February 25, 2025 • 53 mins
On this episode of Movie Smash!, we discuss 1997's Spawn directed by Mark Dippe and starring Michael Jai White, John Leguizamo and Martin Sheen. The film follows the elite mercenary, Al Simmons, as he is taken to Hell to become the general of its armies.
Hosts: Christopher Roberts, Fergel Amayo, Jeremy Parmentier
Guest Host: Louis Peterson
Edited By: Christopher Roberts
Produced By: Off Panel Creations, LLC
Follow the show! Website | Instagram | Facebook | Twitter
Christopher Roberts and Off Panel Creations: Website | Instagram | Facebook
Fergel Amayo and Gotham Night Comics: Website | Instagram | Facebook
Jeremy Parmentier and Retrovania: Website | Instagram | Facebook
Louis Peterson Website | Instagram
To advertise on our podcast, please reach out to moviesmash@hotmail.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(01:00):
Yeah, we were all either high, drunk, or some combination thereof.
He made me feel uncomfortable.
But he eats up every scene he's in.
Just full frontal spawn shots.
That sounds like a lot of therapy.
The violator made me feel weird.
Yeah, you know what? That is a good call.
I pieced together the movie through YouTube.
And it was a sitcom.
Hello and welcome to Movie
Smash.
(01:29):
Hello and welcome to Movie Smash,
the show where we dive headfirst into comic book movies outside the MCU.
If you're new to the show, thanks for joining us.
If you've been here before, you know the drill.
Each episode, we're going to smash a movie whose source material is from a graphic novel or a comic.
Is it worth revisiting?
Should it be forgotten?
Let's find out.
This is Movie Smash.
I'm one of your hosts, Chris Roberts.
I'm the founder of All Panel Creations.
With me today, I have Jeremy Parmentier.
(01:50):
Hey, this is Jeremy Parmentier.
I've also returned from hell, but a hell of playing bad video games on Retrovaniac's podcast.
And Fergal Amayo.
What's going on, y'all?
This is your proprietor of Everything Awesome, Fergal Amayo Gotham Night Comics.
Staying well, my good friend Jeremy has returned from hell.
I have returned from heaven with the sword of Michael to avenge.
And let's get down and dirty.
(02:11):
And our guest host today is Lewis Peterson.
How you doing, y'all?
I am Lewis Peterson.
I am a comic book creator and illustrator.
I am the creator of Mason and also a new comic book coming out called Survival Girl and Puppy.
Come check that out.
Thanks for joining us.
And our movie today is 1997 Spawn starring Michael J. White, John Leguizamo and Martin Sheen.
(02:32):
Directed by Mark Dipp, Dipp A?
I don't know.
It's the only movie that's ever produced.
Dippy.
I'm telling you, it's a diap.
It's diap.
We're all going to be surprised.
It's going to be, my name is Mark Dipp.
Imagine a substance with the power to destroy humanity.
(02:53):
Imagine a creature insane enough to use it.
Imagine a hero on the verge of creation.
From flesh to steel.
You must visualize your objectives.
From blood to blade.
(03:14):
Don't get cocky.
You have a lot more to learn.
From man to spawn.
Pick a boo.
I see you.
So Lewis, why did you pick this movie?
I just, I've been trying to figure that out why I picked it.
(03:34):
I feel like it's one of the one movies that's not Marvel.
It's not DC.
It's not, I don't know, just, I think it was ahead of its time and it needs some shine here.
So before you saw this movie, guys, before you saw this movie, guys, were you familiar with the comic?
Yes, absolutely.
I believe anyone that, again, that golden age, but during the time of Dicko and Kirby,
(03:57):
there was these golden age artists that made amazing work.
That's when we started seeing these guys and I think we're at that point now.
So that's where, yeah, this is a great comic, great story, great movie.
My brother was a big Spawn fan.
I read a few of the comics, but not a lot.
And so I more remembered things like the toys and things that were added to it because,
you know, McFarland, Tom McFarland, who had kind of been the creator of Spawn,
(04:21):
the original artist and everything, had these toys later that were very, very detailed,
looked very, very cool, but they were not the most pliable to play with.
But when you were a toy collector and I used to work at a comic and toy store,
we had all the McFarland toys, I remember those more than the comic itself.
I was a big Tom McFarland fan.
(04:42):
I loved them and Amazing Spider-Man, Adjective Lives Spider-Man,
and when he came out with Spawn, it just continued.
And the artwork was like the main draw for me.
I don't know if I really read the stories back when I first was collecting them,
but I loved the artwork.
I would copy the artwork and just it was the best.
It was the best thing at the time.
I didn't think it was like anything else at the time when it was coming out.
(05:07):
So I had followed him until he stopped drawing Spawn.
So I collected everything that he drew.
And see, that's what I'm talking about, right?
Like he reinvented both of you guys, Lewis and Jeremy, he reinvented so many genres.
Again, with you got to mention with giants like Capullo, Snyder, Kirkman, Silvestri,
I mean, Leopold, I mean, these guys reinvented, but McFarland from both the toy game,
(05:30):
it's when he came as pre.
If you just look at toys pre and post McFarland, you can see the difference, right?
They go for much more detail orientation.
There really is.
And I've got them all behind me.
So I got a lot of different ones behind me and they just, I love the detail.
That's probably the best part.
You might not get to play with them as much, but that detail just makes them so awesome.
You can build on that.
And the comics, the art was something else.
(05:53):
It was completely, we were not used to that because we're Sterenko guys.
We're still looking at the 70s, early 80s.
And then all of a sudden this art comes out.
You're like, what is this?
Yeah.
He broke all the rules of perfect everything.
He just made it look cool.
Didn't have to follow all the rules of perspective, anatomy.
It was just like this awesome, awesome page layouts and just wild poses.
(06:18):
And it was just awesome to look at.
Yeah.
I wasn't feeling respond at all.
The, I could pick him out of lineup, but I had no idea who he was, power sets,
anything like that.
I just knew he existed.
It's about it.
I think you'd be afraid to pick him out of the lineup.
Let's be honest.
Like if you were like, okay, who was the guy that robbed you?
Is it the guy with the flowing red cape?
I honestly think he'd be like, no, that's not the guy.
(06:41):
Third guy from the left.
So was this your guy's first time watching this movie?
Not at all.
No.
Yeah, no, I'd seen it before, but again, based on 1997, there's a solid chance I was
it's not, not non-drunk.
And so I don't remember much about it except for John Luguziamo as the cloud, which we'll
get into, I'm sure.
And not liking it very much.
(07:02):
I'm looking forward to seeing if I liked it anymore this time around.
I know I saw it.
I don't remember seeing it, but I definitely saw it.
I'm 17.
So I don't, I don't know what I was doing at the time.
Probably something like that.
I would imagine.
Yeah.
We were all either high drunk or some combination there of possibly with friends.
This would have been a movie I wouldn't have taken a date to.
(07:22):
So this would have been homeboys.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I was in college at the time, so I have no idea when I saw it, but I definitely saw it
in theaters at that time.
It was one of those random movies you see on the weekends at a very shady movie theater
by College Park.
College Park, Georgia?
No, Maryland.
Oh, Maryland.
Oh yeah.
Sorry.
Boom.
That's way off.
I'm sorry.
I don't even know how we got there.
(07:42):
I apologize.
Georgia.
Not to offend our Georgia listeners.
So Fergal, do you have any little bit of comic book history for us?
A little bit of lore?
I mean, 1992, so again, don't want to bore you with a ton of details because you should
know who Spawn is by now, but it came out of Todd McFarlane's mind when he was 16.
He created this book.
(08:03):
This character is considered one of the top 200 of all time.
Longest running comic book, I believe, independent for sure.
It spawned so many set up characters.
It spawned a toy company that's a multi-billion dollar company.
It changed multiple industries, spawned entire lines.
I think you mentioned Lewis, the Spider-Man run.
There's countless lines.
(08:24):
Those books of McFarlane's do not fetch less than several thousands of dollars.
They are very well known books.
I think that's the biggest thing.
It's great stories.
I mean, multiple characters.
The Neil Gaiman thing I think you mentioned earlier.
You got Medieval Spawn, Gunslinger Spawn, Angela, who's now a Marvel, is now a sister of Thor.
(08:45):
It's an interesting combination there.
So quick spoiler warning for you guys.
If this is your first time joining us, just a heads up.
We're about to discuss certain elements of the story that might be considered spoilers
of this very 90s movie.
So consider yourself warned.
Lewis, you want to walk us through the plot of this movie?
Sure.
Our story follows Al Simmons.
He's a government assassin.
(09:05):
There's an elaborate plot between his boss and the devil to have Al killed.
And then so that he would go to hell and become the new leader of the army of hell.
So it's a very elaborate plot to get him into that point.
And then there's some other things happen.
(09:27):
There's a clown and...
That's a dope ass clown.
This is a dope ass clown.
So why don't we start with that dope ass clown, the violator.
So how do you guys feel about John Leguizamo's portrayal of the clown?
Well, we know how I feel.
I think that a bad guy, because this is such a dumb...
(09:49):
The movie's premise had so many different holes in it.
And it was while they were trying to do an origin story, there were a lot of holes that
could have pushed you out the movie and the character...
Because Al Simmons is playing a completely very straight spawn.
So you needed something to offset that.
And that was not completely aerial.
Whatever that guy was, was certainly not the guy who was going to offset spawn.
(10:10):
But the violator was a perfect foil to spawn.
I just think that the way he talked and it matches the comics and just the whole...
He was with a bandit.
He enjoyed it.
As you said, Chris, he was a penis within a condom.
Yeah, it was weird.
The violator's weird.
I mean, he made me feel uncomfortable the entire movie.
(10:31):
And I guess that's good.
And after rereading some of the spawn in preparation for this,
he did play the character as he was in the book.
So I mean, I can't knock him for his performance.
That was what I remembered before we watched it for this viewing now.
For my original viewing was I did not like John Luguziamo as the clown,
(10:52):
but I also was not extremely familiar with spawn at the time.
I didn't know the clown character other than what he looked like,
which he did look exactly like the toy in the comics.
Like the makeup and everything for him actually looks really good.
But I was just annoyed by him.
But then watching it again this time, it's much less annoying.
I think it does. I did read some spawn in prep for this,
and it does fit the comic field, at least the early issues.
I didn't read the whole run or anything, but the early issues.
(11:14):
So I think he actually did a good job.
But it's also if you don't like John Luguziamo
or if you don't like the character,
I'm going to give you some bad news.
He's in like 90% of this movie.
So I hope you like it.
He's the main villain and the comic relief at the same time.
Which is double duty for anybody.
Yeah.
Yeah, he is in the majority of this movie.
(11:35):
You're right, Jeremy.
I think if you don't like the clown, you don't like clowns,
you're not going to like this movie because he's in so much of it.
And actually, he is pretty much the only thing I remember about this movie
for my first time viewing.
I remember a little bit of spawn.
But it's been 20 odd years.
But he eats up every scene he's in.
That tells you the strength of the movie.
If all of you guys remember that most of all,
(11:55):
even more so than say Al Simons, Michael Jai White,
who at the time was still riding pretty high on a lot of different stuff,
then that just tells you that's like the Penguin.
It's like there are certain roles where you just go,
you know, the original Joker, Jack Nicholson,
that changed the old genre of the Joker.
Well, why don't we jump on the spawn?
How do you think Michael did?
He's Michael Jai White.
I don't think he does too many things bad.
(12:16):
I wouldn't want to fight him.
He's pretty badass.
He's actually so fast.
He's got super fast kicks.
But in this movie, I think he was good, not great,
but he did exactly what he was supposed to do to bring spawn to life.
I don't think there was a lot for him to work with.
Yeah.
I think he was a pretty flat character.
They didn't really go into it.
You didn't really get to know him.
(12:36):
You know what I mean?
It was like it was just flat.
I don't know.
I don't think it was his fault.
No, I don't think it's his fault.
I think the script didn't help him.
And it's an origin story.
So there has to be like him learning what his abilities are,
who he is, what his power is, what his purpose is.
And that is learned throughout the movie.
But especially at the start, I think he is.
He's very flat.
He comes across as that kind of stone voice,
(12:58):
Batman kind of feel to it, but without any of the background.
Like Batman has a purpose. He knows what he's doing.
This is just like, am I here?
What am I doing?
And that's kind of the first half of the movie.
He turned down playing Jax in Mortal Kombat for this role.
This is a good choice.
I would have taken this.
Yeah, this is definitely a good choice.
This is called classic status in this movie.
I was watching an interview, and I have a quote for you from Michael.
(13:21):
And it gives you a good sense of how he feels about this movie.
And he said, there is no footage of me ever saying that I liked Spawn.
I have never said that I thought it was a good movie.
Well, you know, at least he's honest.
I'll give him that.
Yeah, that's awesome.
Well, that's why I think they're looking at Jamie Foxx for the new remake.
Well, we'll get in the remake in a little bit.
