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (01:17:34):
Do you think this helps Taylor's argument and potentially being
considered the greatest female fighter of all time? She's certainly
up against it from someone like Clarissa Shields, the current
poff for pound king, who's won titles in five divisions,
you know, undisputed in two. But now Katie Taylor, at
thirty nine, has three wins over Amanda Serrano, she avenged
her only lost to Chantell Cameron. She's a bigger star,

(01:17:57):
you could argue than any of the women boxing today.
What do you think this fight did to her legacy?

Speaker 1 (01:18:03):
A lot?

Speaker 4 (01:18:04):
Actually, I mean again, the question this is the problem
with the way that it went.

Speaker 1 (01:18:09):
Serrano kind of went out maybe with a whimper is
too strong.

Speaker 4 (01:18:12):
But the reason the third fight was exciting on paper
was you thought, okay, well we just saw twenty rounds
of these two killing each other, like this is going
to be great.

Speaker 1 (01:18:21):
But also that there was some dispute, right.

Speaker 4 (01:18:24):
There was dispute over yeah, Katy Taylor got her hand raised,
but there's dispute over whether she should have. And then
after the third one you're like, you know what, maybe
there shouldn't have been dispute. I mean again, you can
still go back and watch the first two and decide
that Serano one.

Speaker 1 (01:18:36):
I don't think it's unfair.

Speaker 4 (01:18:37):
I'm just saying it closed in a reasonably authoritative way
to the point where it almost made you realize, yeah,
this was a one sided robbery. Might be a little
bit strong, but like one person clearly is the better
of the other one. And they had three chances and
they came up short on all three nights. You know,
I don't know how that does anything but buttress your case,

(01:18:59):
not merely as the best of the two in the rivalry,
but it ultimately your place in women's boxing history.

Speaker 1 (01:19:03):
This is this, dude. She did. Amanda Serrano did not
do everything that she could and he needed Katie Taylor.

Speaker 4 (01:19:09):
But Katy Taylor did everything she needed to and that
to me was the big difference. And she did it
with skill.

Speaker 1 (01:19:14):
Yeah, that goes a long way in my book.

Speaker 3 (01:19:17):
Taylor would not commit after whether she will retire or
continue fighting, but the whole idea of whether a trilogy
against Chantell Cameron, who won on this undercard in her
first fight under the MVP banner. Taylor gave a cold
response to that idea when asked after the fight.

Speaker 10 (01:19:33):
Maybe I think Shandall has to see if she can
set out one Tels Theater arena.

Speaker 5 (01:19:37):
First.

Speaker 2 (01:19:39):
I don't think she can set out I stay to it.

Speaker 4 (01:19:43):
Also, I think I made her.

Speaker 10 (01:19:45):
It made her more way.

Speaker 5 (01:19:46):
Does she redeserves to who?

Speaker 12 (01:19:48):
I know?

Speaker 8 (01:19:48):
But what do you think?

Speaker 3 (01:19:49):
I don't know if she needs a translator, But she
said Cameron needs to sell out a one thousand seed
Arena first and probably has made more money from Taylor
than she deserves. That's a I like this kind of
like victory lab trash talk from her that we're seeing lately, Luke,
you into that.

Speaker 4 (01:20:06):
I mean, at this point her career, she's looking to
start starting to look to me like she's a lot
of fucks to give, So I'm about it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:13):
Alicia Bombgartner, also in her first way fight with MVP,
won a competitive decision over Jennifer Marshall to defend her
undisputed one hundred and thirty pound title in the Comaane.
It was her first fight under new trainer Derek James,
and then she called out Katie Taylor afterwards. Luke, do
you think that could be a fight in which bomb
Gardner will have to move up multiple weight divisions but
she's been threatening to do that to fight Clarissa Shields?

(01:20:35):
Do you think this could be a very big fight
moving forward and one maybe that Taylor would want.

Speaker 1 (01:20:41):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:20:41):
I didn't The Komain event to me was the least
interesting about on this card. I know Bumgarner won, but
I didn't think it was a very decisive performance. She
the thing is the LBC. She did get a win.
She can promote really well. You know, she's got a
certain look that could go a long way, So I
would not be surprised if they do it. If you're

(01:21:01):
asking me, though, am I like particularly excited for that one?

Speaker 1 (01:21:06):
I don't know so, so.

Speaker 3 (01:21:08):
All right quickly, Shadejah Green, and the former college basketball player,
won Most Valuable Promotions two hundred and fifty thousand dollars
post fight bonus for her performance in a very close
decision over Samanna Savannah Marshall to unify titles at one
sixty eight. Luke, We've been following Shadai's story for a while.
It was a inspirational sort of tear felt moment afterwards,

(01:21:29):
But did the judges get it right? In your eyes?

Speaker 1 (01:21:32):
It was close. I could see why Savannah Marshall had
a case. I was close. It was to me, you know,
coin flippish, very very close.

Speaker 4 (01:21:41):
But I will say to your point, we got introduced
to Shadejah Green years ago when she was fighting on
Jake Paul undercards.

Speaker 1 (01:21:47):
Jake's been promoting her a long time.

Speaker 4 (01:21:48):
That's what I mean about Jake Paul the promoter, Like
he really is doing something very very good in the sport,
and he's.

Speaker 1 (01:21:54):
Doing it very well. So I don't really have a
problem with her winning.

Speaker 4 (01:21:59):
Cut to my head, BC, I would maybe have gone
with Marshall, but I you know, there were there were
This was a competitive bout and it was a Green I
thought it did better in the middle parts and Savanna
a little bit better early.

Speaker 1 (01:22:11):
So it's just it's a tough call.

Speaker 3 (01:22:12):
It's a tough call, and it was coming off a
two year boxing layoff as she was doing MMA training
for PFL in between. Now Green becomes an opponent potentially
for Clarissa shield Too as a fight at heavyweight coming up.
But how about the announcer, one of the announcers on
this Netflix card, Leila Ali, making this statement after the
fight about maybe whether she'll come out of retirement at

(01:22:32):
forty seven against Cloressa.

Speaker 13 (01:22:35):
Made the last one at Clarissa Shields. There's rumors that
you gotta come back and find a one.

Speaker 3 (01:22:39):
You gotta.

Speaker 5 (01:22:40):
Everybody's talking about it or in the boxing sip.

Speaker 12 (01:22:42):
The rumor that I heard was that I said that
unless somebody had fifteen to twenty million, don't even call.

Speaker 3 (01:22:47):
Me about this.

Speaker 5 (01:22:48):
Turkey has that money?

Speaker 1 (01:22:49):
Church is gonna sit this up.

Speaker 5 (01:22:50):
I know it.

Speaker 12 (01:22:50):
Unless somebody calls me and says they have it, We're
not even gonna have a conversation. I'm not trying to
come back and fight, but if someone offered that kind
of money, I would actually have to think about it.

Speaker 13 (01:22:58):
I talk to Turkey tonight, fight again, Yes you do?

Speaker 5 (01:23:01):
I think beautiful, Luke?

Speaker 3 (01:23:04):
Would that do anything for you?

Speaker 1 (01:23:05):
Is this scumbag? You look beautiful too, honey?

Speaker 3 (01:23:09):
Yeah, here's the deal.

Speaker 1 (01:23:10):
Stup.

Speaker 3 (01:23:11):
I'm never gonna not mention. I'll always say or sorry.
Layla is, you know, potentially a mount Rushmore and one
of the greatest of all time, undefeating her career. She
ducked Dan Wool straight up. She also could have fought
Shields early and Cloris's run when they had some big
trash talk moments around the time that Laila was forty.
Now at forty seven, even if Turkey bought in, paid

(01:23:32):
her fifteen million, and was all into the storyline because
she's Ali's daughter, do you give her a chance in
that fight?

Speaker 1 (01:23:39):
Not? Really.

Speaker 4 (01:23:39):
I don't want to see that she's forty. She's nearly fifty.
You see, I'm forty five. In my back hurts if
I sleep wrong taking a nap. I mean, I realized
that Leila's a better athlete. But I'm just saying, this
is not a sport where forty seven year olds are
dynamic talents with rare exception, and.

Speaker 1 (01:23:53):
Maybe she could be that.

Speaker 4 (01:23:54):
You know, I wouldn't completely dismiss the idea, but you know,
be hop is special for a reason.

Speaker 1 (01:23:58):
No.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
Yeah, let's see if Manny pack Yo can Adam at
forty six on Saturday night. Let's go to topic number three.
It was the Ring three card from Louis Armstrong Stadium
in Queens, New York, and in that main event, Hamza
Shiraz be brutally KO'ed Edgar Berlanga to become the mandatory
for Canelo Alvarez and in some ways the new sensation

(01:24:18):
at one hundred and sixty eight pounds in his debut.
But from that unique venue living up to expectations, to
the four action packed fights on the card and that
decisive finish in the main event, I gotta tell you
Turkey's Ring three was a massive, massive success on Saturday
from an entertainment standpoint, and Luke outside of the circus

(01:24:40):
side show with Turkey, where we get a lot of
cop and reno VERSACI and all that other stuff going on.
I have to ask you a serious question. Has this
Ring series. Yes, we had the weird times Square card,
but when you encount you Bank Ben one, you count
this big card that the promoting coming up with David Benavidez,
and you count Saturday nights with all the overflowing trash

(01:25:01):
talk and the tough matchmaking, has Ring quietly become the
best thing going on in professional boxing right now? Am
I crazy?

Speaker 4 (01:25:08):
It's still hit or miss quite literally, but the hits
have been really good hits you know.

Speaker 3 (01:25:15):
Is great, dude, it's great.

Speaker 4 (01:25:17):
The U Bank Ben car Or the main event, certainly
at a bare minimum, was extraordinary. The Time Square was
a dud. I mean, there's really no getting around that.
That's part of the report card too. It was a dud,
but it wasn't the kind of dud that makes you
think that like, oh, they couldn't get it right, And
sure enough they got this one pretty right.

Speaker 1 (01:25:32):
Now.

Speaker 4 (01:25:32):
I don't know how well it did at the box office.
I think there's pretty much an open question about that.
In terms of what it did on pay per view
as well. We'll have to see, however, you know, did
it deliver in terms of the fights themselves, And there's
really no question that it did. It maybe even over delivered.
It was fantastic, and you know, we haven't got to
it yet, but youa. Kr Stevenson looked tremendous. Hamas Shiraz
looked very good. Edgar Belonga looked terrible, like I said

(01:25:55):
he would so.

Speaker 3 (01:25:57):
If he was in the fight till he wasn't. It
was a tense battle for about three and a half rounds.
It was back and forth.

Speaker 1 (01:26:03):
Yeah, lasted three and a half rounds before he got
you know, started to get brutalized. BBC. He's bad. He's
not good.

Speaker 4 (01:26:09):
And I know you don't want to have this debate
because you're like, you don't want to have this.

Speaker 1 (01:26:14):
Because you like Big Red.

Speaker 4 (01:26:15):
We all like Big Red, we all like Canelo Alvarez.
But I've been saying for a while he has dropped
off pretty significantly. And you can describe that in whatever
terms you want. But the fact that he went twelve rounds,
everyone was like, oh, he went twelve rounds with Mungia
because he carried him. Okay, I can buy it.

Speaker 3 (01:26:29):
He admitted to it. He admitted to it.

Speaker 5 (01:26:31):
Afterward.

Speaker 4 (01:26:31):
Yeah, well he admitted to it. He said he did it.
That doesn't mean he had actually did it. But okay,
putting that aside twelve rounds with Berlanga is borderline shameful.

Speaker 1 (01:26:42):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (01:26:42):
And here he is Berlanga fighting somebody who wasn't going
to play any of those fuck fuck games with him,
and he got viciously, viciously stopped. People need This is
why BC, this is why I'm going to give Crawford
the nod in my prediction. The people who note, well,
Crawford's going up three weight classes, they're right, that's a
big hurdle, or that Canilo power is going to be

(01:27:03):
the last thing to go.

Speaker 1 (01:27:04):
You know, he's not.

Speaker 4 (01:27:04):
Really dealt with anybody who can do that fair. Those
are real things that you could point to to make
you think that Canelo is gonna win. But the other
side of the coin here is that he's been underperforming
quite literally at this point for years, four years. I
do not have confidence in him to beat a level fighters.
Whether or not Crawford is that at that weight class

(01:27:25):
by the time in September, I don't know, but I'm
banking that he will be.

Speaker 3 (01:27:28):
We'll have a lot of time to break that down.
I understand how that connects, and I did dead wrong
myself earlier. It's Jennifer Miranda who lost to Bomb Gardner,
not Jennifer Marshall. Thank you, Long Island.

Speaker 5 (01:27:37):
Luke.

Speaker 3 (01:27:38):
Let's go to the clowning that Berlanga is receiving here
after Shiraz knocked him down three times brutally chaoted him.
Here's Berlanga's biggest critic, Oscar de la Hoya chiming, Oh
my god, she as congratulations.

Speaker 14 (01:27:56):
You got.

Speaker 6 (01:28:00):
I think couldn't.

Speaker 3 (01:28:05):
Well, he's insufferable, Luke. But Berleannga definitely talked enough shit
to deserve this. But here's my bigger question. You say
he sucks. He didn't look good once it got Harry
on Saturday. But is it fair to announce Charaz as
a danger to this division, as a future champion, as
the newest, freshest thing, or did he mop up on

(01:28:27):
second rate competition and we won't be seeing Edgar at
this level again?

Speaker 4 (01:28:31):
Well, he definitely mopped up on second rate competition. However,
I'm not I'm not ready to say that Sharaz is
like all of a sudden no wow, And I know
what like Turkey's gonna do right. They're gonna try and
make Sharaz Canelo. I'm not convinced Canelo fights any one
of Sharaz's level ever, again, you know what I mean,
I'm not.

Speaker 1 (01:28:49):
I just think these are due though.

Speaker 3 (01:28:53):
When he steps in there, man, he can punch, He's long,
He's got variety. Charaz can punch. Man. I know he
got audited against the admis. It's true. But if you
fight with him, you could get you can get put out.
There's no Thomas is.

Speaker 4 (01:29:05):
Tricky, and he was also on Twitter all that night
talking about how much better he was and so I
I dude, Domis is good and domases and that was all.

Speaker 1 (01:29:12):
You know, there was a tricky ass fight for him.

Speaker 4 (01:29:14):
But you know, fully at one sixty eight super middleweight,
I thought he looked good in the weight class. He
was long, he was tricky, He he does a good power,
the combination work, like he just kept throwing and throwing.
You would see that Berlonga would be, you know, kind
of holesting his weapons a little bit. So I gotta
tell you, I thought that that was a very very
impressive showing. But again, beating Berlonga is one thing. Beating

(01:29:34):
some of like real Real Good Fighters is a very
different one.

Speaker 3 (01:29:37):
All Right, we will pause this conversation. We'll get to
Chris al Jerry in the second as we look ahead
to the weekend. But Luke, I gotta talk to you
quickly about True Classic because when it comes to the
way I feel, the way I look, changing the way
I feel, that's what I feel about True Classic. Right.
The mission goes beyond fit in fabric. It's about helping
guys show up with confidence and purpose. And We've said

(01:29:59):
it before on the sh show, and I'll say it again.
When I put on the True Classic tea or the
form fitting genes, my wife notices something different. Have you
been in the gym?

Speaker 1 (01:30:08):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:30:08):
I haven't, but I have been in the True Classic, Luke,
and I know you can feel that same feeling.

Speaker 4 (01:30:13):
They had no doubt about it. I mean, I can't
give them a bigger endorsement than this. Long before they
ever decided to sponsor the show, I was wearing their clothes.
What else do I need to say that When they
came to us within a whether they're like, hey, you
know they're interested in doing some ads on the show,
I was like, this is.

Speaker 1 (01:30:28):
The easiest yes, in the whole wide world.

Speaker 4 (01:30:30):
This is something I already use. This is something I
already know is good. And to BC's point, it makes
you look good, It makes you feel good. Premium products,
great fit in all the right places. My wife loves it.
You can mix and match it during the summer, during
the winter, whether you can. You can dress it up,
you can dress it down. Guys, this is what you need.
True Classic is going to set you off. I bought

(01:30:50):
it before they ever sponsored us here on MKBC.

Speaker 1 (01:30:55):
So here's what you can do.

Speaker 4 (01:30:57):
You can grab True Classic at go to True Classic
dot com slash Combat, but you can get them at
Target Costco a bunch of places. One more time for
the folks listening on the audio platforms, True Classic dot
Com Slash Combat Combat with a K.

Speaker 1 (01:31:13):
I promise you you cannot go wrong with them.

Speaker 3 (01:31:15):
Yeah, age gracefully. Forget the overpriced designer brands. Ditch the
disposable fast fashion, True Classic, built for comfort, built to last,
built to give back. Head on over to True Classic
dot Com Slash Combat with a K for more True Classic.
Oh yeah, get on board. You're gonna feel it. You're
gonna love it. The way you look. BC's telling you
that right here. All right, let's get into topic number four.

(01:31:37):
As we look ahead to a loaded weekend in boxing,
we had to go to the bullpen and call one
of our favorites in the game, the former world champion
and the world class boxing analyst himself, Chris Aljerry, who
once went the distance in a title fight against Manny Pacquiao.
Chris will return to ringside this Saturday, of course, July nineteenth,
to co host the PPV dot COM's exclusive viewer Chat

(01:32:01):
in real time live from Las Vegas during the PBC
on Prime pay per view headline of course by Manny
Pacio and Mario Barrios, and throughout ppv dot COM's HD
live stream of the fights, you can hear from Chris throughout.
It begins a PM Eastern five Pacific time, and of
course you can order the pay per view at ppv

(01:32:21):
dot Com no subscription required. Let's bring him in. He's
an avocado enthusiast and author, a former kickboxing champion. We
love him. Live from Las Vegas. It's Chris Algerry, co
host of Inside Boxing Live. Chris, great to have you here,
my friend, but this is an early wake up call
for you on the West Coast. We appreciate that, bro.

(01:32:41):
How's ever?

Speaker 15 (01:32:42):
Yeah, yeah, gentlemen, thank you so much for the intro.
I love being here as well, so thanks thanks for
having me.

Speaker 13 (01:32:48):
Yeah, we got it, We got a we got an
early call time. I'm out of here in Vegas, right
and early.

Speaker 15 (01:32:52):
I got, I got my coffee, I got my workout
in so but I'm ready to chat Mannupacau.

