April 25, 2025 • 38 mins
Joe Walsh, the former Congressman turned podcast host, joins David Wheeler and Colonel Moe Davis in this lively episode of "Muck You!" diving deep into the wild world of American politics. The main dish today? Walsh's transformation from a Trump supporter to a fierce critic, and he’s not holding back! They chat about how political identities are shifting, the challenges of today's Democratic landscape, and whether the Dems can get their act together before the next election cycle. Walsh's candid insights are spiced with humor and a sprinkle of exasperation at the current state of affairs, as he calls out both sides for their shortcomings. Buckle up for a rollercoaster of laughs, rants, and some serious food for thought as they tackle everything from the media's role in normalizing Trump to the need for authentic voices in politics.
>>> Crank up the volume and get ready to roll, because this podcast episode is like a rollercoaster ride through the wild and wacky world of politics! David and Colonel Mo are back in the saddle, and they’re joined by none other than the charismatic Joe Walsh. Now, Walsh isn't just another talking head; he’s a former Congressman who went from Tea Party darling to a voice of reason in a chaotic political landscape. Picture this: he takes us on a journey starting from his unexpected win in Illinois against all odds—an 88% chance of losing, and he pulls off a victory by just 291 votes. Talk about a nail-biter! As they dive deeper into the convo, Walsh shares his evolution from a Trump supporter to a vocal critic, delivering spicy takes on everything from the current state of the GOP to the health of American democracy. He’s not holding back, folks! The trio banters about the need for Democrats to step up their game, connect with everyday folks, and maybe even throw in a few F-bombs for good measure. Trust us, it’s a wild ride filled with laughs, insight, and a whole lot of ‘Muck You’ moments that’ll leave you nodding your head and chuckling. So grab your popcorn and tune in; this one’s a doozy!
>>> The conversation in this episode is like a political buffet—there’s just so much to sink your teeth into! David and Moe chat with Joe Walsh, who’s got the kind of story that could fill a book, and guess what? He has! From his days in Congress to his radio show, Walsh is all about calling out the BS in politics. He reflects on his time as a moderate Republican who transitioned into the Tea Party and now finds himself at odds with the party he once embraced. Here’s the kicker: they tackle the elephant in the room—Trump. Walsh doesn’t shy away from critiquing the former president, sharing how he once supported him but has since realized the danger he poses to democracy. The trio also gets candid about the Democratic Party’s struggle to connect with the average American and the need for them to embrace a broader strategy beyond just anti-Trump rhetoric. It’s a mix of humor, raw honesty, and a sprinkle of hope as they discuss the future of politics in America. Walsh’s insights into the evolving political landscape are both eye-opening and entertaining, making this episode a must-listen for anyone looking to understand the current state of affairs.
>>> If you’re looking for a podcast that doesn’t just scratch the surface but dives deep into the murky waters of politics, this episode is your ticket! David and Moe bring on Joe Walsh, a former Congressman with a controversial past that’s as colorful as his personality. The trio kicks things off with a laugh as they reminisce about Walsh’s surprising Congressional win, and from there, the conversation spirals into a passionate discussion about the state of the GOP and the role of Democrats in today’s political climate. Walsh is candid about his transformation from a Trump supporter to a critic, and he doesn’t hold back when discussing the consequences of normalizing Trump’s behavior. With a playful humor...
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:05):
It's MUCK YOU!, the AmericanMuckrakers podcast where we sling
mutt at the high and mighty.I'm David Wheeler, the clown who
kicked off this circus, joinedby my good friend, co founder and
co host Colonel Moe Davis,with an introduction of our guest
today. Take it away, Moe.
Yeah, well, thanks, David, andthanks to everybody for tuning in
again. And we're continuingwith our, our, our line of interesting
(00:29):
and informative guests. Andtoday we've got Joe Walsh. We're
really pleased to have him on.Joe. First time I heard of him was
he got elected to Congressfrom Illinois back in, in 2010. He
ran in a district where, Joe,correct me if I'm wrong, but going
into the election, the NewYork Times said your Democratic opponent
had an 88% chance of winning,and you won instead.
(00:51):
And by 291 votes. Moeving.
Hey, a win's a win. That'slike when I do wordle in the morning.
If I get it in less than six,it's a win. Joe went to Congress
as a, I think, considered amoderate Republican and then became
a pretty solid Tea PartyRepublican who, you know, you're
against tax increases andraising the debt ceiling and climate
(01:14):
change and, and all that. ThenIllinois, as many states have done,
have redrew the districts andin 2012 lost the seat to Tammy Duckworth,
who's now representingIllinois in the, in the Senate. And
over that time, Joe went frombeing, as I said, a Tea Party Republican
and initially was a supporterof Donald Trump, but he's gone from
(01:37):
a Trump supporter to a Trumpcritic. And after leaving Congress,
Joe had a nationwide radioshow. He was on Newsmax, and currently
he's got a weekly podcastradio type show that you can, you
can watch wherever you getyour podcasts. It's about a half
hour show called called theSocial Contract with with Joe Walsh.
And he also has a book out.He's an author, and I think it was
(01:59):
in 2020 the book came out.It's called Silence Calling Trump
out for the cultish, moronic,authoritarian con man he is. And
Joe, I tell you thatoriginally that was the title David
and I wanted for our podcast.And then we didn't want to get into
a copyright dispute with you,so we went with MUCK YOU! instead
of the silence one. But Ithank you so much for doing this.
(02:21):
Thanks for coming on.
Hey, Moe. David, it's great tobe with you both. You guys do have
the best name for a podcast byfar. And Moe, I appreciate you reading
that full title of that book.And I was looking at the book I wrote
about Trump a week or so ago,and it amazes me. I wrote that book
(02:41):
in the fall of 19 and early2020, before either impeachment.
And I tried to make the casethen about how unfit he was. And
man, that's crazy because thatwas like before both impeachments
and trying to overthrow theelection and everything feels like
100 years ago.
(03:02):
Yeah, I know it. Strange timeswe're living in. You know, it's interesting
that we had Paul Begala onlast week and Paul had a book he
and Carville wrote back in the90s. It was called buck up, suck
up and come back when you foulup. And so I asked him, I said, wasn't
there another four letter Fword that you wrote, really wanted
to use instead of foul? And hesaid, well, we did, but our publisher
(03:23):
said they wouldn't put it out.But apparently by 2020, publishers
had changed their mind and letyou put the F word in there.
Well, it is interesting, guyslike I, I've become pretty potty
mouth ever since 2016. Andthen when I turned against Trump,
I let F bombs drop all thetime. And when I go on CNN and msnbc,
(03:44):
sometimes I'll say that'sbullshit. And it's really, it is.
I don't know if it's a good ora bad thing, but we a lot more of
that now, aren't we?
Yeah, and I, we used to watchNicole Wallace in the afternoon and
she'll throw a, throw someprofanity in there from time to time,
but the times call for it.Hey, let me ask you, when you were
in Congress, you served on theHomeland Security Committee. You
(04:06):
know, having served in themilitary for 25 years, I'm just shocked
by where we are today. Youknow that Canada is our enemy and
Russia is our friend. We got asec. Death who sends his wife war
plans. What's your take on ourthe state of national security in
2025?
And thank you, my brother andmy friend, for your service. Look,
(04:29):
none of this is surprising. Wehave the very thing our founding
fathers feared, currently inthe White House. He doesn't believe
in democracy. He doesn'tbelieve in freedom. He doesn't believe
in the rule of law, and he'sall about revenge. And so he's put
people in charge of defenseand CIA and Justice and the FBI and
(04:51):
our intelligence who areeither utterly incompetent and, or
like him, enemies of democracyand the rule of law. And mo. You
know, my God, the DefenseDepartment is the Largest. And we've
got a 19 year old frat boywho's running it. Utterly unfit and
unserious, but a reflection onTrump because he's an unfit, unserious
(05:15):
commander in chief.
Yeah, I'm just flabbergastedthat, you know, we hold 18 year old
recruits to a higher standardthan we do the Secretary of Defense.
And normally, you know,discipline starts at the top. And
it seems with thisadministration there are no standards,
no accountability. You know,it used to be the buck stops here
(05:36):
and now it's past the buck.
But Moe, can I, if I were withyou right now, I'd slap you upside
the head because. And I loveyou, but you don't. Don't say you're
flabbergasted or you'reshocked because none of us should
be. Like, it's so interesting.I'm a Tea Party guy, still a proud
Tea Party guy. I'm no longer aRepublican, but last year I spent
(05:59):
every single day for threemonths in one battleground state
after another trying to helpKamala Harris get elected. And I'm
telling you, and you guysknow, America knowingly elected a
bad bat. He told us what hewas going to do. We knowingly elected
a bad guy. The Democrats havetheir issues and that contributed
(06:19):
to it. But everything he'sdoing right now, none of it should
be a surprise to anybody who'spaying attention.
