The Black Phone (2021): Straitjacket Talk

We dive into The Black Phone (2021) — our spoiler-friendly review & analysis of Scott Derrickson’s Blumhouse hit starring Ethan Hawke as “The Grabber.” From the creepy mask design and ghost-child mythology to Joe Hill’s short story roots (20th Century Ghosts), we cover scares, themes (cycle of abuse, sibling dynamic, 1970s true-crime vibes), box-office surprise ($161M), and whether this villain is a NEW horror icon — plus sequel talk, ending explained, best kills, and where it ranks among modern horror. If you love sinister small-town vibes, tense basement escapes, and mask-iconography lore, this is for you.

Your hosts- Kevin, Nathan, and Gill

Produced by Nathan

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“Dismember” Theme Music by Nathan

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
Hello. Don't do the podcast, Jill.
Why? It's what he wants.
It's a trap, Jill. Oh no, he.
Wants to play naughty boy? Oh, there we go.

(00:32):
Hey everyone, welcome to Straitjacket Talk, where it's
two guys, a girl, and a horror show.
My name is Kevin and I'm joined by a guy who loves to sit around
shirtless while wearing a mask. It's Nathan.
Yep, I'm gonna belt you. I haven't been a naughty boy.
That's a lie. I'm also joined by a girl.

(00:53):
I'm also joined by a girl who dreams of ghost children.
It's Jill. God, I wish it would stop.
Help me. That seems unpleasant, not nice.
Strange. Yikes.
Hopefully we can help you through your dreams so they
don't turn into nightmares. We watched the Black Phone from
2021. It was directed by Scott

(01:14):
Derrickson. Written by Scott Derrickson and
C Robert Cargill, They were the team that brought us Sinister.
I don't know if you guys remember that movie at all.
I. Haven't seen it.
Oh, I like. It.
Me too. It's so good.
You got to watch it, Nathan. I will at some point.
This is based on the short storyThe Black Phone, which is a part

(01:35):
of the book 20th Century Ghost by Joe Hill.
One of my favorite authors. Actually.
Probably my favorite author. Ironically, it's the only book
of his I haven't read. Oh, really?
OK, yeah. Been meaning to read this one
for a while because I saw the movie back when it was in
theaters. I was like, wow, Joe Hill wrote
this? I didn't realize that, but never

(01:56):
got around to reading it. The Black Phone had a budget of
16 to $18 million. Do you know how much you made at
the box office? I don't know what what your
2021. So this was kind of still a
COVID movie, wasn't it? Yeah, in a way.
So I would suggest that possiblyit made most of its money on

(02:16):
streaming and that it probably made $10 million at the box
office. I do see that logic, but I feel
like this one did really well. I, I feel like it was very
mainstream. Like a lot of people talk about
it and there's a lot of buzz about the sequel coming out.
So I'm going to say 100 million.I don't fucking know.

(02:39):
Jill's the closest. It made $161.4 million.
God damn. OK.
Yeah, there's a there's a reasonwhy this got a sequel.
Yeah, Yeah. That's really, really good for a
low budget. And this is a Blumhouse movie as
well. So they're pretty.
No. Yeah.

(03:00):
Making those low budgets go a long way.
People love them. Yeah, People go see them.
A lot of people go see them. You know what was?
We going to say Blumhouse these days doesn't have the best
reputation in my mind anyway. I mean, they play out some
bangers last year. Nice one was garbage but like

(03:22):
think of the bangers man, think of Megan.
Yeah, yeah, Megan was good. It does seem like Blumhouse has
like hit or miss horror movies alot of the time, but you can't
argue with them in their financials and what they do with
these. Movies and properties,
definitely. Not the letterbox rating is a
3.3 out of five and currently itsits at an 81% on the

(03:44):
thermometer, which means it's certified fresh.
But what did we think of this movie?
Before we go any further, if youcould please hit the like and
subscribe buttons and also hit the notification bell because
when we have a new video, you'llbe the first to know.
Isn't that right, Nathan? Yes, it's a privilege.
Yeah, don't let Nathan take the belt out on you.

(04:05):
Go subscribe. They might like we Kind of the
reason why I wanted to do The Black Phone and have thought
about reviewing The Black Phone for a while is when I first saw
this in theaters, it was kind ofa surprise to me and how I
actually liked the movie becausethis isn't the sort of horror

(04:26):
movie that really appeals to me.A kind of ghost children angle.
I found myself pleasantly surprised and I really enjoyed
it in the theater. It was like one of those things
where I thought a lot about the movie afterwards and maybe where
they could go with this movie too, and franchise ideas and

(04:46):
things. It kind of got me excited
really. The other thing too is, and I
know this was a short story written by Joe Hill, who is
Stephen King's son, but you feela lot of Stephen King in this
movie. Yeah, for sure.
And for me though, it's like kind of the best parts of
Stephen King movies because the issue I always have with Stephen

(05:09):
King movies is it's like a lot of exposition, a lot of setting
up the town or a lot of setting up the people within the town.
And this was kind of like, I felt like it, it did a lot of
that, but in a short period of time, it like condensed it all.
It was actually a pretty good movie going experience.
And so I want to talk to everyone about it, especially

(05:33):
because the sequel is coming outsoon.
So before it comes out, I want to get everyone's thoughts.
Nathan, is this your first time seeing The Black Phone?
Yeah, I watched it for the firsttime earlier today, actually,
which I don't like doing. I just couldn't find the time.
I usually like to sit with a movie longer than that, but
that's all right. I thought this was pretty good.

(05:55):
I enjoy its simplicity, that it's basically a ghost story.
It's got some themes of child abuse and stuff like that, but
it doesn't feel the need to explain itself too much or do
things to make the story convoluted.
It's just a boy in a basement being held by a madman, and

(06:16):
there's some ghost children who were killed by that madman
trying to help him out of the situation.
If you dig under the surface, there's themes there, but the
story itself, that's all it is. I really like that, Jill, what
do you think? So this is my I think second
time watching the black phone. I can't remember when the first

(06:38):
time was when I watched it. I remember having like a
pleasant time watching it. Like I thought it was cool at
the time, but I couldn't really recall what happened for some
reason. So when I was watching it I was
like, I just remember the phone being a thing and people being
captive being a thing. But I kind of forgot like a lot
of the main beats to it. But for the movie itself, I

(06:59):
think it being based on a short story.
This is like my little bit of criticism on the movie.
I feel like short story length should kind of stay short story
length instead of a feature film.
I watch a lot of Creep Show, that's Stephen King right there,
and I feel like this would be, and Joe Hill does a lot of work
with Creep Show as well. So I really think this would be

(07:21):
a good Creepshow episode or segment.
But an hour and 43 minutes, I don't know.
I didn't get bored at all, but Iwas kind of feeling the
simplicity of it. I was like, I really wish there
were more to this than the simple story that it is because
I just kind of want more out of it.
That's really my only critique. Well, except for Mason Thames,

(07:44):
who plays Finney. I thought he was kind of boring
because his sister Gwen, played by Madeleine McGraw.
I thought she outshined him and.Trust me, he could get the shit
out of either of you blindfolded.
I don't even know if it was justyeah, the acting or her
character like how it was written.
But yeah, it's rough when the kind of side character

(08:05):
outperforms the main character and you, you care about them
more. So that's my other little
critique. Yeah, it's especially rough
since that little Side Story with the sister having the
dreams and all that sort of feltsuperfluous as well.
Yeah. But I think it would have worked
really well in like a shorter segment.
But apart from that, I think thevillain of the Grabber is a

(08:29):
great villain because it's so real.
Like, I don't know, growing up, there is a guy in my hometown
who also abducted kids, like actually.
And so it was like some thing that like I grew up being very
afraid of, like, don't walk at, don't walk home at night alone,
especially as a young girl because this guy could pick you
up. So I really felt that fear.