Speaker 3 (01:32:57):
Well, Chris, you are retired now, but of course you're
keeping in tip top shape. I'm the same age as
many Pacio at forty six, and my fitness is up
and down. But let's talk first about what we're gonna
see Saturday night. In this main event is pakioo four
years four and a half years removed, excuse me from
the loss to your Dennis Ugas filling in for Aerol Spence.
And yes, we did see Manny a year ago and

(01:33:19):
then maybe an ill advise exhibition bout at one hundred
and sixty pounds where he wasn't in great shape. But
when he goes in there against WBC Welterway title holder
Mario Barrios on Saturday, straight up, how realistic is it
that he could compete? Or maybe that he could add
his name to the likes of George Form and Bernard Hopkins,
Archie Moore, these great all time greats who have kept

(01:33:41):
it going in their forties.

Speaker 15 (01:33:43):
Listen, if we were talking about anybody else besides many Pacyao,
I would say there's some to no chance that he's
even gonna be competitive. But many Pacyao is something special.
He's something different. He's a one of one. There's never
been a Mani Pacao, there never will be a Mani
pacy How you get that idea kind of nostalgically, like, listen,
if anybody can do it, many.

Speaker 13 (01:34:02):
Pacio's that guy. How realistic do I really think it is?
I don't really know. We have a lot of questions.

Speaker 1 (01:34:07):
You know.

Speaker 15 (01:34:07):
You mentioned that exhibition match versus a kickboxer that he
did not too long ago. But I'm gonna go out
on a limb and say that he didn't train for that.

Speaker 13 (01:34:14):
He just showed up. He said it was at one sixty.
He looked fleshy.

Speaker 15 (01:34:17):
We've never seen him look like that physically, and from
the reports that we see now, the workouts that we
see from Wildcard Gym with Freddie Roach, he looks to
be an awesome condition.

Speaker 13 (01:34:25):
Even at forty six, we were getting.

Speaker 15 (01:34:27):
Those old looks at him throwing a million punches on
the bags, him doing pad work, him doing the morning runs.
My nephew was actually out there sparred with Manny's son
and did the runs with them, said he looked like
he was in really good shape.

Speaker 13 (01:34:39):
So there's a lot of questions. You know, we don't
know who's gonna show up.

Speaker 15 (01:34:43):
We got to see how much of that many pacio
of old is left in the forty six year old
retired senator.

Speaker 13 (01:34:49):
But I don't know. I'm still intrigued because it's many packyo.

Speaker 3 (01:34:53):
I mean, I'm with you. It's like, I think there's
been times in the second half of Manny's career where
the motivation the training has dipped, right. You know, I
don't know if he came in world class shape for
that Jeff Horn fight. Yet a couple years later he's
beating Keith Thurman, handing him his first defeat and nearly
becoming the Fighter of the Year at age forty to
become the oldest welterweight champion. You, of course, fight fought

(01:35:14):
him when he was closer to his prime, and you
were certainly in yours, just on the basis of facing
someone like Pacquiao. Why is it potentially possible that he's
the one of one alien? What does he do that
might be able to still be there at forty six?

Speaker 13 (01:35:30):
Yeah, and I was.

Speaker 15 (01:35:31):
I shared the room with Manny Pacio eleven years ago,
and it was a little bit after he was starched
by jan On the Marquez. You know that that scary
face down knockout, and many made an adjustment after that fight.
He was less of that forward, full attack shot out
of a cannon type offensive machine that we saw in
the lighter weights. After that fight, he boxed more, We

(01:35:53):
saw more of his IQ. That was something that I
really recognized when I was in the ring with him.
I mean, his ability to make adjustments on the fly
was super impressive. And I say to this day, I
fought a lot of great champions. He's the best I
ever fought. He's the best I've ever shared the ring with.
His ability to his awareness in the ring. You know,
obviously the guy's got sixty seventy fights, you're gonna be aware.
But his awareness was next level. I couldn't believe how

(01:36:16):
willing and eble he was to be able to see
when I cut his rhythm and then he'd be able
to adjust and change it on the fly. And I
always say, when it comes to being a world champion,
you got to be able to adjust. And many Pack
is a guy who adjusted better than anyone I've ever
been in the ring with.

Speaker 13 (01:36:28):
And that's what gives me a little bit of hope.

Speaker 15 (01:36:30):
Like, listen, this guy could still probably do this because
he's adjusted as his career has changed.

Speaker 13 (01:36:35):
Guys who stay in the in the game long have to.

Speaker 15 (01:36:38):
You look at Bnard Hopkins, the same guy that was
fighting in his forties was not the same guy that
was fighting in his early thirties or his late twenties.
He got a lot of knockouts back then. He threw
way more punches back then. But as he aged, you
saw the boxing IQ. You saw more fainting, more footwork,
more adjustments, more control, more ring generalship, And those are
things that I think Manny Pacoo actually does have in
his toolbox that he can break out comes latter.

Speaker 4 (01:37:01):
Maybe you answered this question already, but I guess I
ask it this way, which is non heavyweight edition because
like Big George Foreman wouldn't really count, but for other fighters,
post forty who won world titles?

Speaker 1 (01:37:12):
Are there common denominators you can point.

Speaker 4 (01:37:15):
To to say they all kind of had X or
y and that explains why they were able to win.

Speaker 15 (01:37:20):
Yeah, and it comes down to ring control and being
able to you know, I'm going to use a quote
from my buddy and podcast partner and commentator partner of
Puli Mala Naji. He goes, those guys are better at
old manning it. Learning how to win parts of the
rounds without having to work is hard because listen, forty
six is forty six. The post forty body is a

(01:37:41):
different machine than that early thirties, late twenties prime physique.
So being able to quote unquote old man in a bit,
be able to control the space in the ring, not
have to work so hard all the time, those are
the guys that generally are able to excel even in
a later age. We saw the Keith Thurman fight. I'll
tell you right now that was not manny of old
He had to be smart in there. There are times

(01:38:03):
he would he didn't have that in and out. He
had to stand and fight with Keith more than he
probably would have thought he would. He took a lot
of punches, in that fight, but the power is the
last thing to go. He still has that power, which
is another common denimeter of a guys who fight on late.

Speaker 13 (01:38:18):
But I don't know man Manny.

Speaker 15 (01:38:19):
A lot of his fight, a lot of his style
was based on pace and volume. That's a really hard
thing to do when you're in your late forties.

Speaker 4 (01:38:28):
For our audience who maybe have seen Mario Barrios but
don't have a clear picture in their mind of exactly
how he boxes, what is Manny Pacio up against in
terms of the things Barrios does as a threat but
also as targets of opportunity.

Speaker 15 (01:38:41):
I mean, first of all, he's thirty years old. I
mean he's in the physical prime of his life. He's
a solid guy. He's come up a lot of weight classes,
but he seemed to carry his power. He scores a
lot of knockdowns at at wealthweight. Even if he doesn't
stop guys, he's able to catch guys. He's a very
sharp puncher. He's long, he's tall. I do believe he's
the tallest person that many Pacio's ever fought. He's five
eleven six foot, so he's taller than me. He's a

(01:39:02):
little taller than Antonio Margarito. But you know, he's got
a good jab, He's got a really good left hook,
especially to the body.

Speaker 13 (01:39:08):
Sharp funk, good fundamentals. He's a bit of a he
likes to.

Speaker 15 (01:39:12):
Scrap, he likes to be in there, fights heavy over
that front foot, so he's gonna be He's gonna be
there to engage.

Speaker 13 (01:39:17):
He likes contact. You know, he's a true Mexican warrior.

Speaker 15 (01:39:20):
Listen, if I was picking this fight from many ten
years ago, I think Mario Baris is tailor made. He
fights heavy over that front foot. He doesn't vary that
jab so much right in front of He engages a lot.
He's there to be hit with the straight left hands.
We've seen that in other fights in the past. But
we're not talking about prime Many packer. We're talking about
forty six year old Mannipac Yao. So I do think

(01:39:42):
we're gonna have a lot of engagement. But you know,
is it gonna be the young man or is it
gonna be the experience? That's really the question.

Speaker 4 (01:39:48):
Is there a way to say how the height and
reach differential might.

Speaker 1 (01:39:52):
Impact this contest.

Speaker 15 (01:39:54):
So Manny, generally he was really good at fighting toller fighters.
He liked fighting toller fighters. Me, Antonio Margarito, Oscar de
Lahoya did very well against those guys, even guys that
didn't fight so much over their front foot.

Speaker 13 (01:40:04):
Margarito very heavy on the front foot. Me not not
so much.

Speaker 15 (01:40:07):
I was a boxer. But you still have to close
the gap very well. And the thing about Manny, the
reason that he's good with these taller guys, is because
his first step, his explosive first step, is the fastest
I've ever experienced. His ability to close the gap, close
the distance, throw that straight left hand with no fat
on that thing right down the middle to split that
guard of especially if an orthodox fighter, that's really going

(01:40:28):
to be what I'm looking for in round one. If
Manny still has that first step, if he can still
fire one of those left straights right down the middle
and split the guard of Mario Barrows in round one,
we got ourselves a fight. But if we see him
falling off balance, getting square, having slower feet, it's going
to be a really long night for many pack Yal fans.

Speaker 3 (01:40:50):
Chris, You'll be in the arena, of course, handling the
PPV dot Com live chat. We've seen great performances in
that in the past, from the likes of Jim Lampley,
your colleague Dan Kenobio, and so many others there when
you are in that arena at the MGM Grant on Saturday,
and let's imagine a scenario that Pakiao does this, you know,
I mean, a stoppage win would be a lot more
of an exclamation point. But even if we're waiting after

(01:41:13):
a close fight to hear those scores, when George Foreman
did that wearing the same trunks that he wore in
Zaire and his loss to Muhammad Ali, have met something different.
What do you think this would mean for a fighter
who's already in the International Boxing Hall of Fame, already
as an eight division champion. No male fighters ever done
that became literally a cultural household name doing karaoke on

(01:41:37):
on the you know, on the late night television. But
what would this adding on top of it mean, And
what would you imagine that moment's going to be like
if it happens on Saturday.

Speaker 15 (01:41:49):
I mean, we're talking this is historic, truly, And look,
you alluded to it earlier that the sub heavyweight weight
divisions are a lot more difficult to win titles in
advanced age. Many Pakow coming back, especially coming off four
and a half your layoff, it's not like he's been active.
Even George Foreman when he thought a heavyweight, he was active.
He was building his way towards fighting to the title
and being ready and finding that that timing in that

(01:42:10):
rhythm so we could catch Michael Moore. Man, he's coming
off the couch man like. Literally, he's just I'm gonna
I'm gonna take this twelve round championship fight against a
young thirty year old champion. If he is able to
pull this off, absolutely historic. I mean, Manny's accolades are
through the roof as is. This would be another feather
than the cap for sure. But I think it's just
it's just gonna cement his legacy as being just one

(01:42:32):
of those people who is just makes you think there's
nothing this man can't do. He just keeps coming back,
He keeps making you, making you.

Speaker 13 (01:42:39):
Want to see him. He is a global star.

Speaker 15 (01:42:42):
He's one of the most famous people walking this earth
to even to this day, I've been around those crowds
all over the world. Actually, I've been in Malaysia, I've
been in Macowch China, and the crowds that come out
for him.

Speaker 13 (01:42:52):
They and they still do. It's amazing.

Speaker 15 (01:42:54):
I mean, it would be an absolutely historic event if
he's able to make this work.

Speaker 3 (01:42:58):
I fully agree with you. This loaded cart on Saturday
there in Las Vegas has a few other big time
all action fights coming our way. We got to talk
about that Cole main event. We had Sebastian Fundora on
this show last time out. He'll be the champion this
time as he welcomes back tim Zo. But we all
saw the first fight a year ago, the first fight
in the PBC on Prime Era, in which Zoo was

(01:43:19):
lighting Fondora up until that elbow to the top of
the head opened to cut, and then we had a blooded,
guts war that even to the to the finish when
we're waiting on the scores, we really didn't know who
was going to come out on top. Since then, Tim
Zoo could not have had a worse, you know, rest
of his year, although to his credit, he picked it
up earlier this year at home and bounced back and
knocked out Joey Spencer. How do you view the stocks

(01:43:43):
of both coming in Considering into the first fight, we
thought Zoo was the next big thing in the division,
and Fondora was coming out a knockout, and now they've
switched places. What should we expect Saturday night?

Speaker 15 (01:43:55):
I mean, I was so high on Tim Zoo going
into that fight, and like you said, everything you said afterwards.
In terms of where where he's at, he's he's been
on the slide, he's been inactive, and even that Joey
Spencer fight, I don't think I did a whole lot
for him.

Speaker 13 (01:44:05):
In terms of momentum.

Speaker 15 (01:44:06):
Fondora is way up, way up since that, since that win,
that bloody win. Uh, he's really been uh you know,
getting in in into fine shape and fine form. I've
interviewed him several times over the past year or so.
I'm seeing him mature. Even in the way that he's
speaking during these interviews. He believes it. He is the guy.
He's like, I'm the guy to beat at fifty four.
Everybody needs to come to see me. And it's it's

(01:44:28):
it's not it's not fake, it's not bravado.

Speaker 13 (01:44:30):
He does.

Speaker 15 (01:44:30):
He does feel that way, and Tim Zuo, I think
it's the opposite. I mean, taking taking that loss that night, okay, Boom,
I got cut with an elbow. I was blood in
my face. I couldn't fight my fight. As you said,
I was winning that fight earlier. I could beat that
guy every single time. But then the Mertisali of destruction
that can really damage a fighter psyche. So in terms
of psychology, these guys are in two completely different places.

(01:44:53):
But we've seen them what they look like when they
fought up for the first time with twelve rounds of action, guts.

Speaker 13 (01:45:00):
It was a fun fight.

Speaker 3 (01:45:02):
I mean, he's frozen, he's Are you still there, Chris?
Can you still hear us?

Speaker 1 (01:45:13):
Give him a minute, it'll sort you know.

Speaker 3 (01:45:16):
That hotel WiFi, Luke, Nick And really, uh, I've done
a few shows from there. Okay, is that a Jackson
chain he's wearing? Yeah, all right?

Speaker 1 (01:45:25):
Did you call? Did you call the Fundora Zoo fight?

Speaker 3 (01:45:28):
I did not. That was the first fight in PBC
Prime history. Yes, yes, uh frozen, Chris. Not sure if
we can unfroz On.

Speaker 1 (01:45:36):
Uh, let it go, Let it go.

Speaker 3 (01:45:40):
I don't know if we can reverse Walt Disney here
his head, but we'll see if we can connect back
with him. But some very interesting stuff, Luke, while we
wait for that connection. He has a fantastic analyst. Whether
he does work on pro Box. He's done work as
well on top rank de Own. So many other places
here are fantastic. Analyst Luke, I did want to get
your your thoughts real quick on Shaker Stevenson against William

(01:46:03):
Zapeta there over the twelve rounds on Saturday, defended his title,
but most importantly did everything that people say he doesn't do.
Stood in the trenches and fought.

Speaker 4 (01:46:12):
And uh with real skill man, especially some of those
sequences up against the ropes where he's shoulder rolling and
it's going just by and then he's popping when he
comes back and then getting right back out of the way,
and you know what.

Speaker 1 (01:46:26):
This was interesting.

Speaker 4 (01:46:27):
Zapeida made him do it, and so I feel like
this is one of those contexts where because he was
pushed by an opponent, you got to see a higher
level of skill and a little bit more offensive urgency
from him too. It wasn't just a defensive showcase like
he had to put it on Zapeida as well, so
it actually was a little bit of both. It was
a defensive showcase while having I thought the requisite offense,

(01:46:52):
although although I thought Sepeida had some good moments in
that fight too, you know, he was competitive in ways
that I did not expect. So I wasn't expecting much
from Czepada. I knew he was like widely well regarded.
I thought Shaquer would just handle him. But no, you
didn't get that at all. This is a great showing
from both guys, but in particular the way in which

(01:47:14):
Chakor had to answer for the particular challenges made it
like a really really nice showcase.

Speaker 1 (01:47:19):
I mean, to go.

Speaker 4 (01:47:20):
From your hometown is walking out on you against Al
Santos to this, and Queen's was a big upgrade.

Speaker 3 (01:47:26):
Look, this is kind of what I've been saying, where
is he his own worst enemy at times with pr
or the way he handles himself in certain fights. Yes,
but if you are a elite or sub elite fighter
and you bring it to him, you're going to get
the very best of Shakur. This version of Chakor is
my favorite fighter at a watch in the world, I'm
telling you, and I know some of it was Zepeida's

(01:47:48):
kind of the constant pressure, and I didn't think Zepeta
would even do this well, so I'd give him that credit.
But some of it was the decision Chaquur made, maybe
because Zepeeda isn't a big one punch knockout threat, but
that decision to stand in there and show everybody what
he has. Dude, this was pound for pound stuff and
now Luke, he had a nice call out afterwards. Can
we show the video of Shakoor talking about Tank Davis?

(01:48:10):
Do we have that here?

Speaker 1 (01:48:11):
Who's nacks? I told y'all who I want to fight.

Speaker 16 (01:48:14):
I can't.

Speaker 8 (01:48:15):
I can't keep saying the same thing. I already told
y'all who I want to fight on the best versus
the best? That should be my next fight. I told y'all,
I'm a dog. I'm top level, elite level fighters. So
let's make the Let's make boxing great again. Let's put
the best fighters in the ring with each other and
let's see who come out victorious.

Speaker 3 (01:48:33):
Yeah, good stuff right there. I want to see that
if I let's see if Turkey gets involved. We do
have Chris al Jerry back. We fixed the Wi Fi issues,
so let's finish our fantastic high level chat with the
former one hundred and forty pound world champion. Chris. Thank
you for staying with us right here. Let's keep it
moving though. I gotta ask you about this heavyweight Tilt
The rematch on Saturday for the undisputed championship as Alexander

(01:48:55):
Ussik welcomes Daniel Dubois a second time, two years after
their first meeting in which Dubois Gastaut got stopped late. Yes,
there was controversy over a body shot that dropped Usic,
some people thought finished Usic. Since then, Dubois has evolved
into an absolute terminator. Does that make this fight a
lot different? When you consider Usik's two years older and

(01:49:17):
he's gone twenty four kind of hard ass rounds with
one Tyson fury. How do you see this match up
heading into Sara.

Speaker 15 (01:49:25):
You know BC On paper? Yes, this makes this an
entirely different fight. Dubois is a different machine now. He's
he's really gotten over that hump that he needed for him.
It was all psychological because we had so much hype
around him, because his physicality has punched his their ability,
and you know, we saw him evolve.

