February 25, 2025 • 39 mins
Is your dog getting the right amount of exercise, or are they overdoing it without you realizing?
Whether your pup is high-energy, low-key, or somewhere in between, knowing how to safely meet their physical needs is crucial to keeping them healthy and pain-free. But most pet parents don’t know when to push their dog or when to let them rest.
In this episode, I talk with Dr. Kelly Fishman, a veterinary sports medicine expert, about how to customize exercise for your dog’s breed, age, and lifestyle—and how to spot the signs of overexertion before it leads to injury.
BY THE TIME YOU FINISH LISTENING, YOU’LL DISCOVER:
- How to gauge the right level of daily activity for your dog
- Red flags that your dog may be pushing too hard
- Simple strategies to protect joints, boost mobility, and keep dogs active through every stage of life
Dr. Fishman’s practical, prevention-focused advice will help you support your dog’s health from puppyhood to senior years—without burnout, boredom, or unnecessary injury.
LEARN MORE ABOUT DR. KELLY FISHMAN:
www.strutanimal.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Amy Castro (00:00):
Is your dog?
That dog, you know, the one whothinks walk means drag the
human at full speed and turnsevery squirrel sighting into a
high-stakes chase, and whobelieves the living room rug is
the perfect place to practicetheir zoomy takeoffs.
Or maybe your dog's yourrunning buddy, the one who never
turns down a jog but ends uplimping and giving you the side
(00:21):
eye, like I told you, that was abad idea.
In this episode, we're talkingabout all dogs, whether your
dog's more of a couch potato oran active dog who loves
neighborhood jogs, backyardsprints or intense adventure
hikes.
How can we keep our pupshealthy and injury-free?
What are the signs that they'veoverdone it and how do we make
sure they keep living their bestzoomy lives for years to come?
(00:41):
Let's find out together.
Stay tuned.
Hey there everybody.
I'm Amy Castro, and welcome toMuddy Paws and Hairballs, where
we dig into the messy, hilariousand realistic life with pets.
Today we're talking aboutkeeping dogs active and
(01:02):
preventing injuries for all dogs, from the casual strollers to
the full-throttle zoomers andeverybody in between, and we
want to keep them healthy,strong and injury-free for a
lifetime of adventures and tohelp us figure out how to help
our high-energy dogs, especiallymove without wrecking their
joints.
We've got Dr Kelly Fishmanjoining us today.
Dr Kelly is the founder ofStrut Animal Mobility Specialist
(01:25):
and she's a veterinary sportsmedicine expert who helps dogs
and cats stay mobile, recoverfrom injuries and thrive at
every stage of their lives.
She's a certified veterinaryacupuncturist and canine
rehabilitation therapist and sheis passionate about giving pet
parents practical tools, whichwe love around here, to help
their animals live longer,healthier and more active lives.
(01:47):
So welcome to the show, drKelly.
We are so excited to have youhere.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (01:51):
Thank you, I'm happy to be here, amy.
Amy Castro (01:53):
Let's go ahead and start with some of the basics.
So how do we know, you know,based on who our dog is, what is
the appropriate level ofactivity?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (02:02):
Yeah, so it definitely is kind of the two
things I'd think about.
One it would be age.
So, first of all, we all wouldknow that a puppy needs
different activity restrictionsthan an adult dog, than a senior
, and what that means is, if Ihave a lab and it's four months
old, I want to be reallyconscious of those growing bones
(02:25):
and those fragile joints, thatI don't do things that, like you
know, jumps that are too highfor my animal, or lots of
activities like running reallyhard on concrete, which are
really, you know, hard on younggrowing bones.
So you know, if I have ayounger dog, you know there's
certain guidelines that us rehabvets are taught about what are
(02:47):
safe activities for puppies andthen usually adult dogs if they
don't have any underlyingmedical issue, and sometimes
those medical issues that Ithink of because I'm a
veterinarian that's dealing withthe body I don't really think
of, like a kidney disease, right, I think of a Frenchie that is
(03:08):
really predisposed to getting adisc herniation, and that's the
stuff that I worry about.
You know, how can I prevent adisc herniation and a French
bulldog?
So things that I would tellsomeone who had a dog like that
would be like you know, again,just like we don't want our
puppies jumping, we probablydon't want those dogs jumping
also.
Amy Castro (03:28):
You know.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (03:28):
So that's something that's, you know, a
bit obvious there.
So but if you, you know, if youkeep aside just the breed and
the age, then we go into ourseniors and our senior dogs are
more likely to have arthritis,neurologic conditions that are
causing them to slow down and bea bit more fragile.
And so those dogs you also wantto be a little bit conscious of
(03:49):
and not overwork them in waysthat kind of flare those issues
up.
So, thinking about the breed ofyour dog, thinking about their
age and then thinking about whatyou can do to just prevent
injury and then also to do safeand fun activities as well.
Amy Castro (04:04):
Right, I'm glad you mentioned the puppy thing
because although you know, assomebody that does rescue and
has puppies come through ourprogram and have raised puppies,
I'm aware of that.
But I think I'm often surprisedthat there is a certain mindset
, or maybe a lack of knowledgeor information that says, oh,
they're young, they can dowhatever because they're young
and, you know, not necessarilythinking about growth plates,
(04:27):
things like that.
That is really important.
We were even seeing that rightnow my daughter's got a little
terrier mix and when sheoverdoes it you can tell it's
like a hint of a limp, but it'sbecause she's still young.
So you do need to keep an eyeon that.
When it comes to the breeds, wedon't do a lot of DNA testing
but I had mentioned to youbefore we started recording that
(04:49):
my dog is two-thirds EnglishBulldog, one-third American
Bulldog and so you know she hasa lot of those, especially the
English Bulldog characteristicsand she's already had an ACL
reconstruction and I'mconstantly telling her stop
running because I don't wantthat knee and she's got loose
hips and things like that.
(05:10):
That sort of come with thebreed but I think, also poor
breeding, because she wasintentionally bred to be what
she is.
It wasn't like an oopsie thing.
Unfortunately, so is DNAtesting.
Like if somebody has a dog andthey don't know what it is, does
it matter the breed Like shouldthey find out, because then
they can watch out for certainpotential sources of injury.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (05:31):
Yeah, I mean I suggest that, and part of it
is we know, we are now learningthat some of those common
orthopedic conditions aregenetic.
So, thinking about our FrenchBulldogs, we know that those
compressed discs, thatinterverticular disease or IVDD
that they suffer from, that dashhounds suffer from, that pugs
(05:51):
have, that sometimes bulldogshave as well.
Send it off to some of theseDNA testing systems and not only
finding so much what breederdog is, but what kind of
conditions they are geneticallypredisposed to.
And another interesting thingthat just came to light in the
(06:16):
veterinary area that most vetsand maybe most people don't know
are that those ACL tears orthat cruciate ligament tear,
that's actually genetic.
So Labradors for example, aregenetically predisposed to get
those cranial cruciate or ACL orCCL tears that we all dread,
(06:37):
and your dog has.
It's a very expensive process tofix it too.
Oh gosh, it's so expensive.
And it's not even that it's soexpensive just to have the
surgery.
But if your dog was a person,they'd be going to
rehabilitation for months afterto strengthen right away.
And then you know, I'm a rehabvet and I sometimes tell people
I said you know the surgery isexpensive but rehab is going to
(07:00):
be twice as much and noteverybody has access to rehab.
And that's something that youknow.
Why I'm here to talk to people?
Because I want pet parents toknow that even if you're, you
know, unable to pursue formalrehab programs for injuries,
there is stuff you could do.
But sorry, a tangent there.
But yes, of course, our geneticthings that these breeds have
(07:20):
and and right now we don'treally have a test for, you know
, a cruciate ligament injurypredisposition, like you would
with a French bulldog, and thosecompressed back issues.
But I'm sure very soon we will.
You know I'm planning to adopta lab, a little black lab puppy,
in two years and I'm sure thenI hope that that's an
opportunity for me to know andyou know knowledge is power I'll
(07:43):
still take my little black labpuppy because that's my breed,
that I love and that's the dogthat I want.
But you know I'll have tounderstand that I'm going to
have to do certain things to tryto prevent the injury that they
are just predisposed to.
Amy Castro (07:55):
Yeah, Like you said, the knowledge is definitely the
power.
I know we had a little dog onetime and it was just a mix of a
whole bunch of things and thatwas pre-DNA testing.
But I remember specifically thevet talking about the fact that
, because the dog had such along back, you know watch the
jumping, the jump, because ofcourse he was always bing, bing,
bing, bing, bing and it's likestop doing that.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (08:15):
I feel like I'm always telling people stop
doing that stop doing that, Iknow, but it's also redirecting
to save things.
So it's like I did aconsultation yesterday on a
nearly two-year-old goldendoodle and was roughhousing with
other dogs and another dogjumped on it and then since then
has just not been right in theback end and we took all the
x-rays, we are trying to figureout what's wrong.
(08:37):
And I said well, one of thethings you could do is that when
in the house, what they weredoing is they were throwing
their food for their dog, so itwas slipping and sliding in the
home on their wood floors andsplaying out the back legs and
going around these hard littleturns because it was a fun way
to interact with their dog, andI was like gosh, you know,
that's just asking for trouble.
And your dog turns out has aniliopsoas injury and doing those
(08:59):
kinds of activities issomething that could really
flare it up.
So let's do other thingsinstead.
Like let's go on long hikes,like that's a nice safe
activities, keeping things instraight lines, you know,
keeping your dog on a tightleash on soft surfaces, so
avoiding those concrete andstaying on grass and dirt, you
know.
