March 22, 2025 • 39 mins
“I lost my son… and my entire world shattered.” In this episode, Rhonda opens up about the unbearable pain of losing her child and the long, complicated journey through grief. She shares what the grieving process really feels like—raw, unfiltered, and often misunderstood—and the tools that helped her survive when she felt completely broken.
Whether you’re grieving a loss or supporting someone who is, Rhonda’s story offers comfort, hope, and real ways to cope. You’re not alone.
Find Rhonda on:
https://www.rhondaparkertaylor.com
Her book on:
https://amzn.to/3lYXRsh
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
I had taken on a job in a retail store, and someone
came in.
He had a knife.
Pick up your bootstraps.
If you fall down seven times,get up the eighth.
And then I see this smallchurch, and I was like, it made
(00:23):
me feel like I was home.
SPEAKER_01 (00:29):
Rhonda, welcome to Multispective.
I am so excited to have you herewith us.
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I'm so glad to be here.
And from, you know, from Indianato you in China, a wonderful,
blessed platform you have wherewe can be multinational and
really bring people together andtalk about sensitive subjects
that just might need a multipleperspective.
SPEAKER_01 (00:55):
What's your personal story and what got you here?
SPEAKER_00 (00:58):
It started with the fact that my grandparents were
Polish immigrants in 1913.
And so when they got to theUnited States, they had a
mentality of survival.
So I came from somestorytellers.
My grandfather is the firstperson and probably the only
(01:19):
person in my life that I'll evermeet that could tell the story
of the Great Depression and makea teenage girl want to live
during that time and try to geta job.
SPEAKER_01 (01:32):
It
SPEAKER_00 (01:33):
was impossible at But he would tell stories about
how he survived and how he wasin the military.
And everybody told him, don'tdrop out because there's no jobs
out there.
And he did anyway.
He wanted to be home with hisfamily.
When he got home, he had toprove that he could get a job in
an environment where peoplearound the block were just
(01:55):
bread, let alone a job.
And so hearing stories like thatas a child and having an
entrepreneurial father andmother, You'd hear other stories
of how you just pick up yourbootstraps.
If you fall down seven times,get up the eighth.
So that was already kind ofbuilt into my protective factor,
into my experience.
(02:16):
But then when life startedhitting me, you learn as a
child, just keep moving forward.
You keep on moving forward.
But then you get your first realbig life hit moment.
The first one for me was I hadtaken on a job in a retail
store.
and someone came in.
He had a knife.
(02:37):
It took away my innocence.
How am I going to survive andhow am I going to handle this?
I went back to thosestorytellings and I started
rebuilding and repairing.
I thought I had my life by thetail.
I was doing well.
I had the job that I dreamed of.
I was an administrator for acollege and I'm going through
(03:02):
life just happy.
I'm making money, you know, agood solid relationship.
And I'm sitting on my couchjournaling on a Saturday morning
and there's a knock at the doorand it opened the door and it's
a police officer, not what younormally would expect on a
(03:24):
weekend morning, right?
And the police officer tells methat my son was shot and killed
at work the night before.
And in that moment, That lifehit moment.
This is one of those ones thatchanges and you know you're
never going to be the sameagain.
I had to practice what I'dlearned for years.
(03:46):
Trial and error from self-helpbook to self-help book to
learning from experience afterexperience.
And that is name the pain.
Understand what you're actuallyexperiencing and make the
decision that you'll survive it.
It's a process.
(04:07):
It's a time.
There's a grief cycle.
There's all these steps that youhave to go through.
But the very first thing is toname it and commit yourself to
the fact that you will surviveit.
And for me, it was taking andwatching the crack on a wall
where the house had settled andfollowing up to the ceiling that
(04:31):
I'd never even noticed before.
And at the very end, when Ireached the ceiling, I said,
it'll be okay.
I knew there were steps that Ineeded to take.
And I turned childlike.
And I started thinking about thelittle jingles we hear when
we're children.
that make you happy, like putone foot in front of the other.
(04:56):
And I started faking theprocesses that I knew I had to
do.
When I say faking, I wasactually doing them, but my body
felt like it was a shell andreally wasn't doing them.
And so I could notify the peoplethat needed to be notified, talk
to the people that needed to betalked to, and start going
(05:16):
through that grief cycle.
That is...
SPEAKER_01 (05:22):
How long did it sort of, like, okay, so walk me
through sort of what happenedfor you and sort of what was
that experience?
So, you know, you wake up onefine morning.
Your son at this point wasalready a working individual.
Was he living at home with you?
Was it one of
SPEAKER_00 (05:37):
those situations where?
He had his own children and hisown girlfriend and his own
place.
And, you know, the police cameto the contact, you know, who is
this person's contact?
He worked at a club.
So he was, you know, he was anadult and he was a bouncer and
(06:01):
they had put a young man outthat had been causing ruckus,
you know, causing fights in thebar.
And when they opened up the doorat last call, he was there with
a gun and shot the wholesecurity team.
SPEAKER_01 (06:16):
The whole security team.
Wow.
Was your son, was he sort ofinjured with this?
Was he like taken to hospital?
Was there still a chance ofrecovery or was it pretty
instant?
SPEAKER_00 (06:27):
It was instant for him.
Now, the rest of the securityteam was different.
They all ended up surviving indifferent forms of issues.
One, incapable of having anormal life again.
Another one, luckily, he'scarrying the bullet with him.
They could not remove it becauseit was lodged in a place that if
(06:48):
they did, he probably would nothave survived.
And then another the one thatwitnessed it was killed late at
a later date.
SPEAKER_01 (07:02):
At a later date?
Yes.
So that one was definitely likewith intentional was like, you
know, planned.
So you get informed by thepolice, this has happened.
Can you, do you remember, do yourecall what happened in that
very instant when you wereinformed this?
What was your, immediately inthat moment, what was your
thought process?
SPEAKER_00 (07:23):
Well, immediately I was in shock, you know, so much
in shock that I don't reallyremember much more of that day
other than the crack on the wallthat I followed.
And I do remember his girlfriendcoming.
I don't even think I had toldher that I already knew.
(07:44):
I think I was just so much instunned that I just let her tell
me what she had learned and whatshe knew.
And I think the one thing thatpeople can realize that when
you're in those moments, thereis no right or wrong.
The storm is being created.
(08:05):
You are like the eye of thestorm.
Sometimes it's quiet.
Sometimes it's rough.
Sometimes it's transforming intosomething else.
It's up to you on how you wantto approach the next steps.