But the next one I want to talk about is Jason Wynn, played by Martin Sheen.
(13:45):
He is the other villain in the movie.
How do you feel his portrayal was as a comic book villain?
I just didn't think he fit.
I just didn't like him.
I just thought he's I think over the top would be a good thing.
I think he kind of slightly over the top, almost non believable in some ways.
I agree with that.
There was one part where I thought was really funny.
(14:05):
He was like, they're telling him that he's got to get that device put on his heart.
Or, you know, so if he dies, he'll release the virus.
And they're like, you got to do that.
He's like, oh, yeah, yeah, no problem.
They just had no like, you didn't like you're going to put a device on your heart.
And he was just like, oh, yeah, yeah, let's do that.
They didn't even even flinch on that.
(14:28):
He's like, yeah, let's get that done.
What a good idea.
I just thought that was so silly.
Well, and he gets the advice from a guy who he knows works with demons.
He's like, hey, you know what?
That is a good call.
I'm going to do that.
I think in general, he's just he's very one dimensional.
There's no there's no like they don't try to make him human.
He's just a bad guy.
He's the Lex Luthor where it's just like I've got a bad idea and I'm running with it.
(14:49):
My goal is domination.
It's nothing else.
It's not like, well, I'm doing this because my uncle died.
I'm very stuck.
No, there's none of that.
He's just like, well, yeah, what do I need to do to control the world and have everyone
that doesn't want to follow me die a horrible death?
And so that's what he's working with.
Even his like when they at the start of the movie, he is he's the one who betrays Al Simmons
and gets him killed.
(15:09):
And he does because this demon guy told him to do it because other stuff he wants to like,
well, I'll do this for you.
But first, you got to kill this guy.
He's like, why?
He's like, why not?
I'm like, OK.
And he just does it like there's no he's worked with him for years.
There's nothing that's going to stop him from doing whatever he needs to do to succeed
in his in his plan, which is clearly a bad plan, like an evil plan.
So from that, it's in one way it's good for a comic book.
(15:29):
We kind of have to have that kind of black and white good, bad, and he's clearly bad.
Right.
There's no there's no good there.
But because of that, he's also not that interesting.
He's just like, yeah, I'm a bad guy, by the way.
Like, yep, we know.
Right.
Yeah, I agree.
And it's such a shame because it's Martin Sheen.
And, you know, that was a big name to be gathered for that movie.
(15:50):
So I think there was and I'm sure you enjoy it.
But again, I'm sure you didn't have much of a script to work with.
But I think the really good ones when they decide to dive in, that's why I like the John
I mean, you know, well, I can't even say his name now because when the really good ones,
when they dive in, they just throw themselves all on, even though they don't have to, they
could still literally phone it in.
Well, and in some ways, because John Liguzi, almost the clown slash violator character
(16:13):
is so over the top, it's kind of good that that this character is just a straightforward
like, no, I'm bad and I'm just going to do whatever it takes and fuck everybody else.
I'm going to get my plan to go through.
I'll backstab anybody, whatever it takes to get there.
Right.
He doesn't have all these funny lines.
He doesn't have all this extra need to chew up the scenery to someone else is doing it
for 90 percent of this movie.
Yeah, I really don't understand his plan at all.
(16:35):
Not Martin Sheen's plan.
His was just the role.
But Jason's plan as an overall story arc, I don't understand what he was trying to accomplish.
I mean, he dies, the world dies, but basically, right.
And is his goal.
You said world domination.
Did he actually say that at any point?
I don't know.
I believe he wanted.
Yes, he wanted to rule the world.
The consortium.
He wants to run.
He wants all the countries in the world to report to him ultimately who decide to follow
(16:59):
him.
Everybody else will not get the vaccine to the disease that he is harvested from the
North Koreans at the start of the movie.
He's going to release to the world.
And if he does that, then he everyone who takes the vaccine will then owe him forever
and he'll be in charge of everything.
That's his plan.
What I what I think is less can like.
I mean, it makes sense separately, but when you put it together, it doesn't make a lot
(17:19):
of sense.
So he's working with the with Malbolgia, who's basically the devil and violator, who is also
one of the devil's like lieutenants, henchmen or whatever.
And they're also working with with when to some level.
But really, their plan is trying to stab him in the back as well, because they want to
kill everybody in the world.
So they become more of spawn or more of Malbolgia's army and that spawn would lead, which clearly
(17:45):
we doesn't know about, because why would you want to rule the world if all of a sudden
there's also a thousand demons that are coming out?
So it's like there's this back and forth.
It's like, I'm not quite sure that they would ever work together, but it doesn't really
matter because there's a giant clown for most of the movie that's taking all of your attention.
He didn't read him in.
The problem was he didn't read him and he didn't read him into the total plan.
But I will tell you, here's my thought process.
(18:06):
If the devil comes and ask you a plan, are you really?
And it's one that involves getting a pacemaker.
You're really going to go through with it.
Is it do you think you're going to win in the end?
But here is two points for anybody that can name the virus.
What was the virus called?
He was six or something.
He ate or he'd six or something.
It's heat something or other.
All right.
Everybody's got one.
There it is.
Lewis, our guest has taken it to the top.
(18:29):
He actually paid attention in the movie.
Thank you, my friend.
Oh, man.
We were close.
We could have said anything and we said heat something.
It was close.
If you didn't say that, I wouldn't have got it.
I just piggybacked off your answer.
I think we've hinted at that this movie is pretty just jointed a little bit.
But what scene stuck out to you guys?
The motorcycle scene, the scene where he's like when he likes coming out
(18:53):
and he's on the bike and then all of a sudden he just does that thing where it's like that
where you can see the capabilities of his cape and the necroplasm and just the idea
that he can do these things.
That's dope.
Come on.
That was dope.
That was cool.
I like the fight scene in the whatever it was like the ballroom there where everybody
where he like smashes through that's kind of a classic sort of Batman sort of fight scene.
(19:15):
I enjoyed that.
You had the little belt thing come out.
That was that was that was fun.
Oh, yeah.
We were the I remember her name is Church was her name Church or Priest or something
that where she tries kicking in the crotch and the belt comes out and blocks it.
Yeah, it bites her leg.
She's like, well, you guys mentioned the cape a little bit, but you notice there's
not many scenes that the cape is actually in.
No, that was an expensive cape.
(19:36):
It was a very expensive cape.
They couldn't get it right for the majority of scenes.
So that's when so they didn't they tried putting into a ton of different scenes,
but no, it just never looked right.
It looked really good in the scene that Lewis mentioned where he jumps in through the glass
and you see the cape coming down.
That looked really good.
Well, and at the end at the end of the movie, it's like you see spa in the middle
and the cape is basically taking over most of the screen when he's standing on top of
(19:56):
the church or whatever.
Like, that's a good pose.
It's a good look.
It looks like the comic book panels.
The other scene I really liked.
I mean, the ballroom fight scene was good, but also the fight.
The first time he fights Violator, the clown character, once he becomes a demon, he becomes
this giant demon in the alleyways where spawn fights him the first time.
That's a very good fight scene.
I really enjoyed that.
(20:17):
It's got, you know, it shows that spawn is not quite sure on how to use all his powers,
but also it makes Violator seem deadly before it's like he's this clown.
Yeah, he does gross things and he can't be killed because he's a demon, but he doesn't
seem to be like scary in that moment where he comes this giant toothy gray, thin, creepy
monster and then just tears him apart.
So that's a great fight scene.
Yeah, they took that.
(20:38):
That was nice from the comic.
They took that sort of they were leading up to that in the comic, that fight, because
you didn't know if that was the same guy.
And then they kind of was like a page turn to reveal that.
So I appreciated that.
Now, I feel like that's where they spent the majority of the CGI budget.
The ending was completely lost.
They did not really spend a lot of money on CGI in the ending.
(20:58):
I think the CGI.
So the Violator CGI for when he's the demon even spawn himself, I think looks pretty good
in all the scenes where they're on Earth or whatever.
When they're in the real world, even like the scenes where they're Violators driving
this trash truck thing and spawn supposed to be stopping him, chasing him on a motorcycle
or whatever.
Those look good.
(21:19):
They still look pretty good.
I mean, they're a little wonky, but they're not terrible.
I remember the CG looking awful and I was watching him at this point.
I was like, Violator actually looks really good at these scenes.
But to Fergle's point, towards the end, anytime they're supposed to be in hell, it looks
horrific.
It looks so there's everything CG and it's too much and it's not good enough.
So it everything looks real.
(21:39):
It looks like a bad 90s video game on Sega CD.
It looks just like that.
Or like a music video.
Gonna roll a Sega or Dreamcast out on you.
It was the music video, the age with all the music videos that were coming out.
Yeah.
The Black Hole Sun.
It reminded me of Black Hole Sun.
Black Hole Sun looks like a masterpiece compared to the CG, though they have in the end of
(22:01):
this movie.
You know, the best part is the mouth motion.
His mouth doesn't move.
Oh, it's so bad.
It's just like, ah, like the voices coming out.
A couple things on that, guys.
First off, a third of the budget went to CGI.
And the funny thing about it, too, they didn't finish the CGI until two weeks before it hit
theaters.
They were working up on this to the very last minute because it kept ballooning out of the
(22:24):
cost.
They started with a 20 million dollar budget and it's spending 40 million dollars because
of the CGI.
The reason why his mouth doesn't move is because they were trying to get across you
that it's he's speaking through hell.
I kid you not.
That's something you make up when you can't make it look good.
You're like, well, it's because he's speaking through fire.
So you would need to speak through fire.
Did he sound like the guy from Inspector Gadget, Dr. Claw?
(22:47):
Yeah, just a hand and a chair.
How did Spawn get the ability to kill every other Spawn, to hurt all the other Spawns?
That was also somebody running out of money and saying, let's just draw green stuff.
And that's how they're going to get out.
Let's make a lot of green electricity.
Well, the original idea for Hell, which they did film a little bit, was it's just a dark
(23:07):
room.
So it'd be Spawn talking to himself in a black room.
And by the end, they're like, yeah, that doesn't work so much.
So that's why we needed a CGI plan.
So the CGI was to solve the problem that came, which was originally just a bad idea.
I'm not sure that fixed it.
No, that made it worse.
Because again, up until that point, up until you do see Hell early on, but there's not
that much going on and it's not there as long.
(23:29):
So it was better.
But yeah, once Malbolgier shows up, once there's that hole towards the end, you see like 5,000
Spawns and it just looked so bad.
Yes.
Miserable.
Yes.
And then when he gets his head zipped off by the thing and he's like, can I get some tongue?
Can I get some tongue?
Why don't we talk a little about the CGI?
(23:50):
We've been sort of touching on it.
The I own the DVD for this, sadly.
And on the movie, on the box itself, it says the special effects movie event of the year.
Does the CGI live up to that title?
In some parts.
I think if you're a fan of Spawn and you were going in and there were obviously a lot of
fans of Spawn, it's one of the top comics ever sold for an independent at the time.
(24:14):
I really think it actually is the top comic, if I'm not mistaken.
Then yeah, you got exactly what you were looking for.
You got a representation of what was in the comic at that time out in public.
This is a bold claim to say in 1997 that this is the CGI event of the year.
When this is the same year that the Star Wars special editions came out,
which were also heavily enhanced with CGI where you didn't even notice half the time.
(24:36):
It was just stuff they added in the background.
And at the time, that was incredible.
So comparatively, this is not the CGI event of 1997.
Yeah, I don't know.
I think that's a stretch.
I think it's a stretch.
It's a good salesmanship.
Yeah.
I was reading some facts, but I think it was like they spent, they actually subcontracted
22 different special effects companies to make this thing happen.
(24:56):
So maybe I think they're not looking at it as like movie event of the year as in it's amazing.
It's just a big event.
They had a bunch of people show up, hang out for a little bit.
I think it was actually good CGI.
Now that's the whole world they look at.
Actually, when I had my physical store, I had several customers that were actually
VFX creators for Marvel.
And they had special put in T1, T4 lines, a massive NDAs or like 400 pages.
(25:21):
And they had to put out this data for 10 or 15 seconds of a VX scene.
But that's not 1997.
In 1997, this was a lot of CGI.
So I do agree.
There's a lot.
And again, when they're not in hell, I think it actually still looks really good.
So I was impressed with some of the CGI in this movie.
But when you're not impressed with it, it's very, very unimpressive.
(25:42):
Yeah, I think what stuck with me, I thought going back to watch the movie that the CGI
was terrible for the entire thing, but it's not.
And I think it made me think that was the devil.
Yes.
That lingered with me for 25 years.
Now, now, Boja, he was not frightening at all.
He looked like he needed a dentist.
The original plan for him too was they were actually going to go with a puppet.
That would have been better because the drawing looks like a like a Jim Henson kind of muppet thing.
(26:07):
Maybe like a dark crystal.
I could work with that.
I think it would have been better.
Or the Guyver.
The Guyver.
As long as J.J. Walker played Malboja, I think it would work out perfectly.
That's the tie.