(08:50):
I think it's very real. And I liked that in this small
town, he recognizes the kids whowent missing from just like
hearing their story and like hearing their voices and stuff.
I like the black phone as sort of like a symbol or motif in the
story. I thought it was very
interesting. I love that it's a Rotary black

(09:10):
and going back. Sorry to the grabber.
I think his character design, the mask is very cool and I'm
sure Kevin will have some stuff to say on that, but I just love
the mask. I love the way he looks, his
mannerisms. Ethan Hawke is amazing and he's
just like so creepy and just like weird, like but also

(09:33):
charming. I don't know, I I just really
love him. What did?
What did you think? What you said was something that
I really picked up on during this watch of The Black Phone,
where you're saying it's kind oflike simple and a a short story.
Maybe it should have been kind of a shorter movie or part of an
anthology. I really think they're smart

(09:53):
with this movie because this to me seems like like what Dan from
The Mouth of Madness says a lot.It's like setting the table.
It is a simple story, but there's a lot of meat on the
bone that they don't really evengo into like and especially with
the grabber, like we don't really know much about the
grabber and I think it was all done on purpose.

(10:14):
And I don't want to know more about him.
It it works for me that we don'tget back stories on stuff like
that. Yeah, for sure.
I think it makes it scarier. You know, it's like the reason
why Michael Myers is iconic too,from Halloween.
He's kind of a blank slate. That's why, like, I think this
hits for me a little and I'm really interested in seeing a

(10:34):
sequel because something I thought about before I even saw
the trailer for the sequel was maybe making this guy into, you
know, kind of a new horror icon.Like once he is dead, you can
set up like a Freddy Krueger type of story with him too.
He transcends into dreams. Maybe this is just the beginning

(10:57):
of his story. Like this is like the Freddy
Krueger story when he was burnedby by all the parents in town.
There's a story that we never really saw in a movie, just
explained in the first one. Yeah, yeah, I get.
What you're saying, I mean, that's what I'm hopeful of work.
Do I know what's going to happen?
I don't know, like maybe this isas good as it gets.
I do want to get everyone's thoughts because Jill had

(11:20):
started with the Grabber and I had talked about it.
Is the Grabber or could you see him becoming kind of a big
horror icon? I mean, the mask itself seems
pretty iconic, does it not? Nathan, what do you think?
Yeah, I mean, the mask is prettyiconic, but the character, to
me, one of the scariest things about him is that he was a

(11:40):
grounded villain, that he was just some guy that was running
around stealing children. He had no powers.
He wasn't a ghost. He was just some guy.
And to me, that makes it difficult to even imagine a
sequel at all. I haven't seen the trailer yet.
He's dead at the end of the movie and I don't know, I feel

(12:05):
like if you make him supernatural, it changes the
entire dynamic of the character.And it it's not what I found
scary about him in this movie, Iwould prefer that they didn't do
a sequel. To be perfectly honest with you,
I haven't seen the the trailer and I could be wrong.

(12:27):
Maybe it'll be great, I don't know.
At the end of this movie I was alittle confused because I didn't
really see Room for a sequel. Yeah, I have to agree with you,
Nathan, especially the last thing you said with not having
room for a sequel. I think especially with it being
going back to what I said earlier, such a short story,
it's hard to kind of expand on it and give it kind of more

(12:50):
background and keep it expandingwhen it's supposed to be
possibly this little standalone thing.
I think it's great on its own. I don't necessarily think it
needs to be expanded at all. And I'm kind of scared with it
being expanded because I feel like it could totally just go
like downhill, but I don't I, I don't know what they're doing.

(13:11):
Joe Joe downhill. I don't know what they're doing.
I'm definitely going to go see it just because I'm interested,
but I really hope that they don't go too far with it.
I love the Grabber. I don't want to see his
character kind of tarnished by extra stuff.
One of the things you said to Jill is about him being like,
charismatic. You don't have to be scared

(13:34):
because nothing bad. It's going to happen here.
I want to get into the time period, how it's set too,
because I think that's a key in this movie as well.
I think it kind of picks up on some of the serial killers that
were in the 70s, right? Like Dahmer and Gacy and things
like that where they were. Like Sam?

(13:55):
Yeah. And, and some of them were real
charismatic people, like in the communities and things like
that. And I think what's super scary
is the Grabber had like just a regular suburban type of house
too, you know, or two houses really that we come to find out
about. I guess to your point, Nathan is

(14:17):
what makes it scary because it is grounded in some sort of
reality with like serial killersand things like that.
It's it is based on real life events, is it not?
Yeah, that's, that's what I'm saying is like this guy was just
a guy, like he could live down the street from you for all you,
you know, he owns a van and a house.

(14:38):
Dude, he could have been in moreCognito mode than he was because
this man going around in this like wack ass van that has
abracadabra written on it, right?
Big ass like bunches of black balloons and his mask and like
his little magician like shtick.Like, how did this, these people

(14:58):
in this small town, like, not notice him 'cause that's, yeah,
what? Yeah, I mean, it didn't.
It didn't really look like the kind of small town that has a
lot of local color either, like some of the small towns around
me. It'd just be like, well anyway,
but. Yeah.

(15:20):
You know, you wouldn't necessarily think to connect him
to any, connect that to any crimes around me, to everybody.
It's like my town is local color, so you know.
I love him though. He's he is charismatic.
He is. Honestly, I think he's
attractive. I don't know if it's the mask, I
don't know if it's Ethan Hawke. I don't know what it is, but
even the scenes where I know I should be grossed out with like

(15:44):
what he's doing, I'm like he looks really good sitting in
that chair topless with the belt.
Edit this owl actually. Nope, I thought.
I mean, you've always been into monster fucking so you know.
Yeah, but. He's more like it's wrong.
Here this. Guy's like dad bod monster
crossover. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(16:06):
He's he's too sexy for what he should be.
I feel like those were some of the scariest parts because I
didn't know at first when he goes down there and he's like
being friendly to the Finley Finney and he's like, hey, I'm
not going to hurt you, blah, blah, blah.

(16:26):
What I said about snapping your neck.
I was angry so. Yeah, I don't trust you at all.
And then, yeah, when he leaves the door unlocked, that's when I
was like, uh oh, wait a minute here.
Yeah. And then the ghost kind of gives
him a. Was that the first?
That wasn't the first phone callhe.

(16:48):
Got right. No, no, the first phone call was
the the tiles. There's a third section of the
floor. In the hallway tiles.
Loose. He dug a hole under those tiles
well before that door got left unlocked.
Yeah, because then the ghost kind of is like, hey man, he
wants you to go up there. Do not go stairs.

(17:08):
And that's how like we or I got killed or beaten, right?
Like he got beaten. Up by the belt, it's part of the
routine. He waits for the child to try
and escape and then beats him with the belt and then moves on
to another phase that we thankfully never got to.
I was thankful for that, too, yeah.
I was thankful for the lack of like, explicit kind of violence.

(17:31):
Because it's I want to it's. Tough when it's children.
Yeah, it was bad enough during the scene where the dad is like,
you know, it's. Disturbing.
That might be the. Most on Gwen.
That might be the most disturbing scene.
In the movie, honestly, that washard to watch.
I wanted to ask because, you know, another thing I really
don't like is like children abductions and things that

(17:52):
happen to like younger children.This was very on the line for me
like because they do show some of these children who are like
tough and can fight back. And I was wondering if some of
these children the Grabber targeted specifically because we
have like the tough guy pinball kid.

(18:13):
And then we have Robin, who's like, you know, no nonsense
fucking, you know. Beats up the bullies.
Yeah, he's. Capable of beating up pretty
much everybody in the school, despite being like half the size
of that I was at that age and I wasn't big.
Right. Do you think like maybe there

(18:33):
was something behind that? Because here, here's where I'm
getting at. I picked up on things that maybe
the Grabber was also abused as achild.
He was in that room where he kept Finney and he talked about
hearing the phone and things like that.
And I was just wondering if somesome abusive stuff happened to

(18:55):
him. I mean, obviously he's not in
the right frame of mind, but I was thinking like if that's part
of like the fucked up game he wants to play is get these tough
guy kids and like really beat them down.
And he just happens to come across Finney, who's kind of
maybe like him because I think he does say, like, oh, you're

(19:15):
special or like, there's something like with you.
Finney's been abused by his father.
I don't know. Yeah, I mean, I think there is a
theme of sort of the cycle of abuse in here and it would make
sense that that that was what caused the psychosis for the
Grabber. Again, that's a left a mystery

(19:35):
though. We know nothing of the Grabber's
back story. I assume the second one will
probably flesh that out a littlebit.
We'll get to know a little bit more about the Grabber.
I kind of would rather leave it in the realm of between people.
Like what do you think is wrong with the guy?
Joe? What do you think on?
That do you think like he was targeting like tougher kids and
there is like an abusive kind ofthread with the Grabber himself?