We can choose to put more energyinto the storm and create more
(08:27):
energy.
and strengthen the storm by ourown mental and emotional
reaction.
Because you have a reactivespirit sometimes, and other
times you can have a peacefulspirit and go through it.
(08:48):
So for me, I think I wentthrough the peaceful mourning
process of it.
I didn't add more chaos.
It was too much chaos for me toadd.
add any more energy to it.
But sometimes in our own storms,we do.
We lash out at people that welove.
Maybe don't pay our bills.
(09:08):
We might, you know, not eatright.
And so then we start, you know,having health issues.
And so these are the intentionalthings that we can do to give
ourselves strength.
SPEAKER_01 (09:19):
So I'm actually curious to know, like, you know,
you mentioned that the way thatyou handled it was like in a
much more peaceful kind of way,like kept maybe more quiet and
kind of went through it moreinternally.
What about his partner?
What about your husband or thefather of him?
How did sort of the peoplearound you that were going
(09:41):
through the same morning?
I guess there were plenty ofstorms happening around.
Everyone was in the middle oftheir own kind of stormy
situation.
How did other people sort ofrespond and react to it?
SPEAKER_00 (09:51):
And you're exactly right.
They call it the domino effect,especially when there's
something, a crisis that isviolence oriented, you know, in
the case of a murder.
Everything just keeps onmultiplying to all the people
around them that may know them,may love them.
(10:12):
So everybody does have differentvulnerabilities and risk.
For me, my risk was maybedepression, you know, not
knowing what to do.
He had small children.
So, you Who's going to care forthem?
And how was that going to benavigated?
(10:33):
Because his girlfriend was onlythe mother of one of his three
children.
And then he had a baby mama thathad two of his children.
And she was going through herown struggle.
So how are we going to navigatethis?
What's going to be fair andright for everybody?
(10:55):
So it was a matter of logicgoing through who's going to do
it.
I would say everybody handled itthe best they could and I would
call it the spirit of calm orthe perseverance of calm helped.
But then, you know, you stillhave the trial, too.
(11:16):
You know, and that was afive-year process.
And so you continued to have torelive the violent act and the
emotions that came through itand where you were in your
recovery of those emotions eachtime another court date came,
(11:39):
another moment came, anotherbirthday came.
So I found and I chose to try toempower myself to look for joy
in those moments too sogratitude lists help and then
also remembering the things heloves so like on his birthday I
still today will make a steakbecause he would always say you
(12:02):
know no matter what holiday itwas he wanted a steak so you
know the small things you can doto keep them in your lives and
SPEAKER_01 (12:12):
Although they're no longer there.
(12:42):
How they were sort of likegrieving through this process or
mourning through it.
What can it look like?
What are the things that we canlook out for?
And how can we help other peoplethat may be in their own
grieving process?
SPEAKER_00 (12:57):
Well, the first thing for me is I had to find a
support network outside of theLifeHit.
Because they were already goingthrough enough.
It doesn't mean you don't stilltell the stories.
But grief hits you at theweirdest times.
You could be in your car on yourway to a business meeting, and
(13:19):
then all of a sudden, I'd juststart crying.
Or maybe you're done with anexhaustive day at work, and the
same thing.
So I found support, not only inthe unit, but outside of the
unit, so I wasn't draining theunit.
I found different religiousorganizations, different mental
(13:46):
health groups, and I would go totheir meetings, their services.
It didn't matter to me what evendenomination of religion it was
because everyone had somethingthat they could add to helping
me recover.
I could be on a mat praying.
(14:09):
I could be meditating.
I could be getting my hands laidon me.
I could be getting oil on myforehead.
All of them worked because itmade me internalize and pull out
the grief in that moment and beintentional about asking for
(14:30):
healing.
And so same thing with themental health issues.
When you go to a mental healthexpert, what that does is it
allows you, whether it be talktherapy or whatever kind of
therapy you're going through, itallows you to do that in a safe
(14:52):
environment with people thataren't going to add to the fuel
and to the hurt that you'realready going through because
they don't know how to handleit.
They're not professionals.
Somebody else might drink toomuch.
Somebody else might turn tosubstance abuse.
That is adding to the energy ofthe fire.
(15:18):
instead of adding to the calm.
SPEAKER_01 (15:22):
Right.
Did you find that you and yourfamily, while going through this
grieving, were kind of traumabonding?
Or do you feel like it was quitean isolating experience with
your family?
SPEAKER_00 (15:33):
I think we all pulled away for a while.
But every time we were together,it was like the elephant in the
room.
You could feel that weunderstood.
You know, there was no judgment.
I think that's real important.
people grieve in different waysand when you put judgment out
there all that does is destroythe relationship by the reaction
(15:57):
that people have towards eachother that is negative so it's
better to stay in that space ofunderstanding compassion for
each other looking at each otherwith love you know and kindness
even when the actions may notreflect that that that person
(16:18):
deserves it.
Give them that grace becausedifferent people are going to
react differently at differenttimes because they're a human
too with their own needs anddesires and wants.
SPEAKER_01 (16:33):
Yeah.
I think that sometimes,unfortunately, there is a little
bit of an expectation and maybeeven not a stigma, but yes, a
judgment in how a personresponds or reacts to the loss
of a loved one.
I've watched a couple of movieswhere parents have lost their
child and maybe the father istrying to function with it,
(16:55):
still go and go to work and tryto meet their friends and still
sort of stay afloat in thatsense and maybe going through
that grieving very quietly andsilently on their own but on the
outside are very fullyfunctional.
In some of these scenes you seehow the mother and the father
actually get into these reallybig fights because the wife is
(17:15):
like why are you not more upsetabout this and why are you not
crying more and why you don'tyou don't seem like you're so
affected by this like you knowour son has died like how can
you and you know a lot ofcouples get pulled apart and you
know they they just can't seemto sort of make it through that
process so can you just share alittle bit about what that was
like for you and the father ofyour child what was that like
SPEAKER_00 (17:40):
we didn't make it i'll be honest we just we didn't
make it we had differences ofopinions of um how things should
be handled and navigated.
And, and it was traumatizing forboth of us.
I would say he would have beenmore of the more stern, just
move on, go on with life.
(18:01):
And I was stayed in it longer.
And it made me vulnerable toothers who might not have good
intentions for me, you know,because I was already I was
going through a divorce, I wasgoing, you know, I was going
through a grief cycle.
So that's one of the reasons whyI say go with care.
(18:24):
And, you know, you have to pickexperts to lean on a lot of
times, not somebody you'vepicked in the emotional aspect
of things.