Speaker 13 (01:49:44):
And mature after that Usik fight.

Speaker 15 (01:49:46):
And I keep remembering Usik grabbing him after the fight
and being like, Hey, you're good, You're gonna be back.

Speaker 13 (01:49:51):
Stick with it.

Speaker 15 (01:49:51):
You're you're a very good fighter, which might come back
to bite him. But if things go if things go
the other way this time. But there is another interesting
aspect of that first fight, now that the fight was
outdoors and the ring was wet and slick, so Usik
didn't have his stellar footwork that he normally has as
a fighter who's fought outside. I fought with slick conditions,

(01:50:14):
especially a mover. It's gonna change the way you throw punches,
it's going to change the way that you change angles,
it's going to change the way your offense, your defense, everything.
So there is that aspect too in that first fight.
But in terms of when these guys meet again, I
think usk is just a different a different animal man.
He's just he is so special, and he's already got
that win over Dubois in which he really made him quit,

(01:50:34):
so he's got that psychological advantage. I know Dubois on
a big upswing, but Usik's a different thing, and he's
got that win over him already. I think it's gonna
look pretty similar to the first fight.

Speaker 4 (01:50:45):
I saw some training footage you might have seen it
as well, Chris of Dubois getting ready for this, and
he's just going hard to the body over and over
and over again. Let me ask you, Obviously the official
ruling is a low blow. There's some controversy over it
looks like a low blow to me. I would love
to get your opinion on it. But more to the
point is I mean, obviously you can't just punch to

(01:51:06):
the body, But to what extent is that a viable
if you were if you were advising Dubois on a
game plan, to what extent would body work feature?

Speaker 15 (01:51:15):
It would need to be an aspect for sure, but
it wouldn't have to be the end all bell or
the entire entire game plan. And I don't think that's
actually a good idea. If you, you know, think about
Usk and Fury, it's like, all right, people know that
Usik can be weak to the body. We saw him
go down in the Amateurs and in the World Series
of Boxing. You know, we saw that what happened when
Dubois hit him, which was questionably a legal blow. I

(01:51:37):
agree with you, I thought it was low But in
terms of okay, why didn't Tyson just go to.

Speaker 1 (01:51:43):
The body then?

Speaker 15 (01:51:43):
Because it's not that easy, guys, when you're in a
world class fight against a world class fighter, especially someone
with the boxing IQ of Alexander Usik. Getting to the
body is not easy, and if that's the only thing
you're looking for, it's gonna leave your head open, which
is the main reason why people don't go to the
body against world class fighters, because you have to put
your head to that line. You're right in front of
their fists. You're hands are away from home to reach
down to the body in that way. So I don't

(01:52:04):
think it's a great idea to make that the only
thing they're looking to do. Because Dubois does have a
deep bag. The guy can punch with both hands. He's
a really dangerous puncher. And it's not just body shots.
He can urge you to the head as well. So
I know we saw training. We don't know how much
that really is the true game plan. But you got
to set those body shots up. You can't just wing
him from the outside against a sharp shreeter like Usig.

Speaker 4 (01:52:24):
This is a bit of a left field question, but
I would love to get your perspective since you fought him.
I had not seen Errol Spence even on social media
until recently. Ugos was sort of reminiscing about their fight
from several years ago. But of course you know, here
comes Crawford. He already fought Matro mav and he's gonna
fight Canelo in September.

Speaker 1 (01:52:41):
Not super active, But.

Speaker 4 (01:52:42):
Since the time that they fought Spence, or he fought Spence,
Spence has been nowhere to be found. And I know
there's been some attempts to getting back in there and
they've kind of all fizzled. What do you make do
you think he'll ever come back, and if so, in
what kind of state?

Speaker 13 (01:52:56):
It's a tough question.

Speaker 15 (01:52:57):
You know, he's had a lot of tough fights, but
he's had way tougher fights outside of the ring with
car accidents, and he's had multiple and these and some
of them, I mean, the one in Vegas was I
think it was Vegas, right, was horrific where he got
thrown from from the car. And then he had another
one like within a year later that he actually said,
you know, he was having some issues and didn't want
to take a tune up fight before the Crawford fight. So, uh,

(01:53:19):
those kinds of accidents and injuries they stick with you, man.
So I don't know how much is left of Errol Spence,
especially at a world class level. He's been one of
the most inactive guys. Even when he was fighting, he
would have long layoffs due to injury, of course, but
also I mean while he also has the torn rittna,
which is how he didn't he wasn't able to make
the many Pakia fight.

Speaker 13 (01:53:38):
How Uga stepped in was able to beat Manny.

Speaker 15 (01:53:40):
So there's a lot of questions in terms of the
health of Errol Spence and he's not getting younger. So
I would I would be surprised if we saw him
back at a world class level.

Speaker 1 (01:53:49):
Wow, what a shame, What a shame.

Speaker 4 (01:53:52):
That's okay, But before you, I appreciate your time here,
let me just ask this. Over the weekend, you saw
what Hamsas Shiraz did to Edgar Burl. I've not been
a believer in Berlonga for quite some time. But then
it's something of a debate point on the show.

Speaker 1 (01:54:04):
I wonder what you make of a what Burlonga showed,
but also what Charaz showed and what that means for
his future at sixty eight.

Speaker 15 (01:54:11):
I've been really high on Charaz for a while. Going
into that Damis fight, I was, I was all on Sharaz.
I'm saying Charaz is going to take over the Midway Division.
Obviously we know how that fight went. I thought he lost,
But I think Adamis is very underrated. I think he's
a much better prider than people give him credit for.
He fought a very good game plan that night. But
then also we hear about Hams of Sharaz having a
hand injury in that night, and obviously he's struggling to

(01:54:33):
make the weight. I don't know how that guy ever
made one sixty. He looked huge at sixty eight over
the weekend, and I'm very impressed with him, and he's
a major player at one sixty eight now. His ability
to completely control and disarm Berloga on Saturday night was
very impressive. He fought at length, but he was also
very physical. He showed his physical strength. I believe it
was the end of the first round. I saw him

(01:54:54):
push Berlanga off and I was.

Speaker 1 (01:54:55):
Like, whoa this is.

Speaker 15 (01:54:58):
This is supposed to be your first time at one
sixty and now you're pushing the giant sixty eight pounder
because berlang is huge around the ring like rag doll.
And he did that all night long. Whenever he got close,
he'd push him off and get right to his right,
to his combinations and even the shots that hurt Berlanga,
he wasn't loading up, he was just letting them go
in combination, and that the impact was there. I really

(01:55:18):
am sure now, or I believe now that one sixty
eight was really hurting him and taking away from his performance,
and now one sixty eight he's a major player.

Speaker 3 (01:55:27):
Chris, I wanted to close with this because we're all,
of course getting pretty excited for Canelo versus Crawford in
September Allegiance Stadium, Netflix, Daniel White envolvement. It's getting wild here,
but the fight is what matters most, not the pageantry.
I swear every other day I wake up and I'm like, oh,
Crawford is definitely gonna win. Await what am I talking about?
There's the size difference. Luke believes there's this connection here,

(01:55:49):
and I don't think it's crazy. Berlango gets blown away
by Shiraz. Maybe it proves that Canela lately is just
carrying B level dudes and not fighting. The a ones
of late are overlooking the idea that maybe Canelo has
aged not as graceful as we thought, and it's not
just buds all time talent that could make this a
truly competitive maybe even a historic matchup.

Speaker 13 (01:56:11):
Yeah, and be say, I'm with you, dude.

Speaker 15 (01:56:13):
I wake up some days and I'm like, I think
Crawford's gonna do it, And then other days I'm like
size and size is a is a thing. You know,
we have weight classes for a reason. Canelo is still Canelo.
Not to mention Bud's actually older than Canelo. Granted he's
probably a lot fresher he is, he is still thirty seven,
thirty eight years old, but yeah, I mean it's hard
not to make those comparisons when you look at Berlanga

(01:56:36):
getting completely physical, out physical and knocked out the way
he was by Hamsa Sharaz coming up and wait to
think like, hey, maybe maybe Canelo really doesn't have all
that much left. But I think part of it is
the age. But also he's still dropping all these guys.
It's not like Canel like just lost his power, lost
his explosiveness. He's just not finishing guys like he used to.
Like what he was when he's fighting BJ Saunders and

(01:56:57):
Yielder him and Cable Plant where he had that where
he stayed on you. He doesn't really have that anymore.
It doesn't have an extra gear or that motor. But
he's still can allow us. He's still explosive, he's still fast,
he still has good defense and head movement.

Speaker 13 (01:57:10):
He's still gonna be the much bigger man on fight night.
But uh, I don't know.

Speaker 15 (01:57:14):
Yeah, I'm with you, though as we get closer, I'm
flip flopping. I mean I tend to flip flop on
fights anyway, but this one more so than usual.

Speaker 3 (01:57:22):
Good stuff, Chris. We appreciate you enjoying us Man. Always
fantastic top level analysis from you, and the fans can
check you out this Saturday during Paciol Versus Burrios, PPV
dot COM's exclusive viewer chat and the HD live stream
beginning eight pm Eastern five pm Pacific, And of course
you can order that PBC pay per view at ppv
dot com right now, no subscription required. Chris, enjoy the

(01:57:45):
fights on Saturday, man, and by the way, loving your
analysis on multiple networks.

Speaker 15 (01:57:50):
We got to say thank you so much, guys. I
really appreciate coming. I love your show, by the way,
I listen to it all the time. And yeah, man,
we're in Vegas, Man fight week. It's I'm gonna have
a lot of fun I'm already having fun.

Speaker 3 (01:57:59):
Get those up coddles out there. We appreciate that. Chris,
great stuff, Chris al Jerry in the house. Big fights
ahead this weekend. Cannot wait, Luke.

Speaker 4 (01:58:08):
Update from Craig Jones, if I may, He says, remember
the pink Cadillac that he bought to go road tripping.

Speaker 1 (01:58:14):
Yes, he tells me it's in the shop.

Speaker 4 (01:58:17):
So it died. So he is taking an uber. He's
gonna be about ten to fifteen minutes late. Like so,
let's say twelve forty twelve forty five perfect.

Speaker 3 (01:58:26):
All good on that one, Luke. To close out our
topic four, we talked about Shakhor's breakthrough win. I gotta
ask you two quick questions. One, I know there's a
lot going on with Tank regarding the roach rematch which
may or may not happen in August, not to mention
his recent arrest, of which he was just released recently.
You think Turkey can step in and make this fight.

(01:58:47):
We did see Louis to Cubus Junior of PBC ringside
next to Turkey. We are gonna see David Benavitez on
a RIAD season card this fall. Obviously, Tanks versus Shakhor
is arguably the fight to make, you know, below middleweight,
maybe even in all the sport. Are we on the
road to seeing this?

Speaker 4 (01:59:06):
In your eyes, you would think in theory Turkey, there's
no fight Turkey couldn't make.

Speaker 1 (01:59:14):
Turkey can't make any fight, but.

Speaker 4 (01:59:17):
There's no fight that is certainly beyond the concerns of purse, right,
So that's not a limiting factor with him, and he
obviously has you know, he's arguably the most important guy
in the world of boxing at the stage right where
his connections are second to nine. Like in that sense,
do I think Turkey can make a very very competitive

(01:59:38):
offer and really lean on these guys to do something.
Of course I do, of course I do. But dude,
Tank seems very unpredictable. And I really thought that after
he went to jail he got some of this shit out.

Speaker 1 (01:59:50):
Of his system. No, turns it out. He didn't turns out.

Speaker 4 (01:59:54):
I mean again, these are accusations, innocential, proven guilty, but
they're the same things he's been in trouble.

Speaker 1 (01:59:59):
For in the past. This is not new.

Speaker 4 (02:00:01):
This is in fact a repeat of the past in
many ways, to say nothing of the odiousness of the
of the alleged crimes themselves. Add on top of that, BC,
during the lead up to Roach, he seemed.

Speaker 1 (02:00:12):
Like halfway in, halfway out.

Speaker 4 (02:00:14):
He kind of had a so so performance against roaches
and no Roach fought very very well. Right, It's not
one or the other, you know, I just don't know
what kind of headspace he's in. Does he even want
to fight Chichord? Does he even want to fight Roach?
Does even want to fight at all?

Speaker 1 (02:00:26):
BC? I don't know how to answer that. I don't
know how you, like I would even answer that.

Speaker 4 (02:00:29):
So it's not to me a question of like, would
Turkey make a no bullshit offer to get this done?

Speaker 1 (02:00:34):
I think you would.

Speaker 4 (02:00:35):
But who the hell knows what Tank Davis is gonna do.
That's kind of where I'm stuck at.

Speaker 3 (02:00:39):
Yeah, I'm home with you on that one. And to
close on this card, we saw all action and really
disputed decisions, both in the David Morrell Junior fight against
Imam Katyev, who over exceeded expectation in some ways, calling
into question Morel's performance, and then we of course had
Alberto Poyo losing the title at one forty to form

(02:01:00):
I have been super Omatias disputed decision, really fun action fight.
Do you believe we mentioned the great matchmaking on these
ring cards. Did Turkey's Tom and Jerry thing really work
across the board?

Speaker 1 (02:01:14):
No?

Speaker 4 (02:01:15):
No, I think that they just did good matchmaking and
they were guys that had You know, again, I do
think it's worth pointing out if you had taken the
exact same card with the exact same guys on the
exact same day, but you didn't put it in times square,
would you have potentially gotten better.

Speaker 1 (02:01:32):
Fights out of those people.

Speaker 4 (02:01:35):
There's a case to be made it could have been
better than that just by taking it and putting it
in a more traditional kind of boxing setting, and that
the weirdness of it all contributed to somehow the fights
fell flat. I lost my train of thought from there,
we see, I apologize, all.

Speaker 3 (02:01:53):
Right, all right with that? Yeah, we were going about
whether he actually encouraged people to stand the Jerry thing.

Speaker 4 (02:02:00):
So I just think that like the crowd, however big
it was in the Queen's, was raucous, and the matchups
were good, you know what I mean. Like Chiraz had
a lot to proof, so to Berlanga Sugar had a
lot to proove, So did Zepeda and on down the list,
like it was just really well put together. And know
you would have thought the same with Garcia and Hani,
but there were so many questions about their lawsuit and

(02:02:22):
the drugs and the weight miths, and like the craziness
of the lives that he had been living and the
damage that Haney had taken. You didn't have some of
those limiting factors here. You more had things, you had
more reason for upside here, and then it just ended
up delivering. So, I mean, there's no question in my
mind can Turkey deliver quality boxing? It's not really a question.
He can't every time.

Speaker 1 (02:02:43):
I don't know, you know.

Speaker 3 (02:02:44):
I mean you can also say, is you know, three
pay per views in boxing in eight days involving different
promoters a good thing? I don't know, But I have
to say, we call out Turkey when things are weird
or we don't agree, you gotta praise him. Saturday was awesome.
And if that's the future of the Rings series, I
am all. Let's go to topic number five quickly as
Craig Jones still on the way, and that's the three
UFC three eighteen storylines will be there two days from

(02:03:07):
now Wednesday, July sixteenth, in Manhattan with Jed meshu Quervo
presents UFC three eighteen pregame preview. You know that's coming,
but look, before we get there, let's talk about the
overarching highest storyline on this card. What is the biggest
question in your eyes that needs answering in Saturday's trilogy
about for the BMF title between a retiring Dustin Poorier

(02:03:28):
and Max Holloway in New Orleans.

Speaker 4 (02:03:31):
I'm not sure how to describe it simply, but let
me tell you what I have my eye on. Max
said something ahead of this which makes total sense. Not
this part was not surprising, where he's like, he doesn't
want to go zero to six in trilogies three losses
to Volk two to Poary eight.

Speaker 1 (02:03:47):
If he loses this one, he'd be six. Not even
with a win, he'd be one in five.

Speaker 4 (02:03:49):
That's not great, but he would at least be able
to rescue himself to a degree. And I think there's
reasons that he might. But then something else happened along
the way. You see that part was very ordinary. But
in subsequent interviews, more recently, people have asked him about
Illia Taporia and he was very very dismissive of him
in a number of different ways, like saying, well, he

(02:04:12):
got you know, Charles off a one fight win streak,
and he got Volcal off of the islam Ko and
it's like, yeah, but Max, he he ko do two,
you know, like and that was, Yes, that was one
of his tougher fights of the three. Effect of the
three was his toughest, but the result was the same
in the end. And to me, it was very uncharacteristic
of Max to not give Ilia some props.

Speaker 1 (02:04:37):
And I'm just wondering between the.

Speaker 4 (02:04:39):
Pressure we see of going oh to six and the
I would say somewhat unusual abrasiveness towards his opponent, is
he really feeling it this time?

Speaker 1 (02:04:51):
You know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (02:04:52):
Is he really He's coming off of a ko a
bat his only KO loss, he's coming off of one
as well. I can't tell if he's got nerve or
if he's angry he because b.

Speaker 1 (02:05:04):
See, we know the truth.

Speaker 4 (02:05:05):
You can have some of those things and it can
propel you to greatness, but you can also have those
things and it can really drag you down. Now, all
eyes are going to be on Dustin in the sense
that it's his retirement fight and you know, how is
he going to perform in his last one and blah
blah blah.

Speaker 1 (02:05:19):
But to me, I've got a little bit.

Speaker 4 (02:05:20):
More of an eye on Max at this point because
he's trying to find a new life at fifty five
and between the circumstances and what it might say about
him long term in conjunction with the dismissiveness.

Speaker 1 (02:05:31):
Over a you know, that was a real good win
for Ilia. I'm getting some strange vibes from him. I
don't know if you share that opinion.

Speaker 3 (02:05:39):
Yeah, I don't know if it's just him trying to
talk up the potential of a Taporia rematch, because he
said when people asked him in interviews if he beats Dustin
like what you know, he said, he's never going back
down to featherweight, even though the UFC keeps him ranked
at number one, And he was talking about, Look, he's
trying to build up a rematch. So if some of
that is to convince himself and maybe to build a
narrative that supports that, I understand that. But I think

(02:06:01):
you're right to bring up his mental state and where
he's at because this has been so over it's been
so this whole event has been about Poorier's retirement, about
the shape he's in, about that he you know, told everybody,
including Mike Bone, that even if they offer him to Pooria,
He's not coming back.

Speaker 5 (02:06:18):
This is it.