(19:59):
Yeah, I think it's. Interesting as a question about
the Grabber targeting certain kids, I actually don't know.
One of the things I picked up onwas like sexual abuse, which I
don't think was like shown on screen.
I'm glad it wasn't, but I reallythink that was.
Kind of implied with some of thethings that were happening,

(20:21):
right. I don't know if he was targeting
them for like, you know, being attracted to them or whatever,
which is disgusting, but so maybe that's it or maybe it's
just like convenience for him. I don't know.
As for the grabber himself, I definitely think he was, you
know, a victim of abuse as well.Maybe that caused his psychosis,

(20:41):
maybe not, who knows, But I definitely see that with him
like referencing hearing the phone before when he was younger
and stuff. So it feels like he was also
kind of in a similar place. But also he gives like kind of
Michael Jackson vibes, you know what I mean?
Like he kind of acts like a child.
That was really. Starting to like you, Finney, a

(21:04):
little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I.
Really do think he's a victim ofabuse.
And I also think there's like a lot of parallels.
Maybe he's a foil to Finney's dad as well, because they're
very similar in. Yeah, yeah.
I was. Thinking to diving in a little
bit deeper, it seemed like the Grabber had multiple

(21:24):
personalities. You could maybe pick him out
with the different masks he worea little bit too.
Because there were How many different masks did he wear?
At least three I counted. Three.
Like there's the one without a mouth at all, the smiling one,
and then the frowning one. Right?
The reveal of the frowning one caught me by surprise.

(21:46):
It was almost like a jump scare and it was like.
Whoa, that's. Not the mask you were wearing.
And and it's scary. Something about it a little
sexy. Creeped.
Me out you. Know.
Yeah, I love their own. I love all the masks.
I really do. They were created by Tom Savini,
which is awesome, in conjunctionwith Jason Baker.

(22:07):
Famously, he does all the masks for Bray Wyatt, The Fiend, and
specifically he did one for BrayWyatt when he came back in 2022
at Extreme Rules that looks verysimilar to The Grabber, which I
thought was cool. Kind of a nod to that.
I really love the masks and maybe how they portrayed his

(22:29):
different personalities a littlebit.
And he freaks out when he gets his mask taken off, doesn't he?
Yeah, he does. At the very end there, when he's
stuck in that hole, he freaks out and it sort of allows Finney
to get the upper hand on him andstart to choke out with the
phone cord. He doesn't want his face seen
for some reason. It's very kind of like.

(22:51):
Covered though, it's not we never ever see his like full
face, right? Even when he has the balloons
and stuff he has like the big glasses.
I mean, it's never just almost from.
Behind to Yeah, that seemed there, by the way.
It was terrifying. That was one of the more
terrifying scenes in the movie. It was just like you knew it was

(23:12):
coming because he'd seen the vanover and over again, but but it
just it faded the black every time before actually showing the
abduction was like. Yeah, dude, I thought, I thought
that was really cool. Like how you said like the first
couple of times you see the van,like when Bruce is riding his

(23:32):
bike, you see it in the distanceand you have that fade out
scene. Same with Robin, like you see it
in the distance and it's like leading us up to Finney's
eventual abduction. But I thought that's all Eerie's
stuff. And just the word of mouth stuff
too, like the kids all talking about the Grabber when they're

(23:53):
coming up with. Folklore about it you don't
actually believe. That story, do you?
No. Because he can't hear.
You he doesn't really take kids that say you can't say his.
Name or else that's when he getsyou.
I I love that type of shit and Ilove that it sort of subverted
my expectations by not being that at all.
That was just things kids were coming up with, Jill, you had

(24:16):
said. You had like a like a similar
maybe thing in your town with like somebody grabbing kids.
Was that like a similar thing though, where like kids were
making up these stories possibly?
But also, parents were like, really afraid, so they would,
you know, try to tell their kidsto, like, watch out and stuff.

(24:36):
So it kind of like prolonged that fear.
But yeah, I really like that. But the other thing, I was just
thinking on one side, you have astory where you have, like, this
guy who's going around abductingchildren.
But I was just thinking back to what I just said about he's kind
of similar to the dad. And bear with me, I'm going down
a rabbit hole. But what if, let's go, what if,

(24:59):
what if the grabber is like not actually real?
This is really stupid, but just bear with me.
And he's just, you know, a representation of abusive
parents. And you know, and maybe all
these kids like got into like horrible situations with their
parents and I don't know, possibly, but I I do like it as

(25:20):
what it is the the simple story of this guy going around
abducting kids. I think the grabber.
Is a symbol in that way I I agree with you.
I just disagree with the idea that he isn't real.
I think it can be. I think it can be both that he
is symbolic and that theme is about child abuse and and the
cycle of abuse. But the Grabber actually exists

(25:44):
within the universe, and my personal opinion so as it
should. The other thing that it reminded
me of a lot was Coraline. Actually I haven't seen.
Coraline and I'm ashamed of it. I don't know it's.
Like Haley's? Favorite movie right now?
Oh, really? Oh, is it?
Yeah. She loves.

(26:04):
That's awesome. Very.
Similar, right? It's a very dark tale, but it's
about this girl who her parents ignore her.
So she goes into this other dimension where it's a parallel
universe, but everything is darker.
There's these like ghost children that try to tell her to
watch out for this other mother and they try to, they help her
like get through all these like trials and tribulations and
stuff. So it's very similar to this

(26:25):
with like the ghosts helping Finney out and telling him what
to do. And it's kind of wholesome in
that way. So it very much reminded me of
Coraline. I don't know if the ghosts are
in the movie. Are they I You know what?
I haven't seen the movie. In a long time, parts of it,
yeah. I've had some parts of it I
haven't. The book is really good.
Yeah, it's a it's a graphic novel.
If you have the chance to read it.
I want to get into the. Actual kids and we had touched

(26:49):
on this a little bit, but I really liked the brother and
sister dynamic between Finney and Gwen.
I thought it was really wholesome, even though they had
a shithead, a father figure, like they both kind of leaned on
each other throughout. Here's my question with them
too. Did they have some sort of like
Shining? I mean, we know that like Gwen

(27:09):
definitely does. Yeah, yeah, Gwen does.
But does he also? Because the ghosts on the phone
told him that the phone's alwaysrang, but he's the only one that
can hear it besides the grabber.It rang, but none of us heard
it. Just you never hears the phone
too. Yeah, they shine.

(27:29):
Yeah, I guess that makes. Sense.
Actually, I forgot about that line.
I just sort of assumed that all the kids prior had heard the
phone and tried other stuff based on the advice and but it
just didn't work because not allthe elements came together at
the same time. Yeah, I think you're onto
something. There, yeah, they're.
Both shining. I don't know, it was kind of a

(27:50):
different dynamic to add to thisthis movie, but I mean, I kind
of liked it. I you have ghosts using a black
phone to communicate. So I feel like if we're going to
go there, we can go there with the dreams and the and the
visions and things like that of what was going on.
Nathan, what did you think of First off, the brother sister
dynamic and kind of her having these visions?

(28:13):
Yeah, I mean, I liked. The brother sister dynamic I
liked that they loved each otherand they stuck together, you
know, as sort of that's safeguard against their own
father as well as the bullies intown.
As far as the girl's dreams go, the subplot didn't feel like it

(28:34):
did much for the story to me like it they she brought the
cops to the the house, but Finney had already killed the
guy. So, like, that's not that
consequential at the end of the day, they didn't come and save
the day at all because he was going to walk out of that front
door either way. And part of my issue with this

(28:55):
movie is that it is too long, asI agree with Jill on that.
That subplot didn't really do much for me.
Every time Baked. Yeah.
Yeah, exactly. I felt like every time we cut to
the sister having dreams or whatever, I was like, can we can
we get back to the phone in the basement?