SPEAKER_01 (18:34):
It makes a lot of sense to be able to lean on
families and friends and, youknow, people around you that you
know and are familiar with, butalso to be able to turn to
someone who can actually maybegive you some steps to guide you
through And, you know, I lovethat you talked earlier about,
you know, really seeking outdifferent religions and seeking
(18:55):
out.
So it's like you were veryproactive in that healing
process for yourself.
And you sat in that grief, youexperienced that grief, you
experienced all the pain, butthen you also said, okay, like,
I'm going to experience it, butI'm also going to try to find
whatever path, whatever waysthat I can being really
(19:15):
intentional in that healingprocess is such a powerful
thing.
powerful thing because sometimesit can be really hard, you know,
especially, you know, it feelslike your life, your purpose has
been sort of like pulled underyou.
Can you walk me a little bitmore through sort of like the
very first thing that you did tosort of seek out some kind of
help?
Where did you first go?
What was that resource that youfirst leaned into?
SPEAKER_00 (19:37):
So the first would be a religious organization that
I'd never gone to.
I was driving down what we callthe Meridian in Illinois area in
Indianapolis.
I was a And it was one of thosemoments where you're just, the
streaming of the tears are goingdown.
And I see this small church.
(19:58):
It was very small.
It probably had less than, Idon't know, maybe 50 people in
it.
And I see it and I pull intothe, I see that they're having,
people are walking in andthey're having a service.
And so I go and they pray withme.
They did communion with it.
and the oil on the forehead.
(20:20):
I'd never experienced it thatway.
I was raised a Baptist.
This was more of an apostolic.
church, which is a moreconservative in their thoughts.
And I'd never been to that kindof a service.
And I had been practicing atthat point Episcopalian
religion, but they were notopen.
(20:40):
My church was not open.
So I went in there and the womenthere made me feel so supported
and so loved.
I ended up going quitefrequently there a lot of times.
And people were like, why wouldyou go to this small church?
And I was like, it's It made mefeel like I was home, even in my
(21:01):
pain.
And what I learned from thevarious organizations and
religions and places that Istopped in under impulse like
this was there's different formsof healing.
So let's take, for instance,meditation.
You know, there's breath work.
There's visualization.
There's, you know, activelyseeking different mindsets
(21:29):
through whether it be, you know,your sense candle that is a
instead of a lighted candle itis one driven by batteries and
it gets the shimmers at acertain time like almost like so
your sense sometimes by justmeditating and watching when it
(21:50):
starts to light up right around7pm and the shimmers start going
I automatically my eyes dart toit and I hold on to it for just
one second longer than Inormally would because it brings
me the feeling of pleasure.
It brings that child out likesnowflakes coming.
(22:12):
Same thing, a lava lamp could dothe same thing, watch it move
around.
Going through the fact thatmeditation makes a big
difference, prayer makes a bigdifference.
So each religion has a differentway of praying so you're feeling
it from a different sense ofsome have you kneel on your
knees on a bench.
(22:33):
Others have you stand when youpray.
Others have you get on a mat.
You know, so you're in thatprayer mode.
You're actually having arelationship with your God, your
spirituality.
Another form that helpsexercise.
That is a form of healing.
(22:54):
And I'm not talking about goingto the gym and lifting weights.
I'm talking about walking innature, looking for the the
things in nature that can put asmile on your face.
And so that's another form ofhealing, journaling.
your thoughts.
I have a book that's coming outcalled Resilience and it takes
(23:16):
you through all the steps ofresilience but the last half of
it is daily practices soaffirmations and saying them
over to yourself looking forwords that mean strength or
whatever the resilience factoris and I wrote poems during my
storms at different timesbecause I was journaling so I've
(23:39):
turned that into part of thepractice and added with it my
visualization process when I wasgoing through it.
So maybe it was climbing a steepmountain.
Maybe it was that I was theanchor in the storm.
And then so I am hoping thatothers can go through the
(24:00):
process of healing and realizehealing takes action.
If I had stayed in bed, therewould have been no action.
Cooking Some people might say,well, that's work.
That's not healing.
No.
As you clean your fruit, do yourprep work with the vegetables
(24:23):
and stuff, you actually tellyourself, I'm doing this because
this is what's best for puttinggood things in my body.
So make sure you'reintentionally getting it in.
And that food prep can make abig difference in your mental
capacity because you know you'redoing self-love.
SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
Can you talk to me a little bit about like any
grieving groups?
Did you ever join any of thosegrieving counseling groups?
SPEAKER_00 (24:48):
I did not join a grieving counseling group.
I should have, but I did notbecause I didn't always navigate
things well.
I was more impulsive, so Ididn't know where they all were
and when they went.
I mainly did the mental healthand the spiritual health.
SPEAKER_01 (25:07):
I'm surprised, though, that if you were seeking
a therapist, that wouldn't havebeen something that would be
recognized.
I would highly recommend
SPEAKER_00 (25:29):
it.
I think it probably, and itprobably was recommended to me.
I probably went in one ear, outthe other, because at that point
in my life, I wasn't asstructured as I needed to be.
So, you know, I would have hadto know the time.
It was more I ended up doing alot of things from shooting from
the hip and impulse rather thanfrom my emotions rather than a
(25:55):
planned strategy.
SPEAKER_01 (25:56):
I think that that's also really great that you were
like leaning into the emotion.
And yeah, maybe it seems like itwas impulsive, but it was kind
of like, yeah, you mentionedyou're in your car, you're
crying, you turn around, you seethis church and you're kind of
your heart, your feelings inthat very moment.
moment is the thing that saidI'm gonna I'm gonna go there
because you could have easilyjust looked at it moved on right
(26:17):
but the fact that you kind oflike leaned into that emotion in
that very moment like I wonder Ikind of just want to highlight
emphasize how like you knowsometimes leaning into that
emotion especially in a verywhen you're in a very
emotionally vulnerable situationand place leaning into that can
be really really powerful in
SPEAKER_00 (26:34):
itself the reason I was more impulsive with it
rather than more structured whenI had lost my mother to breast
cancer five years before that, Idid not go through the grief
cycle.
I just went back to work.
So I think that impulsivenesswas my permission to feel
(26:56):
Because if you go straight backinto your daily routine after a
traumatic life hit moment likethat, sometimes you're not
allowing yourself to go throughthe grief cycles.
So I think that that wasprobably why I was more
impulsive to the emotionsbecause I wanted to feel it and
(27:18):
I wanted to handle and heal.
So I think you're right.
Leaning into it was what wasbest for me at that moment.