So it's not about necessarilynot doing anything, it's just
(09:21):
knowing what's safe and what'snot.
And then one thing about jumpingthat I like to bring up, just
because something is somethingthat most people are not aware
of.
And again, general practicevets don't have this little like
cheat that I can, I can justtell everybody.
But what it is, it is what'swhat is too high to jump, and
what someone has to do is theyjust can take a tape measure and
(09:44):
they can measure, as our dog isstanding, from the paw, as
they're standing on the floor,to the elbow, which, if you
don't know what the elbow is,because sometimes people think
elbow is the knee, so justGoogle it.
Where's the dog's elbow right?
Take a picture, we can put apicture up on the video.
It's kind of where our elbow is,but sometimes they think it's
in the back of the body.
(10:04):
But regardless, take a tapemeasure and measure from the
height of the floor to yourdog's elbow.
Anything above that, you'rekind of in an injury risk zone.
So then if you go to your couchand you're like gosh, my dog's
elbow is 10 inches but my couchis, you know, 16 inches, I
probably should try to give thema little bit of a step to go
down to.
(10:25):
That's a little bit safer thanjumping on and off that.
And because we know withinjuries a lot of times that our
dogs that are not athletesright, are these micro injuries,
meaning that every day they'rejumping out of this giant SUV
onto concrete to get to the dogpark over and over and over, and
then the tendons of yourshoulder and your spine is
absorbing all those microinjuries.
(10:46):
And then by the time your dog's10, all of a sudden they're,
you know, blowing the rotatorcuff or have spinal injury.
And you're like gosh, like mydog was never a dog athlete.
How did that happen?
Amy Castro (10:56):
Yeah, well, and that kind of ties in well to my next
question about you know some ofthe what are some of the common
mistakes that we make in youknow, exercising our dogs and
getting out there.
So I mean, you've already toldus a couple of things thinking
about the surface that they'reon and that more natural.
I remember when I had my ACLdone, it was like closed chain
(11:19):
versus open chain.
It's more natural movementsthat the doctor wanted me doing.
And so when you think about adog, like you said, hiking and
their legs are going in theright direction that they
normally would go in, and theway the knees are supposed to
bend, not flipping hips out 80degrees further than they're
supposed to be and sliding andthings like that, that's such
great advice.
As far as the jumping issue,because I had never, you know,
(11:40):
I've always thought about mylittle chihuahua and I don't
like it when she jumps off thechair because she's got these
little spindly legs.
But no, you never even reallythought that there was a good
way to know how high is too high.
So thank you for sharing that.
What other mistakes do you seepeople making that kind of?
End them up coming to you andneeding either surgery or rehab,
or both.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (11:59):
So one of the biggest ones is the dog chuck
it and or Frisbee.
So I was at a dog event andthey had someone who was doing a
dog's you know, sport orspectacle really or I don't want
to be called a spectaclebecause it was just a
demonstration and what they haddone.
They had a great relationshipwith their dog where they were
(12:19):
throwing the Frisbee and it wasjumping off their back and
catching the Frisbee, midair andthen also midair was turning
around and then landing hard.
So movements like that, wherethey're jumping and twisting and
turning to get a ball or aFrisbee, those are things that
can really put them at risk.
And some of the times that I'vehad people come to me where all
(12:40):
of a sudden their dog wasplaying, chuck at ball, jumped
up, landed hard and then had a,suddenly had a spinal cord
injury and couldn't walk and hadto be rushed to the vet
hospital and have an emergencyspinal surgery.
You know those types ofinjuries are, you know, caused
by that that that type of impactto the spine and ball plays fun
(13:00):
, like dogs, like balls, likethat's what, and they love to
have that.
So what could we do safer?
Well, why don't we just try toprevent some of the twisting and
the jumping.
So let's keep things in astraight line.
Let's do it on a grass you knowfield, with nice, you know
footing that they could digtheir paws into.
We're not in anywhere wherethere's lots of big potholes or
sticks or other dogs to jump onthem.
Amy Castro (13:21):
So that's how I would say to do it safely.
Yeah, that's a good one, andyou had mentioned, you know,
getting in and out of thevehicle for the dog parks, but
that's another thing.
I mean, I'm not a dog parkperson for a lot of reasons, but
some of the.
you know, when you get dogs evenjust my sometimes I feel like I
live in a dog park running ananimal rescue.
But we've got, you know, fourdogs that get outside and it's a
(13:42):
nice day.
And you've got, like I said,down from my tiny little
spindly-legged chihuahua, who'spretty much smart enough to stay
away from everybody, but thenall the other knuckleheads,
including my knucklehead who'salready had her ACL repaired
they're running, they'respinning, they're zooming around
the pool, they're making thesetight turns.
So sometimes just monitoringhow that play is happening and
(14:02):
maybe taking a little morecontrol over that, instead of
just sitting in my chair andwatching it happen, because it's
kind of funny to see a bulldogzipping around in circles with
the terrier but not good for theknee, I'm quite sure.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (14:16):
Yeah, and then there's also one other
thing, and I don't want to gettoo deep into it because people
can certainly Google it or youknow, look on my Instagram for
examples but doing a warm up anda cool down before a vigorous
activity.
And you know people who haveagility dogs, hunting dogs, dog
working dogs, dog athletes theyall know this and this isn't
(14:38):
something that maybe the generalpet owner would know.
But there are things you shoulddo for 90 seconds that you
could do of a warmup for a dog,and then a cool down is really
important, and what a cool downwould mean would be I'm going to
slowly walk my dog afterthey've done this vigorous
activity, before I put them inmy truck hot to go home.
So I'm going to do a one minutewalk.
(14:58):
I'm going to also, during thattime, start to look for a little
bit of lameness.
I'm going to see are they a bitgimpy in their back legs?
Is their tail lower and it'snever low, but now it is Is
their head kind of hanging down?
Watch for subtle signs oflameness and just changes in
body posture as they're walking.
After you've done some of thatactivity, and then also it's a
(15:19):
great time to just do a littlebit of like what I call dog yoga
, which is when you can put themup on the curb and do a little
bit of a spine stretch and asyou're doing that, check their
paws.
Look at their paws, check forinjuries that they could have
sustained.
So that's a great time duringthat cool down phase, to not
only cool them down, tohopefully prevent injury, which
is really that's why you want todo it is to prevent injury.
(15:42):
Also, the spot injury is whenthat would be a great time to do
that.
Amy Castro (15:46):
Yeah, and that's.
You know that's a great time tokind of give them the once over
, and especially for us that are, you know, in hotter climates.
You know you're always lookingfor, in addition to cuts and
things like that on the pad, butyou know, being very cautious
about hot pavement and hopefullypreventing but also looking for
those types of injuries as well.
You know you mentioned a coupleof the signs of overdoing it.
(16:06):
Let's say we don't necessarilynotice anything today but, like
Gigi I mentioned, like I'll see,you're walking down the hallway
and it's just not a normal gait.
There's a little bit of a wesay a little bit of hitching or
giddy up, and when we see thingslike that a limp or the changes
that you mentioned, it's Shouldthat be like an immediate run
to the vet?
(16:27):
Is it one of those things thatyou watch it and kind of see how
it goes?
Should you give them somethingLike if I had a hitch in my
giddy up, we pop a pill and wego on about our business, right,
we don't necessarily run to thedoctor because my knee's a
little sore from working outyesterday, kind of thing.
What should we do when we seethese things?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (16:43):
So most injuries are muscular, skeletal,
no-transcript.
(17:16):
Those injuries get more chronic, meaning as they've.
You've given it a week or two,the dog's getting better because
that's a soft tissue injurythat's healing.
But then by the time you takeit to the vet, your dog's at the
vet, it's adrenaline's going,it's feeling good.
The vet comes over for fiveminutes, especially a general
practitioner.
They don't have tons of time.
Like I do as a rehab vet.
(17:37):
I'm there for 45 minutesfeeling every single bone and
joint in your dog's body andmuscle.
They don't have a lot of time,those GP vets.
So detecting that injury twoweeks later the dog's feeling
good at the vet hospital in fiveminutes is going to be really,
really tough.
So I don't think necessarilygoing to the emergency room is
where I would go for suddenissues with limping and lameness
(17:59):
.
But I would get in with yourregular veterinarian pretty soon
when they could still be ableto detect the injury and feel it
.
So I'm all about getting thereearly and then just knowing that
lameness and limping is notnormal and is a sign of pain.
Amy Castro (18:15):
So that's.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (18:15):
I think, something that people sometimes
they're like well, he's reallygreat, but he, you know, he runs
after his ball Like he's thehappiest dog.
He goes on his his walk but aswe go home he's not hitching the
gate every step.
You know, unfortunately that'sa, that's a problem and and, uh,
you know, maybe it's it'ssomething that we can, we can
fix and we can definitely helpthose dogs.
Amy Castro (18:34):
Yeah, are there other things we could be doing
to prevent some of the injuriesthat you see?
Like I know we've gotten, we'llget bags and bags of donated
items at the rescue and everyonce in a while there's like a
doggy knee brace.
I got one the other day in abag.
It was like the tiniest littleknee brace.
I'm thinking who can I put thison?
Who needs a brace?
You know, like is wrapping orbracing or doing any of that
(18:57):
stuff or feeding them somethingdifferent?
What can we do to help preventsome of these injuries from
happening?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (19:04):
Yeah.
So in regard to wrapping andbracing, I wouldn't suggest that
, and the reason is that,because dogs come in so many
shapes and sizes, getting abrace that's actually fit for
your dog's body, you have tohave them custom made to be
effective.
