Episode 336: Marnie Stockman & Nick Coniglio

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Fonz Mendoza (00:10):
Hello everybody and welcome to another
great episode of my EdTech Life.
Thank you so much for joiningus on this wonderful day and
wherever it is that you'rejoining us from around the world
, we thank you for all of yoursupport.
We appreciate all the likes,the shares, the follows.
Thank you so much for sharingour content and again I want to
give a big shout out to ourthree sponsors that make these

(00:32):
shows possible.
Thank you so much to BookCreator, eduaid and Yellowdig.
We appreciate you believing inour mission to bring amazing
conversations into our educationspace so that way we all
continue to grow and learntogether.
And I am really excited becausewe have a fantastic show.
We have Nick Coniglio who'sjoining us, along with Marnie

(00:56):
Stockman, and I am excited abouttoday's show because today's
show is going to be somethingthat I was just talking to our
amazing guests earlier that Iwas like this is something that
I know I'm going to take a lotfrom, and that entrepreneurial
spirit in me, too, is definitelygoing to take a lot from.
So I would love to welcome tothe show Marnie and Nick.
Marnie, how are you doing thisevening?

Marnie Stockman (01:18):
I'm good Thanks for having us and I'm excited
that my friends at EduAidsponsor the show.
That's excellent.

Nick Coniglio (01:24):
Yes, nick, how about yourself?
I am almost perfect, almostperfect.

I'm doing great, yes, excellent, and I do
want to give a big shout out toScott, who connected us.
So big shout out to my brother,scott.
Thank you so much for makingthis connection.
But let's go ahead and dive in,because there's definitely a
lot that I want you to share andamplify and talk about your
amazing book.
So we'll start off with alittle bit of an introduction

(01:50):
and context.
So we'll start off with Nick.
So, nick, can you give us alittle brief introduction and
what your context is within theeducation?

author space, absolutely Well, I'm guessing, a
little bit outside the spectrumof your typical guest, but I
started my career as a computerprogrammer, of all things, and
from there I quickly foundmyself working for companies
where I was employee numbersingle digit and that happened

(02:21):
to me four times where we youknow as as employer number two,
six, ten, what have you?
The company grew, scaled, hadtremendous growth and I found
myself in leadership really forthe last 25 or 30 years.
The third company that Ihappened to join was a company

(02:43):
called Performance Matters,which today is folded into the
PowerSchool umbrella, and I wasbig.
I was the driving force inengineering and customer support
around an assessment platformand analytics platform geared
towards K-12 schools.

(03:04):
And that is where I ran intoyour other guest, marnie
Stockman, and that's where ourpaths crossed.
So that's where I'm at.
I'm the author, co-author, oftwo books.

Excellent and thank you so much.
Nick and Marnie, how aboutyourself?
Give us a little briefintroduction, and I know one
thing that I love is that we dohave that connection as far as
being former math teachers, sothat's something that's great.
But, marnie, tell us a littlebit more about yourself.

Yes.
So I started out as a highschool math teacher, was
assistant principal, was thedistrict assessment coordinator,
so all things data and I wasworking in a school system
inside the assessment platformwhen the company hired me school
system inside the assessmentplatform.
When the company hired me andmuch to Nick's dismay, he got on

(03:54):
a support call and saw my faceon there and said, oh, we hired
her, but he's gotten over that.
So we worked in the same edtech company.
I ran customer success while heran support, and we quickly
found that we had the same corevalues in really wanting to help
students and help our customers, which were school districts.
So in all of the acquisitions wefound that we were getting a

(04:15):
little culture clash with how wewanted to run things, and so he
said we should go start abusiness of our own.
So we did.
We jumped outside of educationfor a few years, went and
started an IT company and soldthat so that we could jump back
in and build something in the edtech world.
So we wrote Lead it Like Lassoand we wrote now the Business of

(04:35):
you and, as you know, a littlesneak peek into what we're
building next.
So that's how we got here.

Excellent.
Well, that is great, and what away to connect.
That is amazing and I love it,and so I know that this
conversation is definitely goingto be just wonderful and very
full, or full of a lot of energy, for sure.
But let's talk about your book.
Like you said, the Business ofyou and this is such a very
unique title and really it'sjust the book introduces the

(05:02):
idea of running your life as abusiness.
So can you explain a little bitabout what that means and why
we should think of ourselves asthe CEO of our own life?
So I want to start off withMarnie first.

Yeah.
So you know a lot of people onthe Internet will say that you
should be the CEO of you, right,you should be the boss of
yourself.
So you hear that, and what alot of folks, especially kids,
high schoolers, college agestudents.
What they're thinking is great,I'm the boss, right, and
they're picturing the boss assomeone who has everybody else

(05:41):
doing other things for them.
What they don't realize is whenwe're talking about the party
of one, the business of you, youare in charge of your marketing
, you are in charge of yourselling, you are your head of
your HR, you're the head of yourfinance, and so you are then a
part of, you're in charge of allof that, and if you don't take

(06:02):
charge of it, somebody else will.
Right If you don't put your, ifyou're not charge of all of
that, and if you don't takecharge of it, somebody else will
.

Right, if you don't put your weight, if you're
not paying attention to howyou're telling your story, it's
getting told without you.
My gosh, you are so true onthat.
And, like you said right now,what I liked is that if you're
not taking care of it, somebodyelse will.
And oftentimes, you know,sometimes that can be the case
without us really realizing howmuch control we let go in many
times in certain roles.
Nick, how about yourself?
Tell us a little bit about whatyour view is of this, living

(06:34):
your own life as you, being yourCEO of you.

