November 27, 2024 • 28 mins
Megan Seivert, a Harris voter from Pennsylvania, discusses the strain MAGA has caused on her personal and familial relationships, including with her father. She's working to mend ties with her Trump-supporting relatives.
To view our conversation at the MeidasTouch Network, please visit the below link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko9AurxeT1A&list=PLX_rWdQSOcZMZjdaSQUkgFlegPNmGSdRk&index=6
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
How do you interact with people who you know voted for this?
(00:02):
Right? If you are an LGBTQ person and you know someone in your family voted
essentially against your rights or you're a woman knowing that, you know,
this man was calling people the B word.
J.D. Vance was literally calling Kamala Harris the trash and said,
we're going to take out the trash.
I know a lot of black women were incredibly triggered by that.
And if you then meet somebody and you know,
they voted for the people who called you trash or if you're Puerto Rican,
(00:25):
you know, you know, someone voted that way.
Do you recommend just from a psychological standpoint being around them?
We got the holidays coming up.
So I love that you asked this question because, you know, there is a push,
I think, just a societal norm that if somebody is your family,
that they are entitled to your time.
And I think the answer is absolutely not.
(00:48):
So if you are going to a situation where you have family members,
where you have close friends who you know have voted in ways
that are against you, like what you said, against your livelihood.
And it's completely fine to not be around those people and to tell them why.
You know, to say, I have a problem with the way that you voted
(01:09):
because it went against my very livelihood and I'm not going to be around you.
This holiday, I need to take some space for me.
And I actually talked to, you know, adults as well as
advising parents for children.
I mean, I think, you know, I don't think that you should force children.
I don't think you should force adults to be around people just because they're your family.
I think there is a level of, you know, need to establish boundaries.
(01:33):
And if you feel like you need to establish boundaries with people,
whether they're your family or not, I think you should very much be entitled to do so.
And I think it may be essential for your mental health.
Hey, everybody, it's Rich coming to you here with Leaving MAGA
with the Mind is Touch Network.
As I had mentioned in a recent promo video we did, we are still doing our videos
(01:55):
for those to highlight those who left MAGA, but we are also
adding to that a series of videos of friends and family who left MAGA.
So make sure you subscribe so you don't miss any of our updates coming up.
I just want to thank everybody, as always, for all the engagement,
all the comments with all the videos we've been doing with Leaving MAGA.
(02:17):
So I want to just mention how I met our guest today.
Her name is Megan Sievert. She's in Pennsylvania.
I had put out on my socials that I wanted to speak with
friends and family of those who have or those who are in MAGA.
And I did expect to get a response, but it has been completely overwhelming
(02:39):
and humbling just how many people have actually reached out to us.
So I want to bring Megan in.
I want to thank her for joining us today.
Hi, Megan. Appreciate you.
Appreciate you being here.
And let me just let me just preface by saying I know that
these conversations are really difficult and I thank you.
(03:01):
And on behalf of all of us here at Leaving MAGA and Mind is Touch,
we really appreciate that you are doing what I see as an invaluable
public service and a very selfless act.
So when I when I put my message out there in socials,
you reached out to me and we had a chance to converse.
And you had said in that message to me that I want you to get into here
(03:24):
in a moment that you and I don't want to put this word in your mouth,
but you desperately or close to maybe wanted to find a way
of reconciling with some of your family who are in MAGA
and talk to us about some of the relatives.
And what what were the relationships like before Trump and MAGA?
(03:47):
Did you talk a lot about politics?
What was that dynamic like before
the interjection of all this politics in your relationships?
Yeah, so I think we didn't really talk about politics specifically.
I think at some point growing up, I realized that, you know,
(04:09):
my dad's side of the family, my parents are divorced,
but like my dad's side of the family, you know, votes Republican.
And they just, you know, that's what they do.
And 20s, by the time 2016 came around, you know, I was a young adult
and had, you know, started paying attention to politics.
(04:30):
But my family never really pushed political things on me.
We're a big military family.
You know, we moved around all over the place.
And as much as, you know, we had that love of the military
and, you know, love of our country kind of thing going on,
bit of pride there, none of it was ever like politics related.
(04:54):
Like it's it was never about the actual politicians
and the political side of things.
It was like serving your country and and that part of it.
But as a young adult, I started paying attention a little more.
And then in 2016, of course, with Trump kind of shaking things up
in a way and being a very different candidate than normal,
(05:18):
I was instantly turned off by his whole his whole deal.
I wasn't a huge fan of Hillary, but I, you know, I like Bernie.
But I saw Trump for, you know, what he was.
And I wasn't a fan of that.
And I I think I talked about it to my family at that point,
(05:39):
because I was so it was a big deal.
You know, it was the topic of the year or whatever.
It was a huge thing to talk about.
And and they seemed to kind of downplay some of the things he did.
And I was like, what are you talking about?
That's weird. Why would you want that in the White House?
And, you know, they they voted for him and it was a strain on things.
(06:03):
And I think it was.
It started to strain things from there.
And I think Covid was a huge issue as well.