That's the tie we were all waiting for.
The crossover we've all needed in our life.
This movie clocks at 96 minutes.
How's the pacing for it?
(26:28):
Not bad.
It actually moves along pretty quickly.
At the time that this was made, and I don't have it in front of me,
is this a Marvel or an independent movie?
I know they had a crazy director, Diop, but was this back to where Ben Grohl by Marvel
or was this Ben Grohl by Image or Valiant at the time?
I don't remember seeing it.
It was not Marvel.
It's New Line Cinema, so it probably was not Marvel.
(26:52):
Okay, so it was New Line Cinema.
You're right.
It was, yep, New Line was headlining on top of this.
This may have been on the end of their days as New Line Cinema,
because at one point New Line was, if there was a horror movie,
they're like Blumehouse of the 90s.
They did Ninja Turtles too, didn't they?
Yes, they did.
The original Ninja Turtles, I think.
So I think they were considered an independent, right?
(27:13):
More or less.
They were.
They were a large independent studio.
At the time, there weren't many of them.
They were very consistent too.
The smartest thing McFarlane ever did was not sell his rights.
He kept all the rights.
He just allowed them to use the story, but he kept all the rights.
Because I think the Neil Gaiman fight taught him something,
taught him something pretty damn serious that you got to be careful about this,
especially when it's this big.
(27:34):
He was trying to pitch us around.
He was actually looking for a lot of upfront money, but to get the butt,
no one wanted to give them $40 million or $60 million to make it.
So he decided to take $1, but he had to keep all the merchandising rights.
Well, that works when you own the toy company.
Exactly.
Smart.
He's a smart dude, definitely business-wise.
(27:57):
Yeah.
Again, not often.
And I would also put him in the same category.
As I said again, Rob Leofield.
At a certain point, you can create that character.
Because there are guys like Alan Moore who should still be getting
all the rights off Swamp Thing because all the new movies coming out with that.
And he's pretty much, I believe, a stickler.
(28:17):
I think he sold those things off or doesn't own his majority of them.
I didn't even have anything to begin with with those DC things.
And he also hates working with people to make movies.
What, Alan Moore?
Yeah.
What do you think about Todd McFarlane's performance in the movie?
So again, I blinked through YouTube because I wasn't going to rent it today.
(28:38):
So I pieced together the movie through YouTube.
So which scene were you referencing that Todd McFarlane was in?
He's like a homeless guy, isn't he?
Yeah. He bumps into him in the alleyway.
There was an action in that one.
It didn't get on my YouTube when I was piecing together this movie.
Virgo, at this point, you didn't actually watch the whole movie.
I might.
I might.
This is Todd McFarlane.
(28:59):
So back to the original question.
Was the movie long enough?
Did you want more or was it too long as it was?
No, it was good enough.
Yeah. I mean, 90 minutes is pretty short.
We've done some others that go on way too long or that you think it's going to be too long
and it's not that long.
But 90 minutes for this is good.
There's definitely more background you could put in.
We mentioned Cogliostro who's kind of like in this movie, he's like a previous,
(29:23):
it's not a Spawn necessarily, but he worked for the devil or Malvozio or somebody like 500 years ago.
And so now he's kind of there to be Spawn's mentor and kind of guide him away from working
for the devil and work for the forces of good.
I guess it's a good evil fight.
But I would like to see a little more of his background because again,
he just kind of comes out of nowhere.
He says like, oh, I used to do this 500 years ago.
(29:44):
Now you will.
What?
Like, there's not a lot of background, but at the same time, did I need it?
No, that's the only thing I think was missing.
Everything else I didn't need more of.
Thank God there wasn't an hour and a half of Al Simmons pre-spawn in this.
It was just like he starts out.
He gets killed to become Spawn.
I didn't need a ton of background on a lot of the other characters.
I liked knowing literally nothing about Violator when you first meet him.
(30:08):
And then you learn more throughout the movie on him, but you don't need,
well, where'd Violator come from?
Was he used to be a clown?
None of that was in there.
And I don't know if it was ever in the comics because I haven't, again, read a lot of Spawn
just a little bit, but I liked just enough to know he's a demon.
You don't need anything else.
Period.
He's a demon.
He seems to be on the same tier as Spawn, but not quite the same skill set.
So he's not going to be the general.
That was one of my concerns.
(30:28):
I didn't understand quite why.
So they're trying to get Spawn angry enough to kill Wynn, which will cause the pacemaker
they put him to go off and kill everybody on Earth or most people.
The apocalypse.
Yep.
Why doesn't Violator just do it?
I don't understand.
There's got to be rules or something.
So what you're telling me, Jeremy, you didn't want a 20 minute
(30:50):
backstory on the clown's work as a street performer in Memphis.
No, but I expect that.
If this would have been a current movie or if this would have been a series,
let's say it's on HBO or whatever is like a 12 part series, there would be one episode
about nothing but this sad street performer clown that somehow becomes perverted and becomes
the Violator.
(31:10):
That's a guarantee.
I'm okay without that.
It would have been interesting, but I didn't need it.
I was kind of glad it wasn't there.
A lot of these movies do try to fall too much on.
Let's explain everything.
And then you're like, well, this was a great origin for everybody.
And at the end, they get a pizza and you don't see anything else that happens.
So they don't have to do that.
They actually run through the whole story.
You see the start to finish of both Malbo's plan to some level, although it's not over.
(31:33):
The fight continues, right?
But the battle's won and then wins, you know, and for his plan, his plan ends.
So the earthly immediate threat is resolved, but the good versus evil plot goes on.
But the battle is won.
I like that it was just long enough to have that.
I was interested in seeing where else it goes, but I didn't feel like now I got to see the
sequel because I don't know what's going to happen next.
Like you've got a closure in this.
(31:54):
You don't need any more.
I agree.
They moved it along.
They got right into it and, you know, they had a couple of fight scenes and that was
it.
They wrapped it up.
I, you know, it was pretty, you know, one, two, three, not too much, not too little.
There is a director's cut of this movie.
Originally, the original cut of this movie was rated R and they cut it down to qualify
(32:14):
for a PG-13.
Do you want to see the rated R version of this movie and the director's cut?
Do you have the director's cut?
I do not.
I was going to say, yeah, on DVD, I assumed you had the director's cut.
I mean, if the director's cut is increased violence, then I would say in this case, that's
fine because it's a very violent kind of character.
That's okay with me.
If it's, you know, do I need more scenes in hell?
(32:36):
No.
Do I need more story about the homeless kid he hangs out with?
No.
So if depending what the director's cut is, I might want to see it.
And if it is literally just cutting out fight scenes and violence or whatever, for the sake
of getting the rating, sure, I'd like to see what it was.
But most of the time, you know, I didn't feel like after I was watching this, I was like,
I wish there was more of this or the fights weren't good enough.
(32:57):
I enjoyed the fights that were in there aside from the very last fight, which is fine, but
it was all CG and hell.
And I was just glad it was over.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't need to see the director's cut.
I'm good on it.
Probably not.
But if it did leak into kind of like the prosthetics design, because the practical effects, I don't
think we can underestimate those.
Those were really good.
There was a lot of good practical effects for what it was at the time.
(33:20):
So, I mean, I'm really curious to see again how they remake this movie, because it's very
much like, you know, Blade and other movies, they've got kind of kicking around the tin
can for a while.
They're not going to make a stupid story.
They know how important the character is.
They're not going to screw with it.
Well, it's a tough character because you got to, if you're going to watch a movie, you
got to care about the character.
(33:42):
Yeah.
He's a tough guy to care about.
I don't know.
I mean, they try to infuse a little bit like, I feel bad now that I've been in
an assassin role all these years.
You know, now I feel bad.
I don't know.
I feel like I don't connect with this guy.
But, you know, that's the tough part.
You got to pick the right actor and it's got to have the right.
(34:04):
Well, keep in mind, Liam Nielsen did it well.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's true.
All right.
I'd say it's a lot like a Batman character, right?
Like after you learn the origins of Batman, you don't need him to do anything other than
be there.
And you're really watching it for the villains, right?
You're watching it to see how is he going to stop whatever they're doing.
And some of the later Batman movies are, you know, 80% villain, 20% Batman.
He's just there.
And you're like, yep, he's going to stop the day because he's Batman.
(34:25):
But you don't need a lot of the background for Batman.
Instead, you're eating up watching, you know, the Riddler or whoever else being
taking over most of the movie.
And I think that's how you'd have to handle Spawn.
He'd have to.
That's and they kind of do that here by having Violator be so much of the focus of this.
Spawn doesn't have to do more than just be there.
I thought 96 was a good number for it just in general, because I did check my watch a
(34:47):
couple of times because it feels a little just just joined for me.
Now, the director's cut, just so you guys are aware, is an extra two minutes.
Oh, man.
Who has that kind of time?
You write that up pretty strongly, my friend.
You could have told us that and stop that whole conversation.
We got two minutes.
Yeah, throw it in there.
I was curious.
(35:08):
Just full frontal spawn shots.
That's it.
So, Jeremy, you sort of touched on this is an origin story.
And I know you guys have had problems with origin stories in the past.
Did this movie pull off the origin story?
Yes, I think it did because you have a full conflict.
You get to meet a real villain.
You're not just watching Spawn fight homeless people for two hours.
(35:29):
And then at the end, he fights a much stronger homeless person.
Like Violator is a great villain and he's kind of a spawn foil.
He's in there.
It's good.
Much like the Joker for Batman, that first Batman movie.
Yes, it's an origin story.
But at the same time, it's a full contained story.
It's got a villain you want to watch.
This is very similar.
So I think they do pull it off.
That's been my problem specifically.
And like we did the Punisher, I thought that was fine.
(35:52):
But as an origin story, it was like 60% dull until the Punisher shows up.
Right.
So this doesn't have that problem.
I got to echo in with this thing on the Punisher.
Again, I'm just going to say the whole run of Punishers,
except for the Dolph Lundar movie are great.
But at the end of the day, this movie, you know, I think you're right.
(36:13):
You don't need a ton of Al Simmons, but you still need Al Simmons.
And you got to do it right.
And I mean, he's hard to care about.
But I think you got a minefield of really cool spawn stories that you can do.
Even the one that just blew across, although it'll never happen.
I think it could happen animated with Batman and Spawn crossing over.
That would be such a dope story.
(36:34):
That just on the story face alone would be dope as shit.
This movie had a lot of, in pre-production, sort of who they're going forward to tap
for these different roles.
And I want to get your guys take on them.
The director, there were two other choices for director before they finally settle on
Mark Dippis.
Dippis, whatever his name was.
Just go with Dippie.
The first one, his name is Alex Prorius.
(36:55):
You may not know him, but he's the guy who directed Dark City.
Could you see a Dark City version of Spawn?
Maybe.
I'm familiar with that movie.
Oh, go find it.
It's good.
It's good.
It's different, but it would work.
But again, you're comparing it to a director that's not directed anything before this or since.
So I don't know.
He can't have done worse than this guy.
Well, the original director, they were tapping for this, but he decided to turn down with
(37:16):
Tim Burton.
I'm glad it wasn't because, again, Tim Burton does a very specific thing.
And I don't think Spawn fits in that, even though I have compared it to Batman and the
first two Batman movies.
He, you know, the first two 90s Batman movies or 89, whatever, were Tim Burton.
But even the second one would became very Tim Burton.
Right.
So it's like, I'm glad it wasn't because I think it would end up being too close to
(37:38):
Batman Returns.
That's right.
I get it.
I was thinking in my head, I was like, if Tim Burton does this, how could he, how different
could he make it from his, like those Batman movies?
It just seems like the guy's got a cape and he's got a dark city and.
Batman with a red cape.
All you got to do is look at Superman with Nicolas Cage and be like, that's exactly how
(37:58):
Spawn would be.
Now, one character we actually did touch on all is Terry Fitzgerald.
We sort of touched on it.
That's Spawn's best friend who goes off and marries his wife.
Yeah.
D.B. Sweeney.
Yep.
So the original, the original person cast for that was Ed Norton.
I mean, that would have been fine because again, that character in this movie in general,
he's there.
(38:18):
So you have the connection that, you know, Spawn gets mad.
His friend is now with his wife or whatever, and he does have a plot point later and sort
of, but he's not important to the story otherwise.
You're not hanging out with him at all.
He doesn't have any character growth.
You could have been anybody.
So Ed Norton would have been fine there.
I like it, but I don't think it would have made a difference.
Agreed.
The Vindicator, Violator, whatever his name is, Jim Carrey.
(38:41):
No, John Leguiziamo, the little guy with the guy with the exaggerated face.
I think because he did the transvestite movie, that's what really put the whole face together
for it.
I like that you were like, you know what?
I don't want the guy with the exaggerated face.
I mean, I do want the guy with the exaggerated face.
So I'll use John Leguiziamo as opposed to the guy who literally is known for his exaggerated
face.
(39:01):
But I do think I like John Leguiziamo in this role because it works.