Yeah, I mean I think Marty nailed a lot of it.
I did want to add that I thinkthese days business can be seen
as a four-letter word.
It's cruel, it's cutthroat, but, like Marnie said, I think when
people think about it, everysuccessful person we have ever
met, whether they admit it ornot, they're running themselves

(07:01):
like a business.
They're setting the vision andthe strategy.
They're running themselves likea business, you know.
They're setting the vision andthe strategy.
They're building skills andacquiring skills constantly.
They're telling stories sopeople are engaged, and those
all fit into.
You know, whether it's theoffice of the CEO or the
marketing department or learningdevelopment, they all fit into

(07:23):
a department that is aligned toa business.
And I would be remiss if Ididn't add you know, a big part
of our target audience thatwe're going after are students
and we have found with many ofthe students that we have
mentored and spoken to thatthey're entering this world,

(07:43):
whether it's straight out ofhigh school or right out of
college, with not a lot ofknowledge about business
departments, structures,organizational charts, and we
kind of had a little bit of agoal to introduce them to that
so they were comfortableunderstanding.
Okay, this is what a marketingdepartment is responsible for.

(08:04):
This is what research anddevelopment, or learning and
development, or finance.
So we do cover that in the book, but we also really apply what
those departments mean in apersonal journey or in your
personal leadership experience.
So we're excited to knock off alot of birds with that one,

(08:28):
where we feel like we've gottena lot of good in terms of, hey,
not only did I learn how toimprove and set a path for
myself, but I learned a littlebit about what people might be
talking about when I'm on theseinterviews that I've never heard
before.

Yeah, and I think that is such an important
skill.
As you know, for myself, myexperience coming in into the
world of business I had no idea,and that's because I went to
school for marketing and so on.
But once I got into the realworld and into that field, I was
like wow, these are some of thethings that no one ever shared

(09:04):
with me, because it was reallyjust the theory.
You know the books, you'regoing through those studies, but
when you're in an office andyou're working and you've got
bosses, you've got metrics thatyou have to meet your KPIs,
you've got all this other stuff,it's like wow, like what's wait
?
Wait a minute, what's going onhere?
Like I know the definition ofthat, but I didn't know the way

(09:29):
that this really worked and thisis the way that this works, and
so on.
And then now in my current role, with organizational charts and
coming in from the classroominto our service center as the
coordinator for digital learning, I'm like oh my gosh, like I
had no idea how many peoplethere were in the background
doing all of these things fromfinance.
You know, of course, you've gotthe superintendent side, you've
got the curriculum side, you'vegot the special education side,

(09:50):
and I mean that org chart isextensive and I think that what
you hit on right there issomething that is very important
, that I know that of course,the finance, the math and all of
that is very helpful.
But I think navigating thatspace and, like you mentioned,
having just a little bit of thatknowledge of what it means in

(10:11):
an interview when they'retalking about, you know, a KPI
or performance indicator andthings of that sort, that can
definitely help you know aninterviewee go a long way.
But now I want to talk aboutSydney here, and we'll start off
with you, nick.
Now Sydney, her character.
How did you come up with theidea, how did both you and

(10:31):
Marlee come up with that idea ofcoming up with this character,
sydney, to make her veryrelatable to not only myself but
, I think, to many?
As you know, she kind of feltvery stuck and very unsure about
next steps.
So were the, was Sidney kind ofan amalgamation of you know

(10:52):
people that you knew throughyour own experiences as well?
Tell me a little bit aboutSidney.

Yeah, I think you nailed it.
I think Sidney and we will beclear, she is a fictional
character, but she the characterherself, she represents real
experiences both Marty and Ihave seen just countless times.
I think we really intended tobuild her as kind of this
composite characters.
The readers can see themselvesin her struggles.

(11:21):
You know unsure of herdirection.
You know learning.
You know as you her direction.
You know learning, you know asyou read the book.
She's learning constantly,learning how to ask better
questions and gradually finding,I guess, that clarity and you
know the whole notion.
We talk about the importance ofstorytelling and we really

(11:43):
wanted this to be a story sopeople remember it.
People remember stories so much, so much more than than
lectures.
And Sydney, I think, became thebridge between you know our
ideas and, hopefully, the livedexperiences of readers.
That's the goal, at least.

Love it, Marnie.
How about yourself?
Tell me a little bit aboutSydney.
Is there a little of you inSydney character Maybe?
What little bits of you arethere, you know, kind of built
in into Sydney?

So I think the bits of me at this point are the
other side of Sydney, the onetalking to Sydney, because we
have mentored so many folks atour own kitchen, my own kitchen
table, or, you know, over Zoomor in a classroom that I talk to
a lot of students who have doneall the right things, they've

(12:39):
taken the right courses, they'vegotten good grades, They've
joined clubs, they've done allthe things.
They've sent out hundreds ofapplications but they weren't
getting the job, they weren'tstanding out, and I've had a lot
of the conversations with theSidneys of the world of, okay,
well, let's talk about you andwhat you like and who you are.
So that was the perspectivethat I felt like I brought to it

(13:02):
, because it's a different worldnow than when I was applying
for my first job in the 1900s.
So that's how.
That's how we come to the table.
I birthed a couple Sidneys.

I think what Marnie also should say, and I
don't know why she's not sayingit.
One of those people was was myson, connor, who at the time was
maybe 19 or 20 years old, whohad that GPA of you know.
He was 4'3 in high school, hewas 3'8 at the University of
Georgia, he had a job in thecareer center, he was in a

(13:39):
business fraternity, he wasdoing all the right things, but
you know what?
He was struggling to get aninternship and stand out in the
crowd.
And you know, if you ask Martyand I, although we spoke to
dozens and dozens and literallyhundreds and Marty, through
education, thousands of people,it's that one story that

(13:59):
probably, you know, along withher children, you know, probably
really was the tipping pointfor us to actually write this
book and have Sydney become thecharacter that she actually is.