SPEAKER_01 (27:25):
Can you tell me How could it go if an individual
does not or decides tocompletely just shut it off and
move on and not lean into thatgrieving cycle?
SPEAKER_00 (27:36):
Well, you become unavailable.
The hurt is so tender at thatpoint, at least for me, that the
shell of me was like...
like a sore or bruisedindividual walking around and
then anybody that would try toreach out or touch or to you
(28:00):
know experience life with mewhen I didn't allow myself that
grieving moment I didn't havethe capacity to add one more
thing on so I became lessproductive too I was still
working I was still doing thingsbut it was not with any kind of
intentional it was justsurviving
SPEAKER_01 (28:23):
what was that moment that you kind of went aha like I
feel I really do feel muchbetter now like I can actually
now
SPEAKER_00 (28:35):
live I would say probably it took probably about
four years to feel like I wasreally living I still lived but
before I felt like I was healedwhere I could actually
contribute back to people theway I had before I isolated a
(28:59):
little bit to allow myself intothose moments and to heal and so
during that time I would tellpeople not to make major
decisions if you have to becauseyou have to allow yourself time
to heal to know who you're goingto on the other side.
(29:22):
And I, you know, I had so manythings, you know, a split of
relationship, you know, thedeath of my son, you know, the
navigation of life and thetrial.
So probably it, all of that wasjust, it was too overwhelming
for me to add one more bigdecision in it.
(29:46):
So isolation was the best thingfor me.
Now, when I say isolation, Istill stall people, but let's
say I went to a family event andthey were everybody was joyful
it's like Christmas for instanceand everybody's exchanging gifts
and happy and you know there Iwas able to maybe stay there and
I would try to prolong it alittle longer than maybe till
(30:07):
till I was completelyuncomfortable but then when I
was going to have down thatbreakdown moment I would leave
Because, you know, that wastheir moment to stay happy, my
moment to grieve them.
So, you know, it's okay to dothat.
And it's okay to allow yourloved ones to do it, but just
don't allow them to completelyisolate where they're not
(30:30):
healing.
SPEAKER_01 (30:33):
Yeah, I like that.
It's like a fine line betweensort of like a safe and healthy
isolation versus, you know,isolation that's kind of
borderline depression where, youknow, that person is kind of
slipping into to their own kindof painful sort of state of
mind, right?
Would you say writing for you, Iknow you mentioned journaling,
but like creative writing, thebooks, would you say that you
(30:55):
found your sort of creativeelement and spirit through this
journey or was that somethingthat came a bit later?
I
SPEAKER_00 (31:02):
would say it has improved my creativity.
I had already started writingprior to that, but it gave me a
layer of understanding of whatpeople go through.
You know, Crossroads is a crimethriller.
So it introduces some of mycommunity service work
(31:23):
experiences.
So if anybody out there hasnever been to Indianapolis, all
the sites are real sites inIndianapolis.
I give you the historicalcontext so you understand the
history of it.
But the crime itself is fiction.
And it's intended to show whathappens when you're out of
(31:45):
balance.
So every character is out ofbalance with their life.
So you have the workaholic.
You have the law and order guy.
You've got the guy that'sdedicated to his friend.
And you have this trial.
And it's the death of a15-year-old girl.
And...
(32:07):
You have to figure out, okay,what happened to this girl?
Why is this part of, why doeseverybody seem like they're a
loser in the process?
Even though you would think thatthe jury isn't a loser.
Well, they are a loser.
The workaholics there, she wantsto be back at work.
She wants to not be having todeal with this heavy load right
(32:28):
there.
And it's about how we make ourdecisions during those life hit
moments.
What are we going to do when weget the knock on the door?
What are we going to do when ourfriend asks us to go someplace
and we know they're drunk and weget in the car anyway?
What are we going to do whenwe're lonely because we've put
(32:51):
so much into one aspect of ourlives and we're not paying
attention to the 13 other areas?
And what happens to our liveswhen we're that way?
So when we make those decisions,we have to realize that not
everything is for everyone.
body and not everything isintended to be lifelong.
SPEAKER_01 (33:13):
I like that.
SPEAKER_00 (33:18):
What was your sort of inspiration for this story?
(33:43):
And in Proverbs it says, envymakes the bones rot.
SPEAKER_01 (33:49):
Yeah, that's really true.
SPEAKER_00 (33:53):
What envy?
I think it's because itdeteriorates.
Even when you're in crises.
If you're envious of others, youcould strike out to them.
If you're living your life,let's say you're in a perfectly
fine time of your life and youstart getting envious of another
(34:14):
person or what ends up happeningis you'd start deteriorating
your own life.
You start discounting it,putting it on the goodwill rack
on sale like what you'veaccomplished, what you have is
nothing.
And you're basically...
providing your own form ofcancer.
(34:35):
And you don't have to.
It's a choice.
You have a choice not to go downthat path and enjoy what you
have with intentionality.
SPEAKER_01 (34:45):
Right.
And again, especially when itcomes to grieving, it's so much
easier to fall into those kindof negative mindsets, right?
And that be anger, fury, envy,all of these kind of things.
It's part of that sadnessSometimes it is actually easier
(35:05):
for us to kind of fall intothose negative mindsets.
It's so hard sometimes to sortof be positive.
And even unfortunately, peopleare drawn towards negativity,
you know, for the media also isalways sharing negative stuff,
you know, movies, crime, all ofit, right?
So, yeah, I like that when, youknow, you've mentioned
intentionality and sort of, youknow, doing the necessary steps
(35:28):
to kind of, you know, helpyourself through it.
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (35:31):
Open your blinds.
Look outside.
Go take a five-minute walk.
It doesn't have to be afive-mile walk.
Sometimes just doing somethingactive helps you navigate those
storms.
SPEAKER_01 (35:47):
Yeah, for sure.
I really, really appreciate yousort of like being on the
podcast today and sharing yourjourney and being so vulnerable
about your story as well.
And I really think that youhave, you know, so much to offer
and share for our listeners sortof to take away in this.
So yeah, I really appreciateyou.
SPEAKER_00 (36:03):
Well, thank you.
And I hope that everybody outthere, no matter where you are
in the world, you know, whatyou're going through, just
remember, make every day great.
And remember, if you have adesire and a dream go after it
if it's meant to be it's up toyou we sometimes lean into
wanting other people to help usthrough things sometimes it has
(36:26):
to be you music
SPEAKER_01 (36:30):
If you enjoyed the episode and would like to help
support the show, please followand subscribe.
You can rate and review yourfeedback on any of our platforms
listed in the description.