And custom made means thatthey've taken a mold, a cast of
your dog's knee and they'verecreated specifically for your
(19:26):
their knee a brace.
So if it's not something likethat, it's not going to do much
to stabilize.
Amy Castro (19:32):
So it's not worth it .
Dr. Kelly Fishman (19:34):
But what I would say you should do is you
should supplement, and youshould do supplements that are
smart and things that actuallyhelp to, you know, stop with
some of the breakdown in thebody.
So I have top two for that one.
Okay, so one is actuallycollagen.
So they did a study of dogsthat would run I don't know what
(19:56):
the distance was at the top ofmy head, but it was, you know, I
think was a mile intensely atthe end and they had these dogs
they're young and healthy andthey were running and they
actually sampled their bloodafter and they found that they
basically produced at the end ofthe run all these biomarkers of
things that break down thecollagen in their knee.
So a normal, healthy dog, justwith that kind of sudden
(20:21):
physical activity, will start tobreak down their joints.
And one of the things that theydid in the study is that then
they gave half those dogscollagen and the dogs that were
supplemented with collagenactually had less of those
biomarkers of inflammation ofthe cartilage in their blood.
So that would be something thatI would say like.
(20:43):
I suggest not necessarily jointpreventatives like glucosamine
and chondroitin, because I thinkthe evidence for those types of
supplements are less so, butthere is evidence for things
like collagen being protectiveto the joints, so that's
something that I would put myyoung, healthy dog on.
And then the other thing is asupplement from fertilized egg
(21:05):
yolks and it's calledfortitropin, and what this
fertilized egg yolk supplementdoes is it helps to stop the
breakdown of muscle associatedwith injury.
So when your dog was injuredand they hurt he hurt his ACL
his body started to producesomething that would break down
the muscle.
And you've had issues with yourown body, and I've had issues
(21:29):
with my own body as well.
I know when I have an injury,you're weaker, and you're weaker
because your body is trying toheal itself, but in trying to
heal itself it starts to breakdown that muscle.
So this ingredient for thetrope in which my top dog
supplement is called Myo's Pet,so it's M-Y-O-S-P-E-T that
(21:50):
supplement which again, that's afertilized yogurt, prevents
that breakdown of muscle, whichis great, because you don't ever
think of the muscle.
It's all about jointsupplements.
Amy Castro (21:57):
Yeah, so, and all about the joints.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (21:59):
I go to the pet food aisle and there's a
million joint supplements andnot one thing dedicated to
muscle, and we know that if it'snot going to be a joint injury,
it's going to be a muscleinjury.
Yeah, so that's what I do withmy young, healthy, active dogs.
I get them on Myo's Pet.
I get them on a good qualitycollagen that has three types of
collagen, if you could find it,because then that's also good
(22:21):
for the skin.
So that's what I would suggest.
Doing things like that, I think, if it is prevention, I mean
studies in that MyosPet havemostly been with injured dogs
and senior dogs and there's lotsof science behind it.
But you know, I give it to myyoung, healthy dogs as well,
just as a preventative.
Amy Castro (22:37):
Yeah, and you're talking like across the board,
like if I've got a young dog,let's just start doing that,
obviously, unless there's somecontraindication that we've
talked to our vet about.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (22:46):
Yeah, exactly , and I, you know, and I think,
cause it's like why not?
And it's one of those thingswhere I had that dog with an
iliopsoas strain and they'relike gosh, like how do I prevent
this from happening again?
I was like, well, your dog hasa muscle problem, so you need to
be on a muscle supplement thatmakes sure that they're strong,
you know and then you have to doexercises, which is a whole,
nother part of it that we cankind of dive into.
(23:07):
if you want to dive into dogexercise, which is, like my
favorite, most fun thing on theplanet to do with your dogs and
to teach people and to bond withthem, but yeah, so I do it as a
preventative.
You would definitely do it ifyour dog was a senior and had an
injury.
That's a no brainer because ofscience is behind it.
Amy Castro (23:24):
But I like it as a preventative as well, yeah.
Yeah, let's talk about the olderguys and or the guys you know
that have had an injury.
I mean, I think there are somepeople who would say, okay, my
dog is now getting older, so I'mnot going to worry about
exercise anymore or activityanymore, as long as they can go
out and go to the bathroom bythemselves.
Is you know, is it good tocontinue the activity?
(23:46):
And you know, is it basicallythe same signs that I'm looking
for, that I've overdone it?
Or how do we keep those guysmoving so that they have good
quality of life up to the end?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (23:56):
Yeah.
So this is actually the reasonI got into veterinary rehab was
because I learned that thenumber one reason, aside from
having cancer, for euthanasia inolder dogs was basically being
frail.
Everything inside them ishealthy and they feel good and
they could look at you and belike mom, I'm all going to go
play, but my body is breakingdown.
And when I found out thatthere's an area of vet med
(24:19):
called physical rehabilitation,which is like the dog body shop
and I could fix that andincrease their mobility and have
them moving and have themhealthy, I had to be part of it.
So there are so many thingsthat you could do for those
older dogs and one of the thingsthat you should do is to never
stop moving.
Take them on walks and ifthey're slowing down in their
(24:42):
walks, try to do shorter walks acouple times a day.
Amy Castro (24:46):
I've heard people like I get this far down the
road and then I'm picking thedog up and having to carry him
home.
It's like, well, maybe youshouldn't have gone so far down
the road.
Like maybe go around the blockor go up and down your own
street instead of going so far.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (24:58):
Amy, that is the advice that I give people
all the time.
If that's, you know, if yourdog is only getting like four
houses down the block, do onehouse or two houses down the
block and then come back andthen next, you know, do that for
two weeks and then challengethem a little bit and go two and
a half houses like, and thenjust kind of slowly try to
increase their endurance.
But you know, when dogs havethose problems, especially your
(25:20):
senior dogs, that's not aproblem with the cardiovascular
system, like a lot of peoplethink.
It is like their heart andlungs are failing.
That's a.
That's a problem of strength andit's a problem of not having
muscle strength, because as asenior dog you know there's
certain biological things thathappen to senior dogs that make
it hard for them to build andmaintain muscle.
(25:41):
And so if you don't have muscleto power yourself on that walk,
you just don't go as far.
That's why we say keep themmoving, because then if you keep
moving you keep building thatmuscle.
You just don't go as far.
That's why we say keep moving,because then if you keep moving
you keep building that muscle.
Amy Castro (25:52):
Well, and it's the same for us.
I mean everything that you justsaid, all this fantastic advice
.
If you take out the word dogand put people or put your own
name in there, all of that isgood advice.
Do what you can.
Keep moving, the inability tomove and the lack of activity.
I was watching a video theother day that was talking about
a certain group of doctors wasreferring to recliners as your
(26:14):
pre-coffin, because you getolder and you settle into that
recliner and you think you can'tdo it.
So, therefore, you don't do itand you know you lose your, then
you lose your ability to do it,and so you know this is, you
know, whether you're a youngerperson or you know, but I think,
especially with older peoplethat might have older pets, like
this is going to be good foryou to get in your butt out
(26:35):
there and walk.
You know, to start with twohouses, then four houses, and
and make it a challenge to haveboth of you live more active and
healthier lifestyle.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (26:48):
And exactly, and it's one of those things,
too, where you know, if I'm asenior citizen, like I'm aware
that I'm slowing down and I'mgetting slower, so I'm going to
do things like do water aerobics, like continue to exercise, try
to eat in healthy ways thatbuild muscle, and I could even
go to you know the human, uh,the market and I can see all the
different things and you knowareas of supplements that they
can do to build muscle and dogs,like I said, don't have that.
(27:15):
So like knowing that there arethings like that.
When I was talking about thatMayo's pet supplement, that's
actually the, the study thatthey did, which was
groundbreaking, to show thebenefits of their product.
They studied it in senior dogsand they actually showed that
the senior dogs were less frail,and so you know it's like
they're losing muscle.
Let's get them on a nicesupplement to help maintain that
muscle and keep them moving.
(27:35):
Do exercises, Do you know?
Do your stretches?
Like there's a lot that youcould do.
The one thing I want people toknow is that please don't think
that there's something we cancan offer your dog, because
there's something that you haveto do that you have to say
goodbye for that reason.
Like there is, there are things.
Amy Castro (27:51):
Yeah, and and investigate that.
I mean there's nothing sadderthan seeing your pet whether
it's your dog or I mean we'vebeen talking about dogs, but
cats too, you know to see themget to that point where they're
slowing down and they're just,you know, not themselves, and
you start really questioningtheir quality of life.
And if there's something we cando to prolong that I mean,
obviously everybody's body'sgoing to, you know, wear out and
(28:13):
give out at some point.
But if we can prolong that andgive them the best quality of
life by doing the things thatyou've talked about and by
giving you know to, I meanthat's to me that's brilliant,
that you know addressing thejoint issues and the muscle
issues, because those two arethe obviously pivotal in keeping
us all moving.
You know, if we could be doingthose things and have that
(28:33):
better quality of life, I meanit's something that we should
all be doing for sure.
Yeah, absolutely so.
Any final thoughts or advicethat you would want to share
with people?
I mean, obviously you've shareda ton of great advice so far,
but something that we want toleave them with to ponder as
they move forward from thisepisode.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (28:53):
Well, first of all, cats.
I am a cat lover so maybe I'lljust do a little quick cat plug,
because that's something that.