(29:17):
And even the thing with the phone in the basement, it was
like maybe they should have cut it down to 3 ghosts instead of
like 5. I feel like you could have done
this in 90 minutes easily. I don't know, with the the dream
stuff, I'd liked watching the dreams themselves with the shit,
kind of. Questions that Do you even know

(29:38):
who you are? I'm Finney.
Blake Oh, nice to. Fucking meet you, Finney Blake,
right here. This is it.
I just didn't feel like it contributed enough to the movie
for me to be care that much about it.
Even though I liked the sister character quite a bit.
It was like she was given something to do that I wasn't

(29:59):
that interested in. I guess you'd say you know what?
I forgot. To the mother also had the
shining thing right? Right, that's true.
Because she, I guess. Killed herself, right?
That's what the father had said.That's.
Why? He beat her with the belt and he
was like, dreams are just dreams.
My dreams are just dreams. Traumatized by the death of the

(30:22):
mother and attributed it and wasafraid that the daughter was
going in the same direction. Not that that's a good
justification for what he was doing.
I'm just saying that's what how he felt.
You're right. So.
Jill, what's your thoughts on the Brother Sister dynamic and
the shining capabilities? You said it was happy.
Yeah, I really. Liked the brother and sister

(30:44):
dynamic. I like that they kind of depend
on each other and lean on lean on each other to like kind of
get through the things that they're going through, which is
a lot for a kid. And I always felt bad for
Finney, like Wink when went to her friend's house for a
sleepover and he was stuck home along with his dad.
I'm staying over at Susie. 'S tonight, it's Friday, so you

(31:04):
know what that means. Like I.
Really felt for him and there's just so much like Stephen King
there like the beer. I was actually wondering if that
was the same brand of beer and like Creepshow and everything
else Stephen King does. But with the sister.
I got a lot of Carrie vibes and so I I was interested in her

(31:25):
kind of Arc, but it didn't go anywhere because they they spent
so much time on Finney, which isthe main plot line.
So they should. But the fact is they they
expanded a short story so long that they kind of forgot to make
it nuanced, make it sophisticated, you know what I
mean? So if you're going to make a

(31:47):
short story that long, you have to do those things.
To do those things. I don't know.
Well, I wonder too. And this is just me playing
devil's advocate. If again, this is like setting
the tables. I don't remember if their
characters are in the the trailer for the second one, but
yeah we should Google. It like I would like.
To see maybe them go into more of that, because if you're going

(32:10):
to make the Grabber come back and be supernatural, you need
your dream warriors, don't you? Yeah, it.
Says. It's four years after the events
of the first film follows Finn, who's now 17, who struggles to
adjust to life after escaping from his abductor.
His younger sister Gwen, now 15,begins experiencing disturbing

(32:32):
dreams. It receives calls from the black
phone. I like it.
It's the Grabber. In the.
Trailer Yeah, he's back. But he looks.
Different. So to me, he's got to be
supernatural, like he didn't survive, it says.
He seeks revenge from beyond thegrave.
OK. So probably.
Supernatural, so that changes the.

(32:54):
Entire dynamic, then it seems like a.
Very Freddie esque story. I mean, I don't know if I'll go
there, but even like you saw Joewith the with the the pedophile
nuance thing, like Freddy Krueger was also supposed to
have a lot of that too. And they removed that from the
equation, whereas this also treads a little bit in it.

(33:16):
But it doesn't pull on it doesn't explicitly.
Say, But when you're talking about him having a Naughty Boy
game, if you don't play Naughty Boy, the grabber can't beat you.
And if he can't beat you, he can't move on to the next part.
The next part of Naughty Boy. What's his favorite part?
Yeah, you know. The the suggestion.

(33:38):
Is is it pretty? Yeah, in your face.
You know, like, and he's not wearing a shirt.
Yeah, with exactly. Sitting up.
Waiting like gross. Yeah, exactly.
So but also. I wouldn't run away, probably
too old for him. Yeah, and also not a little

(34:00):
girl. Yeah.
So yeah, he's not. Into girls doesn't seem that.
Way one of the things I. Love is this movie being set in
the 70s. I love a time period piece like
this. It just, it feels so cool.
I don't know how to explain it, but it just, it feels eerie too,

(34:21):
you know, In a lot of ways it doesn't.
Even feel like a modern movie, it feels like movies like this
aren't made quite as much. It almost feels like it was
brought forward from the 70s in a way.
It's kind of like a 70s ghost story sort of deal.
I think that's like a. Harken back to that those like
time period movies too simple ghost story.

(34:41):
And I did like to how they dropped in the The Texas
Chainsaw. Robin was going to see fucking
Robin, right? He is like a bully himself, but
a good bully. Yeah, no.
Yeah, I don't know when he's beat up the shit out of that
bully who was calling him a beaner.
You know, you root for him untilhe starts hitting the kid while
he's down and can't defend himself anymore.

(35:05):
And I believe Finney even says no one deserves that.
He had a cone almost. Actually, and I was like.
Yeah I kind of agree. Like, don't like the kid, but
maybe stop after one or two punches after he's down and
can't defend himself anymore. You're starting to talk about
permanent damage with that much.So yeah, the blood dude A.

(35:29):
Situation like that. The more blood the better.
That was very violent. Like that I think was probably
some of the most, like, shocking, kind of like footage
in the movie because, yeah, whenthat other kid is sitting next
to Gwen and the blood is like, where she, like, beat him with a
rock or whatever. Oh yeah.
I thought he was dead. For sure.
Like I, yeah, this kid was dead.And then they kind of just.

(35:52):
Gloss over it. They don't even show any
consequences. Gwen getting kicked in the face
was also like, yeah. Fucking hell.
Come on man, you know. When she was.
On the ground, tough kid. Man tough.
Yeah, lover. Yeah, yeah.
She. She.
Is a little ass. Kicker for sure.
She don't take shit even with her father there with the belt

(36:14):
too. Like she still was giving it out
to him, you know, taking away his vodka.
Hit me again. I'm dropping it.
You drop that and I would reach your ass to watch this hard.
Drop the vodka. On the ground and fuck.

(36:35):
You. I know.
This is going to result in more beating, but I'm doing this to
you. And he's like, that was an $8
bottle of vodka. Yeah.
Jesus Christ, man. You can't afford that.
Shit, they thought it was. Worth more in the 70s, I guess,
You know, Yeah. Oh.

(36:55):
Yeah, yeah, for sure. I thought Jill, you had said
something earlier about Finney, maybe the actor who played.
I'm not giving a really good performance.
I thought that even though I agree like he was very just
paper and wasn't or vanilla wasn't really giving much.
I kind of thought that's how this character should portray it

(37:17):
a little bit because kids who I've seen in my life who have
been, you know, abused and things like that are very timid
and I don't know, they keep to themselves a little bit.
It's tough though, to see a movie like focus on that
character, like portraying it that way.
So I agree, but I thought that'swhy he was portraying it that

(37:39):
way of like just being kind of stone faced the whole time and
not really giving much emotion until the scene where he tries
to get through the freezer. And I thought this was like
probably the hardest scene to watch when he tries to get
through that wall and the freezer won't open and he like
just cries. Man, I felt so bad for him in

(38:01):
that scene, I gotta say that. Scene was the part where I was
like, oh man, this kid is not that great an actor.
Damn, he was fine. He was fine.
I didn't think he was it was a bad performance, but I I also it
wasn't amazing in in my opinion at all in that crying.

(38:22):
It felt pretty crocodile tears like like maybe this part of
this movie is sort of beyond hisabilities in my opinion.
Would you think, Jill you? Did you find any sympathy for
him when he's, you know, down onhis luck?
Yeah. I mean I have a.
Heart like I felt bad for him but.