You know.
Something that's very uniqueabout this book, I think,
personally, is just the way thatyou are using Sydney to you
know we're going through thisjourney, but you're learning
along the way and it's not justa book of like.
Here are 10 chapters, justfollow this and you're just, I
guess, just talking to theperson.
But now it's that storytellingaspect and this is something

(14:38):
that I absolutely love ineducation, that I always did in
the classrooms and even now.
It may not be maybe a glamorousjob to many, but doing the
district assessments, I meanjust still being able to tell a
story through that data when Ihave to present it to me, is
something that's very importantbecause I want to make sure that

(14:58):
we capture everything.
So I think that this issomething very rather unique.
That, as opposed to having alot of the books that I have
here where somebody's justtelling me what to do chapter
one, chapter two, follow thisand so on but just to be able to
relate and you're followingthis character and as the plot
continues to move forward, it'slike, oh, I went through that,

(15:19):
or I've gone through that, orwait a minute, wait that might
come up, and if that comes upnow, I've got that little
knowledge nugget that I cancarry around with me and
sprinkle it onto what I'malready doing great and just to
continue to move forward andgrow, and I think that's
something that is wonderful thatI love about this.
Now let's start off with you,marnie.
I want to kind of change alittle bit here some of the

(15:40):
themes and lessons that I kindof picked up on, and one of my
main things that I love is justpersonal branding in the book
and the importance of personalbranding.
So talk to us about you knowsome advice about personal
branding that you share herethrough Sydney's story.
That would be very useful notonly to our youth but even us as
adults in the education space.

(16:01):
How important is personalbranding to?

us.
So it's interesting because youjust talked about how you
appreciate that this is a storyand branding really more likely
to be remembered than just facts22 times.
So when you're thinking aboutyour own branding, you're

(16:34):
looking at what everythingthat's out in front of you is
telling about your story.
So we mentioned at thebeginning, you are your own
chief marketing officer and ifyou don't put the right story
out there, that story will besomewhere else right?
So whatever you have on socialmedia is telling a part of the
story, but that's not all of thestory.

(16:55):
One of the things we talk aboutis in your HR department.
One of the pieces that's mostimportant to set up and
establish your branding is toreally understand who you are,
and what we find is thatstudents really lack confidence
in understanding themselves andthat is what's holding them back
from being able to tell theirstory.
They don't understand trulywhat their values are in a way

(17:19):
that they can express that.
They don't know their strengthsand their weaknesses, etc.
And all of those things turninto your story that make all of
your lived experiences makesense.
So that's part of what we talkabout in the book is helping
figure out who you are and howyou're putting that out there.

(17:40):
Nick, what am I missing withthe branding piece?
Or did I catch most of what youwere thinking I was going to
say on that?

I could not have answered that any better, and I
would never answer better thanMarnie about personal branding,
because that is truly asuperpower of hers, not only
with her own personal branding,but helping others establish
their own personal brand as wellestablish their own personal

(18:06):
brand as well.

I think I want to highlight something that is
here in the book, if you don'tmind me sharing, but I know here
.
It says here your personalbrand is the story you tell the
world about who you are and whatyou offer, and if you don't
craft that story intentionally,people will assume one for you,
and I just kind of want to digin a little bit deeper on that,
Nick, on your side, just to adda little bit more.
I mean, how has this that Iread from the book?

(18:30):
Is there something that you canremember from your 30 years
experience in ed tech andworking, you know, with
companies?
How important has this been?
Or maybe an experience thatyou've had with personal
branding and making sure thatyou control what the narrative
is?

I'll talk about myself, my personal story first,
and I will say that you know Imentioned at the outset that I
was a programmer and I met allthe stereotypes of the
programmer, meaning that I satin a closet, I drank Coca-Cola,
as I was very introverted, I didnot like to talk to people, but

(19:11):
I was really good functionallyat what I did and I ended up
getting promoted, you know, anumber of times when I was, when
I was very, very young in mycareer and I didn't have any
notion about a personal brand atall None, and I didn't want to
because I didn't like, I wasn'tcomfortable talking to people

(19:33):
and, at the end of the day, what?
what that really came across tomost people that I was working
with that ended up working underme in the leadership position
was that I was more cocky, I wasnot a team player, right, I was
very quiet, but that didn'tmean necessarily that I wasn't a
team player or that I was cocky.

(19:55):
And it took a while for me torealize.
And that was like a spiral Allof a sudden started, you know,
getting out of control where youknow I was.
I felt like I need to know allthe answers, and I, of course,
didn't nobody knows all thoseanswers, right but it just kept
on feeding off of each other andit wasn't until I really
started getting comfortable onwho I was, which is the fact

(20:17):
that I'm somebody who listens alot and it takes me a while to
process things and and respond,because I want to do so in a
very thoughtful way and I feltlike I had to put the time in to
demonstrate that, and that'sultimately what I did, and
eventually, over time, I believethat became my brand.

(20:38):
That was who I was.
I was a cautiousconversationalist, but people
began to know that I wasthinking, because I would ask a
ton of questions and I wouldlisten to them.
I was present with them.
So that's not the story Marniewanted me to tell, but that is
my personal story and I think,no matter what you're doing, we

(21:04):
find it so much with youngpeople these days.
Even the things that you don'tdo are a story about you, or the
things that you don't intend toput out there to create your
brand.
We see it all the time withsocial media.
That is telling a story,whether you like it or not.
You may think you're justhaving fun posting a picture out

(21:25):
at the bar or doing somethingthat you shouldn't be doing, but
it's a story and you'rebuilding a brand, and I think
that's really important for allthe young people out there.