Well, what surprises me is, Imean, not Trump's behavior, but the
Republican Party just beingthing like, you know, I've known
Lindsey Graham longer thanI've known my wife and worked with
him and John McCain back, youknow, when they were the two pushing
(06:40):
back against the Bushadministration. And like Roger Wicker
was a reservist, assigned myoffice for a while. I mean, I know
those guys know better andthey're willingly, you know, letting
the military be degraded theway that it is. And you know, it's
one thing to be stupid and getlulled into the whole MAGA movement,
but there are people like themthat know better.
(07:01):
That's mo, that's such acogent point. Look, the deal is these
past eight, nine years, andit's only gotten worse. If you're
like me, if you're aRepublican, a conservative, and you
publicly speak out againstTrump, you're done. Your career is
done. You're done as aRepublican. You can never get elected
again as a Republican. Yourlivelihood is over. That's what happened
(07:24):
to me six, seven years agowhen I came, my friend and former
colleague Adam Kinzinger, samething Cheney, there are a handful
of us. And so if you'reLindsey Graham and all the others,
you look at that and you say,I don't want that because I want
the power. I want therelevancy. I want to be important.
I still want to be a viableRepublican. It's really, really hard
(07:46):
to give up. I wasn't acongressman for 20 years, but, man,
I was there enough to seewhere the power, the perceived power
and importance you think yougot can easily go to your head, and
it's really hard to let go of.So a lot of them don't like Trump
privately. By God, it's theprice you got to pay when you sell
your soul to stay in power.
(08:08):
Yeah, to me, you know, ifyou're in public service, you know,
for the right reason, youshould be willing to lose your job,
if that's what it means toserve the public. And, you know,
folks that are, you know,again, compromising what they know
is, you know, the. The rightthing to do in order to hang on to
their jobs is just. It'sreally disappointing. But, hey, you
(08:29):
mentioned earlier, youmentioned the Democrats, and certainly
there's. There's a lot ofblame, I think, to go around, but
certainly the Democrats youget. There's a 27 to 29% approval
rating. You did a showrecently on your. Your program called
in. The title was, Damn it,Democrats, Think outside the Box.
Go big or go home. What's youradvice to the Democrats? How do we
(08:51):
claw this thing back?
Yeah, right. Moe and David,like, we need Democrats to get their
act together. My God, theyare. I mean, we've got a legit threat
to our democracy and the ruleof law in the White House. We need
an effective opposition party.They're the only game in town. I've
been preaching about a thirdparty, a fourth party, for years.
(09:13):
That ain't coming now. Andright now, the Dems are the only,
only game in town. So we needthem to get their act together, I
think. And this comes from,again, my experience out campaigning
for Kamala Harris and myexperience kind of coming from MAGA
and coming from where regularfolk live. Every day I was out there
(09:35):
campaigning, Moe, for her.Somebody in Pennsylvania or North
Carolina or Arizona would tellme a variation of the following.
And they all said it, justregular folk. They said, joe, I know
Trump's a fucking asshole, butthe Democrats are elites. They're
snob. They look down on. Iheard a variation of that, Moe, everywhere
(09:57):
I went. And like, when I gotelected to Congress 10, 12 years
ago, most College educatedpeople voted Republican back then.
People without a college. Acollege degree voted Democrat. That's
completely flipped. And it'scompletely flipped because in my
mind, the Democrats have grownout of touch with where regular folk
(10:19):
are. And so then regular folkcan become, as, you know, more really
susceptible to a demagoguelike Trump just lies to them and
bullshits them. But regularfolk have been fooled into thinking
he cares about them. Democratshaven't even given the impression
that they care. So somehowthey got to really begin to connect.
(10:40):
Yeah, I thought Paul McGallalast week had a really good description.
He said, in his opinion,Democrats focus too much on who put
their pronouns at the end oftheir emails rather than people that
have their name stitched abovetheir pocket when they go to work
in the morning.
You know, Moe, I agree withthat to a degree. And Carville says
the same shit. And RahmEmanuel has been out there saying
(11:02):
the same stuff. Like, we. Wegot to pay more attention. Dem's
got to pay more attention tokitchen table issues than all of
this woke stuff. I saybullshit to a lot of that, though.
I think Democrats got to doboth. I think Democrats got us just
take the issue of, like,transgender men and women. Yeah.
Have. Have the left at timesgone too far, pushing stuff, pronoun
(11:26):
stuff and the rest. Sure. Butmy God, the maga, right, when it
comes to transgenderAmericans, they don't even think
it exists. They think thesepeople should be shunned. It's a
mental illness. MoestAmericans are where Democrats should
be on the transgender issue.Live your life. Be true to yourself.
We love and embrace all ofGod's children. When it comes to
(11:49):
transgender men in sports,we've got to make sure that it's
a fair plane. And when itcomes to bathrooms and locker rooms,
respect the privacy of bothsides. That's where most Americans
are. And so Democrats. Moe,maybe it's because I come from the
far right and I used to engagein a lot of the culture war stuff.
(12:09):
We would always do it becauseit worked and Democrats would never
fight us on the culture war. Ithink Democrats got to fight on the
culture war stuff and thebread and butter.
Yeah, I think you're right,Joe. And one of the things that's
been a theme of this show hasbeen the. The fact that Democrats
won't push back. They want tobe right instead of win. And so we've
(12:30):
been trying to push candidatesthat come on the show and others
that there is nothing wrongwith pointing out factual information.
It may be salacious, but yougot to use the tools that you have
in front of you to get to beatthese motherfuckers. They do the
same thing to the Democrat.Why wouldn't you do it back at them?
And here's my question foryou, Joe. What. What is the difference
(12:52):
in the DNA between aDemocratic candidate and a Republican
candidate? Why is it they'rewilling to go the extra way to win
and the Democrat will wouldrather lose?
And you know what, David? It'salways been that way. Again, when
I was in Congress, weRepublicans knew that we'd go places
that Democrats wouldn't go,and so we'd pound them over the head
(13:14):
with shit. You know, in a way,Democrats, like, I agree with Democrats
on most values, and they'remore decent, loving, tolerant people,
but Republicans fucking willgrab you by the balls and do whatever
it takes to win. And so Idon't want Democrats to lose their
decency, but damn it, I wantDemocrats to be authentic, to be
(13:36):
righteously angry and to fight.
Yeah, yeah. Democrats don'thave to lose their innate ability
to be empathetic and helpfulto others, but the fucking candidates
better or they're not going tohave any positions in government.
Yeah, yeah, I know. I agreewith that. But like, and David, I'd
(13:57):
say, look, Democrats comeacross as sort of wussies, as they
do come across as academicsand elitists. Elitists. Now, we are
living. And I've beenpreaching this every time I go on
tv. We've been living in apopulist moment for a long time.
And all that means is regularpeople are pissed off at their government
(14:21):
because they don't think theirgovernment's doing what government
should do. So along comesTrump and maga and they demagogue
the populist moment. DonaldTrump is a populist. He's an evil
populist. But, like, theDemocrats don't even have that. They
don't even recognize thismoment. So I want them to be good,
righteous populists and, andfight for stuff. I don't care. I'm
(14:43):
not an AOC or a Bernie guy.Like, I'm not way over there on the
left. But, man, I, I supportthem because they fight. We need
Democrats to fucking fight.
Yeah, I agree with you 100%.And my only criticism, Bernie and
AOC, is they do these greatbig rallies. But how does that help
us elect five more people inthe House, you know, to take back
(15:06):
the House? What are theydoing, literally, what are they doing
on an operational level tomake that happen?
Well, David, that's a reallyfreaking smart. And so the answer
is, I think what they're doingis valuable in that they're rallying
the base. But to your point,David, if the base come 20, 26, that's
(15:27):
all rallied and fired up,doesn't lock arms with center, center
left, Democrats andindependents, then to your point,
David, it's all for naught.Like, I often ask myself this, guys,
what if Joe Walsh came outtomorrow and a conservative Democrat?
Would the party embrace thator reject? I think the party's got
(15:47):
to figure that out. How big atent are they going to be to win?
No, I agree with 100%. Solet's switch gears a here, head back
to your home state ofIllinois. I spent 22 years in Chicago.
I can't believe we didn't run into.
We did. At some bar. We did, Dave.
I'm sure we did, my friend.
Jesus.