I think Jim Carrey, again, he would have been way too well known by 1997.
It would end up being like the Riddler where it's a lot of Jim Carrey on this character
that might not match the comic anymore.
Jim Carrey's Riddler is fine.
I liked it when I saw it.
That movie is not great.
But the Riddler in the comics is a totally different beast than the version that Jim
(39:25):
Carrey put out.
So I think that would end up happening with Violator and the Clown.
For some reason, I can't see Jim Carrey doing that.
I don't know.
Even though the Violator made me feel weird.
I think that John Leguiziamo was the right guy.
That sounds like a lot of therapy.
I'm sure that, you know, I say, my friend, I will sit here and I still get the eevee
(39:45):
jeevees thinking about Cemetery Man.
There are just some movies that don't deserve a movie.
And that was one of them.
I still love our discussion about Cemetery Man.
Now, Spawn had many people that cast for it.
I want to go through each one.
You guys just tell me if you want to see that version of Spawn or if you thought that version
of Spawn might be better.
And these are no particular order.
So first off, Wesley Snipes.
No.
You can do it.
I think it'd be fine.
Yeah, it'd been fine.
(40:05):
Cuba Getting Jr.
Yes.
See, that's a weird pick.
But I only know him from what was it?
Boat Trip.
So that's not the same guy.
It's the same guy, but a different character.
And Radio.
Snoop Dogg.
No.
Of course.
Of course.
Can you imagine?
Can you imagine?
I mean, there's not even like Snoop Dogg as a CIA assassin.
(40:28):
No, it's not going to work.
Well, you did see the Day Shift, didn't you?
The movie with Jenny Foxley going after vampires.
Snoop Dogg is a vampire hunter in that movie.
He's Snoop Dogg as a vampire hunter.
So it'd be Snoop Dogg as Spawn.
That's not going to work.
I would like to see it.
Yeah.
Let me take it back.
It would be amazing to see.
(40:49):
Would it be good?
No.
Next up is Denzel Washington.
Possibly.
He could, but I think it's a wasting Denzel Washington.
And that is definitely wasting.
And I think Denzel's smart enough because I just saw a video the day where Will Smith
can't even talk about they turned down the Matrix.
And they chose Samuel L. Jackson.
No, he would have played a better Jason Wynn though.
(41:09):
Yeah, I think it would have been Jason Wynn.
Even in 97, he was still, I'm trying to think what he would have been around the
same time to gauge age, but I think he'd be too old for this role, which seems wrong.
We're even thinking of him now, but he always like seems older than he is.
He's 136 years old.
This was a deep blue seed time period, I think, wasn't it?
Which I like that, but I don't think he would have been a good spawn, but that's okay.
(41:30):
But I do agree.
It would have been a good win.
Bing Reims.
No, no, he's just too big.
It would have looked weird.
Imagine how large he would have looked to spawn if he massive.
Okay.
How about two poxacore guys?
Too skinny.
See Snoop could pull it off.
Snoop could pull it off.
Snoop could be a skinny spawn.
(41:50):
But not too tall.
Too tall.
I don't know.
It's too tall.
LL Cool J.
You did this up.
Come on.
Are we really going through the whole list of black people?
No.
Yeah, one more left.
One more black person left.
Good job, Chris.
One more.
There's one more left.
God bless America.
This is the who's who of black people in 98.
(42:13):
No, Will Smith stayed on Independence Day.
And that's from the Affirmed Black Person on the crew.
There's a lot of black folks.
That's all I got for who they were thinking about for casting purposes.
No, I think they did a good job casting.
Again, any weakness in the acting is not the fault of the actor.
It is a pretty rough character to play, and it's not the best script.
(42:36):
Exactly.
And that's right there.
This movie doesn't suffer from good talent.
I mean, again, Michael Jai White is a badass martial artist.
I actually wish we had saw more of that.
But it does suffer from bad script writing.
So at the end of the day, guys, what did you love about this movie?
And what could they have done better?
I like Violator.
(42:56):
I like Spawn.
I think those two guys are pretty awesome.
And then everything else.
Like you said, the script could have been a lot better.
A lot of corny lines, a lot of like eight, like 90s references that don't,
like no one's going to know what those even mean.
You know, it's not like you can't, you know, you can't just say,
it's not like you can't be timeless.
(43:18):
It's like they made it.
It's like stuck in the 90s.
Well, it didn't help the music.
The music threw it in the 90s for me.
Like that whole soundtrack is is literally every late 90s superhero movie is in.
This soundtrack works.
It I liked I liked the Violator more than I remembered.
I actually think he's really good, like a good character in this.
(43:39):
It looks really good even when he's the big demon in the real world.
It looks good.
Spawn's character, Spawn's costume actually looks better than I thought.
I don't know why I thought it looked.
I remembered it not looking good, but then I watched this time.
I was like, it actually looks really good.
I think it looks better than the current Venom costume.
I think the current Venom costume looks pretty bad in the Venom movies,
but I think this actually looks better than that.
What I what I think they did.
And again, this is a script issue because I've only read the first few Spawn comics,
(44:03):
but the Spawn comics in the original comics,
he can't remember like what's going on in his past.
And he like sees things that remind him like who's this woman I'm thinking of in my head.
Oh, he finds it's his wife when he sees like a locket or in a ring or something.
That wasn't in this instead, you know,
Al Simmons wakes up as Spawn and tries to go find his family.
And so this is really awkward party scene.
(44:25):
I think they could have done more with him learning who he was with flashbacks
and make that little less awkward.
But I mean, other than that, I think it actually and the hell scenes,
I know you mentioned that they were trying to get around
that they've only just filmed a dark room or we're going to.
I think I would much rather see a dark room.
I think the hell scenes are what make this not as good as it could be.
I think they when you look at it now, the hell scenes are the weak point of this film.
(44:47):
Blamed the app.
I think the whole script needs a whole rewrite.
I mean, there's I mean, there were some visuals that were pretty interesting for the 90s,
but the actual script itself, the plot makes no sense at the end of the day.
It just it's all over the place.
And that that CGI of the devil or hell is just horrible.
(45:08):
Yeah, now, now, Boja looks bad.
It looks it literally does look like an old video game.
It's not good.
And Lewis, it's very dated.
This whole movie is very dated from the soundtrack to some of the quips.
I was at one point, the clown likes I don't remember the exact quote,
but it's a tie to the girly man pump you up, guys.
He says a quote about that.
I was like, Jesus, like that.
That was one that I was like, oh, boy.
(45:30):
I know that quote because I saw it in my YouTube clips I was watching.
Next episode, Fergill's just going to watch the trailer and talk about that.
We're going to be good.
What's that? Depending on the movie, if it's cemetery, man.
What is the cemetery, man?
I got to see this. Oh, God, sweet Jesus.
It's had quite an effect on you guys.
You can listen to the episode that we talk about it or go see the movie or do both.
(45:52):
It's a horror movie.
It's got some questionable parts.
Questionable is a good word.
You can leave the only thing redeeming on that movie is boobies.
And I promise you that if you find me on Facebook, you like this dude was right.
Those tits are fabulous.
It's an 80s movie.
Yeah. But I mean, as fabulous fake tits, those were up there in the top five.
(46:15):
Now, to be fair, that's the same thing Fergill said about the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles episode.
So now I mean, who had fabulous, big tits in that one?
All four turtles.
They were fabulous.
They were fabulous. The costumes were fabulous.
But I think you didn't understand how it was all coming together.
These folks don't always appreciate the hard work that goes in the 80s movies.
And I get it. I get it.
(46:35):
Fergill, you have actually sort of hinted at that.
There are actually talks of a reboot for this movie that's been talked about for a long time.
For 20 years.
And Jamie Foxx is being sort of thought of being for that role.
Do you guys want to see that reboot or should this thing just disappear into the dustpan of history?
No, a reboot is necessary.
The comics are flying up.
It's one of the few resilient books in the marketplace.
(46:57):
Fergill and Signature has achieved a status pretty similar to Stan Lee's.
So it on its own will drive a book up by a pretty significant margin.
So I mean, yes, a remake is good.
Do I think Jamie Foxx is the guy?
I don't know.
I think there are a lot of very good African American actors.
Like Pierre Johnson, the guy who's doing the Green Lantern.
(47:21):
Idris Elba is another one.
I think the guy who played in Hawkman is another one that could be really good at this.
There's a lot of good actors that could do this.
So I'm not sure Jamie Foxx can pull it off.
I think that's why he did the action movie recently with Cameron Diaz.
I think he's trying to prove that that Rogaine shit is still working out for him.
Whatever Viagra he's using to clear up all the brain power is making them work.
(47:43):
I want them to make a sequel to this and I want it to be good.
So bad.
I want it to be great.
I don't know.
I'm just rooting for that for some reason.
I had something connected to my childhood.
I want them to make a good Spawn movie, not too bad Spawn movies.
Yeah.
And it doesn't have to be a sequel.
It could be a reboot.
I don't need the same story and I'm sure they would do a better job.
(48:04):
But I mean, I would like to see this with current effects and then more interesting plots overall.
This definitely has like an early, not even early, but like a mid 90s comic book plot.
You know, we've talked about Ghost Rider and some other ones and they all have these like goofy,
really silly plots.
(48:24):
This is up there with that.
Yeah, I think it deserves a reboot and let this version of just disappear.
No.
Well, also, I mean, it's not a movie, but there are three seasons of an animated series that were
on HBO.
It's actually very well done.
You can still find it.
It's actually on YouTube for free.
I'm sure it's probably not supposed to be, but it's easily found.
So I would check that out as well.
(48:45):
I think it doesn't follow the same plot as the comics for the most part.
They all start out kind of the same, but it takes its own turn.
But it's not bad at all.
It's well worth.
I think it's better than this movie and I didn't hate this movie.
So guys, what is your actual rating of this movie?
I'm going to go with a nice, slightly upward thumb pointed right at the violator's head
(49:07):
with Al Simmons pointing as well with me with his chains and escape.
I got to give it a half thumb, but it's the violator's hand held up with that piece of pizza
with the maggots all over it because that was pretty also pretty remarkable.
But it's a half thumb.
I mean, I liked it.
It was enjoyable more than I thought it was.
Is it something I'd say you have to rush out to find?
(49:27):
No, probably not.
And I would love to see them redo this.
Those are real maggots, by the way.
Yeah, he threw up after eating that stuff.
Oh, God, that's gross.
It seemed like he turned his back and something weird was happening there.
I'm going to give it one thumb because I really think they tried really hard on this.
And it wasn't the greatest.
(49:49):
It is stuck in the 90s, but I think they gave it a go and they did put together a movie.
It had a beginning and end and then it was one total package.
So they did what they tried to do.
Boom.
This guy, I like the thought process.
I like where you're bringing it.
I'd give it one failed chain up.
You know the scene where Spomb tries to send those chains and they fall back down again?
(50:14):
That's why I give this movie.
It's a good one.
It's okay.
I bet it's a half failed chain and it fails.
I need a viagra for that.
So, Lewis, where can we find you?
Okay, so people can find me.
I have a website.
It's lp-comics.com.
I have some of my books there.
(50:35):
My Instagram, I post a lot.
So it's lwis10221980.
I have to change that, but I will one day.
And so check me out.
I have a lot of my artwork on there and you can see all the different stores where I have my books.
(50:55):
And I also just want to make a quick mention.
I am so I'm publishing a book.
It's at the printers right now.
I'll have that ready for spring.
Survival Girl and Puppy Number One.
And then I also am working on another comic with a writer.
His name is Kevin Michael Rowe.
And we are working on a comic called Invasion on Center Street.
(51:17):
And it's like a sci-fi horror yarn.
It's going to be a lot of fun.
And you can check him out at what's his website here.
I'm going to put his stuff in the show notes along with my other stuff.
On our website, there's a page for our guests where people should be able to find your links as well.
That's awesome.
Thank you so much for that.
(51:37):
And Jeremy, where can people find you?
You can always find me every two weeks here, but also at Retrovania.net,
where we have a podcast called Retrovaniacs.
It comes out four times a month along with some Twitch streams and videos.
Well, you can find me right here on getting your movie smashed.
Otherwise, you can find me at Get Your Nerd On.
You can find me on Instagram.
You can find me on Facebook.
(51:57):
You can find me on TikTok.
Weaving masterful stories, telling masterful stories, putting my two cents into everything.
So come enjoy it.
And oh, selling a few comic books here and there.
Couple things.
Couple things, but only the coolest shit.
And for me, you can always find me at All Final Creations.
We're always over there building some piece of nerdy furniture.
I want to thank you, our listeners, for spending some time with us today.
(52:18):
And I have no idea about Spawn.
I have no quip about it.
But you want to send me a note about why I should have been smarter about what I could
put at the end of this episode.
Send me a note over at movie-smash.com.
And we'll see you in a couple of weeks.
Thank you again for listening, and I hope you enjoy the show.
This has been Movie Smash with Chris Roberts, Jeremy Parmentier, and Fergal Amayo,
(52:40):
produced by me, Chris Roberts, executive produced by Off Panel Creations, LLC.