I'd like to recognize our guestswho are vulnerable and open to
share their life experienceswith us.
Thank you for showing us we'rehuman.
Also, a thank you to our teamwho worked so hard behind the
scenes to make it happen.
(36:52):
The show would be nothingwithout you.
I'm Multispectrum.
I had taken on a job in a retail store, and someone
came in.
He had a knife.
Pick up your bootstraps.
If you fall down seven times,get up the eighth.
And then I see this smallchurch, and I was like, it made
(00:23):
me feel like I was home.
SPEAKER_01 (00:29):
Rhonda, welcome to Multispective.
I am so excited to have you herewith us.
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I'm so glad to be here.
And from, you know, from Indianato you in China, a wonderful,
blessed platform you have wherewe can be multinational and
really bring people together andtalk about sensitive subjects
that just might need a multipleperspective.
SPEAKER_01 (00:55):
What's your personal story and what got you here?
SPEAKER_00 (00:58):
It started with the fact that my grandparents were
Polish immigrants in 1913.
And so when they got to theUnited States, they had a
mentality of survival.
So I came from somestorytellers.
My grandfather is the firstperson and probably the only
(01:19):
person in my life that I'll evermeet that could tell the story
of the Great Depression and makea teenage girl want to live
during that time and try to geta job.
SPEAKER_01 (01:32):
It
SPEAKER_00 (01:33):
was impossible at But he would tell stories about
how he survived and how he wasin the military.
And everybody told him, don'tdrop out because there's no jobs
out there.
And he did anyway.
He wanted to be home with hisfamily.
When he got home, he had toprove that he could get a job in
an environment where peoplearound the block were just
(01:55):
bread, let alone a job.
And so hearing stories like thatas a child and having an
entrepreneurial father andmother, You'd hear other stories
of how you just pick up yourbootstraps.
If you fall down seven times,get up the eighth.
So that was already kind ofbuilt into my protective factor,
into my experience.
(02:16):
But then when life startedhitting me, you learn as a
child, just keep moving forward.
You keep on moving forward.
But then you get your first realbig life hit moment.
The first one for me was I hadtaken on a job in a retail
store.
and someone came in.
He had a knife.
(02:37):
It took away my innocence.
How am I going to survive andhow am I going to handle this?
I went back to thosestorytellings and I started
rebuilding and repairing.
I thought I had my life by thetail.
I was doing well.
I had the job that I dreamed of.
I was an administrator for acollege and I'm going through
(03:02):
life just happy.
I'm making money, you know, agood solid relationship.
And I'm sitting on my couchjournaling on a Saturday morning
and there's a knock at the doorand it opened the door and it's
a police officer, not what younormally would expect on a
(03:24):
weekend morning, right?
And the police officer tells methat my son was shot and killed
at work the night before.
And in that moment, That lifehit moment.
This is one of those ones thatchanges and you know you're
never going to be the sameagain.
I had to practice what I'dlearned for years.
(03:46):
Trial and error from self-helpbook to self-help book to
learning from experience afterexperience.
And that is name the pain.
Understand what you're actuallyexperiencing and make the
decision that you'll survive it.
It's a process.
(04:07):
It's a time.
There's a grief cycle.
There's all these steps that youhave to go through.
But the very first thing is toname it and commit yourself to
the fact that you will surviveit.
And for me, it was taking andwatching the crack on a wall
where the house had settled andfollowing up to the ceiling that
(04:31):
I'd never even noticed before.
And at the very end, when Ireached the ceiling, I said,
it'll be okay.
I knew there were steps that Ineeded to take.
And I turned childlike.
And I started thinking about thelittle jingles we hear when
we're children.
that make you happy, like putone foot in front of the other.
(04:56):
And I started faking theprocesses that I knew I had to
do.
When I say faking, I wasactually doing them, but my body
felt like it was a shell andreally wasn't doing them.
And so I could notify the peoplethat needed to be notified, talk
to the people that needed to betalked to, and start going
(05:16):
through that grief cycle.
That is...
SPEAKER_01 (05:22):
How long did it sort of, like, okay, so walk me
through sort of what happenedfor you and sort of what was
that experience?
So, you know, you wake up onefine morning.
Your son at this point wasalready a working individual.
Was he living at home with you?
Was it one of
SPEAKER_00 (05:37):
those situations where?
He had his own children and hisown girlfriend and his own
place.
And, you know, the police cameto the contact, you know, who is
this person's contact?
He worked at a club.
So he was, you know, he was anadult and he was a bouncer and
(06:01):
they had put a young man outthat had been causing ruckus,
you know, causing fights in thebar.
And when they opened up the doorat last call, he was there with
a gun and shot the wholesecurity team.
SPEAKER_01 (06:16):
The whole security team.
Wow.
Was your son, was he sort ofinjured with this?
Was he like taken to hospital?
Was there still a chance ofrecovery or was it pretty
instant?
SPEAKER_00 (06:27):
It was instant for him.
Now, the rest of the securityteam was different.
They all ended up surviving indifferent forms of issues.
One, incapable of having anormal life again.
Another one, luckily, he'scarrying the bullet with him.
They could not remove it becauseit was lodged in a place that if
(06:48):
they did, he probably would nothave survived.
And then another the one thatwitnessed it was killed late at
a later date.
SPEAKER_01 (07:02):
At a later date?
Yes.
So that one was definitely likewith intentional was like, you
know, planned.
So you get informed by thepolice, this has happened.
Can you, do you remember, do yourecall what happened in that
very instant when you wereinformed this?
What was your, immediately inthat moment, what was your
thought process?
SPEAKER_00 (07:23):
Well, immediately I was in shock, you know, so much
in shock that I don't reallyremember much more of that day
other than the crack on the wallthat I followed.
And I do remember his girlfriendcoming.
I don't even think I had toldher that I already knew.
(07:44):
I think I was just so much instunned that I just let her tell
me what she had learned and whatshe knew.
And I think the one thing thatpeople can realize that when
you're in those moments, thereis no right or wrong.
The storm is being created.
(08:05):
You are like the eye of thestorm.
Sometimes it's quiet.
Sometimes it's rough.
Sometimes it's transforming intosomething else.
It's up to you on how you wantto approach the next steps.
We can choose to put more energyinto the storm and create more
(08:27):
energy.
and strengthen the storm by ourown mental and emotional
reaction.
Because you have a reactivespirit sometimes, and other
times you can have a peacefulspirit and go through it.
(08:48):
So for me, I think I wentthrough the peaceful mourning
process of it.
I didn't add more chaos.