So I am a huge cat person and Ihave a senior kitty and I
noticed that my senior catstarted to do this thing where
she wouldn't jump straight uponto the bed so what she would
do is she had a little sidetable so she would jump from the
(29:16):
floor to the side table andthen to the bed and she had
stopped playing and she wassleeping a lot and it was like,
well, you know, she's 18, shehas kidney disease and maybe
that's like she's getting kindof older.
And then, you know, I didn't,you know dumb's 18, she has
kidney disease and maybe that'slike she's getting kind of older
.
And then, you know, I didn't,you know dumb veterinarian like
doesn't even realize that theirown animal is like suffering
(29:36):
from severe arthritis.
And I finally did a good examon her and I was like goodness,
like her she hurts, like this iswhy she's doing that.
And just really understandingthat pain in animals isn't
always going to be obvious.
It is going to be subtlechanges in their regular
behavior.
So a lot of the times, by thetime they're limping and they're
(29:56):
lame.
It's already kind of, theinjury has been around for a
long time and they're alreadybeen suffering.
So starting to pay attention,if anyone could know to those
little subtle changes in theirnormal behavior.
Anyone could know, to thoselittle subtle changes in their
normal behavior, meaning likethey were going on one mile walk
, were, you know, really feelinggood, tail was wagging the
whole time, you know, running toget back home and then all of a
(30:19):
sudden they don't want to go ontheir walk anymore.
There's another way home.
They keep stopping and wantingto sit or they keep smelling,
you know.
You know the flowers andchecking where their dogs went
to the bathroom and they're kindof like behind me on the leash.
That's a sign of a problem.
You know my cat not wanting tojump as high as she used to,
that was a sign of a problem andso I didn't have to, you know,
(30:41):
wait until she was actuallylimping to know and bring her in
.
Like that's those little subtlechanges in behavior.
We as veterinarians are nowrecognizing our signs of pain
and decreased mobility andstrength that we should be aware
of.
So recognizing that stuff andtrusting your intuition, you
know I have people come into myexam room and be like there's
(31:02):
something wrong with my dog.
I don't know what it is, butthere's something off and he's
not obviously limping, he's notyelping, he wants to still play
ball, he still wants to go tothe dog park, but at the end of
the you know, every once in awhile there's something just off
with his gait.
You know, and and, lo andbehold, there is something and
we've, we figure it out.
(31:22):
And but just as long as peoplecan know that that take, take
that intuition that there'ssomething a little bit off, like
trust yourself.
Amy Castro (31:36):
Yeah, that's such a good point because I think
sometimes we get really reallybusy and we don't necessarily
notice those things until theyget really bad.
And, like you said, our animalsare not.
They obviously can't tell usand they're usually pretty stoic
in kind of hiding things.
But it's interesting youmentioned the cat not wanting to
jump up, because I have anolder cat named Pickles and then
I've got the middle age cat.
He's had multiple names.
(31:57):
We we call him pinny pinheadbecause his head is just too
small for his body in my opinionand he's always been like that.
But I have this video that waskind of funny because we have
baby gates everywhere to keepdogs controlled here at the
rescue and so he's sitting there, he's looking at the baby gate,
he's looking at the top of itand Pickles, who's I don't know
six or seven years older than heis, walks up, sits down next to
(32:20):
him, looks at him and it justgoes and just hops over it and
he kind of gets a hold of it andthen he kind of pulls himself
and scrambles.
So it's like, yeah, there'sdefinitely, and we did take him
in and got it, got it allchecked out and everything.
But it was like it was funny atfirst, but then, when I started
thinking about that video, it'slike there's no reason why she,
who is so much older than him,can, can just go from a sit up
(32:42):
over that gate it's not thathigh and then he's, you know,
having to think about it andthen drag himself over it.
And it wasn't an obvious thing.
It wasn't like, you know, if Imanipulated his leg it hurt or
that he was, you know, limping.
But he definitely has signs ofarthritis that she does not have
and it doesn't have to be asuper old animal, but noticing
(33:03):
that change in behavior, that'shuge, huge.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (33:06):
And then for your cat, just one last thing I
would put them.
My pet does have a felineformula that I put my kitty on,
so and loves it, thinks it'slike the most delicious, like
when I put it on top of his wetfood, like cats are crazy for it
.
But so I would also start that,because, you know, cats get
arthritis, just like dogs do,and people are not aware because
(33:28):
they're not going to be limpinglike a dog, they're going to be
doing exactly what your, yourkitty did and, um, starting them
on pain meds and then, you know, doing other things to support
their, you know, joints andtheir muscles is there are the
same options for dogs.
There are for kitties too.
Amy Castro (33:43):
Good to know we don't want to.
we talk a lot about cats on thisshow because uh yeah, I'm glad
you brought them up at the end,because I felt sort of bad.
It's like we're talking onlyabout dogs and we usually talk
about cats, because our rescueis probably 90% cats, you know,
not to dog ratio, just forlogistics, more than anything
else.
We didn't intend to be a catrescue, but that's kind of the
(34:04):
way it turned out.
Well, wow, I know what I'mgoing to be buying as soon as I
get off get off of thisrecording with you.
I mean, it's such a simple, sucha simple thing and so easy to
to take care of.
Dr Kelly, I really appreciateyou being here with us and
sharing your experience and yourexpertise and, before I kind of
close it out, is there anythingelse that you want to share,
Any kind of any other story thatyou want to tell?
(34:26):
Maybe, maybe a happy endingstory of?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (34:33):
So I'll share the story of one of the first
dogs that I worked on, which wasa handsome black lab named
Sanford, and he was a great dog.
He was playing with his dad andwas playing ball and was one of
those dogs that jumped up andimmediately fell in the wrong
way and was completely paralyzedin all four legs because of a
(34:57):
spinal cord rupture in his neckand his dad was a great pet
parent and a brace down straightto a veterinary neurologist and
had spinal surgery.
And when I met him he came tothe rehab department and the
poor guy couldn't even stand.
You know, he was just floppedout and they looked at me and
they said can our dog walk again?
(35:17):
And I said I think so, we'regoing to try.
You know, he was just floppedout and they looked at me and
they said can our dog walk again?
And I said I think so.
We're going to try.
You know you fix the spine andnow we have to build up strength
and it's going to probably takea couple of months but we're
going to do it and slowly, overtime, just walking that dog to
the first time it could standagain, and just the happiness
that that family had and thenthe first time that they walked
again was amazing.
And then all of a sudden theyare not only walking and jumping
(35:39):
but able to play ball again andget back to their happy times
to live the rest of their life.
You know, that's something thatas a rehab vet, like that joy
is something that I get to havegotten to experience a couple of
different times and in dogs andyeah, it's just, it's great.
Amy Castro (35:55):
Yeah, that's amazing .
It's got to be so rewarding tosee that, because it's a lot of
hard work on your part and theanimals part and the pet owners
part, but the outcome isobviously well worth it.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (36:06):
Absolutely and certainly.
It's something that you know we, our dogs and cats, give us so
much and you know, I was juststruggling with my kitty before
and they just give us so muchlove.
And if we can just provide forthem and give them the best
quality of life and never have abad day, then, gosh, we've done
our job.
Amy Castro (36:24):
There you go.
That's a great way to wrap upour episode.
Well, dr Kelly, again, thankyou so much for being with us
today.
I think it was supereye-opening for me.
Like I said, I know I'm goingto go shopping as soon as I get
(36:44):
off of this recording and iflisteners want to know more
about you and your work or maybethey live in the area and they
can come see you if their animalneeds treatment what's the best
way for people to get a hold ofyou?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (36:50):
The name of my little rehab practice is
called Strut Animal and on myInstagram or Facebook or YouTube
, strut Animal, you can find allthe videos, mostly of dogs,
because I don't all my catpatients.
It's hard to get, it's hard toconvince the kitties to do the
exercises they're notcooperative.
Amy Castro (37:09):
Yeah, they're, you know, they have 10 minutes and
it's not you know what I mean.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (37:14):
It's it's not it's a rare cat to get them to
be able to do lots of exercises,but they sure do love
acupuncture and massage andother things like that and
heating pad therapy.
Oh yeah, I bet they do.
But my Instagram, facebook andYouTube Strut Animal.
If they're interested inlearning more about that Myos
(37:34):
Pet product, they can visit thewebsite myospetcom.
It's available for purchase onAmazon and directly from the
website.
So those would be the ways thatthey can find me, find that
supplement if they're interested.
And yeah, I'm in the KennettSquare Pennsylvania area, just
outside of Philadelphia.
So if anyone has any dog rehabneeds, please call me.
Amy Castro (37:57):
I will, because I'm probably going to be moving to
Northern Delaware.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (38:01):
Yeah, I actually.
I have.
About most of my patients arein Northern Delaware and, as
well, Beautiful area.
Amy Castro (38:07):
I know, I know I'm looking forward to my house
hunting, but yeah, that would begreat.
Okay for everybody that'slistening.
Take these preventative stepsthat Dr Kelly has shared with us
.
Do the right thing when itcomes to getting your dog
activity, be safe and doeverything that you can, like
she said, so that everybody isliving the best quality life
together and your dog lives longand happy and your cat and
(38:30):
active, and we'll see you againnext week.
Thanks for listening to MuddyPaws and Hairballs.
Be sure to visit our website atmuddypawsandhairballscom for
more resources and be sure tofollow this podcast on your
favorite podcast app so you'llnever miss a show.
And hey, if you like this show,text someone right now and say
I've got a podcastrecommendation.
(38:50):
You need to check the show outand tell them to listen and let
you know what they think.
Don't forget to tune in nextweek and every week for a brand
new episode.