I think I kept several barsafloat while I was there, but, you
(16:09):
know, I was a North side guy.And God, I love Chicago news this
week is that, you know,Senator Dick Durbin is going to stand
down. God bless him. I loveDick Durbin. I've been a big supporter
of his, been in the room withhim several times. He, he gets it
now. God damn it. I'm so happyto hear that he's not going to run
again because one of my otherbeefs about politicians on both sides,
(16:32):
but the Democrats are just asbad. They get in there and then they
stay there. They don't giveanybody else a chance. And I think
that is part of the reason theDemocrats have slipped behind is
I couldn't agree with you morethat they have become this elitist
crowd. I also think one of thethings we talked about in another
show was there's this entireclass of consultants in Washington
(16:55):
that has no clue what goes onin western North Carolina, but they
run campaigns here and they'respending the money here. So I'm glad
to hear that Durbin is out twothings. Number one, is that something
you would look at? And numbertwo, would. If not you, then who?
Dick Durbin's a classy guy andhe and I used to fight back in the
(17:16):
day, but he's a classy,principled guy and I respect the
hell out of him for notrunning. To your point, David, like,
when I got elected, the secondbill I introduced in the House was
a term limit. And I didn'tused to be a fan of term limits,
but because I thought, like,politicians should, should limit
themselves, but they don't.Like, why. Why can someone and I
(17:41):
respect the hell out of NancyPelosi. Why the hell is she still
in Congress? Like when shestepped down as speaker, when Hakeem
Jeffries became the leader ofwhy is 83 year old Nancy Pelosi still
in Congress? Makes no sense.
I agree with you 100%.
Then the second to last pointI'll make is I'm still hugely angry
(18:01):
at Joe Biden. I did a TV showthis morning. I lay a lot of the
blame, I lay most of the blamefor Trump's victory at Biden's feet.
Joe Biden was a bitter old manwho couldn't get off the stage. He
put his own interest in frontof the country's interest. He got
Trump elected. My God, why thehell was he still sticking messed
(18:23):
everything up. Now, to yourpoint about Illinois, I'd love to
go back and run for thatSenate. Jan Szakowski, my, my former
colleague is also retiring. Alot of that district is my home district.
The problem is I'm, I'm not aDemocrat. I could become a Democrat,
but there will be really wellknown Illinois local Democrats that
(18:45):
will run for those seats andknow that the Democratic Party would
embrace former Tea Party JoeWalsh coming back home.
Well, Joe, you know, it'sinteresting. We've had, we had Adam
Kinzinger on and, and ask himthe same thing that, you know, where
do you go if you're a JoeWalsh or an Adam Kinzinger, Liz Cheney,
you know, where do you go?Because clearly, you know, the Republicans
(19:07):
have no place for you. And,and he made the same point you did.
If the Democrats were a bigenough tent that they could accommodate
from, you know, like the AOCleft to a moderate centrist that
he said, yeah, he said, Icould see myself being a Democrat,
he said, but I just don't knowthat they're willing to broaden the
aperture enough. But I, youknow, we had, and.
(19:31):
By the way, Moe, by the way,Moe, to that point, I'm so glad you
brought up Adam. He and I gotelected together. Same class, same
state. We talk all the time.You're right. He, he feels the same
way I do. Like the Democratsneed to get their act together and
we don't know that they wouldembrace us. So it's a really big
move. So most of us just kindof hang out here in limbo. I'm no
(19:55):
longer formally a Republican.Adam still is formally a Republican
in name, but it's, it's atough spot to be in.
Well, you know, we had DavidJolly on a couple of weeks ago. And
while he was on, he announcedhe was planning to run for governor
and read today where he's nowregistered as a Democrat. So at least
some of you guys are coming onboard and I think we need that. That.
(20:19):
Yeah. And I think, I think theinteresting thing about Jolly is,
look, I'm former teepot andAdam Kinzinger is a former conservative
Republican. David's alwaysbeen a right down the middle moderate.
So a much easier transitionfor him, but. So he may run for governor
of Florida as a Democrat.That's a, that's a better, that's
(20:40):
a better situation than to saymove back to blue Illinois and try
to run because it's a muchmore crowded field. Florida is a
pretty decent, solid redstate. So Jolly running as a Democrat,
he's got a great chance to getthe nomination and then, you know,
in a crazy year he could win.
Yeah, yeah. If I could justjump in a second Moe, you know. Yeah,
(21:02):
sure, Joe, you know whatyou're saying, you know, it just
angers the out of. Be honestwith you, it should. It does. The
fact that the Democratic Partyhas not figured out that they need
people like you and I'm goingto raise my voice here. I'm sorry,
they need you, they needKinzinger, invite you to the party,
give you a spot on thenational committee. I don't understand
(21:25):
how these people get elected,run this party with this such short
sighted. I'm sorry, it'sstupid thinking that when you've
got got opportunities right infront of your faces and your elite
rich faces, unfortunately, andI think this is. You hit it on the
head. But why wouldn't theyset up a caucus of former folks that
(21:48):
are willing to align with theDemocrats whether they become a Democrat
or not? Who cares as long asthey're going to align and help the
party invite those people tothe table.
Well, David, David, you'reright. But in essence that's what
we've done. We've formed aninformal alliance with Democrats,
Adam and I and a bunch ofother Republicans have. I mean we
(22:08):
were out there all last yearRepublicans for Harris. But we've
been doing it from a positionof Republicans or independents and
we could, I mean, in essence,what am I, I'm a temporary Democrat
because I'm going to spend thenext two cycles at least helping
Democrats get elected. As longas MAGA is MAGA and the Republican
(22:32):
Party's the threat it is, I'malways going to help get Democrats
elected. So it's a weird placeto be in because to Your point, David?
In essence, Kinzinger and Iare temporary Democrats right now
to begin with.
But, you know, we had a long,long tradition of having, particularly
like here in North Carolina,Blue Dog Democrat, which is what
I think you and Kinzingerwould, would fit that, that model.
(22:54):
But I don't know that thereare any true Blue Dog Democrats serving
right now.
No, Moe. It. This is a realproblem in Congress. When I was there,
it was like both parties,Democrats were mostly far left left
and far left, and Republicanswere mostly, you know, far right.
In Tea Party, the primarysystem incentivizes this right. The
(23:18):
more extreme voices winprimaries. And every year I was there,
in every cycle, the Blue DogDemocrats just disappeared and the
Rockefeller moderateRepublicans just disappeared. So
now you have a House basicallymade up of both extremes, and that's.
Not a good place to be. Hey,you did a show, you did a show recently
(23:39):
entitled We Will RegretNormalizing Trump. And I think, to
me, I go back to 2015. Iremember, you know, he came down
the escalator and it was acouple of weeks later, the first
real national media appearancehe did was on Jake Tapper Sunday
morning show. And I postedsaying, it's a bad idea. You're normalizing
(23:59):
a deviant. And Jake messagedme and said, oh, you got to watch.
I'm going to rip him a newone. And he didn't. And then he,
then he had him on again aweek or two later. And I criticized.
And then I got this nasty noteback from Jake Tapper telling me
I was an. And I criticizedMSNBC and CNN for giving him unlimited
airtime to normalize this guythat we all thought was a joke. And
(24:22):
I ended up, I used to do CNNand MSNBC regularly. And after I
criticized system fornormalizing Trump, I never got invited
back to either one. Yeah, andat least, you know, Joe Scarborough
had blocked me on X for awhile after I'd criticized them and.
But he later on messaged meand apologized and unblocked me.
But doesn't the media bearsome of the responsibility for, for
(24:45):
where we are that, you know?
Yeah, great stuff, Moe. Yeah,huge. And especially, you know, when
he first came on the scene inthose first few years, he was just
a ratings juggernaut. And Iget it. The media is all about ratings
and they just ate him up. But,my God, we're nine years into this
thing. We're four yearsremoved from that guy trying to overthrow
(25:08):
a fucking American election.And he only got elected because we
normalized him. The Democratsdid a lousy job of saying what a
unique threat this is. And toyour point, moving the media has
done a lousy job of. I know,like, I'll still go on Tapper show,
and I know the way Jake Tapperreally feels about Trump, but, but
(25:33):
he can't say it. And I thinkTrump masterfully takes advantage
of that because he knows themedia is just going to talk about
him every day and normalizehim every day and he can do whatever
he wants. It's a real, realproblem. I think it's got to come
from a righteous standing onthe mountain. The media is not.
Yeah, well, you know, one ofthe concerns, one reason David and
(25:54):
I started this podcast afterthe election was over in November.
I mean, you know, the farright MAGA owns social media, literally
owns it, and the mainstreammedia has been whipped into submission.
So, you know, how do you getinformation out to people to tell
them the truth? Because a lotof these people are willing to believe,
believe bullshit that, youknow, 20 years ago would have been
(26:16):
grounds for an involuntarycommitment. But how do we, how do
we get the truth out to peoplewhen, you know, the normal means
of communications aredominated by the other side?