Movie clips provided by their respective studios.
You can rate and review the show at Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
You might even find your review read on a future episode.
Got a question for us?
Visit us at movie-smash.com and send us a note.
It too can be read on a future episode.
If you haven't already, please subscribe to Movie Smash wherever you listen to your podcasts.
(53:03):
Next episode, Fergal's just going to watch the trailer and talk about that.
Yeah, we were all either high, drunk, or some combination thereof.
He made me feel uncomfortable.
But he eats up every scene he's in.
Just full frontal spawn shots.
That sounds like a lot of therapy.
The violator made me feel weird.
Yeah, you know what? That is a good call.
I pieced together the movie through YouTube.
And it was a sitcom.
Hello and welcome to Movie
Smash.
(01:29):
Hello and welcome to Movie Smash,
the show where we dive headfirst into comic book movies outside the MCU.
If you're new to the show, thanks for joining us.
If you've been here before, you know the drill.
Each episode, we're going to smash a movie whose source material is from a graphic novel or a comic.
Is it worth revisiting?
Should it be forgotten?
Let's find out.
This is Movie Smash.
I'm one of your hosts, Chris Roberts.
I'm the founder of All Panel Creations.
With me today, I have Jeremy Parmentier.
(01:50):
Hey, this is Jeremy Parmentier.
I've also returned from hell, but a hell of playing bad video games on Retrovaniac's podcast.
And Fergal Amayo.
What's going on, y'all?
This is your proprietor of Everything Awesome, Fergal Amayo Gotham Night Comics.
Staying well, my good friend Jeremy has returned from hell.
I have returned from heaven with the sword of Michael to avenge.
And let's get down and dirty.
(02:11):
And our guest host today is Lewis Peterson.
How you doing, y'all?
I am Lewis Peterson.
I am a comic book creator and illustrator.
I am the creator of Mason and also a new comic book coming out called Survival Girl and Puppy.
Come check that out.
Thanks for joining us.
And our movie today is 1997 Spawn starring Michael J. White, John Leguizamo and Martin Sheen.
(02:32):
Directed by Mark Dipp, Dipp A?
I don't know.
It's the only movie that's ever produced.
Dippy.
I'm telling you, it's a diap.
It's diap.
We're all going to be surprised.
It's going to be, my name is Mark Dipp.
Imagine a substance with the power to destroy humanity.
(02:53):
Imagine a creature insane enough to use it.
Imagine a hero on the verge of creation.
From flesh to steel.
You must visualize your objectives.
From blood to blade.
(03:14):
Don't get cocky.
You have a lot more to learn.
From man to spawn.
Pick a boo.
I see you.
So Lewis, why did you pick this movie?
I just, I've been trying to figure that out why I picked it.
(03:34):
I feel like it's one of the one movies that's not Marvel.
It's not DC.
It's not, I don't know, just, I think it was ahead of its time and it needs some shine here.
So before you saw this movie, guys, before you saw this movie, guys, were you familiar with the comic?
Yes, absolutely.
I believe anyone that, again, that golden age, but during the time of Dicko and Kirby,
(03:57):
there was these golden age artists that made amazing work.
That's when we started seeing these guys and I think we're at that point now.
So that's where, yeah, this is a great comic, great story, great movie.
My brother was a big Spawn fan.
I read a few of the comics, but not a lot.
And so I more remembered things like the toys and things that were added to it because,
you know, McFarland, Tom McFarland, who had kind of been the creator of Spawn,
(04:21):
the original artist and everything, had these toys later that were very, very detailed,
looked very, very cool, but they were not the most pliable to play with.
But when you were a toy collector and I used to work at a comic and toy store,
we had all the McFarland toys, I remember those more than the comic itself.
I was a big Tom McFarland fan.
(04:42):
I loved them and Amazing Spider-Man, Adjective Lives Spider-Man,
and when he came out with Spawn, it just continued.
And the artwork was like the main draw for me.
I don't know if I really read the stories back when I first was collecting them,
but I loved the artwork.
I would copy the artwork and just it was the best.
It was the best thing at the time.
I didn't think it was like anything else at the time when it was coming out.
(05:07):
So I had followed him until he stopped drawing Spawn.
So I collected everything that he drew.
And see, that's what I'm talking about, right?
Like he reinvented both of you guys, Lewis and Jeremy, he reinvented so many genres.
Again, with you got to mention with giants like Capullo, Snyder, Kirkman, Silvestri,
I mean, Leopold, I mean, these guys reinvented, but McFarland from both the toy game,
(05:30):
it's when he came as pre.
If you just look at toys pre and post McFarland, you can see the difference, right?
They go for much more detail orientation.
There really is.
And I've got them all behind me.
So I got a lot of different ones behind me and they just, I love the detail.
That's probably the best part.
You might not get to play with them as much, but that detail just makes them so awesome.
You can build on that.
And the comics, the art was something else.
(05:53):
It was completely, we were not used to that because we're Sterenko guys.
We're still looking at the 70s, early 80s.
And then all of a sudden this art comes out.
You're like, what is this?
Yeah.
He broke all the rules of perfect everything.
He just made it look cool.
Didn't have to follow all the rules of perspective, anatomy.
It was just like this awesome, awesome page layouts and just wild poses.
(06:18):
And it was just awesome to look at.
Yeah.
I wasn't feeling respond at all.
The, I could pick him out of lineup, but I had no idea who he was, power sets,
anything like that.
I just knew he existed.
It's about it.
I think you'd be afraid to pick him out of the lineup.
Let's be honest.
Like if you were like, okay, who was the guy that robbed you?
Is it the guy with the flowing red cape?
I honestly think he'd be like, no, that's not the guy.
(06:41):
Third guy from the left.
So was this your guy's first time watching this movie?
Not at all.
No.
Yeah, no, I'd seen it before, but again, based on 1997, there's a solid chance I was
it's not, not non-drunk.
And so I don't remember much about it except for John Luguziamo as the cloud, which we'll
get into, I'm sure.
And not liking it very much.
(07:02):
I'm looking forward to seeing if I liked it anymore this time around.
I know I saw it.
I don't remember seeing it, but I definitely saw it.
I'm 17.
So I don't, I don't know what I was doing at the time.
Probably something like that.
I would imagine.
Yeah.
We were all either high drunk or some combination there of possibly with friends.
This would have been a movie I wouldn't have taken a date to.
(07:22):
So this would have been homeboys.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I was in college at the time, so I have no idea when I saw it, but I definitely saw it
in theaters at that time.
It was one of those random movies you see on the weekends at a very shady movie theater
by College Park.
College Park, Georgia?
No, Maryland.
Oh, Maryland.
Oh yeah.
Sorry.
Boom.
That's way off.
I'm sorry.
I don't even know how we got there.
(07:42):
I apologize.
Georgia.
Not to offend our Georgia listeners.
So Fergal, do you have any little bit of comic book history for us?
A little bit of lore?
I mean, 1992, so again, don't want to bore you with a ton of details because you should
know who Spawn is by now, but it came out of Todd McFarlane's mind when he was 16.
He created this book.
(08:03):
This character is considered one of the top 200 of all time.
Longest running comic book, I believe, independent for sure.
It spawned so many set up characters.
It spawned a toy company that's a multi-billion dollar company.
It changed multiple industries, spawned entire lines.
I think you mentioned Lewis, the Spider-Man run.
There's countless lines.
(08:24):
Those books of McFarlane's do not fetch less than several thousands of dollars.
They are very well known books.
I think that's the biggest thing.
It's great stories.
I mean, multiple characters.
The Neil Gaiman thing I think you mentioned earlier.
You got Medieval Spawn, Gunslinger Spawn, Angela, who's now a Marvel, is now a sister of Thor.
(08:45):
It's an interesting combination there.
So quick spoiler warning for you guys.
If this is your first time joining us, just a heads up.
We're about to discuss certain elements of the story that might be considered spoilers
of this very 90s movie.
So consider yourself warned.
Lewis, you want to walk us through the plot of this movie?
Sure.
Our story follows Al Simmons.
He's a government assassin.
(09:05):
There's an elaborate plot between his boss and the devil to have Al killed.
And then so that he would go to hell and become the new leader of the army of hell.
So it's a very elaborate plot to get him into that point.
And then there's some other things happen.
(09:27):
There's a clown and...
That's a dope ass clown.
This is a dope ass clown.
So why don't we start with that dope ass clown, the violator.
So how do you guys feel about John Leguizamo's portrayal of the clown?
Well, we know how I feel.
I think that a bad guy, because this is such a dumb...
(09:49):
The movie's premise had so many different holes in it.
And it was while they were trying to do an origin story, there were a lot of holes that
could have pushed you out the movie and the character...
Because Al Simmons is playing a completely very straight spawn.
So you needed something to offset that.
And that was not completely aerial.
Whatever that guy was, was certainly not the guy who was going to offset spawn.
(10:10):
But the violator was a perfect foil to spawn.
I just think that the way he talked and it matches the comics and just the whole...
He was with a bandit.
He enjoyed it.
As you said, Chris, he was a penis within a condom.
Yeah, it was weird.
The violator's weird.
I mean, he made me feel uncomfortable the entire movie.
(10:31):
And I guess that's good.
And after rereading some of the spawn in preparation for this,
he did play the character as he was in the book.
So I mean, I can't knock him for his performance.
That was what I remembered before we watched it for this viewing now.
For my original viewing was I did not like John Luguziamo as the clown,
(10:52):
but I also was not extremely familiar with spawn at the time.
I didn't know the clown character other than what he looked like,
which he did look exactly like the toy in the comics.
Like the makeup and everything for him actually looks really good.
But I was just annoyed by him.
But then watching it again this time, it's much less annoying.
I think it does. I did read some spawn in prep for this,
and it does fit the comic field, at least the early issues.
I didn't read the whole run or anything, but the early issues.
(11:14):
So I think he actually did a good job.
But it's also if you don't like John Luguziamo
or if you don't like the character,
I'm going to give you some bad news.
He's in like 90% of this movie.
So I hope you like it.
He's the main villain and the comic relief at the same time.
Which is double duty for anybody.
Yeah.
Yeah, he is in the majority of this movie.
(11:35):
You're right, Jeremy.
I think if you don't like the clown, you don't like clowns,
you're not going to like this movie because he's in so much of it.
And actually, he is pretty much the only thing I remember about this movie
for my first time viewing.
I remember a little bit of spawn.
But it's been 20 odd years.
But he eats up every scene he's in.
That tells you the strength of the movie.
If all of you guys remember that most of all,
(11:55):
even more so than say Al Simons, Michael Jai White,
who at the time was still riding pretty high on a lot of different stuff,
then that just tells you that's like the Penguin.
It's like there are certain roles where you just go,
you know, the original Joker, Jack Nicholson,
that changed the old genre of the Joker.
Well, why don't we jump on the spawn?
How do you think Michael did?
He's Michael Jai White.
I don't think he does too many things bad.
(12:16):
I wouldn't want to fight him.
He's pretty badass.
He's actually so fast.
He's got super fast kicks.
But in this movie, I think he was good, not great,
but he did exactly what he was supposed to do to bring spawn to life.
I don't think there was a lot for him to work with.
Yeah.
I think he was a pretty flat character.
They didn't really go into it.
You didn't really get to know him.
(12:36):
You know what I mean?
It was like it was just flat.
I don't know.
I don't think it was his fault.
No, I don't think it's his fault.
I think the script didn't help him.
And it's an origin story.
So there has to be like him learning what his abilities are,
who he is, what his power is, what his purpose is.
And that is learned throughout the movie.
But especially at the start, I think he is.
He's very flat.
He comes across as that kind of stone voice,
(12:58):
Batman kind of feel to it, but without any of the background.
Like Batman has a purpose. He knows what he's doing.
This is just like, am I here?
What am I doing?
And that's kind of the first half of the movie.
He turned down playing Jax in Mortal Kombat for this role.
This is a good choice.
I would have taken this.
Yeah, this is definitely a good choice.
This is called classic status in this movie.
I was watching an interview, and I have a quote for you from Michael.
(13:21):
And it gives you a good sense of how he feels about this movie.
And he said, there is no footage of me ever saying that I liked Spawn.
I have never said that I thought it was a good movie.
Well, you know, at least he's honest.
I'll give him that.
Yeah, that's awesome.
Well, that's why I think they're looking at Jamie Foxx for the new remake.
Well, we'll get in the remake in a little bit.
But the next one I want to talk about is Jason Wynn, played by Martin Sheen.
(13:45):
He is the other villain in the movie.
How do you feel his portrayal was as a comic book villain?
I just didn't think he fit.
I just didn't like him.
I just thought he's I think over the top would be a good thing.
I think he kind of slightly over the top, almost non believable in some ways.
I agree with that.
There was one part where I thought was really funny.
(14:05):
He was like, they're telling him that he's got to get that device put on his heart.
Or, you know, so if he dies, he'll release the virus.