No-transcript no-transcript.
(48:40):
Be sure to visit our website atmuddypawsandhairballscom for
more resources and be sure tofollow this podcast on your
favorite podcast app so you'llnever miss a show.
And hey, if you like this show,text someone right now and say
I've got a podcastrecommendation.
You need to check this show outand tell them to listen and let
you know what they think.
Don't forget to tune in nextweek and every week for a brand
(49:01):
new episode, and if you don't doanything else this week, give
your pets a big hug from us.
Is your dog?
That dog, you know, the one whothinks walk means drag the
human at full speed and turnsevery squirrel sighting into a
high-stakes chase, and whobelieves the living room rug is
the perfect place to practicetheir zoomy takeoffs.
Or maybe your dog's yourrunning buddy, the one who never
turns down a jog but ends uplimping and giving you the side
(00:21):
eye, like I told you, that was abad idea.
In this episode, we're talkingabout all dogs, whether your
dog's more of a couch potato oran active dog who loves
neighborhood jogs, backyardsprints or intense adventure
hikes.
How can we keep our pupshealthy and injury-free?
What are the signs that they'veoverdone it and how do we make
sure they keep living their bestzoomy lives for years to come?
(00:41):
Let's find out together.
Stay tuned.
Hey there everybody.
I'm Amy Castro, and welcome toMuddy Paws and Hairballs, where
we dig into the messy, hilariousand realistic life with pets.
Today we're talking aboutkeeping dogs active and
(01:02):
preventing injuries for all dogs, from the casual strollers to
the full-throttle zoomers andeverybody in between, and we
want to keep them healthy,strong and injury-free for a
lifetime of adventures and tohelp us figure out how to help
our high-energy dogs, especiallymove without wrecking their
joints.
We've got Dr Kelly Fishmanjoining us today.
Dr Kelly is the founder ofStrut Animal Mobility Specialist
(01:25):
and she's a veterinary sportsmedicine expert who helps dogs
and cats stay mobile, recoverfrom injuries and thrive at
every stage of their lives.
She's a certified veterinaryacupuncturist and canine
rehabilitation therapist and sheis passionate about giving pet
parents practical tools, whichwe love around here, to help
their animals live longer,healthier and more active lives.
(01:47):
So welcome to the show, drKelly.
We are so excited to have youhere.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (01:51):
Thank you, I'm happy to be here, amy.
Amy Castro (01:53):
Let's go ahead and start with some of the basics.
So how do we know, you know,based on who our dog is, what is
the appropriate level ofactivity?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (02:02):
Yeah, so it definitely is kind of the two
things I'd think about.
One it would be age.
So, first of all, we all wouldknow that a puppy needs
different activity restrictionsthan an adult dog, than a senior
, and what that means is, if Ihave a lab and it's four months
old, I want to be reallyconscious of those growing bones
(02:25):
and those fragile joints, thatI don't do things that, like you
know, jumps that are too highfor my animal, or lots of
activities like running reallyhard on concrete, which are
really, you know, hard on younggrowing bones.
So you know, if I have ayounger dog, you know there's
certain guidelines that us rehabvets are taught about what are
(02:47):
safe activities for puppies andthen usually adult dogs if they
don't have any underlyingmedical issue, and sometimes
those medical issues that Ithink of because I'm a
veterinarian that's dealing withthe body I don't really think
of, like a kidney disease, right, I think of a Frenchie that is
(03:08):
really predisposed to getting adisc herniation, and that's the
stuff that I worry about.
You know, how can I prevent adisc herniation and a French
bulldog?
So things that I would tellsomeone who had a dog like that
would be like you know, again,just like we don't want our
puppies jumping, we probablydon't want those dogs jumping
also.
Amy Castro (03:28):
You know.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (03:28):
So that's something that's, you know, a
bit obvious there.
So but if you, you know, if youkeep aside just the breed and
the age, then we go into ourseniors and our senior dogs are
more likely to have arthritis,neurologic conditions that are
causing them to slow down and bea bit more fragile.
And so those dogs you also wantto be a little bit conscious of
(03:49):
and not overwork them in waysthat kind of flare those issues
up.
So, thinking about the breed ofyour dog, thinking about their
age and then thinking about whatyou can do to just prevent
injury and then also to do safeand fun activities as well.
Amy Castro (04:04):
Right, I'm glad you mentioned the puppy thing
because although you know, assomebody that does rescue and
has puppies come through ourprogram and have raised puppies,
I'm aware of that.
But I think I'm often surprisedthat there is a certain mindset
, or maybe a lack of knowledgeor information that says, oh,
they're young, they can dowhatever because they're young
and, you know, not necessarilythinking about growth plates,
(04:27):
things like that.
That is really important.
We were even seeing that rightnow my daughter's got a little
terrier mix and when sheoverdoes it you can tell it's
like a hint of a limp, but it'sbecause she's still young.
So you do need to keep an eyeon that.
When it comes to the breeds, wedon't do a lot of DNA testing
but I had mentioned to youbefore we started recording that
(04:49):
my dog is two-thirds EnglishBulldog, one-third American
Bulldog and so you know she hasa lot of those, especially the
English Bulldog characteristicsand she's already had an ACL
reconstruction and I'mconstantly telling her stop
running because I don't wantthat knee and she's got loose
hips and things like that.
(05:10):
That sort of come with thebreed but I think, also poor
breeding, because she wasintentionally bred to be what
she is.
It wasn't like an oopsie thing.
Unfortunately, so is DNAtesting.
Like if somebody has a dog andthey don't know what it is, does
it matter the breed Like shouldthey find out, because then
they can watch out for certainpotential sources of injury.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (05:31):
Yeah, I mean I suggest that, and part of it
is we know, we are now learningthat some of those common
orthopedic conditions aregenetic.
So, thinking about our FrenchBulldogs, we know that those
compressed discs, thatinterverticular disease or IVDD
that they suffer from, that dashhounds suffer from, that pugs
(05:51):
have, that sometimes bulldogshave as well.
Send it off to some of theseDNA testing systems and not only
finding so much what breederdog is, but what kind of
conditions they are geneticallypredisposed to.
And another interesting thingthat just came to light in the
(06:16):
veterinary area that most vetsand maybe most people don't know
are that those ACL tears orthat cruciate ligament tear,
that's actually genetic.
So Labradors for example, aregenetically predisposed to get
those cranial cruciate or ACL orCCL tears that we all dread,
(06:37):
and your dog has.
It's a very expensive process tofix it too.
Oh gosh, it's so expensive.
And it's not even that it's soexpensive just to have the
surgery.
But if your dog was a person,they'd be going to
rehabilitation for months afterto strengthen right away.
And then you know, I'm a rehabvet and I sometimes tell people
I said you know the surgery isexpensive but rehab is going to
(07:00):
be twice as much and noteverybody has access to rehab.
And that's something that youknow.
Why I'm here to talk to people?
Because I want pet parents toknow that even if you're, you
know, unable to pursue formalrehab programs for injuries,
there is stuff you could do.
But sorry, a tangent there.
But yes, of course, our geneticthings that these breeds have
(07:20):
and and right now we don'treally have a test for, you know
, a cruciate ligament injurypredisposition, like you would
with a French bulldog, and thosecompressed back issues.
But I'm sure very soon we will.
You know I'm planning to adopta lab, a little black lab puppy,
in two years and I'm sure thenI hope that that's an
opportunity for me to know andyou know knowledge is power I'll
(07:43):
still take my little black labpuppy because that's my breed,
that I love and that's the dogthat I want.
But you know I'll have tounderstand that I'm going to
have to do certain things to tryto prevent the injury that they
are just predisposed to.
Amy Castro (07:55):
Yeah, Like you said, the knowledge is definitely the
power.
I know we had a little dog onetime and it was just a mix of a
whole bunch of things and thatwas pre-DNA testing.
But I remember specifically thevet talking about the fact that
, because the dog had such along back, you know watch the
jumping, the jump, because ofcourse he was always bing, bing,
bing, bing, bing and it's likestop doing that.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (08:15):
I feel like I'm always telling people stop
doing that stop doing that, Iknow, but it's also redirecting
to save things.
So it's like I did aconsultation yesterday on a
nearly two-year-old goldendoodle and was roughhousing with
other dogs and another dogjumped on it and then since then
has just not been right in theback end and we took all the
x-rays, we are trying to figureout what's wrong.
(08:37):
And I said well, one of thethings you could do is that when
in the house, what they weredoing is they were throwing
their food for their dog, so itwas slipping and sliding in the
home on their wood floors andsplaying out the back legs and
going around these hard littleturns because it was a fun way
to interact with their dog, andI was like gosh, you know,
that's just asking for trouble.
And your dog turns out has aniliopsoas injury and doing those
(08:59):
kinds of activities issomething that could really
flare it up.
So let's do other thingsinstead.
Like let's go on long hikes,like that's a nice safe
activities, keeping things instraight lines, you know,
keeping your dog on a tightleash on soft surfaces, so
avoiding those concrete andstaying on grass and dirt, you
know.
So it's not about necessarilynot doing anything, it's just
(09:21):
knowing what's safe and what'snot.
And then one thing about jumpingthat I like to bring up, just
because something is somethingthat most people are not aware
of.
And again, general practicevets don't have this little like
cheat that I can, I can justtell everybody.
But what it is, it is what'swhat is too high to jump, and
what someone has to do is theyjust can take a tape measure and
(09:44):
they can measure, as our dog isstanding, from the paw, as
they're standing on the floor,to the elbow, which, if you
don't know what the elbow is,because sometimes people think
elbow is the knee, so justGoogle it.