(38:43):
Sounds horrible. I felt bad for him, but I was
like, man, like this, this kid kind of sucks.
Like he has to get all these ghosts, like tell him how to get
out of here. Like he's not even trying.
You know what I mean? Like, I don't know.
I don't know. I'm an asshole.
I, no, I was kind of mad at him for like sleeping half the time.
I don't know if he was drugged or whatever, but I was like

(39:05):
dude, why are you aside all thistime digging all those holes?
You ever see the movie Holes they get?
Really. I put the word in that.
One actually. Really.
No. It's a classic.
Kid from Even Stevens. Yes.
Shia LaBeouf, Shia. LaBeouf it's funny that Shia.
Labeouf's been in so much since then, and I still think of him
as the kid from Even Stevens. But this kid?

(39:28):
Yeah, this kid that played Finney looked like Shia LaBeouf
a little bit. Yeah, what?
Maybe because. Hopefully.
He doesn't turn into. I use side by side.
What I was gonna. Say he would fall asleep and
then the grabber would just be sitting there in the corner,
like, dude, you didn't hear a door open.

(39:48):
Anything. Come on, man.
Like, your life's in danger here.
Yeah, Maybe be a. Little bit more alert.
Even in your sleep, you would think that little sounds would
wake him up. He also hangs up the phone when
he hears a scary voice. And I'm sitting there like.
I don't care how scary the voiceis, I'm going to try and figure
out what's going on here and talk to this voice I would not

(40:11):
be picking. Up that phone.
First of all, I I don't even pick up my phone when it rings.
I wouldn't be picking up this creepy ass phone.
Fuck. Crawl at the vent.
There's so many ways he could have like figured out a way to
crawl up to that like window vent thing I feel.
I digress. Yeah, I mean.
Actually, that one kid even asked, have you tried stacking

(40:33):
the carpets to get up to the window?
He's like, I've tried everything.
And I'm saying like, I didn't see you try that.
Like why would you tell him you tried that when you didn't?
He's lying to the. Ghost.
They know he can't lie to a ghost.
Yeah. Exactly, and they're the ghosts.
Are in that room, right? They can see what's going on,

(40:53):
but they just need the phone to communicate.
Yeah, I guess. I guess so.
Yeah, that, that seems that way.I mean, you, you see them
physically at times. So ghost children.
That have been like fucked up. That's scary.
That one that was hanging. Upside down, blood dripping from
her, from his neck. Yeah, that was nasty.

(41:14):
Especially the one too. That I told him about the belt
and stuff and he was like he hits you and it hurts and like
you could see all the belt yeah marks all over him and stuff.
There was some good. Performances in those ghost
voices too. Actually better than Finney's
performance now that I think about it.
Maybe they should have swapped the casting on one of those
kids. Damn, he's.

(41:36):
Getting roasted? Sorry, I want.
To get your thoughts on the ending because we had touched on
a little bit, but what did you think about the ending?
And Vinny, he puts all this stuff together and he like
stands up for himself finally, right?
The Grabbers had enough. Here's my question.
The Grabber was planning on killing him anyways.
And then Grabbers brother who hewas a detective but couldn't

(42:00):
figure out that there's a kid inhis own basement.
Dude I love that character, sorry.
I I am with. You on that, Jill?
Max is my favorite character in the movie.
He's going all Pepe Sylvia and he can't risk them getting away
or waking him up if he's knocking him out, which means
that the grabber has to live somewhere in this area right
here with this conspiracy board and and his cocaine Charlie Gay.

(42:26):
He had the same setup. Exist.
He had the same. Setup he had like the the board.
You know, I love when he comes to like he's like, Oh my God,
like he sees the map and he's like, oh wait, this house is
right right there. Oh God.
He comes down. And he's like, yeah, yeah, I'll
get you out of here. But do you want to hear about

(42:47):
how I figured out that you were down here?
Hey, you want to know the story about how?
I found you man. You want to hear my story?
I do actually. That should be the sequel.
That should be the sequel. Max is.
Alive. Dead though, yeah, Max is.
You know, if the grabber can be alive, why not Max?
Then you know Max gets pretty. Brutal, yeah.

(43:07):
Axe to the back of the head and I love how.
He blames Finney. He's like, look at what you made
me do. Oh my God.
You made me kill my brother. He was an idiot, but he was my
idiot. You made me kill my brother.
No, it wasn't me. He.
Was an idiot, but he was my idiot.

(43:30):
What a good brother. He could tell he loved him.
We're talking. Yeah.
We're talking about how Max was dumb.
He couldn't figure out that he'sgot the kid in the basement.
But what's wrong with these cops?
Why are they so useless? They are.
We know the. Answer we do.
Oh, they're. Cops.
Oh well. They're.
Incompetent. Oh.
Their. Only lead is a little girl's

(43:52):
dreams. What happened in your dream?
He was taken that's all by a manwith black balloons in a van
Yes, we found 2 black balloons at the scene.
When? Yeah, they.
Needed her a little while they're hinging.
Their investigation on her? Oh my God, when they go up to
the house and they kick the doorin, I'm like, you don't have a

(44:15):
warrant and I don't think a little girl's dreams count as
exigent circumstances. You know, it's like you fucked
up the entire investigation by searching without a warrant.
Like if Finney hadn't killed theGrabber, the Grabber wouldn't be
going to jail because you fuckedup the entire chain of evidence.
Maybe that's the. Ending that should have
happened. They should have burst in,

(44:37):
arrested the grabber, and then they were like, hey, do you have
a warrant? All that evidence.
Throw it out. You didn't have a warrant,
dumbass. And right, she ends up sending
the cops to his other house to the death.
House the the body storing house, Yeah, I mean technically.

(44:57):
I mean, I guess eventually they would have found the grabber,
but it would have been too late,right?
If any at least. Yeah, I mean, you're right, man.
These these cops are incompetentand completely useless.
But what did you guys think of the ending?
Because Finney ends up killing the Grabber.
Were you sad to see the Grabber go?

(45:18):
No. No, I, I liked the ending.
I liked it a lot. I think, you know, it was the
ending that it was building to the entire movie.
You sort of knew that. Like, they're not going to have
Finney do a whole bunch of stuffthat's entirely useless by the
end of the movie because you have to have it built to
something. So him taking all the ghosts

(45:40):
advice and putting it all together, it was great and I'm
glad it wasn't a it wasn't a entirely bleak ending because I
was a little afraid that that was where it was going to end up
going. And I just don't think that
would have been right for the movie.
It is still a little bleak because they're still with their
father, who is still an abusive asshole, but you know they're

(46:04):
not. It didn't end with the Grabber
winning. You know, God, I'm.
Going to hell. You wanted the Grabber to win.
I didn't want the. Grabber to win like I didn't
want it to be that bleak. What I really wanted more of
probably was a more gruesome death for him than what he had
because he's messing with children.

(46:25):
He's doing like terrible things to children.
I want to see blood. I want to see guts.
I want to see him like get justice.
I want to see the kids get justice.
I don't know, it just like wasn't enough for me like like
and everything else too like allthe other kills are off screen
except for the brother and the grabber and I felt like it could
have been more the brother's death.

(46:46):
I. Feel like it's the only reason
this movie got in our rating yeah because you could have PG13
this real easy by doing the brother's death off screen as
well Yeah that's true I. Think it's it's tough to with
children like in showing children deaths, you know, and
yeah, there is a line. Yeah.
Toxic Avengers. Doesn't have a problem with it,
but you know for sure. Well, they.

(47:08):
Didn't have to do the children death, they could have just made
like the Grabber's death. Like really like get Gwen in
there with a brick you're already at.
An R Why not just take that a little further?
I I hear you. I think though it was.
Like the symbolism at the end because all the ghosts kind of
got to speak to him. Welcome to the nightmare end of
your pathetic little one. You don't have much.