Remember, Excellent, yeah, and those are
all valid points and that isgreat.
But I love what you share too,because it's a nice segue into
the next question.
But it's because I find thatI'm you are very relatable in
the sense that I am in a verysimilar train of thought.
Like I'm an I'm I think I justover process, but I just love to

(21:57):
process and it takes me a while.
Just I just love to take it allin, be with my thoughts, and
then be able to make sure that Igive an answer that fits, you
know, whatever the situation maybe.
But at the same time I do liketo ask a lot of questions.
But in this world where a lot ofpeople are just sometimes
looking for answers, you know weforget that asking the right

(22:20):
questions would be somethingthat's very critical, and I know
that this is something alsothat you do talk about in the
book the Business of you, whichwe will make sure we link in the
show notes, but talking aboutSydney, that she learns to ask
the right questions and thatthat is more important than
having all of the answers.
So, marnie, tell me a littlebit about that, and why is this

(22:41):
skill so critical and how can ithelp our young adults, you know
, maybe even high schoolstudents coming out and even
just us as adults, you know?
Tell me a little bit more aboutthat.

Well.
So one of the things we talkabout is the need to have a
group of advisors, right, yourpersonal board of advisors, and
Nick is one of mine, and I needto find people that are not like
me, and so he has taught me thepower of listening and asking
better questions.
It is truly a superpower.

(23:12):
It is truly Nick's superpower.
So, in the world of askingquestions, I think people need
to reflect.
It's very easy today to Googlefact answers as opposed to, you
know, asking questions about whoyou are, about what value you
bring to a company.
That's the type of story thatpeople want to hear.

(23:34):
So, when it comes to askingquestions, it's very powerful in
understanding who you are, butalso how you can connect with
others.
One of the things Sydney hasasked is what value she brings.
If you're looking at how you'regoing to apply for a college or
a company, if you're thinking ofa college essay, for example,

(23:56):
you want to think about what youbring to the party and what
would the college want to know.
Right, you need to ask yourself.
Put yourself in the otherperson's shoes.
As a teacher, I'm confident youthought what do the students
really want?
If you're just thinking, I needto communicate this information

(24:21):
.
That can make math a boringsituation, but the great math
teachers figure out how tofigure out what the students
really want, right, what's in itfor them, and when they think
about asking that question, thensuddenly you can turn it around
to make the class much moreentertaining.
So Nick is really the masterquestion asker, but I have
learned quite a bit frompartnering with him.

Excellent.

Nick, tell me a little bit more about that
experience.
You know, just asking the rightquestions.
How has that been somethingthat has helped you personally
grow?
You know, not only within yourspace and your realm of work,
but just even just personally?

You know, I think the simplest way to put it is
that answers end conversations,but questions really open them
up.
And you know, for somebodywho's, again, rather introverted
, you know, what am I alwaysscared of?
And that very annoying pauseand silence that scares me to

(25:32):
death, right, and what I foundout by practicing that right as
a way to network and engage withpeers and people I look up to,
is that that one skill of askingquestions and being curious
about things always moved meforward.
Right, it always opened upadditional, uh, opportunities
for me, whether I was lookingfor them or I.

(25:55):
I wasn't, and I, you know, andit makes sense when you think
about it, right, because you'reyou're wanting to understand
somebody else's perspective.
You're wanting to understandthings that you currently don't
know how they operate, and thatonly helps you grow.
So the whole notion ofcuriosity in driving anybody

(26:19):
forward, we strongly believe in.
We've seen it work.
I've seen it work personally.
Marnie short sells herself, butshe's a.
We've seen it work.
I've seen it work personally.
Marnie short sells herself, butshe's a great question asker as
well.
And the key to remember, though,is, when you're asking
questions, that you really needto be present and listen to what

(26:40):
the person you're communicatingwith is saying.
And again, that I think is astruggle for a lot of people.
I know you know I pride myselfin asking questions.
Sometimes you're like, okay,well, what's the next question
I'm going to ask?
No, stay present, listen tothem, understand, just be
genuinely curious.
And I promise you that's one ofthe things we try to present

(27:03):
with Sidney through the storyand give kind of concrete
example what that means.
But it's a really underratedskill that I think a lot of
people, especially youngerpeople and I was still this one
don't really think about doing.

Excellent.
Oh man, that is such a greatanswer.
Like right now, just listeningto both of you speak and going
back and forth and answeringthese questions is I am just
amazed and I'm like thinking.
I was like, yes, like Sydney,yes, I can think of, like that's
always.
Sydney is just like justamazing.
You know, and everything thatI'm learning you know now I get
to speak to the authors thathelped form Sydney.

(27:42):
But I mean, I think, just withyour experience that you've had
and the way that I listen toy'all and you like just are very
compliment each other very wellas far as you know the content
that we're speaking of, and Iwas like, well, it's no wonder
that this book is just great andit's something that's very
useful and would be just awonderful addition to any

(28:02):
anybody's tool belt to be ableto have it and read, because
this is great.
But going back to this, nick,this is kind of a nice
progression also and this isgreat that it's working out this
way, that talking about beingpresent and asking all the right
questions too.
So, marnie, let's talk aboutthe next aspect, I mean for me,

(28:22):
for myself also, seeing as beingin there and being present is
something that is also a timeinvestment, and I know that that
is something that is one of ourmost valuable resources.
As a matter of fact, herewithin the book, it says it's
not just money that's one of themost valuable resources, but
it's that time and energy so howare we using our time is

(28:46):
something that is verydetrimental to as well.
So let's talk a little bitabout that.
How might we take some steps toaudit our time and to making
sure that we're spending it onwhat truly matters?

Yeah.
So I gave a graduation addressto a local high school this
spring and I went through a fewof the departments and I said if
you're the chief financialofficer, would you invest in you
?
Would you invest in your habitsand your work ethic?
And when you think about that,think about where you are

(29:22):
putting your time.
And it was interesting becauseyou know I talked to five
departments.
But when I said that line, Idefinitely got you got a
reaction from the students.
They were like, oh all right,she's going to hit it hard.
We're not just going to getjokes out on the stage today.
And so really to encouragefolks to say every single thing

(29:45):
you're doing is investing inyourself.
So are those 10 hours of doomscrolling?
Is that a good investment inwhat you're preparing yourself
for?
Right, is what you're doing,working to help you accomplish
your goals?
So when students start thinkingabout that, a lot of folks in
the business world or even ineducation will say, oh, I'm busy

(30:09):
but not productive.
Well, are you doing the rightthings to accomplish your goals
or are you just checking boxes?
I've worked with a couplecollege students recently that
had not heard of the Eisenhowermatrix, which is when you chart
important tasks versus urgencyof tasks, and a lot of people do

(30:31):
urgent but not important thingsbecause they can check box them
as opposed to reallyprioritizing the urgent and
important or, you know, andreally the high value on the
important, and so it'sinteresting to get them to think
about.
So what are the tasks thatyou're doing and are they
helping you with the biggerpicture of who you want to be?