The something about the radicalization
up like went way stronger than it had before during Covid.
(06:28):
I think a lot of people got stir crazy or something.
But politics became less of a.
More talked about because I thought it was important
to share with them my feelings about it.
So thank you. So did you feel like in that time period?
So 2016 to 2020, right?
So the first term, were there these observable
(06:51):
changes that you saw with some of your family members?
And maybe it was.
How they spoke, maybe it was some of their social media.
I'm wondering when you.
Started to maybe become a little bit concerned with this
doesn't really sound like the person I have known
(07:13):
pretty much my entire life, right?
And you start to see those changes because I've talked a lot about this
in my own leaving Maga personal story that.
While I'm not defending.
My actions because I.
Spoke and acted on my own volition, my decisions.
I do feel like a lot of these mythologies in Maga
(07:34):
really actually do change people like something happens
when they start to adhere to them that I feel like it changes
a little bit of a person's outlook and how they treat
their loved ones and their friends.
So I'm wondering about if there were some specific examples
you saw when you started to have a little bit of aha moments
that really unnerved you and stood out to you in terms of
(07:57):
the changes that you saw with your family.
Yeah, and yeah, like you said, it's something that kind of changes
like people that phrase of like it's a slippery slope kind of thing.
You're like building a habit when you do and say certain things.
And a lot of it is to I think the Internet has been a great thing
for communication and society to connect people who are far away.
(08:18):
But also, it's easier to say and do things online
than it is to do it in person to someone's face.
I think a lot of hateful things are said online and spread online
that shouldn't be.
And that was kind of the first few things that I started seeing
like from my dad that were like.
(08:40):
I was like, you're not that kind of person. Why would you say that online
when you wouldn't do that in real life?
Some of the memes, like I love a good meme.
I'm a very online person.
I'm a gamer and I love a good meme, but some of the.
The. The right can't mean Jokey memes that they made were very gross.
(09:03):
Some of the ones about Hillary were really terrible.
And hateful and mean. And then they do the same thing about Nancy Pelosi.
Usually it's women, which also doesn't sit right.
But it would be these Jokey things that were posted on social media
that I was like, you're sharing this with your friends and family
(09:23):
and I'm also on here and I don't I don't like it.
And I think at one point I would speak to the people who are on the internet
at one point I you know, I I would speak back every once in a while
when it was like very outwardly like.
Homophobic or transphobic and I would say like, why are you posting this?
(09:44):
Like don't. Don't do that.
You don't know what you're talking about.
Like, I don't know, but that was kind of the first indicator.
And then it got worse during covid, especially with a lot of the
conspiracies theory type stuff.
And then January 6th to even even to there, there were some bad posts made.
(10:10):
So there's this conversation that I feel like is an ongoing one about
and it's particularly pertinent to my own story, which is I I tell everyone
I was in Magna from 2015 to 2022 and it was in August of 22 when I said
I can't do this anymore.
(10:31):
I'm out. I cannot support and defend the indefensible any longer.
So there is this conversation about why did it take so long for this to happen?
Why didn't. Charlottesville do it or why didn't covid do it or why didn't January 6th do it?
And again, it's not here to defend myself in any way, Megan,
(10:54):
but it is something that I really want to stress and emphasize
that people decide to leave.
When when it's the right time for them, because maybe they just hear one lie
too many or there's one avoidable unnecessary death too many.
And it's not that I want to speak for any of our our viewers, but.
(11:16):
I know it comes up a lot in the comments section here about those wondering, well.
You know, you've got your dad and why wasn't covid enough?
Why wasn't January 6th enough?
And. You know, maybe you've thought that at times,
maybe others, you know, have have wondered that, but.
Do you feel like as you watched over time with your family
(11:40):
and in particular, your dad, did you was there ever this sense
or maybe you have it now that there's not going to be a way to
restore the relationship, because I think one of the reasons
I would imagine wanting to do this testimonial is you don't want that
to be the case, right? You don't want there to be a hopelessness or despair.
You want to try to.
(12:02):
Rekindle as much as possible the relationship that you had before 2015
and 16, I would think. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I think there is hope there
because, like I said, it's my family, like the they're very smart,
they're very caring, and this could happen to anyone.
And that's what a lot of times I I try to tell people is like, they're like,
(12:25):
well, those people are so stupid. And I'm like, you don't have to be stupid
to be drawn into what is essentially a cult.
Like it's like people who study cults know that that's the case and they they know it.
And and I think there's hope there.
I mean, our relationship is pretty stable right now.
(12:45):
I mean, when he got further on to posting things about like
COVID in January six, that was the last straw for me.
And I, you know, kind of cut him off at that point.
And I think that did kind of set a rule there.
It's like I don't. You're doing something that's like crossing a line very severely.
(13:10):
And I'm going to tell you that because I love you and I care about you.
It's not because I'm trying to say I told you so, it's because I love you.
And I don't want to see you do this to yourself and to the people around you.
And I think that kind of, you know, he stopped posting
a lot of those terrible things. I think he's still
maybe in that zone of like still voting Republican because he's always voted Republican.