It was too much chaos for me toadd.
add any more energy to it.
But sometimes in our own storms,we do.
We lash out at people that welove.
Maybe don't pay our bills.
(09:08):
We might, you know, not eatright.
And so then we start, you know,having health issues.
And so these are the intentionalthings that we can do to give
ourselves strength.
SPEAKER_01 (09:19):
So I'm actually curious to know, like, you know,
you mentioned that the way thatyou handled it was like in a
much more peaceful kind of way,like kept maybe more quiet and
kind of went through it moreinternally.
What about his partner?
What about your husband or thefather of him?
How did sort of the peoplearound you that were going
(09:41):
through the same morning?
I guess there were plenty ofstorms happening around.
Everyone was in the middle oftheir own kind of stormy
situation.
How did other people sort ofrespond and react to it?
SPEAKER_00 (09:51):
And you're exactly right.
They call it the domino effect,especially when there's
something, a crisis that isviolence oriented, you know, in
the case of a murder.
Everything just keeps onmultiplying to all the people
around them that may know them,may love them.
(10:12):
So everybody does have differentvulnerabilities and risk.
For me, my risk was maybedepression, you know, not
knowing what to do.
He had small children.
So, you Who's going to care forthem?
And how was that going to benavigated?
(10:33):
Because his girlfriend was onlythe mother of one of his three
children.
And then he had a baby mama thathad two of his children.
And she was going through herown struggle.
So how are we going to navigatethis?
What's going to be fair andright for everybody?
(10:55):
So it was a matter of logicgoing through who's going to do
it.
I would say everybody handled itthe best they could and I would
call it the spirit of calm orthe perseverance of calm helped.
But then, you know, you stillhave the trial, too.
(11:16):
You know, and that was afive-year process.
And so you continued to have torelive the violent act and the
emotions that came through itand where you were in your
recovery of those emotions eachtime another court date came,
(11:39):
another moment came, anotherbirthday came.
So I found and I chose to try toempower myself to look for joy
in those moments too sogratitude lists help and then
also remembering the things heloves so like on his birthday I
still today will make a steakbecause he would always say you
(12:02):
know no matter what holiday itwas he wanted a steak so you
know the small things you can doto keep them in your lives and
SPEAKER_01 (12:12):
Although they're no longer there.
(12:42):
How they were sort of likegrieving through this process or
mourning through it.
What can it look like?
What are the things that we canlook out for?
And how can we help other peoplethat may be in their own
grieving process?
SPEAKER_00 (12:57):
Well, the first thing for me is I had to find a
support network outside of theLifeHit.
Because they were already goingthrough enough.
It doesn't mean you don't stilltell the stories.
But grief hits you at theweirdest times.
You could be in your car on yourway to a business meeting, and
(13:19):
then all of a sudden, I'd juststart crying.
Or maybe you're done with anexhaustive day at work, and the
same thing.
So I found support, not only inthe unit, but outside of the
unit, so I wasn't draining theunit.
I found different religiousorganizations, different mental
(13:46):
health groups, and I would go totheir meetings, their services.
It didn't matter to me what evendenomination of religion it was
because everyone had somethingthat they could add to helping
me recover.
I could be on a mat praying.
(14:09):
I could be meditating.
I could be getting my hands laidon me.
I could be getting oil on myforehead.
All of them worked because itmade me internalize and pull out
the grief in that moment and beintentional about asking for
(14:30):
healing.
And so same thing with themental health issues.
When you go to a mental healthexpert, what that does is it
allows you, whether it be talktherapy or whatever kind of
therapy you're going through, itallows you to do that in a safe
(14:52):
environment with people thataren't going to add to the fuel
and to the hurt that you'realready going through because
they don't know how to handleit.
They're not professionals.
Somebody else might drink toomuch.
Somebody else might turn tosubstance abuse.
That is adding to the energy ofthe fire.
(15:18):
instead of adding to the calm.
SPEAKER_01 (15:22):
Right.
Did you find that you and yourfamily, while going through this
grieving, were kind of traumabonding?
Or do you feel like it was quitean isolating experience with
your family?
SPEAKER_00 (15:33):
I think we all pulled away for a while.
But every time we were together,it was like the elephant in the
room.
You could feel that weunderstood.
You know, there was no judgment.
I think that's real important.
people grieve in different waysand when you put judgment out
there all that does is destroythe relationship by the reaction
(15:57):
that people have towards eachother that is negative so it's
better to stay in that space ofunderstanding compassion for
each other looking at each otherwith love you know and kindness
even when the actions may notreflect that that that person
(16:18):
deserves it.
Give them that grace becausedifferent people are going to
react differently at differenttimes because they're a human
too with their own needs anddesires and wants.
SPEAKER_01 (16:33):
Yeah.
I think that sometimes,unfortunately, there is a little
bit of an expectation and maybeeven not a stigma, but yes, a
judgment in how a personresponds or reacts to the loss
of a loved one.
I've watched a couple of movieswhere parents have lost their
child and maybe the father istrying to function with it,
(16:55):
still go and go to work and tryto meet their friends and still
sort of stay afloat in thatsense and maybe going through
that grieving very quietly andsilently on their own but on the
outside are very fullyfunctional.
In some of these scenes you seehow the mother and the father
actually get into these reallybig fights because the wife is
(17:15):
like why are you not more upsetabout this and why are you not
crying more and why you don'tyou don't seem like you're so
affected by this like you knowour son has died like how can
you and you know a lot ofcouples get pulled apart and you
know they they just can't seemto sort of make it through that
process so can you just share alittle bit about what that was
like for you and the father ofyour child what was that like
SPEAKER_00 (17:40):
we didn't make it i'll be honest we just we didn't
make it we had differences ofopinions of um how things should
be handled and navigated.
And, and it was traumatizing forboth of us.
I would say he would have beenmore of the more stern, just
move on, go on with life.
(18:01):
And I was stayed in it longer.
And it made me vulnerable toothers who might not have good
intentions for me, you know,because I was already I was
going through a divorce, I wasgoing, you know, I was going
through a grief cycle.
So that's one of the reasons whyI say go with care.
(18:24):
And, you know, you have to pickexperts to lean on a lot of
times, not somebody you'vepicked in the emotional aspect
of things.
SPEAKER_01 (18:34):
It makes a lot of sense to be able to lean on
families and friends and, youknow, people around you that you
know and are familiar with, butalso to be able to turn to
someone who can actually maybegive you some steps to guide you
through And, you know, I lovethat you talked earlier about,
you know, really seeking outdifferent religions and seeking
(18:55):
out.