Oh, I love it, Nick.
Is there anything that you'dlove to add to that?
Talking about time and how toinvest it properly?

time and how to invest it properly.
Yeah, and I would.
I would relate it to what mostpeople think about in terms of
investing, which is money, right, investments and that whole
notion, you know, compoundinterest.
I think it's really importantto invest in things that do
compound.
They multiply the more and moreyou do it.
Things like you know learningor your health or relationships.

(31:29):
Those things they pay back by10, 50, 100x when you
consistently and you put thetime in to do those things.
But if you're spending, you know, in to do those things, but if
you're spending, you know, yourtime on things like social media

(31:50):
all the time, or just reviewingemails or scrolling, you know,
scrolling the Internet, those,those are the things that really
depreciate over time.
So it wasn't by accident thatwhen we talked about the office
of the financial officer, weweren't really talking about
money at all.
And, believe me, I thinkfinancial literacy is critically
important, especially foryounger people.

(32:12):
It's a book in and of itself.
But when we think about finance, we think about time, and I
think you should really thinkabout those things that compound
versus those things thatdepreciate.
And we all know what they are.
We absolutely 100%, all knowwhat they are.
But what's hard to do is theself-reflection and we talk with

(32:35):
and Sydney does this right it'sreally to say, okay, all right,
where actually am I spendingyour time?
Because you know, although wekind of know, until you see it
on paper, if you start to log,it, put into a diary or log or
something to that effect that'swhen it really jumps out at you
and you know, out of the 14hours I was awake today, I was

(32:57):
spending 12 of those hours onthings that depreciate very
quickly, when I could have beenworking on something that can
compound and make my journey somuch better, both in the short
and the long run.

I love that and that's great.
And you know, I think justhaving that audit, like you said
, just being able to write itdown actually and see it
physically, just writing it down, is a great reflection piece.
I remember when I first gotmarried, you know, with my
beautiful wife, and we're there,you know, just all of a sudden
we just had to have that talkand say, okay, let's go ahead

(33:35):
and sit down and let's manageour budget.
And all of a sudden, once weput that down in money, like on
paper, we're like, oh mygoodness, like we just found
things that were like wait aminute, like we've got a little
leak here, like we need to makesure we fix this, that ice cream
budget is draining us.
Yeah, you know, those budgetsare we eating out too often?
Are we doing this too often?

(33:56):
We do it.
But then of course, that helpedus in the very beginning to
take control of something andthat really helped us out and
has really laid the path, Likeyou mentioned.
Like just that that oneinstance in doing so has paid
off, probably like a hundred Xto get us to where we are now,
and still we still follow a lotof those same principles now and

(34:19):
that has really helpedtremendously.
So, even just with time thatmany people may say like, oh, I
wish I could do this, I wish Icould do that, I wish I could do
this.
It's like, well, what are we,you know, investing our time in,
and sometimes just putting thatdown on paper that could be
very scary and being like, oh, Iwas just on social media for
like five hours on a Saturday.

(34:39):
You know, what could I havedone on those five hours?
To maybe, you know, get back10x of whatever it is, or pursue
, you know, a different career,or pursue just betterment,
professional development, thingsto talk about.
You know, for myself and I'veshared this story many times on

(35:05):
the podcast, but many years agowhen I was teaching.
I was teaching in Arizona forone year at a charter school and
that's where I met a Marine andhe I don't know I don't
remember what the conversationwas, but he mentioned improvise,
adapt and overcome, and I tookthat to heart, that from that

(35:35):
moment on in my teaching careerand even now, you know, in what
I've been able to accomplish ineducation and through education
those three words have been soimportant to have the ability to
adapt.
It's something that not manypeople may have and it's
something that I think issomething that is very critical,
I think, not only for ourselvesas adults, but even our young

(35:58):
learners and you know peoplecoming out of high school and
college to be able to do that.
So I want to ask you a littlebit about that.
As far as you know when we'llstart off with Marnie, you know,
we know that challenges happenand in being in the world of
education, we know that it's aconstant change and that we have
to just continually improvise,we have to adapt.

(36:19):
So how important is it for usto have that skill set, or the
skill of adaptability, to meetour long-term goals?

Oh, critically important, because otherwise you
will just let any failurederail you completely, and
growth happens in the failureright.
The learning happens in makingthe mistakes and trying.
So you know, two things come tomind.
One, you have to do the work.
When you have hit a struggle,it's the work through that

(36:52):
struggle that will help you grow.
But the other piece is if youare just following the path that
is laid in front of you insteadof designing your path, you may
not even know where you'reheading.
If you are more likely to put avision out in front of you Nick
mentioned at the beginning ofwhere you want to go and how

(37:15):
you're going to get there, whenyou hit a bump in the road, you
can still recalibrate and getback on target or maybe decide
to change the target.
But what won't happen is itwon't cause a spiral that'll
help you, just, you know, adownward spiral because you
realized that, okay, something'sgot to give here and I need to

(37:37):
figure this out.
And that's what happened.
When people just plod their wayfollowing the path that's right
in front of them, they're justnot learning to lead their own
life, which is really somethingwe really highlight.
Raise the third bullet on thecover lead your life.
So that's what adaptabilitywill get you the ability to

(37:58):
actually lead your life insteadof just blindly following a path
.