(13:36):
And I think he did. I don't know for sure because I didn't talk to him about it.
I think he still voted for Trump this year.
And, you know, if he did that, that really hurts.
But I think there's hope there.
I think with this new term, there are going to be a lot of things that happen
that people can't deny are the fault of Trump's administration.
(14:00):
You know, they'll hopefully be able to if we give them a little grace,
because I think that's the big thing, too, is not being ready to shove your finger
in someone's face and say, I told you so.
That doesn't really help us move forward as a country.
Like, what would help the most people as possible, you know,
(14:22):
for us to be a loving and accepting community again?
And I would love to live in a world where I don't have to pay attention to politics
and be relaxed. But, you know, it'll be another four years of me being stressed out,
so stressed again. And, you know, maybe next,
(14:45):
maybe during these four years, we can try to have those conversations
and make a difference, like, to help bring people back into reality, you know.
Well, I'm really glad that you said about reframing from I told you so,
because I've been posting that all over my socials recently.
(15:07):
Yeah. Because to your point, there is a lot that's going to happen
in the next four years, where I do feel like a lot of people who,
out of a sincere desire to see the country be a better place, supported Trump.
(15:27):
And I don't want to ever judge anyone for how they voted,
but I do think that it's not going to be just disappointment.
There are going to be specific happenings and policies
where there's going to be that buyer's remorse.
And as that happens, you know, I'm thinking about your dad.
I'm thinking about another testimonial we had recently.
(15:49):
It's going to be dropping soon with a lady and her best friend of three decades.
You know, three decades. It's like, you're talking about
not just these acquaintanceships, you know, we're talking about parents
and children and best friends of many, many years.
(16:10):
And I do think it's going to happen where people are just going to say,
you know, this isn't exactly what I wanted.
And it's easy to say, I told you so.
But the question is, what is actually going to be gained saying that to them?
Because if our goal is to really empower people to leave MAGA,
we want to try to find a reconciliation with their friends and their family.
(16:34):
All the I told you so is just going to push them right back in
when we're trying to extract them out.
And I promise everyone who challenges me a little bit on that,
I appreciate that people may respectfully disagree with what I'm saying
and what you are saying now.
(16:54):
But I would rather that we not have to find that out in real time, right?
I would rather that we not have to go through the I told you so.
When there's doubt and there's remorse, that's an opportunity for us.
We've got an exit ramp.
Now, I don't want to volunteer you for this one, Megan,
but I'm thinking that you obviously had an impact because your dad stopped posting.
(17:17):
Yeah.
That means something.
So just maybe your dad might eventually leave MAGA.
That could happen, right?
Because you've created an opening.
You know, you did that and you didn't do it by name-calling or by insults.
That's why I really disagree vehemently with so much of the rhetoric about Trump voters
(17:41):
because when one is called the Nazi or the misogynist or the racist,
I'm going to think about your dad.
Yeah.
I'm going to think about siblings and best friends.
Like that's who I'm going to think about.
And of course, I know there's bad people in any large group,
but the ones we're talking to, your dad is,
I don't even need to know your father just listening to you to know that he's a good man.
There is a goodness in him.
(18:02):
And that's true, I think, of most people in the MAGA community.
Yeah. And it's also kind of the concept of how do people learn?
As I've got a good education background,
it's like not everyone learns by being yelled at and told where they made a mistake.
Most people don't learn that way.
They learn by being given the information and an opportunity to learn it and grow.
(18:27):
Like if you do something wrong,
do you want to be the parent that yells at your kid and gets mad at them
for like bringing food out into a room and then dropping it on the floor?
It's like I think children learn better.
I'm not trying to infantilize people, but it's just education-wise.
It's a good parallel to make, you know, people learn at every age.
(18:57):
And, you know, people learn best with positive reinforcement, not being yelled at.
You know, everybody knows a manager at a job you had
or a teacher that was just so mean and cruel about the way that they manage their employees
or, you know, teach people in a classroom.
(19:20):
And do you remember those as good teachers?
No. Do you like those teachers?
No. Or those managers? No.
The best teachers, the best managers, the best way to approach someone trying to help them learn
how to, you know, leave something like that is someone with like a loving approach to it,
like an open approach to it, a conversation.
(19:41):
And I think too, it's like it takes a lot of courage and strength to admit
that you were wrong about something and go back on what you did before.
Like if you wholeheartedly believe something and you realize that you might have been wrong,
(20:02):
it's hard to say that. It's really hard.
No one likes to admit that they were wrong and it's difficult.
Like one of my best friends, I used to hate her. I used to hate her.
I think it was boy drama or something stupid like that during college.
And at some point, we were both just hating on each other so much.
(20:22):
And then one of our mutual friends was like, you guys actually have a lot in common
and I think you would actually really like each other.
And we both had to step back and I stepped back and I said,
am I wrong for being really hateful to this person? And are they right?
And we both kind of said, listen, let's clean the slate.
Let's, you know, I know there were some terrible things that happened,
(20:46):
but I think we were wrong.