So it's like you were veryproactive in that healing
process for yourself.
And you sat in that grief, youexperienced that grief, you
experienced all the pain, butthen you also said, okay, like,
I'm going to experience it, butI'm also going to try to find
whatever path, whatever waysthat I can being really
(19:15):
intentional in that healingprocess is such a powerful
thing.
powerful thing because sometimesit can be really hard, you know,
especially, you know, it feelslike your life, your purpose has
been sort of like pulled underyou.
Can you walk me a little bitmore through sort of like the
very first thing that you did tosort of seek out some kind of
help?
Where did you first go?
What was that resource that youfirst leaned into?
SPEAKER_00 (19:37):
So the first would be a religious organization that
I'd never gone to.
I was driving down what we callthe Meridian in Illinois area in
Indianapolis.
I was a And it was one of thosemoments where you're just, the
streaming of the tears are goingdown.
And I see this small church.
(19:58):
It was very small.
It probably had less than, Idon't know, maybe 50 people in
it.
And I see it and I pull intothe, I see that they're having,
people are walking in andthey're having a service.
And so I go and they pray withme.
They did communion with it.
and the oil on the forehead.
(20:20):
I'd never experienced it thatway.
I was raised a Baptist.
This was more of an apostolic.
church, which is a moreconservative in their thoughts.
And I'd never been to that kindof a service.
And I had been practicing atthat point Episcopalian
religion, but they were notopen.
(20:40):
My church was not open.
So I went in there and the womenthere made me feel so supported
and so loved.
I ended up going quitefrequently there a lot of times.
And people were like, why wouldyou go to this small church?
And I was like, it's It made mefeel like I was home, even in my
(21:01):
pain.
And what I learned from thevarious organizations and
religions and places that Istopped in under impulse like
this was there's different formsof healing.
So let's take, for instance,meditation.
You know, there's breath work.
There's visualization.
There's, you know, activelyseeking different mindsets
(21:29):
through whether it be, you know,your sense candle that is a
instead of a lighted candle itis one driven by batteries and
it gets the shimmers at acertain time like almost like so
your sense sometimes by justmeditating and watching when it
(21:50):
starts to light up right around7pm and the shimmers start going
I automatically my eyes dart toit and I hold on to it for just
one second longer than Inormally would because it brings
me the feeling of pleasure.
It brings that child out likesnowflakes coming.
(22:12):
Same thing, a lava lamp could dothe same thing, watch it move
around.
Going through the fact thatmeditation makes a big
difference, prayer makes a bigdifference.
So each religion has a differentway of praying so you're feeling
it from a different sense ofsome have you kneel on your
knees on a bench.
(22:33):
Others have you stand when youpray.
Others have you get on a mat.
You know, so you're in thatprayer mode.
You're actually having arelationship with your God, your
spirituality.
Another form that helpsexercise.
That is a form of healing.
(22:54):
And I'm not talking about goingto the gym and lifting weights.
I'm talking about walking innature, looking for the the
things in nature that can put asmile on your face.
And so that's another form ofhealing, journaling.
your thoughts.
I have a book that's coming outcalled Resilience and it takes
(23:16):
you through all the steps ofresilience but the last half of
it is daily practices soaffirmations and saying them
over to yourself looking forwords that mean strength or
whatever the resilience factoris and I wrote poems during my
storms at different timesbecause I was journaling so I've
(23:39):
turned that into part of thepractice and added with it my
visualization process when I wasgoing through it.
So maybe it was climbing a steepmountain.
Maybe it was that I was theanchor in the storm.
And then so I am hoping thatothers can go through the
(24:00):
process of healing and realizehealing takes action.
If I had stayed in bed, therewould have been no action.
Cooking Some people might say,well, that's work.
That's not healing.
No.
As you clean your fruit, do yourprep work with the vegetables
(24:23):
and stuff, you actually tellyourself, I'm doing this because
this is what's best for puttinggood things in my body.
So make sure you'reintentionally getting it in.
And that food prep can make abig difference in your mental
capacity because you know you'redoing self-love.
SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
Can you talk to me a little bit about like any
grieving groups?
Did you ever join any of thosegrieving counseling groups?
SPEAKER_00 (24:48):
I did not join a grieving counseling group.
I should have, but I did notbecause I didn't always navigate
things well.
I was more impulsive, so Ididn't know where they all were
and when they went.
I mainly did the mental healthand the spiritual health.
SPEAKER_01 (25:07):
I'm surprised, though, that if you were seeking
a therapist, that wouldn't havebeen something that would be
recognized.
I would highly recommend
SPEAKER_00 (25:29):
it.
I think it probably, and itprobably was recommended to me.
I probably went in one ear, outthe other, because at that point
in my life, I wasn't asstructured as I needed to be.
So, you know, I would have hadto know the time.
It was more I ended up doing alot of things from shooting from
the hip and impulse rather thanfrom my emotions rather than a
(25:55):
planned strategy.
SPEAKER_01 (25:56):
I think that that's also really great that you were
like leaning into the emotion.
And yeah, maybe it seems like itwas impulsive, but it was kind
of like, yeah, you mentionedyou're in your car, you're
crying, you turn around, you seethis church and you're kind of
your heart, your feelings inthat very moment.
moment is the thing that saidI'm gonna I'm gonna go there
because you could have easilyjust looked at it moved on right
(26:17):
but the fact that you kind oflike leaned into that emotion in
that very moment like I wonder Ikind of just want to highlight
emphasize how like you knowsometimes leaning into that
emotion especially in a verywhen you're in a very
emotionally vulnerable situationand place leaning into that can
be really really powerful in
SPEAKER_00 (26:34):
itself the reason I was more impulsive with it
rather than more structured whenI had lost my mother to breast
cancer five years before that, Idid not go through the grief
cycle.
I just went back to work.
So I think that impulsivenesswas my permission to feel
(26:56):
Because if you go straight backinto your daily routine after a
traumatic life hit moment likethat, sometimes you're not
allowing yourself to go throughthe grief cycles.
So I think that that wasprobably why I was more
impulsive to the emotionsbecause I wanted to feel it and
(27:18):
I wanted to handle and heal.
So I think you're right.
Leaning into it was what wasbest for me at that moment.
SPEAKER_01 (27:25):
Can you tell me How could it go if an individual
does not or decides tocompletely just shut it off and
move on and not lean into thatgrieving cycle?
SPEAKER_00 (27:36):
Well, you become unavailable.