Yeah, it's weird, Moe. LikeDems are so far behind the, the eight
ball on. Republicans havelearned and built up a whole alternative
media ecosystem. Democratsstill value going on MSNBC and cnn.
(26:41):
Nobody watches these networks.That, that is, that is like so yesterday,
I, I think, I think KamalaHarris did about as well as she could
do. I think she made two bigmistakes. One was when she sat down
on the View and couldn't thinkof one thing where she differed with
Biden. She should have reallydiffered with Biden. And the second
thing was the minute they gotwind of Joe Rogan might want her
(27:04):
on his show a, she should haveflown down there and sat with him
for, for 10 hours. I mean,right? But Dems are afraid of this
world. Now Republicans do havean advantage in that they lie. Like,
it's easy for Trump to sitdown with somebody for three hours
because he's utterlyuntethered to truth. But again, Democrats
(27:25):
got to get in the arena. Thearena is alternative. Alternative
media, podcasts. This is wherepeople get their news. Democrats
got to go into these arenasand righteously speak truth.
Yeah, it's interesting you saythat, Job. If you look at our past
podcasts, it's mostly guyslike you. We, we have bent over backwards
(27:46):
trying to get a US Senator ora sitting member of the Congress
on the Democratic side on ourshow. And we can't even get a call.
Back, but that's ridiculous.
Adam Kinzinger on Joe Walsh onother moderate Republicans, David
Jolly just no holds fire. He'sjust, yeah, David, whenever you want
(28:06):
me, I'll be there. Sure. Sopart of it is the Democrats fault
and I don't. And I know a lotof some of these consultants I knew,
I knew the campaign managerfor Biden. Not a big fan of hers,
to be honest with you. She's.They're just grifters. I mean, I'm
sorry. We got grifters on ourside of the aisle too, Joe. You know,
some of these consultants thattake on these gigs knowing full well
(28:30):
they're going to lose andspend million upon millions of dollars
ought to be taken out behindthe shed as far as I'm concerned.
So, all right, that's my rant.That's my rant for the day.
I love David. Preach, brother.I love that rant. I made up my mind
eight, nine, ten years ago. Iwill go on any podcast, big and small,
(28:50):
that matter to me, and that'swhat I do. The second point though
is voters are screaming forauthenticity. They do not want to
get behind or support somebodywho sounds like a fucking politician.
Democrats sound like fuckingpoliticians. Trump is a pathological
(29:16):
liar. He's a demagogue, he's abullshitter. But he comes across
as authentic and he certainlydoesn't come across as a packaged
politician. And I, I, I'lltell you what, Democrats gotta find
people like this. Yes, maybeDavid and Moe, maybe you two disagree
(29:36):
with me. Even like thegovernor of Pennsylvania, Shapiro
and Pete, Buddha, Judge, andeverybody says what wonderful speakers
they are. To me they soundlike practiced, rehearsed, polished.
I'm not going to get any wordwrong. Politicians, I want a fucking
Democrat who will rip theirshirt off and say a bunch of shit,
(29:58):
but talk like a real personand not a politician. I don't know
who that Democrat is.
Yeah, I don't either. And it'snot Gavin Newsom, I promise you that.
Him, he's so inauthentic.
Yeah, yeah, no, I, I thinkhe's a good governor. So don't send
your henchmen after me, Gov,but as a presidential candidate,
there's no way he would win.
(30:20):
And you know, it's not thetime for Slick. He comes across as
slick. Slick's not gonna do it.
Yeah, so, so Joe, rants areover. Our listeners like getting
to know our folks a littlebetter. What do you do when you're
off time? Or are you just onall the Time, my friend.
I've learned, David, to taketime off. It took me a while, but
(30:42):
I finally learned it. I. Ilove dogs. If I didn't have dogs,
I'd be dead. I love oldHollywood Moev will sit for hours
in front of Turner ClassicMoevies when I want to really unwind.
I'm a big gun guy. I like toget out in the middle of nowhere
at a range and practiceshooting. And I. I take long walks
(31:06):
in the country. But, yeah, I'mlearning to take time off.
Yeah. Good for you, man. Imean, I think it's important. One
of the things I've. I havelearned to do is I'm a single father.
Every other week, I shut myphone off after dinner. I just shut
it off and spend time with thekids, whether it's homework or movies
(31:27):
or whatever. And then. And Idon't go to bed with the phone on
either. And then I just. Mymental health is so much better that,
and I don't spend as much timeon X. But I'm gonna let Moe toss
one more question at you andthen back to me.
Yeah. Yeah. Another thingwe've talked about on here quite
often, we had, we had DenverRen on.
(31:49):
Yeah.
A while back. And, you know,since leaving Congress, he and his
wife have started adistillery. So we've been asking
folks about. I'm a big bourbonguy. What. What's your, Your mo.
You know that answer? EveryFriday night, I fire off a tequila
(32:10):
tweet where I let about 10 Fbombs fly. I am a hundred percent
a tequila guy. Guy.
Yeah. Is there a favorite?
No, I, I'm not an expert, soI'll drink damn near anything. I,
I come from a big IrishCatholic family. Nine kids, seven
boys. My dad was a bigdrinker. All my brothers are big
(32:33):
drinkers. I've never been abig drinker, but I used to drink
vodka. But then I, I, My, Mystomach was killing me because I'm
always under so much stress.So I went to a doctor, and he told
me seven years ago, tequila isthe healthiest booze. Something having
to do with the agave sugar. SoI've been all tequila ever since.
(32:56):
Love it.
Yeah.
That's great.
Back when I was running in2020, I got a. The, the fundraising
firm I was working with wouldgive me a list of, like, the big
donors and have me call themand thank them. And Ryan Reynolds,
he had a gym. I think it was agym company.
Yeah.
(33:16):
That he had just sold for,like, you know, a billion dollars.
And, and he had donated. IThink like a thousand bucks to my
campaign. So they gave me thenumber and said, you know, you need
to call Mr. Reynolds. I, Icalled and this guy answered the
phone and I said, is MoeDavis, is Ryan Reynolds in? The guy
said, this is he. I wanted tothank you for donating to my, my
campaign. I really appreciateit. And he said, I didn't donate
(33:38):
to your campaign name. And Isaid, well, I was, I was told that
you had, you had donated downhere in North Carolina. I didn't,
I didn't donate any money toyou. So I said, well, gee, I'm sorry,
and hung up. And so, you know,Act Blue is the Democratic fundraising
platform. I sent them a noteand said, look, I think there's been
a mistake here. Could you,yeah, could you refund Mr. Reynolds
money? And so they did. Andthe next day, Ryan Reynolds called
(34:01):
me and said, why in the hellwon't you take my money?
Oh, my God, that's hilarious.
And it turned out that thefundraising firm had found, like,
a Ryan Reynolds who lived onBroadway and assumed that was the,
the Ryan Reynolds. But anyway,by turning him down, he not only,
you know, called me and said,why in the hell won't you take my
money? But he doubled hiscontribution. So we're thinking about
(34:24):
we should turn down morepeople and see if they would double
theirs.
I love it. I love it, Moe.That's classic.
All right, Joe, we want to endon a high note here. What gives you
hope? What, what makes youthink we can maybe win back the house
in 2026 if, if you do?
(34:49):
David, that's always a badquestion to ask me because I'm a
dark Irishman and I generallydon't lead with hope. I, I, I think
this 249 year old experimentin democracy and freedom is teetering
right now, and I don't knowthat will keep it together. I'll
(35:12):
answer your question in twoways. The only thing long term that
gives me hope for America isyoung people. I do a lot of public
speaking with young people.They've opened my eyes and, and so
that gives me some hope on 26.I just think, you know, Trump just
(35:37):
keeps up every day. And so Ithink if the Democrats don't step
all over themselves, theyshould take back the house in 26,
probably not the Senate. But,David, you'll appreciate this. I
think that would be the worstthing to happen to the Democrats
if the Democrats take back theHouse. Only because Trump is suck.
(36:03):
Trump sucks and Trump's bad,and Trump's batshit crazy. And all
the rest. If it's only becauseof Trump again, then Democrats aren't
going to learn the lesson thatwe've all been talking about that
they got to get their acttogether and they got to connect
with regular people. I wantDemocrats to take back the House
because people want to fuckingrun through a wall to vote for Democrats.
(36:25):
And I worry that because Trumpis so up that Democrats are starting
to think, oh, maybe we don'thave to get our act together, we
can just ride the Trump is badtrain to the midterms. I worry about
that.
Yeah, I think that's a validargument. I had thought about that.