And now we've been best friends for over a decade.
Like, and it came out of something where we were very hateful.
Like we were wrong though.
And it was hard to say that and realize that I did something bad.
I did something wrong. I hurt someone and I had to do a lot of introspection on myself
(21:11):
and think to myself, I'm like, am I giving her a fair shot?
Am I doing this because of something wrong in my thought process
when really she could be one of the best friends I've ever had, you know,
if I gave her a chance.
Well, you laid the groundwork for your dad to leave.
Yeah.
(21:31):
And I know that we can't control when, if and when others decide to,
but very clearly you, you influenced him.
And you know, that tells me that the love is strong and you're getting married.
Right. So you've got, you're planning a wedding.
So you, you want your dad to enjoy it, right?
(21:51):
Not have no, no, like,
a weird undertones of like,
you know, like a meet the fuckers drama.
Right. You don't want that.
And you know, you said before about yelling at the kids.
I got two kids. I'm going to plead the fifth on that.
So you, you know, you've, you put, you have really put in the work.
So I want to ask you just as a closing question here,
(22:16):
given everything that happened with your family,
in particular with your father,
if you had the opportunity to speak one-on-one to the president-elect,
I'm curious what you would say to him.
And would your comments be grounded in what
(22:38):
MAGA and Trump coming on the political scene did to your relationship?
I'm wondering what is it that you would actually say
if you had the opportunity to have a conversation with him?
Hmm. I don't know if it would be in relation to
(23:00):
my family and people who, you know, are in MAGA.
I, I, I, because I don't know if he really cares that much
about how his actions affect everyday people.
I really don't think he cares that much.
(23:21):
Maybe I would just say like, you know,
maybe feed into like his sense of like patriotism and just say like,
please don't destroy our American institutions.
Like, please don't do, you know,
(23:42):
Republican presidents in the past have like worked with the systems that we have
and the departments that we have.
You don't need to get rid of the Department of Education.
You don't need to just get rid of the, you know, basically get rid of the EPA.
I don't know exactly what their plans are,
but please don't make too many drastic changes
(24:05):
because it's going to hurt everyday people, including the people who support you.
Like, please don't do all the tariff stuff.
Like, it's going to hurt people a lot, everyday people.
And, you know, I don't know.
I feel like that would really be the only thing I'd have to say
because hopefully it could tone something down,
(24:29):
but I don't think he would care about my opinion, sadly.
I don't know.
I've thought about often what I might say,
and I probably would preface a conversation with him by saying that I was a true believer.
Yeah, you were a supporter.
(24:50):
You know, I worked in the campaign. I was a volunteer.
I wrote part of the call script. I made phone calls.
Did all of the grassroots work.
But I would also say to him that, and I take full responsibility for this,
that I helped him tear asunder families and friendships
and communities, households, places of worship.
(25:12):
And, you know, what has happened with you and your dad,
I feel a particular, I feel like I am a culprit in that story,
you know, that I have some culpability.
And people will say, well, you're only one guy, one vote, one person.
But honestly, Megan, that doesn't register with me that way.
(25:33):
You know, I did assist him in pinning complete strangers and families against each other.
And it's one of the reasons we do these videos.
It's one of the reasons we have our organization,
is that I'm trying to bring good news to the MAGA afflicted.
And what you're doing that I think is really so important as well,
(25:56):
and it's why I feel like people are going to really be moved by this video that you're doing,
is that it requires such a superhuman degree of patience
to have to just have a relationship
with those who are loved ones or our friends who are still in the thrall of MAGA.
(26:18):
Because I try to separate the people in the community.
The community is a toxic one.
And a lot of people have just been subsumed into it.
So I appreciate that you would say that about, you know,
you'd want to be candid with the president-elect.
I'd want to be, but our experiences are different.
(26:39):
And I can appreciate that.
So tell us real quick, when's the big day?
Oh, it's in about a year.
So it's like the 8th of November next year.
So I've got plenty of time.
Okay, you have plenty of time and plenty of time to figure out
who we invite into this, right?
That's not a good idea.
Yeah, that's what my wife and I did.
(27:00):
It's a good idea.
I really, Megan, you know, thank you.
Congratulations in advance.
Thank you.
And I just want to, again, just express our gratitude for you coming on.
I know that your story is going to resonate with so many.
And you are bringing a hopefulness to this.
I think there are a lot of people out there who feel the despair.
(27:21):
They feel the desperation about whether they're going to ever be able
to get their relationships back of their friends and family.
And you are showing that it is possible with the process of doing this.
So you are really providing something that I just think a lot of people
are looking for right now, especially after the selection,
(27:43):
which is a reason to believe.
So Megan Siever from Pennsylvania, thank you so much for being with us today.
Leaving MAGA Midas Touch.
Appreciate that.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Hey guys, if you like this video, make sure you subscribe
so you don't miss any of our updates of leaving MAGA and Midas Touch Network.
And if you've left MAGA or you're having doubts about being in MAGA
(28:04):
or you've got friends or family who are still in the MAGA community,
we want to hear from you and we want to hear your story and your testimonials.