Excellent.
And, marnie, I think you're agreat example also of just
adapting.
I mean, being in education,from going from math, then of
course district assessment, andthen principal and then now
author and then of coursebuilding.
Now in the ed tech space.
I mean I'm sure there'sdefinitely.
You have to maintain a lot offlexibility and adaptability to

(38:22):
navigate this space.
And, nick, also, like youmentioned, with your experience
30 years you know in this space.
I mean I can't even imagine howmuch or how critical
adaptability is for you.
So tell me a little bit aboutyourself and the importance of
adaptability you know throughyour experience.

As Marnie would say, critically important.
I think planning is veryimportant, but being too rigid
is dangerous.
I think we have to go into itwith that mindset that we're
going to have to adapt.
I mean quick story Marniementioned at the very beginning

(39:02):
that when we left EdTech we hadit on compete.
So we started a new business ina completely different space
and we had a go-to market planwhich was, I would say, 90 to
95% driven off of customer tradeshows and that was about I

(39:24):
don't know three months beforeCOVID hit and everything
completely changed right.
No trade shows right in front ofus, right?
So we didn't just give up.
We completely pivoted and wechanged our go-to-market
strategy into pivoted and wechanged our go-to-market

(39:45):
strategy into virtual leveragingpartner networks.
I mean things we didn't eventhink of at the very beginning,
I think some things we had onthe periphery, but we completely
changed our model.
But we had the same vision forour product and the company of
what we wanted to be.
You know, we were building acompany based off of core values

(40:06):
.
We knew that we wanted tobecome the customer success
platform of this IT industry andwe knew we were going to listen
and get the right feedback.
But the way we had to engagewith our clients and prospects
was completely different thananything we ever imagined, and

(40:29):
that's just one example.
I think you know that was.
That was one company, everycompany that I've been part of.
We had to adapt at some pointand, speaking personally from
from myself, I had to adaptright.
I knew at some point that forme to do what I really wanted to
do, which was to create thingsand solve problems for people,

(40:52):
that I needed to step out ofthat closet.
And I took a job in consultingbecause that forced me to get in
front of people and start todevelop people skills, of all
things right, you know, whichwas very intimidating to me.
But I had to adapt becausethat's I had goals and I wanted

(41:15):
to achieve those goals and everychallenge, whether it was to be
vice president of consultingservices, I was a COO for
another company all things I wasalways intimidated to do and,
quite honestly, on some of thoseI had to really work to get
myself visible, to put myself inthat level of uncomfortability.

(41:38):
And in every one, of thosecases.
I adapted my.
You know what I thought was theway I was wired and I operated
and I had to completely change.
So adaptability is critical toanybody's success and I'm sure,
dr Fonz, you have done it agazillion times yourself.

Even being here today.

It is probably because you adapted to something
at some point excellent?

yes, absolutely, and I think that's
such a critical skill.
And now I going intoadaptability, I know that this
is, uh, something that sydneylearns also throughout the story
, and but I want to kind ofstart talking and shifting the
conversation to the next maincharacter that caught my eye in
this story, which I think issomething that is great, and
which is Blue.
So, marnie, we'll start offwith you.

(42:29):
So I know that you mentionedhere that Blue was created to
help people in designing theirown path, so tell me a little
bit about just the inception ofBlue.
How did that come about?

So it's interesting because Blue
actually the idea for Blue camefirst.
So Blue is the app that we arebuilding that will help gamify
you running the departments ofyou, figuring out who you are,
etc.
So we were actually sitting inan airport and said we're going
to start writing therequirements for this app how

(43:04):
can we build an app for studentsto help them figure out who
they are, tell their story, etc.
And as we started defining whatthey would do in the app, we
said huh, this kind of thisfeels like we're writing a story
.
Nick then used the restroomthat was right behind the gate
that we were sitting in and hecame back, I mean 60 seconds

(43:26):
later, and said I think you hada terrible idea.
I had a terrible idea while youwere in the bathroom.
He said, yeah, I think weshould write a story.
So that is how the Businessizethis self-learning, gamify their

(43:49):
own growth.

And I was just going to say we like to think of
it.
I'm not sure if you're familiarwith the Duolingo app, right,
the app that you know where youcan learn different languages.
You know, we feel like it'sgoing to be.
You know, the Duolingo app-likefor personal development,
filled with gamification.
She talked about writing downand auditing your time.

(44:13):
Well, that will be done in theapp through some sort of
gamification process,identifying who you are, what
your values are.
We're not going to just give youa blank form.
We're going to give youprovoking games, bracket
challenges to understand yourvalues, to understand what your
kryptonite is or what yourstrengths are, and then we're

(44:35):
going to take that, we're goingto learn from it and we're going
to say, hey, we know thatyou're about to apply for
college.
Let's think about this.
This is your story, these areyour strengths.
This is where some of yourweaknesses are.
Here are some ideas andconcepts that you might present
for an essay for your collegeapplication.

(44:57):
Or you're going to a networkingevent because you're in college
.
You know, here are some topicsthat you might want to think
about bringing up to thatcomplete stranger, as you're
trying to meet new people.
So we're super excited.
It comes with experience pointsand streaks and all the fun
things that young people like,and we're super looking forward

(45:20):
to later this year when it'swhen it's involved.

Excellent and I think that is something that
is truly unique and I thinkthere's something that is there
is definitely a need for that.
To be honest with you andespecially, you know, with our,
our younger students gettingready to get out of high school
and, like you mentioned,preparing just to get into
college and just to be able togo deeper, I mean, and, marnie,

(45:44):
I mean with your experience ineducation, you know the load of
students or the ratio ofstudents to counselors, you know
to be able to get in and, ofcourse, then you've got your
counselors for you knowfinancial aid, you know college
and all of that, and I mean andto disseminate all that
information.