Where's the dog's elbow right?
Take a picture, we can put apicture up on the video.
It's kind of where our elbow is,but sometimes they think it's
in the back of the body.
(10:04):
But regardless, take a tapemeasure and measure from the
height of the floor to yourdog's elbow.
Anything above that, you'rekind of in an injury risk zone.
So then if you go to your couchand you're like gosh, my dog's
elbow is 10 inches but my couchis, you know, 16 inches, I
probably should try to give thema little bit of a step to go
down to.
(10:25):
That's a little bit safer thanjumping on and off that.
And because we know withinjuries a lot of times that our
dogs that are not athletesright, are these micro injuries,
meaning that every day they'rejumping out of this giant SUV
onto concrete to get to the dogpark over and over and over, and
then the tendons of yourshoulder and your spine is
absorbing all those microinjuries.
(10:46):
And then by the time your dog's10, all of a sudden they're,
you know, blowing the rotatorcuff or have spinal injury.
And you're like gosh, like mydog was never a dog athlete.
How did that happen?
Amy Castro (10:56):
Yeah, well, and that kind of ties in well to my next
question about you know some ofthe what are some of the common
mistakes that we make in youknow, exercising our dogs and
getting out there.
So I mean, you've already toldus a couple of things thinking
about the surface that they'reon and that more natural.
I remember when I had my ACLdone, it was like closed chain
(11:19):
versus open chain.
It's more natural movementsthat the doctor wanted me doing.
And so when you think about adog, like you said, hiking and
their legs are going in theright direction that they
normally would go in, and theway the knees are supposed to
bend, not flipping hips out 80degrees further than they're
supposed to be and sliding andthings like that, that's such
great advice.
As far as the jumping issue,because I had never, you know,
(11:40):
I've always thought about mylittle chihuahua and I don't
like it when she jumps off thechair because she's got these
little spindly legs.
But no, you never even reallythought that there was a good
way to know how high is too high.
So thank you for sharing that.
What other mistakes do you seepeople making that kind of?
End them up coming to you andneeding either surgery or rehab,
or both.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (11:59):
So one of the biggest ones is the dog chuck
it and or Frisbee.
So I was at a dog event andthey had someone who was doing a
dog's you know, sport orspectacle really or I don't want
to be called a spectaclebecause it was just a
demonstration and what they haddone.
They had a great relationshipwith their dog where they were
(12:19):
throwing the Frisbee and it wasjumping off their back and
catching the Frisbee, midair andthen also midair was turning
around and then landing hard.
So movements like that, wherethey're jumping and twisting and
turning to get a ball or aFrisbee, those are things that
can really put them at risk.
And some of the times that I'vehad people come to me where all
(12:40):
of a sudden their dog wasplaying, chuck at ball, jumped
up, landed hard and then had a,suddenly had a spinal cord
injury and couldn't walk and hadto be rushed to the vet
hospital and have an emergencyspinal surgery.
You know those types ofinjuries are, you know, caused
by that that that type of impactto the spine and ball plays fun
(13:00):
, like dogs, like balls, likethat's what, and they love to
have that.
So what could we do safer?
Well, why don't we just try toprevent some of the twisting and
the jumping.
So let's keep things in astraight line.
Let's do it on a grass you knowfield, with nice, you know
footing that they could digtheir paws into.
We're not in anywhere wherethere's lots of big potholes or
sticks or other dogs to jump onthem.
Amy Castro (13:21):
So that's how I would say to do it safely.
Yeah, that's a good one, andyou had mentioned, you know,
getting in and out of thevehicle for the dog parks, but
that's another thing.
I mean, I'm not a dog parkperson for a lot of reasons, but
some of the.
you know, when you get dogs evenjust my sometimes I feel like I
live in a dog park running ananimal rescue.
But we've got, you know, fourdogs that get outside and it's a
(13:42):
nice day.
And you've got, like I said,down from my tiny little
spindly-legged chihuahua, who'spretty much smart enough to stay
away from everybody, but thenall the other knuckleheads,
including my knucklehead who'salready had her ACL repaired
they're running, they'respinning, they're zooming around
the pool, they're making thesetight turns.
So sometimes just monitoringhow that play is happening and
(14:02):
maybe taking a little morecontrol over that, instead of
just sitting in my chair andwatching it happen, because it's
kind of funny to see a bulldogzipping around in circles with
the terrier but not good for theknee, I'm quite sure.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (14:16):
Yeah, and then there's also one other
thing, and I don't want to gettoo deep into it because people
can certainly Google it or youknow, look on my Instagram for
examples but doing a warm up anda cool down before a vigorous
activity.
And you know people who haveagility dogs, hunting dogs, dog
working dogs, dog athletes theyall know this and this isn't
(14:38):
something that maybe the generalpet owner would know.
But there are things you shoulddo for 90 seconds that you
could do of a warmup for a dog,and then a cool down is really
important, and what a cool downwould mean would be I'm going to
slowly walk my dog afterthey've done this vigorous
activity, before I put them inmy truck hot to go home.
So I'm going to do a one minutewalk.
(14:58):
I'm going to also, during thattime, start to look for a little
bit of lameness.
I'm going to see are they a bitgimpy in their back legs?
Is their tail lower and it'snever low, but now it is Is
their head kind of hanging down?
Watch for subtle signs oflameness and just changes in
body posture as they're walking.
After you've done some of thatactivity, and then also it's a
(15:19):
great time to just do a littlebit of like what I call dog yoga
, which is when you can put themup on the curb and do a little
bit of a spine stretch and asyou're doing that, check their
paws.
Look at their paws, check forinjuries that they could have
sustained.
So that's a great time duringthat cool down phase, to not
only cool them down, tohopefully prevent injury, which
is really that's why you want todo it is to prevent injury.
(15:42):
Also, the spot injury is whenthat would be a great time to do
that.
Amy Castro (15:46):
Yeah, and that's.
You know that's a great time tokind of give them the once over
, and especially for us that are, you know, in hotter climates.
You know you're always lookingfor, in addition to cuts and
things like that on the pad, butyou know, being very cautious
about hot pavement and hopefullypreventing but also looking for
those types of injuries as well.
You know you mentioned a coupleof the signs of overdoing it.
(16:06):
Let's say we don't necessarilynotice anything today but, like
Gigi I mentioned, like I'll see,you're walking down the hallway
and it's just not a normal gait.
There's a little bit of a wesay a little bit of hitching or
giddy up, and when we see thingslike that a limp or the changes
that you mentioned, it's Shouldthat be like an immediate run
to the vet?
(16:27):
Is it one of those things thatyou watch it and kind of see how
it goes?
Should you give them somethingLike if I had a hitch in my
giddy up, we pop a pill and wego on about our business, right,
we don't necessarily run to thedoctor because my knee's a
little sore from working outyesterday, kind of thing.
What should we do when we seethese things?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (16:43):
So most injuries are muscular, skeletal,
no-transcript.
(17:16):
Those injuries get more chronic, meaning as they've.
You've given it a week or two,the dog's getting better because
that's a soft tissue injurythat's healing.
But then by the time you takeit to the vet, your dog's at the
vet, it's adrenaline's going,it's feeling good.
The vet comes over for fiveminutes, especially a general
practitioner.
They don't have tons of time.
Like I do as a rehab vet.
(17:37):
I'm there for 45 minutesfeeling every single bone and
joint in your dog's body andmuscle.
They don't have a lot of time,those GP vets.
So detecting that injury twoweeks later the dog's feeling
good at the vet hospital in fiveminutes is going to be really,
really tough.
So I don't think necessarilygoing to the emergency room is
where I would go for suddenissues with limping and lameness
(17:59):
.
But I would get in with yourregular veterinarian pretty soon
when they could still be ableto detect the injury and feel it
.
So I'm all about getting thereearly and then just knowing that
lameness and limping is notnormal and is a sign of pain.
Amy Castro (18:15):
So that's.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (18:15):
I think, something that people sometimes
they're like well, he's reallygreat, but he, you know, he runs
after his ball Like he's thehappiest dog.
He goes on his his walk but aswe go home he's not hitching the
gate every step.
You know, unfortunately that'sa, that's a problem and and, uh,
you know, maybe it's it'ssomething that we can, we can
fix and we can definitely helpthose dogs.
Amy Castro (18:34):
Yeah, are there other things we could be doing
to prevent some of the injuriesthat you see?
Like I know we've gotten, we'llget bags and bags of donated
items at the rescue and everyonce in a while there's like a
doggy knee brace.
I got one the other day in abag.
It was like the tiniest littleknee brace.
I'm thinking who can I put thison?
Who needs a brace?
You know, like is wrapping orbracing or doing any of that
(18:57):
stuff or feeding them somethingdifferent?
What can we do to help preventsome of these injuries from
happening?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (19:04):
Yeah.
So in regard to wrapping andbracing, I wouldn't suggest that
, and the reason is that,because dogs come in so many
shapes and sizes, getting abrace that's actually fit for
your dog's body, you have tohave them custom made to be
effective.
And custom made means thatthey've taken a mold, a cast of
your dog's knee and they'verecreated specifically for your
(19:26):
their knee a brace.
So if it's not something likethat, it's not going to do much
to stabilize.
Amy Castro (19:32):
So it's not worth it .
Dr. Kelly Fishman (19:34):
But what I would say you should do is you
should supplement, and youshould do supplements that are
smart and things that actuallyhelp to, you know, stop with
some of the breakdown in thebody.
So I have top two for that one.