So be sure to visit us at LeavingMAGA.org.
Get in touch.
We appreciate you guys as always watching.
Until next time, thanks again.
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How do you interact with people who you know voted for this?
(00:02):
Right? If you are an LGBTQ person and you know someone in your family voted
essentially against your rights or you're a woman knowing that, you know,
this man was calling people the B word.
J.D. Vance was literally calling Kamala Harris the trash and said,
we're going to take out the trash.
I know a lot of black women were incredibly triggered by that.
And if you then meet somebody and you know,
they voted for the people who called you trash or if you're Puerto Rican,
(00:25):
you know, you know, someone voted that way.
Do you recommend just from a psychological standpoint being around them?
We got the holidays coming up.
So I love that you asked this question because, you know, there is a push,
I think, just a societal norm that if somebody is your family,
that they are entitled to your time.
And I think the answer is absolutely not.
(00:48):
So if you are going to a situation where you have family members,
where you have close friends who you know have voted in ways
that are against you, like what you said, against your livelihood.
And it's completely fine to not be around those people and to tell them why.
You know, to say, I have a problem with the way that you voted
(01:09):
because it went against my very livelihood and I'm not going to be around you.
This holiday, I need to take some space for me.
And I actually talked to, you know, adults as well as
advising parents for children.
I mean, I think, you know, I don't think that you should force children.
I don't think you should force adults to be around people just because they're your family.
I think there is a level of, you know, need to establish boundaries.
(01:33):
And if you feel like you need to establish boundaries with people,
whether they're your family or not, I think you should very much be entitled to do so.
And I think it may be essential for your mental health.
Hey, everybody, it's Rich coming to you here with Leaving MAGA
with the Mind is Touch Network.
As I had mentioned in a recent promo video we did, we are still doing our videos
(01:55):
for those to highlight those who left MAGA, but we are also
adding to that a series of videos of friends and family who left MAGA.
So make sure you subscribe so you don't miss any of our updates coming up.
I just want to thank everybody, as always, for all the engagement,
all the comments with all the videos we've been doing with Leaving MAGA.
(02:17):
So I want to just mention how I met our guest today.
Her name is Megan Sievert. She's in Pennsylvania.
I had put out on my socials that I wanted to speak with
friends and family of those who have or those who are in MAGA.
And I did expect to get a response, but it has been completely overwhelming
(02:39):
and humbling just how many people have actually reached out to us.
So I want to bring Megan in.
I want to thank her for joining us today.
Hi, Megan. Appreciate you.
Appreciate you being here.
And let me just let me just preface by saying I know that
these conversations are really difficult and I thank you.
(03:01):
And on behalf of all of us here at Leaving MAGA and Mind is Touch,
we really appreciate that you are doing what I see as an invaluable
public service and a very selfless act.
So when I when I put my message out there in socials,
you reached out to me and we had a chance to converse.
And you had said in that message to me that I want you to get into here
(03:24):
in a moment that you and I don't want to put this word in your mouth,
but you desperately or close to maybe wanted to find a way
of reconciling with some of your family who are in MAGA
and talk to us about some of the relatives.
And what what were the relationships like before Trump and MAGA?
(03:47):
Did you talk a lot about politics?
What was that dynamic like before
the interjection of all this politics in your relationships?
Yeah, so I think we didn't really talk about politics specifically.
I think at some point growing up, I realized that, you know,
(04:09):
my dad's side of the family, my parents are divorced,
but like my dad's side of the family, you know, votes Republican.
And they just, you know, that's what they do.
And 20s, by the time 2016 came around, you know, I was a young adult
and had, you know, started paying attention to politics.
(04:30):
But my family never really pushed political things on me.
We're a big military family.
You know, we moved around all over the place.
And as much as, you know, we had that love of the military
and, you know, love of our country kind of thing going on,
bit of pride there, none of it was ever like politics related.
(04:54):
Like it's it was never about the actual politicians
and the political side of things.
It was like serving your country and and that part of it.
But as a young adult, I started paying attention a little more.
And then in 2016, of course, with Trump kind of shaking things up
in a way and being a very different candidate than normal,
(05:18):
I was instantly turned off by his whole his whole deal.
I wasn't a huge fan of Hillary, but I, you know, I like Bernie.
But I saw Trump for, you know, what he was.
And I wasn't a fan of that.
And I I think I talked about it to my family at that point,
(05:39):
because I was so it was a big deal.
You know, it was the topic of the year or whatever.
It was a huge thing to talk about.
And and they seemed to kind of downplay some of the things he did.
And I was like, what are you talking about?
That's weird. Why would you want that in the White House?
And, you know, they they voted for him and it was a strain on things.
(06:03):
And I think it was.
It started to strain things from there.
And I think Covid was a huge issue as well.
The something about the radicalization
up like went way stronger than it had before during Covid.
(06:28):
I think a lot of people got stir crazy or something.
But politics became less of a.
More talked about because I thought it was important
to share with them my feelings about it.