(36:46):
But to save democracy, I thinkwe could take back the House and
maybe, yeah, kick, kick somesense into some of these folks during
2627.
Amen.
That's a wrap for MUCK YOU!,Where the Mud Flies and the Phonies
fry. Although RepresentativeWalsh is not a phony in my book,
(37:06):
I'm David Wheeler, theringmaster of this Muckfest alongside
Colonel Moe Davis inAsheville, North Carolina. Thank
you to our guest today, theincomparable Representative Joe Walsh
of Chicago. Actually,Mundelein, which isn't Chicago, but
we'll talk about that later.Listen to Joe's show the Social Contract
weekdays wherever you watchyour podcast and get no Kings merch@oneflaginitiative.org
(37:32):
all one wordoneflaginitiative.org we'll catch
you next time time when werake it up. Until then and this one
goes out especially to you,Representative Walsh. MUCK YOU!.
This has been MUCK YOU! cohosted by Colonel Moe Davis in Asheville,
North Carolina and DavidWheeler in Spruce Pine, North Carolina.
Thanks to our guest today,former Congressman Joe Walsh. Please
(37:55):
listen to Joe's weekday showthe Social Contract wherever you
get your podcast. You can alsopurchase no Kings merch@oneflaginitiative.org
MUCK YOU! is produced byAmerican Muckrakers. Copyright 2025.
You can learn more and donateat americanmckrakers.com Follow us
on Blue sky under AmericanMuckrakers.com and on substack@american
(38:15):
muckrakers.substack.com Davidand Moe Hope y'all come back soon
for a new episode. Andremember to never take from anyone,
especially Trumpers. You knowwho made it.
It's MUCK YOU!, the AmericanMuckrakers podcast where we sling
mutt at the high and mighty.I'm David Wheeler, the clown who
kicked off this circus, joinedby my good friend, co founder and
co host Colonel Moe Davis,with an introduction of our guest
today. Take it away, Moe.
Yeah, well, thanks, David, andthanks to everybody for tuning in
again. And we're continuingwith our, our, our line of interesting
(00:29):
and informative guests. Andtoday we've got Joe Walsh. We're
really pleased to have him on.Joe. First time I heard of him was
he got elected to Congressfrom Illinois back in, in 2010. He
ran in a district where, Joe,correct me if I'm wrong, but going
into the election, the NewYork Times said your Democratic opponent
had an 88% chance of winning,and you won instead.
(00:51):
And by 291 votes. Moeving.
Hey, a win's a win. That'slike when I do wordle in the morning.
If I get it in less than six,it's a win. Joe went to Congress
as a, I think, considered amoderate Republican and then became
a pretty solid Tea PartyRepublican who, you know, you're
against tax increases andraising the debt ceiling and climate
(01:14):
change and, and all that. ThenIllinois, as many states have done,
have redrew the districts andin 2012 lost the seat to Tammy Duckworth,
who's now representingIllinois in the, in the Senate. And
over that time, Joe went frombeing, as I said, a Tea Party Republican
and initially was a supporterof Donald Trump, but he's gone from
(01:37):
a Trump supporter to a Trumpcritic. And after leaving Congress,
Joe had a nationwide radioshow. He was on Newsmax, and currently
he's got a weekly podcastradio type show that you can, you
can watch wherever you getyour podcasts. It's about a half
hour show called called theSocial Contract with with Joe Walsh.
And he also has a book out.He's an author, and I think it was
(01:59):
in 2020 the book came out.It's called Silence Calling Trump
out for the cultish, moronic,authoritarian con man he is. And
Joe, I tell you thatoriginally that was the title David
and I wanted for our podcast.And then we didn't want to get into
a copyright dispute with you,so we went with MUCK YOU! instead
of the silence one. But Ithank you so much for doing this.
(02:21):
Thanks for coming on.
Hey, Moe. David, it's great tobe with you both. You guys do have
the best name for a podcast byfar. And Moe, I appreciate you reading
that full title of that book.And I was looking at the book I wrote
about Trump a week or so ago,and it amazes me. I wrote that book
(02:41):
in the fall of 19 and early2020, before either impeachment.
And I tried to make the casethen about how unfit he was. And
man, that's crazy because thatwas like before both impeachments
and trying to overthrow theelection and everything feels like
100 years ago.
(03:02):
Yeah, I know it. Strange timeswe're living in. You know, it's interesting
that we had Paul Begala onlast week and Paul had a book he
and Carville wrote back in the90s. It was called buck up, suck
up and come back when you foulup. And so I asked him, I said, wasn't
there another four letter Fword that you wrote, really wanted
to use instead of foul? And hesaid, well, we did, but our publisher
(03:23):
said they wouldn't put it out.But apparently by 2020, publishers
had changed their mind and letyou put the F word in there.
Well, it is interesting, guyslike I, I've become pretty potty
mouth ever since 2016. Andthen when I turned against Trump,
I let F bombs drop all thetime. And when I go on CNN and msnbc,
(03:44):
sometimes I'll say that'sbullshit. And it's really, it is.
I don't know if it's a good ora bad thing, but we a lot more of
that now, aren't we?
Yeah, and I, we used to watchNicole Wallace in the afternoon and
she'll throw a, throw someprofanity in there from time to time,
but the times call for it.Hey, let me ask you, when you were
in Congress, you served on theHomeland Security Committee. You
(04:06):
know, having served in themilitary for 25 years, I'm just shocked
by where we are today. Youknow that Canada is our enemy and
Russia is our friend. We got asec. Death who sends his wife war
plans. What's your take on ourthe state of national security in
2025?
And thank you, my brother andmy friend, for your service. Look,
(04:29):
none of this is surprising. Wehave the very thing our founding
fathers feared, currently inthe White House. He doesn't believe
in democracy. He doesn'tbelieve in freedom. He doesn't believe
in the rule of law, and he'sall about revenge. And so he's put
people in charge of defenseand CIA and Justice and the FBI and
(04:51):
our intelligence who areeither utterly incompetent and, or
like him, enemies of democracyand the rule of law. And mo. You
know, my God, the DefenseDepartment is the Largest. And we've
got a 19 year old frat boywho's running it. Utterly unfit and
unserious, but a reflection onTrump because he's an unfit, unserious
(05:15):
commander in chief.
Yeah, I'm just flabbergastedthat, you know, we hold 18 year old
recruits to a higher standardthan we do the Secretary of Defense.
And normally, you know,discipline starts at the top. And
it seems with thisadministration there are no standards,
no accountability. You know,it used to be the buck stops here
(05:36):
and now it's past the buck.
But Moe, can I, if I were withyou right now, I'd slap you upside
the head because. And I loveyou, but you don't. Don't say you're
flabbergasted or you'reshocked because none of us should
be. Like, it's so interesting.I'm a Tea Party guy, still a proud
Tea Party guy. I'm no longer aRepublican, but last year I spent
(05:59):
every single day for threemonths in one battleground state
after another trying to helpKamala Harris get elected. And I'm
telling you, and you guysknow, America knowingly elected a
bad bat. He told us what hewas going to do. We knowingly elected
a bad guy. The Democrats havetheir issues and that contributed
(06:19):
to it. But everything he'sdoing right now, none of it should
be a surprise to anybody who'spaying attention.
Well, what surprises me is, Imean, not Trump's behavior, but the
Republican Party just beingthing like, you know, I've known
Lindsey Graham longer thanI've known my wife and worked with
him and John McCain back, youknow, when they were the two pushing
(06:40):
back against the Bushadministration. And like Roger Wicker
was a reservist, assigned myoffice for a while. I mean, I know
those guys know better andthey're willingly, you know, letting
the military be degraded theway that it is. And you know, it's
one thing to be stupid and getlulled into the whole MAGA movement,
but there are people like themthat know better.
(07:01):
That's mo, that's such acogent point. Look, the deal is these
past eight, nine years, andit's only gotten worse. If you're
like me, if you're aRepublican, a conservative, and you
publicly speak out againstTrump, you're done. Your career is
done. You're done as aRepublican. You can never get elected
again as a Republican. Yourlivelihood is over. That's what happened
(07:24):
to me six, seven years agowhen I came, my friend and former
colleague Adam Kinzinger, samething Cheney, there are a handful
of us. And so if you'reLindsey Graham and all the others,
you look at that and you say,I don't want that because I want
the power. I want therelevancy. I want to be important.
I still want to be a viableRepublican. It's really, really hard
(07:46):
to give up. I wasn't acongressman for 20 years, but, man,
I was there enough to seewhere the power, the perceived power
and importance you think yougot can easily go to your head, and
it's really hard to let go of.So a lot of them don't like Trump
privately. By God, it's theprice you got to pay when you sell
your soul to stay in power.