(47:33):
While he was getting. Choked out with the phone cord,
but I hear you. I think it was gruesome.
He kind of like split his ankle and like was stuck in that stuck
in that little ditch there. I thought that was smart too,
because, you know, you use things like the grape from the
window and him digging that hole.
So it made it worth the other scenes that kind of seemed

(47:58):
tedious like throughout. So I I thought that was all well
done. The dog too You and you had the
freezer. So that made sense too with
giving the dog the the meat because he probably wouldn't
have been able to get through the dog.
I was thinking the ending was going to come a lot sooner in
this movie when Finney did sneakup past the Grabber who had

(48:21):
fallen asleep. This was one of my favorite
scenes, which was like the sceneof tension trying to figure out
that bike lock combination. Very faintly in the background,
you see the grabber sitting in the chair asleep, and you're
like, Oh my God, that. Seemed you like start becoming
aware of your own breathing. Like I don't want to breathe too

(48:43):
loud. It'll wake up the grabber.
Yes, I. Thought that was done so well
and then I guess I got to blame Finney because when he does get
out, why is he on the road? Like running down?
I was saying the same. Thing, get off the fucking Rd.
He's in a van. The van's faster.
But not if you go. Through somebody's yard, You

(49:03):
can't drive through trees. You can run through trees.
That's where I thought he was going.
To get killed I I really thoughtlike I'm like Oh my God like
this is gonna be like the grabber kills them you say 1
fucking. Word and I will get you like a
pig right here in the street. I am happy that.
It was like the ending we got because I think like Nathan

(49:24):
said, it all built up to that ending.
You had to have this mark for his character a little bit.
He finally does fight back. Like Jill, you were saying, you
know, the grabber is kind of a symbol of his own father.
So it's kind of and like him standing up to his own father in
this situation too. I thought that was well done.

(49:44):
But like, I, I agree with you too, chill.
Like, you know, you're fucking with kids.
You need to be like, really punished and tortured.
And yeah, they should have set him on fire just like also would
have been Freddy. Yeah, is there?
Anything else you want to talk about?
Why is Finney? Such a damn good pitcher.
He's got a man. Talk about that baseball.

(50:05):
Oh my God. Darn, you got to be good at
something. Dude, those pitches.
Are nasty. They were like, he's got a
fastball ride. It's crazy.
Until, until Bruce took him out of the yard.
There, how did he take? That pitch out of the yard, that
pitch was down and in. It was out of the zone.
That was nasty pitch and he tookit out of the if that guy hadn't

(50:29):
have killed that that kid you fucking drafted by the Red Sox.
Yeah, being able to. Take that pitch out of the That
was crazy to me, man. Sorry man.
Loves. His baseball.
I do I. Do love baseball?
Man loves his red. Sox I do love.
My Red Sox and black phone today, Yeah.

(50:49):
Congrats. Yeah.
Thank you. Stephen King.
Also loves the Red Sox. Yeah, Stephen King.
Is a huge Red Sox fan. He's at every playoff game.
I'm thinking maybe Joe. Hill also loves him, too, so he
grew up with a Sox. Fan father so probably I get a
story about Stephen King at a baseball game but too unrelated
I'm. Kind of interested.

(51:12):
So Stephen King was at a a playoff game and Fox was doing
the the broadcast and they foundStephen King.
And he was, he was reading between innings and Steven.
They were like, So what are you reading?
Is it one of your own? And he looks at him and goes,
why would I read one of my own books?
So what are you reading? It's not one of yours.
No, this. Why would I read 1 of mine?

(51:35):
I know how they come out. Yes, but no, I don't get cute.
He's just a total Dick to the interviewer.
He's like, no. What are you reading?
And he told him what he was reading.
So do you read while the game's going on?
He's like, no, I read during commercial breaks.
I get to read a lot longer when Fox is handling the game because
the commercials are so much longer.

(51:58):
And now that Fox is doing the games, you can do 27 pages
because the commercial breaks along.
I was like. Oh my God, you're just burning
the network and the interviewer.Anyway, that story's probably
getting cut out of the episode, but I like.
I like it. He's a treasure.
Oh, they played on the. Run by Pink Floyd as the mystery

(52:20):
was being solved. In that.
Scene where Gwen there was figuring out where the dream
took place. I did like how.
They they just had the the soundtrack play.
There was no real talking or anything, especially at the
ending. Thought that was cool, yeah.

(52:42):
It's funny because I, you know, there's no real notable needle
drops in there other than on therun by Pink Floyd.
But because on the run is like this weird, since the
progressive instrumental, if youdidn't know it was Pink Floyd,
you'd have no idea that it was aneedle drop at all.
We're on to quarter. Kill.
We're going to give you our favorite quote in the movie, or

(53:02):
our favorite kill in the movie, or both.
I'm going with the Grabber's death as my favorite.
Kill. I can't kill you.
So Finn is going to do it for me.
I liked him having his comeuppance and especially like
I said, I loved the the ghost kids being able to tell him fuck
you while he was being strangledto death.

(53:23):
I thought that was a cool scene.My quote is and a lot of the
quotes from the grabber just like really good because they're
eerie and stuff. But I do love when he talked
about the the phone ring and thephone ring itself.
The phone ring is always sketchyand in a movie but when he's
like that was down here. Once when it rang.

(53:46):
The creepiest damn thing. The creepiest damn.
Thing, yeah, you know, it's justso good.
Yeah, so just. Weird like the scene too.
Where he where he grabs Finney and he comes out of his van.
He's just like, oh, dear me. Like I I dropped these.

(54:07):
Would you mind helping me? And Oh yes, yeah.
You want to see a. Magic trick?
No, I don't. That's another thing, Finney.
Be safe, man. You know, there's a person
grabbing kids. There's black balloons in there.
Yeah. Finney is dumb.

(54:33):
Jill, how about you? My favorite quote.
Is from Gwen when she says Jesuswhat the fuck Jesus what the?
Fuck, I don't know. I just think.
She's really cool. I love everything that she has
to say. I love everything that she does.
She's just badass and she's kindof like Comic Relief as well.
She's kind of handles business, even though it doesn't really
help in the end. My favorite kill I think is the

(54:55):
brother. I think Max is his name, the
Grabber's brother just because Idid not expect that like that
axe or like whatever it was cameout of nowhere right on the top
of his head. And I was just kind of like, oh
shit, that was that was unexpected.
It was kind of gruesome. What about you, Nathan?
My favorite kill is. Also Max with the axe, the Max

(55:17):
to do that. Yeah, same reasons.
It was just kind of like, whoa, all of a sudden, like we've been
doing this ghost story thing andit's been sort of calm with or
not calm, you know, no kills andstuff like that.
And then all of a sudden gruesome murder acts to the head
out of nowhere. It made me jump a little bit.

(55:39):
I got you. Yeah.
My favorite quote is also from Gwen because she is funny and
pretty great when the cops are questioning her about how there
was black balloons in her dreamsand they were like, that was
never released to the public. And she was like, yeah, I took
him down because obviously I'm the grabber, you dumb fucking

(56:02):
fart knocker. When's the Lynn?
Blake, dumb fucking fart. Knockers.
It. Was.
Good. I thought that was funny.
I love Gwen. It's time for our letterbox
rating. We're gonna rate this movie from
one to five stars. 5 is Gwen because she is badass. 1 is her

(56:23):
dad because he's a Dick. Jill, start us off this one.
OK. Jump scare there for.
You right so. I like this movie more than I
don't like it. I think it's good.
I I really like the Grabber as avillain.
I like the whole aesthetic of him.
I like the way he looks. I like the way he carries
himself. He's just very interesting as a

(56:45):
villain. I think the supernatural
elements with the ghost boys talking through the phone was
cool. Something different.
I really like Gwen. You know, it was scary enough
honestly, as a horror movie withthe dad and the way that he
treated those kids. And so I, I think it's very like
interesting. It's kind of unique.