So thank you. So did you feel like in that time period?
So 2016 to 2020, right?
So the first term, were there these observable
(06:51):
changes that you saw with some of your family members?
And maybe it was.
How they spoke, maybe it was some of their social media.
I'm wondering when you.
Started to maybe become a little bit concerned with this
doesn't really sound like the person I have known
(07:13):
pretty much my entire life, right?
And you start to see those changes because I've talked a lot about this
in my own leaving Maga personal story that.
While I'm not defending.
My actions because I.
Spoke and acted on my own volition, my decisions.
I do feel like a lot of these mythologies in Maga
(07:34):
really actually do change people like something happens
when they start to adhere to them that I feel like it changes
a little bit of a person's outlook and how they treat
their loved ones and their friends.
So I'm wondering about if there were some specific examples
you saw when you started to have a little bit of aha moments
that really unnerved you and stood out to you in terms of
(07:57):
the changes that you saw with your family.
Yeah, and yeah, like you said, it's something that kind of changes
like people that phrase of like it's a slippery slope kind of thing.
You're like building a habit when you do and say certain things.
And a lot of it is to I think the Internet has been a great thing
for communication and society to connect people who are far away.
(08:18):
But also, it's easier to say and do things online
than it is to do it in person to someone's face.
I think a lot of hateful things are said online and spread online
that shouldn't be.
And that was kind of the first few things that I started seeing
like from my dad that were like.
(08:40):
I was like, you're not that kind of person. Why would you say that online
when you wouldn't do that in real life?
Some of the memes, like I love a good meme.
I'm a very online person.
I'm a gamer and I love a good meme, but some of the.
The. The right can't mean Jokey memes that they made were very gross.
(09:03):
Some of the ones about Hillary were really terrible.
And hateful and mean. And then they do the same thing about Nancy Pelosi.
Usually it's women, which also doesn't sit right.
But it would be these Jokey things that were posted on social media
that I was like, you're sharing this with your friends and family
(09:23):
and I'm also on here and I don't I don't like it.
And I think at one point I would speak to the people who are on the internet
at one point I you know, I I would speak back every once in a while
when it was like very outwardly like.
Homophobic or transphobic and I would say like, why are you posting this?
(09:44):
Like don't. Don't do that.
You don't know what you're talking about.
Like, I don't know, but that was kind of the first indicator.
And then it got worse during covid, especially with a lot of the
conspiracies theory type stuff.
And then January 6th to even even to there, there were some bad posts made.
(10:10):
So there's this conversation that I feel like is an ongoing one about
and it's particularly pertinent to my own story, which is I I tell everyone
I was in Magna from 2015 to 2022 and it was in August of 22 when I said
I can't do this anymore.
(10:31):
I'm out. I cannot support and defend the indefensible any longer.
So there is this conversation about why did it take so long for this to happen?
Why didn't. Charlottesville do it or why didn't covid do it or why didn't January 6th do it?
And again, it's not here to defend myself in any way, Megan,
(10:54):
but it is something that I really want to stress and emphasize
that people decide to leave.
When when it's the right time for them, because maybe they just hear one lie
too many or there's one avoidable unnecessary death too many.
And it's not that I want to speak for any of our our viewers, but.
(11:16):
I know it comes up a lot in the comments section here about those wondering, well.
You know, you've got your dad and why wasn't covid enough?
Why wasn't January 6th enough?
And. You know, maybe you've thought that at times,
maybe others, you know, have have wondered that, but.
Do you feel like as you watched over time with your family
(11:40):
and in particular, your dad, did you was there ever this sense
or maybe you have it now that there's not going to be a way to
restore the relationship, because I think one of the reasons
I would imagine wanting to do this testimonial is you don't want that
to be the case, right? You don't want there to be a hopelessness or despair.
You want to try to.
(12:02):
Rekindle as much as possible the relationship that you had before 2015
and 16, I would think. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I think there is hope there
because, like I said, it's my family, like the they're very smart,
they're very caring, and this could happen to anyone.
And that's what a lot of times I I try to tell people is like, they're like,
(12:25):
well, those people are so stupid. And I'm like, you don't have to be stupid
to be drawn into what is essentially a cult.
Like it's like people who study cults know that that's the case and they they know it.
And and I think there's hope there.
I mean, our relationship is pretty stable right now.
(12:45):
I mean, when he got further on to posting things about like
COVID in January six, that was the last straw for me.
And I, you know, kind of cut him off at that point.
And I think that did kind of set a rule there.
It's like I don't. You're doing something that's like crossing a line very severely.
(13:10):
And I'm going to tell you that because I love you and I care about you.
It's not because I'm trying to say I told you so, it's because I love you.
And I don't want to see you do this to yourself and to the people around you.
And I think that kind of, you know, he stopped posting
a lot of those terrible things. I think he's still
maybe in that zone of like still voting Republican because he's always voted Republican.
(13:36):
And I think he did. I don't know for sure because I didn't talk to him about it.
I think he still voted for Trump this year.
And, you know, if he did that, that really hurts.