Speaker 3 (02:06:19):
He's gonna leave it all in the cage. He's gonna
He's had like the best training camp from a fitness level,
and so long, it is interesting to see, well, what
about Max who does come in on our on our
current DraftKings odds as the minus one twenty five favorite
despite losing the first two to the plus one oh
five Poorier. And oh, by the way, the streak that
Poorier is on needs can we throw to that that

(02:06:40):
meme or that uh look at the last eight opponents
for Porier.

Speaker 1 (02:06:45):
Dude, is that fucking insane.

Speaker 3 (02:06:48):
Mahajev Ben was Saint Deny, Justin, Gaigie, Michael Chandler, olivera
Connor twice, Dan Hooker in an absolute war and the
title fight lost to Habib. Dude. That is the definition
of all killer no filler right there.

Speaker 1 (02:07:03):
Holy, it's unbelievable.

Speaker 4 (02:07:05):
And then the fact that he's still this viable is dude,
that would ruin somebody else that our lesser man that
would ruin and look at him still living.

Speaker 1 (02:07:14):
It's insane.

Speaker 3 (02:07:15):
We're gonna get into that a lot more with Jed
Meshu this Wednesday, Live from New York. It is Pregame
Preview brought to you by Quervo check it out. But Luke,
you already know that this sponsor. This podcast is sponsored
by Total Wireless, the official wireless partner of UFC. And
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Speaker 4 (02:08:15):
Ain't that right, LT, That's exactly right, guys. Listen, you
know how it works. The best fighters don't make it
to the octagon alone. They have all in support along
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Speaker 3 (02:08:49):
Well, Luke, we have Craig Jones still to come literally
in your office in Washington, DC. Before then, do you
want to hit a couple dms from donks and get
the people.

Speaker 1 (02:08:57):
Let's do it all right.

Speaker 3 (02:08:58):
We put out the call on Sunday. Nice here's your
questions we got answered. It's oh dms from dogs Gusting.
Our first one comes from Taekwondo dude memes, and he says,
is Katie Taylor the female Canelo a super talented boxer,
but you have to realize every close round will go

(02:09:22):
their way? Yes and no?

Speaker 4 (02:09:26):
Right, Yeah, I sort of get the comparison. I don't
think it's crazy, but I don't think this last one.
Do Katie Taylor out box her in this third one?
Whatever you want to say about the first two ones, fine,
I did not. I had it ninety seven ninety three
on my scorecard too. I thought ninety five ninety five
was generous to Amanda.

Speaker 3 (02:09:43):
I'm with you. I think that the thing when you
examined Canelo's career that even though I scored a few
fights against him Trout Laura, Triple J one and two,
I scored the Jacobs fight a draw. The thing is
he's so efficient. He lands the key counter shots against
your spam jab in activity. There's a reason why that
guy wins close rounds. Watching back the first two Surrouno

(02:10:05):
fights with Taylor, you sort of realize there's a reason
why she does the same. Our second question from Elvis Flexley,
who in the UFC light heavyweight division should move up
to heavyweight? Luke, how about Yuri pro Hotska, forget the
middleweight move, be the quick, explosive, unconventional heavyweight attacker.

Speaker 4 (02:10:24):
Who in the light heavweight vision per Hotchka, I think
could wreck people up there. I fully agree. I think
he'd wreck people. Plus he's got a good chance, so
like you could imagine that he could tolerate some of
the power as well. Dude, But you know what, it
wouldn't be just him, Like I think.

Speaker 3 (02:10:43):
Can Osmir find new life as a striker at you?
Does he have any time for that?

Speaker 1 (02:10:48):
Yeah? No time, No time?

Speaker 3 (02:10:52):
All right, I'm you know long ee, Look, we missing
anybody here.

Speaker 1 (02:10:55):
I was gonna say Poeton, Johnny obvious one, but he did.

Speaker 4 (02:10:59):
I mean the problem with Poton is like, could he
win at heavyweight?

Speaker 12 (02:11:03):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:11:03):
I mean of course he could, right, But like everyone
wants to see the Tom Aspinal fight, I just feel
like Asphaal would blast double him into the fence.

Speaker 6 (02:11:09):
What about someone who's kind of in no man's land
Alexander Racketts, just kind of because he's lost to the
top guys.

Speaker 1 (02:11:17):
Big two oh fiver. He could Yeah, I think that'd
be interesting. He's definitely more athletic than most of the
heavyweights too.

Speaker 3 (02:11:22):
You think Johnny and Walter Walker would fight each other
and then the winner bangs all of Scotland.

Speaker 1 (02:11:32):
Just a fair question there.

Speaker 3 (02:11:34):
Let's keep it going with Samuel Elle with the BMF
belt on the line this weekend. Who are your top
bmfs in each division? What are some potential BMF match Well, I.

Speaker 1 (02:11:49):
Mean Pantoja is the champion, but he also fits the bill.
You know who at Middleway besides Morob like non Mirab.

Speaker 3 (02:11:58):
Edition, Tremiah as a wrestler is kind of BMF ish too.
Look what he did with Gilbert Burns.

Speaker 4 (02:12:03):
Right, Yeah? At forty five? Who would you go back to?
You could maybe say, yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:12:11):
You're ortegas a bmfor.

Speaker 1 (02:12:14):
Yeah, bmfor for sure?

Speaker 3 (02:12:17):
John Who John John.

Speaker 4 (02:12:21):
Silva, Yep, John Zilba. He's a little more of a slickster,
but yeah, I get the point. Yep who else at
seventy for example? I mean Rock Monov is an easy
one for that. At eighty five loser of the main event,
you know what I mean? For three nineteen honestly, and then.

Speaker 3 (02:12:40):
Okay, but it is the better question are you done
with the BMF after this on Saturday?

Speaker 5 (02:12:43):
Is that people keep.

Speaker 4 (02:12:44):
People keep saying this like it's gonna go away, Like
it's not going away. They look at this card like
if they didn't have this, what would they have put on,
Like what other title fights were available?

Speaker 3 (02:12:55):
Yeah, but you don't need a title for this fight.
You don't.

Speaker 4 (02:12:58):
You're telling me that, like I don't like, I don't agree.
I agree, But tell that to the UFC. They don't
like having main events without a title on it. So
like having an extra belt in rotation that they can
just throw out there when they need it is pretty helpful.

Speaker 3 (02:13:11):
Like Samuel al Lungren asks a very honest question, but
I think we're at the point where, especially since the
title doesn't carry with each fighter, they just sort of
like reset it randomly. I think we're kind of done.
We had a good run with it.

Speaker 13 (02:13:23):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (02:13:23):
I don't know, Luke. I also don't love putting people
in there who are also kind of in title contention.
I kind of feel like it should be only for
the na Diez guys. Guys, we love aging brawlers all
of that. But let's go to one more question here
from PlayStation Shavi. He says top fights to show newer
fans pre UFC one.

Speaker 4 (02:13:44):
Hundred anything Pride related I mean, that's a very very
easy pride. But I always tell people the same thing.
This is what I really tell people. Find some great
fighter who had a great run and watch them. Yeah,
watch Saint Pierre's run, Watch Matt Hughes's run, and watch
run exactly, especially a guy like Nick d although he

(02:14:06):
did have some great wins after two thousand and nine.
But but yes, especially a guy like Nick Diaz, like,
just find their beginning, because that's what I've been doing
in boxing, Like when we started doing MK Ketchup, I
would just like pick a guy and then start finding
all of the fights I could find on them on YouTube,
and you just learned so much about them this way
if you didn't get to watch all that stuff live.
That's my Strike Force too, my god, so big pick

(02:14:26):
pick pick Strike Force title fights, Jacquaray, Luke rock Hold,
like any of these things.

Speaker 1 (02:14:31):
Just go back and look at w e.

Speaker 4 (02:14:32):
C Prime Run, Right, You're gonna get prime run forst.
Griffin to an extent, like all those guys. You can
do that, you know, Yeah, I'm with you on that.

Speaker 3 (02:14:42):
There's there's I mean, do you have a like, what's
the best early early UFC fight? Is there one that
stands out.

Speaker 1 (02:14:49):
Now define early early.

Speaker 3 (02:14:51):
I'm going to say, like like before, Okay, how about
I say this pre ZUFA. Is there a go to
best pre zufa ufc F.

Speaker 1 (02:15:01):
I believe Frank Shamrock Tito Ortiz was pre ZUFA. Okay, yep.

Speaker 3 (02:15:06):
I mean I like fights like Chemo versus Hoys Gracie
just because it really tested hoys during a time he had.

Speaker 1 (02:15:13):
To had the hair pole to uh to win. I
mean it was legal at the time.

Speaker 3 (02:15:19):
Obviously it was a different time, different time. Yeah, yeah,
all right. We also have a question here to close
from Styx plays time with Dustin Potrie's final fight coming up.
What are your top five Dustin fights to show new
fans how dominant and exciting a fighter he was. Dude,
Dan Hooker needs to be on this countdown.

Speaker 4 (02:15:38):
Dan Hooker's one Justin Gatchee number one, God, yes, yes,
definitely got to be.

Speaker 1 (02:15:44):
On that one.

Speaker 4 (02:15:45):
Eddie Alvarez the second one, I believe, right because the
first one was controversial. Yes, the second Max fight, and
again you could even do the second Connor fight like
any of those you.

Speaker 3 (02:15:59):
Could pick that Those are those are great choices off
the top of your head right there? Do you don't?
Do you not put in the uh the Chandler fight
that was really gnarly with blood.

Speaker 1 (02:16:08):
I mean good, you.

Speaker 4 (02:16:09):
Could do that one too, yeah, I mean you could
skip the oli Ara and the habib ones. Those ones
didn't go so great. But that guy gave the business
to a generation of very.

Speaker 3 (02:16:18):
BSD fight ruled too, So did the So did the
Majaja fight.

Speaker 1 (02:16:24):
Yeah, yep, yeah, well to an extent.

Speaker 3 (02:16:27):
Yes, Dustin gave us. He gave us a lot, Luke.
But the question is what is Craig Jones going to
give you?

Speaker 1 (02:16:34):
Yeah, he's giving me tardiness?

Speaker 3 (02:16:37):
All right, all right, we're gonna hold the ship right
until Wednesday.

Speaker 4 (02:16:42):
Well, what do you want to do? I don't know
how close he is. I know he's on the way.
What do you want to do?

Speaker 6 (02:16:50):
I got the ship locked and loaded if you want
to do it, so all.

Speaker 3 (02:16:54):
Right, let's ship Yeah you down, Luke.

Speaker 4 (02:16:56):
You know what we're gonna need to anyway, because I'm
gonna have to get him set up when he gets here,
So why not let's just do it?

Speaker 3 (02:17:01):
All right? I scovered the globe to find the most
ridiculous videos that make Luke uncomfortable. This one's called be
Sizzle's feces.

Speaker 1 (02:17:18):
All right.

Speaker 3 (02:17:18):
I mentioned that there was that one extra clip from
the BKFC summit press conference that'll move you. Here's Christine
Ferrea getting after it. You're a fucking ratchet, You fucking ratchet.

Speaker 1 (02:17:29):
Go suck more dicks. That's why you can't make weight.
You got too much come in your throat. Bit. These
women seem nice.

Speaker 3 (02:17:41):
That's the thing. BKFC doesn't know what they're doing. They
play to a certain aesthetic in a crowd and they
go all fricking in. Okay, and Connor's a dirt hole.
Let's go to some street fight dropkicks, Luke. You remember
this very famous clip of Larry Holmes jumping off of
a car against Trevor Burbick in the eighties.

Speaker 1 (02:17:58):
Yeah, sometimes it even carriage over into the parking lot.

Speaker 3 (02:18:12):
Dude, that's such a classic clip, including the quot of
Burbick going Lara home, he kicked me, he kicked me. Well,
look check out this street fight. The same thing happened.
I couldn't get you a smaller video to see it on,
but wow, jumping off the bed of a truck to
drop kick somebody in a street fight. That's good.

Speaker 1 (02:18:33):
That's just pure Americana right there.

Speaker 3 (02:18:35):
What it is? All right, Luca's time for you to
pack for a big trip. We got video of you
choosing your undercarriage for the for the week.

Speaker 1 (02:18:41):
Okay, packing for a four and a trip.

Speaker 5 (02:18:43):
Let's get our underwear. Day one, day, two, day three,
day four.

Speaker 7 (02:18:48):
Poot my pants, poot my pants, poot my pants, poo
my pants, and poot my pants.

Speaker 4 (02:18:57):
Okay, Craig's here, so why don't you take did you freeze?
You gotta be shipping me right as Craig gets here.
I'm okay, all right, you take it from here. I
gotta go get Craig. Okay, Oh my god, are you
dying at the worst possible There you are?

Speaker 1 (02:19:15):
There, you are. I'll be right back. I'll be right back.
It take me off screen. There we go.

Speaker 3 (02:19:20):
A long ill. Look you with me?

Speaker 5 (02:19:22):
Yeah, I'm with you here?

Speaker 3 (02:19:23):
All right? You want to just want to close up
shop here? We'll continue this on Wednesday.

Speaker 1 (02:19:28):
Yeah that works for me, all right?

Speaker 3 (02:19:30):
All right, But while we're waiting on the great Craig
Jones to set up and intervene there, can we go
back quickly to what we left behind on topic number
four and did you watch this card? Did you do
a live thing on Saturday Long?

Speaker 6 (02:19:44):
I did, but I was doing the UFC, so I
wasn't watching the ring three cards.

Speaker 5 (02:19:48):
I had a curve fight up in the background. I
really was not watching it close.

Speaker 3 (02:19:52):
Can we throw to the meme on cop? Did you
see this?

Speaker 1 (02:19:56):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (02:19:57):
This is classic cop.

Speaker 3 (02:19:58):
Dressed like a retired police shout out to Mike Coppinger
on there on the ring card and uh, I wanted
to play one more at a close up shop on Sharaz.
Here is him talking about what he did learn about
that a Damas fight that helped him make the changes
against Brolonga. That's good stuff.

Speaker 9 (02:20:15):
First couple of rounds, I was losing them, and I
knew I was losing them, but I was adjusting and
that was a massive learning experience I learned from my
last fight against the Damis. So I think that's what
makes a great fight or not a great fight, a
good fighter adapting from fights to fights.

Speaker 1 (02:20:29):
And yeah, this was a good day for me.

Speaker 10 (02:20:31):
Does a knockout make the win even more sweeter?

Speaker 1 (02:20:33):
Yeah it does, it does. A lot of people were
happy for me.

Speaker 17 (02:20:36):
A lot of people were happy for me, But like
I said, Respectablanga. At the end of the day, I
knew what I was up against.

Speaker 1 (02:20:43):
I knew this talking that was going to be involved.
I knew the type of character he was.

Speaker 17 (02:20:47):
So it was all about mentally staying staying very sane,
staying very focused, and like I said, nothing was stopping
me winning tonight.

Speaker 1 (02:20:55):
Honestly nothing.

Speaker 3 (02:20:57):
You gotta give or sorry, Charas a lot of credit
for stepping up into that performance after kind of being
auditor there against the damis. He looks like a major player.
I don't know if he can have you know, similar
success against Canelo, but do I want to see it?

Speaker 1 (02:21:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (02:21:11):
I do. And also, of course when we're talking about
Saturday's PBC main event, I'll be of course be on
the call there for that pay per view card on
Prime Video pay per view. Manny Pacquio Mario Barrios Right now,
according to DraftKings, Patio plus two eighty five underdog minus
three ninety is Barrios. But here's Pakov forty six hit
in the bag. Let's see what we got here. I mean,

(02:22:04):
you can't want to fight hitting a heavy bag, but
it's gonna be very interesting to see what version of
Pachio shows up and what he has and when referencing,
of course, that heavyweight undisputed championship rematch on Sarday on
his own pay per view, of which Usik is a
minus three forty betting favorite according to draftings against the
plus two sixty Dubois. Let's hear from Dubois in what

(02:22:25):
promises he is making entering this rematch.

Speaker 1 (02:22:28):
My mass is still right.

Speaker 18 (02:22:29):
Twenty one of your victories have come with straight knockouts.

Speaker 14 (02:22:33):
Yeah, fire works, It's gonna be bombs away on the night.

Speaker 7 (02:22:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:22:37):
Is it gonna be a big punching fight? Is that
how you say it?

Speaker 14 (02:22:40):
I'm gonna be the one for on the bombs and
just coming through. Whyever after come through? No, I'm not
going to be denied.

Speaker 18 (02:22:47):
And just a word about your opponent. I mean, obviously
you think you're gonna win. He'll go in there fining.
He's got every chance of winning. How do you see
him as a fight too?

Speaker 14 (02:22:58):
I've seen him as a top guy, isn't it. It's
gonna be at one of the best in the world ranked,
you know, globally.

Speaker 1 (02:23:04):
But now I think it's my time.

Speaker 14 (02:23:06):
I'm in the young line here and I've got to
approve that I'm a new force, a real force in
the division, and I'm gonna take over.

Speaker 3 (02:23:16):
Of course, I'll have a lot more on this on
Inside the Box with Ary Bartholow you tomorrow. That's Tuesday morning,
eleven am Eastern and the Brian Campbell Experience. But Dubois
saying he's willing to walk through anything like he did
against Joshua in order to try to become the undisputed champion.
It's gonna be fun to see against an older but
still smart Usk with those countershots. And oh, by the way,

(02:23:36):
I didn't even mention here about the merch. By the way,
Morningcombat dot Shop is your entry to getting our newest
July exclusive releases, from the three Margarita shirt to the
Technical Thriller. Of course, you know about these Average Joe
Art designs that are from back in the day. You
can check out our evergreen designs as well by going

(02:23:56):
to Morningcombat Dot Shop. And as we Craig Jones are
setting up for the sit down, we got to show
that quick video of Dustin Poorier wearing another Average Joe
Art exclusive that you can buy on Poorier's website right now.
Ahead of this final fight, the last dance with all
of the heads that Poorier has taken out through his career.
Shout out to the Great average Joe Art for that

(02:24:18):
One Long Island Luke? Where are we at in the
Craig Jones setup process?

Speaker 6 (02:24:22):
So Luke was just seated next to him, but then
Luke just got up. Now it looks like Luke is
sitting back down. I don't want to unmute him yet,
just in case he's already bad.

Speaker 3 (02:24:32):
Yeah, what did you make of One Long Islander? Chris
al Jerry on the show. I wish we had had
more time. I wanted to let you throw a question
about local Huntington action.

Speaker 5 (02:24:41):
I know, I wanted to ask him like, what's his
bagel place? What's his pizza place?