And they're like, you got to do that.
He's like, oh, yeah, yeah, no problem.
They just had no like, you didn't like you're going to put a device on your heart.
And he was just like, oh, yeah, yeah, let's do that.
They didn't even even flinch on that.
(14:28):
He's like, yeah, let's get that done.
What a good idea.
I just thought that was so silly.
Well, and he gets the advice from a guy who he knows works with demons.
He's like, hey, you know what?
That is a good call.
I'm going to do that.
I think in general, he's just he's very one dimensional.
There's no there's no like they don't try to make him human.
He's just a bad guy.
He's the Lex Luthor where it's just like I've got a bad idea and I'm running with it.
(14:49):
My goal is domination.
It's nothing else.
It's not like, well, I'm doing this because my uncle died.
I'm very stuck.
No, there's none of that.
He's just like, well, yeah, what do I need to do to control the world and have everyone
that doesn't want to follow me die a horrible death?
And so that's what he's working with.
Even his like when they at the start of the movie, he is he's the one who betrays Al Simmons
and gets him killed.
(15:09):
And he does because this demon guy told him to do it because other stuff he wants to like,
well, I'll do this for you.
But first, you got to kill this guy.
He's like, why?
He's like, why not?
I'm like, OK.
And he just does it like there's no he's worked with him for years.
There's nothing that's going to stop him from doing whatever he needs to do to succeed
in his in his plan, which is clearly a bad plan, like an evil plan.
So from that, it's in one way it's good for a comic book.
(15:29):
We kind of have to have that kind of black and white good, bad, and he's clearly bad.
Right.
There's no there's no good there.
But because of that, he's also not that interesting.
He's just like, yeah, I'm a bad guy, by the way.
Like, yep, we know.
Right.
Yeah, I agree.
And it's such a shame because it's Martin Sheen.
And, you know, that was a big name to be gathered for that movie.
(15:50):
So I think there was and I'm sure you enjoy it.
But again, I'm sure you didn't have much of a script to work with.
But I think the really good ones when they decide to dive in, that's why I like the John
I mean, you know, well, I can't even say his name now because when the really good ones,
when they dive in, they just throw themselves all on, even though they don't have to, they
could still literally phone it in.
Well, and in some ways, because John Liguzi, almost the clown slash violator character
(16:13):
is so over the top, it's kind of good that that this character is just a straightforward
like, no, I'm bad and I'm just going to do whatever it takes and fuck everybody else.
I'm going to get my plan to go through.
I'll backstab anybody, whatever it takes to get there.
Right.
He doesn't have all these funny lines.
He doesn't have all this extra need to chew up the scenery to someone else is doing it
for 90 percent of this movie.
Yeah, I really don't understand his plan at all.
(16:35):
Not Martin Sheen's plan.
His was just the role.
But Jason's plan as an overall story arc, I don't understand what he was trying to accomplish.
I mean, he dies, the world dies, but basically, right.
And is his goal.
You said world domination.
Did he actually say that at any point?
I don't know.
I believe he wanted.
Yes, he wanted to rule the world.
The consortium.
He wants to run.
He wants all the countries in the world to report to him ultimately who decide to follow
(16:59):
him.
Everybody else will not get the vaccine to the disease that he is harvested from the
North Koreans at the start of the movie.
He's going to release to the world.
And if he does that, then he everyone who takes the vaccine will then owe him forever
and he'll be in charge of everything.
That's his plan.
What I what I think is less can like.
I mean, it makes sense separately, but when you put it together, it doesn't make a lot
(17:19):
of sense.
So he's working with the with Malbolgia, who's basically the devil and violator, who is also
one of the devil's like lieutenants, henchmen or whatever.
And they're also working with with when to some level.
But really, their plan is trying to stab him in the back as well, because they want to
kill everybody in the world.
So they become more of spawn or more of Malbolgia's army and that spawn would lead, which clearly
(17:45):
we doesn't know about, because why would you want to rule the world if all of a sudden
there's also a thousand demons that are coming out?
So it's like there's this back and forth.
It's like, I'm not quite sure that they would ever work together, but it doesn't really
matter because there's a giant clown for most of the movie that's taking all of your attention.
He didn't read him in.
The problem was he didn't read him and he didn't read him into the total plan.
But I will tell you, here's my thought process.
(18:06):
If the devil comes and ask you a plan, are you really?
And it's one that involves getting a pacemaker.
You're really going to go through with it.
Is it do you think you're going to win in the end?
But here is two points for anybody that can name the virus.
What was the virus called?
He was six or something.
He ate or he'd six or something.
It's heat something or other.
All right.
Everybody's got one.
There it is.
Lewis, our guest has taken it to the top.
(18:29):
He actually paid attention in the movie.
Thank you, my friend.
Oh, man.
We were close.
We could have said anything and we said heat something.
It was close.
If you didn't say that, I wouldn't have got it.
I just piggybacked off your answer.
I think we've hinted at that this movie is pretty just jointed a little bit.
But what scene stuck out to you guys?
The motorcycle scene, the scene where he's like when he likes coming out
(18:53):
and he's on the bike and then all of a sudden he just does that thing where it's like that
where you can see the capabilities of his cape and the necroplasm and just the idea
that he can do these things.
That's dope.
Come on.
That was dope.
That was cool.
I like the fight scene in the whatever it was like the ballroom there where everybody
where he like smashes through that's kind of a classic sort of Batman sort of fight scene.
(19:15):
I enjoyed that.
You had the little belt thing come out.
That was that was that was fun.
Oh, yeah.
We were the I remember her name is Church was her name Church or Priest or something
that where she tries kicking in the crotch and the belt comes out and blocks it.
Yeah, it bites her leg.
She's like, well, you guys mentioned the cape a little bit, but you notice there's
not many scenes that the cape is actually in.
No, that was an expensive cape.
(19:36):
It was a very expensive cape.
They couldn't get it right for the majority of scenes.
So that's when so they didn't they tried putting into a ton of different scenes,
but no, it just never looked right.
It looked really good in the scene that Lewis mentioned where he jumps in through the glass
and you see the cape coming down.
That looked really good.
Well, and at the end at the end of the movie, it's like you see spa in the middle
and the cape is basically taking over most of the screen when he's standing on top of
(19:56):
the church or whatever.
Like, that's a good pose.
It's a good look.
It looks like the comic book panels.
The other scene I really liked.
I mean, the ballroom fight scene was good, but also the fight.
The first time he fights Violator, the clown character, once he becomes a demon, he becomes
this giant demon in the alleyways where spawn fights him the first time.
That's a very good fight scene.
I really enjoyed that.
(20:17):
It's got, you know, it shows that spawn is not quite sure on how to use all his powers,
but also it makes Violator seem deadly before it's like he's this clown.
Yeah, he does gross things and he can't be killed because he's a demon, but he doesn't
seem to be like scary in that moment where he comes this giant toothy gray, thin, creepy
monster and then just tears him apart.
So that's a great fight scene.
Yeah, they took that.
(20:38):
That was nice from the comic.
They took that sort of they were leading up to that in the comic, that fight, because
you didn't know if that was the same guy.
And then they kind of was like a page turn to reveal that.
So I appreciated that.
Now, I feel like that's where they spent the majority of the CGI budget.
The ending was completely lost.
They did not really spend a lot of money on CGI in the ending.
(20:58):
I think the CGI.
So the Violator CGI for when he's the demon even spawn himself, I think looks pretty good
in all the scenes where they're on Earth or whatever.
When they're in the real world, even like the scenes where they're Violators driving
this trash truck thing and spawn supposed to be stopping him, chasing him on a motorcycle
or whatever.
Those look good.
(21:19):
They still look pretty good.
I mean, they're a little wonky, but they're not terrible.
I remember the CG looking awful and I was watching him at this point.
I was like, Violator actually looks really good at these scenes.
But to Fergle's point, towards the end, anytime they're supposed to be in hell, it looks
horrific.
It looks so there's everything CG and it's too much and it's not good enough.
So it everything looks real.
(21:39):
It looks like a bad 90s video game on Sega CD.
It looks just like that.
Or like a music video.
Gonna roll a Sega or Dreamcast out on you.
It was the music video, the age with all the music videos that were coming out.
Yeah.
The Black Hole Sun.
It reminded me of Black Hole Sun.
Black Hole Sun looks like a masterpiece compared to the CG, though they have in the end of
(22:01):
this movie.
You know, the best part is the mouth motion.
His mouth doesn't move.
Oh, it's so bad.
It's just like, ah, like the voices coming out.
A couple things on that, guys.
First off, a third of the budget went to CGI.
And the funny thing about it, too, they didn't finish the CGI until two weeks before it hit
theaters.
They were working up on this to the very last minute because it kept ballooning out of the
(22:24):
cost.
They started with a 20 million dollar budget and it's spending 40 million dollars because
of the CGI.
The reason why his mouth doesn't move is because they were trying to get across you
that it's he's speaking through hell.
I kid you not.
That's something you make up when you can't make it look good.
You're like, well, it's because he's speaking through fire.
So you would need to speak through fire.
Did he sound like the guy from Inspector Gadget, Dr. Claw?
(22:47):
Yeah, just a hand and a chair.
How did Spawn get the ability to kill every other Spawn, to hurt all the other Spawns?
That was also somebody running out of money and saying, let's just draw green stuff.
And that's how they're going to get out.
Let's make a lot of green electricity.
Well, the original idea for Hell, which they did film a little bit, was it's just a dark
(23:07):
room.
So it'd be Spawn talking to himself in a black room.
And by the end, they're like, yeah, that doesn't work so much.
So that's why we needed a CGI plan.
So the CGI was to solve the problem that came, which was originally just a bad idea.
I'm not sure that fixed it.
No, that made it worse.
Because again, up until that point, up until you do see Hell early on, but there's not
that much going on and it's not there as long.
(23:29):
So it was better.
But yeah, once Malbolgier shows up, once there's that hole towards the end, you see like 5,000
Spawns and it just looked so bad.
Yes.
Miserable.
Yes.
And then when he gets his head zipped off by the thing and he's like, can I get some tongue?
Can I get some tongue?
Why don't we talk a little about the CGI?
(23:50):
We've been sort of touching on it.
The I own the DVD for this, sadly.
And on the movie, on the box itself, it says the special effects movie event of the year.
Does the CGI live up to that title?
In some parts.
I think if you're a fan of Spawn and you were going in and there were obviously a lot of
fans of Spawn, it's one of the top comics ever sold for an independent at the time.
(24:14):
I really think it actually is the top comic, if I'm not mistaken.
Then yeah, you got exactly what you were looking for.
You got a representation of what was in the comic at that time out in public.
This is a bold claim to say in 1997 that this is the CGI event of the year.
When this is the same year that the Star Wars special editions came out,
which were also heavily enhanced with CGI where you didn't even notice half the time.
(24:36):
It was just stuff they added in the background.
And at the time, that was incredible.
So comparatively, this is not the CGI event of 1997.
Yeah, I don't know.
I think that's a stretch.
I think it's a stretch.
It's a good salesmanship.
Yeah.
I was reading some facts, but I think it was like they spent, they actually subcontracted
22 different special effects companies to make this thing happen.
(24:56):
So maybe I think they're not looking at it as like movie event of the year as in it's amazing.
It's just a big event.
They had a bunch of people show up, hang out for a little bit.
I think it was actually good CGI.
Now that's the whole world they look at.
Actually, when I had my physical store, I had several customers that were actually
VFX creators for Marvel.
And they had special put in T1, T4 lines, a massive NDAs or like 400 pages.
(25:21):
And they had to put out this data for 10 or 15 seconds of a VX scene.
But that's not 1997.
In 1997, this was a lot of CGI.
So I do agree.
There's a lot.
And again, when they're not in hell, I think it actually still looks really good.
So I was impressed with some of the CGI in this movie.
But when you're not impressed with it, it's very, very unimpressive.
(25:42):
Yeah, I think what stuck with me, I thought going back to watch the movie that the CGI
was terrible for the entire thing, but it's not.
And I think it made me think that was the devil.
Yes.
That lingered with me for 25 years.
Now, now, Boja, he was not frightening at all.
He looked like he needed a dentist.
The original plan for him too was they were actually going to go with a puppet.
That would have been better because the drawing looks like a like a Jim Henson kind of muppet thing.
(26:07):
Maybe like a dark crystal.
I could work with that.
I think it would have been better.
Or the Guyver.
The Guyver.
As long as J.J. Walker played Malboja, I think it would work out perfectly.
That's the tie.
That's the tie we were all waiting for.
The crossover we've all needed in our life.
This movie clocks at 96 minutes.
How's the pacing for it?
(26:28):
Not bad.
It actually moves along pretty quickly.
At the time that this was made, and I don't have it in front of me,
is this a Marvel or an independent movie?
I know they had a crazy director, Diop, but was this back to where Ben Grohl by Marvel
or was this Ben Grohl by Image or Valiant at the time?
I don't remember seeing it.