But I think there's hope there.
I think with this new term, there are going to be a lot of things that happen
that people can't deny are the fault of Trump's administration.
(14:00):
You know, they'll hopefully be able to if we give them a little grace,
because I think that's the big thing, too, is not being ready to shove your finger
in someone's face and say, I told you so.
That doesn't really help us move forward as a country.
Like, what would help the most people as possible, you know,
(14:22):
for us to be a loving and accepting community again?
And I would love to live in a world where I don't have to pay attention to politics
and be relaxed. But, you know, it'll be another four years of me being stressed out,
so stressed again. And, you know, maybe next,
(14:45):
maybe during these four years, we can try to have those conversations
and make a difference, like, to help bring people back into reality, you know.
Well, I'm really glad that you said about reframing from I told you so,
because I've been posting that all over my socials recently.
(15:07):
Yeah. Because to your point, there is a lot that's going to happen
in the next four years, where I do feel like a lot of people who,
out of a sincere desire to see the country be a better place, supported Trump.
(15:27):
And I don't want to ever judge anyone for how they voted,
but I do think that it's not going to be just disappointment.
There are going to be specific happenings and policies
where there's going to be that buyer's remorse.
And as that happens, you know, I'm thinking about your dad.
I'm thinking about another testimonial we had recently.
(15:49):
It's going to be dropping soon with a lady and her best friend of three decades.
You know, three decades. It's like, you're talking about
not just these acquaintanceships, you know, we're talking about parents
and children and best friends of many, many years.
(16:10):
And I do think it's going to happen where people are just going to say,
you know, this isn't exactly what I wanted.
And it's easy to say, I told you so.
But the question is, what is actually going to be gained saying that to them?
Because if our goal is to really empower people to leave MAGA,
we want to try to find a reconciliation with their friends and their family.
(16:34):
All the I told you so is just going to push them right back in
when we're trying to extract them out.
And I promise everyone who challenges me a little bit on that,
I appreciate that people may respectfully disagree with what I'm saying
and what you are saying now.
(16:54):
But I would rather that we not have to find that out in real time, right?
I would rather that we not have to go through the I told you so.
When there's doubt and there's remorse, that's an opportunity for us.
We've got an exit ramp.
Now, I don't want to volunteer you for this one, Megan,
but I'm thinking that you obviously had an impact because your dad stopped posting.
(17:17):
Yeah.
That means something.
So just maybe your dad might eventually leave MAGA.
That could happen, right?
Because you've created an opening.
You know, you did that and you didn't do it by name-calling or by insults.
That's why I really disagree vehemently with so much of the rhetoric about Trump voters
(17:41):
because when one is called the Nazi or the misogynist or the racist,
I'm going to think about your dad.
Yeah.
I'm going to think about siblings and best friends.
Like that's who I'm going to think about.
And of course, I know there's bad people in any large group,
but the ones we're talking to, your dad is,
I don't even need to know your father just listening to you to know that he's a good man.
There is a goodness in him.
(18:02):
And that's true, I think, of most people in the MAGA community.
Yeah. And it's also kind of the concept of how do people learn?
As I've got a good education background,
it's like not everyone learns by being yelled at and told where they made a mistake.
Most people don't learn that way.
They learn by being given the information and an opportunity to learn it and grow.
(18:27):
Like if you do something wrong,
do you want to be the parent that yells at your kid and gets mad at them
for like bringing food out into a room and then dropping it on the floor?
It's like I think children learn better.
I'm not trying to infantilize people, but it's just education-wise.
It's a good parallel to make, you know, people learn at every age.
(18:57):
And, you know, people learn best with positive reinforcement, not being yelled at.
You know, everybody knows a manager at a job you had
or a teacher that was just so mean and cruel about the way that they manage their employees
or, you know, teach people in a classroom.
(19:20):
And do you remember those as good teachers?
No. Do you like those teachers?
No. Or those managers? No.
The best teachers, the best managers, the best way to approach someone trying to help them learn
how to, you know, leave something like that is someone with like a loving approach to it,
like an open approach to it, a conversation.
(19:41):
And I think too, it's like it takes a lot of courage and strength to admit
that you were wrong about something and go back on what you did before.
Like if you wholeheartedly believe something and you realize that you might have been wrong,
(20:02):
it's hard to say that. It's really hard.
No one likes to admit that they were wrong and it's difficult.
Like one of my best friends, I used to hate her. I used to hate her.
I think it was boy drama or something stupid like that during college.
And at some point, we were both just hating on each other so much.
(20:22):
And then one of our mutual friends was like, you guys actually have a lot in common
and I think you would actually really like each other.
And we both had to step back and I stepped back and I said,
am I wrong for being really hateful to this person? And are they right?
And we both kind of said, listen, let's clean the slate.
Let's, you know, I know there were some terrible things that happened,
(20:46):
but I think we were wrong.
And now we've been best friends for over a decade.
Like, and it came out of something where we were very hateful.
Like we were wrong though.
And it was hard to say that and realize that I did something bad.