(08:08):
Yeah, to me, you know, ifyou're in public service, you know,
for the right reason, youshould be willing to lose your job,
if that's what it means toserve the public. And, you know,
folks that are, you know,again, compromising what they know
is, you know, the. The rightthing to do in order to hang on to
their jobs is just. It'sreally disappointing. But, hey, you
(08:29):
mentioned earlier, youmentioned the Democrats, and certainly
there's. There's a lot ofblame, I think, to go around, but
certainly the Democrats youget. There's a 27 to 29% approval
rating. You did a showrecently on your. Your program called
in. The title was, Damn it,Democrats, Think outside the Box.
Go big or go home. What's youradvice to the Democrats? How do we
(08:51):
claw this thing back?
Yeah, right. Moe and David,like, we need Democrats to get their
act together. My God, theyare. I mean, we've got a legit threat
to our democracy and the ruleof law in the White House. We need
an effective opposition party.They're the only game in town. I've
been preaching about a thirdparty, a fourth party, for years.
(09:13):
That ain't coming now. Andright now, the Dems are the only,
only game in town. So we needthem to get their act together, I
think. And this comes from,again, my experience out campaigning
for Kamala Harris and myexperience kind of coming from MAGA
and coming from where regularfolk live. Every day I was out there
(09:35):
campaigning, Moe, for her.Somebody in Pennsylvania or North
Carolina or Arizona would tellme a variation of the following.
And they all said it, justregular folk. They said, joe, I know
Trump's a fucking asshole, butthe Democrats are elites. They're
snob. They look down on. Iheard a variation of that, Moe, everywhere
(09:57):
I went. And like, when I gotelected to Congress 10, 12 years
ago, most College educatedpeople voted Republican back then.
People without a college. Acollege degree voted Democrat. That's
completely flipped. And it'scompletely flipped because in my
mind, the Democrats have grownout of touch with where regular folk
(10:19):
are. And so then regular folkcan become, as, you know, more really
susceptible to a demagoguelike Trump just lies to them and
bullshits them. But regularfolk have been fooled into thinking
he cares about them. Democratshaven't even given the impression
that they care. So somehowthey got to really begin to connect.
(10:40):
Yeah, I thought Paul McGallalast week had a really good description.
He said, in his opinion,Democrats focus too much on who put
their pronouns at the end oftheir emails rather than people that
have their name stitched abovetheir pocket when they go to work
in the morning.
You know, Moe, I agree withthat to a degree. And Carville says
the same shit. And RahmEmanuel has been out there saying
(11:02):
the same stuff. Like, we. Wegot to pay more attention. Dem's
got to pay more attention tokitchen table issues than all of
this woke stuff. I saybullshit to a lot of that, though.
I think Democrats got to doboth. I think Democrats got us just
take the issue of, like,transgender men and women. Yeah.
Have. Have the left at timesgone too far, pushing stuff, pronoun
(11:26):
stuff and the rest. Sure. Butmy God, the maga, right, when it
comes to transgenderAmericans, they don't even think
it exists. They think thesepeople should be shunned. It's a
mental illness. MoestAmericans are where Democrats should
be on the transgender issue.Live your life. Be true to yourself.
We love and embrace all ofGod's children. When it comes to
(11:49):
transgender men in sports,we've got to make sure that it's
a fair plane. And when itcomes to bathrooms and locker rooms,
respect the privacy of bothsides. That's where most Americans
are. And so Democrats. Moe,maybe it's because I come from the
far right and I used to engagein a lot of the culture war stuff.
(12:09):
We would always do it becauseit worked and Democrats would never
fight us on the culture war. Ithink Democrats got to fight on the
culture war stuff and thebread and butter.
Yeah, I think you're right,Joe. And one of the things that's
been a theme of this show hasbeen the. The fact that Democrats
won't push back. They want tobe right instead of win. And so we've
(12:30):
been trying to push candidatesthat come on the show and others
that there is nothing wrongwith pointing out factual information.
It may be salacious, but yougot to use the tools that you have
in front of you to get to beatthese motherfuckers. They do the
same thing to the Democrat.Why wouldn't you do it back at them?
And here's my question foryou, Joe. What. What is the difference
(12:52):
in the DNA between aDemocratic candidate and a Republican
candidate? Why is it they'rewilling to go the extra way to win
and the Democrat will wouldrather lose?
And you know what, David? It'salways been that way. Again, when
I was in Congress, weRepublicans knew that we'd go places
that Democrats wouldn't go,and so we'd pound them over the head
(13:14):
with shit. You know, in a way,Democrats, like, I agree with Democrats
on most values, and they'remore decent, loving, tolerant people,
but Republicans fucking willgrab you by the balls and do whatever
it takes to win. And so Idon't want Democrats to lose their
decency, but damn it, I wantDemocrats to be authentic, to be
(13:36):
righteously angry and to fight.
Yeah, yeah. Democrats don'thave to lose their innate ability
to be empathetic and helpfulto others, but the fucking candidates
better or they're not going tohave any positions in government.
Yeah, yeah, I know. I agreewith that. But like, and David, I'd
(13:57):
say, look, Democrats comeacross as sort of wussies, as they
do come across as academicsand elitists. Elitists. Now, we are
living. And I've beenpreaching this every time I go on
tv. We've been living in apopulist moment for a long time.
And all that means is regularpeople are pissed off at their government
(14:21):
because they don't think theirgovernment's doing what government
should do. So along comesTrump and maga and they demagogue
the populist moment. DonaldTrump is a populist. He's an evil
populist. But, like, theDemocrats don't even have that. They
don't even recognize thismoment. So I want them to be good,
righteous populists and, andfight for stuff. I don't care. I'm
(14:43):
not an AOC or a Bernie guy.Like, I'm not way over there on the
left. But, man, I, I supportthem because they fight. We need
Democrats to fucking fight.
Yeah, I agree with you 100%.And my only criticism, Bernie and
AOC, is they do these greatbig rallies. But how does that help
us elect five more people inthe House, you know, to take back
(15:06):
the House? What are theydoing, literally, what are they doing
on an operational level tomake that happen?
Well, David, that's a reallyfreaking smart. And so the answer
is, I think what they're doingis valuable in that they're rallying
the base. But to your point,David, if the base come 20, 26, that's
(15:27):
all rallied and fired up,doesn't lock arms with center, center
left, Democrats andindependents, then to your point,
David, it's all for naught.Like, I often ask myself this, guys,
what if Joe Walsh came outtomorrow and a conservative Democrat?
Would the party embrace thator reject? I think the party's got
(15:47):
to figure that out. How big atent are they going to be to win?
No, I agree with 100%. Solet's switch gears a here, head back
to your home state ofIllinois. I spent 22 years in Chicago.
I can't believe we didn't run into.
We did. At some bar. We did, Dave.
I'm sure we did, my friend.
Jesus.
I think I kept several barsafloat while I was there, but, you
(16:09):
know, I was a North side guy.And God, I love Chicago news this
week is that, you know,Senator Dick Durbin is going to stand
down. God bless him. I loveDick Durbin. I've been a big supporter
of his, been in the room withhim several times. He, he gets it
now. God damn it. I'm so happyto hear that he's not going to run
again because one of my otherbeefs about politicians on both sides,
(16:32):
but the Democrats are just asbad. They get in there and then they
stay there. They don't giveanybody else a chance. And I think
that is part of the reason theDemocrats have slipped behind is
I couldn't agree with you morethat they have become this elitist
crowd. I also think one of thethings we talked about in another
show was there's this entireclass of consultants in Washington
(16:55):
that has no clue what goes onin western North Carolina, but they
run campaigns here and they'respending the money here. So I'm glad
to hear that Durbin is out twothings. Number one, is that something
you would look at? And numbertwo, would. If not you, then who?
Dick Durbin's a classy guy andhe and I used to fight back in the
(17:16):
day, but he's a classy,principled guy and I respect the
hell out of him for notrunning. To your point, David, like,
when I got elected, the secondbill I introduced in the House was
a term limit. And I didn'tused to be a fan of term limits,
but because I thought, like,politicians should, should limit
themselves, but they don't.Like, why. Why can someone and I
(17:41):
respect the hell out of NancyPelosi. Why the hell is she still
in Congress? Like when shestepped down as speaker, when Hakeem
Jeffries became the leader ofwhy is 83 year old Nancy Pelosi still
in Congress? Makes no sense.
I agree with you 100%.
Then the second to last pointI'll make is I'm still hugely angry
(18:01):
at Joe Biden. I did a TV showthis morning. I lay a lot of the
blame, I lay most of the blamefor Trump's victory at Biden's feet.