(57:05):
I just wish that maybe it, it felt a little long just because
like I said before, it's based off of a short story.
I don't know if like if a film length is the length for this
type of story. I don't know if it's the perfect
medium, but I did enjoy it the second time, probably more than

(57:26):
I did the first time. It's gonna give it 3 1/2 stars
just because, you know, it's, it's a little long and it seems
a little simplistic for me at times.
What about you, Nathan? What's your rating?
I am. Also at 3 1/2 stars for a lot of
the same reasons I I enjoyed thestory.
I liked that the story was really simple, that it was just

(57:46):
like a kid being kept in a basement getting instructions
from ghosts. And it was about, you know,
these characters. The Grabber is a great villain.
He's kind. He's scary.
He's kind of pathetic at times, too, which is kind of, it's
scary in its own way. But yeah, I mean, I had some

(58:08):
issues with the pacing. I don't see why this movie has
to be an hour 40. It could have been cut down to
90 minutes easily, probably evenless than that.
Some of the subplot with the sister was just not fleshed out
enough for me to care that much,even though I liked the
character. I mean, overall, it's a, you
know, it's a good movie. It's a fun movie.

(58:30):
I would recommend it to people. 3 1/2 stars.
You guys are twinsies. On this one, yeah, I'm actually
a little bit higher than you both.
I'm at 4 stars for the Black phone is I think my third time
seeing the Black Phone and it has gotten a little bit better
for me too because one of the things I like about it is there
is a lot I think left on the bone here and where we can go

(58:54):
with this story. Like you both, I love the
Grabber. I think he is a great horror
villain and I'm excited like to see more of him.
Like I think you can do more movies with this character and
bring them into the supernaturalelement and then play in that
sandbox. Like I, I think there's a bigger
sandbox to play in and this is just the start of it, which is

(59:17):
exciting to me. Like, you know, I'm also excited
by the fact that like these kindof horror movies, they're tough
for me. Like they're, they're not always
my go to, but I think this one just worked for me and I, I
appreciate that. I think I'm excited to see where
this goes overall, but as far asthis one, I do recommend it and
especially people who haven't seen it definitely take a watch

(59:40):
because I think it is just a cool ghost story and you don't
really see too many good just ghost story horror movies that
much anymore. I feel like they've kind of got
away from them. Yeah, I agree with that.
Sort of somber, slow paced ghoststories or a little out right
now. Yeah.
They should come back, yeah, I think.
That's a valid thing because I don't think this feels like it's

(01:00:04):
in right now. It very much feels like its own
thing, which feels like a throwback too.
So I think that's cool. So if you haven't already, check
out The Black Phone. Before we end the episode, we
want to let you all know what we've been up to.
And actually tying into this a little bit, I actually just
started rereading Joe Hill's Heart-shaped box.

(01:00:25):
Which is my favorite Joe Hill book?
Is it just because it's? Named after the Nirvana song
I'll Be honest with you. I'll be honest with you, when I
was, when I was told about this book, I was like, I don't want
to read that because it seemed like a Nirvana, like cash in a
little bit. I don't know why I'm always so
protective of that. Stuff like that makes no sense.

(01:00:45):
I get it, but Joe Hill is a hugeNirvana fan and I think that's
part of the reason why he did name the book it.
It does revolve around a heart-shaped box, an actual
heart-shaped box. And it is a cool, cool ghost
story that's really, really scary.
I hope this gets made into a movie.
I want to see this into a movie.I think it's awesome.

(01:01:08):
Jill, have you read this one at all?
No, I haven't. You've told me about this one
before, so I need to put it on my list.
Yeah, it's so. Good if you haven't checked it
out, definitely read it especially around spooky season
because this is a really good one.
I think it is a little bit easier to digest than a lot of
Stephen King books. Like I said, I think you can
really picture a movie being made with this, so that would be

(01:01:31):
cool to to check out. It is just to give it like a
simple what it's about. It's about like this kind of old
school rock'n'roll guy that's kind of retired, has some money
and he's kind of skeptical of the paranormal world a little
bit and he looks for paranormal artifacts and things like that.

(01:01:53):
He ends up getting something which is a heart-shaped box.
There's a little bit more to bargain with than he thinks, and
it turns out to be pretty scary and terrifying, just like the.
Thing that the song is based on.Yeah, it's scary, you know,
scary. Yeah.

(01:02:14):
Sorry. That was the dumbest joke I've
ever made in my life, I think. It's the theme of the night.
We're making the lame jokes, allof us with.
Halloween season quickly approaching.
I'm a huge Halloween movie fan and I stumbled across this

(01:02:34):
YouTube channel called Mortimer Nightshade.
And I'm not a huge AI person, but what he's done is actually
something I like. He's created these.
Stories through AI of what happens in between Halloweens a
little bit. Nathan doesn't like it.
I I. Am immediately out on this.

(01:02:58):
And. Immediately out on this.
This is like a real. Thing for like, you know, real
fans of the Halloween movie franchise because it does kind
of try to fill in some gaps and try a couple different things.
I recommend it if you don't likeAI.
I totally understand. I'm a huge AI fan myself, but I
do like kind of what he's tryingto tell with with some of these

(01:03:21):
stories. And you know, it's kind of like
fan fan writing a little bit just done through AI.
So but it's done really well too.
It it it does set a cool tone. It's not cheap looking at all.
So I recommend it. And lastly, I watched Five
Nights at Freddy's for the. My.

(01:03:43):
First time watching it, I never played any of the games but I
thought it was OK. I liked it better than Nathan
did. It was a pretty fun movie
overall, but I think they try todo a little too much and I don't
know if that's just because to appease like fans of the the
games and things like that. But for me who hasn't played any

(01:04:05):
games, it was it was a lot to take.
There is some good. I recommend taking a look at it
even if you haven't played any games.
But yeah. I thought it was boring myself.
I just felt like if you're goingto do a movie based on a
children's video game that it should be like more
action-packed, more stuff happening.

(01:04:26):
We spent a lot of time with those two characters and I
didn't think that they were enough to carry the amount of
screen time they had. There is a little tie.
In too with the black phone of like, ghost children, Yeah.
Yeah, there you go. Yeah, ghost theme of the night.
Indeed. Yep, and.
Dreams and stuff like that. Right.

(01:04:50):
But yeah, I mean. I agree, a lot of dreaming.
In Five Nights and Freddy's too,wasn't there?
Yeah, but I. Agree with you, Nathan.
It should have been more killer animatronic fun, I think.
Yeah. I was just expecting a lot more
of that and I went into the movie wanting to like it because
I wanted it to be big, stupid fun with animatronics and, and,

(01:05:12):
you know, flashing colors to to to entertain the kiddies and it
just it, it wasn't that it was very slow paced.
Well, listen man, I'm. Over too, because, you know,
earlier this year I'd seen the movie Mousetrap, and that was
also at a like. Chuck E.
Cheese separate place. Oh my God.

(01:05:34):
And that that is literally the worst movie I've seen maybe
forever. It's it's so bad.
Yeah, you. Said it was worse than the Bunny
Man massacre it was. And I gave all those one star,
yeah. We got to see Willy.
'S Wonderland with Nick Cage. I've heard that one's the one we

(01:05:55):
want to see. I don't know, Jill.
I'm always. Down to watching Nick Cage movie
so yes Sir. No, you said.
What about Nick Cage? I said I'm always down.
To watching Nick Cage movie. I mean, even if it's bad, I will
probably be entertained by Nicolas Cage, so.
Not. The base.
The base. That's it for me.

(01:06:17):
How about you, Jill? Just because.
You're just talking about Five Nights at Freddy's.
I did just get back from Universal.
I went to Horror Nights and I did.
I stood in line for like 2 hoursfor the Five Nights at Freddy's
house. It was the last house I did.
I was so tired and the line was full of like, younger people,

(01:06:37):
like kids and teenagers. So annoying. 12, yeah.
And. And just like teenagers in
general. I don't know, I I feel really
old. So that was annoying.
But the haunted house was prettycool.
They had like the animatronics and it they did get me a couple
of times with the animatronics, just like rushing at you, like

(01:06:58):
from a corner. It fucking got me.
I like the movie like I I think I thought it was like decent.
I don't remember like the score I gave that one, but I don't
think you liked the. Movie, did I not?
No, because when I went to. Score it.
I saw that you put it in two stars.
OK. I mean, I did like the movie.
Decent. Dang, I'm at 3.