Okay, so one is actuallycollagen.
So they did a study of dogsthat would run I don't know what
(19:56):
the distance was at the top ofmy head, but it was, you know, I
think was a mile intensely atthe end and they had these dogs
they're young and healthy andthey were running and they
actually sampled their bloodafter and they found that they
basically produced at the end ofthe run all these biomarkers of
things that break down thecollagen in their knee.
So a normal, healthy dog, justwith that kind of sudden
(20:21):
physical activity, will start tobreak down their joints.
And one of the things that theydid in the study is that then
they gave half those dogscollagen and the dogs that were
supplemented with collagenactually had less of those
biomarkers of inflammation ofthe cartilage in their blood.
So that would be something thatI would say like.
(20:43):
I suggest not necessarily jointpreventatives like glucosamine
and chondroitin, because I thinkthe evidence for those types of
supplements are less so, butthere is evidence for things
like collagen being protectiveto the joints, so that's
something that I would put myyoung, healthy dog on.
And then the other thing is asupplement from fertilized egg
(21:05):
yolks and it's calledfortitropin, and what this
fertilized egg yolk supplementdoes is it helps to stop the
breakdown of muscle associatedwith injury.
So when your dog was injuredand they hurt he hurt his ACL
his body started to producesomething that would break down
the muscle.
And you've had issues with yourown body, and I've had issues
(21:29):
with my own body as well.
I know when I have an injury,you're weaker, and you're weaker
because your body is trying toheal itself, but in trying to
heal itself it starts to breakdown that muscle.
So this ingredient for thetrope in which my top dog
supplement is called Myo's Pet,so it's M-Y-O-S-P-E-T that
(21:50):
supplement which again, that's afertilized yogurt, prevents
that breakdown of muscle, whichis great, because you don't ever
think of the muscle.
It's all about jointsupplements.
Amy Castro (21:57):
Yeah, so, and all about the joints.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (21:59):
I go to the pet food aisle and there's a
million joint supplements andnot one thing dedicated to
muscle, and we know that if it'snot going to be a joint injury,
it's going to be a muscleinjury.
Yeah, so that's what I do withmy young, healthy, active dogs.
I get them on Myo's Pet.
I get them on a good qualitycollagen that has three types of
collagen, if you could find it,because then that's also good
(22:21):
for the skin.
So that's what I would suggest.
Doing things like that, I think, if it is prevention, I mean
studies in that MyosPet havemostly been with injured dogs
and senior dogs and there's lotsof science behind it.
But you know, I give it to myyoung, healthy dogs as well,
just as a preventative.
Amy Castro (22:37):
Yeah, and you're talking like across the board,
like if I've got a young dog,let's just start doing that,
obviously, unless there's somecontraindication that we've
talked to our vet about.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (22:46):
Yeah, exactly , and I, you know, and I think,
cause it's like why not?
And it's one of those thingswhere I had that dog with an
iliopsoas strain and they'relike gosh, like how do I prevent
this from happening again?
I was like, well, your dog hasa muscle problem, so you need to
be on a muscle supplement thatmakes sure that they're strong,
you know and then you have to doexercises, which is a whole,
nother part of it that we cankind of dive into.
(23:07):
if you want to dive into dogexercise, which is, like my
favorite, most fun thing on theplanet to do with your dogs and
to teach people and to bond withthem, but yeah, so I do it as a
preventative.
You would definitely do it ifyour dog was a senior and had an
injury.
That's a no brainer because ofscience is behind it.
Amy Castro (23:24):
But I like it as a preventative as well, yeah.
Yeah, let's talk about the olderguys and or the guys you know
that have had an injury.
I mean, I think there are somepeople who would say, okay, my
dog is now getting older, so I'mnot going to worry about
exercise anymore or activityanymore, as long as they can go
out and go to the bathroom bythemselves.
Is you know, is it good tocontinue the activity?
(23:46):
And you know, is it basicallythe same signs that I'm looking
for, that I've overdone it?
Or how do we keep those guysmoving so that they have good
quality of life up to the end?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (23:56):
Yeah.
So this is actually the reasonI got into veterinary rehab was
because I learned that thenumber one reason, aside from
having cancer, for euthanasia inolder dogs was basically being
frail.
Everything inside them ishealthy and they feel good and
they could look at you and belike mom, I'm all going to go
play, but my body is breakingdown.
And when I found out thatthere's an area of vet med
(24:19):
called physical rehabilitation,which is like the dog body shop
and I could fix that andincrease their mobility and have
them moving and have themhealthy, I had to be part of it.
So there are so many thingsthat you could do for those
older dogs and one of the thingsthat you should do is to never
stop moving.
Take them on walks and ifthey're slowing down in their
(24:42):
walks, try to do shorter walks acouple times a day.
Amy Castro (24:46):
I've heard people like I get this far down the
road and then I'm picking thedog up and having to carry him
home.
It's like, well, maybe youshouldn't have gone so far down
the road.
Like maybe go around the blockor go up and down your own
street instead of going so far.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (24:58):
Amy, that is the advice that I give people
all the time.
If that's, you know, if yourdog is only getting like four
houses down the block, do onehouse or two houses down the
block and then come back andthen next, you know, do that for
two weeks and then challengethem a little bit and go two and
a half houses like, and thenjust kind of slowly try to
increase their endurance.
But you know, when dogs havethose problems, especially your
(25:20):
senior dogs, that's not aproblem with the cardiovascular
system, like a lot of peoplethink.
It is like their heart andlungs are failing.
That's a.
That's a problem of strength andit's a problem of not having
muscle strength, because as asenior dog you know there's
certain biological things thathappen to senior dogs that make
it hard for them to build andmaintain muscle.
(25:41):
And so if you don't have muscleto power yourself on that walk,
you just don't go as far.
That's why we say keep themmoving, because then if you keep
moving you keep building thatmuscle.
You just don't go as far.
That's why we say keep moving,because then if you keep moving
you keep building that muscle.
Amy Castro (25:52):
Well, and it's the same for us.
I mean everything that you justsaid, all this fantastic advice
.
If you take out the word dogand put people or put your own
name in there, all of that isgood advice.
Do what you can.
Keep moving, the inability tomove and the lack of activity.
I was watching a video theother day that was talking about
a certain group of doctors wasreferring to recliners as your
(26:14):
pre-coffin, because you getolder and you settle into that
recliner and you think you can'tdo it.
So, therefore, you don't do itand you know you lose your, then
you lose your ability to do it,and so you know this is, you
know, whether you're a youngerperson or you know, but I think,
especially with older peoplethat might have older pets, like
this is going to be good foryou to get in your butt out
(26:35):
there and walk.
You know, to start with twohouses, then four houses, and
and make it a challenge to haveboth of you live more active and
healthier lifestyle.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (26:48):
And exactly, and it's one of those things,
too, where you know, if I'm asenior citizen, like I'm aware
that I'm slowing down and I'mgetting slower, so I'm going to
do things like do water aerobics, like continue to exercise, try
to eat in healthy ways thatbuild muscle, and I could even
go to you know the human, uh,the market and I can see all the
different things and you knowareas of supplements that they
can do to build muscle and dogs,like I said, don't have that.
(27:15):
So like knowing that there arethings like that.
When I was talking about thatMayo's pet supplement, that's
actually the, the study thatthey did, which was
groundbreaking, to show thebenefits of their product.
They studied it in senior dogsand they actually showed that
the senior dogs were less frail,and so you know it's like
they're losing muscle.
Let's get them on a nicesupplement to help maintain that
muscle and keep them moving.
(27:35):
Do exercises, Do you know?
Do your stretches?
Like there's a lot that youcould do.
The one thing I want people toknow is that please don't think
that there's something we cancan offer your dog, because
there's something that you haveto do that you have to say
goodbye for that reason.
Like there is, there are things.
Amy Castro (27:51):
Yeah, and and investigate that.
I mean there's nothing sadderthan seeing your pet whether
it's your dog or I mean we'vebeen talking about dogs, but
cats too, you know to see themget to that point where they're
slowing down and they're just,you know, not themselves, and
you start really questioningtheir quality of life.
And if there's something we cando to prolong that I mean,
obviously everybody's body'sgoing to, you know, wear out and
(28:13):
give out at some point.
But if we can prolong that andgive them the best quality of
life by doing the things thatyou've talked about and by
giving you know to, I meanthat's to me that's brilliant,
that you know addressing thejoint issues and the muscle
issues, because those two arethe obviously pivotal in keeping
us all moving.
You know, if we could be doingthose things and have that
(28:33):
better quality of life, I meanit's something that we should
all be doing for sure.
Yeah, absolutely so.
Any final thoughts or advicethat you would want to share
with people?
I mean, obviously you've shareda ton of great advice so far,
but something that we want toleave them with to ponder as
they move forward from thisepisode.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (28:53):
Well, first of all, cats.
I am a cat lover so maybe I'lljust do a little quick cat plug,
because that's something that.
So I am a huge cat person and Ihave a senior kitty and I
noticed that my senior catstarted to do this thing where
she wouldn't jump straight uponto the bed so what she would
do is she had a little sidetable so she would jump from the
(29:16):
floor to the side table andthen to the bed and she had
stopped playing and she wassleeping a lot and it was like,
well, you know, she's 18, shehas kidney disease and maybe
that's like she's getting kindof older.
And then, you know, I didn't,you know dumb's 18, she has
kidney disease and maybe that'slike she's getting kind of older
.
And then, you know, I didn't,you know dumb veterinarian like
doesn't even realize that theirown animal is like suffering
(29:36):
from severe arthritis.