It was not Marvel.
It's New Line Cinema, so it probably was not Marvel.
(26:52):
Okay, so it was New Line Cinema.
You're right.
It was, yep, New Line was headlining on top of this.
This may have been on the end of their days as New Line Cinema,
because at one point New Line was, if there was a horror movie,
they're like Blumehouse of the 90s.
They did Ninja Turtles too, didn't they?
Yes, they did.
The original Ninja Turtles, I think.
So I think they were considered an independent, right?
(27:13):
More or less.
They were.
They were a large independent studio.
At the time, there weren't many of them.
They were very consistent too.
The smartest thing McFarlane ever did was not sell his rights.
He kept all the rights.
He just allowed them to use the story, but he kept all the rights.
Because I think the Neil Gaiman fight taught him something,
taught him something pretty damn serious that you got to be careful about this,
especially when it's this big.
(27:34):
He was trying to pitch us around.
He was actually looking for a lot of upfront money, but to get the butt,
no one wanted to give them $40 million or $60 million to make it.
So he decided to take $1, but he had to keep all the merchandising rights.
Well, that works when you own the toy company.
Exactly.
Smart.
He's a smart dude, definitely business-wise.
(27:57):
Yeah.
Again, not often.
And I would also put him in the same category.
As I said again, Rob Leofield.
At a certain point, you can create that character.
Because there are guys like Alan Moore who should still be getting
all the rights off Swamp Thing because all the new movies coming out with that.
And he's pretty much, I believe, a stickler.
(28:17):
I think he sold those things off or doesn't own his majority of them.
I didn't even have anything to begin with with those DC things.
And he also hates working with people to make movies.
What, Alan Moore?
Yeah.
What do you think about Todd McFarlane's performance in the movie?
So again, I blinked through YouTube because I wasn't going to rent it today.
(28:38):
So I pieced together the movie through YouTube.
So which scene were you referencing that Todd McFarlane was in?
He's like a homeless guy, isn't he?
Yeah. He bumps into him in the alleyway.
There was an action in that one.
It didn't get on my YouTube when I was piecing together this movie.
Virgo, at this point, you didn't actually watch the whole movie.
I might.
I might.
This is Todd McFarlane.
(28:59):
So back to the original question.
Was the movie long enough?
Did you want more or was it too long as it was?
No, it was good enough.
Yeah. I mean, 90 minutes is pretty short.
We've done some others that go on way too long or that you think it's going to be too long
and it's not that long.
But 90 minutes for this is good.
There's definitely more background you could put in.
We mentioned Cogliostro who's kind of like in this movie, he's like a previous,
(29:23):
it's not a Spawn necessarily, but he worked for the devil or Malvozio or somebody like 500 years ago.
And so now he's kind of there to be Spawn's mentor and kind of guide him away from working
for the devil and work for the forces of good.
I guess it's a good evil fight.
But I would like to see a little more of his background because again,
he just kind of comes out of nowhere.
He says like, oh, I used to do this 500 years ago.
(29:44):
Now you will.
What?
Like, there's not a lot of background, but at the same time, did I need it?
No, that's the only thing I think was missing.
Everything else I didn't need more of.
Thank God there wasn't an hour and a half of Al Simmons pre-spawn in this.
It was just like he starts out.
He gets killed to become Spawn.
I didn't need a ton of background on a lot of the other characters.
I liked knowing literally nothing about Violator when you first meet him.
(30:08):
And then you learn more throughout the movie on him, but you don't need,
well, where'd Violator come from?
Was he used to be a clown?
None of that was in there.
And I don't know if it was ever in the comics because I haven't, again, read a lot of Spawn
just a little bit, but I liked just enough to know he's a demon.
You don't need anything else.
Period.
He's a demon.
He seems to be on the same tier as Spawn, but not quite the same skill set.
So he's not going to be the general.
That was one of my concerns.
(30:28):
I didn't understand quite why.
So they're trying to get Spawn angry enough to kill Wynn, which will cause the pacemaker
they put him to go off and kill everybody on Earth or most people.
The apocalypse.
Yep.
Why doesn't Violator just do it?
I don't understand.
There's got to be rules or something.
So what you're telling me, Jeremy, you didn't want a 20 minute
(30:50):
backstory on the clown's work as a street performer in Memphis.
No, but I expect that.
If this would have been a current movie or if this would have been a series,
let's say it's on HBO or whatever is like a 12 part series, there would be one episode
about nothing but this sad street performer clown that somehow becomes perverted and becomes
the Violator.
(31:10):
That's a guarantee.
I'm okay without that.
It would have been interesting, but I didn't need it.
I was kind of glad it wasn't there.
A lot of these movies do try to fall too much on.
Let's explain everything.
And then you're like, well, this was a great origin for everybody.
And at the end, they get a pizza and you don't see anything else that happens.
So they don't have to do that.
They actually run through the whole story.
You see the start to finish of both Malbo's plan to some level, although it's not over.
(31:33):
The fight continues, right?
But the battle's won and then wins, you know, and for his plan, his plan ends.
So the earthly immediate threat is resolved, but the good versus evil plot goes on.
But the battle is won.
I like that it was just long enough to have that.
I was interested in seeing where else it goes, but I didn't feel like now I got to see the
sequel because I don't know what's going to happen next.
Like you've got a closure in this.
(31:54):
You don't need any more.
I agree.
They moved it along.
They got right into it and, you know, they had a couple of fight scenes and that was
it.
They wrapped it up.
I, you know, it was pretty, you know, one, two, three, not too much, not too little.
There is a director's cut of this movie.
Originally, the original cut of this movie was rated R and they cut it down to qualify
(32:14):
for a PG-13.
Do you want to see the rated R version of this movie and the director's cut?
Do you have the director's cut?
I do not.
I was going to say, yeah, on DVD, I assumed you had the director's cut.
I mean, if the director's cut is increased violence, then I would say in this case, that's
fine because it's a very violent kind of character.
That's okay with me.
If it's, you know, do I need more scenes in hell?
(32:36):
No.
Do I need more story about the homeless kid he hangs out with?
No.
So if depending what the director's cut is, I might want to see it.
And if it is literally just cutting out fight scenes and violence or whatever, for the sake
of getting the rating, sure, I'd like to see what it was.
But most of the time, you know, I didn't feel like after I was watching this, I was like,
I wish there was more of this or the fights weren't good enough.
(32:57):
I enjoyed the fights that were in there aside from the very last fight, which is fine, but
it was all CG and hell.
And I was just glad it was over.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't need to see the director's cut.
I'm good on it.
Probably not.
But if it did leak into kind of like the prosthetics design, because the practical effects, I don't
think we can underestimate those.
Those were really good.
There was a lot of good practical effects for what it was at the time.
(33:20):
So, I mean, I'm really curious to see again how they remake this movie, because it's very
much like, you know, Blade and other movies, they've got kind of kicking around the tin
can for a while.
They're not going to make a stupid story.
They know how important the character is.
They're not going to screw with it.
Well, it's a tough character because you got to, if you're going to watch a movie, you
got to care about the character.
(33:42):
Yeah.
He's a tough guy to care about.
I don't know.
I mean, they try to infuse a little bit like, I feel bad now that I've been in
an assassin role all these years.
You know, now I feel bad.
I don't know.
I feel like I don't connect with this guy.
But, you know, that's the tough part.
You got to pick the right actor and it's got to have the right.
(34:04):
Well, keep in mind, Liam Nielsen did it well.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's true.
All right.
I'd say it's a lot like a Batman character, right?
Like after you learn the origins of Batman, you don't need him to do anything other than
be there.
And you're really watching it for the villains, right?
You're watching it to see how is he going to stop whatever they're doing.
And some of the later Batman movies are, you know, 80% villain, 20% Batman.
He's just there.
And you're like, yep, he's going to stop the day because he's Batman.
(34:25):
But you don't need a lot of the background for Batman.
Instead, you're eating up watching, you know, the Riddler or whoever else being
taking over most of the movie.
And I think that's how you'd have to handle Spawn.
He'd have to.
That's and they kind of do that here by having Violator be so much of the focus of this.
Spawn doesn't have to do more than just be there.
I thought 96 was a good number for it just in general, because I did check my watch a
(34:47):
couple of times because it feels a little just just joined for me.
Now, the director's cut, just so you guys are aware, is an extra two minutes.
Oh, man.
Who has that kind of time?
You write that up pretty strongly, my friend.
You could have told us that and stop that whole conversation.
We got two minutes.
Yeah, throw it in there.
I was curious.
(35:08):
Just full frontal spawn shots.
That's it.
So, Jeremy, you sort of touched on this is an origin story.
And I know you guys have had problems with origin stories in the past.
Did this movie pull off the origin story?
Yes, I think it did because you have a full conflict.
You get to meet a real villain.
You're not just watching Spawn fight homeless people for two hours.
(35:29):
And then at the end, he fights a much stronger homeless person.
Like Violator is a great villain and he's kind of a spawn foil.
He's in there.
It's good.
Much like the Joker for Batman, that first Batman movie.
Yes, it's an origin story.
But at the same time, it's a full contained story.
It's got a villain you want to watch.
This is very similar.
So I think they do pull it off.
That's been my problem specifically.
And like we did the Punisher, I thought that was fine.
(35:52):
But as an origin story, it was like 60% dull until the Punisher shows up.
Right.
So this doesn't have that problem.
I got to echo in with this thing on the Punisher.
Again, I'm just going to say the whole run of Punishers,
except for the Dolph Lundar movie are great.
But at the end of the day, this movie, you know, I think you're right.
(36:13):
You don't need a ton of Al Simmons, but you still need Al Simmons.
And you got to do it right.
And I mean, he's hard to care about.
But I think you got a minefield of really cool spawn stories that you can do.
Even the one that just blew across, although it'll never happen.
I think it could happen animated with Batman and Spawn crossing over.
That would be such a dope story.
(36:34):
That just on the story face alone would be dope as shit.
This movie had a lot of, in pre-production, sort of who they're going forward to tap
for these different roles.
And I want to get your guys take on them.
The director, there were two other choices for director before they finally settle on
Mark Dippis.
Dippis, whatever his name was.
Just go with Dippie.
The first one, his name is Alex Prorius.
(36:55):
You may not know him, but he's the guy who directed Dark City.
Could you see a Dark City version of Spawn?
Maybe.
I'm familiar with that movie.
Oh, go find it.
It's good.
It's good.
It's different, but it would work.
But again, you're comparing it to a director that's not directed anything before this or since.
So I don't know.
He can't have done worse than this guy.
Well, the original director, they were tapping for this, but he decided to turn down with
(37:16):
Tim Burton.
I'm glad it wasn't because, again, Tim Burton does a very specific thing.
And I don't think Spawn fits in that, even though I have compared it to Batman and the
first two Batman movies.
He, you know, the first two 90s Batman movies or 89, whatever, were Tim Burton.
But even the second one would became very Tim Burton.
Right.
So it's like, I'm glad it wasn't because I think it would end up being too close to
(37:38):
Batman Returns.
That's right.
I get it.
I was thinking in my head, I was like, if Tim Burton does this, how could he, how different
could he make it from his, like those Batman movies?
It just seems like the guy's got a cape and he's got a dark city and.
Batman with a red cape.
All you got to do is look at Superman with Nicolas Cage and be like, that's exactly how
(37:58):
Spawn would be.
Now, one character we actually did touch on all is Terry Fitzgerald.
We sort of touched on it.
That's Spawn's best friend who goes off and marries his wife.
Yeah.
D.B. Sweeney.
Yep.
So the original, the original person cast for that was Ed Norton.
I mean, that would have been fine because again, that character in this movie in general,
he's there.
(38:18):
So you have the connection that, you know, Spawn gets mad.
His friend is now with his wife or whatever, and he does have a plot point later and sort
of, but he's not important to the story otherwise.
You're not hanging out with him at all.
He doesn't have any character growth.
You could have been anybody.
So Ed Norton would have been fine there.
I like it, but I don't think it would have made a difference.
Agreed.
The Vindicator, Violator, whatever his name is, Jim Carrey.
(38:41):
No, John Leguiziamo, the little guy with the guy with the exaggerated face.
I think because he did the transvestite movie, that's what really put the whole face together
for it.
I like that you were like, you know what?
I don't want the guy with the exaggerated face.
I mean, I do want the guy with the exaggerated face.
So I'll use John Leguiziamo as opposed to the guy who literally is known for his exaggerated
face.
(39:01):
But I do think I like John Leguiziamo in this role because it works.
I think Jim Carrey, again, he would have been way too well known by 1997.
It would end up being like the Riddler where it's a lot of Jim Carrey on this character
that might not match the comic anymore.
Jim Carrey's Riddler is fine.
I liked it when I saw it.
That movie is not great.
But the Riddler in the comics is a totally different beast than the version that Jim
(39:25):
Carrey put out.
So I think that would end up happening with Violator and the Clown.
For some reason, I can't see Jim Carrey doing that.
I don't know.