I did something wrong. I hurt someone and I had to do a lot of introspection on myself
(21:11):
and think to myself, I'm like, am I giving her a fair shot?
Am I doing this because of something wrong in my thought process
when really she could be one of the best friends I've ever had, you know,
if I gave her a chance.
Well, you laid the groundwork for your dad to leave.
Yeah.
(21:31):
And I know that we can't control when, if and when others decide to,
but very clearly you, you influenced him.
And you know, that tells me that the love is strong and you're getting married.
Right. So you've got, you're planning a wedding.
So you, you want your dad to enjoy it, right?
(21:51):
Not have no, no, like,
a weird undertones of like,
you know, like a meet the fuckers drama.
Right. You don't want that.
And you know, you said before about yelling at the kids.
I got two kids. I'm going to plead the fifth on that.
So you, you know, you've, you put, you have really put in the work.
So I want to ask you just as a closing question here,
(22:16):
given everything that happened with your family,
in particular with your father,
if you had the opportunity to speak one-on-one to the president-elect,
I'm curious what you would say to him.
And would your comments be grounded in what
(22:38):
MAGA and Trump coming on the political scene did to your relationship?
I'm wondering what is it that you would actually say
if you had the opportunity to have a conversation with him?
Hmm. I don't know if it would be in relation to
(23:00):
my family and people who, you know, are in MAGA.
I, I, I, because I don't know if he really cares that much
about how his actions affect everyday people.
I really don't think he cares that much.
(23:21):
Maybe I would just say like, you know,
maybe feed into like his sense of like patriotism and just say like,
please don't destroy our American institutions.
Like, please don't do, you know,
(23:42):
Republican presidents in the past have like worked with the systems that we have
and the departments that we have.
You don't need to get rid of the Department of Education.
You don't need to just get rid of the, you know, basically get rid of the EPA.
I don't know exactly what their plans are,
but please don't make too many drastic changes
(24:05):
because it's going to hurt everyday people, including the people who support you.
Like, please don't do all the tariff stuff.
Like, it's going to hurt people a lot, everyday people.
And, you know, I don't know.
I feel like that would really be the only thing I'd have to say
because hopefully it could tone something down,
(24:29):
but I don't think he would care about my opinion, sadly.
I don't know.
I've thought about often what I might say,
and I probably would preface a conversation with him by saying that I was a true believer.
Yeah, you were a supporter.
(24:50):
You know, I worked in the campaign. I was a volunteer.
I wrote part of the call script. I made phone calls.
Did all of the grassroots work.
But I would also say to him that, and I take full responsibility for this,
that I helped him tear asunder families and friendships
and communities, households, places of worship.
(25:12):
And, you know, what has happened with you and your dad,
I feel a particular, I feel like I am a culprit in that story,
you know, that I have some culpability.
And people will say, well, you're only one guy, one vote, one person.
But honestly, Megan, that doesn't register with me that way.
(25:33):
You know, I did assist him in pinning complete strangers and families against each other.
And it's one of the reasons we do these videos.
It's one of the reasons we have our organization,
is that I'm trying to bring good news to the MAGA afflicted.
And what you're doing that I think is really so important as well,
(25:56):
and it's why I feel like people are going to really be moved by this video that you're doing,
is that it requires such a superhuman degree of patience
to have to just have a relationship
with those who are loved ones or our friends who are still in the thrall of MAGA.
(26:18):
Because I try to separate the people in the community.
The community is a toxic one.
And a lot of people have just been subsumed into it.
So I appreciate that you would say that about, you know,
you'd want to be candid with the president-elect.
I'd want to be, but our experiences are different.
(26:39):
And I can appreciate that.
So tell us real quick, when's the big day?
Oh, it's in about a year.
So it's like the 8th of November next year.
So I've got plenty of time.
Okay, you have plenty of time and plenty of time to figure out
who we invite into this, right?
That's not a good idea.
Yeah, that's what my wife and I did.
(27:00):
It's a good idea.
I really, Megan, you know, thank you.
Congratulations in advance.
Thank you.
And I just want to, again, just express our gratitude for you coming on.
I know that your story is going to resonate with so many.
And you are bringing a hopefulness to this.
I think there are a lot of people out there who feel the despair.
(27:21):
They feel the desperation about whether they're going to ever be able
to get their relationships back of their friends and family.
And you are showing that it is possible with the process of doing this.
So you are really providing something that I just think a lot of people
are looking for right now, especially after the selection,
(27:43):
which is a reason to believe.
So Megan Siever from Pennsylvania, thank you so much for being with us today.
Leaving MAGA Midas Touch.
Appreciate that.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Hey guys, if you like this video, make sure you subscribe
so you don't miss any of our updates of leaving MAGA and Midas Touch Network.
And if you've left MAGA or you're having doubts about being in MAGA
(28:04):
or you've got friends or family who are still in the MAGA community,
we want to hear from you and we want to hear your story and your testimonials.
So be sure to visit us at LeavingMAGA.org.
Get in touch.
We appreciate you guys as always watching.
Until next time, thanks again.
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