Joe Biden was a bitter old manwho couldn't get off the stage. He
put his own interest in frontof the country's interest. He got
Trump elected. My God, why thehell was he still sticking messed
(18:23):
everything up. Now, to yourpoint about Illinois, I'd love to
go back and run for thatSenate. Jan Szakowski, my, my former
colleague is also retiring. Alot of that district is my home district.
The problem is I'm, I'm not aDemocrat. I could become a Democrat,
but there will be really wellknown Illinois local Democrats that
(18:45):
will run for those seats andknow that the Democratic Party would
embrace former Tea Party JoeWalsh coming back home.
Well, Joe, you know, it'sinteresting. We've had, we had Adam
Kinzinger on and, and ask himthe same thing that, you know, where
do you go if you're a JoeWalsh or an Adam Kinzinger, Liz Cheney,
you know, where do you go?Because clearly, you know, the Republicans
(19:07):
have no place for you. And,and he made the same point you did.
If the Democrats were a bigenough tent that they could accommodate
from, you know, like the AOCleft to a moderate centrist that
he said, yeah, he said, Icould see myself being a Democrat,
he said, but I just don't knowthat they're willing to broaden the
aperture enough. But I, youknow, we had, and.
(19:31):
By the way, Moe, by the way,Moe, to that point, I'm so glad you
brought up Adam. He and I gotelected together. Same class, same
state. We talk all the time.You're right. He, he feels the same
way I do. Like the Democratsneed to get their act together and
we don't know that they wouldembrace us. So it's a really big
move. So most of us just kindof hang out here in limbo. I'm no
(19:55):
longer formally a Republican.Adam still is formally a Republican
in name, but it's, it's atough spot to be in.
Well, you know, we had DavidJolly on a couple of weeks ago. And
while he was on, he announcedhe was planning to run for governor
and read today where he's nowregistered as a Democrat. So at least
some of you guys are coming onboard and I think we need that. That.
(20:19):
Yeah. And I think, I think theinteresting thing about Jolly is,
look, I'm former teepot andAdam Kinzinger is a former conservative
Republican. David's alwaysbeen a right down the middle moderate.
So a much easier transitionfor him, but. So he may run for governor
of Florida as a Democrat.That's a, that's a better, that's
(20:40):
a better situation than to saymove back to blue Illinois and try
to run because it's a muchmore crowded field. Florida is a
pretty decent, solid redstate. So Jolly running as a Democrat,
he's got a great chance to getthe nomination and then, you know,
in a crazy year he could win.
Yeah, yeah. If I could justjump in a second Moe, you know. Yeah,
(21:02):
sure, Joe, you know whatyou're saying, you know, it just
angers the out of. Be honestwith you, it should. It does. The
fact that the Democratic Partyhas not figured out that they need
people like you and I'm goingto raise my voice here. I'm sorry,
they need you, they needKinzinger, invite you to the party,
give you a spot on thenational committee. I don't understand
(21:25):
how these people get elected,run this party with this such short
sighted. I'm sorry, it'sstupid thinking that when you've
got got opportunities right infront of your faces and your elite
rich faces, unfortunately, andI think this is. You hit it on the
head. But why wouldn't theyset up a caucus of former folks that
(21:48):
are willing to align with theDemocrats whether they become a Democrat
or not? Who cares as long asthey're going to align and help the
party invite those people tothe table.
Well, David, David, you'reright. But in essence that's what
we've done. We've formed aninformal alliance with Democrats,
Adam and I and a bunch ofother Republicans have. I mean we
(22:08):
were out there all last yearRepublicans for Harris. But we've
been doing it from a positionof Republicans or independents and
we could, I mean, in essence,what am I, I'm a temporary Democrat
because I'm going to spend thenext two cycles at least helping
Democrats get elected. As longas MAGA is MAGA and the Republican
(22:32):
Party's the threat it is, I'malways going to help get Democrats
elected. So it's a weird placeto be in because to Your point, David?
In essence, Kinzinger and Iare temporary Democrats right now
to begin with.
But, you know, we had a long,long tradition of having, particularly
like here in North Carolina,Blue Dog Democrat, which is what
I think you and Kinzingerwould, would fit that, that model.
(22:54):
But I don't know that thereare any true Blue Dog Democrats serving
right now.
No, Moe. It. This is a realproblem in Congress. When I was there,
it was like both parties,Democrats were mostly far left left
and far left, and Republicanswere mostly, you know, far right.
In Tea Party, the primarysystem incentivizes this right. The
(23:18):
more extreme voices winprimaries. And every year I was there,
in every cycle, the Blue DogDemocrats just disappeared and the
Rockefeller moderateRepublicans just disappeared. So
now you have a House basicallymade up of both extremes, and that's.
Not a good place to be. Hey,you did a show, you did a show recently
(23:39):
entitled We Will RegretNormalizing Trump. And I think, to
me, I go back to 2015. Iremember, you know, he came down
the escalator and it was acouple of weeks later, the first
real national media appearancehe did was on Jake Tapper Sunday
morning show. And I postedsaying, it's a bad idea. You're normalizing
(23:59):
a deviant. And Jake messagedme and said, oh, you got to watch.
I'm going to rip him a newone. And he didn't. And then he,
then he had him on again aweek or two later. And I criticized.
And then I got this nasty noteback from Jake Tapper telling me
I was an. And I criticizedMSNBC and CNN for giving him unlimited
airtime to normalize this guythat we all thought was a joke. And
(24:22):
I ended up, I used to do CNNand MSNBC regularly. And after I
criticized system fornormalizing Trump, I never got invited
back to either one. Yeah, andat least, you know, Joe Scarborough
had blocked me on X for awhile after I'd criticized them and.
But he later on messaged meand apologized and unblocked me.
But doesn't the media bearsome of the responsibility for, for
(24:45):
where we are that, you know?
Yeah, great stuff, Moe. Yeah,huge. And especially, you know, when
he first came on the scene inthose first few years, he was just
a ratings juggernaut. And Iget it. The media is all about ratings
and they just ate him up. But,my God, we're nine years into this
thing. We're four yearsremoved from that guy trying to overthrow
(25:08):
a fucking American election.And he only got elected because we
normalized him. The Democratsdid a lousy job of saying what a
unique threat this is. And toyour point, moving the media has
done a lousy job of. I know,like, I'll still go on Tapper show,
and I know the way Jake Tapperreally feels about Trump, but, but
(25:33):
he can't say it. And I thinkTrump masterfully takes advantage
of that because he knows themedia is just going to talk about
him every day and normalizehim every day and he can do whatever
he wants. It's a real, realproblem. I think it's got to come
from a righteous standing onthe mountain. The media is not.
Yeah, well, you know, one ofthe concerns, one reason David and
(25:54):
I started this podcast afterthe election was over in November.
I mean, you know, the farright MAGA owns social media, literally
owns it, and the mainstreammedia has been whipped into submission.
So, you know, how do you getinformation out to people to tell
them the truth? Because a lotof these people are willing to believe,
believe bullshit that, youknow, 20 years ago would have been
(26:16):
grounds for an involuntarycommitment. But how do we, how do
we get the truth out to peoplewhen, you know, the normal means
of communications aredominated by the other side?
Yeah, it's weird, Moe. LikeDems are so far behind the, the eight
ball on. Republicans havelearned and built up a whole alternative
media ecosystem. Democratsstill value going on MSNBC and cnn.
(26:41):
Nobody watches these networks.That, that is, that is like so yesterday,
I, I think, I think KamalaHarris did about as well as she could
do. I think she made two bigmistakes. One was when she sat down
on the View and couldn't thinkof one thing where she differed with
Biden. She should have reallydiffered with Biden. And the second
thing was the minute they gotwind of Joe Rogan might want her
(27:04):
on his show a, she should haveflown down there and sat with him
for, for 10 hours. I mean,right? But Dems are afraid of this
world. Now Republicans do havean advantage in that they lie. Like,
it's easy for Trump to sitdown with somebody for three hours
because he's utterlyuntethered to truth. But again, Democrats
(27:25):
got to get in the arena. Thearena is alternative. Alternative
media, podcasts. This is wherepeople get their news. Democrats
got to go into these arenasand righteously speak truth.
Yeah, it's interesting you saythat, Job. If you look at our past
podcasts, it's mostly guyslike you. We, we have bent over backwards
(27:46):
trying to get a US Senator ora sitting member of the Congress
on the Democratic side on ourshow. And we can't even get a call.
Back, but that's ridiculous.