(46:04):
I mean this is something thatis a great tool for students to
get to know themselves more,follow a track, see what it is
that they're really good at, andI love, like you mentioned,
nick, to find those areas ofweakness that they can improve
on and personally andprofessionally develop as they
get ready for college, thingsthat they can go ahead and put
into their college applicationsor college essays, which I think

(46:28):
is something that is valuablebecause for a lot of students,
they go into high school,they're I mean they're out of
high school.
They're like well, what justhappened?
Like, all of a sudden, it'slike it's a blur and all I know
is that I graduated now and I'mon to the next thing.
But, but, but seriously, in thatmoment of like, what do I even
have?

(46:48):
Like what, what value can Ibring in?
And I think that nowadays,that's something that is very,
very, very important.
You know, at least from what Isee and observe, that students
know exactly what value had theyhave.
And, like you mentioned, goingthrough this and learning these
skills, learning that you knowinterview skills, some of the

(47:11):
interview lingo, getting readyto answer questions, how to do
those things and doing it in agamified way where you have
challenges, I mean, I thinkthat's something that is very
unique and I think that issomething that is going to be
very engaging for a lot ofstudents.
And you know, and even formyself as an adult, I'm still
like doing Duolingo and doing alot of things that will give me
points and you know, experiencepoints and so on, and I think

(47:33):
that's something that is greatand I can definitely see that
being used.
You know, at least throughthose offices of you know
college, those college prepcourses and things of that sort.
That would be somethingfantastic.
And now you said the app.
Marnie, you're saying this willbe available approximately when
?

So we're hoping at the end of the year and you
kind of nailed it when youtalked about guidance counselors
we have a lot of folks you knowin advisory periods or guidance
periods.
They need some help because theworkload you know you've got
400 students that are trying toget to graduate and get college
essays and letters ofrecommendations.
So yeah, we're hoping to havesome beta folks that we can work
with Nick.
Anything else on the timingother than we're aiming for the
end of the year, yeah, we'reaiming.

Hopefully it'll be sooner, but we're trying to
be conservative with that.
We have a working prototype ofit now and we just want to make
it right.

Excellent.
Well, that is wonderful and Iknow in the book there is a link
that is available to to be ableto be on the waitlist for this.
So that is something that isgreat and I know, like I said, I
am going to put the link hereto the book and then that way
they can reach out or purchasethe book Also, of course, for
your information, marnie andNick, and you know, that way
they get to learn a little bitabout Sydney and her journey,

(48:51):
which you know.
That way they get to learn alittle bit about Sydney and her
journey, which I know is goingto be something that's very
relatable, as it was to myselfand even to us here as adults,
just talking about all thoseserious skills that even today,
I mean, we're still using.
And if it wasn't for us reallyequipping ourselves with those
skills, who knows?
Maybe the path might have beena little bit different, where
one of us wouldn't be here onthis podcast today.
But I'm glad that our pathscrossed and, of course, like

(49:14):
Nick said, because of thatadaptability and flexibility, we
were able to connect and behere this evening to have this
amazing conversation.
And before I end the show withthe last three questions that I
always love to ask, but, nick, Iwant to ask you, you know, for
our listeners, who are ready totake ownership of their future,
what's the first step that theycan take?

(49:34):
Some of your best advicethrough your experience.

You know, in our last book, Lead a Light Glasso,
we had a saying leadership islife and everybody is a leader.
And I think the most importantlesson that I have learned in my
career and we hope comesthrough with Sydney and the cast
of characters in this book isthat you can't lead others when

(50:02):
you don't lead yourself first.
And I think it's just reallyimportant to focus on personal
leadership be authentic, beyourself.
I think a lot of young people Iknow I did struggle with I
always wanted to be who Ithought I should be, you know,
based on how others saw me, notwho I actually was.

(50:25):
But we say the most importantproject you'll ever work on is
yourself, and I think I knowMarty and I both share that
wholeheartedly.
So hopefully it comes throughwith Sydney Lead yourself first,
Excellent.

Marty?
How about yourself?
What is the one message youhope the readers take away from
the business of you?

Well, nick said it, the most important project
you'll ever work on is you.
You really do have to startthere, because if you are not
feeling that the true you isshowing up at work every day, it
probably doesn't feel good toshow up at that work every day,
and so it really impacts yourmental health along with your
ability to grow.
So just critically important tounderstand you and that's what

(51:07):
we're hoping to help folks walkthrough so they can really get a
get themselves on the rightfoot to the best version of
themselves.

Excellent, I love it, marnie.
So, before we get into our lastthree questions, where can our
listeners connect with both youand Nick and learn a little bit
more about the Business of you?

So our website is thebusinessofyouai, our
social media is Blue, theBusiness of you, and then we are
easy to find on LinkedInbecause we have relatively
unique names.
So you can find Blue theBusiness of you on LinkedIn or
either of us by our name, marnieStockman, nick Coniglio.
He's got some numbers after his, but you'll be able to find him

(51:50):
and connect with him.

Excellent.
Well, thank you so much.
I really appreciate it.
And before we wrap up again, Ialways love to end the show with
these last three questions.
So, nick, we'll go ahead andstart off with you.
As we know, every superhero hasa weakness or a pain point.
So for Superman, it was thatkryptonite that weakened him.
So I want to ask you, nick, inyour experience and what you've

(52:13):
seen whether it be in the edtech space, education space or
just a combination of both Iwant to ask you what would you
say would be your currentkryptonite?

I think I'm a little too close with the panic
monster, meaning that I have atendency to procrastinate a
little too much.
Now I get around it because Icreate a false sense of urgency
on a plan of list of things thatI need to do, but I think

(52:46):
procrastination is my kryptonitefor sure.