Speaker 1 (02:24:44):
You know? But I was loving in the chat.

Speaker 5 (02:24:46):
Some people were like, oh, he sounds just like Long
Island Luke.

Speaker 3 (02:24:50):
I always wonder how he pronounces cool fee, you know
what I mean?

Speaker 5 (02:24:53):
Probably just like me. I'm gonna just assume Luke's ready
for this.

Speaker 3 (02:24:57):
All right, We're gonna throw it over here. Luke will
take you to the f thisisure's Luke Thomas and the
Great Craig Jones.

Speaker 1 (02:25:03):
Here we go. Hey, can you hear me? Can you
see me? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (02:25:07):
We got you?

Speaker 1 (02:25:08):
Dude. Where did b C just leave? Yeah? He signed off, essentially,
what a cocksucker? All right, hello everyone, Luke Thomas here.
You know this guy. This is Craig Jones. How are
you doing, Craig.

Speaker 5 (02:25:22):
I'm hot, I'm enjoying the heat out here.

Speaker 4 (02:25:24):
I'm gonna turn my chair a little bit sideways here,
I'm gonna get a little close.

Speaker 1 (02:25:26):
You know what you want to widen?

Speaker 4 (02:25:27):
Do you want to do me a solid and just
widen the thing we I'm gonna put Craig's camera people
to work.

Speaker 1 (02:25:35):
The back one. Yeah, she has a nice other way there. Yeah,
there we go.

Speaker 4 (02:25:39):
Very good, Thank you so much. That's perfect, Craig. How
are you good?

Speaker 5 (02:25:43):
Good? Fucking warm?

Speaker 4 (02:25:48):
No, it is the mosquitoes too, don't eat your ass
alive here.

Speaker 16 (02:25:52):
The bloody mozziest here for sure.

Speaker 1 (02:25:56):
How has it been?

Speaker 16 (02:25:58):
It's been good of this road trip up in New York.
We started up there, that was just cruising down and
every city the car ends up in the shop. We
make it out of it.

Speaker 5 (02:26:09):
We got the eighty nine Lincoln Town.

Speaker 4 (02:26:11):
I was hoping you were going to pull it up
here and I was gonna be able to take pictures
of it.

Speaker 16 (02:26:14):
But it's in the shop as we speak. The power steering,
I'm talking like I know anything about cars. I don't know,
but probably every shop takes advantage of me. But actually,
where were we We were up in Atlantic City and
one of the gyms there they took care of us,
so they fixed the car problems. At that stage, the
new ones have developed here, so I lost.

Speaker 5 (02:26:34):
Power steering here.

Speaker 16 (02:26:35):
So I was obviously driving this boat through DC and
I started not being down the turn left.

Speaker 5 (02:26:40):
The car was sitting to zoo.

Speaker 1 (02:26:41):
And well, welcome, Welcome to the nation's capital.

Speaker 4 (02:26:46):
I have so many questions for you, but we have
to start with the obvious one, which is the video
you put out yesterday.

Speaker 1 (02:26:52):
So let's break this down.

Speaker 4 (02:26:53):
So for folks who haven't seen it, Craig Jones put
out a video yesterday.

Speaker 1 (02:26:55):
It's on the B Team YouTube.

Speaker 4 (02:26:56):
Channel of Memory serves Yes, Yeah, and in it there's
a few so let's go piece by piece.

Speaker 1 (02:27:01):
One of them is this one was not surprising to me.

Speaker 4 (02:27:04):
One of them is that B Team is basically going
to be no more now, that is to say, you
are leaving B Team and the remaining people. So that's
I don't know Damien's last name, what's his last name?

Speaker 1 (02:27:14):
Not important.

Speaker 4 (02:27:16):
Nicky Ryan, Nicky Rod and some other Ethan Crownson will
be there as well, and they're going to rebrand.

Speaker 1 (02:27:22):
I don't know when that rebrand will happen.

Speaker 5 (02:27:25):
Great question, I would imagine. So it's basically like the
Swan song. Right.

Speaker 16 (02:27:28):
So New Wave and the brilliant political analyst Gordon Ryan
have created Kingsway, So the era of New Wave will end.
So New Wave's final competition, I imagine, will be our event.
And it's kind of the same for B Team. I
mean there's really no how feelings. I'm like kind of
like the dad that went out for milk and never
came back. Yeah, I kicked out of the gym. Now

(02:27:51):
I want to pass pass it on to them, you know,
Like I mean, it's hard to have a gym with
five six on it. You know, It's like it's kind
of hard to make a profit that way really, you know,
like a jiu jitsu gym. I reckon as a business,
they function best single owner, he's the coach, she has
the students. She can make good money doing that. But
in terms of a bunch of professional athletes. It's very difficult, right,

(02:28:15):
like to have a gym that both focuses on the
professional athlete side of things, and to be a professional
athlete you kind of have to be selfish.

Speaker 5 (02:28:22):
To run an academy for.

Speaker 16 (02:28:24):
All people, beginners and everything, you kind of have to
be a bit selfless, right, You have to look at
the students. So that's the direction they want to take
it in, and me, I'm never there, So it's like
full intensive purposes. Why why I keep it going as
it is? We had a good run, So it's kind
of like it fits perfect really.

Speaker 1 (02:28:43):
But why rebrand though?

Speaker 5 (02:28:45):
Why rebrand? Just new beginning?

Speaker 16 (02:28:48):
The beginning and obviously me, my image is quite times
as you can imagine, So like I think a separation
from me, I think unfortunately B Team is quite synonymous
with me. B Team, I mean, keep it out there,
like he'll probably busts some merch out once in a while,
something good comes along. But for those boys, for what
their starting is going to be kind of a different image,

(02:29:10):
you know, family friendly. They want to incorporate mixed martial
arts and striking. Because Damien doesn't ever marry, they want
to go through that big gym type of feelm. I
keep asking him. I'm like, what's the new name going
to be? Because they got their simple Man podcast, so
I'm like, simple Man jiu jitsu fits quite well against
Kingswave elitist you.

Speaker 1 (02:29:28):
Know, Kingsway. That's the new Gordon one.

Speaker 5 (02:29:30):
Yeah, that's the new Gordon one. Yeah.

Speaker 16 (02:29:31):
Gordon's been on the tire eight on the internet against
me today. As you can imagine, perfect grammar, perfect spelling,
clear translation of the ideas.

Speaker 5 (02:29:41):
He's trying to get across.

Speaker 1 (02:29:43):
What has been his line of attack. I didn't see this.

Speaker 16 (02:29:46):
I refuse to read it until he learns how he's backgraphs.
To be honest, I looked for the cliff notes. Honestly,
I don't even know what he means half the time.
But I don't know why he's angry that I'm leaving
his city. He's got his gym, now I'm leaving take it.

Speaker 4 (02:30:00):
Does he see it as some and again, does he
see it as some kind of like victory lap or something?

Speaker 5 (02:30:06):
Maybe?

Speaker 16 (02:30:07):
I mean, I just it's funny. It's like they had
a new way. Now they have Kingsway. We had be team,
and then it'll preve be some sort of incarnation of
simple man. It's kind of like we're kind of doing
the same thing, you know what I mean. Like, so
I don't know what I don't know the beefis. I'm
trying to put the beef aside. Me and John Danaher
were homies again, we're friends again. It's just h Obviously

(02:30:28):
Gordon still doesn't like I don't know why, nothing but
complimentary towards them.

Speaker 4 (02:30:32):
Then, yeah, you guys have been nothing but h fast
friends this whole time. My producer is telling me, you're
a little low on the microphone if you want to
speak a little bit closer to.

Speaker 5 (02:30:39):
It, just whispering.

Speaker 1 (02:30:41):
All right, But let's I want to talk more about this.
So do you know.

Speaker 4 (02:30:46):
When you guys decided to okay, how how did this
decision come about? Did you go to them and say, guys,
I'm out where, they like, we need to make a
call here?

Speaker 1 (02:30:55):
What was the process?

Speaker 3 (02:30:56):
I would?

Speaker 16 (02:30:56):
I would It's just like kind of a logical decision,
you know, Like for the first eighteen months to two years,
I was slogging it out of B team. I was
there twice a day, you know, like, and then as
I mean, even MMA coaching, I'm gone for six weeks
and then sometimes you decide to go to Bali on vacation,
you end up there for six months.

Speaker 5 (02:31:13):
You know, Like I'm just never around. So it was
kind of coming to this point.

Speaker 16 (02:31:18):
Where we were just like we're all collectively thinking it,
and that's just like me, I said, I'm never there.

Speaker 5 (02:31:22):
Why am I attached? Attached to this physical premises?

Speaker 16 (02:31:25):
But I will say, I mean for the students, a
B team, like it's going to have a new name,
but you still have your gym. Really, day to day
operations will continue, the same guys teaching the classes, be
teaching the classes. Nicky Ryan's going to kind of step
up into that head coach roll. Unfortunately, the body he
has been given is failing him.

Speaker 1 (02:31:44):
I've seen the rehab though it seems to be going.

Speaker 16 (02:31:47):
Yeah, he's doing it now, So I'm proud of him
that now he's doing rehab. For the longest time, he
would not do the rehab. He did a little bit
of rehab, but the video games would call him. But
now he's given up the video games and he's really
taken on board the head coach rough and I think
the gym it requires a head coach, right, you know,
it's like kind of Lord of the Flies in there
most of the time. But Nicky Ryan stepping up taking over.

(02:32:10):
He's the best teacher. He's the best teacher in there,
you know. I think he's very good at teaching, and
he's coaching is very good. Like I love having Nicky
Ryan in my corner for matches. I hate to say
I even enjoyed having Gordon in the corner when it
comes to jiu jitsu. Has fantastic opinions. It wouldn't ask
him anything else. Nicky Ryan coaching phenomenal. So I think,
like the gym's in, say fans, people.

Speaker 1 (02:32:29):
In say fans, you're not going to miss Austin.

Speaker 5 (02:32:33):
No, not a lot.

Speaker 16 (02:32:34):
You know, there are some good parts of Ustin. But yeah,
I mean I don't love it too much. It's not
I don't hate these places. I just enjoy being on
the move. You know, when the UFC legal summons come
my way, they weren't know where to find me.

Speaker 1 (02:32:49):
When would they send you legal summons?

Speaker 4 (02:32:51):
By the way, they're just watching this two of the
most hated people that they have.

Speaker 16 (02:32:55):
Actually, before I went on Areo, I didn't tell my
lawyer and manager that I was going on there and
I just posted LA five minutes at the end, he
was like, what have you plugged? It's like advising me,
obviously we have this bazookid a day in White's head.
He did not suggest that, but again, for legal purposes,
that could have been any board man. They all look alike.

Speaker 1 (02:33:13):
Yeah, but fair enough. Is there some plausible deniability? All right?

Speaker 4 (02:33:16):
So the other ports portion excuse me of the announcement
that was in the video yesterday. One was you're leaving
the country, as I understand, right, are you just gonna
roam like you've been doing? Because every time I'm on Instagram,
it's like, well, Craig is in is Stanbull, Creg is
in Ukraine, Creg is in wherever the fuck?

Speaker 5 (02:33:31):
Like is that the adventure?

Speaker 12 (02:33:33):
You know?

Speaker 16 (02:33:34):
Seeing where wherever I'm needed? Most of the time I'm
not needed there, but wherever I feel drawn to. And again,
like we've got a couple of big flights coming up.
I imagined Volks will be fighting before the year ends.
Della is going to take out Macachev. So it's like
I have to put in the effort for those camps.
So it's like those do take a lot of time,
you know what I mean that again, for Volkanovski is

(02:33:55):
long one. I spent a full six weeks with him,
and I think I'm going to be targeting the same
for the Jack Della, even though I have to be
in the cultural hub of Australia of Perth for six weeks.

Speaker 5 (02:34:05):
But you know what we'll pull.

Speaker 1 (02:34:07):
Well, how is Perth I've never been done. That's terrible.

Speaker 16 (02:34:11):
I mean honestly as a city, the beaches, the weather, incredible,
the people table, what's the equivalent here, Oh, summer in
West Virginia movie?

Speaker 1 (02:34:21):
Oh fuck? Really just West Virginia with the beaches.

Speaker 16 (02:34:25):
Yeah, it's the most oscillated city in Australia and that's
for a reason, right, fair.

Speaker 1 (02:34:30):
But then there was a last component of the announcement.

Speaker 4 (02:34:32):
If you want, I'm gonna slide over just a little
bit and come this way, just we get you more
infort Yeah, there you go. No, it's all right, it's
it's listen. It's a narrow thing where we're we're you know,
we're working with the studio.

Speaker 5 (02:34:42):
It's still big. Came backing away from him.

Speaker 1 (02:34:44):
I know, I look like a different species.

Speaker 5 (02:34:46):
Next thing.

Speaker 1 (02:34:47):
It's really quite remarkable. But the other point I will
tell you.

Speaker 4 (02:34:50):
It kind of broke my heart a little bit to
see the last part of the announcement, which was like
the match against Cable Steve Sing, which of course we'll
culminate c J I two later in August.

Speaker 1 (02:34:58):
After that, you're donezo.

Speaker 4 (02:35:00):
And then I saw on Reddit you say you were
going to vanish, So what.

Speaker 1 (02:35:05):
Is happening with you after CJI? We'll talk about CGI
just a second, But what what what? What's happening?

Speaker 16 (02:35:10):
Who you know?

Speaker 5 (02:35:11):
Is that's the mystery? You know, maybe we disappeared for
a while.

Speaker 1 (02:35:13):
And are you Are you sick of it all?

Speaker 5 (02:35:16):
I mean, it is.

Speaker 16 (02:35:16):
It is quite a challenge. It is a lot of work,
but I really don't give myself a chance to take
a break. So it's like a forced break, you know.

Speaker 5 (02:35:22):
What I mean.

Speaker 16 (02:35:23):
I'm forcing myself to take a break. I'll plan and
take a break off the c J one. But I
got a bit too excited in Columbia. Didn't disappear from
socials for a while.

Speaker 4 (02:35:31):
So yeah, it's so funny. I've been going to Columbia
for almost fifteen years. My wife is from from there.

Speaker 5 (02:35:36):
I love the clarification there.

Speaker 4 (02:35:37):
Yeah, I'm not a passport.

Speaker 5 (02:35:40):
He's there for the coaching.

Speaker 3 (02:35:42):
Well, I was just.

Speaker 4 (02:35:42):
Gonna say, I remember I saw you, So it's so funny.
I went to Carta Hannah once and then you went
like right after the first CJI memory, sir, So I
was actually I was actually in Carto Hannah, I think
right right around that time, and then you went after me.
And then I saw some of the places you were
hanging out. I could I could.

Speaker 1 (02:36:00):
Spot them all almostly almost, But then.

Speaker 4 (02:36:02):
I saw you were downtown and you had armed security,
and I was like, yeah, we're having different experiences in
Cartagena at this point.

Speaker 16 (02:36:10):
Yeah, And honestly I probably needed it. With what man
we would drawn a lot of attention to ourselves. The
armed security for what we were doing probably necessary, just
that level of uh.

Speaker 5 (02:36:22):
To the wind on the Columbia Straits.

Speaker 4 (02:36:24):
You know what's so funny you bring this up because
people always ask me, like, what are you recommendations for Columbia,
But like I did, I didn't.

Speaker 1 (02:36:28):
Well, here's the truth. I didn't realize how if you
travel to.

Speaker 4 (02:36:34):
Columbia with somebody from there and they kind of guide
you and keep you off of that like, you can
have a great experience, but it's very careful I didn't
realize how careful my in laws were being and taking
care of me there. And then I see these like
stories from other people who go and they're like, X
happened to me?

Speaker 1 (02:36:53):
Why happened to me? You got the bludundungga, didn't you
the scopel.

Speaker 16 (02:36:56):
Me and like, the yeah, I did get drugged in,
was not the one that druged myself in that situation.

Speaker 5 (02:37:02):
Yeah, that's that.

Speaker 16 (02:37:03):
Shit's brutal. Honestly, that's like anesthetic. I couldn't remember anything.

Speaker 1 (02:37:07):
But it happened to my wife's uncle.

Speaker 4 (02:37:10):
They got him and they emptied out his ATM, and
they emptied out part of his apartment too.

Speaker 1 (02:37:14):
Shit.

Speaker 16 (02:37:14):
I always thought, you know what a part of me
because I watched the old b stuck. I always just
think it was It's a bit of a myth, you know.
It's the husband that goes, oh shit, I spent all
the money last night.

Speaker 5 (02:37:23):
I must have been robbed. It must have been drugs,
you know. But yeah, it happens to the best of us.

Speaker 1 (02:37:26):
Also, I've never been to Metagene, but I heard that's
like the epicenter of gringos getting their ship taken.

Speaker 5 (02:37:32):
That's for sure.

Speaker 16 (02:37:32):
Yeah, there are some men aiming for women above their
pay grade in those regions, and I think that cost
them in the long run. But yeah, I mean menaging beautiful,
like in terms of like city views and stuff. Like
we stayed in the airbnb got I was there for
six weeks. I just stayed there till I got drugged
and I was like, we better get.

Speaker 5 (02:37:52):
Out of here.

Speaker 16 (02:37:53):
But yeah, medagine beautiful city. I mean, if you're smart,
you can avoid the trouble. Honestly, it's pretty I think
it's pretty obvious that's where that trouble lies, you know,
But great time.

Speaker 4 (02:38:05):
Yeah, fair enough. I'll getting back to this about what
you're going to do. Are we only going to see
you when you corner like VULK or j DM or honestly.

Speaker 16 (02:38:15):
I honestly don't know. I like, I'm just focused on
c J and then just having a forced break. If
I feel the need to come back, I'll come back.
But yeah, that's it, basically.

Speaker 1 (02:38:24):
What are you gonna do with your life if you
don't come back?

Speaker 16 (02:38:27):
I mean, I feel like that's the question most people
ask every morning anyway, and you pretend they have the answers.

Speaker 4 (02:38:31):
Yeah, but those are we're all on traditional paths. Yours
is a little bit more unusual.

Speaker 5 (02:38:36):
Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 16 (02:38:36):
I don't know what we'll do afterwards, but I think
actually we've built a Guardian project and we're just finishing
building a school in Peru.

Speaker 5 (02:38:42):
So probably laylo in Peru, and you.

Speaker 1 (02:38:45):
Gotta be careful and security is real, that's true.