And I finally did a good examon her and I was like goodness,
like her she hurts, like this iswhy she's doing that.
And just really understandingthat pain in animals isn't
always going to be obvious.
It is going to be subtlechanges in their regular
behavior.
So a lot of the times, by thetime they're limping and they're
(29:56):
lame.
It's already kind of, theinjury has been around for a
long time and they're alreadybeen suffering.
So starting to pay attention,if anyone could know to those
little subtle changes in theirnormal behavior.
Anyone could know, to thoselittle subtle changes in their
normal behavior, meaning likethey were going on one mile walk
, were, you know, really feelinggood, tail was wagging the
whole time, you know, running toget back home and then all of a
(30:19):
sudden they don't want to go ontheir walk anymore.
There's another way home.
They keep stopping and wantingto sit or they keep smelling,
you know.
You know the flowers andchecking where their dogs went
to the bathroom and they're kindof like behind me on the leash.
That's a sign of a problem.
You know my cat not wanting tojump as high as she used to,
that was a sign of a problem andso I didn't have to, you know,
(30:41):
wait until she was actuallylimping to know and bring her in
.
Like that's those little subtlechanges in behavior.
We as veterinarians are nowrecognizing our signs of pain
and decreased mobility andstrength that we should be aware
of.
So recognizing that stuff andtrusting your intuition, you
know I have people come into myexam room and be like there's
(31:02):
something wrong with my dog.
I don't know what it is, butthere's something off and he's
not obviously limping, he's notyelping, he wants to still play
ball, he still wants to go tothe dog park, but at the end of
the you know, every once in awhile there's something just off
with his gait.
You know, and and, lo andbehold, there is something and
we've, we figure it out.
(31:22):
And but just as long as peoplecan know that that take, take
that intuition that there'ssomething a little bit off, like
trust yourself.
Amy Castro (31:36):
Yeah, that's such a good point because I think
sometimes we get really reallybusy and we don't necessarily
notice those things until theyget really bad.
And, like you said, our animalsare not.
They obviously can't tell usand they're usually pretty stoic
in kind of hiding things.
But it's interesting youmentioned the cat not wanting to
jump up, because I have anolder cat named Pickles and then
I've got the middle age cat.
He's had multiple names.
(31:57):
We we call him pinny pinheadbecause his head is just too
small for his body in my opinionand he's always been like that.
But I have this video that waskind of funny because we have
baby gates everywhere to keepdogs controlled here at the
rescue and so he's sitting there, he's looking at the baby gate,
he's looking at the top of itand Pickles, who's I don't know
six or seven years older than heis, walks up, sits down next to
(32:20):
him, looks at him and it justgoes and just hops over it and
he kind of gets a hold of it andthen he kind of pulls himself
and scrambles.
So it's like, yeah, there'sdefinitely, and we did take him
in and got it, got it allchecked out and everything.
But it was like it was funny atfirst, but then, when I started
thinking about that video, it'slike there's no reason why she,
who is so much older than him,can, can just go from a sit up
(32:42):
over that gate it's not thathigh and then he's, you know,
having to think about it andthen drag himself over it.
And it wasn't an obvious thing.
It wasn't like, you know, if Imanipulated his leg it hurt or
that he was, you know, limping.
But he definitely has signs ofarthritis that she does not have
and it doesn't have to be asuper old animal, but noticing
(33:03):
that change in behavior, that'shuge, huge.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (33:06):
And then for your cat, just one last thing I
would put them.
My pet does have a felineformula that I put my kitty on,
so and loves it, thinks it'slike the most delicious, like
when I put it on top of his wetfood, like cats are crazy for it
.
But so I would also start that,because, you know, cats get
arthritis, just like dogs do,and people are not aware because
(33:28):
they're not going to be limpinglike a dog, they're going to be
doing exactly what your, yourkitty did and, um, starting them
on pain meds and then, you know, doing other things to support
their, you know, joints andtheir muscles is there are the
same options for dogs.
There are for kitties too.
Amy Castro (33:43):
Good to know we don't want to.
we talk a lot about cats on thisshow because uh yeah, I'm glad
you brought them up at the end,because I felt sort of bad.
It's like we're talking onlyabout dogs and we usually talk
about cats, because our rescueis probably 90% cats, you know,
not to dog ratio, just forlogistics, more than anything
else.
We didn't intend to be a catrescue, but that's kind of the
(34:04):
way it turned out.
Well, wow, I know what I'mgoing to be buying as soon as I
get off get off of thisrecording with you.
I mean, it's such a simple, sucha simple thing and so easy to
to take care of.
Dr Kelly, I really appreciateyou being here with us and
sharing your experience and yourexpertise and, before I kind of
close it out, is there anythingelse that you want to share,
Any kind of any other story thatyou want to tell?
(34:26):
Maybe, maybe a happy endingstory of?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (34:33):
So I'll share the story of one of the first
dogs that I worked on, which wasa handsome black lab named
Sanford, and he was a great dog.
He was playing with his dad andwas playing ball and was one of
those dogs that jumped up andimmediately fell in the wrong
way and was completely paralyzedin all four legs because of a
(34:57):
spinal cord rupture in his neckand his dad was a great pet
parent and a brace down straightto a veterinary neurologist and
had spinal surgery.
And when I met him he came tothe rehab department and the
poor guy couldn't even stand.
You know, he was just floppedout and they looked at me and
they said can our dog walk again?
(35:17):
And I said I think so, we'regoing to try.
You know, he was just floppedout and they looked at me and
they said can our dog walk again?
And I said I think so.
We're going to try.
You know you fix the spine andnow we have to build up strength
and it's going to probably takea couple of months but we're
going to do it and slowly, overtime, just walking that dog to
the first time it could standagain, and just the happiness
that that family had and thenthe first time that they walked
again was amazing.
And then all of a sudden theyare not only walking and jumping
(35:39):
but able to play ball again andget back to their happy times
to live the rest of their life.
You know, that's something thatas a rehab vet, like that joy
is something that I get to havegotten to experience a couple of
different times and in dogs andyeah, it's just, it's great.
Amy Castro (35:55):
Yeah, that's amazing .
It's got to be so rewarding tosee that, because it's a lot of
hard work on your part and theanimals part and the pet owners
part, but the outcome isobviously well worth it.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (36:06):
Absolutely and certainly.
It's something that you know we, our dogs and cats, give us so
much and you know, I was juststruggling with my kitty before
and they just give us so muchlove.
And if we can just provide forthem and give them the best
quality of life and never have abad day, then, gosh, we've done
our job.
Amy Castro (36:24):
There you go.
That's a great way to wrap upour episode.
Well, dr Kelly, again, thankyou so much for being with us
today.
I think it was supereye-opening for me.
Like I said, I know I'm goingto go shopping as soon as I get
(36:44):
off of this recording and iflisteners want to know more
about you and your work or maybethey live in the area and they
can come see you if their animalneeds treatment what's the best
way for people to get a hold ofyou?
Dr. Kelly Fishman (36:50):
The name of my little rehab practice is
called Strut Animal and on myInstagram or Facebook or YouTube
, strut Animal, you can find allthe videos, mostly of dogs,
because I don't all my catpatients.
It's hard to get, it's hard toconvince the kitties to do the
exercises they're notcooperative.
Amy Castro (37:09):
Yeah, they're, you know, they have 10 minutes and
it's not you know what I mean.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (37:14):
It's it's not it's a rare cat to get them to
be able to do lots of exercises,but they sure do love
acupuncture and massage andother things like that and
heating pad therapy.
Oh yeah, I bet they do.
But my Instagram, facebook andYouTube Strut Animal.
If they're interested inlearning more about that Myos
(37:34):
Pet product, they can visit thewebsite myospetcom.
It's available for purchase onAmazon and directly from the
website.
So those would be the ways thatthey can find me, find that
supplement if they're interested.
And yeah, I'm in the KennettSquare Pennsylvania area, just
outside of Philadelphia.
So if anyone has any dog rehabneeds, please call me.
Amy Castro (37:57):
I will, because I'm probably going to be moving to
Northern Delaware.
Dr. Kelly Fishman (38:01):
Yeah, I actually.
I have.
About most of my patients arein Northern Delaware and, as
well, Beautiful area.
Amy Castro (38:07):
I know, I know I'm looking forward to my house
hunting, but yeah, that would begreat.
Okay for everybody that'slistening.
Take these preventative stepsthat Dr Kelly has shared with us
.
Do the right thing when itcomes to getting your dog
activity, be safe and doeverything that you can, like
she said, so that everybody isliving the best quality life
together and your dog lives longand happy and your cat and
(38:30):
active, and we'll see you againnext week.
Thanks for listening to MuddyPaws and Hairballs.
Be sure to visit our website atmuddypawsandhairballscom for
more resources and be sure tofollow this podcast on your
favorite podcast app so you'llnever miss a show.
And hey, if you like this show,text someone right now and say
I've got a podcastrecommendation.
(38:50):
You need to check the show outand tell them to listen and let
you know what they think.
Don't forget to tune in nextweek and every week for a brand
new episode.
No-transcript no-transcript.
(48:40):
Be sure to visit our website atmuddypawsandhairballscom for
more resources and be sure tofollow this podcast on your
favorite podcast app so you'llnever miss a show.
And hey, if you like this show,text someone right now and say
I've got a podcastrecommendation.
You need to check this show outand tell them to listen and let
you know what they think.
Don't forget to tune in nextweek and every week for a brand
(49:01):
new episode, and if you don't doanything else this week, give
your pets a big hug from us.
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