Yeah yeah, nick, I think we just became
best friends because my, my, mymotto is procrastinate later.
Yes, so yeah I love that.
I'm still that is something andI'm very similar in the way that
you just mentioned that likeeven doing my dissertation and
things of that sort, it was justlike oh my gosh.

(53:11):
And then until it was just likeoh my gosh, and then until it
was just like oh my gosh, Ireally got to do this.
But it was just that processing, like I said, I had it here but
it was just a matter of puttingit down on paper.
But then, of course, overcomingand overwhelm of like oh my
gosh, I, I got to do this andyeah, so, but anyway,

(53:32):
procrastination, that was mything.
Procrastinate later.
I am getting a little bitbetter, I'm being a little bit
more like just staying on top ofthings.
But yeah, procrastinate lateris my motto.
All right, marty, how about you?
I want to ask you, what wouldyou say is your current
kryptonite?

So it's interesting because I always say
I hate filling out online formswith a white hot passion.
But that stems from the factthat I don't like someone like
the loss of control, as somebodyelse's emergency suddenly
became my emergency.
So you know, lack of planningon someone else's part became an
emergency on my part.
So probably Wrapped a littletoo tight sometimes, how's that?

Or all the time maybe and just on the
procrastination world, because Ican live there too I also
wouldn't have gotten mydissertation done if I wasn't
watching the clock countdown.
You know, if it weren't for thelast minute, nothing would ever
get done.
Share, yeah, that experienceright now, like it's.
It's so great to just be ableto come home and say, hey, I've
got a podcast and that's all Igotta think about, and then
cutting some clips and editingwhere, as opposed to, oh my gosh
, I've got a podcast, but then Ialso have a chapter four that I
have to start editing and doingthis and formatting.

(54:46):
So now I'm like this hugeweight has lifted off my
shoulders and now I candefinitely invest my time and
other things that will bring meback that 10x also.
Not that the dissertationdidn't do that, but I'm just
saying, like these passionprojects, like you know, which
is great, now I'm all in, youknow, but thank you so much for
sharing that.
All right, we'll go ahead andstart off with you for this one.

(55:06):
Marnie, if you could have abillboard with anything on it,
what would it be and why?

I feel like at this point it has to say all gas
no break.
I was recently, and so it's onmy LinkedIn page.
I've certainly been accused ofthat, and recently our local
newspaper did an article aboutLead it Like Lasso and when they
interviewed me they decided tosubtitle it all gas no Break.
And one of my neighbors on awalk walked up and just like
jumped in front of me and saidI'll go with that.

Excellent Nick .
How about yourself?
What would your billboard say?

It would say New York Jets Super Bowl champions.
That's what it would say.
I don't think I'll ever seethat billboard in my lifetime
because it happened right beforeI was born, but I'm a diehard
New York Jets fan.
Now, if we want to keep it alittle more on terms with the
conversation, it would be staycurious, stay kind, that's what

(56:07):
it would be, but I'm a diehardJets fan.
I heard you say earlier thatyou're a Bills fan and I'm
envious.

Dr Fons Excellent, Love it, Nick.
Well, hopefully we'lldefinitely see that billboard.
I was like we got to alwaysremain optimistic no matter what
and hey, we got to just keep itthat way, but I love it All.
Right.
My last question, Nick, thisone.
We'll start off with you first.
If you could trade places witha single person for a day, who
would that be and why?

I'm going to keep the sports theme because I love
to compete and I love the sportof golf and I think I would
like to be Scotty Shuffler onSunday of the Masters tournament
and find a way to lose it.
But I would love to feel whatthat pressure would be like,

(57:02):
because if you want to talk wetalked about adaptability and
problem solving earlier thelevel of adaptability you have
to have to win a golf tournamentjust simply is mind-blowing to
me because I can't even do it asa recreational golfer.
So yeah, I'm sorry I'm no funon these games, but that's my

(57:26):
answer.
That's my honest answer.
Hey, it's a great answer.

Hey, solid answer.
Valid answer Great, thank youso much for sharing, marnie.
How about yourself?
Who is the one person that youwould switch places for or
switch places with for a day?

beach volleyball player.
I'm about eight inches tooshort to be a beach volleyball
player, but I do love volleyball.
And first my students wouldalways ask, like Ms Stockman, if

(58:01):
you could change one thingabout your body, what would it
be?
And I would always say I'd loveto be able to jump higher, and
I don't think any of themthought that that's what they
should be picking.
But so Kerry Walsh, yeah, Ithink same, think, same thing
with nick.
Also, I'm a competitor to beable to really finish the way.
Um, that she and misty maytrainer did.
Yeah, impressive they.

I mean, I remember them from many years
ago and they just dominated.
Yeah, I mean, I was just like,wow, what a duo.
So, yeah, excellent, well,great choices, marnie and Nick,
it has been a pleasure, it hasbeen an honor to have you here.
I am just so thankful.
Again, big shout out to ourfriend Scott for making this
happen.
This conversation definitely hasfilled my bucket and has

(58:46):
definitely allowed me to reallytake down some notes and just
something to reflect on formyself.
As we all know, like Imentioned, this is my solid PD
that I get to share witheverybody, and so thank you so
much for being part of my EdTechLife and for all our audience
members that are checking outthis episode, please make sure

(59:09):
you visit our website and visitat wwwmyedtechlife, where you
can check out this amazingepisode and the other 335
episodes where, I promise you,you will find a little something
that you can take and use andsprinkle onto what you are
already doing.
Great.
And again, a big shout out toour sponsors Book Creator,
eduaid and Yellowdig.
Thank you so much for believingin this mission to bring some
amazing guests and amazingconversations into our space.

(59:31):
And, my friends, until nexttime, don't forget, stay techie.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Cardiac Cowboys

Crime Junkie

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 336: Marnie Stockman & Nick Coniglio

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Cardiac Cowboys

Crime Junkie

All Episodes

Episode 336: Marnie Stockman & Nick Coniglio

On Purpose with Jay Shetty