Speaker 16 (02:38:48):
Yeah, I mean it's a dangerous place, still be dangerous
of having a good time. But yeah, I want to see,
like we put a lot of money from c JI
one and the planned profits of c j I two
into building a school in the northwest to Peru. So
we build the school for the kids over that Godian Project.
Incredible project at schools all around the world. We just
visited the one in Baltimore. But yeah, they do a

(02:39:08):
lot for teaching underprivileged kids. You did to and we'd
just like build a facility for him because the school
improved sort of reached capacity.

Speaker 5 (02:39:16):
So I do a lot of fun programs.

Speaker 16 (02:39:18):
Like if the kids train, they get they get meals,
they get English lessons and stuff like that, and then
obviously get the benefits of jiu jitsu itself, discipline, self reliance.

Speaker 1 (02:39:27):
Is this your first time in Baltimore?

Speaker 16 (02:39:29):
First time in Baltimore. Yeah, I thought I was expect
as I watched the wire, but I don't know. I
feel like I stood out in the car down man.
But I got a lot of respect from uh old people.

Speaker 4 (02:39:40):
I would imagine that that car was popular in Baltimore
city limits.

Speaker 5 (02:39:43):
I haven't been put over yet, I think.

Speaker 16 (02:39:45):
Yeah, I think obviously they see the car, the cops
and they see it's driving anything.

Speaker 5 (02:39:50):
Yeah, a bit of profile.

Speaker 4 (02:39:52):
I will tell you my first thought when I saw
the video yesterday. First I was very well produced.

Speaker 5 (02:39:57):
But that aside, I actually edited them myself. Shut the
fuck out, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:40:02):
You do, Okay.

Speaker 4 (02:40:04):
I was gonna say what really stood out to me
about it was how worried should I be about the
future of jiu jitsu? Here's what I mean, not so
much its popularity as such, but you're the only guy
I can see vocally making a case for basic labor
right slash financial literacy. And if you take a break,

(02:40:28):
I don't know who else does that in the space.
And for that reason, what happens in your absence, Like
I mean, I realized it's not all on you. I'm
just saying you would leave a vacuum in place that
I don't think would be easily filled.

Speaker 5 (02:40:44):
Yeah, I mean that's I mean, that's the mission with CJL.
I was really to like.

Speaker 16 (02:40:50):
Help the athletes out you know, give back, Like I think,
like I've been blessed by people being very forgiving of
my human just for being Australian. So I've been able
to get away with a lot on social media. I
feel like a lot of the times people see what
I post and they just see the good in.

Speaker 5 (02:41:03):
It, you know what I mean.

Speaker 16 (02:41:04):
They ignore a lot of the dark undertones of those posts.
But that helps me build a profile on the sport.
That's helped me be able to make money for myself.
So I know the challenges athletes have of like trying
to make money for themselves and really not to be
used by promoters out there. So I really wanted to
provide them an alternative, and I think I set the
grounds for it. I mean, it's still a pretty damn

(02:41:26):
good chance we do CGI three unless we read a
massive loss on I.

Speaker 4 (02:41:30):
Was gonna say, it sounds like there's not a guarantee
at all that there will be a CGI three.

Speaker 1 (02:41:35):
There could be, but it's not.

Speaker 16 (02:41:37):
Yeah, I wouldn't say there's any guarantees like I mean, honestly,
it's not obviously some of my money. I wish it
was my money. I do wish it was my money,
but I've never won a million dollars in jiu jitsu.
But the investments there for a CGI three. But obviously
the measure of success for me is how interested people
are in the event, how engaged they are, how many

(02:41:59):
people show up to the event. So for my it's
my friend's money, so I don't want to just waste
his money. He has a lot of money to waste.
But at the same time, like if the interest isn't there,
it is what it is. You know, we gave it
a good crack. I think we elevated the sport with
CJI one CJI two using the quintet style team's format.
I think people are just going to be amazed at

(02:42:19):
how exciting and grappling can be. No doubt if there
is no CJI three, UFC will still CGI two's format.
Pretty wrong with that next year, But they should they
owe me some consulting fees. Honestly, I hear they pay well.
But CJI three I'll come back. I mean, if this
is one needs me, I'll come back, but I think
the sport's will be okay, we'll let it.

Speaker 5 (02:42:40):
Ride, right.

Speaker 4 (02:42:42):
I don't know, do you what level of concern do
you have that the UC will be able to monopolize sports.

Speaker 16 (02:42:48):
Jug just so, I mean, the problem is is that,
like like what you said about explained like labor rights.

Speaker 5 (02:42:56):
So it's like the best YouTube.

Speaker 16 (02:42:57):
Comment I've read on my series so far, as it's
like Craig is slowly going insane explaining labor rights to Gabeman.

Speaker 5 (02:43:04):
And that's the most accurate.

Speaker 1 (02:43:05):
The financial literacy among the athletes in this business is
it's not high.

Speaker 5 (02:43:10):
It's not high.

Speaker 16 (02:43:10):
And you know what, even the people in the sport
that are at the top that you think are intelligent.
Obviously we're not talking about the best of the best here,
but there are elite level athletes. One of them in particular,
who was signed to not UFC, but he was signed
to an organization previous that generally have some pretty strict contracts.
I remember I was trying to get him to do
CJI one and I said, well, what does your contract say?

(02:43:33):
And this is a guy that studied law. I believe
his sister's a lawyer, and he's like I didn't read
the contract. I just signed it, Jesus. So like when
when some of the elite level guys, even the guys
at the top of the sport, don't read contracts.

Speaker 5 (02:43:46):
I think that's almost unsalvagable, Jesus.

Speaker 4 (02:43:50):
I'm not even sure what to say about that. Can
I tell you I have a fear about it? Let
me give you a theories. What do you think about this? Yeah,
I'm ready, all right, So I don't know if you
saw this. I mean, there's other there are other factors
I could point to that would buttress this. But certainly
the UFC is going to sign let's talk about the
MA side. So on the UFC side of MMA, I
mean I say UFC, I mean TKO. But on the

(02:44:12):
UFC side, they're about to sign a new television deal,
and certainly for the life of that deal, it's going
to be extremely lucrative, potentially up to a billion dollars
a year. Right, So, like they're fine in that sense,
But there's a lot of broader data that indicates MMA
is in decline. And one of the things that came
out interestingly was there was some data from Typology.

Speaker 1 (02:44:29):
I'm sure you've used the website before.

Speaker 4 (02:44:30):
The amount of global MMA events is steadily declining year
over year, including in USA, Brazil, and Russia, the top
three markets. Now there are some differences there. Japan's on
the up, Europe certainly on the op. I'm not sure
where Australia fits into the conversation, but you know, it's
not a great sign. And of course, you know, if
anybody who works in this business knows that the numbers
are done more broadly. But then you look at what

(02:44:52):
they're doing in boxing. They're trying to get the portion
of the ALI actim ended so that they can get
their own titles put in, which is currently really fucking illegal.
They want to like just rip out federal portions of
federal legislation. And now they're getting into BJJ. It looks
to me like they kind of see where MMA is headed,
that they will they will be able to control it
and be lucrative, but it will the pile will shrink.

(02:45:13):
Why not just expand the reach they already have WWE,
they already have UFC. If they can take over with
svving money boxing, great and then of course BJ is
you would think relative to those things there for the taking,
and this would consolidate their position relative to declines in MMA.

Speaker 1 (02:45:29):
What do you make of this idea of mine?

Speaker 5 (02:45:30):
Well, I don't think the.

Speaker 16 (02:45:31):
US has been in a better position to fight against
corruption and monopolies than it has right now today.

Speaker 1 (02:45:39):
Yeah, I don't know about that. I don't know about that.

Speaker 5 (02:45:44):
I think, Yeah.

Speaker 16 (02:45:45):
I mean that's the thing, right is, like I think
they can do it and there would be no consequences
to it. So it's like it's quite an appeal battle
in that sense, you know, Like I don't think the
monopoly lewis are going to be implemented, you know what
I mean. I didn't think there's going to be any pushback.
And obviously that was a big settlement case recently, but
I think that took like ten years.

Speaker 1 (02:46:06):
Did it take ten years? Yes? Well, though there's new ones.
I don't know if you're aware of that.

Speaker 5 (02:46:10):
Yeah. I did speak to that lawyer.

Speaker 16 (02:46:11):
That lawyer did reach out to me, we did, Yeah, yeah,
so I spoke to him briefly, nothing serious, but yeah,
I spoke to him Eric Eric, Yeah, the main guy,
the main I forget.

Speaker 5 (02:46:20):
I forget.

Speaker 1 (02:46:21):
Well, there's there's two different walk.

Speaker 5 (02:46:22):
Yeah, the three hundred and thirty million dollars settlement.

Speaker 1 (02:46:25):
Yeah, three hundred and seventy five, so they bumped it
up a little bit.

Speaker 5 (02:46:28):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I spoke to him.

Speaker 16 (02:46:30):
Yeah, I mean obviously, like I have quite a negative
view on the direction of sort corruption overall, I think
in the country generally, so it's like we would be
fighting enough, too bad. But I think in terms of
like what you're saying about declining viewership across the board
in MM, I just think it's less it's less interesting now.

(02:46:52):
Like what I really appreciated about Japanese MMA was the show.

Speaker 5 (02:46:57):
The show they put on.

Speaker 16 (02:46:59):
Even recently when we were watch the Boxing Fire where
the dads the dad's for and then their sons fought,
and like the production level of that in Britain.

Speaker 5 (02:47:06):
So yeah, absolutely it was insane credible.

Speaker 16 (02:47:10):
So much effort, even like what the UFC did when
they had the event of this sphere, Like I think
all those little things really help get people excited, like
it's you're actually seeing something incredible. But like the problem
is they've got such a a good formula for profit
that there's really not a lot of creative effort put
into the production side.

Speaker 5 (02:47:30):
Of things, or really even the storytelling.

Speaker 16 (02:47:33):
Like I mean even like to be honest, the Countdown
show is kind of pretty boring, pretty cookie cutter, you know.
Like I remember back in the day, like when BJPM
fought GSP in the rematch, like those previous shows even
I think that was called prime time Prime Time. Yeah,
Like the production level on those that they took chances
there was there was a lot of creative energy put in.

Speaker 5 (02:47:51):
They felt like they cared a lot about it.

Speaker 16 (02:47:54):
I feel like when that starts to diminish at the top,
it's going to translate.

Speaker 5 (02:47:58):
To interest in the sport, right.

Speaker 4 (02:48:01):
I have a theory my sister and my brother used
to they do not anymore if they close it up,
But they used to own a restaurant. And I remember
I came back from Spain one time. You've been in Spain, yep, yeah, yeah,
I love Spain. And I remember you go into these
restaurants and they would be like the size of this room,
and you'd be like, but the food would be just
fire everywhere you went. And they explained to me, like
it's not a coincidence that that, like, the more food

(02:48:24):
you have to prep each day and deliver each day,
the harder it becomes to do, which is why banquet
food is like, it's not bad, but it's it's assembly line,
it's formulaic, just feels a little bit like MMA is
kind of like banquet food right now.

Speaker 5 (02:48:37):
Yeah, yeah, I would agree. I think.

Speaker 16 (02:48:39):
I mean, like I've see, if you get off a
lucrative contracts and you have to deliver a certain amount
of shows, and you're going to have to split those
interesting flights up over the course of the show. Obviously,
depending on the athlete, they're going to be able to
fight more and get paid potentially more four more flights.

Speaker 5 (02:48:54):
But I do miss the.

Speaker 16 (02:48:57):
Days when it was like one paper of view a month,
almost going crazy hype.

Speaker 5 (02:49:01):
The whole thing was stacked, you know.

Speaker 16 (02:49:03):
But I mean maybe that's me just for reminiscing, but
I do agree with what you're saying here, and that's
I mean, that's why I only want to do CJI
once a year, Like it's like one super Bowl event
per year that wouldn't interfere with any other events.

Speaker 5 (02:49:14):
It's a chance for the athletes to make money.

Speaker 16 (02:49:16):
It's not behind a pay well, it shouldn't conflict with
other organizations. If their athletes do well, that's going to
make their athlete more valuable to them. But on the
counter to that, the athlete could get hurt, the athlete
could win that million dollars and be like, hey, bump
the paycheck up, you know what I mean. So like
CGI by providing leverage to the individual athletes is really
I think a scary thing for anyone that would try

(02:49:37):
to control an industry.

Speaker 4 (02:49:39):
Let's talk about the tory you're on. So obviously, like
you started in New York. Yep, did you go to
Philly at all?

Speaker 5 (02:49:45):
On the outskirts of Philly? Where do we go? We
when New York to Atlantic City?

Speaker 1 (02:49:49):
That's the land that time for god, holy shit, we're
trying to go like Hunter S.

Speaker 16 (02:49:53):
Thompson sort of vibes here on the campaign trail, right,
So we're just trying to hit the hit a lot
of obscure spots.

Speaker 5 (02:49:59):
I don't we know we're going after this today.

Speaker 16 (02:50:02):
I mean, we left the car and I think safe
Hans the mechanics said that, have a look at it.
But yeah, let's see. Maybe I was thinking about driving
through West Virginia after this. But we're just winging it,
like I call it a bit of a farewell to it.
I just want to just pull up to gym's and
train with the people, the real people in the country
that are like don't generally have access. That's something I

(02:50:23):
really appreciate because when I came up on the sport
Adelaide Australia, we didn't have too many high level guys bass.

Speaker 5 (02:50:29):
So it's always been in the back of my mind.

Speaker 16 (02:50:31):
It's like I try to visit destination so don't have access,
like places like Venezuela, Like I try to hit these
spots even Ukraine, try to train with the boys in
Ukraine and stuff like that. So that's one way I'm
trying to grow the sport at jiujitsu. It's just even
just showing up, hanging out with them, rolling with them,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 5 (02:50:50):
It really helped.

Speaker 1 (02:50:50):
Where's Lachland from?

Speaker 5 (02:50:51):
Giles Lachland's Melbourne born and raised, Still in Melbourne today.

Speaker 1 (02:50:55):
Okay, okay, I didn't know. If I didn't, I don't.

Speaker 4 (02:50:56):
I'm not too familiar with like how the Aussie's split
out country. Where did you train here in DC yesterday?

Speaker 3 (02:51:03):
Oh?

Speaker 16 (02:51:03):
Actually trained because the captain of the American team or
the coaching the American team he's got called Greg Satis dude.

Speaker 1 (02:51:10):
I used to train under Greg souder. Oh really years ago,
Like maybe maybe I'm not even bullshing, maybe ten years ago.
I like Greg a lot. I know it's the people
get all over his case of a the ecological thing. Dude,
He's one of the fucking best instructors I've ever had. Like,
no bullshit, Greg.

Speaker 4 (02:51:25):
He he left the school I was at, and I
sent him a note even telling him how fucking good
he was, because I was so bummed.

Speaker 1 (02:51:31):
When I found out he left. So you were in
what crazy eighty eight?

Speaker 16 (02:51:35):
No, he teaches now at oh Man. I should remember
the name of the gym, Standard jiu Jitsu out in Maryland, Maryland. Yeah, yeah,
I think. Yeah, But he's got two guys in his
team from his gym, the Brothers. So we went down there.
I rolled with him ten minutes age that was enough
for me. The cardio was was absent, but yeah, we

(02:51:56):
just checked in with him, watched him, watched him how
he runs the room, you know, Like I think a
lot of.

Speaker 5 (02:52:00):
People get caught up in his aggressive interview energy.

Speaker 16 (02:52:03):
But yeah, a lovely guy from my experience, and he
has a good heart, Like he's trying to change the
sport of jiu jitsu through the way he coaches, and
like from everything I can say, he's running it like
a professional wrestling room, like a practice round. It's a
room for practice, so it's like there's a little marketing
in there, right, like no drilling and stuff like that.
But yeah, at the end of the day, I think

(02:52:25):
he's hots in the rap plast.

Speaker 4 (02:52:26):
Well, when he was teaching at the time, this sumost
have been going to I'm going to guess here circa
twenty sixteen.

Speaker 1 (02:52:30):
Something like that. I could be wrong about that.

Speaker 4 (02:52:33):
I don't know if he had like what what we
would call today an ecological approach, But just the first
time I ever trained with him, I remember thinking I'd
never had an instructor who we were doing guard passing
in the gee how he could just connect all the
dots through, like, well, here's what the objective is, here's
what your assignment is to reach the objective.

Speaker 1 (02:52:51):
Here's why.

Speaker 4 (02:52:53):
And I remember being like, cause, do you go a
lot of jiu jitsu schools and they're like, all right,
we're going to train guilla teens today, you know what
I mean?

Speaker 1 (02:52:59):
And they kind of mchann show you how it's.

Speaker 4 (02:53:00):
Done, but they don't really explain why things are the
way they are. No, I thought he was fucking awesome.

Speaker 5 (02:53:06):
So yeah, I think.

Speaker 16 (02:53:07):
I mean, it's just go orientated training, right, and it's
like a lot of people to be creative in the
pursuit of the goal, whether that be a position or submission.
So I think like any room with high level guys
that allows for creativity and discussion is going to deliver
good students and coobay. DeAndre Corbet particular just one one

(02:53:28):
hundred thousand dollars at Sapataria and beat some of the
best guys in his white division in the sport.

Speaker 5 (02:53:33):
So he's done on a very good job.

Speaker 1 (02:53:35):
But DeAndre Corbet, so you might go to West Virginia.

Speaker 4 (02:53:39):
So my understanding was from the plan, the plan was
to basically hit the east coast.

Speaker 5 (02:53:43):
Do you know, I'm not a big plan guy, you know, Okay, intended.

Speaker 1 (02:53:45):
To plan was to hit the East coast right and
then hit the west coast and at the end of
the West coast run just essentially head into Vegas for CJI, Right,
that's the plan. That's the plan, I see. Okay. So
between that, so the plan is to hit are you
going to go all the way down to Florida?

Speaker 16 (02:54:00):
Yeah, so I'm going to hit up flow grappling, have
an event who's number one and my boy Owen Joonce
is committing HG and he group on that and that's
some real interesting matchhouse.

Speaker 5 (02:54:09):
My buddy kit Dale's competing in the main event.

Speaker 1 (02:54:11):
Another Aussie pioneer.

Speaker 5 (02:54:12):
To another bloody Aussie.