Adam Kinzinger on Joe Walsh onother moderate Republicans, David
Jolly just no holds fire. He'sjust, yeah, David, whenever you want
(28:06):
me, I'll be there. Sure. Sopart of it is the Democrats fault
and I don't. And I know a lotof some of these consultants I knew,
I knew the campaign managerfor Biden. Not a big fan of hers,
to be honest with you. She's.They're just grifters. I mean, I'm
sorry. We got grifters on ourside of the aisle too, Joe. You know,
some of these consultants thattake on these gigs knowing full well
(28:30):
they're going to lose andspend million upon millions of dollars
ought to be taken out behindthe shed as far as I'm concerned.
So, all right, that's my rant.That's my rant for the day.
I love David. Preach, brother.I love that rant. I made up my mind
eight, nine, ten years ago. Iwill go on any podcast, big and small,
(28:50):
that matter to me, and that'swhat I do. The second point though
is voters are screaming forauthenticity. They do not want to
get behind or support somebodywho sounds like a fucking politician.
Democrats sound like fuckingpoliticians. Trump is a pathological
(29:16):
liar. He's a demagogue, he's abullshitter. But he comes across
as authentic and he certainlydoesn't come across as a packaged
politician. And I, I, I'lltell you what, Democrats gotta find
people like this. Yes, maybeDavid and Moe, maybe you two disagree
(29:36):
with me. Even like thegovernor of Pennsylvania, Shapiro
and Pete, Buddha, Judge, andeverybody says what wonderful speakers
they are. To me they soundlike practiced, rehearsed, polished.
I'm not going to get any wordwrong. Politicians, I want a fucking
Democrat who will rip theirshirt off and say a bunch of shit,
(29:58):
but talk like a real personand not a politician. I don't know
who that Democrat is.
Yeah, I don't either. And it'snot Gavin Newsom, I promise you that.
Him, he's so inauthentic.
Yeah, yeah, no, I, I thinkhe's a good governor. So don't send
your henchmen after me, Gov,but as a presidential candidate,
there's no way he would win.
(30:20):
And you know, it's not thetime for Slick. He comes across as
slick. Slick's not gonna do it.
Yeah, so, so Joe, rants areover. Our listeners like getting
to know our folks a littlebetter. What do you do when you're
off time? Or are you just onall the Time, my friend.
I've learned, David, to taketime off. It took me a while, but
(30:42):
I finally learned it. I. Ilove dogs. If I didn't have dogs,
I'd be dead. I love oldHollywood Moev will sit for hours
in front of Turner ClassicMoevies when I want to really unwind.
I'm a big gun guy. I like toget out in the middle of nowhere
at a range and practiceshooting. And I. I take long walks
(31:06):
in the country. But, yeah, I'mlearning to take time off.
Yeah. Good for you, man. Imean, I think it's important. One
of the things I've. I havelearned to do is I'm a single father.
Every other week, I shut myphone off after dinner. I just shut
it off and spend time with thekids, whether it's homework or movies
(31:27):
or whatever. And then. And Idon't go to bed with the phone on
either. And then I just. Mymental health is so much better that,
and I don't spend as much timeon X. But I'm gonna let Moe toss
one more question at you andthen back to me.
Yeah. Yeah. Another thingwe've talked about on here quite
often, we had, we had DenverRen on.
(31:49):
Yeah.
A while back. And, you know,since leaving Congress, he and his
wife have started adistillery. So we've been asking
folks about. I'm a big bourbonguy. What. What's your, Your mo.
You know that answer? EveryFriday night, I fire off a tequila
(32:10):
tweet where I let about 10 Fbombs fly. I am a hundred percent
a tequila guy. Guy.
Yeah. Is there a favorite?
No, I, I'm not an expert, soI'll drink damn near anything. I,
I come from a big IrishCatholic family. Nine kids, seven
boys. My dad was a bigdrinker. All my brothers are big
(32:33):
drinkers. I've never been abig drinker, but I used to drink
vodka. But then I, I, My, Mystomach was killing me because I'm
always under so much stress.So I went to a doctor, and he told
me seven years ago, tequila isthe healthiest booze. Something having
to do with the agave sugar. SoI've been all tequila ever since.
(32:56):
Love it.
Yeah.
That's great.
Back when I was running in2020, I got a. The, the fundraising
firm I was working with wouldgive me a list of, like, the big
donors and have me call themand thank them. And Ryan Reynolds,
he had a gym. I think it was agym company.
Yeah.
(33:16):
That he had just sold for,like, you know, a billion dollars.
And, and he had donated. IThink like a thousand bucks to my
campaign. So they gave me thenumber and said, you know, you need
to call Mr. Reynolds. I, Icalled and this guy answered the
phone and I said, is MoeDavis, is Ryan Reynolds in? The guy
said, this is he. I wanted tothank you for donating to my, my
campaign. I really appreciateit. And he said, I didn't donate
(33:38):
to your campaign name. And Isaid, well, I was, I was told that
you had, you had donated downhere in North Carolina. I didn't,
I didn't donate any money toyou. So I said, well, gee, I'm sorry,
and hung up. And so, you know,Act Blue is the Democratic fundraising
platform. I sent them a noteand said, look, I think there's been
a mistake here. Could you,yeah, could you refund Mr. Reynolds
money? And so they did. Andthe next day, Ryan Reynolds called
(34:01):
me and said, why in the hellwon't you take my money?
Oh, my God, that's hilarious.
And it turned out that thefundraising firm had found, like,
a Ryan Reynolds who lived onBroadway and assumed that was the,
the Ryan Reynolds. But anyway,by turning him down, he not only,
you know, called me and said,why in the hell won't you take my
money? But he doubled hiscontribution. So we're thinking about
(34:24):
we should turn down morepeople and see if they would double
theirs.
I love it. I love it, Moe.That's classic.
All right, Joe, we want to endon a high note here. What gives you
hope? What, what makes youthink we can maybe win back the house
in 2026 if, if you do?
(34:49):
David, that's always a badquestion to ask me because I'm a
dark Irishman and I generallydon't lead with hope. I, I, I think
this 249 year old experimentin democracy and freedom is teetering
right now, and I don't knowthat will keep it together. I'll
(35:12):
answer your question in twoways. The only thing long term that
gives me hope for America isyoung people. I do a lot of public
speaking with young people.They've opened my eyes and, and so
that gives me some hope on 26.I just think, you know, Trump just
(35:37):
keeps up every day. And so Ithink if the Democrats don't step
all over themselves, theyshould take back the house in 26,
probably not the Senate. But,David, you'll appreciate this. I
think that would be the worstthing to happen to the Democrats
if the Democrats take back theHouse. Only because Trump is suck.
(36:03):
Trump sucks and Trump's bad,and Trump's batshit crazy. And all
the rest. If it's only becauseof Trump again, then Democrats aren't
going to learn the lesson thatwe've all been talking about that
they got to get their acttogether and they got to connect
with regular people. I wantDemocrats to take back the House
because people want to fuckingrun through a wall to vote for Democrats.
(36:25):
And I worry that because Trumpis so up that Democrats are starting
to think, oh, maybe we don'thave to get our act together, we
can just ride the Trump is badtrain to the midterms. I worry about
that.
Yeah, I think that's a validargument. I had thought about that.
(36:46):
But to save democracy, I thinkwe could take back the House and
maybe, yeah, kick, kick somesense into some of these folks during
2627.
Amen.
That's a wrap for MUCK YOU!,Where the Mud Flies and the Phonies
fry. Although RepresentativeWalsh is not a phony in my book,
(37:06):
I'm David Wheeler, theringmaster of this Muckfest alongside
Colonel Moe Davis inAsheville, North Carolina. Thank
you to our guest today, theincomparable Representative Joe Walsh
of Chicago. Actually,Mundelein, which isn't Chicago, but
we'll talk about that later.Listen to Joe's show the Social Contract
weekdays wherever you watchyour podcast and get no Kings merch@oneflaginitiative.org
(37:32):
all one wordoneflaginitiative.org we'll catch
you next time time when werake it up. Until then and this one
goes out especially to you,Representative Walsh. MUCK YOU!.
This has been MUCK YOU! cohosted by Colonel Moe Davis in Asheville,
North Carolina and DavidWheeler in Spruce Pine, North Carolina.
Thanks to our guest today,former Congressman Joe Walsh. Please
(37:55):
listen to Joe's weekday showthe Social Contract wherever you
get your podcast. You can alsopurchase no Kings merch@oneflaginitiative.org
MUCK YOU! is produced byAmerican Muckrakers. Copyright 2025.
You can learn more and donateat americanmckrakers.com Follow us
on Blue sky under AmericanMuckrakers.com and on substack@american
(38:15):
muckrakers.substack.com Davidand Moe Hope y'all come back soon
for a new episode. Andremember to never take from anyone,
especially Trumpers. You knowwho made it.
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