The hurt is so tender at thatpoint, at least for me, that the
shell of me was like...
like a sore or bruisedindividual walking around and
then anybody that would try toreach out or touch or to you
(28:00):
know experience life with mewhen I didn't allow myself that
grieving moment I didn't havethe capacity to add one more
thing on so I became lessproductive too I was still
working I was still doing thingsbut it was not with any kind of
intentional it was justsurviving
SPEAKER_01 (28:23):
what was that moment that you kind of went aha like I
feel I really do feel muchbetter now like I can actually
now
SPEAKER_00 (28:35):
live I would say probably it took probably about
four years to feel like I wasreally living I still lived but
before I felt like I was healedwhere I could actually
contribute back to people theway I had before I isolated a
(28:59):
little bit to allow myself intothose moments and to heal and so
during that time I would tellpeople not to make major
decisions if you have to becauseyou have to allow yourself time
to heal to know who you're goingto on the other side.
(29:22):
And I, you know, I had so manythings, you know, a split of
relationship, you know, thedeath of my son, you know, the
navigation of life and thetrial.
So probably it, all of that wasjust, it was too overwhelming
for me to add one more bigdecision in it.
(29:46):
So isolation was the best thingfor me.
Now, when I say isolation, Istill stall people, but let's
say I went to a family event andthey were everybody was joyful
it's like Christmas for instanceand everybody's exchanging gifts
and happy and you know there Iwas able to maybe stay there and
I would try to prolong it alittle longer than maybe till
(30:07):
till I was completelyuncomfortable but then when I
was going to have down thatbreakdown moment I would leave
Because, you know, that wastheir moment to stay happy, my
moment to grieve them.
So, you know, it's okay to dothat.
And it's okay to allow yourloved ones to do it, but just
don't allow them to completelyisolate where they're not
(30:30):
healing.
SPEAKER_01 (30:33):
Yeah, I like that.
It's like a fine line betweensort of like a safe and healthy
isolation versus, you know,isolation that's kind of
borderline depression where, youknow, that person is kind of
slipping into to their own kindof painful sort of state of
mind, right?
Would you say writing for you, Iknow you mentioned journaling,
but like creative writing, thebooks, would you say that you
(30:55):
found your sort of creativeelement and spirit through this
journey or was that somethingthat came a bit later?
I
SPEAKER_00 (31:02):
would say it has improved my creativity.
I had already started writingprior to that, but it gave me a
layer of understanding of whatpeople go through.
You know, Crossroads is a crimethriller.
So it introduces some of mycommunity service work
(31:23):
experiences.
So if anybody out there hasnever been to Indianapolis, all
the sites are real sites inIndianapolis.
I give you the historicalcontext so you understand the
history of it.
But the crime itself is fiction.
And it's intended to show whathappens when you're out of
(31:45):
balance.
So every character is out ofbalance with their life.
So you have the workaholic.
You have the law and order guy.
You've got the guy that'sdedicated to his friend.
And you have this trial.
And it's the death of a15-year-old girl.
And...
(32:07):
You have to figure out, okay,what happened to this girl?
Why is this part of, why doeseverybody seem like they're a
loser in the process?
Even though you would think thatthe jury isn't a loser.
Well, they are a loser.
The workaholics there, she wantsto be back at work.
She wants to not be having todeal with this heavy load right
(32:28):
there.
And it's about how we make ourdecisions during those life hit
moments.
What are we going to do when weget the knock on the door?
What are we going to do when ourfriend asks us to go someplace
and we know they're drunk and weget in the car anyway?
What are we going to do whenwe're lonely because we've put
(32:51):
so much into one aspect of ourlives and we're not paying
attention to the 13 other areas?
And what happens to our liveswhen we're that way?
So when we make those decisions,we have to realize that not
everything is for everyone.
body and not everything isintended to be lifelong.
SPEAKER_01 (33:13):
I like that.
SPEAKER_00 (33:18):
What was your sort of inspiration for this story?
(33:43):
And in Proverbs it says, envymakes the bones rot.
SPEAKER_01 (33:49):
Yeah, that's really true.
SPEAKER_00 (33:53):
What envy?
I think it's because itdeteriorates.
Even when you're in crises.
If you're envious of others, youcould strike out to them.
If you're living your life,let's say you're in a perfectly
fine time of your life and youstart getting envious of another
(34:14):
person or what ends up happeningis you'd start deteriorating
your own life.
You start discounting it,putting it on the goodwill rack
on sale like what you'veaccomplished, what you have is
nothing.
And you're basically...
providing your own form ofcancer.
(34:35):
And you don't have to.
It's a choice.
You have a choice not to go downthat path and enjoy what you
have with intentionality.
SPEAKER_01 (34:45):
Right.
And again, especially when itcomes to grieving, it's so much
easier to fall into those kindof negative mindsets, right?
And that be anger, fury, envy,all of these kind of things.
It's part of that sadnessSometimes it is actually easier
(35:05):
for us to kind of fall intothose negative mindsets.
It's so hard sometimes to sortof be positive.
And even unfortunately, peopleare drawn towards negativity,
you know, for the media also isalways sharing negative stuff,
you know, movies, crime, all ofit, right?
So, yeah, I like that when, youknow, you've mentioned
intentionality and sort of, youknow, doing the necessary steps
(35:28):
to kind of, you know, helpyourself through it.
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (35:31):
Open your blinds.
Look outside.
Go take a five-minute walk.
It doesn't have to be afive-mile walk.
Sometimes just doing somethingactive helps you navigate those
storms.
SPEAKER_01 (35:47):
Yeah, for sure.
I really, really appreciate yousort of like being on the
podcast today and sharing yourjourney and being so vulnerable
about your story as well.
And I really think that youhave, you know, so much to offer
and share for our listeners sortof to take away in this.
So yeah, I really appreciateyou.
SPEAKER_00 (36:03):
Well, thank you.
And I hope that everybody outthere, no matter where you are
in the world, you know, whatyou're going through, just
remember, make every day great.
And remember, if you have adesire and a dream go after it
if it's meant to be it's up toyou we sometimes lean into
wanting other people to help usthrough things sometimes it has
(36:26):
to be you music
SPEAKER_01 (36:30):
If you enjoyed the episode and would like to help
support the show, please followand subscribe.
You can rate and review yourfeedback on any of our platforms
listed in the description.
I'd like to recognize our guestswho are vulnerable and open to
share their life experienceswith us.
Thank you for showing us we'rehuman.
Also, a thank you to our teamwho worked so hard behind the
scenes to make it happen.
(36:52):
The show would be nothingwithout you.
I'm Multispectrum.
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