Speaker 16 (02:54:14):
Now he's come out of he's basically come out of retirement,
like he disappeared for a while, but now he's making
a run for it again. And he's always been one
of the most talented guys I've ever trained with. We
actually competed against each other one time, but it was
a bit of a fake match because we're friends. But yeah,
he's phenomenal, so it's great to see him coming back.
He actually did the CGI Trials in Australia and put
on a really, really good performance. And he was one

(02:54:35):
of the guys I think paved the way he shaped
me early in my career because he was being an
idiot making stupid videos, funny videos and stuff like that,
and I saw how that helped him transcend the regular
sort of jiu jitsu field. He really helped him stand out,
make money in the sport and stuff like that, So
I would say Kid DW was very influential on sort
of me being a professional idio myself.

Speaker 4 (02:54:56):
I remember him destimptly for two reasons. One, he got
his black belt very quickly. Yeah, and I think because
he had some kind of at the time him.

Speaker 1 (02:55:07):
So that this is moneyburg I forget it. What's his
first name, Derek? Derek.

Speaker 4 (02:55:10):
This is the guy who got his black belt in
like literally what they say, three and a half years
at forty six years old.

Speaker 1 (02:55:14):
Motherfucker, I'm forty five.

Speaker 4 (02:55:16):
It hurts to nap on one side, like, I just
have a very hard time believing that that's even achievable,
even for like a you know, uh Terrell Owens level athlete.

Speaker 1 (02:55:25):
But okay, go aside.

Speaker 4 (02:55:26):
And then the other part was to the funny videos.
He made a foury into acting for a while. Kid
Dale did, right, I recall that he did. His brother
is actually like Quack a good director.

Speaker 16 (02:55:36):
His brothers like stood out in the directing field, so like,
I think both of those guys have worked together alone.

Speaker 5 (02:55:41):
But yeah, Kid did have a bit of before you know.

Speaker 4 (02:55:44):
What's so funny about this Tory roon? And it kind
of occurred to me when you when I when I
when I heard about it, I was like, dude, this
sounds like a political campaign.

Speaker 5 (02:55:50):
That's the whole thing with like Hunter Unson on the campaign.

Speaker 4 (02:55:53):
Dude, just just handshaking people, grassroots, door to door. That's
how it's done.

Speaker 5 (02:55:58):
Keepsing people's babies, as you know, that's my style. That
is actually the jiu jitsu style.

Speaker 1 (02:56:04):
Sadly, yeah, no, oh god, that's a whole nother conversation.

Speaker 4 (02:56:07):
But like I gotta tell you, like, like you know,
what's so funny about it, Like you clown jiu jitsu
and you know, it's like I saw a video the
other day where we were talking. You were laughing at
people at the team who like open mat on Sundays.
They don't go home to their families, they got nothing
to do, and the whole keep jiu jitsu gay and stuff.
But it's like, dude, at the end of the day,
like I don't know anybody who loves jiu jitsu more
than you, if I could be honest, Like the level
of care you're putting into safeguarding its future, it's quite

(02:56:30):
quite remarkable.

Speaker 16 (02:56:30):
I'm trying to guide the koach as best I can
because it is like it is.

Speaker 5 (02:56:35):
A painful it's a mutant culture.

Speaker 16 (02:56:37):
Brother people out there posting line quotes on Instagram and
stuff like that.

Speaker 5 (02:56:41):
It's uh, it's wild, you know, let me need to
fix it.

Speaker 4 (02:56:43):
It's a lot of it's a lot of I feel
like jiu jitsu is one of those places where like
people who go, that's where they get social time, like
absent that they don't have a lot of social time.
And I'm generalizing obviously, but it seems like that's your
experience as well.

Speaker 16 (02:57:00):
Yeah, that's fair for sure. I mean, I mean the
afteritude the trains probably has it nine to five. He
has a family, so typically speaking of going to be
trained in the morning or not so busy on the
weekends with the family or work.

Speaker 5 (02:57:12):
So it's really yeah, that is pretty much for any
social time.

Speaker 16 (02:57:14):
And I think it draws your way from other friends
that don't train, because everyone's a bit competitive. They want
to get good, they want to put in the hours
and beat up their training find its, so that does
become their social circuit.

Speaker 5 (02:57:24):
It's kind of a code, uh.

Speaker 4 (02:57:26):
For cj I two. It's interesting, right, I want to
talk about the difference in the format, But the first
thing was the CJI one was interesting because of how yeah,
well the kiss was really quite remarkable, but no, it
was so subversive because ADCC has been this established brand
in the sport and then here comes c J.

Speaker 1 (02:57:44):
I same weekends are more or less sad. It was
a slight difference, but you.

Speaker 4 (02:57:47):
Know, same same city, same weekend, Fuck your life, We're
going to do it this way, and you know it
was it was.

Speaker 1 (02:57:53):
It was that. But you have no a d C
C Backdrount this time. It's kind of a floating on
its own.

Speaker 4 (02:57:56):
Obviously, I wonder has that created more challenges because you
have less of a villain to antagonize for sure.

Speaker 16 (02:58:05):
For sure, it was always good to have a villain.
I think it's like it's narrative driven. And again that
brings me back to Japanese mma and that evolved out
of pro wrestling, right, So, like I think pro wrestling
to storylines incredibly well. So I think like CJI one
had this perfect sort of villain and along the lines,
unfortunately that villain makes a bad decision that made life

(02:58:27):
a lot easier for us.

Speaker 5 (02:58:28):
So we had this narrative of against the band.

Speaker 16 (02:58:31):
I do consider us to have a villain for this
next event and that villain would be any event that
blocks their athletes from competing for US, So we do
have a bit of a villain. That's a villain with
a very strong legal team. And actually, for a crew
of people that are anti cancel culture, they're quite sensitive.

Speaker 5 (02:58:49):
They're quite a sensitive group of people.

Speaker 1 (02:58:50):
So this is my favorite thing about UFC.

Speaker 4 (02:58:52):
They what a free speech place, and I'm like, they
are the most censorious organization in all of sports. Dana
White is easily the most sensitive guy in the entirety
of combat sports. It's a I mean, listen, they can
they can operate their business how they want, and it's
obviously been very successful. But the claim that what they're
committed to is the free expression of ideas is fucking comical.

Speaker 16 (02:59:14):
It's true, it's true. Yeah, I mean they are, they
are free speech for some things.

Speaker 5 (02:59:19):
But yeah they do.

Speaker 16 (02:59:21):
Yeah yeah, Brice Mitchell, marketing manager over there, But we
do for us, Like, it is difficult in this sense
because like it's hard to villainize an organization that kids
grew up watching and idealize. So it's like it's I mean,
people will take smaller paychecks to be associated with that organization,

(02:59:42):
and that's kind of the dream they do sell these
they do that make yeah, So it's like we do
have an uphill battle here, and I don't really think
we necessarily need a villain for this event. Like for me,
what I'm so invested in is basically I wanted to
show CI one the perfect format. Obviously stole the pit
and license it, but we stole it. We wanted a

(03:00:06):
perfect format for like an individual tournament style. But it's
always been my dream to showcase quintet as I imagined it,
which is sort of like a five on five last
man standing type of thing. Like I don't think there
would be a more exciting thing in the sport of
jiu jitsu than to see one athlete submit five people
in a row.

Speaker 5 (03:00:24):
And that's all we have the possibility to do here.
So although we.

Speaker 16 (03:00:27):
Do a villain arc is very nice. It is a
playful it's a playful villain this time and we go.
I do have to be careful aout what I say
because expensive legal feest. But for this event, the main
goal is really like to showcase how exciting that team
aspect to jiu jitsu can be. And it's really like
a uniting factor, like we're ever in New York, and

(03:00:47):
I was envisioning myself as Cyrus from the Warriors uniting
the gangs together. Yeah, come out before he got shut
down by the rival organization. But yeah, like basically, like
the teams are kind of like gangs, and everyone's coming
together to showcase the most exciting aspects of jiu jitsu.
And we've got a lot of really all around support

(03:01:09):
and grassroots support from the first one for this one.
But yeah, I mean to see like a new wave
and B team like just being in an event together.

Speaker 5 (03:01:18):
I feel like we've already.

Speaker 16 (03:01:19):
Accomplished something very good with that, and really like it
is the end of the road for both those teams.
So the only chance you'll get to see to what
that beef play out is it CJR.

Speaker 5 (03:01:30):
Two.

Speaker 1 (03:01:30):
Why is at the end of the road, because obviously.

Speaker 5 (03:01:32):
They're going to become Kingsway.

Speaker 1 (03:01:34):
So the new way of just like disintegrating.

Speaker 16 (03:01:38):
I mean, I don't know how they're going to structure it,
but they do have a new premises.

Speaker 5 (03:01:42):
It is King's Way. I'll shout them out even though
the coach, but.

Speaker 16 (03:01:47):
I will shout them at Kingsway. Obviously you gonna have
fantastic instruction there. But you will have an alternative with
the B Team Boys rebranding. It'll probably I'm calling it out,
it probably be called simple Man jiu Jitsu or Simple
Man Martial Arts. Okay, so the rebrand So obviously B
Team new Aves were the names of the teams when the.

Speaker 5 (03:02:03):
Beef was real. So if you want to see it
play out.

Speaker 4 (03:02:09):
It sounds like the balls Quintet thing that you did
through the team really had a very strong impact on you.
It sounds like that's what inspired this whole U.

Speaker 16 (03:02:19):
Oh yeah, I mean I've done quints Out before, and
quints Out would do super teams kind of respect to
Tenth Planet. Ten Planet would participate and they would have
their own team, and they always used to say it.

Speaker 5 (03:02:30):
Should be real teams.

Speaker 16 (03:02:32):
Eddie Brother never took that idea, and Rama it I
stole that idea they were preaching to the choiet. I
thought the idea of real team versus real team is
the most exciting, right, Like, if you do super teams,
you're going to have some DuPont like character come in
and just build the best team possible. So like the
idea of it being real teams as this sort of
fairness factor to her, and.

Speaker 5 (03:02:53):
I think at the end of the day, people want
to see fair competition.

Speaker 16 (03:02:56):
There will be mismatches because of the weight discrepancies, because
we're gonna have a sixty seven eighty eight under ninety
nine over ninety nine. So basically your ADCC weight division
representatives from your team are going to go to war
with another team.

Speaker 4 (03:03:11):
I love it. I think it's something. I think it's
going to be. I actually think the action will be
better this time. No, it's gonna be hard to reproduce
what ro Tolo and Taka did last time. That's pretty
special glamning in the bottle. But to the point you raised,
the format lends itself to a little craziness.

Speaker 16 (03:03:28):
It feels like, yes, and there's obviously Vince mcma being
a personal inspiration to me. We are stealing the Royal
Rumble format, and that.

Speaker 1 (03:03:35):
Is to explain that. I mean, I know what Royal
Rumber is, but how are you implementing it?

Speaker 16 (03:03:38):
So what Quintet would do, And again I think Quintette
did a fantastic job. I just wanted to alter it slightly,
but I still want to give props to Quintet. So
we are this is in my opinion an incarnation of
Quintet right, So like unlike other organizations that think ideas
fall out of the sky claim them as their own,
I give credit to Quintet for this. The way we're

(03:04:00):
changing it is Quintet, you would know the five man
lineup basically immediately and you couldn't change that order.

Speaker 5 (03:04:07):
What we're going to have is the coaches.

Speaker 16 (03:04:09):
So it could be Nicky Ryan and John danaher one
on each side. Nicky Ryan calls in his first guy reveal,
he comes out. Danna calls in his first guy, he
comes out. They fight it out, but the rest of
the team is backstate. So based on the result of
that match, and if it goes to a draw, they're

(03:04:29):
both eliminated. But let's say our guy, Nicky Ryan's guy
defeats John danaherst guy.

Speaker 5 (03:04:35):
John will have a time period to decide who.

Speaker 16 (03:04:38):
He wants new oh shit, and then we're going to
do a ten second time on the wall.

Speaker 5 (03:04:43):
It's going to be a massive reveal. So I think,
just like the excitement from.

Speaker 16 (03:04:49):
Coach perspective, crowd perspective is it's kind of like a
bit of a Pokemon battle meets will rumble here, but
I mean, it's going to be phenomenal to watch, Like
coaches have to make the decision on the spot. They're
gonna have to be like, who do I think can
beat this guy? Cooling Jeancla, you know what I mean.
So we're really going to see coaches at play, Whereas

(03:05:10):
generally most of the coaching he's done in the back.
The coach is going to have to really strategically think
about which of his guys can beat this next guy.
So I really love that aspect of it, and that
reveal aspect. That's what I'm most excited for.

Speaker 4 (03:05:23):
Prize money this time is a little bit different, right,
It's not one million to one guy one million to another.
It's a little bit more evenly distributed.

Speaker 5 (03:05:29):
That might have been unsustainable.

Speaker 1 (03:05:32):
But certainly certainly worked as a marketing gimmick.

Speaker 5 (03:05:36):
I can say that this time it'll be ten thousand
and two dollars to show up.

Speaker 16 (03:05:41):
We'll be just inflation adjusted, and the winning team will
take him a million. So each athlete will take on
two hundred thousand dollars each. But if you lose, you
still got the ten thousand and two.

Speaker 4 (03:05:52):
Right, right, Let's talk about some of your teams so
you mentioned New Wave is on there.

Speaker 5 (03:05:56):
Yeah, we got New Waves.

Speaker 1 (03:05:57):
Big Dan is on the New Wave team.

Speaker 16 (03:05:59):
Big Dan is on a New Wave team. I do
have a big Danna sincere apologia. I bullied him for
a long time after the team break up, and that's
just something that comes out of me from time to time.
We have put out difference to the side. Big Dan
will be in New Wave. Luke Griffiths, South Africa's greatest
ever grandpa will be in New Wave. Jean Carlo Badoni
two time eighty ccs he's in there. And Dorian Olivarez

(03:06:19):
used to train with us, one of the best sixty
six guys in the world, obviously joined the Dark Side.
I forgive you Dora and your dad and we will
have an announcement about their seventy seven Killer wild Card
coming soon.

Speaker 1 (03:06:30):
Did you try to get Gordon to compete? Did you
even like make an attempt?

Speaker 5 (03:06:35):
Given?

Speaker 16 (03:06:36):
I mean no, I didn't make an attempt. It's a
tough fune call to make, you know. It's a tough
one to that.

Speaker 1 (03:06:41):
But you worked it up with John deanaher.

Speaker 4 (03:06:42):
I saw the Instagram photos and whatnot, because they seemed
to be level headed about it.

Speaker 16 (03:06:46):
Yeah, and I think that's the key factor there is
that John Danaher is at the end of the dad
level headed individual and John really cares about the sport
of jiu jitsu as well and where it goes.

Speaker 5 (03:06:57):
And I think I know John's loves Japan loves Japanese.
MMn right, so.

Speaker 1 (03:07:02):
He won't stop using the language.

Speaker 5 (03:07:04):
Yeah, he's still he still the language.

Speaker 16 (03:07:06):
So basically for him to get him involved, we really
have to put some differences aside. But really he sees
the great ignity event Gordon.

Speaker 5 (03:07:14):
I don't think we compete. I think he's health issue.
I think truly he's done this.

Speaker 1 (03:07:18):
Time, like no matter what, like no event, no organization,
no nothing. He's cooked.

Speaker 5 (03:07:23):
I mean for enough money, for sure, someone could learn
back in. But I think generally speaking, yeah, he's uh,
he's out now.

Speaker 16 (03:07:29):
So like I don't even entertain the conversation that John
told me the same thing that yeah he Jones told
me a few times he's not coming back, but he
comes back.

Speaker 5 (03:07:37):
But this time I do believe that Gordon's out.

Speaker 1 (03:07:39):
Okay.

Speaker 4 (03:07:40):
One of the interesting teams that you have, and the
reason why I say this is because some of these
guys were competing at ADCC last time when you couldn't
get them. Michael Pixley out of Daisy Fresh very excited
about him. He obviously had a very important submission to ADCC.
I'm sure, Yeah, I saw that you that made you
quite happy last time around.

Speaker 16 (03:07:57):
Yeah, And I need to explain this right because this
was actually point in the conversation with Dana, right, Mary Gary.
He does play a character for the media, you know,
like and before the match, obviously he's going full Rio style,
blonde platinum hair, He's posting how he's already won.

Speaker 5 (03:08:12):
He's like, he's talking to.

Speaker 1 (03:08:13):
Talk, He's like Elliott yeah yeah.

Speaker 16 (03:08:16):
But ultimately like and again he lost. I believe it
it was the first or second round. I can't remember.

Speaker 1 (03:08:23):
I think it was second. I don't think he won
first pick.

Speaker 5 (03:08:25):
Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 16 (03:08:26):
Actually, Pixley is an incredible wrestler, and Pixley has an
incredible hit toss whizar kick, And sometimes us scrapplers think
we're better wrestlers than we are because we're wrestling with
other jiu jitsu guys. And then Pixie comes across with
his elite level wrestling and he hits it on Merygali

(03:08:46):
once and then on the second time he hits at
Mary Gally makes that fatal mistake, and it's just it's
an instinctive thing. If your heads go on towards the ground,
you post and it injured his shoulder another time.

Speaker 5 (03:08:55):
I didn't know how.

Speaker 16 (03:08:56):
Serious that injury was, so I did enjoy it, not
from a personal level, but because of what he'd been posting,
you know what I mean, Like it is fun to
see someone talk so much and then full shot.

Speaker 1 (03:09:08):
Oh yeah, part of combat sports fandom.

Speaker 16 (03:09:11):
Yeah, it is bad of it. But I do have
Americ galli apolics because I do feel bad because I
think he's had three surgeries on that should catastroph yeah,
really catastrophic injury. So like, although in the heat of
the moment that was funny, in the big picture type
of thing, it's like it is a huge loss of
the sports to not have him competing. Even though he
does this thing that causes sort of like a lot
of negative energy towards him, it does put pressure on

(03:09:33):
him to have to perform, And I do feel bad.
I'm not I don't feel bad he lost. I feel
bad that he got hurt and that.

Speaker 1 (03:09:40):
You dunked on him, like prime Shack.

Speaker 16 (03:09:43):
Yeah, I was watching from the I think it was
setting up CJAR and so I was watching on the
TV screen there, and at the time I did think
it was very funny, just because it was a big
win for US as an organization.

Speaker 5 (03:09:52):
If like one of their stars lose, especially a.

Speaker 16 (03:09:54):
Guy that was like kind of annoying on social media.
But yeah, I don't know Mark Gally. I hope he
does a problem with me. I'll show he was up.

Speaker 1 (03:10:02):
I've had shoulder surgery. Fucking blows. So I love Pixley.