(01:07:19):
Stars 2. Stars.
Damn. Okay.
I really didn't like it. I was at 1 1/2.
So do you wanna play the games? You can't go wrong there, right?
So yeah, I hear they're good. So I've never played.
Once. So I went to the.
Theater and I saw The Conjuring Last Rites.
So final installment in The Conjuring universe, supposedly

(01:07:42):
because you know there's going to be more.
This one makes money there. Certainly will be.
Yes, they they always. Make money off of these movies.
It made a yeah it. Was OK?
It did. Yeah, I heard it was.
Like, one of the top grossing, like, horror movies.
If you want to hear my thoughts on it, you can go over to its
latest podcast. Me and Rowan did an episode of
Now Slaying on it. But yeah, I thought it was cool

(01:08:04):
because it was like, The Haunting was based in
Pennsylvania, like, not too far from me.
And then, like, the haunted object in the movie is from the
county where I used to live, where I was sitting watching the
movie. And I was like, oh shit, I love
local stuff, right? And then I read two books.
This is not my typical kind of Fair when it comes to reading,

(01:08:25):
but I kept seeing these books. They look cozy.
The Pumpkin Spice Cafe by LaurieGilmore.
I already have the second book in the series, which is like the
Cinnamon Bun bookstore or whatever.
I think this takes place in Massachusetts, you know, up your
alley. Not up your alley, but it's, I
don't know, close to. You it's just.

(01:08:47):
Like, you know, a Hallmark movie, but it's a book.
It's cozy. Sometimes you just need a
reprieve from the world. So I was reading that, all
right. And then the other thing I read
was a book of poetry. Eat the World by Marina from
Marina and the Diamonds. I always thought her music was
good. And so I didn't even know that

(01:09:10):
she put this book out until I saw my friend bought it.
And then I went and I saw it on the shelf, so I bought it.
So I read it the other night. Yeah, it's pretty good.
I think I gave it four stars outof five.
I just kind of expected more from, like, seeing the lyrics of
her music. And then it's kind of hard when
you see like, like the modern poetry nowadays.
It's very like Instagrammy. It's very short, you know?

(01:09:31):
Yeah. So it's hard.
For me to take some of that stuff seriously.
But you know, she did a good jobat it.
So I I liked what I read and I think I also gave the Pumpkin
Spice Cafe a four stars as well.Because, you know, it's nothing
groundbreaking, it's nothing thought provoking.
You're just turning your brain off and reading some cozy stuff,
Nathan. Besides Five Nights at Freddy's,

(01:09:53):
what have you been up to? I was not.
Entirely out of Godzilla mode after we were done.
But I didn't watch another Godzilla movie, I watched
Pacific Rim. Fuck yeah.
Which is. Another.
Kaiju movie was really surprisedat the end when it said directed
by Guillermo del Toro. I I didn't know that and after

(01:10:14):
watching the movie that is the last name I was expecting just
because I've seen The Shape of Water and and Pan's Labyrinths
that you're much smaller. Endeavours.
It's a really fun, big stupid monster movie.
Kaiju's have been coming out of the ocean because there's some

(01:10:35):
sort of weird portal to another dimension and the humans decide
that instead of just nuking them, which would make sense,
they need to build giant robots to to fight the Kaijus.
And the robots are like piloted by two people and they piloted
together. It's just, it's big stupid fun.

(01:10:57):
I gave it 3 1/2 stars. I had fun with it.
I hell yeah, you know. If.
You need if you need your giant monster movie fix and you want
something a little modern, I think it's probably better than
the the American Godzilla moviesoverall, but but I like the
American Godzilla movies too. So and then I watched Alien

(01:11:18):
Covenant which is one of the only Alien movies I haven't seen
and that shit sucks. Everyone hates that fucking
movie. I really hate that.
Movie, you know, it's, it's, I guess I don't hate it that much.
It's actually really good when it's just being a monster movie.

(01:11:40):
Like there's a lot of alien segments that are genuinely
terrifying body horror type stuff, the back bursters and all
of that. Yeah, my issue is that I hated
all the characters. The dialogue was just atrocious.
There was a lot of boring sort of pseudo philosophical

(01:12:01):
religious stuff in there that just doesn't matter.
And this is coming from somebodywho actually didn't hate
Prometheus. I didn't love it either, but I
liked Prometheus. And then?
This one just continues down that road.
And I was like, man, I thought we got through all this in

(01:12:23):
Prometheus. Why are we doing more of this
shit, Nathan? It was a.
Creator and what's your rating? Of the Alien movies, it's a
it's. A 2 1/2 What's your favorite and
what's? Like your least favorite?
What do you think of the newer ones?
So my. Favorite is the original.
A lot of people like Aliens the best.
Actually the second one, I disagree.

(01:12:45):
I think that's the second best one, but I like the slasher
nature of the They were the first Alien, my least favorite.
God, I didn't like Alien Resurrection when I saw it in
the theaters at like 12 years old.
I haven't seen it. I haven't seen it since then
because I didn't like it when I was like 12.

(01:13:07):
So I, I, I maybe that's my leastfavorite, but I haven't I that's
not fair. I have.
It's been too long since I've seen it.
Let's do an Alien Covenant is myleast.
Let's do an alien ranking. Actually, yeah, we.
Should honestly alien ranking? I'm down.
It's a lot of movies. Joe, what's your favorite?
Yeah, what's yours? What's your favorite?

(01:13:31):
Yeah, damn. OK, so.
It's kind of a tie. I like Aliens and I also really
liked Prometheus. Wait, Prometheus?
Is that your I love? For #1.
Yeah, I also. Really like Romulus I I like the
newer Alien movies. Honestly, I'm a piece of shit.
Yeah, I did. Really.

(01:13:52):
Like 3. Honestly, three was kind of bad.
Yeah, what about you? So the only.
One I've really seen is Alien, and I saw that 20 years ago.
God. OK, we got it.
Holy shit. Wait, you?
Haven't seen aliens I haven't seen.
Aliens. I've seen parts of it, I just
haven't seen the whole put it onthe list put.
It on the list that's. What we're doing next, you're

(01:14:13):
not allowed to make. Fun of Jill for not having seen
things ever again. You make.
Fun of me I don't make. Fun of you, Nathan.
Does we make the fuck? I.
Can't believe you haven't. Seen aliens?
That's insane to me. Should we hang him up by his
toes Jill for having not seen aliens?

(01:14:34):
Like get the belt out. Yeah, get the belt.
Out so also I started watching the latest season of Only Only
Murders in the building. Oh nice.
Which is is great. Have either of you 2 watched any
of that? I've watched the.
I've watched the first season, the first season's probably.
The best one, it's just a lot offun comedy with Selena Gomez and

(01:15:00):
Martin Short and Steve Martin. It's kind of like a a buddy
investigation sort of deal. And you know, the age difference
between Steve Martin, the old guys and Selena Gomez is part of
the comedy because they're like can't work their phones and
shit. It's it's that sort of thing.
And she's. Looking fun of them for it, you

(01:15:21):
know, I love when they're like. Setting up the podcast too.
And like they like they don't really know much about, you
know, like you said, technology and things like that.
So. Yeah, it's like me.
Yeah. And I'm in.
I'm in love with Selena Gomez, so that, that helps too.
Yeah, that helps. Yeah, same.
Well, we're gonna have links down below.
You can take a look at all of our letter boxes and see what

(01:15:44):
we're rating the movies we're watching.
Also, we have a link to Jill's Goodreads so you can let's take
a look and see what she's reading as well.
We'll be back soon with another episode and we're going to be
covering Mandy. We're heading to the Nick Cage
Cinematic universe. Strap in.
I'm going to need to put the. Song in there again, aren't
they? Dude, it's got.

(01:16:04):
To be in there. I said.
Put. Goodbye.
Back in the box. Nick.

(01:16:30):
Cage. Song it is.
But until then, you want to playNaughty Boy back to the padded
room with you. I said naughty boy like 30 times

(01:16:59):
of this episode. Filthy get.
The water bottle.