Even though the Violator made me feel weird.
I think that John Leguiziamo was the right guy.
That sounds like a lot of therapy.
I'm sure that, you know, I say, my friend, I will sit here and I still get the eevee
(39:45):
jeevees thinking about Cemetery Man.
There are just some movies that don't deserve a movie.
And that was one of them.
I still love our discussion about Cemetery Man.
Now, Spawn had many people that cast for it.
I want to go through each one.
You guys just tell me if you want to see that version of Spawn or if you thought that version
of Spawn might be better.
And these are no particular order.
So first off, Wesley Snipes.
No.
You can do it.
I think it'd be fine.
Yeah, it'd been fine.
(40:05):
Cuba Getting Jr.
Yes.
See, that's a weird pick.
But I only know him from what was it?
Boat Trip.
So that's not the same guy.
It's the same guy, but a different character.
And Radio.
Snoop Dogg.
No.
Of course.
Of course.
Can you imagine?
Can you imagine?
I mean, there's not even like Snoop Dogg as a CIA assassin.
(40:28):
No, it's not going to work.
Well, you did see the Day Shift, didn't you?
The movie with Jenny Foxley going after vampires.
Snoop Dogg is a vampire hunter in that movie.
He's Snoop Dogg as a vampire hunter.
So it'd be Snoop Dogg as Spawn.
That's not going to work.
I would like to see it.
Yeah.
Let me take it back.
It would be amazing to see.
(40:49):
Would it be good?
No.
Next up is Denzel Washington.
Possibly.
He could, but I think it's a wasting Denzel Washington.
And that is definitely wasting.
And I think Denzel's smart enough because I just saw a video the day where Will Smith
can't even talk about they turned down the Matrix.
And they chose Samuel L. Jackson.
No, he would have played a better Jason Wynn though.
(41:09):
Yeah, I think it would have been Jason Wynn.
Even in 97, he was still, I'm trying to think what he would have been around the
same time to gauge age, but I think he'd be too old for this role, which seems wrong.
We're even thinking of him now, but he always like seems older than he is.
He's 136 years old.
This was a deep blue seed time period, I think, wasn't it?
Which I like that, but I don't think he would have been a good spawn, but that's okay.
(41:30):
But I do agree.
It would have been a good win.
Bing Reims.
No, no, he's just too big.
It would have looked weird.
Imagine how large he would have looked to spawn if he massive.
Okay.
How about two poxacore guys?
Too skinny.
See Snoop could pull it off.
Snoop could pull it off.
Snoop could be a skinny spawn.
(41:50):
But not too tall.
Too tall.
I don't know.
It's too tall.
LL Cool J.
You did this up.
Come on.
Are we really going through the whole list of black people?
No.
Yeah, one more left.
One more black person left.
Good job, Chris.
One more.
There's one more left.
God bless America.
This is the who's who of black people in 98.
(42:13):
No, Will Smith stayed on Independence Day.
And that's from the Affirmed Black Person on the crew.
There's a lot of black folks.
That's all I got for who they were thinking about for casting purposes.
No, I think they did a good job casting.
Again, any weakness in the acting is not the fault of the actor.
It is a pretty rough character to play, and it's not the best script.
(42:36):
Exactly.
And that's right there.
This movie doesn't suffer from good talent.
I mean, again, Michael Jai White is a badass martial artist.
I actually wish we had saw more of that.
But it does suffer from bad script writing.
So at the end of the day, guys, what did you love about this movie?
And what could they have done better?
I like Violator.
(42:56):
I like Spawn.
I think those two guys are pretty awesome.
And then everything else.
Like you said, the script could have been a lot better.
A lot of corny lines, a lot of like eight, like 90s references that don't,
like no one's going to know what those even mean.
You know, it's not like you can't, you know, you can't just say,
it's not like you can't be timeless.
(43:18):
It's like they made it.
It's like stuck in the 90s.
Well, it didn't help the music.
The music threw it in the 90s for me.
Like that whole soundtrack is is literally every late 90s superhero movie is in.
This soundtrack works.
It I liked I liked the Violator more than I remembered.
I actually think he's really good, like a good character in this.
(43:39):
It looks really good even when he's the big demon in the real world.
It looks good.
Spawn's character, Spawn's costume actually looks better than I thought.
I don't know why I thought it looked.
I remembered it not looking good, but then I watched this time.
I was like, it actually looks really good.
I think it looks better than the current Venom costume.
I think the current Venom costume looks pretty bad in the Venom movies,
but I think this actually looks better than that.
What I what I think they did.
And again, this is a script issue because I've only read the first few Spawn comics,
(44:03):
but the Spawn comics in the original comics,
he can't remember like what's going on in his past.
And he like sees things that remind him like who's this woman I'm thinking of in my head.
Oh, he finds it's his wife when he sees like a locket or in a ring or something.
That wasn't in this instead, you know,
Al Simmons wakes up as Spawn and tries to go find his family.
And so this is really awkward party scene.
(44:25):
I think they could have done more with him learning who he was with flashbacks
and make that little less awkward.
But I mean, other than that, I think it actually and the hell scenes,
I know you mentioned that they were trying to get around
that they've only just filmed a dark room or we're going to.
I think I would much rather see a dark room.
I think the hell scenes are what make this not as good as it could be.
I think they when you look at it now, the hell scenes are the weak point of this film.
(44:47):
Blamed the app.
I think the whole script needs a whole rewrite.
I mean, there's I mean, there were some visuals that were pretty interesting for the 90s,
but the actual script itself, the plot makes no sense at the end of the day.
It just it's all over the place.
And that that CGI of the devil or hell is just horrible.
(45:08):
Yeah, now, now, Boja looks bad.
It looks it literally does look like an old video game.
It's not good.
And Lewis, it's very dated.
This whole movie is very dated from the soundtrack to some of the quips.
I was at one point, the clown likes I don't remember the exact quote,
but it's a tie to the girly man pump you up, guys.
He says a quote about that.
I was like, Jesus, like that.
That was one that I was like, oh, boy.
(45:30):
I know that quote because I saw it in my YouTube clips I was watching.
Next episode, Fergill's just going to watch the trailer and talk about that.
We're going to be good.
What's that? Depending on the movie, if it's cemetery, man.
What is the cemetery, man?
I got to see this. Oh, God, sweet Jesus.
It's had quite an effect on you guys.
You can listen to the episode that we talk about it or go see the movie or do both.
(45:52):
It's a horror movie.
It's got some questionable parts.
Questionable is a good word.
You can leave the only thing redeeming on that movie is boobies.
And I promise you that if you find me on Facebook, you like this dude was right.
Those tits are fabulous.
It's an 80s movie.
Yeah. But I mean, as fabulous fake tits, those were up there in the top five.
(46:15):
Now, to be fair, that's the same thing Fergill said about the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles episode.
So now I mean, who had fabulous, big tits in that one?
All four turtles.
They were fabulous.
They were fabulous. The costumes were fabulous.
But I think you didn't understand how it was all coming together.
These folks don't always appreciate the hard work that goes in the 80s movies.
And I get it. I get it.
(46:35):
Fergill, you have actually sort of hinted at that.
There are actually talks of a reboot for this movie that's been talked about for a long time.
For 20 years.
And Jamie Foxx is being sort of thought of being for that role.
Do you guys want to see that reboot or should this thing just disappear into the dustpan of history?
No, a reboot is necessary.
The comics are flying up.
It's one of the few resilient books in the marketplace.
(46:57):
Fergill and Signature has achieved a status pretty similar to Stan Lee's.
So it on its own will drive a book up by a pretty significant margin.
So I mean, yes, a remake is good.
Do I think Jamie Foxx is the guy?
I don't know.
I think there are a lot of very good African American actors.
Like Pierre Johnson, the guy who's doing the Green Lantern.
(47:21):
Idris Elba is another one.
I think the guy who played in Hawkman is another one that could be really good at this.
There's a lot of good actors that could do this.
So I'm not sure Jamie Foxx can pull it off.
I think that's why he did the action movie recently with Cameron Diaz.
I think he's trying to prove that that Rogaine shit is still working out for him.
Whatever Viagra he's using to clear up all the brain power is making them work.
(47:43):
I want them to make a sequel to this and I want it to be good.
So bad.
I want it to be great.
I don't know.
I'm just rooting for that for some reason.
I had something connected to my childhood.
I want them to make a good Spawn movie, not too bad Spawn movies.
Yeah.
And it doesn't have to be a sequel.
It could be a reboot.
I don't need the same story and I'm sure they would do a better job.
(48:04):
But I mean, I would like to see this with current effects and then more interesting plots overall.
This definitely has like an early, not even early, but like a mid 90s comic book plot.
You know, we've talked about Ghost Rider and some other ones and they all have these like goofy,
really silly plots.
(48:24):
This is up there with that.
Yeah, I think it deserves a reboot and let this version of just disappear.
No.
Well, also, I mean, it's not a movie, but there are three seasons of an animated series that were
on HBO.
It's actually very well done.
You can still find it.
It's actually on YouTube for free.
I'm sure it's probably not supposed to be, but it's easily found.
So I would check that out as well.
(48:45):
I think it doesn't follow the same plot as the comics for the most part.
They all start out kind of the same, but it takes its own turn.
But it's not bad at all.
It's well worth.
I think it's better than this movie and I didn't hate this movie.
So guys, what is your actual rating of this movie?
I'm going to go with a nice, slightly upward thumb pointed right at the violator's head
(49:07):
with Al Simmons pointing as well with me with his chains and escape.
I got to give it a half thumb, but it's the violator's hand held up with that piece of pizza
with the maggots all over it because that was pretty also pretty remarkable.
But it's a half thumb.
I mean, I liked it.
It was enjoyable more than I thought it was.
Is it something I'd say you have to rush out to find?
(49:27):
No, probably not.
And I would love to see them redo this.
Those are real maggots, by the way.
Yeah, he threw up after eating that stuff.
Oh, God, that's gross.
It seemed like he turned his back and something weird was happening there.
I'm going to give it one thumb because I really think they tried really hard on this.
And it wasn't the greatest.
(49:49):
It is stuck in the 90s, but I think they gave it a go and they did put together a movie.
It had a beginning and end and then it was one total package.
So they did what they tried to do.
Boom.
This guy, I like the thought process.
I like where you're bringing it.
I'd give it one failed chain up.
You know the scene where Spomb tries to send those chains and they fall back down again?
(50:14):
That's why I give this movie.
It's a good one.
It's okay.
I bet it's a half failed chain and it fails.
I need a viagra for that.
So, Lewis, where can we find you?
Okay, so people can find me.
I have a website.
It's lp-comics.com.
I have some of my books there.
(50:35):
My Instagram, I post a lot.
So it's lwis10221980.
I have to change that, but I will one day.
And so check me out.
I have a lot of my artwork on there and you can see all the different stores where I have my books.
(50:55):
And I also just want to make a quick mention.
I am so I'm publishing a book.
It's at the printers right now.
I'll have that ready for spring.
Survival Girl and Puppy Number One.
And then I also am working on another comic with a writer.
His name is Kevin Michael Rowe.
And we are working on a comic called Invasion on Center Street.
(51:17):
And it's like a sci-fi horror yarn.
It's going to be a lot of fun.
And you can check him out at what's his website here.
I'm going to put his stuff in the show notes along with my other stuff.
On our website, there's a page for our guests where people should be able to find your links as well.
That's awesome.
Thank you so much for that.
(51:37):
And Jeremy, where can people find you?
You can always find me every two weeks here, but also at Retrovania.net,
where we have a podcast called Retrovaniacs.
It comes out four times a month along with some Twitch streams and videos.
Well, you can find me right here on getting your movie smashed.
Otherwise, you can find me at Get Your Nerd On.
You can find me on Instagram.
You can find me on Facebook.
(51:57):
You can find me on TikTok.
Weaving masterful stories, telling masterful stories, putting my two cents into everything.
So come enjoy it.
And oh, selling a few comic books here and there.
Couple things.
Couple things, but only the coolest shit.
And for me, you can always find me at All Final Creations.
We're always over there building some piece of nerdy furniture.
I want to thank you, our listeners, for spending some time with us today.
(52:18):
And I have no idea about Spawn.
I have no quip about it.
But you want to send me a note about why I should have been smarter about what I could
put at the end of this episode.
Send me a note over at movie-smash.com.
And we'll see you in a couple of weeks.
Thank you again for listening, and I hope you enjoy the show.
This has been Movie Smash with Chris Roberts, Jeremy Parmentier, and Fergal Amayo,
(52:40):
produced by me, Chris Roberts, executive produced by Off Panel Creations, LLC.
Movie clips provided by their respective studios.
You can rate and review the show at Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
You might even find your review read on a future episode.
Got a question for us?
Visit us at movie-smash.com and send us a note.
It too can be read on a future episode.
If you haven't already, please subscribe to Movie Smash wherever you listen to your podcasts.
(53:03):
Next episode, Fergal's just going to watch the trailer and talk about that.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!