Speaker 4 (03:10:07):
Everyone thinks you have to get the D one wrestlers,
but I've always said this, you get some scrappy D
two guys. That's great for the sport too. There's plenty
of talent there that can contribute in really important ways.

Speaker 1 (03:10:17):
He's one of those guys.

Speaker 5 (03:10:18):
And wasn't even D one and look at the damage.

Speaker 1 (03:10:20):
He exactly exactly.

Speaker 4 (03:10:21):
So okay, So we got beat Team New Wave, Daisy Fresh,
Tenth Planet has a team, right, Planet has a team,
was on tenth, So I'm guessing Gio Martinez is on
that right.

Speaker 5 (03:10:29):
Geo PJJ one of the best grappers in the world today.

Speaker 16 (03:10:35):
We've got Ryan Akin, We've got Kyle BAM and I
feel so bad. I think I'm forgetting one name, but
it's a stacked it is a and Alan Sanchez's okay.
So they do have a very strong team and they
didn't utilize any of the wild cards. We gave teams
a wild card basically because it is hot to feel

(03:10:55):
five white visions from your own team, and some of
the guys that represent smaller teams might not have found
a position right, like their team didn't have enough people
to fill the spot. But we still wanted in the event,
and we like the idea of a wild card. So
it's still predominantly your team, but you have that wild
card option where it's like, oh, we don't have a
sixty six er, we'll call this guy in.

Speaker 5 (03:11:17):
And that's what I mean.

Speaker 16 (03:11:18):
We BETEAM did that. We brought in Victor Hugo. So
we've got Ethan Crevenstein, Joseph Chan, Joseph one of the
best I think is the best athlete out there today.
In terms of a technical sense, we have my memories,
Chris Wergic, we have Nicki Rod and we have Victor Hugo.
And Victor Hugo it's great that him and Nicki areight

(03:11:38):
to come together because Nicki Rod has lost to him
four times. Unfortunately that his victor ego has proven to
be his krypton had unfortunately, but they put there they
don't really have any differences. But obviously it's like Nicky Rod,
it's gonna be hard to have another match agains victor
after they trained together for this event, you know. So
that's Nicki Rod props in with his ego aside, brought

(03:11:58):
in the guy that beat him and gets the up
with him all the time.

Speaker 4 (03:12:00):
Now, Yeah, incredible. Who else are the teams that I'm missing?
There's a is there an Australian team as well, like
a super team?

Speaker 16 (03:12:06):
Yeah, we got an Australian team. Loclan Giles is heading
that up. We got man, you're testing my memory hit.

Speaker 5 (03:12:11):
Today's a lot of teams we got. That was a
bit of a wild card draw there.

Speaker 16 (03:12:16):
He's like kind of an unknown but really really talented
me but lock and Giles telling me before the trials
that he thought Butla would secure one of the spots
in the team. I didn't know who Blaw was, but yeah,
he proved very dangerous. They've got Deckl and Moody. Unfortunately,
Levi I had to pull out maybe as a back
in Joy.

Speaker 1 (03:12:31):
He was so fucking awesome last year or two. What
a revolution he was.

Speaker 16 (03:12:35):
Yeah, I'm super disappointed. I always feel like Lee was
on the cusp, like he in the Gee. He was
about to do what no Ozzie had ever done, and
I believe at the time and that was when a
black belt world title in the Gee, everyone thought that
was impossible. And he he beat Lucas lepri and he
got double DQ and he disappeared for a while after
the World Championships, and then obviously he had his CGI
performance is an incredible run, and then he sort of

(03:12:58):
disappeared again a little bit, you know, like he's obviously
dealing with some injuries and stuff. So it's sad we
lost him, but we've got Ken te Iwamoto replacing him,
who's a guy that's trained to beat him. The Lord
trains a lot with Joseph Chan. We've got Lucas Cannard,
and Lucas is the Ossie kid that upset Victor Hugo.
So Victor was like probably the betting favorite for Cji
I one in the heavyweight division. Basically it was it

(03:13:19):
was going to be Victor and Nicky run the finals,
Lucas comes out as an unknown way under size and
I think he was the last guy. We selected him
the sixteen man. We stole him from ADCC at the
last second. Actually my brother at the time was saying, no,
there's this Aussie guy that's really good. So we put
Lucas Cannard in and he beats Victor Hugo first round
and that was just like that. One of the submission
of the tournament was just absolutely blown away. And then

(03:13:42):
at sixty six killers, who is it in Team Australia.
They're going to crucify me for this.

Speaker 1 (03:13:47):
Wow, what a fucking trader you are.

Speaker 16 (03:13:49):
Yeah, they won't working me back now sixty six who
is it?

Speaker 5 (03:13:54):
I can't remember?

Speaker 4 (03:13:55):
That's all right, Well, we'll share links and people can
check it on the the around.

Speaker 1 (03:13:59):
There's two more things I want to get to.

Speaker 4 (03:14:01):
One the women's side actually has a bit of a
bracket this time with some big names on. There are
some ADCC champions on there from actually Adele won. She's Australian,
she won ADECC last year. She's a name could be
at CGI.

Speaker 1 (03:14:12):
This time she came out of nowhere.

Speaker 16 (03:14:14):
She came out of nowhere really like obviously a lot
of people in the Australian see knew how good she was,
but she just came out of nowhere and double gold
and it's like first ADCC double Golds. Then we have
Anna Vieira Ana Vieira one ADCC in her weeight division
and she beat the third contestant we have in there,
and that is Helena Craber. And Helena is like the

(03:14:36):
new Wave new Wave child prodigy. And that props to
John on this because like when I was talking to
John about being like, yo, can we please have a
team new Wave, like this wouldn't be right without a
team new Wave, Like it's like we missed out on
you guys for c J one. You guys stuck the
course of ADCC loyal to ADCC. I'm like, we need
you for c j I two, And he was was

(03:14:57):
a bit hesitant, but one of the things he did
say is like we I really want a spot for Helena,
and I was going to.

Speaker 5 (03:15:03):
Make sure we had something for her.

Speaker 16 (03:15:05):
And then we were able to find max out the
credit card and get the one hundred k WHI would
be the largest women's prize pool in the history of grappling.

Speaker 1 (03:15:13):
Wow. If memory serves.

Speaker 4 (03:15:15):
Did theon Davies like y'all have a falling out or
something like that.

Speaker 5 (03:15:20):
Uh, it gets it. It has its ups and downs.

Speaker 4 (03:15:23):
You know what I mean? Yeah, Like, I know she
got some I don't know Gordon doesn't like her. I
didn't know how that pertained to you.

Speaker 5 (03:15:28):
That's actually probably an endearing quality in it.

Speaker 16 (03:15:31):
If Gordon doesn't like that, that's a great review of
you as a.

Speaker 5 (03:15:35):
Human being, I think.

Speaker 16 (03:15:36):
But yeah, I love the Filon's awesome films paved the
way in the sport as like a role model for
so many women in the sport, and she was one
of the first people to come across for CG at once,
so like love her for that. She donated a huge
portion of her prize money to a charity group in
Gaza for kids. So that props to her for giving

(03:15:57):
away so much.

Speaker 5 (03:15:57):
Money on that.

Speaker 16 (03:15:58):
I worked so, so so hard to get McKenzie Dorn.
McKenzie was obviously hesitanting because it's like she's been out
of the game so long. You know, she's been in
an MMA, and MMA is a vastly different thing. Like
we see submissions in MMA, but like Filon's just training grapping.

Speaker 5 (03:16:15):
It's so hard.

Speaker 16 (03:16:16):
Mackenzie was the best girl at the time in her
weight division back in twenty fifteen when she won ADCC.
So like, I know, even from my own personal experience,
like to face the next up and comer after being
away that long is a tool order.

Speaker 5 (03:16:31):
But we're able to.

Speaker 16 (03:16:31):
Secure McKenzie Dern and I wanted to show how exciting
femal grapping could be. And that was one of the
big peaks on the broadcast And kind of like the
falling out was me just being like a bit disappointed
that she did sign a deal with UFC. She said
that she was allowed to do CGI. They had a
CGI clause in there. I haven't seen the contract, I
don't know, but based on my dealings with them, their athletes.

Speaker 5 (03:16:55):
Won't be able to do CJI.

Speaker 16 (03:16:57):
So like I kind of like I might have said
in it more of an emotional moment that I was
just like, oh, well, you support and other women, other
women athletes had company and said, well, now if I
have to face Fiel and I kind of have to
sign an exclusive deal with the UFC. And if you're
from a pure athletic perspective, if you want to face

(03:17:18):
the best, but you have to accept the contract, you're
not happy with the facer. I'm like, well, that puts
all the other women in a bit of an awkward spot. So,
like I had said some things about, obviously if you
were four the sport for women in the sport, you
wouldn't be locked down to an exclusive contract. But on
the other side, I have to remember that, like, she's
got to take care of herself. She got to take
care of making money for herself. So really no skin

(03:17:42):
off her back for doing that. At the time, we
hadn't exclusively locked down the four women CGI division, so
in retrospective, I could do it again.

Speaker 5 (03:17:52):
But obviously there's so many things happen on the fly.

Speaker 16 (03:17:54):
We're trying to organize, so many things, talking all these
scrappers like herding cats, you know. So it's like at
the time when I the UFC was entering the market,
we started getting our contracts out early for these teams
and these athletes because it was one of those things
where it's like, if they're locked in for August, they
now have to if they sign exclusive contract, there has
to be an exemption because they've already got a contractually

(03:18:15):
obligated obligation to perform at our event, So we were
trying to get ahead of these exclusive contracts, and at
the time, we hadn't locked down the women's prize money,
we hadn't locked down the women's division, so I couldn't
offer anything tangible to Fion at the time to get
her to sign. So it was a gray area. It
was a disagreement, but I love him fair enough.

Speaker 4 (03:18:36):
Before we wrapped the super fight last year was Gabby Garcia,
which was hilarious. This one is equally not equally, but
I would say also there's a lot of lighthearted vibe
to it.

Speaker 1 (03:18:47):
You versus Olympic champ into DOAA champ. Gable Steveson. Was
it hard to convince him to do it?

Speaker 5 (03:18:55):
You know what? I said this before we got him
at a vulnerable moment.

Speaker 16 (03:18:58):
Obviously he's coming off a loss and I do my
best work when I noticed someone did a Vulnable moment,
so that definitely helped us something.

Speaker 5 (03:19:04):
He goes out on the table, But yeah, Gable, Gable
was down, Gable was down to do is down to
how fine? I believe he's yeah, sorry about that. It's
ue ice. It is called to get me.

Speaker 16 (03:19:14):
Gable is down, He's down to go there have a scrap,
you know, Like obviously, I hope he doesn't break my
spine and leaf permanent injury.

Speaker 5 (03:19:21):
That's what I'm hoping for. But yeah, it's gonna be
a fun one.

Speaker 16 (03:19:24):
I do onetend to kiss him as a face off
as well.

Speaker 4 (03:19:28):
The rule set is what is the rule set for
the super fight, the same as any of the other matches.

Speaker 16 (03:19:33):
The quintet matches will just be eight minutes. Last year,
in the tournament style, we did three by fives and
five by fives for the final. This one will be
three five minute round scored just like a regular CG
match at Okay, so I'm trying to go Helio Gracie
style when he faced the massive judo dude and got
his time broke.

Speaker 5 (03:19:53):
And hopefully it's yeah, hopefully to roll abstle here some evening.

Speaker 4 (03:19:58):
If I may before You know, I greatly respect you,
but I have to ask this. Gable does have a
weird relationship with the fans, stemming from a twenty nineteen arrest.
Now ultimately the charges were dropped as a sexual assault charge.
I could be wrong about the actual terminologist, to please
forgive me. Some folks are wondering why you're doing business
with him, to which you would say.

Speaker 16 (03:20:18):
I mean, I to be honest, I did not know
about that until after the match, and I haven't discussed
that within once the contract was signed.

Speaker 5 (03:20:27):
You know, I really don't know enough about it.

Speaker 1 (03:20:29):
Actually.

Speaker 4 (03:20:30):
The only reason I heard about it is because I
heard he had, Like I so, he had the thing
with pro wrestling went poorly, and someone told me, I
forget how long ago it was.

Speaker 1 (03:20:39):
They're like, oh, the fans turned on him, and.

Speaker 4 (03:20:41):
I was like, well why, And then they sent me
some of the news articles about it, and I guess
it has something to do with the law that was
passed at the time that allowed him and this other
guy to kind of skatee. But it didn't necessarily exonerate them.
I mean it did in the legal sense, but not
in the public perception sense.

Speaker 16 (03:20:58):
Yeah, it'sbviously it's difficult. We had the nothing on that scale.
Obviously we had to navigate the Jay Rudd situation the gym,
which are very difficult with being Nicky Rod's brother, we
had some problems there.

Speaker 5 (03:21:09):
But yeah, like it is, it's a difficult area to
work through.

Speaker 1 (03:21:14):
Understand.

Speaker 5 (03:21:14):
Like, it's like if we were to find individuals in
the sport.

Speaker 16 (03:21:18):
Without skeletons in the closet, we probably have no event unfortunately,
you know. And there has been some pushback in a
couple of one athlete particular that I allowed to compete
in this event. But yeah, we did do the deal
with Gable, so I have to take all the heat
for that. But like for the most part, like the teams,
I'm just like I'm trying to distance myself from that
side of things by being like I picked the coach

(03:21:39):
the coach pixy athletes, you know. But yeah, that is
I think that's a difficult thing for in all of
combat sports, you know what I mean, should try to
navigate it in people's what's happened in the past, you know, Like.

Speaker 1 (03:21:48):
It's no, it's a challenge for every single promoter in
the sport. I mean, it's what do you do? Can
you have a puritanical version of promoting? I don't. I
don't think that you can. But where do you draw
the line?

Speaker 5 (03:21:58):
It's not really yeah, yeah, I mean that's the difficult thing. Right.

Speaker 16 (03:22:01):
Obviously my name's on the event, but yeah, there's like
a lot of people going into it, so it's take
like it's it's hard to find opponents that'll all viewers in,
you know, like, I'll have to look more into the
gable thing.

Speaker 5 (03:22:13):
But yeahs far like from a person to burden. It
sounds like a cop out.

Speaker 16 (03:22:17):
But he seemed like a lovely guy, so I'm not
exactly sure the details.

Speaker 5 (03:22:22):
Someone actually happened.

Speaker 1 (03:22:23):
Tickets for CJI, how do folks get them?

Speaker 16 (03:22:26):
I don't know the exact link, but if you go
to Google and you go CJI two tickets, there'll be
two links. We actually had a few ticketing issues. So
if you're international, try to find the international site. If
you're a US based, find the domestic sign. But if
you use the team code words of the athletes, obviously
they're great. They're great marketers, these athletes, they're sharing them
every day. Have faith in them, no doubt. But you're

(03:22:47):
get a ten percent discount if you use the athletes code.

Speaker 4 (03:22:50):
Well, it look the same this time as it looked
because the same venue Thomas and Max Center. Is it
going to put any difference in production this time?

Speaker 16 (03:22:57):
I mean it's gonna look the same, it's gonna have
the same alley. Obviously, we have that war rumble factor.
So we're right now we're going to do our final
walk through end of July, and we're going to just brainstorm.

Speaker 5 (03:23:06):
Because obviously we have to deal with copyright music.

Speaker 16 (03:23:08):
I wish we could have some John Sena ship playing
as people they do the reveal, so we have to
sort of navigate how we're going to do those reveals.

Speaker 5 (03:23:16):
You know, who knows what my walking will be. I
haven't picked a song yet.

Speaker 16 (03:23:20):
I'm hoping that they can drop me from the sky
to appear behind Gable and get a head start. But yeah,
we're going to have some fun with the production. We're
putting a lot of effort into the creative aspect of
the production. They don't want it to be a boring
runn of the mil cookie Cutter event.

Speaker 4 (03:23:33):
Right and the last but not least. If folks just
want to get involved, learn more about the Good Fight Foundation,
where can you send them all?

Speaker 5 (03:23:40):
Right?

Speaker 16 (03:23:40):
Yeah, I mean if you look up Fair Five Foundation,
you see our website, you see sort of the things
we're involved in. Right now, we're really largely working with
Guardian program. So if you want to support Guardian, they
take donations. If you want to donate your time, if
you're a jiu jitsu athlete or whatever, yourself you can
go visit these schools and like, yeah, that's for me.
It's for the most fulfilling work I've found is like

(03:24:02):
you can have a tangible change on these kids' lives.
So for CGI won a lot of money was donated
to things like tap Cancer Out, which is obviously cancer research.

Speaker 5 (03:24:11):
We donate money to a Ukrainian children's hospital.

Speaker 16 (03:24:13):
But in terms of like changing the sport of jiu jitsu,
building schools for kids around the world is something amazing
because we can it's something tangible for people to see
get behind, you know what I mean. Like unfortunately, like
people just think, oh, donate to cancer researcher, dropping the bucket.
But in terms of me building these schools, Me and
South building these schools for kids around the world, we

(03:24:34):
get to go there, we get to meet the kids,
we get to.

Speaker 5 (03:24:36):
See how the school is helping them.

Speaker 16 (03:24:38):
So it's something tangible we get to kind of work
with and really like it's quite fulfilling to see the kids'
lives down track.

Speaker 1 (03:24:44):
For Brico Andres under sixty six Team Australia.

Speaker 5 (03:24:47):
That's it.

Speaker 16 (03:24:48):
That's the wildcast. Why I forgot for Resa is probably
my favorite. He honestly is play my favorite athlete in
the entire sport. It's one of the most exciting. He
has this little kagi thing he does before the matches
and in terms of a danger at sixty six, beaten.

Speaker 5 (03:25:00):
Young Carlo and that is as peak of wild good.

Speaker 4 (03:25:04):
If you can get Creig Jones, it is quite the
heavy lift you're undertaking. I think you No, I couldn't
imagine a better person to do it. Jiu Jitsu is
lucky to have you don't fucking die on America's roads
going place to place.

Speaker 1 (03:25:17):
But I.

Speaker 4 (03:25:19):
Won't tell us, but good luck with it. And think
I know this has been an awkward setup. Thank you
for making some time and talking to us.

Speaker 16 (03:25:27):
And all right, well now I got a roommate.

Speaker 4 (03:25:32):
All right, Well, I appreciate everyone tuning in. Craig Jones,
thanks to all you who watched and stuck around. I
know it was an unusual episode today, but we appreciate it.
Until next time, may all of your gains be loyal

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